June 12, 2025 • 38 mins
Drink up the scene like a local as Keith & Ben chat up their fellow Austinites (and a few out of town visitors) at the annual Austin Film Society Parking Lot Party at SXSW. This episode is a veritable smorgasbord of festival conversation including appearances by local filmmakers Cassie Hay, Tracy Frazier & Karen Skloss; festival programmers like Bart Weiss and James Faust; SXSW-premiering CREEDE, USA editor Andrew Saunderson; producer Mike Blizzard; and an AFS-appreciation conversation with CEO Rebecca Campbell. All that and a literal Rolls Royce car crash makes this bonus episode a unique peek into Austin’s film community.
00:00 Introduction and Setting the Scene
00:59 Meeting Cassie Hay: A Filmmaking Journey
03:38 Tracy Frazier: From Documentaries to Gaming
06:39 Bart Weiss: The Evolution of Video Fest
11:56 Andrew Saunderson: Editing Creed USA
15:54 James Faust: Festival Highlights
16:16 Introduction to South by Southwest
16:53 Interview with James Faust
17:12 The State of Documentary Films
19:54 Challenges in the Film Industry
24:16 Rebecca Campbell on Austin Film Society
29:45 Mike Blizzard on Austin's Film Community
31:37 Karen Skloss on the Austin Film Society Party
34:22 Conclusion and Future Episodes
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Oh, we're rolling.
Hello.
This is exciting.
We're at the Austin Film Society ParkingLot Party here at South by Southwest.
It's an annual tradition.
I feel like it's a Who's whoof the Austin film scene.
Wouldn't you say that, Ben?
I would say that.
I think that's an accurate description.
Weirdness out on the festivities bystanding out here talking to people.
But I, I don't mind.
I
don't either.
(00:20):
I we're working the party, Ithink that's what this is called.
That's right.
We're actually standing right acrossfrom a Rolls Royce, which feels.
Strangely outta place in a way.
I don't know if it'sapropos or not apropos, but
except is that a seventiesRolls Royce and then maybe a.
It is a Dookie Brown, 1977 kind of cheapo.
Rolls Royce.
(00:40):
Rolls Ro.
That is for sale.
It is for sale.
So actually that doesfeel very Austin in a way.
Yeah, exactly.
Someone
rolled in here in theseventies and they never left.
On your left,
you're listening to DocWalks with Ben and Keith.
Who are we here with?
(01:00):
Keith Ben.
Lemme introduce you.
My old friend, Cassie Hay.
And when I'm an old friend, it'snot that she's old, it's just that
we've been friends for a while.
You're old.
That's true.
Yes.
Cassie and I have some overlappingbackground, both in New York.
And here in Austin and the oneday that we ever worked together
was on a film that she directedthat I was a standin camera guy.
(01:23):
Way back in like 2014 maybe.
Yes.
It's
still one of my favorite stories.
Tell me,
tell me the story.
'cause we, I, it was a little on the fly.
You came in, we were on the UT campusand this interview subject walked in and
took the cowboy hat right off your head.
You were wearing a cowboy hat, Keith.
I don't know why.
And he put it on his
(01:43):
head.
That's hard to do.
And I was like, Ooh, that is a power move.
That's a Texas power move, right?
There isn't?
Yes.
Yeah.
Did you have toimmediately go have a dual?
I, no.
I, I shrank.
Yeah, I shrank and my boots, I,he took the boots off my feet.
My, my told.
Curled up.
He stole all your cattle.
It was Dick DeGuerin, legendaryTexas law man or lawyer.
(02:04):
Yes.
Dick DeGuerin.
You just let him do that?
Yeah.
You have to just let him take your hat
when you're It wasn't my set.
If I was the director, I think Imight have put up a little bit of
fight, but I was there to try todo a good job for Cassie and so it
was up to her to defend my honor.
And so what were you interviewing him for?
You were making a movie?
Um, yes.
It was a movie called The Liberators andit was at South by Southwest in 2016.
Same time as Tower.
(02:25):
So it was kinda a nice like.
Full circle moment you came in andsaved my bacon to do that interview.
But he was, that's a great
expression by the way.
Save my bacon.
I like, yeah, I'm
just throwing out the, the country iss.
But he, no, he, it was a greatinterview and he had, it is great
quote for the trailer, which wassometimes good people do bad things,
but that doesn't make 'em bad people.
(02:47):
Wow.
I was like, oh man, that was agood impression as he said it.
I was like, oh, here it, this is it.
So anyway, it was reallyfun and yeah, here we are.
And you're here with a new movie, correct?
I I, I am a supported filmmakerthis year, which is really exciting.
Yeah.
And
you said you're a supportedfilmmaker with Austin Film Society.
What does that mean?
So we got a developmentgrant for feature film.
So that means, which is just amazingthat it just allows us the opportunity
(03:12):
to really explore your story, buildit out, try to make into feature,
get it to our, our reps, try toput some, get some juice behind it.
So yeah, they've beenreally wonderful and.
Talk about how to solve problems, andI just can't believe that it's another
wonderful thing that AFS provides.
So.
All
right.
Well thank you for doing this.
(03:33):
Yeah.
Go enjoy the party and we'llsee you around South by.
So
nice to talk to y'all.
Yeah.
Okay, thanks.
Bye.
Here's my,
uh, this is my good friend Tracy Frazier.
Ben, do you know Tracy?
Yes,
I know Tracy.
Hello.
Great to see you.
How are you doing?
How's south by treating
you?
I'm doing great.
I'm.
I'm actually been slammed, soI don't know how much I'm gonna
(03:53):
be doing during South by, but,
and what are you slammed with?
What are you doing?
I did a little bit of a pivot fromdocumentary to the world of games.
Well, but that's interesting though,because Austin is a hotbed of the gaming
industry in this, in a pretty unique waythat is building momentum more and more.
(04:13):
So tell us about that.
Well, the thing, what are you doing?
The thing is, and I'm in this finance.
Accounting, running a studiofrom here that's based in LA.
Uh, was it a hard decision on makingthis pivot from documentary filmmaking
to the world of video game Mogul?
No, not, no, because of the team.
So I'm more of a, like, ifthey're kind, I will go there.
(04:37):
And I got that from Kat Candler.
Oh.
So that was 20 years ago workingon jumping off bridges and doing
that with her and the team there.
But yeah.
You gotta be kind
nice.
You gotta be kind.
You gotta be kind.
Totally agree.
In
fact, they interviewed me onthe treadmill 20 years ago and
they were like, are you nice?
(04:57):
And I was like, I think so
they ask you that on this?
Yes.
In an interview.
Absolutely.
I'm gonna steal that.
We should start asking peopleif they're, are you nice?
Are
you nice?
And can you get shit done?
Shit done.
That's right.
Mm-hmm.
So
well
one out of two ain't bad.
Yeah.
God.
Tracy, you've been a longtime South by Southwest.
Attendee.
(05:18):
Yeah.
She's been rocking and rolling OliverAustin since at least the mid nineties.
Mm-hmm.
Um, what advice do you have for,for people we might run into, not
us, we're old time South, south bySouthwest folks as well, but what
advice do you have for newcomers?
Hydrate.
Take it slow, maybe, uh, giveyourself a little bit of a pep
talk of what your purpose is.
(05:41):
Wow.
Yeah.
Wow.
And, uh, and then.
Oh my God.
This is the
second time that Rolls Royce has been hit.
When that one's a lot worseand that one's way worse.
I, I think this guy just,just bought a 77 Rolls Royce.
I think he's connected toit, like he can't get loose.
Oh no.
Or was it a 76?
(06:02):
It is a 75 or 70.
Fuck geez.
He's turn loose like a fine wine.
Oh boy.
A fine brown wine that isparked in a really unfortunate
place, really bad place.
Oh
wow.
Oh, this poor guy.
Oh no, don't worry.
It's just a Rolls Royce.
God, he actually liked that joke.
I would've hated you in that moment.
(06:22):
But he smiled.
But you gotta laugh 'causeyou know why I'm nice.
You're gonna get shit nice.
So you get shit done.
Shit.
That's
right.
That's right.
Oh my God.
I think that's where we ended.
That was a great, thankyou so much for doing this.
Of
course, yeah.
This is, uh.
Bart Weiss approaching and you can alwaysrecognize Bart because he is got his
(06:43):
signature red frame glasses, his shockof white hair, and uh, a big smile.
A hardy laugh when I sawyou across the street there.
When I saw you across the streetthere, I said there's a living
legend walking towards us.
It is Bart Weiss.
You can't talk about filmmaking inTexas, at least since 1980 something
without talking about Bart and his roleup in Dallas running multiple festivals.
(07:08):
But primarily Video fest.
Video fest, yeah.
Is the festival that, thatyou've really championed?
Yes.
For how many years?
What is that fest like and whatdo you have to say about it?
So I ran it for 34.
I ran it for 34 years.
And then there were some years whenI splintered off an experimental
festival and then I splintered off adocumentary festival called Docu Vests.
(07:28):
But yeah, it was, it was alot of fun because I could
show things I wanted to show.
I didn't have anybody who could say no.
I didn't have anybody on my boardwho would say, no, you can't
show that for whatever reason.
And I was able to champion a lotof works that I really loved.
And because of doing that festival, Igot to meet so many wonderful people.
(07:51):
Yeah.
Keith and
well, and I think you showedsome of my early short films.
I'm sure you don't remember,but I moved here in 2002 and.
Played quite a few films at your festival.
Oh my God.
