March 16, 2025 • 25 mins
If your sports bra is cutting off your circulation, causing back pain, or letting the girls bounce like they’re at a trampoline park—this episode is for you.In this week's episode of the FIT(ish) Podcast, host Phoebe Parsons chats with Tish Tilley, founder of She Science, about the biggest sports bra mistakes women make (yep, we’re all guilty).
From the “crop top that does nothing” to the “straps digging into your soul”, we’re breaking down why most women wear the wrong size, what damage it could actually be causing, and what to look for in a high-impact, actually supportive sports bra.Prepare to laugh, cringe, and (probably) realize it’s time to go bra shopping.For daily FIT(ish) updates follow Phoebe on Instagram here
To find out more about She Science, visit their website here: https://shescience.com.au/
If you like the Podcast, show your support and rate it, write a review and follow on Apple or Spotify or wherever you get your podcasts.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:05):
Apodje Production. Welcome to fit Ish.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
I'm Phoebe Parsons and this is the podcast that proves
that you don't have to choose between staying fit and
having fun. Welcome to the show at Tish Tilley from
She signs to talk about something I have been dying
to talk about on the show for literally years, and
that is sports Bras, but more specifically some mistakes.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
That you might be making.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
Thank you for having me. Obviously, I'm very passionate about
this as co founder of a sports Bras store, so
hoping I can share some gems with you today.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
I cannot wait.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
Now.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
I have actually prepared a couple of ice breakers before
we jump in, just given the nature of the topic,
before we get into the pardon my French, the titties
and the boobs, I just thought we could start with
some fun little icebreakers. So firstly, have you ever had
a sports bra faux po or like a little nipslit moment?
Speaker 3 (01:03):
You know what? I haven't, which I'm very glad about,
but I have heard of many so, particularly with washing
machine disasters etc. We've heard all of the worst.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Well, I guess that just further endorses your expertise in
the area. Then, as someone who works in a gym,
I've actually seen a lot of nip slips and I
have just it happens a lot actually in reformer pilates,
and I think people must not, you know, when they're
using their strap and they're pulling it over. I've had
someone with one entire boob expos and you just walk
(01:35):
over and you're.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Like, Oh, I just wanted to let you know. You know,
it's like girl code.
Speaker 3 (01:40):
I'm sure she would have appreciated that.
Speaker 1 (01:42):
One hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
This one's more so just for my curiosity, how many
sports bras do you currently have in your underwear door?
As someone who owns a sports bra business and.
Speaker 3 (01:51):
Brand, my drawer is very, very deep. I actually have
multiple of them. Look, I'll preface this with I probably
have four high rotation sports bras, but I would have
thirty or I do have a yeah, a thirty or
forty my collection. I have a friend that's a similar
size that gets all of my bras that have had
(02:14):
to wear test, et cetera. So I try not too wasteful.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
What a good friend.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
And then, just in comparison, how many normal bras do
you have here?
Speaker 3 (02:22):
I'm probably even deeper, I like, because we sell everyday
bras as well, so you've got to have something for
every occasion, you know, to match. Yeah, i'd probably say
the same, maybe forty or fifty so good.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
And have you ever worn a sports bra instead of
a real bra somewhere? Because I do that constantly.
Speaker 3 (02:41):
Absolutely. For my first five years of running my business,
I wore a sports bor almost every day. In fact,
I have an embarrassing story. I probably shouldn't be showing this,
but I will. I remember the first holiday that I
went on with my now husband, I remember him having
to say to me, are you going to pack any
bras that aren't sports bras? So yes, I've definitely been.
(03:06):
I've overworn sports bras for sure.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
I love that I specifically don't buy white, normal clothes
because then you can actually hide the sports brus underneath them.
I feel like you only get busted if you're wearing
something that's like a little bit sheer, like a white shirt,
and you can see the race and back straps of
the sports bra. Otherwise I'm good, all right. So firstly,
the reason I wanted to chat to you today is
(03:30):
because we all know that the girlies love a matching
active wear moment and social media is rife with the
cutest sets, like the matching crops and the tights, which
I absolutely love. But one of my biggest scribes at
the moment, and this is probably because I have naturally
large boobs. I'm like an eight to ten double D
sometimes even an eve I've got my period. But a
lot of the models that they're using on e common
(03:52):
in their campaigns they have breast implants, which is totally fine,
not throwing shade, but fake breast versus real breast obviously
required very different levels of support. And I know for myself,
if I'm wearing a crop top or something, I can
barely drive over a speed bump without having to like
grab onto my chest. So I just want to start
by asking what is the actual difference between a crop
(04:14):
top and a sports bra.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
I'm so glad you asked this question, because I am
incredibly passionate about this good and sometimes I feel like
I'm the only person talking about it. They're completely different
segments of the industry. A sports crop is almost like
a fashion item. It's a patent cut garment from design,
typically made up of sort of one to three individual elements,
(04:39):
it's not built in cup and band sizes, which is
actually really important when it comes to controlling breast displacement.
Typically not lab tested for effectiveness, often mismarketed as sports bras,
like you say, particularly around the fashion brands. And I
truly believe those brands don't even know the difference, Like
(04:59):
they don't know what they don't know. So we need
to kind of look at a sports crop as a
fashion garment. Now, for some cup sizes and some breast densities,
this might be enough for low impact activity like pilates, yoga.
You know, again, I'm not shaming the industry. There's a
place for it, one hundred percent. It's just when people
(05:21):
confuse that with sports bras. Now, a sports br is
a technical piece of apparel. It is built in cup
and band sizes, so ten D, eight G, twenty two F.
And that's really important because a sports brand knows that
it has one job, and that is to function. It's
built that way, and in order to function, a bra
(05:45):
needs to fit. And that's not a fluffy comment from
a passionate brafater of which I am. That is actually
the science behind it. You know, Bryce support us based
on principles of physics and if it doesn't fit, then
it can't work. So what are the other differences A
sports bra will typically be lab tested.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
I had no idea.
