November 30, 2021 • 39 mins
A brand-new lineup, a brand-new pop music scene, and a brand-new name. Our guys give the big time another swing, and get closer to a hit than ever before. Dave gets the scoop on the turn-of-the-millennium version of Sudden Impact, and makes contact with one of the most unforgettable faces in music video history. Warning: this episode will put your heart in motion.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:04):
How did you feel about the style of the group
and how that sort of evolved.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Yeah, so I was I was definitely the outsider of
the Outsiders just because like they called me tiger Beat
because I was I don't have any edge, right, like
like Todd Allen and and even Jimmy, you know, like
they all kind of grew up in a I don't know,
(00:30):
there were military kids, and they grew up in around
with different culture than I did.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
This right here is Jason Dowdy. When Aaron Kane and
his brother Noel left Sudden Impact, which by then was
called the Outsiders, Jason is one of the new guys
who took their place, and for the rest of the group,
the first order of business was to dirty him up
a little.
Speaker 3 (00:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
So when I joined the group, they kind of had
to give me a makeover, you know a little bit. Yeah,
and like what like how oh, like you know, get
like Jibo jeans and Iceberg and I don't know all
this stuff in the.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
Time, sure, all giant giant jeans.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
Yeah, yeah, I had my jeans that I had at
the time were more Jimko than Chirpo, you know what
I mean.
Speaker 5 (01:12):
Yeah, But what I got there, I got there.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
Yeah, Jason didn't know he'd be a part of the
version of Sudden Impact that came the closest to fulfilling
the promise of the Motown Philly Moment, the version that
finally got a whole song on a movie soundtrack, The
version that finally appeared in music videos for its own music.
These Outsiders for live videos are on YouTube, by the way,
And in the one I'm looking at right now, the
(01:35):
one that you will not believe me when I tell
you who directed it, Sweet Tiger Beat, Jason is definitely
all decked out and bad boy tank tops and do
rags and wide leg jeans. He exhales blunt smoke and
when you look, you don't even have to look that closely,
you see it. The blunt smoke is cgi. We'll talk
to Sweet Jason Dowdy Tiger Beat, the new guy in
(01:57):
Sudden Impact, about his life in the group's final stretch,
the Outsiders for Life years. He'll take us into the
inevitable tragic drug chapter of the story.
Speaker 4 (02:06):
Every group has one.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
And since we're taking some big swings lately, if we
are really chiseling out Mount Rushmore of early nineties music
video special guest performers. I have found the daddy of
them all. No, I have found the zaddy of them all.
I've reached out to an unforgettable face from a nineteen
ninety one music video, someone I have always wanted to
track down, and baby, Baby, you will not believe who
(02:30):
I have got for you. This is Waiting for Impact,
a Dave Holmes pasion project. By the late nineties, the
(02:56):
group that had started as Two Special became White Hot Empty,
famous as Sudden Impact, got renamed White Guys, and later
rebranded themselves.
Speaker 4 (03:04):
The Outsiders began to implode.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
After being pulled off of Capital and then dropped from
BIV ten Records. Their third record label, Stone Creek, just
folded entirely, putting them right back to square one. Brothers
Aaron and Noel Kine left the group to start a
new one, and their empty seats got taken by two
young singers, Jimmy Marble and Jason Dowdy.
Speaker 4 (03:26):
How are you good, Dave good good?
Speaker 5 (03:29):
Where are you in well OneD Ontario where we have
free healthcare?
Speaker 4 (03:33):
Oh? Come on, good thinking.
Speaker 1 (03:35):
When we talk, Jason Dowdy is freshly vexed and ready
to talk about his adventure with a group he already
knew a little bit about. Did you remember having seen
the Boys to Men Motown, Philly video and the sudden impact?
Speaker 2 (03:49):
Oh yeah, absolutely, Yeah, Okay, I remember. Let's see that
was in ninety I want to say one or two
somewhere around there house, still in high school when I
saw that. Yeah, And of course I was like what
I was like cause, you know, new addition Viv like
all that. There were my heroes growing up. So yeah,
(04:09):
I was like, what's gonna happen with this?
Speaker 4 (04:11):
What was the Outsiders for life lifestyle?
Speaker 3 (04:15):
Like?
Speaker 4 (04:15):
For you, what was a typical day?
Speaker 5 (04:20):
Hurry up and wait?
Speaker 2 (04:21):
So it depended on the day, right, Yeah, Like I
would say, most of my time spent with the Outsiders
was downtime because we were waiting on this or that
to happen before we could you know, tour or record
or that type of thing. They put us up in
a really nice apartment. You know, we were at this
we were definitely vampires, so you know, we were staying
(04:43):
up all night.
Speaker 5 (04:45):
I would say Tim probably worked the hardest out of
us all.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
Like I would go sing my little bit and then
I would be, you know, walking the streets with Jimmy
or ordering Chinese food, or we'd play ping.
Speaker 3 (04:54):
Pong or whatever.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
Right, Like a lot of a lot of weed being smoked,
a lot of that going on. I wasn't I wasn't
a weat smoker, but a lot of that happening people
in and out of the studio all the time. Like
you know, we'd run into Kenny Loggins and I remember
Queen Latakifa stopping by at some point. So it's a
little bit of like surreal, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
That is the entire tragic drug chapter of the story.
By the way, you're safe now. Like I said, if
you do some digging on YouTube, you can find some
of the videos from the early Outsiders for Life era.
There's one called college Degrees spelled with a Z, just
like Outsiders.
Speaker 3 (05:33):
Those God, the.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
Guys are a little thugged up in this one. They're
in low riders. They're smoking blunts for Jason and I'm
just gonna repeat this in case his parents are listening.
The blunt smoke is cgi. This video is a wild ride.
But I was not prepared for what Jason told me
about it.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
That one that was a hype Williams one. So first
of all, we got like the best director.
Speaker 4 (05:56):
Wait a minute, Hype Williams directed.
Speaker 5 (05:57):
That college degree.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
Yeah yeah, wow, yeah, Okay, yeah, I can send over
like a picture.
Speaker 5 (06:02):
I think we have a picture of us with him.
Speaker 1 (06:04):
Okay, gather round, kids. Hype Williams was the music video
director of the late nineties. Every hip hop video cliche,
he did it first, fish eye lenses, hype, artists bathed
in deep red or vivid blue lighting, hype. All those
early Missy Elliott and Buster Rhymes videos, all hype. Name
an iconic nineties hip hop or R and B video,
and I bet he directed it. No scrubs, getting jiggy
(06:27):
with it, MO money, more problems, Hype, hype and hype.
It's no exaggeration to say that he single handedly changed
the visual language of music, video and film. In two thousand,
he directed videos for jay Z, No Doubt, DMX, and
Outsiders for Life. Jason has a YouTube channel where he
hosts a bunch of Outsiders for Life videos. There's College
(06:48):
Degrees directed by Hype Williams. The guys are shooting, Moody
looks at the camera inside a bowling alley and then
getting hauled off to a jail cell for reasons that
are never made clear. There's one for Not Enough, with
the guys in matching black leather outfits. The video features
each one of the guys rolling around with a model
on a bed with some aggressively shiny satin sheets, and
(07:09):
the guys do the very two thousand music video thing
of getting so emotional they have to rip their jacket
or shirt off and expose their tank top. Not Enough
has Todd White singing the lyric You're something special girl,
you know your shit is tight?
Speaker 4 (07:21):
And then there are.
Speaker 1 (07:22):
Two videos for a song called who Are You, the
original and the Timbaland remix. Both of these songs start
with a verse from Dave Smith, the Quiet One from
the group Let's take a listen. Okay, you really have
(07:46):
to watch out for the Quiet Ones. But I listened
to this verse again and something jumps out at me.
Pay attention to these lyrics. You think you're hot shit,
but you ain't nothing.
Speaker 4 (07:54):
Now.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
You went from boys to men, broke to Benjamin's front
and day by day like we're fucking friend, come up
with something new because you ain't saying nothing.
Speaker 4 (08:03):
Hold on, is who are you a diss? Track? And
if so, who are they dissing?
Speaker 1 (08:11):
January nineteen ninety one, a thirty year old superstar in
the Christian music world released her first pop single, a
song whose lyrics are actually about her six week old daughter, Millie.
The artist was Amy Grant and the song was Baby Baby.
(08:33):
It went to number one on the Billboard Hot one
hundred in April, unseating Wilson Phillips You're in Love because again,
nineteen ninety one was a great fucking year.
Speaker 4 (08:42):
Anyway.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
If you know the song, which you do, you also
know the video. The video was absolutely everywhere you looked
in nineteen ninety one, seismic in our culture. Karen Kilgareth
herself describes the video as like if Rachel from Friends
were a music video. It's Amy Grant doing what we
can only call avoiding in some outfits right out of
the Elaine Bennis collection, with a guy, a handsome guy,
(09:06):
a strikingly startlingly seen, stealingly handsome guy, a rare male
video vixen. Largely because of him, the video for Baby
Baby made people crazy crazy. It was sweet, aspirational, clean
enough for a Christian music star. Yet because of this guy,
undeniably sexy, he was so popular he made the rare
(09:27):
music video move of reprising his role in a sequel,
the video for Ammy Grant's Good for Me. He was
one of the faces of nineteen ninety one, but because
it was nineteen ninety one and there was no Internet
or social media, and I guess he didn't hire a publicist.
