November 26, 2024 • 34 mins
In this episode of Educating to Be Human, Lisa is joined by Julius Cave, Regional Director of the Leading Men Fellowship, a program of The Literacy Lab. In a field where Black men make up only 1.3% of the teaching workforce, the Leading Men Fellowship is tackling this disparity head-on by recruiting young men of color to serve as pre-K educators. This initiative not only reimagines representation in early education but also transforms the classroom experience for students in historically marginalized communities. Julius and his team have developed a curriculum rooted in evidence-based literacy instruction while emphasizing cultural relevance and community-focused support. By empowering fellows and reshaping learning pathways, the program is diversifying the educator pipeline, fostering resilience, and planting the seeds for change in cities nationwide.
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Julius Cave brings over a decade of experience in education, spanning classroom teaching, administration, and nonprofit leadership. As Regional Director for The Literacy Lab’s Southern region, he oversees the recruitment, training, and placement of young men of color, ages 18–24, to serve in early childhood education classrooms where they provide evidence-based literacy support to children who live in historically marginalized communities while helping to diversify the educator pipeline. He is also tasked with building relationships with key community stakeholders to help support the Leading Men Fellowship locally and nationally.
Prior to joining the Leading Men Fellowship originally as a Program Manager, Julius served as the Program Director at the Jumpstart Program at Georgia State University, where he recruited, onboarded, and developed college students to serve in preschool classrooms. Julius has also served as a lead high school history teacher in Houston, Texas, dean of students at one of Memphis, Tennessee’s highest performing middle schools, and as a 7th grade social studies teacher in Atlanta.
A former Education Pioneers Fellow, Julius holds a Bachelors of Arts degree in political science and a Master of Arts degree in management from Wake Forest University.
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Resources
The Literacy Lab: https://theliteracylab.org/
Leading Men Fellowship: https://theliteracylab.org/leading-men/
Follow them on Instagram at @the_literacy_lab & Twitter: @theliteracylab
Also mentioned in this episode: Profound Gentlemen - https://profoundgentlemen.org/
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Lisa (23:59:59):
Welcome to Educating to be Human, a podcast where we'll explore what it means to be human in today's world at the intersection of education, technology, and culture. I' m your host, Lisa Petrides, founder of the Institute for the Study of Knowledge Management in Education. Each week, I'll speak with people who are supporting transformative change in education today. That is, ordinary people creating extraordinary impact. Thank you very much for listening.
Thank you for joining us on Educating to be
Human.
Today,
I have the great pleasure of speaking with Julius
Cave,
the Regional Director of the Leading Men Fellowship,
a program of the Literacy Lab.
The Leading Men Fellowship is dedicated to bringing
young men of color into the classroom as pre-K
educators,
which profoundly reimagines representation in early
education and transforms students' experiences in the
classroom.
Leading Men Fellows are young men of color; they're
18 to 24,
with a high school degree or a GED equivalent,
who participate in a year-long residency-style
experience in which they are trained to provide
literacy support to pre-K students while they
receive coaching and professional development.
Now,
Julius and his team have created a curriculum that
addresses literacy needs through evidence-based
instruction,
and at the same time,
they're reshaping learning pathways that emphasize
cultural relevance and community-rooted support for
these pre-K students and for the fellows themselves.
When I was in Atlanta earlier this year,
I had the good fortune to see this work in action.
I witnessed firsthand the profound impact these
young men are having on pre-K learners.
And as you'll hear from Julius,
this program not only supports literacy,
but gives these young men an opportunity to further
their own education.
Many of them continue on to college,
some as educators,
and almost all continue serving their communities in
some way.
This program is truly diversifying the teaching
pipeline.
It's building community resilience.
And it's sowing the seeds for change in cities
across the country.
Welcome,
Julius,
and thank you for joining us.
Julius (02:39):
Thank you.
Glad to be here.
Lisa (02:40):
So I would love to hear a bit more about
the Literacy Lab and the Leading Men Fellowship and
what you do in that program.
Julius (02:49):
Yeah,
yeah.
First,
Lisa,
let me say thank you to you for having me on and
getting a chance to speak about our work.
Also,
congratulations to you on this podcast.
You know,
when we met in person,
we were talking about it as an idea,
and here it is now.
Lisa (03:04):
That's right.
Julius (03:05):
Part of life.
So,
yeah,
the Leading Men Fellowship is a program of the
Literacy Lab.
Now,
as an organization,
the Literacy Lab was started in 2009.
The Leading Men Fellowship came about in 2016 in
Washington,
D.
C.,
where we're headquartered.
Now we're currently in five cities (03:21):
Atlanta,
Milwaukee,
Washington,
D.
C.,
Baltimore,
and Cincinnati.
The work of the Literacy Lab has been focused
since our inception around literacy for young
students,
how we support that in neighborhoods who have
experienced economic and racial inequities.
And then the Leading Men Fellowship,
(03:42):
we came along to say,
how else do we think about who's in front of
children and how do we increase and diversify the
educator pipeline?
And so our focus with the Leading Men Fellowship
is a couple of main things.
One is early intervention around literacy and
support for the development of literacy skills for
students in pre-K classrooms.
(04:02):
The other piece is leveraging the opportunity to
diversify the educator pipeline with specifically
young men of color,
ages 18 to 24,
who work as literacy tutors in those pre-K classes
for a full school year.
And it's also an opportunity to provide a
professional working opportunity for these young men
who don't have a bachelor's degree right now.
(04:24):
So fellows commit to working for a full school
year in one classroom at one school with the focus
on leveraging the training that our coaches and
other folks provide to deliver a curriculum that's
aligned to the science of reading.
We use this called the SEEDS curriculum that's
really designed to see where students are and
(04:47):
support them on that literacy journey for that full
school year.
Lisa (04:51):
How do these prospective fellows find you?
So where do you recruit these young men from?
And tell me a little bit more.
It's interesting.
You said they come to you and they don't have a
college degree at this point.
Julius (05:04):
So I think we take a step back.
One,
young men are not encouraged,
typically encouraged to go into the education field.
So our work in recruiting is really trying to go
far and wide to find young men that are looking
for an opportunity like this to maybe have an
interest in working with students.
But maybe it hasn't been encouraged or they didn't
know how to get into the education field.
(05:26):
So we do recruit at high schools for young men
that will be graduating.
We do recruit at colleges.
So some of our fellows are college students,
like I said,
they just don't have a bachelor's degree already.
We go to community colleges.
We connect with other community organizations.
We're at events.
A number of places,
wherever we can go to share about the opportunity.
And talk about it not only from the lens of being
(05:49):
an educator,
but also the opportunity for them to grow in their
professional and personal development as well.
Lisa (23:59:59):
And you talk about diversifying the pipeline
or diversifying the workforce.
I don't know the exact numbers,
but I think that men of color,
Black men in particular,
make up what?
Less than 2% of the country's teaching force?
Is that about right?
That's it.
That's it.
Last statistic I saw was 1.
3%.
1.
3.
And now let's talk about pre-K.
I'm imagining that number's got to be substantially
less.
Julius (06:21):
Right.
Right.
Correct.
Lisa (06:23):
Great.
So you're really recruiting for a program that is
so needed and certainly is,
I would say,
in uncharted waters,
right?
I don't know of another program like this that is
reaching out to young men of color to see about
interesting them and helping to train and mentor
(06:46):
them into the education sector.
