March 12, 2025 • 41 mins
Bloomberg's Jackie Davalos and Sonali Basak discuss tech's market rebound amid Trump's tariff tensions. And, a look at Tesla's future as the company leads the S&P 500 as the biggest decliner so far this year. Plus, SpaceX's next mission: rescuing the two stranded astronauts.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
From the heart of where innovation, money and power collide
in Silicon Valley and beyond. This is Bloomberg Technology with
Caroline Hyde and Ed Ludlow.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Live from New York Opsinali Basic, and I'm Jackie Devalas
in Washington.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
This is Bloomberg Technology coming up.
Speaker 4 (00:37):
Stocks rebound after a positive inflation reading. The relief comes
after some market turmoil this week on the back of
President Trump's tariffs.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
Plus, we'll dive into what's.
Speaker 4 (00:47):
Behind the retreat from Musk's ev company, with Tesla being
the biggest decliner in the S and P five hundred
index this year, and SpaceX's Crew ten is launching this
evening for a relief mission for NASA astronauts at the
International Space Station. Let's get into some of these Intel
moves right away with Bloomberg's Mike Shephard. Mike, there's still
(01:10):
a lot we don't know about some of this report
coming from riders on Intel.
Speaker 3 (01:15):
Fill us in on what we do know.
Speaker 5 (01:17):
Well, one of the questions is really how much of
this would ultimately bear fruit. And we had reported about
a month ago now that the Trump administration had approached
TSMC to perhaps takeover Intel's foundry business That would be
a big undertaking, of course, given all the malays surrounding
Intel and some of the business complications therein. But it
(01:39):
also opened the door to perhaps working together with other companies,
and this report would certainly fit into that. However, more
recent events suggest a different direction of travel. Intel announced
this one hundred billion dollar additional investment in the US
a little more than a week ago with President Donald Trump,
and that's the kind of thing that doesn't seem to
(02:00):
include or leave room for Intel. Also, there are some
thorny problems involved here. One of them is intellectual property.
Would TSMC be willing to share some of its precious
trade secrets with a company that could, in other ways
also be arrival when it comes to its business. Likewise,
integrating some of Intel's operations into TSMC would also involve
(02:23):
a lot of work. So there's a lot of skepticisms
surrounding this report.
Speaker 6 (02:27):
We'll have to see what actually develops.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Mike, I want to bring in your broader view here,
of course, because you're seeing a market today that is
reacting to some of the relief relative to where we
were twenty four hours ago in the tariff story. Yet
you are seeing retaliatory tariffs coming in from around the world.
Looking at the EU and Canada, how are investors' markets
digesting the latest coming out of Washington and what is
(02:51):
still absolutely uncertain?
Speaker 5 (02:54):
Well, there is a lot of uncertainty, as you put
it earlier in the introm malaise. That really seems to
be one of the operative words right now when it
comes to investors, and especially in the tech sector. When
you look at the now is that one hundred It
really has taken the brunt of this downdraft and markets.
Obviously there was a lot of run up ahead of
(03:17):
time in the past year or so on enthusiasm about
artificial intelligence, and you know what goes up is now
coming down. But a lot of that is being fueled
by uncertainty surrounding the president's tariff policies. And last night
during a meeting with top CEOs here in Washington, he
signaled that they should be prepared for more. He sees
(03:37):
tariffs is a tool for getting companies to invest in
the US and he is cited in the past Apple's
decision to invest five hundred billion dollars year in the US,
and we just talked about TSMC's plans both of those
he credited to his own tariff policies.
Speaker 3 (03:53):
Let's talk a little bit more about that meeting. There
was a lot of anticipation.
Speaker 4 (03:56):
We saw chip stocks really take a beating last week,
but now they're getting a lot little bit of release.
Speaker 3 (04:00):
They're up by about one point six percent.
Speaker 4 (04:03):
What did we learn more from that meeting with tech
CEOs earlier?
Speaker 5 (04:08):
Well, the tech CEOs meeting a Monday seemed to be
less of a fireworks event, and then the business roundtable
meeting last night seemed to be a little bit more
of a a more cordial give and take, even given
the circumstances that we're seeing in the market and the
concerns that CEOs may have about where to take their
(04:29):
business in light if the way tariffs could affect their
supply chains. We heard Anthony Nary, the CEO, if you'll
look Packard Enterprises tell investors on a call last week, look,
we don't know where this is going exactly. There may
be some pricing changes. We're going to do the best
we can through our supply chain to minimize the impact,
(04:50):
but they really don't know where it's going. And that
was also echo by the head of Broadcam Broadcom hoked
in on a call with investors as well, suggesting that hey,
this is really your we don't know where this is.
Speaker 7 (05:01):
Going, Mike.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
We appreciate all your time and all your analysis. That
is Bloomberg's Mike Sheppard. Now I quickly want to check
in on shares of Tesla as well, because as Mike
was talking about a lot of malaise in the tech sector,
but not today, and Tesla is the one that's really
leading the Nasdaq one hundred higher. It is still up
more than five percent, but remember it was down fifteen
(05:22):
percent on Monday, So between Tuesday and Wednesday's gain, we
have not recouped all of those losses yet it sure
helps that it's up today for the broader Nasdaq one
hundred and to zoom out. Now we're going to bring
in Amanda Agatti. She is a CIO of P ANDC
Asset Management Group. You know, you think about what's happening
in the tech sector. Yes, today is a day of relief,
(05:42):
but the MAG seven, the relative underperformance that you have seen.
At what point do you see that overhang start to disappear? Really,
the only member of the MAG seven that is up
here to date is meta.
Speaker 8 (05:57):
That's right, it's great to be with you. Yeah, And
I would say that overhang is going to stick around
for a while here. The challenges that we're still very
much in a purple haze of fiscal policy uncertainty, and
it's namely a tariff and trade related policy, and so
it's not so much of a direct hit to the
underlying fundamentals of the MAG seven. In fact, I think
(06:19):
for the most part their business models tend to be
somewhat insulated from it. But the challenges that in this
purple haze of uncertainty, there's pretty extreme valuation, multiple compression,
and the MAG seven have been priced in your perfection.
So we're not seeing fundamentals deteriorate, We're just seeing multiples
come down materially until we start to get past some
(06:40):
of this growth scare narrative that's been gripping markets. I
think it's going to continue to be an overhang.
Speaker 3 (06:47):
Amanda.
Speaker 4 (06:47):
You mentioned fundamentals, they look strong. There was so much
reassurance from companies and appeased investors that a lot of
the capex going in isn't going to stop. That spig
is going to keep going. But are we bracing for
a more fragile tech sector. Now, what catalysts going forward
do you see kind of providing more assurance to investors
(07:11):
that they're not going to be that easy to break.
Speaker 8 (07:14):
It's it's a really great question, and it's a really
hard one to answer, and I think that's why tech
investors in particular are struggling in this environment, because we
are craving more catalysts. We're in a little bit of
a lull in terms of innovation, and so the focus
these last few years has really been on chips one
(07:34):
stock in particular. But where are all these use cases.
We need to see broader based use cases, new business
models really developing and broadening in terms of adoption across
the market. I think that's really the critical catalyst or
next step to this next wave of innovation and perhaps
even getting the market rally catalyzed again. So I think
(07:55):
it's going to take a little bit of time, given
some of this policy uncertainty, but I think it apps
Lily could become a tailwind in the second half of
this year and into twenty twenty six.
Speaker 6 (08:05):
It's just we're in.
Speaker 8 (08:06):
A little bit of a void at the moment, which
is very frustrating.
Speaker 6 (08:09):
Certainly you know, one.
Speaker 7 (08:10):
Interesting part of the tech trade as well.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
As just how much it has contributed to the weakness
in the consumer discretionary sector for the S and P
five hundred. You think about Amazon, you think about Tesla.
In reality, how levered are some of those giant tech
names to the US consumer and any potential further weakening.
Speaker 8 (08:32):
Well, I always say that the US consumers and the
driver's seed, right, seventy percent of GDP or you know,
spending in this consumption is tied is tied to the
consumer in some way, shape or form, and so the
path for the consumer and the health of the US
consumer is critical for all of us in terms of
both the market and the economic cycle. But I think
(08:53):
you're right to make a little bit of a distinction
here in terms of how much influence directly hits some
of those business models. I think the story and the
concern is much more around consumers start to get a
bit more paralyzed by this policy uncertainty, and so they
slow down or even stop spending, which sort of cascades
(09:13):
into a more material slowdown than what we're seeing. The
earnings growth backdrop is continuing to be strong. It's not
so much about one quarter. The full year expectation still
looks very strong. The economic cycle looks pretty strong, consumer
spending related data looks solid. So again, it's all about
the sort of narrative and this sentiment concern. It's not
(09:36):
so much translating into the underlying fundamentals breaking down yet.
Speaker 2 (09:40):
Now when you think about the consumer. Also, we're thinking
about the US consumer so much, and you have to
wonder whether Europe China is a bigger headwind or tailwind
for this group.
Speaker 7 (09:51):
Do you see any risk there?
Speaker 8 (09:55):
I'm most concerned. I think about developed international exposure, and
so Europe in p particular, just given some of the
continued geopolitical tensions and conflict. You know, are we going
to get a resolution out of Russia and Ukraine or not.
That's a really critical thing that I think needs to happen.
To see signs of life improve in a more material
(10:16):
way across the Eurozone. I think it is possible to
see a bit of a relief rally. We started to
get it at the beginning of the year, and then
we've seemingly seen it falter a bit here. So you know,
I am most concerned about that area. I think in
terms of emerging markets. More broadly, there's a really attractive
valuation opportunity there, so for investors who can be patient,
(10:40):
I think this is a very attractive entry point, even
in the midst of you know, additional tariff policy aims
specifically at China. I think there is a real opportunity
set there for investors to be focused on in terms
of allocating capital early this.