Speaker 3 (06:04):
Oh absolutely, this is a really really really big thing
in our industry right now, and it has been for
a decade or so. And sports bras will be designed
with technical fabrics. They're just worlds apart.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
I'm really glad that you define that difference because I
feel like, again, sometimes when you're shopping for cropped sports bras,
they're still listed in support categories and someone I'll have
a look at that, because obviously I wear like Burley's
and Triumph the Triaction when I'm doing like running or
high intensity cardio, and so I would look at that
and just kind of assume, oh, that's a high intensity
(06:40):
sports bra that I could get away with.
Speaker 1 (06:42):
So I'd buy it.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
And then it arrives and I'm like, what I could
not do more than walk in that sports bra.
Speaker 3 (06:47):
One hundred percent? And look, this is why I started
a business. I was working for a technical footwear group
and they used to get sports bras delivered all the
time for us to kind of wet test to range
which they were never going to do. And I was
the only female in head office, and I really noticed
the difference between mean, what some brands we'd call high
impact and what other brands we call high impact. And
(07:09):
then doing a bit of a review on the industry
and sort of realizing that, well, first of all, there's
no rules around this. You can write whatever you like.
You know, not even the industry could agree on what
is it should be defined as a high impact bra.
And yeah, you know, marketing agencies or you know, marketing
(07:30):
arms of these companies wouldn't have a clue about this.
They're just going to stick a label on it, and
higher impact is going to sell.
Speaker 1 (07:38):
One hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
So then what is I'm sure you see hundreds of
women every single week, what is one of the most
common mistakes you see women making when it comes to
them choosing a sports bra.
Speaker 3 (07:48):
Well, the first one is definitely getting the size wrong
because almost I'm going to say almost all women in Australia,
and I don't say that to shame anybody, but it
is the reality. Most women are wearing the wrong size
bra and no career brafter will disagree with me in
saying it's typically that the band around the rib cage
(08:09):
is too loose, so most Australian women wear that one
to two sizes too big and they wear the cups
too small. Whow And if the band is not fitted firmly,
then the bra essentially is not going to have any
integrity on you. It cannot work right. It's like we're
talking about the science and the physics for a bra
to support us, it needs to fit firmly around the
(08:30):
rib cage. So that's probably the biggest mistake. And then
the second mistake is what we've been talking about, you know,
people being in sports crops, being frustrated by not getting
a result and they've just actually bought them on category
without realizing like which, as we've just talked about, is
incredibly easy to do.
Speaker 1 (08:49):
Oh my god, it's so easy to do.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
And I used to when I was starting out, when
I was a lot younger, and before I was I
guess a bit more comfortable with my body and even
had a bit more money that I could spend on
you know, proper sports bras. I would wear two or
three crop tops at a time just to jam right down.
And it reminds me, do you remember the movie God,
I can't even remember the name of it, but it's
she tapes her bus it is and she takes her
(09:15):
boobs down with masking tape, and I swear I was like,
I need to do this.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
That's a genius idea.
Speaker 3 (09:21):
Yeah, I remember that movie, and as somebody who bloomed
early and excessively, I was definitely inspired by that myself.
So yeah, a lot of ladies definitely wearing two bras
when they could easily be wearing one.
Speaker 2 (09:35):
And then what are some of the most common signs
as a wearer that you might be wearing the wrong bra?
Speaker 3 (09:39):
Well, firstly, do you feel like you're getting lackluster support,
because if you do, then there's something wrong. It's probably
the wrong fit because most people don't get that right,
and it's also likely the wrong style. Another sign is
if you get chafing. If you're starting to get those
chafing kind of welts on your skin, that can be
(10:00):
a sign that the bra is no longer fitting you,
will never fit you in the first place.
Speaker 2 (10:04):
God, that's w So I know from personal experience, as
I mentioned before, I have very large natural breasts that
finding the right bride is crucial. But I kind of
want to just let people know. There's some like core
memory that I have in my brain of maybe it
was when I was younger and growing up on TV.
I remember there being an AD and it was showing
a woman running and she didn't have the right breast
(10:26):
support and I'm pretty sure it was like the average
breast bounce between eight and nine centimeters per running step
that you take, and it showed that breast tissue like
repeatedly going up and down. What is the actual impact
of not wearing the right size sportsbra?
Speaker 3 (10:42):
Okay, good question. So I think I know which to
ad you were talking about with a barely AD and
that that was actually a B cup model No so,
and that would be about right and unsupported, and I
think they had either a twelve FEE or fourteen B
in the ad. An unsupported B cup breast could displace
about eight centimeters. The average breast size in Australia at
(11:05):
the moment, we think is about fourteen double Dee. That's
not representative of what comes to my store. That's what
we think the average is in Australia.
Speaker 1 (11:13):
Yes, that's a lot bigger than I would have thought.
Speaker 3 (11:15):
Yeah, most people think that a D cup is a
massive boob in actual factor. A D cup is a
fairly average size breast on a frame double dee. Obviously
we're getting bigger, like a fourteen double D fourteen E.
They found about fourteen centimes of breast displacement in a
low support condition.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
That's like half a ruler what.
Speaker 3 (11:38):
And that's the difference in breast movement or displacement to
your torso movement and displacement. So yeah, it's quite quite significant.
There's a word that we use in the industry. It's
literally like a scientific technical word called breast slap, which
is like that jerking moment, that jerking motion that your
(12:00):
breast makes, and when your breast moves at a fast
kind of velocity fourteen centimeters and then rapidly changes direction
like for me, it's like a jerk, like it's like
a whiplash, you know. But yeah, it can be really aggressive,
and that's one of the reasons why so many women
just stopt out of activity altogether.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
I never even thought of that, but that is such
a deterrence I think, especially if you ask someone with
a bigger bust, it would just kind of stop you
from doing it in the first place. So asides from
obviously pain and discomfort because that would just like without
a give and that would hurt. Is that going to
cause things like saggy breasts?