And I remember that was always like sortof the destination and you'd meet all
kinds of very interesting other filmmakersand see lots of mind blowing work.
And so I love that you started, I don'tknow if putting Dallas on the map is
(08:15):
the right way to say it, but like youstarted something that's very unique,
that feels very like of a place.
And Dallas has now become with guys likeDavid Lowry and Sailor Bear being there,
Dallas has become something of a film.
city,
we showed David's firstshort film called Lullaby.
And I think we may have the only copy.
(08:38):
Wow.
On a three quarter inch tape.
Oh boy.
You hear that David Lowry.
That's right.
I
hope he has one, but I know thatwe do and maybe he doesn't want it.
It's a great film.
It's wonderful.
Awesome.
That's so cool.
So, you know, one of the thingswe talk about is the state of
the, of documentary film, and youhave an interesting angle on that.
As somebody who has runa festival for 34 years.
(09:00):
What are you currently seeingas being the state of Doc film?
Well, like most things in life, it'sthe best of time and the worst of time.
It's the worst of time.
It's really hard to get on astreaming service or distribution.
Right.
So the feature documentary, the onebest documentary, has no distribution,
(09:22):
which is no Other Land, correct?
Yes.
Yeah, no other land.
Really wonderful film.
It's playing in theaters, butthey're booking it themselves.
What kind of world are we in?
Where the documentary feature winner ofthe Academy Awards has no distribution,
and you're in this place where if yourfilm does not have a celebrity or about
(09:43):
true crime, you're probably not gonnaget on a streaming service and you're
probably not gonna get distribution.
But yet there's a gazillion documentariesbeing made and everything else.
Like a lot of them are not good and,but some of them are incredibly awesome.
But the other thing I think isreally important, and this is
something I've a vested interest in.
(10:05):
I just wrote this book abouthow to make films with mobile
phones and mobile filmmaking.
I've been doing these workshopsall over the country and to me what
this a is able to do is to make surethat anybody can make a documentary.
If you use a black magic camera appand you learn how to get good sound.
And you do a bunch of otherthings that you can easily learn.
(10:27):
But more importantly, and I think thisis what the real great thing about
mobile filmmaking is, you need lesscrew, which means you can have much
more intensity in what you're doing.
So if I don't have a sound personand a gaffer and a dp, and it's just
me and you having a conversation.
I can get something completely different.
(10:48):
Absolutely.
It's more intimate for
sure.
I, I love hearing you say that, Bart.
That is my personalapproach to filmmaking.
We don't use phones, although I haven'tbeen known to sneak a few iPhone shots
in, but I totally agree that the morelayers of institutional, the quote
unquote help you add, the further youget from an intimate personal connection.
And also in narrative film, there'sthis shot, it's still image of Soderberg
(11:10):
directing high-flying bird, and it's just.
Him and his actor in a gymwith a phone on a tripod.
And if you're an actor and there'snobody else in the room, but you
and the director like you canget to different emotional space.
Yes.
Right now, I'm not saying it's rightfor every project, but Soderberg and,
well, there are other people they'vedone pretty well, including somebody
(11:32):
who just wanted Academy of Work.
It it's, this is not likea fringe thing anymore.
Right.
Well as somebody who, like I said,has sort of created something that
had a huge impact on our community,thank you very much and thank you
for taking the time to do this.
Well, thank you.
I really appreciate it.
Yeah.
And now I gotta run.
Do a q and a.
Go.
Do a q and a. Go do it.
Enjoy
the fest.
Hey, I will.
(11:52):
Thank you.
See you soon to see you Bart.
So Andrew, you and I arejust meeting each other.
Tell me who you are and what you do.
Yeah, thanks.
Nice to meet you.
My name's Andrew Sanderson andI'm the editor of Creed USA, which
is here at South by Southwest,and I'm a nonfiction film editor.
Awesome.
We've heard multiple peopletalk about Creed and how they're
very excited to see it, so
(12:13):
that's amazing.
I'm gonna see the film tomorrow night,and I'm very excited because I've been
hearing these great things about it, andI've been hearing about it a couple years
ago from Kahani Cooperman, the director.
Mm-hmm.
Shortly after she got started,we had a conversation around
what her goals were for it.
And then I've heard a little bit from yourcomposer, our mutual friend Osay Esid who,
who I know always makes beautiful music.
Yeah.
And always makes the films he's on better.
(12:35):
Certainly he's done that on myfilms and so I'm excited to be his
guest at the screening tour night.
Amazing.
Yeah.
Excited that you guys are gonna
be there.
Where are you in town from?
Uh, from Brooklyn, New York.
I'm originally from Seattle, Washington.
Okay.
Oh yeah, I've been inBrooklyn for 10 years now.
Excellent.
And as somebody not fromAustin, what's your, how do
you see the Austin film scene?
The Austin film scene.
Yeah.
I feel connected to it through beinginspired by independent cinema and
(12:59):
particularly Slacker and El Mariachiand like growing up more in that vein of
things and then seeing the arts festival,support of the arts throughout the years.
That, particularly the festivalhas, I think, inspired a lot of,
which just has been so exciting.
And so I always feel like if,when I'm down here, it just
(13:19):
feels like a great community.
It feels like.
Creative people who want to be inspired,who want to inspire each other and
get things going, make things happen.
Yeah.
It's always warm and lovely down here.
That's awesome.
That's great.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And so this is the world premiere at
Southlake.
This is the world premiere, yeah.
On Sunday, March 9th.
Is that right?
Yeah, that's sounds right.
(13:40):
Is that sound right?
Excellent.
And how long have youbeen working on the film?
So I started in February of 2024.
And so we cut.
Yeah, pretty much in up to December.
So we were going for a while.
We had a couple down times there.
But yeah, it was, it's a complex film.
There's a lot of characters,a lot of different storylines.
(14:01):
We're all really happy with how it cametogether in the time that it took to come
together.
As an editor who works with differentdirectors, I'm always so curious
about the relationship between aneditor and a director and kind of.
Where one begins and one ends.
And when you're watching a finishedproduct and you see a great sequence where
you see an overarching kind of structurethat really speaks to you, it's impossible
(14:23):
to know as an audience member, whetherthat's the director's vision being an
actor, if that's an editor coming inand reshaping a big gelatinous mess.
What is your role, uh, when you'reworking with a new partner, a
new collaborator, a new director?
How do you establish thatrelationship and that rapport?
I, I try to get to know themand try to get a sense of what
they're trying to achieve.
Artistically creatively and the typeof story that they're trying to tell.
(14:47):
I ultimately am trying to servicethat and bring as much creativity and
help as I can In nonfiction editing.
I usually think that there's a lotof writing involved, and so trying to
bring that aspect of where I can comein and say where we're trying to get
to, like how we achieve that goal.
And so it's just working handin hand with the director to
(15:07):
figure some of that stuff out.
Sometimes it is just going in andbeing like, I'm gonna try something.
Like with what you have presented and,but this might be outta left field,
but maybe this might not work at all.
It might be completely outside of it,but it might inspire something new for
us to go off of, which it usually doeseven if it doesn't make it into the film.
But with Kahani and Creed, USA,and this is our sixth project
(15:31):
together, we know each other so well.
At this point.
I know I have a strong sense of whatshe has and in mind and how she wants
to tell a story, and so I'm ultimately.
Trying to achieve that.
Yeah.
In, in the That's
great.
In the approach.
Awesome.
Amen.
Well that's great.
Well, thank you so muchfor giving us some time.
Yeah, thanks guys.
Appreciate it.
Yeah, thanks for having me.
Really good meet.
Yeah.
(15:51):
Awesome.
Who are we standing here with?
Keith, to me,
it's not a festive festival.
If I don't
get a chance, see what he did there.
That's, yes.
That's the kind of verbal trickery thatyou can look forward to in this interview.
He's flexible that way.
James Faust is thefestival at the festival.
(16:12):
Whoa,
whoa.
That
is, he gave me just enough time.
Seriously there.
We're here at South by Southwest and I'vehad wonderful experiences at South by
Southwest, but there is one programmer inthe entire nation and the entire world.
Who somehow has said yes to every filmI've ever submitted to in film festival,
and that is because the very first shortfilm I ever made was programmed by James
(16:36):
at the Santa Monica Film Festival in 2001.
Yeah, I've looked, oh yeah.
Oh one or oh two.
Oh yeah, maybe 2002.
And then I've made four featuressince then, all of which have
played here at South By, but allof which have also played at James
Premier Festival up in Dallas.
The Dallas International Film Festival.
This is James Faust.
Film festival programmerextraordinaire, and good friend.
(16:57):
Hi.
Hi.
Thanks.
I am shocked and happy andI'm feeling a little humble.
I could turn purple right now.
That was a, that's a good intro.
Thanks.
Purple with humility.
That's right.
I
think in spite of having poor taste, wewant your opinion here about, I don't
know how much Keith's told you about.
We're doing a podcast about thestate of documentary Oh wow.
Business, about what it's liketo be a working filmmaker.
(17:18):
Okay.
In your case, what it's liketo have a festival right
now in this environment, so.
Give us an overview.
What do you, what are you, whatare you thinking about the state
of documentary film right now?
I can actually say that in the 20years I've been doing programming
from the Deep El Santa Monica Asianfilm festivals, Austin Film Festival,
(17:38):
Dallas, a FI, Dallas, A-F-I-A-F-I, docs.
At this point in time, I'venever seen more documentary
films being made, created.
Than ever.
It has been.
