September 10, 2023 • 27 mins
What's @ Risk with Mike Christian #1 Segment #2 - Boston’s Boch Center CEO, Josiah Spaulding reflects on his 35+ years at the helm of the Wang and Schubert Theaters, discussion includes youth education and how arts and music can help heal the community.
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(00:00):
What's on your mind? Send usyour thoughts, comments and questions to What's
at Risk at gmail dot com.That's one word, What's at Risk at
gmail dot com. Thank you,welcome back to What's at Risk. I'm
(00:25):
Mike Christian. We are speaking withJoe Spaulding, CEO of the Box Center
in Boston, which encompasses both theWang and the Schubert Theaters. Thanks for
joining us, Joe. How youdoing. I'm doing great, Mike,
and I'm thrilled to be here.Yeah, and I'm thrilled to have you
man. So the Wang opened asthe Metropolitan Theater in nineteen twenty five and
(00:48):
the Schubert opened in January of nineteenten. What's it like for you to
be the steward of these two grandand historic venues. What's what's the magic?
Well, one, the spaces arethe magic. But operating and being
in charge of two buildings, onewell over one hundred and the other coming
up to be one hundred is achallenge because it's you know, you never
(01:14):
know what's going to break at anyparticular time, right, and so you
have to be ready for that.It's a beautiful building and at full disclosure
to our audience out there. Iam on the board of the Whang,
so I do know the Whang verywell, and I've known Joe for many
years now, and it's a it'sbeen an absolute pleasure to serve on that
board. So you've been here forover thirty five years now, what are
(01:37):
some of the most memorable performances you'veexperienced at the Whang or the Schuberts.
Well, I'm asked that question alot, Mike, and when my staff
tells me I've seen over seven thousandshows during it'll be coming up on thirty
eight years on seven thousand shows,and so it depends. We do a
lot of diversity by programming. Andso if it's a Broadway show, you
(02:01):
know, I would say some ofthe ones that we have produced and won
Tony's with, which is American inParis or the Adams Family, or or
if it was a concert. Myfavorite show of all time was two thy
sixteen when we had Cat Stevens.Use of Cat Stevens. Got Stevens is
one of your favorites? Right,Yes, he is. I saw him
(02:23):
at the Music Hall. I believeit was in nineteen seventy, well before
I obviously became CEO and he wasopening He was the opening act for America
Highways and he blew me away thenand he continues to do that even today.
(02:47):
It's amazing he's still performing. Andyou've had some some pretty name performers
over the last even over the lastyear or so that you wouldn't expect to
play at the Wang or the orthe Shoe. Can you name a couple
of those, sure, Billy strings, Jason Isbell. We've been doing Bob
(03:07):
Dylan for quite a while. Thebiggest one for me of the most recent
was Ed Shart playing the Wang Theaterat thirty five hundred seats before he went
to play Gillette Stadium with eighty onethousand people, and it was a special,
special, special night. This isfrom the Box mission and something off
And hear you say. We believethe arts heal transform lives and create opportunities
(03:30):
for expression, dialogue and shared culturalexperiences. We believe the arts keep us
a civilized society. Can you justgive us a couple of examples of how
you and the Buck Center bring theseconcepts to life. Sure, we believe
in the creative spirit and that spirityou're born with, but many times over
(03:53):
growing up you don't think about that, and yet when you get to go
to see a multiple of the typeof show that we do, you begin
to understand that these are really,really important moments and that what is being
expressed from the stage, whether it'sdance or whether it's popular music, or
whether it's a Broadway show or aChristmas show, is really something special.
(04:16):
And what you end up seeing allthese years that I've been doing this an
incredible amount of what is known asa smile and it creates thinking. And
I believe, and we believe thata creative person is a better person,
and the more that we can emphasizethat, the better. So at the
(04:38):
Box Center we do that by ourproprietary programming and our diversity of our programming.
You've been in the performing arts industryfor a long time and it's changed
a lot over the years. Howis the Box Center innovating to keep up
with those changes? And how canyou thrive in a time that's so challenging
and so competitive right now? Well, the first thing that comes to mind,
(05:00):
Mike is you can remember a timewhen we were shut down for two
years, a little over two yearswith COVID, and you know, there
was a there was a move offoot that you've got to switch what you
do, you got to live isnever coming back, and I thoroughly disagree
with that. And you know,there's many people who is pushing you need
(05:23):
to do live streaming that should bethe main core of your business, and
it's not. It's it's the interactionbetween the audience and the artist that is
so exciting, and if you're inthe right environment, you can create that.