Speaker 3 (12:37):
Good question. I kind of love this question and I
kind of hate it, but it is a good question
because it's what people want to know. Like the truth is,
we'll never be able to say that it will cause
breast sag because they will never be able to produce
this study that will eliminate all the other factors that
cause breast sagging or breast toosis, so aging, weight loss, weight,
(12:58):
going hormones, you know, breastfeeding, all those things, smoking alcohol.
The skin is one of our natural support structures and
the Cooper's ligaments, right, they're both weak and irreversibly damaged.
So if we are straining our skin every time we
sort of leap or move during activity, then there is
(13:21):
this consensus in the industry that that repeated strain is
going to cause that irreversible damage, which, once our skin
stops supporting us, will result in sag. So we don't
use this as like a marketing kind of tactic. I
don't like playing on people's insecurity. So that's why I
say I kind of hate the question because I don't
(13:41):
like talking about it, but you know that is fairly real.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
Yeah, yeah, it's kind of like fear mongering.
Speaker 2 (13:48):
But I think that there's always been similar discussions happening
online about even the effects on skin when it's something
like walking versus running, and how people say the impact
on your joints and your skin and everything kind of
moving a lot, obviously more aggressively and intensely when you're
doing something higher impact versus lower impact. It's kind of
irregardless of what body part you're talking about. Yeah, high
(14:08):
that pact is going to take its time no matter
what you're doing. Sure, so let's talk about sizing. Do
you need to get professionally fitted for a.
Speaker 3 (14:18):
Sports bra Obviously I think that is the gold standard,
But obviously not everybody has that available to them, and
in some instances, like a poorly trained brafter or a
brafter with not enough experience is actually going to do
more damage than good. So if you have a reputable,
trustworthy brafter available to that has a broad range of
(14:40):
sizes and brands, then that's going to be your gold standard.
But look, there are also a plethora of resources on
the internet. We have a lot of videos on our website,
trying to educate people about how to measure themselves, how
bra needs to fit, and why you know, benefits of
underwire versus why free, et cetera. So you know, we
(15:02):
do these days have a really good opportunity to educate
ourselves and make better informed buying choices online as well.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
And then how often in your lifetime. I suppose after
you've kind of stopped growing, maybe in your earlier twenties,
should you recur to get fitted because I know that.
I mean, obviously it goes without saying that something like
if you have a baby or you're stopping breastfeeding, your
breasts are going to change sizes. But I even think
about myself in a month period and my breast can move,
like in terms of sizing by half or one size
(15:33):
period versus non period.
Speaker 3 (15:35):
Yeah, sure, I remember seeing a stat somewhere. Don't ask
me to quote where, but three kilos in weight change
can change our braw size. So it depends where we're
losing it, you know, where where we're shifting it as
an example, or putting it on. So I think you know,
that's another thing to consider. It's not just about like
how often we should check in. It's like what changes
(15:57):
have happened to our body. So definitely the major milestones
after having a baby, you know, or whatever it might be.
But just be honest with yourself. If your shape has changed,
you know, three, five, ten kilos, go and get a
bra fitting, because like you'll feel better for it. You know,
you can only win out of the out of the experience.
Speaker 2 (16:17):
I also want to talk about what is the average
life cycle or expiration date associated to a bra, because
I feel like a lot of people can relate to
the fact that when you find something. I have like
particular items, especially in my underwear drawer that I really
hyper fixate on due to things like how comfortable they are,
how much you know they support you. But then you
can really see them starting to go. They might have
(16:39):
holes in them, they might have lost their color. When
is it time to say goodbye?
Speaker 3 (16:44):
Okay? So, if you have a bra in high rotation,
so by that, I mean if you're washing wearing it,
you know, maybe an average of two to three times
a week. It should never celebrate a birthday. Most bras don't.
They die kind of silently, right if things like hooks
have gone underwires snapped, or poking through unless there's been
(17:06):
a traumatic incident involved in that. If those are those
things are starting to happen, I can tell you right now,
the materials went a long time ago. And it's often
not until you put on a new bra that you realize, wow,
that one was doing nothing. You know, same size, same style,
But yeah, just having a bra with you know, firmer,
(17:28):
non stretched out fabrics makes a really big difference to
the support. So and that's what it's all about. Like
a bra, you know, we don't tell you to replace
your bras for funny games. It's because the material stretches
out and the bra no longer fits you, and if
it doesn't fit you in no longer supports you. And
these things happen so gradually. It's hard to tell.
Speaker 2 (17:49):
It's so wild because you really notice it with something
like a pair of sandshoes or sneakers, because you can
actively feel it underneath your feet. But for some reason,
you just don't think about that when it comes to
a bra.
Speaker 3 (17:59):
Totally, and because it's hidden. It's like that thing that
you know, it's that kind of slightly little shit ful
thing like you know, I shouldn't be replacing this, but yeah,
I can hide it that's another that's a problem for
another day.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
And then in that same vein, this is like a
teeny bit of a side note, but how often should
we be washing sports bras and also bras. I feel
like bras are something that I wash quite sparingly, but
sports bras, if it's something i've done for high intensity,
obviously that's getting washed straight after I wear it.
Speaker 1 (18:26):
But something like a crop top, I might stretch it
out again.
Speaker 3 (18:29):
Yeah, totally. Look the thing with washing our bras, particularly
if we're machine washing them, which we shouldn't do, right,
let's go there in a moment, it's all about, uh,
it's all about protecting the fabrics because again, the fabrics
is what helps the bra fit us. So if we've
(18:50):
had a seriously high intensity session or if we've sweated
a lot, whether that be an everyday bra or sports bra,
we've got to get that sweat off those fabrics because
it's going to damage them, you know, prematurely. So if
you've had a sweaty session, then definitely wash your bra
after that. If you haven't, then give it a miss.
