May 16, 2024 • 39 mins
Bloomberg's Caroline Hyde and Ed Ludlow break down Cisco earnings sending shares sliding after analysts dubbed its outlook conservative. Plus, Walmart posts a big jump in its online business, and Perplexity discusses growing competition in the search space.
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Speaker 1 (00:02):
Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news from Marhard.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
We're Innovation, Money and Power Collie in Silicon Valley, NBN.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
This is Bloomberg Technology with Caroline Hyde and Ed lud Love.
Speaker 4 (00:32):
I'm Caroline Heyde a Bloomberg's World headquarters in New York,
and I'm Ed Lodlow in San Francisco.
Speaker 5 (00:36):
This is Bloomberg Technology coming up.
Speaker 4 (00:38):
Full earnings coverage ahead. We've got Cisco. It's sliding because
analysts dub its outlook conservative.
Speaker 6 (00:45):
We'll hear from the CFO Plust.
Speaker 7 (00:47):
We dig into Walmart's results as the commerce giant posts
a big jump in its online business.
Speaker 4 (00:52):
Only We're just sitting down with the CEO of hot
Ai search startup Perplexity to discuss growing competition in the
search space and a new set of board advisors in
the here and then now is to dig in to
investor sentiment more broadly. We can do that across geographies,
across industry groups, but really to really tackle these record highs,
where with Principal Asset Management Chief Global Strategist Sema Shah
(01:15):
joining us and look, I mean game on today from
a macro perspective and will it carry on into the
tech outperformance.
Speaker 3 (01:22):
Do you think hi creator the honesty. Look, it's clearly
it's a good risk one day. I think there's fundamental
reasons for that. You know, of course there's a discussion
about rape cuts coming back onto the agenda. But I
think more fundamentally, we can see that from the economic
data it's slowing, but we're not talking about a weak
economy as yet at least, so this is still a
(01:44):
fundamentally strong economy, which means it and should be fairly
solid as we go through THEA and that should translate
into a broadening of the rally, which is why we're
seeing so many of them.
Speaker 8 (01:54):
Disease reach record highs.
Speaker 7 (01:57):
As Sebahad dead in San Francisco. Looking at all the
index level energy so far yere today, right and you
look at the NAZAQ one hundred s and P five hundred.
I can't believe we showed the Dow Jones Industrial average
and the top of this program today. But I think
what I'm trying to find out is if there's any
commonality in the direction of the market and strip out
(02:17):
the mag seven, because I know that that's top of
mind for so many people. Is there something in common
for this market, or is it still dominated by our
view of those single technology names.
Speaker 3 (02:28):
So I think those single technous they are clearly still
dominating the market.
Speaker 8 (02:33):
They're driving a lot.
Speaker 3 (02:34):
But what you have seen from the most recent earning
season is that this good performance is spreading out to
other parts of the economy.
Speaker 8 (02:40):
Other sectors have done pretty well. So if that can
be maintained, and particularly if you.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
Do actually start adding in those ratee puts towards the
last part of the year, that will help the story,
particularly for certain segments of the market. I mean, even
if you just thinking about small caps, they need those
rate cuts. But overall this is a broad good story.
We still probably need to see a little bit more
evidence in order to secure that perspective, but at least
(03:05):
for now, the evidence that is coming in suggests that
this isn't just a year for the mag seven but
it's going to be a year for the broad act market.
Speaker 4 (03:14):
What about the valuations of well, they're fewer than seven
now when they're magnificent, But more broadly, let's call it
chip stocks, let's call it the winning formula of Nvidia,
of Well, Alphabet, even Apple getting some lift again.
Speaker 6 (03:26):
Now, are those valuations out of whack.
Speaker 8 (03:30):
It's interesting.
Speaker 3 (03:30):
I was traveling across the US last week and I
was with investors everywhere, and that was a question that
still keeps coming up, is you know, do we think
of this as overvalued and is a time for a correction?
So we would definitely push back on that. Yes, it's
a little bit frothy, but do we make comparisons to
the dot com bubble?
Speaker 8 (03:49):
Absolutely not. These earnings are somewhat believable, maybe a.
Speaker 3 (03:53):
Little bit frothy, as I said, but there's actually something
fundamental in those valuations.
Speaker 8 (03:57):
So it doesn't really concern us.
Speaker 3 (03:59):
Inevitably with this kind of market, when there's so much
good news priced in, there's always going to be risk
of a bit of a pullback, But we look at
the tech story as a long term play, and from
a long term play, we still it's still one of
our favored areas of the market.
Speaker 5 (04:15):
It talks about the good news that's priced in. Seema.
Speaker 7 (04:18):
I don't want to bring the mood down, but something
we've been talking a lot about recently on the show
is the relationship between the US and China, whether it's
constructive or otherwise. Is that a headwind you're factoring in
right now, particularly when you look at the technology sector,
so Ineffe, it's.
Speaker 3 (04:35):
Something that we do to consider, especially when you're going
into the presidential election, where China is going to be
top of the news as we get close from closer
to that point. So it is something we consider, but
I think it's very much on a single stock name basis,
because there's some which are going to be particularly exposed
and others which are not so much. The good news
from a China stundpoint, though, is from the most recent
(04:56):
data that we're seeing come in there does seem like
it's a bit of a sickle club term, nothing to
rave on about, but something at least to lift at
least expectations. If that is carried through then certainly for
a lot of those bigger multinational tech companies which have
got so much exposure to China, it does suggest.
Speaker 8 (05:13):
That they are a little bit less at risk than
we would have considered.
Speaker 3 (05:17):
But certainly the geopolitics is something we always have to watch,
but it's not yet at that point where it's changing
up perspective on positivity about the sector.
Speaker 4 (05:25):
I like that we go global because look, it's not
just US stocks have done particularly well of late Japanese
stocks on a tear, European stocks at Sandraman and at
a record as well. Where are you liking other geographies
right now?
Speaker 3 (05:39):
Yeah, And it's a great question because at the moment,
I mean, at least for the last couple of weeks,
what we've been challenged with in the market is that
although I think a lot of people continue to believe
in use exceptionalism, they have been confounded by the fact
that the rat debate continues. We're not very sure about
where that's going. When you think about the growth story,
you're suddenly the economic downside surprises in the US, and
then of course there's evaluation. So then this is probably
(06:01):
a good time to start thinking outside of the US,
and there are some good stories.
Speaker 8 (06:04):
So if you think about Europe, which.
Speaker 3 (06:06):
Is the perennial disappointment, but now you're seeing that we
know what the ECB is going to do, we have
I think pretty much good confidence that there's going to
be cut in June, and then thereafter we know that
we're starting to see a cyclical economic upside upside surprise,
not an acceleration, but at least we're seeing some good
news come through, and then valuations more attractive.
Speaker 8 (06:26):
So if you look across Europe, that's fairly good news.
Speaker 3 (06:28):
And even in China, as I said, given where sentiment was,
you couldn't get much worse than that. And now with
the economic data seeing some signs of brightness, that is
looking like a more attractive part of the market too.
Speaker 7 (06:42):
A Seema, you're a regular on Bloomberg Television. You're a
regular here on Bloomberg Technology away from the market, So
I wanted to ask you about how you're using AI
at work or at home. You know we're going to
be talking later about AI driven search. What have you
been up to in the world of AI.
Speaker 3 (06:59):
Look, I mean, I think any company out there has
to be embracing AI and trying to figure out where
they can.
Speaker 8 (07:04):
Use it in any parts of working home.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
So from a work perspective, of course, trying to adopt
AI into our models, trying to analyze the companies from
a single sector, single stock perspective. That is going to
be the easiest way to try and do full analysis
and get a full complete level of information.
Speaker 8 (07:23):
So that is something that we're trying to bring into work.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
I have some more children. AI is the stuff that
they talk about it at school. As well, so you
can see that this is everywhere. It's not just dominated
by the finance news.
Speaker 7 (07:34):
Princevill Asset Management, Chief Global Strategy as semashark Ai everything
all the time and markets.
Speaker 5 (07:39):
What more can you ask for? On Bloombo Technology.
Speaker 7 (07:42):
Coming up on the show, we're going to hear from
the Cisco CFO Scott Heron is the company's slides and
its outlook is being seen as conservative as coming up next,
Stick with us because we'll be right back.
Speaker 5 (07:53):
This is Bloombo Technology.
Speaker 6 (08:08):
Got to talk.
Speaker 4 (08:09):
Cisco because it's been quite the volatile trade after hours
and in today's training. We're now off by one point
seven percent, moving lower well despite the forecast actually showing
a return of customer spending of networking gear, analysts dubbing
the outlook perhaps a little conservative. Wiliam had got the
chance to discuss all of the results earlier with Cisco
CFO Scott Heron Tickulasen.
Speaker 9 (08:30):
So this was our fiscal third quarter that we announced.
Then normally I wouldn't guide fiscal twenty five until we
get to the fourth quarter earnings call. But you know,
we just acquired Splunk. So the big news for us
is we acquired Splunk. We got a closed mid quarter,
and I think the analysts are all trying to adjust
now to what does the combined company look like.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
So what I wanted to do is kind of.