And when you introduce that to anawful lot of different genres that we
do, whether it's with the Educationprogram or frankly not one of my favorite
(05:46):
bands but I had a wonderful timewas the Hollywood Vampires. There you had
Alice Cooper at seventy five doing histhing, and we filmed it for a
Netflix documentary. So again I'm goingto say, I think it's the creative
spirit gets done and we seem tobe able to latch onto that all the
time. How about the competition now, I mean, there's so many theaters
(06:10):
around the country, but particularly inthe Boston area, and the Wang is
a unique room for sure, butthere's also other theaters that are maybe more
competitive or more linked to the distributionof tickets and maybe have a little more
clout. How does the Wang andthe Schubert compete with those venues, Well,
we're competing every single day, butwe also promote and co promote and
(06:36):
four a wall, which means rentour facilities to our biggest competitors. So
we are an independent, nonprofit performingarts center that happens to be the largest
nonprofit performing arts center in New England, and our competition is worldwide organizations like
(06:59):
Live Nation or ag or goes onand on, and yeah, there are
a lot of venues and there aren'tenough artists to fill all those venues.
So we have to figure out waysthat make the Box Center, Lang and
Schubert Theaters stand out a little bitmore for all the different things that we
do do that our competitors don't do. And we've been successful at that mic
(07:23):
over the many years and can wantto continue to do that as we sort
of justify who we are and whywe do what we do. When you
think about the community outreach programs thatthe Box has, and I know the
education program and you've alluded to ita few times here today is probably the
most meaningful of those, and Ithink it's way under the radar given the
(07:46):
value that it gives back to thecommunity, Maybe what was the original inspiration
to do that kind of education program? And now it's multifaceted and I'll let
you maybe talk about it a littlebit, but what inspired you in the
Box to initially do that and thenmaybe just give us a little overview of
what it is today. Right.Well, so prior to me going to
(08:07):
the Box Center, I along witha great friend and a mentor and my
biggest competitor, Don Law, webuilt outdoor amphitheaters and owned radio stations and
so one of the ones that wedid was what was called Great Woods,
which is now referred to as theXfinity Center, and we had an educational
component back then. That was innineteen eighty four that we opened Great Woods
(08:33):
and it was called the Great WoodsEducational Form and we actually did it on
the campus of Wheaton, again usingall the arts to make a difference for
young people and artists to be ableto mingle together. So when I got
to the center, there was agentleman who was on the board and his
name was doctor Vanderpol Maurice Vanderpolt,and he was a Dutch jew from Amsterdam,
(09:00):
and during World War Two, he, like Anne Frank, was held
up in an attic somewhere and hesaid that what got him through life and
those very difficult times were the arts, and that he always wanted to have
an educational arm to the center.And I believe that any institution should have
(09:24):
an educational arm. So I said, well, that's great, and we
ended up calling it of the WalterSuskin Memorial Fund, and it was named
after a Dutch jew who saved twelvehundred kids out of a crush in Amsterdam
as their parents and their families wentoff to concentration camps. And we went
out and we raised five million bucksand got this thing off the ground,
(09:48):
and we've been doing it ever since. And there was something else that came
out of that mic, and thatwas the incredible difference that it makes to
mental health. And as you know, we've been doing the Express Yourself program
with the Department of Mental Health andExpress Yourself which is in Beverly, Massachusetts
coming up on our thirty first year. And you know, you mentioned mental
(10:09):
health, and obviously that's on theminds and lips of many people, many
academics, many teachers these days,especially with youth. Many of the artists
that have played at the Wang andthe Schubert have talked about their struggles with
mental health and how they've used thearts or music to be able to work
through some of those issues. Howdo you think the programs that the educational
(10:33):
programs that the Box Center has helpsthe youth in our community, of which
there are many that go through thoseprograms. How do you think it helps
them from a mental health standpoint?Well, I'd like to answer that in
two things. Might The first thingwas we're going to use a concept that
we just had and talked about ita little bit edge Sharon, so Ed
(10:56):
Sharon comes out in the Wang andwants to play his entire new album start
to finish, and he goes tothe mic when he comes out and he
says, I'm a folk artist.That's number one. So folk artists are
not old folk artists to be thebiggest male star in the world, which
he is. And yet he talkedabout that first album about what it meant
(11:20):
to him and his mental health,and his grandmother had died, and his
best friend had died, and hiswife was having their second child and she
was diagnosed with a terminal tumor,and she couldn't have the operation until after
they had the baby, and itwas a very stressful time. On top
(11:41):
of that, he talked about howhe's dealing with stardom, how I went
from being an artist that was playingbars and clubs to now just by myself
standing in front of eighty one thousandpeople and they're all singing my song back
to me, all right. Sothere's something of value that comes from that.
It's the freedom of being able toexpress yourself and tell people why you
(12:05):
did what you did, why youwrote this particular song that is so beneficial
to young people. You've seen ithappen in City Spotlight's leadership program, where
these kids create their own work,they create their own lyrics, they create
their own dance from teams, they'vecreate all the things that again teach self
esteem and self expression. Many ofthose kids in the City Spotli's program are
(12:28):
not going to go on to befamous artists. In fact, very few
of them are going to go onto be artists at all. But what
they get out of this program isan incredible benefit that they will forever take
with them no matter where they goin life. And we've seen that happen.
And I really am very proud thatthis year. You know, out
(12:50):
of the twelve staff that we hiredin the summertime to be a part of
City Spotlies, seven of them werealumni went through the program on their own.
