February 26, 2025 • 52 mins
On this episode of Chargers Weekly, hosts Chris Hayre and Matt “Money” Smith are onsite at the 2025 NFL Scouting Combine in Indianapolis to recap the latest news involving LA and the entire NFL. The hosts sit down with NFL.com’s Lance Zierlein, NFL Network’s Charles Davis, and Reception Perception’s Matt Harmon to break down the top WR & OL prospects in the 2025 NFL Draft. Analyzing the draft class, Zierlein talks which offensive linemen could help protect quarterback Justin Herbert, Davis discusses which prospects could fit Head Coach Jim Harbaugh’s identity, and Harmon discusses the wide receiver class and who fits alongside second-year receiver Ladd McConkey.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Late fifteen to ten touchdown. What's up, guys, Welcome into
a brand new episode of Chargers Weekly, Episode number two
from Indianapolis as always, joined by the Voice of the
Chargers Matt Muney Smith and Money another gym of a
(00:22):
pot ahead.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Yeah. Look, there's all our friends are here and they're
kind enough to sit with us as they make the rounds.
They got a lot of requests, they can't honor them all.
And today three of our favorites, CD Charles Davis, just
one of the you know Tennessee cornerback when he was playing,
and of course part of you know the premiere one
of the premiere productions on CBS when it comes to
(00:43):
college YEP games. He called the Charger Houston Texan playoff
game and does a great shot for NFL Network covering
the Senior Bowl in the draft. So he's going to
join us, our old friend Matt Harmon, who's met reception perception.
So today's cool because you know, ce deal give us
the overview. And then Matt Harmon, who has has been
(01:03):
charting wide receivers for a decade now, is going to
just dig into the wide receiver free agency class. Some
of the options there the draft and what might be
available there. And then you know, one of my absolute
favorite people that we get to connect with whenever we
come down to the combine is Lance Airline. And Lance
is the guy that writes every single bio for the
(01:25):
NFL Network. And so when you're when I worked for
the NFL Network, I had seven hundred names and a
giant binder back in the day before it was digital.
They would give me three binders, massive binders. And he
was all from Lance, all from Lance. He wrote every
single bio, graded every player, every comp But his dad
is you know, his dad is well known as one
(01:45):
of the great o line coaches in the history of
the NFL. And so Lance was kind of raised on
offensive line, and so we'll focus on that with him.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
He gave us some great names. Matt Harmon obviously with
the wide receivers and so much uncertainty in the Charges
wide receiver room this offseason. So we'll get to Matt,
we'll get to Lance, but we're gonna kick this thing
off with Charles Davis. All right, Maddy, one of our favorites.
Charles Davis joins us here on Charges Weekly, and Charles,
we saw you in Houston Yeah, I'm just talking about
(02:13):
just the quick turnaround with the NFL. It never stops.
Saw your round and you are in. You go from
NFL mode to draft mode very very quickly.
Speaker 3 (02:21):
Yeah, I think we all do right. If you're in
the NFL, you're making these transitions all the time, you know.
And after draft mode, we'll be into OTA Mini camp mode,
then we'll be into short break mode, then we'll be
we'll be intestipating in training camp, and then we're in
the preseason, and then we're into the sea. It just
keeps going. I am old enough to remember when the
(02:42):
pat when the newspaper would arrive, the headline at a
certain point around this time of year would be pictures
and Catchers Report, and it would be this massive headline.
I remember one year it said pictures and Catchers Report.
I don't you know, I've conflated things. But along that line,
(03:03):
in the time frame of it, there's this blurb about
Giants draft Rocky Thompson number one. He was their first
round pick. He was a kick returner, wide receiver out
of North Texas State. It was three inches Pictures and
Catchers Report. Yeah, now it's pictures and Catchers Report. Is
(03:27):
the blurby and where will Aaron Rodgers go?
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Na it right?
Speaker 4 (03:32):
Headlines that's how we've changed.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Yeah, let's go to Houston. Let's talk about that. You
called the game, and you know, one of the things
that DJ said, Uh, you know we're both fortunate enough
to work with DJ is that you know you're and
it's an old football cleahere, right, your weaknesses get exposed
in the postseason. So did you feel like that's kind
of played out for the Chargers and they kind of
have a pretty good idea of what needs to be addressed, I.
Speaker 3 (03:53):
Would think so. I mean it's a very smart organization,
as you guys know, especially with the changes that you've
had over the last year. I mean just in last year.
What's been infused there? Because I remember seeing Joe Hortiz
when he got the job and we were talking knowing
m from Baltimore, and I was like, so congratulations during
cap hell huh yeah, And he knew it when he
(04:14):
took job.
Speaker 5 (04:14):
He's not naive.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
He Jim and the rest of the organization went to
work knowing, Okay, we got to try and mitigate here,
we got to go bring some and the moves they've
made let's be honest about the moves they made her
off the charts. We got to talk to JK. Dobbins
before the game. Well, the enthusiasm. He came in and
literally hugged all of us to say hello and then
hugged us all goodbye. I was like, can I just
hang with him for a while? Really like him? But
(04:37):
you're talking about you know, this was not new front line,
not new defensive front, not new We've had that for
X number of years now. So here's an opportunity now
to start to make some moves that way and see
where they're gonna go. I mean, I'm looking at this.
I actually did some notes last night for myself. You
know what's gonna happen? Edge rusher wise, right, because for
(05:01):
a long time that's been a strength. But right now
could that be beefed up? I'd say the answer is
going to be yes, you're gonna have to do that.
We mentioned inside in terier when people want to run
the ball defensive front, on the offensive side of the ball.
Everybody likes a good tight end. Oh yeah, right, everybody.
Any quarterback I always talked about young quarterbacks love the
tight ends. Every quarterback loves a good tight end. We're
(05:23):
gonna do it the pivot, you know, because offensive line
really started to get a makeover, a bunch of different
places to go.
Speaker 2 (05:30):
But you Jo said yesterday about Zion maybe getting a
look at center.
Speaker 4 (05:34):
I did not hear that.
Speaker 3 (05:35):
That's an interesting that's an interesting thought because if he
can and now you're just replacing it that guard position,
you've really strengthened your your offensive line. Because I think
that center has become more valuable than ever. I really do,
just by the way people are doing things. Would we
say that the Super Bowl of Seattle and the Patriots
(05:56):
really brought into focus how big it is to have
the center. Yeah, and the interior line taken care of.
And we probably missed the lesson that Sean Payton gave
us for years ago, especially if you have a smaller quarterback.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
Now you don't.
Speaker 3 (06:10):
You have monster a quarterback, but the smaller quarterback exists
in the league like crazy. Sean Payton got out ahead
of it because what did he have in the middle
Mammoth people, the Jarry Evans Is of the world and
what have you. Because Drew wasn't tall, but that allowed
him a cup to step up in and find sight
lines and throw the ball and networked pretty well for them.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
Charles, I think they've taken kind of a two step
approach with the offensive line. You get old you already
have Slater who's doing a big contract, and now it's
time to solidify the interior line. But on top of that,
you mentioned what Joe did this past year has been masterful.
But now I guess it's a good problem. You have
twenty six unrestricted free agents, So how do you prioritize
(06:50):
which guys come back while knowing that you have some
holes into your offensive line? And then how does the
draft come into play? How does the unrestricted free agency
dictate what they do in the draft?
Speaker 3 (07:04):
The priorities are going to be who are the guys
that we feel like we have to have to play
and what's our price tag on them? Without saying, well,
we really like him, so we'll go a little higher.
Now you're starting to eat into your margins and you're
going to hurt yourself elsewhere. I have a pretty good
idea that Joe and crew are going to be like,
this is what we value him. If we get him
for this.
Speaker 5 (07:22):
We're good.
Speaker 3 (07:22):
If not, we'll go elsewhere with luck. Yeah, right, and
go from there. And then once you're done with that,
then you know what you've got to do in the draft.
And because as our friend Daniel Jeremiah said, this is
a meat and potatoes draft, Yep, you're probably pretty decent
shape to go get people with whatever round you want
to the guys that have a chance to play. And
I think that's where they're good. I think that's what
(07:43):
they'll do. And I'd be surprised to hear that they
overpaid for anyone.
Speaker 4 (07:47):
I really would. I don't think that's how they operate.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
Those that are watching a lot of people listening right
now on the pod, but those that are watching, they
get to see the exquisite taste in headwear that CD
with his melon hat brought to the table never shows
a sweat stain. Throw them in the dishwashers. That yeah,
we surfing. They're amazing.
Speaker 4 (08:07):
They're amazing, Right, how did you get turned onto it?
Speaker 2 (08:10):
They sent me one. They were just like, hey, we
hear you're a surfer I was talking about on the air,
and they're like, if you like, if you ever want
to wear a hat in the water, try this out,
and they flipped it to me. I was like, Holy crap,
this thing.
Speaker 4 (08:19):
I need to hang out with you more. No one's
ever sent me anything but.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Well, since they will never se.
Speaker 3 (08:29):
My son turned me onto it. He said this because
I wear hats a lot, because the hair is you know,
there's there's not a lot to it. So so the
so my son goes, listen, you know, you're always in
a hat. This is what I want you to try.
So I always let him pick my head. And there,
you know, he said. And he told me, he said,
you're not gonna want to wear anything else, and he's right.
I brought three with them.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
There we go. Your son knows. Let's let's get into
the chiefs because people are taking shots at him now, saying, lookod,
look at this. There's it's the a f C. West.
It's a pain. It's been a pain for a while.
So what do you think moving forward? You know, the
challengers you had Broncos and the Chargers make the playoffs, Like, yeah,
how in peril do you think the throne is for
(09:09):
Kansas City going into twenty.
Speaker 4 (09:10):
Twenty the most imperil it's been under Andy Reid.
Speaker 3 (09:13):
And and I don't mean to be overly dramatic, it's
just simply you have two teams now that know that
they can do this. Like, even though you don't have
the actual full evidence, the idea that the Chargers lost
twice to them last year is still confounding to them.
You flip it over to Denver. Was that a block
(09:35):
field goal?
Speaker 2 (09:36):
Yeah? Right about that.
Speaker 3 (09:39):
We didn't matter, but they laid it on them anyway
because it felt good. You know, it felt good to
go ahead and let your rookie quarterback get some more
experience and beat them down like that. They still have
to go get it done. I don't think the Chiefs
are going like, oh, they're off the cliff. I don't
think they're there. But I do think that the confidence
level of everyone in the AFC West has to be
(09:59):
at an altar time high, Like if there's a chance
to go get this is our chance to go get
them right now.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
Now.
Speaker 3 (10:04):
We'll see what Kansay does offseason. But guys, this is
like NBA when you have the same team make deep runs.
How many extra games now are on the wear and
tear of your core? Because you know the league is
the league is your core and then you build around
your core, and around your core changes all the time,
but your core Mahomes, Kelsey, Chris Jones, those guys, how
(10:29):
many extra games have they played?
Speaker 1 (10:30):
Now?
Speaker 3 (10:30):
It just keeps going and going and going. And I'm
telling you that Super Bowl I'm taking zero credit away
from Philadelphia. But if Kansas City didn't look like a
fighter who had gone one fight too long, I don't
know what else to do. I don't know what else
to say. That's how they look that night.
Speaker 2 (10:45):
Now.
Speaker 3 (10:45):
I don't expect them to be that way in next season,
but I also don't expect them to go fifteen and two.
Speaker 4 (10:49):
Just don't say it, you.
Speaker 1 (10:51):
Know, Charles, Let's go back to Houston too. I think
that that game was the perfect illustration of this Chargers
offense in what's lacking on the outside? Talk out one
hundred ninety seventy yards receiving. Nobody else really did anything
in that game. The Chargers are lacking an X A
receiver on the other side of Ladd. Can you find
(11:11):
it in this draft? What's the best way to approach it?
Because it sounds like t Higgins is franchised. I don't know.
I don't know how you going to get him out
of Cincinnati. I don't think you are Adams an option
like what would you do me?
Speaker 4 (11:23):
Baron comes with him.
Speaker 1 (11:25):
That's what it sounds like. It's a good number two, right,
good number two.
Speaker 3 (11:29):
It sounds to me like Devonte Adams replaced Randall cobp
as Aaron's running guy, right and and somewhere Alm those are.
It's like, yo, yo, yo, what about me? Don't forget me.
We'll see if they do. I think you can find
those guys. I think there's a bunch of them there.
Obviously at the top of the food chain. You know,
you get to Travis Hunter is the receiver, is a corner,
you know that sort of.
Speaker 4 (11:48):
A deal you've got. You know what is Luther Burden
for you?
Speaker 5 (11:52):
Right?
Speaker 4 (11:52):
Although he kind of looks more.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
Like La lad Yeah, I think right right, thank you?
Speaker 3 (11:58):
Right, you have from McMillan that. But he's not gonna
I don't think he's gonna blow us away running.
Speaker 5 (12:02):
No.
Speaker 3 (12:03):
I think he's gonna be fine. But you're not gonna
go what did he run again? I don't think you
see that he wins with body control, going up and
getting it rout running, which I love like a Drake London,
thank you, just not quite as big as Drake, right,
Drake's monsters we saw that's a big man. It's like, damn,
(12:23):
that's a big man. Right, So I totally get it.
But I do think there's a bunch of them out there.
It's not as sexy as we've had it before, but
I've said it before. Dj' is probably sick of me
saying it. As long as we're gonna play football the
way we're playing it, every year, you're gonna a million receivers,
you are, and most of them are gonna be fairly
accomplished because they've been playing pitch and catch since seven
(12:44):
on seven in middle school.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
Yep.
Speaker 4 (12:46):
So it's a whole different ballgame.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Last thing for you, CD, we appreciate it. You were
at the Senior Bowl. You mentioned the pivot, and you know,
I think maybe the biggest name to come out of
there was Gray's Abel. Thank you so talking there we go,
so talk to us out there.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
He is.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
You know, it used to be crazy to think that
you take a center, you know, but you look at
what Linderbaum's done. You look at some of these centers
that go and then last year Graham.
Speaker 4 (13:08):
Barton, remember Corey Linsley when you brought him over a
free agent.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
It's difference that it made the difference that it makes.
