The Black Maternal Health Crisis

Guest: Dr. Isabel Morgan, Senior Advisor of Maternal Health at the Black Women’s Health Imperative

Episode Summary:

In this powerful and necessary conversation, Dr. Isabel Morgan shares hard truths and hopeful pathways forward in the fight for Black maternal health. As an epidemiologist and anthropologist, she brings both data and deep cultural insight to the conversation—breaking down how racism, medical models, and policy choices converge to create a maternal health crisis in the United States.

Together, we discuss:

• Why the U.S. has the worst maternal mortality rates of any high-income country
• The racial disparities in cesarean section rates and postpartum outcomes
• The midwifery model vs. obstetric care—and why it matters
• How implicit bias and structural racism shape healthcare experiences
• Why storytelling, data, and advocacy are all critical tools for justice
• The importance of the “fourth trimester” and postpartum care
• What legislative changes—like the Black Maternal Health Momnibus—can actually save lives

This episode is a call to action—and a reminder that we can fix this.

📣 Resources & Mentions:

• Black Women’s Health Imperative (BWHI): https://bwhi.org
• Earth App by Kimberly Seals Allers: https://birthplacelab.org/earth-app
• Black Maternal Health Momnibus Act
• My Sister’s Keeper & BWHI’s doula training programs

💡 Quote of the Episode:

“Eighty percent of pregnancy-related deaths are preventable. This is something we can fix.” — Dr. Isabel Morgan

—

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📲 Follow Lucinda Koza on Instagram: @lucindarogerskoza

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Episode Transcript

(00:00):
And welcome to how I Ally.
This is Lucinda Koza and I am here with a fabulous guest.
If you don't mind, I'd love for you to introduce yourself and give a bit of, backstory or bio? Absolutely.

(00:23):
So I'm Dr.
Isabel Morgan, and I'm Senior Advisor of Maternal Health at the Black Women's Health Imperative, BWHI.
It's an organization that was founded in 1983.
Billy Avery, really to address health issues impacting black women and girls across the country.
And so we engage in research and programming and education and engage in legislative advocacy to advance black women's and girls health.

(00:50):
A little bit about me.
I'm trained as an epidemiologist and as an anthropologist, and so for many years have studied.
Racial inequities in black maternal and reproductive health, ranging from postpartum care to maternal mortality, and more recently focused on infertility.
First of all that's incredible.

(01:11):
I didn't know that you trained in anthropology as well.
The epidemiology skills really primarily focus on quantitative data analysis, data collection, and really where anthropology comes into play is of course understanding how people are socialized.
And introducing me and allowing me to leverage qualitative data skills to support the research I'm invested in.

(01:35):
So understanding, talking to people about their experiences, navigating maternal healthcare and maternity care systems so that we can develop solutions to improve them.
Wow, that makes complete sense.
So you said just recently you've started focusing on infertility? Yes.

(01:59):
So what have you found? Actually, let me back up.
The.
First of all the rates, the maternal mortality rates in our country, period are outrageous.

(02:22):
Correct? Absolutely.
When we look at data from.
CDC and from the National Center of Health Statistics, and we compare that to data in other countries, we do see that within the us among all industrialized states or high countries, excuse me, high resource income countries, the US has the worst maternal mortality rates compared to those other countries.

(02:46):
And so it's very alarming on where our statistics are and the types of care that.
Women and birthing people received because we spend the most money on healthcare, but it's not translating into the results that we need, which is for people to be able to enjoy their pregnancy and birth experiences, survive their pregnancy and birth experiences, and to be able to leave hospitals or birth centers with their babies.

(03:16):
Oh, I feel that so hard.
Is that, is there just a, is that because of a huge discrepancy between patient centered care and.
Everything else.

(03:38):
I think you raised a great point about patient-centered care.
When we look at the way our healthcare system is set up compared to these other countries, they're drastically different.
So we rely on this health insurance model.
So folks, for folks to be able to access medical care and healthcare through essentially having health insurance to pay for the services of these providers.

(04:01):
Whereas some of the other countries, high income countries, they have universal healthcare coverage.
So that's significantly different than the way our system is set up specifically when it comes to, excuse me, maternity care.
Most.
Women and birthing individuals are serviced by obstetricians and gynecologists within our country, within the us.

(04:24):
Whereas in some of these other countries, the predominant providers are midwives and so they're using different models of care.
The midwifery model of care is quite different than the allopathic medicine and models of care that that we use here within the us with obstetricians and gynecologists and obstetricians are really trained as surgeons, and so their training really positions them to focus on and address abnormal progression of labor and abnormal pregnancies, midwives are really trained to support the natural progression of labor.

(05:01):
And so we do see a shift recently with.
The attention that's been attributed to the maternal health crisis, really within the US is understanding these distinctions and providing supports for obstetrics and gynecologists to shift their practice and how they practice and how they care for patients.

