June 16, 2025 • 35 mins
Bloomberg’s Caroline Hyde and Ed Ludlow discuss the Trump family’s plan for a self-branded mobile phone service. Plus, Meta launches ads on the privacy-focused messaging service WhatsApp. And robotics firm 1X Technologies announces a new “World Model” to train robots on the physical world using data-driven simulations.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. Bloomberg Tech is alive
from coast to coast with Caroline Hyde in New York
and Vla Loow in San Francisco.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
This is Bloomberg Tech coming up. President Trump's families getting
into the mobile phone business with the Trump branded service
plus Meta.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
We'll start showing ads in WhatsApp and offer paid subscriptions
for the first time.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
And robotics firm one Ex Technology says it can evaluate
a robot's performance without deploying it into the real world.
But first, President Trump is attending a Group of Seventh
summit in Canada today. This amid tariff uncertainty, a Middle
East crisis between Israel and Iran. Let's go over to
the G seven summit where Bloomberg's and Marie Horden is
standing by AMH. What do we need to know?
Speaker 4 (00:56):
Well, certainly this is going to be a packed summit
and what's going on in the Middle East is certainly
taking center stage now really topping the agenda. We are
waiting for President Trump to have a first bilateral meeting
before the summit really kicks off. In earnest with Mark Karney,
the Prime Minister of Canada, and really the Canadians here
are trying to avoid what happened in twenty eighteen. You
(01:16):
may remember that viral photo and the President was sitting
with his arms crossed looking up at Angela Merkel, the
then German Chancellor. She was surrounded by a number of leaders,
the only one that's lasted since a fence, and then,
of course President Trump pulled the US out of that
joint communicate. So Mark Kearney's taking a different approach this time,
looking at different statements that they can have a common
(01:41):
thread for specifics, not one communicate for wide range of topics,
maybe something regarding artificial intelligence, critical minerals. Potentially there will
not be an agreement from all of these countries when
it comes to things like the war in Ukraine, things
like climate change, or even when it comes to what
is going on with Iran and Israel. That is certainly
(02:01):
going to be top of the agenda today. The President
was speaking about as he left the White House yesterday
and his way to Canada, and he was saying that
these two may have to fight it out, but in
the end he wants a deal.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
Bloomberg's Amory Horden will stick with what's happening in the
G seven throughout the day. Thank you. Let's go with
Donald Trump and over to DC to talk about some
news in technology. The President's family launching a Trump branded
mobile phone service that will rely on wireless networks and
hardware quotes made in America, Bloomberg, Kelsey Griffiths here with more.
The idea is that they're not building the network from
(02:36):
the ground upright, They basically licensed capacity from the three
major US carriers. But what else do we know about
Trump Mobile? That's right ed?
Speaker 5 (02:46):
So the Trump family's mobile service is they say they're
going to rely on the three major US telecom networks that.
Speaker 6 (02:54):
Have already been built.
Speaker 5 (02:55):
And this is a pretty common strategy that we see.
Meant Mobile is one of the pretty well known so
called mv and os that was eventually acquired by T Mobile.
We also saw some celebrities last week looking to get
into the mobile game, launching their own mv and O.
So the Trump family is following a pretty popular tradition
(03:17):
here by getting into this.
Speaker 6 (03:18):
Business, Kelsey Popular.
Speaker 3 (03:20):
Last time I checked, there were one hundreds, more than
one hundred here in the United States of mobile virtual
network operators.
Speaker 6 (03:27):
But what they're trying to tap into.
Speaker 3 (03:28):
Here is the Trump narrative, the Trump brand. How will
it be priced versus other competitors in the space.
Speaker 5 (03:36):
That's right, So the brand is it's going to cost
about just under fifty dollars. I think it's a forty
seven to forty five per month, and I would say
that is pretty competitive with the space. These mv and
os tend to target these niche markets that are looking
at customers that maybe don't want to or can't pay
(03:58):
one hundred dollars or or you know, somewhere in that range.
So I do think that there is a chance they
will be targeting this niche that you know, maybe other
operators aren't necessary.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Are you looking at Kelsey? It's a competitive field, right
when you're looking at any carrier. When I was reading
the news from Trump Mobile, they're including everything that you'd expect,
unlimited text, data, voice protection, overseas call. Just give us
the basics of the plan.
Speaker 5 (04:29):
Yeah, exactly. So there are going to be some of
these value added services on top of your mobile services
that you would expect. There is going to be some
sort of roadside assistance, there will be international calling thrown in,
and there's also going to be the opportunity to purchase
a mobile device that will also be branded with the
(04:52):
Trump family logo. It will come in a gold variety,
which you know, I'm looking forward to seeing.
Speaker 3 (05:00):
Kelsey Griffiths puts us perfectly onto our next discussion because
we want to talk about the hardware perspective. Bomberg's Dana
woman is, hey, with US four hundred and ninety nine dollars,
you're going to be able to get it as soon
as September. You can put one hundred dollars down for
initial well, name.
Speaker 6 (05:15):
On a list. But can they make that in America?
Speaker 7 (05:19):
Never say never, but certainly the smartphone industry is not
really making phones here in the US right now, and
it's unclear from the report so far and what we
know so far who exactly are with what partners Trump
and his family would be making these devices. All that
we know, as Kelsey has said, is that the advice
would be golden color, which is very on brand for Trump,
and that it will be caught, that it will be
(05:40):
priced at four hundred and ninety nine dollars, which even
before recent inflation, was a pretty budget price for a
phone and seems especially low these days. So not knowing
anything about the hardware, we can at least say safely
these are probably not phones offering the most advanced features.
And maybe that's not the point, as Kelsey said, for
this particular niche right.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
The point, Jiner is that this is built as being
designed and built in America at a time where the
President is putting pressure on Apple to build the iPhone
in America or face tariffs of as much as twenty
five percent. I think it's really notable that it's going
to run Android OS as well.
Speaker 6 (06:17):
Yes, absolutely, as we said.
Speaker 7 (06:20):
As I said, it's unclear exactly how the Trump organization
would make this phone come to pass so quickly in
the US, just knowing from Apple and other manufacturers as
well all of the human resources, the human labor and
physical resources that just are lacking here in the US.
(06:43):
And by human resources, I mean specialized talent that know
how to use this particular manufacturing equipment. A lot of
the equipment itself is abroad. So it's unclear exactly how
the team plans to surmount those challenges that other smartphone
makers either haven't tackled or just seem to be avoiding.
Speaker 3 (07:01):
It's interesting who ultimately it'll be competing against because we've heard.
Speaker 6 (07:05):
Him take aim President Trump.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
This is of course the phone being made by President
by Trump organization in his family. But President Trump himself,
the administration of taken aim at Apple front and center.
Bring your manufacturing back to the United States, but at
a four nine to nine price point. Yeah, I might
compete against an iPhone se but really it's going against
other Android phones. It's going against the pixel AA for example.
Speaker 7 (07:26):
Yes, maybe perhaps not even the pixel A line, perhaps
even more budget, sort of bargain basement phones that I'm
not able to recite offhand, and most of us can't
recite offhand.
Speaker 6 (07:38):
And I think one.
Speaker 7 (07:39):
Key question is how many does the organization plan to produce.
I think one of the key lines in our story
is that smartphone makers aren't producing.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
At scale in the US.
Speaker 7 (07:49):
So it's that, to me, is a really key question.
Could you produce a small, really sort of limited run
number of phones here in the US, probably more easily
than Apple could produce its whole iPhone line. So I
think the volume that they're expecting is an unknown detail,
but seems like an important one to me.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
Motorola tried to build the Moto X in Dallas Fort
Worth in twenty thirteen, and they shut the plant a
year later. It was an Android based phone because the
costs were too high. I mean, that's what we're talking
about here. Karen made a really interesting point in our
group chat earlier about like what is four nine nine
relative to the field. It's like iPhone se It's like
(08:29):
that kind of mid tier of Android smartphone. But making
it and the number of components go into it. That's
like the key question here if they can have a
business in it.
Speaker 8 (08:38):
Yes, absolutely, data on all right, Bluebergs, go for it.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
Cara, I'll wrap it up.
