May 8, 2025 • 20 mins
In this episode of Doc Walks, Ben & Keith duck out of the freezing temperatures of Park City for a warm and cozy indoor sit-down with Academy Award-nominated producer Diane Quon. A personal story of determination, Diane shares her inspiring journey from marketing executive to Academy Award-nominated documentary producer. From acclaimed films like 'Minding the Gap,' and 'Breaking the News,' to her Sundance premiering 'Third Act,' Diane shares insights and experiences as a late-entrant into the documentary world, relying on real-world experience and some well-timed words of encouragement too. 00:00 Braving the Cold: A Frosty Start 00:45 Seeking Warmth: A Change of Plans 01:48 Introducing Diane Quan: A Special Guest 05:55 Diane's Journey: From Marketing to Filmmaking 08:37 The Impact of Documentaries: Personal Stories and Social Issues 13:12 Advice for Aspiring Filmmakers 16:39 Wrapping Up: Reflections and Gratitude
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Oh my Lord.
It's cold.
Let's see how cold it is.
Ooh, it
is 20 degrees, a balmy, 20 degrees herein Park City, uh, with snowflakes falling
somehow directly into my eyeballs.
Yeah, these aren't flakes.
(00:20):
These are like snow daggers.
Snow pellets, uh, raining down on us.
The ground is slippery.
Uh, there's lots of brown, mushy snow.
Yeah.
This is not a greatday for a, uh, podcast.
Where we go walking.
We don't just walk.
(00:40):
We also dock.
And we are, we are dock docking.
The walk right now.
Well, I'm wondering what
if we docked but didn't
walk?
Why don't we try to find aquiet corner inside somewhere?
Preferably with, uh, drinks and snacks.
Okay, now you're talking, I'm sorry.
Now you're docking
(01:01):
on your left.
You're listening to DockWalk with Ben and Keith.
We are not walking, we are sitting.
This is welcome to Doc sits.
We have stopped walking and, and plantedourselves in some comfy chairs because.
It is cold as hell outside.
(01:22):
It's miserable.
It's freezing.
Uh, everything's covered in snow.
It's actively snowing a lot.
It's like slapping your face.
Wet spit snow.
And what about 15 degrees?
Maybe?
I would say it's more like nine.
Um,
but it feels like negative 10to a guy from Austin, Texas.
Not used to this.
Yeah.
So anyway, we found refugein a little, uh, secret room.
(01:46):
Uh, just off Main Street.
Yeah.
And today we're talking to Diane Quan,who is a producer, uh, academy Award,
ca Academy Award nominee DianeQuan, producer of Minding The Gap.
Minding The Gap, who's herewith her new film, third Act.
Yeah.
And she's an executiveproducer on that one.
Uh, they're making their world premier.
I think tomorrow, and Diane is a friendof mine and somebody I've worked with.
(02:08):
I'm sure we'll talk about it.
Um, but weirdly, I'venever met her in person.
We've only met each other on Zoom,and so I'm, I'm excited to meet her.
Uh, I'm excited for you to meet her.
She's great.
Awesome.
I You're much better on Zoom,so we'll see how this goes.
Oh yeah.
Live and in person with Diane Kwan.
Hi, Diane.
That's great.
So you, you ended up gettingthis or you were always here?
(02:30):
We, uh,
no.
Oh, this is very different.
We are normally walking and talking, andthat's the whole idea of the podcast.
Yeah.
But it is freezing cold.
You even have snow inside the gases.
I can't, which is,
I can't.
I was like, just,
which is why we're doing this inside.
When Keith first said, we'regonna walk and talk, I go,
okay, I'll try to not slip.
We were gonna sit
in the, in the warmth.
This what we, I.
(02:51):
Imagine me being, I alreadyam hard at being coherent.
So then also walking at same time.
Well, you live in Chicago, so you'renot I know, but unaccustomed to this,
I lived 17 years in LA and thelast two years in San Francisco.
Ah.
Oh, okay.
So, so I became
thin skin.
I always was.
Actually, that's why I left Chicago.
(03:12):
I took a look through the programand saw that you had third act here.
Yeah, I knew that one.
We're long overdue forjust meeting in person.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So I, that was one of my top things to,to do and I knew I wanted to talk to
you and hear what's going on becauseI always, I I have loved getting
to know you the last couple years.
Yeah.
See And making, breakingthe news together.
Yeah.
Did you know we justgot the GLAD nomination.
I just
heard that yesterday.
(03:32):
Congratulations.
Yeah.
It's so wonderful.
It's
kind of what I needed to hear.
They told us, like three days ago,and I had just made the mistake of
turning on the news and I'm like, oh.
And then I, uh, got the emailfrom Alex Schmid, who's, um.
Works for glad and it was like,Ugh, that's such a. It just
reminds me of why we do stuff.
(03:53):
We do.
What is the, uh, what is the award?
Uh, best doc, it's a nomination.
Like there's 10, I think,in the, in the category.
Okay.
And this year the focusis on the trans community.
So it's mostly they've tried to lookfor everything from docs to podcasts.