So can you see that, Like, does that if you
have Colston Loveland, if if a Marion Hampton is there,
if Tamax slides, Like, can you see Gray's able being
a realistic pick for this team or is it too rich?
Speaker 3 (13:26):
I feel like I still feel like he would be
a second round guy. You know, I think if those
other guys were available, I think they'd go there.
Speaker 4 (13:34):
I just do.
Speaker 3 (13:35):
I think it's It's still one of those things where
can you name the rams front five? Can you name
the interior guys? Because it especially as the way, especially
the way the season went.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
Yah, I know what you're saying, and yet they function.
Speaker 3 (13:48):
So if you have the right play call or the
right system and all that, you can do it. I
think you can hide a few deficiencies there better than
because if you can get Loveland right, you gotta go exact,
you gotta do it. But if I could get Gray's abel,
I'm making my center like I'm not playing in MC
guard I'm putting him at center right away. You know
who if you get him later, the Monnheim kid out
(14:10):
of us see a heck of a week, and I
think that he can play in this league. I'd be
surprised if he can't. I need to do some more work.
I've got Drew Kendall from Boston College down. I'm old
enough to remember his old man. And you remember not
a center, but Ozzie Trapea who was putting Trapillo Trapella,
who was playing a tackle at.
Speaker 4 (14:30):
The Senior Bowl, big out of Boston College.
Speaker 3 (14:33):
I played in the Japan Bowl with his dad, and
his dad passed away young. He had a heart attack
and passed away by putting Japan Bowl with Steve. That's
when I go, old brothers.
Speaker 1 (14:45):
Get right.
Speaker 4 (14:47):
We were in we were in.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
Tokyo.
Speaker 4 (14:51):
We're in Tokyo. And I'll just leave it.
Speaker 3 (14:53):
This way, those old bowl games that we grew up watching,
the hull of Bowl, Japan Bowl, right, senior all those
think of it this way. Bo Jackson played in the
Japan Bowl.
Speaker 4 (15:07):
Bo Jackson played in the Japan Bowl.
Speaker 2 (15:11):
Pretty great. Think about that, Yeah, it's pretty great.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
Not in twenty twenty five.
Speaker 3 (15:15):
Could you imagine if he said, you know, I think
I'm playing in Japan, but and how many people have
tackled him in his camp?
Speaker 5 (15:20):
Right?
Speaker 2 (15:20):
No, no, no, absolutely not. You don't even get on the
plane Japan.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
I'm not even risking it, not even a tourist.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
But in that Japan Bowl I played in Brett Fulwan
was the first round pick for the Packers.
Speaker 1 (15:31):
Oh yeah, played in Japan Bowl.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
Look at that fantastic Charles Davis.
Speaker 1 (15:36):
Get for an hour, man, We can't take it for
your time to your next destination. Appreciate you, s gread
to see you. Guys. Always the best, the best man.
This week is so fun. So many friends joining us
on Chargers Weekly. Matt Harmon in person in Indianapolis, first combine.
Speaker 5 (15:53):
I mean, I'm just still struck. Friend. I mean, that's
that's high bar.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
Right.
Speaker 2 (15:57):
I appreciate colleague, not contemporary.
Speaker 5 (16:00):
Workplace proximity is a former work worker. Absolutely, it's awesome
to be here. It's great. Peanut butter denial, Yeah, peanut
butter denial. Many many or chain out. We're chain in today.
Yesterday was chain out. We'll see tonight though, chanin's probably
coming out.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
It's coming out.
Speaker 5 (16:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:21):
Listen, you don't throw around weight on inclined bench and
keep your chaining. You know, Matt's remade his body. He's
all barrel chested. He's throwing around freaking plates at the
y m c A, you get your chain out.
Speaker 5 (16:32):
That was what I was doing, like an hour ago.
I was up in the hotel gym, you.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
Know, just full at the podium. Today we are we
interviewing you.
Speaker 5 (16:40):
I think I probably should get up there and see
how long it would take for somebody be like, wait
a second, that guy, that guy's not a ball play.
Speaker 2 (16:46):
That's that guy dissects wide receivers. Now you're gonna have
to get the line plate, dude, you know, with this
new body of yours.
Speaker 5 (16:54):
It is funny. I interviewed thelak neighbors at the at
the super Bowl, and people like my podcast were just like, wow,
this's got a lot of Engagemently, let's go check out
the comments. Most of it was like, does neighbors need
to hit the weight room? Was like no, no, no, no, no, no,
I'm like probably sixty pounds having that right.
Speaker 2 (17:08):
No, I'm I'm a big bodied white dude that lives
in Virginia. That's all I got.
Speaker 5 (17:12):
Hey, that's all I've got to do is lift weights.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
So let's tell the people about reception per se. Nobody's
better at it. We're gonna talk straight wide receivers with Matt.
He does reception perception. He's done it for a long time,
You're great at it. Let's go just share with the
people to kind of I think set a baseline last year,
huge wide receiver class, sort of what you thought and
where Lad McConkie fit into that mix with I think
(17:35):
it was what the sixth pass catcher taken in the draft,
So kind of how you shook how you saw last
year shaken out.
Speaker 5 (17:40):
Yeah, last year was great for business. It was a
great receiver class. We had those three guys that were
all Tier one prospects, Harrison and dounesay neighbors. I think
I talked to you guys about this last year that
you could order those guys however, and I didn't really care.
It was basically like, what's your flavor. And really the
funny part is that you could argue that two guys
outside of that top three were the two best rookie
(18:03):
wide receivers last year, which I think was Lad mccaukey
and Brian Thomas Junior. So just funny that it's one
of those things where this is projecting to the NFL. Man,
anything can happen you get in the right situation, and
some of those guys that are maybe tier two or
even Tier three prospects can produce in the right situation,
which lad was certainly one of those guys. And man,
what an incredible rookie season he had. And I think
(18:23):
he showed you very early on like all of the
things that made him such an awesome prospect. You know,
there were some questions, right obviously, durability concerns, you know,
the playing time and overall just where does he fit
on an NFL field, because I do think he got
stereotyped as kind of like a bunny hop slot receiver.
But man, that guy's a real deal downfield route runner.
(18:46):
And I think it was the early on you could
really see Herbert gravitate to him because of like when
he's working in zone coverage, he's just always settling at
the right spot. And you know, Herbert is such a smart,
like cerebral quarterback, that is really something that he values.
But it was I think it was like the Week
six Saints game. Was it was around that time where
he had the two monster sideline touchdown. Yeah, and that
(19:07):
one to me where I mean he was sidelined touchdown
but he was very far away. Yeah, Yeah, And that
play was very significant to what I think that you
could see that trust because Herbert actually looks to like
the backside dig which I think was a zero two
two was the guy there and or semi fo Hooko
excuse me for Hooko was the the read I think
(19:27):
the first year on that play, he whips background so
fast and throws that like slot fade to Lad McConkie,
who wins it in tight coverage and then rips off
like a yards after catch play which man coverage winning
at the catch point yards after catch. That's a pretty
good wide receiver right there.
Speaker 1 (19:42):
What do you think he will look like in year
two with someone on the other side of him that
is perceived as a one A or a a number two?
Like how do you view Lad? Is he a sure
fire number one? Or do you think that they need
I guess they just need a different type of receiver
on the other side of.
Speaker 5 (19:58):
It, Yeah, they do. I think they're need is pretty
obvious for like an X receiver, because I think Lad
can win inside out his in terms of yards per
route run. He's actually better on the outside than he
is on the inside. And I mean he's damn good
working that slot. So that's that's a pretty incredible thing.
For giving him someone that can kind of like move
him from that flanker slot position is pretty crucial to
(20:19):
me because I do think he's capable of being a
number one receiver, Like, do you want to throw him
the ball one hundred and sixty one hundred and fifty
times in a year? Probably not, for a variety of reasons,
but I think he's a guy capable of being your
first read in the vast majority of your concepts. But
having someone that can not just clear out space from
the X receiver position, but can win in that spot
(20:40):
as well, that just makes the.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Offense more dangerous overall. So it seems like this year
you talked about it last year is good for business.
This year's a bit of a struggle. I think it
might have been. Was it Kuiper's draft mock draft that
had t ma max sliding all the way to twenty two?
Can you envision, like what's your grade on on McMillan
versus like where he would have fit in last year,
And whether or not you think in a league that
(21:03):
is desperate for wide receivers and they get paid a
ton of money, so it's a premium position, whether or
not it's realistic that that guy's there at twenty two.
Speaker 5 (21:10):
Right. That's the thing for me because DJ had him
slipping Dan Jerem I had him slipping to the bucks
as well, right, And then to me, I struggle kind
of seeing that happen, especially if he goes out, because
he's gonna work out right, like he's gonna run the forty.
If he goes out and rips like a four or
five two or something like that, I think then he's
locked himself into probably the top fifteen picks. I don't
care about his forty time, like that doesn't really matter
(21:32):
to me, but that does set the narrative of who
you are as a draft prospect when I watch him,
and I'm still like working my way through the film
on these guys for reception perception, it's always an eight
game sample if those are available, I'm like about halfway
through that right now. To me, he's kind of charting
out as more of like a tier two prospect. So
that would have put him last year in the conversation
with like Brian Thomas Junior in that range, which again
(21:53):
he was made.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
It to twenty right, whatever it was at twenty six or.
Speaker 5 (21:56):
I just think in this class though, he's the Travis
Hunter kind of discussed aside. I think he's the best
just receiver. And to me, like you said, it's such
a premium position. The money is crazy there, and there's
so many teams that need, like we just talked about
the Chargers need an X. I can go down the
list and tell you, like a lot of teams need
that skill set. And I just struggled to see him
(22:16):
slipping that far. But shoot, if you made it to LA,
that is exactly the guy we are talking That's like
the best version, the best outcome of what we're talking
about from that position.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
And that's what we're trying to identify. Is okay, if
it's not in the draft, you know, there's rumors about
guys like DK Metcalf and Adams and you know, Tyreek Hill,
all these different players. You know, we've talked about Chris Olavin,
Garret Wilson. Who knows what's gonna happen with the cap
situations in New York and New Orleans. If you had
to scour the league in terms of guys who could
(22:46):
be available via trade or just straight up free agents,
who do you think makes the most sense for the Chargers.
Speaker 5 (22:52):
That Adams one, I mean makes a ton of sense
to me. You know, he wants to play on the
West Coast. Don't blame him. I'm a guy that moved
away from the West Coast a stupid decision poorly. If
I'm him, I love the idea of getting back there
for sure. And again, he's somebody that can play the
ex receiver position. Now you also he moved around a
little bit with the Jets last year, but he can
play at that spot. Be kind of the backside ISO guy.
(23:13):
Allow you to move Lad McConkie into a bunch of
different positions, maybe work him off like full speed motion concepts.
There's there's a lot you can do there having that
guy who's also a credible threat. I mean, once he
hit the field for the Jets, it allowed Garrett Wilson
to really do a lot of this like move around
stuff we're talking about. So I think he would be
a great fit, you know, if he's available, if it fits,
they have a lot of cap space to do it.
(23:34):
I'm just curious like where the Chargers view themselves as
like how close are they how much do they want
to push the chips into I think they feel and
I think they should feel that way. You know, they
have the quarterback, they have the head coach. You've got
a lot of these like pieces that outkicked their coverage
last year, maybe outkicked expectations. Can we get an interior
offensive line locked in here? Can we get one more
(23:55):
pass catching threat, because that just and you know you
got needs on the defensive side too, You got things
to check off there. But offensively, I do feel like
they're right there, and a piece like Adams would be
an ideal, you know, kind of archetype for that. If
we get beyond that. I mean, there's just not a
lot of guys in this free agent market that fit
into that like potential X receiver bucket.
Speaker 2 (24:14):
Yeah, the Alave thing has always been interesting, and obviously
there's that Southern California connection as well, and that for
whatever reason, it just feels like there's always some sort
of issue with the Saints and their pass catchers. Yea,
if for whatever reason they decide to make him a
vail and I know the concussions are kind of scary
they're doing that thing, but I mean, he's he is
also a perfect fit right for kind of the way
(24:35):
he plays. He would fit in right there, wouldn't he?
Speaker 5 (24:39):
I think so, And I think he is a guy
who has a lot of untapped potential right from a
production standpoint, for sure. It just felt like him and
Derek Carr were never quite like a good fit for
each other, and like sometimes you can be a you know,
we could haggle about where Derek Carr ranks in terms
of NFL quarterbacks, but he's a starting quarterback in the league,
and Olave is a guy that should be kind of
on that upper trajectory. But some guys just don't see
(25:00):
the game the same way. Their styles don't fit in together.
I don't think that would be an issue in this offense,
where again you're getting so much play action, you're getting
shot plays like that really fits into a Lave skill set,
because when I've charted him out his first two seasons especially,
I mean, awesome separator, another guy that just gets open,
and that really is what you felt lacking. I've never seen,
I mean, I've never seen a freaking playoff box score
(25:21):
like the one that the Chargers had where it's just
Adam McConkie has one hundred and ninety seven yards and
the next highest is what like eighteen or something like that,
or was anybody even in double digits. It was absurd.
I've never seen a wide receiver split like that because
the other guys just can't consistently separate. If you can
get somebody like yeah, it's the idea of a big
ball winning X receiver, that's one thing. But if you
have two guys who are uncoverable, it's a pretty good start.
Speaker 1 (25:44):
Joshua Palmer understricted free agent. You know a lot of
conversation about Quintin Johnson in his second year more of
a mixed bag, but he had some good games. How
do you view Quinton coming into twenty twenty five.
Speaker 5 (25:57):
I think you can. You can get away with him
being your third receiver. The problem is, like he's a
volatile player. I think that's always going to be the case.
I don't think he's useless. I think there are This
is just what happens to guys who have drops in
big moments. They immediately start getting like its spirals, like
you start taking away everything that they do bring to
the game. And I do think there are things that
(26:17):
he does really well. I think he needs roll catering.
We've talked about this a lot we took about it previously.
He can't just be an X receiver. That's not his game.
The ball tracking is an issue. Winning against press coverage
consistently is an issue. But he's a run after catch streat.
