September 16, 2025 • 48 mins
This week on Premeditated Opinions:
Pamela and Josh cover the truly important things: stalking authors (lovingly), bourbon correctness (it’s Kentucky or it’s whiskey), and whether the new electric VW ID. Buzz is the millennial minivan of our dreams. We spiral through culture, faith, and streaming TV, with just enough politics to keep your blood pressure spicy and your Google tabs open.
Pamela gushes about Jen Hatmaker’s upcoming memoir Awake (launch-team perks, activated) and why affirming your kid (and your conscience) might cost you everything and still be worth it. We detour into National Guard photo-ops vs. real public safety, nerd out on canceled genius (Netflix’s KAOS), celebrate Wednesday (Jenna Ortega hive, rise), worship Pedro Pascal in The Last of Us, and palate-cleanse with Somebody Feed Phil. We also plot a chaotic group trip to SXSW (pray for Austin traffic), and settle the eternal debate: bourbon ≠ Tennessee.
Other highlights:
- EV nostalgia: the electric VW ID. Buzz and why configurable seats + LEDs = instant serotonin.
- Faith & LGBTQ+ inclusion: how Hatmaker’s “affirming” stance reshaped evangelical discourse, and our own.
- Public safety sanity check: fund local solutions > out-of-state Guard deployments.
- TV you should (and shouldn’t) watch: KAOS (RIP), Wednesday, The Last of Us, and food-joy via Somebody Feed Phil.
- City culture mashup: Austin × Louisville energy, “Keep It Weird,” and the Bourbon Trail you swear you’ll finally do.
If you like millennial dry humor, progressive faith conversations, EVs & tech, Austin/SXSW culture, bourbon nerdery, and TV recs that actually slap, this episode is your algorithm’s love language.
Listen on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, iHeartRadio, and YouTube, then send it to someone who needs to feel seen, dragged, or both.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
SPEAKER_02 (00:00):
I'll just hang out in her driveway.
I'll just block her in again andbe like, I need you to taste
SPEAKER_00 (00:04):
this.
Which won't be suspicious atall.
At all.
Yeah, yeah.
I promise it's just whiskey.
Or
SPEAKER_02 (00:18):
bourbon.
That's it.
UNKNOWN (00:22):
Cut.
We're done.
SPEAKER_02 (00:28):
listening to premeditated opinions because
yes we thought about it and thenwe said it anyway i'm pamela
SPEAKER_00 (00:34):
and i'm josh and we are just two people who somehow
share a brain and decided toweaponize our brains with
microphones
SPEAKER_02 (00:41):
each week we unpack the chaos the politics and
religion to petty internetfights and existential dread
like it's our unpaid job
SPEAKER_00 (00:50):
we are not experts we are just way too confident so
with all that being said let'sget started All right, so on the
way in, you were telling meabout something cool that you
saw.
What did you see on your way torecording this morning?
SPEAKER_02 (01:02):
Okay, so normally I don't get all excited about
seeing electric cars anymore,but I was taking my daughter to
school this morning, and out ofone of the neighborhoods we
passed, a brand-new VW buscalled the IQ Buzz pulled out,
(01:23):
and I was like,
SPEAKER_00 (01:25):
They're cool.
They've got a great aesthetic.
SPEAKER_02 (01:30):
They do.
And I was intrigued.
I haven't had a chance yet tokind of dig into anything about
them.
But I was excited that theybrought it back.
And it's sharp.
And I'm sure it's really awesomeon the inside.
SPEAKER_00 (01:46):
It is.
So we actually bought Krista'sJeep from a VW dealership.
And we walked past one on theirshowroom floor.
kind of in the process of buyingher car.
And the sales guy we wereworking with was like, well, do
you want to look inside?
I was like, absolutely.
And so we didn't get a full tourof it, but what little I saw was
(02:10):
really cool.
And I just like well-conceivedcars.
And what I mean by that is likeI love it when there's sort of
new ideas brought to the tablewith cars because, you know,
we're all just sort of used to apretty generic vehicle
experience.
But even in looking around likethe way you don't like
SPEAKER_02 (02:31):
inbreeding within your vehicles.
SPEAKER_00 (02:33):
Exactly.
Yeah, I need to.
I want diversity among the.
So if you want if you want tofind something that's kind of
new and different and infairness, there are brands that
are doing cool and differentthings.
Maybe
SPEAKER_02 (02:49):
society could learn from that.
You know?
Anyway,
SPEAKER_00 (02:52):
moving on.
But, you know, the Teslas of theworld and a lot of electric car
manufacturers, Lucid and Rivianand stuff like that, they're all
kind of doing cool new things.
And even inside, the inside ofthe IQ Buzz, if I'm remembering
it correctly, like you could,you could even change like seat
configurations and things likethat.
And the front is really sharpwith, it's all screens and LEDs
(03:14):
and you can customize what theLEDs do and when they do it.
And so, I don't know.
It's just, it's nerdy andbeautiful.
I love it.
SPEAKER_02 (03:22):
Yeah.
I mean, I am kind of a car snob.
You know, we've talked aboutwe're gearheads.
The one thing I do like aboutVolkswagen is they...
they usually are very eclectic.
SPEAKER_00 (03:37):
Yeah.
No, I'm with you on the cars.
I drive a very generic vehiclethat I just need for work stuff,
and we have a travel trailer,and it pulls a travel trailer
very well, and that's great.
I love...
everything from old schoolmuscle cars to just classically
restored, like, you know,vintage vehicles to, you know,
(04:01):
I'm, I'm pretty open-minded asfar as new cars and, you know,
there's plenty of cool stuff.
And honestly, I'm not, I, I usedto be kind of anti-electric car,
but that ship has sailed for me.
Like I'm, I'm all in at thispoint.
I just need the infrastructureto catch up to, Yes,
SPEAKER_02 (04:22):
that's the biggest issue.
Until you can charge at any gasstation, we've got some ways to
go.
SPEAKER_00 (04:32):
Well, you had kind of a cool experience in the last
couple of weeks.
I know that you're a huge fan ofJen Hatmaker.
That's an understatement.
So for the uninitiated, JenHatmaker is an author and a
speaker and just kind of hasbeen a huge presence in I don't
know.
(04:53):
What would you describe herdemographic as?
SPEAKER_02 (04:56):
So she started off as a Christian author.
SPEAKER_00 (05:01):
She was a darling of sort of the evangelical
conservative Christian.
SPEAKER_02 (05:06):
Exactly.
Midwest, you know.
I actually started following herin 2016 or shortly after.
So in 2016, she had a momentwhere...
She came out as affirming.
Affirming, for people who don'tknow, is basically just saying
(05:27):
that we agree with LGBTQ, we'reokay with marriage within that
community, we accept thatcommunity, we want them in our
church, and people lost theirminds.
SPEAKER_00 (05:41):
Oh, completely.
SPEAKER_02 (05:42):
Her books got ripped from the shelves, they were
taken out of publication.
She pretty much very publiclylost everything.
Um, it was very, a verydevastating moment for her.
Um, I, I had a friend who hadreposted something of hers on
Facebook and that's how I foundher.
(06:04):
And she, this was post Christiandemise.
SPEAKER_00 (06:10):
I don't know.
Um, cancellation.
Yes.
SPEAKER_02 (06:13):
And she was still kind of rebuilding and picking
up the pieces.
UNKNOWN (06:17):
Um,
SPEAKER_02 (06:17):
And she was just funny.
SPEAKER_01 (06:19):
Yeah.
Like she was
SPEAKER_02 (06:20):
very funny and very relatable.
I followed a lot of her content,you know, around her kids and
getting them ready for schooland all the things.
And as she evolved over theyears, I really...
started kind of learning alittle bit more about her.
(06:42):
I started reading some of herbooks.
I hadn't read any of her books.
I think her first book I readmay have been...