The, the amount of content has beenshocking to me, and I, I won't say
that the artistic merit of all thedocumentaries, because there's so
(18:00):
many outlets for where to go, so.
The diversity of the contentis something that slows down.
What we're looking for at ourfestival is different than what
other people are looking for.
And so the things that I've beenseeing, there's a lot of things
that are in the television world.
Like this is not, I don'tthink this is a feature.
I think this is something that you'relooking to make a TV show out of,
and it just happened to submit it.
'cause the way the lower thirds are setup or whatever, it's just seeing that.
(18:21):
So what I've seen a lot more is peoplemaking more content and submitting it
to festivals as if it's a festival film.
And I think some of the thingsthat are more television.
End up playing more wherethey're locally centric.
For instance, oh, there's agreat story about a homeless
shelter in in San Antonio.
Yeah, it's a pretty cool movie, butit seems very San Antonio centric.
(18:42):
Right.
And if it, so the content isthere, but the filmmaking seems
a little bit, oh, so product.
Seems to be not a problem.
That's really interesting.
I wonder how much of that isas social media's influence.
'cause it's almost like you're expectedto be documenting and posting and telling
stories about your life, and as youngerpeople are coming up, maybe it's a lot of
that that's rubbing off and like that'sleading to more documentary content,
(19:05):
I think.
Yeah, but everything from True Crime tojust actually just reality television.
I don't want somebody to do a study onthis and go back to when the first big
strike happened, and then we have this.
Rage of, of reality television thatcame out beyond the survivor and all
these house shows and everything.
I just think that, and peoplegrowing up on that as well.
(19:26):
'cause that's what we were watching.
It wasn't a lot of scripted TV for a yearor two years and just this barrage of
these product and Oh, I'm watching tv.
What?
Yeah, I'm watching RealHousewives of Guatemala.
Okay.
Like that's, but they'rewatching that thing.
And so I think that translatesinto I can do that, right?
I can make a show about this.
I'm gonna make a show aboutpeople going on blind dates and
it's just blah and all that.
And then they turn that intosubmitted films for film festivals,
(19:48):
which is just mind blowing.
Well, what you're thinking,you should go talk to Netflix
or put that on Prime yourself,
which is, that's so interesting becausea lot of you, as you might guess, a lot
of people's answer to that question is.
Can be doom and gloom sometimes.
Yeah.
About like funding being hard toget, and eyeballs being hard to
reach and people being distracted bytheir phones and that sort of thing.
But in a way, you could look at youranswer as being like, this is a sort
(20:11):
of golden age in a way of documentary.
Yeah.
I know you're saying it's more maybequantity than quality, but Yes.
But it's interesting thatthere's that level of quantity.
Yeah,
it is.
And I just think that there'salmost too much, and I don't think.
It's, it's hard to find a placeto find what you wanna find.
I don't think eyes are a problem.
I, I think in the business side of it,I think it's the who's ever investing
(20:33):
or wherever you're streaming from,like the monetization of those eyes.
And I think that seemsto be the difference.
I think people are watching things.
I just don't think people aresadly making money, making the
things that people are watching.
Yeah.
Because the back backendis not very great.
Oh yeah.
We'll take your thing andyou're just happy to get it
sold and happy to get it seen.
Yeah, but that's not, that maynot put bread on the table.
You're basically de describingevery experience I've ever
(20:54):
had with a distributor.
And I, when I talk to filmmakersnowadays, one of the things that I,
the way that I can make sense of itis it feels like the film business is
where the music business was about 10years ago when Spotify came around.
Oh wow.
And all of a sudden, everythingis expected to be free, so
why should we pay for it?
Why do we buy a record when I can justsubscribe to Spotify and it's free, or
Apple Music, or pull it up on YouTube?
(21:17):
And I think, you know, if youlook at the analytics, people go
home now and they watch YouTube.
Mm-hmm.
Which is hard for me to understandas somebody who doesn't do that.
I'm always amazed by those peopleor the how tos, like the guy who
will teach you like some veryspecific niche thing like Oh yeah.
The fact that they tookthe time to do that.
Yeah.
And post it is Mind
bog I, I prepared my washer anddryer going to YouTube and said,
(21:38):
all right, this is the model number.
This is it.
And somebody has gone out there and foundthat specific random model and built it.
And so
I
don't think those things are competingwith what we do for a living.
They may be competing for thetime that people are allotting
in their day to take in media.
And so in that way it is a, is itis in competition, but they're not
trying to scratch the same itch.
(21:58):
They're not doing long form storytelling.
They're not saying, let's have anemotive, empathetic human exchange.
Yeah.
They're saying we're, they're, in my mind,they're competing with the newspaper.
It used to be you wake up in the morningand your dad before he went off to
work, might read most of the newspaper.
It might take an hour and a half,and that was like an hour and
a half of his day, and it was.
(22:20):
Consumed and discarded.
The next day, there's anothernewspaper consumed and discarded.
That to me is what thosetype of things on YouTube.
Are in competition with.
So I don't personallytake it as an affront.
And I hear that except for thefact that they made, let's say
they made 600 TV shows last year.
Yeah.
They're making 300 this year, right?
(22:40):
Because people are going home andsitting on their couch and they're
watching TikTok and they're watchingInstagram and they're watching sports
highlights on YouTube, and they'renot flipping on a and e networks and
watching whatever the latest TV show is.
And so that is having a very real effect.
On, uh, not exactly what we do,but it's certainly impacting it.
(23:02):
And, uh, things like, like I showran a, the Hulu original show and
all signs pointed to season two, allour analytics were above expectation
and they basically didn't renewit because they decided to kind of
billion dollars from their budgets.
And they're not the only ones doing that.
So.
All of LA and the people I know therewho work in TV and nonfiction are in free
(23:25):
fall because of this new societal shift.
So I hear you, but INo, I, that's very real.
Respectfully disagree with that.
No, that's very real.
You have a much more, and I'm justtalking outta my ass here, so that's,
I'm happy to probably edit this out,
but I'm curious for, as a somebodywho programs film festivals, runs
film festivals, like how is that.
How do we bridge those gaps?
(23:46):
Because in a way, they'rethe same thing, right?
Like it's storytelling, it's documenting,it's like they're, I'm waiting for
the synthesis and I'm excited forwhat that, what the new version of the
morphing version of documentary is going
to.
I don't think there needs to be adifferent model and expectations.
So like, why are you making this film?
Why are you doing this,and what is your end game?
(24:07):
That's great.
Oh, what a great answer.
Yeah.
Well, let's get back tosome of those filmmakers.
Alright.
Yeah.
Go party with us.
Thanks James.
Yeah, thanks for doing that.
I want you to introduce yourselfand tell us what you do and
what the Film Society does.
Like you would be talking to a classfull of students because I think a lot
of people who hopefully will listento our podcast may not be familiar.
(24:29):
Not at all with how.
Yeah, important and pivotal.
The Austin Film Society is, yeah.
My name's Rebecca Campbell and I'm theCEO of the Austin Film Society, and
I've been in this role for 27 years,and at the moment we're celebrating our
40th anniversary, believe it or not.
So the Austin Film Society.
All week long as we've gotten readyfor South by Southwest and we've done
(24:51):
our big annual gala, the Texas FilmAwards, all kinds of people have been
just like testifying and talking abouthow a FS has changed their lives.
And I've gotten people to, I've heardpeople say, if you could just use one word
to describe a FS, and one of them said,community, and they said that was the way
they were able to find their people wasthrough a FS when they moved to Austin.
(25:14):
Rebecca, what makes AustinFilm Society what it is?
For starters, just hanging in therebecause you know how it is, you could
see all the things that you, thatcould happen and that you wanna do and
that you could do, but you have to.
Hang in there for the iterationsof it because you don't just buy
something like this, you build it.
(25:36):
And so really what makes a FSwhat it is, it's still true.
Our founder, Richard Linklater, who justwanted to show films and help filmmakers,
and it just built from there, but it's,that's always been the North Star.
It's, it comes across, and asBen said, he's one of those
people, I'm one of those people.
Austin Film Society started givingproduction grants right around
(25:57):
the time I was in college, inundergrad, and it was the first.
It's actually the first grant I'dever heard about for filmmaking.
And the fact that it came from thework of a filmmaker like Linklater just
was just another of the many steps ofinspiration that that his career and what
the Austin film scene in the ninetiespresented to me as an emerging filmmaker.
(26:17):
And then over the last 20 years receivingsome of those grants, being a part of
the committee that chooses grants workingin and around the world of the society.
It's offered what youjust said, community.
And you know, when you come tothis party, you're gonna recognize
20 or 30 faces and it's peoplefrom all levels in our industry.
(26:38):
People who are gonna be on the marquee atthe Paramount this week, and people that
are struggling to get their first filmout of the computer and onto any screen.
You juggle all that as a CEO.
Wait, I wanna tell yousomething that reminded me of
something, what you just said.
Okay.
That reminded me.
So I went to the University ofTexas at Austin to learn documentary
(26:59):
filmmaking, and it was brutal.
It took me five years to get my MFA.
I went through two learning curvesbecause first it was linear,
then it was non-linear, andit was somewhat humbling, but.
I got my documentary made.
It was a really cool story abouta dying mining town in Oklahoma.
(27:21):
And so then I did not know what I wasgonna do, and then the Austin film
study needed somebody and I alreadyhad a nonprofit management background.