Speaker 3 (08:44):
We've talked so much all things about the future of
actual hardware and software. But let's take a look at
what's happening in the world of crypto now ed because
there's some Trump action there too.
Speaker 6 (08:54):
Let's hina light what's happening with DJT.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
Now we know that we were reporting last week about
how they're going to be starting to by bitcoin in
the treasury. Well, now we understand that they're pivoting with
true social filing to the SEC with an s one
saying they want a bitcoin in ethereum etf Now they've already.
Speaker 6 (09:11):
Looked at a Bitcoin ETF.
Speaker 3 (09:12):
But this is scaling out to Ether as well. Bitcoin's
up two point seventy five percent. Ether is up more
than five percent. Remember perhaps bouncing back after last week's
sell off amid some of that risk aversion. But check
out what's happening with Circle, the latest crypto ipo is
just going from.
Speaker 6 (09:26):
Strength to strength throughout more than twenty percent.
Speaker 3 (09:28):
As we all anticipate that the latest Genius Act that
will put into legal clarity stable coins is likely to
occur this week.
Speaker 6 (09:37):
I also want to.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
Say that Tron is being reported in the ft that
Tron my ipo here in the United States via a
reverse merger, and that's sending other companies, particularly higher.
Speaker 8 (09:47):
Ed coming up. Robots.
Speaker 2 (09:51):
They're just like us now, possibly more so, as robotics
firm one X Technologies launches a world model that will
teach robots to anticipate and understand the physics that's all
around them. That's coming up next. This is Bloomberg technology
(10:15):
companies like Tesla betting their future on humanoid robots that
fill labor shortages, particularly in manufacturing. Today, robotics firm one
X Technologies is out with a new world model it
says can evaluate a robot's performance without deploying it into
the real world. The models are data driven simulator of
humanoids with the grounded understanding of physics of their surrounding world.
(10:36):
The CEO and CTO of one X Burn Burnick joins
us here in San Francisco. You would claim that this
world model is the first of its kind, and you
have the data from it that that proves its effectiveness.
But the main point is validation of capability without collecting
the real world data.
Speaker 8 (10:55):
Kind of yes, you got to model the right.
Speaker 9 (10:58):
So what had really does us is it gives us
the ability to basically see the future with respect to
what would happen if the role what actually takes these
specific actions. And this allows us to really test at
scale where these new AI models that we're actually creating
will be better than the previous ones, right, and that
really allows us to climb this and really to create
(11:18):
better and better our models for physical labor.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
I wrote in the Tech and Depth newsletter this morning
that if you look at particularly manufacturing jobs data, there
is a need there. You know, it's hard to fill
those roles. Why does this world model open a path
to a world where humanoid robotics are genuinely useful, deployable
in manufacturing or other logistic settings where a human is
(11:42):
currently needed.
Speaker 9 (11:43):
So I think like taking a step back to us,
like you know, we're a consumer company. Seen often ask
right now, but to us, it's really about how do
you create an actual abundance of artificial labor as quickly
as possible, which means going into factories, going into enterprise
services and everything right. But to get there and get
your robos to be intelligent enough to solve these tasks,
(12:05):
you just need this incredible diversity of data.
Speaker 8 (12:08):
And that's why we're going to the home first. And
if you're deploying.
Speaker 9 (12:13):
These robots at scaling to homes, living and learning among us,
then we also need to be able in a safe
manner to test how will our models perform? And this
is really what the world mode allows us to do.
It allows us to take all of this data that
we're gathering, create new models, and then see if we
deployed these to our fleet of robots, how would it
(12:34):
actually perform, Would all of the behaviors that it do
actually be safe? Would it be able to do things
that couldn't do before? And kind of really benchmark the
models so we can progress.
Speaker 3 (12:45):
How soffiscated is the hardware right now, we're talking about
how the models and the software is going to really
bring it to bear. What are they already doing in
the home those that are out in beta.
Speaker 9 (12:55):
So the hardware is actually really getting there. So I
have one in my home, for example, and it's doing
like tidying, cleaning, vacuuming, some laundry, different kind of tasks.
Speaker 8 (13:07):
The whole are on the home.
Speaker 9 (13:09):
And of course also the social aspect of this, right
being able to have this AI companion together with you,
which does not allow you doesn't actually require you to
look at your phone all the time to be able
to interface with AI. Now, currently this is still pretty
brittle and the magic is there, and then maybe it
lasts for a minute and then you need someone to
(13:30):
nudge it in the right direction. Right, but it's really
getting to where you see where this will go and
the hardware can do it. And now it's really about
how do we gather the data that allows us to
automate all this behavior. And that's also really what we're
doing this year, right, So when we're talking about the
goal being by end of year, we're actually going to
have this commercially out in the market. In homes, it's
(13:51):
really important to do expectation management because this is not
the consumer product at that point that everyone will have
at home. This is the big beginning of a journey
where we're inviting people in on our mission to really
almost like adopt an neo into your family, have it,
live and learn among us, and have a lot of
fun around fun along the way.
Speaker 2 (14:11):
Okay, see your.
Speaker 6 (14:12):
Pitch, it's still early adopted here.
Speaker 3 (14:14):
Basically you're pitching an earlier adoptor in the home. Go
to outside the home for a moment. I really want
your expertise. When we're talking about having robots help manufacture
here in the US, President Trump wants to build Apple
phones here in the US. Is robotics at a level
in the next few years where we could ever make
that achievable.
Speaker 8 (14:35):
In the next few years.
Speaker 9 (14:36):
I think like this is going to happen a lot
sooner than people might think. But it's not happening this year.
But we are a few years, not a few decades
away from where actually, most importantly to me, robots can
build robots, meaning we can have robots build more robots,
We can have robots build out the energy infrastructure, the
data centers, the chip fabs and really enable us to
(14:57):
get this.
Speaker 8 (14:57):
Multiplier on the workforce for artificial labor.
Speaker 9 (15:00):
Which will allow us to automate all kinds of factory
work across the US. And I think this can have
a tremendous impact on our GDP right and how we.
Speaker 8 (15:08):
Can grow our way out of the current deficit.
Speaker 9 (15:12):
But I also wanted to just do expectation management and
say like this is years away, but years it's not
that long in the ground picture of things, it's not.
Speaker 8 (15:20):
Okay, you first.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
Came on our radar in Video GtC. You had this
sort of very prominent place, and I know that the
one X exchanged jackets with Jensen, etc. What is the
unlock bin from Nvidia? You know they always talk about
how they work in multiple ways, not just providing the
basis for training, but the localized silicon for the robot
itself and then simulated or virtual data. Just to explain
(15:44):
the relationship.
Speaker 9 (15:45):
Yeah, sure, and Video is an amazing partner, right, and
we're working very deeply together both with our engineering team.
We're using their hardware, we're using their simulators, and I
think they've done an incredible job in just enabling the
ecosystem and all of the things you've touched upon.
Speaker 8 (16:01):
We are using right.
Speaker 9 (16:02):
So they're very fast simulators that allow us to learn
a lot in simulation before we have to go into
the real world. It's really valuable for us. We had
some great results we published last week from our reinforcement
learning and our work on how to use the entire
body like you can see here to robot actually using
its entire body to do tasks, and this is training
(16:23):
nvidas simulators. The compute on Border robot actually is nvida's harbor,
and they've done a great job in creating very good
embedded compute that can allow us to run the robot
fully kind of enclosed. Right doesn't actually need to be
connected to the internet to do its tasks. And of
course we're training on the infrastructure from NVIDA like everyone else.
Speaker 2 (16:44):
We're talking a lot about your model world model today,
but we're showing also pictures on the screen of the
hardware side. What is different, what is your different mission
statement to a figure, AI, agility, TESLA and optimists all
the things we've been talking about for many weeks.
Speaker 9 (16:59):
Sure, so of course I don't want to speak on
other's behalf. But I can see like my view on this,
so I'd actually say it's pretty different because most of
the companies in this field they're focusing on how can
we be useful as quickly as possible in manufacturing or
some kind of enterprise, while to me, it's actually all
about how can we make robots that are safe so
they can live and learn among people, because that's how
(17:19):
we get to truly intelligent machines. And if you want
to put them in consumer they need to be extremely affordable.