(05:22):
But also in increasing access to midwives and midwifery care for those patients who they are low risk and can experience.
Labor and experience pregnancy without these medical interventions like cesarean sections, for example.
I really didn't know.

(05:43):
I had a C-section cesarean.
I didn't even know that was not an ideal outcome.
I was just not educated about that.
And it may have been, I don't know your story, it may have been a blessing for you.

(06:05):
There are certainly medical indications of cesarean sections, but what is concerning is the unnecessary or elective cesarean sections that we see within our country.
Which is tell me about that data.
I know that it's.
Very high.

(06:25):
The rate of C-sections, is that correct? Percent of births in the us the folks are babies are delivered via cesarean section as compared to vaginal birth, and that is quite higher than in these other industrialized and well-resourced countries that I'm, that I've mentioned.
We also see racial inequities in cesarean section.

(06:47):
So you'll see in certain parts of the country, particularly in the south or in these community safety net hospitals, public hospitals.
Hospitals that are servicing more patients of color, like black patients.
You'll see higher rates of cesarean sections.
There's even data that shows that in the same hospital seeing more cesarean sections, a higher percentage being performed among black patients versus white patients.

(07:13):
That's concerning.
When we think about the implications of those cesarean sections, if they are unnecessary, not medically indicated, the implications for the outcomes from that birth and that delivery.
You know this, the recovery time from cesareans is certainly much longer than from a vaginal delivery.

(07:33):
There's increased risk for infections and hemorrhage.
And so when a cesarean section is not medically indicated however is being performed, there's a cascading effect on women, on birthing people and on infants.
Absolutely.
Absolutely.
You've.

(07:54):
Even the infant.
Yes.
Which is outrageous, if we look at data that we have on pregnancy related deaths, we know that the majority of those are occurring in the postpartum period.
And so previously I had mentioned maternal mortality.
We make a distinction between maternal mortality and pregnancy related deaths, where maternal mortality are deaths that occur up to.

(08:20):
Maternal deaths that occur up to 42 days postpartum.
And why this random number? This is so that we can be in alignment with data that's reported from other countries at the global level.
So that's how we're able to compare our maternal mortality rates to other countries like Switzerland and Sweden.
But pregnancy related deaths are data that are collected by CDC.

(08:44):
The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention, and they're collecting data on deaths that are occurring up to 12 months after the end of the pregnancy.
And that's really important 'cause that's showing us.
We're capturing that people are dying after pregnancy in the postpartum period.
And in fact that's where most of those deaths are occurring beyond 42 days even.

(09:08):
And so that's really been significant in helping us to understand where these deaths are occurring and really where resources need to be shifted to be able to support people, not just through pregnancy, but also postpartum.
There, do you feel, or do you, in your opinion, do you feel in your, I'm using weird words here do you, is it your opinion that women in postpartum, in the postpartum period do not get.

(09:45):
Much care in our country.
There's been a significant shift.
Absolutely.
But there's been a significant shift in.
Directing resources towards the postpartum period.
I think that's, for so long there was such a focus on pregnancy, and I think that this actually has to do with our focus and attention on infants and the babies, right? That really being like the woman being a vessel for this life, right? I think that's indicative of our focus on the infant, the baby.

(10:16):
And then once they're born, they're here.
Then a lack of support and attention to what the mom or the birthing person's needs are.
And so I, there has been a shift with understanding.
We talk about first, second, and third trimester.
Now we're talking about the fourth trimester and that being postpartum.
So once.
The baby's here, or for after a pregnancy ends, however it ends, the person who delivered needs support, they need care, they need healing, right? And so there has been a shift in understanding that more care is needed.

(10:46):
So prior to 2018, the American, American College of Obstetrician and gynecologist, or acog, essentially recommended that.
Those providers, that people who that deliver that they're seen about six weeks after they deliver.
And that's it.
And in 2018 the guidelines were actually shifted and changed so that there's touch points more than six weeks and more than just one time postpartum, three or four times of having touchpoints for providers to be seeing their patients for patients to be going back to their providers.

(11:21):
So that they can get screenings for mental health disorders, like depression and anxiety, that they can have their blood pressure checked, right? There says, has been a shift in a recognition that the postpartum period is significant and that we need to be directing more resources and attention to people after they give birth.
That's great because that is that's so true.

(11:44):
Do you think that would, do you think that would result in fewer deaths? Absolutely.
I think that the work that has been done to support people postpartum is making a difference.
The data that we've seen on maternal mortality in 2023, we've seen a decrease slightly.