Difference here where there is somekind of focus on the trans community.
(04:15):
So the special in breakingthe news, it's, it says in the
thing really honoring like Kate?
Yeah.
As the character that they'readmiring in the, in the film.
So, yeah.
That's great.
Congratulations.
So anyway, what I was saying is, um.
Breaking the News was an incredibleproject to work on together, and I,
and to get to see Diane in action.
And that film played Independent Lenslast year and has just been nominated
(04:37):
for a GLAD award, as Diane mentioned.
Uh, which is awesome.
But we also know Diane'swork on, uh, mining the Gap.
Mm-hmm.
And, which a fabulous move.
Oh,
thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Yeah.
And on
bad acts.
Yeah.
Which is, you know, taking, uh.
I, I thought was so bold, uh, figuringout how to make a film during Covid
(04:58):
Yeah.
And, and telling a story that reallygot a chance to kind of break through.
And even though it's about a very specificplace and very specific family Yeah.
Um, it has such universal themes that likewe were all kind of confronted with Yeah.
During Covid and beyond.
And now you're here.
With third act.
Right.
Um, and so I don't know a lot about it.
We don't, uh, we don't have tickets.
(05:19):
We didn't get screeners.
We don't know anything aboutthe films that are playing here,
screener after.
Um, I'd
love to see it.
Please do.
Yeah.
But, uh, we wanted to talk to youabout your role as a producer.
Mm-hmm.
We wanted to talk, you know, somany times at these festivals and
in, in our media we're directors,people focus on the directors,
but we work with great producers.
Mm-hmm.
(05:39):
And, you know, uh.
I love hearing from somebodywho has the, kind of the
breadth of experience you have.
Mm-hmm.
Um, talk about what.
You love about being a producerand what people miss maybe about.
Mm-hmm.
You know what it is you're,you're really up to Yeah.
You know, behind the scenes.
I actually came into producing latejust 10 years ago, um, Sundance.
(06:00):
My first Sundance was 2013.
And it was that year, I thought,well, I would love to try.
And then 2016 I actually startedworking on dogs, so it's not that long.
So I was older coming into it and it'sthinking, what do I want to leave, um,
you know, for my grandkids one day?
And I feel like with film, itactually, you can put work into it.
(06:24):
On something you love and then youactually have something that comes
out of it, and like, how cool isthat to have that opportunity?
I'm not a writer.
I can't write a book.
I can't do that, but I can help a movieget made that I care about an issue or a
idea or a story that I really care about.
So I think that's what's so specialabout being a producer, is being able
(06:44):
to make this vision come to life andthen have it last hopefully forever.
I mean, maybe one persononly sees it, but.
That's okay too.
It's still there.
Um, but you know, of course my goalis hopefully as many people can see it
and appreciate it over, over the years.
Um, that's beautiful.
Yeah.
So what, what is it that made youcome to documentary late in life?
(07:06):
Well, all my background is in marketing.
I worked at NBC and then Paramountfor 12 years, and I was vice
president of marketing and I loved.
Fat job, but I market a lot of bad moviesand I remember thinking when I started,
I always had wanted to make my own films.
I didn't know directingproducer and what role.
I just thought, uh, growing up in Chicago,my parents owned a Chinese restaurant.
(07:28):
I had no clue like how it worked.
So I got my MBA and thought I wouldjust come in on the business end.
So I did marketing.
Then I also have four kids and I thought,well, when they're older, maybe I'll.
Pursue that dream to pro tomake my own film, whether it's
directing, producing or whatever.
Yeah.
And we moved to Chicago,where I'm from, 'cause I was
(07:48):
developing some health problems.
Then when my son graduated and my youngestwas about to go college, I lost my son.
Oh.
Oh Diane, I'm sorry.
I didn't know that.
Yeah, and that's 16 years ago.
It like changed my life forever.
And so I, I, you know.
Making a movie is like the lastthing I wanted to do, and for maybe
(08:12):
four or five years, never, exceptfor taking care of my daughters.
Didn't really wanna get out.
And one of my best friends saidto me, um, I know you love film.
I went to Sundance lastyear, will you come with me?
So your friend invited you toSundance, and what did you say?
Uh, I now I can't go.
And then I'm like, okay, I'm gonna go.
(08:35):
And at first, um.
Movie we saw was a documentary, andI had always thought when I produced
it would be fiction because Paramountand NBC, but the documentary.
It just touched me in a way that youcan tell something's so entertaining,
but come out, changed and hopefullystart a conversation or learn something
new about someone or someplace thatyou didn't know anything about.
(08:58):
So I went home and thought, well,maybe this is something I can do.
So I Googled documentaries.
And found Emin in Chicago who happenedto produce, uh, Steve James Film Hoop
Dreams and go, whoa, I contact them.
Do you need volunteers?
They said no.
Um, so I went to try the seventh classesand won the classes, was documentary
(09:20):
and you had to make your own short.
So I made a little short, directed it.
Produced it, which was a great learningexperience and really taught me.
