April 24, 2025 • 39 mins
In this episode, we explore what it means to break free from societal expectations and redefine success on your terms. We dive into the power of aligning your life with your core values, the impact of living with intention, and how that shift can create a ripple effect of fulfillment and joy. We also unpack the "mother wound," inspired by Bethany Webster’s work, and how healing from inherited beliefs can deepen self-love and compassion.
About Dina:
Dina-Marie is the creator of Way of the Founder, where she helps visionary nomads and expats build purpose-driven, location-independent businesses. With 10 years of nomadic living and over 5 years of coaching experience, she blends strategy with soul to support entrepreneurs in creating freedom-filled lives. Her holistic approach combines business strategy, healing practices, and travel inspiration to help clients redefine success and align with their dreams.
Find Dina:
https://www.instagram.com/_wayofthefounder/
https://www.linkedin.com/in/dina-marie-weineck/
https://wayofthefounder.com
Free masterclass:
https://wayofthefounder.com/masterclass/
Follow us on Instagram, leave a review, and share your experiences – we'd love to hear what resonates with you!
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Click here to download Kira's free self-love hypnosis audio or her free gut guide
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:03):
Welcome to the Heal Yourself Podcast, where we dive
deep into all things healing.
I'm Denise, a speech-languagepathologist and a self-love
coach for adults and teens.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
And I'm Kira, a traditional naturopath and
functional nutritionist, and weare here to guide you through
the transformative process ofhealing your body, mind and soul
.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
From the latest in functional medicine to nurturing
your relationship with yourself, healing trauma and even
transforming your money story.
We're here to empower you withthe knowledge and tools to
create lasting change.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
So, whether you're looking to heal physically,
emotionally or spiritually, joinus as we explore the many paths
to wholeness and wellness.
Hello everyone, and welcomeback to another episode.
Today I have a special guestfor you, who I will introduce in
(01:01):
just a moment.
Unfortunately, denise could notbe with us, but it's still
going to be a great episode.
So today I'm talking to DanaMarie, who's the creator of Way
of the Founder, a dynamic spacewhere personal growth, spiritual
exploration and businessleadership converge to help
visionary nomads, expats andother transplants build location
(01:24):
independent businesses withpurpose.
An expat nomad of 10 years andprofessional coach for over five
years, dina Marie empowersentrepreneurs to stop trading
time for money and buildbusinesses that align with their
wildest dreams of freedom andimpact.
And before I say welcome, dina,I want to say, even if you are
(01:44):
not a business owner, it is okay.
I still want you to listen tothis episode.
There's going to be lots foryou.
So, dina, welcome, hello, happyto be here.
Yeah, so happy to have you.
So tell us a little bit aboutyourself.
I know we chatted just a momentbefore recording, but your
story is intriguing.
(02:05):
I love it.
But I think, like I mentioned,even though you're geared
towards entrepreneurs.
This is going to help so manypeople regardless.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Yeah, absolutely and really, for me, my whole life,
whether it was as a kid, as adancer, as a nine to five person
or as an entrepreneur, my northstar has always been how can I
have more freedom and how can Ihave an actual impact and be
fulfilled doing the thing that Iwant to be doing?
(02:38):
Right, and it sounds superaspirational, right Like wait a
minute you want to have afulfilling life and a great
impact and have the choice toburn it all down and start over
all at the same time in the samelifetime.
Yeah, I kind of do.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
I really do and you know, with that North Star has
always come the courage for meto, like I just said, burn it
all down Right.
I grew up in Germany,originally from Germany, and I
had an amazing opportunity tocome to the United States and
study there and with that myprofessional background has
really become orchestramanagement.
(03:14):
So I was in the weeds, I wasfundraising, I was planning
community engagement events forclassical orchestras, and what
always excited me most about mywork in the office was the work
I could do outside the officewhere I could work with aspiring
musicians or with professionalmusicians who were aspiring
(03:36):
entrepreneurs.
We're like Dina.
I have this idea and I thinkit's going to make a huge impact
on the community that I careabout.
I just don't know the business.
Can you help me Right and fastforward?
I'm sure we'll get into why andhow I quit my job and how that
all turned into me being a nomadnow and living in Da Nang for
(03:57):
the time being.
But fast forward.
I work as a coach with those whoseek more freedom in their
lives, specifically more freedomof choice.
That might look like becomingor being a nomad.
That might look like being anomad and wanting to quit your
job and build your own business.
That might look like I justwant to have the choice to work
(04:19):
from a different state or fromout of the country for a month
or three months a year, right?
So freedom, if we really lookat it, just like success.
We really look at it.
We all have a differentdefinition for it.
We tend to all pursue the samedefinition and that's a problem
that I'm sure we'll get into.
But if we really look at it andif we really return to our most
(04:42):
authentic, most loving self, weall have a different idea for
what success or freedom aremeant to look, feel like and
taste like, right?
So that's what I do with myclients.
I help them build the lifethat's truly authentic to them,
wildly fulfilling and massivelyimpactful.
Because when you are happy, ifyou become happy and fulfilled,
(05:05):
that has a ripple effect.
The work that you do in theworld, if you do it from a place
of authenticity, it has anamazing and a positive and a
loving ripple effect.
And that's what I'm reallyinterested in.
That's my guiding star.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Yeah, well, and it's.
It's such a powerful thing too,because I think it's so easy to
take one path in life and belike, well, I'm here, so I'm
just going to stick with it.
And I think so many are lackingpurpose and passion in their
lives and then they're wonderingwhy they're chronically ill.
Like, yeah, that can be afactor If you're not living out
(05:40):
your life's purpose and you'rejust going through the motions
and pleasing others and'm justgoing to my nine to five.
Yeah, it's no wonder you're,you know, dealing with ongoing
stuff and freedom, like you said, means different things to
different people.
That's actually my number onevalue.
So I always talk to clientsabout are we even working from
our values?
Do we know what our values areIf your value is freedom and
(06:02):
you're not living afreedom-based life, whatever
that looks like?
Again, good luck.
Speaker 3 (06:08):
Right, right, yeah.
And I think you know, when itcomes to just sort of going
through the motions andrealizing that you're actually
not living or living towardsyour purpose, I think it's easy
to say, oh yeah, like I want todo something that's on purpose
for me.
But if we really look at themindset of it, more often than
(06:29):
not I find that in working withmy clients there is a real
identity shift that has tohappen.
If you're looking to switchcareers, if you're looking to
change your tax status, akaleave your 9 to 5 and become an
entrepreneur, right, becausemore often than not we identify
with the path towards successthat has been laid out for us.
(06:54):
If we follow that, I will belovable.
If I follow that path ofsuccess, I will be worthy of
fill in the blanks love right.
So there is some real inner workthat has to take place more
often than not where we canreclaim the source of love right
.
More often than not, aschildren, at some point that
(07:16):
source gets given away tosomeone, to something, to source
outside ourselves, and if wemake that source happy, maybe,
maybe then we'll be seen assuccessful, maybe then we'll
seen as lovable right.
So the path out of a nine tofive, or even if you stay in a
nine to five, you switch yourcareer and you rearrange your
(07:38):
life for purpose, that pathinevitably has come across the
point where you take backcontrol.
I describe to my clients youtake back the remote control
over your feelings and you say,no, I'm the one who's pushing
the buttons, because I know thatI'm responsible for my
happiness.
That means others don't get tohave control over that, and
(08:00):
that's easier said than done.
But however uncomfortable thatjourney may be, it's also one of
the most rewarding journeysthat I've personally ever gone
on.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
Yeah, so I can relate .
I was a nine to five.
I was a middle school Englishteacher for years and then made
the leap myself.
So yeah, tell us a little bit.
How did you get to that place,like what caused you to leave
your job and go down this road?
Speaker 3 (08:37):
The year is 2019.
Over a decade following a pathnot only of predefined and
predetermined success, but apath that I hoped would help me
gain my parents' approval andvalidation right.
There was a lot of chaos in myearly childhood and that sort of
(08:59):
had me end up in a place whereuncertainty wasn't really
something I gelled with right.