Like if the materials aren't going to be risked, then yeah,
(19:14):
you can absolutely go sessions without washing and washing it
will again put tension on the fabrics. That kind of
twisting that in a washing machine that absolutely reduces the
lifespan of the product, Like it's not designed to go
through those three ars.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
Oh my god.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
Okay, let's talk about that for a second, because I
know washing machines are very aggressive. If you've ever had
an underwire bra in a washing machine, you will hear
it from two doors down in your house. But when
I used to work for an active ray brand, I
won't say which one, but we were taught to tell
customers to color lock their sports bras by putting a
pinch of salt in the machine with their sports brother
(19:54):
first time they washed it.
Speaker 1 (19:56):
But is that all incorrect?
Speaker 3 (19:58):
I honestly wouldn't even know. I've never said that to
a customer. But our customers aren't shopping with us to
maintain the color of their product. They're there for kind
of serious support. So color is second pilarity to that.
But look, the vast majority of the products that we
sell technical products are all hand wash only because they're
(20:19):
just simply not designed for the rigors of a washing machine.
Like and for some reason, I don't know if people
get frustrated by that. But then you know, if you
think if you've got a sequin top or you know,
imagine if you had a top that had like underwires
stitched on the outside of it. You never put that
in a washing machine, right, But yet we expect our
(20:40):
bra to cope with it. So even you know, people
will try and talk me into letting them do it.
Like what if I put it in a washbag and
put it on a gentle cycle, and I just say, sure,
if you're happy to replace it, absolutely no worries. But
if you're not going to be happy replacing your product
if the underwey snaps or the hook bends or something
(21:00):
which it still can do in a washbag, then don't
do it.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
Wow, well, I would just be worried that.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
I know this is probably TMI as well, but sometimes
when I do a really high intensity session, my sports
wear stinks. I feel like if I handwash that would
I be getting the smell out.
Speaker 3 (21:16):
I think that all comes down to you to do,
is what it is. I don't know. I think it
comes out.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
To problem.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
And then out of curiosity, I'm just fascinated to know
what sports bras do you wear?
Speaker 1 (21:30):
What are your faves.
Speaker 3 (21:32):
Ooh, okay, my high rotation sports bras right now, the
Fantasy Elevate, which is quite a new br it's just
hit the market. I've been wear testing it for a
little while and now it's available, so I'm very excited
about that. It's a DTA H cup underwire sports bra.
I love it. My second favorite is the Anita Active Dynamics.
This I use for pilates and I do a low skiing.
(21:54):
It's Razor BAC, it's why free. It's comfortable for long periods.
I love it, and it's also high impact. And thirdly,
the Panache Endurance, which is an absolute work of the Brow.
I think it's D to jcap. Yeah, just love it.
Everybody loves that brow when they try it install.
Speaker 1 (22:11):
I love that so much.
Speaker 2 (22:12):
And you actually just raised a very valid point that
I want to ask you just before you finish up,
in the same way that we have different sets of
sneakers to different kinds of activity. So I know some
people where there's obviously more the fashion sneaker, like the
ninety to twenty New Balances, and then there's something like
the Hokers for running. Should we be looking at our
sports bars in a similar way in matching them to activities.
Speaker 3 (22:30):
Look in an ideal world, yes, but most people don't
really have the budget for that, particularly if they're investing
in quality pieces. So look, I mean to break it down.
If you have low impact activities that you do throughout
the week and high impact activities that you do throughout
the week, ideally you would be in something high impact
(22:51):
for your high impact stuff and low impact for your
lower impact stuff. That's going to preserve the life of
each garment as well, and you're going to have just
a better experience. But if you don't have that in
your budget, then just going with ticking the high impact
box and wearing it for your low impact activities, that
suffices as well. For me, I have a very deep
(23:11):
draw of sports bras, which means I do get to
perfectly match my bra for the activity. You know, As
an example, I do a lot of skiing and there
is only one bra that I'm comfortable in with. You know,
with that, I can't transfer other bras into the mix.
But I've got that luxury. So if you have the luxury,
then yes, kind of purposely choosing particular features to match
(23:33):
the sport is ideal. But you know, that it is
a bit of a tricky one to wrap your head around.
Speaker 1 (23:39):
I love it so real.
Speaker 2 (23:40):
And then just to finish off, what is one piece
of lasting advice or takeaway information you would want everyone
listening to this podcast to take away.
Speaker 3 (23:47):
I've already said it, but I want to hone in.
If it doesn't fit, it can't function. And don't kid
yourself like this is science, so you if you can't
talk yourself into the fact that something fits, just yeah,
get fitted and experience the better fit of a bra
that actually fits that will in turn function.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
Love it, Tish Tilly, thank you so much for your time.
Before you finish, can you just let everyone listening know
where they can find a little bit more about you?
Speaker 3 (24:16):
Oh? Thank you? So. My business is she Science. We
specialize in sports bras for cupsizes A through K and
band sizes six through twenty four. We also do a
really big range of beautiful, supportive, everyday bras and you
can find us at shescience dot com dot au On there,
we also have a quiz that can help guide you
(24:37):
into good product for you. Like I mentioned earlier, lots
of video resources to try and help the bribuying experience online,
try and make that a bit easier.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
Love it and I'll put all of those links in
the show notes so you can easily find them. Thank
you so much again for your time, such a pleasure
chatting to you nice.
Speaker 3 (24:55):
Thanks for having me Phoebe.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
I loved it. Thank you so much for listening.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
Guys, I really hope you enjoyed the episode, and don't
forget to help a sister out. Follow the podcast on
Apple or on Spotify or wherever you listen to your podcasts.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
Rate it, write me.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
A review, and if you want more Finish, we do
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Apodje Production. Welcome to fit Ish.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
I'm Phoebe Parsons and this is the podcast that proves
that you don't have to choose between staying fit and
having fun. Welcome to the show at Tish Tilley from
She signs to talk about something I have been dying
to talk about on the show for literally years, and
that is sports Bras, but more specifically some mistakes.