I don't wanna direct,you know, you really.
Come to understand whereare your strengths?
And I think marketing reallylends itself to being a producer.
So that's around the time you met Bing.
You were both at Kartemquin.
Yeah.
(09:40):
And you started making Mining the Gap.
He had already shot most of it,but it's looking for the story.
And I met him at Kartemquin and Iwas like, I've never produced, but
if you're willing to take a chance,I would love to do this with you.
He was a one man showand we said, let's do it.
When was that?
That was 2016, and thenwe got into Sundance 2018.
(10:03):
And I remember thinking, this is whySundance is such a special place.
It was like Full circle is where Isaw my first documentary, and then
my first documentary was acceptedhere, and then we got nominated
for an Oscar the following year.
And I remember thinking, howthe hell did this happen?
But in many ways, I.
Very spiritual.
You know, I feel like my son's with meall the time to say, mom, you can do it.
(10:26):
And I also feel that like Godgave me like a good one to start
because he knew I was older.
So I'm gonna give you a head start,uh, with a good one because he
allowed me to meet so many greatpeople, so many kind people who
are willing to meet with me and.
Because it did so well.
I got to meet a lot of buyers.
(10:47):
You know, Hulu bought the film alongwith POV along the awards campaign.
I met so many filmmakers, somethat I ended up working with now,
you know, and, uh, met agents.
It just opened up all these doors.
I don't think if I, if it wasn't sosuccessful for the first film, it take
me a lot longer and I think that's why.
(11:08):
I work with so manyfirst time filmmakers, so
we're here at Sundance andyou are here with the film.
Mm-hmm.
Uh, so you are taking meetings, Iassume, and you are probably looking for
distribution if you don't already have it.
Mm-hmm.
So you're, you know,as a producer, correct.
I'm sure you're very familiarwith the sort of state of the doc.
Landscape.
Yeah.
Keith and I have been talking about,have talked about this before.
(11:29):
I mean, it is, it is tough.
Luckily for third act, and I say luckybecause I, I really do appreciate
PBS and what they offer, especiallyto documentaries that aren't
necessarily, I think they call itthe Three Cs, um, celebrities crime,
and I forgot the third c, uh, cults.
That's it.
Cults, cults, cults.
You know, so, so Tad'sfilm, so I'm the ep.
(11:51):
Uh, on the film we did get funding from.
ITVS.
So we will be on indie lens,so we know at least people will
see it through that platform.
We do have a sales agent, which was someaningful to me too, because on top of
distribution, a lot of sales agents justbeing realistic, they know that if some
rights are sold, it's hard to sell it.
(12:12):
And
is ITVS an independent lensis lowest taking streaming
as well as TV at this point?
Yeah.
Yeah, I think like a portion like Windows.
Um.
So, you know, so there, along withbroadcast, there is a streaming
window that they have access to.
Okay.
So that is something that I dealtwith also for Minding the Gap.
We were ITVS funded too, and thenwe were able to make it work with
(12:35):
Hulu and you know, I always tryto think positive and think like
maybe we can make something happen.
I don't think it's thesame kind of deal because.
Streaming has just changed so muchin these last years where um, they
don't necessarily, you know, like Isaid, one film's about social issues.
So it is a challenge, but hopefullythere's still opportunity.
You see it every once in a while wheredocumentaries that are not the three Cs
(13:00):
are able to break out and I guess the onlyway I can do it is, is to stay positive
and keep trying and knocking on doors.
And knowing will get nos.
A lot of nos.
Yeah.
But, but not giving up.
Right, right.
You know what I can't believe we didn'tfollow up and ask you about is what was
that film that you saw at Sundance thatmade you want to make documentaries?
It was 20 feet from stardom.
(13:20):
Oh.
And I, I tell Morgan andNevol list, so I was so naive.
I wrote in an emailand, hi, I'm Diane Kwan.
I'd like to make docs.
Any advice, so naive.
But he wrote me back.
He actually emailed me back.
And what did he say to you in that email?
He says, you know, find a good storyand I can't even remember the rest.
(13:40):
And good luck probably,but, um, don't do it.
But very, yeah.
But very positive and encouraging, youknow, just like it was a dream for me.
I feel like it's people's dreams.
I gotta try at least Yeah.
Encouraging to try I andthird act, which is tomorrow.
I'm the ep and I just, again, it'slike another story that means so much
(14:02):
to me and I'm so, it's a father, son.
Story, two filmmakers, the father's, thefilmmaker from years, years and years.
He's known as thegodfather of Asian media.
And his son started making filmsand wanted to do a biopic of
him, but in the middle of the,he's diagnosed with Parkinson's.
(14:23):
And I think because of that,the film really changed.
And his father really.
Really has become so vulnerableand want to share his story now,
um, with, with Tad, he was atthe camps back in, in the 1940s.
Yeah.
And they come to understand eachother's that you wouldn't have if
(14:44):
they didn't make that film togetherbecause sometimes something about film
allows you to share things you wouldn'tnecessarily say to your dad or, so that's.