How cool is that? Right?Yeah, I always think the alumni
programs are the greatest testament to theeffectiveness of a program, because they come
back, they want to stay apart of it, even after they've moved
on, maybe even moved on beyondcollege. It's terrific. And you know,
(13:13):
it also dawned on me and thiswas so important during the pandemic.
Think of these young teenagers in differentneighborhoods, not great neighborhoods in the city
of Boston. They were stuck athome. They couldn't go out, they
couldn't go to school, they couldn'thang with their friends. They didn't have
technology in the way that you andI are doing this interview right now.
(13:37):
So the Box Center provided them thistechnology and we ran the program in the
same way that we run it inperson, virtually, and it made a
huge difference in these young people's lives, just a huge difference because all of
a sudden they were writing songs onzoom, they were being able to create
routines on zoom. They were talkingto their friends or they're new friends.
(14:01):
And for me, that was itjust is an incredible reward to me to
say that, and I've you've experiencedthis when Corey Evans was our director,
senior vice president director of Education,gets on the stage and she says,
I am proud to present you thetwenty twenty three City Spotlights Leaders. And
(14:22):
she's been doing that for thirteen years, and I cry every time that she
does that. All Right, Iget peered up because that's what we do,
right, and that is why whatI get to do for a living
for thirty eight years is so wonderful. I'm such a lucky guy. Let's
talk a little bit more about theFolk American the Roots Hall of Fame and
(14:46):
where that's at today. I thinkyou told me about that the very first
day I met you years ago,and I was wondering, what was your
inspiration for that? And then whatcan you give us a little bit of
an update of where it's progressed totoday? Sure? Uh, you know,
the idea crossed my mind back inlike twenty seventeen, eighteen and We
(15:09):
started the project in nineteen. Butthe concept was what you all asked me
earlier, which is, how dowe, you know, stand out differently
than the big four profit worldwide organizations, and uh, we're a nonprofit.
And so here was a way ofsaying, look, let's celebrate of folk,
(15:33):
American and roots music because everybody,every artist that is out there today
came from one of those genres.Whether you're a hip hop artist today,
or you're a rock and roller,or you're you know, whatever you are,
you came from that roots and theroots to Americana to folk to bluegrass,
(15:56):
and so why don't we do that? Because I learned that they're wasn't
a Folk Americana Roots Hall of Fameanywhere in the world. There was a
rock and Roll Hall of Fame.There was the Country Music Hall of Fame,
there was the Songwriters Hall of Fame, there was the Blues Hall of
Fame, the Bluegrass Hall of Fame, the Grammy Museum, but there was
(16:17):
no Folk Americana Roots Hall of Fame. And it got started because we were
doing a Neil Young concert and I'vebeen toying around with this talking about with
my chairman Mark Weld, who youknow, and you know, he was
looking at me saying, what areyou thinking about? Why really? And
I would saying, yeah, thisis this could be really beneficial to what
(16:38):
makes us different. And it's sotied to education. Everything is educational that
we're trying to attempt to. Sowe launched it. But Neil Young on
stage at the Wing and said,two nights in a row. You know,
everybody, Boston is the folk capitalof North missearching, and I said,
(17:10):
wow, I've been thinking about that, and here he is saying that.
So he said, no, Ifirmly believe that, Joe, and
you think about all the artists thatactually came through the Boston era back in
those days, from Joan bay Asto Bob Dylan, to Peter Paul and
Mary to keep going and going andgoing. That really changed this world.
(17:32):
And so I said, okay,well I'm gonna go try and do this.
We know how to do concerts,we know how to do diversified programming,
and we got fifty seven thousand squarefeet of empty wall space. Let's
put it in a living, breathing, performing arts center. So I went
back to all of them and Isaid, this is what I'm going to
think in of doing, and theyall looked at me and said, that's
(17:52):
the best idea you ever had.So we started down that path and already
we've had seven exhibits. We've gottwo more coming in in early September with
Bruce Springsteen and the Legends exhibit,which is going to have instruments by artists
that have from Lead Belly to JoshWhite, to Woody Guthrie to Beete Seeger
(18:14):
to Oscar brand and and and JeanieRitchie. I could go on and on
and on and Odetta and none ofthese instruments have been in the same place
at the same time ever in history. So we're making progress. And every
single one of all the memorabilia whenyou come on a tour and see the
(18:34):
exhibits, we didn't buy one thinglike it all came from their estates or
from the artists because the artist thinksthat this is a great idea. This
has become their hall of fame,and they're very into it. I think
there's a perception you mentioned it alittle while ago, that folk is,
you know, old person's music,Peter, Paul and Mary in the sixties
(18:56):
and even even before that. Ithink Pete Seager said all music is folk
music, So I think we haveto we have to embrace that comment.
But I think there's a whole newgeneration of young people that are coming up,
as always happens, that have embracedfolk music or Americano music or the
next iteration of folk music. AndI think it's very relevant also, and
(19:18):
knowing its roots makes it even thatmuch more important, exactly, and it's
becoming more diverse. So right nowwe're partnering with past scenes, but you
know, Will and they have anew program called a Folk Collective, and
it's made up of twelve artists.They're Indigenous artists, they're Black artists,
they're Latino artists, they're Hispanic artists, and they all refer to themselves in
(19:45):
their twenties. There's folk artists,right, And I just think that's incredible,
And that's why I think the Edsheeran experience of I just went through
and that others are going through.Here is the lead lead male guy in
the world saying I'm a folk artist, and he's thirty one years old.