(12:07):
Within for at the larger population level.
Unfortunately though we did see an increase, a slight increase for black women.
And so that's something that we need to be paying attention to.
We still experience racial inequities.
We still need to be making strides and supporting black mothers and black folks postpartum throughout the entire pregnancy, but also postpartum.
But I do believe that this attention to warning signs, maternity care, warning signs, for example, has really helped to.

(12:34):
Empower women and birthing people with an understanding about what is not normal to experience and when they should be contacting their providers.
I think it's also equipped doulas and other perinatal workers to support their clients with understanding when is it time for them to be seen? How do they advocate for themselves postpartum? I think I've also seen a shift in.

(12:59):
How we're showing up for each other in communities.
And I hope that you have this Lucinda, like a mater, like a a meal train, your family and friends essentially pitching in right? With supporting your family with meals, for example.
There's like the clinical programming that's being incorporated that I think is very helpful.
There's a community level solutions, but like also in families, like people showing up in communities, I have seen a shift in people understanding that folks need support postpartum and pitching in the support.

(13:32):
Yeah.
And that's what I'm trying to do for sure.
To do my part and to and to just impress upon people how absolutely vital the fourth trimester is, and that the health of the baby really depends upon the health of the mother.

(13:55):
Absolutely.
I think that there has been an understanding too that the dyad, in order for the mother baby dyad to be healthy, the mother has to be healthy.
That birthing person has to be healthy.
They have to be seen, they have to be valued.
They have to be whole.
And that's why, we at bw, BWHI.
Support legislation like the Black Maternal Health Mom nibus package, specifically the Perinatal Care Workforce Act that is meant to increase funding for these perinatal health workers that I mentioned, like the doulas.

(14:29):
And then we have midwives and lactation consultants community health workers, being able to support people throughout their pregnancy and certainly postpartum.
Are black women just straight up not seen as human beings as much as.

(14:55):
their white counterparts.
Lucinda say it.
You can say it.
It's something that we still struggle with, right? Like it is a valid question.
It sounds ridiculous, but yes.
In 2025.
In 2025, we still have to contend with that.
And I think that there are certainly.
Providers and people who are overtly racist, right? I think that there's also we've all been socialized to see move through the world a particular way and certainly there's a distinction, some how we've been socialized like within our homes, but this is why it's been important for us to develop programming and engage in work that addresses implicit bias.

(15:40):
So implicit biases that people have that they're not fully aware of and that how that impacts how they're providing care.
Even down to the person who is checking you in at the hospital, you know how they're treating you as you're being checked in to sit in the waiting room, how they are triage, how a nurse might be triaging you, for example, from the waiting room and or from, an emergency room.

(16:02):
So that is certainly an issue that we deal with.
It's why CDC developed in collaboration with several partners, the Hear Her Campaign.
And that was to address the fact that black women are not listened to and that is the root of that is not seeing valuing black women and black people certainly.

(16:25):
So that is certainly an issue that.
We still deal with, and again, related to the advocacy work that we're doing at the Black Women's Health Imperative specifically around the Black Maternal Health Mom nibus package, which was introduced by the Black Maternal Health Caucus there are bills within that package that support growing and diversifying.

(16:45):
Workforce.
The perinatal workforce.
And that's really important because it's important that people are seen, like they see people that look like them, that have similar life experiences.
That have a particular cultural upbringing because I do think that helps if they're not necessarily being seen if a person's not necessarily being seen by that provider, but that provider's a part of, like a larger a care team.

(17:12):
They're able to maybe pick out something in like the case study when their providers are doing their rounds before they're seeing their patients for the day.
Like asking questions in a different way, asking their colleagues to think about these issues in a different way.
I can give a personal story, there is a person in my family who had to report to the hospital for a gunshot wound.

(17:34):
My mother took them and she talks about how she had to contend with the staff, misinterpreting that they were looking for like drugs.
They just wanted opioids.
They're literally report they're reporting to the hospital for care.
But because they're black, because they're a male he was male.
Just having this perception that they are.

(17:58):
That they're here for drugs, right? So this is something that people that I've dealt with in my own family and that we see, and so that's why it's really important for us to engage in programming and legislative advocacy that is growing and diversifying that healthcare providers, that we're addressing implicit bias, that we're addressing structural racism.

(18:20):
But it starts with calling it out.
So I appreciate the question and it is a reality.
Absolutely.
And I grew up in South Carolina, so I I certainly I mean my whole childhood we still had the Confederate flag flying over the State House.

(18:46):
But it's not really that different in New Jersey where I live now.
It's just hidden better maybe.
Yeah.
It's, it makes me think of trauma informed care.
If.
The staff or the care team actually take the time to know what has happened to the patient.

(19:18):
Maybe in their past if they've gone through some trauma and that makes a difference in how they treat them, it's.
That kind of personal attention or just really thinking just really thinking about how you're providing care to this specific person.

