What happens after your pet dies at home? In this tender and practical conversation, Karen Wylie and Gail Pope guide pet parents through what to expect—physically, emotionally, and spiritually. From how to care for your pet’s body, to creating space for honoring and grief, this episode is filled with comforting insights and gentle support.
Whether you’re planning ahead or navigating a recent loss, you’ll find reassurance and clarity here.
📌 Related Resource: PEACEFUL: The Quality of Dying Guide: Signs of a Peaceful Passing PDF - This guide is designed to help pet parents observe signs indicating an acceptable quality of life that supports the natural, peaceful dying process.
💬 If this episode touched your heart, you’re not alone. The BrightHaven Caregivers’ Hub is our supportive membership community for pet parents navigating caregiving, anticipatory grief, and all the moments in between.
We gather to share stories, ask questions, and care for each other as we care for our animals. If you’re walking this path, we’d be honored to walk it with you.
🔗 Learn more about the Hub: https://brightpathforpets.com/caregivers-hub/
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Learn More from BrightHaven Caregiver Academy For free resources, upcoming workshops, and a supportive community dedicated to navigating life with your aging or ill pet:
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Disclaimer: This content is for educational purposes and not a substitute for professional advice.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:01):
Welcome to Peace of Mind for Pet Parents, the podcast by BrightHaven Caregiver Academy.
I'm Gail Pope and I'm Karen Wylie and together we're here to support you in navigating life with your aging or ill pets.
We know how deeply you care for your beloved companions, and we're here to offer guidance, understanding, and resources for this meaningful journey.
(00:25):
Each episode we'll explore topics that address the daily challenges, emotional realities, and choices you face as a pet parent helping you and your pets find peace, comfort, and joy.
Whether it's making sense of a new diagnosis, adjusting to changing needs, or simply seeking a place to feel understood, you're not alone.
(00:47):
Thank you for being here with us.
Karen Wylie (00:50):
Hello and welcome to Peace of Mind for Pet Parents.
I'm Karen Wylie here with my friend Gail Pope.
This is a topic today that we've talked about doing for a while and would really like to— I'm sorry, I have a tail that's constantly knocking my notes.
Gail Pope (01:13):
Oh, wait.
Karen Wylie (01:14):
Like what the hell was I going to say there?
Okay, now she's sitting.
We'll see how long that lasts.
The thing is when you have pets— life is imperfect.
It just is!
You can't control when they're going to bump a screen or turn the microphone off or god knows what else.
You just have to have a "different" home if you're going to have pets and yes, it's never perfect, that's for sure.
(01:38):
So today's topic is one we've wanted to explore for a long time because it really addresses the quiet fears that most pet parents have and carry in their hearts and heads.
It's not really the fear of death itself but the question that follows it which is, "What do I do if my pet dies at home?"
(02:03):
So today we're going to explore and talk about some of the physical aspects of handling a pet's body after death.
Of course, also talk about the emotional context for each of us when we're handling our pet's bodies and perhaps making decisions about their body and how we want to be with the body or honor it in an ongoing way.
(02:34):
Gail let's start out, can we take a look at the different emotions that each of us has when our pet dies at home?
Each of us, especially you with a sanctuary, you certainly had more animals to have these experiences with than the average pet parent but I think there's just so many emotions you can have at that time.
(02:58):
Part of it is shock because even if you're prepared for it, your pet has been in the process of dying for a long time, you think that's going to keep going on forever and then it doesn't.
So there's still always an element of shock even if the death is expected.
Gail Pope (03:13):
Yes, it's a moment in time, isn't it?
It can go all the way from fear and shock to relief to floods of tears to almost like a cold stonelike acceptance and in the moment you are frozen.
It can happen in so many different ways.
(03:34):
So I think the first and most important thing is for the person to be with themselves for a little while.
I'm not suggesting they're not touching or being with the animal but to just bring themselves back down to earth.
For me sometimes, happily most often our animals have been taking a slow trajectory to the end.
(04:00):
When it comes, I'm not frozen inside, I'm relaxed.
I'm with them and they breathe their last.
It's as though I'm breathing it with them and I'm okay.
There aren't floods of tears.
Sometimes there are, sometimes they come a little later.
I think we're all different and it really is honoring our own selves and accepting this moment because it can be really hard.
(04:28):
If there's been a death that isn't the easiest thing in the world, a lot of deaths can be difficult, then there can be anger, fear, regret.
There are so many negative emotions that can hit.
I think fear is one of the big ones there.
It's a fear that isn't fearful of something about to happen.
(04:51):
It's that same reaction of, "Oh my God, that was awful!"
Luckily that doesn't happen very often but for a person who's not used to seeing death.
Isn't used to how the body moves during death and this is humans as well as animals.
Sometimes a human will be like on TV and they'll just take it a breath and they're gone.
(05:17):
Other times it will be more difficult and so it's the same with animals.
I guess that's why we developed the "Peaceful Checklist" so many moons ago because there are so many things, so many symptoms, if you like, that are common at the end of life in that dying process.
(05:40):
Because that can be so helpful to people to understand what's normal and what's not normal because I think this is where the fear comes in.
We are not sure when they're following the trajectory and you see maybe little neurological impulses in the body.
If you don't know that's perfectly normal as the mechanisms of the body, the chemical reactions are in progress.
(06:05):
That's normal.
So once you accept what is or can be normal.
Then when you see it, it's almost "Okay, yes. Got that, knew that."
So I think the more we can know about the process of birth as well— birthing and dying, their processes we honor them.
(06:25):
Maybe birth more than death in this part of our culture.
We honor them but we don't really delve deeper into them, most of us anyway.
When we do, it relieves a lot of the humanness we carry with us.
Karen Wylie (06:39):
That's a great point.
The peaceful checklist that is A PDF available on our website.
So I will make sure that a link is included below in the description for this podcast.
So if anyone's interested in downloading it, you'll be able to.
I'd like to go back to what you're talking about in terms of the fear of this unknown process because of course this is what you're talking about in terms of our culture.
(07:10):
Handling death and handling our loved one's bodies after death is something that we've been outsourcing for years.
It isn't how it used to be for humans or for pets.
