April 17, 2025 • 10 mins
Heather Spilsbury, CEO of 50/50 Women on Boards discuses the importance of women being on company boards and the non profit's third annual 50 Women to watch for Boards program. 50/50 Women on Boards is a nonprofit education and advocacy campaign driving the movement toward gender balance and diversity on corporate boards.
Hosts: Carol Massar and Tim Stenovec
Producer: Sebastian Escobar
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, Radio News. This is Bloomberg business
Weekdaily reporting from the magazine that helps global leaders stay
ahead with insight on the people, companies, and trends shaping
today's complex economy. Plus global business finance and tech news
(00:23):
as it happens. The Bloomberg Business Week Daily Podcast with
Carol Masser and Tim Steneveek on Bloomberg Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
Well, female representation in the bordroom almost tripled since twenty ten,
with most gender diverse companies delivering higher shareholder returns compared
to male dominated boards. This is according to some research
from Bloomberg Intelligence.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
You have the numbers, Carol, Yeah, listen, check this out. Everybody,
Women made up twenty six percent of boards in twenty
twenty three. That's up from nine percent and twenty ten,
so thirteen years. Highlighting how regulations in Europe, US and
Asia that compel change are impacting global corporations. This is
a again from a Bloomberg Intelligence report that was put
out in December.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Heather Spilsbury is chief operating officer of Fifty to fifty
Women on Boards. It's a global nonprofit that looks to
create a gender balance on corporate board she joins us
here in the Bloomberg Interactive Broker's studio. It's good to
see you.
Speaker 4 (01:15):
Go to see you too.
Speaker 5 (01:16):
You were here a year ago with Carol. Yes, I
was the Chief Meling Officer.
Speaker 4 (01:19):
Now I'm the CEO.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
Oh oh oh yes, changing in the Google doc.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
Great.
Speaker 5 (01:26):
So you were here a year ago.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
Yes, and a lot has changed.
Speaker 5 (01:31):
A lot has changed since then. I'm just curious what
the world looks like to you right now.
Speaker 4 (01:37):
You know, it's interesting because obviously we're an organization that's
committed to elevating women in the pipeline to corporate board service,
and we're committed to positively impacting corporate governance because it's
good for business. And we've always said that we've never
used really the acronym of D, E and I. So
when we get into these conversations, especially with corporations, right,
we've noticed that the language needs to change so that
(01:59):
they understand and really what we're here to support and
why we're here to support it. Women still don't hold
the same amount of seats as men. The research from
our standpoints shows that women hold thirty point two percent
of the seats as of Q four, twenty twenty four.
Which means that we have ways to go just from
a gender equality standpoint. And this isn't about representation or equality.
(02:19):
It's about making sure that you have talent in the
pipeline that is being looked at that maybe under networked
they may not have the same opportunity.
Speaker 3 (02:27):
Well, the pushback that we are seeing, certainly from the administration,
whether it's an academia, whether it's across corporate America, whether
it's across the government, the pushback are we going to see,
Like what are you hearing as you talk to corporations.
Are they saying, yep, we are going to change what
we do or are they going to continue business as
usual with these DEI initiatives but just not talk about it.
Speaker 4 (02:48):
It's a little bit of both. I would say that
the environment just depends on the corporation.
Speaker 3 (02:52):
And some are pulling back.
Speaker 4 (02:53):
Some are pulling back. Some are also saying we can
do this, but we're going to be silent partners. Some
are also saying we can do this, but we need
to reframe how we're going to partner with you and
the type of language we can use. And so US
as a nonprofit, you know, we rely on corporate sponsorship
to ensure that we can still run our programs and
events for women like fifty women to watch for boards,
(03:13):
like our board readiness workshops, like distributing research, like you know,
any of the programs that we have to offer women
and to men. Frankly, you know, because these events are
an opportunity to network with directors.
Speaker 3 (03:24):
Do you have to water down your message our messaging?
Speaker 1 (03:28):
You know?
Speaker 3 (03:28):
I was it's hard when you're you know what the
company's called, you know.
Speaker 5 (03:31):
And when it's called.
Speaker 4 (03:32):
But again, it's fifty to fifty. So we're not asking
for men to be eliminated from the equation. We just
want to ensure that we're looking at other talent, which
includes women, which includes people of color. And again it
goes back to those under network groups that maybe don't
have the same opportunities as white men have had in
the past, especially when it comes to securing a board
(03:54):
seat in board governance.
