May 7, 2025 • 26 mins
Heads tend to compartmentalize everything. Hearts are more likely to flow things together that are linked by similar emotions. This can lead to conflict in a relationship when we don't understand it or assume that our partner does it the same way as we do. Putting things in boxes also makes the Head partner seem like an uncaring narcissist or unfeeling robot. Lumping things together makes the Heart partner seem irrational at times. In this episode, Randy and Beverly offer some insight into why it happens, where it leads and how to resolve the problem. Learn more about the hosts and their work at HeartAndHeadCoaching.com
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Episode Transcript
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SPEAKER_00 (00:00):
Welcome to Heart vs.
Head, a podcast that helpscouples communicate and fight
better.
Here are your hosts, RandyHampton and Beverly Craddock.
SPEAKER_01 (00:19):
It's Randy and Beverly, and welcome to the
podcast.
I have to say, Randy, today'spodcast almost didn't happen.
SPEAKER_02 (00:27):
Oh, really?
SPEAKER_01 (00:28):
Well, I woke up with a headache.
SPEAKER_02 (00:30):
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (00:31):
And it might have been from the wine last night.
Could have been.
But who cares what it's from?
I woke up with a headache.
And the one thing I've noticedabout hearts is that when we
have a health issue, whensomething's going on physically
with us, not just emotionally,this was strictly a headache,
(00:51):
it's purely physical, it reallymakes it hard for me and for
most hearts to push throughthat.
I look at you and you tell methe stories of times where
you've had just a debilitatingmigraine.
I mean, the one that comes tomind is before the pandemic,
there was a day where Randy hada migraine during a session with
(01:14):
a client.
And he said he literally, hisvision was so impaired, he could
not see the client, but hedidn't miss a step.
And he not only completed thesession, the client oblivious to
his migraine, but it was abomber session.
Well, like most of yoursessions.
Thank you.
SPEAKER_02 (01:35):
It's interesting because I don't, gosh, I don't
know how to explain it.
I know it's a thing becausewe've talked about it with
clients, but I don't put Randyhas a headache or Randy's knee
is hurting into the category ofthat has anything to do with
work.
SPEAKER_01 (01:51):
Right.
It's this thing about puttingissues in a box.
Randy and I have talked aboutthis many, many times.
I believe it's in the couple'srule book, the book we wrote
that's available on Amazon.
Little pitch, sorry.
Hearts are much more attuned tonot only emotional things, but
(02:13):
body sensations, discomfort,fatigue, changes in our mood or
energy.
SPEAKER_02 (02:19):
You're all feelers.
I mean, you feel stuff.
And so I know when Beverly has aheadache, she feels that.
And if It affects, I guess, theability to function sometimes on
all the other levels, like doinga podcast.
SPEAKER_01 (02:58):
And–
SPEAKER_02 (03:28):
That's crazy.
(03:58):
Partner will say, well, yeah,but I remember in 1974 when my
partner did this or did that.
And hearts are just so connectedto all of it.
How does that work for you guys?
SPEAKER_01 (04:16):
We don't put things in boxes.
Hearts tend to really lumpeverything together.
It's like this deepinterconnected web where all of
our thoughts and feelings thedifferent relationships we have.
Everything in our life isinterconnected.
So that's why today, a headache,my body, how I'm feeling
(04:38):
physically.
Also, it impacts my work, thispodcast, even our relationship.
I'm sure I've been a little bitless energy, less good mood
today.
It is very hard for me or for aheart to deal with that.
It's very overwhelming, as youmight say.
say, and it's this naturaltendency that hearts have when
(05:03):
we absorb emotions from others,we read people because we care
about them so much, and it'sjust the way that we interpret
things and we give it such abigger, broader context.
And so it becomes reallydifficult for us to isolate
things from each other orcompartmentalize or put it in a
(05:24):
box as heads do.
Although I will say beingmarried to I do see an
SPEAKER_02 (05:34):
advantage to doing that.
(05:57):
All of these things.
So if she wakes up and says, Ihave a headache, I say, we have
some ibuprofen.
I would be happy to get yousome.
I get overwhelmed even just whenyou start talking about trying
to manage all that stuff.
My brain just goes, no, I don'thave time for that.
We are, as heads, we are systembuilders.
(06:18):
That's kind of what made me verygood in the job that I had for
years as a journalist and as anews director, building these
systems, going in and Yeah.
(06:57):
No, you can't yell at me andthen go have a romantic lunch.
(07:18):
I am not
SPEAKER_01 (07:20):
going to let you.
I
SPEAKER_02 (07:29):
know.
I know that.
I have tried.
SPEAKER_01 (07:33):
Well, while heads have strengths in the way that
you process and make decisionsthat way, hearts also have
strengths in the way that we doit.
So being naturally tuned in toemotional subtext, to things
that are unspoken, nonverbal, itreally helps us to understand
people really so much more.
And it creates that harmony.
(07:56):
It makes us feel We're veryauthentic, very open and honest
with genuine with who we are andwhat we're feeling.