Speaker 4 (10:55):
Year, Amanda on that emerging market storage is a huge
competitor here in the tech space, Are you seeing any
interesting opportunities with some of those up and coming companies
unveiling new features and AI models every week, I could
give investors perhaps another choice outside of the traditional US
(11:17):
based tech players.
Speaker 8 (11:19):
Well, I'm never going to bet against our US tech
industry just as a general rule, I have a very
home country bias here. But of course, I mean, I
think innovation shows up in all different shapes and forms,
and so you know, even just what seemingly is old
news now, but the deep Seek story that sort of
(11:39):
came out of nowhere recently, I think is fascinating in
terms of this innovation story being born out of anywhere
and sort of this natural comparative or competitive advantage that
we have as it relates to AI, automation, robotics, et cetera.
The story continues, and so I think it's really healthy.
I think it's important for investors to think much bigger
(12:02):
and more holistically than just one or two names. This
cycle is very early innings. We have a long, long
runway here, and so we are absolutely believers in the
secular tailwinds here. And so from a multi asset investor perspective,
I think you really do have to look beyond US
equities in this environment, even in private markets. I think
(12:24):
there's a tremendous amount of opportunity in vcland we'll.
Speaker 4 (12:29):
Have you down as not betting against the US. Amanda
Agati from PNC Asset Management, thank you so much for
joining us. Coming up, Google deep Mind launches a new
branch of its AI model to help robots navigate the
physical world.
Speaker 3 (12:43):
We'll get the details after the break. This is Bloomberg.
Speaker 4 (12:59):
Google deep Mind has unveiled a new Gemini model that
it says helps robots understand the physical world around them.
Speaker 3 (13:07):
Bloomberg's Mark German joined us. Now. Mark, It seems like every.
Speaker 4 (13:11):
Big tech company has been unveiling some kind of new
robotics venture as of like, how does Google stack up?
Speaker 9 (13:18):
Yeah, I've been trying to tell everyone on here. Robotics.
Consumer robotics is the next big thing in the industry. Right,
we had autonomous cars, we had mixed reality AR glasses,
we have voice right, but artificial intelligence is going to
be at the core of everything. And really the ultimate
hardware expression of AI is robotics right, being able to
(13:41):
understand how a human acts right, artificially learn from data right,
and mimic a human, and that is what a robot is. Right.
And so you've seen Tesla play in this space. Now
you're seeing Meta make a big investment in that space.
And now today Google is announcing new Gemini models in
infrastructure specific to powering robots. So all of these companies
(14:05):
want to play in this space. Meta announced versions of
Lama right in a big investment to build consumer robots
and to be at the center of everything. Meta wants
to be the future operating system to power these robots.
But they're going to have a big competitor here with
Google right, who has experience building operating systems for first
party and third party hardware. And obviously Gemini is right
(14:27):
up there with Lama and CHADGBT and the other AI systems.
So this is a big deal not only for Google
but the industry at large.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
So mark how convincing is this push Because we have
seen Google try or Alphabet try to get into the
robot world before. I understand is that they shut down
a spinoff company that was associated with this. So this
time around, what's the difference and how big is the push?
Speaker 9 (14:52):
I think the difference this time is Gemini, Right. The
underlying AI technology is much different, It's much more advanced,
it's more reputable, right, and now appears to be the
time where companies are willing to put in the proper investment,
the necessary infrastructure to make robotics happen. Right. Waimo is
being has been pretty successful comparatively in the industry, and
(15:16):
so what you're seeing is a lot of data collection.
There a lot of experience in autonomy and cameras, and
that's technology that Google could ultimately use if it wanted
to build its own humanoid. But don't count out Apple.
Apple has Skunkworks teams. We're in humanoid robots as well.
The big difference is they're not going to publicly release
an underlying robotic model, right, in order to support third
(15:39):
party robots and other consumer hardware. They're going to go
all in house. They're going to follow the Tesla method
that you've seen from the Tesla bot over the past
couple of years. So at some point in the next
five to ten years, you're going to see real competition
between Google, Meta, Apple, Tesla, and Chinese companies and others
in consumer robots. So this is this is going to
(16:01):
be a really big deal. And some of those movies
we've seen over the last several decades, they're starting to
come to reality.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
Mark, We thank you so much for your time today
breaking it all down for us. That is Bloomberg's Mark German,
And as you know, I'm excited about having a robot
at home, and we're going to talk more about robots here.
Not as pleasant as a story shares of consumer robotics
company I Robot. They're sliding today after it warned of
quote substantial doubt over.
Speaker 7 (16:28):
Its ability to continue to operate.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
You might remember that the company was once sought after
by Amazon for more than a billion dollars and it
has begun a foremost strategic of you to evaluate options
for more Bloomberg's Vanagasia Perez joins us now on set.
Was this warning a surprise, especially given the kind of
unicorn standing that it once had, and not totally.
Speaker 10 (16:50):
The company has been losing money and burning cash for
the you know, the past at least three years, and
then when the Amazon deal fail basically last year, the
company lost a big option. It started a strategic review
last year. It has cut losses, but it's still loss making,
(17:14):
and it has cut expenses, but it's still struggling.
Speaker 4 (17:19):
What does this tell us about the state of consumer
demand in this space? As we were hearing it seems
like the time horizon for some of these technologies to
really get in the hands of consumers takes time, especially
for those to get used to them.
Speaker 3 (17:35):
What does this tell us?
Speaker 10 (17:37):
So in the case of this company, I guess it's
another example of consumers cutting on discretionary spending. We've seen
it in other names like casual lining companies like Hooters
considering bankruptcy filing. We've seen it in a broad range
of retailers also struggling. So this is another example. And
(17:59):
the company mentioned in the going concern warning that consumer
spending could be one of the reasons why. Like weaker
consumer spending could be one of the reasons why it
doesn't manage to survive, and tariffs was another one that
they mentioned as a potential threat to the company's viability.
Speaker 4 (18:18):
Tariff's winging in here as well. Bloomberg'sidna Garcia Perez, thank
you so much for joining us.
Speaker 2 (18:31):
Now, some long term Tesla investors are backing away from
the stock after falling as much as forty two percent
so far this year, and this is as questions arise
about the company's future. For more of Bloomberg's Max Chaffin
joins us today.
Speaker 7 (18:45):
Now I want to point.
Speaker 2 (18:46):
Out also, of course today people are buying the dips,
people are believing the story. Today you have the president
himself looking to defend Musk in many ways.
Speaker 7 (18:56):
What is the trouble in Paradise?
Speaker 11 (18:58):
I mean more than defend, you know, wholding a sales
event on the White House lawn. The trouble is that
Tesla's customer base is not especially trumpy, and that's probably
an understatement. You think of a typical Tesla owner, this
is like an upper middle class, suburban progressive, or at
least a centrist, somebody who cares about the environment.
Speaker 6 (19:19):
You know, these are not Trump voters. These are very.
Speaker 11 (19:23):
Much the constituency that backed Barack Obama, Joe Biden, and
to a large extent, Kamala Harris, and those people, which
include a lot of Tesla customers, are very mad at
Elon Musk right now. We've seen protests all across the
country and the world, including some you know, acts of vandalism,
and just this kind of tone of mockery of you know,
(19:44):
seeing Elon Musk as kind of a lightning rod for
the worst for what these people, these Tesla customers see
as the worst excesses of the Trump administration so far.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
Max.
Speaker 4 (19:56):
And it's not just about the political leanings of who's
buying some of those cars, but they've recently gotten some
pretty good support, especially under the Abiden administration, for ev credits.
And I'm having trouble reconciling how Elon Musk can really
back Trump in some ways, but his company is somewhat
dependent on the government also supporting the transition to electric vehicles.
Speaker 3 (20:19):
How is that working out?
Speaker 11 (20:20):
Yeah, you know, Trump kind of ran to some extent
as an opponent of electric vehicles, talking constantly about ending
the quote unquote electric vehicle mandate, you know, and in
fact sign an executive order early on stating an attention
to pull back some of these regulations. Even brought this
up during the event yesterday, showing offering it as an
(20:41):
example of how selfless Musk is.
Speaker 6 (20:43):
I think from the kind.
Speaker 11 (20:44):
Of bull perspective, like why Tesla investors could be potentially
okay with this is the fact that Tesla has a
leading market position. So if you remove these subsidies subsidies
from electric cars, it arguably hurts GM and Ford and Tesla's.
Speaker 7 (20:59):
Other copetitors more than it hurts Tesla.
Speaker 11 (21:01):
Tesla has wider margins on evs, it's able to better
absorb this. Now that said, those companies are bringing out
new models and they're stealing customers away from Tesla.
Speaker 7 (21:11):
Right.
Speaker 3 (21:12):
That's Bloomberg'smax Taffkin, Thanks so much for joining.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
Us, and welcome back to Bloomberg Technology.
Speaker 7 (21:25):
I'm Shanalie Bask in New York.
Speaker 3 (21:27):
And I'm Jackie Devalis in Washington.
Speaker 2 (21:29):
It's got to check on these markets because you do
have a NAZAQ one hundred that has been fluctuating. We
are well off of session lows for the morning, but
only up now about six tenths of one percent, and
it's trying to fight for dominance. You have the NAZAQ
one hundred with only roughly half of its component parts
up on the day, the other half of course down
the Philadelphia A Semicconductor Index maintaining its lead after a
(21:52):
brutal stretch the last couple of weeks. It is now
up about two point three percent heading into midday, and
on other movers. This morning, we're going to bring in
Bloomberg's Isabelle Lee who joins us now on set Haitianali.