Julius (06:49):
I think what we found is that there are
programs that are focusing either more on the
literacy aspect or more focused on supporting male
educators of color.
I think for us combining that and again with early
education is pretty unique.
Lisa (07:04):
Yeah.
I want to talk a little bit about why literacy
and the impact of literacy,
but I'd love to hear a little bit about your
story and how does your origin story impact the
work that you do now?
Julius (07:15):
Yeah.
So a couple of things for me.
So I grew up in Allendale,
South Carolina.
Actually the smallest county in South Carolina.
And a couple of pieces that have stuck with me in
terms of my journey is that one,
surrounded by a family of educators,
surrounded by folks who said that education was
important.
There was always a push in my family.
(07:36):
And for me,
feeling called to the education field and that's
something that I was supposed to do.
And so with that encouragement from family and
saying,
you know,
pursue that calling.
And here we are.
I've been an educator for a number of years now
in a number of different capacities.
But for me,
supporting young students in this field is always
critical and important for me.
(07:58):
Also growing up in Allendale,
I think,
you know,
what I witnessed is,
you know,
perception of a community.
You know,
if we were just to look at some of the data and
statistics about the community,
a lot of folks would see those as negative and
completely miss the amazing and incredible people
that make up the community.
The genius and the amazing young students that are
(08:20):
part of the community.
And so for me,
this work is about that calling.
But it's also how do we work in specific
communities and areas and support and help the
incredible people and incredible students and folks
that make up these communities.
And so that's,
for me,
the through line in my career.
So working in Houston,
Texas,
(08:41):
Memphis,
Tennessee,
and now Atlanta,
Georgia,
it's always about how do we put more of a
positive light and see the opportunity that we have
versus some of the negative information that is
promoted a lot of times.
Lisa (08:55):
So we get to literacy,
right?
And literacy is the core.
It's the first piece.
And so you are impacting,
when we're talking about the pre-K level,
this is the beginning.
This is the beginning of learning.
This is the beginning of critical thinking,
right?
What is it that you're doing at that level?
And what is it about your program that is really
(09:18):
impacting these young people in this way?
Julius (09:20):
So,
one,
it's thinking about the literacy piece and the,
you know,
some aspects of everything we do is one,
infusing joy and making it fun,
right?
It's learning,
but,
you know,
how do we do this in a fun way?
Thinking about part of the curriculum we use to
focus is on development by doing.
So,
you know,
encouraging students to practice and actually
(09:41):
leverage and use the skills that our fellows are
going over.
It's encouragement.
So continue to encourage them to work towards their
educational goals.
And it's done in a caring and compassionate way.
I think that's important,
you know,
especially we think about human beings.
Sometimes,
we talk about education in terms of data and
outcomes,
right?
But to your question about how do we get there,
(10:03):
it's remembering that we're working with human
beings.
And so care and compassion,
some of our fellows' interventions are done in
small groups and one-on-one.
So it's an opportunity to build relationships.
That's also why fellows are in that one classroom
for a full school year.
So we know it.
Because we know it takes time to build
relationships.
And so when we hear things like,
(10:23):
You know,
students that at the beginning of the year were no
t really speaking at all,
but through their work with their fellow where they
got some more one-on-one time and small group time,
that helped them to,
that student open up and communicate more,
which is a part of literacy,
right?
When we hear about students that the first couple
(10:44):
weeks are crying pretty much every day in their
classroom.
And so when a fellow is able to spend time with
them,
that helps.
That helps in their building relationships.
We hear later on that that student is more active
in class and they're not crying anymore.
And,
teachers and others can attribute that directly to
that fellow's work.
And that's what helps get to that data and that
(11:06):
outcomes.
So those relationships we know are critical in
supporting students.
And also as we're preparing educators to say, 'Hey,
this is about working with people.' And we have
to do it in a caring and compassionate way. Lisa:
Tell me a little bit about how do those students,
the young,
I guess they're four and five year olds,
how do they end up being in this program?
(11:27):
And then we're going to talk about the fellows
themselves.
But tell me a little bit about the students.
Yeah.
So our work is more relationships with,
say,
districts or providers.
And then we work with them to identify classrooms.
And then,
from there,
our fellows will spend a couple weeks building
relationships with students.
(11:48):
And then they'll do an assessment.
And I say assessment.
Again,
it's fine.
It doesn't come like, 'Hey,
we're testing.' The students don't feel like it's
a test.
But it's an assessment.
They'll do some reading together,
look at some letters.
And from there,
they'll determine what students will get more
focused interventions on a daily basis while also
including some others in the class will get some
(12:08):
of the interventions.
But that caseload will get more focused
interventions on a daily basis.
Lisa (12:12):
Got it.
So let's talk more about the fellows.
So you do recruitment.
Some of them,
probably,
do they find you somehow also from outreach that
you've done?
And then tell me a little bit about that process.
What happens?
Julius (12:27):
So,
yeah,
it's a mix.
So some find us whether,
you know,
it's online posting.
Some find us,
you know,
somebody may refer them,
a community organization,
a previous fellow,
a staff member.
It varies.
Or some,
like,
say,
when we're out and do presentations or we're out
in the community or we have something going on.
And that's how fellows get connected as well.
(12:50):
And so it's a process where we do interview the
fellows.
We talk with them more about the logistics and
about that commitment piece,
like having that eight-to-one available Monday
through Friday for that full school year.
And why that's important,
you know,
is understanding more about some of the logistics
on there.
So that's a discussion up front.
We do an interview with fellows more so to get to
(13:13):
know them better.
What we say is you're the expert in yourself.
And so the interview is not a gotcha moment,
right?
It's just a chance for us all to kind of learn
more about each other.
And that's the crux of the process. For us,
it's more about,
you know,
is this for both parties,
is this a good fit for a person at this point in
time?
(13:33):
And sometimes it's not.
And we're okay with that because it's also we've
had fellows come back at a different point in time
because that time was right for them.
And so we're open.
We also communicate.
We say,
hey,
we want to support you.
Even if you're not a fellow,
we're here to,
you know,
people that want to support you.
It's really the approach in saying this is about a
community.
This is about connection.
How do we start that process and showing that from
(13:56):
even the beginning of this process.
Lisa:
I think the first program you had was 2022.
Is that right?
So relatively recently.
Yes,
here in Atlanta.
That was the first.
Lisa (14:06):
In Atlanta,
right.
So the fellows start.
They sign up.
They're committed.
They're going to be there Monday through Friday.
For the school year from 8 a.
m.
to 1 p.
m.
And then what kind of training?
So a lot of these young men have not had training
necessarily in education or teaching.
Right.
So what is it that they get?
And how do they find themselves then,
(14:28):
you know,
in that classroom with that young group of pre-K?
Julius (14:32):
That's actually one of my favorite parts.
The training and the amount of training that they
get.
So before fellows even enter the classroom,
they get at least 40 hours of training.
And so our staff,
we have literacy coaches who come to us with
experience and expertise and working with folks
around literacy.
And they work with those fellows,
training them not only in the curriculum,
(14:54):
but how to do it from the aspect of working with
preschool and pre-K students.
So that happens before they even enter the class.
And then we layer it on throughout the year.
So we know that education,
you know, you can give it all the training you
want up front.
But once you get in there with students,
there's some other things.
There's some other learnings that have to happen.
And so we give them a good base and good
(15:16):
foundation.