Speaker 9 (08:49):
Get ahead of that with fiscal twenty five and without
doing a fulsome guide, just get enough information out there
so that they could narrow down their expectations for fiscal
twenty five conservative. I think it's a first view of
where that's going, you know. I think the encouraging thing
for us is we've worked through the supply chain disruptions
(09:09):
that we had that caused us to build up a
huge backlog, and then we're able to clear as we
got the components in, we're able to clear that backlog,
revenue spiked, and now we're having to compare to those
to those compare points, so the year on years are
a little bit difficult to actually discern what's happening in
the underlying business. We spent some time trying to unpack
that for the for investors yesterday, and we'll do some
(09:30):
more of that with the byside later. So first view,
but really just trying to give them enough insight so
that the models would start to converge on what we think.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
Is the right set of numbers.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
So it sounds like you're not saying no, but making
the point that it's very early. I mean, twenty twenty five,
who knows what will happen. But let's talk a little
bit more about inventory.
Speaker 10 (09:47):
You make the point that it feels like you've turned
a corner when it comes to a lot of those
supply chain disruptions, and what does that say about corporate spending.
A lot of people looked at this report and said,
there's screenshoots there, there's a bit of an uptick.
Speaker 1 (10:00):
That's the case. Where is that coming from? What kind
of customers are we seeing that demand from?
Speaker 9 (10:04):
You know, what's really interesting for us? And of course
we've got Splunk added in for just half a quarter.
So if you net that out and look at what
the core business apples to Apple's basis, looks like. Actually
orders were flat overall, which is an improvement from where
it's been as customers have been really trying to implement
the huge amount of product that we shipped out to
them in three consecutive quarters.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
We see that ending.
Speaker 9 (10:25):
We see them getting through implementing all of the product
that we ship to them. By about the end of
this fiscal quarter, which for US will end at the
end of July, and as that happens, we're already starting
to see demand return and product orders flat, I think
encouragingly within that overall flat growth in security orders, growth
in collaboration orders, but most importantly growth in data center
(10:46):
networking orders, which has been a headwind for some time,
and growth in campus switching. And I think the campus
switching one surprised a lot of people that we're seeing
growth there with the sense that you know, there's more
vacant office space than there's ever been. How can campus
switching be growing? So I think it's an encouraging sign.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
So some tailwinds there, and it took me through questions,
but we.
Speaker 10 (11:05):
Have to talk about AI because of course a detail
that caught a lot of people's eyes was the fact
that you have about a billion dollars on AI infrastructure
orders in sight. And I guess my question there is
is that for a particular line of business, where would
that spending actually be taking.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
Place within Cisco.
Speaker 9 (11:23):
Yeah, it's a great question. That's not a new data
point we put that out there. It's in the back end.
So if you think of how these AI models get
trained and then get used, which is called inferencing. It's
in the back end, so it's networking and optics in
the back end. A lot of that going to the big,
large public clouds that you'd expect in the Tier two
AI infrastructure build out is what drives them.
Speaker 7 (11:44):
Cisco CFO Scott Heron giving Frankly a classic class on
being a CFO for a technology company. Let's get some
clarity on Cisco It's technology and its endings. Efering Bloombergsy
and King. There was a lot of CFO speaking on
pick it for us and explain the quarter that's just gone.
Speaker 11 (12:04):
Yeah, I think the best way to view it is
through the lens of what happened with the share price.
We had an initial spike yesterday and after hours right
exactly and after hours trading, and today we're sort of
down moderately a little bit more sober.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
What really happened and Scott kind.
Speaker 11 (12:20):
Of alluded to that was the expectation for orders was
that they would be down possibly as much as ten percent,
maybe even.
Speaker 2 (12:28):
More in the quarter that they just reported came in.
Speaker 11 (12:32):
It's kind of okay, maybe up slightly when you include
this new acquisition. So there was like, oh, things aren't
as bad as we had feared. Kind of reaction that
happened in the after hours. Then when we go through
the numbers and listen to the call, we've seen a
reaction this morning which is more like, yeah, okay, it's okay.
But bearing in mind they've just done this massive acquisition,
(12:54):
maybe they're not getting quite the kick from that.
Speaker 4 (12:56):
Yeah, I mean, we have to take Splunk into consideration here,
and there's gonna be new role of president for example,
in But what about some of the other partnerships natural
M and A. But you know, they had this big
fanfare of an end video deal and partnership has that
bringing in any much needed revenue streams.
Speaker 11 (13:14):
Well that is still in the early day, so we
don't really know. But you know, back to the conversation
that was had with Scott and the big question of
this billion dollar of AI related orders. Obviously Cisco wants
to go to the party too at the moment though,
and there were a lot of questions on the call yesterday, well,
what exactly do you mean by a billion dollars?
Speaker 2 (13:33):
Who's giving you these orders?
Speaker 11 (13:35):
How sure are you that these are real orders and
not just an aspirational goal, and there was a lot
of to and fro with a leadership team about you
know what that really means and whether this is real
and really the bottom line is that investors aren't quite
yet ready to let Cisco go into that AI party.
Speaker 7 (13:52):
I and you broke a story literally as we started
the show and before you walked on set about ampare
the chip company teaming up with to make AI technology
AI infrastructure. I didn't know that Qualcom was in that
line of business. I do now give us the details.
Speaker 11 (14:08):
Yeah, I mean what's going on. There is Umpair, who
we had at our tech conference flash It. They're an
armed server chip company trying to get into all of
the big hyperscalers. They're teaming up with Qualcomm to bring
in this accelerator to try to basically bring a cheaper
alternative to the kind of thing that Nvidia is selling
for many tens.
Speaker 2 (14:27):
Of thousands of dollars. We'll see how well that goes.
We'll see how well that performs.
Speaker 4 (14:31):
I mean, we sat with Renee James, both you and
I individually at various points throughout that event last week.
I and she has a brother fresh air in many
ways to the area of computing and the startup side
of things. But it looks like there's kind of a
trifecta going on. They can't just do it alone. They've
got to be working whether super Micro's involved, super Microcomputer
alongside Qualcom, alongside a pair. But the key refrain coming
(14:55):
from everyone is energy right efficiency.
Speaker 11 (14:57):
Here, Yeah, as you as you point out, Reno is
pretty fired up about this, and she's making a point
which many agree, which is we cannot carry on like this.
The cost of AI in terms of power, in terms
of money is just too great right now. We need
technology answers to that problem. We need more efficient chips,
(15:17):
we need cheaper chips, and she's trying to offer that
her company as a solution to that problem.
Speaker 4 (15:24):
Well, certainly managing to come out to the market with
a combination offering at the moment, Ian, it's brilliant that
you got to break it for us.
Speaker 6 (15:31):
Thank you, Blue Meg's Ian King. Time now for talking tech.
Speaker 4 (15:42):
First up, Microsoft is said to have asked hundreds of
its China based AI staff to consider relocating.
Speaker 6 (15:48):
That's all, according to the Wall Street Journal.
Speaker 4 (15:50):
Now, the tech giant has asked its employees based in
China to move to a different country, perhaps US, but Ireland,
Australia and New Zealand. It's all a growing tensions between
the US and China on technology. Those who choose not
to transfer could remain working in the country for now. Plus,
Michael Varie's investment firm is doubling down on its Chinese
investments JD dot Com, Ali barber Now. According to thirteen
(16:11):
f filings, JD was the firm's top holding after boosting
its stake by eighty percent, with Ali Barba coming in second.
Laberia has been making a return to the Chinese tech
sector after exiting them at one point in twenty twenty three,
and revenue for Baydo grew at actually its slowest pace
in more than a year. Chinese internet search leader look
At struggling to turn its investments into generative AI into actually.
Speaker 6 (16:32):
Real revenue real earnings.
Speaker 4 (16:34):
They came in at four point four billion for the
three months ending in March. Meanwhile, JD dot Com reported
well better than expected seven percent rise in revenue, this
after the Beijing based retailer actually cut prices ramped up
customer perks to counter us on that competition. JD dot
COM's results are seen as one of the key bellweathers
of Chinese consumption, which look a struggle to recover since
the country lifted COVID curbs.
Speaker 7 (16:56):
Yeah, there's going to be a big global e commerce
theme in today's show because Walmart's also out with its
results this morning. It showed a twenty two percent jump
year over year in its online business. This is e
commerce growth, principally in the US. Let's get out to
Bloomberg's Jay one Com who covers Walmart for US, and
that's the story.
Speaker 5 (17:15):
But what's behind it?
Speaker 7 (17:16):
What's Walmart been doing with its digital presence?
Speaker 12 (17:21):
Yeah, so e commerce has been a really important business
for Walmart. It's you know, definitely one of the factors
of growth. And what they've been doing is, you know,
really adding capabilities like delivering orders super early in the morning.
They're also working to deliver their items faster so you know,
(17:41):
the same day, you know, or in a couple of hours.
Speaker 8 (17:46):
They're also improving what.
Speaker 12 (17:49):
The company calls a perfect order, which refers to different
metrics like you know, when orders arrive or how complete
the orders are, and they've been working on improving all
of those things while cutting down costs associated with delivery.
Speaker 6 (18:07):
The numbers are phenomenal.
Speaker 4 (18:09):
And when you're looking at what four billion items in
the last twelve months delivered by in the same day
or next day, that's comparable to Amazon. What's also comparable
to Amazon is some of the teething problems that they
have back in the day when they started having third
party sellers. Look, I was just sat down in makeup
and make a part of saying, look, have you seen
(18:30):
that there's like some fake handbags being sold on Walmart?
Speaker 6 (18:33):
Now, I had an.
Speaker 4 (18:33):
Issue with my son's gift arriving during Christmas because it
was from a third party vendor and that bender didn't
seem to live up to the expectations.