Speaker 12 (22:06):
So there's really a ton of uncertainty in the markets
right now. A gauged by city shifted from risk off
to risk on, risk on to risk off rather in
just six weeks, and really just as liew of headlines
crossing the wire this morning from Canada firing back on
TIFFs to inflation is really causing some more acts. So
back to inflation, that's a big data today. It showed
some signs of easing, but even so economists are anticipating
(22:27):
that the escalating trade war will really just drive up prices,
and you see waves of selling even in tech high flyers,
so Tesla, super Micro and Palan there for instance, have
wiped out more than a quarter of their value in
the last fourteen trading sessions since they peak, so their
losses are more than triple the decline of the S ANDP.
So really a tough market right now, and of course
an ass like one hundred tumbled into correction territory last week.
Speaker 4 (22:49):
Isabelle talk to us about what we're seeing in some
of those MAGS seven names you mentioned Tesla seeing some relief.
What else are we seeing when it comes to the
big tech giants that absolutely got battered.
Speaker 12 (22:59):
Earlier this week, they're still really better. Tesla is leading
the Lasses and the Magnificent seven index, and you see
the rally broadening out, and there are the losers right now.
In fact, a note earlier this morning says maleficent seven,
and you see that people are now questioning whether the
US exceptionalism has cracks. We have Citygroup and HSBC downgrading
their views on US equities this week. I talked to
(23:19):
a bank yesterday and they said that they're underweight Magnificent seven,
which is really a star contrast to when everyone was
just piling in, because if you don't pile in, then
you underperform the benchmark. But we have JP Morgan David Lebowitz,
which I talked to yesterday, said that, you know, risk
premiums have jump, credit market has yet to crack. Economic
data at least for now, points to expansion, so bullish
(23:40):
overall in the long term.
Speaker 4 (23:42):
That's Bloomberg's Isabelle, thank you so much for joining us.
Two astronauts stranded at the International Space Station since arriving
aboard Boeing Starliner in June could finally be heading home.
That's part of the goal for the SpaceX crew. Ten
missions scheduled to launch later today. Joining us to talk
about this is Clayton Swoke. He's Deputy director of the
(24:05):
Aerospace Security Project and a senior fellow at the Center
for Strategic and International Studies.
Speaker 3 (24:11):
Clayton, this is a really big moment.
Speaker 4 (24:13):
Everyone has really become so endeared to Sunny and Butch.
Speaker 3 (24:18):
What did this tell us about what went wrong? And
will this ever happen again?
Speaker 6 (24:23):
Well, Jackie, it's funny.
Speaker 3 (24:24):
I was thinking too.
Speaker 13 (24:25):
The one thing that I have as a takeaway is
just it's about Sunny and Butch and just their endurance
and their patients and their grace, and.
Speaker 3 (24:34):
It's something that I think back on.
Speaker 6 (24:35):
I think I admire that.
Speaker 13 (24:36):
I'm sure a lot of Americans admire that, and people
around the world and probably you like me, I get
up to that when I'm three hours late at the
airport and they've been there since June, so it's a
very different thing to think how long that they've been
up there and everything that they've been through, But they've
had that poise throughout. I think what we've learned too
is that space really can still throw us curveballs, but
(24:57):
that we have gotten to the point where we have
flexibility and adaptability that we can still do human space
fight safely and do that at scale. And that's a
lot of credit to NASA on the approach that they've
taken to get us here, and then also to SpaceX
on whose technology we really relied on to make this happen.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
How do you think about the next apps moving forward
when it comes to the star Liner? What do you
think is the future from here?
Speaker 13 (25:22):
Well, there's still a lot of things that we don't know.
We do know that Boeing has said they want to
stay in the space game. It's less clear on what
happens next for Starliner specifically. That will depend a lot
on what NASA decides with Boeing about certifying that capsule
to fly astronauts again into space.
Speaker 3 (25:40):
So we don't really know how long that would take.
Speaker 13 (25:42):
But if we look to the horizon, just with the
International Space Station, we're planning for it to deorbit in
twenty thirty, so that's less than five years away. So
there's really only a few more opportunities really in the
grand scheme to bring astronauts to that station, and that
window is quickly closing.
Speaker 3 (25:58):
There's been a lot.
Speaker 4 (25:59):
Going on in this space field as of late, and
I think it has many people wondering are we in
a new space race of some kind? How does the
US stack up with what we're doing in the field
versus other countries.
Speaker 13 (26:12):
It's really hard to not think about China and all
their achievements in space. Right now, there's seven astronauts and
cosmonauts on the International Space Station.
Speaker 2 (26:21):
All that thought for a moment here, because we want
to bring our audience some live images of President Trump
who is greeting the Prime Minister of Ireland.
Speaker 7 (26:30):
The two men are about to take part in.
Speaker 2 (26:32):
A bilateral meeting at the Oval Office. Now we will
bring you those headlines as they come in. You could
also check for updates on live go on your Bloomberg terminal. Now, Jackie,
back to you.
Speaker 4 (26:47):
Talk to us more about how China is really getting
to the space race.
Speaker 13 (26:51):
Yeah, there's three Chinese astronauts on their space station Tiangong
THII right now as we speak. So they've really made
space look routine in a lot of ways that has
also been able to do. They're also eyeing the Moon.
They want to land Chinese astronauts on the Moon by
twenty thirty, so is NASA. I think it's hard to
avoid the notion that this is a space race, maybe
a moon race.
Speaker 6 (27:11):
Two point zero.
Speaker 13 (27:12):
The United States is still the undeniable space power, lead
space power in the world, but China is definitely nipping
at our heels.
Speaker 4 (27:18):
Let's talk about who's making us the space power. We
hear a lot about SpaceX, but over in Silicon Valley
there's a lot of contenders really coming into the four
as well. What are you seeing in terms of concentration
of who's taking us to the next level.
Speaker 13 (27:32):
SpaceX is the main player right now when it comes
to launch, when it comes to broadband from lower thorbit,
when it comes to a lot of the things that
we rely on to get people and cargo to.
Speaker 6 (27:41):
The space station.
Speaker 13 (27:42):
But there are a lot of other companies that are
innovating in Silicon Valley and around the country. You have
companies in Pittsburgh and Texas and Florida. They're trying to
catch up and come up with new ways to do space,
to do it cheaper, to do it more efficiently, to
mine asteroids. Even so, there are a lot of up
and comers that really will challenge SpaceX's dominance, and it
will be their game to lose the overtime because there's
(28:02):
a lot of smart people though right behind them.
Speaker 4 (28:05):
Let's talk a little bit about who's behind SpaceX because
Elon Musk has been making waves here in Washington for
other reasons, but one of the areas that he's poised
to potentially benefit from are his relationships in Washington SpaceX
potentially getting more contracts. Does his politics detract in any
way from the progress that SpaceX can make or does
(28:26):
it really operate independently of that.
Speaker 13 (28:29):
SpaceX has led the way for what we call commercial
space today, and it has taken a number of years
for them to get to where they are. This isn't
something that just happened with President Trump's inauguration in January.
This has been a long trend where NASA, the Department
of Defense, and other customers both commercially and internationally have
really grown to depend on SpaceX for launch and then
now for broadband from space. So these are areas that
(28:51):
have been trending to that direction for a long time.
Those business opportunities that exist in space SpaceX built over
the last few years, probably around twenty two thousand and eight,
so it's not something new, and they're just really taking
advantage of all of that time and effort that they
put into this for almost seven to eight years at
this point.
Speaker 7 (29:10):
Clayton, we thank you for joining us.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
Of course, fascinating establishments in that space race. That is
Clayton Swope from the Center for Strategic and International Studies.
Speaker 4 (29:29):
Startup Celestial AI has raised two hundred and fifty million
dollars in its latest Series C round, valuing the company
at two point five billion dollars. It's photonic fabric technology
aims to improve speed and efficiency in AI computing. For
more on this, Dave Lozowski joins us. Now, Dave, help
(29:49):
our views understand how your technology is actually making this
part of AI computing that much more efficient.
Speaker 6 (29:58):
Thanks so much for having me.
Speaker 14 (30:00):
Yeah, Celestilia is the creators of the photonic fabric, as
you'd mentioned, which is the optical interconnectivity technology platform for
accelerated computing. So set another way, we're interconnecting AI processors
with light. What's happening in AI right now is that
artificial intelligence workloads are growing exponentially. They're now so large
(30:21):
trillions of parameters that they need to be partitioned over
hundreds of processors, which puts more and more demands on
the network as the processor doing the work needs to
move across the network to fetch information from another processor's memory,
moving back to where the work gets done, and there's
no more efficient way to move information than photonically.
Speaker 4 (30:45):
Dave, you managed to snag two hundred and fifty million
dollars from some institutional investors by the likes of Fidelity, Tiger, Blackrock,
Maverick Capital.
Speaker 3 (30:54):
How do you plan to put this money to use?
Speaker 6 (30:58):
Yeah, we're focused right now on scaling.
Speaker 14 (31:00):
So we have multiple deep collaborative development engagements with the
largest hyperscale data center companies on Earth. Right now, we're
collaborating with them to integrate our photonic fabric technology into
their next generation AI accelerators. These are programs that are
on the order of eighteen months, so through the balance
(31:23):
of twenty twenty five and into the first half of
next year, we're working together to get this technology scaled
and qualified.
Speaker 6 (31:32):
So right now the focus is.
Speaker 14 (31:33):
On our volume manufacturing supply chain because our customers are
immense scale. They require hundreds of thousands of units to
serve their demand.
Speaker 7 (31:43):
You know, Dave back to the fundraising question as well.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
Not only do you have kind of like the blue
chip of finance involved in this round, Fidelity, black Rock,
but the Mavericks and Tiger part of this. It's interesting
when you have those traditional hedge funds getting in.