So you need to have this combination of something that's
very safe but still affordable and very capable, and then
you can have this living and learning among people.
Speaker 8 (17:32):
And basically solve the full problem, right, how do we.
Speaker 9 (17:35):
Get robots that are as intelligent as us so that
we can easily instruct them in how to do labor
across society at scale? So I'd say like we're betting
to go directly to the goal instead of going through
the factories.
Speaker 3 (17:49):
Ben Berneck, it's been great having you CEO and CTO
of one X Technology is fascinating.
Speaker 6 (17:54):
Thanks.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
It is time now for talking tech and first up
shares a Roku surging today. Now the company has announced
a partnership with Amazon Ads that it says will allow
advertisers access to more than eighty percent of US households
with Amazon Connected TVs.
Speaker 6 (18:12):
Now.
Speaker 3 (18:12):
The full integration and roll out to all advertisers that's
expected by Q four of this year likely drive more
demand for Roku's US inventory.
Speaker 6 (18:19):
Analysts A plus.
Speaker 3 (18:21):
Imax, while it is set to expand it screens aggressively
across China, i'm act as Chinese arm alongside partner Wonder Films,
says they will replace twenty seven screens in IMAX's jumbo screen.
Imax will currently operate eight hundred screens in China, and
it drew a record twenty two million customers from January
to May.
Speaker 6 (18:38):
And Taiwan's International.
Speaker 3 (18:40):
Trade Administration has added Huawei and Smith it's list of
blacklisted companies. It's a move that undercuts China's efforts in
developing AI chip technology locally ed.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
Turning to Tesla, the company's full self driving tech stack,
alongside their ability to scale, is proving to be a
tailwind against drivers like Weaimo is the robotaxi race ramps up.
That's the latest from Bloomberg Intelligence Steve Man, who led
the research, joins us. Now, the kind of key headline
from the REACT piece is that Tesla's vehicle costs is
about one seventh of Weaimo's. Why were you so focused
(19:15):
on that, Steve Well?
Speaker 10 (19:17):
I think is the critical piece in getting it on
a commercial basis, on a mass scale basis. And also,
you know the.
Speaker 8 (19:27):
Payback is also important.
Speaker 10 (19:28):
If you can produce the cars at a fraction of
the price, Look, you can get more of these vehicles
out on the road. And also you know, whoever is
running can actually make their money back much sooner.
Speaker 3 (19:43):
The issue you really highlight is the lack of production
of real vehicles by Weimo versus. Tesla just has hundreds
of thousands of millions on the road already.
Speaker 6 (19:53):
Is that the key dividing factor?
Speaker 10 (19:54):
Histey, that's one key dividing factor. I think technology is
also important. Look, I don't want to discount Weymo technology.
I think you know they've have had a number of
cars on the road.
Speaker 8 (20:07):
It's working.
Speaker 10 (20:09):
You know, there's always going to be some issues here
and there. But look, I think if you look at
Tesla's technology and their approach with using cameras, it's just
much easier to scale and especially now if you look
at the recent news, you know, the Chinese are actually
opening up the market, opening up the market for them
(20:31):
and allowing them to export some of that data, training
data out of China. That's a huge that's a huge
win for Tesla and scaling over the long term.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
Steve I used full self driving supervised the latest version
this morning to go to thirty miles from my house
to the studio. I do it every day. You stay
very clearly it's still a level two system right on
a technical basis, do you see the jump to a
software platform that how is a vehicle with no one
in the driver's seat at all?
Speaker 10 (21:04):
That's that's gonna be a while. I have to admittedly
say it's going to be a while. I think the
consumer needs to gain confidence. It's going to be a
gold standard. It's going to be you know, if if
a car is ninety nine point ninety nine percent accurate,
I think then the consumer will be more confidence. Before that,
(21:24):
I think there's going to be always some level of
monitoring from from the consumer. We're not at that stage
where we see you know, this is not like the
Eye Robot movie that that Will Smith was was on
a long time ago, where you know cars are actually
driving itself and making decisions on their own. We're not
at that at that moment yet. But what's really important
(21:47):
is the training data, and that's where Tesla also comes
in as well, where they have just tons of training
data from around the world.
Speaker 6 (21:57):
Steve Man of BlueBag Intelligence is a great read. Thanks
for coming on.
Speaker 3 (22:00):
Now coming up Meta, it has to start showing ads
in WhatsApp, it's private messaging services. We'll find out what
the change means for users and for the social media giant.
This is Bloomberg Tech. Welcome back to Bloomberg Tech. I'm
(22:23):
Caroline Hyde in New York.
Speaker 2 (22:24):
And I met love Loow in San Francisco.
Speaker 3 (22:26):
Quick check on these markets said, because look, we are
powering back after selling off on Friday and mid geopolitical anxiety,
we rally as we all eyes atturn our attention to
Iran Israel and of course what's happening at the g
seventh summit. But under the hood, chip makers having a
really nice day, AMD leading the charge up more than
eight percent after it's unveiled last week of GPUs and
(22:46):
some analyst notes on the back of that. But move
on to Meta because it is one of the key
points contributors, the second biggest points contributor.
Speaker 6 (22:53):
On the day, we're up three percent.
Speaker 3 (22:55):
Why because the announcements when it comes to advertising ED YEP.
Speaker 2 (22:59):
Announce it's introducing ads as well as some new features
into WhatsApp. It marks a change for the privacy focus
messaging platform. Blue most Riley Griffin joins us, this is
all about the updates tab and what people maybe outside
of America actually don't appreciate. It's like one and a
half billion visits per day to this updates tab. What's
the ad strategy here for Meta? Because clearly the shares
are higher. This is something the markets es is positive.
Speaker 6 (23:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 11 (23:23):
Meta has begun introducing ads to various outlets other than
Instagram and Facebook, the platforms that we know really well,
and here with WhatsApp, they're introducing those ads starting today,
rolling that out over time into the updates tab, which
is much like stories. You're able to get other kinds
of information there, and they're not actually introducing it to
(23:44):
the conversations the messages that you and I might be
having ED.
Speaker 6 (23:48):
But this is a new revenue line. They're introducing it.
Speaker 11 (23:50):
While at Con this week, advertising is the name of
the game, and more to come in terms of how
big of a share of revenue this world pull in.
Speaker 6 (23:59):
Rnie.
Speaker 3 (23:59):
Yeah, got to walk that fine line that they don't
invade what we feel is very personalized and private conversations,
the going down the updates route, but also subscriptions. In
the longer term, the business communications is really going to
be where it's at.
Speaker 11 (24:14):
No doubt they've been using the platform to bring businesses on.
You can communicate with airlines, with shops. But a really
important point that you made, Caroline is that this was
not the intention of the original WhatsApp owners when met
about the company in twenty fourteen.
Speaker 6 (24:31):
Even before then.
Speaker 11 (24:32):
The co founders had said that they would never introduce
ads to the platform. So this is a market change
and one very specific to Mark Zuckerberg.
Speaker 2 (24:41):
The main thing about Meta right now is that ads
is still the core. It's still the bread and butter business.
But success and growth and top line growth all justifies
investment in AI. I think that's still the formula.
Speaker 6 (24:53):
Absolutely.
Speaker 11 (24:54):
We know that Meta might be spending more than seventy
billion on AI this week. This comes on the news
last week that Meta is finalizing a deal for Scale
AI that is more than fourteen billion investment to be specific.
But ads are going to be improved by AI, no doubt.
And that's the conversation in comm this week.
Speaker 6 (25:13):
And it's a perfect set up.
Speaker 3 (25:14):
Riley Griffin, we thank you because let's go out to
CAM right now and talk about social media advertising more
with Rachel Tippograph founeracy of Mick Matt. You're out there
taking a step out of the sam for a moment
to be with us. Rachel, just talk about the well
euphoria around how generative AI is going to be helping
the AI offering and advertising offering.
Speaker 6 (25:35):
But is it going to impact companies and people?
