The Point After - What Now?

Rob, Matt, and Wolf discuss the disappointment within Steelers' nation after a second loss in a row to a 10 loss team.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:10):
This is the Point After presented by Parks Casino. Is
today your Lucky Day bet Parks by Brian Patton and Associates.
It's all about the benefits and by this dealer's pro
shop get it direct from the team at shop dot
Steelers dot com. Alongside Craig Woefully and Matt Williamson, I'm
Rob King. It is time for our taking look back segment.

(00:30):
This look back segment is brought to you by Brian
Patton Associates. It's all about the benefits. I think all
three of us were like, wait, Thursday, is that what
it was? It's been a while and we're looking way back.
We're going into the wayback machine.

Speaker 2 (00:45):
As the most concussed man in the room, I will
I will depend on my compatriots for a lot of
the background we need to fill in here.

Speaker 1 (00:52):
Well, it was a twenty one to eighteen loss. Kenny
Pickett did not start the game against New England. It
was a second consecutive loss to a two and ten team.
Was a second consecutive loss to a two and ten
team at home. The two losses happened within four days
of each other, and generally not very good. Not what
the Steelers needed there. You know. Amazingly they find themselves

(01:16):
right now still in the playoff picture, which is just
incredible and right in the middle of it, you know.
But well, just sort of the sense the feeling that
must be pervading a locker room after two consecutive losses
like that.

Speaker 2 (01:30):
Oh, there's no question that there's a huge deflation amongst
the guys in the locker room. I mean, that had
to hurt, like you can't believe. I remember back in
nineteen eighty eight. Wow, you go way back there, five
and eleven, and just how miserable that season was. And
there were certain poignant moments in that season that were

(01:51):
just incredibly hard to handle, and it just ticked you off.
And it was just one of those things that no
matter what, you know that you got to slug through it.
And there's nowhere know how, no way is anybody coming
in from anywhere to help any sort of relief or
provide any sort of spark. It's had to be, you know,
organic from within on those guys. But you know, I
will tell you the guys fought it out, won three

(02:13):
of the last four games that year, and that was
a catalyst for a better year than next year, though
it started off a little bit shaky in eighty nine.
But I will tell you that the fact that guys
that that season didn't go over the cliff was number
one a reflection on how great Chuck Knowle was as coach.

Speaker 3 (02:31):
People don't believe.

Speaker 2 (02:32):
They laugh when I talk about it, but you can't
believe the job that he did to hold everybody together.
And Mike Webster was one of the first guys to
voice that. I remember that distinctly. But the second thing
was that the guys hung together and won the last
three or four and that ended at least on a
decent note.

Speaker 1 (02:47):
Hard Matt to not, you know, feel sympathy for Steelers Nation.
That's saying, wow, this doesn't feel like you know, all
of a sudden, you go from I'll tell you my emotions.
I go from thinking, hey, who in the AFC scares me? Nobody?
You take care of business at home as well? You should?

(03:08):
You beat two in ten Arizona, you beat two and
ten New England. Boy, man, you're in the driver's seat.
You know, you're nine and five. What they would have
been nine and four nine four nine four nine and
four six, nine and fourth, You know, thinking about maybe
the top seed right two, they're going seven to ten.
Tell me why they're not going seven to ten. And

(03:31):
you know they can't beat those teams. They certainly can't
win any playoff games. It's hard not to sympathize a
little bit with what steelersination is feeling.

Speaker 4 (03:37):
Right now, no question, no question about it, because I mean,
we don't have crystal balls. But you knew if you
won those two games, you're in really good shape for
the postseason. And you know, the Browns are sitting there
at eight and five and it seems like they haven't
made and you know, you could be one step ahead
of them or equal with them as opposed to being
one of six seven and sixteen six six. Yeah, that's amazing, unbelievable.

(04:00):
And they all have cases for being strong teams. You know,
the Bengals and Bills are back from the dead, and
you know Houston all of a sudden made a little
lost their quarterback and receivers. So there's all kinds of
things going on that way. But these were two games
that you should win. I mean, I don't think there's
any way around that. I don't look at the NFL
like some and just think, oh, that's a win. That's
a loss.

Speaker 3 (04:19):
That's a win.

Speaker 4 (04:20):
I mean it's harder than that. But if I feel like,
you play the Cardinals ten times, you win seven of them.
If you play the Patriots ten times, you win seven
of them. But in that back to back stretch, you
were not playing your best football. And I like what
Wolf said, I mean, you can't go off the cliff.
I mean, maybe you don't end up going the postseason,
but if you go zero and six in your last
you know, to end the season, that's problematic.

Speaker 1 (04:42):
I mean big picture, right, And there are a lot
of problematic things in this game, beginning with the opening drive.
I mean that narrative going in Wolf to take you
back to that as we all refresh our collective memories,
which might add up to one memory that you know,
they had scored twenty six points last or given up
twenty six points in the last three games, and they

(05:03):
had lost them all. Hard to do. In fact, according
to research, the last team to have done that to
given up ten who give him up ten or fewer
points in three consecutive games and lost them all was
the nineteen thirty eight Chicago Cardinals.

Speaker 3 (05:20):
Funny how the Cardinals jumped back up there.

Speaker 1 (05:22):
Yeah right, yeah, that was the uh yeah, that was
like the bid Well owned Chicago Cardinals, you know, going
against George Hallis's Chicago Bears right back in the day
eighteen thirty eight. And that's when you know they wasn't
exactly you know, explosive offenses back that they're still trying
to figure out whether they should run the T formation
or the single wing regardless. You know, you go into

(05:45):
that game thinking, okay, well we put up ten thirteen points,
we might be able to win this game. And what
does this inept Patriots offense do but drive right down
the field eight plays, seventy five yards and score an
opening touchdown. And that that was not a good note
to be struck early in that game, coming off the
loss kind of lopsided lost to Arizona.

Speaker 2 (06:08):
Well, Bailey ZAPPI hadn't even thrown a touchdown yet. I
mean literally had not thrown a touchdown pass yet. And
yet how many how many you throw that day? Was
it three two or three? I think something like that.
I mean just think about it. He hasn't done any
of those things, and yet you're able to go out
and do this.