Speaker 7 (31:58):
They have been cautious in the.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
World of startups, especially with a dearth of public market exits.
So bring us behind a conversation what is it about you?
And then that served as a good match.
Speaker 14 (32:11):
Yeah, So we took a hard look at the types
of investors that we wanted to have involved at this
stage in the company's life cycle. So just as you
develop a technology for successful qualification and implementation in a
large market like artificial intelligence, we are developing and optimizing
(32:32):
our cap table for having the rights investors involved, not
just at this phase in the company's life cycle.
Speaker 6 (32:39):
But through an IPO.
Speaker 14 (32:41):
Should we make the decision to take the company public
over the course the next few years and to have
the right investors that can invest with us over the
course of the next decade or more so on their ends.
The decision, I think was made based on the fact
that we are the only company in existence that has
the ability to provide optically interconnectivity that meets the requirements
(33:02):
of what are called scale up networks. This is a
processor to processor interconnect The gold standard today is in
Vidia with Envy Link and in v Switch.
Speaker 6 (33:13):
All of that is run over copper.
Speaker 14 (33:15):
So data communication today between processors at in Nvidia and
elsewhere throughout the industry today is entirely electronically over copper.
Speaker 6 (33:24):
With the photonic fabric, we are.
Speaker 14 (33:26):
Changing that, right, We're moving information optically at a fraction
of the energy and at much higher bandwidth and lower latency.
Speaker 7 (33:34):
You know.
Speaker 2 (33:35):
An interesting part of your cap table also that I've noticed,
and this is an existing.
Speaker 7 (33:39):
Investor, is Porsche.
Speaker 2 (33:41):
And with all that's going on in the world, worries
about the consumer, worries about international trade, auto parts also
facing risks of tariffs. I'm wondering what role you play
in the automobile story. Have they led to meaningful work
with you as an investor?
Speaker 14 (34:00):
Two different branches of Porsche. There's Porchia AG, which is
the automotive group, which we all know and love. That's
my favorite at brand, by the way. And there's Porsche ESI,
which is the mothership that it's the holding company for
all of the Porsche's family money as well as they
control about fifty.
Speaker 6 (34:17):
Percent of the assets of the Volkswaking Group. So this
is the.
Speaker 14 (34:20):
Financial arm of Porsche. Now Portia can and certainly we
anticipate will be a strategic partner for us as well
on the automotive group side, as their requirements for artificial
intelligence training and inference will be similar to that of Tesla,
who has played kind of a leading role early on
(34:41):
in building out AI infrastructure and support of autonomous vehicles.
Speaker 4 (34:46):
Dave, how do you think about kind of diversifying your
customer base. You noted that your target clientele those effectively
control more than ninety percent of the trillion dollar end market.
Do you get to spand past that as the company
grows or are you more dependent on those select few.
Speaker 14 (35:06):
Well, like you just said that those select few represent
you know, there's eight companies that represent roughly ninety percent
of this trillion dollar market, and we'd be fine with
just those, right, So, if you think about it, that's
a good problem for us to have. And you've got
four major hyperscalers, you know, I think the world knows
who they are that represent roughly seventy percent of.
Speaker 6 (35:24):
The addressable in market.
Speaker 14 (35:26):
And then you have the ecosystem around them, right, the
GPU manufacturers which include Nvidia and AMD, AIMD by the way,
being one of our strategic investors as well. And then
there are a couple of design services companies which include Broadcomics. Right,
so Broadcom is playing a larger role. I think you've
heard from their earnings announcement over the last week and
a half that they're gaining traction and building custom silicon
(35:49):
for the hyperscalers.
Speaker 2 (35:51):
Dave, we thank you so much for your time today.
Congratulations on that fundraise. We are looking forward to seeing where.
Speaker 7 (35:56):
It all goes.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
That is Dave Lozowski of Celestial Ai. Now, another AI
story that we're watching, Ali Baba is accelerating its efforts
to lead in the AI space and they're pushing out
an AI model that.
Speaker 7 (36:09):
Can read emotions for more.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
Bloomberg's Peter Elstrom joins us now and I think just
back to a couple of days ago, I tried so
hard to read this story that Sam Altman posted online
about the creative writing exercise that you saw through Open AI,
and that does go down to the ability to read
beyond the objective and then to be subjective. Right, And
(36:35):
so when you think about Ali Baba, how successful are
they in emotional intelligence.
Speaker 15 (36:41):
We're seeing this very rapid innovation of AI models really
around the world, but China now particularly has gained a
lot of attention because of the breakthrough of deep Seek
a few weeks ago. Ali Baba is, course of course,
best known for its e commerce business. It competes with
Amazon in that market. But of late the past couple
of months, they've come out with an number of AI
models that are quite innovative. They have one called Gwen
(37:03):
that it compared with deep Seek and said that it
was ahead on certain metrics. They're also striking an alliance
with Apple to be able to provide some of the
AI features for the iPhones within China.
Speaker 3 (37:14):
And now we see this.
Speaker 15 (37:15):
The model is called R one omni. They're saying it's
able to detect emotions within the people were asking questions
and give better answers. Because of that, they can customize
in certain ways. Now this fair follows very rapidly on
the heels of open Ai, which has tried something like
this with their GPT four point five. Now open Ai
(37:35):
is charging two hundred dollars a month for that service,
and here Alibab is putting this out there for free.
It doesn't have all the bells and whistles that you
would see in some other models, but it's a pretty
aggressive move into this space, and the China market is
not one where you're going to see the American companies play.
So it's a pretty far step ahead for Ali Baba.
Speaker 4 (37:53):
Peter, we have about thirty seconds left, but talk to
us about how this now stacks Ali Baba up again
to some of the players here in the US. Is
it really going to depend on things like emotional intelligence?
Speaker 15 (38:06):
Well, it's important to understand how bifurcated these markets are.
The Western companies can't get into China. These Chinese companies
are largely not competing outside of their own market at
this point. So they're pretty separate at this point. But
I think what's been surprising to a lot of observers
is how quickly some of these Chinese companies have been
able to evolve their AI models, especially because they're cut
off from the most advanced chips. You're talking before about
(38:28):
the Nvidia chips that are used to train these AI models.
Most of the Chinese companies can no longer buy those
from the Western world, so they're doing this with some
pretty hardcore engineering. Deep Seak in particular show that they
could make some advances that would be very difficult in
the Western world. That's partly because of the constraints they
have on the chip side.
Speaker 2 (38:46):
Peter, we thank you so much for all of your reporting.
That is Bloomberg's Peter Alstrom and Jackie. Something I've been
thinking about that is interesting about this emotional intelligence aspect
of things is if you believe that leadership needs EQ,
maybe AI can be your next boss.
Speaker 3 (39:03):
Yeah, let's hope not.
Speaker 4 (39:04):
I don't know about you, but I wouldn't want a
giving me my evel if you know what I mean,
right or raise?
Speaker 7 (39:10):
Anyways, is coming up next?
Speaker 2 (39:12):
Remember, speaking of big companies, we are coming out with
Adobe earnings after the closing bell.
Speaker 7 (39:18):
It is held up.
Speaker 2 (39:19):
Relatively well in the tech malaise we've seen through the
broader market.
Speaker 7 (39:22):
We're gonna take a look at what to expect next.
This is Bloomberg.
Speaker 2 (39:32):
Adobe earnings are out after the closing bell, and we're
going to bring in now Anu Ragrana of Bloomberg Intelligence
for a look at what to expect. It's interesting because
Adobe has held up relatively well relative to a lot
of those magneticuden Officient seven names, relative to what you've
seen in a lot of the Philadelphia Semiconductor Index. Is
there a story something to buy right now or are
(39:54):
there real risks after the market today?
Speaker 6 (39:56):
So sure, Naaliban, you look at it.
Speaker 16 (39:58):
Adobe's probably the cheapest large cap software stock right now,
much cheaper than any of its peers, and there is
a reason behind it because it is also the most
controversial one right now. They have a huge segment, one
of the most profitable businesses in the world, their photoshop
creative business, which is under threat or perceived threat by
a lot of open source models out there now. The
(40:21):
company has guided to their annual recurring revenue for their
digital media segment to go up by eleven percent. That's
the only number we are looking for when they report,
because any kind of disturbance and that number on the
downside really is not going to be good for the stock.
But meanwhile, if they are able to hold onto it
or even raise it, I think that's going to be
(40:41):
perceived very well. So that is really something different that's
happening from a macroside right now.
Speaker 2 (40:48):
ANURRAD thank you so very much for your time. That
is ANURAG run of Bloomberg Intelligence. We are looking forward.
Speaker 7 (40:53):
To your readout after they report.
Speaker 2 (40:56):
To your point, very controversial at the moment, and we
are hitting that tail end of earning season, and of
course as we hit that tail end, we are also
keeping an eye on these markets for you as before
we let you go, because we are looking at that
Nasdaq one hundred trying to maintain those gains for the day.
It has been a volatile morning, but we are back
up to one percent worth of gains on that Nasdaq
(41:18):
one hundred. Really the leaderboard here, the Russell two thousand
losing its gains though on the day, and the S
and P five hundred up but less than you're seeing.
Speaker 7 (41:26):
In big tech.
Speaker 2 (41:27):
The semiconductor is getting some relief, a nearly three percent
rise now at two point eight percent, and you're looking at.
Speaker 7 (41:34):
That big come back into the market.
Speaker 2 (41:36):
The dip buyers are on the sidelines and hopping back in.