Speaker 2 (03:57):
But is that something we can talk about right now,
Like it seems like if you were to say that.
Speaker 5 (04:04):
In an environment.
Speaker 1 (04:06):
Now, it's as volatile as is.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
Like, yeah, it's it's like your persona on grata, It's like,
you know, it's like it's a it's a four letter work.
Speaker 5 (04:16):
Yeah, it is.
Speaker 4 (04:17):
Well yeah, and it's it's the acronym in and of
itself that I think is being weaponized. And we're talking
about merit and and when you look at the composition
of a board, everybody that's appointed to a board seat
should be viewed at it from a from a merit standpoint.
Do they have the expertise, do they have the skills?
Speaker 5 (04:37):
You know?
Speaker 4 (04:37):
Is that board also succession planning? Are they doing the
right thing? So that's when we when we look at governance,
we really need to look at that holistically.
Speaker 3 (04:44):
Heather, One thing I do wonder, because women are now
what more than a third right right of board members,
and non white directors I think are more prevalent as well.
Speaker 5 (04:54):
Does that ultimately help.
Speaker 3 (04:56):
Women going for women going forward because the composition is
more just diversity in general.
Speaker 4 (05:04):
It does. There is also some other research that shows
that women are leaving boards much sooner than they used to,
which means they may not have a voice on that
board seat. There's more research on our end that needs
to be done there, but there's also other things to
look at. Right, So, even though they're attaining board seats,
the amount of time that they're spending on that board
is something that needs to be reviewed. I would say
that it does help because women end up supporting other
(05:25):
women like men end up supporting other men. I mean,
it's just natural, right, It's in our own bias. But
I think what we've seen from our research is when
women are pointed to boards, they are committed to diversity.
And that's not a bad thing because when you're looking
at your company, who are you serving as customers clients?
Speaker 5 (05:43):
Are you a global organization?
Speaker 4 (05:44):
Do you need that expertise and experience?
Speaker 2 (05:47):
So reached out to Jeff Green, who covers these issues
here at Bloomberg. He made the point to me that
women are now more than a third of board members,
but there are some questions. He pointed out about forty
percent being some sort of level of resistance at least,
you know, in terms of what the workforce looks like
right now, maybe until we see more retirement from baby boomers.
(06:08):
Do you see that is there a resistance when you
get to forty percent of women on boards? I don't.
Speaker 5 (06:13):
I don't know we can get to fifty.
Speaker 4 (06:14):
I think we can get to fifty. I think it's
going to take time. I think, especially in the climate
we're in right now the numbers that we previously said
that we'd reach gender parody by you know, by twenty fifty,
that may take longer, which is unfortunate because you know,
you would think that in today's age where we've all
you know, grown and evolved as humans and people and
(06:38):
it as businesses, because really most businesses are global in
some way, shape or form, especially corporations that are publicly listed,
you would just think that the natural thing to do
would be to include talent that has that expertise that
comes from a different background or experience than someone else does.
And that's not just about race, and it's not just
about gender. Again, it goes back to expertise ease. You know,
(07:01):
what life experience do you have? What qualities do you
add to the board that someone doesn't have, and they
might give you a different perspective.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
I am also curious when company is a global company, right,
and they operate in global markets, right, that may still
embraced EI initiatives.
Speaker 4 (07:17):
That is a really good point.
Speaker 3 (07:18):
How does that work out?
Speaker 5 (07:19):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (07:19):
And they do and I and you know, we have
a couple of clear examples. I won't name those companies,
but they are global companies and they are sponsors of ours.
So they've said to us, well, we're going to lean
in more on the international side, where you have other
chapters outside of the US, which is Mexico, Toronto, London, Tokyo, Nairobi,
things of that nature, where they want to get involved
because they know nothing is changing there and they're still
(07:41):
supportive of what we're our mission is and what we're doing.
Speaker 5 (07:44):
Do they have to be did they did we quiet
about this? Now? Did they used to sort of talk.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
About their supportive issues such as this and now maybe
they're still supporting but they're not advertising yet.
Speaker 5 (07:55):
Correct. But it's not.
Speaker 4 (07:56):
It wasn't so much as as at a regional level,
to be frank, it wasn't like, oh, we're going to
support the US in this way and then international regions
in this way from where we're based. It was more
of holistic conversations about supporting women on boards. I think
now we're seeing more of a shift with those global
companies specifically who are saying, let's put more of our
(08:17):
dollars into this part of the business where you have
events and where you're supporting women through educational programs. But
then that tips the scale in a very different way.