(19:49):
Providers have 15 minutes, sometimes max, as they're going into these.
So we think about a prenatal visit.
The OB, GYN might have 15 minutes max with their patient.
So they're trying to basically counsel them at whatever stage that they are in their pregnancy.
Let's say a pregnant patient's in the in reporting to the hospital or the clinic.
That doesn't really leave time for the patient to ask questions.

(20:11):
That doesn't leave time for them to do like a social determinants of health screener, which those do exist.
That doesn't leave time for them to get to know this person as a human being.
What are their dreams and their desires, right? So there's some of that's happening over the course of the care.
But we also know that providers might be shifting like their patient loads.

(20:33):
And so who you have during your prenatal visits might not be the person that's helping you deliver on your delivery date.
But, I do think it's important that as much as possible providers are being trained, retrained when they're already, board certified but also starting with these medical institutions is training the providers, nurses, medical schools, physicians assistants, programs, really training them on racial inequities, training them on implicit bias, training them on how structural and systemic racism shows up within the healthcare system.

(21:08):
I can give you another example from.
Data that came out of a study out of the University of Virginia many years ago, and it showed that medical school students, they inaccurately believed and reported that black people could tolerate more pain.
And so that was many years ago.
But more recently, there's data out of UNC Chapel Hill that showed that black patients and I believe Hispanic patients were.

(21:36):
Indicating higher severity pain scores either I think it was postpartum and they were, however, they were less likely than the white patient to receive medication, pain medication that's related to my family story.
So even, we still see these issues around.
How providers are listening to or not listening to, or the implicit biases or racism that they have against patients, but, and the ways that we can humanize the experience, absolutely.

(22:08):
That can make a difference.
I do wanna mention some efforts that are existing, like there's the Earth app, for example, that.
Kimberly Seals Allers has created, it's phenomenal.
She calls it like the Yelp of hospital reviews.
And essentially what it's doing is capturing patient level data on what is their experience with a particular hospital.

(22:32):
So then you know you as a pregnant person, as a family member, as a doula, you are equipped with information on what people satisfaction is with particular healthcare institutions within.
Your area and you can make an informed decision.
Hopefully if you have access to, you can make an informed decision about which hospital that you might wanna be seen at.