They start in the classroom and then we spend time
each month with training specifically around that
curriculum that's delivered by our literacy coaches.
And then,
in addition to that,
some other members of our staff,
our program managers,
our program associates,
they lead trainings more around professional and
personal development.
So thinking about things like college and career
(15:38):
literacy,
financial literacy,
mental health literacy,
civic literacy.
And so really it's we want to say we want to
provide a robust menu of training and development
and support.
And so,
fellows are well-positioned when they step into that
classroom.
I think it's thinking about getting them as human
beings and how do we provide a support for them
(15:59):
as people so that they in turn can provide that
support for those young human beings that they're
going to interact with.
Lisa (16:06):
Right.
And tell me a little bit.
I mean,
we got to meet some of those amazing young men
when we visited the site.
Maybe you could describe some of the experiences
they have throughout the year and how this
fellowship actually changes them.
(23:59:59):
Julius:
I was thinking about this and I think it was
great that you know,
got to see them near the end of that experience.
And we have some fellows right now that are
starting the experience.
Thinking about where they end up is powerful just
to watch.
I'll say because the classroom affords a lot of
learning.
A lot of times we think about the students,
but the classroom affords a lot of learning for
the teachers and educators as well.
What I actually said to somebody just recently,
it has a way of pointing out the things and areas
where we could do a little bit more support and
work.
And it has a way of doing that.
And so for fellows,
that's going to happen.
They're going to be challenged.
They're going to face some situations that are
difficult.
And that's just a part of even that.
You know,
some of those first-year experiences of being in
classrooms.
First one,
we know that and saying that's OK.
And then two,
providing,
you know,
a group of people and some other supports that not
only continue to tell them that it's OK,
but continue to tell them that we believe in them
and that we're there to support them.
So I think what happens by the end of this is
that fellows are able to take a look back and
really see some of their own growth.
They're able to see some of their resilience.
They're able to see where they've been challenged
and able to push forward.
And where they've been pushed.
And so,
you know,
a great example is in that visit that we had that
you got to meet some of our fellows - a couple of
them volunteered and came up and shared about their
experience.
And some of them at the beginning of the year
absolutely would not have done that.
Right.
And so it's an environment where I think whether
explicit or implicitly,
they feel like it's their environment.
They have a say in it.
And that's what we-that's what we push and
encourage and allow that space for growth.
And I just I think that's that's key.
Right.
Not only for young men of color,
but for other folks,
we think about developing professionals as being
environments where,
you know,
challenge is welcome.
You're pushed to grow.
You're encouraged to grow.
And you have people that continue and consistently
say we're here for you.
And I think it just makes a world of difference.
So you've had a couple of graduation years,
right?
You've had a couple of fellowship programs go
through the whole year now.
What are some of those fellows doing now as they
finish?
Are they entering the education field?
Are they finding they education environment to be
something that seems welcoming to them or inclusive
of them?
Julius (18:54):
One I's
say it's interesting to watch during the year,
that's another area of growth.
Some that fellow students start out just like,
you know,
looking for a job and this worked out.
And,
you know,
and that escalates to yeah,
I kind of like this thing,
but I don't know about teaching.
And then by the end of the year,
it's more of them yes,
I'm definitely continuing in the education field.
Lisa (19:14):
Love that.
Julius (19:15):
Yeah,
it's,
you know,
for some,
each year for us here in Atlanta,
over half of the cohort has continued in the
education field.
For some of those that haven't,
there's other opportunities that were a better fit
for them or more aligned with where they wanted to
take their careers.
A few have done some full-time,
become full-time college students looking to study
(19:37):
education as well as some other areas.
We've had a fellow that decided to teach abroad
and has taught in Spain.
Some fellows that are serving and working as
paraprofessionals in schools.
What's striking is how they talk about it now as
well.
So for some,
it's seeing it more as a career.
(19:59):
It's hearing them talk about the things that they
learned and how they implement in the classrooms
that they're working in now.
And then,
you know,
just hearing,
I was somewhere recently,
one of our fellows is working at a school I met.
And someone that works at that school as well.
And they're like,
oh,
yeah,
I was just in his class just the other day.
And was saying nothing but great things about him.
So that's always good to hear as well.
Lisa:
I used to work in a school of education for
(20:21):
several years.
And just being in the field of education,
we hear a lot.
There aren't enough men who are in teaching,
particularly in the primary grades.
And then,
of course,
we hear,
oh,
and there aren't enough young men of color or
young Black men who want to enter teaching.
It's sort of set up by,
in some ways,
(20:41):
it's like,
oh,
we have this problem.
We don't know how to get them into the pipeline.
And it seems that this approach you're taking is
sort of turning that on its head in a fabulous
way.
Because you're growing people.
You're growing the interest and the awareness to
make it be an environment where they want to enter
teaching.
(21:02):
I mean,
is that,
I don't want to put words in your mouth.
But that's kind of what I'm hearing in terms of
the impact that you're having.
(23:59:59):
No,
you're not.
That's accurate.
And I'll add this in saying,
you know,
another component that is huge within this is that
the fact that fellows are going through this with
other young men of color.
And so the relationships that they build,
you know,
mean so much to them.
And that's not me saying it.
That's what they tell us.
I talk about it as a brotherhood,
not because,
not as a marketing term or a term I came up
with,
but because of the term that they've used and how
they talk about it.
And so that's a hugely important piece for them.
Being in conversations that honestly,
quite frankly,
they just haven't really been able to have
consistently.
Even about themselves.
Even about what they want to do.
Their hopes,
their dreams.
You know,
being vulnerable in spaces.
Having some difficult conversations.
And so for them to be in a room regularly with
other young men of color, working positively to
impact lives in their community plays a huge role.
And so we've seen that across not only Atlanta,
but in our other regions as well.
And a part of it is the work we do up front.
We do a week where we're all together and not
only training,
but doing some other events and things together.
So it's all opportunities to help them build that
bond that we know is going to be important for
them throughout this experience.
Lisa (22:31):
It's just an amazing program.
What are your ideas about how we infuse something
like this into our teacher training programs?
And is that even possible?
Given the inherent structure,
you know,
just from the fact that a teacher training
program to get in,
you need to have certain background or certain test
scores or even have the interest or think it's
(22:54):
even something that's possible to do.
Right?
Julius (22:58):
Right.
I think it's something that you said earlier,
right?
Like identifying a problem.
And then the second part I would add is,
you know,
how committed are we to that piece?
And if we are,
then we understand that,
you know,
when there's some things that maybe we wouldn't or
shouldn't or don't want to do,
but there's some things that we may have to do.
Right?
And what I'm getting at is like recruitment.
Yeah.
If we want,
you know,
(23:18):
more men,
we have to go out where these young men are.
And we have to have conversations in a way that
aren't one-sided.
They're listening.
We're listening to help understand what challenges
there may be.
We have to think about barriers.
Right?
For thinking about schools of education.
This is,
I'm just completely making this up.
But,
right,
like is the timeline it takes from when we apply
(23:40):
to when we start,
is that a barrier for someone?
Right?
If there are some other concerns or think about
making money,
what are some other opportunities that we could
think about and further leverage in this?
I think an opportunity is we look at some of the
districts and how they're partnering with some
(24:00):
colleges and universities where work,
you know,
credit for work will count towards that degree.
I think we have to listen more and better
understand what barriers are there,
be willing and committed to removing some of those
barriers.
And then providing the environment that it takes to
support students and folks in getting in and
staying in this field.
