How to Support Burnt-Out Teachers and Build a Thriving School Culture
In this episode of The Elemental Educator Podcast, host Tyler Comeau welcomes Brittany Thompson, an experienced administrator from East Texas, to discuss burnout, school culture, and the challenges of leadership. With over 16 years in education, including 8 years in administration, Brittany shares her insights on transforming struggling schools, building teacher morale, and fostering student success. Learn how to lead through adversity, support struggling teachers, and create a culture that inspires students and staff alike.
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TimeCodes:
0:00 - Introduction
5:57 - Grounded Moments
11:33 - Headwinds and Tailwinds
22:52 - Ripples of Change
32:08 - Spark or Burn
42:18 - Listener Questions
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Alchemists I just finished recording this episode with Brittany and I know you're gonnalove the conversation that we have.
(00:05):
We unpack everything from burnt out leaders, burnt out teachers, how to try to addressthose things, how to bring about change within an organization, one that you're already in
or one that you're getting picked up and moved over to and put down in.
So you're gonna wanna check out the full episode and stay tuned to the very end where weanswer a listener's question.
And stay tuned to the very end where we answer one of your listeners questions.
(00:43):
What do they say in Texas?
y'all?
Yeah?
Yeah.
Okay.
That's awesome.
What is your school's podcast on?
anywhere you can listen.
I don't know what platform they use to get it all done.
I, yeah, I should know more, but I don't.
(01:03):
I just know that I listened to it and it's very cute.
So this week their podcast is over the TikTok band.
And so it's really interesting because you would think middle schoolers sometimes, youknow, can be very, it's so stupid.
Like that's not cool, but they had some really insightful things.
to say so they always surprise me.
(01:26):
Yeah, for better or worse.
If you want to plug it at the end, by all means, take some time or even throughout theshow, feel free to talk about it.
All right, I'm gonna kick us off here.
Before I do that though, Brittany, can I get you, this is just for my thumbnail shot.
Can I get you to look to your right and just say, hello, my name is Brittany.
(01:50):
Okay, hello, my name is Brittany.
And like a full on like turn to like this way.
Yeah.
okay.
And say hello, my name is Brittany.
Okay, okay.
I'm going to clip me going this way and saying, hello, my name is Tyler.
And it's just a still image, but it's going to look like we're having a conversation thisway.
So there we go.
(02:11):
OK, I'm going to get us started.
okay.
me change one thing here.
Alchemists, welcome to episode 54 of the Elemental Educator podcast.
I'm your host Tyler, and thank you so much for joining our community for anotherincredible connection.
If you're here for the first time, welcome to a place where we redefine leadership andchallenge the status quo.
Take a minute before continuing the episode to subscribe to our YouTube at Elementalunderscore educator, where we upload all of our videos and additional leadership content
(02:38):
meant for anyone looking to grow.
For those returning alchemists, take some time to expand our community and share thisplatform.
with one other person today.
I'm so thankful for your passion and dedication to being better together.
Now get ready to let the alchemy of education ignite your passion for learning.
Today, I'm thrilled to connect with Brittany Thompson, an educator from East Texas withover 16 years of experience, including eight years in administration.
(03:01):
She's passionate about fostering positive campus culture and climate.
She is dedicated to creating thriving school environments where students and staff cansucceed.
Welcome to the Elemental Educator podcast, Brittany.
It is a pleasure to have you here with us today.
Thank you, I am so happy to be here.
And before we jump in, is podcast number one for Brittany.
This is your first podcast.
(03:24):
hoping to make it fun, hoping to make it lively.
This is a video podcast.
So you're actually getting two for one here.
You're getting the audio and the video podcast at the end of it.
Now, right before we pressed record, though, you shared that your school has a podcast.
They do.
I have a group of seventh and eighth graders that have started a content creation classthis year and they have a podcast and a blog.
(03:44):
So I don't have it right off the top of my head, but I will link it on my Instagram.
Yeah, and we'll link it into the description of the show notes of this episode so peoplecan go check it out if they want to.
And at the point of this conversation, you know, when this episode is released,unfortunately, TikTok will already have been banned, maybe saved, who knows where it's
going to be.
But their recent conversation that they're unpacking with you right now is the ban ofTikTok.
(04:08):
Now, I got incredibly off topic here.
So I want to start with the big question for us, which is how did you get to where you arenow, Brittany?
So I taught choir and elementary music for almost 10 years.
It was about eight.
But I remember, this is horrible to admit, but one year I worked for an administrationthat was less than stellar.
(04:33):
And I had been looking, I'd been itching to get out of the classroom and like do my nextstep, but I knew it needed to be an education.
And I just remember one moment in particular, I thought,
Yeah, this is the time because teachers need more support than that.
And so it just kind of lit a fire in me to jump in with both feet and the rest is history.
Here I am.
(04:55):
There we go.
Now, before you even got into education, let's go all the way back to that.
What was the driving moment, like four years, right?
What was the driving moment that made you want to even get into the field?
I was a junior in high school.
remember because before then I wanted to do something medical which anybody who knows mewould laugh at that.
(05:16):
it doesn't seem like I truly am made to do this.
But I was in choir class and my choir director said, how awesome is my job that I get tosit here and listen to students sing to me all day?
And I just remember thinking.
Well yeah, music at that moment was my passion.
That's what I love to do.
So why wouldn't I go into that and want to ignite that passion in other students?
(05:40):
So that's really what pushed me to get into music education.
Love that.
And the segue into leadership, like you said, you saw a problem, you wanted to help be apart of the solution to it.
So it drove you towards that, which is so great to hear and sets us up for success toreally get into what we value, which brings us to the first segment of our show.
(06:00):
Rooted in wisdom, driven by purpose, welcome to grounded moments.
And to build some momentum here, I want to start by asking you, what's one thing groundingyou in what you're doing now?
my passion to serve and that's for both students and teachers.
That's just really what I when I make decisions every day, that's where I go to.
(06:21):
Is this best for teachers?
Is this best for students?
Great questions to ask, even outside of education, just as a general CEO manager, is thisbest for our organization?
Is this best for the people I oversee?
And then try to make those decisions around that.
Now, before the show, I asked you to provide a quote that resonates with you.
And the quote you chose is, to whom much is given, much is required, Luke 12.48.
(06:45):
Can I get you to break down how you found this quote and why you picked it?
Sure.
So I am a person of faith.
My faith is another thing that is very essential to me.
And I found this quote again, well, I was probably in college when it started reallysinking in, you know, in high school things are kind of surface.
But at that moment I was about to graduate and I just remember thinking, man, I'm going tohave a classroom of, you know, I'm a music teacher.
(07:13):
So I have at any point like 50 kids in a classroom.
But my impact is the entire campus.
That's huge.
And I just felt like to be entrusted with those students and with the knowledge that I'dbe giving them meant that I needed to pay a lot of attention to my craft and to my
practice in the field.
So I took it very seriously.
(07:34):
And it's just rolled right with me going into leadership with teachers on our campus.
know, again, I've been impacted in many different ways as a teacher.
And so as a leader, I try to reflect on that and realize that I'm not dealing with justschool district employees, I'm dealing with people.
And so I have been entrusted to lead a group of people who are leading our greatest assetin the world, which is our children.
(08:00):
So that's why that is my quote.
And it's a great quote to bring in and to live by, and you kind of answered the nextquestion, which is how does it show up in your workflow there?
What I wanna go into is in public systems, Catholic systems, depending on which systemyou're in, this quote can carry extra weight to it.
In a public setting, how do you tiptoe the line then of bringing in potentially areligious quote to then push an action within your organization?
(08:25):
Yeah, so I am in East Texas and we are still very much, there are certain things that Icannot say to students and there are definitely times that I will let my teachers know
like if I feel like I need to pray about something, I'm respectful of what their beliefsare and it's definitely not anything that I'm forcing people to do.
(08:48):
But I do think that at the heart of a lot of our literature, at the heart of a lot of ourwisdom, is the Bible.
And so if you need to view it as a piece of literature, then that's what some people do.
But I have a lot of teachers that work for me that are people of faith.
And so I think it resonates.
Like you said, it's a good quote, whether you read it as something faith-based or not, butit does resonate differently for people with faith.
(09:12):
We are...
in the Bible Belt.
And so that is something that's not as taboo in this part of the country as it is in otherparts of the country.
But I still am very careful to respect those around me.
I'm not ignorant to think that everybody believes the same way that I do, and I wouldnever want to make anybody feel uncomfortable.
(09:33):
So that's kind of how I try to approach that.
And standing aside, if it wasn't cited, the words on it are just as important in what it'sasking us to action, right?
Which is what you've alluded to, which is great to see.
Brittany, have you heard of an elevator pitch before?
Okay.
So again, 10 to 20 second pitch here, your idea on this quote, how it should be gettingaction, the valid message behind it that you value.
(09:58):
And we're going to see how we do.
So whenever you're ready, sell us, well, I'm not gonna run a timer.
Maybe I should in this segment though.
Well, now you got me thinking, maybe I should add an animated time.
No, we won't do it.
Yeah, a whole level of pressure to it.
So let's hear your pitch on why people should be valuing this and consider it important.
(10:21):
So I believe that people deserve every, the basic right that humans get, which istolerance and decency.
Like we're gonna treat each other the way we want it to be treated, which is pullinganother Bible verse in there.
However, it's important when making decisions that you consider those around you and theimpact that those decisions are going to have.
(10:42):
And so if I'm given much, which is the leadership of a school,
then much will be required of me to handle that school, those people, the children, theadults with care.
How did I do?
Great, I didn't even start my timer.
I just wanted to listen to what you had to say and it was powerful and it was awesome.
And it brings me back to a quote of, with great power comes great responsibility.
(11:04):
And that's very similar to who much is given, much is required.
And the action behind it, it's just a good reminder to anybody in any position, whetheryou're a teacher, a leader, a CEO of an organization, a manager, a parent in any way,
shape or form, right?
You have much given to you.
So you are required to give much back, right?
And return that.
(11:25):
And that's where we go from there.
Now, along the way of having to action that, there is going to be some adversity along theway where we're gonna lean on this quote, which brings us to our next segment of headwinds
and tailwinds.
Through storms and surges, discover the lessons from headwinds and tailwinds, where wefocus on the challenge that tests us and the forces that help us move forward.
(11:46):
So let's set the stage here, and can you share a time where you faced a piece ofsignificant adversity?
Sure.
I have a couple that come to mind.
One specifically as an administrator was when I walked into my first principalshipposition.
Love the district that I'm in.
It's a great school, but we were walking in.