Tomorrow and he's here.
He's 88 years old.
If somebody sent you the same kind ofemail that you sent to Morgan Neville
mm-hmm.
What would you say?
Yeah, I would say.
If you're going to do this and you'regonna approach someone, which I made the
(15:06):
mistake of not really having my story.
I kind of had a story, but I didn't reallythink it through, is really to have your
pitch together about what this story is.
And when you think about story, it'sback to what I said, it has to be a
story that we haven't heard before.
Yeah.
People just get so caught upwith the idea or the issue.
They don't think about that.
So that's why I try toencourage filmmakers is.
(15:30):
To think of what is thatstory that's unique.
And also, again, like I said,don't necessarily lead with
the social issue because we'retrying to start a conversation.
So if we can start with the story,you know, that's why we're doing it.
Film, otherwise we can chooseto do it a different way.
But we we're choosing to puton the screen and then maybe
they'll hear that social issue.
(15:50):
Yeah.
Hidden and there.
Great.
So you're gonna go back out intothe cold and wet, uh, Sundance Day.
Yes.
You're, uh.
The subject of yourdoc is coming tomorrow.
Mm-hmm.
Um, so that's gonna besuch a great celebration.
Mm-hmm.
After tomorrow.
We'll totally enjoy it, but Ican't wait till the premiere.
There's nothing like showingthe film for the first time
to audience, don't you think?
(16:11):
Incredible.
Yeah.
Incredible.
Yeah.
I mean, that's why we do it, right?
Yeah.
For that moment.
Yeah.
Because there's just nothinglike that experience.
There's nothing like being
in the room.
Yeah.
This is a Thank you so much.
Thank you for, it's a pleasure.
Yeah.
Thank
you for telling us your storyand sharing your time with us.
Thank you.
Yeah.
We actually going to, uh, todo another podcast I've never
done, I think I've done one.
Wow.
But I'm really.
(16:32):
Not very articulate, so that's why.
Yes.
Yeah.
Well, we feel honored.
Uh, thank you so much.
You were great.
Oh, thank
you.
Okay, so we're, we'rewalking away from Diane Kwan.
We're outside again.
And, um, I, I'm feeling movedemotionally from that interview.
That was really beautiful andI'm super grateful that we
got a chance to talk to her.
I think Diane is the best and she told usa lot and there's so much to take from it.
(16:55):
But I think the, the two thingsthat are my biggest takeaways are.
You don't have to start making filmsas a, as a 22-year-old to have an
exciting and successful career.
You can have lived experience.
You can come from other areas and bringwhat you know about life to filmmaking
and, and make a mark right outta thegate, which she did with Minding the Gap.
(17:16):
And then I think my secondtakeaway is that she started out
by reaching out to a filmmakerthat inspired her, Morgan Neville.
And she sat down and she wrotean email and she says herself.
You know, it wasn't the, the,the most deeply thought through
email, but she asked for advice.
And Morgan, who, you know, I don't knowwell, but from, for everything I do know
(17:39):
seems to be the nicest guy in America.
Yeah.
Um, it's amazing that he wrote herback and had such like inspirational,
aspirational words for her.
Yeah.
And a guy who's that busy, who'swinning Academy Awards and working
with celebrities, you would thinkwould not take the time to do that.
Yeah.
It spurs on, uh, a topic I want tocover on one of our future episodes,
which is about, um, advice seekingadvice, giving advice, mentorship notes.
(18:06):
So much of what this podcast is about,I think is, we hope, we hope, is
building and reflecting community.
I mean, that's what makesdocumentary such a wonderful
space to work in is the community.
Yep.
And I love that Diane kind ofkicked off her first efforts.
By relying on community andkind of creating a low community
(18:26):
between her and Morgan.
Absolutely.
And to bring it back to Sundance,that's what this feels like.
It is like a community thatfor a long time I was sort of.
Uh, refusing to join and That's right.
Was
there all along Ben's Sherman'smarch through Park City.
It seems like it's been a success.
I would say so.
(18:47):
And, uh, thank you to thegreat Ross Mcoe, uh, for the
inspiration for Sherman's March.
Thank you to everybody here at Sundance.
Thank you to Diane Kwanand thank you to you.
I was gonna say, wheredo I fit into all this?
Uh, thank you to you, Ben, or elseI would've come here all alone and
lonely and sad and I would've stoodoff to the side at the parties.
Aw, Keith, which I still did a littleof, but much less because you were
(19:09):
here, so you're still a little sad.
I mean, that's kind of baked in.
That's like a, a. Okay, good.
Well, my work here is a layer in theseven layer dip that is of sadness.
No, it's one layer.
Oh, one layer.
Okay.
It's one layer.
So there's sour cream andcheddar cheese and sadness.
I'm glad we're gonna edit it out.
The nacho references, uh,across the board as a rule.
(19:32):
Um, alright, well let's wrap this up.
Let's wrap it up.
And so I'm excited.
That we, this was an exciting, I'mexcited that this was exciting.
Yeah.