Speaker 12 (25:38):
So everyone's in agreement that AI is going to lower
the barrier to entry for advertising. Where has all the
friction been in the creative and ad buying process, generating
creative figuring out where you're going to invest your dollars,
launching those ads and auto optimizing experiences and ultimately getting
reporting back. Where the friction is in the conversation right
(26:01):
now at con with CMOS is that they absolutely agree
that there are efficiency disease to be had in the
process that I just describe, but what they feel cannot
be outsourced is creative ideas that break through culture. And
so it's interesting that Zuckerberg has been very bold in
his statement where he's essentially said, by the end of
(26:22):
twenty twenty six, all human intervention will be removed from advertising.
I believe that fifty percent will be removed, but not
one hundred percent. And the biggest cmos in the world
share the same sentiment.
Speaker 6 (26:36):
What about the social media companies?
Speaker 3 (26:38):
The biggest in the world is TikTok, is it on
veilzez It's general to AI offering also as bullish as
Mark Zukobog.
Speaker 12 (26:45):
Absolutely, there's a place to lower the barrier to entry
in terms of creative What's interesting with TikTok's announcements this
week is that they even said that they're going to
help generate influencer content, which raises the question around authenticity.
So while AI is going to help lower the barrier
to entry increase productivity, it's also going to create new
(27:07):
questions in advertising.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
Is this real?
Speaker 12 (27:10):
How much is an advertiser willing to spend on a
agentic impression? Will they spend the same amount on a
human impression. It's going to create a whole new opening
and advertising for new companies to come to market to
define what the standardization is in terms of ad buying
measurement in forms of agentic AI and creative experiences.
Speaker 2 (27:31):
Rachel, what are people talking about on tiktoking? Can there's
a June nineteenth deadline for sale shut down? We haven't
yet gotten an extension. What are you hearing?
Speaker 12 (27:42):
Everyone has come to the point in this journey where
they believe TikTok is here to stay. When we look
at mickmac data, it's essentially held as our third most
traffic channel on any given day Meta number one, Google
Search number two, TikTok number three. When TikTok went dark
on January nineteenth, it did take about until March first
(28:04):
for advertisers to get back to Q four levels of traffic.
By May, we saw it surpass Rach on any given
day in May, just going to seventy percent of traffic.
Speaker 3 (28:15):
Rachel typograph keeping it global. So good to have you found, Racio, MIKEMP.
Speaker 2 (28:24):
VC firms are continuing to step up their investments in
AIAI Expentsures is one of those early stage VC firms
doing just that. Sean Johnson, co founder and general partner
AIX menures joins us now earlier in the show one X.
On the robotics side, we've been thinking a lot about
scale AI data on that side, agentic AI. What they
(28:45):
all have in common, to my mind is that the
cost of getting towards this level of intelligence is coming
down and down and down. How do you invest in
the early stage to kind of rite that wave?
Speaker 13 (28:55):
Yeah, and thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 6 (28:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 13 (28:58):
Absolutely, we think a lot about this new era where
the cost of intelligence, just as you called out, is
going to zero, and so what does that mean for
the new world we're going to live in. That means
that you're on the consumer side, you're going to have
ready access to tutors doctors. On the enterprise side, you're
going to see more and more knowledge workers be augmented
(29:20):
and some replaced by AI. And so we invest at
the early stage, you know, first check. We are looking
at founders with big visions looking to change the world,
that want to move very fast to bring that disruption
to market. And that's how we've positioned the fur.
Speaker 3 (29:38):
What's interesting is there's big visions coming from big companies. Sean,
we can't help but sort of draw the attention that
it's phenomenal amounts of money coming from just a few
key players, whether it be Amazon, whether it be Meta.
And of course, reports that open Ai might be snapping
up one of your portfolio companies, Weights and Biases has
already been eyed as well and bought by call Weave.
Speaker 6 (30:00):
Is M and A going to happen for these smaller
companies a lot?
Speaker 13 (30:04):
Absolutely? I mean so, I'd say two things there. The
first is it makes sense for the large companies to
get a lot of attention. They make a lot of revenue,
they have large market caps. Venture capital is a business
that's focused on small companies that start with no revenue
and then have much smaller prospects in the short term,
but can grow quickly and under the radar to an
(30:26):
extent of the large companies. Now, large companies are certainly
focused on building AI native teams, bringing AI throughout, refusing
that sort of mindset throughout their organizations, and M and
A is very important for that. And it's going to
happen at all stages. It's going to happen at startups
that are really just getting started. It's also going to
happen at startups that are fairly far along to.
Speaker 2 (30:50):
Perplexity. We just showed some of the portfolio companies on
the screen that this thesis building that they're almost peerless.
They get talked a lot about in the context of
Google and Search, also get towards about in the context
of sort of those working on the on the frontier model.
Just your your thesis on them, please sure.
Speaker 13 (31:09):
So you know, Arvind and the team have been setting
their sights on building an iconic business. And we all
know one thing's true in AI as it moves very fast.
You know, if you never know what's going to be
launched tomorrow, what's going to be launched the next day.
And the amazing thing about Perplexity in the team is
they have a group of some of the world's foremost
practitioners executing at you know, the speed of light, if
(31:31):
you will. And so they're all focused right now on,
you know, redefining what knowledge knowledge engine looks like. But
then also you're going to see Commet their new browser
come out very soon, and that's going to redefine again
what Argentic Solutions can bring you.
Speaker 3 (31:46):
Of course, yourself were very much helming product design at
startups before you came onto co found aix bench as Sean,
what'sn't only one question people are coming to your founders
coming to you at the moment.
Speaker 6 (31:57):
Is it about talent? Is it about taris what is
it a app?
Speaker 13 (32:03):
Yeah, that's a really good question, Caroline. Founders often talk
to us about, you know, number one, how do you start,
you know, connecting with early customers, early prospects. It's all
about product market fit, and that can be elusive for
many years into the journey. You know that is an
entrepreneurs and so what we do is orient ourselves around
the founder and we think a lot about how do
(32:24):
we get to product market fit with the founder through
lots of customer conversations, hiring a team, thinking about business
strategy execution, but then also connecting with the next wave
of venture firms will that will continue to back the founders.
Speaker 3 (32:38):
Jean Johnson of AI Expensions, we appreciate you coming on today.
Speaker 7 (32:41):
Thanks.
Speaker 3 (32:42):
Now let's just talk about one time login codes. You
probably have them a lot that meant to be security
and verify users identity that may not actually though, be
all that private. Millions of those codes sent via text
pastor into madiories, making it possible for entities to actually
see their content and most, Ryan Gallagher is been really
needing the charge. This is an investigation, a deep one, Ryan,
(33:04):
just showing how actually we shouldn't really be using TECHSSMS
as our form of two factual authentication. That's right.
Speaker 14 (33:11):
Yeah, we looked in depth at this issue because I
think a lot of people don't realize that when you
log into whether it's a banking app or whether it's
Google or Meta, when you receive one of these logging
codes via SMS, it isn't actually coming directly from the
tech company or the platform that you're logging into is
routed through intermediaries all across the world, and there's very
(33:36):
little oversight of who actually handles those messages. So that's
what we set about to do is to show look
who is actually looking at these security codes and is
there a potential vulnerability in terms of the people who
are accessing the codes. And that's what we found that
there's some concerns around some of the entities that are
handling them.
Speaker 2 (33:55):
Ryan, what's the alternative then to SMS? We just have
thirty seconds.
Speaker 14 (34:00):
The alternative is to use, for example, an authenticator app
on your phone which actually gives you the code on
your phone. You don't have to rely on SMS. It
doesn't go across any network. It's just on your device
all the time and it stays there. So authenticator apps
Google those and you'll find plenty of options.
Speaker 3 (34:17):
Ryan Allagher, it's a really thoughtful piece. We hurt you
to go and read it from a business perspective, from
a security perspective. Now that does it for this edition
of Bloomberg Tech ed.
Speaker 2 (34:27):
Yeah, astonishing way to start the week. Don't forget to
recap through the podcast. You know where to find the pod.