The state of Texas rates your schools once you get your accountability turned in.
(12:11):
And this particular school was rated an F.
And so walking into, which was a sudden
I think, how did you say it, did it feel like it was a sudden storm or a slow build up?
It was a sudden storm.
Yes.
Which, no.
Yes.
And I have other opinions about that, but you didn't ask me yet.
(12:33):
So, it was a sudden storm for me, but I became quickly aware that it was a slow build forthe campus.
And so, that was something where this quote again,
came into play knowing that I was about to lead a group that was in the middle of theirstorm.
A lot of them felt very defeated.
A lot of them felt very discouraged.
(12:54):
Their principal was not there anymore, which was heartbreaking for many of them.
So I was walking into a touchy situation at best.
Now, would you have felt if the script was flipped, if it was an A rated school, would youfeel like there was more given or is that a situation where you're perceiving it as less
given?
(13:14):
Because I'm interpreting this as with an F rated school, there's much more given, there'smuch more responsibility here, but the flip argument could be made as, we're already just
an F school, can, we're like this, yeah.
So, actually the school that I'm at now walked into an A.
Pressure's completely different.
Completely different.
(13:35):
The thing with walking into a school where teachers are doubting themselves is that youhave to, as a leader, number one, try to figure out where the breakdown is without
offending anybody or devaluing anybody.
But then also restoring a bit of confidence in their abilities.
(13:56):
Spoiler alert, we did not stay in F after that year.
We made a lot of great gains and it was the same teachers that I started with.
And so they had it.
They knew what needed to happen.
There were many factors at play there that I won't get into to protect people, but...
when you get to that point where you start doubting what your calling is, that's heavy.
(14:19):
That's heavy.
So on that side of it, was a lot, it was a lot more difficult to walk into a situationlike that.
When you're walking into an A campus, which is the campus that I'm on now and love dearly,then you're walking into and thinking like, man, if I make any changes and then it goes
down, like, have I wrecked this school?
(14:40):
So it's different kind of pressure.
But when you're handling,
Fragile people, I feel like that's a little bit more heavy.
Right, and it's difficult to walk into that situation.
You mentioned it yourself in balance between wanting to build a positive relationship andto put it bluntly also acknowledging that this kind of sucks right now and something needs
to change.
(15:00):
And then to bring about that change, it can't just come from you and how do you get thatownership?
You've clearly found the magic and Brittany, there's a book in the works here by you Ifeel that could talk about.
you know, from F to A and see what it looks like.
And in that book, you could unpack this whole grading system.
That's a big flaw in itself.
So with that though, you you mentioned in that year, you were able to turn that schoolaround.
(15:25):
What was a pivotal turning point where things started to shift?
So I was able, I was so lucky that year to be able to bring my assistant principal thatwas with me at the campus before.
So we already had some chemistry going, which I think was great.
Like we had a very strong leadership team, but we decided that summer as we were planningfor the school year that we were gonna focus on three things throughout the year and that
(15:51):
was it.
We were just gonna drive those three things.
And so student culture, we looked at
Successful student outcomes and then teacher morale.
So what does the student community look like?
How do the students interact with each other?
What can we do to build community amongst the kids?
(16:12):
Because discipline was a little bit of an issue walking in.
And then with the successful student outcomes, it was like, let's get back to basics.
Let's figure out what works for these guys.
Let's figure out where our teachers are strong and just lean in there.
Like just, I think a lot of times in education, there are so many new, like latest andgreatest that things get lost in translation.
(16:36):
And we forget what our bread and butter is, which is building relationship with kids andthen leaning into the content.
Like let's just get back to basics.
So we tried to pull a lot off them that they had in years prior.
And then the last one,
I'm trying to make sure I didn't already staff morale.
(16:57):
Which, you know, there's a lot of little tag lines out there.
Morale is more than Sonic drinks.
But I'm going to tell you right now, Sonic drink does a lot for a teacher in the middle ofthe day.
So we tried to plan some really uplifting things, but then also we tried to be reallyintentional with the conversations.
after evaluations or just in the hallway or in the break room, just spending timevalidating them and what they brought to our team and what they brought to these students.
(17:26):
And that year we made a C and then the next year we were a B and then I moved campuses.
But we, I'm extremely proud of the staff and what they were able to accomplish just inthat year.
But yeah, it,
We overcomplicate it too many times.
Absolutely we do.
And one thing that I love about the province that I'm in is we have a teacher qualitystandard, leader quality standard, superintendent leadership quality standard.
(17:53):
And the first standard, no matter where you are on that journey, is effectiverelationships.
And it brings it back to the root of you should be putting these first beyond anythingelse, because if you don't have a connection, you're not going to make any progress with
anything that you're trying to do.
So I love that you're sharing that as well and that it's not just here.
(18:15):
Although what is just there is Sonic.
We don't have Sonics here.
I can't bring somebody there Sonic drink.
We can bring them at Tim Hortons.
We can bring them a Starbucks.
So, you know, we got some things that kind of work for us in our way.
Same general idea.
Yeah, definitely might not be as good though.
I might have to try out a Sonic one day.
Well, there you go.
Jam packed.
Now with this though, we talk about this movement and this incredible feat of
(18:39):
turning around an entire organization and a system behind it.
That's not all sunshine and rainbows because there probably were days where you'requestioning if what you're doing is right.
There's moments of frustration.
What helped anchor you and stay grounded during that adversity?
What was kind of the wind at your back?
So I think anybody, and it probably is way expanded than just to education, but anybody inthis field, especially in the administration field, you need to have a circle of people
(19:10):
that either are doing the same thing you're doing or have done what you're doing, just arereally close.
And I'm not, I love the social media community.
I think it's great, but like I have a circle of friends.
There are four of us and all four of us have been in administration, some up tosuperintendent and one is a school counselor and we've all been in the administration
(19:36):
role.
They're not in my district.
And so I feel like I can be candid with them.
You have to be careful when you're talking to people who are in the same area you are,especially when you're needing to vent or bounce ideas about different things.
So I think it's really important to build
very close community of people that know your heart and know your vision and are there tochampion that with you but are also there to say, hey, you need to rethink that.
(20:04):
Like, let's take a moment because on those days where I'm feeling extremely frustrated, Imight say something to them that they're like, no, yeah, I get it.
Don't say that out loud in front of your staff.
And I need that.
I need somebody to check me on that sometimes because
you know, there are really frustrating moments.
(20:24):
There are very low moments where it just kind of feels like, geez, can I do anything rightin this moment?
Or have I just completely dug this hole a little bit deeper?
So I think that's a very important piece of success and leadership is your circle.
That's such a strong message to send as well.
And as a leader anywhere, if you can establish it where the people that you work withallow you to be a part of that circle and show that vulnerability with you as the leader,
(20:55):
man, have you ever created an effective system, right?
I'm so thankful to have a space where people that I collaborate with are people that Ialso work with as well.
And we can.
Openly bounce these ideas off of each other knowing that hey we are here and aligned tothe same goal Which is something you said earlier.
How are we putting kids first?
How are we putting stuff first?
Outside of education, how are you putting whatever your organization's goal is first andwhen that's what the conversation is aligned to you can be vulnerable blunt and Open with
(21:25):
the people you work with because you're trying to align to that same vision So for peoplefacing their own headwinds
What's one thing they can do to move forward despite whatever adversity or storm theycould be facing?
I would say to take a moment.
My dad used to say like, don't let the bird build a nest.
(21:46):
So like if you have a lot going on, take a moment to ground yourself in what truth is andthen remember what your purpose is.
Remember your why.
We hear that all the time.
But listen, it's really true when you're in the middle of a lot, whether it's a lot ofgood things happening, that's just really stressful.
or requires a lot of your mental energy, or it's a more heavy, discouraging moment to sitdown and then be reflective of, okay, why did we start?
(22:18):
Where are we going and what is our purpose?
Like, just take a moment to yourself.
It'll all still be there when you walk out of your office or when you come back to workthe next day.
Everything's still gonna be there.
I just think that sometimes we try to move too fast.
That would be my number one piece of advice is just remember what your initial purposewas.
Did it get lost in the middle of all of this and how do we realign ourselves back to it?
(22:42):
taking that moment, hoping sometimes things go away doesn't always work.
So you and you're right, you do come back to that.
But that actually brings us to the next segment, which after we face this adversity, howdo we action our change?
Small shifts, big waves, this is ripples of change, where we dive into the power ofembracing change and making waves that last.
(23:03):
So Brittany, along the way, we've talked about things that you've put in place to makechange.
What's one of the recent changes that you've either led or embraced?
So here at the middle school, coming from elementary, one of the things that I noticedabout secondary is that our MTSS or response to intervention, RTI system, it's kind of,
(23:24):
it's hard to implement.
know, at elementary level, you have about 90 to 120 minutes of a block to work with thesesame kids.
Middle school man, you're running 47 minutes in and out.
So how do we do small group?
Is that even reasonable?
How do we serve students that are at tier two or tier three or are on a lower grade levelthan where they actually are?
(23:47):
How do we meet those needs?
And so that is a change that I started implementing last year.
It is a slow and steady change because one thing I am extremely aware of is how much weare asking our teachers to do.
And I don't want to add anything to that.
Most, I mean, I can't think of a teacher on my campus right now that is not alreadyserving all of their students.
(24:11):
This kind of goes into, okay, what's the next step?
How do we go deeper?
How do we push that kid who's right there?
How do we take time to address that need when we have 21 others?
Our classes here run about 21 students at the max.
We have
which I'm learning is a pretty reasonable ratio compared to some other schools.
(24:35):
I know I had a teacher come in from out of state that said she served, this was in anotherdistrict, but she served like 42 students in a classroom at one time.
That's insane.
So we thankfully are able to keep it at 21 or below.
It's still a lot of kids and it's still a lot of content, you know, when you have...
(24:55):
standardized testing breathing down your neck and you want to make sure that you're notteaching a test you want to teach children that's what their passion is so we're trying to
basically develop develop the plane while it's flying of how do we make this work for usfor this campus and there have been some moments where I can see the stress like fall but
(25:16):
we're getting there we're not there yet but we're getting there
one of the things you said earlier was that it was a slow process and a slow change.
One of the great and actually incredible things about a slow process and a slow change isthat it usually leads to consistency and it leads to something that's gonna stick after.
And it actually becomes a part of the school culture.
Those quick and sudden changes, sometimes needed and sometimes very good and powerful.