I don't know if it was For theLove or if it was Of Mess and
Moxie, but I immediatelyrelated.
And we have histories within theevangelical church, so...
(07:07):
And a lot of the things that shewas questioning and things that
she was being ostracized forwere things that I had also had
questions and similarexperiences.
thoughts about similar opinionsabout and I just I don't know
she's just very endearing andyou know she she also she lives
(07:28):
down in Austin she's only acouple hours away so I can stalk
her at any time um so uh that'sone reason why I agreed to move
to Texas
SPEAKER_00 (07:39):
oh but you you know less than a four hour drive away
from yeah
SPEAKER_02 (07:44):
I'm sure I have like a restraining order or something
at this point but But in 2020,went through another milestone,
another very devastating event.
Very public.
Very public.
Where her and her husband of 26years got divorced.
And at this time, she wasactually releasing Fierce, Free,
(08:08):
and Full of Fire.
And I was on the launch team
SPEAKER_00 (08:13):
for
SPEAKER_02 (08:13):
that book.
SPEAKER_00 (08:13):
So how did you get on the launch team?
UNKNOWN (08:17):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (08:17):
Just stalking.
SPEAKER_02 (08:19):
Probably.
SPEAKER_00 (08:19):
Standing outside her house.
SPEAKER_02 (08:21):
I wrote her a letter and just
SPEAKER_00 (08:26):
handed it to her personally.
Did you use magazine clippingsfor the words?
I just sat in
SPEAKER_02 (08:31):
her driveway until she had to leave.
SPEAKER_00 (08:36):
Perfect.
SPEAKER_02 (08:37):
Meanwhile, I still lived in Louisville at the time.
SPEAKER_00 (08:40):
That was expensive stalking.
It required a lot of effort.
So you got on the launch teamfor that last book?
SPEAKER_02 (08:50):
I did.
I didn't know that.
I think that it may have justbeen a call for members, either
on Facebook or at...
It may have been an email.
I'm not sure.
I can't remember.
But I got accepted and I was soexcited because you get an early
(09:13):
copy of the book and that onewas really good.
SPEAKER_01 (09:16):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (09:17):
Really good.
But it came out as her life wasbasically shattering all over
again.
And so this new book that shehas coming out is basically kind
of about that time.
Yeah.
But the difference with this isit's her memoir.
Yeah,
SPEAKER_01 (09:36):
yeah,
SPEAKER_02 (09:37):
yeah.
So she kind of walks us throughthat period of her life, but
also flashbacks a lot to specialperiods of her life or things
that...
She's just a very interestingperson.
Definitely.
And she's very relatable.
She's very funny.
She's very great with words.
She's got a way of puttingthings...
(10:01):
And a perspective that is justincredibly relatable.
SPEAKER_01 (10:06):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (10:07):
Yeah.
And so this time I'm on herlaunch team.
I got accepted on her launchteam for Awake.
I think it releases here at theend of September.
Yeah.
And I'm super excited aboutthat.
And I'm supposed to be going tothat book tour.
I think it's like a week afterher book releases.
(10:29):
But yeah, I've started readingit.
I'm about 60% of the waythrough.
I wanted to talk about it today,but we'll talk about it next
time.
But it's so good.
All her stuff is so good.
And while she tends to writemore for women and in that
perspective, I've recommendedher books to guys before.
(10:52):
Oh, absolutely.
And just said, hey, her FearsFree and Full of Fire really...
changed my perspective on thingsand gave me a more positive or
encouraging outlook, you know,like to really take care of
(11:14):
yourself.
And, you know, outside of justlike, Bubble baths and Starbucks
coffees, like actual self-careand what that looks like
spiritually, emotionally,physically.
And I don't know, this soundsreally ridiculous, but I swear
(11:34):
this woman has changed my life.
SPEAKER_00 (11:36):
Oh, I don't think that's ridiculous.
I don't think that's ridiculousat all.
I think we...
I think humans often look tocreators to help make sense of
just the world that we are, theworld we have inherited.
And those creators can beauthors, they can be speakers,
they can be musicians, they canbe actors.
Like we use all these differentresources to sort of make things
(12:00):
make more sense.
And, you know, for me, and thisparticular author has changed a
lot since he wrote some booksthat were very impactful for me,
but for me, a guy who I thinkchanged my life is a guy named
Donald Miller.
Any
SPEAKER_02 (12:14):
relation?
SPEAKER_00 (12:15):
No.
Unfortunately.
But he is a really, like,honestly, his professional life
has kind of taken a differentpath now and he does a lot more
sort of corporate things.
And I throw no shade.
Like, do your thing.
You know, it's fine.
But he wrote some books kind ofearlier in his life in a
different era of his life.
One called Blue Like Jazz thatwas incredibly formative for me.
(12:38):
And then another one called AMillion Miles in a Thousand
Years.
They've reshaped a lot of myperspectives on the world around
me, on the faith I was trying topractice, on the relationships
that I had.
And so I don't think it'sridiculous at all to...
kind of crown somebody within amore creative atmosphere as
(13:02):
like, oh, you have been superimpactful on me and my
perspective.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_02 (13:07):
And so one thing I really appreciate is she's got a
podcast.
SPEAKER_00 (13:11):
Which you all should go listen to.
Not right now.
Finish this one, but then golisten to hers.
SPEAKER_02 (13:15):
Yeah, we come first.
So anyway, but the guests thatshe has brought on have been, I
mean, I don't know how she findsthese people, but every one of
her guests have always givenjust amazing interviews and just
(13:37):
really have...
I don't even know how to...
quantify or qualify the impactyou know and it's been almost 10
years I just realized I'm like20 26 is coming up like that's
10 years um but yeah between herpodcasts and her books and her
social media and all of thesethings I just I really kind of
(14:03):
look to her when things feeluneasy, unsure, chaotic, you
know, I'm kind of like, where isJen's headspace at with this?
Like she kind of, and shedoesn't know this, but I mean,
(14:23):
she really does kind of helpground me.
I don't want to say she's like aNorthern star, but like, I'm
almost like if Jen's notpanicking, I'm not panicking.
SPEAKER_00 (14:34):
Sure.
If
SPEAKER_02 (14:35):
Jen's panicking,
SPEAKER_00 (14:36):
I'm paying attention.
SPEAKER_02 (14:37):
Yes.
Yes.
SPEAKER_00 (14:39):
Well, and, And so I want to talk more about her.
I want to read the book as welland have you do it.
But I will say...
before we jump off the Jen hatmaker train, which is really fun
to be on.
Um, when she, um, basically cameout in support of the LGBT
community, it's because herdaughter came out and this is
(15:02):
all public.
You know, I'm not, I am not, youknow, I'm not revealing anything
that is not out there, you know,in depth.
Uh, so yeah, don't at me, butthe, uh, When that happened, I
was already in a place in my ownsort of spiritual life where I
was at a real impasse with a lotof the perspectives of the way
(15:25):
that I had grown up.
But I also didn't feel like Ihad a model yet, because I
didn't know where to look.
I didn't have a model for whatfaith could look like, what
spirituality could look like,where was there space for
perspectives that definitely didnot align with the way that I
grew up, with the community thatwas around me, with the church I
(15:46):
was involved in, all of that.
And so now here's this personwho was already on my radar
because she was such a darlingof the...
And these are her words, notmine.
Don't at me.
She said, She was the darling ofthe white evangelical soccer
mom.
SPEAKER_02 (16:02):
That's in this book.
She says
SPEAKER_00 (16:04):
that.
And so she was already on myradar just because of that.
She had done tons of speakingtours, and I don't know that I
had attended anything she hadspoken at, but she was on my
radar.
I was following her on socialmedia channels and things like
that, had seen tons of hercontent.
And so...
She comes out in support of thatcommunity to support her
(16:27):
daughter and was absolutelyannihilated by just conservative
Christianity.