Nobody knew his name. I did a little digging. I
found him and I talked to him, and his name
is Jamie Sin. Yes, sir as I live in breath.
(09:50):
I can't believe we found you and it's happening.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
Yeah, I'm pretty in shocked myself. I'm in shock. Thirty
years is what I'm in shocked at.
Speaker 4 (10:02):
Yeah, tell me what you're doing now. You're in Miami Beach.
Speaker 3 (10:04):
Well, I'm in Miami Beach and I'm kind of going
back California. In Miami Beach, my son lives here. I'm still,
believe it or not, in the fashion world, modeling at
the age of fifty two.
Speaker 4 (10:17):
I can see you. I believe it.
Speaker 3 (10:19):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 4 (10:19):
This is a video call. I believe it.
Speaker 3 (10:21):
Thank you you guys.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
Jamie Stein looks good as hell. He's in kind of
a salt and pepper silver Fox Daddy moment.
Speaker 4 (10:29):
It works. Let's go back. Who was Jamie Stein in
nineteen ninety one?
Speaker 3 (10:34):
Oh, my god, who was Jamie Stein in nineteen ninety one?
I was. I was just starting in the business of
doing commercials and modeling, just literally fresh into it. I
must have been twenty four, around twenty four years old.
I was living in LA and I was surfing a lot,
(10:56):
and then I got into the fashion world and that
kind of changed the direction on my life for sure.
Speaker 4 (11:04):
What did you want out of life at twenty four?
Speaker 3 (11:06):
Oh? I mean literally just I wanted to see the
world as I was doing. Even went out before the business.
I was traveling just to go surf and explore. That's
really what my life was about. And all I wanted
to do was surf and travel.
Speaker 1 (11:21):
You can relate to this, right You moved to Los
Angeles to surf and then you find yourself swept up
in the world of high fashion modeling.
Speaker 4 (11:27):
Well, that's Jamie's life. He's modeling.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
He's starting to go out on commercial auditions, and at
that time, with four major networks and just a few
dozen cable channels, a national commercial could make your career.
The residuals alone could buy you a house, You could
get discovered and go onto something bigger like Brad Pitt
and Matt LeBlanc did. Jamie Stein went a different direction.
So you're going out on commercial castings and whatnot. What
(11:50):
kind of stuff would you go out for?
Speaker 3 (11:52):
Oh my god, from Coca Cola to car commercials. Back
then there was even out cigarette commercials. I mean, it
was such a wide variety of music videos, you know, yeah,
there you go, yeah yeah.
Speaker 4 (12:07):
So how did the Baby Baby job come about?
Speaker 3 (12:10):
Well, they my agency sent me on a casting to
go see about this video, and I had no idea
what it was about. And I never heard of I was.
I was always listening to reggae music as I grew up,
and that was most of the music I listened to.
Speaker 1 (12:27):
Just breaking in to say that reggae absolutely suits Jamie's
personal brand.
Speaker 3 (12:32):
So I wasn't really familiar with Amy Grant at the time,
and I didn't know how big of the deal she
was back in that time as well. And I didn't
know that she was a christ Christian gospel singer. I
thought she was just a pop singer. So I had
no idea the whole background of this whole situation, you know.
So I just went in and I casted for it.
(12:54):
They made me dance around and sing to the song
that I never heard of before, which was crazy, but
it was super fun and it felt comfortable and they
liked me. And then they called me back and I
met the director and I did some more dancing and
some more singing, lip singing, obviously to her music, and
(13:16):
uh and there you go. They booked me for it.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
You were living in La at the time where we're Yes, yeah,
I was in La Okay whereabouts.
Speaker 3 (13:24):
I was living at that at that time, on top
of the Panga Canyon. Oh wow, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4 (13:30):
Theme themes are emerging here, Jamie stout. Welcome to my world, right,
I love it. Your world is a good place, Jamie steins.
Speaker 1 (13:41):
Panka Canyon, for those who don't know, is just over
the hill from Malibu, and it is exactly the part
of La you would end up in if you were
a surfer turned model who listened to a lot of reggae.
It's perfect. Jamie booked the job. The video came out
and you've seen it.
Speaker 4 (13:54):
So you know he crushes it. So during during.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
Lockdown, we've had a lot of time time to you know,
to watch things, to binge, watch our thing here.
Speaker 4 (14:05):
In our home.
Speaker 1 (14:05):
My partner and I will just go down late night
YouTube music video rabbit holes, right, and we we got
into the Amygrant music videos recently, and I said out loud,
this is a man who understands the assignment. This guy
(14:28):
has a job and he's doing the hell out of it.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
I appreciate that you're I appreciate that.
Speaker 1 (14:34):
It's you're you're like you're magnetic, but you're not stealing focus.
It's like, it is. I hope you're comfortable with me
saying this. It is you're performing a male Tawny Katain situation. Wow, Wow, Wow,
all right, kids, gather around again. Tawny Katain was the
video vixen of the eighties. She appeared on the cover
(14:57):
of rats breakthrough album Out of the Cellar, but she's
known for her performance doing the splits and vaults on
the hoods of luxury cars in White Snakes Here I
Go Again video. That performance made MTV play that video
a million times a day, and MTV playing that video
a million times a day made that song an album
go multi platinum. You're gonna have to take my word
(15:17):
for it that when I said he had pulled off
a rare male Tawny Kataine maneuver. Jamie put his hand
right on his chest like he was really touched. This
guy gets it. Okay, yeah, Okay, that landed. Wow good
yeah good.
Speaker 3 (15:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (15:31):
So on set, what kind of direction were you given?
Speaker 3 (15:35):
Well, first of all, I have to say DJ Webster,
who was the director, was just he was crazy but
so like like he gave me all the energy that
I needed. I was, you have to you have to
know that I was really raw, like into this business.
So I really didn't know what I was doing at all.
(15:56):
I was just going with how I feel and with
the direction I was And Amy Grant Okay, so I really,
like I said, I don't really don't know anything about Amy,
And she was so sweet and so understanding and so
like I had the lip sync to her her song
and in front of like I don't know, fifty sixties
(16:18):
people working in front of me. So I was super
embarrassed in the beginning because I didn't want to embarrass
her by me like making a fool myself. She said,
just go with it, just let's have fun. And I
literally just whatever came on the line, I just did.
And with the direction of DJ and and Amy just
(16:39):
like leading it was. It just felt it felt really natural.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
After the video comes out, it explodes and gets played constantly.
Speaker 3 (16:49):
Oh my god, Oh my god, you have you have
no idea, you have no idea. It was no, it
was it was beyond what I'd ever thought I was
doing at the time. What was going to be the
direction of my life was going after that, Like it
was literally on I don't know, because MTV back then
(17:11):
was playing videos and it was my video, the video
I was in, and the Janet Jackson video at that time,
and it literally was playing probably ten ten times a
day at least. Yeah, and and averywhere I you know,
a lot of places I went, Like I would see
it on like a TV inside a restaurant I would see.
(17:31):
I would hear the music in like target, you know,
I would. It was and this goes on for years,
you know, for years, and every time someone would look
at me or say something to me, or it caught
me by surprise every single time. And I never ever
got used to that ever, And it happened a lot.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
Yeah, I saw this video a lot that year, and
every time it was on, I would watch it all
the way through. Everybody would Jamie's that magnetic. Amy Grant's
fans ate the video up. Jamie knew a little about
Amy Grant, but he didn't get how many fans she
had or what kind of fans they were.
Speaker 3 (18:09):
And I didn't realize she had that many followers and
that many fans. The followers fans, like a crazy, crazy
amount of fans.
Speaker 4 (18:19):
Yeah, well, she had a lot of fans.
Speaker 1 (18:21):
But then also that song and that album made her
cross over to the mainstream pop charts, and then then
it really exploded.
Speaker 3 (18:29):
I didn't realize that's what was going on. And then
it kind of got a little controversial, I guess with oh, explain, Yeah,
well she was married and I was playing her love interest.
So the Christian gospel fans, some of them, you know,
were just like, well, what's going on here? You know,
they actually believed I was her boyfriend on the side.
(18:49):
Some people.
Speaker 1 (18:50):
While another guy might have tried to seize that moment
and capitalize on it, try to spin it into a
movie career or a pop single of his own, Jamie
just kind of took it in stride. It raised your
profile through the roof. Did it did it change the
way you saw your future?
Speaker 3 (19:06):
I mean day I saw my future. I saw like
I see my future day by day, not like long
long term. But it changed it for sure within within
my within my work, because people started calling for me
because I want that guy in the in the amy gravity,
who's that guy? Let's get him for this, Let's get
him for that. So it opened up huge opportunities for me.
(19:30):
I just went with it, and and from there I
ended up moving to Europe to Paris, and I stayed
in Paris for like almost eight years, working working fashion
in Paris, and I would come back to California and
do jobs through through my agency's in LA and New York,
and and I was getting a lot of work because
of that video of the videos, but first basically from
(19:53):
the first one for sure.
Speaker 4 (19:55):
So just as a model, it got.
Speaker 3 (19:57):
To yes, yes, okay. But I also think because they
saw that, they believe that I wasn't just modeling in it.