Speaker 1 (00:33):
That you might be making.
Speaker 3 (00:34):
Thank you for having me. Obviously, I'm very passionate about
this as co founder of a sports Bras store, so
hoping I can share some gems with you today.
Speaker 1 (00:44):
I cannot wait.
Speaker 3 (00:45):
Now.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
I have actually prepared a couple of ice breakers before
we jump in, just given the nature of the topic,
before we get into the pardon my French, the titties
and the boobs, I just thought we could start with
some fun little icebreakers. So firstly, have you ever had
a sports bra faux po or like a little nipslit moment?
Speaker 3 (01:03):
You know what? I haven't, which I'm very glad about,
but I have heard of many so, particularly with washing
machine disasters etc. We've heard all of the worst.
Speaker 2 (01:15):
Well, I guess that just further endorses your expertise in
the area. Then, as someone who works in a gym,
I've actually seen a lot of nip slips and I
have just it happens a lot actually in reformer pilates,
and I think people must not, you know, when they're
using their strap and they're pulling it over. I've had
someone with one entire boob expos and you just walk
(01:35):
over and you're.
Speaker 1 (01:36):
Like, Oh, I just wanted to let you know. You know,
it's like girl code.
Speaker 3 (01:40):
I'm sure she would have appreciated that.
Speaker 1 (01:42):
One hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (01:43):
This one's more so just for my curiosity, how many
sports bras do you currently have in your underwear door?
As someone who owns a sports bra business and.
Speaker 3 (01:51):
Brand, my drawer is very, very deep. I actually have
multiple of them. Look, I'll preface this with I probably
have four high rotation sports bras, but I would have
thirty or I do have a yeah, a thirty or
forty my collection. I have a friend that's a similar
size that gets all of my bras that have had
(02:14):
to wear test, et cetera. So I try not too wasteful.
Speaker 1 (02:18):
What a good friend.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
And then, just in comparison, how many normal bras do
you have here?
Speaker 3 (02:22):
I'm probably even deeper, I like, because we sell everyday
bras as well, so you've got to have something for
every occasion, you know, to match. Yeah, i'd probably say
the same, maybe forty or fifty so good.
Speaker 2 (02:35):
And have you ever worn a sports bra instead of
a real bra somewhere? Because I do that constantly.
Speaker 3 (02:41):
Absolutely. For my first five years of running my business,
I wore a sports bor almost every day. In fact,
I have an embarrassing story. I probably shouldn't be showing this,
but I will. I remember the first holiday that I
went on with my now husband, I remember him having
to say to me, are you going to pack any
bras that aren't sports bras? So yes, I've definitely been.
(03:06):
I've overworn sports bras for sure.
Speaker 2 (03:09):
I love that I specifically don't buy white, normal clothes
because then you can actually hide the sports brus underneath them.
I feel like you only get busted if you're wearing
something that's like a little bit sheer, like a white shirt,
and you can see the race and back straps of
the sports bra. Otherwise I'm good, all right. So firstly,
the reason I wanted to chat to you today is
(03:30):
because we all know that the girlies love a matching
active wear moment and social media is rife with the
cutest sets, like the matching crops and the tights, which
I absolutely love. But one of my biggest scribes at
the moment, and this is probably because I have naturally
large boobs. I'm like an eight to ten double D
sometimes even an eve I've got my period. But a
lot of the models that they're using on e common
(03:52):
in their campaigns they have breast implants, which is totally fine,
not throwing shade, but fake breast versus real breast obviously
required very different levels of support. And I know for myself,
if I'm wearing a crop top or something, I can
barely drive over a speed bump without having to like
grab onto my chest. So I just want to start
by asking what is the actual difference between a crop
(04:14):
top and a sports bra.
Speaker 3 (04:16):
I'm so glad you asked this question, because I am
incredibly passionate about this good and sometimes I feel like
I'm the only person talking about it. They're completely different
segments of the industry. A sports crop is almost like
a fashion item. It's a patent cut garment from design,
typically made up of sort of one to three individual elements,
(04:39):
it's not built in cup and band sizes, which is
actually really important when it comes to controlling breast displacement.
Typically not lab tested for effectiveness, often mismarketed as sports bras,
like you say, particularly around the fashion brands. And I
truly believe those brands don't even know the difference, Like
(04:59):
they don't know what they don't know. So we need
to kind of look at a sports crop as a
fashion garment. Now, for some cup sizes and some breast densities,
this might be enough for low impact activity like pilates, yoga.
You know, again, I'm not shaming the industry. There's a
place for it, one hundred percent. It's just when people
(05:21):
confuse that with sports bras. Now, a sports br is
a technical piece of apparel. It is built in cup
and band sizes, so ten D, eight G, twenty two F.
And that's really important because a sports brand knows that
it has one job, and that is to function. It's
built that way, and in order to function, a bra
(05:45):
needs to fit. And that's not a fluffy comment from
a passionate brafater of which I am. That is actually
the science behind it. You know, Bryce support us based
on principles of physics and if it doesn't fit, then
it can't work. So what are the other differences A
sports bra will typically be lab tested.
Speaker 1 (06:03):
I had no idea.
Speaker 3 (06:04):
Oh absolutely, this is a really really really big thing
in our industry right now, and it has been for
a decade or so. And sports bras will be designed
with technical fabrics. They're just worlds apart.
Speaker 2 (06:18):
I'm really glad that you define that difference because I
feel like, again, sometimes when you're shopping for cropped sports bras,
they're still listed in support categories and someone I'll have
a look at that, because obviously I wear like Burley's
and Triumph the Triaction when I'm doing like running or
high intensity cardio, and so I would look at that
and just kind of assume, oh, that's a high intensity
(06:40):
sports bra that I could get away with.