Speaker 1 (06:26):
Yeah, it was three two to Henry and one day. Yeah, okay, right, yeah.

Speaker 2 (06:29):
This is that's part of the convoluted thinking, my gord,
right now, you know, gotta gotta get those crushes.

Speaker 1 (06:34):
We're firing back to it. We're all trying to recall,
you know, a moment, a moment, a moment that we
were trying to forget.

Speaker 3 (06:41):
Yeah, and no doubt about it.

Speaker 2 (06:43):
But you know, you got Zappi comes in and he
just takes them down the field, you know. And and
it's really funny because you look at that and you
see where you know, I always talk about.

Speaker 3 (06:53):
The x's and o's and the Jimmy's and Joe's.

Speaker 2 (06:55):
You know that first thirty seven yard at a Juju
that was perfectly schemed out by the Steelers defense, that
was right into the teeth of double coverage, and yet
Juju and that would be the Jimmy and the Joe's
were better than the x's and o's on that one.
And then if you look at later on when they
scored at the you know that that little swing pass

(07:16):
to Ezekiel Elliott, that was a great example of the
x'es and o's getting the job the Yeah, the exz
is getting the job done because Michael Walker was in
coverage and man coverage and McBride did a little rub
route picked him, and then of course Ezekiel Elliott caught
the ball walked into the end zone.

Speaker 3 (07:33):
You know.

Speaker 2 (07:34):
But I mean you see two perfect examples of it,
and they did a good job of it. But it
was remarkable to me and the fact that this guy
who had not done anything, basically Bailey's abbey, came in
and lit it up and it did so in a
big fashion.

Speaker 4 (07:47):
And along those lines, I mean you mentioned Juju, I
think you have to throw Zeke Elliott into a lesser
degree Hunter Henry in that mix too, Like these were
guys you wanted on your fantasy team four years ago,
not this year. I mean, they're backup guys there, not
what they used to be. But as Wolf often says,
I mean like Ezekiel Elliot might be going the Hall
of Fame. I mean, like he's a proud football player

(08:07):
that put that team on his back and so give
me the ball over and over. He handled I think
every carry from what I remember, like every running back rep.
You know, suck it up for one day and you
be a professional. And Juju against his old team and
Hunter Henry on his birthday. And you know, anyone's dangerous.
And it's a lesson teams time and time again learning
this league that you can't just roll the ball out

(08:27):
there and beat anybody.

Speaker 2 (08:28):
You know.

Speaker 1 (08:29):
We we've talked to Matt about how, you know, the
offense and defense feed off each other. And for a
little while there they were like, the offense is getting
more productive. They were beginning to control the clock a
little bit more and that was allowing the defense to rest,
and the defense was then giving the ball back to
the offense and they go back and forth, and you
start winning some games and you start feeling good about yourself.

(08:50):
In the last two weeks, you know, the defense, most
of the emphasis is going to be on the offense,
and rightly so, the offense has really really struggled. It
struggled against a bad Arizona defense. It struggled against this
Patriots defense, which is a little bit different caliber obviously,
but you know, against the Cardinals. To me, the turning
point was that ninety nine yard touchdown drive and this

(09:12):
Patriots came. I don't want to say the turning point
was right away, but you know, the in the first half,
the Steelers could not come up with a stop. They
you need that stop on the opening drive. You want
to set a tone. Sure, and again they weren't able
to do it. In the ninety nine yard drive against
the Cardinals. I was I was stunned by the inability
to make the big play and make Zappy feel uncomfortable.

(09:35):
They allowed him to get comfortable. And look, people can
talk about and we'll mention this hadn't thrown a touchdown pass.
Everybody that was in the NFL was a star at
some point in their life. They know how they know
what it feels like to be a star. They know
when you get going. It might have been the loan exception,
no stop that, but they get that belief, right, and
the Steelers allowed Bailey Zappy to get belief. They just

(09:58):
could not really muster in the first half any pressure
on Zappy at meaningful times in the game.

Speaker 4 (10:04):
Yeah, and losing Heigsmith didn't help, of course. And sure
there's obviously circumstances like that. And they found matchups in
the middle of the field that they were exploiting and
mostly Michael Walker unfortunately. And you know, you picked the
wrong day to have Robert Golden inactive too. I mean
just total kind of a haphazard thing because they kept
him an extra inside line.

Speaker 3 (10:24):
Marcus Golden right him to all the goldens.

Speaker 1 (10:28):
Yeah, for all the times I've said Percy Harvin instead
of Presley Harvid, I think we can forgive you.

Speaker 4 (10:33):
Let that one's THI yeah, so that wasn't great, But
I mean I think you got a long stretch between
that game in Indianapolis and you have to get that
Colts game. You have to now, and I think he
gives you a nice stretch to a say, what are
we doing wrong? Let's evaluate some things. It might be
too little, too late, who knows. But one thing that
has to be examined that I don't think any of

(10:54):
us have the answer for is you have to start
games faster.

Speaker 3 (10:57):
I mean, you just do. You can't.

Speaker 4 (10:58):
This team can't be down nothing, ten nothing before you
know it. They're just not equipped to win that way.

Speaker 3 (11:03):
Or twenty one to three, and then your running game
goes right right.

Speaker 1 (11:08):
And it looked good when they brought the coordinator out
of the box and put them on the field. That
seemed to be the answer for about two games. But
it has been a problem for sure. And they marched
oven that look.

Speaker 4 (11:16):
Good when they fired the coordinator, and then the yeah,
maybe it's more than just that.

Speaker 1 (11:19):
Yeah, the Steelers did get you know, a field goal
drive fifty six yarder from Boswell to sort of answer early.
But you know, bad interceptions and you know that the
Trubisky interception into heavy coverage, Bill Pepper's wind up with
the interception, you know, and again after the game, kudos
to Trubisky for saying he didn't play well enough. He

(11:41):
just this is a team that because they live on
the edge wolf can't afford, you know, an alignment issue.
I don't understand again why that alignment issue cropped up
again in this game. You know, so some of these
things you're gonna be are going to be, you know,
the scrutiny of coaching, the scrutiny of the coaching staff.