They believed that the emotions and stuff like that and
in the chemistry, they believe it's real, and so a
lot of those jobs that's what they wanted. And so
they saw that and they're like, oh, let's try this
guy looks good for what we're doing. So I mean,
(20:18):
I can't give enough thanks to aiming for all that.
Speaker 1 (20:22):
So a music video, there are no like residuals or
anything like that, Like it's you get your day right
and then it doesn't.
Speaker 3 (20:29):
Yeah, I if there was residuals from that, I would
be a different, different category. But yeah, no, no, it's
it's just it's a it's a one time thing, okay, yeah,
but what it gave me in the future is priceless. Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (20:46):
So he took a big role in a big music
video that he did extremely well, and he used it
as a way to do more of what he was
already doing. He got exactly what he wanted from his
big break, and what he wanted was what he already had.
Speaker 4 (20:59):
This goes against everything that you're.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
Taught about how you're supposed to live in America in
late capitalism.
Speaker 4 (21:04):
But he didn't want to be rich, he didn't want
to be famous.
Speaker 3 (21:07):
No, I just wanted to to be to be be happy,
be at peace with myself, enjoy my life. I wanted
I wanted to. I wanted to I wanted to surf, obviously,
and I wanted to travel and and and get different
cultures and and and experienced life. That's what I wanted
to do, and that's what I was doing and continuing
(21:30):
to do. And I would just pick another place to
go into experience and and and to dive into the culture.
I saw myself doing that until I couldn't do it anymore.
Let's just put it that way.
Speaker 4 (21:41):
And and it sounds like that is how it's panned.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
Out a little bit. It has it, really, it really has.
I mean since I had my son, it's obviously slowed
me down. It's not slowed me down, it's it's put
me in a different position to be. To be a father,
you have to be there for your for your son
or your daughter. So I'm more focused on being a father,
(22:04):
but also traveling and doing that as much as possible
and actually making him understand, like feel the way I
feel about it as well. That's important to me to
understand that there's a world out there. Yeah, what's he's studying,
what's his marine biology? I mean it's amazing. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (22:23):
Yeah, the apple has not fallen far from the trade.
Speaker 3 (22:26):
No, no, thank god.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
The day after we spoke, he headed to Las Vegas
to do some modeling for a hotel, then off to
Kona in Hawaii. Than Corus out than Hamburg, Germany. Dude
has not stopped working or exploring or surfing. He's busy.
Speaker 4 (22:42):
Your dance card is full and I love it.
Speaker 3 (22:45):
Thank you so much. I'm very I'm very happy.
Speaker 1 (22:49):
You've got a great energy. I would if I were
to in a position to cast you in my music video,
I would do it in a heartbeat.
Speaker 3 (22:57):
Oh my god, I appreciate it truly.
Speaker 4 (23:00):
I'm gonna You've made me want to learn to surf.
Speaker 3 (23:04):
See, that's all. That's all I want to do. That's
all I want to do, inspire people to get in
the water and enjoy the water.
Speaker 1 (23:10):
Just as we were saying goodbye, Jamie remembered a message
he had just gotten on his Instagram. And it's too
good not to play for you.
Speaker 3 (23:16):
I want to share one thing with you guys really quick,
because I thought this was really special. If someone sent
me this message on Instagram literally two days ago. Do
you mind if I share it with you guys?
Speaker 4 (23:26):
Please?
Speaker 3 (23:27):
Okay, so let me just put my glasses on because
I'm flying without him, That's all right, Okay. This is
from Lisa twenty five years ago. My husband and I,
being nine months pregnant and overdue, went on a dancing
date to possibly get things moving. As luck would have it,
the DJ saw my huge belly on the dance floor
(23:50):
and played Baby Baby and made me feel like a
star out there. Not only did I love the song
and the artists, but I thought you were perfect in
the role. So now I have an amazingly gifted and
gorgeous twenty five year old son named Jamie. Can you
believe that? It's unbelievable?
Speaker 4 (24:09):
How often does that kind of thing happen?
Speaker 3 (24:11):
It happens quite a bit, honestly. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's
I mean, it makes me feel really good. You know,
if I get if I'm down one day, I'll look
at one of these texts, these messages, I'm like, wow,
that's pretty amazing. So yeah, it makes me happy.
Speaker 1 (24:26):
Jamie Stein has the life he wants. He has a
chill attitude, and there's at least one child out in
the world named after him. If he's not alongside such
an impact in the music video co Star Hall of Fame,
I don't know who is. Now, feel excuse me, I
need to watch Baby Baby five more times. So there
(24:51):
is a thing that people do in conversation that really
jumps out at me and it's starting a sentence with
the word so. I find myself doing it a lot
in questions. I'm not sure what it's all about. I
think it's to reassure the person I'm talking to that
I've done my research, So tell me about that BBD
tour jacket.
Speaker 4 (25:08):
So what was the super Bowl halftime show?
Speaker 1 (25:10):
Like?
Speaker 3 (25:10):
Etc.
Speaker 1 (25:11):
But often I ask a question and then the answer
begins with the words so, I've thought a lot about
what that so signifies, because, as you probably know by now,
I think about a lot of things that can't possibly
benefit me financially. I think what it says is, Okay,
here it goes, I've anticipated your question, and you're going
to get a full and satisfying answer. Jason goes a
step further. I ask a question and he begins his answer, yeah,
(25:35):
even if it isn't a yes or no question.
Speaker 4 (25:37):
Yeah. And then sometimes so it's next level.
Speaker 1 (25:40):
It's Jason saying, not only have I anticipated this question,
I've answered it in my head a few times already.
To me, it says, Jason has been ready to talk
about this stuff for a long time. He's just been
waiting for someone to ask, how does.
Speaker 4 (25:52):
That feel to you?
Speaker 1 (25:53):
When you've you've made something, and now it's just you're
just waiting for strangers to do something with it.
Speaker 3 (26:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (26:01):
Well, at the time, like it was, it was so gradual,
like our you know, the realization that you're not going
to get released.
Speaker 1 (26:12):
Once again, the three remaining guys of Sudden Impact, who
are now recording as Outsiders for Life with Jimmy Marble
and Jason Dowdy, are recording for a hot record label,
this time Blackground Records, the label launched by Aliah's uncle
Barry Hankerson, and once again, the finished product never sees
the light of day.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
There's probably one moment where, you know, I think all
of our hearts sank a little bit when we were
promoting not Enough, So we got a lot of radio play.
It was trending up. We were on tour like it
was around spring break time. I want to say, I
can't remember if it was ninety nine or two thousand,
I cannot remember.
Speaker 5 (26:51):
Somewhere in that time.
Speaker 2 (26:53):
I remember it was spring break time because we were
in Florida and we were, you know, opening for our idols,
you know, like Loud Cruise and Pink and Shaggy, and
we're starting to get some attention, We're starting to gain
some momentum, doing interviews all of that, and then I
guess the single lost momentum and they just pulled the
plug on the tour, so we're off the tour bus
(27:14):
and all that, and I think that was kind of
the moment where like, and you know that boy bands
are about to be over, you know, the kind of
run their course. By the time, I think this was
in two thousand, so he kind of knew that they
were running their course. And that's probably the moment where
I was like, oh, I don't think this.
Speaker 5 (27:31):
May not happen.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
With the single sputtering out, Blackground pulled the plug on
the album, an album that was already made, finished, had
a cover and everything. They did get one song, a
remix of hell Yeah on the soundtrack of the DMX
Steven Sigall movie Exit Wounds, But as for a full album, again,
the guys have poured their hearts into a project that
sits in a vault at a record company. Why record
(27:54):
something and then never give it an opportunity to earn
a single dollar back?
Speaker 2 (28:00):
I think that's just I think that's just part of
the business at the time. There, I mean, there are
so many boy bands and like girl groups from that
time that probably got left on the cutting room floor,
you know what I mean.
Speaker 5 (28:13):
Like, I bet there are.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
Thousands of stories like mine out there, and I think
it was just the way they did business like they
would it was worth the investment to see if it
would happen to get like like, it's kind of like
a gold rush, right instinct. You know, Backstreet Boys are popular.
Everybody's like, let's make the next one. When they all
rushed to it and they all throw money at it,
and then you know, whoever catches on, great, But if
(28:38):
they don't catch on, it was worth the investment to
seek to get part of that part of that market.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
To your point about boy bands that that don't take off,
Get this, Okay, I'm going to tell you a story.
This would have to have been. In two thousand, I
hosted the get this you're sitting down, this is good.
I hosted the press conference the unveiling of the Backstreet
(29:06):
Boys Burger King Kids Club action figures.
Speaker 5 (29:12):
Okay, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:13):
They flew me down to Orlando, Florida to like to
some theme park or something, and the Backstreet Boys were
there and they were unveiling their kids Club, Action figures
and so and so that's that was going on there,
which was of course wild. And the night that I
spent in Orlando, we ended up going to some club
(29:34):
and the club was literally full. Like everyone that I
met was like in a boy band or a girl group.
So it was like they would introduce themselves by name
and then.
Speaker 4 (29:48):
Name of group.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
Oh wow, as though I knew like these you know,
second and third tier like groups that Lou Pearlman was,
you know, was working with, but it was it was insane.