Speaker 1 (06:42):
So I'd buy it.
Speaker 2 (06:42):
And then it arrives and I'm like, what I could
not do more than walk in that sports bra.
Speaker 3 (06:47):
One hundred percent? And look, this is why I started
a business. I was working for a technical footwear group
and they used to get sports bras delivered all the
time for us to kind of wet test to range
which they were never going to do. And I was
the only female in head office, and I really noticed
the difference between mean, what some brands we'd call high
impact and what other brands we call high impact. And
(07:09):
then doing a bit of a review on the industry
and sort of realizing that, well, first of all, there's
no rules around this. You can write whatever you like.
You know, not even the industry could agree on what
is it should be defined as a high impact bra.
And yeah, you know, marketing agencies or you know, marketing
(07:30):
arms of these companies wouldn't have a clue about this.
They're just going to stick a label on it, and
higher impact is going to sell.
Speaker 1 (07:38):
One hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (07:39):
So then what is I'm sure you see hundreds of
women every single week, what is one of the most
common mistakes you see women making when it comes to
them choosing a sports bra.
Speaker 3 (07:48):
Well, the first one is definitely getting the size wrong
because almost I'm going to say almost all women in Australia,
and I don't say that to shame anybody, but it
is the reality. Most women are wearing the wrong size
bra and no career brafter will disagree with me in
saying it's typically that the band around the rib cage
(08:09):
is too loose, so most Australian women wear that one
to two sizes too big and they wear the cups
too small. Whow And if the band is not fitted firmly,
then the bra essentially is not going to have any
integrity on you. It cannot work right. It's like we're
talking about the science and the physics for a bra
to support us, it needs to fit firmly around the
(08:30):
rib cage. So that's probably the biggest mistake. And then
the second mistake is what we've been talking about, you know,
people being in sports crops, being frustrated by not getting
a result and they've just actually bought them on category
without realizing like which, as we've just talked about, is
incredibly easy to do.
Speaker 1 (08:49):
Oh my god, it's so easy to do.
Speaker 2 (08:50):
And I used to when I was starting out, when
I was a lot younger, and before I was I
guess a bit more comfortable with my body and even
had a bit more money that I could spend on
you know, proper sports bras. I would wear two or
three crop tops at a time just to jam right down.
And it reminds me, do you remember the movie God,
I can't even remember the name of it, but it's
she tapes her bus it is and she takes her
(09:15):
boobs down with masking tape, and I swear I was like,
I need to do this.
Speaker 1 (09:19):
That's a genius idea.
Speaker 3 (09:21):
Yeah, I remember that movie, and as somebody who bloomed
early and excessively, I was definitely inspired by that myself.
So yeah, a lot of ladies definitely wearing two bras
when they could easily be wearing one.
Speaker 2 (09:35):
And then what are some of the most common signs
as a wearer that you might be wearing the wrong bra?
Speaker 3 (09:39):
Well, firstly, do you feel like you're getting lackluster support,
because if you do, then there's something wrong. It's probably
the wrong fit because most people don't get that right,
and it's also likely the wrong style. Another sign is
if you get chafing. If you're starting to get those
chafing kind of welts on your skin, that can be
(10:00):
a sign that the bra is no longer fitting you,
will never fit you in the first place.
Speaker 2 (10:04):
God, that's w So I know from personal experience, as
I mentioned before, I have very large natural breasts that
finding the right bride is crucial. But I kind of
want to just let people know. There's some like core
memory that I have in my brain of maybe it
was when I was younger and growing up on TV.
I remember there being an AD and it was showing
a woman running and she didn't have the right breast
(10:26):
support and I'm pretty sure it was like the average
breast bounce between eight and nine centimeters per running step
that you take, and it showed that breast tissue like
repeatedly going up and down. What is the actual impact
of not wearing the right size sportsbra?
Speaker 3 (10:42):
Okay, good question. So I think I know which to
ad you were talking about with a barely AD and
that that was actually a B cup model No so,
and that would be about right and unsupported, and I
think they had either a twelve FEE or fourteen B
in the ad. An unsupported B cup breast could displace
about eight centimeters. The average breast size in Australia at
(11:05):
the moment, we think is about fourteen double Dee. That's
not representative of what comes to my store. That's what
we think the average is in Australia.
Speaker 1 (11:13):
Yes, that's a lot bigger than I would have thought.
Speaker 3 (11:15):
Yeah, most people think that a D cup is a
massive boob in actual factor. A D cup is a
fairly average size breast on a frame double dee. Obviously
we're getting bigger, like a fourteen double D fourteen E.
They found about fourteen centimes of breast displacement in a
low support condition.
Speaker 1 (11:35):
That's like half a ruler what.
Speaker 3 (11:38):
And that's the difference in breast movement or displacement to
your torso movement and displacement. So yeah, it's quite quite significant.
There's a word that we use in the industry. It's
literally like a scientific technical word called breast slap, which
is like that jerking moment, that jerking motion that your
(12:00):
breast makes, and when your breast moves at a fast
kind of velocity fourteen centimeters and then rapidly changes direction
like for me, it's like a jerk, like it's like
a whiplash, you know. But yeah, it can be really aggressive,
and that's one of the reasons why so many women
just stopt out of activity altogether.
Speaker 2 (12:20):
I never even thought of that, but that is such
a deterrence I think, especially if you ask someone with
a bigger bust, it would just kind of stop you
from doing it in the first place. So asides from
obviously pain and discomfort because that would just like without
a give and that would hurt. Is that going to
cause things like saggy breasts?
Speaker 3 (12:37):
Good question. I kind of love this question and I
kind of hate it, but it is a good question
because it's what people want to know. Like the truth is,
we'll never be able to say that it will cause
breast sag because they will never be able to produce
this study that will eliminate all the other factors that
cause breast sagging or breast toosis, so aging, weight loss, weight,
(12:58):
going hormones, you know, breastfeeding, all those things, smoking alcohol.