(12:05):
I would not have gone for the first down. I
would have kicked the field goal and the first play
of the fourth quarter. That's what I would have done. However,
if they'd scored a touchdown, we would have said, you know,
if they if they'd gotten the first down to score
a touchdown, would have said great. You know to me,
that's not you know, I'm not going to look at
the coaching and say, hey, they should have you know,
should have done what I think they should have done.

(12:27):
But there were things like the alignment issues that you
just think, what, you know, what's what's going on here?

Speaker 3 (12:33):
It's a lack of focus.

Speaker 1 (12:34):
Yeah, there's a lot of things. It felt like out
of this game in the last two games, I really
didn't feel like and the special team's good for Killer
Brew bouncing back, but special teams struggled against Cincinnati, they
struggled against Arizona. The defense, I'm sure would like to
have come up with more stops than they did the
last two weeks. The offense wants to score more points.
The coaching staff would like to see some things tightened

(12:55):
up as far as having to use timeouts and you
have twelve men on the field and communication issues. I
think you know, when you can look around and say, hey,
there's there's plenty of blame to spread around, does that
maybe make it a little bit easier for a team
to come together as opposed to saying, ah, man, that
offense has got to score some more points. If everyone
can look in the mirror and say, hey, we all

(13:18):
just like you all share success, we kind of all
share the blame here, you know, there's.

Speaker 3 (13:22):
No question about it.

Speaker 2 (13:23):
Look, everybody within the four walls of that locker room
has to take accountability for their one fifty third of
what's going on, and then they've got to do something
about it. They've got to make a determination here. There's
a point in time where I remember sitting in the
locker room and everyone's looking at each other like this
really sucks, you know, I mean, we're losing and it's
nineteen eighty eight and things just are terrible. And then

(13:45):
you start to realize that, you know, the power to
change is within and each one, you know, with good leadership,
with people talking about listen, we need to, you know,
do something here. Bring this up, let's get going down.
You have conversations and all it takes is a little
bit of a spark and a little bit of a
some sort of little fire match.

Speaker 3 (14:05):
To get going.

Speaker 2 (14:06):
But before you know it, if you get enough guys
jumping on and they are of the right mind, things
can happen. And it was what Chuck Nole used to
refer to as synergy. The synergy was about the fact
that if everybody, if everybody got one percent better, then
back then it would be forty five because it was
forty five roster, but it would be a forty five
percent increase in productivity, and that to him was huge

(14:29):
and it's he always referred to it as like a
snowball that starts rolling down the hill but gets bigger
and badder as it goes along, because then if you
get people jumping on board and they start to do
the things they're capable of, before you know it, a
lot of them are doing things that you didn't know
that they were capable of.

Speaker 1 (14:46):
That's a good way of looking at it. He's Craig Wolf,
we have Matt Waiamson, I'm Rob King. We're all going
to try to be one percent better next segment, which
will make the show three percent better. So stick around.
We had that to look forward to. You're listening to
the Point After Steelers Nation Radio and one oh two
point five DV. This is the Point After presented by

(15:15):
Parks Casino. Is today your Lucky Day bet Parks by
Brian Patton and Associates. It's all about the benefits and
by the Steelers Pro Shop. Get it direct from the
team at shop dot Steelers dot com. That's justin going
with our producer going a little different music bed. So
this yeah, four percent better. He's another Yeah, he's kicking in.
I left him out and that's shame on me for

(15:36):
doing that. Alongside Craig Willfully and Matt Williams and arm
Rob King, thanks for being with us for the point after. Okay,
so I do want to get back to the game.
But where we left off the conversation. I'm going to
start Matt with you first. You're you're in a scouting position,
you're part of the front office. You know, you've got
two games not go the way you want to go,
and you have ten days to prepare for the next

(15:58):
game and you need to win obviously, right, So talk
us through what goes on in that part of the
building to try to make sure that you're doing everything
you can to help the team break out of this funk.

Speaker 4 (16:15):
Yeah, I mean I actually wrote an article of some
personnel changes I would consider, you know. I mean, again,
you have nine or ten days to prepare.

Speaker 1 (16:21):
But but is that under discussion. I mean when everybody
gets together, I mean, what are what are they discussing?
You know, to take take back the curtain for us,
because you've been in those discussions. Tell us what is
what goes on in an organization.

Speaker 4 (16:34):
I'll give you some examples, Like during a bye week,
most teams will have the offensive staff game plan against
the defensive staff. You know, like, just give me a breakdown,
how would you attack our offense? You know, Coach Austin
and your staff pretend like you're playing in the Steelers
this week.

Speaker 3 (16:47):
Well, you guys tip this off a lot.

Speaker 4 (16:49):
Like something comes to mind, like when Washington's out there,
they're running the ball high tendency. Right now, I mean,
the Steelers' blitz pick up has been very poor the
last couple of weeks, and I felt Belichick was gonna
you know, he saved that last blitz on fourth down
for the right time, knowing that they're struggling with this stuff,
you know, So I think that could be part of it.
But really the head guy would probably be the one

(17:09):
to deal with that, more so in a shorter week,
because boy, I'm seeing these tendencies not working time and
time again for us. Now, some personnel things I think
you could consider is I think you have to settle
on an inside linebacker. And to me, Martinez played pretty
well when he took over in the second half of
the game.

Speaker 3 (17:27):
Believe it or not. Everything in that game wasn't awful,
you know, I mean.

Speaker 1 (17:30):
Especially his second half defense was much much better, much better.

Speaker 4 (17:33):
And hey, I mean I'm not picking on Walker, but
they picked on Walker, you know, So let's put Martinez
out there and give that a shot.

Speaker 3 (17:41):
I think that's one thing to consider.