I think he works on these, like inbreaking routes, and
I would say from literally the first game I remember
(26:37):
watching the Chargers this past season, it's like, Wow, this
coaching staff has such a better understanding of what this
guy is than the previous group that drafted him. Ironically enough,
because there was like a couple of plays where even
in that first game, again he's off. Then he's still
primarily line up at X in that game, but he's
off the line of scrimmage, and we're just working him
on quick in breaking routes and letting him go after
(26:58):
the catchdowns. Like I could probably like group the amount
of times he did that as a rookie. On one hand,
you know, so that is something that he can do.
But I think he's somebody that you just don't want
to be throwing the ball to eight, nine, ten times. Again.
You sprinkle him in like three. I think that's that's perfect.
Then you can get something out of a player like that.
Speaker 2 (27:18):
I don't know how much you mentioned you're kind of
trying to go through eight games for reception perception. How
deep have you gotten into the draft class this year?
Speaker 5 (27:24):
I've gotten about like six seven guys in.
Speaker 2 (27:27):
What do you think of Matthew Golden.
Speaker 5 (27:29):
I think he's interesting. He's kind of the hardest player
for me to get my mind around right now because
I think the three four games I've had are a
little bit of a mixed bag there. It kind of
gives me like Jordan Addison vibes a little bit right.
He's not a full field, consistent separator, but he has
real big flashes, but there are moments where he wins
like big time catches too, and especially late in the
(27:52):
season for Texas. So I think he's a guy that
I don't know if he's a future number one or
something like that, but definitely someone you can you can
kind of have in the rotation. And again, he's the
one I'm probably still trying to get my mind around
the most in terms of players who are projected in
the first round. Other guys I think I have got
like a pretty good grasp one and sometimes that's the
way it is. I can't remember I was talking to
you yesterday, because you know, some people push back like, oh,
(28:13):
eight games, like that's not the that's not the full season.
Like you can talk to like scouts stuff like that,
they're finaling reports on like free games, you know. But
and sometimes after one two games, like I get this player,
but that's standard, just the standard, and we still do
eight games, but sometimes even three four, and I'm like,
I don't quite I don't quite know where we are
with this guy yet. And that's kind of where I'm
(28:34):
at with.
Speaker 1 (28:34):
Golden Keenan, Allen, Mike Williams. Last year, the big debate was, Okay,
you're gonna keep Joey and Khalil versus those guys. They're
both unrestricted free agents right now. Mike was obviously coming
off a big injury, Keenan had some injury issues. What
did you see from those guys this past year, because
you know they're also unrestricted free agents who have history
(28:54):
with Justin Herbert.
Speaker 5 (28:55):
Yeah, And Keenan said, like, I'm only playing in La Chicago.
Speaker 1 (28:59):
Yeah, mine in the Sand or Virginia.
Speaker 5 (29:02):
Yeah, we'll see. I mean, everybody everybody says they're only
doing something until the checks start coming in. And there's
also two teams in LA and you know, I think
he actually would make some sense for the Rams if
he's a kind of low cost edition. Although I was
talking with our another one of our former workplace proximity
associates and I mean my business partner slash friend, James
co yesterday that if he was to replace Cooper Cup
(29:24):
in the Rams offense, it's interesting from a receiving perspective,
but you are going on to the other end of
the spectrum from blocking, you know, standpoint, like Cooper is
one of the best blocking receivers in the league, and
Keenan was definitely that was an issue for him in
Chicago last year. And it is kind of hard in
Chicago last year, Like I kind of want to give
all those guys a pass because these are, like, especially
the two former Pro Bowl receivers, These are you know,
(29:48):
proven guys like DJ Moore think about and I'm off
on a tangent here, but like DJ Moore, he's a
guy that has played in some rough situations in throughout
the course of his career. And this is probably the
first time you can look at the film and be like,
I don't know if this guy's fully bought into what's
going on here, and even some of his public comments,
which again is outrageous. This guy has played for some
weird coaching staff, so there was a lot going on
in Chicago last year. I think Keenan showed you he's
(30:08):
one of these players that sometimes with wide receivers you
just fall off the cliff. Other times there's a little
bit more of like a steady tick down. And I
think he could still be useful to the right team.
I don't know Chicago. I don't know if LA the
Chargers are that right team. Mike Williams. I mean, I
think it was tough last year. I just think it
was tough to.
Speaker 2 (30:28):
Expect the injury.
Speaker 5 (30:30):
He's a big guy.
Speaker 1 (30:31):
He's never been like a two different teams.
Speaker 5 (30:32):
Yeah, and he's never been an above average separator either.
I also thought that him and George Pickens kind of
have like a very overlapping skill set there in Pittsburgh too,
so you're kind of looking a little too samey. And
I mean Russell Wilson, like every offense just kind of
becomes the Russell Wilson offense, where you're looking at deep
shot wide receivers, tight coverage go routes, fades and things
(30:54):
like that, which is Mike Williams's skill set. But I
mean you're you're asking a lot for basically two guys
play the same position and play the position the same
way to be on the field at the same time
and thriving. Right.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
All right, well, reception perception check it out. He was
all over lad last year and uh, you know, business
was good last year, business was booming. So let's hope
that the combine turned some of these dudes out there.
Are you doing tight ends?
Speaker 5 (31:21):
No?
Speaker 2 (31:21):
I know you well, you thought it was. I was
listening to one of the I remember when you were
lovely know you were kicking it around. You were kicking
the idea around. What was it last year or the
year before you were talking about tight ends, isn't am?
I not right? Am?
Speaker 5 (31:37):
I remember you are remembering that the audience desperately wants
to see some of the tight end charting. There's two
problems with that. One. The technical answer is I've been
doing reception perception for ten years now. There's a very
over ten years. There's a clear database, like I can
tell you what each metric tells you like this. This
(31:59):
matter is because of this, and this is where we
know that this guy should play all that stuff, and
we're starting the database over. If we're like including tight ends,
it is a different position. Even if these the lines
can get a little blurred. The non technical answer is
I'm happily married man. I'd like to stay happily married.
Speaker 2 (32:14):
Man.
Speaker 5 (32:14):
I got enough damn work with. There's like fifty sixty
wide receivers. I need to charge up grind Will Disley
tape for us. Tell you what, gritty guy, all right,
it's grit.
Speaker 2 (32:23):
It's it team grit, all right, Matt. We appreciate it, man, appreciate.
Speaker 5 (32:26):
You, guys.
Speaker 1 (32:26):
Thank you well, Maddy another one of our favorites. I
can't believe it's been a year since Lancier Line joined
us and it was a draft where Joe Alt, Oh.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
Can you here, I'm just coming down a little bit too loud.
Speaker 1 (32:41):
Oh, I'm sorry.
Speaker 6 (32:41):
No, it's just my radio, you know. Just I just
go to the producer, I say, on the what is it?
I don't even I've been to radio twenty seven years.
Speaker 1 (32:48):
Chargers Weekly hosted around on the return, I was I
was just gonna find my game.
Speaker 2 (32:53):
I need a little bit more me in my air,
more me in my air. Please, that's that's that's a
routine for me. I like me, me like me, some
me exactly.
Speaker 1 (33:04):
At last, we were just saying, how you know you
gave us all this great insight on the offensive line
h last year, and the Chargers selected the best offensive
lineman in the draft in Joe Alt, and now the
bookends off for Shawn Slater and Joe Alt gonna be
with the Powder Blue for the next decade plus.
Speaker 4 (33:20):
However, you may need to go back to the.
Speaker 2 (33:23):
Well, here we go, this is how we get it started.
Speaker 6 (33:26):
You may need to go back to the well. I
like the book, NDS, I like your book. I think
you go you always go guard. Well, if you can't,
well you go best player available.
Speaker 4 (33:35):
Well, because you.
Speaker 6 (33:37):
Know, I covered the Houston Texans and uh so obviously
really in tune with with that match up the Chargers
and Texans. Yeah, and uh DJ and I talked a
little bit during the week about strengths and weaknesses of
the Texans and I, you know, I kind of gave
him a scouting report. He gave me the scouting report
on Chargers, and the one thing that really stood out
was this could be trouble because the Texans can mix
(34:00):
it up a little bit on the interior as rushers,
and that was an issue for the Chargers last year.
And I think that, you know, strengthening that immediate weakness
has got to be a priority. And I don't I
don't know that you do it with one pick. You know,
you may have to do it free agency and a pick,
but this isn't a good free agent market, so you
may need to go two picks.
Speaker 4 (34:17):
But the good news is it's pretty good guard draft.
Speaker 6 (34:20):
You got some centers you can look at, so it's
it's it can be taken care of. Probably need to
do it inside the first four four rounds, though.
Speaker 2 (34:28):
Let's uh, you know what, Let's start just I want
to make sure I got it right. Let's start with
the free agent market. You said it's not a good
guard market, but obviously.
Speaker 4 (34:36):
It's not a good free agent market in general.
Speaker 5 (34:38):
Yep.
Speaker 2 (34:38):
There may be a couple, so that's what I want
to get at. So let's say if they try to
mix and match, right, I don't know. I don't Maybe
they'll spend twenty two twenty four million bucks on Trey Smith.
I don't know. If I see him doing that. I
don't know if I see Kansas City.
Speaker 4 (34:50):
Let great fit. I don't. If I'm Kansas City, I
can't let them go, right, I just I just can't.
Speaker 6 (34:55):
You'll catch a French Chargers, Yeah, you'll catch a You'll
catch a tag for me from me before where I'll.
Speaker 1 (35:00):
Let you go.
Speaker 2 (35:00):
Okay, So then let's go. I'm just going through the
PFF rankings here. I don't know if these would be
your rankings, but next in line as will Fries look
good before he got hurt?
Speaker 5 (35:08):
Solid?
Speaker 2 (35:08):
That fit?
Speaker 4 (35:09):
So I think that's a fit.
Speaker 2 (35:10):
Fit take million bucks a year?
Speaker 4 (35:11):
Well is that what guards get with here?
Speaker 2 (35:14):
I mean, you know Houston needs them, Chargers need them.
Everybody needs a line, right.
Speaker 6 (35:18):
Well, I'd like him for a little less if I could,
But no, I mean, if if money's not an issue,
then yeah, fries and would make a lot of sense.
A guy like Gray's able, you know, who can play
center or guard. You know, in a perfect world money
you want tackle guard or guard center. You always want
position flexibility, but you'd also like not just like get
you out of a game and an emergency, you'd like
(35:39):
I can start like Landon Dickerson when he came out
of Alabama, he was a center at that time, but
he can play guard, and the idea was he'll eventually
go to center when Kelsey's gone. So you want guys
who have dual starting flexibility when possible. The tackle to
guard thing is is usually you have a guy's kind
of short armed or not big for whatever the case
(36:00):
may be, or not maybe quick enough depending on if
you're going to more of a gap scheme like the
like the Chargers have, and so you want somebody who's
got the pass pro finesse.
Speaker 4 (36:10):
And so I think there are.
Speaker 6 (36:12):
Some players that that can be found in free agency
who fit immediately, who are veterans and they won't have
the the bumps in the road that you're going to
have with the rookie.
Speaker 4 (36:23):
So if you can't get one.
Speaker 2 (36:25):
What about Tevin Jenkins?
Speaker 1 (36:28):
Maybe maybe too much mad case.
Speaker 6 (36:31):
I mean, Tevin is a talented player, but they've had
to really hustle over there to get him motivated. Although
he came off of a really good season, like he's
when he's motivated, he.
Speaker 4 (36:40):
Plays really really well.
Speaker 6 (36:41):
But you know, I don't know what the Chargers room
is like, I don't know how he fits into that room.
That's always a question that that that I guess the
study from the front office is.
Speaker 4 (36:52):
Going to have to do on this.
Speaker 2 (36:53):
Let me just throw the rest of these at you.
Tell me if if one of them jumps out at you. Zeitler,
James Daniels, McCarry. How about Aaron Banks taking a flyer
on him?
Speaker 6 (37:03):
Aaron Banks is big and strong, might be a guy
that you get cheap, and then you might. What you
do is you go probably twice in the offensive you know,
you go once in a fifth round, you go another
time in the first or second round, and then you say, okay,
we got some competition. Now we got three new we
got three new faces we're throwing in the offensive line room.
Let's let's get to it. Because to me, I mean,
(37:25):
just about every job should be up for grabs. There
should at least be real competition there because you got
too much, you know, I mean, there's still some holes
you can get better running back, can get better wide receiver.
There's there's some spots to get better in the secondary.
But you're not that far off if you're the chargers.
So you have to your your approach needs to be
pretty it needs to be pretty aggressive. And this is
(37:48):
only year two for this, you know, for this particular
group of coaches, and and so if you didn't get
it done in year one, your job should be up
in the air.
Speaker 1 (37:57):
Two. Lance's kind of a two part question here, George.
He said yesterday that they may experiment with experiment with
a Zion Johnson at center. Uh, you mentioned Gray Zabel,
a guy who has a lot of positional flexibility in
the interior. A. What do you think of Zion potentially
at center?
Speaker 5 (38:13):
And B?
Speaker 1 (38:15):
Would Graysabel be a solid pick at twenty two or
is that somebody that slide to the second round?
Speaker 6 (38:20):
You know, I'd say it's too early. But here's the thing.
Cole Strange was a first round pick from New England.
You know, New England has gone Logan Mankins in the past.
They went you know, New England always believed in if
we get a good guard, we're gonna draft good guard
and we don't care.
Speaker 4 (38:34):
We're not gonna play games with it. We just will
do it in the first round.
Speaker 6 (38:38):
I don't think that's the worst idea in the world.
Is that a little early for grays Abel? I guess,
but who really cares if he becomes a ten year starter? Like,
what difference does it make if you drafted him if you,
because he's not going.
Speaker 2 (38:48):
To be there when you draft him the second round,
we'll be there fifty five, so he's not going.
Speaker 4 (38:51):
To be there.
Speaker 6 (38:52):
So either you're trading back and hoping that he's still
on the board or you or you take him there.