Now of course if there is a fear of death or that not knowing of what to do well then euthanasia is the choice.
(07:37):
I think for those who are fearful, euthanasia is almost an automatic choice.
Then there are other people who don't know that allowing a natural transition at home is even an option.
Gail Pope (07:52):
Oh yes.
That's happened to me quite often when it's come up in perhaps in conversation towards the end of life.
Somebody has said, "What do you mean? I didn't even know that it was legal."
Again, with humans who die at home in bed, a lot of people think, "Oh, how much time do I have before I have to call the hospital? What do I do?"
(08:13):
So it really is hard, the subject is a real learning experience.
I guess I'm lucky in some ways and not in others that I've learned it over a lot of time.
But I remember how lost and alone I felt in the early days of having an animal die at home and not knowing quite what to do.
Having that old fashioned upbringing of, "Oh, I'm so scared. This is..." and I didn't even know what I was scared of.
(08:40):
Did I think there was a ghost in the room now or I don't know.
It's a fear that I grew up with— a dead body.
That's something I had to learn, to honor it as the house that my loved one lived in.
When you turn it or when I turned it to that understanding, of course I'm going to honor this body.
The word dead isn't important.
(09:01):
This is the house that they lived in and I want it to look nice.
I want to celebrate it.
I want to celebrate them too but they're not living in this house now.
I really want to honor them by doing this.
Karen Wylie (09:16):
And honoring them at home in such a variety of ways, which we'll continue to talk about, allows people to grieve differently and longer than euthanasia at home— perhaps with a mobile vet who also will then take the body with them when they leave.
(09:37):
Although the opportunity to choose a home euthanasia is a wonderful option for people who want it for situations where that's the right thing to do.
Everything is condensed together where the vet arrives, there's the euthanasia itself.
Although the vets are allowing sometime for the pet parents to grieve about the reality that their pet who was alive 10 minutes ago is now gone they generally are going to leave within 20 to 30 minutes after the euthanasia and they'll be taking the body with them.
(10:15):
When I think of euthanasia, whether at home or certainly at the clinic, there are so many reasons why euthanasia is chosen and is a good and helpful thing to have.
Cremation for people who live in apartments, for example, and and don't have a yard to bury their pet or a cemetery could be very far away.
(10:41):
Cremation is sometimes the only option available for people but the time is compressed.
You don't have the same amount of time to grieve and spend time just being with your pet's body with the house that they lived in.
That's where taking the time to understand the options you do have, if you want to have a wake for your pet at home.
(11:09):
Just like people used to do with their loved ones at home.
Now of course we outsource it to the funeral homes but your loved one could stay at home for various periods of time.
We won't go down the human road too long and talk about the cultural issues but for our pets let's talk a little bit about how much time we have with our pet's body.
(11:32):
Because I think that's almost the number one question that people have.
First are they allowed to keep their pet at home?
Then I know we've talked to clients who say that when they call a crematorium to ask, how long can I keep my pet at home?
They say just a few hours.
You've got to get them here right away.
(11:53):
That is not actually true.
So can you walk us through the timeframes and options that most pet parents have if they want to consider them?
Gail Pope (12:07):
I don't know that there is a timeframe.
I think that it's up to us.
It's up to setting our own honoring schedule, if you like.
When an animal's died, whether they're at home, whether they're in the hospital, whether the veterinarian is at your home— I think the first thing that I found is that people don't understand sometimes that if they want to keep the animal to honor them for a few days or however long, or even a few hours, that's okay.
(12:40):
They can say to the vet, "Thank you so much." These days at home veterinarians do such a wonderful job.
They bring ceremony and honoring into the process.
People don't understand at that point, they can accept that and say, "Now I'm going to keep him for a day or two. I'll let you know when I would like to bring him in or when he gets collected."
(13:01):
Because then you're up against a deadline and that doesn't feel good.
So I think being comfortable with the dead body is probably the first part.
Then just thinking about what feels right or appropriate to you.
Years ago if someone had this conversation with me, I would've been saying, "Oh, is it that time? I think I need to go now,."
(13:26):
Because it wasn't in my nature to understand the fact that I might want to honor someone after.
To me, you might do that in the church at the ceremony if they had an open casket, and I wouldn't have even wanted to look at that.
But times have changed and very often people who are spiritually inclined or religiously inclined, they actually lose that fear that we were talking about.
(13:55):
I see Callie's very much with us today, isn't she?
She's our executive producer.
I don't know why she thinks that's a really good view.
In fact, I've totally lost the point.
What was I supposed to be talking about?
She threw me there.
Karen Wylie (14:08):
We were talking about feeling being in control of time and not feeling like you're up against this deadline as so many people do when they've had the home euthanasia done and a veterinarian is trying to give them some immediate grieving time.
Gail Pope (14:26):
Yes.
I think once you understand that it's not an illegal thing to have a dead body at home which is the bottom line there.
I think that's what most people are a little bit, "Oh my goodness! What are the rules? What am I allowed to do?" It's up to you what you're allowed to do.
Then the next thing happens that creeps into the mind is "What's going to happen to the body?"
(14:50):
The big one obviously, "Is it going to smell? What about rigor mortis? What exactly is that and what's involved?" They're big topics.
They're important topics because as Mother Nature, who is to me always the other doctor in the room, Mother Nature is still following her process of dying when biological death steps in.
(15:16):
So organs are still closing down and there are still processes, chemical processes going on in the body.
At some point there may be smell.
For the most part, a dead body doesn't start smelling until those processes are at that appropriate time and it's different for everybody.
(15:38):
Most animals that I've cared for actually don't smell for a few days.
Some have smelled actually during their dying process.
That was scary when that first happened.
It's "Oh my God, this is terrible, what's going on?" But it's just a part of the natural process.
It happens as when it does and it is part of a normal process of dying.
(16:02):
So I think those questions come next, "What to expect?"
If you expect these things then you're prepared.
The focus is honoring, "How do I want to honor this beautiful body? What do I want to do?"
For most old fashioned cultures and it still remains (16:18):
we wash, we groom, we make the body look beautiful.
We also remember that rigor mortis will set in.
Sometimes it sets in sooner and sometimes later.