He looks like he's fourteen. Andmaybe we just touch a little bit on
(20:15):
the education theme that comes from thefolk America on a Hall of Fame,
which is short short for that isFarhoff. That's how it's often referred to.
But Farhoff gives the BACH an opportunityto enhance the education program. And
this is my own personal opinion byillustrating not only the history of the music,
(20:38):
but the parallel history of the countryand the world via music and via
arts, and via the creativity thatcomes from music and musicians. What are
your thoughts about that? I thinkyou've hit it right on the head,
nail on the head, like that'sexactly correct. And so let's think about
(20:59):
one of our exhibits that we havein the lower lobby today. It's the
Cultural Heroes. They are these headbustsby Alan the Choir, a very famous
sculptor out of Nashville, and theyfeature artists like Josh White, Lead Belly
By Smith, Billie Holiday, MarianAnderson, Paul Robinson, and Woody Guthrie.
(21:22):
And every single one of those artistschanged the history of music and activenesses.
And every single one of those artistsactually has a United States Posts stamp.
You know, think of all thebig artists today, they don't have
Posts stamps, and yet every singleone of those artists was thought of as
a communist, you know, atthat particular time, but they were changing
(21:45):
the course of history. And let'sgo to Lead Belly. He was the
inventor of Skifful music. If youdidn't have Skifful music, you wouldn't have
had the Beatles, you wouldn't havehad the Rolling Stones, you just wouldn't
have had them. Dan Morrison's wholenew album that's just been at least double
album is all on Skifful music andfeatures a lot of Lead Belly songs.
So what goes around comes around andwe learn from that. And there's a
(22:10):
history of listening to this music andbeing able to participate in it. And
that's great for young people, andit's great for old people, and it's
great for artists, and it's itjust seems to be our new platform that
seems to be getting a great receptionat this particular moment. We're very proud
of it. And one last questionregarding the Box, do you see it
(22:33):
in this time and especially on theheels of having created Far Hoof and looking
to compete in an environment where youhave to add value in ways that is
more than just just showcasing artists.Do you see the Box Center becoming more
of a community center in the future, Well, I do, but I
(22:55):
think we've we are recognized already inthe greater Boston area and Massachusetts as being
a community arts center. We createda program called Arn't We which was reaching
out in the city of Boston thateventually went statewide, and it was saying
that every city and town should takeon the role that the arts play in
(23:19):
a very important part in all oftheir citizens in their town's lives, and
young people, middle aged people,old people didn't matter, and so that
was very successful. Unfortunately covid Catorthat went down, But that is the
goal and always has been the goalduring my administration that we are a community
(23:41):
arts center, and I think moreand more people are starting to recognize that.
So we're working with over four hundredcultural organizations and community organizations, and
we give away about six thousand ticketsa year to people that can't afford to
come to see the shows at theBoxing m And the other thing we have
(24:03):
which is really really special and you'veexperienced it both buildings, but certainly the
way there's a special connection between theaudience and the artists. It just happens
in that space, and that's oneof the reasons that's kept me in this
job for all these years because nomatter what I go to see, the
(24:26):
excitement level that's created between the artistsand the audience is just remarkable. I've
seen that live many times with theartists. So one last thing, with
all these years behind you, now, Joe, what are you most proud
of? Well, I'm most proudthat I think I've made a difference in
what I truly believe. And thatgoes right back to what you read is
(24:49):
sort of the mission than the philosophybehind the arts keeps us a civilized society
and creative people are better people.And so I've had, in a sense,
the incredible opportunity to do God's workfor the last thirty eight or fifty
years of my career being able tobe involved in that, and so that's
(25:11):
why I love it. You know, people say, well, gee,
Joe, you know I didn't knowyou were doing Latin shows. Well,
we do Latin shows all the time, right, I had a Mexican band
just last last Friday. I mean, so it's like, you know,
we we strive to do that andwe're reaching out to all the different communities
and that is what makes us differentthan our for profit competitors. We've been
(25:36):
speaking with Joe Spalding, the CEOof the Box Center. Joe, thank
you so much for your time,just to really appreciate it all your insights.
Well, I appreciate you asking meto be on the program. I'm
thrilled that you're you're back doing thisand I gotta say, Mike, you
have a great radio voice. Thanks. I certainly I certainly have a face
for radio, there's no question aboutthat. Thanks a lot, Joe,
(25:57):
thank you for including me. Iwant to thank this week's guest Joe Spaulding,
CEO of the Box Center in Boston. It's Scott Gendel, author of
That's All I Ever Wanted to BeAnd again a big thank you to our
(26:18):
producer, Ken Carberry of Chart Productions. And let us know what's on your
mind. Send us your comments andquestions to What's at Risk at gmail dot
com. That's all one word,What's at Risk at gmail dot com.