Speaker 6 (18:41):
What's going on in terms of teething issues.
Speaker 12 (18:44):
So Marketplace has also been one of the factors of
growth for Walmart, and it's been trying to you know,
add sellers and increase the number of items that it
sells on on Marketplace in the US and abroad. And
a huge benefit of that business is the fact that
you know, the company can really grow the range of
(19:04):
items that it selves online and they you know, see
a lot of opportunities with general merchandise in particular. So
you know, this morning they talked about items like pets
and beauty. They're you know, going up in sales by
more than thirty percent on marketplace, and you know, at
the same time it is it is a more decent.
Speaker 8 (19:25):
Business compared to selling items in stores.
Speaker 12 (19:28):
And so you know we'll see the different puts in
takes that they'll you know, test start with that business for.
Speaker 4 (19:36):
Now, and thing's looking very strong. Thank you so much,
Joy and Kang on All Things warm Up. Welcome back
to Blue Bag Technology and Karin Hide in New York.
Speaker 5 (19:52):
And I'm id love Low in San Francisco.
Speaker 4 (19:54):
But for now, there's news from Perplexity, the developer of
an AI based search engine platform. It's creating brand new
advice board that will include Mikhale Parakin, the former head
of Microsoft being researched, of course, Rich Minor, Google Advisor,
Android co founder, and Emil Michael, former.
Speaker 6 (20:08):
Chief business officer over al Uber.
Speaker 4 (20:10):
Here for more on this news is Perplexity CEO Aravin Shunibas.
So we have this new set of advisors. I'm going
to start with the obvious. Having your look to the pictures.
You're four male co founders and you've got three men
on your advisory board. You are a man of color.
I don't need you to preach to the converted. Whereas
the women, where's a diversity.
Speaker 13 (20:31):
So one of our board directors Cacile Hem from IVP,
she's a woman. We also have another board observer and
board 'ski from Anya who's also a woman. And Susan Wojitski, farmer,
YouTube CEOs and investor in US and she's also very
helpful in advice. So we have a lot of people
from many different diverse backgrounds helping us right now.
Speaker 4 (20:55):
Okay, so one female board member, one observer, one investor
that you name. That doesn't feel like a lot, but
I get it. You feel this diversity enough. Many would
quibble with that, but let's talk about what these three
people bring from a across the board, across experience.
Speaker 6 (21:12):
What is it that you need right now in terms
of advice.
Speaker 13 (21:15):
Yeah, So as a startup, we've been fortunate to scale
up so much in such a short period of time.
The next step for us is to really think hard
about strategy, both in terms of search, how to build
our own index and how to like scale it up
to like even more users, and in terms of how
our mobile and distribution strategy. It was right, So search
(21:36):
is all about distribution. They all say soon their purchases
CEO Google because he really cracked the distribution code to Chrome.
So we are working with Email who is the farmer
business officer of Uber, who is so aggressive on growth
in terms of getting such a large user base, So
we need to think have similar ideas here.
Speaker 6 (21:55):
And in terms of mobile, I would say it was
too aggressive.
Speaker 14 (21:58):
Yeah, we'll try to tone it down, sure, but.
Speaker 13 (22:02):
Look, startups have to be aggressive in terms of competing
against incumbents who already have like billion users or Opening
I has one hundred million users.
Speaker 14 (22:11):
We don't have that today, so we have to be
it's on us to do that.
Speaker 13 (22:15):
And it requires a good mobile strategy to a great
mobile experience, so rich from Android it would be very
helpful there. And of course the core thing is search,
and no one better than Mikail who used to head bing.
He rolled out being chat co pilot and was previously
doing all the search infrastructure for yandex. So he's going
(22:36):
to advise us on building a lot of in house
infrastructure for us.
Speaker 5 (22:40):
Aravin. Thanks.
Speaker 7 (22:41):
Coming back on the program, I've got to ask you
about Google Io and the real emphasis frankly that Google
put on integration of AI into search specifically, it's like this.
Speaker 5 (22:53):
Idea of AI overviews.
Speaker 7 (22:54):
Right, you know, you search for something, it gives you
a text answer as opposed to link. A lot of
people want to know what is Aravin Shinabas's reaction to
what you saw out a Google IO.
Speaker 13 (23:07):
That's the same reaction to what I saw last year
when they called it Search Generative Experience. It's just the
exact same thing called it is a different name. There's
literally no change to it. And sure it's being rolled
out to more people, but it's not going to be
rolled out for.
Speaker 14 (23:22):
Every single query you type on Google.
Speaker 13 (23:25):
And the most important thing when someone uses a product
is they should know what's.
Speaker 14 (23:29):
Going to happen.
Speaker 13 (23:30):
When people go to Google, they hate the latency being bad.
They expect instant and the links to render. So the
moment you start making people wonder what's going to happen,
whether that's going to be a streaming of tokens for
an answer, or is this going to be links, or
whether it's going to be ads, or whether it's going
to be some other panels and a UI that's so
cluttered with all these elements at one face versus a
(23:53):
single UI just focus for a question answering. That's what
users are going to decide between perplexity and Google AI overviews.
And I think like users like simple, minimum, clean products,
so we are pretty confident in our own direction.
Speaker 7 (24:08):
Aravin, Do you have any information or even just sense
that this was Google responding directly to perplexity, pulsa and
possible right? And how do you plan to respond yourself?
Speaker 13 (24:20):
But being a better product by actually working on categories
of searches that they're definitely going to be not incentivized to,
for example, shopping. If it's still like I'm on the
SGE experiment already, and when I still type on shoes,
I don't get any of the AI overviews. I just
get all the Google Shopping clutter UI, so I still
get ads. So there are like query categories, commercially intended
(24:42):
query categories insurance, travel, shopping, or like education, the universities
from different fution programs, taxes, all these different categories where
all these advertisers are screaming.
Speaker 14 (24:54):
At you to click on them.
Speaker 13 (24:57):
There's just no incentive for them to put an AI
overview for those querries and like lose their revenue share.
Speaker 4 (25:03):
What's interesting though, is you actually are built in some ways.
You use claw three, you also use open aiyes underlying
large language model. And there's rumors that open aie got
to come out with some sort of search. That worry
a little bit more.
Speaker 14 (25:17):
Not really though.
Speaker 13 (25:19):
Their strategy is cleaner than what Google is doing. They're
not actually just changing chat GPT to put in search.
They're building out a separate product. But by building out
a separate product, you're competing for users from you know,
in the same way as like Google rolling out Gemini
or Bard. You're not actually taking advantage of the existing
user base. And we are confident that like our existing
(25:41):
work on using many models and many indexes and all
the orchestration that we do will still keep us a
superior product. But it's a good competition, Like we're definitely
going to watch what they're going to release and make
sure we execute even faster than what we're doing.
Speaker 4 (25:54):
It's competition for talent, it is competition for dollars because
this is not a cheap process to be answering all
our questions, are you fundraising again?
Speaker 6 (26:04):
As rumors that you are are there rumors?
Speaker 14 (26:06):
I mean, I don't know.
Speaker 13 (26:07):
Look, all I'll say is that we are trying to
be as efficient as possible and not going and raising
like a billion dollar round or something like that. I
would say, yes, I agree with you, this is going
to be expensive. We would have to fundraise again at
some point. But our goal is to get our revenue
in good shape so that as we scale in terms
(26:29):
of a number of people, that's a good revenue per
employee and we're a healthy business too.
Speaker 7 (26:36):
Aravins, Welcome to Bloomberg Technology. I'm glad that you're in
the studio with us today. When we say that you're
coming on the show, we get a lot of questions
from the audience. Unsurprisingly, there are many perplexity users out
there right. What always strikes me is how simple the
questions are. They just want to know from you, what
your daily active user metrics are, the latest on the
(26:57):
user base geographically where these people are.
Speaker 13 (27:01):
Yeah, so we actually care more about the number of
queries we get every single day. That's a better metric
for us because that's more directly tied to expanding our
index and getting our models in better shape. So we
are pretty close to ten million daily queries of this
fine somewhere in the late single digits of millions, So
that's actually a really good progress from where we started.
Every single month we are basically serving close to like
(27:23):
one hundred and ninety million queries, and this is only expanding.
We started like one and a half years ago and
one looking forward like we can definitely for example, bing
chat served like a billion queries in twenty twenty three,
and we sell five hundred million this year itself. We've
already surpassed the entirety of twenty twenty three in the
(27:44):
first three months of four months. So looking forward, if
we keep sustaining these growth rates, we're headed for a
great future.
Speaker 7 (27:53):
Aravin I wrote on Monday in The Tech Daily that
consolidations coming among AI startups essentially, have you held talks
with a bigger technology company about the potential of being
acquired or do you see yourselves as an acquirer of
some of the other smaller names or teams that are
out there.
Speaker 13 (28:12):
Yeah, so I agree with you on the broader point
of consolidation. It's already happening. Like a lot of us
startups that used to be there no longer there, and
like the fewer ones that exist continue to keep getting
more and more powerful in terms of user based or
market share and APIs. So we've had interests in the past,
I'm not going to deny that. And we've also looked
(28:34):
into acquiring a few smaller startups, and in fact we've
made one active hire already, like a company called spell Wise,
which helped revamp our mobile team. And we're always looking
for like new hungry founders who are like you know,
even earlier stage than we are, faster at executing than
like typical engineers from big tech, and we're always excited
(28:56):
about like talking to more people like that.