Sometimes it lasts a very short period of time and sometimes it lasts a longer period of time.
(16:42):
But when rigor mortis sets in, as you and I know a lot of people don't know, if say for instance it's very normal for an animal or a human to stretch out as they're dying.
Then as the body relaxes, there may be one arm that sticks out over here or however the posture is which is okay.
(17:03):
It's normal and the body is limp.
However as you are honoring and preparing that body, putting them into lying on the side that they favored best— lying them as you would want to remember them is important to do because when rigor mortis sets in, the body will be firm.
You won't be able to move a paw that's in the wrong place or a head that's tilted a little bit.
(17:26):
So making them look to you comfortable is important and rigor mortis, again, can last anything from a few hours to a few days.
It can also set in again before death— actually is final.
Karen Wylie (17:43):
Yes, of course that's the unpredictability of a natural transition is observing that process and understanding that in a natural transition, every cell in the body doesn't die at the same time.
The organs are fading away in terms of their ability to function.
(18:05):
The areas furthest away from the heart that receive the least circulation— therefore the least oxygen.
The areas that are going to be dying sooner than others.
So it can be a process that takes a long period of time.
Just like you're saying, that could lead to earlier rigor.
But generally speaking, I think if we say to reposition the body within an hour or two.
Gail Pope (18:27):
Yes, I generally do it as soon as it is in my mind because you know it, we just don't know how soon it will set in or not.
Again, I think for me, it's my loved one.
I want to cuddle them.
I want to see them looking comfortable.
So if they don't look comfortable, I want to do it anyway.
I'm not thinking about
rigor mortis setting in.
(18:47):
I'm just thinking about
making them look comfortable.
It's part of, again, honoring the house that my loved one lived in.
Also remembering that because death has come, it doesn't mean they've gone.
We know we think of the word transition and sometimes I think when an animal has been dying for a long time, particularly if they're very old, I don't feel their presence.
(19:15):
It's as though the death has occurred and I don't feel anything.
Yet with others, the death occurs— I can feel them.
They're still here.
We feel their presence.
Human people talk about images that they're seeing as they're dying.
There are so many of the spooky type things that can occur that it can be a comforting time because although you have the body, the house that is empty now, you feel the presence.
(19:47):
So they're still there.
So you can smile and feel grateful for that.
Karen Wylie (19:51):
Yes, absolutely.
Gail Pope (19:53):
And that leads to honoring and you want to honor the house with them, "I don't know where you are but I sense you're here.
Look!
We are grooming, we are cleaning.
You looking so beautiful.
Aren't you proud of this house you live in?"
Karen Wylie (20:04):
I talk to them too.
I do.
I feel their presence especially as you're saying with the younger ones.
They often, I think, had hoped to be with us longer and perhaps that's part of why they stay longer.
Very often the older ones do leave sooner.
(20:24):
That's been my experience as well.
I don't know that you and I have talked about this, we talked so much about all these issues, but I'm not sure we've talked specifically about this before.
But if you think about so many of the stories you hear within families or now you can see on social media where an older individual, human individual is in the dying process but they might be a few days away.
(20:49):
You'll see them with their hands out stretched because they're having a conversation with a loved one who has passed over, has crossed over.
I always think of their ability where it's like they have one foot in and one foot out.
Then it's like they're in both dimensions and that's what allows them to begin to see, to hear and experience things that typical healthy person going about day-to-day life with a job is not as much into sensing the energy field, that someone who is in the dying process and focused on that is going to be able to sense.
(21:28):
I do feel our animals have that same ability.
So the older ones who are declining in the slower way, I think do come to a point where they're ready to leave.
Yet I still can feel their energy but it's not as much as the younger.
How about describing a little bit of the three-day honoring process that you usually proceed with at BrightHaven?
(21:51):
Because I remember you mentioning it that, from your reading, the energy of the body is still very much there in that three days.
Gail Pope (22:01):
Oh my goodness.
I think we can talk in detail about this on another podcast.
Basically, I feel totally comfortable after learning all sorts from different people.
A dear friend brought the idea to me of honoring the body for a period of time.
Possibly three days because it has been scientifically proven that energy stays with the body anywhere from the point of death all the way to weeks— couple of weeks even.
(22:34):
But in general, whether the being was young and strong or old and gradually dying, the average in the middle was around the three day period.
So I started researching and reading a little bit more.
After I had done, that's where the three day process came.
(22:54):
So for me, we call it the three day process but with some it's generally at least three days.
Sometimes only one or two days because we know she's not here, she's gone.
It's about us and when we are comfortable.
So that will dictate how we do it.
(23:17):
But for most it's three days and sometimes we will keep a body even longer because it just feels the right thing to do.
When time comes then we wrap them up.
I think for me, one of the traditions that I actually have come to cherish is after I've taken their body and wrapped it up beautifully and everything, then I take my altar that has been decorated for each one.
(23:43):
There's different ornaments, different toys, teddies, hair, crystals, whatever has seemed important to honor this being.
Then it's taking those back because they sit all around my house in various places and most on the altar but other ornaments that may be precious and just remind me of them.
So just actually putting everything back where it was, gives me pleasure too.
(24:07):
I walk around my house and I can sit here in the office and I can see things that remind me of at least a hundred different animals.
That always brings joy.
Karen Wylie (24:17):
One thing we haven't specifically discussed is ice and especially if someone was pursuing the three day honoring system or a day or two.
Certainly depending on where they live and whether their environment is hot or cold makes a difference.
So can you speak to that for how you would encourage people to approach this?
Gail Pope (24:42):
For the most part, we would choose a basket or whatever we were going to honor the body in and the bedding that we wanted to use.
Then we would buy literally bags of ice.
We used to keep them in the freezer for if and when we might need them.
We'd put them in the bottom of the basket, maybe one or two, depending on the size of the animal, sometimes more.
(25:03):
And make sure that we could make the bed on top of them but not a very thick bed.
It's more about not freezing the body but keeping it cool.
Because if the weather is warm, again, it's that human fear of, "Oh God, is it going to smell?"
Well, it shouldn't— no.
So, we then have a thin layer of bedding then we lay the animal on top.
(25:24):
Then we decorate around depending on where we are in the room or even outdoors, and we check the ice.