You can find podcasts of each showat WBZ Radio. iHeart dot com podcast.
(26:41):
See you next Saturday at nine forWhat's at Risk
What's on your mind? Send usyour thoughts, comments and questions to What's
at Risk at gmail dot com.That's one word, What's at Risk at
gmail dot com. Thank you,welcome back to What's at Risk. I'm
(00:25):
Mike Christian. We are speaking withJoe Spaulding, CEO of the Box Center
in Boston, which encompasses both theWang and the Schubert Theaters. Thanks for
joining us, Joe. How youdoing. I'm doing great, Mike,
and I'm thrilled to be here.Yeah, and I'm thrilled to have you
man. So the Wang opened asthe Metropolitan Theater in nineteen twenty five and
(00:48):
the Schubert opened in January of nineteenten. What's it like for you to
be the steward of these two grandand historic venues. What's what's the magic?
Well, one, the spaces arethe magic. But operating and being
in charge of two buildings, onewell over one hundred and the other coming
up to be one hundred is achallenge because it's you know, you never
(01:14):
know what's going to break at anyparticular time, right, and so you
have to be ready for that.It's a beautiful building and at full disclosure
to our audience out there. Iam on the board of the Whang,
so I do know the Whang verywell, and I've known Joe for many
years now, and it's a it'sbeen an absolute pleasure to serve on that
board. So you've been here forover thirty five years now, what are
(01:37):
some of the most memorable performances you'veexperienced at the Whang or the Schuberts.
Well, I'm asked that question alot, Mike, and when my staff
tells me I've seen over seven thousandshows during it'll be coming up on thirty
eight years on seven thousand shows,and so it depends. We do a
lot of diversity by programming. Andso if it's a Broadway show, you
(02:01):
know, I would say some ofthe ones that we have produced and won
Tony's with, which is American inParis or the Adams Family, or or
if it was a concert. Myfavorite show of all time was two thy
sixteen when we had Cat Stevens.Use of Cat Stevens. Got Stevens is
one of your favorites? Right,Yes, he is. I saw him
(02:23):
at the Music Hall. I believeit was in nineteen seventy, well before
I obviously became CEO and he wasopening He was the opening act for America
Highways and he blew me away thenand he continues to do that even today.
(02:47):
It's amazing he's still performing. Andyou've had some some pretty name performers
over the last even over the lastyear or so that you wouldn't expect to
play at the Wang or the orthe Shoe. Can you name a couple
of those, sure, Billy strings, Jason Isbell. We've been doing Bob
(03:07):
Dylan for quite a while. Thebiggest one for me of the most recent
was Ed Shart playing the Wang Theaterat thirty five hundred seats before he went
to play Gillette Stadium with eighty onethousand people, and it was a special,
special, special night. This isfrom the Box mission and something off
And hear you say. We believethe arts heal transform lives and create opportunities
(03:30):
for expression, dialogue and shared culturalexperiences. We believe the arts keep us
a civilized society. Can you justgive us a couple of examples of how
you and the Buck Center bring theseconcepts to life. Sure, we believe
in the creative spirit and that spirityou're born with, but many times over
(03:53):
growing up you don't think about that, and yet when you get to go
to see a multiple of the typeof show that we do, you begin
to understand that these are really,really important moments and that what is being
expressed from the stage, whether it'sdance or whether it's popular music, or
whether it's a Broadway show or aChristmas show, is really something special.
(04:16):
And what you end up seeing allthese years that I've been doing this an
incredible amount of what is known asa smile and it creates thinking. And
I believe, and we believe thata creative person is a better person,
and the more that we can emphasizethat, the better. So at the
(04:38):
Box Center we do that by ourproprietary programming and our diversity of our programming.
You've been in the performing arts industryfor a long time and it's changed
a lot over the years. Howis the Box Center innovating to keep up
with those changes? And how canyou thrive in a time that's so challenging
and so competitive right now? Well, the first thing that comes to mind,
(05:00):
Mike is you can remember a timewhen we were shut down for two
years, a little over two yearswith COVID, and you know, there
was a there was a move offoot that you've got to switch what you
do, you got to live isnever coming back, and I thoroughly disagree
with that. And you know,there's many people who is pushing you need
(05:23):
to do live streaming that should bethe main core of your business, and
it's not. It's it's the interactionbetween the audience and the artist that is
so exciting, and if you're inthe right environment, you can create that.
And when you introduce that to anawful lot of different genres that we
do, whether it's with the Educationprogram or frankly not one of my favorite
(05:46):
bands but I had a wonderful timewas the Hollywood Vampires. There you had
Alice Cooper at seventy five doing histhing, and we filmed it for a
Netflix documentary. So again I'm goingto say, I think it's the creative
spirit gets done and we seem tobe able to latch onto that all the
time. How about the competition now, I mean, there's so many theaters
(06:10):
around the country, but particularly inthe Boston area, and the Wang is
a unique room for sure, butthere's also other theaters that are maybe more
competitive or more linked to the distributionof tickets and maybe have a little more
clout. How does the Wang andthe Schubert compete with those venues, Well,
we're competing every single day, butwe also promote and co promote and
(06:36):
four a wall, which means rentour facilities to our biggest competitors. So
we are an independent, nonprofit performingarts center that happens to be the largest
nonprofit performing arts center in New England, and our competition is worldwide organizations like
(06:59):
Live Nation or ag or goes onand on, and yeah, there are
a lot of venues and there aren'tenough artists to fill all those venues.