(22:56):
And I think that's really great because hospitals do have their own.
Quality improvement programs.
They collect data on satisfaction and quality like the HCAP survey.
But they are analyzing, they, it's a different data source and you gotta be really motivated to fill those out.
And so I think that Kimberly's work with the Earth app is really wonderful to compliment the data that's captured in hcaps. 201 00:23:20,492.3121811 --> 00:23:21,572.3121811 Genius. 202 00:23:23,312.3121811 --> 00:23:26,842.3121811 That's in, I did not fill out any of those. 203 00:23:27,152.3121811 --> 00:23:38,377.3121811 I still always get, request like for about my kids after doctor's appointments and stuff, and I never fill them out because I'm like, yeah, it's something to think about. 204 00:23:38,572.3121811 --> 00:23:42,742.3121811 You might not have time, but it's something to think about because hospitals do use those data. 205 00:23:43,222.3121811 --> 00:23:45,562.3121811 And I think they build dashboards. 206 00:23:45,592.3121811 --> 00:23:48,262.3121811 Sometimes they're building dashboards and it's informing their training. 207 00:23:48,262.3121811 --> 00:23:52,362.3121811 It's informing how they're allocating resources within the hospital. 208 00:23:52,362.3121811 --> 00:23:53,442.3121811 But we need more of that. 209 00:23:53,442.3121811 --> 00:23:54,492.3121811 We do need more data. 210 00:23:54,492.3121811 --> 00:23:57,182.3121811 We do need more disaggregation of data. 211 00:23:57,182.3121811 --> 00:24:00,632.3121811 So looking at data by zip code, for example. 212 00:24:00,692.3121811 --> 00:24:08,203.3121811 So do you understand like your patients from a particular zip code might be experiencing less lower quality of care that might have to do with. 213 00:24:09,132.3121811 --> 00:24:12,382.3121811 Classism, and how people are being profiled in the hospitals. 214 00:24:14,272.3121811 --> 00:24:15,832.3121811 Yeah, absolutely. 215 00:24:17,692.3121811 --> 00:24:17,962.3121811 Yeah. 216 00:24:17,962.3121811 --> 00:24:23,602.3121811 No, I feel really bad about not filling out any no. 217 00:24:23,652.3121811 --> 00:24:27,327.3121811 Now, in the future if you're, motivated to fill out those surveys when you can. 218 00:24:27,327.3121811 --> 00:24:27,417.3121811 Yes. 219 00:24:27,747.3121811 --> 00:24:30,662.3121811 And we certainly at BWHI, we. 220 00:24:31,437.3121811 --> 00:24:32,667.3121811 Really value data. 221 00:24:32,697.3121811 --> 00:24:33,957.3121811 We really value data. 222 00:24:33,957.3121811 --> 00:24:35,817.3121811 It's incorporated into our programming. 223 00:24:35,817.3121811 --> 00:24:37,677.3121811 It informs the research that we do. 224 00:24:38,97.3121811 --> 00:24:45,827.3121811 For example, the doula training curriculum that we were able to implement at Morgan State University between 2022 and 2023. 225 00:24:47,267.3121811 --> 00:24:56,892.3121811 We trained about 38 black students at that HBCU, and they were able to go on and support about 140 black families in the DMV area. 226 00:24:57,192.3121811 --> 00:25:12,262.3121811 We leveraged that data in our one-pager, in our packets that we use when we're on the hill, and we're trying to advocate for these legislative changes and to support funding for these critical programs to support maternal health. 227 00:25:13,102.3121811 --> 00:25:13,312.3121811 Oh man. 228 00:25:15,967.3121811 --> 00:25:33,942.3121811 So it's very important for everybody to share their experiences and whether it be super casual, like on the app or. 229 00:25:35,312.3121811 --> 00:25:44,732.3121811 In these surveys for hospitals or both, or actually, I want everyone to share their experiences all the time. 230 00:25:45,122.3121811 --> 00:26:03,282.3121811 And too often we feel like it doesn't really matter what we think or what we have to say or what we went through or what happened to us, and we stay silent. 231 00:26:04,437.3121811 --> 00:26:09,157.3121811 Especially women I think that women are socialized to not speak up. 232 00:26:09,157.3121811 --> 00:26:09,697.3121811 Definitely. 233 00:26:09,727.3121811 --> 00:26:11,467.3121811 We're definitely socialized to not speak up. 234 00:26:11,467.3121811 --> 00:26:16,897.3121811 We're definitely socialized to, to take care of other people, right? Instead of taking care of ourselves. 235 00:26:16,897.3121811 --> 00:26:30,957.3121811 It's why we see that 98% of children are like taken to their well-child visits, but then you have 40% of women and birthing people reporting for their postpartum care visits. 236 00:26:31,447.3121811 --> 00:26:34,917.3121811 Like they, they it's certainly related, when people use the data. 237 00:26:34,947.3121811 --> 00:26:54,112.3121811 So when you can report your experiences, whether they're terrible or whether they were amazing, like that is helpful and it's really insightful for the work that even we do, right? Storytelling is a huge component of many of our programs and how we engage in narrative shifting. 238 00:26:54,142.3121811 --> 00:27:00,802.3121811 And that's why I feel, empowered and motivated in the work that I do, because I can see the narrative shifting. 239 00:27:00,862.3121811 --> 00:27:03,22.3121811 I can see the culture shift. 