So I don't know, I don't know how you how
you work it, But that's a guy that would make
sense coming in at playing. If if Zion could give
you the snaps, that's great. Can he is he a
good snapper? Can he identify fronts? It may not require
that Zion is a very smart guy. Is he football smart?
(39:13):
I don't know. You're gonna be BookSmart. You may not
have a great feel and instinct. Sometimes it doesn't matter.
Sometime the guards are making the calls an identifying the front.
So Gray is a tough guy, as you mentioned he
has he has He has three for one position flexibility,
probably more emergency right tackle in the league, but starting guards,
starting center, very strong core so he can hold up
(39:36):
to bull rushes. He was fantastic at the senior well,
just really really good and much better than I had anticipated.
But you always love having a guy with tackle experience
in because they're just they're just they're going to be
more savvy and they're going to be more technically sound
in pass pro. And for me, that's obviously like a huge,
huge get. But you can't really sacrifice, like Jim Harball
(39:59):
is not going to sacrifice your ability to be tough
and kind of move people around. But that the duo
blocks and the gap scheme stuff. So Grey's abel actually
fits that too. So he's one of those guys that fits.
Speaker 2 (40:09):
What if he let's say he's there, Booker's there.
Speaker 4 (40:15):
I mean Booker, you race it up and it's over.
Speaker 2 (40:17):
That would be it that Yeah, But I'm saying so.
Speaker 4 (40:19):
Because Booker's wired the way you want him to.
Speaker 6 (40:21):
He's big, like like like Hardball likes him, and he's
strong and physical, so hert I mean, Booker should be
one of the guys who's at the very top of
their list because he's also considered the leader at Alabama.
It's not Milrow, it's not anyone on defense. The leader
is a guard of the team of the team. So
now you've got a guy in a room that's already
(40:42):
got a strong room with all you got a lot
of football character. Now with Alt and Schlater and Booker.
And you know in Zion Johnson he's got a lot
of football character as well. You got to really you
got the right kind of room if you got Booker.
I just don't think Booker is going to be there.
I know he's not gonna be when you're drafted. So
because because what I'm telling you is what a lot
(41:03):
of teams want. And it wouldn't shock me if somebody
moved up. It's crazy to move up for a guard.
But there's not a lot of first round guards. So
thirteen fifty yeah, I mean, you know that's not where
I have him graded, but where you have to slot them.
And now DJ loves all the intangibles. The people at
the Alabama program speak extremely glowingly of them. Well, if
(41:23):
you think they're doing that to DJ, to myself, what
do you think they're telling the NFL teams, they're telling them.
Speaker 1 (41:27):
The same thing.
Speaker 6 (41:28):
And so teams who say, man, we need somebody inside
who's tough, who's a leader, Who's Houston Texans?
Speaker 4 (41:34):
Who I cover? They need somebody inside who's tough, who's
a leader? Will you draft ahead of them?
Speaker 6 (41:39):
So, I mean, you can't play games with it if
Booker's there, Race the card up, but I just.
Speaker 4 (41:44):
Don't see what are you?
Speaker 1 (41:45):
Twenty two two?
Speaker 5 (41:47):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (41:47):
I just I think he goes inside the top eighteen picks.
Speaker 2 (41:50):
You mentioned flexibility, what about Membo?
Speaker 4 (41:54):
That's another one.
Speaker 5 (41:55):
Maybe.
Speaker 4 (41:55):
Yeah, you have to trade up to get Membo. But Membo.
Speaker 6 (41:59):
You know, it's funny I talk to a team that
isn't quite as high as I am on them, but
they're just wrong. I'm right and they're wrong. Mimbo is
really going to be good. He is very tough. He's
he's about three hundred and thirty pounds of solid mass.
He's a little shorter than most tackles, but he's got
thirty four inch arms, which makes up for it because
he's got that wingspan. But what makes Membo different to
(42:20):
me is, you know, he's mostly been in an outside
zone scheme. A lot of inside outside zone, which is
a move based offense blocking scheme. For those listening what
the Chargers do and what Jim did at what Hardball
did at Michigan, there's a lot of double teams and
then you work up to the linebacker called duo blocks
or gap scheme. But I think Membo can do that.
Like he's strong, he's got really good hands, He's very
(42:42):
technically sounded, he's tough.
Speaker 4 (42:43):
He's very tough.
Speaker 6 (42:44):
So from a from a culture fit and from a
scheme fit, Membo is fantastic and he gives you the
potential to step out at right.
Speaker 4 (42:54):
Let let all roll over to left tackle.
Speaker 6 (42:56):
If something happens Slater and Membo to right side, maybe
Mimbo go's left side. You know, he can slide, he
can play an emergency swing tackle if you're not happy
with your swing tackle. But I think he is a
long time starting guard and a good one if you
got your hands on him. But he goes before Booker
potentially lace.
Speaker 1 (43:13):
That was my next question to you is we saw
All go out with a knee injury earlier in the year,
missed the game. Slater has had some injury history. What
about just adding to a strength and like the third
or fourth right and getting another tackle that maybe has
that positional versatility to kick inside the guard. Are there
any guys you can think about and maybe those mid
(43:34):
rounds that the Chargers may be attracted to.
Speaker 6 (43:38):
Yeah, I think if you start looking at third and
fourth round probably you know Anthony Belton from NC State
is a name. He's a big massive guy, but he's tough,
he's physical, he's got a little better feet than you're
maybe expecting.
Speaker 4 (43:53):
I think a player, and I'm trying to think, you.
Speaker 6 (43:55):
Know, specific to to I think Jack Nelson from is
more of a four round type of tackle from Wisconsin.
But you know, he's a big ten player and he
comes from the same type of mentality over at Wisconsin
that that. You know, it's when you when you try
to figure out what a team is gonna do, you
really sometimes you have to try to get into the
personality of the team. And with Hardball, there's no He's
(44:17):
not sneaky exactly. I mean he told h he basically
told us he was drafting an offensive lineman last year.
Like you know, most teams try to smoke screen. I
don't think he's capable of it. But he's also he's
also like easy for me to read because I can
just look for Chargers. I go look for Michigan, Michigan
men boy, the boys in blue, and I'm looking for that,
(44:40):
only it's a it's a lighter color, more a softer
blue now, but it's not softer in the interior, you know,
in the trenches. So Charles Grant loved Charles Grant, and
he is a player.
Speaker 2 (44:51):
That's he's third at the latest.
Speaker 6 (44:55):
He could be a riser and I'd kind of plugged
him into the third fourth at first when I first
watched him, and I thought, boy, this is a guy
that is going to be a steal. Well, if I'm
thinking he's a steal in December, he's probably gonna test
well and he's not gonna be a steal because offensive
lineman get pushed up, so he won't be there for
the Chargers third round pick, I don't think, And he
could end up going in a second because he is
a tackle guard flexible player too, but he is a
(45:18):
tremendously quick zone scheme guy, so I don't know that
he would fit schematically.
Speaker 2 (45:22):
What about just center, if they're going to maybe try
Zion at center, if they bring back Bozeman on a
you know, lower number contract. Everybody loves him in the room,
so I'd be really surprised. And then if they're going
fishing in those late rounds for you.
Speaker 4 (45:38):
Know, if you want to fish in the late rounds.
Speaker 6 (45:41):
Jake Majors from University of Texas Money and I talked
about him the other night. One of the smartest centers
in the whole draft, really really football smart. He's tough,
he has good size, so he's not like one of
these three hundred and two pounds centers that has to
try to eat all day to keep his weight on.
I mean, he's in a three fifteen range, I think
something like that. I don't know where he will be
(46:03):
if he's weighed here, what he's going to be here.
But he's a hardy. He's a good hearty size for center.
Speaker 4 (46:08):
What do you have on him? Money?
Speaker 2 (46:10):
I got him at Let's see, they don't have it here.
Speaker 4 (46:13):
Let's see for that look yep, so that's where he plays.
Speaker 2 (46:17):
See your guy, Well, this is the guy that Lance
and I were talking about. Then I went back and
watched the Michigan game and I was like, he's holding
his own against Kenneth Grant. He's holding his own against
Mason Grant. He had a good game that day.
Speaker 6 (46:28):
You got to see what the Longhorns look like. A
good look against Michigan. And I love watching best on best,
and he more than held his own against those two guys.
And he's smart, he's durable at the point of attack,
and you know, he's the type of guy that I
think can become a starter, even if you're taking him
in the fifth or sixth round. And and and that's
(46:49):
what you love to find. There's a lot of centers
who start in this league that were fifth, sixth, seventh
and undrafted, usually like fifth, sixth and undrafted. You find
it all the time, and you have to so you
can afford other players. You have to go find late
round guys.
Speaker 1 (47:03):
Lansay, if I get you off the offensively just for
a second, goes hand in hand.
Speaker 5 (47:06):
Though.
Speaker 1 (47:07):
I don't know if we're seeing a running back renaissance.
You see what Saquan did and to lead the Eagles
to a Super Bowl victory. He saw with Derek Henry
did in Baltimore. The Chargers could use an Omari and
Hampton and Ashton genty. How do you view this running
back class and who do you think would be the
best fit from a running back perspective, knowing what you
(47:29):
have on the offensive line right now on the book ends.
Speaker 6 (47:30):
Well, I think it's a really good it's a really
good running back draft for what you guys do. There's
some hammerheads in here. There's some tough guys, some physical players,
and it happens to be very deep. I mean, you
can go find guys in a fifth round who are
gonna fit and maybe sixth who can come in and
give you good number two carries. You want to find
a number one, number ones or in this draft as well,
(47:51):
Amara and Hampton.
Speaker 4 (47:53):
You know.
Speaker 6 (47:56):
To have two first round maybe three for round running back.
I think Travion Henderson is going to test well and
he could be a real wildcard after what Jamior Gibbs
has been able to do.
Speaker 4 (48:06):
Ashton Gent's gonna go high.
Speaker 6 (48:07):
But Omarion Hampton is the perfect kind of right down
the middle, no no gatherers feet. He's he's accelerating through
into and through contact. He's a big guy, He's been
extremely healthy. He's a number one back who's gonna get
a lot of carries, maybe in the first round.
Speaker 4 (48:24):
Uh.
Speaker 6 (48:24):
Quinn Shawn Judkins is another tough guy, very tough, physical,
not as explosive in terms of hitting the big chunk
plays that's typically not really a concern for a Jim
Harball type offense.
Speaker 4 (48:36):
I mean, if you get it, you get it. If
you don't, you don't.
Speaker 6 (48:38):
If you if you want to have a hardcore player
like a Judkins in the first running back spot. Then
just go find a guy with a little more a
little more juice at the second running back spot.
Speaker 4 (48:48):
Uh.
Speaker 6 (48:48):
But then you get to players like I think another
guy that would fit would be Cam scattaball as a
as a second. Now i'm making him a second. I'm
trying to beat you up by committee. So I want
to have the first guy who beats you up. Then
I want to have the second guy who comes and
does some of the same stuff. In that case, my
third running back needs to be the splash and dash
player who maybe gets three or four carries but does
(49:10):
all the third most of the third down work for you.
But you can go into the like the fourth and
fifth rounds Montreal Johnson out of Florida, Jordan James out
of Oregon. These are guys who are extraordinarily physical and
who have a certain mentality, And this is a great
draft for mentality running backs. You know, guys that are
gonna get between the tackles and keep it between the tackles.
(49:33):
It's just that, you know, you got to do the
work on how many of these can catch passes as well,
how many of these guys keep it on the track,
Because what you don't want is. You don't want players
who try to bounce it. You know, you can have
a physical player who likes to kind of every once
in a while drift into the world of finesse and
think he's going to be a slick I remember watching
Chris Carson.
Speaker 4 (49:53):
Remember Chris Carson.
Speaker 6 (49:54):
Yeah, when he came out of Oklahoma State, and I
just kept seeing like he's so big and strong, why
does he keep dancing around and trying to be a
finesse back? And I read an article where his running
backs in the same room with him gave him hell
over the same thing, like, dude, you're so big and strong,
you got to just be running over people. When he
got to the league, that's what he became, is a
(50:15):
running back coach or an offense coordinator or maybe a
veteran got in his head and said, you're so big,
what are you doing?
Speaker 1 (50:21):
Man?
Speaker 4 (50:21):
Just go run over people? And he was a he
was a nightmare for a little bit. Like he was
a really physical back. So good draft have physical backs.
Speaker 2 (50:29):
Great stuff. He writes all the tree. You hit up
NFL dot com and you click on a player's name,
and that is all Lance. He's done the great He's
done the bio. He's done the write up, he's done
the comparison, seven hundred eight, So we're talking about.
Speaker 4 (50:42):
Fifty five hundred over the last eleven drafts.
Speaker 6 (50:45):
But right now we're sitting at about three forty five
three for that one hundred and forty five to go.
Speaker 2 (50:50):
Yeah, they don't push back on Lance. Man knows what
he's talking about, and we appreciate it.
Speaker 4 (50:53):
Man.
Speaker 2 (50:54):
Thanks brother, you're the best.
Speaker 1 (50:55):
Thanks guys, So buddy, we are spoiled. Two more podcasts
this week. This one was.
Speaker 2 (51:00):
Fun, absolutely great one.
Speaker 5 (51:02):
Today.
Speaker 2 (51:02):
We'll have great one tomorrow. Mina's gonna join us, so
Mina comes from over at ESPN. We'll have danme Brugler,
our friend from the Athletic puts together The Beast another.
You know, we talked about Lance in this one. Danged
the same way, six seven hundred names that he's grading
and putting up reviews on. And it's Brett Coleman exactly,
our friend that you see if you go to Charger games,
you see him breaking it down up on the giant board.
(51:23):
Just incredible at watching tape and breaking players down. So
most definitely gonna be another Gret one tomorrow.
Speaker 1 (51:29):
It's easy to forget because we've had like so many
twenty guests this week. Exactly we'll do it. Should we
do a Prime forty seven recap? No no, no, so
not do that that. We'll skip that one. Use your imagination.
And I need to go take a nap.
Speaker 5 (51:45):
For buddy up.
Speaker 1 (51:45):
Chris, it's been charges weekly. We'll see you tomorrow.