Speaker 7 (28:58):
An arab intion Abatis pop CEO, thank you for coming
back on the show in Bluebot Technology and joining.
Speaker 5 (29:04):
Us at the New York studio. Appreciate it.
Speaker 7 (29:06):
Sticking with AI, the Senates by Partners in AI working Group,
which is led by Majority leader Chuck Schumer, finally released
its highly anticipated roadmap yesterday to provide guidance on congressional
efforts to harness AI's benefits but mitigate potential risks. The
blueprint recommends thirty two billion dollars in annual government spending
(29:28):
to support non defense AI research and development efforts, in
part to stay ahead of rivals like China.
Speaker 4 (29:34):
Caroline long time coming, a fur bit of criticism from
some lobby years over there. But now we're going to
take the conversation forward and actually maybe divert into the
world of web three.
Speaker 6 (29:44):
For a moment.
Speaker 4 (29:45):
Segey Nazarrov's gonna be with US co found and Chainlink
to discuss the trend in asset tokenizations from New York,
where we're also looking at meta shares, talking of all
things social media. Look, we're currently under pressure just by
one point four percent, and the day interesting risk off
tone given that the rest of the market is pushing
higher measure being suspected by the EU of hooking kids
(30:08):
on Facebook and Instagram. Look, this is yet another investigation,
this time coming under the Digital Services Act that could
lead to some finds from New York. For San Francisco,
this is a Bloomberg technology.
Speaker 7 (30:32):
Let's talk crypto an assets ognization with chain Link, a
company that connects blockchains and brings real world data on
chain and which now works with the likes of BNP,
Bank of America and Citybanking. Just in the last few
moments has had some pretty significant breaking news. Sergey Nazarov
is the co founder of chain Link and joins US
(30:52):
now let's start with that news.
Speaker 5 (30:54):
DTCC.
Speaker 7 (30:55):
You have a new arrangement with them, a new relationship,
explain it to us.
Speaker 5 (31:00):
Yes, yeah, sure.
Speaker 15 (31:03):
So we've been working with them for some time now
on how to create high quality on chain digital assets
that are driven by data. And so the report that's
just come out today shows how data can flow into
assets on chain and prove critical things about the assets
on an ongoing basis, which is very different from how
(31:24):
the current financial system works, where the ownership of an
asset doesn't give you access to data that becomes your responsibility.
So the BTCC report was around something called smart now
where chain link was used to put critical pieces of
data on chain around funds tokenized funds, and the collaboration
included big firms like JP Morgan, Franklin, Templeton, BNYML and
(31:48):
State Street.
Speaker 5 (31:49):
And others were part of the pilot with them.
Speaker 15 (31:51):
And I think what this shows is that real world
asset to organization is taking a more mainstream institutional interest level,
especially the real world assets that are backed by data,
because the big difference here is that the asset can
have critical information about it continually updated, and the holder
(32:13):
of the asset or the buyer of the asset doesn't
have to search for that data and they don't need
to have any special expertise. And also the data can
move across chains. That was the other big part of
the collaboration is how does the data and the asset
end up moving across chains. But this is just some
of our initial work together, and I'm hopeful there will
be more with them and other large csds.
Speaker 4 (32:36):
It's interesting, of course, because there are many vocal critics
of some of the actual coins and investment opportunities when
it comes to crypto, but they've always all together now said,
but we like the underlying technology. We like blockchain CEO
Jamie Diamond for example of JP Morgan. How does this
disintermediate longer term financial institute?
Speaker 15 (33:02):
I think financial institutions have a fundamental role to play
in terms of compliance and in terms of allowing users
to use digital asset products in a compliant way, in
relation to their identity, in relation to ways that regulators
and csds and central banks find acceptable. So I don't
think banks are going away. I don't think things like
(33:25):
the DTCC are going away. I don't think central banks
are going away. I think they're going to use the
technology I think there will actually be the biggest net
users of blockchain technology, and they're going to generate the
most assets, they're going to generate the most payments, and importantly,
they're going to do it in a way that complies
with legal requirements. We're kind of at a place in
(33:46):
the crypto industry where if you're a two and a
half trillion maybe you can go to as high as
ten trillion off of hedge funds and prop traders in
the retail community.
Speaker 5 (33:55):
But in my opinion, if you want to go.
Speaker 15 (33:57):
To the hundreds of trillions that will be the blockchain format,
you need the global c as these the central banks,
the big commercial banks, to basically adopt the technology for
its value. And that's what this collaboration with the DTCC
has been about, is providing that technical value in ways
that benefits both the traditional financial system and consumers and
(34:21):
the Web three blockchain community.
Speaker 4 (34:24):
This is about, you, say, accelo, to the investment fund
tokenization movement, which particular real world assets we're ultimately going
to see being put forward on the blockchain. First, it's
already being done, already being experimented with. But for the
audience out there who also happen to be training equities
or in a commodity space, maybe they're upond syndicate desk.
Where are they going to see their assets at HIT first?
Speaker 15 (34:49):
So it's actually going to vary by institution and what
institutions are good at tokenizing or good at turning into securities.
Speaker 5 (34:56):
There are basically two categories.
Speaker 15 (34:58):
There are the core financial pro products of the current
financial system, treasuries, money market funds, bonds. These are being
tokenized by bigger institutions, and the benefits of tokenizing them
are around collateral management, and they're around diversifying your on
chain holdings so that you're not just holding cryptocurrencies on chain,
you're holding treasuries on chain. Then you have what are
(35:20):
called assets at the edges. These are assets that have
traditionally not been tokenized. So these are assets like carbon credits,
real estate, private equity. These are the assets that have
not been securitized that are now being securitized in the
form of a tokenized product. These are the things that
(35:41):
people have more press releases about. They hear more about
because they are more exciting kind of net new product.
And I think that there is tens of trillions of
dollars in value just in the net new product category.
But I am actually seeing both of them happening at
the same time. I'm seeing the toe organization of treasuries
(36:01):
and money markets and more foundational financial products and very
foundational parts of the financial system. And then I'm also
seeing the more advanced kind of securitization two point zero
waves of tokenized products. The ones that come to mind
are private equity, real.
Speaker 5 (36:19):
Estate, and carbon credits. So again, Nazrov co founder Chainling,
great to have you on the show. Thank you.
Speaker 2 (36:33):
So.
Speaker 4 (36:34):
Service Now is beefing up, It's increasing its workforce, its
expanding in enterprise software.
Speaker 6 (36:38):
How pretty simple. The hiring from a larger.
Speaker 4 (36:41):
Competitor salesforce me to Brodie Ford is here with a
very well read story today because everyone loves to hear
about people pinching people from workplaces, and this is.
Speaker 6 (36:50):
What's going on.
Speaker 16 (36:51):
We all love a rivalry, The tech industry loves a rivalry,
and we're seeing one here. Service Now is a very
fast growing software company. A lot of other software companies
have seen this real almost oppressive environment. They've managed to
keep growing quick. They're expanding into new product categories. Where
does that leave them? Edging up? Into Salesforce, right, and
(37:11):
so what do you do? You poach a couple hundred people.
And that's what we're seeing here, right. They have hired
pretty aggressively from Salesforce, their CEOs taking some potshots at them.
I mean they even stopped using Slack once Slack got
bought by Salesforce. So we have kind of one of
these fun little rivalries bubbling up here.
Speaker 8 (37:28):
You know.
Speaker 5 (37:30):
Emily Changs can be speaking to Benioff later today. I'm
speaking to Bill McDermott on Monday.
Speaker 14 (37:35):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (37:35):
I wonder if it come I wonder if it comes up.
Put that aside.
Speaker 7 (37:40):
Put that aside for a second. Competition is not new
in this place, this town. Is it salaries?
Speaker 5 (37:46):
Is it stock? How they're doing it?
Speaker 16 (37:48):
Yeah, I would say part of it is that there's
been disruption at Salesforce, right, I mean they had the
big layoffs a little over a year ago. A lot
of it I hear is that salespeople got laid off
over there. Service Now said hey, we actually need more
salespeople with your kind of experience or come on over.
But it's not at the executive level too, right, I
mean Service Now's new chief marketing officer came from Salesforce,
(38:11):
so I imagine there are some pretty aggressive offers happening here,
and it's really across the board. So it's interesting to
see what this kind of new infusion of talent does
for them. I mean, they've grown their headcount maybe three
thousand over the last year, which most companies have cut
by that amount, so it'll be interesting to see how
that impacts them.
Speaker 4 (38:29):
I love that Phil Patterson is giving you the quote
of basically that imitation is the best form of flattery.
So it's quite flattering, honestly that they happen to aspire
to be more like us.
Speaker 16 (38:38):
The larger company doesn't usually want to engage with this
kind of thing because then it validates it, right, So yeah,
they they kind of poo poo to the competition.
Speaker 4 (38:46):
Oh well, we'll see how they handle some of the questions. Yeah, Emily,
and from our own end a little bit later, Bridie
Ford always great writing, great explaining. He love having on Meanwhile,
that does it for this edition of BlueBag Technology.
Speaker 7 (38:57):
Yet what an addition of BlueBag Technology was check out
the pod. Lots of chat about the pod all the time,
you know exactly where to find it. One day left
in this fantastic week. Keep with us from San Francisco
and New York. This is Bloomberg Technology,
Bloomberg Audio Studios, podcasts, radio news from Marhard.