Generally I would change the ice.
It varies.
Again, if we are outdoors, the ice may not need changing for a couple of days.
If it's indoors and the house is a little warmer than maybe it should be, you may need to change it more often.
(25:45):
Nothing's going to happen— people are worried, "The ice is melting. What am I going to do?"
It's okay, there isn't a death about to happen.
It's okay.
There's nothing bad.
I think it's perhaps more about, "Is it going to smell?" And if it does, that's a natural process.
That's a natural process anyway— you can spray essential oils, you can use all sorts of different things if you feel the need.
Karen Wylie (26:14):
But I think your point is that if people are going to have their pet with them let's say a day or more, they need to look at their climate.
How warm or cool they keep their home and be aware that a couple packs of ice underneath can prevent any of their fears of odor or something else happening.
(26:37):
So I think those are all great suggestions.
As so many things, I know this is one we can talk about for a really long time but one thing I wanted to bring up is when I choose to do this process.
I'm generally not able to do the three days but I aim for at least a day but having your pet die at home allows the other pets in the family to cope better.
(27:06):
They can interact with the body after the pet has died.
They can confirm for themselves that their friend, their loved one is no longer in that body.
It doesn't typically happen where they just walk up one time and sniff the body and say, "Oh, yes, they're gone."
(27:27):
At least that doesn't happen at my house.
As I've told you, I think my Aussies in particular, because they're used to being bossy.
They use their heads and noses a lot as they would if they were herding sheep with a beloved member of the family, they will go over and use their noses to try to nudge them and get them to move.
(27:47):
It's a very active process for several hours.
I do have to watch for that but I also allow for that because they understand what has happened and they may need a few hours to deal with it.
Others will know right away but I found a lot of them just need a few hours themselves to be with the pet's body in various ways.
(28:10):
Then they're able to grieve more effectively.
Gail Pope (28:13):
Yes.
I think it's important when we set up our honoring, it's generally on a table or on a something but I always start off at floor level so that the other animals have an easy way of just stopping by to say hi if they want to.
Some do and some don't.
Some aren't interested in the body.
(28:35):
Yet I know they were very close perhaps to that animal in life.
I can sense that they know this is the house— that she's not there.
Sometimes they'll sit and just be almost meditating and it's not about the body because I think they've already moved on with the one that's gone.
So I do see that if the animal had a particular bed.
(29:01):
That was like their favorite place that other animals tend to honor it and not use that bed.
So generally I would leave it down for a while so that they could walk round it but then maybe launder it and put it in a different part of the house and then they would all go to it.
That was okay.
Karen Wylie (29:19):
Yes, they're so aware of each other's belongings or accessories or favorite things.
Gail Pope (29:27):
It's part of honoring really.
It goes to that word again.
I think it really is honoring in their way not necessarily our way.
Karen Wylie (29:36):
Absolutely which is that balance we're all trying to find at the end of life because some of what we do is for us and much of what we do is for them.
Gail Pope (29:47):
That also begs something we've talked about a lot before which is that for the most part I've seen in the last 30, 40 years that animals grieve with the pet before the death.
So afterwards they can enter into the honoring period and not mourn.
(30:07):
Some do— you do see some who literally are head down in sorrow afterwards especially if it's been a fast death.
But they have this level of acceptance because they have grieved.
That's what I was taught by animals.
We talked about that I think in one of our most recent podcasts.
How that happened and as I look back, I think I was very honored to have learned that process because it does allow me to celebrate and honor the life with the being after their death.
(30:39):
I couldn't never have done that in the past.
Wow.
Karen Wylie (30:42):
And with every member of the family, furry— or four-legged or two-legged.
Sometimes when we're talking about these concepts, I laugh and it's not a nervous laugh.
It's just that there are aspects of the dying process or the after death process that I have really wonderful memories of.
So I can smile and I can laugh about it and I don't feel like I'm being disrespectful to anybody but I guess it's possible to somebody else.
(31:10):
It'd be like, "How can she laugh about that? How can she smile about that?"
If you do follow some of the ways that you and I try to do with our pets during their transition as their physical body dies and afterwards.
I have great peace about that.
So I have great memories when I'm able to handle things the way I want to handle them.
(31:34):
I give my babies the respect I think they deserve and share the time with my other pets so that everybody's getting comfortable with the new reality that we're going to be— minus a member of the family.
I think that feels good to me.
So when I reflect on those situations I do smile a lot about it because I feel good about how we handled it.
(31:56):
I don't know that other people would have that same feeling but I think you do when you reflect on...
Gail Pope (32:04):
yes, absolutely.
Absolutely.
Karen Wylie (32:07):
I think given our timeframe here, we'll end our discussion here.
Never a shortage of stories to tell and things to consider in making decisions about our pets.
We have, we did talk earlier about the peaceful checklist to become more aware of the things that a pet does and a pet's body does in the dying process.
(32:32):
So that PDF is available on the BrightPathForPets.com website and we'll include a link to it underneath the description to this episode.
I hope that even though this topic is not an easy one to consider and think about.
Those of you who've been with us now and listening to some of these comments and want to allow a peaceful death for your pet at home that you've received a little bit of guidance and perhaps some reassurance about the time available to you and what you can do and what you can begin to think about.
(33:07):
I guess the bottom line is each of us are very capable of managing this process for ourselves and our pets.
You love them.
You are not alone.
When the time comes, whether it's now or someday in the future, I hope you'll remember some of the things we talked about today.
You have everything you need inside of you to handle these kinds of situations.
(33:30):
I hope that if you do provide time with your pet at home after he or she has died, that it gives you a sense of peace.
I know that following these kinds of processes helps me and as Gail is saying, it's helped her a lot in coming to terms with our losses.
Until next time, I'm Karen Wylie with Gail Pope and as always we thank you for being with us.
(33:57):
Thank you now.
Bye-Bye.
Gail Pope (33:58):
We certainly do.
Thank you so much.
Until next time.
Thank you for joining us on Peace of Mind for Pet Parents.
We hope today's episode has offered you support and insight as you care for your aging or ill pets.
Remember, it's not just about the end.
It's about living well at every stage of life.