So I reluctantly went to the interviewjust thinking, I'll see what this is,
and I immediately just fell in love andI knew I'd found my people and before I
(27:41):
started the job, I don't know why, butI handed Richard Linklater my film, my
30 minute film, and he responded to meand said, I watched your film and he
told me the things that he liked aboutmy film, and I, I just realized what
you said about people at all levels.
That is a real thing in the documentaryfilm community and in the a FS
(28:03):
community, and not all of us are likedestined to become marquee names.
Eventually I found my passion in beingbehind the scenes and helping really
talented, funny, cool people likeyourselves, get their stories out there.
But yeah, we don't know where we'regonna end up, but just taking that
step and, and jumping in and doing it.
(28:26):
And is the thing, and I like tothink that a FS encourages that.
Rebecca, thanks for this party.
Every year we were talking about it.
It is the kickoff to South by Southwest.
It's a way for people who don't havea film in the festival or who can't
afford a badge to get what makes so byso exciting, which is a celebration of
film, a celebration of community as areminder of what we love about a FS.
(28:49):
And it's always a beautiful day.
Here in the parking lot at Austin Public.
So thanks for a great party.
Here's,
do you wanna talk to us or
Yes.
Come on,
Mike.
We have to do this.
We talking
about, what the fuck.
So we're here, uh, we're talking topeople about, uh, the, basically the
state of the Austin film community,Uhhuh, uh, what the a FS Party means to
you each year.
(29:09):
I think that.
This event in particular, I tellpeople who are visiting filmmakers
like part of the indie or doccrowd, they've gotta come here.
I think it's a great place where allthe people can gather and it's really,
it's got that Austin vibe to it.
This is like sort of a streetparty, and so people are comfortable
with that with each other.
So the people from out of townbecome comfortable as well.
(29:32):
You know, if you're from LA or something,you're just not used to events like
this, you know, it's more competitive.
People are in their ownniches and whatever.
Now here, all differentkinds of filmmakers know
each other like each other.
Work on each other's shit.
And so, uh, for those of, uh,people who don't know who we're
talking to, Mike Blizzard.
Mike Blizzard, Austin based producer,
let me, let me help you out.
(29:53):
Mike Blizzard started as a, as apolitical operative, uh, man about town.
He has produced documentaries.
He's directed his own documentary.
He produces frequentlywith Richard Linklater.
Mike, we're gonna letyou go in just a second.
This party is always such a big deal.
You mentioned it yourself.
You bring people from outof town when they come here.
Yeah.
I mean, so by Southwest brings in hundredsof thousand of people from all around the
(30:15):
world, but this is the Austin Film Party.
Yeah.
What, what does the world not knowabout the Austin Film community?
I think.
I mean, the biggest thing I kindof alluded to earlier is just
there's not really competition.
It's all collaboration.
And I If an Austin filmmakeris doing well, that's good for
every other Austin filmmaker.
(30:37):
You know, a rising tide lifts all boats inother places in New York and Los Angeles.
People of course, don't see it that way.
It's a more cutthroatindustry and business.
And so I think that that.
That comes from the top a little bit.
I think Linklater and Rodriguez andstuff, they've always been these
creative, wanna do it their own way,uh, by their own rules type of people.
(30:59):
And of course there's the sort oftwin titans of the, of the modern
era of film in Austin, I guess.
And um, I think that trickles down thateveryone, like that's our ethic here.
Yeah.
You know, that's how we do itand people are just like, oh
my God, everyone's so friendly.
Everyone.
You know, and it you, youknow, you give everyone advice.
You guys know, we allshow each other our films.
(31:21):
Yeah.
So that you can critique it and tell uswhat we've missed and how we're too close
to it and we're not seeing the problems.
And that's like, I don't thinkthat happens in other places.
You have to go pay test audiences.
Or whatever to do that.
We could have been gettingpaid this whole time.
So we're here with Karen Sloss,who's filmmaker extraordinaire.
(31:41):
Band leader.
Drummer.
It's an editor.
It's an egalitarian band artist
and Oh, no leader.
It's Marriage Corps.
It's,
you guys know how
it's, yes.
You and your husband, Sandy, are bothin the band Skloss who, and you just
had a record release party, right?
Yes.
Yesterday record came outyesterday, our debut album.
Congratulations on Fuzz Club.
(32:03):
Fuzz Club.
Okay.
Yeah.
And how'd it go?
How was the, it was
great.
Yeah?
Yeah.
And now we're just gonnaplay five more shows.
Woohoo.
And a showcase on Friday.
Amazing.
It's
old school south by Southwest.
Yeah,
it is.
Yeah.
Yeah, it is.
This is my first, so by Southwest,well, no, not first swim, but in a while
as a musician instead of a filmmaker.
(32:24):
It's okay, Karen, we're here atthe Austin Film Society Party.
What does this party meanto you as a local filmmaker?
So that long history of relationshipssouth by what makes it such a fun party.
It's a reunion every year.
It's the best.
And the film Society is one of thosethings that is at the heart of our
(32:45):
success as a community in Austin.
And.
I feel like that, and then also justthat there were the right amount
or the perfect kind of group offilmmakers that decided to nest here.
Everybody knows the the folks, butI'll also add Paul Steckler in the doc
world and attracting all these people.
So we just have had this like amazing.
(33:07):
Community growing up here anda FS is like the watering hole.
It's like, that's a great way to say it.
We can all come and some ofthem are adult beverages, but we
can all hang out and catch up.
And people who are comingthrough town who are part of our
family, we all get to reconnect.
And then there's also so much tremendoustalent coming through all the programs
(33:30):
and the services and then even justthe film festival who are attracted.
So it's become.
Something, it's really snowballed.
Yeah.
To, it was one of the greatest artisticnonprofits in the country, I think now.
Yeah.
So many people envy the Austin FilmSociety when as a filmmaker you
tell somebody you live in Austin.
That's like often whatthey want to talk about.
(33:51):
It's insane.
Yeah.
I, they were so privileged that wewere here when it was first being
put together, or like, we weren'there 40 years ago, but I feel like
we were the first like pip squeaks.
Yeah.
You know?
Yeah.
First class of, yeah.
Yeah.
Muppet babies.
So maybe garbage beil kids inyour, that's probably we're after.
Let's wrap it up.
Let's wrap it.
(34:11):
My voice is going.
You gotta like, are you okay?
Your ride is waiting for you.
The party's over.
Yeah.
Let's, uh, turn off
the lights.
The
party.
Yes.
This has been an awesome day.
We set out to go do kind of man on thestreet interviews at South by Southwest.
And we said we're gonna go to the AFSparty as kind of one part of that.
But this feels like it's a whole episode.
(34:33):
It feels like the AFS Party celebrationof the community here in Austin
is an episode unto itself, and Ithink maybe Karen just named it.
The watering hole.
Hey, I love that.
Well, it's pretty hilariousto drive up and see you guys
doing this, I have to say.
Yeah.
I, it really gave me a chuckle.
Oh, good.
Yeah.
Seeing me look like a huge nerdwith a fanny pack on and headphones.
It's
like we said, we're gonna go to the party.
(34:54):
We don't wanna feel like those dipshits at the party or like working and
trying to make something outta nothing.
We'll grab one or two people off tothe side, no one will even notice.
And here we are.
I was like, that's one wayto get invited to the party
now.
You know our secret.
That's right.
Well, thank you for doing this, KA.
Yeah.
It's great to see you.
Yeah, great to see you too.
All right, so that was like.
(35:14):
Um, basically all of our friends here inAustin that we just talked to at a party,
well, it was all of our friends.
And given a new context via our goodfriend Karen Sloss, uh, when she said,
this place is like the watering hole,which I never thought of it that way,
but I am kind of like an old caribou.
I. Who like sauntersdown to the water's edge.
I've been saying that about you for years.
Keith's just an old caribou.
(35:35):
I I was thinking of it more aslike, uh, sometimes you want to go
where everybody knows your name.
It's something that strikes me wheneverwe do this podcast is like when you
go to that party and you look around.
There's a dozen people at thisparty that should be hosting
their own filmmaking podcast.
Mm-hmm.
These folks had a lot to add.
I'm glad we got a chanceto talk with them.
Um, your voice is sounding a lot better.
(35:56):
Thank you.
I'm feeling much better nowthat South By is behind us.
Um, I love it and everyyear it beats me up.
Um, but I, I hope you guys like it.
Uh, it was a lot of fun to make.
Yeah.
Appreciate you guyschecking out this episode.
Of course.
We also released an episode, uh, withJohn Sloss this week, um, and he's
got insights into the media landscapeand the nineties indie film boom that
(36:19):
inspired both of us so much in the.
Early parts of our career.
And so check that episode out and then,uh, join us next week where, uh, Ben
and I go on a walk, just the two of us.
We're gonna be moseying throughHyde Park here in Austin, and
we have a lot to say about
the modern media landscape,so tune in for that.
We were wandering down back alleysand getting lost in Hyde Park and
(36:43):
getting lost in philosophical thought.
So hope you guys enjoy.
Yeah, that's gonna bea video, episode two.
Which we are, you know,slowly porting over to.
It looks like all these episodes aregonna be kind of up on YouTube for
those who like to watch when they walk.
And uh, for those of you who justprefer to listen, you can find
us at Apple Podcasts, um, andSpotify iHeartRadio apparently.
(37:07):
I mean, who knows?
We could be playing at truckstops right now, Keith.
We're our, our reach is, is long
Dock Walks stock Walks is,uh, produced and edited.