It's on the Bloomberg terminal all the Bloomberg platforms, as
well as online on Apple, Spotify in iHeart all right,
strong way to start the week. From San Francisco, New
York City. This IS's Bloomberg Tech
Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news. Bloomberg Tech is alive
from coast to coast with Caroline Hyde in New York
and Vla Loow in San Francisco.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
This is Bloomberg Tech coming up. President Trump's families getting
into the mobile phone business with the Trump branded service
plus Meta.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
We'll start showing ads in WhatsApp and offer paid subscriptions
for the first time.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
And robotics firm one Ex Technology says it can evaluate
a robot's performance without deploying it into the real world.
But first, President Trump is attending a Group of Seventh
summit in Canada today. This amid tariff uncertainty, a Middle
East crisis between Israel and Iran. Let's go over to
the G seven summit where Bloomberg's and Marie Horden is
standing by AMH. What do we need to know?
Speaker 4 (00:56):
Well, certainly this is going to be a packed summit
and what's going on in the Middle East is certainly
taking center stage now really topping the agenda. We are
waiting for President Trump to have a first bilateral meeting
before the summit really kicks off. In earnest with Mark Karney,
the Prime Minister of Canada, and really the Canadians here
are trying to avoid what happened in twenty eighteen. You
(01:16):
may remember that viral photo and the President was sitting
with his arms crossed looking up at Angela Merkel, the
then German Chancellor. She was surrounded by a number of leaders,
the only one that's lasted since a fence, and then,
of course President Trump pulled the US out of that
joint communicate. So Mark Kearney's taking a different approach this time,
looking at different statements that they can have a common
(01:41):
thread for specifics, not one communicate for wide range of topics,
maybe something regarding artificial intelligence, critical minerals. Potentially there will
not be an agreement from all of these countries when
it comes to things like the war in Ukraine, things
like climate change, or even when it comes to what
is going on with Iran and Israel. That is certainly
(02:01):
going to be top of the agenda today. The President
was speaking about as he left the White House yesterday
and his way to Canada, and he was saying that
these two may have to fight it out, but in
the end he wants a deal.
Speaker 2 (02:13):
Bloomberg's Amory Horden will stick with what's happening in the
G seven throughout the day. Thank you. Let's go with
Donald Trump and over to DC to talk about some
news in technology. The President's family launching a Trump branded
mobile phone service that will rely on wireless networks and
hardware quotes made in America, Bloomberg, Kelsey Griffiths here with more.
The idea is that they're not building the network from
(02:36):
the ground upright, They basically licensed capacity from the three
major US carriers. But what else do we know about
Trump Mobile? That's right ed?
Speaker 5 (02:46):
So the Trump family's mobile service is they say they're
going to rely on the three major US telecom networks that.
Speaker 6 (02:54):
Have already been built.
Speaker 5 (02:55):
And this is a pretty common strategy that we see.
Meant Mobile is one of the pretty well known so
called mv and os that was eventually acquired by T Mobile.
We also saw some celebrities last week looking to get
into the mobile game, launching their own mv and O.
So the Trump family is following a pretty popular tradition
(03:17):
here by getting into this.
Speaker 6 (03:18):
Business, Kelsey Popular.
Speaker 3 (03:20):
Last time I checked, there were one hundreds, more than
one hundred here in the United States of mobile virtual
network operators.
Speaker 6 (03:27):
But what they're trying to tap into.
Speaker 3 (03:28):
Here is the Trump narrative, the Trump brand. How will
it be priced versus other competitors in the space.
Speaker 5 (03:36):
That's right, So the brand is it's going to cost
about just under fifty dollars. I think it's a forty
seven to forty five per month, and I would say
that is pretty competitive with the space. These mv and
os tend to target these niche markets that are looking
at customers that maybe don't want to or can't pay
(03:58):
one hundred dollars or or you know, somewhere in that range.
So I do think that there is a chance they
will be targeting this niche that you know, maybe other
operators aren't necessary.
Speaker 2 (04:11):
Are you looking at Kelsey? It's a competitive field, right
when you're looking at any carrier. When I was reading
the news from Trump Mobile, they're including everything that you'd expect,
unlimited text, data, voice protection, overseas call. Just give us
the basics of the plan.
Speaker 5 (04:29):
Yeah, exactly. So there are going to be some of
these value added services on top of your mobile services
that you would expect. There is going to be some
sort of roadside assistance, there will be international calling thrown in,
and there's also going to be the opportunity to purchase
a mobile device that will also be branded with the
(04:52):
Trump family logo. It will come in a gold variety,
which you know, I'm looking forward to seeing.
Speaker 3 (05:00):
Kelsey Griffiths puts us perfectly onto our next discussion because
we want to talk about the hardware perspective. Bomberg's Dana
woman is, hey, with US four hundred and ninety nine dollars,
you're going to be able to get it as soon
as September. You can put one hundred dollars down for
initial well, name.
Speaker 6 (05:15):
On a list. But can they make that in America?
Speaker 7 (05:19):
Never say never, but certainly the smartphone industry is not
really making phones here in the US right now, and
it's unclear from the report so far and what we
know so far who exactly are with what partners Trump
and his family would be making these devices. All that
we know, as Kelsey has said, is that the advice
would be golden color, which is very on brand for Trump,
and that it will be caught, that it will be
(05:40):
priced at four hundred and ninety nine dollars, which even
before recent inflation, was a pretty budget price for a
phone and seems especially low these days. So not knowing
anything about the hardware, we can at least say safely
these are probably not phones offering the most advanced features.
And maybe that's not the point, as Kelsey said, for
this particular niche right.
Speaker 2 (06:00):
The point, Jiner is that this is built as being
designed and built in America at a time where the
President is putting pressure on Apple to build the iPhone
in America or face tariffs of as much as twenty
five percent. I think it's really notable that it's going
to run Android OS as well.
Speaker 6 (06:17):
Yes, absolutely, as we said.
Speaker 7 (06:20):
As I said, it's unclear exactly how the Trump organization
would make this phone come to pass so quickly in
the US, just knowing from Apple and other manufacturers as
well all of the human resources, the human labor and
physical resources that just are lacking here in the US.
(06:43):
And by human resources, I mean specialized talent that know
how to use this particular manufacturing equipment. A lot of
the equipment itself is abroad. So it's unclear exactly how
the team plans to surmount those challenges that other smartphone
makers either haven't tackled or just seem to be avoiding.
Speaker 3 (07:01):
It's interesting who ultimately it'll be competing against because we've heard.
Speaker 6 (07:05):
Him take aim President Trump.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
This is of course the phone being made by President
by Trump organization in his family. But President Trump himself,
the administration of taken aim at Apple front and center.
Bring your manufacturing back to the United States, but at
a four nine to nine price point. Yeah, I might
compete against an iPhone se but really it's going against
other Android phones. It's going against the pixel AA for example.
Speaker 7 (07:26):
Yes, maybe perhaps not even the pixel A line, perhaps
even more budget, sort of bargain basement phones that I'm
not able to recite offhand, and most of us can't
recite offhand.
Speaker 6 (07:38):
And I think one.
Speaker 7 (07:39):
Key question is how many does the organization plan to produce.
I think one of the key lines in our story
is that smartphone makers aren't producing.
Speaker 2 (07:47):
At scale in the US.
Speaker 7 (07:49):
So it's that, to me, is a really key question.
Could you produce a small, really sort of limited run
number of phones here in the US, probably more easily
than Apple could produce its whole iPhone line. So I
think the volume that they're expecting is an unknown detail,
but seems like an important one to me.
Speaker 2 (08:07):
Motorola tried to build the Moto X in Dallas Fort
Worth in twenty thirteen, and they shut the plant a
year later. It was an Android based phone because the
costs were too high. I mean, that's what we're talking
about here. Karen made a really interesting point in our
group chat earlier about like what is four nine nine
relative to the field. It's like iPhone se It's like
(08:29):
that kind of mid tier of Android smartphone. But making
it and the number of components go into it. That's
like the key question here if they can have a
business in it.
Speaker 8 (08:38):
Yes, absolutely, data on all right, Bluebergs, go for it.
Speaker 2 (08:42):
Cara, I'll wrap it up.
Speaker 3 (08:44):
We've talked so much all things about the future of
actual hardware and software. But let's take a look at
what's happening in the world of crypto now ed because
there's some Trump action there too.