(34:19):
To continue your journey with us, explore more resources at BrightHaven Caregiver Academy's website— BrightPathForPets.com, where you'll find guides, assessments, and a caring community of pet parents like you.
Until next time, may you and your pets find comfort, connection, and peace in every moment.
(34:43):
Take care.
Welcome to Peace of Mind for Pet Parents, the podcast by BrightHaven Caregiver Academy.
I'm Gail Pope and I'm Karen Wylie and together we're here to support you in navigating life with your aging or ill pets.
We know how deeply you care for your beloved companions, and we're here to offer guidance, understanding, and resources for this meaningful journey.
(00:25):
Each episode we'll explore topics that address the daily challenges, emotional realities, and choices you face as a pet parent helping you and your pets find peace, comfort, and joy.
Whether it's making sense of a new diagnosis, adjusting to changing needs, or simply seeking a place to feel understood, you're not alone.
(00:47):
Thank you for being here with us.
Karen Wylie (00:50):
Hello and welcome to Peace of Mind for Pet Parents.
I'm Karen Wylie here with my friend Gail Pope.
This is a topic today that we've talked about doing for a while and would really like to— I'm sorry, I have a tail that's constantly knocking my notes.
Gail Pope (01:13):
Oh, wait.
Karen Wylie (01:14):
Like what the hell was I going to say there?
Okay, now she's sitting.
We'll see how long that lasts.
The thing is when you have pets— life is imperfect.
It just is!
You can't control when they're going to bump a screen or turn the microphone off or god knows what else.
You just have to have a "different" home if you're going to have pets and yes, it's never perfect, that's for sure.
(01:38):
So today's topic is one we've wanted to explore for a long time because it really addresses the quiet fears that most pet parents have and carry in their hearts and heads.
It's not really the fear of death itself but the question that follows it which is, "What do I do if my pet dies at home?"
(02:03):
So today we're going to explore and talk about some of the physical aspects of handling a pet's body after death.
Of course, also talk about the emotional context for each of us when we're handling our pet's bodies and perhaps making decisions about their body and how we want to be with the body or honor it in an ongoing way.
(02:34):
Gail let's start out, can we take a look at the different emotions that each of us has when our pet dies at home?
Each of us, especially you with a sanctuary, you certainly had more animals to have these experiences with than the average pet parent but I think there's just so many emotions you can have at that time.
(02:58):
Part of it is shock because even if you're prepared for it, your pet has been in the process of dying for a long time, you think that's going to keep going on forever and then it doesn't.
So there's still always an element of shock even if the death is expected.
Gail Pope (03:13):
Yes, it's a moment in time, isn't it?
It can go all the way from fear and shock to relief to floods of tears to almost like a cold stonelike acceptance and in the moment you are frozen.
It can happen in so many different ways.
(03:34):
So I think the first and most important thing is for the person to be with themselves for a little while.
I'm not suggesting they're not touching or being with the animal but to just bring themselves back down to earth.
For me sometimes, happily most often our animals have been taking a slow trajectory to the end.
(04:00):
When it comes, I'm not frozen inside, I'm relaxed.
I'm with them and they breathe their last.
It's as though I'm breathing it with them and I'm okay.
There aren't floods of tears.
Sometimes there are, sometimes they come a little later.
I think we're all different and it really is honoring our own selves and accepting this moment because it can be really hard.
(04:28):
If there's been a death that isn't the easiest thing in the world, a lot of deaths can be difficult, then there can be anger, fear, regret.
There are so many negative emotions that can hit.
I think fear is one of the big ones there.
It's a fear that isn't fearful of something about to happen.
(04:51):
It's that same reaction of, "Oh my God, that was awful!"
Luckily that doesn't happen very often but for a person who's not used to seeing death.
Isn't used to how the body moves during death and this is humans as well as animals.
Sometimes a human will be like on TV and they'll just take it a breath and they're gone.
(05:17):
Other times it will be more difficult and so it's the same with animals.
I guess that's why we developed the "Peaceful Checklist" so many moons ago because there are so many things, so many symptoms, if you like, that are common at the end of life in that dying process.
(05:40):
Because that can be so helpful to people to understand what's normal and what's not normal because I think this is where the fear comes in.
We are not sure when they're following the trajectory and you see maybe little neurological impulses in the body.
If you don't know that's perfectly normal as the mechanisms of the body, the chemical reactions are in progress.
(06:05):
That's normal.
So once you accept what is or can be normal.
Then when you see it, it's almost "Okay, yes. Got that, knew that."
So I think the more we can know about the process of birth as well— birthing and dying, their processes we honor them.
(06:25):
Maybe birth more than death in this part of our culture.
We honor them but we don't really delve deeper into them, most of us anyway.
When we do, it relieves a lot of the humanness we carry with us.
Karen Wylie (06:39):
That's a great point.
The peaceful checklist that is A PDF available on our website.
So I will make sure that a link is included below in the description for this podcast.
So if anyone's interested in downloading it, you'll be able to.
I'd like to go back to what you're talking about in terms of the fear of this unknown process because of course this is what you're talking about in terms of our culture.
(07:10):
Handling death and handling our loved one's bodies after death is something that we've been outsourcing for years.
It isn't how it used to be for humans or for pets.
Now of course if there is a fear of death or that not knowing of what to do well then euthanasia is the choice.
(07:37):
I think for those who are fearful, euthanasia is almost an automatic choice.
Then there are other people who don't know that allowing a natural transition at home is even an option.
Gail Pope (07:52):
Oh yes.
That's happened to me quite often when it's come up in perhaps in conversation towards the end of life.
Somebody has said, "What do you mean? I didn't even know that it was legal."
Again, with humans who die at home in bed, a lot of people think, "Oh, how much time do I have before I have to call the hospital? What do I do?"
(08:13):
So it really is hard, the subject is a real learning experience.
I guess I'm lucky in some ways and not in others that I've learned it over a lot of time.
But I remember how lost and alone I felt in the early days of having an animal die at home and not knowing quite what to do.
Having that old fashioned upbringing of, "Oh, I'm so scared. This is..." and I didn't even know what I was scared of.
(08:40):
Did I think there was a ghost in the room now or I don't know.