That does it for Bloomberg Technology though today. Don't forget
to check out our podcast. You could find it on
the terminal and on Apple, Spotify and iHeart this is
Bloomberg
From the heart of where innovation, money and power collide
in Silicon Valley and beyond. This is Bloomberg Technology with
Caroline Hyde and Ed Ludlow.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Live from New York Opsinali Basic, and I'm Jackie Devalas
in Washington.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
This is Bloomberg Technology coming up.
Speaker 4 (00:37):
Stocks rebound after a positive inflation reading. The relief comes
after some market turmoil this week on the back of
President Trump's tariffs.
Speaker 3 (00:46):
Plus, we'll dive into what's.
Speaker 4 (00:47):
Behind the retreat from Musk's ev company, with Tesla being
the biggest decliner in the S and P five hundred
index this year, and SpaceX's Crew ten is launching this
evening for a relief mission for NASA astronauts at the
International Space Station. Let's get into some of these Intel
moves right away with Bloomberg's Mike Shephard. Mike, there's still
(01:10):
a lot we don't know about some of this report
coming from riders on Intel.
Speaker 3 (01:15):
Fill us in on what we do know.
Speaker 5 (01:17):
Well, one of the questions is really how much of
this would ultimately bear fruit. And we had reported about
a month ago now that the Trump administration had approached
TSMC to perhaps takeover Intel's foundry business That would be
a big undertaking, of course, given all the malays surrounding
Intel and some of the business complications therein. But it
(01:39):
also opened the door to perhaps working together with other companies,
and this report would certainly fit into that. However, more
recent events suggest a different direction of travel. Intel announced
this one hundred billion dollar additional investment in the US
a little more than a week ago with President Donald Trump,
and that's the kind of thing that doesn't seem to
(02:00):
include or leave room for Intel. Also, there are some
thorny problems involved here. One of them is intellectual property.
Would TSMC be willing to share some of its precious
trade secrets with a company that could, in other ways
also be arrival when it comes to its business. Likewise,
integrating some of Intel's operations into TSMC would also involve
(02:23):
a lot of work. So there's a lot of skepticisms
surrounding this report.
Speaker 6 (02:27):
We'll have to see what actually develops.
Speaker 2 (02:29):
Mike, I want to bring in your broader view here,
of course, because you're seeing a market today that is
reacting to some of the relief relative to where we
were twenty four hours ago in the tariff story. Yet
you are seeing retaliatory tariffs coming in from around the world.
Looking at the EU and Canada, how are investors' markets
digesting the latest coming out of Washington and what is
(02:51):
still absolutely uncertain?
Speaker 5 (02:54):
Well, there is a lot of uncertainty, as you put
it earlier in the introm malaise. That really seems to
be one of the operative words right now when it
comes to investors, and especially in the tech sector. When
you look at the now is that one hundred It
really has taken the brunt of this downdraft and markets.
Obviously there was a lot of run up ahead of
(03:17):
time in the past year or so on enthusiasm about
artificial intelligence, and you know what goes up is now
coming down. But a lot of that is being fueled
by uncertainty surrounding the president's tariff policies. And last night
during a meeting with top CEOs here in Washington, he
signaled that they should be prepared for more. He sees
(03:37):
tariffs is a tool for getting companies to invest in
the US and he is cited in the past Apple's
decision to invest five hundred billion dollars year in the US,
and we just talked about TSMC's plans both of those
he credited to his own tariff policies.
Speaker 3 (03:53):
Let's talk a little bit more about that meeting. There
was a lot of anticipation.
Speaker 4 (03:56):
We saw chip stocks really take a beating last week,
but now they're getting a lot little bit of release.
Speaker 3 (04:00):
They're up by about one point six percent.
Speaker 4 (04:03):
What did we learn more from that meeting with tech
CEOs earlier?
Speaker 5 (04:08):
Well, the tech CEOs meeting a Monday seemed to be
less of a fireworks event, and then the business roundtable
meeting last night seemed to be a little bit more
of a a more cordial give and take, even given
the circumstances that we're seeing in the market and the
concerns that CEOs may have about where to take their
(04:29):
business in light if the way tariffs could affect their
supply chains. We heard Anthony Nary, the CEO, if you'll
look Packard Enterprises tell investors on a call last week, look,
we don't know where this is going exactly. There may
be some pricing changes. We're going to do the best
we can through our supply chain to minimize the impact,
(04:50):
but they really don't know where it's going. And that
was also echo by the head of Broadcam Broadcom hoked
in on a call with investors as well, suggesting that hey,
this is really your we don't know where this is.
Speaker 7 (05:01):
Going, Mike.
Speaker 2 (05:02):
We appreciate all your time and all your analysis. That
is Bloomberg's Mike Sheppard. Now I quickly want to check
in on shares of Tesla as well, because as Mike
was talking about a lot of malaise in the tech sector,
but not today, and Tesla is the one that's really
leading the Nasdaq one hundred higher. It is still up
more than five percent, but remember it was down fifteen
(05:22):
percent on Monday, So between Tuesday and Wednesday's gain, we
have not recouped all of those losses yet it sure
helps that it's up today for the broader Nasdaq one
hundred and to zoom out. Now we're going to bring
in Amanda Agatti. She is a CIO of P ANDC
Asset Management Group. You know, you think about what's happening
in the tech sector. Yes, today is a day of relief,
(05:42):
but the MAG seven, the relative underperformance that you have seen.
At what point do you see that overhang start to disappear? Really,
the only member of the MAG seven that is up
here to date is meta.
Speaker 8 (05:57):
That's right, it's great to be with you. Yeah, And
I would say that overhang is going to stick around
for a while here. The challenges that we're still very
much in a purple haze of fiscal policy uncertainty, and
it's namely a tariff and trade related policy, and so
it's not so much of a direct hit to the
underlying fundamentals of the MAG seven. In fact, I think
(06:19):
for the most part their business models tend to be
somewhat insulated from it. But the challenges that in this
purple haze of uncertainty, there's pretty extreme valuation, multiple compression,
and the MAG seven have been priced in your perfection.
So we're not seeing fundamentals deteriorate, We're just seeing multiples
come down materially until we start to get past some
(06:40):
of this growth scare narrative that's been gripping markets. I
think it's going to continue to be an overhang.
Speaker 3 (06:47):
Amanda.
Speaker 4 (06:47):
You mentioned fundamentals, they look strong. There was so much
reassurance from companies and appeased investors that a lot of
the capex going in isn't going to stop. That spig
is going to keep going. But are we bracing for
a more fragile tech sector. Now, what catalysts going forward
do you see kind of providing more assurance to investors
(07:11):
that they're not going to be that easy to break.
Speaker 8 (07:14):
It's it's a really great question, and it's a really
hard one to answer, and I think that's why tech
investors in particular are struggling in this environment, because we
are craving more catalysts. We're in a little bit of
a lull in terms of innovation, and so the focus
these last few years has really been on chips one
(07:34):
stock in particular. But where are all these use cases.
We need to see broader based use cases, new business
models really developing and broadening in terms of adoption across
the market. I think that's really the critical catalyst or
next step to this next wave of innovation and perhaps
even getting the market rally catalyzed again. So I think
(07:55):
it's going to take a little bit of time, given
some of this policy uncertainty, but I think it apps
Lily could become a tailwind in the second half of
this year and into twenty twenty six.
Speaker 6 (08:05):
It's just we're in.
Speaker 8 (08:06):
A little bit of a void at the moment, which
is very frustrating.
Speaker 6 (08:09):
Certainly you know, one.
Speaker 7 (08:10):
Interesting part of the tech trade as well.
Speaker 2 (08:12):
As just how much it has contributed to the weakness
in the consumer discretionary sector for the S and P
five hundred. You think about Amazon, you think about Tesla.
In reality, how levered are some of those giant tech
names to the US consumer and any potential further weakening.
Speaker 8 (08:32):
Well, I always say that the US consumers and the
driver's seed, right, seventy percent of GDP or you know,
spending in this consumption is tied is tied to the
consumer in some way, shape or form, and so the
path for the consumer and the health of the US
consumer is critical for all of us in terms of
both the market and the economic cycle. But I think
(08:53):
you're right to make a little bit of a distinction
here in terms of how much influence directly hits some
of those business models. I think the story and the
concern is much more around consumers start to get a
bit more paralyzed by this policy uncertainty, and so they
slow down or even stop spending, which sort of cascades
(09:13):
into a more material slowdown than what we're seeing. The
earnings growth backdrop is continuing to be strong. It's not
so much about one quarter. The full year expectation still
looks very strong. The economic cycle looks pretty strong, consumer
spending related data looks solid. So again, it's all about
the sort of narrative and this sentiment concern. It's not
(09:36):
so much translating into the underlying fundamentals breaking down yet.
Speaker 2 (09:40):
Now when you think about the consumer. Also, we're thinking
about the US consumer so much, and you have to
wonder whether Europe China is a bigger headwind or tailwind
for this group.
Speaker 7 (09:51):
Do you see any risk there?
Speaker 8 (09:55):
I'm most concerned. I think about developed international exposure, and
so Europe in p particular, just given some of the
continued geopolitical tensions and conflict. You know, are we going
to get a resolution out of Russia and Ukraine or not.
That's a really critical thing that I think needs to happen.
To see signs of life improve in a more material
(10:16):
way across the Eurozone. I think it is possible to
see a bit of a relief rally. We started to
get it at the beginning of the year, and then
we've seemingly seen it falter a bit here. So you know,
I am most concerned about that area. I think in
terms of emerging markets. More broadly, there's a really attractive
valuation opportunity there, so for investors who can be patient,
(10:40):
I think this is a very attractive entry point, even
in the midst of you know, additional tariff policy aims
specifically at China. I think there is a real opportunity
set there for investors to be focused on in terms
of allocating capital early this.