(25:40):
But usually after a very quick change, it's very tough to stay consistent with that quickchange because now all of the questions, all of the pushback and you keep hitting this
vicious cycle where if you can approach something slow, prolonged over time, that's howyou start to build it into culture.
That's how you start to infuse it into something that's going to be everlasting.
And speaking of that though, with change, there's usually two key moments, which is thatfirst step you take to make a change in the final move that makes it stick with this being
(26:07):
a slow change for you.
What was the first step that you've taken to address improving MTSS?
So we met as a staff and we started with just our reading and math teachers.
And so we looked at, because it was important for me to make it sustainable.
That was like one of the first things that I looked at when I'm implementing anything.
(26:29):
It's like crash dieting, right?
Like it'll never last if it's too extreme.
So I wanted it to be sustainable, but I also wanted it to be aligned with our district.
I don't want us to do all this work here at the middle school and then high school has acompletely different thing and then those kids get lost again when they get over there or
same for elementary like they they've done all of this work and now we're doing differentwe have to reinvent the wheel.
(26:54):
So we did a lot of work figuring out what it is that elementary is doing what programthey're using our region service center which is kind of like
In Texas, we serve under the Texas Education Agency and every region has their own servicecenter and they have a program that houses all the documentation for MTSS or RTI.
(27:16):
So we took some time last year getting to know the ins and out of that side of the programof how we're going to be documenting.
Because like I said, most of my teachers were already serving those kids.
It's just, we don't, I want to have a way to follow them.
and to make sure that they continue being served when they go to the next grade level andthe next grade level.
(27:37):
So that was the first step was really committing as a group to, okay, this is the piecethat we feel like we're missing.
Now let's figure out how to find it and make it work for us.
So that's been the part that's taken the longest is, you know, documentation takes a lotof time and I don't want to monopolize their conference time asking them to do all of this
(27:58):
documentation.
We're just troubleshooting and figuring out as we go, but that was the initial like, allright, we know we're doing this.
Now how can we add this to it and make it sustainable?
And with that, you know, it's a great idea and to hopefully build some momentum around it.
Usually along the way there are some unexpected setbacks.
What was one ripple effect within it that you didn't see coming?
(28:22):
So because I was coming from the elementary school, I kind of expected it to be an easysell, and it wasn't.
And if any of my current teachers listen to this, they will agree with me.
But I think it's because initially they felt like it was going to be a very hugeundertaking.
And I'll be honest, at times it has felt that way.
(28:42):
So last year we just
played around with the documentation of things and just doing that I think brought newideas to teachers' mind of, this is how I can serve this group of students during this
time and made it more meaningful to them.
They're more intentional with that.
This year, we were able to implement two new positions where they specifically focus onthat part of it, the documentation part of it, so the teachers aren't doing all the heavy
(29:09):
lifting on their own.
That was something that I saw honestly back in April.
thought man if we're gonna keep this moving at all I'm going to have to take some of theweight off of them because it's just a lot.
So that's kind of how we have solved that problem and now we're just continuing on withwhat the consistency is gonna look like over time.
(29:31):
How we're gonna create it, make it
become part of our culture and expectations on campus.
It's like you read my mind on my next question here that I'm bringing up because we justtalked about the prolongment leading to culture, hopefully infusing it in.
And people often worry that change won't last.
And I'm almost positive, even you as a leader, myself as a leader, there's things that wedream of doing and we start them and we go, wonder if this is gonna stick around and how
(29:55):
can I make it stick around?
What steps are you taking to make sure that this is actually something that is beinginfused into this culture?
Well, we're doing, you know, my assistant principal and I try to get out in the hallway,in the classrooms as much as we can.
And so we see this in action.
And the ability to be able to pinpoint it with certain teachers, like, no, that's all I'masking for.
(30:17):
Like, you're already doing it.
I think that was a big aha for some of them last year.
My thing is, I know that if it's gonna have the legs it needs to keep going, it's going tohave to feel natural.
And so just continuing to tweak along the way, I think is what it's gonna take to make itjust part of who we are.
(30:38):
You know, we're gonna continue to refine, refine, refine.
And before we know it, we're just adjusting what the norm is.
And so that's the hope.
I initially gave myself three years.
Like, we're gonna make this happen.
So when a new teacher comes on my campus,
in three years, this is gonna be part of the conversation with them.
(31:00):
And it'll be a norm for the rest of my staff, and so it'll be easy for them to talk about.
When they're able to communicate it with those who don't know, who are new to us, then Iknow it's like our kids, right?
When they can teach it, we know they've got it.
So that's the hope.
I'll be honest, there are times when I still am thinking like, okay.
(31:20):
Is this, do I need to pivot and start again and figure out another way?
But I try in situations of change to give myself three to five years and things so that Ias the leader don't let myself back out too quick.
Because sometimes you're right there when it feels like it's getting the hardest and theheaviest, you're right at the peak of the mountain and you're about to go downhill.
(31:43):
So.
And downhill is good in that scenario.
That seemed weird, but.
no, I got it.
So you know, you know what, though, it's such a such a powerful statement there that youare always going uphill and you never know when it plateaus or starts to go down and you
have to keep having that drive and that decision that you're making to give it three tofive years is the perfect segue into our next bold decision making segment.
(32:07):
And one of our last elements, we'll talk about the fire element.
Ignite your ideas, face the flames.
This is Spark or Burn, where we talk about bold decisions, big risks, and the fires thateither spark success or burn lessons into our memory.
So Brittany, can you tell us about a bold decision that you've had to make and why it wasa risk to you?
(32:28):
My bold decision was changing campuses.
I had a lot of the work at the lower campus and we were doing really well and we wererocking and rolling and we had some things happen in the district and my superintendent
approached me and asked me if I would think about coming to the middle school.
It was a risk for me because elementary was where I was comfortable.
(32:51):
I had taught middle school before, but I had never been an administrator at a secondarylevel campus.
There is so much more to it than I was even aware of.
My daughter, my oldest daughter had just come to the middle school and I was kind ofworried about how she would feel about all of a sudden me.
(33:12):
crashing her fun.
She just got rid of me and now here I am again.
And I also had another child that was on the elementary campus that I didn't necessarilywant to leave.
So the mom part of me struggled with that.
But then also, you know, there's always the thought of, gosh, what if I get over there andI don't like it or it's not a good fit or it's too much and I can't, I can't keep up or I
(33:35):
don't know enough about it to make effective change.
So it felt like a very, very, very bold move.
My ultimate goal is to continue to move up in education, but that was not my timeline.
I really thought that I would be at the elementary level for another, I mean, well untilmy kids were out of elementary and I have a two year old.
(33:58):
So I had expected to be there for quite a while.
So it was a big change in.
When you connect with a campus,
The next hard part is telling them that you've made the decision for the big change.
So I knew all of that was ahead of me.
There was a lot of learning ahead of me, but I talked about it with my husband and prayedabout it.
(34:20):
And I just felt like, man, if not now, when?
And if the opportunity presents itself and it feels right, then jump in.
And it's honestly been the best decision.
I don't know that I'll ever leave middle school.
I love it here.
I love the age.
The kids are hysterical and they can take the joking back like elementary can't sometimes.
(34:43):
just sometimes that's true.
That's true.
But it's a lot easier to pinpoint who can and who can't because students are becoming moreself-aware at this age, which is really fun to watch.
But yeah, it was it was a hard decision.
It really was.
So with that, you you talked about thinking it over, talking it through, praying about it.
What was the spark behind it?
(35:04):
What made you say, I just have to go for it?
I honestly wondered if I pass up this opportunity, when will the opportunity presentitself again?
I knew I wanted to stay in this district.
I love my school district.
My kids love where we are.
And so then I wondered like, okay, am I closing a door that won't come back open for me?
And then there was also the piece of me that always can come back to bite me, but thecuriosity of it was just...
(35:31):
enough to drive me to want to try.
I like a challenge.
Like I said, I knew academically I was walking into a campus that was solid, but we hadsome culture things to work on and I love that.
That's like my thing.
So I couldn't resist it.
I just get it.
I got to the point where I thought, yep, I'm gonna do it.
What was at stake for you if it didn't work out?
(35:53):
If you had gone there and it was horrible.
Was this an all or nothing type of moment?
For me it was because it's very important to me to love what I do.
I think it makes me a better leader if I love what I do.
It makes me a better mom and wife.
I would come home completely unhappy every day.
But that's always kind of in the back of your mind.
(36:16):
I think when you start any new position or go to any new places, gosh if I hate it.
How long do I stay before I determine, yeah, no, this is really, do you just hate itbecause it's different and it's change?
Or is it truly not fulfilling to you?
And so that is always scary, especially as a married woman who has children.
So, you know, my husband and I both work and so I contribute to the household income justlike he does.
(36:43):
And so there's all of these things flying around in your head, like, man, if this doesn'twork,
I'm going to put us in a lurch a little bit until I find something that does work, youknow?
So it's heavy, but it worked.
I lucked out.
you know what though, I don't know if it's luck or if you made your own, you made your ownfuture here and you made your own scenario because you rooted it in that idea of you knew
(37:04):
you were having to take on much responsibility.
We go back to your grounding earth moment, right?
So you knew you had to give much to make it work.
And so you put the work in and based off of what you said earlier, you probably would havebeen willing to give it a three to five year span.
And if you're putting the work in that makes that a much easier.
decision to hopefully see the payoff, see the change.
(37:24):
And because you're rooted in putting relationships first, it becomes an easier transition.
It would be a very different conversation if you weren't meant for that job, right?
And that's not to say that you would have never been somebody who does not buildrelationships effectively, somebody that does not put much work in.
That's not the right person for the job.
So it's a good hiring process on the team by shoulder tapping you to say, hey, you shouldconsider this, but also for you to build the character you are to go in and be successful
(37:49):
in that moment and in any situation.
regardless of where it is, because as a leader that you are, you can work in almost anyprobable organization or setting.
And if you're working with people, you'll be OK because you know what you value.
And that's the important part behind it.
So with that, though, that's a big that is a big change to decide to uproot and go to adifferent location for for work.
(38:11):
How would you encourage the listeners to also consider making that bold decision and helpthem along the way with that process?
Yeah, I think it goes back to the question you asked me earlier is just what is yourpurpose?
And mine is to foster relationships with teachers and be supportive for teachers.
(38:32):
So for me, that was the ultimate question.
Am I still getting to fulfill what is meaningful to me, what I'm passionate about?
And so that would be my recommendation is does the job.
or the change aligned to what your personal mission and vision is, what your personalpassion is.
Because if it's not, it would just be very ungratifying.
(38:53):
I don't know how that could work.