Speaker 4 (17:43):
I think it's noteworthy that since they let Matt Canada go,
Jaylen Warren, who was on top of the world, he
hasn't become an afterthought, but his usage has gone down
since the coordinator change. I mean, whether that's an accident
or not, maybe we need to reexamine that he's one
of our best guys. You know, why is that happening?
I mean things of that nature. I think you have
to evaluate. One small thing that I noticed in this

(18:05):
game I thought was really interesting was I believe me,
I believe they're five best skill guys or Friarmouth, Johnson, Pickens, Warren, Harris.
We've never seen a game until this where more than
two snaps of Haron, Warren, and Harris were on the
field together once in we'd see it one play a game,
give or take. It was up to like twelve in

(18:27):
this game. I mean I don't know, is that just
a patriot thing or hey, let's get our five most
skilled guys out there no matter what, and less Alan
Robinson and more of our best playmakers.

Speaker 3 (18:37):
We need every playmaker we can get. So I think
things like that are what you examined too. You know,
look out, you've already got the traps going on. Now
you've got split backs.

Speaker 2 (18:46):
Maybe and they out shades of the day of Franco
and Rocky together in the backfield. Yeah, how about I
formation formation there? Yeah, rock paper scissors to see who's
the up back and he's a tailbacks as they.

Speaker 1 (19:02):
Come out of the Hoddle. So Wolf, Now take us
through the player you know you've been through that. I
don't know, you know, not necessarily the bye week er,
the shorter you know, the ten days off between games,
maybe you have. But what has to happen inside the
locker room? So the front office is going to do
their part, the coaching staff is going to do their part.

(19:24):
What part do the players take to say, Hey, we've
got to change us around? Other than talking about it,
is there you know, some sort of motivational speech somebody
can give to you. What goes on?

Speaker 2 (19:36):
It's really got to be to me, it's got to
be organic from within, and it's got to start with
guys like Cam Hayward, the guys that you know that
walk the walk and carry a big stick, Guys like
Mike and Fitzpatrick, guys that are recognized locker room leaders.

Speaker 3 (19:50):
And you start to and.

Speaker 2 (19:51):
If there are youngins, younger people, because I go back
to this, when I was a young guy. Okay, Joe
Green apparently got a little honked off the some of us.
I won't say me, although I was a young man
in the locker room at the time. But he stood
up and he yelled at young men and used the
term young men, and he said it would behoove you

(20:13):
to study your playbook at home, because the light down
at Confetti's, which was a nightclub back in the day,
is not bright enough to study your playbook, meaning stay
off the streets, get home, get yourself ready to go,
be part of moving forward, and get the job done
when you're called on to do so. And he let
everybody know in a very official tone of voice, shall

(20:36):
we say that it was expected of them.

Speaker 3 (20:39):
And that's the.

Speaker 2 (20:40):
Type of leadership that helps in a situation like this,
This isn't about calling out and pointing guys out and
trying to you know, get one guy or something like.
It's about a rising up of everybody having to do
their one fifty third or today or one forty fifth
back in the day. But it's about doing that and
then putting that effort into practice. Now, the difference is

(21:03):
they don't bang as much as we did back then.
And back then that was also kind of like a
carrot and a stick that Chuck Mole used very well.
And you know, there were there was bad days when
he heard back to basics, and there was just regular
days when it was just, you know, go out and
practice and it was going to be hard. But that
certainly it was about a rising up of everybody and

(21:24):
getting on board with the fact that this is not
mess around time.

Speaker 3 (21:27):
You can't.

Speaker 2 (21:28):
There's there's nothing left as far as nobody's going to
come in from outside the locker room. This is from
within and we got to get it done organically from
everybody within here.

Speaker 3 (21:37):
Go ahead, ye say along those lines.

Speaker 4 (21:39):
Though I'm not in the locker room, I'd never pretend
to be, but I would have some concerns about the offense.
I mean, last year's offense. Twenty twenty two offense was
the youngest offense in the entire league by far. So
they did add some veterans Alan Robinson Seeamalo, et cetera.
But Alan Robinson's not your best player, you know. Mason
Cole's been around the block, but he's not your best player.

(22:01):
And frankly, i'd consider with his snapping issues, is her
Big a better center going forward? I mean, just things
of that nature. But Kenny's considered a great leader, but
he's in his second season, he's hurt, and he struggled
all year, you know what I mean. Like, I'm not
saying they're gonna have Joe Green on the offensive side
of the ball or Cam Hayward, but the Castro or
Pouncy would have been nice, you know what I mean. Yeah,

(22:22):
you know, someone's been around the block to say, hey, guys,
I've been here, right, you know, get out of confetti's.

Speaker 1 (22:27):
I think it's I think it is hard to sort
of lead from the back, you know what I mean. Question,
it's hard to lead from the bench. You know, if
you're a baseball player or a basketball player. I think
it's hard to lead when you're the sixteenth or seventeenth man.
It's just the nature of the nature of the beast.

(22:48):
It's just it's difficult to do that. So and I
think the other thing that's that's different now too is look,
you know, Chuck Nole, My understanding Chuck Nole was not
was that he was not a yell and a screamer,
that you needed to be self motive. He expected, well
that's the thing. He expected you to be self motivated.

(23:09):
But there were tricks that coaches could use that aren't
necessarily available to him. You know, I don't think teams
are allowed to have as much physicality and practice. There's
no question. You know they're there. You know, you hear
the old stories of you know, teams. Uh, you know
they're they're getting a hockey team getting dressed and ready
to leave the arena after their four straight loss and

(23:29):
the coach going on, you're not going anywhere. So this
this arena is empty. You're skating up and down the ice,
uh until you uh, you know, basically you throw up.
You can't do some of those things anymore, and so, uh,
you have to find a way, and yelling and screaming
isn't gonna work. It's just that just you know, for
people that think that's gonna work, it doesn't work. It doesn't.

(23:50):
It's peer pressure, that's what it is. And it has
to be more and more. It almost seems like it
would have to be that way.

Speaker 3 (23:57):
There's no question.