So I always made sure that Iknew the next step and I always
made sure that I had tunnelvision on that next step.
Because feeling all of thefeelings from my past, from my
childhood, feeling all of thetrauma, allowing all of the
(09:21):
feelings in that felt reallychaotic, really overwhelming.
It felt like it might drown me.
It didn't, but took a lot ofdamn courage to let them back in
right.
So it felt easier, it felt morecomfortable to follow someone
else's path towards success, andso I did right.
I graduated, I went to the US.
(09:42):
That was unconventional.
I'll say that I went to the us.
That was unconventional.
I'll say that I went to the usas an international student on a
full scholarship, like that'sunheard of um, and by the time I
was settled in my job and I wasbeginning to get promotions, I
looked around and this life thatthis person named Dina was
(10:04):
living, was beautiful, was great, right, perfect LA, the great
job, the dream job, a cute car,great relationship, but I
couldn't see myself in it and Icouldn't see myself in it.
I felt like every day I wasjust living this weird
out-of-body experience.
(10:24):
It's like, oh yeah, I know,this is my body, I know that I,
the soul, made this all happen,but it doesn't feel authentic.
And then I began to ask myselfsome really deep questions.
I would drive into the office,or I would drive into work an
hour early to have anopportunity to sit in a cafe
(10:44):
before going into the office tojust journal.
And I would ask myselfquestions every morning like who
would I be if this careerdidn't define my life, if money
wasn't a problem?
What would I want to do If Iwasn't afraid what my mom would
think of me quitting this job?
What would I do, yeah, if Icould just pause?
(11:10):
How would I relate to myself?
How would I relate to my body?
And then, at one point,everything just sort of came to
a head.
You know, I was living in theUS, working in the US on a visa
as an expat.
My visa was up for renewal andour board chair sat me down and
she was like we love you and wewant to keep you around.
(11:30):
We'll pay for your visa, we'llsponsor you.
And also, here's more money andhere's a promotion.
Any normal person would havebeen like yes, okay, great like
any normal person would havebeen like yes, okay, great and
expats, dream come true, right,and I had a nervous breakdown
(11:50):
that evening and I walked in thenext morning with so much
clarity more clarity than I hadever had in my life and I handed
in my two weeks notice and Icame home that day and I put a
one-way ticket out of thecountry to Ho Chi Minh City,
vietnam not the reason why.
I'm currently in Vietnam.
That was a backpacking trip tojust sort of, you know, get my
bearings.
But yeah, I just cold turkeyquit.
(12:12):
I had no plan, I just knew this, ain't it?
yeah this ain't it and it was.
You know, sometimes you do thething that you've been afraid of
for years, but somewhere withinthe last few months, not doing
the thing is actually scarierthan doing it.
There comes a tipping point,and that was that for me, like
staying in the job was likefeels like a death sentence.
(12:36):
Right, Not because the job wasbad it wasn't great leadership
but because it was so out ofalignment with what I wanted to
do, with what I wanted to say,with who I wanted to become.
So I quit.
Speaker 2 (12:50):
I love that.
Good for you.
I mean similar, and I won't getinto my story, obviously, but I
understand where you're comingfrom and I think it's so easy
for women to hold themselvesback.
No, no, no, no, we're going toplay safe.
We can't do that crazy thingwhen, in reality, that crazy
thing is going to bring youcloser to you.
Sometimes we need to do thatcrazy thing that gets you out of
(13:13):
the box.
Otherwise, you're just going tokeep remaining in the same
pattern and you're not living.
Speaker 3 (13:19):
Yeah, absolutely.
You know, I talk a lot aboutthe mother wound.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
I was I.
It's so funny that you saidthat because I was, you
mentioned mother and I'm like,hmm, let's talk about the mother
wounds.
Let's talk about it For thosethat don't know what is the
mother wound.
Speaker 3 (13:36):
Well, a mother wound is a lot of things.
So actually there is a bookthat I like to reference, for
all those who are interested,brave enough to read it, by
bethany bethany webster.
She wrote a book calleddiscovering the inner mother,
and I really like that term.
(13:56):
The inner mother mother woundsounds really drastic and I'll
say, looking at our relationship, especially as women, looking
at our relationship to our mom,that's a drastic move to dare to
question what our moms told us,to dare to question, uh, our
mom's beliefs about life and theworld that at some point as
(14:19):
children we have internalized.
That takes bravery right.
So there's there's truth tocalling it the mother wound, but
I really do love the, the, thehealing term discovering the
inner mother.
Right, you're not onlyremothering yourself in healing
the mother wound, but but you'recreating a whole new
(14:40):
relationship.
That sounds a little compoundy,but you're learning to relate
differently to your relationshipto your mom, and I'll get into
that.
You asked me a question, thoughwhat is the mother wound?
Well, it's the enmeshment ofthe daughter's identity with
that of the mom.
Right, and it manifests in somany different things, right.
(15:03):
Typically, you'll find thatmanifest when you feel as though
you can't be yourself aroundyour mom, when you weigh every
decision that you make in yourlife against what your mom will
think about it, when you changethe color of your hair because
of something that your mom said.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
I'm raising my hand for those who can't see, I'm
like how many women are like, ohcrap that's me, right.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
Like right now, I wear my natural hair color and I
freaking love it.
I adore it.
I'm like, literally in lovewith my hair, not from a
narcissistic place, but it tookme a really long time to no
longer dye my hair the way mymom dyes her hair.
Yeah, time to no longer dye myhair the the way my mom dyes her
hair.
Yeah, right.
So that's the mother wound.
(15:46):
It's it's an enmeshment of youridentity with that of your mom.
I believe we all have the motherwound to an extent.
We all have an opportunity tolook at.
Okay, well, this beautifulcaregiver called my mom, she
raised me, and some of herthoughts I have taken on and
thought that they are my own.
But do I have an opportunity toexamine these thoughts and do I
(16:08):
really believe these thoughts?
That's the surface level, right, and sometimes, if we have a
really healthy relationship withour moms, that's where we get
to stop.
But sometimes we don't.
Sometimes we become thecaregiver of our moms
emotionally, right, way tooearly on.
I'm not talking about when wewere 15, our moms are 70.
I'm talking about when we werefive, right, yeah, we become the
(16:33):
parentified daughter and wetake on an emotional
responsibility that we're notmeant to take on, right?
So that plays out in manydifferent ways in adult life,
and I mentioned a few of them.
Right, it's when we weigh ourdecisions against what our moms
will think about us and how thatwill affect the emotional
wellbeing of our moms, becausewe haven't yet understood that
(16:56):
in the same way in which I haveto claim back the remote control
over my emotions, I also haveto claim back the remote control
over my emotions.
I also have to give back theremote control over the emotions
of my mom to my mom.
Right, and that's the work ofhealing the mother wound is a
disentanglement of identities.
Speaker 2 (17:16):
Yeah, I love that description, and one thing I
want to clarify for ourlisteners is just because you
had a wonderful relationshipgrowing up with your mother
doesn't mean you can't havemother wounds.
The thing is is we are soimpressionable between the ages
of zero and seven that's wheneverything comes about.
Our beliefs are all of it right, our programming is what I'll
(17:40):
call it, and as you get older inlife you start to question some
of that.
So, again, you can have anamazing relationship with your
mother.
It doesn't mean she was bad.
It means we're doing the samething to our children and
they're going to do the samething to theirs.
We're just adopting at that agewhat we're being told, and so
(18:00):
it's not a bad thing.
But, like you said, it's, it'sunweaving that it's, I say,
unlearning.
We have to unlearn some stuff.
Speaker 3 (18:08):
It's unlearning, it's deconditioning, and you know,
there are two things I want toecho and to expound on in what
you're saying.
We all have a mother wound,right, we all have an
opportunity to examine ourrelationship to our moms.
And two things here.
One, that doesn't mean our momsare bad.
(18:30):
That doesn't mean that we haveto begin to judge our moms.