It would be exhausting, frankly, to go somewhere where you're doing something that justhas no fulfillment at all.
And that's what leads to burnout, right?
Is people often don't root what they're trying to take home as a paycheck to somethingthat they love doing.
that's where people, you hear about teacher burnout, you hear about issues with that,that's a system problem in its own, but it's also an individual problem in pursuing
(39:18):
something not rooted in their personal value and what they want to aspire to do.
think in education a lot, you know, we're in the middle of a big teacher shortage andthat's everywhere I think.
And so we're getting a lot of professional people coming in that haven't necessarily gonethrough school to be teachers and there have been a few that have come and they've stuck
(39:38):
out the year and at the end they've said like, this is nothing that I thought it would be.
So I think that that's part of it too.
And you know, to try to validate that when I hear that, I'm...
I'm never mad about that change.
I'm grateful that they see that this is just not what they're cut out to do.
But in a big change, like that is, that's one of the dangers.
(39:58):
So you have to do your research too to make sure it is something that is meaningful toyou.
Off script here a little bit and just a tangent on that too.
think if I was to give advice to anybody that's thinking about an education field and forall of those not in education listening, just bear with me for a moment because this also
does apply to you and I'll get to how it does in a second here.
(40:19):
People don't realize and I often hear this from not teachers that I'm with right now, butteachers in the past that I didn't realize that I would have to wipe boogers or deal with
tears or deal with X, Y, Z all day.
Like that's not what I'm here for as a teacher.
I'm here to take the program of study and teach it to kids.
I'm like, well, if your job is to teach the program of study, you're covering one seventhof your job, to be honest with you.
(40:44):
you know, people that get into education actually do get into it to work with kids and tobuild effective relationships, bringing it back to point number one on all of our
leadership quality standards, teacher quality standards.
You have to.
assume that your job is more than just standing up there, sage on the stage, talking,presenting, giving instruction.
And any job that you go into, whether or not you're a plumber, an electrician, whetheryou're in the marketing side of things, whether you're a broker or a trader or an
(41:13):
entrepreneur of some way, or form, whatever you intend your business to be about, there'sprobably six to 10 other things that your business is also about that you have to deal
with as well.
And it's about fully understanding that and buying in not just to the one thing that youwanna do, but all of the other 10 things that are entailed within it that leads you to
(41:34):
sustain your momentum and be okay with your momentum forward.
I knew getting into leadership that my sole job was not managing the budget of my school.
I knew getting into leadership that my sole job was not writing teachers up if they'rebad.
Right?
We go in with these assumptions and you have to see the whole picture before you make thatdecision.
(41:57):
So with that, my final tip for people on decision making process is take the time tounpack everything that it could entail and make it an informed decision.
Don't just make a decision on a whim, make an informed decision.
And your gut can still help you inform that decision.
Just make sure you have some information.
Okay.
(42:17):
I do not have a segment yet to play for our last section here.
And I told the person that I interviewed before this that I would create one and I didn't.
So I dropped the ball a little bit, but we are moving on to listener questions wherethey've asked and we're going to answer.
It's time for listener questions.
And the one that I'm going to bring up to the discussion today is from another person inthe States, but I'll do my best to not expose where they are or anything like that in case
(42:41):
they wanted to keep this a bit more personal to them.
How can you inspire a leader?
who seems uninspired when it's their job to do the inspiring.
Lots of inspires there.
How do you inspire a leader who is uninspired, but it's their job to do the inspiring?
My initial thought is you have the wrong mindset.
And where I'm gonna go with this is don't get me wrong.
(43:03):
A leader's job is to be a system of support.
But if you're writing them off and saying that is their only job and it's not yourresponsibility as well, there needs to be a level of accountability as a team.
Now,
you need to say that louder for the people in the back.
Not to the individual specifically that wrote this, but if you're talking a school system,you need teachers lifting teachers up.
(43:33):
You need teachers lifting your principal up.
You need your support staff lifting teachers and your principal up.
And you need kids lifting people up.
There has been days where I've gone to my workplace and my teachers have picked up myslack for the day.
Mm-hmm.
I have two kids under three right now as well.
There's days where I'm going to work tired.
There's days where, you know, you're leaving everything that you try to possibly leave atthe door, but you're still going in with a little bit of, need some help today.
(43:59):
Now, the hard part to that is being in a position of vulnerability to say, I need somehelp from the team to pick up the slack.
Because the other thing that I would share in answering this question is people are notmind readers.
And so this leader that you have, this principle that you have, this person that you havein this position where you're asking this question from, are they aware that they're not
(44:23):
inspiring people?
Because they might, and they might go home every day thinking they've done a fantastic jobor you know what, another step further, they probably going home, they probably go home
every day feeling like they did the best job they can.
Right.
because if they didn't, they would make it known.
(44:44):
Now, if they're making it known, this is a whole other system.
It's not your job to hire and fire this person.
You maybe need to look at channels going higher up and saying, are having an issue here asa group.
We need some help.
We want to come together as a team and make this the best we possibly can.
However, you also need to approach it of, we need to raise awareness as step one.
We need to be all a part of the solution as step two.
(45:07):
What's take on this?
I could not agree more.
As a teacher, I worked on a campus where there were some fellow teachers who we lovinglyreferred to as vampires because all they ever did was just suck the joy out of things.
(45:27):
Yeah, not so much Twilight.
I'm talking about like the old 1950s vampires.
So, and I just remember as a teacher feeling bad for my administration because they oftenwould try to do, you know, not just morale boosting things like, I don't know, Sonic
drinks, we'll go back to that, but they tried to give us extra time for planning and allof this and it sometimes just seemed like it didn't matter.
(45:52):
So on that side of it, you do have some people that it doesn't matter what you do.
it doesn't matter how you do it, they're for whatever reason going through something orjust unhappy where they are and so they don't feel inspired and therefore they feel like
their administration is not doing their job.
As an administrator, I was given the advice by a friend who is a superintendent in anotherdistrict.
(46:17):
She said, always find people on your team that will be honest about
the pulse on the campus.
Because I feel like being out and about and having conversations every day does a lot ofthat work for me.
I feel like I can tell if something feels off or if people are unhappy.
But there are times where, as you said, I come in because my daughter's been up all nightand I'm a zombie and I need somebody to help me check in on that kind of area.
(46:48):
So your admin team is really important, I think, to have a really good chemistry with yourassistant principal or with your counselor.
Your front office knows so much about what's happening on the campus.
They are invaluable.
I love them.
But then also, I think it goes back to building a relationship with your administrator.
I think that sometimes, and I have worked for admin before, that there's like a wallbetween
(47:13):
the admin and the teachers because they don't want to cross a professional line.
Like you can't be my friend because I'm your boss.
When that's not at all what people are asking for.
I feel like what they're asking for is just conversation, validation of you're my coworkerand I might be organizationally your boss, but we're in this together, man.
(47:35):
Like we, we're doing this job together.
Yes.
And I did,
My daughter got RSV right before Christmas and I'll just wrap up with this and then I'llbe done.
I'm sorry, I talk a whole lot.
And it was hard.
We had a lot of sleepless nights.
My husband and I were just trading off who was gonna take off work that day to stay homewith her.
(47:59):
And so I came in and a teacher came in to bring me some paperwork that...
She had to turn in for something.
Anyway, before she left, she stopped and she said, and how are you doing?
And that meant so much to me, because I feel like that's what I do all day, every day.
And so when a teacher reciprocates that, man, I feel like, okay, we're doing the rightthing.
(48:24):
We are building this campus together.
This is not a me and them thing.
This is an us thing.
And so the inspiring is a lot easier to do.
when you're doing it together, when they look at it as a two-way street, it's not just usserving them, but they're in that way serving us.
They're treating us as their coworkers and not as their superiors, you know?
(48:46):
So, I'm, this poor person that wrote the question probably didn't even mean it like that,but that's kind of how I look at it.
That's culture.
That's culture.
That is a culture of collaboration when you can work on doing the inspiring.
together and not look at it as a what can you give me today to help me want to do my job.
(49:09):
Yeah, and there's so many elements to this that we could unpack with it.
We also have no idea on the context of this to did this person used to inspire and didsomething happen where they are now not motivated to inspire and they're actually just
pulling back from their job because of other things that could have happened in theirlife.
(49:30):
And if that's the case too, the answer doesn't really change.
The answer stays the same and
You know, I had a literacy coach actually say it best, stay in your lane.
What can you control?
What can you be accountable for?
And part of your lane in being a team is raising awareness with your team, right?
(49:53):
And they talk a lot about if it was something external that has changed the way thisperson is motivated in the workplace, that conversation needs to happen.
Something is different.
I've noticed this.
Right.
what can we do together to make it better, right?
And there's so much power in that conversation and approach it with love and approach itwith caution.
(50:18):
And I'm sure if you approach it with vulnerability, they would be receptive to at leastentertaining the conversation or you've now raised the awareness to them that somebody has
noticed things are different.
Yeah.
Because sometimes they do feel like they're putting on the happy face and coming to work,you know?
absolutely.
So with that, you know what listeners, I hope that that answers one of the questions thatwe tried to unpack.
(50:41):
Every time we have a guest, please continue to send questions.
I love getting to unpack them with you.
It leads to such great conversation.
And if this helped you in any way, shape or form, reach out, send it, send me a DM onInstagram, email Tyler at elementaleducator.com and connect with me and let me know if how
that helped with you in any situation you might be in.
Brittany, as we wrap up, what is one...
(51:01):
message that you wish everybody listening could take away with them.
that teachers do the most impossibly hard job.
And as administrators, the worst thing that we could ever do is forget that they arepeople first.
They are mothers, they are sisters, they are wives, they are daughters, they are sons,they are husbands, they are brothers, they are people.
(51:27):
And this job is heavy and with the climate that we're in right now, it feels like it'sgetting heavier.
And if we don't support the people who are passionate about serving our kids, we're gonnalose something really important.
And I think that it takes a lot to give teachers what they need, and we need to be tryingharder.
(51:48):
Very well put.
And thank you teachers.
Thank you all service.
All service, yeah.
Now with that, Brittany, if people want to hear more of your story, get in touch, what isthe best way for our audience to connect with you?
So I have an Instagram, it's The Preoccupied Principal.
(52:10):
I also have under the same name on Facebook and then my email is thepreoccupiedprincipalat gmail.com.
Wonderful, thank you for sharing and alchemists, as we wrap up our episode, I just wannatake a moment and share my appreciation for your listenership.
You're the reason we're here, you're the inspiration for the show, and I hope our journeytoday sparks some points of interest for you.