Late fifteen to ten touchdown. What's up, guys, Welcome into
a brand new episode of Chargers Weekly, Episode number two
from Indianapolis as always, joined by the Voice of the
Chargers Matt Muney Smith and Money another gym of a
(00:22):
pot ahead.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
Yeah. Look, there's all our friends are here and they're
kind enough to sit with us as they make the rounds.
They got a lot of requests, they can't honor them all.
And today three of our favorites, CD Charles Davis, just
one of the you know Tennessee cornerback when he was playing,
and of course part of you know the premiere one
of the premiere productions on CBS when it comes to
(00:43):
college YEP games. He called the Charger Houston Texan playoff
game and does a great shot for NFL Network covering
the Senior Bowl in the draft. So he's going to
join us, our old friend Matt Harmon, who's met reception perception.
So today's cool because you know, ce deal give us
the overview. And then Matt Harmon, who has has been
(01:03):
charting wide receivers for a decade now, is going to
just dig into the wide receiver free agency class. Some
of the options there the draft and what might be
available there. And then you know, one of my absolute
favorite people that we get to connect with whenever we
come down to the combine is Lance Airline. And Lance
is the guy that writes every single bio for the
(01:25):
NFL Network. And so when you're when I worked for
the NFL Network, I had seven hundred names and a
giant binder back in the day before it was digital.
They would give me three binders, massive binders. And he
was all from Lance, all from Lance. He wrote every
single bio, graded every player, every comp But his dad
is you know, his dad is well known as one
(01:45):
of the great o line coaches in the history of
the NFL. And so Lance was kind of raised on
offensive line, and so we'll focus on that with him.
Speaker 1 (01:52):
He gave us some great names. Matt Harmon obviously with
the wide receivers and so much uncertainty in the Charges
wide receiver room this offseason. So we'll get to Matt,
we'll get to Lance, but we're gonna kick this thing
off with Charles Davis. All right, Maddy, one of our favorites.
Charles Davis joins us here on Charges Weekly, and Charles,
we saw you in Houston Yeah, I'm just talking about
(02:13):
just the quick turnaround with the NFL. It never stops.
Saw your round and you are in. You go from
NFL mode to draft mode very very quickly.
Speaker 3 (02:21):
Yeah, I think we all do right. If you're in
the NFL, you're making these transitions all the time, you know.
And after draft mode, we'll be into OTA Mini camp mode,
then we'll be into short break mode, then we'll be
we'll be intestipating in training camp, and then we're in
the preseason, and then we're into the sea. It just
keeps going. I am old enough to remember when the
(02:42):
pat when the newspaper would arrive, the headline at a
certain point around this time of year would be pictures
and Catchers Report, and it would be this massive headline.
I remember one year it said pictures and Catchers Report.
I don't you know, I've conflated things. But along that line,
(03:03):
in the time frame of it, there's this blurb about
Giants draft Rocky Thompson number one. He was their first
round pick. He was a kick returner, wide receiver out
of North Texas State. It was three inches Pictures and
Catchers Report. Yeah, now it's pictures and Catchers Report. Is
(03:27):
the blurby and where will Aaron Rodgers go?
Speaker 2 (03:31):
Na it right?
Speaker 4 (03:32):
Headlines that's how we've changed.
Speaker 2 (03:34):
Yeah, let's go to Houston. Let's talk about that. You
called the game, and you know, one of the things
that DJ said, Uh, you know we're both fortunate enough
to work with DJ is that you know you're and
it's an old football cleahere, right, your weaknesses get exposed
in the postseason. So did you feel like that's kind
of played out for the Chargers and they kind of
have a pretty good idea of what needs to be addressed, I.
Speaker 3 (03:53):
Would think so. I mean it's a very smart organization,
as you guys know, especially with the changes that you've
had over the last year. I mean just in last year.
What's been infused there? Because I remember seeing Joe Hortiz
when he got the job and we were talking knowing
m from Baltimore, and I was like, so congratulations during
cap hell huh yeah, And he knew it when he
(04:14):
took job.
Speaker 5 (04:14):
He's not naive.
Speaker 3 (04:15):
He Jim and the rest of the organization went to
work knowing, Okay, we got to try and mitigate here,
we got to go bring some and the moves they've
made let's be honest about the moves they made her
off the charts. We got to talk to JK. Dobbins
before the game. Well, the enthusiasm. He came in and
literally hugged all of us to say hello and then
hugged us all goodbye. I was like, can I just
hang with him for a while? Really like him? But
(04:37):
you're talking about you know, this was not new front line,
not new defensive front, not new We've had that for
X number of years now. So here's an opportunity now
to start to make some moves that way and see
where they're gonna go. I mean, I'm looking at this.
I actually did some notes last night for myself. You
know what's gonna happen? Edge rusher wise, right, because for
(05:01):
a long time that's been a strength. But right now
could that be beefed up? I'd say the answer is
going to be yes, you're gonna have to do that.
We mentioned inside in terier when people want to run
the ball defensive front, on the offensive side of the ball.
Everybody likes a good tight end. Oh yeah, right, everybody.
Any quarterback I always talked about young quarterbacks love the
tight ends. Every quarterback loves a good tight end. We're
(05:23):
gonna do it the pivot, you know, because offensive line
really started to get a makeover, a bunch of different
places to go.
Speaker 2 (05:30):
But you Jo said yesterday about Zion maybe getting a
look at center.
Speaker 4 (05:34):
I did not hear that.
Speaker 3 (05:35):
That's an interesting that's an interesting thought because if he
can and now you're just replacing it that guard position,
you've really strengthened your your offensive line. Because I think
that center has become more valuable than ever. I really do,
just by the way people are doing things. Would we
say that the Super Bowl of Seattle and the Patriots
(05:56):
really brought into focus how big it is to have
the center. Yeah, and the interior line taken care of.
And we probably missed the lesson that Sean Payton gave
us for years ago, especially if you have a smaller quarterback.
Speaker 1 (06:09):
Now you don't.
Speaker 3 (06:10):
You have monster a quarterback, but the smaller quarterback exists
in the league like crazy. Sean Payton got out ahead
of it because what did he have in the middle
Mammoth people, the Jarry Evans Is of the world and
what have you. Because Drew wasn't tall, but that allowed
him a cup to step up in and find sight
lines and throw the ball and networked pretty well for them.
Speaker 1 (06:29):
Charles, I think they've taken kind of a two step
approach with the offensive line. You get old you already
have Slater who's doing a big contract, and now it's
time to solidify the interior line. But on top of that,
you mentioned what Joe did this past year has been masterful.
But now I guess it's a good problem. You have
twenty six unrestricted free agents, So how do you prioritize
(06:50):
which guys come back while knowing that you have some
holes into your offensive line? And then how does the
draft come into play? How does the unrestricted free agency
dictate what they do in the draft?
Speaker 3 (07:04):
The priorities are going to be who are the guys
that we feel like we have to have to play
and what's our price tag on them? Without saying, well,
we really like him, so we'll go a little higher.
Now you're starting to eat into your margins and you're
going to hurt yourself elsewhere. I have a pretty good
idea that Joe and crew are going to be like,
this is what we value him. If we get him
for this.
Speaker 5 (07:22):
We're good.
Speaker 3 (07:22):
If not, we'll go elsewhere with luck. Yeah, right, and
go from there. And then once you're done with that,
then you know what you've got to do in the draft.
And because as our friend Daniel Jeremiah said, this is
a meat and potatoes draft, Yep, you're probably pretty decent
shape to go get people with whatever round you want
to the guys that have a chance to play. And
I think that's where they're good. I think that's what
(07:43):
they'll do. And I'd be surprised to hear that they
overpaid for anyone.
Speaker 4 (07:47):
I really would. I don't think that's how they operate.
Speaker 2 (07:49):
Those that are watching a lot of people listening right
now on the pod, but those that are watching, they
get to see the exquisite taste in headwear that CD
with his melon hat brought to the table never shows
a sweat stain. Throw them in the dishwashers. That yeah,
we surfing. They're amazing.
Speaker 4 (08:07):
They're amazing, Right, how did you get turned onto it?
Speaker 2 (08:10):
They sent me one. They were just like, hey, we
hear you're a surfer I was talking about on the air,
and they're like, if you like, if you ever want
to wear a hat in the water, try this out,
and they flipped it to me. I was like, Holy crap,
this thing.
Speaker 4 (08:19):
I need to hang out with you more. No one's
ever sent me anything but.
Speaker 1 (08:24):
Well, since they will never se.
Speaker 3 (08:29):
My son turned me onto it. He said this because
I wear hats a lot, because the hair is you know,
there's there's not a lot to it. So so the
so my son goes, listen, you know, you're always in
a hat. This is what I want you to try.
So I always let him pick my head. And there,
you know, he said. And he told me, he said,
you're not gonna want to wear anything else, and he's right.
I brought three with them.
Speaker 2 (08:49):
There we go. Your son knows. Let's let's get into
the chiefs because people are taking shots at him now, saying, lookod,
look at this. There's it's the a f C. West.
It's a pain. It's been a pain for a while.
So what do you think moving forward? You know, the
challengers you had Broncos and the Chargers make the playoffs, Like, yeah,
how in peril do you think the throne is for
(09:09):
Kansas City going into twenty.
Speaker 4 (09:10):
Twenty the most imperil it's been under Andy Reid.
Speaker 3 (09:13):
And and I don't mean to be overly dramatic, it's
just simply you have two teams now that know that
they can do this. Like, even though you don't have
the actual full evidence, the idea that the Chargers lost
twice to them last year is still confounding to them.
You flip it over to Denver. Was that a block
(09:35):
field goal?
Speaker 2 (09:36):
Yeah? Right about that.
Speaker 3 (09:39):
We didn't matter, but they laid it on them anyway
because it felt good. You know, it felt good to
go ahead and let your rookie quarterback get some more
experience and beat them down like that. They still have
to go get it done. I don't think the Chiefs
are going like, oh, they're off the cliff. I don't
think they're there. But I do think that the confidence
level of everyone in the AFC West has to be
(09:59):
at an altar time high, Like if there's a chance
to go get this is our chance to go get
them right now.
Speaker 1 (10:04):
Now.
Speaker 3 (10:04):
We'll see what Kansay does offseason. But guys, this is
like NBA when you have the same team make deep runs.
How many extra games now are on the wear and
tear of your core? Because you know the league is
the league is your core and then you build around
your core, and around your core changes all the time,
but your core Mahomes, Kelsey, Chris Jones, those guys, how
(10:29):
many extra games have they played?
Speaker 1 (10:30):
Now?
Speaker 3 (10:30):
It just keeps going and going and going. And I'm
telling you that Super Bowl I'm taking zero credit away
from Philadelphia. But if Kansas City didn't look like a
fighter who had gone one fight too long, I don't
know what else to do. I don't know what else
to say. That's how they look that night.
Speaker 2 (10:45):
Now.
Speaker 3 (10:45):
I don't expect them to be that way in next season,
but I also don't expect them to go fifteen and two.
Speaker 4 (10:49):
Just don't say it, you.
Speaker 1 (10:51):
Know, Charles, Let's go back to Houston too. I think
that that game was the perfect illustration of this Chargers
offense in what's lacking on the outside? Talk out one
hundred ninety seventy yards receiving. Nobody else really did anything
in that game. The Chargers are lacking an X A
receiver on the other side of Ladd. Can you find
(11:11):
it in this draft? What's the best way to approach it?
Because it sounds like t Higgins is franchised. I don't know.
I don't know how you going to get him out
of Cincinnati. I don't think you are Adams an option
like what would you do me?
Speaker 4 (11:23):
Baron comes with him.
Speaker 1 (11:25):
That's what it sounds like. It's a good number two, right,
good number two.
Speaker 3 (11:29):
It sounds to me like Devonte Adams replaced Randall cobp
as Aaron's running guy, right and and somewhere Alm those are.
It's like, yo, yo, yo, what about me? Don't forget me.
We'll see if they do. I think you can find
those guys. I think there's a bunch of them there.
Obviously at the top of the food chain. You know,
you get to Travis Hunter is the receiver, is a corner,
you know that sort of.
Speaker 4 (11:48):
A deal you've got. You know what is Luther Burden
for you?
Speaker 5 (11:52):
Right?
Speaker 4 (11:52):
Although he kind of looks more.
Speaker 2 (11:54):
Like La lad Yeah, I think right right, thank you?
Speaker 3 (11:58):
Right, you have from McMillan that. But he's not gonna
I don't think he's gonna blow us away running.
Speaker 5 (12:02):
No.
Speaker 3 (12:03):
I think he's gonna be fine. But you're not gonna
go what did he run again? I don't think you
see that he wins with body control, going up and
getting it rout running, which I love like a Drake London,
thank you, just not quite as big as Drake, right,
Drake's monsters we saw that's a big man. It's like, damn,
(12:23):
that's a big man. Right, So I totally get it.
But I do think there's a bunch of them out there.
It's not as sexy as we've had it before, but
I've said it before. Dj' is probably sick of me
saying it. As long as we're gonna play football the
way we're playing it, every year, you're gonna a million receivers,
you are, and most of them are gonna be fairly
accomplished because they've been playing pitch and catch since seven
(12:44):
on seven in middle school.
Speaker 2 (12:45):
Yep.
Speaker 4 (12:46):
So it's a whole different ballgame.
Speaker 2 (12:47):
Last thing for you, CD, we appreciate it. You were
at the Senior Bowl. You mentioned the pivot, and you know,
I think maybe the biggest name to come out of
there was Gray's Abel. Thank you so talking there we go,
so talk to us out there.
Speaker 1 (13:00):
He is.
Speaker 2 (13:00):
You know, it used to be crazy to think that
you take a center, you know, but you look at
what Linderbaum's done. You look at some of these centers
that go and then last year Graham.
Speaker 4 (13:08):
Barton, remember Corey Linsley when you brought him over a
free agent.
Speaker 2 (13:11):
It's difference that it made the difference that it makes.
So can you see that, Like, does that if you
have Colston Loveland, if if a Marion Hampton is there,
if Tamax slides, Like, can you see Gray's able being
a realistic pick for this team or is it too rich?