Like, the whole process oflooking at oh wait, a minute,
that's my mom's identity, that'snot actually my identity that
that process has to be full ofself-compassion and empathy for
our little kids, our inner childand our moms, right, like
(18:53):
there's, hate has no place inhealing.
Judgment has no place inhealing, in fact it hinders it.
Right, and and a more right toto those to the male listeners
who may be tuning into thepodcast right, we're talking
about the daughter motherrelationship.
That's just a very, very primalrelationship, right, and
(19:16):
there's so that.
So that societal factors thatfactor into how a woman views
her, her place in society, right, but every child has to some
extent or another and enmeshedidentity with their primary
caregiver.
Right, and a more allencompassing term, of course, to
to look at that as trauma.
Speaker 1 (19:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (19:38):
And you have trauma, I have trauma, the next person
has trauma.
My trauma isn't bigger thanyours.
I find that a lot when peopleare beginning to heal, it's like
oh, you know, it wasn't thatbad.
I don't actually have thatbigger trauma, and that may be
true.
You most definitely didn'texperience everything else that
(19:59):
the next person experienced.
Your trauma is very unique toyou and you get to claim it
right.
You get to find the wisdomwithin it, you get to find the
lessons within it, and only byaccepting what happened as
(20:19):
having happened, without ajudgment, without having to blow
it out of proportion or todiminish it.
No, this happened.
And in accepting it point blank.
Now what becomes available isforgiveness work.
Now, what becomes available iscompassion and empathy, and what
becomes available is and Ithink bethany webster says this
(20:39):
in her book is the medicineinside the wound healing it's
healing that's where the healingprocess begins.
In order, to heal trauma.
You can't go around it, youcan't circumvent the trauma.
Yeah, yeah, you have to gothrough, and what's inside of it
is wisdom.
What's inside of it is emotionsthat carry insights and
(21:01):
knowledge and that want to bereleased.
The only burden about theemotions is they haven't yet
been felt right.
So my first coach said this tome.
I always say is to my clientsthese days, the only way through
is through 100%.
Speaker 2 (21:19):
So, talking about the mother wound, it's funny
because, as you're saying, someof that, I'm like yep, yep, yep,
but without judgment.
But one thing I started tonotice over the years was my
issues with money.
Now do I think that they'vecome from both parents?
Yes, but a lot of times, evenspeaking with Denise, who I know
(21:42):
is not here, when we were at um, well, we spent a weekend
together doing a bunch of stuffand the conversation kept coming
up of like where do all thesemoney issues come from?
And whenever I would bringsomething up, go back to my
mother.
So talk to us about the motherwound and money well, I'll start
(22:03):
there.
Speaker 3 (22:07):
So, when it comes to any any form of conditioning
right childhood trauma,conditioned self um,
internalized thoughts, limitingbeliefs, the mother wound right
we always want to look at.
First of all, you have to allowyourself to become aware of the
fact that a thought may notnecessarily be fact, it might be
(22:30):
fiction, right.
And then you want to look atwell, how do I know that?
Where does that thought comefrom?
And there are different ways toask the question.
I always like to ask this verybroad question oh, how do I know
this?
How how did I learn this?
And yeah, if, as women, we arein the midst of looking at our
(22:55):
relationship to our moms andtypically you know, from our mid
twenties to our mid thirties,that that's I personally found
to be like the prime agesTypically that answer does end
up being oh yeah, like somethingthat my mom did, taught me that
that.
Or my mom always used to saythat right.
Or that's just how my momhandled money right.
(23:16):
Or again, that's how my dadhandled money.
Or that's how my guardianhandled money right, like, oh
yeah, like I learned that inchildhood and that's what we
turn to right, we come into thislife and we're helpless, right,
the human being.
As babies, we're helpless.
We require help, right?
(23:38):
So very quickly we learnadaptive behavior in order to
keep ourselves safe.
Oh, if I smile, I get milk.
Oh, if I don't cry, then this.
Oh, if I hide this emotion,then that right.
And as we grow older and older,all of this turns into
something that started veryinnocently oh if I don't cry
right.
But suddenly, as we grow older,that turns into oh, if I don't
(24:01):
make more money than my mom everdid in her life, she'll always
love me.
Yeah, that's money in themother wound so this one's a
loaded question.
Speaker 2 (24:15):
How do you begin to chip away at that?
Because I guarantee there arelisteners going oh my gosh, I
have so many money issues and Ican't attract more money or I
hit a cap on money.
Whether you're an entrepreneuror whatever it might be, how do
you start to chip away at that?
Speaker 3 (24:34):
Yeah.
So, if it's okay, I want totell just a brief story because
I feel like I haven't talkedmuch about personal relationship
with my mom and listeners mightbe like who is she to talk
about?
So, specifically to money, Ihave a hundred stories to tell
about me and my mom, and my momand I have a really good
relationship these days.
(24:54):
But two years ago that certainlywasn't the case.
Five years ago most certainlynot Right.
And in the beginning of mybusiness I've always had really
big goals Like ever since I wasa child.
I've always had really biggoals.
Like ever since I was a childI've always had really big
visions, right.
And I remember as a child someof these visions would be
(25:17):
minimized, ridiculed, diminishedby the adults, not even just my
mom, right, but just by theadults.
Like be realistic, and you knowall from a place of oh, we just
want to keep you safe, yeah,yeah, right.
But that's yet anotherconditioning, right.
Like, oh, like, growing big isunsafe Boom, another
(25:37):
conditioning, right.
So with our moms I justmentioned earlier, one of the
beliefs that we want to look atwhen we heal the mother wound is
are you afraid to rock the boatto change the dynamic in your
relationship to your mom if youwere to become more successful,
(25:59):
more wealthy or differentlysuccessful in a way that your
mom never did, never could,never had the opportunity to
right?
So in the beginning of mybusiness I like six months in, I
had thankfully been able togenerate quite a bit of money
quite early on in my businessand that allowed me to just
(26:20):
reinvest into the business anddo a bunch of things.
And I was hyper.
I was like, oh, if I can makelike x amount of money within
six months, I make fill in thesix figure amount within the
next year.
And I proudly shared that withmy mom and the response I got
was oh, don't get too greedy now.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
Yeah, I can relate to that one.
Speaker 3 (26:42):
And I didn't make a lot of money the next few months
of my business, I'll tell youthat.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (26:46):
Yeah, right, so you know you look at that.
And that's the first question Iwould ask you.
Well, are you afraid, does itfeel unsafe to become
differently successful than yourmom?
Has your mom ever displayed asense of creating distance
(27:07):
between the both of you when youhad a big success that she may
never have never had access to?
Did you ever feel guilty whenyou did something for yourself
that may have that you may haveperceived to have affected your
mom's happiness?
Oh, yeah, that time when Istayed away in Japan for
(27:28):
Christmas.
So what we have to look at iswell, where is the source of
your innate, unconditionallovability?
Does your mom hold that remotecontrol?
And then what I like to do is Icall it positive projection.
(27:53):
Right, we project judgmentsonto others, right, we, we think
of our, or we judge ourselvesas ugly, and suddenly the whole
world is ugly.
Oh, they're ugly.
They're ugly, right.
And it's easier to project anegative judgment onto someone
else than to own it forourselves.
Well, we can flip that and wecan look at.
(28:13):
Actually, I feel so much lovewhenever I pet my dog.
There's just unconditional love.
There's no hate I have towardsmy dog, like I just really love
him.
Is it possible for you toredirect that love towards
yourself?
Another way of looking at thisis if you were your own mother,
(28:36):
what needs would you be sure tomeet right now, and can you
carve out some time to go aheadand meet those needs?
Because what has to happen isyou have to sort of give
ourselves the memo, unlearn thatwe need someone else, not just
(28:56):
our mom, but that we needsomeone else to fulfill our
needs.
And we have to unlearn that wecould possibly do something to
become worthy of someone else'slove.
We're all made of love.
We all are love.
We're created by love.
(29:16):
We're made of love.
We're all made of the same love.
How could you ever not belovable if you're made of love?
But that's the authentic self.