Speaker 6 (08:54):
Let's hina light what's happening with DJT.
Speaker 3 (08:56):
Now we know that we were reporting last week about
how they're going to be starting to by bitcoin in
the treasury. Well, now we understand that they're pivoting with
true social filing to the SEC with an s one
saying they want a bitcoin in ethereum etf Now they've already.
Speaker 6 (09:11):
Looked at a Bitcoin ETF.
Speaker 3 (09:12):
But this is scaling out to Ether as well. Bitcoin's
up two point seventy five percent. Ether is up more
than five percent. Remember perhaps bouncing back after last week's
sell off amid some of that risk aversion. But check
out what's happening with Circle, the latest crypto ipo is
just going from.
Speaker 6 (09:26):
Strength to strength throughout more than twenty percent.
Speaker 3 (09:28):
As we all anticipate that the latest Genius Act that
will put into legal clarity stable coins is likely to
occur this week.
Speaker 6 (09:37):
I also want to.
Speaker 3 (09:38):
Say that Tron is being reported in the ft that
Tron my ipo here in the United States via a
reverse merger, and that's sending other companies, particularly higher.
Speaker 8 (09:47):
Ed coming up. Robots.
Speaker 2 (09:51):
They're just like us now, possibly more so, as robotics
firm one X Technologies launches a world model that will
teach robots to anticipate and understand the physics that's all
around them. That's coming up next. This is Bloomberg technology
(10:15):
companies like Tesla betting their future on humanoid robots that
fill labor shortages, particularly in manufacturing. Today, robotics firm one
X Technologies is out with a new world model it
says can evaluate a robot's performance without deploying it into
the real world. The models are data driven simulator of
humanoids with the grounded understanding of physics of their surrounding world.
(10:36):
The CEO and CTO of one X Burn Burnick joins
us here in San Francisco. You would claim that this
world model is the first of its kind, and you
have the data from it that that proves its effectiveness.
But the main point is validation of capability without collecting
the real world data.
Speaker 8 (10:55):
Kind of yes, you got to model the right.
Speaker 9 (10:58):
So what had really does us is it gives us
the ability to basically see the future with respect to
what would happen if the role what actually takes these
specific actions. And this allows us to really test at
scale where these new AI models that we're actually creating
will be better than the previous ones, right, and that
really allows us to climb this and really to create
(11:18):
better and better our models for physical labor.
Speaker 2 (11:20):
I wrote in the Tech and Depth newsletter this morning
that if you look at particularly manufacturing jobs data, there
is a need there. You know, it's hard to fill
those roles. Why does this world model open a path
to a world where humanoid robotics are genuinely useful, deployable
in manufacturing or other logistic settings where a human is
(11:42):
currently needed.
Speaker 9 (11:43):
So I think like taking a step back to us,
like you know, we're a consumer company. Seen often ask
right now, but to us, it's really about how do
you create an actual abundance of artificial labor as quickly
as possible, which means going into factories, going into enterprise
services and everything right. But to get there and get
your robos to be intelligent enough to solve these tasks,
(12:05):
you just need this incredible diversity of data.
Speaker 8 (12:08):
And that's why we're going to the home first. And
if you're deploying.
Speaker 9 (12:13):
These robots at scaling to homes, living and learning among us,
then we also need to be able in a safe
manner to test how will our models perform? And this
is really what the world mode allows us to do.
It allows us to take all of this data that
we're gathering, create new models, and then see if we
deployed these to our fleet of robots, how would it
(12:34):
actually perform, Would all of the behaviors that it do
actually be safe? Would it be able to do things
that couldn't do before? And kind of really benchmark the
models so we can progress.
Speaker 3 (12:45):
How soffiscated is the hardware right now, we're talking about
how the models and the software is going to really
bring it to bear. What are they already doing in
the home those that are out in beta.
Speaker 9 (12:55):
So the hardware is actually really getting there. So I
have one in my home, for example, and it's doing
like tidying, cleaning, vacuuming, some laundry, different kind of tasks.
Speaker 8 (13:07):
The whole are on the home.
Speaker 9 (13:09):
And of course also the social aspect of this, right
being able to have this AI companion together with you,
which does not allow you doesn't actually require you to
look at your phone all the time to be able
to interface with AI. Now, currently this is still pretty
brittle and the magic is there, and then maybe it
lasts for a minute and then you need someone to
(13:30):
nudge it in the right direction. Right, but it's really
getting to where you see where this will go and
the hardware can do it. And now it's really about
how do we gather the data that allows us to
automate all this behavior. And that's also really what we're
doing this year, right, So when we're talking about the
goal being by end of year, we're actually going to
have this commercially out in the market. In homes, it's
(13:51):
really important to do expectation management because this is not
the consumer product at that point that everyone will have
at home. This is the big beginning of a journey
where we're inviting people in on our mission to really
almost like adopt an neo into your family, have it,
live and learn among us, and have a lot of
fun around fun along the way.
Speaker 2 (14:11):
Okay, see your.
Speaker 6 (14:12):
Pitch, it's still early adopted here.
Speaker 3 (14:14):
Basically you're pitching an earlier adoptor in the home. Go
to outside the home for a moment. I really want
your expertise. When we're talking about having robots help manufacture
here in the US, President Trump wants to build Apple
phones here in the US. Is robotics at a level
in the next few years where we could ever make
that achievable.
Speaker 8 (14:35):
In the next few years.
Speaker 9 (14:36):
I think like this is going to happen a lot
sooner than people might think. But it's not happening this year.
But we are a few years, not a few decades
away from where actually, most importantly to me, robots can
build robots, meaning we can have robots build more robots,
We can have robots build out the energy infrastructure, the
data centers, the chip fabs and really enable us to
(14:57):
get this.
Speaker 8 (14:57):
Multiplier on the workforce for artificial labor.
Speaker 9 (15:00):
Which will allow us to automate all kinds of factory
work across the US. And I think this can have
a tremendous impact on our GDP right and how we.
Speaker 8 (15:08):
Can grow our way out of the current deficit.
Speaker 9 (15:12):
But I also wanted to just do expectation management and
say like this is years away, but years it's not
that long in the ground picture of things, it's not.
Speaker 8 (15:20):
Okay, you first.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
Came on our radar in Video GtC. You had this
sort of very prominent place, and I know that the
one X exchanged jackets with Jensen, etc. What is the
unlock bin from Nvidia? You know they always talk about
how they work in multiple ways, not just providing the
basis for training, but the localized silicon for the robot
itself and then simulated or virtual data. Just to explain
(15:44):
the relationship.
Speaker 9 (15:45):
Yeah, sure, and Video is an amazing partner, right, and
we're working very deeply together both with our engineering team.
We're using their hardware, we're using their simulators, and I
think they've done an incredible job in just enabling the
ecosystem and all of the things you've touched upon.
Speaker 8 (16:01):
We are using right.
Speaker 9 (16:02):
So they're very fast simulators that allow us to learn
a lot in simulation before we have to go into
the real world. It's really valuable for us. We had
some great results we published last week from our reinforcement
learning and our work on how to use the entire
body like you can see here to robot actually using
its entire body to do tasks, and this is training
(16:23):
nvidas simulators. The compute on Border robot actually is nvida's harbor,
and they've done a great job in creating very good
embedded compute that can allow us to run the robot
fully kind of enclosed. Right doesn't actually need to be
connected to the internet to do its tasks. And of
course we're training on the infrastructure from NVIDA like everyone else.
Speaker 2 (16:44):
We're talking a lot about your model world model today,
but we're showing also pictures on the screen of the
hardware side. What is different, what is your different mission
statement to a figure, AI, agility, TESLA and optimists all
the things we've been talking about for many weeks.
Speaker 9 (16:59):
Sure, so of course I don't want to speak on
other's behalf. But I can see like my view on this,
so I'd actually say it's pretty different because most of
the companies in this field they're focusing on how can
we be useful as quickly as possible in manufacturing or
some kind of enterprise, while to me, it's actually all
about how can we make robots that are safe so
they can live and learn among people, because that's how
(17:19):
we get to truly intelligent machines. And if you want
to put them in consumer they need to be extremely affordable.