I mean, overnight she was deadto everyone.
And that revealed two things tome immediately.
One, I am a part of a systemthat is really focused on who
I'm hating more than who I'mloving.
(16:49):
And two, if we can't stomachsome level of disagreement or
different perspectives insidethis kind of religious
experience, then I'm starting toget less and less interested.
And I'm not interested in beingtold who to hate.
I'm not interested in being toldlike, I latched on to her big
(17:13):
time at that point and have hadtremendous respect for her ever
since.
SPEAKER_02 (17:20):
Absolutely, because she got annihilated.
She lost everything.
Everything.
SPEAKER_00 (17:26):
Every speaking engagement, every book deal.
Overnight.
Everything.
SPEAKER_02 (17:29):
And she held firm.
SPEAKER_00 (17:30):
Yeah.
For her kid.
SPEAKER_02 (17:32):
And she weathered that storm and she, I mean, that
was a big sacrifice.
Yeah.
You know, because she could havejust stayed quiet.
SPEAKER_01 (17:42):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (17:42):
She could have just gone along and she didn't.
And the thing about that momentis I think there were several
people kind of in that same campthat were like, I don't think I
agree with this.
Right.
And what she did gave peoplepermission to say, you know
(18:03):
what?
I can love, you know, my gayneighbors and friends and
lesbians.
Family members.
Exactly.
And all that.
And still be a Christian.
Right.
And still have faith.
Like, this is not aboutChristian hating or any of that.
It is...
(18:25):
basically tearing down a lot ofthe rules that are just made up.
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (18:32):
Yes.
SPEAKER_02 (18:33):
Yeah.
And, and, and she just reallybarreled through several of
those walls.
Um, and she will admit, like itcame out at a time that she, she
didn't have a lot of time toprepare.
She, she knew she'd had theinterview, um, They gave her
basically 24 hours and then itreleased and it opened the
(18:55):
floodgates.
But now I hear so many storieson her podcast and other forms
of media where people are like,you don't know what that did for
me.
Like you, you know, help me getout of a bad marriage or get out
of a bad, you know, religioussituation or help me see that
(19:21):
there is a path forward here.
Like these two things don't haveto be mutually exclusive.
SPEAKER_00 (19:27):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (19:27):
So yeah, we could go on all day.
SPEAKER_00 (19:30):
Oh man, this could be the Jen hat maker
appreciation podcast.
Yeah.
But I
SPEAKER_02 (19:33):
suggest, I definitely recommend, I know I'm
not through, but the book isvery quick.
It's a very quick, easy read.
It's not her typical.
She does have humor, but it'snot her typical kind of like
where you kind of get itthroughout.
It's a little more serious, butit's It's good.
SPEAKER_00 (19:53):
Yeah.
I mean, she's basically astand-up comic
SPEAKER_01 (19:56):
who,
SPEAKER_00 (19:56):
you know, writes.
And I heard her say on a podcastrecently that, you know, at the
end of the day, the thing thatshe considers herself to be is a
writer.
Yes.
Sure, she does speaking gigs.
Sure, she's a podcast host andall this other thing.
But at the end of the day, shesees herself as a writer.
And that really comes througheven just in her social media
(20:18):
presence.
Like, everything is quippy.
It's well-written.
It's...
But you also feel like she'sjust talking to you, which is
really amazing.
But her commentary, too, on alot of just current events and
political stuff.
I mean, to your point, she iskind of a bellwether of like,
okay, there are certain peoplein my life that when– Things are
(20:38):
going crazy.
I sort of glance at to be like,are we okay?
SPEAKER_02 (20:44):
And I hate that she's the one that had to be
crucified for it, but it was notdone in vain.
SPEAKER_00 (20:50):
Right, right.
But even, like, there's so muchabout our current political
climate that it's hard to knowhow to respond to.
And so, on one hand, like, Idon't want to be an alarmist and
constantly think that the sky isfalling and constantly be
worried and concerned about, um,the state of Washington and our
(21:15):
political leaders and thingslike that.
And so I probably put too muchemphasis on looking to people
like her to be like, okay, areyou using the fascism word yet?
Because it's starting to seemlike this is what we're doing.
Are we okay with the factthat...
It
SPEAKER_02 (21:33):
kind of tempers your alarmist.
SPEAKER_00 (21:35):
Yes, it does.
I don't know when to reach forthe panic button, but if they're
reaching for the panic button,then oh boy.
And there's plenty to panicabout.
Right?
I've got a dear friend inWashington, D.C.
that she...
She actually works for a localpolitician there.
She was posting on one of hersocial profiles recently.
(21:59):
She was having a very pleasantday, and she had done some
reading and done some work andall this, and she was walking
past a lake by where they live,and there was like a National
Guard checkpoint that had beenset up right at that sidewalk.
And it just seemed so weird anddystopian to me that, you know,
(22:23):
I realize that there are crimein various places, but I've also
spent a lot of time walkingthrough Washington, D.C.
because I have a major client inthat area.
So I've been there a ton, andI've just not really felt all
that unsafe.
And so to have things likeNational Guard deployments, and
then I read this morning thatthere's a Texas National Guard
(22:44):
deployment that might behappening in Illinois.
Why are we sending one state'sNational Guard to a different
state Crime?
Well, and that's
SPEAKER_02 (22:54):
not what they're there for.
SPEAKER_00 (22:56):
Right.
That's
SPEAKER_02 (22:56):
not what they're trained to do.
They're not trained lawenforcement.
Last I heard, they're not evendoing anything.
They're cleaning up trash.
Right.
Exactly.
They're walking around like theydon't know what to do because
this isn't what they're trainedto do.
SPEAKER_00 (23:13):
Well, and thankfully, we have such
qualified, capable leadership atthe very top of our governmental
organization.
That is sarcasm for people whocannot see my face.
We have such qualifiedleadership at the top of all of
our organizations that we justhave nothing to be concerned
about because I'm sure they haveit under control.
Right, Jen Hatmaker?
SPEAKER_02 (23:32):
Right.
So, okay, and then I don't wantto belabor this point, but like,
oh, there's so much crime inD.C.
SPEAKER_01 (23:38):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (23:39):
Okay, what kind of crime?
What are we talking about here?
What kind of crime is going on?
I mean, they're not dispersingriots.
Like, are you going to happen tocatch the person who happens to
be walking down the street witha gun?
What are you going to do?
I mean, technically, I have aright until they actually shoot
somebody.
Well, what do you, I mean, howare you preventing that?
(24:00):
Like, you're not preventing drugcrime.
That's not going to happen outon the street.
Like, what are you, to me, it'sjust, I got thoughts.
I got thoughts, I got opinions,and I'm just like, it's
SPEAKER_01 (24:14):
bullshit.
SPEAKER_02 (24:16):
It's just, I'm like, oh, yeah, we got to fight crime.
What crime?
SPEAKER_00 (24:22):
Right.
I'm stealing this from a podcastthat you also should go listen
to if you're listening to ours,a brilliant podcast called
Pantsuit Politics.
They're also big Jen Hatmakerfans there.
SPEAKER_02 (24:32):
And they're from my state of Kentucky.
SPEAKER_00 (24:33):
They are from your state of Kentucky.
And they love it there.
They speak fondly of that partof the world.
And so Beth, one of the hosts ofthat podcast, said something
that I thought was so smart whenthey were talking about this.
She said that the...
Instead of sending NationalGuard people, send that budget
(24:57):
to local law enforcement so theycan expand their own presence in
ways that make sense for theirlocal districts.
SPEAKER_02 (25:05):
Exactly, because they know what's going on.
They're on the ground.
These are their beats.
These are their neighborhoods.
They know who these people are.
They know the offenders.
That makes perfect sense.
Because send a National Guard,National Guard doesn't know
what's going
SPEAKER_00 (25:18):
on.
Right, and it's more people tofigure out, okay, where do we
put all these people?
people?