It would just be like, Hi, I'm Ashley Innocence. Okay, Okay,
I don't know what that means. I don't know what
that means. But there were dozens of them, and it
(30:10):
was like I am fully in like in like some
sort of I'm like at Hogwarts for boy bands and
girl groups, and most of the ones I met nothing happened.
Speaker 4 (30:23):
So there you go.
Speaker 2 (30:24):
Well, and I think part of the reason we had
some success was like there was some integrity to our
group because we wrote and produced the stuff, and we
like the contracts that we had to choose from. DreamWorks
was one of them, and we could have gone that route,
you know, work with David Foster, you know, with that direction.
(30:47):
But Todd and Alan and Tim really liked the offer
from Blackground because they were more like our people, you
know what I mean, Like they understood the type of
music we wanted to make. They were working with our
ye rows, you know, Timberlance from the Missier Votes, from
that Hampton Roads area, like, you know, it just seemed
(31:07):
like a better fit. So, like, I think the reason
we even caught on some was because there was like
that people can tell genuine from fake pretty easily, right,
and I think at least people could tell that, you know,
we wrote the song and it's real and we mean
the lyrics and all that.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
So in the early nineties, Sudden Impact slash White Guys
Slashed the Outsiders couldn't get their records released because new
Kids on the Block were over. In two thousand, Outsiders
for Life couldn't get their record released because Backstreet Boys
and in Sync were huge. Sudden Impact got pushed to
the side because there were no boy bands. Outsiders for
Life got pushed to the side because there were too
(31:41):
many boy bands. For Jason, this was a disappointment, but
he was still new to the game. For the core
group from Sudden impact. This has to have been devastating.
If this is two thousand, this is nine years into
a career where this has been happening over and over
and over. Did you get a sense for how they
(32:01):
were feeling.
Speaker 5 (32:02):
Yeah, so Todd.
Speaker 2 (32:04):
Todd is definitely the most persistent person in the group
that will do anything to make the dream happen. He
started the group, it's his dream. He is so good
at I don't know, like motivating people and getting people
on board. But his I think his thought process at
(32:27):
the time was this sucks. What can I do next
to make it happen? Like, you know, it was more
like let's do this, let's do that, let's talk to
these people. He's more in like, let's still make it
happen mode. So I think you'll have to ask Todd
what happened after that. But I think for him it
wasn't quite real yet, and it wasn't real necessarily for
(32:49):
any of us were But that was kind of a
moment where I was like, oh, yeah, this could be
over soon, you know, like where at least that light
bulb went on, you know, but we weren't ready to
give up.
Speaker 4 (32:59):
Sure, and what does that feel like?
Speaker 2 (33:02):
So joining this group has always felt like it's too
good to be true anyway, you know what I mean,
Like I talked in right when everybody did the groundwork,
you know what I'm saying, Like everybody had already done
the groundwork, got the contract and all that, and I'm
just like singing songs that other people are writing. Like
so for me it wasn't as bad. I was like,
I can always go back to, you know, performing doing
(33:24):
what I was doing before. So and you know, it's
been a dream of mine, but I'm not like, you know,
there are people who dream and then there's people who
build and do things about it. When I was that young,
I was just dreaming, not doing anything about it. So
I wasn't like invested too heavily. So I probably took
it better than most of the people, like especially Pod
(33:45):
and Allen and.
Speaker 1 (33:46):
Day and Jason had a fallback position doing something else
that I feel like I'm going to have to explain
to young people, like.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
I moved did a cruise ship contract two thousand and
four and moved back to two thousand and five to
make one last go of the group, and then in
two thousand and six is when I moved away started
doing cruise ships again and all of that.
Speaker 1 (34:06):
All right, kids gather around one more time. People used
to go on cruise ships.
Speaker 4 (34:10):
That's it.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
So I think that's kind of when the realization happened
for Todd and for the guys in the group. I
think we're all slowly accepting it over time.
Speaker 1 (34:21):
Now Todd, as I understand it, is still in the business,
still like writing songs for country artists.
Speaker 5 (34:27):
Yeah, yeah, he's still doing that.
Speaker 2 (34:29):
He's I think he has a You'll have to ask
Todd obviously to get the exact thing, but I know
he had a last time I spoke to him, he
said he had a big meeting in Nashville and he
was considering, like there offered him a publishing contract. But
you know, he has a family now, he's got a mortgage,
and he's got all these responsibilities. So in order to
(34:51):
only focus on writing, like we'd have to take drastic cut.
Speaker 5 (34:54):
And pay and so I think he was weighing those options.
You'll have to ask him how it came out.
Speaker 1 (34:59):
Yeah, Jason's got a good attitude about the whole thing,
probably because he remembers why he got involved in the
first place. When you were like starting out as a singer.
What did what did success in music look like to you?
Speaker 3 (35:14):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (35:14):
I I didn't really I didn't really think about it
that much. I so my very first job, I got
it Frontier City in Oklahoma, just singing in some show,
earning minimum wage, you know, and I was selling pictures
at the front of the park before and after, and
like I was thrilled, you know at the time, like I.
Speaker 5 (35:36):
Can sing for a living.
Speaker 2 (35:37):
Wow, you know what I mean. Like I had that
just attitude or gratitude all the time. So I success
to me was just like the fact that I could
sing and make a living at it. That was number one.
Like in Oklahoma, they don't preach that, like it doesn't
happen because there aren't any performing jobs there obviously, right,
(35:58):
So you know, if I grew up in La or
York or something like that, I'd probably have bigger, bigger dreams.
But did that got a job at Busch Gardens. I
was like, Wow, even a better job. And then you know,
started doing that, and then when this came along, I
was like, oh, I didn't even realize this could happen
this easily, you know what I mean, Like I was
I didn't build it from scratch or anything like that.
(36:19):
I just kind of luckily fell into it. So and
then I got out a new vision of success with
the group. I was like, Wow, we could really make it.
We could do this, we could do that. Started to
learn producing and songwriting and all that while while we went.
Speaker 1 (36:32):
And now are you still well nobody's doing cruise ships now,
But have you had you How long did you continue
singing on cruise ships and stuff?
Speaker 2 (36:43):
Yeah, until like twenty thirteen, and then I got another
regular nine to five job, met my wife, you know,
so now we have kids and all that, so just
doing that. I still write songs. I still put music
out and do some producing and stuff like that, but
not like I don't have time to pursue it or
anything like that.
Speaker 4 (37:04):
Yeah. How many kids?
Speaker 1 (37:06):
Oh?
Speaker 5 (37:07):
Oh two? I have two kids? Yeah, three and five.
Sophia's five, Kayley's two.
Speaker 4 (37:12):
Congratulations, Oh thank you, thank you.
Speaker 3 (37:14):
I love it.
Speaker 4 (37:15):
And what line of business are you in?
Speaker 2 (37:17):
I worked for an internet service provider and as a
team manager just for people. We basically give a call
and say, hey, I see you signed up for our internet.
Let's let's get an appointment going that type.
Speaker 4 (37:28):
Thanks good. It's a happy life.
Speaker 5 (37:31):
It sounds like, yeah, yeah, it's a happy life most definitely.
Speaker 4 (37:34):
Are you glad you took the ride?
Speaker 2 (37:36):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely yeah it was. I mean I have
some of my best stories from there. I don't know
if I should share any other I think. I mean, like,
I don't know, no, not have it involves other people,
but yeah, yeah, I would say it's definitely worth the ride.
Speaker 1 (37:53):
Jason Dowdy and Jamie Stein Tiger Beet and the Baby
Baby Man, two good guys, two living lessons in gratitude.
Speaker 4 (38:01):
I check my.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
Email after I get off the zoom and there's a
message from Todd White, the main songwriter for Sudden Impact,
the guy all the way to the right in the
Motown Philly moment, the driver of the whole project, the
guy who was gonna beat up Aaron Kine but started
a singing group with him instead. He says he's down
to talk and he wants to know if Alan Healy
can join the call. I'll talk to two fifths of
(38:23):
Sudden Impact at the same time, and maybe they'll give
me the dish on who that disc track was about.
We'll find out next time. On Waiting for Impact, a
Dave Holmes passion project This has been an exactly Right production.
Written by me Dave Holmes, produced by Hannah Kyle Crichton, recorded,
(38:47):
mixed and sound designed by Andrew Eapen. Additional engineering and
assembly by Annalise Nelson. Music by Ben Wise, artwork by
Garrett Ross. Executive produced by Caro kill Gareff, Georgia hard
Stark and Danielle Kramer. Follow the show on Instagram, Facebook,
and Twitter at exactly right and follow me at Dave Holmes.
(39:11):
For more information, go to Exactlyrightmedia dot com. Binge the
show add free on stitch your premium for a free month.
Head to Stitcher Premium dot com, slash impact and enter
promo code Impact when you select a monthly plan. Listen, subscribe,
and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher, or
wherever you get your podcasts
How did you feel about the style of the group
and how that sort of evolved.
Speaker 2 (00:10):
Yeah, so I was I was definitely the outsider of
the Outsiders just because like they called me tiger Beat
because I was I don't have any edge, right, like
like Todd Allen and and even Jimmy, you know, like
they all kind of grew up in a I don't know,
(00:30):
there were military kids, and they grew up in around
with different culture than I did.