Speaker 2 (00:09):
We're Innovation, Money and Power Collie in Silicon Valley, NBN.
Speaker 3 (00:14):
This is Bloomberg Technology with Caroline Hyde and Ed lud Love.
Speaker 4 (00:32):
I'm Caroline Heyde a Bloomberg's World headquarters in New York,
and I'm Ed Lodlow in San Francisco.
Speaker 5 (00:36):
This is Bloomberg Technology coming up.
Speaker 4 (00:38):
Full earnings coverage ahead. We've got Cisco. It's sliding because
analysts dub its outlook conservative.
Speaker 6 (00:45):
We'll hear from the CFO Plust.
Speaker 7 (00:47):
We dig into Walmart's results as the commerce giant posts
a big jump in its online business.
Speaker 4 (00:52):
Only We're just sitting down with the CEO of hot
Ai search startup Perplexity to discuss growing competition in the
search space and a new set of board advisors in
the here and then now is to dig in to
investor sentiment more broadly. We can do that across geographies,
across industry groups, but really to really tackle these record highs,
where with Principal Asset Management Chief Global Strategist Sema Shah
(01:15):
joining us and look, I mean game on today from
a macro perspective and will it carry on into the
tech outperformance.
Speaker 3 (01:22):
Do you think hi creator the honesty. Look, it's clearly
it's a good risk one day. I think there's fundamental
reasons for that. You know, of course there's a discussion
about rape cuts coming back onto the agenda. But I
think more fundamentally, we can see that from the economic
data it's slowing, but we're not talking about a weak
economy as yet at least, so this is still a
(01:44):
fundamentally strong economy, which means it and should be fairly
solid as we go through THEA and that should translate
into a broadening of the rally, which is why we're
seeing so many of them.
Speaker 8 (01:54):
Disease reach record highs.
Speaker 7 (01:57):
As Sebahad dead in San Francisco. Looking at all the
index level energy so far yere today, right and you
look at the NAZAQ one hundred s and P five hundred.
I can't believe we showed the Dow Jones Industrial average
and the top of this program today. But I think
what I'm trying to find out is if there's any
commonality in the direction of the market and strip out
(02:17):
the mag seven, because I know that that's top of
mind for so many people. Is there something in common
for this market, or is it still dominated by our
view of those single technology names.
Speaker 3 (02:28):
So I think those single technous they are clearly still
dominating the market.
Speaker 8 (02:33):
They're driving a lot.
Speaker 3 (02:34):
But what you have seen from the most recent earning
season is that this good performance is spreading out to
other parts of the economy.
Speaker 8 (02:40):
Other sectors have done pretty well. So if that can
be maintained, and particularly if you.
Speaker 3 (02:45):
Do actually start adding in those ratee puts towards the
last part of the year, that will help the story,
particularly for certain segments of the market. I mean, even
if you just thinking about small caps, they need those
rate cuts. But overall this is a broad good story.
We still probably need to see a little bit more
evidence in order to secure that perspective, but at least
(03:05):
for now, the evidence that is coming in suggests that
this isn't just a year for the mag seven but
it's going to be a year for the broad act market.
Speaker 4 (03:14):
What about the valuations of well, they're fewer than seven
now when they're magnificent, But more broadly, let's call it
chip stocks, let's call it the winning formula of Nvidia,
of Well, Alphabet, even Apple getting some lift again.
Speaker 6 (03:26):
Now, are those valuations out of whack.
Speaker 8 (03:30):
It's interesting.
Speaker 3 (03:30):
I was traveling across the US last week and I
was with investors everywhere, and that was a question that
still keeps coming up, is you know, do we think
of this as overvalued and is a time for a correction?
So we would definitely push back on that. Yes, it's
a little bit frothy, but do we make comparisons to
the dot com bubble?
Speaker 8 (03:49):
Absolutely not. These earnings are somewhat believable, maybe a.
Speaker 3 (03:53):
Little bit frothy, as I said, but there's actually something
fundamental in those valuations.
Speaker 8 (03:57):
So it doesn't really concern us.
Speaker 3 (03:59):
Inevitably with this kind of market, when there's so much
good news priced in, there's always going to be risk
of a bit of a pullback, But we look at
the tech story as a long term play, and from
a long term play, we still it's still one of
our favored areas of the market.
Speaker 5 (04:15):
It talks about the good news that's priced in. Seema.
Speaker 7 (04:18):
I don't want to bring the mood down, but something
we've been talking a lot about recently on the show
is the relationship between the US and China, whether it's
constructive or otherwise. Is that a headwind you're factoring in
right now, particularly when you look at the technology sector,
so Ineffe, it's.
Speaker 3 (04:35):
Something that we do to consider, especially when you're going
into the presidential election, where China is going to be
top of the news as we get close from closer
to that point. So it is something we consider, but
I think it's very much on a single stock name basis,
because there's some which are going to be particularly exposed
and others which are not so much. The good news
from a China stundpoint, though, is from the most recent
(04:56):
data that we're seeing come in there does seem like
it's a bit of a sickle club term, nothing to
rave on about, but something at least to lift at
least expectations. If that is carried through then certainly for
a lot of those bigger multinational tech companies which have
got so much exposure to China, it does suggest.
Speaker 8 (05:13):
That they are a little bit less at risk than
we would have considered.
Speaker 3 (05:17):
But certainly the geopolitics is something we always have to watch,
but it's not yet at that point where it's changing
up perspective on positivity about the sector.
Speaker 4 (05:25):
I like that we go global because look, it's not
just US stocks have done particularly well of late Japanese
stocks on a tear, European stocks at Sandraman and at
a record as well. Where are you liking other geographies
right now?
Speaker 3 (05:39):
Yeah, And it's a great question because at the moment,
I mean, at least for the last couple of weeks,
what we've been challenged with in the market is that
although I think a lot of people continue to believe
in use exceptionalism, they have been confounded by the fact
that the rat debate continues. We're not very sure about
where that's going. When you think about the growth story,
you're suddenly the economic downside surprises in the US, and
then of course there's evaluation. So then this is probably
(06:01):
a good time to start thinking outside of the US,
and there are some good stories.
Speaker 8 (06:04):
So if you think about Europe, which.
Speaker 3 (06:06):
Is the perennial disappointment, but now you're seeing that we
know what the ECB is going to do, we have
I think pretty much good confidence that there's going to
be cut in June, and then thereafter we know that
we're starting to see a cyclical economic upside upside surprise,
not an acceleration, but at least we're seeing some good
news come through, and then valuations more attractive.
Speaker 8 (06:26):
So if you look across Europe, that's fairly good news.
Speaker 3 (06:28):
And even in China, as I said, given where sentiment was,
you couldn't get much worse than that. And now with
the economic data seeing some signs of brightness, that is
looking like a more attractive part of the market too.
Speaker 7 (06:42):
A Seema, you're a regular on Bloomberg Television. You're a
regular here on Bloomberg Technology away from the market, So
I wanted to ask you about how you're using AI
at work or at home. You know we're going to
be talking later about AI driven search. What have you
been up to in the world of AI.
Speaker 3 (06:59):
Look, I mean, I think any company out there has
to be embracing AI and trying to figure out where
they can.
Speaker 8 (07:04):
Use it in any parts of working home.
Speaker 3 (07:07):
So from a work perspective, of course, trying to adopt
AI into our models, trying to analyze the companies from
a single sector, single stock perspective. That is going to
be the easiest way to try and do full analysis
and get a full complete level of information.
Speaker 8 (07:23):
So that is something that we're trying to bring into work.
Speaker 3 (07:25):
I have some more children. AI is the stuff that
they talk about it at school. As well, so you
can see that this is everywhere. It's not just dominated
by the finance news.
Speaker 7 (07:34):
Princevill Asset Management, Chief Global Strategy as semashark Ai everything
all the time and markets.
Speaker 5 (07:39):
What more can you ask for? On Bloombo Technology.
Speaker 7 (07:42):
Coming up on the show, we're going to hear from
the Cisco CFO Scott Heron is the company's slides and
its outlook is being seen as conservative as coming up next,
Stick with us because we'll be right back.
Speaker 5 (07:53):
This is Bloombo Technology.
Speaker 6 (08:08):
Got to talk.
Speaker 4 (08:09):
Cisco because it's been quite the volatile trade after hours
and in today's training. We're now off by one point
seven percent, moving lower well despite the forecast actually showing
a return of customer spending of networking gear, analysts dubbing
the outlook perhaps a little conservative. Wiliam had got the
chance to discuss all of the results earlier with Cisco
CFO Scott Heron Tickulasen.
Speaker 9 (08:30):
So this was our fiscal third quarter that we announced.
Then normally I wouldn't guide fiscal twenty five until we
get to the fourth quarter earnings call. But you know,
we just acquired Splunk. So the big news for us
is we acquired Splunk. We got a closed mid quarter,
and I think the analysts are all trying to adjust
now to what does the combined company look like.
Speaker 2 (08:48):
So what I wanted to do is kind of.
Speaker 9 (08:49):
Get ahead of that with fiscal twenty five and without
doing a fulsome guide, just get enough information out there
so that they could narrow down their expectations for fiscal
twenty five conservative. I think it's a first view of
where that's going, you know. I think the encouraging thing
for us is we've worked through the supply chain disruptions
(09:09):
that we had that caused us to build up a
huge backlog, and then we're able to clear as we
got the components in, we're able to clear that backlog,
revenue spiked, and now we're having to compare to those
to those compare points, so the year on years are
a little bit difficult to actually discern what's happening in
the underlying business. We spent some time trying to unpack
that for the for investors yesterday, and we'll do some
(09:30):
more of that with the byside later. So first view,
but really just trying to give them enough insight so
that the models would start to converge on what we think.