It's created by, it's, it's hostedby, uh, me, Keith Maitland, and
this guy Ben Steinbauer and Keith.
Uh.
Keith's company produces it.
Go Valley.
Uh, my production company, The Bear, alsohelps out and we have a lot of help from
(37:31):
Juliana Rios, who is our new, uh,edit assistant, and she's doing a
great job over there in the edit room.
We've also got original music fromSam Billen and Primary Color Group.
And, uh, if you're watching the show open,uh, thanks to Josh Allen who gave us a
little bit of VFX help on the front side.
Um, anyway, that's us.
(37:51):
Thanks for being you.
We'll catch you next time on.
Doc Walks
follow us at Doc Walks podon Instagram X and YouTube.
Oh, we're rolling.
Hello.
This is exciting.
We're at the Austin Film Society ParkingLot Party here at South by Southwest.
It's an annual tradition.
I feel like it's a Who's whoof the Austin film scene.
Wouldn't you say that, Ben?
I would say that.
I think that's an accurate description.
Weirdness out on the festivities bystanding out here talking to people.
But I, I don't mind.
I
don't either.
(00:20):
I we're working the party, Ithink that's what this is called.
That's right.
We're actually standing right acrossfrom a Rolls Royce, which feels.
Strangely outta place in a way.
I don't know if it'sapropos or not apropos, but
except is that a seventiesRolls Royce and then maybe a.
It is a Dookie Brown, 1977 kind of cheapo.
Rolls Royce.
(00:40):
Rolls Ro.
That is for sale.
It is for sale.
So actually that doesfeel very Austin in a way.
Yeah, exactly.
Someone
rolled in here in theseventies and they never left.
On your left,
you're listening to DocWalks with Ben and Keith.
Who are we here with?
(01:00):
Keith Ben.
Lemme introduce you.
My old friend, Cassie Hay.
And when I'm an old friend, it'snot that she's old, it's just that
we've been friends for a while.
You're old.
That's true.
Yes.
Cassie and I have some overlappingbackground, both in New York.
And here in Austin and the oneday that we ever worked together
was on a film that she directedthat I was a standin camera guy.
(01:23):
Way back in like 2014 maybe.
Yes.
It's
still one of my favorite stories.
Tell me,
tell me the story.
'cause we, I, it was a little on the fly.
You came in, we were on the UT campusand this interview subject walked in and
took the cowboy hat right off your head.
You were wearing a cowboy hat, Keith.
I don't know why.
And he put it on his
(01:43):
head.
That's hard to do.
And I was like, Ooh, that is a power move.
That's a Texas power move, right?
There isn't?
Yes.
Yeah.
Did you have toimmediately go have a dual?
I, no.
I, I shrank.
Yeah, I shrank and my boots, I,he took the boots off my feet.
My, my told.
Curled up.
He stole all your cattle.
It was Dick DeGuerin, legendaryTexas law man or lawyer.
(02:04):
Yes.
Dick DeGuerin.
You just let him do that?
Yeah.
You have to just let him take your hat
when you're It wasn't my set.
If I was the director, I think Imight have put up a little bit of
fight, but I was there to try todo a good job for Cassie and so it
was up to her to defend my honor.
And so what were you interviewing him for?
You were making a movie?
Um, yes.
It was a movie called The Liberators andit was at South by Southwest in 2016.
Same time as Tower.
(02:25):
So it was kinda a nice like.
Full circle moment you came in andsaved my bacon to do that interview.
But he was, that's a great
expression by the way.
Save my bacon.
I like, yeah, I'm
just throwing out the, the country iss.
But he, no, he, it was a greatinterview and he had, it is great
quote for the trailer, which wassometimes good people do bad things,
but that doesn't make 'em bad people.
(02:47):
Wow.
I was like, oh man, that was agood impression as he said it.
I was like, oh, here it, this is it.
So anyway, it was reallyfun and yeah, here we are.
And you're here with a new movie, correct?
I I, I am a supported filmmakerthis year, which is really exciting.
Yeah.
And
you said you're a supportedfilmmaker with Austin Film Society.
What does that mean?
So we got a developmentgrant for feature film.
So that means, which is just amazingthat it just allows us the opportunity
(03:12):
to really explore your story, buildit out, try to make into feature,
get it to our, our reps, try toput some, get some juice behind it.
So yeah, they've beenreally wonderful and.
Talk about how to solve problems, andI just can't believe that it's another
wonderful thing that AFS provides.
So.
All
right.
Well thank you for doing this.
(03:33):
Yeah.
Go enjoy the party and we'llsee you around South by.
So
nice to talk to y'all.
Yeah.
Okay, thanks.
Bye.
Here's my,
uh, this is my good friend Tracy Frazier.
Ben, do you know Tracy?
Yes,
I know Tracy.
Hello.
Great to see you.
How are you doing?
How's south by treating
you?
I'm doing great.
I'm.
I'm actually been slammed, soI don't know how much I'm gonna
(03:53):
be doing during South by, but,
and what are you slammed with?
What are you doing?
I did a little bit of a pivot fromdocumentary to the world of games.
Well, but that's interesting though,because Austin is a hotbed of the gaming
industry in this, in a pretty unique waythat is building momentum more and more.
(04:13):
So tell us about that.
Well, the thing, what are you doing?
The thing is, and I'm in this finance.
Accounting, running a studiofrom here that's based in LA.
Uh, was it a hard decision on makingthis pivot from documentary filmmaking
to the world of video game Mogul?
No, not, no, because of the team.
So I'm more of a, like, ifthey're kind, I will go there.
(04:37):
And I got that from Kat Candler.
Oh.
So that was 20 years ago workingon jumping off bridges and doing
that with her and the team there.
But yeah.
You gotta be kind
nice.
You gotta be kind.
You gotta be kind.
Totally agree.
In
fact, they interviewed me onthe treadmill 20 years ago and
they were like, are you nice?
(04:57):
And I was like, I think so
they ask you that on this?
Yes.
In an interview.
Absolutely.
I'm gonna steal that.
We should start asking peopleif they're, are you nice?
Are
you nice?
And can you get shit done?
Shit done.
That's right.
Mm-hmm.
So
well
one out of two ain't bad.
Yeah.
God.
Tracy, you've been a longtime South by Southwest.
Attendee.
(05:18):
Yeah.
She's been rocking and rolling OliverAustin since at least the mid nineties.
Mm-hmm.
Um, what advice do you have for,for people we might run into, not
us, we're old time South, south bySouthwest folks as well, but what
advice do you have for newcomers?
Hydrate.
Take it slow, maybe, uh, giveyourself a little bit of a pep
talk of what your purpose is.
(05:41):
Wow.
Yeah.
Wow.
And, uh, and then.
Oh my God.
This is the
second time that Rolls Royce has been hit.
When that one's a lot worseand that one's way worse.
I, I think this guy just,just bought a 77 Rolls Royce.
I think he's connected toit, like he can't get loose.
Oh no.
Or was it a 76?
(06:02):
It is a 75 or 70.
Fuck geez.
He's turn loose like a fine wine.
Oh boy.
A fine brown wine that isparked in a really unfortunate
place, really bad place.
Oh
wow.
Oh, this poor guy.
Oh no, don't worry.
It's just a Rolls Royce.
God, he actually liked that joke.
I would've hated you in that moment.
(06:22):
But he smiled.
But you gotta laugh 'causeyou know why I'm nice.
You're gonna get shit nice.
So you get shit done.
Shit.
That's
right.
That's right.
Oh my God.
I think that's where we ended.
That was a great, thankyou so much for doing this.
Of
course, yeah.
This is, uh.
Bart Weiss approaching and you can alwaysrecognize Bart because he is got his
(06:43):
signature red frame glasses, his shockof white hair, and uh, a big smile.
A hardy laugh when I sawyou across the street there.
When I saw you across the streetthere, I said there's a living
legend walking towards us.
It is Bart Weiss.
You can't talk about filmmaking inTexas, at least since 1980 something
without talking about Bart and his roleup in Dallas running multiple festivals.
(07:08):
But primarily Video fest.
Video fest, yeah.
Is the festival that, thatyou've really championed?
Yes.
For how many years?
What is that fest like and whatdo you have to say about it?
So I ran it for 34.
I ran it for 34 years.
And then there were some years whenI splintered off an experimental
festival and then I splintered off adocumentary festival called Docu Vests.
(07:28):
But yeah, it was, it was alot of fun because I could
show things I wanted to show.
I didn't have anybody who could say no.
I didn't have anybody on my boardwho would say, no, you can't
show that for whatever reason.
And I was able to champion a lotof works that I really loved.
And because of doing that festival, Igot to meet so many wonderful people.
(07:51):
Yeah.
Keith and
well, and I think you showedsome of my early short films.
I'm sure you don't remember,but I moved here in 2002 and.
Played quite a few films at your festival.
Oh my God.
And I remember that was always like sortof the destination and you'd meet all
kinds of very interesting other filmmakersand see lots of mind blowing work.
And so I love that you started, I don'tknow if putting Dallas on the map is
(08:15):
the right way to say it, but like youstarted something that's very unique,
that feels very like of a place.
And Dallas has now become with guys likeDavid Lowry and Sailor Bear being there,
Dallas has become something of a film.
city,
we showed David's firstshort film called Lullaby.
And I think we may have the only copy.
(08:38):
Wow.
On a three quarter inch tape.
Oh boy.
You hear that David Lowry.
That's right.
I
hope he has one, but I know thatwe do and maybe he doesn't want it.
It's a great film.