240 00:27:03,342.3121811 --> 00:27:12,182.3121811 I think fewer people not knowing about what doulas are or not knowing about how to advocate for themselves or not knowing what maternity warning signs. 241 00:27:12,362.3121811 --> 00:27:14,972.3121811 I see the shift in the conversations. 242 00:27:15,22.3121811 --> 00:27:21,982.3121811 I see the shift in the media and so that's something that really encourages me, including seeing women speak up. 243 00:27:23,887.3121811 --> 00:27:24,787.3121811 Yes. 244 00:27:26,677.3121811 --> 00:27:33,887.3121811 So you, so that must be really rewarding and encouraging. 245 00:27:35,717.3121811 --> 00:27:36,587.3121811 Absolutely. 246 00:27:36,647.3121811 --> 00:27:42,77.3121811 It is really encouraging because I know that these are issues that we can fix. 247 00:27:43,37.3121811 --> 00:27:50,687.3121811 Other set of data that comes outta CDC, we, shows yes, that we have dire pregnancy related death rates in our country. 248 00:27:51,187.3121811 --> 00:27:56,347.3121811 But majority of those deaths, 80% are deemed preventable. 249 00:27:56,827.3121811 --> 00:27:59,527.3121811 So this is an issue that we can fix. 250 00:27:59,527.3121811 --> 00:28:02,617.3121811 That's just one of the issues, right? We're talking about the most severe. 251 00:28:03,117.3121811 --> 00:28:08,217.3121811 And I think too, like it's important to even think beyond. 252 00:28:09,132.3121811 --> 00:28:10,692.3121811 Pregnancy related deaths. 253 00:28:11,172.3121811 --> 00:28:19,452.3121811 There's people who experience severe maternal morbidities or like pregnancy complications that don't result in death, but they cause harm to them like hemorrhage. 254 00:28:19,932.3121811 --> 00:28:31,782.3121811 There are people who experience depression or anxiety, so I am grateful and motivated that I see a shift in how we're talking about these issues that we understand. 255 00:28:32,142.3121811 --> 00:28:34,842.3121811 That for black women especially, it's not innate. 256 00:28:34,932.3121811 --> 00:28:36,222.3121811 There's not a genetic component. 257 00:28:36,222.3121811 --> 00:28:37,272.3121811 It's not biological. 258 00:28:37,272.3121811 --> 00:28:54,132.3121811 It is literally how the system was created and how a number of structures really condition for us to be disadvantaged within these systems and to experience of lower quality of care and more adverse out health outcomes. 259 00:28:54,462.3121811 --> 00:28:56,22.3121811 But certainly knowing that. 260 00:28:56,577.3121811 --> 00:29:07,357.3121811 There's people that are dedicated to this, that there's movement that we see the culture shift that we did see overall a decline in maternal mortality rates in 2023. 261 00:29:07,687.3121811 --> 00:29:14,157.3121811 We did see we've seen funding being allocated towards programming. 262 00:29:14,217.3121811 --> 00:29:21,217.3121811 Like for example, the National Institutes of Health had allocated millions of dollars to fund research. 263 00:29:22,507.3121811 --> 00:29:26,797.3121811 Through the Improve initiative on maternity care and on maternal health disparities. 264 00:29:27,97.3121811 --> 00:29:28,297.3121811 And so that was very encouraging. 265 00:29:28,297.3121811 --> 00:29:29,647.3121811 We've seen a shift since then. 266 00:29:29,647.3121811 --> 00:29:34,177.3121811 That's a bit disco, certainly discouraging in that we're trying to hold the line for. 267 00:29:34,417.3121811 --> 00:29:46,707.3121811 But there's been a lot of amazing advocacy work and I'm really grateful that Black Women's Health Imperative has been really in the fight with so many other organizations and has been. 268 00:29:47,97.3121811 --> 00:29:49,917.3121811 A stalwart organization for 43 years. 269 00:29:50,107.3121811 --> 00:29:54,787.3121811 It's really incredible what we've been able to accomplish even before my time with the organization. 270 00:29:55,237.3121811 --> 00:29:57,397.3121811 I'm very proud of our doula training curriculum. 271 00:29:57,397.3121811 --> 00:30:02,527.3121811 I'm very proud of our My Sisters Keepers program that educates young black women. 272 00:30:03,67.3121811 --> 00:30:12,817.3121811 On college campuses about their reproductive health and supports them in how do they advocate for their reproductive health with their state legislator. 273 00:30:12,997.3121811 --> 00:30:17,767.3121811 So those are all things that I'm very proud of and grateful that we've been able to make strides in and contribute to. 274 00:30:19,147.3121811 --> 00:30:21,487.3121811 That's so fantastic. 275 00:30:21,567.3121811 --> 00:30:23,517.3121811 That's just, that's so incredible. 276 00:30:25,167.3121811 --> 00:30:27,627.3121811 That's, it's just. 277 00:30:28,452.3121811 --> 00:30:29,952.3121811 That's so incredible. 278 00:30:30,732.3121811 --> 00:30:36,432.3121811 I do, you said it's almost designed to to take your power away. 279 00:30:36,972.3121811 --> 00:30:42,552.3121811 To take your power away in the moment that you are the. 280 00:30:43,497.3121811 --> 00:30:52,487.3121811 At your most powerful or should be it should be a joyful experience. 281 00:30:52,577.3121811 --> 00:30:54,467.3121811 It should be a joyful experience. 