(24:21):
Lisa:
Could you talk a little bit more about what some
of those barriers are that you find from your
listening,
your very active listening,
especially in recruitment,
as well as in the actual year that the fellows
spend with you?
What are some of those barriers?
And how are you addressing them?
Or how are you mitigating them?
I think it's best for me.
I mean,
these are some real life examples.
(24:44):
You know,
one thing is that our role is part time.
So,
again,
eight to one,
eight to two.
You know,
fellows are paid $17 an hour.
One of the things we think about on the listening
piece is that we were hearing a couple of years
ago where we started at $15 that it wasn't going
to work.
So we did increase that.
Listening and hearing from fellows that it's part.
(25:05):
But there's more that they need in terms of
income.
And so we've started to build partnerships and
relationships with some other organizations that have
opportunities in the afternoons or evenings.
So that fellows have some some other opportunities
to make some money.
You know,
transportation is a challenge.
Those are just real live examples that we're
(25:26):
working through right now and building relationships
with other community organizations that will support
in addressing those those barriers that fellows have
not only when they come to us,
but even throughout the program that may pop up.
(23:59:59):
Lisa:
You've talked about how literacy and then the
teaching of literacy and how we how you support
the young men in this way that there's a piece
there that's around social justice.
Right.
When we when we put literacy and education together
in this way,
that's something that we know we need to be doing
a lot more of in these communities that aren't
necessarily even believing that education is a way
forward.
I would love to just hear your thoughts about
that.
I think literacy is,
you know,
just to say it's critical and important doesn't do
it in and of itself enough justice.
A colleague I used to work with just,
you know,
somebody wants to be a rocket scientist like they
they still have to know how to read.
And so literacy is embedded in so much of what
we do.
Math,
science,
all all the different fields and areas.
And so for if we're going to encourage students to
go into different fields and we have to be honest
with ourselves and really make sure we're providing
the fundamentals and basics that are going to
support them in those fields.
And then when we think about access to knowledge,
right,
literacy provides so much of an open door to
access to knowledge and information.
So when we think about not only reading,
writing,
communicating,
literacy is something that provides a lot of a lot
of opportunities.
Right.
And so when we think about,
you know,
what are ways that we can support communities,
right,
education and specifically literacy can play a huge
role in how we're setting students up and,
you know,
for their goals and where they want to go.
Lisa:
Do you have some examples of this from the fellows
that you've been working with?
Some of what comes to mind,
I think,
has impressed me.
One is for fellows who have spoken about how
they've increased their own literacy and what
they're reading and the amount that they're reading.
Lisa (27:34):
Oh,
interesting.
Julius (27:36):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And so it's not from us saying you need to read
more,
but it's fellows that have as they kind of analyze
their own goals and growth and where they want to
go.
You know,
they've seen their own literacy and reading and,
you know,
writing.
Some of them talk about journaling more regularly
(27:56):
and just writing things down.
And so,
like I said,
it's not a direct thing.
But you should do this.
It's more of that encouragement to dream,
to follow your dreams,
to follow your goals,
to follow where you want to go.
Right.
But you're going to need a skill set and some
things to help you get there.
And for them to kind of analyze and have said,
yeah,
this is this literacy piece for them that is super
(28:18):
important and critical for them.
So that's that's what comes to mind in thinking
about that.
Lisa:
You've talked a little bit before about the role of
partnerships and community partnerships.
And could you talk a little bit more about how
you have set forth to actually create those deeper
partnerships and community and what that impact has
been?
(23:59:59):
You know,
personal belief in is infusing this work.
I mean,
we we can't do it by ourselves.
And even when we think of it,
if we can focus on our mission and vision,
we can't we can't do it by ourselves.
And so partnership and community is necessary.
And my approach is that one, I think it's easy to
sometimes look at the other groups and how can we
partner with with them?
and saying,
what can we get from them?
But my approach,
I think,
is for us,
we make sure we're being a good partner first.
And that's where it starts,
being a good partner.
And other than thinking about what makes sense in
terms of partnerships,
is there a need that needs to be filled?
More support?
Like we said,
transportation?
Income? Are there when we think about our
personal and professional development what's our
actual capacity?
We talk about financial literacy.
I'm not a financial literacy expert,
but we were able to get connected to some great
folks with Bank of America who said,
absolutely,
we'll come in and do not only some sessions with
fellows about financial literacy,
but we'll also host an event at our offices and
give fellows a chance to hear from professionals in
this field.
And then on the back end,
we've been able to partner with another group who
offers some personal financial coaching.
And fellows said,
after the Bank of America session,
said, 'Hey,
we need some more; we need some more intent and
more support around our individual situations.
" And so we were able to partner with someone that
provides individualized financial coaching.
What's out here is listening,
understanding,
listening to feedback from fellow.
So looking at the community,
seeing where opportunities are.
Some great folks that we partnered with around some
training opportunities for fellows.
Folks like Profound Gentlemen is an organization,
national organization that supports male educators of
color.
And so it only made sense for us to partner.
And now fellows that have come back for a second
year and are alum that are in education,
are part of their organization.
And so now they get continued support after they
leave us.
This work can't be done alone and it can't be
done in isolation.
And so it's going to require us to be open to
it,
creative around it,
dream around it,
make sure we're being good partners in this work.
Lisa (30:46):
Yeah,
that's great.
It really sounds like you're creating sort of,
you're weaving the fabric together.
You're creating a strong web of support for these
young men of color to be successful in what they
do.
And it takes connecting those dots.
It takes those partnerships.
It takes those relationships.
Not to be cliché,
it takes a village.
(31:07):
We know that.
And it seems like you're really putting that into
practice.
How are you thinking about expanding this program?
You have now,
what,
about 20 fellows a year there in the Atlanta
region.
This is a program that I can see in so many
parts of the country,
or even just in the southern region.
I'm imagining there's just a phenomenal opportunity
(31:31):
there in that way.
What are you thinking?
Juilus (31:34):
Yeah,
so in Metro Atlanta this year,
we'll get up to 40 fellows.
So doubling right here in the Atlanta area.
And then as we think about it more broadly,
you're absolutely right.
A lot of opportunity.
Some folks in a number of cities and places that
have said,
hey,
if you think about expanding,
you know,
keep us in mind.
I think as an organization,
(31:54):
there's just things that we need to be thinking
about scalable in a sense of quality.
And what I mean is that,
you know,
we could,
yeah,
this sounds great.
Let's just go here.
But also,
you know,
what are the resources that we can,
will be in place?
What's that web of support look like?
You know,
what's our own organizational capacity look like?
And so that's part of,
(32:14):
as we look at the south part of this,
kind of in my bucket,
as we look organizationally about expansion here in
the south.
So we'll see.
We'll see.
I'm excited to see what's coming.
Lisa (32:25):
Thank you very much,
Julius,
for sharing the inspiring work you and your team
are doing.
It's clear that you're creating meaningful change,
not just in the field of education,
but also deep in the hearts and minds within the
communities you serve.
The Leading Men Fellowship is showing what's
possible when young men of color are encouraged and
(32:47):
supported to step into classrooms as educators and
role models.
And what a powerful support system you've created.
Providing these fellows with professional
development,
building their own resilience,
and equipping them with the skills they need to
thrive both in and outside the classroom.
(33:07):
You're doing such amazing work,
and I would love to continue this conversation in
the future.