So we have to figure out waysthat make the Box Center, Lang and
Schubert Theaters stand out a little bitmore for all the different things that we
do do that our competitors don't do. And we've been successful at that mic
(07:23):
over the many years and can wantto continue to do that as we sort
of justify who we are and whywe do what we do. When you
think about the community outreach programs thatthe Box has, and I know the
education program and you've alluded to ita few times here today is probably the
most meaningful of those, and Ithink it's way under the radar given the
(07:46):
value that it gives back to thecommunity, Maybe what was the original inspiration
to do that kind of education program? And now it's multifaceted and I'll let
you maybe talk about it a littlebit, but what inspired you in the
Box to initially do that and thenmaybe just give us a little overview of
what it is today. Right.Well, so prior to me going to
(08:07):
the Box Center, I along witha great friend and a mentor and my
biggest competitor, Don Law, webuilt outdoor amphitheaters and owned radio stations and
so one of the ones that wedid was what was called Great Woods,
which is now referred to as theXfinity Center, and we had an educational
component back then. That was innineteen eighty four that we opened Great Woods
(08:33):
and it was called the Great WoodsEducational Form and we actually did it on
the campus of Wheaton, again usingall the arts to make a difference for
young people and artists to be ableto mingle together. So when I got
to the center, there was agentleman who was on the board and his
name was doctor Vanderpol Maurice Vanderpolt,and he was a Dutch jew from Amsterdam,
(09:00):
and during World War Two, he, like Anne Frank, was held
up in an attic somewhere and hesaid that what got him through life and
those very difficult times were the arts, and that he always wanted to have
an educational arm to the center.And I believe that any institution should have
(09:24):
an educational arm. So I said, well, that's great, and we
ended up calling it of the WalterSuskin Memorial Fund, and it was named
after a Dutch jew who saved twelvehundred kids out of a crush in Amsterdam
as their parents and their families wentoff to concentration camps. And we went
out and we raised five million bucksand got this thing off the ground,
(09:48):
and we've been doing it ever since. And there was something else that came
out of that mic, and thatwas the incredible difference that it makes to
mental health. And as you know, we've been doing the Express Yourself program
with the Department of Mental Health andExpress Yourself which is in Beverly, Massachusetts
coming up on our thirty first year. And you know, you mentioned mental
(10:09):
health, and obviously that's on theminds and lips of many people, many
academics, many teachers these days,especially with youth. Many of the artists
that have played at the Wang andthe Schubert have talked about their struggles with
mental health and how they've used thearts or music to be able to work
through some of those issues. Howdo you think the programs that the educational
(10:33):
programs that the Box Center has helpsthe youth in our community, of which
there are many that go through thoseprograms. How do you think it helps
them from a mental health standpoint?Well, I'd like to answer that in
two things. Might The first thingwas we're going to use a concept that
we just had and talked about ita little bit edge Sharon, so Ed
(10:56):
Sharon comes out in the Wang andwants to play his entire new album start
to finish, and he goes tothe mic when he comes out and he
says, I'm a folk artist.That's number one. So folk artists are
not old folk artists to be thebiggest male star in the world, which
he is. And yet he talkedabout that first album about what it meant
(11:20):
to him and his mental health,and his grandmother had died, and his
best friend had died, and hiswife was having their second child and she
was diagnosed with a terminal tumor,and she couldn't have the operation until after
they had the baby, and itwas a very stressful time. On top
(11:41):
of that, he talked about howhe's dealing with stardom, how I went
from being an artist that was playingbars and clubs to now just by myself
standing in front of eighty one thousandpeople and they're all singing my song back
to me, all right. Sothere's something of value that comes from that.
It's the freedom of being able toexpress yourself and tell people why you
(12:05):
did what you did, why youwrote this particular song that is so beneficial
to young people. You've seen ithappen in City Spotlight's leadership program, where
these kids create their own work,they create their own lyrics, they create
their own dance from teams, they'vecreate all the things that again teach self
esteem and self expression. Many ofthose kids in the City Spotli's program are
(12:28):
not going to go on to befamous artists. In fact, very few
of them are going to go onto be artists at all. But what
they get out of this program isan incredible benefit that they will forever take
with them no matter where they goin life. And we've seen that happen.
And I really am very proud thatthis year. You know, out
(12:50):
of the twelve staff that we hiredin the summertime to be a part of
City Spotlies, seven of them werealumni went through the program on their own.
How cool is that? Right?Yeah, I always think the alumni
programs are the greatest testament to theeffectiveness of a program, because they come
back, they want to stay apart of it, even after they've moved
on, maybe even moved on beyondcollege. It's terrific. And you know,
(13:13):
it also dawned on me and thiswas so important during the pandemic.