Speaker 2 (23:57):
Look, when I was a rookie, act was two minutes
late to a meeting, the offensive line meeting, and I
ended up having to run after practice twenty twenty or
forty forties, I can't remember which. It was full pads
after practice. You couldn't make anybody run the day, you know.
I mean, that just isn't done, you know. So it
has to come about by another means, and part of

(24:19):
that is pure pressure. And you've got recognized leaders who
are capable of drawing the other young guys up into
a better frame of mind. Shall we say, if you
go forward and you you know, there's nothing wrong with
sitting down and having a conversation with some people that
are maybe struggling, you know, and find out how they doing,

(24:40):
how you doing. Let's talk da Dad and you can
have that conversation.

Speaker 3 (24:44):
You know.

Speaker 2 (24:45):
It's not about pinpointing anyone and holding them up. Matter
of fact, if all these all, if all this would
go on is the way it should Back in the day,
none of us outside that locker room would hear a
whisper of it, and I wouldn't want to know a
bit of it. You know, stay with the guys inside
those four walls. That's the way it should be handled,
and you move forward from there. But it happens because

(25:07):
once you like that sparking guys start to get it.
Things like when in last three out of four, they happen.
You know, even when a miserable team and as such
as the eighty eight team was, it can happen.

Speaker 1 (25:19):
The other thing, too, is that I think there's a
thread of insecurity that people don't recognize. It goes with
being a pro athlete, right you're you know, from the
minute you're you know, at some point you're your hold
on your job as tenuous. You hold on your career
is tenuous. Since you've been a young man or a
young woman, you are looking at some kind of coaching

(25:39):
figure to either give you praise or to tell you
you're not doing well enough. So there's this constant sort
of you know, feedback like that. And so that's why
I always thought one of the one of the most
effective things a coach could do is simply put you
on the bench.

Speaker 3 (25:56):
That's what I say. Yeah, you can still threaten playing time, right, yeah,
no matter what.

Speaker 1 (26:00):
I think that that's it doesn't get any more personal.

Speaker 3 (26:04):
Than that, right, absolutely, yeah.

Speaker 2 (26:07):
I mean the fact if you take away what each
player wants, that's playing time, and which leads to monetary
additives that are you know, just right from great.

Speaker 1 (26:19):
Back in that huge contract, if you're sitting on the bench,
there you.

Speaker 3 (26:21):
Go, you know what I mean? Advertisements? Yeah right, that's
right right.

Speaker 2 (26:25):
And see the thing about it too, is different with
the salary cap and issues such as that guaranteed contracts.
It's a little bit different than back in my day.
Chuck made you compete every day for your job, for
your spot, and you're always well aware that well Joe
Green has some you know, ability to ride it out
or something. It wasn't always it's not always guaranteed. I mean,

(26:48):
look at Franco, right, you know, as soon as Franco
was was let loose, I remember touch and I going, okay,
I guess we're all anybody's a game now, you know.
I mean, that's the way it is. But that that
sort of thing, that sort of mindset, and this is
the important part creates that intensity and that a desperation.

Speaker 3 (27:07):
A desperation ain't bad.

Speaker 2 (27:09):
Okay, you know that's how, as I say, that's how
the pyramids get built.

Speaker 1 (27:13):
Well, I've I've said this partially jokingly throughout my life,
but not always jokingly. Of the reason that I always
show up to work no matter what two reasons. One
is that my absence might affect the smooth flowing work
of you know, of the op of the operation in workplace,
and the other is that it might not. And so
number two is far more motivating than number one. I

(27:36):
think for a lot. I think lou Gerring story, right, Yeah,
that's right.

Speaker 4 (27:40):
Yeah, I don't show up today and Justin takes a seat.
I may not get it back.

Speaker 3 (27:45):
And Justin's laughing like crazy.

Speaker 1 (27:47):
It's kind of over there by the way too. But
I wouldn't, both of us, you know. So so uh again,
when we look at this twenty one to eighteen loss
continue our sort of our look back at this and
to look forward. And what you need to do again,
I wonder, Matt, going back to my you know, talking

(28:08):
about what you do in this time off, how you
make yourself better is the fact that it isn't one thing, right,
So so you know again, and I would think that
that would be an opportunity to pull the team together, right,
you can't. I mean, after a while, say we've got
to fix the offense. We've got to fix the offense.
We've got to fix the offense. After a while, you know,

(28:29):
we talk about personalities, and you know, you might creep in,
a little resentment, might creep in, like, hey man, these
dudes are ever going to help us out and help
us win a game. Well, I think you can clearly
look at the last couple of games and say that
there was no one area. You can't point to a man,
the special teams killed us. Oh man, you know, I
wish the coaches has done this. Oh Man, the offense
killed us all man, the defense, it all needs to

(28:51):
be picked up by the bootstraps moving forward.

Speaker 3 (28:53):
Yeah, I don't know if that's better or worse.

Speaker 4 (28:54):
I mean, if you had one area that is not
carrying their water, or you can at least say well
we'll just go get Aaron Rodgers, you know what I mean.

Speaker 1 (29:04):
Well, I'm just talking about in season, right, I mean, yes,
I agree with you. I would rather have one issue
to fix in the offseason, and normally I would at
this time. But we have seen the defense perform well,
We've seen the special teams be solid. We know the
pedigree of Mike Tomlin and his coaching staff. We've seen
the special teams well, we've seen him be sometimes solid

(29:25):
and sometimes had their struggles. I just maybe think when
it comes to something like this where it seems that
it's not about the qual it doesn't feel like it's
about the quality of the team, not when you've gotten
some wins and not when you've lost the teams like
this in the last two weeks.