(52:33):
To dive deeper, make sure to subscribe to our monthly newsletter for scholarly insights,actionable strategies, and in-depth analysis of each episode.
Just reach out on our Instagram for the link.
And Brittany, thank you so much for taking the time out of your schedule to connect,collaborate, and empower us through your lived experience.
Thank you for having me.
I loved it.
Alchemists I just finished recording this episode with Brittany and I know you're gonnalove the conversation that we have.
(00:05):
We unpack everything from burnt out leaders, burnt out teachers, how to try to addressthose things, how to bring about change within an organization, one that you're already in
or one that you're getting picked up and moved over to and put down in.
So you're gonna wanna check out the full episode and stay tuned to the very end where weanswer a listener's question.
And stay tuned to the very end where we answer one of your listeners questions.
(00:43):
What do they say in Texas?
y'all?
Yeah?
Yeah.
Okay.
That's awesome.
What is your school's podcast on?
anywhere you can listen.
I don't know what platform they use to get it all done.
I, yeah, I should know more, but I don't.
(01:03):
I just know that I listened to it and it's very cute.
So this week their podcast is over the TikTok band.
And so it's really interesting because you would think middle schoolers sometimes, youknow, can be very, it's so stupid.
Like that's not cool, but they had some really insightful things.
to say so they always surprise me.
(01:26):
Yeah, for better or worse.
If you want to plug it at the end, by all means, take some time or even throughout theshow, feel free to talk about it.
All right, I'm gonna kick us off here.
Before I do that though, Brittany, can I get you, this is just for my thumbnail shot.
Can I get you to look to your right and just say, hello, my name is Brittany.
(01:50):
Okay, hello, my name is Brittany.
And like a full on like turn to like this way.
Yeah.
okay.
And say hello, my name is Brittany.
Okay, okay.
I'm going to clip me going this way and saying, hello, my name is Tyler.
And it's just a still image, but it's going to look like we're having a conversation thisway.
So there we go.
(02:11):
OK, I'm going to get us started.
okay.
me change one thing here.
Alchemists, welcome to episode 54 of the Elemental Educator podcast.
I'm your host Tyler, and thank you so much for joining our community for anotherincredible connection.
If you're here for the first time, welcome to a place where we redefine leadership andchallenge the status quo.
Take a minute before continuing the episode to subscribe to our YouTube at Elementalunderscore educator, where we upload all of our videos and additional leadership content
(02:38):
meant for anyone looking to grow.
For those returning alchemists, take some time to expand our community and share thisplatform.
with one other person today.
I'm so thankful for your passion and dedication to being better together.
Now get ready to let the alchemy of education ignite your passion for learning.
Today, I'm thrilled to connect with Brittany Thompson, an educator from East Texas withover 16 years of experience, including eight years in administration.
(03:01):
She's passionate about fostering positive campus culture and climate.
She is dedicated to creating thriving school environments where students and staff cansucceed.
Welcome to the Elemental Educator podcast, Brittany.
It is a pleasure to have you here with us today.
Thank you, I am so happy to be here.
And before we jump in, is podcast number one for Brittany.
This is your first podcast.
(03:24):
hoping to make it fun, hoping to make it lively.
This is a video podcast.
So you're actually getting two for one here.
You're getting the audio and the video podcast at the end of it.
Now, right before we pressed record, though, you shared that your school has a podcast.
They do.
I have a group of seventh and eighth graders that have started a content creation classthis year and they have a podcast and a blog.
(03:44):
So I don't have it right off the top of my head, but I will link it on my Instagram.
Yeah, and we'll link it into the description of the show notes of this episode so peoplecan go check it out if they want to.
And at the point of this conversation, you know, when this episode is released,unfortunately, TikTok will already have been banned, maybe saved, who knows where it's
going to be.
But their recent conversation that they're unpacking with you right now is the ban ofTikTok.
(04:08):
Now, I got incredibly off topic here.
So I want to start with the big question for us, which is how did you get to where you arenow, Brittany?
So I taught choir and elementary music for almost 10 years.
It was about eight.
But I remember, this is horrible to admit, but one year I worked for an administrationthat was less than stellar.
(04:33):
And I had been looking, I'd been itching to get out of the classroom and like do my nextstep, but I knew it needed to be an education.
And I just remember one moment in particular, I thought,
Yeah, this is the time because teachers need more support than that.
And so it just kind of lit a fire in me to jump in with both feet and the rest is history.
Here I am.
(04:55):
There we go.
Now, before you even got into education, let's go all the way back to that.
What was the driving moment, like four years, right?
What was the driving moment that made you want to even get into the field?
I was a junior in high school.
remember because before then I wanted to do something medical which anybody who knows mewould laugh at that.
(05:16):
it doesn't seem like I truly am made to do this.
But I was in choir class and my choir director said, how awesome is my job that I get tosit here and listen to students sing to me all day?
And I just remember thinking.
Well yeah, music at that moment was my passion.
That's what I love to do.
So why wouldn't I go into that and want to ignite that passion in other students?
(05:40):
So that's really what pushed me to get into music education.
Love that.
And the segue into leadership, like you said, you saw a problem, you wanted to help be apart of the solution to it.
So it drove you towards that, which is so great to hear and sets us up for success toreally get into what we value, which brings us to the first segment of our show.
(06:00):
Rooted in wisdom, driven by purpose, welcome to grounded moments.
And to build some momentum here, I want to start by asking you, what's one thing groundingyou in what you're doing now?
my passion to serve and that's for both students and teachers.
That's just really what I when I make decisions every day, that's where I go to.
(06:21):
Is this best for teachers?
Is this best for students?
Great questions to ask, even outside of education, just as a general CEO manager, is thisbest for our organization?
Is this best for the people I oversee?
And then try to make those decisions around that.
Now, before the show, I asked you to provide a quote that resonates with you.
And the quote you chose is, to whom much is given, much is required, Luke 12.48.
(06:45):
Can I get you to break down how you found this quote and why you picked it?
Sure.
So I am a person of faith.
My faith is another thing that is very essential to me.
And I found this quote again, well, I was probably in college when it started reallysinking in, you know, in high school things are kind of surface.
But at that moment I was about to graduate and I just remember thinking, man, I'm going tohave a classroom of, you know, I'm a music teacher.
(07:13):
So I have at any point like 50 kids in a classroom.
But my impact is the entire campus.
That's huge.
And I just felt like to be entrusted with those students and with the knowledge that I'dbe giving them meant that I needed to pay a lot of attention to my craft and to my
practice in the field.
So I took it very seriously.
(07:34):
And it's just rolled right with me going into leadership with teachers on our campus.
know, again, I've been impacted in many different ways as a teacher.
And so as a leader, I try to reflect on that and realize that I'm not dealing with justschool district employees, I'm dealing with people.
And so I have been entrusted to lead a group of people who are leading our greatest assetin the world, which is our children.
(08:00):
So that's why that is my quote.
And it's a great quote to bring in and to live by, and you kind of answered the nextquestion, which is how does it show up in your workflow there?
What I wanna go into is in public systems, Catholic systems, depending on which systemyou're in, this quote can carry extra weight to it.
In a public setting, how do you tiptoe the line then of bringing in potentially areligious quote to then push an action within your organization?
(08:25):
Yeah, so I am in East Texas and we are still very much, there are certain things that Icannot say to students and there are definitely times that I will let my teachers know
like if I feel like I need to pray about something, I'm respectful of what their beliefsare and it's definitely not anything that I'm forcing people to do.
(08:48):
But I do think that at the heart of a lot of our literature, at the heart of a lot of ourwisdom, is the Bible.
And so if you need to view it as a piece of literature, then that's what some people do.
But I have a lot of teachers that work for me that are people of faith.
And so I think it resonates.
Like you said, it's a good quote, whether you read it as something faith-based or not, butit does resonate differently for people with faith.
(09:12):
We are...
in the Bible Belt.
And so that is something that's not as taboo in this part of the country as it is in otherparts of the country.
But I still am very careful to respect those around me.
I'm not ignorant to think that everybody believes the same way that I do, and I wouldnever want to make anybody feel uncomfortable.
(09:33):
So that's kind of how I try to approach that.
And standing aside, if it wasn't cited, the words on it are just as important in what it'sasking us to action, right?
Which is what you've alluded to, which is great to see.
Brittany, have you heard of an elevator pitch before?
Okay.
So again, 10 to 20 second pitch here, your idea on this quote, how it should be gettingaction, the valid message behind it that you value.
(09:58):
And we're going to see how we do.
So whenever you're ready, sell us, well, I'm not gonna run a timer.
Maybe I should in this segment though.
Well, now you got me thinking, maybe I should add an animated time.
No, we won't do it.
Yeah, a whole level of pressure to it.
So let's hear your pitch on why people should be valuing this and consider it important.
(10:21):
So I believe that people deserve every, the basic right that humans get, which istolerance and decency.
Like we're gonna treat each other the way we want it to be treated, which is pullinganother Bible verse in there.
However, it's important when making decisions that you consider those around you and theimpact that those decisions are going to have.
(10:42):
And so if I'm given much, which is the leadership of a school,
then much will be required of me to handle that school, those people, the children, theadults with care.
How did I do?
Great, I didn't even start my timer.
I just wanted to listen to what you had to say and it was powerful and it was awesome.
And it brings me back to a quote of, with great power comes great responsibility.
(11:04):
And that's very similar to who much is given, much is required.
And the action behind it, it's just a good reminder to anybody in any position, whetheryou're a teacher, a leader, a CEO of an organization, a manager, a parent in any way,
shape or form, right?
You have much given to you.
So you are required to give much back, right?
And return that.
(11:25):
And that's where we go from there.
Now, along the way of having to action that, there is going to be some adversity along theway where we're gonna lean on this quote, which brings us to our next segment of headwinds
and tailwinds.
Through storms and surges, discover the lessons from headwinds and tailwinds, where wefocus on the challenge that tests us and the forces that help us move forward.
(11:46):
So let's set the stage here, and can you share a time where you faced a piece ofsignificant adversity?
Sure.
I have a couple that come to mind.
One specifically as an administrator was when I walked into my first principalshipposition.
Love the district that I'm in.
It's a great school, but we were walking in.
The state of Texas rates your schools once you get your accountability turned in.
(12:11):
And this particular school was rated an F.
And so walking into, which was a sudden
I think, how did you say it, did it feel like it was a sudden storm or a slow build up?
It was a sudden storm.
Yes.
Which, no.
Yes.
And I have other opinions about that, but you didn't ask me yet.