Speaking Over time, thatauthentic self gets covered up
by our conditioned self, right?
And that's that's full ofbeliefs, that's that's full of
judgments, that's full ofinternalized beliefs about the
(29:39):
world, right?
So so these three things Ithink I shared three things
right.
Look at, oh.
How do you?
How do you know that to be true?
Who told you that, right?
And if it's someone who's notyou, chances are that's not your
actual belief about the world.
Chances are, there's anopportunity for more loving
(30:00):
thought.
And then follow it up with thenext question Well, who would
you be without that thought?
See if you can find a lovingobject, place or being animal or
human I always think of, likelittle adams peak in sri lanka.
I hiked up there once a fewyears ago and I had this
(30:22):
beautiful meditation for me,that's my unconditional loving
place, right?
So if I'm feeling a littleself-hatredy like little adams
peak, little adams peak, rightso.
So find that that of love, thatplace of love or that being of
love, and see if you cannotredirect some of that love back
towards yourself.
And let's see if I can rememberthe third point that I made.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
Even if you can't.
Honestly, that was a wonderfulway, because it just changes so
much Like it's not just aboutmoney and I want people to see
that.
Yes, I brought that one up formyself, but we do.
We have these beliefs that wehave adopted that are not ours,
(31:10):
and we look at ourselves withjudgment when we shouldn't be.
And, like you said, we areunconditional love, we are
worthy just because we exist,but somewhere along the way we
lose all that.
We develop these limitingbeliefs and so much.
Speaker 3 (31:25):
Yeah, the third point .
I just remembered thanks to youjumping in.
Speaker 2 (31:29):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (31:31):
Looking at, if I was my own mother, what are the
needs I would be sure to meet?
And can I not carve out sometime to go ahead and meet those
needs, to sort of retrainyourself that you, in fact, are
the source of the love that youneed.
You, in fact, are the source ofthe care that you need?
Why?
Because you're an adult, now,right, and yeah, this applies to
(31:52):
a lot of things, includingmoney.
Why?
Because the way in which werelate to one thing is how we
relate to everything, 100%.
If you have a fear of beingabandoned by your mom,
inevitably that shows up in yourclient relationships, that
shows up in your annual reviewswith your boss.
That shows up in your romanticrelationships, that shows up in
(32:14):
your money.
Maybe because you have a fearof being abandoned, you don't
invest because once it's out ofsight, maybe the money will just
abandon you.
So you just put it under yourpillow.
You see how it all connects,right.
Speaker 2 (32:26):
Yeah, and that's why Denise and I are so passionate
about this podcast because wewant people to see that healing
isn't just one thing.
It's not podcast, because wewant people to see that healing
isn't just one thing, it's notokay.
So you're feeling this way, sogo take this.
Well, have you looked at and Idon't love the word mother
wounds, but have you looked atthat?
Have you looked at the fatherwounds?
Have you looked at yourrelationship with yourself?
I love how you said and I'mgoing to butcher how you said it
(32:51):
but if you were your own mother, what would you, what would you
need or how would you be?
Because I think that that is soimportant to look at ourselves.
What do I need in this moment,what do I need today, what do I
need this week?
And we don't do that.
It seems egotistical to stepback and say, well, what do I
need in this moment and can Ihonor that?
Speaker 3 (33:13):
Especially for women, because we've been taught that
to put our own needs first, thatmakes us selfish, and we're
supposed to be the caregivers.
Well, guess what?
You can't pour from an emptycup, right?
So that's a dead argument.
Yeah, go ahead.
Speaker 2 (33:33):
Yeah, no, I just.
This has been such a beautifulconversation, um, is there
anything else you feel like ourlisteners need to hear?
And I I always put people onthe spot like that and sometimes
there's not, but somethingthere's.
Speaker 3 (33:46):
You know, sometimes there's something I did musical
theater for 11 years.
I love the spotlight all daylong.
Well, you know to to sort ofwrap a nice bow tie or whatever
around this conversation andprobably butcher the the phrase
no, um, you know what I justsaid?
(34:10):
The how we relate to anythingis how we relate to everything,
and typically the journey ofhealing is one of coming home to
yourself.
The journey of healing is oneof recognizing that everything
you need the medicine you need,the fix you need is inside
yourself, right.
So it may be really easy, whenyou feel a body ache, to go and
(34:34):
grab some ibuprofen Hell, like Iwant to do it once a month,
right.
But maybe a meditation can bejust as healing, maybe literally
tuning into the pain and goingokay, you're back.
It's been a month.
What are you here to tell me?
Speaker 2 (34:53):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (34:54):
Right, like healing, is a journey of getting to know
yourself right, and you'llnotice, if you were to listen
back to the podcast episode, ifyou wanted to do it a second
time.
Right, you'll notice.
I ask all of these questionsfrom a place of well, how can
you get yourself, how can youget to know yourself better?
Right, the medicine is in thewound.
(35:15):
Do you have the courage?
Healing takes courage.
Do you have the courage tomaybe spend five minutes less on
social media and five minutesmore just examining your body,
doing like an internal body scan, to get to know what your body
feels like?
Speaker 1 (35:37):
Maybe instead of defaulting to the oh yeah, mom,
I'll be over on Thursday, likealways.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Ask yourself if you want to do that.
Speaker 3 (35:44):
Maybe put the phone down for five minutes and ask
yourself, well, what wouldactually feel like a really
loving act of kindness to giveto yourself, to to yourself, on
thursday evening maybe it is togo and have dinner with your mom
, absolutely, and maybe it's notso.
Looking at healing as thoughit's a journey back to yourself
(36:04):
has been really, really helpfulfor me, especially as I travel
so much.
Right, it's like, oh yeah, I'lljust find healing in bali when
I talk to this guru.
Well, but I'm still in mysuitcase, right like all of my
baggage.
All Well, but I'm still in mysuitcase, right Like all of my
baggage.
All of my trauma is still rightthere inside my suitcase.
So I can be as far away fromhome as possible, given the
(36:26):
modern day technology.
I'm still me.
The task of life, the task ofand the excitement about having
this human experience still isto get to know this human
experience, to get to knowyourself.
So that's my invitation Get toknow yourself.
Speaker 2 (36:45):
I got chills Like I just want to jump up and down if
everyone could see me, because100 percent that.
That is my belief, that is my,that is my truth now.
And yeah, there's so manythings I just want to say about
this.
I'll just state one thing.
So there's someone I followedon social media for a long time
and she would always end herstuff with your life is your
(37:09):
medicine.
And I would go what the hell isshe talking about?
And only in I don't know, thelast year did I start to
understand that that medicine isus, it's everything around us.
We are constantly lookingexternally for healing, physical
healing.
Well, this one thing happenedand it caused this.
Or I must be deficient in this,or you know, yes, deficiencies
(37:33):
can exist, deficient in this, or, yes, deficiencies can exist.
But if we're really looking atwhat brings healing, it's not
another thing or another person.
It is looking within.
Am I getting that time innature?
Am I getting the sunlight?
Am I asking myself what I need?
Am I spending time with myself?
Am I digging into those wounds?
There's so much in you thatbrings the healing.
(37:55):
But you're right, people don'twant to go through, they want to
go around because it's toopainful.
Speaker 3 (38:02):
Yeah, but if you go around long enough, going around
becomes more painful than goingit does.
Speaker 2 (38:08):
Eventually they get to that point, but sometimes it
takes a really long time.
Speaker 3 (38:13):
Or maybe another lifetime, you know.
Speaker 2 (38:15):
Yeah, this was such a beautiful conversation.
Speaker 3 (38:18):
Thank you I feel like we could have chatted all day,
but I know we can't.
I'm really grateful to havebeen on and have this
conversation with you.
Speaker 2 (38:28):
I thank you so, so much for having me.
Yeah, so I will put everythingin the show notes, as I always
do, but I always like to askwhere can people find you if
they're looking for you?
Speaker 3 (38:36):
Yeah, Name is way of the founder Instagram and my
websites, where you can find me.