282 00:30:54,797.3121811 --> 00:30:57,707.3121811 People should be happy, they should walk away healthy. 283 00:30:58,97.3121811 --> 00:31:01,547.3121811 But for so many people, that's not their experience. 284 00:31:02,687.3121811 --> 00:31:06,292.3121811 And then you're, and then you feel like it's your fault. 285 00:31:06,912.3121811 --> 00:31:07,492.3121811 You failed. 286 00:31:08,832.3121811 --> 00:31:16,122.3121811 And then you start out as a parent already feeling like you've, you're a failure. 287 00:31:18,832.3121811 --> 00:31:23,932.3121811 That's, then you're like, you're at a huge disadvantage. 288 00:31:25,192.3121811 --> 00:31:33,622.3121811 Or at least I was per, personally, it was so hard to come from that, to. 289 00:31:35,497.3121811 --> 00:31:40,357.3121811 To climb that hill from feeling like I had failed so horribly. 290 00:31:41,47.3121811 --> 00:31:45,17.3121811 And, I left the hospital without my babies. 291 00:31:45,17.3121811 --> 00:31:52,7.3121811 I had twins and yeah, so I definitely needed the C-section. 292 00:31:52,997.3121811 --> 00:31:57,47.3121811 But it was still, it was traumatic and I. 293 00:31:57,737.3121811 --> 00:32:03,837.3121811 Felt, I left just confused what just happened, and that's just, that doesn't help anyone. 294 00:32:04,407.3121811 --> 00:32:07,977.3121811 That doesn't help our whole society. 295 00:32:08,7.3121811 --> 00:32:19,497.3121811 We need to empower mothers and at the very least, we're disempowering mothers, if not killing them. 296 00:32:19,812.3121811 --> 00:32:20,832.3121811 Absolutely. 297 00:32:21,12.3121811 --> 00:32:28,752.3121811 That is such a blessing that you have twins, but it is very traumatic, right? To leave the hospital with your babies being in the nicu. 298 00:32:29,152.3121811 --> 00:32:32,182.3121811 That's, that is a very traumatic experience. 299 00:32:32,182.3121811 --> 00:32:35,872.3121811 And so you're trying to recover, you're trying to make sure your babies are okay. 300 00:32:36,232.3121811 --> 00:32:47,572.3121811 And something that we, that we recognize and understand from the communities that we support and that we operate in, is that so many people don't have paid family leave. 301 00:32:48,142.3121811 --> 00:32:54,142.3121811 And so then that is the, it's the guilt of not being able to stay home with your children. 302 00:32:54,172.3121811 --> 00:33:00,82.3121811 Like first it's the guilt of them being in the nicu, like in your case, and it's the guilt of not being able to stay home with your children. 303 00:33:00,637.3121811 --> 00:33:02,587.3121811 That makes it very difficult. 304 00:33:02,887.3121811 --> 00:33:23,702.3121811 And so paid family leave is also a really important component, right? There's so much that we could be doing to better support mothers and birthing people and families, that they can focus on healing, they can focus on their families, their babies and they can really adjust to what is a monumental shift in their family dynamic. 305 00:33:25,277.3121811 --> 00:33:26,627.3121811 Absolutely. 306 00:33:27,917.3121811 --> 00:33:43,622.3121811 And that is more that's gonna have, that's gonna have way more of of an impact on society than I shutting down well. 307 00:33:44,647.3121811 --> 00:33:53,277.3121811 That's gonna have a more positive impact on society than like outlawing abortion and shutting down Planned Parenthoods. 308 00:33:53,277.3121811 --> 00:33:56,307.3121811 And, it's so backwards. 309 00:33:57,417.3121811 --> 00:34:04,227.3121811 It's like the, this fight to. 310 00:34:05,227.3121811 --> 00:34:12,787.3121811 Bring more people into the world, even if it's, in these horrible circumstances. 311 00:34:14,377.3121811 --> 00:34:21,917.3121811 But, once they're here, there's, we don't, there's no interest in supporting them. 312 00:34:23,967.3121811 --> 00:34:26,667.3121811 There's a lot more that we can be doing to support families. 313 00:34:27,777.3121811 --> 00:34:33,267.3121811 To be whole, to be sustained, to be comfortable to live with dignity. 314 00:34:33,267.3121811 --> 00:34:39,417.3121811 That's really what it boils down to, is to live with dignity and to recognize that people's basic human rights are being violated. 315 00:34:39,417.3121811 --> 00:34:47,97.3121811 So certainly being able to allocate funding towards paid family leave, that is huge. 316 00:34:47,187.3121811 --> 00:34:52,102.3121811 Being able to allocate funding to support these perinatal care workers, that is huge. 317 00:34:53,37.3121811 --> 00:35:02,217.3121811 Right now we're talking about retracting funding for Medicaid really and reducing the match, the federal match for Medicaid programs. 318 00:35:02,737.3121811 --> 00:35:09,877.3121811 What is really more helpful for protecting maternal health is expanding access to Medicaid. 319 00:35:10,117.3121811 --> 00:35:17,317.3121811 What is more protective from maternal health is investing in our maternity care systems instituting these quality improvement initiatives. 320 00:35:18,247.3121811 --> 00:35:36,617.3121811 Working with organizations like the Black Women's Health Imperative with community-based organizations that serve in the gap, our safety net programs that are really able to support direct these hospitals and healthcare systems on how to best support their communities. 