So you need to have this combination of something that's
very safe but still affordable and very capable, and then
you can have this living and learning among people.
Speaker 8 (17:32):
And basically solve the full problem, right, how do we.
Speaker 9 (17:35):
Get robots that are as intelligent as us so that
we can easily instruct them in how to do labor
across society at scale? So I'd say like we're betting
to go directly to the goal instead of going through
the factories.
Speaker 3 (17:49):
Ben Berneck, it's been great having you CEO and CTO
of one X Technology is fascinating.
Speaker 6 (17:54):
Thanks.
Speaker 3 (18:00):
It is time now for talking tech and first up
shares a Roku surging today. Now the company has announced
a partnership with Amazon Ads that it says will allow
advertisers access to more than eighty percent of US households
with Amazon Connected TVs.
Speaker 6 (18:12):
Now.
Speaker 3 (18:12):
The full integration and roll out to all advertisers that's
expected by Q four of this year likely drive more
demand for Roku's US inventory.
Speaker 6 (18:19):
Analysts A plus.
Speaker 3 (18:21):
Imax, while it is set to expand it screens aggressively
across China, i'm act as Chinese arm alongside partner Wonder Films,
says they will replace twenty seven screens in IMAX's jumbo screen.
Imax will currently operate eight hundred screens in China, and
it drew a record twenty two million customers from January
to May.
Speaker 6 (18:38):
And Taiwan's International.
Speaker 3 (18:40):
Trade Administration has added Huawei and Smith it's list of
blacklisted companies. It's a move that undercuts China's efforts in
developing AI chip technology locally ed.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
Turning to Tesla, the company's full self driving tech stack,
alongside their ability to scale, is proving to be a
tailwind against drivers like Weaimo is the robotaxi race ramps up.
That's the latest from Bloomberg Intelligence Steve Man, who led
the research, joins us. Now, the kind of key headline
from the REACT piece is that Tesla's vehicle costs is
about one seventh of Weaimo's. Why were you so focused
(19:15):
on that, Steve Well?
Speaker 10 (19:17):
I think is the critical piece in getting it on
a commercial basis, on a mass scale basis. And also,
you know the.
Speaker 8 (19:27):
Payback is also important.
Speaker 10 (19:28):
If you can produce the cars at a fraction of
the price, Look, you can get more of these vehicles
out on the road. And also you know, whoever is
running can actually make their money back much sooner.
Speaker 3 (19:43):
The issue you really highlight is the lack of production
of real vehicles by Weimo versus. Tesla just has hundreds
of thousands of millions on the road already.
Speaker 6 (19:53):
Is that the key dividing factor?
Speaker 10 (19:54):
Histey, that's one key dividing factor. I think technology is
also important. Look, I don't want to discount Weymo technology.
I think you know they've have had a number of
cars on the road.
Speaker 8 (20:07):
It's working.
Speaker 10 (20:09):
You know, there's always going to be some issues here
and there. But look, I think if you look at
Tesla's technology and their approach with using cameras, it's just
much easier to scale and especially now if you look
at the recent news, you know, the Chinese are actually
opening up the market, opening up the market for them
(20:31):
and allowing them to export some of that data, training
data out of China. That's a huge that's a huge
win for Tesla and scaling over the long term.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
Steve I used full self driving supervised the latest version
this morning to go to thirty miles from my house
to the studio. I do it every day. You stay
very clearly it's still a level two system right on
a technical basis, do you see the jump to a
software platform that how is a vehicle with no one
in the driver's seat at all?
Speaker 10 (21:04):
That's that's gonna be a while. I have to admittedly
say it's going to be a while. I think the
consumer needs to gain confidence. It's going to be a
gold standard. It's going to be you know, if if
a car is ninety nine point ninety nine percent accurate,
I think then the consumer will be more confidence. Before that,
(21:24):
I think there's going to be always some level of
monitoring from from the consumer. We're not at that stage
where we see you know, this is not like the
Eye Robot movie that that Will Smith was was on
a long time ago, where you know cars are actually
driving itself and making decisions on their own. We're not
at that at that moment yet. But what's really important
(21:47):
is the training data, and that's where Tesla also comes
in as well, where they have just tons of training
data from around the world.
Speaker 6 (21:57):
Steve Man of BlueBag Intelligence is a great read. Thanks
for coming on.
Speaker 3 (22:00):
Now coming up Meta, it has to start showing ads
in WhatsApp, it's private messaging services. We'll find out what
the change means for users and for the social media giant.
This is Bloomberg Tech. Welcome back to Bloomberg Tech. I'm
(22:23):
Caroline Hyde in New York.
Speaker 2 (22:24):
And I met love Loow in San Francisco.
Speaker 3 (22:26):
Quick check on these markets said, because look, we are
powering back after selling off on Friday and mid geopolitical anxiety,
we rally as we all eyes atturn our attention to
Iran Israel and of course what's happening at the g
seventh summit. But under the hood, chip makers having a
really nice day, AMD leading the charge up more than
eight percent after it's unveiled last week of GPUs and
(22:46):
some analyst notes on the back of that. But move
on to Meta because it is one of the key
points contributors, the second biggest points contributor.
Speaker 6 (22:53):
On the day, we're up three percent.
Speaker 3 (22:55):
Why because the announcements when it comes to advertising ED YEP.
Speaker 2 (22:59):
Announce it's introducing ads as well as some new features
into WhatsApp. It marks a change for the privacy focus
messaging platform. Blue most Riley Griffin joins us, this is
all about the updates tab and what people maybe outside
of America actually don't appreciate. It's like one and a
half billion visits per day to this updates tab. What's
the ad strategy here for Meta? Because clearly the shares
are higher. This is something the markets es is positive.
Speaker 6 (23:23):
Yeah.
Speaker 11 (23:23):
Meta has begun introducing ads to various outlets other than
Instagram and Facebook, the platforms that we know really well,
and here with WhatsApp, they're introducing those ads starting today,
rolling that out over time into the updates tab, which
is much like stories. You're able to get other kinds
of information there, and they're not actually introducing it to
(23:44):
the conversations the messages that you and I might be
having ED.
Speaker 6 (23:48):
But this is a new revenue line. They're introducing it.
Speaker 11 (23:50):
While at Con this week, advertising is the name of
the game, and more to come in terms of how
big of a share of revenue this world pull in.
Speaker 6 (23:59):
Rnie.
Speaker 3 (23:59):
Yeah, got to walk that fine line that they don't
invade what we feel is very personalized and private conversations,
the going down the updates route, but also subscriptions. In
the longer term, the business communications is really going to
be where it's at.
Speaker 11 (24:14):
No doubt they've been using the platform to bring businesses on.
You can communicate with airlines, with shops. But a really
important point that you made, Caroline is that this was
not the intention of the original WhatsApp owners when met
about the company in twenty fourteen.
Speaker 6 (24:31):
Even before then.
Speaker 11 (24:32):
The co founders had said that they would never introduce
ads to the platform. So this is a market change
and one very specific to Mark Zuckerberg.
Speaker 2 (24:41):
The main thing about Meta right now is that ads
is still the core. It's still the bread and butter business.
But success and growth and top line growth all justifies
investment in AI. I think that's still the formula.
Speaker 6 (24:53):
Absolutely.
Speaker 11 (24:54):
We know that Meta might be spending more than seventy
billion on AI this week. This comes on the news
last week that Meta is finalizing a deal for Scale
AI that is more than fourteen billion investment to be specific.
But ads are going to be improved by AI, no doubt.
And that's the conversation in comm this week.
Speaker 6 (25:13):
And it's a perfect set up.
Speaker 3 (25:14):
Riley Griffin, we thank you because let's go out to
CAM right now and talk about social media advertising more
with Rachel Tippograph founeracy of Mick Matt. You're out there
taking a step out of the sam for a moment
to be with us. Rachel, just talk about the well
euphoria around how generative AI is going to be helping
the AI offering and advertising offering.
Speaker 6 (25:35):
But is it going to impact companies and people?