It's wonderful.
Awesome.
That's so cool.
So, you know, one of the thingswe talk about is the state of
the, of documentary film, and youhave an interesting angle on that.
As somebody who has runa festival for 34 years.
(09:00):
What are you currently seeingas being the state of Doc film?
Well, like most things in life, it'sthe best of time and the worst of time.
It's the worst of time.
It's really hard to get on astreaming service or distribution.
Right.
So the feature documentary, the onebest documentary, has no distribution,
(09:22):
which is no Other Land, correct?
Yes.
Yeah, no other land.
Really wonderful film.
It's playing in theaters, butthey're booking it themselves.
What kind of world are we in?
Where the documentary feature winner ofthe Academy Awards has no distribution,
and you're in this place where if yourfilm does not have a celebrity or about
(09:43):
true crime, you're probably not gonnaget on a streaming service and you're
probably not gonna get distribution.
But yet there's a gazillion documentariesbeing made and everything else.
Like a lot of them are not good and,but some of them are incredibly awesome.
But the other thing I think isreally important, and this is
something I've a vested interest in.
(10:05):
I just wrote this book abouthow to make films with mobile
phones and mobile filmmaking.
I've been doing these workshopsall over the country and to me what
this a is able to do is to make surethat anybody can make a documentary.
If you use a black magic camera appand you learn how to get good sound.
And you do a bunch of otherthings that you can easily learn.
(10:27):
But more importantly, and I think thisis what the real great thing about
mobile filmmaking is, you need lesscrew, which means you can have much
more intensity in what you're doing.
So if I don't have a sound personand a gaffer and a dp, and it's just
me and you having a conversation.
I can get something completely different.
(10:48):
Absolutely.
It's more intimate for
sure.
I, I love hearing you say that, Bart.
That is my personalapproach to filmmaking.
We don't use phones, although I haven'tbeen known to sneak a few iPhone shots
in, but I totally agree that the morelayers of institutional, the quote
unquote help you add, the further youget from an intimate personal connection.
And also in narrative film, there'sthis shot, it's still image of Soderberg
(11:10):
directing high-flying bird, and it's just.
Him and his actor in a gymwith a phone on a tripod.
And if you're an actor and there'snobody else in the room, but you
and the director like you canget to different emotional space.
Yes.
Right now, I'm not saying it's rightfor every project, but Soderberg and,
well, there are other people they'vedone pretty well, including somebody
(11:32):
who just wanted Academy of Work.
It it's, this is not likea fringe thing anymore.
Right.
Well as somebody who, like I said,has sort of created something that
had a huge impact on our community,thank you very much and thank you
for taking the time to do this.
Well, thank you.
I really appreciate it.
Yeah.
And now I gotta run.
Do a q and a.
Go.
Do a q and a. Go do it.
Enjoy
the fest.
Hey, I will.
(11:52):
Thank you.
See you soon to see you Bart.
So Andrew, you and I arejust meeting each other.
Tell me who you are and what you do.
Yeah, thanks.
Nice to meet you.
My name's Andrew Sanderson andI'm the editor of Creed USA, which
is here at South by Southwest,and I'm a nonfiction film editor.
Awesome.
We've heard multiple peopletalk about Creed and how they're
very excited to see it, so
(12:13):
that's amazing.
I'm gonna see the film tomorrow night,and I'm very excited because I've been
hearing these great things about it, andI've been hearing about it a couple years
ago from Kahani Cooperman, the director.
Mm-hmm.
Shortly after she got started,we had a conversation around
what her goals were for it.
And then I've heard a little bit from yourcomposer, our mutual friend Osay Esid who,
who I know always makes beautiful music.
Yeah.
And always makes the films he's on better.
(12:35):
Certainly he's done that on myfilms and so I'm excited to be his
guest at the screening tour night.
Amazing.
Yeah.
Excited that you guys are gonna
be there.
Where are you in town from?
Uh, from Brooklyn, New York.
I'm originally from Seattle, Washington.
Okay.
Oh yeah, I've been inBrooklyn for 10 years now.
Excellent.
And as somebody not fromAustin, what's your, how do
you see the Austin film scene?
The Austin film scene.
Yeah.
I feel connected to it through beinginspired by independent cinema and
(12:59):
particularly Slacker and El Mariachiand like growing up more in that vein of
things and then seeing the arts festival,support of the arts throughout the years.
That, particularly the festivalhas, I think, inspired a lot of,
which just has been so exciting.
And so I always feel like if,when I'm down here, it just
(13:19):
feels like a great community.
It feels like.
Creative people who want to be inspired,who want to inspire each other and
get things going, make things happen.
Yeah.
It's always warm and lovely down here.
That's awesome.
That's great.
Yeah.
Yeah.
And so this is the world premiere at
Southlake.
This is the world premiere, yeah.
On Sunday, March 9th.
Is that right?
Yeah, that's sounds right.
(13:40):
Is that sound right?
Excellent.
And how long have youbeen working on the film?
So I started in February of 2024.
And so we cut.
Yeah, pretty much in up to December.
So we were going for a while.
We had a couple down times there.
But yeah, it was, it's a complex film.
There's a lot of characters,a lot of different storylines.
(14:01):
We're all really happy with how it cametogether in the time that it took to come
together.
As an editor who works with differentdirectors, I'm always so curious
about the relationship between aneditor and a director and kind of.
Where one begins and one ends.
And when you're watching a finishedproduct and you see a great sequence where
you see an overarching kind of structurethat really speaks to you, it's impossible
(14:23):
to know as an audience member, whetherthat's the director's vision being an
actor, if that's an editor coming inand reshaping a big gelatinous mess.
What is your role, uh, when you'reworking with a new partner, a
new collaborator, a new director?
How do you establish thatrelationship and that rapport?
I, I try to get to know themand try to get a sense of what
they're trying to achieve.
Artistically creatively and the typeof story that they're trying to tell.
(14:47):
I ultimately am trying to servicethat and bring as much creativity and
help as I can In nonfiction editing.
I usually think that there's a lotof writing involved, and so trying to
bring that aspect of where I can comein and say where we're trying to get
to, like how we achieve that goal.
And so it's just working handin hand with the director to
(15:07):
figure some of that stuff out.
Sometimes it is just going in andbeing like, I'm gonna try something.
Like with what you have presented and,but this might be outta left field,
but maybe this might not work at all.
It might be completely outside of it,but it might inspire something new for
us to go off of, which it usually doeseven if it doesn't make it into the film.
But with Kahani and Creed, USA,and this is our sixth project
(15:31):
together, we know each other so well.
At this point.
I know I have a strong sense of whatshe has and in mind and how she wants
to tell a story, and so I'm ultimately.
Trying to achieve that.
Yeah.
In, in the That's
great.
In the approach.
Awesome.
Amen.
Well that's great.
Well, thank you so muchfor giving us some time.
Yeah, thanks guys.
Appreciate it.
Yeah, thanks for having me.
Really good meet.
Yeah.
(15:51):
Awesome.
Who are we standing here with?
Keith, to me,
it's not a festive festival.
If I don't
get a chance, see what he did there.
That's, yes.
That's the kind of verbal trickery thatyou can look forward to in this interview.
He's flexible that way.
James Faust is thefestival at the festival.
(16:12):
Whoa,
whoa.
That
is, he gave me just enough time.
Seriously there.
We're here at South by Southwest and I'vehad wonderful experiences at South by
Southwest, but there is one programmer inthe entire nation and the entire world.
Who somehow has said yes to every filmI've ever submitted to in film festival,
and that is because the very first shortfilm I ever made was programmed by James
(16:36):
at the Santa Monica Film Festival in 2001.
Yeah, I've looked, oh yeah.
Oh one or oh two.
Oh yeah, maybe 2002.
And then I've made four featuressince then, all of which have
played here at South By, but allof which have also played at James
Premier Festival up in Dallas.
The Dallas International Film Festival.
This is James Faust.
Film festival programmerextraordinaire, and good friend.
(16:57):
Hi.
Hi.
Thanks.
I am shocked and happy andI'm feeling a little humble.
I could turn purple right now.
That was a, that's a good intro.
Thanks.
Purple with humility.
That's right.
I
think in spite of having poor taste, wewant your opinion here about, I don't
know how much Keith's told you about.
We're doing a podcast about thestate of documentary Oh wow.
Business, about what it's liketo be a working filmmaker.
(17:18):
Okay.
In your case, what it's liketo have a festival right
now in this environment, so.
Give us an overview.
What do you, what are you, whatare you thinking about the state
of documentary film right now?
I can actually say that in the 20years I've been doing programming
from the Deep El Santa Monica Asianfilm festivals, Austin Film Festival,
(17:38):
Dallas, a FI, Dallas, A-F-I-A-F-I, docs.
At this point in time, I'venever seen more documentary
films being made, created.
Than ever.
It has been.
The, the amount of content has beenshocking to me, and I, I won't say
that the artistic merit of all thedocumentaries, because there's so
(18:00):
many outlets for where to go, so.
The diversity of the contentis something that slows down.
What we're looking for at ourfestival is different than what
other people are looking for.
And so the things that I've beenseeing, there's a lot of things
that are in the television world.
Like this is not, I don'tthink this is a feature.
I think this is something that you'relooking to make a TV show out of,
and it just happened to submit it.
'cause the way the lower thirds are setup or whatever, it's just seeing that.
(18:21):
So what I've seen a lot more is peoplemaking more content and submitting it
to festivals as if it's a festival film.