I have a bunch of freebies onboth of those platforms and if
you do, if you come along onInstagram, just come and say hi.
Speaker 2 (38:48):
Love it.
Well, thank you so much.
Thank you listeners you much.
Thank you listeners.
You guys know the drill.
We would love reviews, we wouldlove feedback.
Come to our Instagram, tell uswhat you want to hear about and
we will see you on the nextepisode.
Welcome to the Heal Yourself Podcast, where we dive
deep into all things healing.
I'm Denise, a speech-languagepathologist and a self-love
coach for adults and teens.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
And I'm Kira, a traditional naturopath and
functional nutritionist, and weare here to guide you through
the transformative process ofhealing your body, mind and soul
.
Speaker 1 (00:25):
From the latest in functional medicine to nurturing
your relationship with yourself, healing trauma and even
transforming your money story.
We're here to empower you withthe knowledge and tools to
create lasting change.
Speaker 2 (00:39):
So, whether you're looking to heal physically,
emotionally or spiritually, joinus as we explore the many paths
to wholeness and wellness.
Hello everyone, and welcomeback to another episode.
Today I have a special guestfor you, who I will introduce in
(01:01):
just a moment.
Unfortunately, denise could notbe with us, but it's still
going to be a great episode.
So today I'm talking to DanaMarie, who's the creator of Way
of the Founder, a dynamic spacewhere personal growth, spiritual
exploration and businessleadership converge to help
visionary nomads, expats andother transplants build location
(01:24):
independent businesses withpurpose.
An expat nomad of 10 years andprofessional coach for over five
years, dina Marie empowersentrepreneurs to stop trading
time for money and buildbusinesses that align with their
wildest dreams of freedom andimpact.
And before I say welcome, dina,I want to say, even if you are
(01:44):
not a business owner, it is okay.
I still want you to listen tothis episode.
There's going to be lots foryou.
So, dina, welcome, hello, happyto be here.
Yeah, so happy to have you.
So tell us a little bit aboutyourself.
I know we chatted just a momentbefore recording, but your
story is intriguing.
(02:05):
I love it.
But I think, like I mentioned,even though you're geared
towards entrepreneurs.
This is going to help so manypeople regardless.
Speaker 3 (02:16):
Yeah, absolutely and really, for me, my whole life,
whether it was as a kid, as adancer, as a nine to five person
or as an entrepreneur, my northstar has always been how can I
have more freedom and how can Ihave an actual impact and be
fulfilled doing the thing that Iwant to be doing?
(02:38):
Right, and it sounds superaspirational, right Like wait a
minute you want to have afulfilling life and a great
impact and have the choice toburn it all down and start over
all at the same time in the samelifetime.
Yeah, I kind of do.
Speaker 1 (02:53):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (02:53):
I really do and you know, with that North Star has
always come the courage for meto, like I just said, burn it
all down Right.
I grew up in Germany,originally from Germany, and I
had an amazing opportunity tocome to the United States and
study there and with that myprofessional background has
really become orchestramanagement.
(03:14):
So I was in the weeds, I wasfundraising, I was planning
community engagement events forclassical orchestras, and what
always excited me most about mywork in the office was the work
I could do outside the officewhere I could work with aspiring
musicians or with professionalmusicians who were aspiring
(03:36):
entrepreneurs.
We're like Dina.
I have this idea and I thinkit's going to make a huge impact
on the community that I careabout.
I just don't know the business.
Can you help me Right and fastforward?
I'm sure we'll get into why andhow I quit my job and how that
all turned into me being a nomadnow and living in Da Nang for
(03:57):
the time being.
But fast forward.
I work as a coach with those whoseek more freedom in their
lives, specifically more freedomof choice.
That might look like becomingor being a nomad.
That might look like being anomad and wanting to quit your
job and build your own business.
That might look like I justwant to have the choice to work
(04:19):
from a different state or fromout of the country for a month
or three months a year, right?
So freedom, if we really lookat it, just like success.
We really look at it.
We all have a differentdefinition for it.
We tend to all pursue the samedefinition and that's a problem
that I'm sure we'll get into.
But if we really look at it andif we really return to our most
(04:42):
authentic, most loving self, weall have a different idea for
what success or freedom aremeant to look, feel like and
taste like, right?
So that's what I do with myclients.
I help them build the lifethat's truly authentic to them,
wildly fulfilling and massivelyimpactful.
Because when you are happy, ifyou become happy and fulfilled,
(05:05):
that has a ripple effect.
The work that you do in theworld, if you do it from a place
of authenticity, it has anamazing and a positive and a
loving ripple effect.
And that's what I'm reallyinterested in.
That's my guiding star.
Speaker 2 (05:18):
Yeah, well, and it's.
It's such a powerful thing too,because I think it's so easy to
take one path in life and belike, well, I'm here, so I'm
just going to stick with it.
And I think so many are lackingpurpose and passion in their
lives and then they're wonderingwhy they're chronically ill.
Like, yeah, that can be afactor If you're not living out
(05:40):
your life's purpose and you'rejust going through the motions
and pleasing others and'm justgoing to my nine to five.
Yeah, it's no wonder you're,you know, dealing with ongoing
stuff and freedom, like you said, means different things to
different people.
That's actually my number onevalue.
So I always talk to clientsabout are we even working from
our values?
Do we know what our values areIf your value is freedom and
(06:02):
you're not living afreedom-based life, whatever
that looks like?
Again, good luck.
Speaker 3 (06:08):
Right, right, yeah.
And I think you know, when itcomes to just sort of going
through the motions andrealizing that you're actually
not living or living towardsyour purpose, I think it's easy
to say, oh yeah, like I want todo something that's on purpose
for me.
But if we really look at themindset of it, more often than
(06:29):
not I find that in working withmy clients there is a real
identity shift that has tohappen.
If you're looking to switchcareers, if you're looking to
change your tax status, akaleave your 9 to 5 and become an
entrepreneur, right, becausemore often than not we identify
with the path towards successthat has been laid out for us.
(06:54):
If we follow that, I will belovable.
If I follow that path ofsuccess, I will be worthy of
fill in the blanks love right.
So there is some real inner workthat has to take place more
often than not where we canreclaim the source of love right
.
More often than not, aschildren, at some point that
(07:16):
source gets given away tosomeone, to something, to source
outside ourselves, and if wemake that source happy, maybe,
maybe then we'll be seen assuccessful, maybe then we'll
seen as lovable right.
So the path out of a nine tofive, or even if you stay in a
nine to five, you switch yourcareer and you rearrange your
(07:38):
life for purpose, that pathinevitably has come across the
point where you take backcontrol.
I describe to my clients youtake back the remote control
over your feelings and you say,no, I'm the one who's pushing
the buttons, because I know thatI'm responsible for my
happiness.
That means others don't get tohave control over that, and
(08:00):
that's easier said than done.
But however uncomfortable thatjourney may be, it's also one of
the most rewarding journeysthat I've personally ever gone
on.
Speaker 2 (08:14):
Yeah, so I can relate .
I was a nine to five.
I was a middle school Englishteacher for years and then made
the leap myself.
So yeah, tell us a little bit.
How did you get to that place,like what caused you to leave
your job and go down this road?
Speaker 3 (08:37):
The year is 2019.
Over a decade following a pathnot only of predefined and
predetermined success, but apath that I hoped would help me
gain my parents' approval andvalidation right.
There was a lot of chaos in myearly childhood and that sort of
(08:59):
had me end up in a place whereuncertainty wasn't really
something I gelled with right.
So I always made sure that Iknew the next step and I always
made sure that I had tunnelvision on that next step.
Because feeling all of thefeelings from my past, from my
childhood, feeling all of thetrauma, allowing all of the
(09:21):
feelings in that felt reallychaotic, really overwhelming.
It felt like it might drown me.
It didn't, but took a lot ofdamn courage to let them back in
right.
So it felt easier, it felt morecomfortable to follow someone
else's path towards success, andso I did right.
I graduated, I went to the US.
(09:42):
That was unconventional.
I'll say that I went to the us.