Perhaps in a future episode,
we could hear firsthand from some of the fellows
themselves and learn about the impact this program
is having on them and the impact they're making in
the classroom.
So thank you again,
Julius,
for your time,
dedication,
(33:28):
and your commitment.
Julius (33:29):
Absolutely.
My honor and pleasure.
We appreciate you,
Lisa.
And yeah,
absolutely.
If we can get folks on,
you know,
whether that's Season Two,
Three,
Four,
or Five,
you know,
we'll be ready.
Lisa (23:59:59):
Thank you everybody for listening to the show this week; this has been Lisa Petrides with Educating to be Human. If you enjoy our show, please rate and review us on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you listen to your podcasts. You can access our show notes for links and information on our guests, and don' t forget to follow us on Instagram and Facebook. We' ll see you next time. To Be Human, That Is Edu To Be Human. This Podcast Was Created By Lisa Petrides And Produced By Helene Theros. Educating To Be Human Is Recorded By Nathan Sherman And Edited By Ty Mayer.
Welcome to Educating to be Human, a podcast where we'll explore what it means to be human in today's world at the intersection of education, technology, and culture. I' m your host, Lisa Petrides, founder of the Institute for the Study of Knowledge Management in Education. Each week, I'll speak with people who are supporting transformative change in education today. That is, ordinary people creating extraordinary impact. Thank you very much for listening.
Thank you for joining us on Educating to be
Human.
Today,
I have the great pleasure of speaking with Julius
Cave,
the Regional Director of the Leading Men Fellowship,
a program of the Literacy Lab.
The Leading Men Fellowship is dedicated to bringing
young men of color into the classroom as pre-K
educators,
which profoundly reimagines representation in early
education and transforms students' experiences in the
classroom.
Leading Men Fellows are young men of color; they're
18 to 24,
with a high school degree or a GED equivalent,
who participate in a year-long residency-style
experience in which they are trained to provide
literacy support to pre-K students while they
receive coaching and professional development.
Now,
Julius and his team have created a curriculum that
addresses literacy needs through evidence-based
instruction,
and at the same time,
they're reshaping learning pathways that emphasize
cultural relevance and community-rooted support for
these pre-K students and for the fellows themselves.
When I was in Atlanta earlier this year,
I had the good fortune to see this work in action.
I witnessed firsthand the profound impact these
young men are having on pre-K learners.
And as you'll hear from Julius,
this program not only supports literacy,
but gives these young men an opportunity to further
their own education.
Many of them continue on to college,
some as educators,
and almost all continue serving their communities in
some way.
This program is truly diversifying the teaching
pipeline.
It's building community resilience.
And it's sowing the seeds for change in cities
across the country.
Welcome,
Julius,
and thank you for joining us.
Julius (02:39):
Thank you.
Glad to be here.
Lisa (02:40):
So I would love to hear a bit more about
the Literacy Lab and the Leading Men Fellowship and
what you do in that program.
Julius (02:49):
Yeah,
yeah.
First,
Lisa,
let me say thank you to you for having me on and
getting a chance to speak about our work.
Also,
congratulations to you on this podcast.
You know,
when we met in person,
we were talking about it as an idea,
and here it is now.
Lisa (03:04):
That's right.
Julius (03:05):
Part of life.
So,
yeah,
the Leading Men Fellowship is a program of the
Literacy Lab.
Now,
as an organization,
the Literacy Lab was started in 2009.
The Leading Men Fellowship came about in 2016 in
Washington,
D.
C.,
where we're headquartered.
Now we're currently in five cities (03:21):
Atlanta,
Milwaukee,
Washington,
D.
C.,
Baltimore,
and Cincinnati.
The work of the Literacy Lab has been focused
since our inception around literacy for young
students,
how we support that in neighborhoods who have
experienced economic and racial inequities.
And then the Leading Men Fellowship,
(03:42):
we came along to say,
how else do we think about who's in front of
children and how do we increase and diversify the
educator pipeline?
And so our focus with the Leading Men Fellowship
is a couple of main things.
One is early intervention around literacy and
support for the development of literacy skills for
students in pre-K classrooms.
(04:02):
The other piece is leveraging the opportunity to
diversify the educator pipeline with specifically
young men of color,
ages 18 to 24,
who work as literacy tutors in those pre-K classes
for a full school year.
And it's also an opportunity to provide a
professional working opportunity for these young men
who don't have a bachelor's degree right now.
(04:24):
So fellows commit to working for a full school
year in one classroom at one school with the focus
on leveraging the training that our coaches and
other folks provide to deliver a curriculum that's
aligned to the science of reading.
We use this called the SEEDS curriculum that's
really designed to see where students are and
(04:47):
support them on that literacy journey for that full
school year.
Lisa (04:51):
How do these prospective fellows find you?
So where do you recruit these young men from?
And tell me a little bit more.
It's interesting.
You said they come to you and they don't have a
college degree at this point.
Julius (05:04):
So I think we take a step back.
One,
young men are not encouraged,
typically encouraged to go into the education field.
So our work in recruiting is really trying to go
far and wide to find young men that are looking
for an opportunity like this to maybe have an
interest in working with students.
But maybe it hasn't been encouraged or they didn't
know how to get into the education field.
(05:26):
So we do recruit at high schools for young men
that will be graduating.
We do recruit at colleges.
So some of our fellows are college students,
like I said,
they just don't have a bachelor's degree already.
We go to community colleges.
We connect with other community organizations.
We're at events.
A number of places,
wherever we can go to share about the opportunity.
And talk about it not only from the lens of being
(05:49):
an educator,
but also the opportunity for them to grow in their
professional and personal development as well.
Lisa (23:59:59):
And you talk about diversifying the pipeline
or diversifying the workforce.
I don't know the exact numbers,
but I think that men of color,
Black men in particular,
make up what?
Less than 2% of the country's teaching force?
Is that about right?
That's it.
That's it.
Last statistic I saw was 1.
3%.
1.
3.
And now let's talk about pre-K.
I'm imagining that number's got to be substantially
less.
Julius (06:21):
Right.
Right.
Correct.
Lisa (06:23):
Great.
So you're really recruiting for a program that is
so needed and certainly is,
I would say,
in uncharted waters,
right?
I don't know of another program like this that is
reaching out to young men of color to see about
interesting them and helping to train and mentor
(06:46):
them into the education sector.
Julius (06:49):
I think what we found is that there are
programs that are focusing either more on the
literacy aspect or more focused on supporting male
educators of color.
I think for us combining that and again with early
education is pretty unique.
Lisa (07:04):
Yeah.
I want to talk a little bit about why literacy
and the impact of literacy,
but I'd love to hear a little bit about your
story and how does your origin story impact the
work that you do now?
Julius (07:15):
Yeah.
So a couple of things for me.
So I grew up in Allendale,
South Carolina.
Actually the smallest county in South Carolina.
And a couple of pieces that have stuck with me in
terms of my journey is that one,
surrounded by a family of educators,
surrounded by folks who said that education was
important.
There was always a push in my family.
(07:36):
And for me,
feeling called to the education field and that's
something that I was supposed to do.
And so with that encouragement from family and
saying,
you know,
pursue that calling.
And here we are.
I've been an educator for a number of years now
in a number of different capacities.
But for me,
supporting young students in this field is always
critical and important for me.
(07:58):
Also growing up in Allendale,
I think,
you know,
what I witnessed is,
you know,
perception of a community.