The skin is one of our natural support structures and
the Cooper's ligaments, right, they're both weak and irreversibly damaged.
So if we are straining our skin every time we
sort of leap or move during activity, then there is
(13:21):
this consensus in the industry that that repeated strain is
going to cause that irreversible damage, which, once our skin
stops supporting us, will result in sag. So we don't
use this as like a marketing kind of tactic. I
don't like playing on people's insecurity. So that's why I
say I kind of hate the question because I don't
(13:41):
like talking about it, but you know that is fairly real.
Speaker 1 (13:46):
Yeah, yeah, it's kind of like fear mongering.
Speaker 2 (13:48):
But I think that there's always been similar discussions happening
online about even the effects on skin when it's something
like walking versus running, and how people say the impact
on your joints and your skin and everything kind of
moving a lot, obviously more aggressively and intensely when you're
doing something higher impact versus lower impact. It's kind of
irregardless of what body part you're talking about. Yeah, high
(14:08):
that pact is going to take its time no matter
what you're doing. Sure, so let's talk about sizing. Do
you need to get professionally fitted for a.
Speaker 3 (14:18):
Sports bra Obviously I think that is the gold standard,
But obviously not everybody has that available to them, and
in some instances, like a poorly trained brafter or a
brafter with not enough experience is actually going to do
more damage than good. So if you have a reputable,
trustworthy brafter available to that has a broad range of
(14:40):
sizes and brands, then that's going to be your gold standard.
But look, there are also a plethora of resources on
the internet. We have a lot of videos on our website,
trying to educate people about how to measure themselves, how
bra needs to fit, and why you know, benefits of
underwire versus why free, et cetera. So you know, we
(15:02):
do these days have a really good opportunity to educate
ourselves and make better informed buying choices online as well.
Speaker 2 (15:10):
And then how often in your lifetime. I suppose after
you've kind of stopped growing, maybe in your earlier twenties,
should you recur to get fitted because I know that.
I mean, obviously it goes without saying that something like
if you have a baby or you're stopping breastfeeding, your
breasts are going to change sizes. But I even think
about myself in a month period and my breast can move,
like in terms of sizing by half or one size
(15:33):
period versus non period.
Speaker 3 (15:35):
Yeah, sure, I remember seeing a stat somewhere. Don't ask
me to quote where, but three kilos in weight change
can change our braw size. So it depends where we're
losing it, you know, where where we're shifting it as
an example, or putting it on. So I think you know,
that's another thing to consider. It's not just about like
how often we should check in. It's like what changes
(15:57):
have happened to our body. So definitely the major milestones
after having a baby, you know, or whatever it might be.
But just be honest with yourself. If your shape has changed,
you know, three, five, ten kilos, go and get a
bra fitting, because like you'll feel better for it. You know,
you can only win out of the out of the experience.
Speaker 2 (16:17):
I also want to talk about what is the average
life cycle or expiration date associated to a bra, because
I feel like a lot of people can relate to
the fact that when you find something. I have like
particular items, especially in my underwear drawer that I really
hyper fixate on due to things like how comfortable they are,
how much you know they support you. But then you
can really see them starting to go. They might have
(16:39):
holes in them, they might have lost their color. When
is it time to say goodbye?
Speaker 3 (16:44):
Okay? So, if you have a bra in high rotation,
so by that, I mean if you're washing wearing it,
you know, maybe an average of two to three times
a week. It should never celebrate a birthday. Most bras don't.
They die kind of silently, right if things like hooks
have gone underwires snapped, or poking through unless there's been
(17:06):
a traumatic incident involved in that. If those are those
things are starting to happen, I can tell you right now,
the materials went a long time ago. And it's often
not until you put on a new bra that you realize, wow,
that one was doing nothing. You know, same size, same style,
But yeah, just having a bra with you know, firmer,
(17:28):
non stretched out fabrics makes a really big difference to
the support. So and that's what it's all about. Like
a bra, you know, we don't tell you to replace
your bras for funny games. It's because the material stretches
out and the bra no longer fits you, and if
it doesn't fit you in no longer supports you. And
these things happen so gradually. It's hard to tell.
Speaker 2 (17:49):
It's so wild because you really notice it with something
like a pair of sandshoes or sneakers, because you can
actively feel it underneath your feet. But for some reason,
you just don't think about that when it comes to
a bra.
Speaker 3 (17:59):
Totally, and because it's hidden. It's like that thing that
you know, it's that kind of slightly little shit ful
thing like you know, I shouldn't be replacing this, but yeah,
I can hide it that's another that's a problem for
another day.
Speaker 2 (18:12):
And then in that same vein, this is like a
teeny bit of a side note, but how often should
we be washing sports bras and also bras. I feel
like bras are something that I wash quite sparingly, but
sports bras, if it's something i've done for high intensity,
obviously that's getting washed straight after I wear it.
Speaker 1 (18:26):
But something like a crop top, I might stretch it
out again.
Speaker 3 (18:29):
Yeah, totally. Look the thing with washing our bras, particularly
if we're machine washing them, which we shouldn't do, right,
let's go there in a moment, it's all about, uh,
it's all about protecting the fabrics because again, the fabrics
is what helps the bra fit us. So if we've
(18:50):
had a seriously high intensity session or if we've sweated
a lot, whether that be an everyday bra or sports bra,
we've got to get that sweat off those fabrics because
it's going to damage them, you know, prematurely. So if
you've had a sweaty session, then definitely wash your bra
after that. If you haven't, then give it a miss.
Like if the materials aren't going to be risked, then yeah,
(19:14):
you can absolutely go sessions without washing and washing it
will again put tension on the fabrics. That kind of
twisting that in a washing machine that absolutely reduces the
lifespan of the product, Like it's not designed to go
through those three ars.
Speaker 1 (19:33):
Oh my god.