Speaker 2 (09:38):
Is the right set of numbers.
Speaker 1 (09:39):
So it sounds like you're not saying no, but making
the point that it's very early. I mean, twenty twenty five,
who knows what will happen. But let's talk a little
bit more about inventory.
Speaker 10 (09:47):
You make the point that it feels like you've turned
a corner when it comes to a lot of those
supply chain disruptions, and what does that say about corporate spending.
A lot of people looked at this report and said,
there's screenshoots there, there's a bit of an uptick.
Speaker 1 (10:00):
That's the case. Where is that coming from? What kind
of customers are we seeing that demand from?
Speaker 9 (10:04):
You know, what's really interesting for us? And of course
we've got Splunk added in for just half a quarter.
So if you net that out and look at what
the core business apples to Apple's basis, looks like. Actually
orders were flat overall, which is an improvement from where
it's been as customers have been really trying to implement
the huge amount of product that we shipped out to
them in three consecutive quarters.
Speaker 2 (10:24):
We see that ending.
Speaker 9 (10:25):
We see them getting through implementing all of the product
that we ship to them. By about the end of
this fiscal quarter, which for US will end at the
end of July, and as that happens, we're already starting
to see demand return and product orders flat, I think
encouragingly within that overall flat growth in security orders, growth
in collaboration orders, but most importantly growth in data center
(10:46):
networking orders, which has been a headwind for some time,
and growth in campus switching. And I think the campus
switching one surprised a lot of people that we're seeing
growth there with the sense that you know, there's more
vacant office space than there's ever been. How can campus
switching be growing? So I think it's an encouraging sign.
Speaker 1 (11:02):
So some tailwinds there, and it took me through questions,
but we.
Speaker 10 (11:05):
Have to talk about AI because of course a detail
that caught a lot of people's eyes was the fact
that you have about a billion dollars on AI infrastructure
orders in sight. And I guess my question there is
is that for a particular line of business, where would
that spending actually be taking.
Speaker 1 (11:22):
Place within Cisco.
Speaker 9 (11:23):
Yeah, it's a great question. That's not a new data
point we put that out there. It's in the back end.
So if you think of how these AI models get
trained and then get used, which is called inferencing. It's
in the back end, so it's networking and optics in
the back end. A lot of that going to the big,
large public clouds that you'd expect in the Tier two
AI infrastructure build out is what drives them.
Speaker 7 (11:44):
Cisco CFO Scott Heron giving Frankly a classic class on
being a CFO for a technology company. Let's get some
clarity on Cisco It's technology and its endings. Efering Bloombergsy
and King. There was a lot of CFO speaking on
pick it for us and explain the quarter that's just gone.
Speaker 11 (12:04):
Yeah, I think the best way to view it is
through the lens of what happened with the share price.
We had an initial spike yesterday and after hours right
exactly and after hours trading, and today we're sort of
down moderately a little bit more sober.
Speaker 2 (12:18):
What really happened and Scott kind.
Speaker 11 (12:20):
Of alluded to that was the expectation for orders was
that they would be down possibly as much as ten percent,
maybe even.
Speaker 2 (12:28):
More in the quarter that they just reported came in.
Speaker 11 (12:32):
It's kind of okay, maybe up slightly when you include
this new acquisition. So there was like, oh, things aren't
as bad as we had feared. Kind of reaction that
happened in the after hours. Then when we go through
the numbers and listen to the call, we've seen a
reaction this morning which is more like, yeah, okay, it's okay.
But bearing in mind they've just done this massive acquisition,
(12:54):
maybe they're not getting quite the kick from that.
Speaker 4 (12:56):
Yeah, I mean, we have to take Splunk into consideration here,
and there's gonna be new role of president for example,
in But what about some of the other partnerships natural
M and A. But you know, they had this big
fanfare of an end video deal and partnership has that
bringing in any much needed revenue streams.
Speaker 11 (13:14):
Well that is still in the early day, so we
don't really know. But you know, back to the conversation
that was had with Scott and the big question of
this billion dollar of AI related orders. Obviously Cisco wants
to go to the party too at the moment though,
and there were a lot of questions on the call yesterday, well,
what exactly do you mean by a billion dollars?
Speaker 2 (13:33):
Who's giving you these orders?
Speaker 11 (13:35):
How sure are you that these are real orders and
not just an aspirational goal, and there was a lot
of to and fro with a leadership team about you
know what that really means and whether this is real
and really the bottom line is that investors aren't quite
yet ready to let Cisco go into that AI party.
Speaker 7 (13:52):
I and you broke a story literally as we started
the show and before you walked on set about ampare
the chip company teaming up with to make AI technology
AI infrastructure. I didn't know that Qualcom was in that
line of business. I do now give us the details.
Speaker 11 (14:08):
Yeah, I mean what's going on. There is Umpair, who
we had at our tech conference flash It. They're an
armed server chip company trying to get into all of
the big hyperscalers. They're teaming up with Qualcomm to bring
in this accelerator to try to basically bring a cheaper
alternative to the kind of thing that Nvidia is selling
for many tens.
Speaker 2 (14:27):
Of thousands of dollars. We'll see how well that goes.
We'll see how well that performs.
Speaker 4 (14:31):
I mean, we sat with Renee James, both you and
I individually at various points throughout that event last week.
I and she has a brother fresh air in many
ways to the area of computing and the startup side
of things. But it looks like there's kind of a
trifecta going on. They can't just do it alone. They've
got to be working whether super Micro's involved, super Microcomputer
alongside Qualcom, alongside a pair. But the key refrain coming
(14:55):
from everyone is energy right efficiency.
Speaker 11 (14:57):
Here, Yeah, as you as you point out, Reno is
pretty fired up about this, and she's making a point
which many agree, which is we cannot carry on like this.
The cost of AI in terms of power, in terms
of money is just too great right now. We need
technology answers to that problem. We need more efficient chips,
(15:17):
we need cheaper chips, and she's trying to offer that
her company as a solution to that problem.
Speaker 4 (15:24):
Well, certainly managing to come out to the market with
a combination offering at the moment, Ian, it's brilliant that
you got to break it for us.
Speaker 6 (15:31):
Thank you, Blue Meg's Ian King. Time now for talking tech.
Speaker 4 (15:42):
First up, Microsoft is said to have asked hundreds of
its China based AI staff to consider relocating.
Speaker 6 (15:48):
That's all, according to the Wall Street Journal.
Speaker 4 (15:50):
Now, the tech giant has asked its employees based in
China to move to a different country, perhaps US, but Ireland,
Australia and New Zealand. It's all a growing tensions between
the US and China on technology. Those who choose not
to transfer could remain working in the country for now. Plus,
Michael Varie's investment firm is doubling down on its Chinese
investments JD dot Com, Ali barber Now. According to thirteen
(16:11):
f filings, JD was the firm's top holding after boosting
its stake by eighty percent, with Ali Barba coming in second.
Laberia has been making a return to the Chinese tech
sector after exiting them at one point in twenty twenty three,
and revenue for Baydo grew at actually its slowest pace
in more than a year. Chinese internet search leader look
At struggling to turn its investments into generative AI into actually.
Speaker 6 (16:32):
Real revenue real earnings.
Speaker 4 (16:34):
They came in at four point four billion for the
three months ending in March. Meanwhile, JD dot Com reported
well better than expected seven percent rise in revenue, this
after the Beijing based retailer actually cut prices ramped up
customer perks to counter us on that competition. JD dot
COM's results are seen as one of the key bellweathers
of Chinese consumption, which look a struggle to recover since
the country lifted COVID curbs.
Speaker 7 (16:56):
Yeah, there's going to be a big global e commerce
theme in today's show because Walmart's also out with its
results this morning. It showed a twenty two percent jump
year over year in its online business. This is e
commerce growth, principally in the US. Let's get out to
Bloomberg's Jay one Com who covers Walmart for US, and
that's the story.
Speaker 5 (17:15):
But what's behind it?
Speaker 7 (17:16):
What's Walmart been doing with its digital presence?
Speaker 12 (17:21):
Yeah, so e commerce has been a really important business
for Walmart. It's you know, definitely one of the factors
of growth. And what they've been doing is, you know,
really adding capabilities like delivering orders super early in the morning.
They're also working to deliver their items faster so you know,
(17:41):
the same day, you know, or in a couple of hours.
Speaker 8 (17:46):
They're also improving what.
Speaker 12 (17:49):
The company calls a perfect order, which refers to different
metrics like you know, when orders arrive or how complete
the orders are, and they've been working on improving all
of those things while cutting down costs associated with delivery.
Speaker 6 (18:07):
The numbers are phenomenal.
Speaker 4 (18:09):
And when you're looking at what four billion items in
the last twelve months delivered by in the same day
or next day, that's comparable to Amazon. What's also comparable
to Amazon is some of the teething problems that they
have back in the day when they started having third
party sellers. Look, I was just sat down in makeup
and make a part of saying, look, have you seen
(18:30):
that there's like some fake handbags being sold on Walmart?
Speaker 6 (18:33):
Now, I had an.