You know,
if we were just to look at some of the data and
statistics about the community,
a lot of folks would see those as negative and
completely miss the amazing and incredible people
that make up the community.
The genius and the amazing young students that are
(08:20):
part of the community.
And so for me,
this work is about that calling.
But it's also how do we work in specific
communities and areas and support and help the
incredible people and incredible students and folks
that make up these communities.
And so that's,
for me,
the through line in my career.
So working in Houston,
Texas,
(08:41):
Memphis,
Tennessee,
and now Atlanta,
Georgia,
it's always about how do we put more of a
positive light and see the opportunity that we have
versus some of the negative information that is
promoted a lot of times.
Lisa (08:55):
So we get to literacy,
right?
And literacy is the core.
It's the first piece.
And so you are impacting,
when we're talking about the pre-K level,
this is the beginning.
This is the beginning of learning.
This is the beginning of critical thinking,
right?
What is it that you're doing at that level?
And what is it about your program that is really
(09:18):
impacting these young people in this way?
Julius (09:20):
So,
one,
it's thinking about the literacy piece and the,
you know,
some aspects of everything we do is one,
infusing joy and making it fun,
right?
It's learning,
but,
you know,
how do we do this in a fun way?
Thinking about part of the curriculum we use to
focus is on development by doing.
So,
you know,
encouraging students to practice and actually
(09:41):
leverage and use the skills that our fellows are
going over.
It's encouragement.
So continue to encourage them to work towards their
educational goals.
And it's done in a caring and compassionate way.
I think that's important,
you know,
especially we think about human beings.
Sometimes,
we talk about education in terms of data and
outcomes,
right?
But to your question about how do we get there,
(10:03):
it's remembering that we're working with human
beings.
And so care and compassion,
some of our fellows' interventions are done in
small groups and one-on-one.
So it's an opportunity to build relationships.
That's also why fellows are in that one classroom
for a full school year.
So we know it.
Because we know it takes time to build
relationships.
And so when we hear things like,
(10:23):
You know,
students that at the beginning of the year were no
t really speaking at all,
but through their work with their fellow where they
got some more one-on-one time and small group time,
that helped them to,
that student open up and communicate more,
which is a part of literacy,
right?
When we hear about students that the first couple
(10:44):
weeks are crying pretty much every day in their
classroom.
And so when a fellow is able to spend time with
them,
that helps.
That helps in their building relationships.
We hear later on that that student is more active
in class and they're not crying anymore.
And,
teachers and others can attribute that directly to
that fellow's work.
And that's what helps get to that data and that
(11:06):
outcomes.
So those relationships we know are critical in
supporting students.
And also as we're preparing educators to say, 'Hey,
this is about working with people.' And we have
to do it in a caring and compassionate way. Lisa:
Tell me a little bit about how do those students,
the young,
I guess they're four and five year olds,
how do they end up being in this program?
(11:27):
And then we're going to talk about the fellows
themselves.
But tell me a little bit about the students.
Yeah.
So our work is more relationships with,
say,
districts or providers.
And then we work with them to identify classrooms.
And then,
from there,
our fellows will spend a couple weeks building
relationships with students.
(11:48):
And then they'll do an assessment.
And I say assessment.
Again,
it's fine.
It doesn't come like, 'Hey,
we're testing.' The students don't feel like it's
a test.
But it's an assessment.
They'll do some reading together,
look at some letters.
And from there,
they'll determine what students will get more
focused interventions on a daily basis while also
including some others in the class will get some
(12:08):
of the interventions.
But that caseload will get more focused
interventions on a daily basis.
Lisa (12:12):
Got it.
So let's talk more about the fellows.
So you do recruitment.
Some of them,
probably,
do they find you somehow also from outreach that
you've done?
And then tell me a little bit about that process.
What happens?
Julius (12:27):
So,
yeah,
it's a mix.
So some find us whether,
you know,
it's online posting.
Some find us,
you know,
somebody may refer them,
a community organization,
a previous fellow,
a staff member.
It varies.
Or some,
like,
say,
when we're out and do presentations or we're out
in the community or we have something going on.
And that's how fellows get connected as well.
(12:50):
And so it's a process where we do interview the
fellows.
We talk with them more about the logistics and
about that commitment piece,
like having that eight-to-one available Monday
through Friday for that full school year.
And why that's important,
you know,
is understanding more about some of the logistics
on there.
So that's a discussion up front.
We do an interview with fellows more so to get to
(13:13):
know them better.
What we say is you're the expert in yourself.
And so the interview is not a gotcha moment,
right?
It's just a chance for us all to kind of learn
more about each other.
And that's the crux of the process. For us,
it's more about,
you know,
is this for both parties,
is this a good fit for a person at this point in
time?
(13:33):
And sometimes it's not.
And we're okay with that because it's also we've
had fellows come back at a different point in time
because that time was right for them.
And so we're open.
We also communicate.
We say,
hey,
we want to support you.
Even if you're not a fellow,
we're here to,
you know,
people that want to support you.
It's really the approach in saying this is about a
community.
This is about connection.
How do we start that process and showing that from
(13:56):
even the beginning of this process.
Lisa:
I think the first program you had was 2022.
Is that right?
So relatively recently.
Yes,
here in Atlanta.
That was the first.
Lisa (14:06):
In Atlanta,
right.
So the fellows start.
They sign up.
They're committed.
They're going to be there Monday through Friday.
For the school year from 8 a.
m.
to 1 p.
m.
And then what kind of training?
So a lot of these young men have not had training
necessarily in education or teaching.
Right.
So what is it that they get?
And how do they find themselves then,
(14:28):
you know,
in that classroom with that young group of pre-K?
Julius (14:32):
That's actually one of my favorite parts.
The training and the amount of training that they
get.
So before fellows even enter the classroom,
they get at least 40 hours of training.
And so our staff,
we have literacy coaches who come to us with
experience and expertise and working with folks
around literacy.
And they work with those fellows,
training them not only in the curriculum,
(14:54):
but how to do it from the aspect of working with
preschool and pre-K students.
So that happens before they even enter the class.
And then we layer it on throughout the year.
So we know that education,
you know, you can give it all the training you
want up front.
But once you get in there with students,
there's some other things.
There's some other learnings that have to happen.
And so we give them a good base and good
(15:16):
foundation.
They start in the classroom and then we spend time
each month with training specifically around that
curriculum that's delivered by our literacy coaches.
And then,
in addition to that,
some other members of our staff,
our program managers,
our program associates,
they lead trainings more around professional and
personal development.
So thinking about things like college and career
(15:38):
literacy,
financial literacy,
mental health literacy,
civic literacy.
And so really it's we want to say we want to
provide a robust menu of training and development
and support.
And so,
fellows are well-positioned when they step into that
classroom.
I think it's thinking about getting them as human
beings and how do we provide a support for them
(15:59):
as people so that they in turn can provide that
support for those young human beings that they're
going to interact with.
Lisa (16:06):
Right.
And tell me a little bit.
I mean,
we got to meet some of those amazing young men
when we visited the site.
Maybe you could describe some of the experiences
they have throughout the year and how this
fellowship actually changes them.
(23:59:59):
Julius:
I was thinking about this and I think it was
great that you know,
got to see them near the end of that experience.
And we have some fellows right now that are
starting the experience.
Thinking about where they end up is powerful just
to watch.
I'll say because the classroom affords a lot of
learning.