And I think some of the thingsthat are more television.
End up playing more wherethey're locally centric.
For instance, oh, there's agreat story about a homeless
shelter in in San Antonio.
Yeah, it's a pretty cool movie, butit seems very San Antonio centric.
(18:42):
Right.
And if it, so the content isthere, but the filmmaking seems
a little bit, oh, so product.
Seems to be not a problem.
That's really interesting.
I wonder how much of that isas social media's influence.
'cause it's almost like you're expectedto be documenting and posting and telling
stories about your life, and as youngerpeople are coming up, maybe it's a lot of
that that's rubbing off and like that'sleading to more documentary content,
(19:05):
I think.
Yeah, but everything from True Crime tojust actually just reality television.
I don't want somebody to do a study onthis and go back to when the first big
strike happened, and then we have this.
Rage of, of reality television thatcame out beyond the survivor and all
these house shows and everything.
I just think that, and peoplegrowing up on that as well.
(19:26):
'cause that's what we were watching.
It wasn't a lot of scripted TV for a yearor two years and just this barrage of
these product and Oh, I'm watching tv.
What?
Yeah, I'm watching RealHousewives of Guatemala.
Okay.
Like that's, but they'rewatching that thing.
And so I think that translatesinto I can do that, right?
I can make a show about this.
I'm gonna make a show aboutpeople going on blind dates and
it's just blah and all that.
And then they turn that intosubmitted films for film festivals,
(19:48):
which is just mind blowing.
Well, what you're thinking,you should go talk to Netflix
or put that on Prime yourself,
which is, that's so interesting becausea lot of you, as you might guess, a lot
of people's answer to that question is.
Can be doom and gloom sometimes.
Yeah.
About like funding being hard toget, and eyeballs being hard to
reach and people being distracted bytheir phones and that sort of thing.
But in a way, you could look at youranswer as being like, this is a sort
(20:11):
of golden age in a way of documentary.
Yeah.
I know you're saying it's more maybequantity than quality, but Yes.
But it's interesting thatthere's that level of quantity.
Yeah,
it is.
And I just think that there'salmost too much, and I don't think.
It's, it's hard to find a placeto find what you wanna find.
I don't think eyes are a problem.
I, I think in the business side of it,I think it's the who's ever investing
(20:33):
or wherever you're streaming from,like the monetization of those eyes.
And I think that seemsto be the difference.
I think people are watching things.
I just don't think people aresadly making money, making the
things that people are watching.
Yeah.
Because the back backendis not very great.
Oh yeah.
We'll take your thing andyou're just happy to get it
sold and happy to get it seen.
Yeah, but that's not, that maynot put bread on the table.
You're basically de describingevery experience I've ever
(20:54):
had with a distributor.
And I, when I talk to filmmakersnowadays, one of the things that I,
the way that I can make sense of itis it feels like the film business is
where the music business was about 10years ago when Spotify came around.
Oh wow.
And all of a sudden, everythingis expected to be free, so
why should we pay for it?
Why do we buy a record when I can justsubscribe to Spotify and it's free, or
Apple Music, or pull it up on YouTube?
(21:17):
And I think, you know, if youlook at the analytics, people go
home now and they watch YouTube.
Mm-hmm.
Which is hard for me to understandas somebody who doesn't do that.
I'm always amazed by those peopleor the how tos, like the guy who
will teach you like some veryspecific niche thing like Oh yeah.
The fact that they tookthe time to do that.
Yeah.
And post it is Mind
bog I, I prepared my washer anddryer going to YouTube and said,
(21:38):
all right, this is the model number.
This is it.
And somebody has gone out there and foundthat specific random model and built it.
And so
I
don't think those things are competingwith what we do for a living.
They may be competing for thetime that people are allotting
in their day to take in media.
And so in that way it is a, is itis in competition, but they're not
trying to scratch the same itch.
(21:58):
They're not doing long form storytelling.
They're not saying, let's have anemotive, empathetic human exchange.
Yeah.
They're saying we're, they're, in my mind,they're competing with the newspaper.
It used to be you wake up in the morningand your dad before he went off to
work, might read most of the newspaper.
It might take an hour and a half,and that was like an hour and
a half of his day, and it was.
(22:20):
Consumed and discarded.
The next day, there's anothernewspaper consumed and discarded.
That to me is what thosetype of things on YouTube.
Are in competition with.
So I don't personallytake it as an affront.
And I hear that except for thefact that they made, let's say
they made 600 TV shows last year.
Yeah.
They're making 300 this year, right?
(22:40):
Because people are going home andsitting on their couch and they're
watching TikTok and they're watchingInstagram and they're watching sports
highlights on YouTube, and they'renot flipping on a and e networks and
watching whatever the latest TV show is.
And so that is having a very real effect.
On, uh, not exactly what we do,but it's certainly impacting it.
(23:02):
And, uh, things like, like I showran a, the Hulu original show and
all signs pointed to season two, allour analytics were above expectation
and they basically didn't renewit because they decided to kind of
billion dollars from their budgets.
And they're not the only ones doing that.
So.
All of LA and the people I know therewho work in TV and nonfiction are in free
(23:25):
fall because of this new societal shift.
So I hear you, but INo, I, that's very real.
Respectfully disagree with that.
No, that's very real.
You have a much more, and I'm justtalking outta my ass here, so that's,
I'm happy to probably edit this out,
but I'm curious for, as a somebodywho programs film festivals, runs
film festivals, like how is that.
How do we bridge those gaps?
(23:46):
Because in a way, they'rethe same thing, right?
Like it's storytelling, it's documenting,it's like they're, I'm waiting for
the synthesis and I'm excited forwhat that, what the new version of the
morphing version of documentary is going
to.
I don't think there needs to be adifferent model and expectations.
So like, why are you making this film?
Why are you doing this,and what is your end game?
(24:07):
That's great.
Oh, what a great answer.
Yeah.
Well, let's get back tosome of those filmmakers.
Alright.
Yeah.
Go party with us.
Thanks James.
Yeah, thanks for doing that.
I want you to introduce yourselfand tell us what you do and
what the Film Society does.
Like you would be talking to a classfull of students because I think a lot
of people who hopefully will listento our podcast may not be familiar.
(24:29):
Not at all with how.
Yeah, important and pivotal.
The Austin Film Society is, yeah.
My name's Rebecca Campbell and I'm theCEO of the Austin Film Society, and
I've been in this role for 27 years,and at the moment we're celebrating our
40th anniversary, believe it or not.
So the Austin Film Society.
All week long as we've gotten readyfor South by Southwest and we've done
(24:51):
our big annual gala, the Texas FilmAwards, all kinds of people have been
just like testifying and talking abouthow a FS has changed their lives.
And I've gotten people to, I've heardpeople say, if you could just use one word
to describe a FS, and one of them said,community, and they said that was the way
they were able to find their people wasthrough a FS when they moved to Austin.
(25:14):
Rebecca, what makes AustinFilm Society what it is?
For starters, just hanging in therebecause you know how it is, you could
see all the things that you, thatcould happen and that you wanna do and
that you could do, but you have to.
Hang in there for the iterationsof it because you don't just buy
something like this, you build it.
(25:36):
And so really what makes a FSwhat it is, it's still true.
Our founder, Richard Linklater, who justwanted to show films and help filmmakers,
and it just built from there, but it's,that's always been the North Star.
It's, it comes across, and asBen said, he's one of those
people, I'm one of those people.
Austin Film Society started givingproduction grants right around
(25:57):
the time I was in college, inundergrad, and it was the first.
It's actually the first grant I'dever heard about for filmmaking.
And the fact that it came from thework of a filmmaker like Linklater just
was just another of the many steps ofinspiration that that his career and what
the Austin film scene in the ninetiespresented to me as an emerging filmmaker.
(26:17):
And then over the last 20 years receivingsome of those grants, being a part of
the committee that chooses grants workingin and around the world of the society.
It's offered what youjust said, community.
And you know, when you come tothis party, you're gonna recognize
20 or 30 faces and it's peoplefrom all levels in our industry.
(26:38):
People who are gonna be on the marquee atthe Paramount this week, and people that
are struggling to get their first filmout of the computer and onto any screen.
You juggle all that as a CEO.
Wait, I wanna tell yousomething that reminded me of
something, what you just said.
Okay.
That reminded me.
So I went to the University ofTexas at Austin to learn documentary
(26:59):
filmmaking, and it was brutal.
It took me five years to get my MFA.
I went through two learning curvesbecause first it was linear,
then it was non-linear, andit was somewhat humbling, but.
I got my documentary made.
It was a really cool story abouta dying mining town in Oklahoma.
(27:21):
And so then I did not know what I wasgonna do, and then the Austin film
study needed somebody and I alreadyhad a nonprofit management background.
So I reluctantly went to the interviewjust thinking, I'll see what this is,
and I immediately just fell in love andI knew I'd found my people and before I
(27:41):
started the job, I don't know why, butI handed Richard Linklater my film, my
30 minute film, and he responded to meand said, I watched your film and he
told me the things that he liked aboutmy film, and I, I just realized what
you said about people at all levels.
That is a real thing in the documentaryfilm community and in the a FS
(28:03):
community, and not all of us are likedestined to become marquee names.
Eventually I found my passion in beingbehind the scenes and helping really
talented, funny, cool people likeyourselves, get their stories out there.
But yeah, we don't know where we'regonna end up, but just taking that
step and, and jumping in and doing it.
(28:26):
And is the thing, and I like tothink that a FS encourages that.