Speaker 4 (10:55):
Year, Amanda on that emerging market storage is a huge
competitor here in the tech space, Are you seeing any
interesting opportunities with some of those up and coming companies
unveiling new features and AI models every week, I could
give investors perhaps another choice outside of the traditional US
(11:17):
based tech players.
Speaker 8 (11:19):
Well, I'm never going to bet against our US tech
industry just as a general rule, I have a very
home country bias here. But of course, I mean, I
think innovation shows up in all different shapes and forms,
and so you know, even just what seemingly is old
news now, but the deep Seek story that sort of
(11:39):
came out of nowhere recently, I think is fascinating in
terms of this innovation story being born out of anywhere
and sort of this natural comparative or competitive advantage that
we have as it relates to AI, automation, robotics, et cetera.
The story continues, and so I think it's really healthy.
I think it's important for investors to think much bigger
(12:02):
and more holistically than just one or two names. This
cycle is very early innings. We have a long, long
runway here, and so we are absolutely believers in the
secular tailwinds here. And so from a multi asset investor perspective,
I think you really do have to look beyond US
equities in this environment, even in private markets. I think
(12:24):
there's a tremendous amount of opportunity in vcland we'll.
Speaker 4 (12:29):
Have you down as not betting against the US. Amanda
Agati from PNC Asset Management, thank you so much for
joining us. Coming up, Google deep Mind launches a new
branch of its AI model to help robots navigate the
physical world.
Speaker 3 (12:43):
We'll get the details after the break. This is Bloomberg.
Speaker 4 (12:59):
Google deep Mind has unveiled a new Gemini model that
it says helps robots understand the physical world around them.
Speaker 3 (13:07):
Bloomberg's Mark German joined us. Now. Mark, It seems like every.
Speaker 4 (13:11):
Big tech company has been unveiling some kind of new
robotics venture as of like, how does Google stack up?
Speaker 9 (13:18):
Yeah, I've been trying to tell everyone on here. Robotics.
Consumer robotics is the next big thing in the industry. Right,
we had autonomous cars, we had mixed reality AR glasses,
we have voice right, but artificial intelligence is going to
be at the core of everything. And really the ultimate
hardware expression of AI is robotics right, being able to
(13:41):
understand how a human acts right, artificially learn from data right,
and mimic a human, and that is what a robot is. Right.
And so you've seen Tesla play in this space. Now
you're seeing Meta make a big investment in that space.
And now today Google is announcing new Gemini models in
infrastructure specific to powering robots. So all of these companies
(14:05):
want to play in this space. Meta announced versions of
Lama right in a big investment to build consumer robots
and to be at the center of everything. Meta wants
to be the future operating system to power these robots.
But they're going to have a big competitor here with
Google right, who has experience building operating systems for first
party and third party hardware. And obviously Gemini is right
(14:27):
up there with Lama and CHADGBT and the other AI systems.
So this is a big deal not only for Google
but the industry at large.
Speaker 2 (14:34):
So mark how convincing is this push Because we have
seen Google try or Alphabet try to get into the
robot world before. I understand is that they shut down
a spinoff company that was associated with this. So this
time around, what's the difference and how big is the push?
Speaker 9 (14:52):
I think the difference this time is Gemini, Right. The
underlying AI technology is much different, It's much more advanced,
it's more reputable, right, and now appears to be the
time where companies are willing to put in the proper investment,
the necessary infrastructure to make robotics happen. Right. Waimo is
being has been pretty successful comparatively in the industry, and
(15:16):
so what you're seeing is a lot of data collection.
There a lot of experience in autonomy and cameras, and
that's technology that Google could ultimately use if it wanted
to build its own humanoid. But don't count out Apple.
Apple has Skunkworks teams. We're in humanoid robots as well.
The big difference is they're not going to publicly release
an underlying robotic model, right, in order to support third
(15:39):
party robots and other consumer hardware. They're going to go
all in house. They're going to follow the Tesla method
that you've seen from the Tesla bot over the past
couple of years. So at some point in the next
five to ten years, you're going to see real competition
between Google, Meta, Apple, Tesla, and Chinese companies and others
in consumer robots. So this is this is going to
(16:01):
be a really big deal. And some of those movies
we've seen over the last several decades, they're starting to
come to reality.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
Mark, We thank you so much for your time today
breaking it all down for us. That is Bloomberg's Mark German,
And as you know, I'm excited about having a robot
at home, and we're going to talk more about robots here.
Not as pleasant as a story shares of consumer robotics
company I Robot. They're sliding today after it warned of
quote substantial doubt over.
Speaker 7 (16:28):
Its ability to continue to operate.
Speaker 2 (16:30):
You might remember that the company was once sought after
by Amazon for more than a billion dollars and it
has begun a foremost strategic of you to evaluate options
for more Bloomberg's Vanagasia Perez joins us now on set.
Was this warning a surprise, especially given the kind of
unicorn standing that it once had, and not totally.
Speaker 10 (16:50):
The company has been losing money and burning cash for
the you know, the past at least three years, and
then when the Amazon deal fail basically last year, the
company lost a big option. It started a strategic review
last year. It has cut losses, but it's still loss making,
(17:14):
and it has cut expenses, but it's still struggling.
Speaker 4 (17:19):
What does this tell us about the state of consumer
demand in this space? As we were hearing it seems
like the time horizon for some of these technologies to
really get in the hands of consumers takes time, especially
for those to get used to them.
Speaker 3 (17:35):
What does this tell us?
Speaker 10 (17:37):
So in the case of this company, I guess it's
another example of consumers cutting on discretionary spending. We've seen
it in other names like casual lining companies like Hooters
considering bankruptcy filing. We've seen it in a broad range
of retailers also struggling. So this is another example. And
(17:59):
the company mentioned in the going concern warning that consumer
spending could be one of the reasons why. Like weaker
consumer spending could be one of the reasons why it
doesn't manage to survive, and tariffs was another one that
they mentioned as a potential threat to the company's viability.
Speaker 4 (18:18):
Tariff's winging in here as well. Bloomberg'sidna Garcia Perez, thank
you so much for joining us.
Speaker 2 (18:31):
Now, some long term Tesla investors are backing away from
the stock after falling as much as forty two percent
so far this year, and this is as questions arise
about the company's future. For more of Bloomberg's Max Chaffin
joins us today.
Speaker 7 (18:45):
Now I want to point.
Speaker 2 (18:46):
Out also, of course today people are buying the dips,
people are believing the story. Today you have the president
himself looking to defend Musk in many ways.
Speaker 7 (18:56):
What is the trouble in Paradise?
Speaker 11 (18:58):
I mean more than defend, you know, wholding a sales
event on the White House lawn. The trouble is that
Tesla's customer base is not especially trumpy, and that's probably
an understatement. You think of a typical Tesla owner, this
is like an upper middle class, suburban progressive, or at
least a centrist, somebody who cares about the environment.
Speaker 6 (19:19):
You know, these are not Trump voters. These are very.
Speaker 11 (19:23):
Much the constituency that backed Barack Obama, Joe Biden, and
to a large extent, Kamala Harris, and those people, which
include a lot of Tesla customers, are very mad at
Elon Musk right now. We've seen protests all across the
country and the world, including some you know, acts of vandalism,
and just this kind of tone of mockery of you know,
(19:44):
seeing Elon Musk as kind of a lightning rod for
the worst for what these people, these Tesla customers see
as the worst excesses of the Trump administration so far.
Speaker 3 (19:55):
Max.
Speaker 4 (19:56):
And it's not just about the political leanings of who's
buying some of those cars, but they've recently gotten some
pretty good support, especially under the Abiden administration, for ev credits.
And I'm having trouble reconciling how Elon Musk can really
back Trump in some ways, but his company is somewhat
dependent on the government also supporting the transition to electric vehicles.
Speaker 3 (20:19):
How is that working out?
Speaker 11 (20:20):
Yeah, you know, Trump kind of ran to some extent
as an opponent of electric vehicles, talking constantly about ending
the quote unquote electric vehicle mandate, you know, and in
fact sign an executive order early on stating an attention
to pull back some of these regulations. Even brought this
up during the event yesterday, showing offering it as an
(20:41):
example of how selfless Musk is.
Speaker 6 (20:43):
I think from the kind.
Speaker 11 (20:44):
Of bull perspective, like why Tesla investors could be potentially
okay with this is the fact that Tesla has a
leading market position. So if you remove these subsidies subsidies
from electric cars, it arguably hurts GM and Ford and Tesla's.
Speaker 7 (20:59):
Other copetitors more than it hurts Tesla.
Speaker 11 (21:01):
Tesla has wider margins on evs, it's able to better
absorb this. Now that said, those companies are bringing out
new models and they're stealing customers away from Tesla.
Speaker 7 (21:11):
Right.
Speaker 3 (21:12):
That's Bloomberg'smax Taffkin, Thanks so much for joining.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
Us, and welcome back to Bloomberg Technology.
Speaker 7 (21:25):
I'm Shanalie Bask in New York.
Speaker 3 (21:27):
And I'm Jackie Devalis in Washington.
Speaker 2 (21:29):
It's got to check on these markets because you do
have a NAZAQ one hundred that has been fluctuating. We
are well off of session lows for the morning, but
only up now about six tenths of one percent, and
it's trying to fight for dominance. You have the NAZAQ
one hundred with only roughly half of its component parts
up on the day, the other half of course down
the Philadelphia A Semicconductor Index maintaining its lead after a
(21:52):
brutal stretch the last couple of weeks. It is now
up about two point three percent heading into midday, and
on other movers. This morning, we're going to bring in
Bloomberg's Isabelle Lee who joins us now on set Haitianali.