It's a fear that I grew up with— a dead body.
That's something I had to learn, to honor it as the house that my loved one lived in.
When you turn it or when I turned it to that understanding, of course I'm going to honor this body.
The word dead isn't important.
(09:01):
This is the house that they lived in and I want it to look nice.
I want to celebrate it.
I want to celebrate them too but they're not living in this house now.
I really want to honor them by doing this.
Karen Wylie (09:16):
And honoring them at home in such a variety of ways, which we'll continue to talk about, allows people to grieve differently and longer than euthanasia at home— perhaps with a mobile vet who also will then take the body with them when they leave.
(09:37):
Although the opportunity to choose a home euthanasia is a wonderful option for people who want it for situations where that's the right thing to do.
Everything is condensed together where the vet arrives, there's the euthanasia itself.
Although the vets are allowing sometime for the pet parents to grieve about the reality that their pet who was alive 10 minutes ago is now gone they generally are going to leave within 20 to 30 minutes after the euthanasia and they'll be taking the body with them.
(10:15):
When I think of euthanasia, whether at home or certainly at the clinic, there are so many reasons why euthanasia is chosen and is a good and helpful thing to have.
Cremation for people who live in apartments, for example, and and don't have a yard to bury their pet or a cemetery could be very far away.
(10:41):
Cremation is sometimes the only option available for people but the time is compressed.
You don't have the same amount of time to grieve and spend time just being with your pet's body with the house that they lived in.
That's where taking the time to understand the options you do have, if you want to have a wake for your pet at home.
(11:09):
Just like people used to do with their loved ones at home.
Now of course we outsource it to the funeral homes but your loved one could stay at home for various periods of time.
We won't go down the human road too long and talk about the cultural issues but for our pets let's talk a little bit about how much time we have with our pet's body.
(11:32):
Because I think that's almost the number one question that people have.
First are they allowed to keep their pet at home?
Then I know we've talked to clients who say that when they call a crematorium to ask, how long can I keep my pet at home?
They say just a few hours.
You've got to get them here right away.
(11:53):
That is not actually true.
So can you walk us through the timeframes and options that most pet parents have if they want to consider them?
Gail Pope (12:07):
I don't know that there is a timeframe.
I think that it's up to us.
It's up to setting our own honoring schedule, if you like.
When an animal's died, whether they're at home, whether they're in the hospital, whether the veterinarian is at your home— I think the first thing that I found is that people don't understand sometimes that if they want to keep the animal to honor them for a few days or however long, or even a few hours, that's okay.
(12:40):
They can say to the vet, "Thank you so much." These days at home veterinarians do such a wonderful job.
They bring ceremony and honoring into the process.
People don't understand at that point, they can accept that and say, "Now I'm going to keep him for a day or two. I'll let you know when I would like to bring him in or when he gets collected."
(13:01):
Because then you're up against a deadline and that doesn't feel good.
So I think being comfortable with the dead body is probably the first part.
Then just thinking about what feels right or appropriate to you.
Years ago if someone had this conversation with me, I would've been saying, "Oh, is it that time? I think I need to go now,."
(13:26):
Because it wasn't in my nature to understand the fact that I might want to honor someone after.
To me, you might do that in the church at the ceremony if they had an open casket, and I wouldn't have even wanted to look at that.
But times have changed and very often people who are spiritually inclined or religiously inclined, they actually lose that fear that we were talking about.
(13:55):
I see Callie's very much with us today, isn't she?
She's our executive producer.
I don't know why she thinks that's a really good view.
In fact, I've totally lost the point.
What was I supposed to be talking about?
She threw me there.
Karen Wylie (14:08):
We were talking about feeling being in control of time and not feeling like you're up against this deadline as so many people do when they've had the home euthanasia done and a veterinarian is trying to give them some immediate grieving time.
Gail Pope (14:26):
Yes.
I think once you understand that it's not an illegal thing to have a dead body at home which is the bottom line there.
I think that's what most people are a little bit, "Oh my goodness! What are the rules? What am I allowed to do?" It's up to you what you're allowed to do.
Then the next thing happens that creeps into the mind is "What's going to happen to the body?"
(14:50):
The big one obviously, "Is it going to smell? What about rigor mortis? What exactly is that and what's involved?" They're big topics.
They're important topics because as Mother Nature, who is to me always the other doctor in the room, Mother Nature is still following her process of dying when biological death steps in.
(15:16):
So organs are still closing down and there are still processes, chemical processes going on in the body.
At some point there may be smell.
For the most part, a dead body doesn't start smelling until those processes are at that appropriate time and it's different for everybody.
(15:38):
Most animals that I've cared for actually don't smell for a few days.
Some have smelled actually during their dying process.
That was scary when that first happened.
It's "Oh my God, this is terrible, what's going on?" But it's just a part of the natural process.
It happens as when it does and it is part of a normal process of dying.
(16:02):
So I think those questions come next, "What to expect?"
If you expect these things then you're prepared.
The focus is honoring, "How do I want to honor this beautiful body? What do I want to do?"
For most old fashioned cultures and it still remains (16:18):
we wash, we groom, we make the body look beautiful.
We also remember that rigor mortis will set in.
Sometimes it sets in sooner and sometimes later.
Sometimes it lasts a very short period of time and sometimes it lasts a longer period of time.
(16:42):
But when rigor mortis sets in, as you and I know a lot of people don't know, if say for instance it's very normal for an animal or a human to stretch out as they're dying.
Then as the body relaxes, there may be one arm that sticks out over here or however the posture is which is okay.
(17:03):
It's normal and the body is limp.
However as you are honoring and preparing that body, putting them into lying on the side that they favored best— lying them as you would want to remember them is important to do because when rigor mortis sets in, the body will be firm.
You won't be able to move a paw that's in the wrong place or a head that's tilted a little bit.
(17:26):
So making them look to you comfortable is important and rigor mortis, again, can last anything from a few hours to a few days.
It can also set in again before death— actually is final.
Karen Wylie (17:43):
Yes, of course that's the unpredictability of a natural transition is observing that process and understanding that in a natural transition, every cell in the body doesn't die at the same time.
The organs are fading away in terms of their ability to function.