Where do we put all theequipment they're bringing with
them?
There's so much in the way oflogistics when you're deploying
a unit of National Guard versusif you're just empowering local
law enforcement.
I don't know.
To me, that makes so much sense.
SPEAKER_02 (25:36):
I'm glad we took money away from Medicare and
Medicaid to fund
SPEAKER_00 (25:41):
that.
Yeah, it makes perfect sense.
Anyway,
SPEAKER_02 (25:44):
moving on.
SPEAKER_00 (25:46):
So have you ever had the experience where you find a
show and you get really excitedabout a show, and then as you
are watching the first couple ofepisodes, you find out that it's
already been canceled?
No, never.
It's never happened to me.
SPEAKER_02 (26:01):
Happens to almost every show I like.
So
SPEAKER_00 (26:05):
you are partially responsible for this, and
actually another friend of minehad mentioned this show to my
wife and I previously.
I
SPEAKER_02 (26:12):
shan't be held accountable.
SPEAKER_00 (26:13):
You shan't.
No, absolutely not.
There's this brilliant show onNetflix called Chaos, K-A-O-S,
and it's genius.
And so another friend hadrecommended it, and then our
families were all hanging out alittle while back, and you threw
an episode on just because y'alllove it.
(26:35):
And in 10 minutes, I was hooked.
I was like, this is brilliant.
It is.
It's a great concept.
SPEAKER_02 (26:41):
It's so creative.
SPEAKER_00 (26:42):
It's so creative.
So the general concept, andcorrect me if I'm wrong here,
but the general concept is it'ssort of a reframing of Greek
mythology based on actualcharacters from Greek mythology.
UNKNOWN (26:54):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (26:55):
But the stories are told in almost a modernized way.
Yes.
Is that fair to say?
SPEAKER_02 (26:59):
Yeah, it's like modern day.
SPEAKER_00 (27:01):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (27:01):
As though Crete is still an empire and Sparta and
all of those.
And yeah, so you've got Eurydiceand Orpheus and their story.
You've got Icarus and Daedalus.
But yeah, it's kind of like ifthose gods, like if we still
(27:24):
believe
SPEAKER_01 (27:25):
right in that
SPEAKER_02 (27:26):
today
SPEAKER_01 (27:27):
yeah
SPEAKER_02 (27:27):
as though those empires never fell
SPEAKER_01 (27:29):
right
SPEAKER_02 (27:30):
and I love Greek and Roman mythology and so this is
like right up my alley and hasJeff Goldblum yes who is Zeus
yeah yes and it's it's just veryclever yeah it's very creative
it was very well produced
SPEAKER_00 (27:51):
yes yeah Netflix spent some money on it you know
they the cast is excellent andJeff Goldblum is I think
probably the biggest name butit's got a lot of very
recognizable it
SPEAKER_02 (28:05):
has Helen
SPEAKER_00 (28:05):
Mirren oh Helen Mirren yeah
SPEAKER_02 (28:08):
she's Hera
SPEAKER_00 (28:08):
yeah that's probably definitely your top two cast but
absolute genius show it's sofunny
SPEAKER_02 (28:16):
not safe for children
SPEAKER_00 (28:17):
no don't watch it with your kids but it's
hilarious it's so smart andcreative I loved it and it's
gone now.
And I have a chaos-shaped holein my heart that I didn't even
know I had.
It was really, really brilliant.
But what else should people bewatching?
What else have you been into outthere in the entertainment
(28:41):
scene?
SPEAKER_02 (28:42):
We're also watching the new season of Wednesday Just
Dropped.
Oh,
SPEAKER_01 (28:47):
yes.
SPEAKER_02 (28:48):
And so I grew up loving the Addams
SPEAKER_01 (28:52):
Family.
SPEAKER_02 (28:53):
Addams Family values All of those.
When Wednesday came out, I wassuper excited.
We actually didn't watch it withthe kids.
We watched it first.
It was not quite what I wasexpecting, but I'm not sure how
else they could have done it.
Because Wednesday kind ofbecomes like a Harry at the Spa.
SPEAKER_01 (29:16):
Yeah, yeah,
SPEAKER_02 (29:17):
yeah.
And I'm like, this justdoesn't...
feel like Wednesday but I don'tknow how else they could have
like I don't know what else theywould have done
SPEAKER_00 (29:29):
yeah and I think that they took so Tim Burton is
directing I love Tim Burton heis absolutely brilliant I love
his approach with how hedeveloped a lot of the
characters and things like thatit is it's intense and there are
parts especially towards the endof the first season that lean a
(29:50):
bit violent so if that somethingthat you're sensitive to,
especially as far as kids areconcerned.
That's a good thing to keep inmind.
Tim Burton really took somecreative license in ways that I
think work.
I've been impressed nonstop withJenna Ortega's performance.
The I read early on that shetried really hard when they were
(30:14):
doing any close-ups of her tonot blink.
SPEAKER_02 (30:17):
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (30:17):
I heard about that.
Just to make herself a littlebit more imposing and
intimidating and for it to be alittle bit more disconcerting.
But, yeah, even that cast isabsolutely stacked.
I mean, Catherine Zeta-Jones isin it in the first season.
It's got Gwendolyn Christie init, who is awesome as Brienne of
Tarth in Game of Thrones.
She's also the silverstormtrooper from the Star Wars
(30:40):
movies like it's really justbrilliantly done and I'm excited
about it but yeah that show hasbeen a pleasant surprise and
then the second season just cameout and I've watched probably
about half of it I need to goback and rewatch a couple
episodes so I wasn't payingenough attention more recently
but like that's been a blast andI've really enjoyed all of that
(31:04):
I'm hoping that Netflix keeps itaround it seems to be one of
their major players so I I thinkthat's probably the case.
So we have kind of a sillytradition around entertainment
at my house.
We are normally watching acouple of more serious shows,
and then we have just absolutegarbage that we watch.
(31:25):
Unashamed, Love Island garbage.
That's our garbage of choiceright now.
I haven't tapped
SPEAKER_02 (31:31):
into that, but I've done Love is Blind.
I've done Perfect Match.
SPEAKER_00 (31:36):
We did Perfect Match, too.
Too
SPEAKER_02 (31:37):
Hot to Handle.
SPEAKER_00 (31:38):
We did Too Hot to Handle.
SPEAKER_02 (31:39):
Just...
SPEAKER_00 (31:41):
Crap.
Oh, yeah.
Junk.
I'm
SPEAKER_02 (31:43):
like, we could get rid of a few of those and have a
budget for chaos.
SPEAKER_00 (31:47):
I mean, you're not wrong.
The problem with reality showsis they're really cheap to
produce because you're notpaying major talent.
Even down to the kind of crewthat you have on a show like
that, most of those cameras areremote controlled.
They're not even paying a ton ofcameramen and stuff like that to
(32:08):
be out there.
And so those shows are reallyinexpensive to produce.
which is great but also meansthat we have too many of them
and then like one of the showsthat we just finished we watched
it on a delay but the we werehuge fans of The Last of Us on
HBO oh yeah
SPEAKER_02 (32:26):
yeah my husband was a big fan of the game
SPEAKER_00 (32:30):
yeah
SPEAKER_02 (32:31):
and so when the show came out we had to literally had
to get an HBO subscription
SPEAKER_01 (32:36):
to
SPEAKER_02 (32:37):
watch it and that's the only time we have HBO is
when the That show comes out.
SPEAKER_00 (32:43):
Yeah, I mean, it's incredible.
And everything Pedro Pascaltouches has been turning to
gold.
And, like, he just...
SPEAKER_02 (32:51):
He is a treasure.
SPEAKER_00 (32:53):
He is a treasure.
And, man, I'll die on that hill.
That guy is incredible.
And he's not just incredible,like, in the various acting
roles that...
He's in because he's freakingeverywhere all the time.