Speaker 3 (13:26):
I feel like I still feel like he would be
a second round guy. You know, I think if those
other guys were available, I think they'd go there.
Speaker 4 (13:34):
I just do.
Speaker 3 (13:35):
I think it's It's still one of those things where
can you name the rams front five? Can you name
the interior guys? Because it especially as the way, especially
the way the season went.
Speaker 2 (13:46):
Yah, I know what you're saying, and yet they function.
Speaker 3 (13:48):
So if you have the right play call or the
right system and all that, you can do it. I
think you can hide a few deficiencies there better than
because if you can get Loveland right, you gotta go exact,
you gotta do it. But if I could get Gray's abel,
I'm making my center like I'm not playing in MC
guard I'm putting him at center right away. You know
who if you get him later, the Monnheim kid out
(14:10):
of us see a heck of a week, and I
think that he can play in this league. I'd be
surprised if he can't. I need to do some more work.
I've got Drew Kendall from Boston College down. I'm old
enough to remember his old man. And you remember not
a center, but Ozzie Trapea who was putting Trapillo Trapella,
who was playing a tackle at.
Speaker 4 (14:30):
The Senior Bowl, big out of Boston College.
Speaker 3 (14:33):
I played in the Japan Bowl with his dad, and
his dad passed away young. He had a heart attack
and passed away by putting Japan Bowl with Steve. That's
when I go, old brothers.
Speaker 1 (14:45):
Get right.
Speaker 4 (14:47):
We were in we were in.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
Tokyo.
Speaker 4 (14:51):
We're in Tokyo. And I'll just leave it.
Speaker 3 (14:53):
This way, those old bowl games that we grew up watching,
the hull of Bowl, Japan Bowl, right, senior all those
think of it this way. Bo Jackson played in the
Japan Bowl.
Speaker 4 (15:07):
Bo Jackson played in the Japan Bowl.
Speaker 2 (15:11):
Pretty great. Think about that, Yeah, it's pretty great.
Speaker 1 (15:13):
Not in twenty twenty five.
Speaker 3 (15:15):
Could you imagine if he said, you know, I think
I'm playing in Japan, but and how many people have
tackled him in his camp?
Speaker 5 (15:20):
Right?
Speaker 2 (15:20):
No, no, no, absolutely not. You don't even get on the
plane Japan.
Speaker 1 (15:24):
I'm not even risking it, not even a tourist.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
But in that Japan Bowl I played in Brett Fulwan
was the first round pick for the Packers.
Speaker 1 (15:31):
Oh yeah, played in Japan Bowl.
Speaker 2 (15:34):
Look at that fantastic Charles Davis.
Speaker 1 (15:36):
Get for an hour, man, We can't take it for
your time to your next destination. Appreciate you, s gread
to see you. Guys. Always the best, the best man.
This week is so fun. So many friends joining us
on Chargers Weekly. Matt Harmon in person in Indianapolis, first combine.
Speaker 5 (15:53):
I mean, I'm just still struck. Friend. I mean, that's
that's high bar.
Speaker 1 (15:57):
Right.
Speaker 2 (15:57):
I appreciate colleague, not contemporary.
Speaker 5 (16:00):
Workplace proximity is a former work worker. Absolutely, it's awesome
to be here. It's great. Peanut butter denial, Yeah, peanut
butter denial. Many many or chain out. We're chain in today.
Yesterday was chain out. We'll see tonight though, chanin's probably
coming out.
Speaker 2 (16:20):
It's coming out.
Speaker 5 (16:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (16:21):
Listen, you don't throw around weight on inclined bench and
keep your chaining. You know, Matt's remade his body. He's
all barrel chested. He's throwing around freaking plates at the
y m c A, you get your chain out.
Speaker 5 (16:32):
That was what I was doing, like an hour ago.
I was up in the hotel gym, you.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
Know, just full at the podium. Today we are we
interviewing you.
Speaker 5 (16:40):
I think I probably should get up there and see
how long it would take for somebody be like, wait
a second, that guy, that guy's not a ball play.
Speaker 2 (16:46):
That's that guy dissects wide receivers. Now you're gonna have
to get the line plate, dude, you know, with this
new body of yours.
Speaker 5 (16:54):
It is funny. I interviewed thelak neighbors at the at
the super Bowl, and people like my podcast were just like, wow,
this's got a lot of Engagemently, let's go check out
the comments. Most of it was like, does neighbors need
to hit the weight room? Was like no, no, no, no, no, no,
I'm like probably sixty pounds having that right.
Speaker 2 (17:08):
No, I'm I'm a big bodied white dude that lives
in Virginia. That's all I got.
Speaker 5 (17:12):
Hey, that's all I've got to do is lift weights.
Speaker 2 (17:14):
So let's tell the people about reception per se. Nobody's
better at it. We're gonna talk straight wide receivers with Matt.
He does reception perception. He's done it for a long time,
You're great at it. Let's go just share with the
people to kind of I think set a baseline last year,
huge wide receiver class, sort of what you thought and
where Lad McConkie fit into that mix with I think
(17:35):
it was what the sixth pass catcher taken in the draft,
So kind of how you shook how you saw last
year shaken out.
Speaker 5 (17:40):
Yeah, last year was great for business. It was a
great receiver class. We had those three guys that were
all Tier one prospects, Harrison and dounesay neighbors. I think
I talked to you guys about this last year that
you could order those guys however, and I didn't really care.
It was basically like, what's your flavor. And really the
funny part is that you could argue that two guys
outside of that top three were the two best rookie
(18:03):
wide receivers last year, which I think was Lad mccaukey
and Brian Thomas Junior. So just funny that it's one
of those things where this is projecting to the NFL. Man,
anything can happen you get in the right situation, and
some of those guys that are maybe tier two or
even Tier three prospects can produce in the right situation,
which lad was certainly one of those guys. And man,
what an incredible rookie season he had. And I think
(18:23):
he showed you very early on like all of the
things that made him such an awesome prospect. You know,
there were some questions, right obviously, durability concerns, you know,
the playing time and overall just where does he fit
on an NFL field, because I do think he got
stereotyped as kind of like a bunny hop slot receiver.
But man, that guy's a real deal downfield route runner.
(18:46):
And I think it was the early on you could
really see Herbert gravitate to him because of like when
he's working in zone coverage, he's just always settling at
the right spot. And you know, Herbert is such a smart,
like cerebral quarterback, that is really something that he values.
But it was I think it was like the Week
six Saints game. Was it was around that time where
he had the two monster sideline touchdown. Yeah, and that
(19:07):
one to me where I mean he was sidelined touchdown
but he was very far away. Yeah, Yeah, And that
play was very significant to what I think that you
could see that trust because Herbert actually looks to like
the backside dig which I think was a zero two
two was the guy there and or semi fo Hooko
excuse me for Hooko was the the read I think
(19:27):
the first year on that play, he whips background so
fast and throws that like slot fade to Lad McConkie,
who wins it in tight coverage and then rips off
like a yards after catch play which man coverage winning
at the catch point yards after catch. That's a pretty
good wide receiver right there.
Speaker 1 (19:42):
What do you think he will look like in year
two with someone on the other side of him that
is perceived as a one A or a a number two?
Like how do you view Lad? Is he a sure
fire number one? Or do you think that they need
I guess they just need a different type of receiver
on the other side of.
Speaker 5 (19:58):
It, Yeah, they do. I think they're need is pretty
obvious for like an X receiver, because I think Lad
can win inside out his in terms of yards per
route run. He's actually better on the outside than he
is on the inside. And I mean he's damn good
working that slot. So that's that's a pretty incredible thing.
For giving him someone that can kind of like move
him from that flanker slot position is pretty crucial to
(20:19):
me because I do think he's capable of being a
number one receiver, Like, do you want to throw him
the ball one hundred and sixty one hundred and fifty
times in a year? Probably not, for a variety of reasons,
but I think he's a guy capable of being your
first read in the vast majority of your concepts. But
having someone that can not just clear out space from
the X receiver position, but can win in that spot
(20:40):
as well, that just makes the.
Speaker 2 (20:40):
Offense more dangerous overall. So it seems like this year
you talked about it last year is good for business.
This year's a bit of a struggle. I think it
might have been. Was it Kuiper's draft mock draft that
had t ma max sliding all the way to twenty two?
Can you envision, like what's your grade on on McMillan
versus like where he would have fit in last year,
And whether or not you think in a league that
(21:03):
is desperate for wide receivers and they get paid a
ton of money, so it's a premium position, whether or
not it's realistic that that guy's there at twenty two.
Speaker 5 (21:10):
Right. That's the thing for me because DJ had him
slipping Dan Jerem I had him slipping to the bucks
as well, right, And then to me, I struggle kind
of seeing that happen, especially if he goes out, because
he's gonna work out right, like he's gonna run the forty.
If he goes out and rips like a four or
five two or something like that, I think then he's
locked himself into probably the top fifteen picks. I don't
care about his forty time, like that doesn't really matter
(21:32):
to me, but that does set the narrative of who
you are as a draft prospect when I watch him,
and I'm still like working my way through the film
on these guys for reception perception, it's always an eight
game sample if those are available, I'm like about halfway
through that right now. To me, he's kind of charting
out as more of like a tier two prospect. So
that would have put him last year in the conversation
with like Brian Thomas Junior in that range, which again
(21:53):
he was made.
Speaker 2 (21:53):
It to twenty right, whatever it was at twenty six or.
Speaker 5 (21:56):
I just think in this class though, he's the Travis
Hunter kind of discussed aside. I think he's the best
just receiver. And to me, like you said, it's such
a premium position. The money is crazy there, and there's
so many teams that need, like we just talked about
the Chargers need an X. I can go down the
list and tell you, like a lot of teams need
that skill set. And I just struggled to see him
(22:16):
slipping that far. But shoot, if you made it to LA,
that is exactly the guy we are talking That's like
the best version, the best outcome of what we're talking
about from that position.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
And that's what we're trying to identify. Is okay, if
it's not in the draft, you know, there's rumors about
guys like DK Metcalf and Adams and you know, Tyreek Hill,
all these different players. You know, we've talked about Chris Olavin,
Garret Wilson. Who knows what's gonna happen with the cap
situations in New York and New Orleans. If you had
to scour the league in terms of guys who could
(22:46):
be available via trade or just straight up free agents,
who do you think makes the most sense for the Chargers.
Speaker 5 (22:52):
That Adams one, I mean makes a ton of sense
to me. You know, he wants to play on the
West Coast. Don't blame him. I'm a guy that moved
away from the West Coast a stupid decision poorly. If
I'm him, I love the idea of getting back there
for sure. And again, he's somebody that can play the
ex receiver position. Now you also he moved around a
little bit with the Jets last year, but he can
play at that spot. Be kind of the backside ISO guy.
(23:13):
Allow you to move Lad McConkie into a bunch of
different positions, maybe work him off like full speed motion concepts.
There's there's a lot you can do there having that
guy who's also a credible threat. I mean, once he
hit the field for the Jets, it allowed Garrett Wilson
to really do a lot of this like move around
stuff we're talking about. So I think he would be
a great fit, you know, if he's available, if it fits,
they have a lot of cap space to do it.
(23:34):
I'm just curious like where the Chargers view themselves as
like how close are they how much do they want
to push the chips into I think they feel and
I think they should feel that way. You know, they
have the quarterback, they have the head coach. You've got
a lot of these like pieces that outkicked their coverage
last year, maybe outkicked expectations. Can we get an interior
offensive line locked in here? Can we get one more
(23:55):
pass catching threat, because that just and you know you
got needs on the defensive side too, You got things
to check off there. But offensively, I do feel like
they're right there, and a piece like Adams would be
an ideal, you know, kind of archetype for that. If
we get beyond that. I mean, there's just not a
lot of guys in this free agent market that fit
into that like potential X receiver bucket.
Speaker 2 (24:14):
Yeah, the Alave thing has always been interesting, and obviously
there's that Southern California connection as well, and that for
whatever reason, it just feels like there's always some sort
of issue with the Saints and their pass catchers. Yea,
if for whatever reason they decide to make him a
vail and I know the concussions are kind of scary
they're doing that thing, but I mean, he's he is
also a perfect fit right for kind of the way
(24:35):
he plays. He would fit in right there, wouldn't he?
Speaker 5 (24:39):
I think so, And I think he is a guy
who has a lot of untapped potential right from a
production standpoint, for sure. It just felt like him and
Derek Carr were never quite like a good fit for
each other, and like sometimes you can be a you know,
we could haggle about where Derek Carr ranks in terms
of NFL quarterbacks, but he's a starting quarterback in the league,
and Olave is a guy that should be kind of
on that upper trajectory. But some guys just don't see
(25:00):
the game the same way. Their styles don't fit in together.
I don't think that would be an issue in this offense,
where again you're getting so much play action, you're getting
shot plays like that really fits into a Lave skill set,
because when I've charted him out his first two seasons especially,
I mean, awesome separator, another guy that just gets open,
and that really is what you felt lacking. I've never seen,
I mean, I've never seen a freaking playoff box score
(25:21):
like the one that the Chargers had where it's just
Adam McConkie has one hundred and ninety seven yards and
the next highest is what like eighteen or something like that,
or was anybody even in double digits. It was absurd.
I've never seen a wide receiver split like that because
the other guys just can't consistently separate. If you can
get somebody like yeah, it's the idea of a big
ball winning X receiver, that's one thing. But if you
have two guys who are uncoverable, it's a pretty good start.
Speaker 1 (25:44):
Joshua Palmer understricted free agent. You know a lot of
conversation about Quintin Johnson in his second year more of
a mixed bag, but he had some good games. How
do you view Quinton coming into twenty twenty five.
Speaker 5 (25:57):
I think you can. You can get away with him
being your third receiver. The problem is, like he's a
volatile player. I think that's always going to be the case.
I don't think he's useless. I think there are This
is just what happens to guys who have drops in
big moments. They immediately start getting like its spirals, like
you start taking away everything that they do bring to
the game. And I do think there are things that
(26:17):
he does really well. I think he needs roll catering.
We've talked about this a lot we took about it previously.
He can't just be an X receiver. That's not his game.
The ball tracking is an issue. Winning against press coverage
consistently is an issue. But he's a run after catch streat.