Well,
that's exciting that you're excitedtaking what we've learned here in this
community in Park City, going back to ourown community of Austin, Texas, uh, let's,
let's pick up this conversation back home.
All right.
Let's do it.
Bye everybody.
(19:52):
Thanks a lot.
Doc Walks is created, produced, and editedby my friend Ben Steiner of the Bear.
Hello.
And my friend Keith Maitland of Go Valley.
Thanks for
tuning in.
Follow us at Doc Walks Podon Instagram X and YouTube.
Oh my Lord.
It's cold.
Let's see how cold it is.
Ooh, it
is 20 degrees, a balmy, 20 degrees herein Park City, uh, with snowflakes falling
somehow directly into my eyeballs.
Yeah, these aren't flakes.
(00:20):
These are like snow daggers.
Snow pellets, uh, raining down on us.
The ground is slippery.
Uh, there's lots of brown, mushy snow.
Yeah.
This is not a greatday for a, uh, podcast.
Where we go walking.
We don't just walk.
(00:40):
We also dock.
And we are, we are dock docking.
The walk right now.
Well, I'm wondering what
if we docked but didn't
walk?
Why don't we try to find aquiet corner inside somewhere?
Preferably with, uh, drinks and snacks.
Okay, now you're talking, I'm sorry.
Now you're docking
(01:01):
on your left.
You're listening to DockWalk with Ben and Keith.
We are not walking, we are sitting.
This is welcome to Doc sits.
We have stopped walking and, and plantedourselves in some comfy chairs because.
It is cold as hell outside.
(01:22):
It's miserable.
It's freezing.
Uh, everything's covered in snow.
It's actively snowing a lot.
It's like slapping your face.
Wet spit snow.
And what about 15 degrees?
Maybe?
I would say it's more like nine.
Um,
but it feels like negative 10to a guy from Austin, Texas.
Not used to this.
Yeah.
So anyway, we found refugein a little, uh, secret room.
(01:46):
Uh, just off Main Street.
Yeah.
And today we're talking to Diane Quan,who is a producer, uh, academy Award,
ca Academy Award nominee DianeQuan, producer of Minding The Gap.
Minding The Gap, who's herewith her new film, third Act.
Yeah.
And she's an executiveproducer on that one.
Uh, they're making their world premier.
I think tomorrow, and Diane is a friendof mine and somebody I've worked with.
(02:08):
I'm sure we'll talk about it.
Um, but weirdly, I'venever met her in person.
We've only met each other on Zoom,and so I'm, I'm excited to meet her.
Uh, I'm excited for you to meet her.
She's great.
Awesome.
I You're much better on Zoom,so we'll see how this goes.
Oh yeah.
Live and in person with Diane Kwan.
Hi, Diane.
That's great.
So you, you ended up gettingthis or you were always here?
(02:30):
We, uh,
no.
Oh, this is very different.
We are normally walking and talking, andthat's the whole idea of the podcast.
Yeah.
But it is freezing cold.
You even have snow inside the gases.
I can't, which is,
I can't.
I was like, just,
which is why we're doing this inside.
When Keith first said, we'regonna walk and talk, I go,
okay, I'll try to not slip.
We were gonna sit
in the, in the warmth.
This what we, I.
(02:51):
Imagine me being, I alreadyam hard at being coherent.
So then also walking at same time.
Well, you live in Chicago, so you'renot I know, but unaccustomed to this,
I lived 17 years in LA and thelast two years in San Francisco.
Ah.
Oh, okay.
So, so I became
thin skin.
I always was.
Actually, that's why I left Chicago.
(03:12):
I took a look through the programand saw that you had third act here.
Yeah, I knew that one.
We're long overdue forjust meeting in person.
Yeah.
Yeah.
So I, that was one of my top things to,to do and I knew I wanted to talk to
you and hear what's going on becauseI always, I I have loved getting
to know you the last couple years.
Yeah.
See And making, breakingthe news together.
Yeah.
Did you know we justgot the GLAD nomination.
I just
heard that yesterday.
(03:32):
Congratulations.
Yeah.
It's so wonderful.
It's
kind of what I needed to hear.
They told us, like three days ago,and I had just made the mistake of
turning on the news and I'm like, oh.
And then I, uh, got the emailfrom Alex Schmid, who's, um.
Works for glad and it was like,Ugh, that's such a. It just
reminds me of why we do stuff.
(03:53):
We do.
What is the, uh, what is the award?
Uh, best doc, it's a nomination.
Like there's 10, I think,in the, in the category.
Okay.
And this year the focusis on the trans community.
So it's mostly they've tried to lookfor everything from docs to podcasts.
Difference here where there is somekind of focus on the trans community.
(04:15):
So the special in breakingthe news, it's, it says in the
thing really honoring like Kate?
Yeah.
As the character that they'readmiring in the, in the film.
So, yeah.
That's great.
Congratulations.
So anyway, what I was saying is, um.
Breaking the News was an incredibleproject to work on together, and I,
and to get to see Diane in action.