321 00:35:36,617.3121811 --> 00:35:40,187.3121811 They're during, with the a CA, the Affordable Care Act. 322 00:35:41,132.3121811 --> 00:35:47,672.3121811 Public hospitals receiving funding from federal government had to conduct these community needs assessments. 323 00:35:48,302.3121811 --> 00:35:54,302.3121811 And I think that's such, and they had to act on how they were gonna address the findings from the community needs assessment. 324 00:35:54,752.3121811 --> 00:36:06,332.3121811 I think that is really important for hospitals and healthcare systems, understanding who are the patients that they're servicing and providing care to and how can they better support them. 325 00:36:06,812.3121811 --> 00:36:15,362.3121811 There there's just there's so much more that we could be doing and we need to be making sure at this time that we are moving in the right direction, as you pointed out, rather than in the wrong direction. 326 00:36:15,572.3121811 --> 00:36:19,22.3121811 That would have very negative adverse implications. 327 00:36:19,52.3121811 --> 00:36:26,522.3121811 It already is having that negative adverse implications on maternal health and people's pregnancy and birth experiences. 328 00:36:27,92.3121811 --> 00:36:29,312.3121811 It's incredible to speak with you. 329 00:36:30,182.3121811 --> 00:36:31,112.3121811 You are. 330 00:36:32,112.3121811 --> 00:36:36,307.3121811 You should be speaking all the time, everywhere, every day. 331 00:36:39,282.3121811 --> 00:36:40,212.3121811 I appreciate that. 332 00:36:40,572.3121811 --> 00:36:41,622.3121811 I appreciate that. 333 00:36:42,412.3121811 --> 00:36:54,322.3121811 You're, you have all the data, you have all the, you have all the right things to say and you're just you. 334 00:36:55,72.3121811 --> 00:36:57,212.3121811 We and we need to hear it. 335 00:36:57,362.3121811 --> 00:36:58,352.3121811 We need to hear it. 336 00:36:59,672.3121811 --> 00:37:00,752.3121811 I appreciate that. 337 00:37:00,752.3121811 --> 00:37:04,262.3121811 I appreciate you using your platform to elevate this issue. 338 00:37:04,682.3121811 --> 00:37:12,2.3121811 Like I said, I have seen the narrative shifting, but I don't think this is a time where we have to continue pushing forward. 339 00:37:12,272.3121811 --> 00:37:14,522.3121811 Like we have to continue elevating the message. 340 00:37:14,522.3121811 --> 00:37:17,792.3121811 We have to continue staying empowered and informed. 341 00:37:18,162.3121811 --> 00:37:34,602.3121811 We just had a hundred days town hall and it was incredible with really really elevating where we're at, what this moment needs, where we need to be holding the line, where we need to be shifting resources, and what's working well. 342 00:37:34,837.3121811 --> 00:37:45,402.5412061 But as you're saying, what's been really grounding for me sharing with you is 'cause I'm surrounded by brilliant minds and compassionate people, so that's why I'm able to, share this information. 343 00:37:45,402.5412061 --> 00:38:00,162.5412061 And so I really appreciate opportunities like this to elevate the work that we're doing at the Black Women's Health imperative and really to be able to showcase the beauty and the need for us to continue to be in partnership. 344 00:38:00,162.5412061 --> 00:38:01,722.5412061 Like people need to tap into. 345 00:38:02,322.5412061 --> 00:38:05,92.5412061 Who are their movement partners at this time. 346 00:38:05,512.5412061 --> 00:38:09,682.5412061 And, we have a lot of resources on our social media pages for people to stay in touch. 347 00:38:09,682.5412061 --> 00:38:18,692.5412061 We have a newsletter they wanna learn about, ways that they can tap in and support and just stay informed about what's happening and how it's impacting maternal health. 348 00:38:19,742.5412061 --> 00:38:23,372.5412061 Yes, we need to keep the. 349 00:38:24,467.5412061 --> 00:38:30,637.5412061 The, the presence we need to keep the presence present. 350 00:38:31,447.5412061 --> 00:38:46,162.5412061 We need to keep the information flowing and breathing and living in the face of everything ugly. 351 00:38:47,162.5412061 --> 00:38:49,202.5412061 So thank you so much. 352 00:38:49,652.5412061 --> 00:38:55,532.5412061 It's been, I feel like I've been in church. 353 00:38:55,892.5412061 --> 00:38:56,392.5412061 In a good way. 354 00:38:57,452.5412061 --> 00:38:57,952.5412061 In a good way. 355 00:38:59,177.5412061 --> 00:39:00,137.5412061 In a good way. 356 00:39:01,137.5412061 --> 00:39:14,289.56411 There's so much work to do and that's why there are people like you you have to have, the stomach for it, to fight in a way. 357 00:39:15,289.56411 --> 00:39:23,629.56411 Yes I, tapping into the legacy, I'm not the first, I'm not gonna be the last, but there's work to be done and there's a legacy. 358 00:39:23,629.56411 --> 00:39:28,819.56411 There's a, there's an amazing group of people that have been doing this work before me that inspire me. 359 00:39:28,819.56411 --> 00:39:34,459.56411 So I appreciate you for sharing this platform for us to have this important conversation. 360 00:39:34,549.56411 --> 00:39:35,29.56411 Thank you. 361 00:39:36,919.56411 --> 00:39:37,519.56411 Thank you.