Speaker 4 (18:33):
Issue with my son's gift arriving during Christmas because it
was from a third party vendor and that bender didn't
seem to live up to the expectations.
Speaker 6 (18:41):
What's going on in terms of teething issues.
Speaker 12 (18:44):
So Marketplace has also been one of the factors of
growth for Walmart, and it's been trying to you know,
add sellers and increase the number of items that it
sells on on Marketplace in the US and abroad. And
a huge benefit of that business is the fact that
you know, the company can really grow the range of
(19:04):
items that it selves online and they you know, see
a lot of opportunities with general merchandise in particular. So
you know, this morning they talked about items like pets
and beauty. They're you know, going up in sales by
more than thirty percent on marketplace, and you know, at
the same time it is it is a more decent.
Speaker 8 (19:25):
Business compared to selling items in stores.
Speaker 12 (19:28):
And so you know we'll see the different puts in
takes that they'll you know, test start with that business for.
Speaker 4 (19:36):
Now, and thing's looking very strong. Thank you so much,
Joy and Kang on All Things warm Up. Welcome back
to Blue Bag Technology and Karin Hide in New York.
Speaker 5 (19:52):
And I'm id love Low in San Francisco.
Speaker 4 (19:54):
But for now, there's news from Perplexity, the developer of
an AI based search engine platform. It's creating brand new
advice board that will include Mikhale Parakin, the former head
of Microsoft being researched, of course, Rich Minor, Google Advisor,
Android co founder, and Emil Michael, former.
Speaker 6 (20:08):
Chief business officer over al Uber.
Speaker 4 (20:10):
Here for more on this news is Perplexity CEO Aravin Shunibas.
So we have this new set of advisors. I'm going
to start with the obvious. Having your look to the pictures.
You're four male co founders and you've got three men
on your advisory board. You are a man of color.
I don't need you to preach to the converted. Whereas
the women, where's a diversity.
Speaker 13 (20:31):
So one of our board directors Cacile Hem from IVP,
she's a woman. We also have another board observer and
board 'ski from Anya who's also a woman. And Susan Wojitski, farmer,
YouTube CEOs and investor in US and she's also very
helpful in advice. So we have a lot of people
from many different diverse backgrounds helping us right now.
Speaker 4 (20:55):
Okay, so one female board member, one observer, one investor
that you name. That doesn't feel like a lot, but
I get it. You feel this diversity enough. Many would
quibble with that, but let's talk about what these three
people bring from a across the board, across experience.
Speaker 6 (21:12):
What is it that you need right now in terms
of advice.
Speaker 13 (21:15):
Yeah, So as a startup, we've been fortunate to scale
up so much in such a short period of time.
The next step for us is to really think hard
about strategy, both in terms of search, how to build
our own index and how to like scale it up
to like even more users, and in terms of how
our mobile and distribution strategy. It was right, So search
(21:36):
is all about distribution. They all say soon their purchases
CEO Google because he really cracked the distribution code to Chrome.
So we are working with Email who is the farmer
business officer of Uber, who is so aggressive on growth
in terms of getting such a large user base, So
we need to think have similar ideas here.
Speaker 6 (21:55):
And in terms of mobile, I would say it was
too aggressive.
Speaker 14 (21:58):
Yeah, we'll try to tone it down, sure, but.
Speaker 13 (22:02):
Look, startups have to be aggressive in terms of competing
against incumbents who already have like billion users or Opening
I has one hundred million users.
Speaker 14 (22:11):
We don't have that today, so we have to be
it's on us to do that.
Speaker 13 (22:15):
And it requires a good mobile strategy to a great
mobile experience, so rich from Android it would be very
helpful there. And of course the core thing is search,
and no one better than Mikail who used to head bing.
He rolled out being chat co pilot and was previously
doing all the search infrastructure for yandex. So he's going
(22:36):
to advise us on building a lot of in house
infrastructure for us.
Speaker 5 (22:40):
Aravin. Thanks.
Speaker 7 (22:41):
Coming back on the program, I've got to ask you
about Google Io and the real emphasis frankly that Google
put on integration of AI into search specifically, it's like this.
Speaker 5 (22:53):
Idea of AI overviews.
Speaker 7 (22:54):
Right, you know, you search for something, it gives you
a text answer as opposed to link. A lot of
people want to know what is Aravin Shinabas's reaction to
what you saw out a Google IO.
Speaker 13 (23:07):
That's the same reaction to what I saw last year
when they called it Search Generative Experience. It's just the
exact same thing called it is a different name. There's
literally no change to it. And sure it's being rolled
out to more people, but it's not going to be
rolled out for.
Speaker 14 (23:22):
Every single query you type on Google.
Speaker 13 (23:25):
And the most important thing when someone uses a product
is they should know what's.
Speaker 14 (23:29):
Going to happen.
Speaker 13 (23:30):
When people go to Google, they hate the latency being bad.
They expect instant and the links to render. So the
moment you start making people wonder what's going to happen,
whether that's going to be a streaming of tokens for
an answer, or is this going to be links, or
whether it's going to be ads, or whether it's going
to be some other panels and a UI that's so
cluttered with all these elements at one face versus a
(23:53):
single UI just focus for a question answering. That's what
users are going to decide between perplexity and Google AI overviews.
And I think like users like simple, minimum, clean products,
so we are pretty confident in our own direction.
Speaker 7 (24:08):
Aravin, Do you have any information or even just sense
that this was Google responding directly to perplexity, pulsa and
possible right? And how do you plan to respond yourself?
Speaker 13 (24:20):
But being a better product by actually working on categories
of searches that they're definitely going to be not incentivized to,
for example, shopping. If it's still like I'm on the
SGE experiment already, and when I still type on shoes,
I don't get any of the AI overviews. I just
get all the Google Shopping clutter UI, so I still
get ads. So there are like query categories, commercially intended
(24:42):
query categories insurance, travel, shopping, or like education, the universities
from different fution programs, taxes, all these different categories where
all these advertisers are screaming.
Speaker 14 (24:54):
At you to click on them.
Speaker 13 (24:57):
There's just no incentive for them to put an AI
overview for those querries and like lose their revenue share.
Speaker 4 (25:03):
What's interesting though, is you actually are built in some ways.
You use claw three, you also use open aiyes underlying
large language model. And there's rumors that open aie got
to come out with some sort of search. That worry
a little bit more.
Speaker 14 (25:17):
Not really though.
Speaker 13 (25:19):
Their strategy is cleaner than what Google is doing. They're
not actually just changing chat GPT to put in search.
They're building out a separate product. But by building out
a separate product, you're competing for users from you know,
in the same way as like Google rolling out Gemini
or Bard. You're not actually taking advantage of the existing
user base. And we are confident that like our existing
(25:41):
work on using many models and many indexes and all
the orchestration that we do will still keep us a
superior product. But it's a good competition, Like we're definitely
going to watch what they're going to release and make
sure we execute even faster than what we're doing.
Speaker 4 (25:54):
It's competition for talent, it is competition for dollars because
this is not a cheap process to be answering all
our questions, are you fundraising again?
Speaker 6 (26:04):
As rumors that you are are there rumors?
Speaker 14 (26:06):
I mean, I don't know.
Speaker 13 (26:07):
Look, all I'll say is that we are trying to
be as efficient as possible and not going and raising
like a billion dollar round or something like that. I
would say, yes, I agree with you, this is going
to be expensive. We would have to fundraise again at
some point. But our goal is to get our revenue
in good shape so that as we scale in terms
(26:29):
of a number of people, that's a good revenue per
employee and we're a healthy business too.
Speaker 7 (26:36):
Aravins, Welcome to Bloomberg Technology. I'm glad that you're in
the studio with us today. When we say that you're
coming on the show, we get a lot of questions
from the audience. Unsurprisingly, there are many perplexity users out
there right. What always strikes me is how simple the
questions are. They just want to know from you, what
your daily active user metrics are, the latest on the
(26:57):
user base geographically where these people are.
Speaker 13 (27:01):
Yeah, so we actually care more about the number of
queries we get every single day. That's a better metric
for us because that's more directly tied to expanding our
index and getting our models in better shape. So we
are pretty close to ten million daily queries of this
fine somewhere in the late single digits of millions, So
that's actually a really good progress from where we started.
Every single month we are basically serving close to like
(27:23):
one hundred and ninety million queries, and this is only expanding.
We started like one and a half years ago and
one looking forward like we can definitely for example, bing
chat served like a billion queries in twenty twenty three,
and we sell five hundred million this year itself. We've
already surpassed the entirety of twenty twenty three in the
(27:44):
first three months of four months. So looking forward, if
we keep sustaining these growth rates, we're headed for a
great future.
Speaker 7 (27:53):
Aravin I wrote on Monday in The Tech Daily that
consolidations coming among AI startups essentially, have you held talks
with a bigger technology company about the potential of being
acquired or do you see yourselves as an acquirer of
some of the other smaller names or teams that are
out there.
Speaker 13 (28:12):
Yeah, so I agree with you on the broader point
of consolidation. It's already happening. Like a lot of us
startups that used to be there no longer there, and
like the fewer ones that exist continue to keep getting
more and more powerful in terms of user based or
market share and APIs. So we've had interests in the past,
I'm not going to deny that. And we've also looked
(28:34):
into acquiring a few smaller startups, and in fact we've
made one active hire already, like a company called spell Wise,
which helped revamp our mobile team. And we're always looking
for like new hungry founders who are like you know,
even earlier stage than we are, faster at executing than
like typical engineers from big tech, and we're always excited
(28:56):
about like talking to more people like that.