(12:33):
So, it was a sudden storm for me, but I became quickly aware that it was a slow build forthe campus.
And so, that was something where this quote again,
came into play knowing that I was about to lead a group that was in the middle of theirstorm.
A lot of them felt very defeated.
A lot of them felt very discouraged.
(12:54):
Their principal was not there anymore, which was heartbreaking for many of them.
So I was walking into a touchy situation at best.
Now, would you have felt if the script was flipped, if it was an A rated school, would youfeel like there was more given or is that a situation where you're perceiving it as less
given?
(13:14):
Because I'm interpreting this as with an F rated school, there's much more given, there'smuch more responsibility here, but the flip argument could be made as, we're already just
an F school, can, we're like this, yeah.
So, actually the school that I'm at now walked into an A.
Pressure's completely different.
Completely different.
(13:35):
The thing with walking into a school where teachers are doubting themselves is that youhave to, as a leader, number one, try to figure out where the breakdown is without
offending anybody or devaluing anybody.
But then also restoring a bit of confidence in their abilities.
(13:56):
Spoiler alert, we did not stay in F after that year.
We made a lot of great gains and it was the same teachers that I started with.
And so they had it.
They knew what needed to happen.
There were many factors at play there that I won't get into to protect people, but...
when you get to that point where you start doubting what your calling is, that's heavy.
(14:19):
That's heavy.
So on that side of it, was a lot, it was a lot more difficult to walk into a situationlike that.
When you're walking into an A campus, which is the campus that I'm on now and love dearly,then you're walking into and thinking like, man, if I make any changes and then it goes
down, like, have I wrecked this school?
(14:40):
So it's different kind of pressure.
But when you're handling,
Fragile people, I feel like that's a little bit more heavy.
Right, and it's difficult to walk into that situation.
You mentioned it yourself in balance between wanting to build a positive relationship andto put it bluntly also acknowledging that this kind of sucks right now and something needs
to change.
(15:00):
And then to bring about that change, it can't just come from you and how do you get thatownership?
You've clearly found the magic and Brittany, there's a book in the works here by you Ifeel that could talk about.
you know, from F to A and see what it looks like.
And in that book, you could unpack this whole grading system.
That's a big flaw in itself.
So with that though, you you mentioned in that year, you were able to turn that schoolaround.
(15:25):
What was a pivotal turning point where things started to shift?
So I was able, I was so lucky that year to be able to bring my assistant principal thatwas with me at the campus before.
So we already had some chemistry going, which I think was great.
Like we had a very strong leadership team, but we decided that summer as we were planningfor the school year that we were gonna focus on three things throughout the year and that
(15:51):
was it.
We were just gonna drive those three things.
And so student culture, we looked at
Successful student outcomes and then teacher morale.
So what does the student community look like?
How do the students interact with each other?
What can we do to build community amongst the kids?
(16:12):
Because discipline was a little bit of an issue walking in.
And then with the successful student outcomes, it was like, let's get back to basics.
Let's figure out what works for these guys.
Let's figure out where our teachers are strong and just lean in there.
Like just, I think a lot of times in education, there are so many new, like latest andgreatest that things get lost in translation.
(16:36):
And we forget what our bread and butter is, which is building relationship with kids andthen leaning into the content.
Like let's just get back to basics.
So we tried to pull a lot off them that they had in years prior.
And then the last one,
I'm trying to make sure I didn't already staff morale.
(16:57):
Which, you know, there's a lot of little tag lines out there.
Morale is more than Sonic drinks.
But I'm going to tell you right now, Sonic drink does a lot for a teacher in the middle ofthe day.
So we tried to plan some really uplifting things, but then also we tried to be reallyintentional with the conversations.
after evaluations or just in the hallway or in the break room, just spending timevalidating them and what they brought to our team and what they brought to these students.
(17:26):
And that year we made a C and then the next year we were a B and then I moved campuses.
But we, I'm extremely proud of the staff and what they were able to accomplish just inthat year.
But yeah, it,
We overcomplicate it too many times.
Absolutely we do.
And one thing that I love about the province that I'm in is we have a teacher qualitystandard, leader quality standard, superintendent leadership quality standard.
(17:53):
And the first standard, no matter where you are on that journey, is effectiverelationships.
And it brings it back to the root of you should be putting these first beyond anythingelse, because if you don't have a connection, you're not going to make any progress with
anything that you're trying to do.
So I love that you're sharing that as well and that it's not just here.
(18:15):
Although what is just there is Sonic.
We don't have Sonics here.
I can't bring somebody there Sonic drink.
We can bring them at Tim Hortons.
We can bring them a Starbucks.
So, you know, we got some things that kind of work for us in our way.
Same general idea.
Yeah, definitely might not be as good though.
I might have to try out a Sonic one day.
Well, there you go.
Jam packed.
Now with this though, we talk about this movement and this incredible feat of
(18:39):
turning around an entire organization and a system behind it.
That's not all sunshine and rainbows because there probably were days where you'requestioning if what you're doing is right.
There's moments of frustration.
What helped anchor you and stay grounded during that adversity?
What was kind of the wind at your back?
So I think anybody, and it probably is way expanded than just to education, but anybody inthis field, especially in the administration field, you need to have a circle of people
(19:10):
that either are doing the same thing you're doing or have done what you're doing, just arereally close.
And I'm not, I love the social media community.
I think it's great, but like I have a circle of friends.
There are four of us and all four of us have been in administration, some up tosuperintendent and one is a school counselor and we've all been in the administration
(19:36):
role.
They're not in my district.
And so I feel like I can be candid with them.
You have to be careful when you're talking to people who are in the same area you are,especially when you're needing to vent or bounce ideas about different things.
So I think it's really important to build
very close community of people that know your heart and know your vision and are there tochampion that with you but are also there to say, hey, you need to rethink that.
(20:04):
Like, let's take a moment because on those days where I'm feeling extremely frustrated, Imight say something to them that they're like, no, yeah, I get it.
Don't say that out loud in front of your staff.
And I need that.
I need somebody to check me on that sometimes because
you know, there are really frustrating moments.
(20:24):
There are very low moments where it just kind of feels like, geez, can I do anything rightin this moment?
Or have I just completely dug this hole a little bit deeper?
So I think that's a very important piece of success and leadership is your circle.
That's such a strong message to send as well.
And as a leader anywhere, if you can establish it where the people that you work withallow you to be a part of that circle and show that vulnerability with you as the leader,
(20:55):
man, have you ever created an effective system, right?
I'm so thankful to have a space where people that I collaborate with are people that Ialso work with as well.
And we can.
Openly bounce these ideas off of each other knowing that hey we are here and aligned tothe same goal Which is something you said earlier.
How are we putting kids first?
How are we putting stuff first?
Outside of education, how are you putting whatever your organization's goal is first andwhen that's what the conversation is aligned to you can be vulnerable blunt and Open with
(21:25):
the people you work with because you're trying to align to that same vision So for peoplefacing their own headwinds
What's one thing they can do to move forward despite whatever adversity or storm theycould be facing?
I would say to take a moment.
My dad used to say like, don't let the bird build a nest.
(21:46):
So like if you have a lot going on, take a moment to ground yourself in what truth is andthen remember what your purpose is.
Remember your why.
We hear that all the time.
But listen, it's really true when you're in the middle of a lot, whether it's a lot ofgood things happening, that's just really stressful.
or requires a lot of your mental energy, or it's a more heavy, discouraging moment to sitdown and then be reflective of, okay, why did we start?
(22:18):
Where are we going and what is our purpose?
Like, just take a moment to yourself.
It'll all still be there when you walk out of your office or when you come back to workthe next day.
Everything's still gonna be there.
I just think that sometimes we try to move too fast.
That would be my number one piece of advice is just remember what your initial purposewas.
Did it get lost in the middle of all of this and how do we realign ourselves back to it?
(22:42):
taking that moment, hoping sometimes things go away doesn't always work.
So you and you're right, you do come back to that.
But that actually brings us to the next segment, which after we face this adversity, howdo we action our change?
Small shifts, big waves, this is ripples of change, where we dive into the power ofembracing change and making waves that last.
(23:03):
So Brittany, along the way, we've talked about things that you've put in place to makechange.
What's one of the recent changes that you've either led or embraced?
So here at the middle school, coming from elementary, one of the things that I noticedabout secondary is that our MTSS or response to intervention, RTI system, it's kind of,
(23:24):
it's hard to implement.
know, at elementary level, you have about 90 to 120 minutes of a block to work with thesesame kids.
Middle school man, you're running 47 minutes in and out.
So how do we do small group?
Is that even reasonable?
How do we serve students that are at tier two or tier three or are on a lower grade levelthan where they actually are?
(23:47):
How do we meet those needs?
And so that is a change that I started implementing last year.
It is a slow and steady change because one thing I am extremely aware of is how much weare asking our teachers to do.
And I don't want to add anything to that.
Most, I mean, I can't think of a teacher on my campus right now that is not alreadyserving all of their students.
(24:11):
This kind of goes into, okay, what's the next step?
How do we go deeper?
How do we push that kid who's right there?
How do we take time to address that need when we have 21 others?
Our classes here run about 21 students at the max.
We have
which I'm learning is a pretty reasonable ratio compared to some other schools.
(24:35):
I know I had a teacher come in from out of state that said she served, this was in anotherdistrict, but she served like 42 students in a classroom at one time.
That's insane.
So we thankfully are able to keep it at 21 or below.
It's still a lot of kids and it's still a lot of content, you know, when you have...
(24:55):
standardized testing breathing down your neck and you want to make sure that you're notteaching a test you want to teach children that's what their passion is so we're trying to
basically develop develop the plane while it's flying of how do we make this work for usfor this campus and there have been some moments where I can see the stress like fall but
(25:16):
we're getting there we're not there yet but we're getting there
one of the things you said earlier was that it was a slow process and a slow change.
One of the great and actually incredible things about a slow process and a slow change isthat it usually leads to consistency and it leads to something that's gonna stick after.
And it actually becomes a part of the school culture.
Those quick and sudden changes, sometimes needed and sometimes very good and powerful.
(25:40):
But usually after a very quick change, it's very tough to stay consistent with that quickchange because now all of the questions, all of the pushback and you keep hitting this
vicious cycle where if you can approach something slow, prolonged over time, that's howyou start to build it into culture.
That's how you start to infuse it into something that's going to be everlasting.
And speaking of that though, with change, there's usually two key moments, which is thatfirst step you take to make a change in the final move that makes it stick with this being
(26:07):
a slow change for you.