Speaker 1 (00:34):
This right here is Jason Dowdy. When Aaron Kane and
his brother Noel left Sudden Impact, which by then was
called the Outsiders, Jason is one of the new guys
who took their place, and for the rest of the group,
the first order of business was to dirty him up
a little.
Speaker 3 (00:48):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (00:48):
So when I joined the group, they kind of had
to give me a makeover, you know a little bit. Yeah,
and like what like how oh, like you know, get
like Jibo jeans and Iceberg and I don't know all
this stuff in the.
Speaker 4 (01:01):
Time, sure, all giant giant jeans.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
Yeah, yeah, I had my jeans that I had at
the time were more Jimko than Chirpo, you know what
I mean.
Speaker 5 (01:12):
Yeah, But what I got there, I got there.
Speaker 1 (01:14):
Yeah, Jason didn't know he'd be a part of the
version of Sudden Impact that came the closest to fulfilling
the promise of the Motown Philly Moment, the version that
finally got a whole song on a movie soundtrack, The
version that finally appeared in music videos for its own music.
These Outsiders for live videos are on YouTube, by the way,
And in the one I'm looking at right now, the
(01:35):
one that you will not believe me when I tell
you who directed it, Sweet Tiger Beat, Jason is definitely
all decked out and bad boy tank tops and do
rags and wide leg jeans. He exhales blunt smoke and
when you look, you don't even have to look that closely,
you see it. The blunt smoke is cgi. We'll talk
to Sweet Jason Dowdy Tiger Beat, the new guy in
(01:57):
Sudden Impact, about his life in the group's final stretch,
the Outsiders for Life years. He'll take us into the
inevitable tragic drug chapter of the story.
Speaker 4 (02:06):
Every group has one.
Speaker 1 (02:08):
And since we're taking some big swings lately, if we
are really chiseling out Mount Rushmore of early nineties music
video special guest performers. I have found the daddy of
them all. No, I have found the zaddy of them all.
I've reached out to an unforgettable face from a nineteen
ninety one music video, someone I have always wanted to
track down, and baby, Baby, you will not believe who
(02:30):
I have got for you. This is Waiting for Impact,
a Dave Holmes pasion project. By the late nineties, the
(02:56):
group that had started as Two Special became White Hot Empty,
famous as Sudden Impact, got renamed White Guys, and later
rebranded themselves.
Speaker 4 (03:04):
The Outsiders began to implode.
Speaker 1 (03:07):
After being pulled off of Capital and then dropped from
BIV ten Records. Their third record label, Stone Creek, just
folded entirely, putting them right back to square one. Brothers
Aaron and Noel Kine left the group to start a
new one, and their empty seats got taken by two
young singers, Jimmy Marble and Jason Dowdy.
Speaker 4 (03:26):
How are you good, Dave good good?
Speaker 5 (03:29):
Where are you in well OneD Ontario where we have
free healthcare?
Speaker 4 (03:33):
Oh? Come on, good thinking.
Speaker 1 (03:35):
When we talk, Jason Dowdy is freshly vexed and ready
to talk about his adventure with a group he already
knew a little bit about. Did you remember having seen
the Boys to Men Motown, Philly video and the sudden impact?
Speaker 2 (03:49):
Oh yeah, absolutely, Yeah, Okay, I remember. Let's see that
was in ninety I want to say one or two
somewhere around there house, still in high school when I
saw that. Yeah, And of course I was like what
I was like cause, you know, new addition Viv like
all that. There were my heroes growing up. So yeah,
(04:09):
I was like, what's gonna happen with this?
Speaker 4 (04:11):
What was the Outsiders for life lifestyle?
Speaker 3 (04:15):
Like?
Speaker 4 (04:15):
For you, what was a typical day?
Speaker 5 (04:20):
Hurry up and wait?
Speaker 2 (04:21):
So it depended on the day, right, Yeah, Like I
would say, most of my time spent with the Outsiders
was downtime because we were waiting on this or that
to happen before we could you know, tour or record
or that type of thing. They put us up in
a really nice apartment. You know, we were at this
we were definitely vampires, so you know, we were staying
(04:43):
up all night.
Speaker 5 (04:45):
I would say Tim probably worked the hardest out of
us all.
Speaker 2 (04:47):
Like I would go sing my little bit and then
I would be, you know, walking the streets with Jimmy
or ordering Chinese food, or we'd play ping.
Speaker 3 (04:54):
Pong or whatever.
Speaker 2 (04:55):
Right, Like a lot of a lot of weed being smoked,
a lot of that going on. I wasn't I wasn't
a weat smoker, but a lot of that happening people
in and out of the studio all the time. Like
you know, we'd run into Kenny Loggins and I remember
Queen Latakifa stopping by at some point. So it's a
little bit of like surreal, you know what I mean.
Speaker 1 (05:16):
That is the entire tragic drug chapter of the story.
By the way, you're safe now. Like I said, if
you do some digging on YouTube, you can find some
of the videos from the early Outsiders for Life era.
There's one called college Degrees spelled with a Z, just
like Outsiders.
Speaker 3 (05:33):
Those God, the.
Speaker 1 (05:36):
Guys are a little thugged up in this one. They're
in low riders. They're smoking blunts for Jason and I'm
just gonna repeat this in case his parents are listening.
The blunt smoke is cgi. This video is a wild ride.
But I was not prepared for what Jason told me
about it.
Speaker 2 (05:51):
That one that was a hype Williams one. So first
of all, we got like the best director.
Speaker 4 (05:56):
Wait a minute, Hype Williams directed.
Speaker 5 (05:57):
That college degree.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
Yeah yeah, wow, yeah, Okay, yeah, I can send over
like a picture.
Speaker 5 (06:02):
I think we have a picture of us with him.
Speaker 1 (06:04):
Okay, gather round, kids. Hype Williams was the music video
director of the late nineties. Every hip hop video cliche,
he did it first, fish eye lenses, hype, artists bathed
in deep red or vivid blue lighting, hype. All those
early Missy Elliott and Buster Rhymes videos, all hype. Name
an iconic nineties hip hop or R and B video,
and I bet he directed it. No scrubs, getting jiggy
(06:27):
with it, MO money, more problems, Hype, hype and hype.
It's no exaggeration to say that he single handedly changed
the visual language of music, video and film. In two thousand,
he directed videos for jay Z, No Doubt, DMX, and
Outsiders for Life. Jason has a YouTube channel where he
hosts a bunch of Outsiders for Life videos. There's College
(06:48):
Degrees directed by Hype Williams. The guys are shooting, Moody
looks at the camera inside a bowling alley and then
getting hauled off to a jail cell for reasons that
are never made clear. There's one for Not Enough, with
the guys in matching black leather outfits. The video features
each one of the guys rolling around with a model
on a bed with some aggressively shiny satin sheets, and
(07:09):
the guys do the very two thousand music video thing
of getting so emotional they have to rip their jacket
or shirt off and expose their tank top. Not Enough
has Todd White singing the lyric You're something special girl,
you know your shit is tight?
Speaker 4 (07:21):
And then there are.
Speaker 1 (07:22):
Two videos for a song called who Are You, the
original and the Timbaland remix. Both of these songs start
with a verse from Dave Smith, the Quiet One from
the group Let's take a listen. Okay, you really have
(07:46):
to watch out for the Quiet Ones. But I listened
to this verse again and something jumps out at me.
Pay attention to these lyrics. You think you're hot shit,
but you ain't nothing.
Speaker 4 (07:54):
Now.
Speaker 1 (07:55):
You went from boys to men, broke to Benjamin's front
and day by day like we're fucking friend, come up
with something new because you ain't saying nothing.
Speaker 4 (08:03):
Hold on, is who are you a diss? Track? And
if so, who are they dissing?
Speaker 1 (08:11):
January nineteen ninety one, a thirty year old superstar in
the Christian music world released her first pop single, a
song whose lyrics are actually about her six week old daughter, Millie.
The artist was Amy Grant and the song was Baby Baby.
(08:33):
It went to number one on the Billboard Hot one
hundred in April, unseating Wilson Phillips You're in Love because again,
nineteen ninety one was a great fucking year.
Speaker 4 (08:42):
Anyway.
Speaker 1 (08:42):
If you know the song, which you do, you also
know the video. The video was absolutely everywhere you looked
in nineteen ninety one, seismic in our culture. Karen Kilgareth
herself describes the video as like if Rachel from Friends
were a music video. It's Amy Grant doing what we
can only call avoiding in some outfits right out of
the Elaine Bennis collection, with a guy, a handsome guy,
(09:06):
a strikingly startlingly seen, stealingly handsome guy, a rare male
video vixen. Largely because of him, the video for Baby
Baby made people crazy crazy. It was sweet, aspirational, clean
enough for a Christian music star. Yet because of this guy,
undeniably sexy, he was so popular he made the rare
(09:27):
music video move of reprising his role in a sequel,
the video for Ammy Grant's Good for Me. He was
one of the faces of nineteen ninety one, but because
it was nineteen ninety one and there was no Internet
or social media, and I guess he didn't hire a publicist.
Nobody knew his name. I did a little digging. I
found him and I talked to him, and his name
is Jamie Sin. Yes, sir as I live in breath.