And that film played Independent Lenslast year and has just been nominated
(04:37):
for a GLAD award, as Diane mentioned.
Uh, which is awesome.
But we also know Diane'swork on, uh, mining the Gap.
Mm-hmm.
And, which a fabulous move.
Oh,
thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Yeah.
And on
bad acts.
Yeah.
Which is, you know, taking, uh.
I, I thought was so bold, uh, figuringout how to make a film during Covid
(04:58):
Yeah.
And, and telling a story that reallygot a chance to kind of break through.
And even though it's about a very specificplace and very specific family Yeah.
Um, it has such universal themes that likewe were all kind of confronted with Yeah.
During Covid and beyond.
And now you're here.
With third act.
Right.
Um, and so I don't know a lot about it.
We don't, uh, we don't have tickets.
(05:19):
We didn't get screeners.
We don't know anything aboutthe films that are playing here,
screener after.
Um, I'd
love to see it.
Please do.
Yeah.
But, uh, we wanted to talk to youabout your role as a producer.
Mm-hmm.
We wanted to talk, you know, somany times at these festivals and
in, in our media we're directors,people focus on the directors,
but we work with great producers.
Mm-hmm.
(05:39):
And, you know, uh.
I love hearing from somebodywho has the, kind of the
breadth of experience you have.
Mm-hmm.
Um, talk about what.
You love about being a producerand what people miss maybe about.
Mm-hmm.
You know what it is you're,you're really up to Yeah.
You know, behind the scenes.
I actually came into producing latejust 10 years ago, um, Sundance.
(06:00):
My first Sundance was 2013.
And it was that year, I thought,well, I would love to try.
And then 2016 I actually startedworking on dogs, so it's not that long.
So I was older coming into it and it'sthinking, what do I want to leave, um,
you know, for my grandkids one day?
And I feel like with film, itactually, you can put work into it.
(06:24):
On something you love and then youactually have something that comes
out of it, and like, how cool isthat to have that opportunity?
I'm not a writer.
I can't write a book.
I can't do that, but I can help a movieget made that I care about an issue or a
idea or a story that I really care about.
So I think that's what's so specialabout being a producer, is being able
(06:44):
to make this vision come to life andthen have it last hopefully forever.
I mean, maybe one persononly sees it, but.
That's okay too.
It's still there.
Um, but you know, of course my goalis hopefully as many people can see it
and appreciate it over, over the years.
Um, that's beautiful.
Yeah.
So what, what is it that made youcome to documentary late in life?
(07:06):
Well, all my background is in marketing.
I worked at NBC and then Paramountfor 12 years, and I was vice
president of marketing and I loved.
Fat job, but I market a lot of bad moviesand I remember thinking when I started,
I always had wanted to make my own films.
I didn't know directingproducer and what role.
I just thought, uh, growing up in Chicago,my parents owned a Chinese restaurant.
(07:28):
I had no clue like how it worked.
So I got my MBA and thought I wouldjust come in on the business end.
So I did marketing.
Then I also have four kids and I thought,well, when they're older, maybe I'll.
Pursue that dream to pro tomake my own film, whether it's
directing, producing or whatever.
Yeah.
And we moved to Chicago,where I'm from, 'cause I was
(07:48):
developing some health problems.
Then when my son graduated and my youngestwas about to go college, I lost my son.
Oh.
Oh Diane, I'm sorry.
I didn't know that.
Yeah, and that's 16 years ago.
It like changed my life forever.
And so I, I, you know.
Making a movie is like the lastthing I wanted to do, and for maybe
(08:12):
four or five years, never, exceptfor taking care of my daughters.
Didn't really wanna get out.
And one of my best friends saidto me, um, I know you love film.
I went to Sundance lastyear, will you come with me?
So your friend invited you toSundance, and what did you say?
Uh, I now I can't go.
And then I'm like, okay, I'm gonna go.
(08:35):
And at first, um.
Movie we saw was a documentary, andI had always thought when I produced
it would be fiction because Paramountand NBC, but the documentary.
It just touched me in a way that youcan tell something's so entertaining,
but come out, changed and hopefullystart a conversation or learn something
new about someone or someplace thatyou didn't know anything about.
(08:58):
So I went home and thought, well,maybe this is something I can do.
So I Googled documentaries.
And found Emin in Chicago who happenedto produce, uh, Steve James Film Hoop
Dreams and go, whoa, I contact them.
Do you need volunteers?
They said no.
Um, so I went to try the seventh classesand won the classes, was documentary
(09:20):
and you had to make your own short.
So I made a little short, directed it.
Produced it, which was a great learningexperience and really taught me.
I don't wanna direct,you know, you really.
Come to understand whereare your strengths?
And I think marketing reallylends itself to being a producer.
So that's around the time you met Bing.
You were both at Kartemquin.
Yeah.
(09:40):
And you started making Mining the Gap.
He had already shot most of it,but it's looking for the story.
And I met him at Kartemquin and Iwas like, I've never produced, but
if you're willing to take a chance,I would love to do this with you.
He was a one man showand we said, let's do it.
When was that?