A lot of times we think about the students,
but the classroom affords a lot of learning for
the teachers and educators as well.
What I actually said to somebody just recently,
it has a way of pointing out the things and areas
where we could do a little bit more support and
work.
And it has a way of doing that.
And so for fellows,
that's going to happen.
They're going to be challenged.
They're going to face some situations that are
difficult.
And that's just a part of even that.
You know,
some of those first-year experiences of being in
classrooms.
First one,
we know that and saying that's OK.
And then two,
providing,
you know,
a group of people and some other supports that not
only continue to tell them that it's OK,
but continue to tell them that we believe in them
and that we're there to support them.
So I think what happens by the end of this is
that fellows are able to take a look back and
really see some of their own growth.
They're able to see some of their resilience.
They're able to see where they've been challenged
and able to push forward.
And where they've been pushed.
And so,
you know,
a great example is in that visit that we had that
you got to meet some of our fellows - a couple of
them volunteered and came up and shared about their
experience.
And some of them at the beginning of the year
absolutely would not have done that.
Right.
And so it's an environment where I think whether
explicit or implicitly,
they feel like it's their environment.
They have a say in it.
And that's what we-that's what we push and
encourage and allow that space for growth.
And I just I think that's that's key.
Right.
Not only for young men of color,
but for other folks,
we think about developing professionals as being
environments where,
you know,
challenge is welcome.
You're pushed to grow.
You're encouraged to grow.
And you have people that continue and consistently
say we're here for you.
And I think it just makes a world of difference.
So you've had a couple of graduation years,
right?
You've had a couple of fellowship programs go
through the whole year now.
What are some of those fellows doing now as they
finish?
Are they entering the education field?
Are they finding they education environment to be
something that seems welcoming to them or inclusive
of them?
Julius (18:54):
One I's
say it's interesting to watch during the year,
that's another area of growth.
Some that fellow students start out just like,
you know,
looking for a job and this worked out.
And,
you know,
and that escalates to yeah,
I kind of like this thing,
but I don't know about teaching.
And then by the end of the year,
it's more of them yes,
I'm definitely continuing in the education field.
Lisa (19:14):
Love that.
Julius (19:15):
Yeah,
it's,
you know,
for some,
each year for us here in Atlanta,
over half of the cohort has continued in the
education field.
For some of those that haven't,
there's other opportunities that were a better fit
for them or more aligned with where they wanted to
take their careers.
A few have done some full-time,
become full-time college students looking to study
(19:37):
education as well as some other areas.
We've had a fellow that decided to teach abroad
and has taught in Spain.
Some fellows that are serving and working as
paraprofessionals in schools.
What's striking is how they talk about it now as
well.
So for some,
it's seeing it more as a career.
(19:59):
It's hearing them talk about the things that they
learned and how they implement in the classrooms
that they're working in now.
And then,
you know,
just hearing,
I was somewhere recently,
one of our fellows is working at a school I met.
And someone that works at that school as well.
And they're like,
oh,
yeah,
I was just in his class just the other day.
And was saying nothing but great things about him.
So that's always good to hear as well.
Lisa:
I used to work in a school of education for
(20:21):
several years.
And just being in the field of education,
we hear a lot.
There aren't enough men who are in teaching,
particularly in the primary grades.
And then,
of course,
we hear,
oh,
and there aren't enough young men of color or
young Black men who want to enter teaching.
It's sort of set up by,
in some ways,
(20:41):
it's like,
oh,
we have this problem.
We don't know how to get them into the pipeline.
And it seems that this approach you're taking is
sort of turning that on its head in a fabulous
way.
Because you're growing people.
You're growing the interest and the awareness to
make it be an environment where they want to enter
teaching.
(21:02):
I mean,
is that,
I don't want to put words in your mouth.
But that's kind of what I'm hearing in terms of
the impact that you're having.
(23:59:59):
No,
you're not.
That's accurate.
And I'll add this in saying,
you know,
another component that is huge within this is that
the fact that fellows are going through this with
other young men of color.
And so the relationships that they build,
you know,
mean so much to them.
And that's not me saying it.
That's what they tell us.
I talk about it as a brotherhood,
not because,
not as a marketing term or a term I came up
with,
but because of the term that they've used and how
they talk about it.
And so that's a hugely important piece for them.
Being in conversations that honestly,
quite frankly,
they just haven't really been able to have
consistently.
Even about themselves.
Even about what they want to do.
Their hopes,
their dreams.
You know,
being vulnerable in spaces.
Having some difficult conversations.
And so for them to be in a room regularly with
other young men of color, working positively to
impact lives in their community plays a huge role.
And so we've seen that across not only Atlanta,
but in our other regions as well.
And a part of it is the work we do up front.
We do a week where we're all together and not
only training,
but doing some other events and things together.
So it's all opportunities to help them build that
bond that we know is going to be important for
them throughout this experience.
Lisa (22:31):
It's just an amazing program.
What are your ideas about how we infuse something
like this into our teacher training programs?
And is that even possible?
Given the inherent structure,
you know,
just from the fact that a teacher training
program to get in,
you need to have certain background or certain test
scores or even have the interest or think it's
(22:54):
even something that's possible to do.
Right?
Julius (22:58):
Right.
I think it's something that you said earlier,
right?
Like identifying a problem.
And then the second part I would add is,
you know,
how committed are we to that piece?
And if we are,
then we understand that,
you know,
when there's some things that maybe we wouldn't or
shouldn't or don't want to do,
but there's some things that we may have to do.
Right?
And what I'm getting at is like recruitment.
Yeah.
If we want,
you know,
(23:18):
more men,
we have to go out where these young men are.
And we have to have conversations in a way that
aren't one-sided.
They're listening.
We're listening to help understand what challenges
there may be.
We have to think about barriers.
Right?
For thinking about schools of education.
This is,
I'm just completely making this up.
But,
right,
like is the timeline it takes from when we apply
(23:40):
to when we start,
is that a barrier for someone?
Right?
If there are some other concerns or think about
making money,
what are some other opportunities that we could
think about and further leverage in this?
I think an opportunity is we look at some of the
districts and how they're partnering with some
(24:00):
colleges and universities where work,
you know,
credit for work will count towards that degree.
I think we have to listen more and better
understand what barriers are there,
be willing and committed to removing some of those
barriers.
And then providing the environment that it takes to
support students and folks in getting in and
staying in this field.
(24:21):
Lisa:
Could you talk a little bit more about what some
of those barriers are that you find from your
listening,
your very active listening,
especially in recruitment,
as well as in the actual year that the fellows
spend with you?
What are some of those barriers?
And how are you addressing them?
Or how are you mitigating them?
I think it's best for me.
I mean,
these are some real life examples.
(24:44):
You know,
one thing is that our role is part time.
So,
again,
eight to one,
eight to two.
You know,
fellows are paid $17 an hour.
One of the things we think about on the listening
piece is that we were hearing a couple of years
ago where we started at $15 that it wasn't going
to work.
So we did increase that.
Listening and hearing from fellows that it's part.
(25:05):
But there's more that they need in terms of
income.
And so we've started to build partnerships and
relationships with some other organizations that have
opportunities in the afternoons or evenings.
So that fellows have some some other opportunities
to make some money.
You know,
transportation is a challenge.
Those are just real live examples that we're
(25:26):
working through right now and building relationships
with other community organizations that will support
in addressing those those barriers that fellows have
not only when they come to us,
but even throughout the program that may pop up.