SPEAKER_01 (33:05):
He
SPEAKER_00 (33:06):
also, from the outside looking in, seems to be
a wonderful human being.
Oh,
SPEAKER_02 (33:13):
yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (33:13):
Just a delightful guy.
Did you know he just turned 50?
That dude is 50.
UNKNOWN (33:21):
Like...
SPEAKER_02 (33:22):
I can see it only because they aged him in The
Last of Us.
So when I realized that that isnot his default persona, I was
like, oh.
Because he just plays thatcharacter so well.
SPEAKER_00 (33:40):
Oh, absolutely.
SPEAKER_02 (33:42):
And yeah, to find out.
Doesn't he have like an accent?
SPEAKER_00 (33:46):
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
I'm pretty sure.
Is he Chilean?
I think he's Chilean.
It's either that or Peruvian.
It's somewhere South America.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (33:53):
I mean, to play...
a guy from Texas that's, youknow...
SPEAKER_00 (33:59):
Who's got a southern drawl and...
All of that,
SPEAKER_02 (34:01):
yeah.
And then,
SPEAKER_00 (34:03):
yeah.
But in The Mandalorian, hebasically has no accent.
He has to be, like, super flat,you know, as far as that's
concerned.
And he does a wonderful job inthat show.
And so, yeah, I just...
I'm a huge, huge, huge fan ofhis.
The Last of Us is so brilliantlydone.
It was a great show.
And, you know, I...
(34:26):
Stuff like that, though, I haveto have a palate cleanser
afterward.
I'll watch one of those, andthen my wife and I will be like,
okay, so now I want to watchsomething stupid.
I need a food show.
I need like, oh, have you everwatched on Netflix Somebody Feed
Phil?
SPEAKER_02 (34:44):
No.
Never heard
SPEAKER_00 (34:46):
of it.
I'm excited to tell you aboutthis right now.
Okay.
For real.
So Phil Rosenthal is the host ofthis show.
Phil Rosenthal kind of rose tofame because he was one of the
writers and showrunners forEverybody Loves Raymond.
SPEAKER_02 (34:59):
Okay, I was going to say that name sounds
SPEAKER_00 (35:01):
familiar.
So he had some huge hits in the90s and early 2000s as far as
sitcoms and things like that.
He was very, very instrumentalin the writing for those shows
and then just the development ofother stuff.
And he might be the most likableperson I've ever seen on
television.
SPEAKER_02 (35:20):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (35:21):
He is...
hilarious.
He's also unfailingly kind.
And he has a way of just gettingaway with saying whatever he
wants and making you feel greatabout it.
Interesting.
But his show on Netflix now iscalled Somebody Feed Phil.
And it's a food show where hetravels the world and eats in
(35:42):
all these different places.
And he eats in restaurants andpeople's homes and street food
and all sorts of things.
And he always is working with alocal fixer of some sort.
So he's got a guide.
One of my Yeah, yeah, yeah.
(36:23):
and local fixers and producersand whatever.
And I love that about it as aproduction guy because it sort
of brings a little bit ofhumanity to something that
usually is not ever seen.
So I love that.
But also Phil's the kind of guywho, like there's an episode, I
don't remember what city he wasin, I think it was somewhere in
the States, but he is at thispizza place, a famous pizza
(36:46):
place, and he orders just a tonof pizza.
And there's a line of people outthe door.
And so he walks out the door andhe literally just starts opening
up his pizza boxes and he'slike, hey, you want a slice of
this?
And he's literally just givingaway food to everyone who's in
line waiting.
He is just remarkably kind andfunny and the whole show is a
(37:09):
palate cleanser.
It is impossible to watch thatshow and be in a bad mood.
It's so good.
So anyway, I'm going to forcefeed you some Somebody Feed Phil
at some point.
You know,
SPEAKER_02 (37:19):
and I'm just sitting here thinking like, They could
have done, they could have hadfun with that title.
SPEAKER_00 (37:26):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (37:26):
Like, eat your fill.
Or.
SPEAKER_00 (37:30):
Oh my God, that's really smart.
Eat your fill or
SPEAKER_02 (37:33):
something.
I don't know.
UNKNOWN (37:34):
Eat your fill.
SPEAKER_00 (37:35):
Oh, that's so good.
We should call Netflix.
it needs a rebrand
SPEAKER_02 (37:40):
yep anyway no that sounds like fun
SPEAKER_00 (37:44):
yeah we'll definitely check it out no it is
a lot of fun one of the thingsthat I know you're pretty
excited about that's coming upin March of next year there's a
huge festival in Austin Texascalled South by Southwest and it
does it's kind of a lot ofdifferent things it's evolved a
lot over the years and I thinkand I'm sure there are people
who can correct me on this but Ithink that it actually started
(38:06):
purely as a music festival umAnd it's evolved into almost
like a music and tech thing.
So I know you're interested init, excited about it.
What do you know about it?
What drew your attention towardsthat?
What makes it interesting foryou?
SPEAKER_02 (38:22):
I've just seen some posts about it and people
talking about...
They always just seem excitedabout anything that's kind of
coming out of that industry.
Conference or whatever it'scalled.
I'll be honest.
I thought it was put on bySouthwest Airlines.
(38:45):
I was like, South by Southwest.
And then I'm seeing all thistech stuff and I was like,
interesting.
SPEAKER_01 (38:50):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (38:50):
Having trouble putting those pieces together
until I realized they don't fit.
So, yeah, I don't know muchabout it, but I did see like
it's in Austin in March.
And so I put a feeler out to ourgroup chat just saying like hey
I kind of want to go to this
SPEAKER_00 (39:08):
yeah well so I've been it's been a few years and
it's it is both a tremendousamount of fun and something you
have to have a lot of patiencewith because Austin as a city is
a decent sized city.
I mean, it's obviously thecapital of Texas, but it's
(39:30):
congested.
Exactly.
Austin's already congested andthen you bring a huge festival
into that space and it is worse.
And so that's where you have toexercise some patience and it's
going to take you forever to getaround.
It's going to, you're not goingto get a restaurant reservation
at all.
You have to think through theexperience you're wanting to
(39:51):
have.
The actual event itself isincredible.
I actually had a friend a fewyears ago speak out there he's a
South African friend of mine whohas done a tremendous amount of
work in like the conservationspace and a lot of environmental
work and stuff and he's used hisknowledge of video production
(40:14):
and specifically virtual realityvideo production to just create
a lot of awareness aroundenvironmental issues and things
like that and so he was invitedto speak out there a few years
ago and I wish I had gone whenhe was there I don't remember
why I couldn't but it's just, itis a unique experience for sure.
I want to go to, I think ourcrew should just all go down
(40:39):
there and make plans and justknow that it's going to be a
little bonkers.
But it's, it's a ton of fun.
And if you're into live music atall, it's a great place to be.
And they usually bring in somereally legit headliners and,
When I went, so they'll convertparts of like the open air
(41:03):
spaces in Austin's parks andthings like that.
Last time I went, they wereusing some of those spaces as
venues.
And so, you know, there would bestages set up and people
everywhere and vendorseverywhere, you know, And being
in March in Central Texas,that's usually a pretty good
time to be down there.
(41:24):
The weather in March here can goa million directions, but it
usually is a pretty greatexperience.
A lot of bands work really,really hard to get into South By
so that they can kind of get infront of larger audiences, have
an opportunity to open forbigger acts and things like
that.
One of my favorite bands, a bandcalled Lawrence, they kind of
(41:47):
had their big break prior toSouth By, but then that got them
a lot of attention when theyactually played that festival.
It's really cool.
And Austin's just a fun place tobe.
Oh, I
SPEAKER_02 (41:57):
love Austin.
I love it.
So Louisville steals a lot ofculture from Austin.
Several years ago, there was aKeep Austin Weird.