That was 2016, and thenwe got into Sundance 2018.
(10:03):
And I remember thinking, this is whySundance is such a special place.
It was like Full circle is where Isaw my first documentary, and then
my first documentary was acceptedhere, and then we got nominated
for an Oscar the following year.
And I remember thinking, howthe hell did this happen?
But in many ways, I.
Very spiritual.
You know, I feel like my son's with meall the time to say, mom, you can do it.
(10:26):
And I also feel that like Godgave me like a good one to start
because he knew I was older.
So I'm gonna give you a head start,uh, with a good one because he
allowed me to meet so many greatpeople, so many kind people who
are willing to meet with me and.
Because it did so well.
I got to meet a lot of buyers.
(10:47):
You know, Hulu bought the film alongwith POV along the awards campaign.
I met so many filmmakers, somethat I ended up working with now,
you know, and, uh, met agents.
It just opened up all these doors.
I don't think if I, if it wasn't sosuccessful for the first film, it take
me a lot longer and I think that's why.
(11:08):
I work with so manyfirst time filmmakers, so
we're here at Sundance andyou are here with the film.
Mm-hmm.
Uh, so you are taking meetings, Iassume, and you are probably looking for
distribution if you don't already have it.
Mm-hmm.
So you're, you know,as a producer, correct.
I'm sure you're very familiarwith the sort of state of the doc.
Landscape.
Yeah.
Keith and I have been talking about,have talked about this before.
(11:29):
I mean, it is, it is tough.
Luckily for third act, and I say luckybecause I, I really do appreciate
PBS and what they offer, especiallyto documentaries that aren't
necessarily, I think they call itthe Three Cs, um, celebrities crime,
and I forgot the third c, uh, cults.
That's it.
Cults, cults, cults.
You know, so, so Tad'sfilm, so I'm the ep.
(11:51):
Uh, on the film we did get funding from.
ITVS.
So we will be on indie lens,so we know at least people will
see it through that platform.
We do have a sales agent, which was someaningful to me too, because on top of
distribution, a lot of sales agents justbeing realistic, they know that if some
rights are sold, it's hard to sell it.
(12:12):
And
is ITVS an independent lensis lowest taking streaming
as well as TV at this point?
Yeah.
Yeah, I think like a portion like Windows.
Um.
So, you know, so there, along withbroadcast, there is a streaming
window that they have access to.
Okay.
So that is something that I dealtwith also for Minding the Gap.
We were ITVS funded too, and thenwe were able to make it work with
(12:35):
Hulu and you know, I always tryto think positive and think like
maybe we can make something happen.
I don't think it's thesame kind of deal because.
Streaming has just changed so muchin these last years where um, they
don't necessarily, you know, like Isaid, one film's about social issues.
So it is a challenge, but hopefullythere's still opportunity.
You see it every once in a while wheredocumentaries that are not the three Cs
(13:00):
are able to break out and I guess the onlyway I can do it is, is to stay positive
and keep trying and knocking on doors.
And knowing will get nos.
A lot of nos.
Yeah.
But, but not giving up.
Right, right.
You know what I can't believe we didn'tfollow up and ask you about is what was
that film that you saw at Sundance thatmade you want to make documentaries?
It was 20 feet from stardom.
(13:20):
Oh.
And I, I tell Morgan andNevol list, so I was so naive.
I wrote in an emailand, hi, I'm Diane Kwan.
I'd like to make docs.
Any advice, so naive.
But he wrote me back.
He actually emailed me back.
And what did he say to you in that email?
He says, you know, find a good storyand I can't even remember the rest.
(13:40):
And good luck probably,but, um, don't do it.
But very, yeah.
But very positive and encouraging, youknow, just like it was a dream for me.
I feel like it's people's dreams.
I gotta try at least Yeah.
Encouraging to try I andthird act, which is tomorrow.
I'm the ep and I just, again, it'slike another story that means so much
(14:02):
to me and I'm so, it's a father, son.
Story, two filmmakers, the father's, thefilmmaker from years, years and years.
He's known as thegodfather of Asian media.
And his son started making filmsand wanted to do a biopic of
him, but in the middle of the,he's diagnosed with Parkinson's.
(14:23):
And I think because of that,the film really changed.
And his father really.
Really has become so vulnerableand want to share his story now,
um, with, with Tad, he was atthe camps back in, in the 1940s.
Yeah.
And they come to understand eachother's that you wouldn't have if
(14:44):
they didn't make that film togetherbecause sometimes something about film
allows you to share things you wouldn'tnecessarily say to your dad or, so that's.
Tomorrow and he's here.
He's 88 years old.
If somebody sent you the same kind ofemail that you sent to Morgan Neville
mm-hmm.
What would you say?
Yeah, I would say.
If you're going to do this and you'regonna approach someone, which I made the
(15:06):
mistake of not really having my story.
I kind of had a story, but I didn't reallythink it through, is really to have your
pitch together about what this story is.
And when you think about story, it'sback to what I said, it has to be a
story that we haven't heard before.
Yeah.