Speaker 2 (19:34):
Okay, let's talk about that for a second, because I
know washing machines are very aggressive. If you've ever had
an underwire bra in a washing machine, you will hear
it from two doors down in your house. But when
I used to work for an active ray brand, I
won't say which one, but we were taught to tell
customers to color lock their sports bras by putting a
pinch of salt in the machine with their sports brother
(19:54):
first time they washed it.
Speaker 1 (19:56):
But is that all incorrect?
Speaker 3 (19:58):
I honestly wouldn't even know. I've never said that to
a customer. But our customers aren't shopping with us to
maintain the color of their product. They're there for kind
of serious support. So color is second pilarity to that.
But look, the vast majority of the products that we
sell technical products are all hand wash only because they're
(20:19):
just simply not designed for the rigors of a washing machine.
Like and for some reason, I don't know if people
get frustrated by that. But then you know, if you
think if you've got a sequin top or you know,
imagine if you had a top that had like underwires
stitched on the outside of it. You never put that
in a washing machine, right, But yet we expect our
(20:40):
bra to cope with it. So even you know, people
will try and talk me into letting them do it.
Like what if I put it in a washbag and
put it on a gentle cycle, and I just say, sure,
if you're happy to replace it, absolutely no worries. But
if you're not going to be happy replacing your product
if the underwey snaps or the hook bends or something
(21:00):
which it still can do in a washbag, then don't
do it.
Speaker 1 (21:04):
Wow, well, I would just be worried that.
Speaker 2 (21:06):
I know this is probably TMI as well, but sometimes
when I do a really high intensity session, my sports
wear stinks. I feel like if I handwash that would
I be getting the smell out.
Speaker 3 (21:16):
I think that all comes down to you to do,
is what it is. I don't know. I think it
comes out.
Speaker 1 (21:23):
To problem.
Speaker 2 (21:26):
And then out of curiosity, I'm just fascinated to know
what sports bras do you wear?
Speaker 1 (21:30):
What are your faves.
Speaker 3 (21:32):
Ooh, okay, my high rotation sports bras right now, the
Fantasy Elevate, which is quite a new br it's just
hit the market. I've been wear testing it for a
little while and now it's available, so I'm very excited
about that. It's a DTA H cup underwire sports bra.
I love it. My second favorite is the Anita Active Dynamics.
This I use for pilates and I do a low skiing.
(21:54):
It's Razor BAC, it's why free. It's comfortable for long periods.
I love it, and it's also high impact. And thirdly,
the Panache Endurance, which is an absolute work of the Brow.
I think it's D to jcap. Yeah, just love it.
Everybody loves that brow when they try it install.
Speaker 1 (22:11):
I love that so much.
Speaker 2 (22:12):
And you actually just raised a very valid point that
I want to ask you just before you finish up,
in the same way that we have different sets of
sneakers to different kinds of activity. So I know some
people where there's obviously more the fashion sneaker, like the
ninety to twenty New Balances, and then there's something like
the Hokers for running. Should we be looking at our
sports bars in a similar way in matching them to activities.
Speaker 3 (22:30):
Look in an ideal world, yes, but most people don't
really have the budget for that, particularly if they're investing
in quality pieces. So look, I mean to break it down.
If you have low impact activities that you do throughout
the week and high impact activities that you do throughout
the week, ideally you would be in something high impact
(22:51):
for your high impact stuff and low impact for your
lower impact stuff. That's going to preserve the life of
each garment as well, and you're going to have just
a better experience. But if you don't have that in
your budget, then just going with ticking the high impact
box and wearing it for your low impact activities, that
suffices as well. For me, I have a very deep
(23:11):
draw of sports bras, which means I do get to
perfectly match my bra for the activity. You know, As
an example, I do a lot of skiing and there
is only one bra that I'm comfortable in with. You know,
with that, I can't transfer other bras into the mix.
But I've got that luxury. So if you have the luxury,
then yes, kind of purposely choosing particular features to match
(23:33):
the sport is ideal. But you know, that it is
a bit of a tricky one to wrap your head around.
Speaker 1 (23:39):
I love it so real.
Speaker 2 (23:40):
And then just to finish off, what is one piece
of lasting advice or takeaway information you would want everyone
listening to this podcast to take away.
Speaker 3 (23:47):
I've already said it, but I want to hone in.
If it doesn't fit, it can't function. And don't kid
yourself like this is science, so you if you can't
talk yourself into the fact that something fits, just yeah,
get fitted and experience the better fit of a bra
that actually fits that will in turn function.
Speaker 2 (24:09):
Love it, Tish Tilly, thank you so much for your time.
Before you finish, can you just let everyone listening know
where they can find a little bit more about you?
Speaker 3 (24:16):
Oh? Thank you? So. My business is she Science. We
specialize in sports bras for cupsizes A through K and
band sizes six through twenty four. We also do a
really big range of beautiful, supportive, everyday bras and you
can find us at shescience dot com dot au On there,
we also have a quiz that can help guide you
(24:37):
into good product for you. Like I mentioned earlier, lots
of video resources to try and help the bribuying experience online,
try and make that a bit easier.
Speaker 2 (24:47):
Love it and I'll put all of those links in
the show notes so you can easily find them. Thank
you so much again for your time, such a pleasure
chatting to you nice.
Speaker 3 (24:55):
Thanks for having me Phoebe.
Speaker 1 (24:56):
I loved it. Thank you so much for listening.
Speaker 2 (25:00):
Guys, I really hope you enjoyed the episode, and don't
forget to help a sister out. Follow the podcast on
Apple or on Spotify or wherever you listen to your podcasts.
Speaker 1 (25:09):
Rate it, write me.
Speaker 2 (25:10):
A review, and if you want more Finish, we do
have a private Facebook group. There is going to be
exclusive Q and A is happening with my guests in
that group. That's going to be events going live first,
so much fun stuff happening. Just look up fit ish
in brackets on Facebook and you can be part of
the Finish online community
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I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com