Speaker 12 (25:38):
So everyone's in agreement that AI is going to lower
the barrier to entry for advertising. Where has all the
friction been in the creative and ad buying process, generating
creative figuring out where you're going to invest your dollars,
launching those ads and auto optimizing experiences and ultimately getting
reporting back. Where the friction is in the conversation right
(26:01):
now at con with CMOS is that they absolutely agree
that there are efficiency disease to be had in the
process that I just describe, but what they feel cannot
be outsourced is creative ideas that break through culture. And
so it's interesting that Zuckerberg has been very bold in
his statement where he's essentially said, by the end of
(26:22):
twenty twenty six, all human intervention will be removed from advertising.
I believe that fifty percent will be removed, but not
one hundred percent. And the biggest cmos in the world
share the same sentiment.
Speaker 6 (26:36):
What about the social media companies?
Speaker 3 (26:38):
The biggest in the world is TikTok, is it on
veilzez It's general to AI offering also as bullish as
Mark Zukobog.
Speaker 12 (26:45):
Absolutely, there's a place to lower the barrier to entry
in terms of creative What's interesting with TikTok's announcements this
week is that they even said that they're going to
help generate influencer content, which raises the question around authenticity.
So while AI is going to help lower the barrier
to entry increase productivity, it's also going to create new
(27:07):
questions in advertising.
Speaker 2 (27:09):
Is this real?
Speaker 12 (27:10):
How much is an advertiser willing to spend on a
agentic impression? Will they spend the same amount on a
human impression. It's going to create a whole new opening
and advertising for new companies to come to market to
define what the standardization is in terms of ad buying
measurement in forms of agentic AI and creative experiences.
Speaker 2 (27:31):
Rachel, what are people talking about on tiktoking? Can there's
a June nineteenth deadline for sale shut down? We haven't
yet gotten an extension. What are you hearing?
Speaker 12 (27:42):
Everyone has come to the point in this journey where
they believe TikTok is here to stay. When we look
at mickmac data, it's essentially held as our third most
traffic channel on any given day Meta number one, Google
Search number two, TikTok number three. When TikTok went dark
on January nineteenth, it did take about until March first
(28:04):
for advertisers to get back to Q four levels of traffic.
By May, we saw it surpass Rach on any given
day in May, just going to seventy percent of traffic.
Speaker 3 (28:15):
Rachel typograph keeping it global. So good to have you found, Racio, MIKEMP.
Speaker 2 (28:24):
VC firms are continuing to step up their investments in
AIAI Expentsures is one of those early stage VC firms
doing just that. Sean Johnson, co founder and general partner
AIX menures joins us now earlier in the show one X.
On the robotics side, we've been thinking a lot about
scale AI data on that side, agentic AI. What they
(28:45):
all have in common, to my mind is that the
cost of getting towards this level of intelligence is coming
down and down and down. How do you invest in
the early stage to kind of rite that wave?
Speaker 13 (28:55):
Yeah, and thank you so much for having me.
Speaker 6 (28:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 13 (28:58):
Absolutely, we think a lot about this new era where
the cost of intelligence, just as you called out, is
going to zero, and so what does that mean for
the new world we're going to live in. That means
that you're on the consumer side, you're going to have
ready access to tutors doctors. On the enterprise side, you're
going to see more and more knowledge workers be augmented
(29:20):
and some replaced by AI. And so we invest at
the early stage, you know, first check. We are looking
at founders with big visions looking to change the world,
that want to move very fast to bring that disruption
to market. And that's how we've positioned the fur.
Speaker 3 (29:38):
What's interesting is there's big visions coming from big companies. Sean,
we can't help but sort of draw the attention that
it's phenomenal amounts of money coming from just a few
key players, whether it be Amazon, whether it be Meta.
And of course, reports that open Ai might be snapping
up one of your portfolio companies, Weights and Biases has
already been eyed as well and bought by call Weave.
Speaker 6 (30:00):
Is M and A going to happen for these smaller
companies a lot?
Speaker 13 (30:04):
Absolutely? I mean so, I'd say two things there. The
first is it makes sense for the large companies to
get a lot of attention. They make a lot of revenue,
they have large market caps. Venture capital is a business
that's focused on small companies that start with no revenue
and then have much smaller prospects in the short term,
but can grow quickly and under the radar to an
(30:26):
extent of the large companies. Now, large companies are certainly
focused on building AI native teams, bringing AI throughout, refusing
that sort of mindset throughout their organizations, and M and
A is very important for that. And it's going to
happen at all stages. It's going to happen at startups
that are really just getting started. It's also going to
happen at startups that are fairly far along to.
Speaker 2 (30:50):
Perplexity. We just showed some of the portfolio companies on
the screen that this thesis building that they're almost peerless.
They get talked a lot about in the context of
Google and Search, also get towards about in the context
of sort of those working on the on the frontier model.
Just your your thesis on them, please sure.
Speaker 13 (31:09):
So you know, Arvind and the team have been setting
their sights on building an iconic business. And we all
know one thing's true in AI as it moves very fast.
You know, if you never know what's going to be
launched tomorrow, what's going to be launched the next day.
And the amazing thing about Perplexity in the team is
they have a group of some of the world's foremost
practitioners executing at you know, the speed of light, if
(31:31):
you will. And so they're all focused right now on,
you know, redefining what knowledge knowledge engine looks like. But
then also you're going to see Commet their new browser
come out very soon, and that's going to redefine again
what Argentic Solutions can bring you.
Speaker 3 (31:46):
Of course, yourself were very much helming product design at
startups before you came onto co found aix bench as Sean,
what'sn't only one question people are coming to your founders
coming to you at the moment.
Speaker 6 (31:57):
Is it about talent? Is it about taris what is
it a app?
Speaker 13 (32:03):
Yeah, that's a really good question, Caroline. Founders often talk
to us about, you know, number one, how do you start,
you know, connecting with early customers, early prospects. It's all
about product market fit, and that can be elusive for
many years into the journey. You know that is an
entrepreneurs and so what we do is orient ourselves around
the founder and we think a lot about how do
(32:24):
we get to product market fit with the founder through
lots of customer conversations, hiring a team, thinking about business
strategy execution, but then also connecting with the next wave
of venture firms will that will continue to back the founders.
Speaker 3 (32:38):
Jean Johnson of AI Expensions, we appreciate you coming on today.
Speaker 7 (32:41):
Thanks.
Speaker 3 (32:42):
Now let's just talk about one time login codes. You
probably have them a lot that meant to be security
and verify users identity that may not actually though, be
all that private. Millions of those codes sent via text
pastor into madiories, making it possible for entities to actually
see their content and most, Ryan Gallagher is been really
needing the charge. This is an investigation, a deep one, Ryan,
(33:04):
just showing how actually we shouldn't really be using TECHSSMS
as our form of two factual authentication. That's right.
Speaker 14 (33:11):
Yeah, we looked in depth at this issue because I
think a lot of people don't realize that when you
log into whether it's a banking app or whether it's
Google or Meta, when you receive one of these logging
codes via SMS, it isn't actually coming directly from the
tech company or the platform that you're logging into is
routed through intermediaries all across the world, and there's very
(33:36):
little oversight of who actually handles those messages. So that's
what we set about to do is to show look
who is actually looking at these security codes and is
there a potential vulnerability in terms of the people who
are accessing the codes. And that's what we found that
there's some concerns around some of the entities that are
handling them.
Speaker 2 (33:55):
Ryan, what's the alternative then to SMS? We just have
thirty seconds.
Speaker 14 (34:00):
The alternative is to use, for example, an authenticator app
on your phone which actually gives you the code on
your phone. You don't have to rely on SMS. It
doesn't go across any network. It's just on your device
all the time and it stays there. So authenticator apps
Google those and you'll find plenty of options.
Speaker 3 (34:17):
Ryan Allagher, it's a really thoughtful piece. We hurt you
to go and read it from a business perspective, from
a security perspective. Now that does it for this edition
of Bloomberg Tech ed.
Speaker 2 (34:27):
Yeah, astonishing way to start the week. Don't forget to
recap through the podcast. You know where to find the pod.
It's on the Bloomberg terminal all the Bloomberg platforms, as
well as online on Apple, Spotify in iHeart all right,
strong way to start the week. From San Francisco, New
York City. This IS's Bloomberg Tech
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