Think of these young teenagers in differentneighborhoods, not great neighborhoods in the city
of Boston. They were stuck athome. They couldn't go out, they
couldn't go to school, they couldn'thang with their friends. They didn't have
technology in the way that you andI are doing this interview right now.
(13:37):
So the Box Center provided them thistechnology and we ran the program in the
same way that we run it inperson, virtually, and it made a
huge difference in these young people's lives, just a huge difference because all of
a sudden they were writing songs onzoom, they were being able to create
routines on zoom. They were talkingto their friends or they're new friends.
(14:01):
And for me, that was itjust is an incredible reward to me to
say that, and I've you've experiencedthis when Corey Evans was our director,
senior vice president director of Education,gets on the stage and she says,
I am proud to present you thetwenty twenty three City Spotlights Leaders. And
(14:22):
she's been doing that for thirteen years, and I cry every time that she
does that. All Right, Iget peered up because that's what we do,
right, and that is why whatI get to do for a living
for thirty eight years is so wonderful. I'm such a lucky guy. Let's
talk a little bit more about theFolk American the Roots Hall of Fame and
(14:46):
where that's at today. I thinkyou told me about that the very first
day I met you years ago,and I was wondering, what was your
inspiration for that? And then whatcan you give us a little bit of
an update of where it's progressed totoday? Sure? Uh, you know,
the idea crossed my mind back inlike twenty seventeen, eighteen and We
(15:09):
started the project in nineteen. Butthe concept was what you all asked me
earlier, which is, how dowe, you know, stand out differently
than the big four profit worldwide organizations, and uh, we're a nonprofit.
And so here was a way ofsaying, look, let's celebrate of folk,
(15:33):
American and roots music because everybody,every artist that is out there today
came from one of those genres.Whether you're a hip hop artist today,
or you're a rock and roller,or you're you know, whatever you are,
you came from that roots and theroots to Americana to folk to bluegrass,
(15:56):
and so why don't we do that? Because I learned that they're wasn't
a Folk Americana Roots Hall of Fameanywhere in the world. There was a
rock and Roll Hall of Fame.There was the Country Music Hall of Fame,
there was the Songwriters Hall of Fame, there was the Blues Hall of
Fame, the Bluegrass Hall of Fame, the Grammy Museum, but there was
(16:17):
no Folk Americana Roots Hall of Fame. And it got started because we were
doing a Neil Young concert and I'vebeen toying around with this talking about with
my chairman Mark Weld, who youknow, and you know, he was
looking at me saying, what areyou thinking about? Why really? And
I would saying, yeah, thisis this could be really beneficial to what
(16:38):
makes us different. And it's sotied to education. Everything is educational that
we're trying to attempt to. Sowe launched it. But Neil Young on
stage at the Wing and said,two nights in a row. You know,
everybody, Boston is the folk capitalof North missearching, and I said,
(17:10):
wow, I've been thinking about that, and here he is saying that.
So he said, no, Ifirmly believe that, Joe, and
you think about all the artists thatactually came through the Boston era back in
those days, from Joan bay Asto Bob Dylan, to Peter Paul and
Mary to keep going and going andgoing. That really changed this world.
(17:32):
And so I said, okay,well I'm gonna go try and do this.
We know how to do concerts,we know how to do diversified programming,
and we got fifty seven thousand squarefeet of empty wall space. Let's
put it in a living, breathing, performing arts center. So I went
back to all of them and Isaid, this is what I'm going to
think in of doing, and theyall looked at me and said, that's
(17:52):
the best idea you ever had.So we started down that path and already
we've had seven exhibits. We've gottwo more coming in in early September with
Bruce Springsteen and the Legends exhibit,which is going to have instruments by artists
that have from Lead Belly to JoshWhite, to Woody Guthrie to Beete Seeger
(18:14):
to Oscar brand and and and JeanieRitchie. I could go on and on
and on and Odetta and none ofthese instruments have been in the same place
at the same time ever in history. So we're making progress. And every
single one of all the memorabilia whenyou come on a tour and see the
(18:34):
exhibits, we didn't buy one thinglike it all came from their estates or
from the artists because the artist thinksthat this is a great idea. This
has become their hall of fame,and they're very into it. I think
there's a perception you mentioned it alittle while ago, that folk is,
you know, old person's music,Peter, Paul and Mary in the sixties
(18:56):
and even even before that. Ithink Pete Seager said all music is folk
music, So I think we haveto we have to embrace that comment.
But I think there's a whole newgeneration of young people that are coming up,
as always happens, that have embracedfolk music or Americano music or the
next iteration of folk music. AndI think it's very relevant also, and
(19:18):
knowing its roots makes it even thatmuch more important, exactly, and it's
becoming more diverse. So right nowwe're partnering with past scenes, but you
know, Will and they have anew program called a Folk Collective, and
it's made up of twelve artists.They're Indigenous artists, they're Black artists,
they're Latino artists, they're Hispanic artists, and they all refer to themselves in
(19:45):
their twenties. There's folk artists,right, And I just think that's incredible,
And that's why I think the Edsheeran experience of I just went through
and that others are going through.Here is the lead lead male guy in
the world saying I'm a folk artist, and he's thirty one years old.