Speaker 4 (29:41):
Yeah, And I would think in season it would be
easier to look at everybody in the locker room. And
I mentioned Aaron Rodgers because the Jets offense has been horrible,
the Jets defense has been great. I'm sure after months
and months that gets old, you know, where we know
what the problem is. I can't help you. I'm on
the field all the time because you guys can't even
get first down right, getting old where now everyone kind

(30:02):
of looks there and says, to Wolf's point, we're all
to blame, you know, I mean, we need we need
snaps better, we need blitz pick up better. We need
better game management from the coaching staff. We need better substitutions.
I mean there's not any area I think you could
look at it right now and be like, oh, that's fine.
I mean the pass rush is great, but it hasn't

(30:23):
been super influential the last three games or so, you know,
taking over games thanks of that nature and people a
getting there hitting the ball on their hands quicker because
they know that's you know, how to attack the Steelers.
So again, I think everybody needs to improve. Maybe that
would be easier. I've never been in a locker room,
I mean, as opposed to just blaming one guy that
can't get it done.

Speaker 1 (30:42):
You know, we'll try to improve as well. This is
the point After. We have one more segment coming your
way on Steelers Nation Radio on one o two point
five DVE. This is the Point After, presented by Parks Casino.

(31:03):
Is today You're Lucky Day bet Parks by Brian Patton
and associates. It's all about the benefits and by this
year there's pro shop get it direct from the team
at shop dot Steelers dot com. Alongside Craig Wolfley and
Matt Williamson. I'm Rob King kind of putting a rap
on the twenty one to eighteen loss to the Patriots
and the things that have happened sort of for the
Steelers over the last couple of weeks, tying in the

(31:25):
lost to Arizona as well. But also I'm going to
start looking forward and looking around the rest of the
AFC before we do that, though, Wolf, you wanted to
get into the mindset. Yeah, the mindset.

Speaker 2 (31:36):
You know, here's the thing about it that it's extremely
difficult to give or translate to other people if you've
not ever competed in sports, you know, a team sport,
things like that, or you've never been in a situation
such as this. But you know, when they talk about
the mindset of a guy who comes off the mat,
and I don't mean Matt Williamson, but a guy who

(32:00):
you know, gets gets knocked down, gets back up, I
mean there was there was a lot in that that
people tend to gloss over.

Speaker 3 (32:07):
Look.

Speaker 2 (32:07):
I remember in nineteen eighty nine, you know, we lost
fifty one to nothing to the Cleveland Browns and a
home opener three Rivers Stadium three weeks later, four weeks later,
I'm sorry, we went to Cleveland and beat that same
Cleveland team with essentially the same people that they wanted
fifty one to nothing in our.

Speaker 1 (32:26):
Place seventeen to seven.

Speaker 3 (32:28):
You beat them.

Speaker 2 (32:28):
Okay, see, well, first of all, I can't remember the score.
But second of all, what happened is that you had
guys that got honked off of the fact that they
got wopped so bad in front of the hometown in
their home stadium. And you know what, everybody took it
upon themselves. You got to get better. You can't handle this.
This this is unmerciful. I remember that whole week Tonch
and I tounch Chilkin. That being that is we're going

(32:49):
to and from you know, the stadium and this network,
you know, the practice and all we're going through drive throughs.
If we went to get something to eat through a
drive through, I mean, you just didn't want to be
associated with a fifty one to nothing womping, right, So
you take back and you get fighting mad. And there
is in the mindset that gets you and gets an athlete.
A good athlete gets him to focus and move forward

(33:13):
and change. Look at think about boxers. You know when
they get knocked down. What makes a man get up
off the carpet like that and go back and maybe
get knocked down again, and yet get back up again
and eventually win. It's a determination in his heart, soul
and mind that with everything he's got, he's gonna overcome.
And there is a certain sort of beauty in that

(33:34):
desperation that is hard to quantify. You can't calibrate a
man's fighting spirit in his heart. And that's what it's
gonna take. Because this is it.

Speaker 3 (33:44):
Man.

Speaker 2 (33:45):
You are on that last stretch, that last leg. Go
back to two thousand and five. Two thousand and five,
they were seven and five and they hit that four
game stretch and they took him into the playoffs and
they were Super Bowl champions. I know there's differences there,
but the fact of the matter is seven and six,
seven and five, determination to improve, to do something bigger

(34:06):
and get after it.

Speaker 3 (34:08):
Man.

Speaker 2 (34:08):
That that is organic and wells up from within. So
you can't tell me that it can't be done, because
I've seen it done. I've been part of something that
got done, and once you experience it, you carry it
into other parts of your life. So that's my little.

Speaker 1 (34:23):
I love it, and I think, like a lot of
Steelers fans, we want to believe that this can happen. Yes,
there are differences. You don't have Ben Roethlisberger quarterback. You
I have some of the players you had on offense
and defense on that team, but you do face similar
long odds. The odds for the Steelers now having lost
these last two games, and they appeared to be I

(34:43):
think they were seventy something percent chance of making the
playoffs two weeks ago, they're now to twenty six percent.
By the way, if they win the next two games,
we'll be back up over seventy percent.

Speaker 2 (34:52):
Again, That's why I'm so glad I flunked math, because
never bothered me then.

Speaker 1 (34:57):
But when you look at the the rest of the AFC,
it I mean, look, you still have to do something,
and you you know there's a recency bias. Right the
last two games you lost to and ten teams. Evidently
that's never happened to a team that was above five hundred,
never in the history of the NFL. And so you

(35:18):
look at all that and you say, well, we're doomed, right,
But then you think about two thousand and five and
you think maybe we're not doomed. And then you look
around the rest of the AFC, and somebody's gonna get in.

Speaker 3 (35:27):
The playoffs, right the Colts.

Speaker 1 (35:30):
The Colts, I just got pummeled by the Bengals, pumbled.

Speaker 3 (35:35):
They were in a four game winning street before that.

Speaker 1 (35:37):
Yeah, the Houston Texans kind of kind of a darling team, Like, wow,
look at these guys. We saw what they could do
earlier when when they got you know, the Steelers got
trounced by them, they got destroyed by the Jets. The Jets,
I mean.

Speaker 3 (35:53):
And what happened Zach Wilson came off and had the
game of his life.