And it also brings up differentissues, deeper issues, things
that you might just brush overbecause you don't want to deal
with the emotion.
Those are things that a lot oftimes hearts will spot and we
(08:17):
will press further because wethink something bigger is going
on.
The challenge to hearts,obviously, besides the ones
you've mentioned, is true It'soverwhelming, but also it comes
across as irrational.
It comes across as crazy,especially when our emotions are
very intense.
And sometimes it gets in the wayof solving problems.
(08:41):
And this is where couples comein and they really are at a
standstill.
And it's one of those thingsthat it's easy for Randy and I
to spot once you understandhearts and heads.
Beyond talking about thedifferences, which is great to
really understand yourself yourpartner, how these strengths and
challenges might present in yourown world.
(09:03):
We also have some tips for it,some solutions.
SPEAKER_02 (09:06):
Yeah, it's not hard to solve, and it's probably
easiest to solve just byunderstanding a little bit about
it.
So the basic of it, as we'vekind of already explained long,
let me make the short version ofit, heads are
compartmentalizers.
We have boxes in our mind wherethings go.
(09:27):
So when When somebody sayssomething, we say, oh, this is
that, and that's where it goes.
Hearts are lumpers.
Everything just kind of is allinterconnected, flowing not
together.
We process the worlddifferently.
SPEAKER_01 (09:46):
Which also means we make decisions differently
because of that processing.
It's difficult for me, as Isaid, to imagine having some
kind of personal disagreementwhere I feel somewhat attacked
or get defensive and then beable to just go have a nice
lunch.
A lot of times this shows upwhen couples have a date night
(10:06):
and maybe the topics get a bitargumentative or discussion
during dinner and what wassupposed to end up in some great
intimacy at the end end up inthis big blow up and there's no
way to recover.
SPEAKER_02 (10:21):
Actually, I remember a Valentine's Day dinner that
went that way for us.
When you can say, okay Headpartner is compartmentalizing
this heart partner is lumpingthis and sit down and talk about
how are you doing that?
How are you processing that?
How are you thinking about that?
How are you feeling about that?
(10:43):
And you can begin to beintellectually and emotionally
curious with your partner.
That's the biggest thing you cando.
Take that kind of emotion out ofit.
Impossible for hearts, but kindof take the emotion out of it
for a minute.
Be a scientist.
Ask some questions.
(11:03):
Ask your partner, how do you dothat?
Because I can't do it that way.
How do you do that?
And it will solve a lot of theseproblems if you can do it in a
non-confrontational, hey, I'mcurious kind of way.
SPEAKER_01 (11:20):
Which is how we wrote the book as social
scientists is we startedbreaking things down and every
fight we had was, wait, wait,pause, hold that thought.
This is good for the book.
What did you just say?
Why did you just say that?
What was behind that?
What were you thinking?
What were you feeling?
We started separating things,breaking them down, putting them
(11:40):
in boxes in order to write thebook, which is probably a good
way to write any
SPEAKER_02 (11:46):
book.
The best way to write a book isto actually have some subtopics.
SPEAKER_01 (11:52):
Makes it logical instead of a lot of books
written by hearts are a littlehard to follow.
I will give you
SPEAKER_02 (11:57):
that.
A little over here, a littleover there.
Oh, I remember this thing that,whoa, wait, where'd we go?
We tell couples that all thetime.
We talk to couples, we say, ifyou really want a great
relationship and you want tocommunicate with your partner,
you really want that greatrelationship, write a book about
relationships because it taughtus so much to be able to sit
(12:18):
back and go, why are you doingthat?
And not in a, why are you doingthat?
But in a, wait a second, I'mcurious about this kind of way.
And we realized we quitfighting.
We just don't have disagreementsthat don't have a purpose.
We still have disagreements.
We're two different people, butwe don't have disagreements that
(12:40):
don't serve a purpose.
When there is a disagreement,we're able to go, okay, what's
this about?
Why is it that way for you?
Why is it that way for me?
And we're able to make progressin our relationship.
Our relationship gets strongerthrough the disagreements, not
torn apart by the disagreements,I think, in a lot of ways.
SPEAKER_01 (13:00):
I would also give you some credit for recognizing
that I am a heart and emotionalprocessor.
And so if something you says inthe disagreement gives me that
look of, oh, you just hit anerve.
then you are very good atbacking up and saying, okay,
(13:21):
pause, what just happened?
What did I say?
How did you hear that?
What just happened?
I saw something change.
And that's really helpfulbecause when you point that out,
I'm able to say, well, yeah,that hurt.
SPEAKER_02 (13:34):
Heads, listen up.
This is for the head partnersout there.
You are my people.
Love y'all.
I realized that the easiestthing to do when I would end up
in those situations whereBeverly would express, I'd see
her face or I'd see the emotionstart to come up.
SPEAKER_01 (13:52):
Tears.
SPEAKER_02 (13:53):
Yeah.
No, God, no, not the tears.