Speaker 5 (08:27):
S then what does it you look like? What does
the environment look like in the US right now? Exactly?
Because that's when we'll start to see the effects of.
Speaker 4 (08:33):
This, and that's where I think globalization is so important
and is key. We cannot look at ourselves as a
country that's separated from other countries because we're not. We're
all so intertwined.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
From a perspective of a for example, a head of state,
we are separate from that. We're a country that has
never had a female head of state. True, and a
lot of you know, our quote unquote peer countries have.
Speaker 4 (08:57):
But think of companies like Apple. I mean they rely
heavily on China for their products and to be able
to get that at a decent price, and so having
a manufacturer that here in the US creates a huge
divide for US as a nation where we have to
now bring this all in house. That's a lot of
infrastructure to build that we don't currently have and doesn't exist.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
Well. Last question twenty seconds what is this environment due
to your mission? Does it slow it down a little bit?
Speaker 1 (09:22):
No?
Speaker 4 (09:22):
We are leaning in and I know in other organizations
are doing the same thing. I think it's really important
for us to stay committed to what we're doing. We're
committed to elevating women in the pipeline to corporate board
service with allyship from men, also supporting men on their journeys.
Of course, if they, you know, they're welcome to come
to our events and meet corporate directors. We just want
to ensure that corporate governance is positively impacted, because again,
(09:45):
it's good for business, and so it doesn't do us
any good to keep quiet and sit back.
Speaker 5 (09:50):
Have you called the White House?
Speaker 3 (09:51):
Are they taking a meeting?
Speaker 4 (09:52):
No, they have not.
Speaker 3 (09:52):
Okay, TVD, TVD. Heather, thank you so much, so thanks
for having me get check in with you. Heather Spillsberry,
she's the chief executive officer. Fifty to fifty women on
boards joining us at studio. Thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
This is the Bloomberg Business Week Daily podcast, available on Apple, Spotify,
and anywhere else you get your podcasts. Listen live weekday
afternoons from two to five pm Eastern on Bloomberg dot com,
the iHeartRadio app, tune In, and the Bloomberg Business App.
You can also watch us live every weekday on YouTube
(10:24):
and always on the Bloomberg terminal
Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, Radio News. This is Bloomberg business
Weekdaily reporting from the magazine that helps global leaders stay
ahead with insight on the people, companies, and trends shaping
today's complex economy. Plus global business finance and tech news
(00:23):
as it happens. The Bloomberg Business Week Daily Podcast with
Carol Masser and Tim Steneveek on Bloomberg Radio.
Speaker 2 (00:32):
Well, female representation in the bordroom almost tripled since twenty ten,
with most gender diverse companies delivering higher shareholder returns compared
to male dominated boards. This is according to some research
from Bloomberg Intelligence.
Speaker 3 (00:44):
You have the numbers, Carol, Yeah, listen, check this out. Everybody,
Women made up twenty six percent of boards in twenty
twenty three. That's up from nine percent and twenty ten,
so thirteen years. Highlighting how regulations in Europe, US and
Asia that compel change are impacting global corporations. This is
a again from a Bloomberg Intelligence report that was put
out in December.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Heather Spilsbury is chief operating officer of Fifty to fifty
Women on Boards. It's a global nonprofit that looks to
create a gender balance on corporate board she joins us
here in the Bloomberg Interactive Broker's studio. It's good to
see you.
Speaker 4 (01:15):
Go to see you too.
Speaker 5 (01:16):
You were here a year ago with Carol. Yes, I
was the Chief Meling Officer.
Speaker 4 (01:19):
Now I'm the CEO.
Speaker 3 (01:20):
Oh oh oh yes, changing in the Google doc.
Speaker 1 (01:25):
Great.
Speaker 5 (01:26):
So you were here a year ago.
Speaker 2 (01:28):
Yes, and a lot has changed.
Speaker 5 (01:31):
A lot has changed since then. I'm just curious what
the world looks like to you right now.
Speaker 4 (01:37):
You know, it's interesting because obviously we're an organization that's
committed to elevating women in the pipeline to corporate board service,
and we're committed to positively impacting corporate governance because it's
good for business. And we've always said that we've never
used really the acronym of D, E and I. So
when we get into these conversations, especially with corporations, right,
we've noticed that the language needs to change so that
(01:59):
they understand and really what we're here to support and
why we're here to support it. Women still don't hold
the same amount of seats as men. The research from
our standpoints shows that women hold thirty point two percent
of the seats as of Q four, twenty twenty four.