That was unconventional.
I'll say that I went to the usas an international student on a
full scholarship, like that'sunheard of um, and by the time I
was settled in my job and I wasbeginning to get promotions, I
looked around and this life thatthis person named Dina was
(10:04):
living, was beautiful, was great, right, perfect LA, the great
job, the dream job, a cute car,great relationship, but I
couldn't see myself in it and Icouldn't see myself in it.
I felt like every day I wasjust living this weird
out-of-body experience.
(10:24):
It's like, oh yeah, I know,this is my body, I know that I,
the soul, made this all happen,but it doesn't feel authentic.
And then I began to ask myselfsome really deep questions.
I would drive into the office,or I would drive into work an
hour early to have anopportunity to sit in a cafe
(10:44):
before going into the office tojust journal.
And I would ask myselfquestions every morning like who
would I be if this careerdidn't define my life, if money
wasn't a problem?
What would I want to do If Iwasn't afraid what my mom would
think of me quitting this job?
What would I do, yeah, if Icould just pause?
(11:10):
How would I relate to myself?
How would I relate to my body?
And then, at one point,everything just sort of came to
a head.
You know, I was living in theUS, working in the US on a visa
as an expat.
My visa was up for renewal andour board chair sat me down and
she was like we love you and wewant to keep you around.
(11:30):
We'll pay for your visa, we'llsponsor you.
And also, here's more money andhere's a promotion.
Any normal person would havebeen like yes, okay, great like
any normal person would havebeen like yes, okay, great and
expats, dream come true, right,and I had a nervous breakdown
(11:50):
that evening and I walked in thenext morning with so much
clarity more clarity than I hadever had in my life and I handed
in my two weeks notice and Icame home that day and I put a
one-way ticket out of thecountry to Ho Chi Minh City,
vietnam not the reason why.
I'm currently in Vietnam.
That was a backpacking trip tojust sort of, you know, get my
bearings.
But yeah, I just cold turkeyquit.
(12:12):
I had no plan, I just knew this, ain't it?
yeah this ain't it and it was.
You know, sometimes you do thething that you've been afraid of
for years, but somewhere withinthe last few months, not doing
the thing is actually scarierthan doing it.
There comes a tipping point,and that was that for me, like
staying in the job was likefeels like a death sentence.
(12:36):
Right, Not because the job wasbad it wasn't great leadership
but because it was so out ofalignment with what I wanted to
do, with what I wanted to say,with who I wanted to become.
So I quit.
Speaker 2 (12:50):
I love that.
Good for you.
I mean similar, and I won't getinto my story, obviously, but I
understand where you're comingfrom and I think it's so easy
for women to hold themselvesback.
No, no, no, no, we're going toplay safe.
We can't do that crazy thingwhen, in reality, that crazy
thing is going to bring youcloser to you.
Sometimes we need to do thatcrazy thing that gets you out of
(13:13):
the box.
Otherwise, you're just going tokeep remaining in the same
pattern and you're not living.
Speaker 3 (13:19):
Yeah, absolutely.
You know, I talk a lot aboutthe mother wound.
Speaker 2 (13:23):
I was I.
It's so funny that you saidthat because I was, you
mentioned mother and I'm like,hmm, let's talk about the mother
wounds.
Let's talk about it For thosethat don't know what is the
mother wound.
Speaker 3 (13:36):
Well, a mother wound is a lot of things.
So actually there is a bookthat I like to reference, for
all those who are interested,brave enough to read it, by
bethany bethany webster.
She wrote a book calleddiscovering the inner mother,
and I really like that term.
(13:56):
The inner mother mother woundsounds really drastic and I'll
say, looking at our relationship, especially as women, looking
at our relationship to our mom,that's a drastic move to dare to
question what our moms told us,to dare to question, uh, our
mom's beliefs about life and theworld that at some point as
(14:19):
children we have internalized.
That takes bravery right.
So there's there's truth tocalling it the mother wound, but
I really do love the, the, thehealing term discovering the
inner mother.
Right, you're not onlyremothering yourself in healing
the mother wound, but but you'recreating a whole new
(14:40):
relationship.
That sounds a little compoundy,but you're learning to relate
differently to your relationshipto your mom, and I'll get into
that.
You asked me a question, thoughwhat is the mother wound?
Well, it's the enmeshment ofthe daughter's identity with
that of the mom.
Right, and it manifests in somany different things, right.
(15:03):
Typically, you'll find thatmanifest when you feel as though
you can't be yourself aroundyour mom, when you weigh every
decision that you make in yourlife against what your mom will
think about it, when you changethe color of your hair because
of something that your mom said.
Speaker 2 (15:21):
I'm raising my hand for those who can't see, I'm
like how many women are like, ohcrap that's me, right.
Speaker 3 (15:26):
Like right now, I wear my natural hair color and I
freaking love it.
I adore it.
I'm like, literally in lovewith my hair, not from a
narcissistic place, but it tookme a really long time to no
longer dye my hair the way mymom dyes her hair.
Yeah, time to no longer dye myhair the the way my mom dyes her
hair.
Yeah, right.
So that's the mother wound.
(15:46):
It's it's an enmeshment of youridentity with that of your mom.
I believe we all have the motherwound to an extent.
We all have an opportunity tolook at.
Okay, well, this beautifulcaregiver called my mom, she
raised me, and some of herthoughts I have taken on and
thought that they are my own.
But do I have an opportunity toexamine these thoughts and do I
(16:08):
really believe these thoughts?
That's the surface level, right, and sometimes, if we have a
really healthy relationship withour moms, that's where we get
to stop.
But sometimes we don't.
Sometimes we become thecaregiver of our moms
emotionally, right, way tooearly on.
I'm not talking about when wewere 15, our moms are 70.
I'm talking about when we werefive, right, yeah, we become the
(16:33):
parentified daughter and wetake on an emotional
responsibility that we're notmeant to take on, right?
So that plays out in manydifferent ways in adult life,
and I mentioned a few of them.
Right, it's when we weigh ourdecisions against what our moms
will think about us and how thatwill affect the emotional
wellbeing of our moms, becausewe haven't yet understood that
(16:56):
in the same way in which I haveto claim back the remote control
over my emotions, I also haveto claim back the remote control
over my emotions.
I also have to give back theremote control over the emotions
of my mom to my mom.
Right, and that's the work ofhealing the mother wound is a
disentanglement of identities.
Speaker 2 (17:16):
Yeah, I love that description, and one thing I
want to clarify for ourlisteners is just because you
had a wonderful relationshipgrowing up with your mother
doesn't mean you can't havemother wounds.
The thing is is we are soimpressionable between the ages
of zero and seven that's wheneverything comes about.
Our beliefs are all of it right, our programming is what I'll
(17:40):
call it, and as you get older inlife you start to question some
of that.
So, again, you can have anamazing relationship with your
mother.
It doesn't mean she was bad.
It means we're doing the samething to our children and
they're going to do the samething to theirs.
We're just adopting at that agewhat we're being told, and so
(18:00):
it's not a bad thing.
But, like you said, it's, it'sunweaving that it's, I say,
unlearning.
We have to unlearn some stuff.
Speaker 3 (18:08):
It's unlearning, it's deconditioning, and you know,
there are two things I want toecho and to expound on in what
you're saying.
We all have a mother wound,right, we all have an
opportunity to examine ourrelationship to our moms.
And two things here.
One, that doesn't mean our momsare bad.
(18:30):
That doesn't mean that we haveto begin to judge our moms.
Like, the whole process oflooking at oh wait, a minute,
that's my mom's identity, that'snot actually my identity that
that process has to be full ofself-compassion and empathy for
our little kids, our inner childand our moms, right, like
(18:53):
there's, hate has no place inhealing.
Judgment has no place inhealing, in fact it hinders it.
Right, and and a more right toto those to the male listeners
who may be tuning into thepodcast right, we're talking
about the daughter motherrelationship.
That's just a very, very primalrelationship, right, and
(19:16):
there's so that.