Holy hell, I can't not with thetears.
Sorry, I don't deal with tears.
I know you don't.
That's why you bring them out.
No.
I had to learn to step back whenI would see those responses and
just say, wait a second, stop.
(14:13):
That's not what I was going for.
That's not what I was trying todo.
I wasn't trying to hurt you.
I wasn't trying to make you sad.
I wasn't trying to make youangry.
That's not what I was going for.
Here's what I was trying to say.
What are you experiencingthrough that?
And where did I go wrong in thecommunication?
(14:34):
Because even that insight helpsme in future communications.
And maybe that's what you'retalking about, about the ability
to step back sometimes is Iprobably overstepped one time,
1,000 times.
Yeah.
You do have to drop a brick onmy head to get me to learn I'm
ahead.
I think it's good to be able togain insight to yourself and how
(14:57):
you fight and just say, wait asecond, wait a second.
Okay, wait, that wasn't myintention.
Because it's not.
It shouldn't be.
I mean, if it's your intentionto hurt your partner, cool.
Nobody wins.
Yeah, that makes you a jerk andmove on.
SPEAKER_01 (15:13):
Makes you alone.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (15:15):
Makes you a lot of things.
SPEAKER_01 (15:17):
Yeah.
Some of them I
SPEAKER_02 (15:19):
can't say on the program.
I mean, I can, I just won't.
It's not our intention to hurtour partner and recognize it and
be able to step back and talkabout it.
So for heads, the biggest thingis slow down, realize that your
heart partner, the crazy one, isa little bit crazy because
everything's kind of all jumbledup in their brain that way and
(15:40):
tied together.
And so when you talk aboutsomething that happened
yesterday and you're like, oh,I'm sorry I did that thing, and
your heart partner is like seeit wasn't just that thing it was
that thing you did six monthsago and and you did that
remember that time when we wereon vacation and 10 years ago
during the pandemic and you didthat thing too
SPEAKER_01 (15:58):
we have great memories
SPEAKER_02 (15:59):
yeah well and you would have to everything's
connected heads don't have greatmemories because our stuff ends
up in a box in the garage of ourbrain we're like i don't even
remember that vacation duringthe pandemic
SPEAKER_01 (16:13):
and you weren't emotional emotional and memories
go together so of course you'renot going to remember It
SPEAKER_02 (16:19):
was just a moment and it's in a box somewhere in
my brain.
And so hearts will be thepartner that bring up a lot of
stuff from the past because it'show they felt then and it's how
they feel now.
And you have to be aware ofthat.
And they're not bringing upstuff to just continuously beat
us up.
Feels that way sometimes, butthat's not what they're
(16:40):
intending to do either.
They're trying to resolve andunderstand the hurt and resolve
and understand how it is or whyit is that we hurt them.
I hate to say this.
This is one of those placeswhere, sorry, heads, this is one
of those places where you haveto learn to apologize too.
SPEAKER_01 (16:59):
Oh, that's a word that's not in their vocabulary,
is
SPEAKER_02 (17:03):
it?
No, not regularly.
Beverly apologizes to me all thetime.
I am not that person.
Yeah, once a year.
I'm better, I think.
I'm learning.
We have to be able to step back.
So for heads, be willing to say,hey, I'm sorry recognize how
your heart partner's doing itwhat advice for hearts beverly
that that might help them inthese situations where conflict
(17:27):
or or communication has brokendown
SPEAKER_01 (17:29):
well i want to first say that when you file away all
of those things that's the crazybox because you don't understand
the emotion to it and that'sjust another crazy event you
know a dinner we had where therewas a fight and you don't even
really know why so hopefullyhopefully hearts and heads or
learning something today in thispodcast.
(17:50):
It is one of the key elements inthis unique approach that Randy
and I have with relationshipswhen we work with couples or
individuals that are in arelationship.
And once people open their eyesto the differences in head and
heart, how we do thingsdifferently, how we process
(18:10):
differently, it really is a gamechanger.
I would say 70% is justunderstanding the concepts here
today.
So if we've said something thatreally interests you, reach out.
We have our email address.
SPEAKER_02 (18:24):
Info at heartandheadcoaching.com.
Info atheartandheadcoaching.com.
SPEAKER_01 (18:30):
Just had to put a plug out there because there's a
lot more to this and we are morethan happy to set up a session
or have some coaching aroundthat if anybody's interested.
Okay, heart partners.
The thing about hearts is thatwhen you say that we need to
kind of process through this,sometimes the tears come because
(18:51):
we actually need to release theemotion.
So crying and tears are areleasing.
And what I wish every headpartner knew is that when your
heart is crying, it's no reasonfor you to feel awkward or
freaked out or to just pause.
It's really a moment tounderstand what it is that we're
(19:11):
doing.
We're releasing, we'reprocessing, and it's actually a
very good thing for you and forme.
It's one of the ways to avoidnext week having me say, well,
five years ago you did this, andapparently I didn't release
that.
I didn't process through it.