(18:05):
The areas furthest away from the heart that receive the least circulation— therefore the least oxygen.
The areas that are going to be dying sooner than others.
So it can be a process that takes a long period of time.
Just like you're saying, that could lead to earlier rigor.
But generally speaking, I think if we say to reposition the body within an hour or two.
Gail Pope (18:27):
Yes, I generally do it as soon as it is in my mind because you know it, we just don't know how soon it will set in or not.
Again, I think for me, it's my loved one.
I want to cuddle them.
I want to see them looking comfortable.
So if they don't look comfortable, I want to do it anyway.
I'm not thinking about
rigor mortis setting in.
(18:47):
I'm just thinking about
making them look comfortable.
It's part of, again, honoring the house that my loved one lived in.
Also remembering that because death has come, it doesn't mean they've gone.
We know we think of the word transition and sometimes I think when an animal has been dying for a long time, particularly if they're very old, I don't feel their presence.
(19:15):
It's as though the death has occurred and I don't feel anything.
Yet with others, the death occurs— I can feel them.
They're still here.
We feel their presence.
Human people talk about images that they're seeing as they're dying.
There are so many of the spooky type things that can occur that it can be a comforting time because although you have the body, the house that is empty now, you feel the presence.
(19:47):
So they're still there.
So you can smile and feel grateful for that.
Karen Wylie (19:51):
Yes, absolutely.
Gail Pope (19:53):
And that leads to honoring and you want to honor the house with them, "I don't know where you are but I sense you're here.
Look!
We are grooming, we are cleaning.
You looking so beautiful.
Aren't you proud of this house you live in?"
Karen Wylie (20:04):
I talk to them too.
I do.
I feel their presence especially as you're saying with the younger ones.
They often, I think, had hoped to be with us longer and perhaps that's part of why they stay longer.
Very often the older ones do leave sooner.
(20:24):
That's been my experience as well.
I don't know that you and I have talked about this, we talked so much about all these issues, but I'm not sure we've talked specifically about this before.
But if you think about so many of the stories you hear within families or now you can see on social media where an older individual, human individual is in the dying process but they might be a few days away.
(20:49):
You'll see them with their hands out stretched because they're having a conversation with a loved one who has passed over, has crossed over.
I always think of their ability where it's like they have one foot in and one foot out.
Then it's like they're in both dimensions and that's what allows them to begin to see, to hear and experience things that typical healthy person going about day-to-day life with a job is not as much into sensing the energy field, that someone who is in the dying process and focused on that is going to be able to sense.
(21:28):
I do feel our animals have that same ability.
So the older ones who are declining in the slower way, I think do come to a point where they're ready to leave.
Yet I still can feel their energy but it's not as much as the younger.
How about describing a little bit of the three-day honoring process that you usually proceed with at BrightHaven?
(21:51):
Because I remember you mentioning it that, from your reading, the energy of the body is still very much there in that three days.
Gail Pope (22:01):
Oh my goodness.
I think we can talk in detail about this on another podcast.
Basically, I feel totally comfortable after learning all sorts from different people.
A dear friend brought the idea to me of honoring the body for a period of time.
Possibly three days because it has been scientifically proven that energy stays with the body anywhere from the point of death all the way to weeks— couple of weeks even.
(22:34):
But in general, whether the being was young and strong or old and gradually dying, the average in the middle was around the three day period.
So I started researching and reading a little bit more.
After I had done, that's where the three day process came.
(22:54):
So for me, we call it the three day process but with some it's generally at least three days.
Sometimes only one or two days because we know she's not here, she's gone.
It's about us and when we are comfortable.
So that will dictate how we do it.
(23:17):
But for most it's three days and sometimes we will keep a body even longer because it just feels the right thing to do.
When time comes then we wrap them up.
I think for me, one of the traditions that I actually have come to cherish is after I've taken their body and wrapped it up beautifully and everything, then I take my altar that has been decorated for each one.
(23:43):
There's different ornaments, different toys, teddies, hair, crystals, whatever has seemed important to honor this being.
Then it's taking those back because they sit all around my house in various places and most on the altar but other ornaments that may be precious and just remind me of them.
So just actually putting everything back where it was, gives me pleasure too.
(24:07):
I walk around my house and I can sit here in the office and I can see things that remind me of at least a hundred different animals.
That always brings joy.
Karen Wylie (24:17):
One thing we haven't specifically discussed is ice and especially if someone was pursuing the three day honoring system or a day or two.
Certainly depending on where they live and whether their environment is hot or cold makes a difference.
So can you speak to that for how you would encourage people to approach this?
Gail Pope (24:42):
For the most part, we would choose a basket or whatever we were going to honor the body in and the bedding that we wanted to use.
Then we would buy literally bags of ice.
We used to keep them in the freezer for if and when we might need them.
We'd put them in the bottom of the basket, maybe one or two, depending on the size of the animal, sometimes more.
(25:03):
And make sure that we could make the bed on top of them but not a very thick bed.
It's more about not freezing the body but keeping it cool.
Because if the weather is warm, again, it's that human fear of, "Oh God, is it going to smell?"
Well, it shouldn't— no.
So, we then have a thin layer of bedding then we lay the animal on top.
(25:24):
Then we decorate around depending on where we are in the room or even outdoors, and we check the ice.
Generally I would change the ice.
It varies.
Again, if we are outdoors, the ice may not need changing for a couple of days.
If it's indoors and the house is a little warmer than maybe it should be, you may need to change it more often.
(25:45):
Nothing's going to happen— people are worried, "The ice is melting. What am I going to do?"
It's okay, there isn't a death about to happen.
It's okay.
There's nothing bad.
I think it's perhaps more about, "Is it going to smell?" And if it does, that's a natural process.
That's a natural process anyway— you can spray essential oils, you can use all sorts of different things if you feel the need.
Karen Wylie (26:14):
But I think your point is that if people are going to have their pet with them let's say a day or more, they need to look at their climate.
How warm or cool they keep their home and be aware that a couple packs of ice underneath can prevent any of their fears of odor or something else happening.
(26:37):
So I think those are all great suggestions.
As so many things, I know this is one we can talk about for a really long time but one thing I wanted to bring up is when I choose to do this process.