So that societal factors thatfactor into how a woman views
her, her place in society, right, but every child has to some
extent or another and enmeshedidentity with their primary
caregiver.
Right, and a more allencompassing term, of course, to
to look at that as trauma.
Speaker 1 (19:38):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (19:38):
And you have trauma, I have trauma, the next person
has trauma.
My trauma isn't bigger thanyours.
I find that a lot when peopleare beginning to heal, it's like
oh, you know, it wasn't thatbad.
I don't actually have thatbigger trauma, and that may be
true.
You most definitely didn'texperience everything else that
(19:59):
the next person experienced.
Your trauma is very unique toyou and you get to claim it
right.
You get to find the wisdomwithin it, you get to find the
lessons within it, and only byaccepting what happened as
(20:19):
having happened, without ajudgment, without having to blow
it out of proportion or todiminish it.
No, this happened.
And in accepting it point blank.
Now what becomes available isforgiveness work.
Now, what becomes available iscompassion and empathy, and what
becomes available is and Ithink bethany webster says this
(20:39):
in her book is the medicineinside the wound healing it's
healing that's where the healingprocess begins.
In order, to heal trauma.
You can't go around it, youcan't circumvent the trauma.
Yeah, yeah, you have to gothrough, and what's inside of it
is wisdom.
What's inside of it is emotionsthat carry insights and
(21:01):
knowledge and that want to bereleased.
The only burden about theemotions is they haven't yet
been felt right.
So my first coach said this tome.
I always say is to my clientsthese days, the only way through
is through 100%.
Speaker 2 (21:19):
So, talking about the mother wound, it's funny
because, as you're saying, someof that, I'm like yep, yep, yep,
but without judgment.
But one thing I started tonotice over the years was my
issues with money.
Now do I think that they'vecome from both parents?
Yes, but a lot of times, evenspeaking with Denise, who I know
(21:42):
is not here, when we were at um, well, we spent a weekend
together doing a bunch of stuffand the conversation kept coming
up of like where do all thesemoney issues come from?
And whenever I would bringsomething up, go back to my
mother.
So talk to us about the motherwound and money well, I'll start
(22:03):
there.
Speaker 3 (22:07):
So, when it comes to any any form of conditioning
right childhood trauma,conditioned self um,
internalized thoughts, limitingbeliefs, the mother wound right
we always want to look at.
First of all, you have to allowyourself to become aware of the
fact that a thought may notnecessarily be fact, it might be
(22:30):
fiction, right.
And then you want to look atwell, how do I know that?
Where does that thought comefrom?
And there are different ways toask the question.
I always like to ask this verybroad question oh, how do I know
this?
How how did I learn this?
And yeah, if, as women, we arein the midst of looking at our
(22:55):
relationship to our moms andtypically you know, from our mid
twenties to our mid thirties,that that's I personally found
to be like the prime agesTypically that answer does end
up being oh yeah, like somethingthat my mom did, taught me that
that.
Or my mom always used to saythat right.
Or that's just how my momhandled money right.
(23:16):
Or again, that's how my dadhandled money.
Or that's how my guardianhandled money right, like, oh
yeah, like I learned that inchildhood and that's what we
turn to right, we come into thislife and we're helpless, right,
the human being.
As babies, we're helpless.
We require help, right?
(23:38):
So very quickly we learnadaptive behavior in order to
keep ourselves safe.
Oh, if I smile, I get milk.
Oh, if I don't cry, then this.
Oh, if I hide this emotion,then that right.
And as we grow older and older,all of this turns into
something that started veryinnocently oh if I don't cry
right.
But suddenly, as we grow older,that turns into oh, if I don't
(24:01):
make more money than my mom everdid in her life, she'll always
love me.
Yeah, that's money in themother wound so this one's a
loaded question.
Speaker 2 (24:15):
How do you begin to chip away at that?
Because I guarantee there arelisteners going oh my gosh, I
have so many money issues and Ican't attract more money or I
hit a cap on money.
Whether you're an entrepreneuror whatever it might be, how do
you start to chip away at that?
Speaker 3 (24:34):
Yeah.
So, if it's okay, I want totell just a brief story because
I feel like I haven't talkedmuch about personal relationship
with my mom and listeners mightbe like who is she to talk
about?
So, specifically to money, Ihave a hundred stories to tell
about me and my mom, and my momand I have a really good
relationship these days.
(24:54):
But two years ago that certainlywasn't the case.
Five years ago most certainlynot Right.
And in the beginning of mybusiness I've always had really
big goals Like ever since I wasa child.
I've always had really biggoals.
Like ever since I was a childI've always had really big
visions, right.
And I remember as a child someof these visions would be
(25:17):
minimized, ridiculed, diminishedby the adults, not even just my
mom, right, but just by theadults.
Like be realistic, and you knowall from a place of oh, we just
want to keep you safe, yeah,yeah, right.
But that's yet anotherconditioning, right.
Like, oh, like, growing big isunsafe Boom, another
(25:37):
conditioning, right.
So with our moms I justmentioned earlier, one of the
beliefs that we want to look atwhen we heal the mother wound is
are you afraid to rock the boatto change the dynamic in your
relationship to your mom if youwere to become more successful,
(25:59):
more wealthy or differentlysuccessful in a way that your
mom never did, never could,never had the opportunity to
right?
So in the beginning of mybusiness I like six months in, I
had thankfully been able togenerate quite a bit of money
quite early on in my businessand that allowed me to just
(26:20):
reinvest into the business anddo a bunch of things.
And I was hyper.
I was like, oh, if I can makelike x amount of money within
six months, I make fill in thesix figure amount within the
next year.
And I proudly shared that withmy mom and the response I got
was oh, don't get too greedy now.
Speaker 2 (26:39):
Yeah, I can relate to that one.
Speaker 3 (26:42):
And I didn't make a lot of money the next few months
of my business, I'll tell youthat.
Speaker 2 (26:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (26:46):
Yeah, right, so you know you look at that.
And that's the first question Iwould ask you.
Well, are you afraid, does itfeel unsafe to become
differently successful than yourmom?
Has your mom ever displayed asense of creating distance
(27:07):
between the both of you when youhad a big success that she may
never have never had access to?
Did you ever feel guilty whenyou did something for yourself
that may have that you may haveperceived to have affected your
mom's happiness?
Oh, yeah, that time when Istayed away in Japan for
(27:28):
Christmas.
So what we have to look at iswell, where is the source of
your innate, unconditionallovability?
Does your mom hold that remotecontrol?
And then what I like to do is Icall it positive projection.
(27:53):
Right, we project judgmentsonto others, right, we, we think
of our, or we judge ourselvesas ugly, and suddenly the whole
world is ugly.
Oh, they're ugly.
They're ugly, right.
And it's easier to project anegative judgment onto someone
else than to own it forourselves.
Well, we can flip that and wecan look at.
(28:13):
Actually, I feel so much lovewhenever I pet my dog.
There's just unconditional love.
There's no hate I have towardsmy dog, like I just really love
him.
Is it possible for you toredirect that love towards
yourself?
Another way of looking at thisis if you were your own mother,
(28:36):
what needs would you be sure tomeet right now, and can you
carve out some time to go aheadand meet those needs?
Because what has to happen isyou have to sort of give
ourselves the memo, unlearn thatwe need someone else, not just
(28:56):
our mom, but that we needsomeone else to fulfill our
needs.
And we have to unlearn that wecould possibly do something to
become worthy of someone else'slove.
We're all made of love.
We all are love.
We're created by love.
(29:16):
We're made of love.
We're all made of the same love.
How could you ever not belovable if you're made of love?
But that's the authentic self.
Speaking Over time, thatauthentic self gets covered up
by our conditioned self, right?
And that's that's full ofbeliefs, that's that's full of
judgments, that's full ofinternalized beliefs about the
(29:39):
world, right?
So so these three things Ithink I shared three things
right.
Look at, oh.
How do you?
How do you know that to be true?
Who told you that, right?
And if it's someone who's notyou, chances are that's not your
actual belief about the world.
Chances are, there's anopportunity for more loving
(30:00):
thought.