Also, for the hearts out there,I want you to understand a few
things about heads.
(19:32):
As much as we are sarcasticabout heads being narcissists
and robots, which they're not.
SPEAKER_02 (19:40):
We just act like it.
UNKNOWN (19:42):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (19:43):
They actually do have emotion.
Thank you so much.
(20:17):
wired that way.
It's not that heads don't haveemotion.
It's just they're boxing itbecause they don't want to
really deal with that.
In order to have a meaningfulconflict to fight better, I want
you to not see your partner asunfeeling or unemotional, to
(20:37):
just recognize they do itdifferently.
And that way you're not feelingalone or detached or
misunderstood.
If I look at Randi and I say,okay, we're arguing about
something.
He seems very cut off from theemotion.
He's not understanding oracknowledging what I'm going
through.
Then it feels like I'm an alien.
(20:59):
We're from two different planetsand therefore we're not
connecting at all.
And connection is our oxygen.
If I feel like an alien withhim, we're not going to resolve
this.
This is going to leave mefeeling worse.
And this probably is verybeneficial for heads where
You've had a conflict.
You've had the crying.
(21:20):
You've had the arguing.
You go to bed each mad.
The next morning you wake up,she's still not talking.
Well, guess what?
There's a lot of this that'sgoing on.
If you don't acknowledge a heartand the feeling that we're
having, then we will feel likean alien and even more
disconnected.
So what I want you to do is,first of all, recognize the
(21:40):
differences as we've explained.
Secondly, I want you to startconflicts and fights with a
Establishing that you're a team.
Recognizing that we're on thesame team here and we're just
working on an issue.
We're not breaking up.
This isn't about me not beingsatisfied in the relationship.
(22:01):
This is about resolving thisissue.
Nothing personal.
And if you kind of set theground rules with that, the
shared intention of what we'redoing, then a heart has a better
chance of giving that open spaceand look What hearts want is we
(22:21):
want to be heard, understood,and we want to connect while we
do it.
We don't want to sit like robotsand put things in boxes and
check, check, check, on goes ourlife because that's just not the
way it works for us.
It's very uncaring, unconnected,again, makes me feel like an
alien.
So once we set that intention,then we can feel safe.
(22:46):
I feel safe.
And this is where heads need tobe patient.
Hearts have a lot of words, andwe need that time to express,
even if we bring up things fromthe past.
Your job is to listen, toacknowledge.
If Randy's just sitting thereand he's not shaking his head or
asking questions oracknowledging, I will repeat and
(23:10):
repeat and repeat.
The
SPEAKER_02 (23:12):
horse is dead.
SPEAKER_01 (23:13):
Yes.
SPEAKER_02 (23:15):
Stop beating it.
The horse is dead.
is dead.
SPEAKER_01 (23:17):
But if I get a few head nods and, oh, that makes
sense, so forth, now I feelacknowledged and understood.
I don't need to beat the deadhorse.
And we can be done with thatmore quickly.
If I'm crying, I expect a hug,even if what we're talking about
is not something that you'vedone to me or you feel
(23:38):
responsible for.
After that, then you can kind ofsay back to me in your
acknowledgement, okay, so thisis the way that if I understand
you correctly.
This is what you're saying.
This is what you were feeling.
That was not your intent.
Obviously, give me yourperspective.
It helps if you can even throwin a little bit of emotion.
(23:58):
Here's maybe what you werethinking, what was going on in
your mind, reminding me that youdo love me.
You never want to hurt me.
Sorry would be nice.
And acknowledging that maybe Ifelt alone or attacked, so
forth.
Now that we've done all the hardpart, it's really then just
(24:19):
about breaking it down andsaying, what can we do moving
forward?
What would feel better nexttime?
And each person has a role inthat.
It's kind of hard to break itdown generally here, but each
person would know in eachsituation what we would do
different and what I need fromyou, what you need from me.
No one's perfect, but we canagree going forward as a team,
(24:43):
we're going to do our part asmuch as we can, a little bit of
grace, maybe check in in a weekor two, see how it's going.
And what we find is that when wepresent this to clients, it's
actionable, it's simple, andclients are just amazed at how
much better things go.
Again, no one's perfect.
There can be stumbling blocksalong the way.
We've obviously oversimplifiedthis.
(25:05):
However, for the podcast,Keeping Things Short, this is
really a good way to understandone another and to do better, to
understand and have empathy,compassion, to be a team, and
then to really solve things.
And both partners can reallyexcel in that.
SPEAKER_02 (25:27):
Absolutely.
All right.
We've probably given enoughwords and beat that horse.
The ability of heads tocompartmentalize things and the
process of lumping things thathearts go through is super
complex.
We have pretty much simplifiedit.
We will be back to it in futurepodcasts with But that's
(25:48):
everything for today.
We are very happy that you tunedin and would just love seeing
around the world where some ofthe folks that are tuning into
the podcast are coming from andthings like that.
So glad to have you along forthe ride for Heart vs.
Head.
We will talk to you next time.