Speaker 12 (22:06):
So there's really a ton of uncertainty in the markets
right now. A gauged by city shifted from risk off
to risk on, risk on to risk off rather in
just six weeks, and really just as liew of headlines
crossing the wire this morning from Canada firing back on
TIFFs to inflation is really causing some more acts. So
back to inflation, that's a big data today. It showed
some signs of easing, but even so economists are anticipating
(22:27):
that the escalating trade war will really just drive up prices,
and you see waves of selling even in tech high flyers,
so Tesla, super Micro and Palan there for instance, have
wiped out more than a quarter of their value in
the last fourteen trading sessions since they peak, so their
losses are more than triple the decline of the S ANDP.
So really a tough market right now, and of course
an ass like one hundred tumbled into correction territory last week.
Speaker 4 (22:49):
Isabelle talk to us about what we're seeing in some
of those MAGS seven names you mentioned Tesla seeing some relief.
What else are we seeing when it comes to the
big tech giants that absolutely got battered.
Speaker 12 (22:59):
Earlier this week, they're still really better. Tesla is leading
the Lasses and the Magnificent seven index, and you see
the rally broadening out, and there are the losers right now.
In fact, a note earlier this morning says maleficent seven,
and you see that people are now questioning whether the
US exceptionalism has cracks. We have Citygroup and HSBC downgrading
their views on US equities this week. I talked to
(23:19):
a bank yesterday and they said that they're underweight Magnificent seven,
which is really a star contrast to when everyone was
just piling in, because if you don't pile in, then
you underperform the benchmark. But we have JP Morgan David Lebowitz,
which I talked to yesterday, said that, you know, risk
premiums have jump, credit market has yet to crack. Economic
data at least for now, points to expansion, so bullish
(23:40):
overall in the long term.
Speaker 4 (23:42):
That's Bloomberg's Isabelle, thank you so much for joining us.
Two astronauts stranded at the International Space Station since arriving
aboard Boeing Starliner in June could finally be heading home.
That's part of the goal for the SpaceX crew. Ten
missions scheduled to launch later today. Joining us to talk
about this is Clayton Swoke. He's Deputy director of the
(24:05):
Aerospace Security Project and a senior fellow at the Center
for Strategic and International Studies.
Speaker 3 (24:11):
Clayton, this is a really big moment.
Speaker 4 (24:13):
Everyone has really become so endeared to Sunny and Butch.
Speaker 3 (24:18):
What did this tell us about what went wrong? And
will this ever happen again?
Speaker 6 (24:23):
Well, Jackie, it's funny.
Speaker 3 (24:24):
I was thinking too.
Speaker 13 (24:25):
The one thing that I have as a takeaway is
just it's about Sunny and Butch and just their endurance
and their patients and their grace, and.
Speaker 3 (24:34):
It's something that I think back on.
Speaker 6 (24:35):
I think I admire that.
Speaker 13 (24:36):
I'm sure a lot of Americans admire that, and people
around the world and probably you like me, I get
up to that when I'm three hours late at the
airport and they've been there since June, so it's a
very different thing to think how long that they've been
up there and everything that they've been through, But they've
had that poise throughout. I think what we've learned too
is that space really can still throw us curveballs, but
(24:57):
that we have gotten to the point where we have
flexibility and adaptability that we can still do human space
fight safely and do that at scale. And that's a
lot of credit to NASA on the approach that they've
taken to get us here, and then also to SpaceX
on whose technology we really relied on to make this happen.
Speaker 2 (25:13):
How do you think about the next apps moving forward
when it comes to the star Liner? What do you
think is the future from here?
Speaker 13 (25:22):
Well, there's still a lot of things that we don't know.
We do know that Boeing has said they want to
stay in the space game. It's less clear on what
happens next for Starliner specifically. That will depend a lot
on what NASA decides with Boeing about certifying that capsule
to fly astronauts again into space.
Speaker 3 (25:40):
So we don't really know how long that would take.
Speaker 13 (25:42):
But if we look to the horizon, just with the
International Space Station, we're planning for it to deorbit in
twenty thirty, so that's less than five years away. So
there's really only a few more opportunities really in the
grand scheme to bring astronauts to that station, and that
window is quickly closing.
Speaker 3 (25:58):
There's been a lot.
Speaker 4 (25:59):
Going on in this space field as of late, and
I think it has many people wondering are we in
a new space race of some kind? How does the
US stack up with what we're doing in the field
versus other countries.
Speaker 13 (26:12):
It's really hard to not think about China and all
their achievements in space. Right now, there's seven astronauts and
cosmonauts on the International Space Station.
Speaker 2 (26:21):
All that thought for a moment here, because we want
to bring our audience some live images of President Trump
who is greeting the Prime Minister of Ireland.
Speaker 7 (26:30):
The two men are about to take part in.
Speaker 2 (26:32):
A bilateral meeting at the Oval Office. Now we will
bring you those headlines as they come in. You could
also check for updates on live go on your Bloomberg terminal. Now, Jackie,
back to you.
Speaker 4 (26:47):
Talk to us more about how China is really getting
to the space race.
Speaker 13 (26:51):
Yeah, there's three Chinese astronauts on their space station Tiangong
THII right now as we speak. So they've really made
space look routine in a lot of ways that has
also been able to do. They're also eyeing the Moon.
They want to land Chinese astronauts on the Moon by
twenty thirty, so is NASA. I think it's hard to
avoid the notion that this is a space race, maybe
a moon race.
Speaker 6 (27:11):
Two point zero.
Speaker 13 (27:12):
The United States is still the undeniable space power, lead
space power in the world, but China is definitely nipping
at our heels.
Speaker 4 (27:18):
Let's talk about who's making us the space power. We
hear a lot about SpaceX, but over in Silicon Valley
there's a lot of contenders really coming into the four
as well. What are you seeing in terms of concentration
of who's taking us to the next level.
Speaker 13 (27:32):
SpaceX is the main player right now when it comes
to launch, when it comes to broadband from lower thorbit,
when it comes to a lot of the things that
we rely on to get people and cargo to.
Speaker 6 (27:41):
The space station.
Speaker 13 (27:42):
But there are a lot of other companies that are
innovating in Silicon Valley and around the country. You have
companies in Pittsburgh and Texas and Florida. They're trying to
catch up and come up with new ways to do space,
to do it cheaper, to do it more efficiently, to
mine asteroids. Even so, there are a lot of up
and comers that really will challenge SpaceX's dominance, and it
will be their game to lose the overtime because there's
(28:02):
a lot of smart people though right behind them.
Speaker 4 (28:05):
Let's talk a little bit about who's behind SpaceX because
Elon Musk has been making waves here in Washington for
other reasons, but one of the areas that he's poised
to potentially benefit from are his relationships in Washington SpaceX
potentially getting more contracts. Does his politics detract in any
way from the progress that SpaceX can make or does
(28:26):
it really operate independently of that.
Speaker 13 (28:29):
SpaceX has led the way for what we call commercial
space today, and it has taken a number of years
for them to get to where they are. This isn't
something that just happened with President Trump's inauguration in January.
This has been a long trend where NASA, the Department
of Defense, and other customers both commercially and internationally have
really grown to depend on SpaceX for launch and then
now for broadband from space. So these are areas that
(28:51):
have been trending to that direction for a long time.
Those business opportunities that exist in space SpaceX built over
the last few years, probably around twenty two thousand and eight,
so it's not something new, and they're just really taking
advantage of all of that time and effort that they
put into this for almost seven to eight years at
this point.
Speaker 7 (29:10):
Clayton, we thank you for joining us.
Speaker 2 (29:12):
Of course, fascinating establishments in that space race. That is
Clayton Swope from the Center for Strategic and International Studies.
Speaker 4 (29:29):
Startup Celestial AI has raised two hundred and fifty million
dollars in its latest Series C round, valuing the company
at two point five billion dollars. It's photonic fabric technology
aims to improve speed and efficiency in AI computing. For
more on this, Dave Lozowski joins us. Now, Dave, help
(29:49):
our views understand how your technology is actually making this
part of AI computing that much more efficient.
Speaker 6 (29:58):
Thanks so much for having me.
Speaker 14 (30:00):
Yeah, Celestilia is the creators of the photonic fabric, as
you'd mentioned, which is the optical interconnectivity technology platform for
accelerated computing. So set another way, we're interconnecting AI processors
with light. What's happening in AI right now is that
artificial intelligence workloads are growing exponentially. They're now so large
(30:21):
trillions of parameters that they need to be partitioned over
hundreds of processors, which puts more and more demands on
the network as the processor doing the work needs to
move across the network to fetch information from another processor's memory,
moving back to where the work gets done, and there's
no more efficient way to move information than photonically.
Speaker 4 (30:45):
Dave, you managed to snag two hundred and fifty million
dollars from some institutional investors by the likes of Fidelity, Tiger, Blackrock,
Maverick Capital.
Speaker 3 (30:54):
How do you plan to put this money to use?
Speaker 6 (30:58):
Yeah, we're focused right now on scaling.
Speaker 14 (31:00):
So we have multiple deep collaborative development engagements with the
largest hyperscale data center companies on Earth. Right now, we're
collaborating with them to integrate our photonic fabric technology into
their next generation AI accelerators. These are programs that are
on the order of eighteen months, so through the balance
(31:23):
of twenty twenty five and into the first half of
next year, we're working together to get this technology scaled
and qualified.
Speaker 6 (31:32):
So right now the focus is.
Speaker 14 (31:33):
On our volume manufacturing supply chain because our customers are
immense scale. They require hundreds of thousands of units to
serve their demand.
Speaker 7 (31:43):
You know, Dave back to the fundraising question as well.
Speaker 2 (31:46):
Not only do you have kind of like the blue
chip of finance involved in this round, Fidelity, black Rock,
but the Mavericks and Tiger part of this. It's interesting
when you have those traditional hedge funds getting in.