He looks like he's fourteen. Andmaybe we just touch a little bit on
(20:15):
the education theme that comes from thefolk America on a Hall of Fame,
which is short short for that isFarhoff. That's how it's often referred to.
But Farhoff gives the BACH an opportunityto enhance the education program. And
this is my own personal opinion byillustrating not only the history of the music,
(20:38):
but the parallel history of the countryand the world via music and via
arts, and via the creativity thatcomes from music and musicians. What are
your thoughts about that? I thinkyou've hit it right on the head,
nail on the head, like that'sexactly correct. And so let's think about
(20:59):
one of our exhibits that we havein the lower lobby today. It's the
Cultural Heroes. They are these headbustsby Alan the Choir, a very famous
sculptor out of Nashville, and theyfeature artists like Josh White, Lead Belly
By Smith, Billie Holiday, MarianAnderson, Paul Robinson, and Woody Guthrie.
(21:22):
And every single one of those artistschanged the history of music and activenesses.
And every single one of those artistsactually has a United States Posts stamp.
You know, think of all thebig artists today, they don't have
Posts stamps, and yet every singleone of those artists was thought of as
a communist, you know, atthat particular time, but they were changing
(21:45):
the course of history. And let'sgo to Lead Belly. He was the
inventor of Skifful music. If youdidn't have Skifful music, you wouldn't have
had the Beatles, you wouldn't havehad the Rolling Stones, you just wouldn't
have had them. Dan Morrison's wholenew album that's just been at least double
album is all on Skifful music andfeatures a lot of Lead Belly songs.
So what goes around comes around andwe learn from that. And there's a
(22:10):
history of listening to this music andbeing able to participate in it. And
that's great for young people, andit's great for old people, and it's
great for artists, and it's itjust seems to be our new platform that
seems to be getting a great receptionat this particular moment. We're very proud
of it. And one last questionregarding the Box, do you see it
(22:33):
in this time and especially on theheels of having created Far Hoof and looking
to compete in an environment where youhave to add value in ways that is
more than just just showcasing artists.Do you see the Box Center becoming more
of a community center in the future, Well, I do, but I
(22:55):
think we've we are recognized already inthe greater Boston area and Massachusetts as being
a community arts center. We createda program called Arn't We which was reaching
out in the city of Boston thateventually went statewide, and it was saying
that every city and town should takeon the role that the arts play in
(23:19):
a very important part in all oftheir citizens in their town's lives, and
young people, middle aged people,old people didn't matter, and so that
was very successful. Unfortunately covid Catorthat went down, But that is the
goal and always has been the goalduring my administration that we are a community
(23:41):
arts center, and I think moreand more people are starting to recognize that.
So we're working with over four hundredcultural organizations and community organizations, and
we give away about six thousand ticketsa year to people that can't afford to
come to see the shows at theBoxing m And the other thing we have
(24:03):
which is really really special and you'veexperienced it both buildings, but certainly the
way there's a special connection between theaudience and the artists. It just happens
in that space, and that's oneof the reasons that's kept me in this
job for all these years because nomatter what I go to see, the
(24:26):
excitement level that's created between the artistsand the audience is just remarkable. I've
seen that live many times with theartists. So one last thing, with
all these years behind you, now, Joe, what are you most proud
of? Well, I'm most proudthat I think I've made a difference in
what I truly believe. And thatgoes right back to what you read is
(24:49):
sort of the mission than the philosophybehind the arts keeps us a civilized society
and creative people are better people.And so I've had, in a sense,
the incredible opportunity to do God's workfor the last thirty eight or fifty
years of my career being able tobe involved in that, and so that's
(25:11):
why I love it. You know, people say, well, gee,
Joe, you know I didn't knowyou were doing Latin shows. Well,
we do Latin shows all the time, right, I had a Mexican band
just last last Friday. I mean, so it's like, you know,
we we strive to do that andwe're reaching out to all the different communities
and that is what makes us differentthan our for profit competitors. We've been
(25:36):
speaking with Joe Spalding, the CEOof the Box Center. Joe, thank
you so much for your time,just to really appreciate it all your insights.
Well, I appreciate you asking meto be on the program. I'm
thrilled that you're you're back doing thisand I gotta say, Mike, you
have a great radio voice. Thanks. I certainly I certainly have a face
for radio, there's no question aboutthat. Thanks a lot, Joe,
(25:57):
thank you for including me. Iwant to thank this week's guest Joe Spaulding,
CEO of the Box Center in Boston. It's Scott Gendel, author of
That's All I Ever Wanted to BeAnd again a big thank you to our
(26:18):
producer, Ken Carberry of Chart Productions. And let us know what's on your
mind. Send us your comments andquestions to What's at Risk at gmail dot
com. That's all one word,What's at Risk at gmail dot com.
You can find podcasts of each showat WBZ Radio. iHeart dot com podcast.
(26:41):
See you next Saturday at nine forWhat's at Risk
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