SPEAKER_00 (42:10):
Oh, yeah.
Yeah, that's an
SPEAKER_02 (42:12):
initiative.
And Louisville took that fromAustin.
They did credit Austin, butyeah, there was Keep Louisville
Weird, Which then became theslogan for the Louisville
Independent Business Alliance,and I volunteered for them.
Oh, cool.
This was several years ago, butI used to have a Keep Louisville
Weird sticker.
(42:32):
They just draw a lot from Austinbecause it's a really cool
culture.
It is.
It kind of reminds me almost,and I think friends back home
will understand this, it'salmost like if you took
Louisville and Nashville and putthem together.
SPEAKER_01 (42:48):
Mm-hmm.
is Austin.
SPEAKER_02 (42:50):
There's a little more cowboy, but it's got the
eclectic feel.
SPEAKER_00 (42:58):
It's very artistic.
Yes,
SPEAKER_02 (43:00):
very indie.
SPEAKER_00 (43:02):
So I've only been to Louisville once, and it was for
work, and I stayed like onenight, and I squeezed in one
distillery tour while I wasthere.
That was the only kind oftouristy thing I did.
But what makes Louisville weird?
So if they're embracing thatkind of language, what is it
(43:22):
about them that is...
It's
SPEAKER_02 (43:24):
a very indie culture.
SPEAKER_00 (43:25):
Cool.
SPEAKER_02 (43:26):
It's a very indie culture.
Now, granted, we've been gonefor a couple of years.
COVID made the mess.
The Breonna Taylor situationkind of rocked the area.
SPEAKER_01 (43:39):
And
SPEAKER_02 (43:40):
I think there's still some...
fall out from that a little bitbut it's live bands local bands
uh very foodie city um you knowthere are a couple of streets
that i hung out on in my teenageyears uh college years um where
(44:02):
we literally just walk up anddown the street and go to
different shops and um yeah ilistened to live music and there
were some clubs at night butthey were all Irish-themed pubs.
SPEAKER_00 (44:17):
Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02 (44:18):
There's just a certain culture there that you
don't find everywhere.
I think it mimics Austin a lot.
I don't think that we...
I think they were both kind ofnaturally in their respective
cities, and then maybe somebodyjust went to Austin.
(44:39):
It was like, wait a minute.
They have like a sister cityover here.
SPEAKER_00 (44:43):
Yeah, no, it's fun.
The distillery tour I went on, Iwent to Angel's Envy and did
that whole tour and learned aton.
It was fascinating, and I verymuch enjoyed it.
There was a season in my lifewhere I was really big into
bourbon, and actually I wascollecting it.
And kind of part of the resalemarket and stuff.
(45:03):
And I've gotten out of all ofthat.
It just got too crazy expensiveand all that.
But it did kind of endear me tothat part of the world.
And I would have loved to havespent more time even doing like
big distillery tours and stuff.
I know there's a whole, thebourbon trail that you can go on
and check all that out.
Because I don't, like I stillknow a lot about it.
(45:25):
But I'm pretty out of the, I'mout of the like aftermarket
bourbon scene.
Because it was just.
The
SPEAKER_02 (45:30):
bourbon black market.
SPEAKER_00 (45:31):
Yeah.
Basically, yeah.
It
SPEAKER_02 (45:32):
is what it is.
It's crazy.
It's fun.
I have friends who are involvedor were involved.
I'm not sure if they areanymore.
It's kind of an exciting, funlittle thing to basically hear
that very rare bourbons aregoing to be available at some
obscure liquor store around thecity and people line up to get
(45:56):
it and there's raffles and allsorts of things.
Now, I'm going to get crucifiedfor this, but But I've never
actually been on a bourbon tour.
UNKNOWN (46:05):
Wow.
SPEAKER_02 (46:06):
Just like I've also never been to the actual Derby.
Now, to be fair, locals don't goto the Derby.
SPEAKER_01 (46:12):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (46:13):
But I haven't done the bourbon thing.
SPEAKER_00 (46:16):
Well, it's kind of like I've lived in Dallas for, I
mean, ages.
I've been in North Texas most ofmy life.
And just last year, I finallywent to the JFK Museum and
Memorial.
SPEAKER_01 (46:31):
that's here
SPEAKER_00 (46:32):
and I've been here forever and so I think when
you're a local you tend to notgravitate towards the things
that are more touristy and I'msure there's plenty of other
stuff in Dallas I haven't donethat you know people would be
like are you serious but yeah Imean I just
SPEAKER_02 (46:49):
what's so funny is my relationship with bourbon is
kind of like a sibling like it'snot like we don't get along but
I will fight somebody like Oversomeone saying, oh, yeah, I had
bourbon from Tennessee.
No, you didn't.
SPEAKER_01 (47:08):
Uh-uh.
SPEAKER_02 (47:08):
Nope.
You had whiskey because onlybourbon is made in Kentucky.
SPEAKER_00 (47:12):
Right.
Yeah.
And it's a fun kind ofsubculture, too.
That's part of why I got intoit.
It was just the entertainment offollowing these distilleries and
really– I don't know.
Being interested in themanufacturing process, the
flavor profiles, all that.
I don't know.
I really nerded out on all thatstuff and I enjoyed it a lot.
(47:34):
Anyhow, I wonder if JenHammacher likes bourbon.
We should ask her.
You should ask her.
Write her another letter.
SPEAKER_02 (47:39):
I'll just hang out in her driveway.
I'll just block her in again andbe like, I need you to taste
SPEAKER_00 (47:44):
this.
Which won't be suspicious atall.
At all.
I promise it's just whiskey.
Or bourbon.
It's not.
That's
SPEAKER_02 (47:57):
it.
Cut.
We're done.
I'm out.
You just
SPEAKER_00 (48:01):
committed a cardinal sin.
I know, but I figured I'd drawyou off sides.
That worked beautifully.
I'm really going to have a
SPEAKER_02 (48:11):
restraining
SPEAKER_00 (48:12):
order
SPEAKER_02 (48:13):
now.
Well, that's it for PremeditatedOpinions, where the thoughts
were fully baked and only mildlyregrettable.
SPEAKER_00 (48:18):
And if you enjoyed today's episode, congrats on
having truly excellent taste inpodcasts and also opinions.
SPEAKER_02 (48:24):
Send this to someone who needs it.
And until then, please stay
SPEAKER_00 (48:32):
hydrated and behave yourself in the comments.
SPEAKER_02 (48:39):
But if you don't, share them with us.
I'll just hang out in her driveway.
I'll just block her in again andbe like, I need you to taste
SPEAKER_00 (00:04):
this.
Which won't be suspicious atall.
At all.
Yeah, yeah.
I promise it's just whiskey.
Or
SPEAKER_02 (00:18):
bourbon.
That's it.
UNKNOWN (00:22):
Cut.
We're done.
SPEAKER_02 (00:28):
listening to premeditated opinions because
yes we thought about it and thenwe said it anyway i'm pamela
SPEAKER_00 (00:34):
and i'm josh and we are just two people who somehow
share a brain and decided toweaponize our brains with
microphones
SPEAKER_02 (00:41):
each week we unpack the chaos the politics and
religion to petty internetfights and existential dread
like it's our unpaid job
SPEAKER_00 (00:50):
we are not experts we are just way too confident so
with all that being said let'sget started All right, so on the
way in, you were telling meabout something cool that you
saw.
What did you see on your way torecording this morning?
SPEAKER_02 (01:02):
Okay, so normally I don't get all excited about
seeing electric cars anymore,but I was taking my daughter to
school this morning, and out ofone of the neighborhoods we
passed, a brand-new VW buscalled the IQ Buzz pulled out,
(01:23):
and I was like,
SPEAKER_00 (01:25):
They're cool.
They've got a great aesthetic.
SPEAKER_02 (01:30):
They do.
And I was intrigued.
I haven't had a chance yet tokind of dig into anything about
them.