Which means that we have ways to go just from
a gender equality standpoint. And this isn't about representation or equality.
(02:19):
It's about making sure that you have talent in the
pipeline that is being looked at that maybe under networked
they may not have the same opportunity.
Speaker 3 (02:27):
Well, the pushback that we are seeing, certainly from the administration,
whether it's an academia, whether it's across corporate America, whether
it's across the government, the pushback are we going to see,
Like what are you hearing as you talk to corporations.
Are they saying, yep, we are going to change what
we do or are they going to continue business as
usual with these DEI initiatives but just not talk about it.
Speaker 4 (02:48):
It's a little bit of both. I would say that
the environment just depends on the corporation.
Speaker 3 (02:52):
And some are pulling back.
Speaker 4 (02:53):
Some are pulling back. Some are also saying we can
do this, but we're going to be silent partners. Some
are also saying we can do this, but we need
to reframe how we're going to partner with you and
the type of language we can use. And so US
as a nonprofit, you know, we rely on corporate sponsorship
to ensure that we can still run our programs and
events for women like fifty women to watch for boards,
(03:13):
like our board readiness workshops, like distributing research, like you know,
any of the programs that we have to offer women
and to men. Frankly, you know, because these events are
an opportunity to network with directors.
Speaker 3 (03:24):
Do you have to water down your message our messaging?
Speaker 1 (03:28):
You know?
Speaker 3 (03:28):
I was it's hard when you're you know what the
company's called, you know.
Speaker 5 (03:31):
And when it's called.
Speaker 4 (03:32):
But again, it's fifty to fifty. So we're not asking
for men to be eliminated from the equation. We just
want to ensure that we're looking at other talent, which
includes women, which includes people of color. And again it
goes back to those under network groups that maybe don't
have the same opportunities as white men have had in
the past, especially when it comes to securing a board
(03:54):
seat in board governance.
Speaker 2 (03:57):
But is that something we can talk about right now,
Like it seems like if you were to say that.
Speaker 5 (04:04):
In an environment.
Speaker 1 (04:06):
Now, it's as volatile as is.
Speaker 2 (04:09):
Like, yeah, it's it's like your persona on grata, It's like,
you know, it's like it's a it's a four letter work.
Speaker 5 (04:16):
Yeah, it is.
Speaker 4 (04:17):
Well yeah, and it's it's the acronym in and of
itself that I think is being weaponized. And we're talking
about merit and and when you look at the composition
of a board, everybody that's appointed to a board seat
should be viewed at it from a from a merit standpoint.
Do they have the expertise, do they have the skills?
Speaker 5 (04:37):
You know?
Speaker 4 (04:37):
Is that board also succession planning? Are they doing the
right thing? So that's when we when we look at governance,
we really need to look at that holistically.
Speaker 3 (04:44):
Heather, One thing I do wonder, because women are now
what more than a third right right of board members,
and non white directors I think are more prevalent as well.
Speaker 5 (04:54):
Does that ultimately help.
Speaker 3 (04:56):
Women going for women going forward because the composition is
more just diversity in general.
Speaker 4 (05:04):
It does. There is also some other research that shows
that women are leaving boards much sooner than they used to,
which means they may not have a voice on that
board seat. There's more research on our end that needs
to be done there, but there's also other things to
look at. Right, So, even though they're attaining board seats,
the amount of time that they're spending on that board
is something that needs to be reviewed. I would say
that it does help because women end up supporting other
(05:25):
women like men end up supporting other men. I mean,
it's just natural, right, It's in our own bias. But
I think what we've seen from our research is when
women are pointed to boards, they are committed to diversity.
And that's not a bad thing because when you're looking
at your company, who are you serving as customers clients?
Speaker 5 (05:43):
Are you a global organization?
Speaker 4 (05:44):
Do you need that expertise and experience?
Speaker 2 (05:47):
So reached out to Jeff Green, who covers these issues
here at Bloomberg. He made the point to me that
women are now more than a third of board members,
but there are some questions. He pointed out about forty
percent being some sort of level of resistance at least,
you know, in terms of what the workforce looks like
right now, maybe until we see more retirement from baby boomers.
(06:08):
Do you see that is there a resistance when you
get to forty percent of women on boards? I don't.
Speaker 5 (06:13):
I don't know we can get to fifty.