What was the first step that you've taken to address improving MTSS?
So we met as a staff and we started with just our reading and math teachers.
And so we looked at, because it was important for me to make it sustainable.
That was like one of the first things that I looked at when I'm implementing anything.
(26:29):
It's like crash dieting, right?
Like it'll never last if it's too extreme.
So I wanted it to be sustainable, but I also wanted it to be aligned with our district.
I don't want us to do all this work here at the middle school and then high school has acompletely different thing and then those kids get lost again when they get over there or
same for elementary like they they've done all of this work and now we're doing differentwe have to reinvent the wheel.
(26:54):
So we did a lot of work figuring out what it is that elementary is doing what programthey're using our region service center which is kind of like
In Texas, we serve under the Texas Education Agency and every region has their own servicecenter and they have a program that houses all the documentation for MTSS or RTI.
(27:16):
So we took some time last year getting to know the ins and out of that side of the programof how we're going to be documenting.
Because like I said, most of my teachers were already serving those kids.
It's just, we don't, I want to have a way to follow them.
and to make sure that they continue being served when they go to the next grade level andthe next grade level.
(27:37):
So that was the first step was really committing as a group to, okay, this is the piecethat we feel like we're missing.
Now let's figure out how to find it and make it work for us.
So that's been the part that's taken the longest is, you know, documentation takes a lotof time and I don't want to monopolize their conference time asking them to do all of this
(27:58):
documentation.
We're just troubleshooting and figuring out as we go, but that was the initial like, allright, we know we're doing this.
Now how can we add this to it and make it sustainable?
And with that, you know, it's a great idea and to hopefully build some momentum around it.
Usually along the way there are some unexpected setbacks.
What was one ripple effect within it that you didn't see coming?
(28:22):
So because I was coming from the elementary school, I kind of expected it to be an easysell, and it wasn't.
And if any of my current teachers listen to this, they will agree with me.
But I think it's because initially they felt like it was going to be a very hugeundertaking.
And I'll be honest, at times it has felt that way.
(28:42):
So last year we just
played around with the documentation of things and just doing that I think brought newideas to teachers' mind of, this is how I can serve this group of students during this
time and made it more meaningful to them.
They're more intentional with that.
This year, we were able to implement two new positions where they specifically focus onthat part of it, the documentation part of it, so the teachers aren't doing all the heavy
(29:09):
lifting on their own.
That was something that I saw honestly back in April.
thought man if we're gonna keep this moving at all I'm going to have to take some of theweight off of them because it's just a lot.
So that's kind of how we have solved that problem and now we're just continuing on withwhat the consistency is gonna look like over time.
(29:31):
How we're gonna create it, make it
become part of our culture and expectations on campus.
It's like you read my mind on my next question here that I'm bringing up because we justtalked about the prolongment leading to culture, hopefully infusing it in.
And people often worry that change won't last.
And I'm almost positive, even you as a leader, myself as a leader, there's things that wedream of doing and we start them and we go, wonder if this is gonna stick around and how
(29:55):
can I make it stick around?
What steps are you taking to make sure that this is actually something that is beinginfused into this culture?
Well, we're doing, you know, my assistant principal and I try to get out in the hallway,in the classrooms as much as we can.
And so we see this in action.
And the ability to be able to pinpoint it with certain teachers, like, no, that's all I'masking for.
(30:17):
Like, you're already doing it.
I think that was a big aha for some of them last year.
My thing is, I know that if it's gonna have the legs it needs to keep going, it's going tohave to feel natural.
And so just continuing to tweak along the way, I think is what it's gonna take to make itjust part of who we are.
(30:38):
You know, we're gonna continue to refine, refine, refine.
And before we know it, we're just adjusting what the norm is.
And so that's the hope.
I initially gave myself three years.
Like, we're gonna make this happen.
So when a new teacher comes on my campus,
in three years, this is gonna be part of the conversation with them.
(31:00):
And it'll be a norm for the rest of my staff, and so it'll be easy for them to talk about.
When they're able to communicate it with those who don't know, who are new to us, then Iknow it's like our kids, right?
When they can teach it, we know they've got it.
So that's the hope.
I'll be honest, there are times when I still am thinking like, okay.
(31:20):
Is this, do I need to pivot and start again and figure out another way?
But I try in situations of change to give myself three to five years and things so that Ias the leader don't let myself back out too quick.
Because sometimes you're right there when it feels like it's getting the hardest and theheaviest, you're right at the peak of the mountain and you're about to go downhill.
(31:43):
So.
And downhill is good in that scenario.
That seemed weird, but.
no, I got it.
So you know, you know what, though, it's such a such a powerful statement there that youare always going uphill and you never know when it plateaus or starts to go down and you
have to keep having that drive and that decision that you're making to give it three tofive years is the perfect segue into our next bold decision making segment.
(32:07):
And one of our last elements, we'll talk about the fire element.
Ignite your ideas, face the flames.
This is Spark or Burn, where we talk about bold decisions, big risks, and the fires thateither spark success or burn lessons into our memory.
So Brittany, can you tell us about a bold decision that you've had to make and why it wasa risk to you?
(32:28):
My bold decision was changing campuses.
I had a lot of the work at the lower campus and we were doing really well and we wererocking and rolling and we had some things happen in the district and my superintendent
approached me and asked me if I would think about coming to the middle school.
It was a risk for me because elementary was where I was comfortable.
(32:51):
I had taught middle school before, but I had never been an administrator at a secondarylevel campus.
There is so much more to it than I was even aware of.
My daughter, my oldest daughter had just come to the middle school and I was kind ofworried about how she would feel about all of a sudden me.
(33:12):
crashing her fun.
She just got rid of me and now here I am again.
And I also had another child that was on the elementary campus that I didn't necessarilywant to leave.
So the mom part of me struggled with that.
But then also, you know, there's always the thought of, gosh, what if I get over there andI don't like it or it's not a good fit or it's too much and I can't, I can't keep up or I
(33:35):
don't know enough about it to make effective change.
So it felt like a very, very, very bold move.
My ultimate goal is to continue to move up in education, but that was not my timeline.
I really thought that I would be at the elementary level for another, I mean, well untilmy kids were out of elementary and I have a two year old.
(33:58):
So I had expected to be there for quite a while.
So it was a big change in.
When you connect with a campus,
The next hard part is telling them that you've made the decision for the big change.
So I knew all of that was ahead of me.
There was a lot of learning ahead of me, but I talked about it with my husband and prayedabout it.
(34:20):
And I just felt like, man, if not now, when?
And if the opportunity presents itself and it feels right, then jump in.
And it's honestly been the best decision.
I don't know that I'll ever leave middle school.
I love it here.
I love the age.
The kids are hysterical and they can take the joking back like elementary can't sometimes.
(34:43):
just sometimes that's true.
That's true.
But it's a lot easier to pinpoint who can and who can't because students are becoming moreself-aware at this age, which is really fun to watch.
But yeah, it was it was a hard decision.
It really was.
So with that, you you talked about thinking it over, talking it through, praying about it.
What was the spark behind it?
(35:04):
What made you say, I just have to go for it?
I honestly wondered if I pass up this opportunity, when will the opportunity presentitself again?
I knew I wanted to stay in this district.
I love my school district.
My kids love where we are.
And so then I wondered like, okay, am I closing a door that won't come back open for me?
And then there was also the piece of me that always can come back to bite me, but thecuriosity of it was just...
(35:31):
enough to drive me to want to try.
I like a challenge.
Like I said, I knew academically I was walking into a campus that was solid, but we hadsome culture things to work on and I love that.
That's like my thing.
So I couldn't resist it.
I just get it.
I got to the point where I thought, yep, I'm gonna do it.
What was at stake for you if it didn't work out?
(35:53):
If you had gone there and it was horrible.
Was this an all or nothing type of moment?
For me it was because it's very important to me to love what I do.
I think it makes me a better leader if I love what I do.
It makes me a better mom and wife.
I would come home completely unhappy every day.
But that's always kind of in the back of your mind.
(36:16):
I think when you start any new position or go to any new places, gosh if I hate it.
How long do I stay before I determine, yeah, no, this is really, do you just hate itbecause it's different and it's change?
Or is it truly not fulfilling to you?
And so that is always scary, especially as a married woman who has children.
So, you know, my husband and I both work and so I contribute to the household income justlike he does.
(36:43):
And so there's all of these things flying around in your head, like, man, if this doesn'twork,
I'm going to put us in a lurch a little bit until I find something that does work, youknow?
So it's heavy, but it worked.
I lucked out.
you know what though, I don't know if it's luck or if you made your own, you made your ownfuture here and you made your own scenario because you rooted it in that idea of you knew
(37:04):
you were having to take on much responsibility.
We go back to your grounding earth moment, right?
So you knew you had to give much to make it work.
And so you put the work in and based off of what you said earlier, you probably would havebeen willing to give it a three to five year span.
And if you're putting the work in that makes that a much easier.
decision to hopefully see the payoff, see the change.
(37:24):
And because you're rooted in putting relationships first, it becomes an easier transition.
It would be a very different conversation if you weren't meant for that job, right?
And that's not to say that you would have never been somebody who does not buildrelationships effectively, somebody that does not put much work in.
That's not the right person for the job.
So it's a good hiring process on the team by shoulder tapping you to say, hey, you shouldconsider this, but also for you to build the character you are to go in and be successful
(37:49):
in that moment and in any situation.
regardless of where it is, because as a leader that you are, you can work in almost anyprobable organization or setting.
And if you're working with people, you'll be OK because you know what you value.
And that's the important part behind it.
So with that, though, that's a big that is a big change to decide to uproot and go to adifferent location for for work.
(38:11):
How would you encourage the listeners to also consider making that bold decision and helpthem along the way with that process?
Yeah, I think it goes back to the question you asked me earlier is just what is yourpurpose?
And mine is to foster relationships with teachers and be supportive for teachers.
(38:32):
So for me, that was the ultimate question.
Am I still getting to fulfill what is meaningful to me, what I'm passionate about?
And so that would be my recommendation is does the job.
or the change aligned to what your personal mission and vision is, what your personalpassion is.
Because if it's not, it would just be very ungratifying.
(38:53):
I don't know how that could work.
It would be exhausting, frankly, to go somewhere where you're doing something that justhas no fulfillment at all.
And that's what leads to burnout, right?
Is people often don't root what they're trying to take home as a paycheck to somethingthat they love doing.
that's where people, you hear about teacher burnout, you hear about issues with that,that's a system problem in its own, but it's also an individual problem in pursuing
(39:18):
something not rooted in their personal value and what they want to aspire to do.
think in education a lot, you know, we're in the middle of a big teacher shortage andthat's everywhere I think.