SPEAKER_00 (26:05):
Thanks for listening.
Thanks for listening to Heartvs.
Head.
You can learn more atheartandheadcoaching.com and
check out new podcast episodesevery Wednesday.
If you have a question for Randyand Beverly, send an email to
info at heart and head coachingdot com.
Welcome to Heart vs.
Head, a podcast that helpscouples communicate and fight
better.
Here are your hosts, RandyHampton and Beverly Craddock.
SPEAKER_01 (00:19):
It's Randy and Beverly, and welcome to the
podcast.
I have to say, Randy, today'spodcast almost didn't happen.
SPEAKER_02 (00:27):
Oh, really?
SPEAKER_01 (00:28):
Well, I woke up with a headache.
SPEAKER_02 (00:30):
Okay.
SPEAKER_01 (00:31):
And it might have been from the wine last night.
Could have been.
But who cares what it's from?
I woke up with a headache.
And the one thing I've noticedabout hearts is that when we
have a health issue, whensomething's going on physically
with us, not just emotionally,this was strictly a headache,
(00:51):
it's purely physical, it reallymakes it hard for me and for
most hearts to push throughthat.
I look at you and you tell methe stories of times where
you've had just a debilitatingmigraine.
I mean, the one that comes tomind is before the pandemic,
there was a day where Randy hada migraine during a session with
(01:14):
a client.
And he said he literally, hisvision was so impaired, he could
not see the client, but hedidn't miss a step.
And he not only completed thesession, the client oblivious to
his migraine, but it was abomber session.
Well, like most of yoursessions.
Thank you.
SPEAKER_02 (01:35):
It's interesting because I don't, gosh, I don't
know how to explain it.
I know it's a thing becausewe've talked about it with
clients, but I don't put Randyhas a headache or Randy's knee
is hurting into the category ofthat has anything to do with
work.
SPEAKER_01 (01:51):
Right.
It's this thing about puttingissues in a box.
Randy and I have talked aboutthis many, many times.
I believe it's in the couple'srule book, the book we wrote
that's available on Amazon.
Little pitch, sorry.
Hearts are much more attuned tonot only emotional things, but
(02:13):
body sensations, discomfort,fatigue, changes in our mood or
energy.
SPEAKER_02 (02:19):
You're all feelers.
I mean, you feel stuff.
And so I know when Beverly has aheadache, she feels that.
And if It affects, I guess, theability to function sometimes on
all the other levels, like doinga podcast.
SPEAKER_01 (02:58):
And–
SPEAKER_02 (03:28):
That's crazy.
(03:58):
Partner will say, well, yeah,but I remember in 1974 when my
partner did this or did that.
And hearts are just so connectedto all of it.
How does that work for you guys?
SPEAKER_01 (04:16):
We don't put things in boxes.
Hearts tend to really lumpeverything together.
It's like this deepinterconnected web where all of
our thoughts and feelings thedifferent relationships we have.
Everything in our life isinterconnected.
So that's why today, a headache,my body, how I'm feeling
(04:38):
physically.
Also, it impacts my work, thispodcast, even our relationship.
I'm sure I've been a little bitless energy, less good mood
today.
It is very hard for me or for aheart to deal with that.
It's very overwhelming, as youmight say.
say, and it's this naturaltendency that hearts have when
(05:03):
we absorb emotions from others,we read people because we care
about them so much, and it'sjust the way that we interpret
things and we give it such abigger, broader context.
And so it becomes reallydifficult for us to isolate
things from each other orcompartmentalize or put it in a
(05:24):
box as heads do.
Although I will say beingmarried to I do see an
SPEAKER_02 (05:34):
advantage to doing that.
(05:57):
All of these things.
So if she wakes up and says, Ihave a headache, I say, we have
some ibuprofen.
I would be happy to get yousome.
I get overwhelmed even just whenyou start talking about trying
to manage all that stuff.
My brain just goes, no, I don'thave time for that.
We are, as heads, we are systembuilders.
(06:18):
That's kind of what made me verygood in the job that I had for
years as a journalist and as anews director, building these
systems, going in and Yeah.
(06:57):
No, you can't yell at me andthen go have a romantic lunch.
(07:18):
I am not
SPEAKER_01 (07:20):
going to let you.
I
SPEAKER_02 (07:29):
know.
I know that.
I have tried.
SPEAKER_01 (07:33):
Well, while heads have strengths in the way that
you process and make decisionsthat way, hearts also have
strengths in the way that we doit.
So being naturally tuned in toemotional subtext, to things
that are unspoken, nonverbal, itreally helps us to understand
people really so much more.
And it creates that harmony.
(07:56):
It makes us feel We're veryauthentic, very open and honest
with genuine with who we are andwhat we're feeling.
And it also brings up differentissues, deeper issues, things
that you might just brush overbecause you don't want to deal
with the emotion.
Those are things that a lot oftimes hearts will spot and we
(08:17):
will press further because wethink something bigger is going
on.