I think he works on these, like inbreaking routes, and
I would say from literally the first game I remember
(26:37):
watching the Chargers this past season, it's like, Wow, this
coaching staff has such a better understanding of what this
guy is than the previous group that drafted him. Ironically enough,
because there was like a couple of plays where even
in that first game, again he's off. Then he's still
primarily line up at X in that game, but he's
off the line of scrimmage, and we're just working him
on quick in breaking routes and letting him go after
(26:58):
the catchdowns. Like I could probably like group the amount
of times he did that as a rookie. On one hand,
you know, so that is something that he can do.
But I think he's somebody that you just don't want
to be throwing the ball to eight, nine, ten times. Again.
You sprinkle him in like three. I think that's that's perfect.
Then you can get something out of a player like that.
Speaker 2 (27:18):
I don't know how much you mentioned you're kind of
trying to go through eight games for reception perception. How
deep have you gotten into the draft class this year?
Speaker 5 (27:24):
I've gotten about like six seven guys in.
Speaker 2 (27:27):
What do you think of Matthew Golden.
Speaker 5 (27:29):
I think he's interesting. He's kind of the hardest player
for me to get my mind around right now because
I think the three four games I've had are a
little bit of a mixed bag there. It kind of
gives me like Jordan Addison vibes a little bit right.
He's not a full field, consistent separator, but he has
real big flashes, but there are moments where he wins
like big time catches too, and especially late in the
(27:52):
season for Texas. So I think he's a guy that
I don't know if he's a future number one or
something like that, but definitely someone you can you can
kind of have in the rotation. And again, he's the
one I'm probably still trying to get my mind around
the most in terms of players who are projected in
the first round. Other guys I think I have got
like a pretty good grasp one and sometimes that's the
way it is. I can't remember I was talking to
you yesterday, because you know, some people push back like, oh,
(28:13):
eight games, like that's not the that's not the full season.
Like you can talk to like scouts stuff like that,
they're finaling reports on like free games, you know. But
and sometimes after one two games, like I get this player,
but that's standard, just the standard, and we still do
eight games, but sometimes even three four, and I'm like,
I don't quite I don't quite know where we are
with this guy yet. And that's kind of where I'm
(28:34):
at with.
Speaker 1 (28:34):
Golden Keenan, Allen, Mike Williams. Last year, the big debate was, Okay,
you're gonna keep Joey and Khalil versus those guys. They're
both unrestricted free agents right now. Mike was obviously coming
off a big injury, Keenan had some injury issues. What
did you see from those guys this past year, because
you know they're also unrestricted free agents who have history
(28:54):
with Justin Herbert.
Speaker 5 (28:55):
Yeah, And Keenan said, like, I'm only playing in La Chicago.
Speaker 1 (28:59):
Yeah, mine in the Sand or Virginia.
Speaker 5 (29:02):
Yeah, we'll see. I mean, everybody everybody says they're only
doing something until the checks start coming in. And there's
also two teams in LA and you know, I think
he actually would make some sense for the Rams if
he's a kind of low cost edition. Although I was
talking with our another one of our former workplace proximity
associates and I mean my business partner slash friend, James
co yesterday that if he was to replace Cooper Cup
(29:24):
in the Rams offense, it's interesting from a receiving perspective,
but you are going on to the other end of
the spectrum from blocking, you know, standpoint, like Cooper is
one of the best blocking receivers in the league, and
Keenan was definitely that was an issue for him in
Chicago last year. And it is kind of hard in
Chicago last year, Like I kind of want to give
all those guys a pass because these are, like, especially
the two former Pro Bowl receivers, These are you know,
(29:48):
proven guys like DJ Moore think about and I'm off
on a tangent here, but like DJ Moore, he's a
guy that has played in some rough situations in throughout
the course of his career. And this is probably the
first time you can look at the film and be like,
I don't know if this guy's fully bought into what's
going on here, and even some of his public comments,
which again is outrageous. This guy has played for some
weird coaching staff, so there was a lot going on
in Chicago last year. I think Keenan showed you he's
(30:08):
one of these players that sometimes with wide receivers you
just fall off the cliff. Other times there's a little
bit more of like a steady tick down. And I
think he could still be useful to the right team.
I don't know Chicago. I don't know if LA the
Chargers are that right team. Mike Williams. I mean, I
think it was tough last year. I just think it
was tough to.
Speaker 2 (30:28):
Expect the injury.
Speaker 5 (30:30):
He's a big guy.
Speaker 1 (30:31):
He's never been like a two different teams.
Speaker 5 (30:32):
Yeah, and he's never been an above average separator either.
I also thought that him and George Pickens kind of
have like a very overlapping skill set there in Pittsburgh too,
so you're kind of looking a little too samey. And
I mean Russell Wilson, like every offense just kind of
becomes the Russell Wilson offense, where you're looking at deep
shot wide receivers, tight coverage go routes, fades and things
(30:54):
like that, which is Mike Williams's skill set. But I
mean you're you're asking a lot for basically two guys
play the same position and play the position the same
way to be on the field at the same time
and thriving. Right.
Speaker 2 (31:06):
All right, well, reception perception check it out. He was
all over lad last year and uh, you know, business
was good last year, business was booming. So let's hope
that the combine turned some of these dudes out there.
Are you doing tight ends?
Speaker 5 (31:21):
No?
Speaker 2 (31:21):
I know you well, you thought it was. I was
listening to one of the I remember when you were
lovely know you were kicking it around. You were kicking
the idea around. What was it last year or the
year before you were talking about tight ends, isn't am?
I not right? Am?
Speaker 5 (31:37):
I remember you are remembering that the audience desperately wants
to see some of the tight end charting. There's two
problems with that. One. The technical answer is I've been
doing reception perception for ten years now. There's a very
over ten years. There's a clear database, like I can
tell you what each metric tells you like this. This
(31:59):
matter is because of this, and this is where we
know that this guy should play all that stuff, and
we're starting the database over. If we're like including tight ends,
it is a different position. Even if these the lines
can get a little blurred. The non technical answer is
I'm happily married man. I'd like to stay happily married.
Speaker 2 (32:14):
Man.
Speaker 5 (32:14):
I got enough damn work with. There's like fifty sixty
wide receivers. I need to charge up grind Will Disley
tape for us. Tell you what, gritty guy, all right,
it's grit.
Speaker 2 (32:23):
It's it team grit, all right, Matt. We appreciate it, man, appreciate.
Speaker 5 (32:26):
You, guys.
Speaker 1 (32:26):
Thank you well, Maddy another one of our favorites. I
can't believe it's been a year since Lancier Line joined
us and it was a draft where Joe Alt, Oh.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
Can you here, I'm just coming down a little bit too loud.
Speaker 1 (32:41):
Oh, I'm sorry.
Speaker 6 (32:41):
No, it's just my radio, you know. Just I just
go to the producer, I say, on the what is it?
I don't even I've been to radio twenty seven years.
Speaker 1 (32:48):
Chargers Weekly hosted around on the return, I was I
was just gonna find my game.
Speaker 2 (32:53):
I need a little bit more me in my air,
more me in my air. Please, that's that's that's a
routine for me. I like me, me like me, some
me exactly.
Speaker 1 (33:04):
At last, we were just saying, how you know you
gave us all this great insight on the offensive line
h last year, and the Chargers selected the best offensive
lineman in the draft in Joe Alt, and now the
bookends off for Shawn Slater and Joe Alt gonna be
with the Powder Blue for the next decade plus.
Speaker 4 (33:20):
However, you may need to go back to the.
Speaker 2 (33:23):
Well, here we go, this is how we get it started.
Speaker 6 (33:26):
You may need to go back to the well. I
like the book, NDS, I like your book. I think
you go you always go guard. Well, if you can't,
well you go best player available.
Speaker 4 (33:35):
Well, because you.
Speaker 6 (33:37):
Know, I covered the Houston Texans and uh so obviously
really in tune with with that match up the Chargers
and Texans. Yeah, and uh DJ and I talked a
little bit during the week about strengths and weaknesses of
the Texans and I, you know, I kind of gave
him a scouting report. He gave me the scouting report
on Chargers, and the one thing that really stood out
was this could be trouble because the Texans can mix
(34:00):
it up a little bit on the interior as rushers,
and that was an issue for the Chargers last year.
And I think that, you know, strengthening that immediate weakness
has got to be a priority. And I don't I
don't know that you do it with one pick. You know,
you may have to do it free agency and a pick,
but this isn't a good free agent market, so you
may need to go two picks.
Speaker 4 (34:17):
But the good news is it's pretty good guard draft.
Speaker 6 (34:20):
You got some centers you can look at, so it's
it's it can be taken care of. Probably need to
do it inside the first four four rounds, though.
Speaker 2 (34:28):
Let's uh, you know what, Let's start just I want
to make sure I got it right. Let's start with
the free agent market. You said it's not a good
guard market, but obviously.
Speaker 4 (34:36):
It's not a good free agent market in general.
Speaker 5 (34:38):
Yep.
Speaker 2 (34:38):
There may be a couple, so that's what I want
to get at. So let's say if they try to
mix and match, right, I don't know. I don't Maybe
they'll spend twenty two twenty four million bucks on Trey Smith.
I don't know. If I see him doing that. I
don't know if I see Kansas City.
Speaker 4 (34:50):
Let great fit. I don't. If I'm Kansas City, I
can't let them go, right, I just I just can't.
Speaker 6 (34:55):
You'll catch a French Chargers, Yeah, you'll catch a You'll
catch a tag for me from me before where I'll.
Speaker 1 (35:00):
Let you go.
Speaker 2 (35:00):
Okay, So then let's go. I'm just going through the
PFF rankings here. I don't know if these would be
your rankings, but next in line as will Fries look
good before he got hurt?
Speaker 5 (35:08):
Solid?
Speaker 2 (35:08):
That fit?
Speaker 4 (35:09):
So I think that's a fit.
Speaker 2 (35:10):
Fit take million bucks a year?
Speaker 4 (35:11):
Well is that what guards get with here?
Speaker 2 (35:14):
I mean, you know Houston needs them, Chargers need them.
Everybody needs a line, right.
Speaker 6 (35:18):
Well, I'd like him for a little less if I could,
But no, I mean, if if money's not an issue,
then yeah, fries and would make a lot of sense.
A guy like Gray's able, you know, who can play
center or guard. You know, in a perfect world money
you want tackle guard or guard center. You always want
position flexibility, but you'd also like not just like get
you out of a game and an emergency, you'd like
(35:39):
I can start like Landon Dickerson when he came out
of Alabama, he was a center at that time, but
he can play guard, and the idea was he'll eventually
go to center when Kelsey's gone. So you want guys
who have dual starting flexibility when possible. The tackle to
guard thing is is usually you have a guy's kind
of short armed or not big for whatever the case
(36:00):
may be, or not maybe quick enough depending on if
you're going to more of a gap scheme like the
like the Chargers have, and so you want somebody who's
got the pass pro finesse.
Speaker 4 (36:10):
And so I think there are.
Speaker 6 (36:12):
Some players that that can be found in free agency
who fit immediately, who are veterans and they won't have
the the bumps in the road that you're going to
have with the rookie.
Speaker 4 (36:23):
So if you can't get one.
Speaker 2 (36:25):
What about Tevin Jenkins?
Speaker 1 (36:28):
Maybe maybe too much mad case.
Speaker 6 (36:31):
I mean, Tevin is a talented player, but they've had
to really hustle over there to get him motivated. Although
he came off of a really good season, like he's
when he's motivated, he.
Speaker 4 (36:40):
Plays really really well.
Speaker 6 (36:41):
But you know, I don't know what the Chargers room
is like, I don't know how he fits into that room.
That's always a question that that that I guess the
study from the front office is.
Speaker 4 (36:52):
Going to have to do on this.
Speaker 2 (36:53):
Let me just throw the rest of these at you.
Tell me if if one of them jumps out at you. Zeitler,
James Daniels, McCarry. How about Aaron Banks taking a flyer
on him?
Speaker 6 (37:03):
Aaron Banks is big and strong, might be a guy
that you get cheap, and then you might. What you
do is you go probably twice in the offensive you know,
you go once in a fifth round, you go another
time in the first or second round, and then you say, okay,
we got some competition. Now we got three new we
got three new faces we're throwing in the offensive line room.
Let's let's get to it. Because to me, I mean,
(37:25):
just about every job should be up for grabs. There
should at least be real competition there because you got
too much, you know, I mean, there's still some holes
you can get better running back, can get better wide receiver.
There's there's some spots to get better in the secondary.
But you're not that far off if you're the chargers.
So you have to your your approach needs to be
pretty it needs to be pretty aggressive. And this is
(37:48):
only year two for this, you know, for this particular
group of coaches, and and so if you didn't get
it done in year one, your job should be up
in the air.
Speaker 1 (37:57):
Two. Lance's kind of a two part question here, George.
He said yesterday that they may experiment with experiment with
a Zion Johnson at center. Uh, you mentioned Gray Zabel,
a guy who has a lot of positional flexibility in
the interior. A. What do you think of Zion potentially
at center?
Speaker 5 (38:13):
And B?
Speaker 1 (38:15):
Would Graysabel be a solid pick at twenty two or
is that somebody that slide to the second round?
Speaker 6 (38:20):
You know, I'd say it's too early. But here's the thing.
Cole Strange was a first round pick from New England.
You know, New England has gone Logan Mankins in the past.
They went you know, New England always believed in if
we get a good guard, we're gonna draft good guard
and we don't care.
Speaker 4 (38:34):
We're not gonna play games with it. We just will
do it in the first round.
Speaker 6 (38:38):
I don't think that's the worst idea in the world.
Is that a little early for grays Abel? I guess,
but who really cares if he becomes a ten year starter? Like,
what difference does it make if you drafted him if you,
because he's not going.
Speaker 2 (38:48):
To be there when you draft him the second round,
we'll be there fifty five, so he's not going.
Speaker 4 (38:51):
To be there.
Speaker 6 (38:52):
So either you're trading back and hoping that he's still
on the board or you or you take him there.