Speaker 1 (35:56):
Yeah, look, unbelievable. It is hard for me to look
around the AFC and not only the teams are competing
with the wolf and I were talking about this earlier.
Everyone you know, the Ravens, So you know, first it
was the Bills are gonna be Oh, this is their year.
Then wow, the Chiefs, and then I don't know then
then then it was the Ravens for ou Then for
about you know, I don't even know. I think it

(36:16):
was like half a week, everyone's like, watch out for Jacksonville.
Then it's back to the Ravens. Now a Ravens team
the Steelers beat by the way, you know. So I
look around the AFC, I'm like, I don't I don't
see any Cowboys or forty nine Ers. Those two teams
would frighten me, right if I had to play them
in the playoffs. I don't see anybody in the AFC
where I think, oh boy, including the other five teams

(36:39):
that are seven and six, somebody's got to get in
the playoffs. And you know that you can, really, you know,
as far as you can. Since you're in the playoffs
now as this seilers, you can control your own outcome.

Speaker 3 (36:53):
Right right, I mean you you win.

Speaker 1 (36:57):
Yeah, yeah, you have all that stuff going for you,
and so it can be done.

Speaker 3 (37:02):
It can be done.

Speaker 4 (37:03):
And kind of reiterate what Wolf was saying about, you know,
the spirit of it all. As well as the other
AFC teams. Three teams stand out to me. I mean,
Joe Burrow's out, what are they gonna do?

Speaker 1 (37:15):
Right?

Speaker 4 (37:15):
And comes Browning. They're stringing wins together, you know, they
all they play a little different. They get the ball
out of his hands, they don't ask as much other quarterback.
They're stringing wins together the other team.

Speaker 1 (37:24):
And by the way, I'm glad you pointed that out
because for those people looking at his sat now two
games ago, he was magnificent. I mean he was incredible
this last game. Little screen pass, nothing down the field, Yeah,
catch and run kind of thing. So people say, look
what they do. You know, everything has to be taken
within context. So continue to two other teams.

Speaker 3 (37:44):
To bring out though.

Speaker 4 (37:45):
The other team in Ohio, they're on their fourth quarterback,
and all of a sudden they're stringing wins together. They're
eight and five compared to all these other seven and
six teams. I mean, the Browns are in great shape
all of a sudden. And by the way, they're fourth quarterback.
Is how old man I recruited them.

Speaker 3 (38:00):
The pit, which means you're too old to be in
the league.

Speaker 1 (38:02):
Wow, there you go.

Speaker 4 (38:04):
If I watch your high school tape, you're too old
to be in the league. That's a golden rule. And
then Denver, Denver the trade deadline. They're gonna trade everybody.
They're trying to get the first pick. They just led
seventy points to the Dolphins. Well they're seven and six
now too. With a coach like Tomlin that's probably gonna
end up in the Hall of Fame that knows how
to win in this league and galvanize his team. You know,
there's a lot of examples of they're done, there's no

(38:25):
chance of Bengles can do it. And then Denver's the
worst team in the league. They're all seven and six.

Speaker 1 (38:29):
Yeah, they might be the one team and I'm like, oh,
the one seven and six team. They've really turned it around,
ye had Denver. Yeah, that they might be.

Speaker 3 (38:37):
In defense and not turn them ball over.

Speaker 1 (38:39):
But none of them scare me. None of the teams
in the playoffs scar the Chiefs. Their wide receiving corps
is a mess. The Bills tough schedule, are not tough schedule.
There's still a seven and six team, you know, and
if they got things going, I might feel differently about
the Bills and not wanting to play the Bills.

Speaker 3 (38:59):
Real quick. On the Bills.

Speaker 4 (39:00):
For three weeks, I've been saying, I think the Bills
can win the Super Bowl. I just don't know if
they can get in the playoffs right Yeah. Yeah, it's
a great eleven seed right now.

Speaker 1 (39:07):
That's a great way of putting it.

Speaker 2 (39:08):
So.

Speaker 1 (39:09):
And I think they still got a couple more They
have a couple more tough games coming up.

Speaker 3 (39:13):
The Bills.

Speaker 4 (39:13):
They find the Miami in week eighteen and they have
another tough one.

Speaker 1 (39:17):
Yeah, they I mean they've run a gauntlet of different schedules.
But I mean that's another thing. I might look around
wolf and say, if I was in the steels, lock
and row, someone's gonna make it, it might as well be.

Speaker 3 (39:29):
Us, Thank you very much.

Speaker 2 (39:30):
And that's all about the mindset, and you decide, Okay,
we're gonna got to do this one at a time
right now. You can't look to week two, you know,
cut in two weeks down the road, because week one
is it could be the only time that you're still
in contention to be in the playoffs. You know, if
you drop this one, don't worry about the rest of them.
The fact of the matter is you got to focus

(39:51):
in on each and every one and that's the way
winning is done.

Speaker 1 (39:55):
That's what happened in two thousand and five. To your point,
thank you very much.

Speaker 2 (39:58):
Yes, those guys they I had to play their best
football at the very best time of the year to
be able to get into the playoffs. And it was
at the very end that's where they needed to go.
That's where they went. And it's let me tell you
something again, when you get enough guys that you know
I'm mad as that I ain't gonna take it anymore, that
sort of thing, and you ball up your fist and

(40:18):
get with the bloody knuckles in the trenches.

Speaker 3 (40:21):
Man, I'm telling you what, it can be a beautiful thing.

Speaker 1 (40:24):
You know, Matt two. I have to remind myself that
this is the same team, now different quarterback. Right with
Trubisky going, I would think for at least one more week,
different quarterback, for sure. But this was a team two
weeks ago, after they beat Cincinnati and put up four
hundred yards offense for the first time in a fifty
eight game stretch that I was thinking to myself, Hey,

(40:46):
defense looks pretty good.

Speaker 3 (40:47):
Yeah, this team could.

Speaker 1 (40:50):
Get into the playoffs, and not only get into the playoffs,
but win a couple games like this could be I mean,
you know, I'm not saying that they look like the
Cowboys are the forty nine ers, but you've got this
defense playing pretty well. The defensive trajectory has been up
really since the first few weeks of the season. Now
you've got four hundred yards of offense. I'm trying to
remind myself that two weeks ago I felt like hang

(41:11):
on now, we might be in for a nice little
run to you know, right.