But I was excited that theybrought it back.
And it's sharp.
And I'm sure it's really awesomeon the inside.
SPEAKER_00 (01:46):
It is.
So we actually bought Krista'sJeep from a VW dealership.
And we walked past one on theirshowroom floor.
kind of in the process of buyingher car.
And the sales guy we wereworking with was like, well, do
you want to look inside?
I was like, absolutely.
And so we didn't get a full tourof it, but what little I saw was
(02:10):
really cool.
And I just like well-conceivedcars.
And what I mean by that is likeI love it when there's sort of
new ideas brought to the tablewith cars because, you know,
we're all just sort of used to apretty generic vehicle
experience.
But even in looking around likethe way you don't like
SPEAKER_02 (02:31):
inbreeding within your vehicles.
SPEAKER_00 (02:33):
Exactly.
Yeah, I need to.
I want diversity among the.
So if you want if you want tofind something that's kind of
new and different and infairness, there are brands that
are doing cool and differentthings.
Maybe
SPEAKER_02 (02:49):
society could learn from that.
You know?
Anyway,
SPEAKER_00 (02:52):
moving on.
But, you know, the Teslas of theworld and a lot of electric car
manufacturers, Lucid and Rivianand stuff like that, they're all
kind of doing cool new things.
And even inside, the inside ofthe IQ Buzz, if I'm remembering
it correctly, like you could,you could even change like seat
configurations and things likethat.
And the front is really sharpwith, it's all screens and LEDs
(03:14):
and you can customize what theLEDs do and when they do it.
And so, I don't know.
It's just, it's nerdy andbeautiful.
I love it.
SPEAKER_02 (03:22):
Yeah.
I mean, I am kind of a car snob.
You know, we've talked aboutwe're gearheads.
The one thing I do like aboutVolkswagen is they...
they usually are very eclectic.
SPEAKER_00 (03:37):
Yeah.
No, I'm with you on the cars.
I drive a very generic vehiclethat I just need for work stuff,
and we have a travel trailer,and it pulls a travel trailer
very well, and that's great.
I love...
everything from old schoolmuscle cars to just classically
restored, like, you know,vintage vehicles to, you know,
(04:01):
I'm, I'm pretty open-minded asfar as new cars and, you know,
there's plenty of cool stuff.
And honestly, I'm not, I, I usedto be kind of anti-electric car,
but that ship has sailed for me.
Like I'm, I'm all in at thispoint.
I just need the infrastructureto catch up to, Yes,
SPEAKER_02 (04:22):
that's the biggest issue.
Until you can charge at any gasstation, we've got some ways to
go.
SPEAKER_00 (04:32):
Well, you had kind of a cool experience in the last
couple of weeks.
I know that you're a huge fan ofJen Hatmaker.
That's an understatement.
So for the uninitiated, JenHatmaker is an author and a
speaker and just kind of hasbeen a huge presence in I don't
know.
(04:53):
What would you describe herdemographic as?
SPEAKER_02 (04:56):
So she started off as a Christian author.
SPEAKER_00 (05:01):
She was a darling of sort of the evangelical
conservative Christian.
SPEAKER_02 (05:06):
Exactly.
Midwest, you know.
I actually started following herin 2016 or shortly after.
So in 2016, she had a momentwhere...
She came out as affirming.
Affirming, for people who don'tknow, is basically just saying
(05:27):
that we agree with LGBTQ, we'reokay with marriage within that
community, we accept thatcommunity, we want them in our
church, and people lost theirminds.
SPEAKER_00 (05:41):
Oh, completely.
SPEAKER_02 (05:42):
Her books got ripped from the shelves, they were
taken out of publication.
She pretty much very publiclylost everything.
Um, it was very, a verydevastating moment for her.
Um, I, I had a friend who hadreposted something of hers on
Facebook and that's how I foundher.
(06:04):
And she, this was post Christiandemise.
SPEAKER_00 (06:10):
I don't know.
Um, cancellation.
Yes.
SPEAKER_02 (06:13):
And she was still kind of rebuilding and picking
up the pieces.
UNKNOWN (06:17):
Um,
SPEAKER_02 (06:17):
And she was just funny.
SPEAKER_01 (06:19):
Yeah.
Like she was
SPEAKER_02 (06:20):
very funny and very relatable.
I followed a lot of her content,you know, around her kids and
getting them ready for schooland all the things.
And as she evolved over theyears, I really...
started kind of learning alittle bit more about her.
(06:42):
I started reading some of herbooks.
I hadn't read any of her books.
I think her first book I readmay have been...
I don't know if it was For theLove or if it was Of Mess and
Moxie, but I immediatelyrelated.
And we have histories within theevangelical church, so...
(07:07):
And a lot of the things that shewas questioning and things that
she was being ostracized forwere things that I had also had
questions and similarexperiences.
thoughts about similar opinionsabout and I just I don't know
she's just very endearing andyou know she she also she lives
(07:28):
down in Austin she's only acouple hours away so I can stalk
her at any time um so uh that'sone reason why I agreed to move
to Texas
SPEAKER_00 (07:39):
oh but you you know less than a four hour drive away
from yeah
SPEAKER_02 (07:44):
I'm sure I have like a restraining order or something
at this point but But in 2020,went through another milestone,
another very devastating event.
Very public.
Very public.
Where her and her husband of 26years got divorced.
And at this time, she wasactually releasing Fierce, Free,
(08:08):
and Full of Fire.
And I was on the launch team
SPEAKER_00 (08:13):
for
SPEAKER_02 (08:13):
that book.
SPEAKER_00 (08:13):
So how did you get on the launch team?
UNKNOWN (08:17):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (08:17):
Just stalking.
SPEAKER_02 (08:19):
Probably.
SPEAKER_00 (08:19):
Standing outside her house.
SPEAKER_02 (08:21):
I wrote her a letter and just
SPEAKER_00 (08:26):
handed it to her personally.
Did you use magazine clippingsfor the words?
I just sat in
SPEAKER_02 (08:31):
her driveway until she had to leave.
SPEAKER_00 (08:36):
Perfect.
SPEAKER_02 (08:37):
Meanwhile, I still lived in Louisville at the time.
SPEAKER_00 (08:40):
That was expensive stalking.
It required a lot of effort.
So you got on the launch teamfor that last book?
SPEAKER_02 (08:50):
I did.
I didn't know that.
I think that it may have justbeen a call for members, either
on Facebook or at...
It may have been an email.
I'm not sure.
I can't remember.
But I got accepted and I was soexcited because you get an early
(09:13):
copy of the book and that onewas really good.
SPEAKER_01 (09:16):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (09:17):
Really good.
But it came out as her life wasbasically shattering all over
again.
And so this new book that shehas coming out is basically kind
of about that time.
Yeah.
But the difference with this isit's her memoir.
Yeah,
SPEAKER_01 (09:36):
yeah,
SPEAKER_02 (09:37):
yeah.
So she kind of walks us throughthat period of her life, but
also flashbacks a lot to specialperiods of her life or things
that...
She's just a very interestingperson.
Definitely.
And she's very relatable.
She's very funny.
She's very great with words.
She's got a way of puttingthings...
(10:01):
And a perspective that is justincredibly relatable.
SPEAKER_01 (10:06):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (10:07):
Yeah.
And so this time I'm on herlaunch team.
I got accepted on her launchteam for Awake.
I think it releases here at theend of September.
Yeah.
And I'm super excited aboutthat.
And I'm supposed to be going tothat book tour.
I think it's like a week afterher book releases.
(10:29):
But yeah, I've started readingit.
I'm about 60% of the waythrough.
I wanted to talk about it today,but we'll talk about it next
time.
But it's so good.
All her stuff is so good.
And while she tends to writemore for women and in that
perspective, I've recommendedher books to guys before.
(10:52):
Oh, absolutely.