The challenge to hearts,obviously, besides the ones
you've mentioned, is true It'soverwhelming, but also it comes
across as irrational.
It comes across as crazy,especially when our emotions are
very intense.
And sometimes it gets in the wayof solving problems.
(08:41):
And this is where couples comein and they really are at a
standstill.
And it's one of those thingsthat it's easy for Randy and I
to spot once you understandhearts and heads.
Beyond talking about thedifferences, which is great to
really understand yourself yourpartner, how these strengths and
challenges might present in yourown world.
(09:03):
We also have some tips for it,some solutions.
SPEAKER_02 (09:06):
Yeah, it's not hard to solve, and it's probably
easiest to solve just byunderstanding a little bit about
it.
So the basic of it, as we'vekind of already explained long,
let me make the short version ofit, heads are
compartmentalizers.
We have boxes in our mind wherethings go.
(09:27):
So when When somebody sayssomething, we say, oh, this is
that, and that's where it goes.
Hearts are lumpers.
Everything just kind of is allinterconnected, flowing not
together.
We process the worlddifferently.
SPEAKER_01 (09:46):
Which also means we make decisions differently
because of that processing.
It's difficult for me, as Isaid, to imagine having some
kind of personal disagreementwhere I feel somewhat attacked
or get defensive and then beable to just go have a nice
lunch.
A lot of times this shows upwhen couples have a date night
(10:06):
and maybe the topics get a bitargumentative or discussion
during dinner and what wassupposed to end up in some great
intimacy at the end end up inthis big blow up and there's no
way to recover.
SPEAKER_02 (10:21):
Actually, I remember a Valentine's Day dinner that
went that way for us.
When you can say, okay Headpartner is compartmentalizing
this heart partner is lumpingthis and sit down and talk about
how are you doing that?
How are you processing that?
How are you thinking about that?
How are you feeling about that?
(10:43):
And you can begin to beintellectually and emotionally
curious with your partner.
That's the biggest thing you cando.
Take that kind of emotion out ofit.
Impossible for hearts, but kindof take the emotion out of it
for a minute.
Be a scientist.
Ask some questions.
(11:03):
Ask your partner, how do you dothat?
Because I can't do it that way.
How do you do that?
And it will solve a lot of theseproblems if you can do it in a
non-confrontational, hey, I'mcurious kind of way.
SPEAKER_01 (11:20):
Which is how we wrote the book as social
scientists is we startedbreaking things down and every
fight we had was, wait, wait,pause, hold that thought.
This is good for the book.
What did you just say?
Why did you just say that?
What was behind that?
What were you thinking?
What were you feeling?
We started separating things,breaking them down, putting them
(11:40):
in boxes in order to write thebook, which is probably a good
way to write any
SPEAKER_02 (11:46):
book.
The best way to write a book isto actually have some subtopics.
SPEAKER_01 (11:52):
Makes it logical instead of a lot of books
written by hearts are a littlehard to follow.
I will give you
SPEAKER_02 (11:57):
that.
A little over here, a littleover there.
Oh, I remember this thing that,whoa, wait, where'd we go?
We tell couples that all thetime.
We talk to couples, we say, ifyou really want a great
relationship and you want tocommunicate with your partner,
you really want that greatrelationship, write a book about
relationships because it taughtus so much to be able to sit
(12:18):
back and go, why are you doingthat?
And not in a, why are you doingthat?
But in a, wait a second, I'mcurious about this kind of way.
And we realized we quitfighting.
We just don't have disagreementsthat don't have a purpose.
We still have disagreements.
We're two different people, butwe don't have disagreements that
(12:40):
don't serve a purpose.
When there is a disagreement,we're able to go, okay, what's
this about?
Why is it that way for you?
Why is it that way for me?
And we're able to make progressin our relationship.
Our relationship gets strongerthrough the disagreements, not
torn apart by the disagreements,I think, in a lot of ways.
SPEAKER_01 (13:00):
I would also give you some credit for recognizing
that I am a heart and emotionalprocessor.
And so if something you says inthe disagreement gives me that
look of, oh, you just hit anerve.
then you are very good atbacking up and saying, okay,
(13:21):
pause, what just happened?
What did I say?
How did you hear that?
What just happened?
I saw something change.
And that's really helpfulbecause when you point that out,
I'm able to say, well, yeah,that hurt.
SPEAKER_02 (13:34):
Heads, listen up.
This is for the head partnersout there.
You are my people.
Love y'all.
I realized that the easiestthing to do when I would end up
in those situations whereBeverly would express, I'd see
her face or I'd see the emotionstart to come up.
SPEAKER_01 (13:52):
Tears.
SPEAKER_02 (13:53):
Yeah.
No, God, no, not the tears.
Holy hell, I can't not with thetears.
Sorry, I don't deal with tears.
I know you don't.
That's why you bring them out.
No.
I had to learn to step back whenI would see those responses and
just say, wait a second, stop.
(14:13):
That's not what I was going for.
That's not what I was trying todo.
I wasn't trying to hurt you.