(09:50):
I can't believe we found you and it's happening.
Speaker 3 (09:55):
Yeah, I'm pretty in shocked myself. I'm in shock. Thirty
years is what I'm in shocked at.
Speaker 4 (10:02):
Yeah, tell me what you're doing now. You're in Miami Beach.
Speaker 3 (10:04):
Well, I'm in Miami Beach and I'm kind of going
back California. In Miami Beach, my son lives here. I'm still,
believe it or not, in the fashion world, modeling at
the age of fifty two.
Speaker 4 (10:17):
I can see you. I believe it.
Speaker 3 (10:19):
Thank you so much.
Speaker 4 (10:19):
This is a video call. I believe it.
Speaker 3 (10:21):
Thank you you guys.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
Jamie Stein looks good as hell. He's in kind of
a salt and pepper silver Fox Daddy moment.
Speaker 4 (10:29):
It works. Let's go back. Who was Jamie Stein in
nineteen ninety one?
Speaker 3 (10:34):
Oh, my god, who was Jamie Stein in nineteen ninety one?
I was. I was just starting in the business of
doing commercials and modeling, just literally fresh into it. I
must have been twenty four, around twenty four years old.
I was living in LA and I was surfing a lot,
(10:56):
and then I got into the fashion world and that
kind of changed the direction on my life for sure.
Speaker 4 (11:04):
What did you want out of life at twenty four?
Speaker 3 (11:06):
Oh? I mean literally just I wanted to see the
world as I was doing. Even went out before the business.
I was traveling just to go surf and explore. That's
really what my life was about. And all I wanted
to do was surf and travel.
Speaker 1 (11:21):
You can relate to this, right You moved to Los
Angeles to surf and then you find yourself swept up
in the world of high fashion modeling.
Speaker 4 (11:27):
Well, that's Jamie's life. He's modeling.
Speaker 1 (11:29):
He's starting to go out on commercial auditions, and at
that time, with four major networks and just a few
dozen cable channels, a national commercial could make your career.
The residuals alone could buy you a house, You could
get discovered and go onto something bigger like Brad Pitt
and Matt LeBlanc did. Jamie Stein went a different direction.
So you're going out on commercial castings and whatnot. What
(11:50):
kind of stuff would you go out for?
Speaker 3 (11:52):
Oh my god, from Coca Cola to car commercials. Back
then there was even out cigarette commercials. I mean, it
was such a wide variety of music videos, you know, yeah,
there you go, yeah yeah.
Speaker 4 (12:07):
So how did the Baby Baby job come about?
Speaker 3 (12:10):
Well, they my agency sent me on a casting to
go see about this video, and I had no idea
what it was about. And I never heard of I was.
I was always listening to reggae music as I grew up,
and that was most of the music I listened to.
Speaker 1 (12:27):
Just breaking in to say that reggae absolutely suits Jamie's
personal brand.
Speaker 3 (12:32):
So I wasn't really familiar with Amy Grant at the time,
and I didn't know how big of the deal she
was back in that time as well. And I didn't
know that she was a christ Christian gospel singer. I
thought she was just a pop singer. So I had
no idea the whole background of this whole situation, you know.
So I just went in and I casted for it.
(12:54):
They made me dance around and sing to the song
that I never heard of before, which was crazy, but
it was super fun and it felt comfortable and they
liked me. And then they called me back and I
met the director and I did some more dancing and
some more singing, lip singing, obviously to her music, and
(13:16):
uh and there you go. They booked me for it.
Speaker 1 (13:18):
You were living in La at the time where we're Yes, yeah,
I was in La Okay whereabouts.
Speaker 3 (13:24):
I was living at that at that time, on top
of the Panga Canyon. Oh wow, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 4 (13:30):
Theme themes are emerging here, Jamie stout. Welcome to my world, right,
I love it. Your world is a good place, Jamie steins.
Speaker 1 (13:41):
Panka Canyon, for those who don't know, is just over
the hill from Malibu, and it is exactly the part
of La you would end up in if you were
a surfer turned model who listened to a lot of reggae.
It's perfect. Jamie booked the job. The video came out
and you've seen it.
Speaker 4 (13:54):
So you know he crushes it. So during during.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
Lockdown, we've had a lot of time time to you know,
to watch things, to binge, watch our thing here.
Speaker 4 (14:05):
In our home.
Speaker 1 (14:05):
My partner and I will just go down late night
YouTube music video rabbit holes, right, and we we got
into the Amygrant music videos recently, and I said out loud,
this is a man who understands the assignment. This guy
(14:28):
has a job and he's doing the hell out of it.
Speaker 3 (14:32):
I appreciate that you're I appreciate that.
Speaker 1 (14:34):
It's you're you're like you're magnetic, but you're not stealing focus.
It's like, it is. I hope you're comfortable with me
saying this. It is you're performing a male Tawny Katain situation. Wow, Wow, Wow,
all right, kids, gather around again. Tawny Katain was the
video vixen of the eighties. She appeared on the cover
(14:57):
of rats breakthrough album Out of the Cellar, but she's
known for her performance doing the splits and vaults on
the hoods of luxury cars in White Snakes Here I
Go Again video. That performance made MTV play that video
a million times a day, and MTV playing that video
a million times a day made that song an album
go multi platinum. You're gonna have to take my word
(15:17):
for it that when I said he had pulled off
a rare male Tawny Kataine maneuver. Jamie put his hand
right on his chest like he was really touched. This
guy gets it. Okay, yeah, Okay, that landed. Wow good
yeah good.
Speaker 3 (15:31):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (15:31):
So on set, what kind of direction were you given?
Speaker 3 (15:35):
Well, first of all, I have to say DJ Webster,
who was the director, was just he was crazy but
so like like he gave me all the energy that
I needed. I was, you have to you have to
know that I was really raw, like into this business.
So I really didn't know what I was doing at all.
(15:56):
I was just going with how I feel and with
the direction I was And Amy Grant Okay, so I really,
like I said, I don't really don't know anything about Amy,
And she was so sweet and so understanding and so
like I had the lip sync to her her song
and in front of like I don't know, fifty sixties
(16:18):
people working in front of me. So I was super
embarrassed in the beginning because I didn't want to embarrass
her by me like making a fool myself. She said,
just go with it, just let's have fun. And I
literally just whatever came on the line, I just did.
And with the direction of DJ and and Amy just
(16:39):
like leading it was. It just felt it felt really natural.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
After the video comes out, it explodes and gets played constantly.
Speaker 3 (16:49):
Oh my god, Oh my god, you have you have
no idea, you have no idea. It was no, it
was it was beyond what I'd ever thought I was
doing at the time. What was going to be the
direction of my life was going after that, Like it
was literally on I don't know, because MTV back then
(17:11):
was playing videos and it was my video, the video
I was in, and the Janet Jackson video at that time,
and it literally was playing probably ten ten times a
day at least. Yeah, and and averywhere I you know,
a lot of places I went, Like I would see
it on like a TV inside a restaurant I would see.
(17:31):
I would hear the music in like target, you know,
I would. It was and this goes on for years,
you know, for years, and every time someone would look
at me or say something to me, or it caught
me by surprise every single time. And I never ever
got used to that ever, And it happened a lot.
Speaker 1 (17:53):
Yeah, I saw this video a lot that year, and
every time it was on, I would watch it all
the way through. Everybody would Jamie's that magnetic. Amy Grant's
fans ate the video up. Jamie knew a little about
Amy Grant, but he didn't get how many fans she
had or what kind of fans they were.
Speaker 3 (18:09):
And I didn't realize she had that many followers and
that many fans. The followers fans, like a crazy, crazy
amount of fans.
Speaker 4 (18:19):
Yeah, well, she had a lot of fans.
Speaker 1 (18:21):
But then also that song and that album made her
cross over to the mainstream pop charts, and then then
it really exploded.
Speaker 3 (18:29):
I didn't realize that's what was going on. And then
it kind of got a little controversial, I guess with oh, explain, Yeah,
well she was married and I was playing her love interest.
So the Christian gospel fans, some of them, you know,
were just like, well, what's going on here? You know,
they actually believed I was her boyfriend on the side.
(18:49):
Some people.
Speaker 1 (18:50):
While another guy might have tried to seize that moment
and capitalize on it, try to spin it into a
movie career or a pop single of his own, Jamie
just kind of took it in stride. It raised your
profile through the roof. Did it did it change the
way you saw your future?
Speaker 3 (19:06):
I mean day I saw my future. I saw like
I see my future day by day, not like long
long term. But it changed it for sure within within
my within my work, because people started calling for me
because I want that guy in the in the amy gravity,
who's that guy? Let's get him for this, Let's get
him for that. So it opened up huge opportunities for me.
(19:30):
I just went with it, and and from there I
ended up moving to Europe to Paris, and I stayed
in Paris for like almost eight years, working working fashion
in Paris, and I would come back to California and
do jobs through through my agency's in LA and New York,
and and I was getting a lot of work because
of that video of the videos, but first basically from
(19:53):
the first one for sure.
Speaker 4 (19:55):
So just as a model, it got.
Speaker 3 (19:57):
To yes, yes, okay. But I also think because they
saw that, they believe that I wasn't just modeling in it.