Speaker 4 (06:14):
I think we can get to fifty. I think it's
going to take time. I think, especially in the climate
we're in right now the numbers that we previously said
that we'd reach gender parody by you know, by twenty fifty,
that may take longer, which is unfortunate because you know,
you would think that in today's age where we've all
you know, grown and evolved as humans and people and
(06:38):
it as businesses, because really most businesses are global in
some way, shape or form, especially corporations that are publicly listed,
you would just think that the natural thing to do
would be to include talent that has that expertise that
comes from a different background or experience than someone else does.
And that's not just about race, and it's not just
about gender. Again, it goes back to expertise ease. You know,
(07:01):
what life experience do you have? What qualities do you
add to the board that someone doesn't have, and they
might give you a different perspective.
Speaker 3 (07:08):
I am also curious when company is a global company, right,
and they operate in global markets, right, that may still
embraced EI initiatives.
Speaker 4 (07:17):
That is a really good point.
Speaker 3 (07:18):
How does that work out?
Speaker 5 (07:19):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (07:19):
And they do and I and you know, we have
a couple of clear examples. I won't name those companies,
but they are global companies and they are sponsors of ours.
So they've said to us, well, we're going to lean
in more on the international side, where you have other
chapters outside of the US, which is Mexico, Toronto, London, Tokyo, Nairobi,
things of that nature, where they want to get involved
because they know nothing is changing there and they're still
(07:41):
supportive of what we're our mission is and what we're doing.
Speaker 5 (07:44):
Do they have to be did they did we quiet
about this? Now? Did they used to sort of talk.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
About their supportive issues such as this and now maybe
they're still supporting but they're not advertising yet.
Speaker 5 (07:55):
Correct. But it's not.
Speaker 4 (07:56):
It wasn't so much as as at a regional level,
to be frank, it wasn't like, oh, we're going to
support the US in this way and then international regions
in this way from where we're based. It was more
of holistic conversations about supporting women on boards. I think
now we're seeing more of a shift with those global
companies specifically who are saying, let's put more of our
(08:17):
dollars into this part of the business where you have
events and where you're supporting women through educational programs. But
then that tips the scale in a very different way.
Speaker 5 (08:27):
S then what does it you look like? What does
the environment look like in the US right now? Exactly?
Because that's when we'll start to see the effects of.
Speaker 4 (08:33):
This, and that's where I think globalization is so important
and is key. We cannot look at ourselves as a
country that's separated from other countries because we're not. We're
all so intertwined.
Speaker 2 (08:44):
From a perspective of a for example, a head of state,
we are separate from that. We're a country that has
never had a female head of state. True, and a
lot of you know, our quote unquote peer countries have.
Speaker 4 (08:57):
But think of companies like Apple. I mean they rely
heavily on China for their products and to be able
to get that at a decent price, and so having
a manufacturer that here in the US creates a huge
divide for US as a nation where we have to
now bring this all in house. That's a lot of
infrastructure to build that we don't currently have and doesn't exist.
Speaker 3 (09:17):
Well. Last question twenty seconds what is this environment due
to your mission? Does it slow it down a little bit?
Speaker 1 (09:22):
No?
Speaker 4 (09:22):
We are leaning in and I know in other organizations
are doing the same thing. I think it's really important
for us to stay committed to what we're doing. We're
committed to elevating women in the pipeline to corporate board
service with allyship from men, also supporting men on their journeys.
Of course, if they, you know, they're welcome to come
to our events and meet corporate directors. We just want
to ensure that corporate governance is positively impacted, because again,
(09:45):
it's good for business, and so it doesn't do us
any good to keep quiet and sit back.
Speaker 5 (09:50):
Have you called the White House?
Speaker 3 (09:51):
Are they taking a meeting?
Speaker 4 (09:52):
No, they have not.
Speaker 3 (09:52):
Okay, TVD, TVD. Heather, thank you so much, so thanks
for having me get check in with you. Heather Spillsberry,
she's the chief executive officer. Fifty to fifty women on
boards joining us at studio. Thank you so much.
Speaker 2 (10:03):
This is the Bloomberg Business Week Daily podcast, available on Apple, Spotify,
and anywhere else you get your podcasts. Listen live weekday
afternoons from two to five pm Eastern on Bloomberg dot com,
the iHeartRadio app, tune In, and the Bloomberg Business App.
You can also watch us live every weekday on YouTube
(10:24):
and always on the Bloomberg terminal
Hosts And Creators
Tim Stenovec
Carol Massar
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