(23:59:59):
Lisa:
You've talked about how literacy and then the
teaching of literacy and how we how you support
the young men in this way that there's a piece
there that's around social justice.
Right.
When we when we put literacy and education together
in this way,
that's something that we know we need to be doing
a lot more of in these communities that aren't
necessarily even believing that education is a way
forward.
I would love to just hear your thoughts about
that.
I think literacy is,
you know,
just to say it's critical and important doesn't do
it in and of itself enough justice.
A colleague I used to work with just,
you know,
somebody wants to be a rocket scientist like they
they still have to know how to read.
And so literacy is embedded in so much of what
we do.
Math,
science,
all all the different fields and areas.
And so for if we're going to encourage students to
go into different fields and we have to be honest
with ourselves and really make sure we're providing
the fundamentals and basics that are going to
support them in those fields.
And then when we think about access to knowledge,
right,
literacy provides so much of an open door to
access to knowledge and information.
So when we think about not only reading,
writing,
communicating,
literacy is something that provides a lot of a lot
of opportunities.
Right.
And so when we think about,
you know,
what are ways that we can support communities,
right,
education and specifically literacy can play a huge
role in how we're setting students up and,
you know,
for their goals and where they want to go.
Lisa:
Do you have some examples of this from the fellows
that you've been working with?
Some of what comes to mind,
I think,
has impressed me.
One is for fellows who have spoken about how
they've increased their own literacy and what
they're reading and the amount that they're reading.
Lisa (27:34):
Oh,
interesting.
Julius (27:36):
Yeah.
Yeah.
And so it's not from us saying you need to read
more,
but it's fellows that have as they kind of analyze
their own goals and growth and where they want to
go.
You know,
they've seen their own literacy and reading and,
you know,
writing.
Some of them talk about journaling more regularly
(27:56):
and just writing things down.
And so,
like I said,
it's not a direct thing.
But you should do this.
It's more of that encouragement to dream,
to follow your dreams,
to follow your goals,
to follow where you want to go.
Right.
But you're going to need a skill set and some
things to help you get there.
And for them to kind of analyze and have said,
yeah,
this is this literacy piece for them that is super
(28:18):
important and critical for them.
So that's that's what comes to mind in thinking
about that.
Lisa:
You've talked a little bit before about the role of
partnerships and community partnerships.
And could you talk a little bit more about how
you have set forth to actually create those deeper
partnerships and community and what that impact has
been?
(23:59:59):
You know,
personal belief in is infusing this work.
I mean,
we we can't do it by ourselves.
And even when we think of it,
if we can focus on our mission and vision,
we can't we can't do it by ourselves.
And so partnership and community is necessary.
And my approach is that one, I think it's easy to
sometimes look at the other groups and how can we
partner with with them?
and saying,
what can we get from them?
But my approach,
I think,
is for us,
we make sure we're being a good partner first.
And that's where it starts,
being a good partner.
And other than thinking about what makes sense in
terms of partnerships,
is there a need that needs to be filled?
More support?
Like we said,
transportation?
Income? Are there when we think about our
personal and professional development what's our
actual capacity?
We talk about financial literacy.
I'm not a financial literacy expert,
but we were able to get connected to some great
folks with Bank of America who said,
absolutely,
we'll come in and do not only some sessions with
fellows about financial literacy,
but we'll also host an event at our offices and
give fellows a chance to hear from professionals in
this field.
And then on the back end,
we've been able to partner with another group who
offers some personal financial coaching.
And fellows said,
after the Bank of America session,
said, 'Hey,
we need some more; we need some more intent and
more support around our individual situations.
" And so we were able to partner with someone that
provides individualized financial coaching.
What's out here is listening,
understanding,
listening to feedback from fellow.
So looking at the community,
seeing where opportunities are.
Some great folks that we partnered with around some
training opportunities for fellows.
Folks like Profound Gentlemen is an organization,
national organization that supports male educators of
color.
And so it only made sense for us to partner.
And now fellows that have come back for a second
year and are alum that are in education,
are part of their organization.
And so now they get continued support after they
leave us.
This work can't be done alone and it can't be
done in isolation.
And so it's going to require us to be open to
it,
creative around it,
dream around it,
make sure we're being good partners in this work.
Lisa (30:46):
Yeah,
that's great.
It really sounds like you're creating sort of,
you're weaving the fabric together.
You're creating a strong web of support for these
young men of color to be successful in what they
do.
And it takes connecting those dots.
It takes those partnerships.
It takes those relationships.
Not to be cliché,
it takes a village.
(31:07):
We know that.
And it seems like you're really putting that into
practice.
How are you thinking about expanding this program?
You have now,
what,
about 20 fellows a year there in the Atlanta
region.
This is a program that I can see in so many
parts of the country,
or even just in the southern region.
I'm imagining there's just a phenomenal opportunity
(31:31):
there in that way.
What are you thinking?
Juilus (31:34):
Yeah,
so in Metro Atlanta this year,
we'll get up to 40 fellows.
So doubling right here in the Atlanta area.
And then as we think about it more broadly,
you're absolutely right.
A lot of opportunity.
Some folks in a number of cities and places that
have said,
hey,
if you think about expanding,
you know,
keep us in mind.
I think as an organization,
(31:54):
there's just things that we need to be thinking
about scalable in a sense of quality.
And what I mean is that,
you know,
we could,
yeah,
this sounds great.
Let's just go here.
But also,
you know,
what are the resources that we can,
will be in place?
What's that web of support look like?
You know,
what's our own organizational capacity look like?
And so that's part of,
(32:14):
as we look at the south part of this,
kind of in my bucket,
as we look organizationally about expansion here in
the south.
So we'll see.
We'll see.
I'm excited to see what's coming.
Lisa (32:25):
Thank you very much,
Julius,
for sharing the inspiring work you and your team
are doing.
It's clear that you're creating meaningful change,
not just in the field of education,
but also deep in the hearts and minds within the
communities you serve.
The Leading Men Fellowship is showing what's
possible when young men of color are encouraged and
(32:47):
supported to step into classrooms as educators and
role models.
And what a powerful support system you've created.
Providing these fellows with professional
development,
building their own resilience,
and equipping them with the skills they need to
thrive both in and outside the classroom.
(33:07):
You're doing such amazing work,
and I would love to continue this conversation in
the future.
Perhaps in a future episode,
we could hear firsthand from some of the fellows
themselves and learn about the impact this program
is having on them and the impact they're making in
the classroom.
So thank you again,
Julius,
for your time,
dedication,
(33:28):
and your commitment.
Julius (33:29):
Absolutely.
My honor and pleasure.
We appreciate you,
Lisa.
And yeah,
absolutely.
If we can get folks on,
you know,
whether that's Season Two,
Three,
Four,
or Five,
you know,
we'll be ready.
Lisa (23:59:59):
Thank you everybody for listening to the show this week; this has been Lisa Petrides with Educating to be Human. If you enjoy our show, please rate and review us on Apple, Spotify, or wherever you listen to your podcasts. You can access our show notes for links and information on our guests, and don' t forget to follow us on Instagram and Facebook. We' ll see you next time. To Be Human, That Is Edu To Be Human. This Podcast Was Created By Lisa Petrides And Produced By Helene Theros. Educating To Be Human Is Recorded By Nathan Sherman And Edited By Ty Mayer.
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