Speaker 7 (28:58):
An arab intion Abatis pop CEO, thank you for coming
back on the show in Bluebot Technology and joining.
Speaker 5 (29:04):
Us at the New York studio. Appreciate it.
Speaker 7 (29:06):
Sticking with AI, the Senates by Partners in AI working Group,
which is led by Majority leader Chuck Schumer, finally released
its highly anticipated roadmap yesterday to provide guidance on congressional
efforts to harness AI's benefits but mitigate potential risks. The
blueprint recommends thirty two billion dollars in annual government spending
(29:28):
to support non defense AI research and development efforts, in
part to stay ahead of rivals like China.
Speaker 4 (29:34):
Caroline long time coming, a fur bit of criticism from
some lobby years over there. But now we're going to
take the conversation forward and actually maybe divert into the
world of web three.
Speaker 6 (29:44):
For a moment.
Speaker 4 (29:45):
Segey Nazarrov's gonna be with US co found and Chainlink
to discuss the trend in asset tokenizations from New York,
where we're also looking at meta shares, talking of all
things social media. Look, we're currently under pressure just by
one point four percent, and the day interesting risk off
tone given that the rest of the market is pushing
higher measure being suspected by the EU of hooking kids
(30:08):
on Facebook and Instagram. Look, this is yet another investigation,
this time coming under the Digital Services Act that could
lead to some finds from New York. For San Francisco,
this is a Bloomberg technology.
Speaker 7 (30:32):
Let's talk crypto an assets ognization with chain Link, a
company that connects blockchains and brings real world data on
chain and which now works with the likes of BNP,
Bank of America and Citybanking. Just in the last few
moments has had some pretty significant breaking news. Sergey Nazarov
is the co founder of chain Link and joins US
(30:52):
now let's start with that news.
Speaker 5 (30:54):
DTCC.
Speaker 7 (30:55):
You have a new arrangement with them, a new relationship,
explain it to us.
Speaker 5 (31:00):
Yes, yeah, sure.
Speaker 15 (31:03):
So we've been working with them for some time now
on how to create high quality on chain digital assets
that are driven by data. And so the report that's
just come out today shows how data can flow into
assets on chain and prove critical things about the assets
on an ongoing basis, which is very different from how
(31:24):
the current financial system works, where the ownership of an
asset doesn't give you access to data that becomes your responsibility.
So the BTCC report was around something called smart now
where chain link was used to put critical pieces of
data on chain around funds tokenized funds, and the collaboration
included big firms like JP Morgan, Franklin, Templeton, BNYML and
(31:48):
State Street.
Speaker 5 (31:49):
And others were part of the pilot with them.
Speaker 15 (31:51):
And I think what this shows is that real world
asset to organization is taking a more mainstream institutional interest level,
especially the real world assets that are backed by data,
because the big difference here is that the asset can
have critical information about it continually updated, and the holder
(32:13):
of the asset or the buyer of the asset doesn't
have to search for that data and they don't need
to have any special expertise. And also the data can
move across chains. That was the other big part of
the collaboration is how does the data and the asset
end up moving across chains. But this is just some
of our initial work together, and I'm hopeful there will
be more with them and other large csds.
Speaker 4 (32:36):
It's interesting, of course, because there are many vocal critics
of some of the actual coins and investment opportunities when
it comes to crypto, but they've always all together now said,
but we like the underlying technology. We like blockchain CEO
Jamie Diamond for example of JP Morgan. How does this
disintermediate longer term financial institute?
Speaker 15 (33:02):
I think financial institutions have a fundamental role to play
in terms of compliance and in terms of allowing users
to use digital asset products in a compliant way, in
relation to their identity, in relation to ways that regulators
and csds and central banks find acceptable. So I don't
think banks are going away. I don't think things like
(33:25):
the DTCC are going away. I don't think central banks
are going away. I think they're going to use the
technology I think there will actually be the biggest net
users of blockchain technology, and they're going to generate the
most assets, they're going to generate the most payments, and importantly,
they're going to do it in a way that complies
with legal requirements. We're kind of at a place in
(33:46):
the crypto industry where if you're a two and a
half trillion maybe you can go to as high as
ten trillion off of hedge funds and prop traders in
the retail community.
Speaker 5 (33:55):
But in my opinion, if you want to go.
Speaker 15 (33:57):
To the hundreds of trillions that will be the blockchain format,
you need the global c as these the central banks,
the big commercial banks, to basically adopt the technology for
its value. And that's what this collaboration with the DTCC
has been about, is providing that technical value in ways
that benefits both the traditional financial system and consumers and
(34:21):
the Web three blockchain community.
Speaker 4 (34:24):
This is about, you, say, accelo, to the investment fund
tokenization movement, which particular real world assets we're ultimately going
to see being put forward on the blockchain. First, it's
already being done, already being experimented with. But for the
audience out there who also happen to be training equities
or in a commodity space, maybe they're upond syndicate desk.
Where are they going to see their assets at HIT first?
Speaker 15 (34:49):
So it's actually going to vary by institution and what
institutions are good at tokenizing or good at turning into securities.
Speaker 5 (34:56):
There are basically two categories.
Speaker 15 (34:58):
There are the core financial pro products of the current
financial system, treasuries, money market funds, bonds. These are being
tokenized by bigger institutions, and the benefits of tokenizing them
are around collateral management, and they're around diversifying your on
chain holdings so that you're not just holding cryptocurrencies on chain,
you're holding treasuries on chain. Then you have what are
(35:20):
called assets at the edges. These are assets that have
traditionally not been tokenized. So these are assets like carbon credits,
real estate, private equity. These are the assets that have
not been securitized that are now being securitized in the
form of a tokenized product. These are the things that
(35:41):
people have more press releases about. They hear more about
because they are more exciting kind of net new product.
And I think that there is tens of trillions of
dollars in value just in the net new product category.
But I am actually seeing both of them happening at
the same time. I'm seeing the toe organization of treasuries
(36:01):
and money markets and more foundational financial products and very
foundational parts of the financial system. And then I'm also
seeing the more advanced kind of securitization two point zero
waves of tokenized products. The ones that come to mind
are private equity, real.
Speaker 5 (36:19):
Estate, and carbon credits. So again, Nazrov co founder Chainling,
great to have you on the show. Thank you.
Speaker 2 (36:33):
So.
Speaker 4 (36:34):
Service Now is beefing up, It's increasing its workforce, its
expanding in enterprise software.
Speaker 6 (36:38):
How pretty simple. The hiring from a larger.
Speaker 4 (36:41):
Competitor salesforce me to Brodie Ford is here with a
very well read story today because everyone loves to hear
about people pinching people from workplaces, and this is.
Speaker 6 (36:50):
What's going on.
Speaker 16 (36:51):
We all love a rivalry, The tech industry loves a rivalry,
and we're seeing one here. Service Now is a very
fast growing software company. A lot of other software companies
have seen this real almost oppressive environment. They've managed to
keep growing quick. They're expanding into new product categories. Where
does that leave them? Edging up? Into Salesforce, right, and
(37:11):
so what do you do? You poach a couple hundred people.
And that's what we're seeing here, right. They have hired
pretty aggressively from Salesforce, their CEOs taking some potshots at them.
I mean they even stopped using Slack once Slack got
bought by Salesforce. So we have kind of one of
these fun little rivalries bubbling up here.
Speaker 8 (37:28):
You know.
Speaker 5 (37:30):
Emily Changs can be speaking to Benioff later today. I'm
speaking to Bill McDermott on Monday.
Speaker 14 (37:35):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (37:35):
I wonder if it come I wonder if it comes up.
Put that aside.
Speaker 7 (37:40):
Put that aside for a second. Competition is not new
in this place, this town. Is it salaries?
Speaker 5 (37:46):
Is it stock? How they're doing it?
Speaker 16 (37:48):
Yeah, I would say part of it is that there's
been disruption at Salesforce, right, I mean they had the
big layoffs a little over a year ago. A lot
of it I hear is that salespeople got laid off
over there. Service Now said hey, we actually need more
salespeople with your kind of experience or come on over.
But it's not at the executive level too, right, I
mean Service Now's new chief marketing officer came from Salesforce,
(38:11):
so I imagine there are some pretty aggressive offers happening here,
and it's really across the board. So it's interesting to
see what this kind of new infusion of talent does
for them. I mean, they've grown their headcount maybe three
thousand over the last year, which most companies have cut
by that amount, so it'll be interesting to see how
that impacts them.
Speaker 4 (38:29):
I love that Phil Patterson is giving you the quote
of basically that imitation is the best form of flattery.
So it's quite flattering, honestly that they happen to aspire
to be more like us.
Speaker 16 (38:38):
The larger company doesn't usually want to engage with this
kind of thing because then it validates it, right, So yeah,
they they kind of poo poo to the competition.
Speaker 4 (38:46):
Oh well, we'll see how they handle some of the questions. Yeah, Emily,
and from our own end a little bit later, Bridie
Ford always great writing, great explaining. He love having on Meanwhile,
that does it for this edition of BlueBag Technology.
Speaker 7 (38:57):
Yet what an addition of BlueBag Technology was check out
the pod. Lots of chat about the pod all the time,
you know exactly where to find it. One day left
in this fantastic week. Keep with us from San Francisco
and New York. This is Bloomberg Technology,
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