People just get so caught upwith the idea or the issue.
They don't think about that.
So that's why I try toencourage filmmakers is.
(15:30):
To think of what is thatstory that's unique.
And also, again, like I said,don't necessarily lead with
the social issue because we'retrying to start a conversation.
So if we can start with the story,you know, that's why we're doing it.
Film, otherwise we can chooseto do it a different way.
But we we're choosing to puton the screen and then maybe
they'll hear that social issue.
(15:50):
Yeah.
Hidden and there.
Great.
So you're gonna go back out intothe cold and wet, uh, Sundance Day.
Yes.
You're, uh.
The subject of yourdoc is coming tomorrow.
Mm-hmm.
Um, so that's gonna besuch a great celebration.
Mm-hmm.
After tomorrow.
We'll totally enjoy it, but Ican't wait till the premiere.
There's nothing like showingthe film for the first time
to audience, don't you think?
(16:11):
Incredible.
Yeah.
Incredible.
Yeah.
I mean, that's why we do it, right?
Yeah.
For that moment.
Yeah.
Because there's just nothinglike that experience.
There's nothing like being
in the room.
Yeah.
This is a Thank you so much.
Thank you for, it's a pleasure.
Yeah.
Thank
you for telling us your storyand sharing your time with us.
Thank you.
Yeah.
We actually going to, uh, todo another podcast I've never
done, I think I've done one.
Wow.
But I'm really.
(16:32):
Not very articulate, so that's why.
Yes.
Yeah.
Well, we feel honored.
Uh, thank you so much.
You were great.
Oh, thank
you.
Okay, so we're, we'rewalking away from Diane Kwan.
We're outside again.
And, um, I, I'm feeling movedemotionally from that interview.
That was really beautiful andI'm super grateful that we
got a chance to talk to her.
I think Diane is the best and she told usa lot and there's so much to take from it.
(16:55):
But I think the, the two thingsthat are my biggest takeaways are.
You don't have to start making filmsas a, as a 22-year-old to have an
exciting and successful career.
You can have lived experience.
You can come from other areas and bringwhat you know about life to filmmaking
and, and make a mark right outta thegate, which she did with Minding the Gap.
(17:16):
And then I think my secondtakeaway is that she started out
by reaching out to a filmmakerthat inspired her, Morgan Neville.
And she sat down and she wrotean email and she says herself.
You know, it wasn't the, the,the most deeply thought through
email, but she asked for advice.
And Morgan, who, you know, I don't knowwell, but from, for everything I do know
(17:39):
seems to be the nicest guy in America.
Yeah.
Um, it's amazing that he wrote herback and had such like inspirational,
aspirational words for her.
Yeah.
And a guy who's that busy, who'swinning Academy Awards and working
with celebrities, you would thinkwould not take the time to do that.
Yeah.
It spurs on, uh, a topic I want tocover on one of our future episodes,
which is about, um, advice seekingadvice, giving advice, mentorship notes.
(18:06):
So much of what this podcast is about,I think is, we hope, we hope, is
building and reflecting community.
I mean, that's what makesdocumentary such a wonderful
space to work in is the community.
Yep.
And I love that Diane kind ofkicked off her first efforts.
By relying on community andkind of creating a low community
(18:26):
between her and Morgan.
Absolutely.
And to bring it back to Sundance,that's what this feels like.
It is like a community thatfor a long time I was sort of.
Uh, refusing to join and That's right.
Was
there all along Ben's Sherman'smarch through Park City.
It seems like it's been a success.
I would say so.
(18:47):
And, uh, thank you to thegreat Ross Mcoe, uh, for the
inspiration for Sherman's March.
Thank you to everybody here at Sundance.
Thank you to Diane Kwanand thank you to you.
I was gonna say, wheredo I fit into all this?
Uh, thank you to you, Ben, or elseI would've come here all alone and
lonely and sad and I would've stoodoff to the side at the parties.
Aw, Keith, which I still did a littleof, but much less because you were
(19:09):
here, so you're still a little sad.
I mean, that's kind of baked in.
That's like a, a. Okay, good.
Well, my work here is a layer in theseven layer dip that is of sadness.
No, it's one layer.
Oh, one layer.
Okay.
It's one layer.
So there's sour cream andcheddar cheese and sadness.
I'm glad we're gonna edit it out.
The nacho references, uh,across the board as a rule.
(19:32):
Um, alright, well let's wrap this up.
Let's wrap it up.
And so I'm excited.
That we, this was an exciting, I'mexcited that this was exciting.
Yeah.
Well,
that's exciting that you're excitedtaking what we've learned here in this
community in Park City, going back to ourown community of Austin, Texas, uh, let's,
let's pick up this conversation back home.
All right.
Let's do it.
Bye everybody.
(19:52):
Thanks a lot.
Doc Walks is created, produced, and editedby my friend Ben Steiner of the Bear.
Hello.
And my friend Keith Maitland of Go Valley.
Thanks for
tuning in.
Follow us at Doc Walks Podon Instagram X and YouTube.
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