I wasn't trying to make you sad.
I wasn't trying to make youangry.
That's not what I was going for.
Here's what I was trying to say.
What are you experiencingthrough that?
And where did I go wrong in thecommunication?
(14:34):
Because even that insight helpsme in future communications.
And maybe that's what you'retalking about, about the ability
to step back sometimes is Iprobably overstepped one time,
1,000 times.
Yeah.
You do have to drop a brick onmy head to get me to learn I'm
ahead.
I think it's good to be able togain insight to yourself and how
(14:57):
you fight and just say, wait asecond, wait a second.
Okay, wait, that wasn't myintention.
Because it's not.
It shouldn't be.
I mean, if it's your intentionto hurt your partner, cool.
Nobody wins.
Yeah, that makes you a jerk andmove on.
SPEAKER_01 (15:13):
Makes you alone.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (15:15):
Makes you a lot of things.
SPEAKER_01 (15:17):
Yeah.
Some of them I
SPEAKER_02 (15:19):
can't say on the program.
I mean, I can, I just won't.
It's not our intention to hurtour partner and recognize it and
be able to step back and talkabout it.
So for heads, the biggest thingis slow down, realize that your
heart partner, the crazy one, isa little bit crazy because
everything's kind of all jumbledup in their brain that way and
(15:40):
tied together.
And so when you talk aboutsomething that happened
yesterday and you're like, oh,I'm sorry I did that thing, and
your heart partner is like seeit wasn't just that thing it was
that thing you did six monthsago and and you did that
remember that time when we wereon vacation and 10 years ago
during the pandemic and you didthat thing too
SPEAKER_01 (15:58):
we have great memories
SPEAKER_02 (15:59):
yeah well and you would have to everything's
connected heads don't have greatmemories because our stuff ends
up in a box in the garage of ourbrain we're like i don't even
remember that vacation duringthe pandemic
SPEAKER_01 (16:13):
and you weren't emotional emotional and memories
go together so of course you'renot going to remember It
SPEAKER_02 (16:19):
was just a moment and it's in a box somewhere in
my brain.
And so hearts will be thepartner that bring up a lot of
stuff from the past because it'show they felt then and it's how
they feel now.
And you have to be aware ofthat.
And they're not bringing upstuff to just continuously beat
us up.
Feels that way sometimes, butthat's not what they're
(16:40):
intending to do either.
They're trying to resolve andunderstand the hurt and resolve
and understand how it is or whyit is that we hurt them.
I hate to say this.
This is one of those placeswhere, sorry, heads, this is one
of those places where you haveto learn to apologize too.
SPEAKER_01 (16:59):
Oh, that's a word that's not in their vocabulary,
is
SPEAKER_02 (17:03):
it?
No, not regularly.
Beverly apologizes to me all thetime.
I am not that person.
Yeah, once a year.
I'm better, I think.
I'm learning.
We have to be able to step back.
So for heads, be willing to say,hey, I'm sorry recognize how
your heart partner's doing itwhat advice for hearts beverly
that that might help them inthese situations where conflict
(17:27):
or or communication has brokendown
SPEAKER_01 (17:29):
well i want to first say that when you file away all
of those things that's the crazybox because you don't understand
the emotion to it and that'sjust another crazy event you
know a dinner we had where therewas a fight and you don't even
really know why so hopefullyhopefully hearts and heads or
learning something today in thispodcast.
(17:50):
It is one of the key elements inthis unique approach that Randy
and I have with relationshipswhen we work with couples or
individuals that are in arelationship.
And once people open their eyesto the differences in head and
heart, how we do thingsdifferently, how we process
(18:10):
differently, it really is a gamechanger.
I would say 70% is justunderstanding the concepts here
today.
So if we've said something thatreally interests you, reach out.
We have our email address.
SPEAKER_02 (18:24):
Info at heartandheadcoaching.com.
Info atheartandheadcoaching.com.
SPEAKER_01 (18:30):
Just had to put a plug out there because there's a
lot more to this and we are morethan happy to set up a session
or have some coaching aroundthat if anybody's interested.
Okay, heart partners.
The thing about hearts is thatwhen you say that we need to
kind of process through this,sometimes the tears come because
(18:51):
we actually need to release theemotion.
So crying and tears are areleasing.
And what I wish every headpartner knew is that when your
heart is crying, it's no reasonfor you to feel awkward or
freaked out or to just pause.
It's really a moment tounderstand what it is that we're
(19:11):
doing.
We're releasing, we'reprocessing, and it's actually a
very good thing for you and forme.
It's one of the ways to avoidnext week having me say, well,
five years ago you did this, andapparently I didn't release
that.
I didn't process through it.
Also, for the hearts out there,I want you to understand a few
things about heads.
(19:32):
As much as we are sarcasticabout heads being narcissists
and robots, which they're not.
SPEAKER_02 (19:40):
We just act like it.
UNKNOWN (19:42):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_01 (19:43):
They actually do have emotion.
Thank you so much.