So I don't know, I don't know how you how
you work it, But that's a guy that would make
sense coming in at playing. If if Zion could give
you the snaps, that's great. Can he is he a
good snapper? Can he identify fronts? It may not require
that Zion is a very smart guy. Is he football smart?
(39:13):
I don't know. You're gonna be BookSmart. You may not
have a great feel and instinct. Sometimes it doesn't matter.
Sometime the guards are making the calls an identifying the front.
So Gray is a tough guy, as you mentioned he
has he has He has three for one position flexibility,
probably more emergency right tackle in the league, but starting guards,
starting center, very strong core so he can hold up
(39:36):
to bull rushes. He was fantastic at the senior well,
just really really good and much better than I had anticipated.
But you always love having a guy with tackle experience
in because they're just they're just they're going to be
more savvy and they're going to be more technically sound
in pass pro. And for me, that's obviously like a huge,
huge get. But you can't really sacrifice, like Jim Harball
(39:59):
is not going to sacrifice your ability to be tough
and kind of move people around. But that the duo
blocks and the gap scheme stuff. So Grey's abel actually
fits that too. So he's one of those guys that fits.
Speaker 2 (40:09):
What if he let's say he's there, Booker's there.
Speaker 4 (40:15):
I mean Booker, you race it up and it's over.
Speaker 2 (40:17):
That would be it that Yeah, But I'm saying so.
Speaker 4 (40:19):
Because Booker's wired the way you want him to.
Speaker 6 (40:21):
He's big, like like like Hardball likes him, and he's
strong and physical, so hert I mean, Booker should be
one of the guys who's at the very top of
their list because he's also considered the leader at Alabama.
It's not Milrow, it's not anyone on defense. The leader
is a guard of the team of the team. So
now you've got a guy in a room that's already
(40:42):
got a strong room with all you got a lot
of football character. Now with Alt and Schlater and Booker.
And you know in Zion Johnson he's got a lot
of football character as well. You got to really you
got the right kind of room if you got Booker.
I just don't think Booker is going to be there.
I know he's not gonna be when you're drafted. So
because because what I'm telling you is what a lot
(41:03):
of teams want. And it wouldn't shock me if somebody
moved up. It's crazy to move up for a guard.
But there's not a lot of first round guards. So
thirteen fifty yeah, I mean, you know that's not where
I have him graded, but where you have to slot them.
And now DJ loves all the intangibles. The people at
the Alabama program speak extremely glowingly of them. Well, if
(41:23):
you think they're doing that to DJ, to myself, what
do you think they're telling the NFL teams, they're telling them.
Speaker 1 (41:27):
The same thing.
Speaker 6 (41:28):
And so teams who say, man, we need somebody inside
who's tough, who's a leader, Who's Houston Texans?
Speaker 4 (41:34):
Who I cover? They need somebody inside who's tough, who's
a leader? Will you draft ahead of them?
Speaker 6 (41:39):
So, I mean, you can't play games with it if
Booker's there, Race the card up, but I just.
Speaker 4 (41:44):
Don't see what are you?
Speaker 1 (41:45):
Twenty two two?
Speaker 5 (41:47):
Yeah?
Speaker 4 (41:47):
I just I think he goes inside the top eighteen picks.
Speaker 2 (41:50):
You mentioned flexibility, what about Membo?
Speaker 4 (41:54):
That's another one.
Speaker 5 (41:55):
Maybe.
Speaker 4 (41:55):
Yeah, you have to trade up to get Membo. But Membo.
Speaker 6 (41:59):
You know, it's funny I talk to a team that
isn't quite as high as I am on them, but
they're just wrong. I'm right and they're wrong. Mimbo is
really going to be good. He is very tough. He's
he's about three hundred and thirty pounds of solid mass.
He's a little shorter than most tackles, but he's got
thirty four inch arms, which makes up for it because
he's got that wingspan. But what makes Membo different to
(42:20):
me is, you know, he's mostly been in an outside
zone scheme. A lot of inside outside zone, which is
a move based offense blocking scheme. For those listening what
the Chargers do and what Jim did at what Hardball
did at Michigan, there's a lot of double teams and
then you work up to the linebacker called duo blocks
or gap scheme. But I think Membo can do that.
Like he's strong, he's got really good hands, He's very
(42:42):
technically sounded, he's tough.
Speaker 4 (42:43):
He's very tough.
Speaker 6 (42:44):
So from a from a culture fit and from a
scheme fit, Membo is fantastic and he gives you the
potential to step out at right.
Speaker 4 (42:54):
Let let all roll over to left tackle.
Speaker 6 (42:56):
If something happens Slater and Membo to right side, maybe
Mimbo go's left side. You know, he can slide, he
can play an emergency swing tackle if you're not happy
with your swing tackle. But I think he is a
long time starting guard and a good one if you
got your hands on him. But he goes before Booker
potentially lace.
Speaker 1 (43:13):
That was my next question to you is we saw
All go out with a knee injury earlier in the year,
missed the game. Slater has had some injury history. What
about just adding to a strength and like the third
or fourth right and getting another tackle that maybe has
that positional versatility to kick inside the guard. Are there
any guys you can think about and maybe those mid
(43:34):
rounds that the Chargers may be attracted to.
Speaker 6 (43:38):
Yeah, I think if you start looking at third and
fourth round probably you know Anthony Belton from NC State
is a name. He's a big massive guy, but he's tough,
he's physical, he's got a little better feet than you're
maybe expecting.
Speaker 4 (43:53):
I think a player, and I'm trying to think, you.
Speaker 6 (43:55):
Know, specific to to I think Jack Nelson from is
more of a four round type of tackle from Wisconsin.
But you know, he's a big ten player and he
comes from the same type of mentality over at Wisconsin
that that. You know, it's when you when you try
to figure out what a team is gonna do, you
really sometimes you have to try to get into the
personality of the team. And with Hardball, there's no He's
(44:17):
not sneaky exactly. I mean he told h he basically
told us he was drafting an offensive lineman last year.
Like you know, most teams try to smoke screen. I
don't think he's capable of it. But he's also he's
also like easy for me to read because I can
just look for Chargers. I go look for Michigan, Michigan
men boy, the boys in blue, and I'm looking for that,
(44:40):
only it's a it's a lighter color, more a softer
blue now, but it's not softer in the interior, you know,
in the trenches. So Charles Grant loved Charles Grant, and
he is a player.
Speaker 2 (44:51):
That's he's third at the latest.
Speaker 6 (44:55):
He could be a riser and I'd kind of plugged
him into the third fourth at first when I first
watched him, and I thought, boy, this is a guy
that is going to be a steal. Well, if I'm
thinking he's a steal in December, he's probably gonna test
well and he's not gonna be a steal because offensive
lineman get pushed up, so he won't be there for
the Chargers third round pick, I don't think, And he
could end up going in a second because he is
a tackle guard flexible player too, but he is a
(45:18):
tremendously quick zone scheme guy, so I don't know that
he would fit schematically.
Speaker 2 (45:22):
What about just center, if they're going to maybe try
Zion at center, if they bring back Bozeman on a
you know, lower number contract. Everybody loves him in the room,
so I'd be really surprised. And then if they're going
fishing in those late rounds for you.
Speaker 4 (45:38):
Know, if you want to fish in the late rounds.
Speaker 6 (45:41):
Jake Majors from University of Texas Money and I talked
about him the other night. One of the smartest centers
in the whole draft, really really football smart. He's tough,
he has good size, so he's not like one of
these three hundred and two pounds centers that has to
try to eat all day to keep his weight on.
I mean, he's in a three fifteen range, I think
something like that. I don't know where he will be
(46:03):
if he's weighed here, what he's going to be here.
But he's a hardy. He's a good hearty size for center.
Speaker 4 (46:08):
What do you have on him? Money?
Speaker 2 (46:10):
I got him at Let's see, they don't have it here.
Speaker 4 (46:13):
Let's see for that look yep, so that's where he plays.
Speaker 2 (46:17):
See your guy, Well, this is the guy that Lance
and I were talking about. Then I went back and
watched the Michigan game and I was like, he's holding
his own against Kenneth Grant. He's holding his own against
Mason Grant. He had a good game that day.
Speaker 6 (46:28):
You got to see what the Longhorns look like. A
good look against Michigan. And I love watching best on best,
and he more than held his own against those two guys.
And he's smart, he's durable at the point of attack,
and you know, he's the type of guy that I
think can become a starter, even if you're taking him
in the fifth or sixth round. And and and that's
(46:49):
what you love to find. There's a lot of centers
who start in this league that were fifth, sixth, seventh
and undrafted, usually like fifth, sixth and undrafted. You find
it all the time, and you have to so you
can afford other players. You have to go find late
round guys.
Speaker 1 (47:03):
Lansay, if I get you off the offensively just for
a second, goes hand in hand.
Speaker 5 (47:06):
Though.
Speaker 1 (47:07):
I don't know if we're seeing a running back renaissance.
You see what Saquan did and to lead the Eagles
to a Super Bowl victory. He saw with Derek Henry
did in Baltimore. The Chargers could use an Omari and
Hampton and Ashton genty. How do you view this running
back class and who do you think would be the
best fit from a running back perspective, knowing what you
(47:29):
have on the offensive line right now on the book ends.
Speaker 6 (47:30):
Well, I think it's a really good it's a really
good running back draft for what you guys do. There's
some hammerheads in here. There's some tough guys, some physical players,
and it happens to be very deep. I mean, you
can go find guys in a fifth round who are
gonna fit and maybe sixth who can come in and
give you good number two carries. You want to find
a number one, number ones or in this draft as well,
(47:51):
Amara and Hampton.
Speaker 4 (47:53):
You know.
Speaker 6 (47:56):
To have two first round maybe three for round running back.
I think Travion Henderson is going to test well and
he could be a real wildcard after what Jamior Gibbs
has been able to do.
Speaker 4 (48:06):
Ashton Gent's gonna go high.
Speaker 6 (48:07):
But Omarion Hampton is the perfect kind of right down
the middle, no no gatherers feet. He's he's accelerating through
into and through contact. He's a big guy, He's been
extremely healthy. He's a number one back who's gonna get
a lot of carries, maybe in the first round.
Speaker 4 (48:24):
Uh.
Speaker 6 (48:24):
Quinn Shawn Judkins is another tough guy, very tough, physical,
not as explosive in terms of hitting the big chunk
plays that's typically not really a concern for a Jim
Harball type offense.
Speaker 4 (48:36):
I mean, if you get it, you get it. If
you don't, you don't.
Speaker 6 (48:38):
If you if you want to have a hardcore player
like a Judkins in the first running back spot. Then
just go find a guy with a little more a
little more juice at the second running back spot.
Speaker 4 (48:48):
Uh.
Speaker 6 (48:48):
But then you get to players like I think another
guy that would fit would be Cam scattaball as a
as a second. Now i'm making him a second. I'm
trying to beat you up by committee. So I want
to have the first guy who beats you up. Then
I want to have the second guy who comes and
does some of the same stuff. In that case, my
third running back needs to be the splash and dash
player who maybe gets three or four carries but does
(49:10):
all the third most of the third down work for you.
But you can go into the like the fourth and
fifth rounds Montreal Johnson out of Florida, Jordan James out
of Oregon. These are guys who are extraordinarily physical and
who have a certain mentality, And this is a great
draft for mentality running backs. You know, guys that are
gonna get between the tackles and keep it between the tackles.
(49:33):
It's just that, you know, you got to do the
work on how many of these can catch passes as well,
how many of these guys keep it on the track,
Because what you don't want is. You don't want players
who try to bounce it. You know, you can have
a physical player who likes to kind of every once
in a while drift into the world of finesse and
think he's going to be a slick I remember watching
Chris Carson.
Speaker 4 (49:53):
Remember Chris Carson.
Speaker 6 (49:54):
Yeah, when he came out of Oklahoma State, and I
just kept seeing like he's so big and strong, why
does he keep dancing around and trying to be a
finesse back? And I read an article where his running
backs in the same room with him gave him hell
over the same thing, like, dude, you're so big and strong,
you got to just be running over people. When he
got to the league, that's what he became, is a
(50:15):
running back coach or an offense coordinator or maybe a
veteran got in his head and said, you're so big,
what are you doing?
Speaker 1 (50:21):
Man?
Speaker 4 (50:21):
Just go run over people? And he was a he
was a nightmare for a little bit. Like he was
a really physical back. So good draft have physical backs.
Speaker 2 (50:29):
Great stuff. He writes all the tree. You hit up
NFL dot com and you click on a player's name,
and that is all Lance. He's done the great He's
done the bio. He's done the write up, he's done
the comparison, seven hundred eight, So we're talking about.
Speaker 4 (50:42):
Fifty five hundred over the last eleven drafts.
Speaker 6 (50:45):
But right now we're sitting at about three forty five
three for that one hundred and forty five to go.
Speaker 2 (50:50):
Yeah, they don't push back on Lance. Man knows what
he's talking about, and we appreciate it.
Speaker 4 (50:53):
Man.
Speaker 2 (50:54):
Thanks brother, you're the best.
Speaker 1 (50:55):
Thanks guys, So buddy, we are spoiled. Two more podcasts
this week. This one was.
Speaker 2 (51:00):
Fun, absolutely great one.
Speaker 5 (51:02):
Today.
Speaker 2 (51:02):
We'll have great one tomorrow. Mina's gonna join us, so
Mina comes from over at ESPN. We'll have danme Brugler,
our friend from the Athletic puts together The Beast another.
You know, we talked about Lance in this one. Danged
the same way, six seven hundred names that he's grading
and putting up reviews on. And it's Brett Coleman exactly,
our friend that you see if you go to Charger games,
you see him breaking it down up on the giant board.
(51:23):
Just incredible at watching tape and breaking players down. So
most definitely gonna be another Gret one tomorrow.
Speaker 1 (51:29):
It's easy to forget because we've had like so many
twenty guests this week. Exactly we'll do it. Should we
do a Prime forty seven recap? No no, no, so
not do that that. We'll skip that one. Use your imagination.
And I need to go take a nap.
Speaker 5 (51:45):
For buddy up.
Speaker 1 (51:45):
Chris, it's been charges weekly. We'll see you tomorrow.
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