And then follow it up with thenext question Well, who would
you be without that thought?
See if you can find a lovingobject, place or being animal or
human I always think of, likelittle adams peak in sri lanka.
I hiked up there once a fewyears ago and I had this
(30:22):
beautiful meditation for me,that's my unconditional loving
place, right?
So if I'm feeling a littleself-hatredy like little adams
peak, little adams peak, rightso.
So find that that of love, thatplace of love or that being of
love, and see if you cannotredirect some of that love back
towards yourself.
And let's see if I can rememberthe third point that I made.
Speaker 2 (30:48):
Even if you can't.
Honestly, that was a wonderfulway, because it just changes so
much Like it's not just aboutmoney and I want people to see
that.
Yes, I brought that one up formyself, but we do.
We have these beliefs that wehave adopted that are not ours,
(31:10):
and we look at ourselves withjudgment when we shouldn't be.
And, like you said, we areunconditional love, we are
worthy just because we exist,but somewhere along the way we
lose all that.
We develop these limitingbeliefs and so much.
Speaker 3 (31:25):
Yeah, the third point .
I just remembered thanks to youjumping in.
Speaker 2 (31:29):
Yeah, yeah, yeah.
Speaker 3 (31:31):
Looking at, if I was my own mother, what are the
needs I would be sure to meet?
And can I not carve out sometime to go ahead and meet those
needs, to sort of retrainyourself that you, in fact, are
the source of the love that youneed.
You, in fact, are the source ofthe care that you need?
Why?
Because you're an adult, now,right, and yeah, this applies to
(31:52):
a lot of things, includingmoney.
Why?
Because the way in which werelate to one thing is how we
relate to everything, 100%.
If you have a fear of beingabandoned by your mom,
inevitably that shows up in yourclient relationships, that
shows up in your annual reviewswith your boss.
That shows up in your romanticrelationships, that shows up in
(32:14):
your money.
Maybe because you have a fearof being abandoned, you don't
invest because once it's out ofsight, maybe the money will just
abandon you.
So you just put it under yourpillow.
You see how it all connects,right.
Speaker 2 (32:26):
Yeah, and that's why Denise and I are so passionate
about this podcast because wewant people to see that healing
isn't just one thing.
It's not podcast, because wewant people to see that healing
isn't just one thing, it's notokay.
So you're feeling this way, sogo take this.
Well, have you looked at and Idon't love the word mother
wounds, but have you looked atthat?
Have you looked at the fatherwounds?
Have you looked at yourrelationship with yourself?
I love how you said and I'mgoing to butcher how you said it
(32:51):
but if you were your own mother, what would you, what would you
need or how would you be?
Because I think that that is soimportant to look at ourselves.
What do I need in this moment,what do I need today, what do I
need this week?
And we don't do that.
It seems egotistical to stepback and say, well, what do I
need in this moment and can Ihonor that?
Speaker 3 (33:13):
Especially for women, because we've been taught that
to put our own needs first, thatmakes us selfish, and we're
supposed to be the caregivers.
Well, guess what?
You can't pour from an emptycup, right?
So that's a dead argument.
Yeah, go ahead.
Speaker 2 (33:33):
Yeah, no, I just.
This has been such a beautifulconversation, um, is there
anything else you feel like ourlisteners need to hear?
And I I always put people onthe spot like that and sometimes
there's not, but somethingthere's.
Speaker 3 (33:46):
You know, sometimes there's something I did musical
theater for 11 years.
I love the spotlight all daylong.
Well, you know to to sort ofwrap a nice bow tie or whatever
around this conversation andprobably butcher the the phrase
no, um, you know what I justsaid?
(34:10):
The how we relate to anythingis how we relate to everything,
and typically the journey ofhealing is one of coming home to
yourself.
The journey of healing is oneof recognizing that everything
you need the medicine you need,the fix you need is inside
yourself, right.
So it may be really easy, whenyou feel a body ache, to go and
(34:34):
grab some ibuprofen Hell, like Iwant to do it once a month,
right.
But maybe a meditation can bejust as healing, maybe literally
tuning into the pain and goingokay, you're back.
It's been a month.
What are you here to tell me?
Speaker 2 (34:53):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (34:54):
Right, like healing, is a journey of getting to know
yourself right, and you'llnotice, if you were to listen
back to the podcast episode, ifyou wanted to do it a second
time.
Right, you'll notice.
I ask all of these questionsfrom a place of well, how can
you get yourself, how can youget to know yourself better?
Right, the medicine is in thewound.
(35:15):
Do you have the courage?
Healing takes courage.
Do you have the courage tomaybe spend five minutes less on
social media and five minutesmore just examining your body,
doing like an internal body scan, to get to know what your body
feels like?
Speaker 1 (35:37):
Maybe instead of defaulting to the oh yeah, mom,
I'll be over on Thursday, likealways.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
Ask yourself if you want to do that.
Speaker 3 (35:44):
Maybe put the phone down for five minutes and ask
yourself, well, what wouldactually feel like a really
loving act of kindness to giveto yourself, to to yourself, on
thursday evening maybe it is togo and have dinner with your mom
, absolutely, and maybe it's notso.
Looking at healing as thoughit's a journey back to yourself
(36:04):
has been really, really helpfulfor me, especially as I travel
so much.
Right, it's like, oh yeah, I'lljust find healing in bali when
I talk to this guru.
Well, but I'm still in mysuitcase, right like all of my
baggage.
All Well, but I'm still in mysuitcase, right Like all of my
baggage.
All of my trauma is still rightthere inside my suitcase.
So I can be as far away fromhome as possible, given the
(36:26):
modern day technology.
I'm still me.
The task of life, the task ofand the excitement about having
this human experience still isto get to know this human
experience, to get to knowyourself.
So that's my invitation Get toknow yourself.
Speaker 2 (36:45):
I got chills Like I just want to jump up and down if
everyone could see me, because100 percent that.
That is my belief, that is my,that is my truth now.
And yeah, there's so manythings I just want to say about
this.
I'll just state one thing.
So there's someone I followedon social media for a long time
and she would always end herstuff with your life is your
(37:09):
medicine.
And I would go what the hell isshe talking about?
And only in I don't know, thelast year did I start to
understand that that medicine isus, it's everything around us.
We are constantly lookingexternally for healing, physical
healing.
Well, this one thing happenedand it caused this.
Or I must be deficient in this,or you know, yes, deficiencies
(37:33):
can exist, deficient in this, or, yes, deficiencies can exist.
But if we're really looking atwhat brings healing, it's not
another thing or another person.
It is looking within.
Am I getting that time innature?
Am I getting the sunlight?
Am I asking myself what I need?
Am I spending time with myself?
Am I digging into those wounds?
There's so much in you thatbrings the healing.
(37:55):
But you're right, people don'twant to go through, they want to
go around because it's toopainful.
Speaker 3 (38:02):
Yeah, but if you go around long enough, going around
becomes more painful than goingit does.
Speaker 2 (38:08):
Eventually they get to that point, but sometimes it
takes a really long time.
Speaker 3 (38:13):
Or maybe another lifetime, you know.
Speaker 2 (38:15):
Yeah, this was such a beautiful conversation.
Speaker 3 (38:18):
Thank you I feel like we could have chatted all day,
but I know we can't.
I'm really grateful to havebeen on and have this
conversation with you.
Speaker 2 (38:28):
I thank you so, so much for having me.
Yeah, so I will put everythingin the show notes, as I always
do, but I always like to askwhere can people find you if
they're looking for you?
Speaker 3 (38:36):
Yeah, Name is way of the founder Instagram and my
websites, where you can find me.
I have a bunch of freebies onboth of those platforms and if
you do, if you come along onInstagram, just come and say hi.
Speaker 2 (38:48):
Love it.
Well, thank you so much.
Thank you listeners you much.
Thank you listeners.
You guys know the drill.
We would love reviews, we wouldlove feedback.
Come to our Instagram, tell uswhat you want to hear about and
we will see you on the nextepisode.
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