(20:17):
wired that way.
It's not that heads don't haveemotion.
It's just they're boxing itbecause they don't want to
really deal with that.
In order to have a meaningfulconflict to fight better, I want
you to not see your partner asunfeeling or unemotional, to
(20:37):
just recognize they do itdifferently.
And that way you're not feelingalone or detached or
misunderstood.
If I look at Randi and I say,okay, we're arguing about
something.
He seems very cut off from theemotion.
He's not understanding oracknowledging what I'm going
through.
Then it feels like I'm an alien.
(20:59):
We're from two different planetsand therefore we're not
connecting at all.
And connection is our oxygen.
If I feel like an alien withhim, we're not going to resolve
this.
This is going to leave mefeeling worse.
And this probably is verybeneficial for heads where
You've had a conflict.
You've had the crying.
(21:20):
You've had the arguing.
You go to bed each mad.
The next morning you wake up,she's still not talking.
Well, guess what?
There's a lot of this that'sgoing on.
If you don't acknowledge a heartand the feeling that we're
having, then we will feel likean alien and even more
disconnected.
So what I want you to do is,first of all, recognize the
(21:40):
differences as we've explained.
Secondly, I want you to startconflicts and fights with a
Establishing that you're a team.
Recognizing that we're on thesame team here and we're just
working on an issue.
We're not breaking up.
This isn't about me not beingsatisfied in the relationship.
(22:01):
This is about resolving thisissue.
Nothing personal.
And if you kind of set theground rules with that, the
shared intention of what we'redoing, then a heart has a better
chance of giving that open spaceand look What hearts want is we
(22:21):
want to be heard, understood,and we want to connect while we
do it.
We don't want to sit like robotsand put things in boxes and
check, check, check, on goes ourlife because that's just not the
way it works for us.
It's very uncaring, unconnected,again, makes me feel like an
alien.
So once we set that intention,then we can feel safe.
(22:46):
I feel safe.
And this is where heads need tobe patient.
Hearts have a lot of words, andwe need that time to express,
even if we bring up things fromthe past.
Your job is to listen, toacknowledge.
If Randy's just sitting thereand he's not shaking his head or
asking questions oracknowledging, I will repeat and
(23:10):
repeat and repeat.
The
SPEAKER_02 (23:12):
horse is dead.
SPEAKER_01 (23:13):
Yes.
SPEAKER_02 (23:15):
Stop beating it.
The horse is dead.
is dead.
SPEAKER_01 (23:17):
But if I get a few head nods and, oh, that makes
sense, so forth, now I feelacknowledged and understood.
I don't need to beat the deadhorse.
And we can be done with thatmore quickly.
If I'm crying, I expect a hug,even if what we're talking about
is not something that you'vedone to me or you feel
(23:38):
responsible for.
After that, then you can kind ofsay back to me in your
acknowledgement, okay, so thisis the way that if I understand
you correctly.
This is what you're saying.
This is what you were feeling.
That was not your intent.
Obviously, give me yourperspective.
It helps if you can even throwin a little bit of emotion.
(23:58):
Here's maybe what you werethinking, what was going on in
your mind, reminding me that youdo love me.
You never want to hurt me.
Sorry would be nice.
And acknowledging that maybe Ifelt alone or attacked, so
forth.
Now that we've done all the hardpart, it's really then just
(24:19):
about breaking it down andsaying, what can we do moving
forward?
What would feel better nexttime?
And each person has a role inthat.
It's kind of hard to break itdown generally here, but each
person would know in eachsituation what we would do
different and what I need fromyou, what you need from me.
No one's perfect, but we canagree going forward as a team,
(24:43):
we're going to do our part asmuch as we can, a little bit of
grace, maybe check in in a weekor two, see how it's going.
And what we find is that when wepresent this to clients, it's
actionable, it's simple, andclients are just amazed at how
much better things go.
Again, no one's perfect.
There can be stumbling blocksalong the way.
We've obviously oversimplifiedthis.
(25:05):
However, for the podcast,Keeping Things Short, this is
really a good way to understandone another and to do better, to
understand and have empathy,compassion, to be a team, and
then to really solve things.
And both partners can reallyexcel in that.
SPEAKER_02 (25:27):
Absolutely.
All right.
We've probably given enoughwords and beat that horse.
The ability of heads tocompartmentalize things and the
process of lumping things thathearts go through is super
complex.
We have pretty much simplifiedit.
We will be back to it in futurepodcasts with But that's
(25:48):
everything for today.
We are very happy that you tunedin and would just love seeing
around the world where some ofthe folks that are tuning into
the podcast are coming from andthings like that.
So glad to have you along forthe ride for Heart vs.
Head.
We will talk to you next time.
SPEAKER_00 (26:05):
Thanks for listening.
Thanks for listening to Heartvs.
Head.
You can learn more atheartandheadcoaching.com and
check out new podcast episodesevery Wednesday.
If you have a question for Randyand Beverly, send an email to
info at heart and head coachingdot com.
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