They believed that the emotions and stuff like that and
in the chemistry, they believe it's real, and so a
lot of those jobs that's what they wanted. And so
they saw that and they're like, oh, let's try this
guy looks good for what we're doing. So I mean,
(20:18):
I can't give enough thanks to aiming for all that.
Speaker 1 (20:22):
So a music video, there are no like residuals or
anything like that, Like it's you get your day right
and then it doesn't.
Speaker 3 (20:29):
Yeah, I if there was residuals from that, I would
be a different, different category. But yeah, no, no, it's
it's just it's a it's a one time thing, okay, yeah,
but what it gave me in the future is priceless. Absolutely.
Speaker 1 (20:46):
So he took a big role in a big music
video that he did extremely well, and he used it
as a way to do more of what he was
already doing. He got exactly what he wanted from his
big break, and what he wanted was what he already had.
Speaker 4 (20:59):
This goes against everything that you're.
Speaker 1 (21:01):
Taught about how you're supposed to live in America in
late capitalism.
Speaker 4 (21:04):
But he didn't want to be rich, he didn't want
to be famous.
Speaker 3 (21:07):
No, I just wanted to to be to be be happy,
be at peace with myself, enjoy my life. I wanted
I wanted to. I wanted to I wanted to surf, obviously,
and I wanted to travel and and and get different
cultures and and and experienced life. That's what I wanted
to do, and that's what I was doing and continuing
(21:30):
to do. And I would just pick another place to
go into experience and and and to dive into the culture.
I saw myself doing that until I couldn't do it anymore.
Let's just put it that way.
Speaker 4 (21:41):
And and it sounds like that is how it's panned.
Speaker 3 (21:43):
Out a little bit. It has it, really, it really has.
I mean since I had my son, it's obviously slowed
me down. It's not slowed me down, it's it's put
me in a different position to be. To be a father,
you have to be there for your for your son
or your daughter. So I'm more focused on being a father,
(22:04):
but also traveling and doing that as much as possible
and actually making him understand, like feel the way I
feel about it as well. That's important to me to
understand that there's a world out there. Yeah, what's he's studying,
what's his marine biology? I mean it's amazing. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (22:23):
Yeah, the apple has not fallen far from the trade.
Speaker 3 (22:26):
No, no, thank god.
Speaker 1 (22:29):
The day after we spoke, he headed to Las Vegas
to do some modeling for a hotel, then off to
Kona in Hawaii. Than Corus out than Hamburg, Germany. Dude
has not stopped working or exploring or surfing. He's busy.
Speaker 4 (22:42):
Your dance card is full and I love it.
Speaker 3 (22:45):
Thank you so much. I'm very I'm very happy.
Speaker 1 (22:49):
You've got a great energy. I would if I were
to in a position to cast you in my music video,
I would do it in a heartbeat.
Speaker 3 (22:57):
Oh my god, I appreciate it truly.
Speaker 4 (23:00):
I'm gonna You've made me want to learn to surf.
Speaker 3 (23:04):
See, that's all. That's all I want to do. That's
all I want to do, inspire people to get in
the water and enjoy the water.
Speaker 1 (23:10):
Just as we were saying goodbye, Jamie remembered a message
he had just gotten on his Instagram. And it's too
good not to play for you.
Speaker 3 (23:16):
I want to share one thing with you guys really quick,
because I thought this was really special. If someone sent
me this message on Instagram literally two days ago. Do
you mind if I share it with you guys?
Speaker 4 (23:26):
Please?
Speaker 3 (23:27):
Okay, so let me just put my glasses on because
I'm flying without him, That's all right, Okay. This is
from Lisa twenty five years ago. My husband and I,
being nine months pregnant and overdue, went on a dancing
date to possibly get things moving. As luck would have it,
the DJ saw my huge belly on the dance floor
(23:50):
and played Baby Baby and made me feel like a
star out there. Not only did I love the song
and the artists, but I thought you were perfect in
the role. So now I have an amazingly gifted and
gorgeous twenty five year old son named Jamie. Can you
believe that? It's unbelievable?
Speaker 4 (24:09):
How often does that kind of thing happen?
Speaker 3 (24:11):
It happens quite a bit, honestly. Yeah, yeah, yeah, it's
I mean, it makes me feel really good. You know,
if I get if I'm down one day, I'll look
at one of these texts, these messages, I'm like, wow,
that's pretty amazing. So yeah, it makes me happy.
Speaker 1 (24:26):
Jamie Stein has the life he wants. He has a
chill attitude, and there's at least one child out in
the world named after him. If he's not alongside such
an impact in the music video co Star Hall of Fame,
I don't know who is. Now, feel excuse me, I
need to watch Baby Baby five more times. So there
(24:51):
is a thing that people do in conversation that really
jumps out at me and it's starting a sentence with
the word so. I find myself doing it a lot
in questions. I'm not sure what it's all about. I
think it's to reassure the person I'm talking to that
I've done my research, So tell me about that BBD
tour jacket.
Speaker 4 (25:08):
So what was the super Bowl halftime show?
Speaker 1 (25:10):
Like?
Speaker 3 (25:10):
Etc.
Speaker 1 (25:11):
But often I ask a question and then the answer
begins with the words so, I've thought a lot about
what that so signifies, because, as you probably know by now,
I think about a lot of things that can't possibly
benefit me financially. I think what it says is, Okay,
here it goes, I've anticipated your question, and you're going
to get a full and satisfying answer. Jason goes a
step further. I ask a question and he begins his answer, yeah,
(25:35):
even if it isn't a yes or no question.
Speaker 4 (25:37):
Yeah. And then sometimes so it's next level.
Speaker 1 (25:40):
It's Jason saying, not only have I anticipated this question,
I've answered it in my head a few times already.
To me, it says, Jason has been ready to talk
about this stuff for a long time. He's just been
waiting for someone to ask, how does.
Speaker 4 (25:52):
That feel to you?
Speaker 1 (25:53):
When you've you've made something, and now it's just you're
just waiting for strangers to do something with it.
Speaker 3 (26:00):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (26:01):
Well, at the time, like it was, it was so gradual,
like our you know, the realization that you're not going
to get released.
Speaker 1 (26:12):
Once again, the three remaining guys of Sudden Impact, who
are now recording as Outsiders for Life with Jimmy Marble
and Jason Dowdy, are recording for a hot record label,
this time Blackground Records, the label launched by Aliah's uncle
Barry Hankerson, and once again, the finished product never sees
the light of day.
Speaker 2 (26:30):
There's probably one moment where, you know, I think all
of our hearts sank a little bit when we were
promoting not Enough, So we got a lot of radio play.
It was trending up. We were on tour like it
was around spring break time. I want to say, I
can't remember if it was ninety nine or two thousand,
I cannot remember.
Speaker 5 (26:51):
Somewhere in that time.
Speaker 2 (26:53):
I remember it was spring break time because we were
in Florida and we were, you know, opening for our idols,
you know, like Loud Cruise and Pink and Shaggy, and
we're starting to get some attention, We're starting to gain
some momentum, doing interviews all of that, and then I
guess the single lost momentum and they just pulled the
plug on the tour, so we're off the tour bus
(27:14):
and all that, and I think that was kind of
the moment where like, and you know that boy bands
are about to be over, you know, the kind of
run their course. By the time, I think this was
in two thousand, so he kind of knew that they
were running their course. And that's probably the moment where
I was like, oh, I don't think this.
Speaker 5 (27:31):
May not happen.
Speaker 1 (27:32):
With the single sputtering out, Blackground pulled the plug on
the album, an album that was already made, finished, had
a cover and everything. They did get one song, a
remix of hell Yeah on the soundtrack of the DMX
Steven Sigall movie Exit Wounds, But as for a full album, again,
the guys have poured their hearts into a project that
sits in a vault at a record company. Why record
(27:54):
something and then never give it an opportunity to earn
a single dollar back?
Speaker 2 (28:00):
I think that's just I think that's just part of
the business at the time. There, I mean, there are
so many boy bands and like girl groups from that
time that probably got left on the cutting room floor,
you know what I mean.
Speaker 5 (28:13):
Like, I bet there are.
Speaker 2 (28:16):
Thousands of stories like mine out there, and I think
it was just the way they did business like they
would it was worth the investment to see if it
would happen to get like like, it's kind of like
a gold rush, right instinct. You know, Backstreet Boys are popular.
Everybody's like, let's make the next one. When they all
rushed to it and they all throw money at it,
and then you know, whoever catches on, great, But if
(28:38):
they don't catch on, it was worth the investment to
seek to get part of that part of that market.
Speaker 1 (28:43):
To your point about boy bands that that don't take off,
Get this, Okay, I'm going to tell you a story.
This would have to have been. In two thousand, I
hosted the get this you're sitting down, this is good.
I hosted the press conference the unveiling of the Backstreet
(29:06):
Boys Burger King Kids Club action figures.
Speaker 5 (29:12):
Okay, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 1 (29:13):
They flew me down to Orlando, Florida to like to
some theme park or something, and the Backstreet Boys were
there and they were unveiling their kids Club, Action figures
and so and so that's that was going on there,
which was of course wild. And the night that I
spent in Orlando, we ended up going to some club
(29:34):
and the club was literally full. Like everyone that I
met was like in a boy band or a girl group.
So it was like they would introduce themselves by name
and then.