Rebecca, thanks for this party.
Every year we were talking about it.
It is the kickoff to South by Southwest.
It's a way for people who don't havea film in the festival or who can't
afford a badge to get what makes so byso exciting, which is a celebration of
film, a celebration of community as areminder of what we love about a FS.
(28:49):
And it's always a beautiful day.
Here in the parking lot at Austin Public.
So thanks for a great party.
Here's,
do you wanna talk to us or
Yes.
Come on,
Mike.
We have to do this.
We talking
about, what the fuck.
So we're here, uh, we're talking topeople about, uh, the, basically the
state of the Austin film community,Uhhuh, uh, what the a FS Party means to
you each year.
(29:09):
I think that.
This event in particular, I tellpeople who are visiting filmmakers
like part of the indie or doccrowd, they've gotta come here.
I think it's a great place where allthe people can gather and it's really,
it's got that Austin vibe to it.
This is like sort of a streetparty, and so people are comfortable
with that with each other.
So the people from out of townbecome comfortable as well.
(29:32):
You know, if you're from LA or something,you're just not used to events like
this, you know, it's more competitive.
People are in their ownniches and whatever.
Now here, all differentkinds of filmmakers know
each other like each other.
Work on each other's shit.
And so, uh, for those of, uh,people who don't know who we're
talking to, Mike Blizzard.
Mike Blizzard, Austin based producer,
let me, let me help you out.
(29:53):
Mike Blizzard started as a, as apolitical operative, uh, man about town.
He has produced documentaries.
He's directed his own documentary.
He produces frequentlywith Richard Linklater.
Mike, we're gonna letyou go in just a second.
This party is always such a big deal.
You mentioned it yourself.
You bring people from outof town when they come here.
Yeah.
I mean, so by Southwest brings in hundredsof thousand of people from all around the
(30:15):
world, but this is the Austin Film Party.
Yeah.
What, what does the world not knowabout the Austin Film community?
I think.
I mean, the biggest thing I kindof alluded to earlier is just
there's not really competition.
It's all collaboration.
And I If an Austin filmmakeris doing well, that's good for
every other Austin filmmaker.
(30:37):
You know, a rising tide lifts all boats inother places in New York and Los Angeles.
People of course, don't see it that way.
It's a more cutthroatindustry and business.
And so I think that that.
That comes from the top a little bit.
I think Linklater and Rodriguez andstuff, they've always been these
creative, wanna do it their own way,uh, by their own rules type of people.
(30:59):
And of course there's the sort oftwin titans of the, of the modern
era of film in Austin, I guess.
And um, I think that trickles down thateveryone, like that's our ethic here.
Yeah.
You know, that's how we do itand people are just like, oh
my God, everyone's so friendly.
Everyone.
You know, and it you, youknow, you give everyone advice.
You guys know, we allshow each other our films.
(31:21):
Yeah.
So that you can critique it and tell uswhat we've missed and how we're too close
to it and we're not seeing the problems.
And that's like, I don't thinkthat happens in other places.
You have to go pay test audiences.
Or whatever to do that.
We could have been gettingpaid this whole time.
So we're here with Karen Sloss,who's filmmaker extraordinaire.
(31:41):
Band leader.
Drummer.
It's an editor.
It's an egalitarian band artist
and Oh, no leader.
It's Marriage Corps.
It's,
you guys know how
it's, yes.
You and your husband, Sandy, are bothin the band Skloss who, and you just
had a record release party, right?
Yes.
Yesterday record came outyesterday, our debut album.
Congratulations on Fuzz Club.
(32:03):
Fuzz Club.
Okay.
Yeah.
And how'd it go?
How was the, it was
great.
Yeah?
Yeah.
And now we're just gonnaplay five more shows.
Woohoo.
And a showcase on Friday.
Amazing.
It's
old school south by Southwest.
Yeah,
it is.
Yeah.
Yeah, it is.
This is my first, so by Southwest,well, no, not first swim, but in a while
as a musician instead of a filmmaker.
(32:24):
It's okay, Karen, we're here atthe Austin Film Society Party.
What does this party meanto you as a local filmmaker?
So that long history of relationshipssouth by what makes it such a fun party.
It's a reunion every year.
It's the best.
And the film Society is one of thosethings that is at the heart of our
(32:45):
success as a community in Austin.
And.
I feel like that, and then also justthat there were the right amount
or the perfect kind of group offilmmakers that decided to nest here.
Everybody knows the the folks, butI'll also add Paul Steckler in the doc
world and attracting all these people.
So we just have had this like amazing.
(33:07):
Community growing up here anda FS is like the watering hole.
It's like, that's a great way to say it.
We can all come and some ofthem are adult beverages, but we
can all hang out and catch up.
And people who are comingthrough town who are part of our
family, we all get to reconnect.
And then there's also so much tremendoustalent coming through all the programs
(33:30):
and the services and then even justthe film festival who are attracted.
So it's become.
Something, it's really snowballed.
Yeah.
To, it was one of the greatest artisticnonprofits in the country, I think now.
Yeah.
So many people envy the Austin FilmSociety when as a filmmaker you
tell somebody you live in Austin.
That's like often whatthey want to talk about.
(33:51):
It's insane.
Yeah.
I, they were so privileged that wewere here when it was first being
put together, or like, we weren'there 40 years ago, but I feel like
we were the first like pip squeaks.
Yeah.
You know?
Yeah.
First class of, yeah.
Yeah.
Muppet babies.
So maybe garbage beil kids inyour, that's probably we're after.
Let's wrap it up.
Let's wrap it.
(34:11):
My voice is going.
You gotta like, are you okay?
Your ride is waiting for you.
The party's over.
Yeah.
Let's, uh, turn off
the lights.
The
party.
Yes.
This has been an awesome day.
We set out to go do kind of man on thestreet interviews at South by Southwest.
And we said we're gonna go to the AFSparty as kind of one part of that.
But this feels like it's a whole episode.
(34:33):
It feels like the AFS Party celebrationof the community here in Austin
is an episode unto itself, and Ithink maybe Karen just named it.
The watering hole.
Hey, I love that.
Well, it's pretty hilariousto drive up and see you guys
doing this, I have to say.
Yeah.
I, it really gave me a chuckle.
Oh, good.
Yeah.
Seeing me look like a huge nerdwith a fanny pack on and headphones.
It's
like we said, we're gonna go to the party.
(34:54):
We don't wanna feel like those dipshits at the party or like working and
trying to make something outta nothing.
We'll grab one or two people off tothe side, no one will even notice.
And here we are.
I was like, that's one wayto get invited to the party
now.
You know our secret.
That's right.
Well, thank you for doing this, KA.
Yeah.
It's great to see you.
Yeah, great to see you too.
All right, so that was like.
(35:14):
Um, basically all of our friends here inAustin that we just talked to at a party,
well, it was all of our friends.
And given a new context via our goodfriend Karen Sloss, uh, when she said,
this place is like the watering hole,which I never thought of it that way,
but I am kind of like an old caribou.
I. Who like sauntersdown to the water's edge.
I've been saying that about you for years.
Keith's just an old caribou.
(35:35):
I I was thinking of it more aslike, uh, sometimes you want to go
where everybody knows your name.
It's something that strikes me wheneverwe do this podcast is like when you
go to that party and you look around.
There's a dozen people at thisparty that should be hosting
their own filmmaking podcast.
Mm-hmm.
These folks had a lot to add.
I'm glad we got a chanceto talk with them.
Um, your voice is sounding a lot better.
(35:56):
Thank you.
I'm feeling much better nowthat South By is behind us.
Um, I love it and everyyear it beats me up.
Um, but I, I hope you guys like it.
Uh, it was a lot of fun to make.
Yeah.
Appreciate you guyschecking out this episode.
Of course.
We also released an episode, uh, withJohn Sloss this week, um, and he's
got insights into the media landscapeand the nineties indie film boom that
(36:19):
inspired both of us so much in the.
Early parts of our career.
And so check that episode out and then,uh, join us next week where, uh, Ben
and I go on a walk, just the two of us.
We're gonna be moseying throughHyde Park here in Austin, and
we have a lot to say about
the modern media landscape,so tune in for that.
We were wandering down back alleysand getting lost in Hyde Park and
(36:43):
getting lost in philosophical thought.
So hope you guys enjoy.
Yeah, that's gonna bea video, episode two.
Which we are, you know,slowly porting over to.
It looks like all these episodes aregonna be kind of up on YouTube for
those who like to watch when they walk.
And uh, for those of you who justprefer to listen, you can find
us at Apple Podcasts, um, andSpotify iHeartRadio apparently.
(37:07):
I mean, who knows?
We could be playing at truckstops right now, Keith.
We're our, our reach is, is long
Dock Walks stock Walks is,uh, produced and edited.
It's created by, it's, it's hostedby, uh, me, Keith Maitland, and
this guy Ben Steinbauer and Keith.
Uh.
Keith's company produces it.
Go Valley.
Uh, my production company, The Bear, alsohelps out and we have a lot of help from
(37:31):
Juliana Rios, who is our new, uh,edit assistant, and she's doing a
great job over there in the edit room.
We've also got original music fromSam Billen and Primary Color Group.
And, uh, if you're watching the show open,uh, thanks to Josh Allen who gave us a
little bit of VFX help on the front side.
Um, anyway, that's us.
(37:51):
Thanks for being you.
We'll catch you next time on.
Doc Walks
follow us at Doc Walks podon Instagram X and YouTube.
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