And so we're getting a lot of professional people coming in that haven't necessarily gonethrough school to be teachers and there have been a few that have come and they've stuck
(39:38):
out the year and at the end they've said like, this is nothing that I thought it would be.
So I think that that's part of it too.
And you know, to try to validate that when I hear that, I'm...
I'm never mad about that change.
I'm grateful that they see that this is just not what they're cut out to do.
But in a big change, like that is, that's one of the dangers.
(39:58):
So you have to do your research too to make sure it is something that is meaningful toyou.
Off script here a little bit and just a tangent on that too.
think if I was to give advice to anybody that's thinking about an education field and forall of those not in education listening, just bear with me for a moment because this also
does apply to you and I'll get to how it does in a second here.
(40:19):
People don't realize and I often hear this from not teachers that I'm with right now, butteachers in the past that I didn't realize that I would have to wipe boogers or deal with
tears or deal with X, Y, Z all day.
Like that's not what I'm here for as a teacher.
I'm here to take the program of study and teach it to kids.
I'm like, well, if your job is to teach the program of study, you're covering one seventhof your job, to be honest with you.
(40:44):
you know, people that get into education actually do get into it to work with kids and tobuild effective relationships, bringing it back to point number one on all of our
leadership quality standards, teacher quality standards.
You have to.
assume that your job is more than just standing up there, sage on the stage, talking,presenting, giving instruction.
And any job that you go into, whether or not you're a plumber, an electrician, whetheryou're in the marketing side of things, whether you're a broker or a trader or an
(41:13):
entrepreneur of some way, or form, whatever you intend your business to be about, there'sprobably six to 10 other things that your business is also about that you have to deal
with as well.
And it's about fully understanding that and buying in not just to the one thing that youwanna do, but all of the other 10 things that are entailed within it that leads you to
(41:34):
sustain your momentum and be okay with your momentum forward.
I knew getting into leadership that my sole job was not managing the budget of my school.
I knew getting into leadership that my sole job was not writing teachers up if they'rebad.
Right?
We go in with these assumptions and you have to see the whole picture before you make thatdecision.
(41:57):
So with that, my final tip for people on decision making process is take the time tounpack everything that it could entail and make it an informed decision.
Don't just make a decision on a whim, make an informed decision.
And your gut can still help you inform that decision.
Just make sure you have some information.
Okay.
(42:17):
I do not have a segment yet to play for our last section here.
And I told the person that I interviewed before this that I would create one and I didn't.
So I dropped the ball a little bit, but we are moving on to listener questions wherethey've asked and we're going to answer.
It's time for listener questions.
And the one that I'm going to bring up to the discussion today is from another person inthe States, but I'll do my best to not expose where they are or anything like that in case
(42:41):
they wanted to keep this a bit more personal to them.
How can you inspire a leader?
who seems uninspired when it's their job to do the inspiring.
Lots of inspires there.
How do you inspire a leader who is uninspired, but it's their job to do the inspiring?
My initial thought is you have the wrong mindset.
And where I'm gonna go with this is don't get me wrong.
(43:03):
A leader's job is to be a system of support.
But if you're writing them off and saying that is their only job and it's not yourresponsibility as well, there needs to be a level of accountability as a team.
Now,
you need to say that louder for the people in the back.
Not to the individual specifically that wrote this, but if you're talking a school system,you need teachers lifting teachers up.
(43:33):
You need teachers lifting your principal up.
You need your support staff lifting teachers and your principal up.
And you need kids lifting people up.
There has been days where I've gone to my workplace and my teachers have picked up myslack for the day.
Mm-hmm.
I have two kids under three right now as well.
There's days where I'm going to work tired.
There's days where, you know, you're leaving everything that you try to possibly leave atthe door, but you're still going in with a little bit of, need some help today.
(43:59):
Now, the hard part to that is being in a position of vulnerability to say, I need somehelp from the team to pick up the slack.
Because the other thing that I would share in answering this question is people are notmind readers.
And so this leader that you have, this principle that you have, this person that you havein this position where you're asking this question from, are they aware that they're not
(44:23):
inspiring people?
Because they might, and they might go home every day thinking they've done a fantastic jobor you know what, another step further, they probably going home, they probably go home
every day feeling like they did the best job they can.
Right.
because if they didn't, they would make it known.
(44:44):
Now, if they're making it known, this is a whole other system.
It's not your job to hire and fire this person.
You maybe need to look at channels going higher up and saying, are having an issue here asa group.
We need some help.
We want to come together as a team and make this the best we possibly can.
However, you also need to approach it of, we need to raise awareness as step one.
We need to be all a part of the solution as step two.
(45:07):
What's take on this?
I could not agree more.
As a teacher, I worked on a campus where there were some fellow teachers who we lovinglyreferred to as vampires because all they ever did was just suck the joy out of things.
(45:27):
Yeah, not so much Twilight.
I'm talking about like the old 1950s vampires.
So, and I just remember as a teacher feeling bad for my administration because they oftenwould try to do, you know, not just morale boosting things like, I don't know, Sonic
drinks, we'll go back to that, but they tried to give us extra time for planning and allof this and it sometimes just seemed like it didn't matter.
(45:52):
So on that side of it, you do have some people that it doesn't matter what you do.
it doesn't matter how you do it, they're for whatever reason going through something orjust unhappy where they are and so they don't feel inspired and therefore they feel like
their administration is not doing their job.
As an administrator, I was given the advice by a friend who is a superintendent in anotherdistrict.
(46:17):
She said, always find people on your team that will be honest about
the pulse on the campus.
Because I feel like being out and about and having conversations every day does a lot ofthat work for me.
I feel like I can tell if something feels off or if people are unhappy.
But there are times where, as you said, I come in because my daughter's been up all nightand I'm a zombie and I need somebody to help me check in on that kind of area.
(46:48):
So your admin team is really important, I think, to have a really good chemistry with yourassistant principal or with your counselor.
Your front office knows so much about what's happening on the campus.
They are invaluable.
I love them.
But then also, I think it goes back to building a relationship with your administrator.
I think that sometimes, and I have worked for admin before, that there's like a wallbetween
(47:13):
the admin and the teachers because they don't want to cross a professional line.
Like you can't be my friend because I'm your boss.
When that's not at all what people are asking for.
I feel like what they're asking for is just conversation, validation of you're my coworkerand I might be organizationally your boss, but we're in this together, man.
(47:35):
Like we, we're doing this job together.
Yes.
And I did,
My daughter got RSV right before Christmas and I'll just wrap up with this and then I'llbe done.
I'm sorry, I talk a whole lot.
And it was hard.
We had a lot of sleepless nights.
My husband and I were just trading off who was gonna take off work that day to stay homewith her.
(47:59):
And so I came in and a teacher came in to bring me some paperwork that...
She had to turn in for something.
Anyway, before she left, she stopped and she said, and how are you doing?
And that meant so much to me, because I feel like that's what I do all day, every day.
And so when a teacher reciprocates that, man, I feel like, okay, we're doing the rightthing.
(48:24):
We are building this campus together.
This is not a me and them thing.
This is an us thing.
And so the inspiring is a lot easier to do.
when you're doing it together, when they look at it as a two-way street, it's not just usserving them, but they're in that way serving us.
They're treating us as their coworkers and not as their superiors, you know?
(48:46):
So, I'm, this poor person that wrote the question probably didn't even mean it like that,but that's kind of how I look at it.
That's culture.
That's culture.
That is a culture of collaboration when you can work on doing the inspiring.
together and not look at it as a what can you give me today to help me want to do my job.
(49:09):
Yeah, and there's so many elements to this that we could unpack with it.
We also have no idea on the context of this to did this person used to inspire and didsomething happen where they are now not motivated to inspire and they're actually just
pulling back from their job because of other things that could have happened in theirlife.
(49:30):
And if that's the case too, the answer doesn't really change.
The answer stays the same and
You know, I had a literacy coach actually say it best, stay in your lane.
What can you control?
What can you be accountable for?
And part of your lane in being a team is raising awareness with your team, right?
(49:53):
And they talk a lot about if it was something external that has changed the way thisperson is motivated in the workplace, that conversation needs to happen.
Something is different.
I've noticed this.
Right.
what can we do together to make it better, right?
And there's so much power in that conversation and approach it with love and approach itwith caution.
(50:18):
And I'm sure if you approach it with vulnerability, they would be receptive to at leastentertaining the conversation or you've now raised the awareness to them that somebody has
noticed things are different.
Yeah.
Because sometimes they do feel like they're putting on the happy face and coming to work,you know?
absolutely.
So with that, you know what listeners, I hope that that answers one of the questions thatwe tried to unpack.
(50:41):
Every time we have a guest, please continue to send questions.
I love getting to unpack them with you.
It leads to such great conversation.
And if this helped you in any way, shape or form, reach out, send it, send me a DM onInstagram, email Tyler at elementaleducator.com and connect with me and let me know if how
that helped with you in any situation you might be in.
Brittany, as we wrap up, what is one...
(51:01):
message that you wish everybody listening could take away with them.
that teachers do the most impossibly hard job.
And as administrators, the worst thing that we could ever do is forget that they arepeople first.
They are mothers, they are sisters, they are wives, they are daughters, they are sons,they are husbands, they are brothers, they are people.
(51:27):
And this job is heavy and with the climate that we're in right now, it feels like it'sgetting heavier.
And if we don't support the people who are passionate about serving our kids, we're gonnalose something really important.
And I think that it takes a lot to give teachers what they need, and we need to be tryingharder.
(51:48):
Very well put.
And thank you teachers.
Thank you all service.
All service, yeah.
Now with that, Brittany, if people want to hear more of your story, get in touch, what isthe best way for our audience to connect with you?
So I have an Instagram, it's The Preoccupied Principal.
(52:10):
I also have under the same name on Facebook and then my email is thepreoccupiedprincipalat gmail.com.
Wonderful, thank you for sharing and alchemists, as we wrap up our episode, I just wannatake a moment and share my appreciation for your listenership.
You're the reason we're here, you're the inspiration for the show, and I hope our journeytoday sparks some points of interest for you.
(52:33):
To dive deeper, make sure to subscribe to our monthly newsletter for scholarly insights,actionable strategies, and in-depth analysis of each episode.
Just reach out on our Instagram for the link.
And Brittany, thank you so much for taking the time out of your schedule to connect,collaborate, and empower us through your lived experience.
Thank you for having me.
I loved it.
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