Speaker 4 (29:48):
Name of group.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
Oh wow, as though I knew like these you know,
second and third tier like groups that Lou Pearlman was,
you know, was working with, but it was it was insane.
It would just be like, Hi, I'm Ashley Innocence. Okay, Okay,
I don't know what that means. I don't know what
that means. But there were dozens of them, and it
(30:10):
was like I am fully in like in like some
sort of I'm like at Hogwarts for boy bands and
girl groups, and most of the ones I met nothing happened.
Speaker 4 (30:23):
So there you go.
Speaker 2 (30:24):
Well, and I think part of the reason we had
some success was like there was some integrity to our
group because we wrote and produced the stuff, and we
like the contracts that we had to choose from. DreamWorks
was one of them, and we could have gone that route,
you know, work with David Foster, you know, with that direction.
(30:47):
But Todd and Alan and Tim really liked the offer
from Blackground because they were more like our people, you
know what I mean, Like they understood the type of
music we wanted to make. They were working with our
ye rows, you know, Timberlance from the Missier Votes, from
that Hampton Roads area, like, you know, it just seemed
(31:07):
like a better fit. So, like, I think the reason
we even caught on some was because there was like
that people can tell genuine from fake pretty easily, right,
and I think at least people could tell that, you know,
we wrote the song and it's real and we mean
the lyrics and all that.
Speaker 1 (31:20):
So in the early nineties, Sudden Impact slash White Guys
Slashed the Outsiders couldn't get their records released because new
Kids on the Block were over. In two thousand, Outsiders
for Life couldn't get their record released because Backstreet Boys
and in Sync were huge. Sudden Impact got pushed to
the side because there were no boy bands. Outsiders for
Life got pushed to the side because there were too
(31:41):
many boy bands. For Jason, this was a disappointment, but
he was still new to the game. For the core
group from Sudden impact. This has to have been devastating.
If this is two thousand, this is nine years into
a career where this has been happening over and over
and over. Did you get a sense for how they
(32:01):
were feeling.
Speaker 5 (32:02):
Yeah, so Todd.
Speaker 2 (32:04):
Todd is definitely the most persistent person in the group
that will do anything to make the dream happen. He
started the group, it's his dream. He is so good
at I don't know, like motivating people and getting people
on board. But his I think his thought process at
(32:27):
the time was this sucks. What can I do next
to make it happen? Like, you know, it was more
like let's do this, let's do that, let's talk to
these people. He's more in like, let's still make it
happen mode. So I think you'll have to ask Todd
what happened after that. But I think for him it
wasn't quite real yet, and it wasn't real necessarily for
(32:49):
any of us were But that was kind of a
moment where I was like, oh, yeah, this could be
over soon, you know, like where at least that light
bulb went on, you know, but we weren't ready to
give up.
Speaker 4 (32:59):
Sure, and what does that feel like?
Speaker 2 (33:02):
So joining this group has always felt like it's too
good to be true anyway, you know what I mean,
Like I talked in right when everybody did the groundwork,
you know what I'm saying, Like everybody had already done
the groundwork, got the contract and all that, and I'm
just like singing songs that other people are writing. Like
so for me it wasn't as bad. I was like,
I can always go back to, you know, performing doing
(33:24):
what I was doing before. So and you know, it's
been a dream of mine, but I'm not like, you know,
there are people who dream and then there's people who
build and do things about it. When I was that young,
I was just dreaming, not doing anything about it. So
I wasn't like invested too heavily. So I probably took
it better than most of the people, like especially Pod
(33:45):
and Allen and.
Speaker 1 (33:46):
Day and Jason had a fallback position doing something else
that I feel like I'm going to have to explain
to young people, like.
Speaker 2 (33:52):
I moved did a cruise ship contract two thousand and
four and moved back to two thousand and five to
make one last go of the group, and then in
two thousand and six is when I moved away started
doing cruise ships again and all of that.
Speaker 1 (34:06):
All right, kids gather around one more time. People used
to go on cruise ships.
Speaker 4 (34:10):
That's it.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
So I think that's kind of when the realization happened
for Todd and for the guys in the group. I
think we're all slowly accepting it over time.
Speaker 1 (34:21):
Now Todd, as I understand it, is still in the business,
still like writing songs for country artists.
Speaker 5 (34:27):
Yeah, yeah, he's still doing that.
Speaker 2 (34:29):
He's I think he has a You'll have to ask
Todd obviously to get the exact thing, but I know
he had a last time I spoke to him, he
said he had a big meeting in Nashville and he
was considering, like there offered him a publishing contract. But
you know, he has a family now, he's got a mortgage,
and he's got all these responsibilities. So in order to
(34:51):
only focus on writing, like we'd have to take drastic cut.
Speaker 5 (34:54):
And pay and so I think he was weighing those options.
You'll have to ask him how it came out.
Speaker 1 (34:59):
Yeah, Jason's got a good attitude about the whole thing,
probably because he remembers why he got involved in the
first place. When you were like starting out as a singer.
What did what did success in music look like to you?
Speaker 3 (35:14):
Yeah?
Speaker 2 (35:14):
I I didn't really I didn't really think about it
that much. I so my very first job, I got
it Frontier City in Oklahoma, just singing in some show,
earning minimum wage, you know, and I was selling pictures
at the front of the park before and after, and
like I was thrilled, you know at the time, like I.
Speaker 5 (35:36):
Can sing for a living.
Speaker 2 (35:37):
Wow, you know what I mean. Like I had that
just attitude or gratitude all the time. So I success
to me was just like the fact that I could
sing and make a living at it. That was number one.
Like in Oklahoma, they don't preach that, like it doesn't
happen because there aren't any performing jobs there obviously, right,
(35:58):
So you know, if I grew up in La or
York or something like that, I'd probably have bigger, bigger dreams.
But did that got a job at Busch Gardens. I
was like, Wow, even a better job. And then you know,
started doing that, and then when this came along, I
was like, oh, I didn't even realize this could happen
this easily, you know what I mean, Like I was
I didn't build it from scratch or anything like that.
(36:19):
I just kind of luckily fell into it. So and
then I got out a new vision of success with
the group. I was like, Wow, we could really make it.
We could do this, we could do that. Started to
learn producing and songwriting and all that while while we went.
Speaker 1 (36:32):
And now are you still well nobody's doing cruise ships now,
But have you had you How long did you continue
singing on cruise ships and stuff?
Speaker 2 (36:43):
Yeah, until like twenty thirteen, and then I got another
regular nine to five job, met my wife, you know,
so now we have kids and all that, so just
doing that. I still write songs. I still put music
out and do some producing and stuff like that, but
not like I don't have time to pursue it or
anything like that.
Speaker 4 (37:04):
Yeah. How many kids?
Speaker 1 (37:06):
Oh?
Speaker 5 (37:07):
Oh two? I have two kids? Yeah, three and five.
Sophia's five, Kayley's two.
Speaker 4 (37:12):
Congratulations, Oh thank you, thank you.
Speaker 3 (37:14):
I love it.
Speaker 4 (37:15):
And what line of business are you in?
Speaker 2 (37:17):
I worked for an internet service provider and as a
team manager just for people. We basically give a call
and say, hey, I see you signed up for our internet.
Let's let's get an appointment going that type.
Speaker 4 (37:28):
Thanks good. It's a happy life.
Speaker 5 (37:31):
It sounds like, yeah, yeah, it's a happy life most definitely.
Speaker 4 (37:34):
Are you glad you took the ride?
Speaker 2 (37:36):
Yeah, yeah, absolutely yeah it was. I mean I have
some of my best stories from there. I don't know
if I should share any other I think. I mean, like,
I don't know, no, not have it involves other people,
but yeah, yeah, I would say it's definitely worth the ride.
Speaker 1 (37:53):
Jason Dowdy and Jamie Stein Tiger Beet and the Baby
Baby Man, two good guys, two living lessons in gratitude.
Speaker 4 (38:01):
I check my.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
Email after I get off the zoom and there's a
message from Todd White, the main songwriter for Sudden Impact,
the guy all the way to the right in the
Motown Philly moment, the driver of the whole project, the
guy who was gonna beat up Aaron Kine but started
a singing group with him instead. He says he's down
to talk and he wants to know if Alan Healy
can join the call. I'll talk to two fifths of
(38:23):
Sudden Impact at the same time, and maybe they'll give
me the dish on who that disc track was about.
We'll find out next time. On Waiting for Impact, a
Dave Holmes passion project This has been an exactly Right production.
Written by me Dave Holmes, produced by Hannah Kyle Crichton, recorded,
(38:47):
mixed and sound designed by Andrew Eapen. Additional engineering and
assembly by Annalise Nelson. Music by Ben Wise, artwork by
Garrett Ross. Executive produced by Caro kill Gareff, Georgia hard
Stark and Danielle Kramer. Follow the show on Instagram, Facebook,
and Twitter at exactly right and follow me at Dave Holmes.
(39:11):
For more information, go to Exactlyrightmedia dot com. Binge the
show add free on stitch your premium for a free month.
Head to Stitcher Premium dot com, slash impact and enter
promo code Impact when you select a monthly plan. Listen, subscribe,
and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts, Stitcher, or
wherever you get your podcasts
Host
Dave Holmes
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