I'm generally not able to do the three days but I aim for at least a day but having your pet die at home allows the other pets in the family to cope better.
(27:06):
They can interact with the body after the pet has died.
They can confirm for themselves that their friend, their loved one is no longer in that body.
It doesn't typically happen where they just walk up one time and sniff the body and say, "Oh, yes, they're gone."
(27:27):
At least that doesn't happen at my house.
As I've told you, I think my Aussies in particular, because they're used to being bossy.
They use their heads and noses a lot as they would if they were herding sheep with a beloved member of the family, they will go over and use their noses to try to nudge them and get them to move.
(27:47):
It's a very active process for several hours.
I do have to watch for that but I also allow for that because they understand what has happened and they may need a few hours to deal with it.
Others will know right away but I found a lot of them just need a few hours themselves to be with the pet's body in various ways.
(28:10):
Then they're able to grieve more effectively.
Gail Pope (28:13):
Yes.
I think it's important when we set up our honoring, it's generally on a table or on a something but I always start off at floor level so that the other animals have an easy way of just stopping by to say hi if they want to.
Some do and some don't.
Some aren't interested in the body.
(28:35):
Yet I know they were very close perhaps to that animal in life.
I can sense that they know this is the house— that she's not there.
Sometimes they'll sit and just be almost meditating and it's not about the body because I think they've already moved on with the one that's gone.
So I do see that if the animal had a particular bed.
(29:01):
That was like their favorite place that other animals tend to honor it and not use that bed.
So generally I would leave it down for a while so that they could walk round it but then maybe launder it and put it in a different part of the house and then they would all go to it.
That was okay.
Karen Wylie (29:19):
Yes, they're so aware of each other's belongings or accessories or favorite things.
Gail Pope (29:27):
It's part of honoring really.
It goes to that word again.
I think it really is honoring in their way not necessarily our way.
Karen Wylie (29:36):
Absolutely which is that balance we're all trying to find at the end of life because some of what we do is for us and much of what we do is for them.
Gail Pope (29:47):
That also begs something we've talked about a lot before which is that for the most part I've seen in the last 30, 40 years that animals grieve with the pet before the death.
So afterwards they can enter into the honoring period and not mourn.
(30:07):
Some do— you do see some who literally are head down in sorrow afterwards especially if it's been a fast death.
But they have this level of acceptance because they have grieved.
That's what I was taught by animals.
We talked about that I think in one of our most recent podcasts.
How that happened and as I look back, I think I was very honored to have learned that process because it does allow me to celebrate and honor the life with the being after their death.
(30:39):
I couldn't never have done that in the past.
Wow.
Karen Wylie (30:42):
And with every member of the family, furry— or four-legged or two-legged.
Sometimes when we're talking about these concepts, I laugh and it's not a nervous laugh.
It's just that there are aspects of the dying process or the after death process that I have really wonderful memories of.
So I can smile and I can laugh about it and I don't feel like I'm being disrespectful to anybody but I guess it's possible to somebody else.
(31:10):
It'd be like, "How can she laugh about that? How can she smile about that?"
If you do follow some of the ways that you and I try to do with our pets during their transition as their physical body dies and afterwards.
I have great peace about that.
So I have great memories when I'm able to handle things the way I want to handle them.
(31:34):
I give my babies the respect I think they deserve and share the time with my other pets so that everybody's getting comfortable with the new reality that we're going to be— minus a member of the family.
I think that feels good to me.
So when I reflect on those situations I do smile a lot about it because I feel good about how we handled it.
(31:56):
I don't know that other people would have that same feeling but I think you do when you reflect on...
Gail Pope (32:04):
yes, absolutely.
Absolutely.
Karen Wylie (32:07):
I think given our timeframe here, we'll end our discussion here.
Never a shortage of stories to tell and things to consider in making decisions about our pets.
We have, we did talk earlier about the peaceful checklist to become more aware of the things that a pet does and a pet's body does in the dying process.
(32:32):
So that PDF is available on the BrightPathForPets.com website and we'll include a link to it underneath the description to this episode.
I hope that even though this topic is not an easy one to consider and think about.
Those of you who've been with us now and listening to some of these comments and want to allow a peaceful death for your pet at home that you've received a little bit of guidance and perhaps some reassurance about the time available to you and what you can do and what you can begin to think about.
(33:07):
I guess the bottom line is each of us are very capable of managing this process for ourselves and our pets.
You love them.
You are not alone.
When the time comes, whether it's now or someday in the future, I hope you'll remember some of the things we talked about today.
You have everything you need inside of you to handle these kinds of situations.
(33:30):
I hope that if you do provide time with your pet at home after he or she has died, that it gives you a sense of peace.
I know that following these kinds of processes helps me and as Gail is saying, it's helped her a lot in coming to terms with our losses.
Until next time, I'm Karen Wylie with Gail Pope and as always we thank you for being with us.
(33:57):
Thank you now.
Bye-Bye.
Gail Pope (33:58):
We certainly do.
Thank you so much.
Until next time.
Thank you for joining us on Peace of Mind for Pet Parents.
We hope today's episode has offered you support and insight as you care for your aging or ill pets.
Remember, it's not just about the end.
It's about living well at every stage of life.
(34:19):
To continue your journey with us, explore more resources at BrightHaven Caregiver Academy's website— BrightPathForPets.com, where you'll find guides, assessments, and a caring community of pet parents like you.
Until next time, may you and your pets find comfort, connection, and peace in every moment.
(34:43):
Take care.
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Crime Junkie
Does hearing about a true crime case always leave you scouring the internet for the truth behind the story? Dive into your next mystery with Crime Junkie. Every Monday, join your host Ashley Flowers as she unravels all the details of infamous and underreported true crime cases with her best friend Brit Prawat. From cold cases to missing persons and heroes in our community who seek justice, Crime Junkie is your destination for theories and stories you won’t hear anywhere else. Whether you're a seasoned true crime enthusiast or new to the genre, you'll find yourself on the edge of your seat awaiting a new episode every Monday. If you can never get enough true crime... Congratulations, you’ve found your people. Follow to join a community of Crime Junkies! Crime Junkie is presented by audiochuck Media Company.