Speaker 7 (31:58):
They have been cautious in the.
Speaker 2 (32:00):
World of startups, especially with a dearth of public market exits.
So bring us behind a conversation what is it about you?
And then that served as a good match.
Speaker 14 (32:11):
Yeah, So we took a hard look at the types
of investors that we wanted to have involved at this
stage in the company's life cycle. So just as you
develop a technology for successful qualification and implementation in a
large market like artificial intelligence, we are developing and optimizing
(32:32):
our cap table for having the rights investors involved, not
just at this phase in the company's life cycle.
Speaker 6 (32:39):
But through an IPO.
Speaker 14 (32:41):
Should we make the decision to take the company public
over the course the next few years and to have
the right investors that can invest with us over the
course of the next decade or more so on their ends.
The decision, I think was made based on the fact
that we are the only company in existence that has
the ability to provide optically interconnectivity that meets the requirements
(33:02):
of what are called scale up networks. This is a
processor to processor interconnect The gold standard today is in
Vidia with Envy Link and in v Switch.
Speaker 6 (33:13):
All of that is run over copper.
Speaker 14 (33:15):
So data communication today between processors at in Nvidia and
elsewhere throughout the industry today is entirely electronically over copper.
Speaker 6 (33:24):
With the photonic fabric, we are.
Speaker 14 (33:26):
Changing that, right, We're moving information optically at a fraction
of the energy and at much higher bandwidth and lower latency.
Speaker 7 (33:34):
You know.
Speaker 2 (33:35):
An interesting part of your cap table also that I've noticed,
and this is an existing.
Speaker 7 (33:39):
Investor, is Porsche.
Speaker 2 (33:41):
And with all that's going on in the world, worries
about the consumer, worries about international trade, auto parts also
facing risks of tariffs. I'm wondering what role you play
in the automobile story. Have they led to meaningful work
with you as an investor?
Speaker 14 (34:00):
Two different branches of Porsche. There's Porchia AG, which is
the automotive group, which we all know and love. That's
my favorite at brand, by the way. And there's Porsche ESI,
which is the mothership that it's the holding company for
all of the Porsche's family money as well as they
control about fifty.
Speaker 6 (34:17):
Percent of the assets of the Volkswaking Group. So this
is the.
Speaker 14 (34:20):
Financial arm of Porsche. Now Portia can and certainly we
anticipate will be a strategic partner for us as well
on the automotive group side, as their requirements for artificial
intelligence training and inference will be similar to that of Tesla,
who has played kind of a leading role early on
(34:41):
in building out AI infrastructure and support of autonomous vehicles.
Speaker 4 (34:46):
Dave, how do you think about kind of diversifying your
customer base. You noted that your target clientele those effectively
control more than ninety percent of the trillion dollar end market.
Do you get to spand past that as the company
grows or are you more dependent on those select few.
Speaker 14 (35:06):
Well, like you just said that those select few represent
you know, there's eight companies that represent roughly ninety percent
of this trillion dollar market, and we'd be fine with
just those, right, So, if you think about it, that's
a good problem for us to have. And you've got
four major hyperscalers, you know, I think the world knows
who they are that represent roughly seventy percent of.
Speaker 6 (35:24):
The addressable in market.
Speaker 14 (35:26):
And then you have the ecosystem around them, right, the
GPU manufacturers which include Nvidia and AMD, AIMD by the way,
being one of our strategic investors as well. And then
there are a couple of design services companies which include Broadcomics. Right,
so Broadcom is playing a larger role. I think you've
heard from their earnings announcement over the last week and
a half that they're gaining traction and building custom silicon
(35:49):
for the hyperscalers.
Speaker 2 (35:51):
Dave, we thank you so much for your time today.
Congratulations on that fundraise. We are looking forward to seeing where.
Speaker 7 (35:56):
It all goes.
Speaker 2 (35:57):
That is Dave Lozowski of Celestial Ai. Now, another AI
story that we're watching, Ali Baba is accelerating its efforts
to lead in the AI space and they're pushing out
an AI model that.
Speaker 7 (36:09):
Can read emotions for more.
Speaker 2 (36:11):
Bloomberg's Peter Elstrom joins us now and I think just
back to a couple of days ago, I tried so
hard to read this story that Sam Altman posted online
about the creative writing exercise that you saw through Open AI,
and that does go down to the ability to read
beyond the objective and then to be subjective. Right, And
(36:35):
so when you think about Ali Baba, how successful are
they in emotional intelligence.
Speaker 15 (36:41):
We're seeing this very rapid innovation of AI models really
around the world, but China now particularly has gained a
lot of attention because of the breakthrough of deep Seek
a few weeks ago. Ali Baba is, course of course,
best known for its e commerce business. It competes with
Amazon in that market. But of late the past couple
of months, they've come out with an number of AI
models that are quite innovative. They have one called Gwen
(37:03):
that it compared with deep Seek and said that it
was ahead on certain metrics. They're also striking an alliance
with Apple to be able to provide some of the
AI features for the iPhones within China.
Speaker 3 (37:14):
And now we see this.
Speaker 15 (37:15):
The model is called R one omni. They're saying it's
able to detect emotions within the people were asking questions
and give better answers. Because of that, they can customize
in certain ways. Now this fair follows very rapidly on
the heels of open Ai, which has tried something like
this with their GPT four point five. Now open Ai
(37:35):
is charging two hundred dollars a month for that service,
and here Alibab is putting this out there for free.
It doesn't have all the bells and whistles that you
would see in some other models, but it's a pretty
aggressive move into this space, and the China market is
not one where you're going to see the American companies play.
So it's a pretty far step ahead for Ali Baba.
Speaker 4 (37:53):
Peter, we have about thirty seconds left, but talk to
us about how this now stacks Ali Baba up again
to some of the players here in the US. Is
it really going to depend on things like emotional intelligence?
Speaker 15 (38:06):
Well, it's important to understand how bifurcated these markets are.
The Western companies can't get into China. These Chinese companies
are largely not competing outside of their own market at
this point. So they're pretty separate at this point. But
I think what's been surprising to a lot of observers
is how quickly some of these Chinese companies have been
able to evolve their AI models, especially because they're cut
off from the most advanced chips. You're talking before about
(38:28):
the Nvidia chips that are used to train these AI models.
Most of the Chinese companies can no longer buy those
from the Western world, so they're doing this with some
pretty hardcore engineering. Deep Seak in particular show that they
could make some advances that would be very difficult in
the Western world. That's partly because of the constraints they
have on the chip side.
Speaker 2 (38:46):
Peter, we thank you so much for all of your reporting.
That is Bloomberg's Peter Alstrom and Jackie. Something I've been
thinking about that is interesting about this emotional intelligence aspect
of things is if you believe that leadership needs EQ,
maybe AI can be your next boss.
Speaker 3 (39:03):
Yeah, let's hope not.
Speaker 4 (39:04):
I don't know about you, but I wouldn't want a
giving me my evel if you know what I mean,
right or raise?
Speaker 7 (39:10):
Anyways, is coming up next?
Speaker 2 (39:12):
Remember, speaking of big companies, we are coming out with
Adobe earnings after the closing bell.
Speaker 7 (39:18):
It is held up.
Speaker 2 (39:19):
Relatively well in the tech malaise we've seen through the
broader market.
Speaker 7 (39:22):
We're gonna take a look at what to expect next.
This is Bloomberg.
Speaker 2 (39:32):
Adobe earnings are out after the closing bell, and we're
going to bring in now Anu Ragrana of Bloomberg Intelligence
for a look at what to expect. It's interesting because
Adobe has held up relatively well relative to a lot
of those magneticuden Officient seven names, relative to what you've
seen in a lot of the Philadelphia Semiconductor Index. Is
there a story something to buy right now or are
(39:54):
there real risks after the market today?
Speaker 6 (39:56):
So sure, Naaliban, you look at it.
Speaker 16 (39:58):
Adobe's probably the cheapest large cap software stock right now,
much cheaper than any of its peers, and there is
a reason behind it because it is also the most
controversial one right now. They have a huge segment, one
of the most profitable businesses in the world, their photoshop
creative business, which is under threat or perceived threat by
a lot of open source models out there now. The
(40:21):
company has guided to their annual recurring revenue for their
digital media segment to go up by eleven percent. That's
the only number we are looking for when they report,
because any kind of disturbance and that number on the
downside really is not going to be good for the stock.
But meanwhile, if they are able to hold onto it
or even raise it, I think that's going to be
(40:41):
perceived very well. So that is really something different that's
happening from a macroside right now.
Speaker 2 (40:48):
ANURRAD thank you so very much for your time. That
is ANURAG run of Bloomberg Intelligence. We are looking forward.
Speaker 7 (40:53):
To your readout after they report.
Speaker 2 (40:56):
To your point, very controversial at the moment, and we
are hitting that tail end of earning season, and of
course as we hit that tail end, we are also
keeping an eye on these markets for you as before
we let you go, because we are looking at that
Nasdaq one hundred trying to maintain those gains for the day.
It has been a volatile morning, but we are back
up to one percent worth of gains on that Nasdaq
(41:18):
one hundred. Really the leaderboard here, the Russell two thousand
losing its gains though on the day, and the S
and P five hundred up but less than you're seeing.
Speaker 7 (41:26):
In big tech.
Speaker 2 (41:27):
The semiconductor is getting some relief, a nearly three percent
rise now at two point eight percent, and you're looking at.
Speaker 7 (41:34):
That big come back into the market.
Speaker 2 (41:36):
The dip buyers are on the sidelines and hopping back in.
That does it for Bloomberg Technology though today. Don't forget
to check out our podcast. You could find it on
the terminal and on Apple, Spotify and iHeart this is
Bloomberg
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