Speaker 4 (41:16):
And I think we've all been doing this long enough
that maybe we were a little too optimistic two weeks ago,
and I promise we're a little too pessimistic.

Speaker 3 (41:24):
Today, you know. I mean, it's good point.

Speaker 4 (41:26):
It's five days of bad football. I mean, it's not
three hundred and sixty five of them, you know. I mean,
so it's just the way it works.

Speaker 2 (41:33):
Right, that's all nature of the beast, though, yeah, yeah,
you know, you look at think about it. The Steels
are running the snot out of the ball right for
what three four games in a row, then all of
a sudden they run into the Patriots. But the fact
is the Patriots defense is good. I give them that,
But that still doesn't equate to shutting down a running
game that was very powerful and doing well. Right, You've

(41:53):
got to be able to do the same thing to
the best and the best if you want to be
part of the best. And certainly they can get the
running game going, they gotta get it going again if
they hope to have any sort of run going and
be able to get through the next four games. But
you know, you see that the big dip in the
running game. But when they were just sailing through, you know,
in the last three or four weeks with one hundred

(42:15):
and fifty plus, all right, so they.

Speaker 4 (42:17):
Can get it done, I'd be shocked a wolf disagrees
with me. But to me, that's where you start. We
have to run the ball four games in a row
to be who we used to be, you know what
I mean, Like we do those three keys on the
videos we do on Thursday, and mine was get to
one hundred yards against a really good defense. They didn't,
you know, I mean, that's not a huge milestone. I mean,

(42:38):
that has to be your identity. Let's run the football
successfully game after game, because then things fall into play.

Speaker 1 (42:44):
Totally agree.

Speaker 2 (42:45):
I have to laugh just because we said who they
used to be? And I remember the year after I
retired from ball. I remember I was at a meet
and greet and I was going up. The little kid
came up with he goes, hey, mister, who did you
used to be? I looked at him, said, well.

Speaker 1 (43:01):
Well spoken that that that goes back to the insecurity
of a football player's life. Right, So within the context,
and I totally agree, you know, that is their identity,
right let's run the football. And the other thing is
that allows you to play with the lead, that allows
the pass rush to be more effective. You know, it's
running the ball is is the key to what they're
they're trying to do four hundred yards or not. You know,

(43:24):
a couple of games to go against the Bengals. Is
it better that this team is now going on the road.
Normally you'd say, let's let's bring a team here. But
now they've heard, you know, they've heard. Listen every fans
out there this. You know, the coaching staff's got to go,
These players have to go. This has to happen, that
has to happen. Is it maybe better.

Speaker 3 (43:44):
Game? Right?

Speaker 1 (43:45):
Yeah, there's a chance by the fans, right, yeah, I
mean that that's right, that that happened. I mean very
early in the game there was a chance for Mason Rudolph.
So you are going on the road now, and and
essentially you and the culture in the same situation, right,
I mean basically, right, loser of this game is in big, big,
big trouble. Is it better to be on the road

(44:07):
for this one?

Speaker 2 (44:08):
Sometimes yes, sometimes no, it really depends. I've been in both.
I felt that situation. You go on the road, there's
a beauty and going on the road. Here's the one thing.
You go on the road, I'm surrounded by everybody else
that's like minded. On the day before the game, you're traveling.
It's hard to explain to people, but it's not like
you're kind of abby normal, you know, I mean, you're

(44:29):
not normal. You don't want to be around normal people.
They get irritating. You know, you're around the rest of
the boys. When you're traveling together, you're on just the guys,
and your focus is on football.

Speaker 3 (44:39):
You're not at home.

Speaker 2 (44:40):
I'm not a husband, I'm not a father, I'm not
a son, you know, taking care of tickets and getting
the family to the stadium and all the other arrangements
that have to be made for something like that. I
can leave that all behind. I go on the road
and there's a focus that is there's something beautiful about
going into a hostile place that it's hard to I
can see why the Vikings back in the day like

(45:02):
to you know, ransack villages. You know, I mean, it
just there's something about going somewhere else and spoiling their
day and not having the concerns of being at home,
but being able to flourish in a in a hostile atmosphere.
I'm telling you, it's it's great when you go in
there and you hear the booze and the people are
screaming and going nuts, and you're like.

Speaker 3 (45:21):
Yeah, I like this.

Speaker 1 (45:23):
And my wife loves the young Frankenstein reference one of
her famous movies. Quickly Matt on the road. Opportunity here
for this dealers to defeat the Colts and and feel
a lot better about themselves one week from now when

(45:45):
we're having the same show.

Speaker 4 (45:46):
Yeah, I mean, this is an inconsistent football team. I
think their head coach has done a great job. They
were playing on Anthony richardson start to finish and he
didn't even last for you.

Speaker 3 (45:55):
In a rebuilding year in a rebuilding there and new coach.

Speaker 4 (45:58):
Yeah, now that they can playoffs now with playoffs, so
they're kind of playing with house money. They're real aggressive.
They've scored a lot of defensive his special teams touchdowns.
You need to be careful with that kind of stuff,
block punts, block prints, things of that nature too. I
mean they're aggressive, but they're still learned to win too,
you know, So that's not a it's on an on.
You're not going to Kansas City, you know what I mean,

(46:18):
You're not going to Buffalo. I mean, this is a
very winnable game for them.

Speaker 3 (46:22):
You gotta have it.

Speaker 1 (46:23):
Steelers need it, Colts need it. Yeah. Well, well summed
up Craig wolfleet Matt Williamson. For the most complete selection
of Steelers merchandise, from official sideline gear and authentic memorabilia
to our extensive selection of jerseys and Terrible towels, visit
one of the official Steelers pro shops located at Akroscher Stadium,
Grove City Premium Outlets, or Tanger Outlets, or you can

(46:45):
visit us online at shop dot Steelers dot com for
all your Steelers merchandise needs directly from the team for
Craig Wolfley, Matt Williams and I'm Rob King. Thanks for
listening to the point after on Steeers Nation Radio and
one of two point five dve