And just said, hey, her FearsFree and Full of Fire really...
changed my perspective on thingsand gave me a more positive or
encouraging outlook, you know,like to really take care of
(11:14):
yourself.
And, you know, outside of justlike, Bubble baths and Starbucks
coffees, like actual self-careand what that looks like
spiritually, emotionally,physically.
And I don't know, this soundsreally ridiculous, but I swear
(11:34):
this woman has changed my life.
SPEAKER_00 (11:36):
Oh, I don't think that's ridiculous.
I don't think that's ridiculousat all.
I think we...
I think humans often look tocreators to help make sense of
just the world that we are, theworld we have inherited.
And those creators can beauthors, they can be speakers,
they can be musicians, they canbe actors.
Like we use all these differentresources to sort of make things
(12:00):
make more sense.
And, you know, for me, and thisparticular author has changed a
lot since he wrote some booksthat were very impactful for me,
but for me, a guy who I thinkchanged my life is a guy named
Donald Miller.
Any
SPEAKER_02 (12:14):
relation?
SPEAKER_00 (12:15):
No.
Unfortunately.
But he is a really, like,honestly, his professional life
has kind of taken a differentpath now and he does a lot more
sort of corporate things.
And I throw no shade.
Like, do your thing.
You know, it's fine.
But he wrote some books kind ofearlier in his life in a
different era of his life.
One called Blue Like Jazz thatwas incredibly formative for me.
(12:38):
And then another one called AMillion Miles in a Thousand
Years.
They've reshaped a lot of myperspectives on the world around
me, on the faith I was trying topractice, on the relationships
that I had.
And so I don't think it'sridiculous at all to...
kind of crown somebody within amore creative atmosphere as
(13:02):
like, oh, you have been superimpactful on me and my
perspective.
Exactly.
SPEAKER_02 (13:07):
And so one thing I really appreciate is she's got a
podcast.
SPEAKER_00 (13:11):
Which you all should go listen to.
Not right now.
Finish this one, but then golisten to hers.
SPEAKER_02 (13:15):
Yeah, we come first.
So anyway, but the guests thatshe has brought on have been, I
mean, I don't know how she findsthese people, but every one of
her guests have always givenjust amazing interviews and just
(13:37):
really have...
I don't even know how to...
quantify or qualify the impactyou know and it's been almost 10
years I just realized I'm like20 26 is coming up like that's
10 years um but yeah between herpodcasts and her books and her
social media and all of thesethings I just I really kind of
(14:03):
look to her when things feeluneasy, unsure, chaotic, you
know, I'm kind of like, where isJen's headspace at with this?
Like she kind of, and shedoesn't know this, but I mean,
(14:23):
she really does kind of helpground me.
I don't want to say she's like aNorthern star, but like, I'm
almost like if Jen's notpanicking, I'm not panicking.
SPEAKER_00 (14:34):
Sure.
If
SPEAKER_02 (14:35):
Jen's panicking,
SPEAKER_00 (14:36):
I'm paying attention.
SPEAKER_02 (14:37):
Yes.
Yes.
SPEAKER_00 (14:39):
Well, and, And so I want to talk more about her.
I want to read the book as welland have you do it.
But I will say...
before we jump off the Jen hatmaker train, which is really fun
to be on.
Um, when she, um, basically cameout in support of the LGBT
community, it's because herdaughter came out and this is
(15:02):
all public.
You know, I'm not, I am not, youknow, I'm not revealing anything
that is not out there, you know,in depth.
Uh, so yeah, don't at me, butthe, uh, When that happened, I
was already in a place in my ownsort of spiritual life where I
was at a real impasse with a lotof the perspectives of the way
(15:25):
that I had grown up.
But I also didn't feel like Ihad a model yet, because I
didn't know where to look.
I didn't have a model for whatfaith could look like, what
spirituality could look like,where was there space for
perspectives that definitely didnot align with the way that I
grew up, with the community thatwas around me, with the church I
(15:46):
was involved in, all of that.
And so now here's this personwho was already on my radar
because she was such a darlingof the...
And these are her words, notmine.
Don't at me.
She said, She was the darling ofthe white evangelical soccer
mom.
SPEAKER_02 (16:02):
That's in this book.
She says
SPEAKER_00 (16:04):
that.
And so she was already on myradar just because of that.
She had done tons of speakingtours, and I don't know that I
had attended anything she hadspoken at, but she was on my
radar.
I was following her on socialmedia channels and things like
that, had seen tons of hercontent.
And so...
She comes out in support of thatcommunity to support her
(16:27):
daughter and was absolutelyannihilated by just conservative
Christianity.
I mean, overnight she was deadto everyone.
And that revealed two things tome immediately.
One, I am a part of a systemthat is really focused on who
I'm hating more than who I'mloving.
(16:49):
And two, if we can't stomachsome level of disagreement or
different perspectives insidethis kind of religious
experience, then I'm starting toget less and less interested.
And I'm not interested in beingtold who to hate.
I'm not interested in being toldlike, I latched on to her big
(17:13):
time at that point and have hadtremendous respect for her ever
since.
SPEAKER_02 (17:20):
Absolutely, because she got annihilated.
She lost everything.
Everything.
SPEAKER_00 (17:26):
Every speaking engagement, every book deal.
Overnight.
Everything.
SPEAKER_02 (17:29):
And she held firm.
SPEAKER_00 (17:30):
Yeah.
For her kid.
SPEAKER_02 (17:32):
And she weathered that storm and she, I mean, that
was a big sacrifice.
Yeah.
You know, because she could havejust stayed quiet.
SPEAKER_01 (17:42):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (17:42):
She could have just gone along and she didn't.
And the thing about that momentis I think there were several
people kind of in that same campthat were like, I don't think I
agree with this.
Right.
And what she did gave peoplepermission to say, you know
(18:03):
what?
I can love, you know, my gayneighbors and friends and
lesbians.
Family members.
Exactly.
And all that.
And still be a Christian.
Right.
And still have faith.
Like, this is not aboutChristian hating or any of that.
It is...
(18:25):
basically tearing down a lot ofthe rules that are just made up.
Right.
SPEAKER_00 (18:32):
Yes.
SPEAKER_02 (18:33):
Yeah.
And, and, and she just reallybarreled through several of
those walls.
Um, and she will admit, like itcame out at a time that she, she
didn't have a lot of time toprepare.
She, she knew she'd had theinterview, um, They gave her
basically 24 hours and then itreleased and it opened the
(18:55):
floodgates.
But now I hear so many storieson her podcast and other forms
of media where people are like,you don't know what that did for
me.
Like you, you know, help me getout of a bad marriage or get out
of a bad, you know, religioussituation or help me see that
(19:21):
there is a path forward here.
Like these two things don't haveto be mutually exclusive.
SPEAKER_00 (19:27):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (19:27):
So yeah, we could go on all day.
SPEAKER_00 (19:30):
Oh man, this could be the Jen hat maker
appreciation podcast.
Yeah.
But I
SPEAKER_02 (19:33):
suggest, I definitely recommend, I know I'm
not through, but the book isvery quick.
It's a very quick, easy read.
It's not her typical.
She does have humor, but it'snot her typical kind of like
where you kind of get itthroughout.
It's a little more serious, butit's It's good.
SPEAKER_00 (19:53):
Yeah.
I mean, she's basically astand-up comic
SPEAKER_01 (19:56):
who,
SPEAKER_00 (19:56):
you know, writes.
And I heard her say on a podcastrecently that, you know, at the
end of the day, the thing thatshe considers herself to be is a
writer.
Yes.
Sure, she does speaking gigs.
Sure, she's a podcast host andall this other thing.
But at the end of the day, shesees herself as a writer.
And that really comes througheven just in her social media
(20:18):
presence.
Like, everything is quippy.
It's well-written.
It's...
But you also feel like she'sjust talking to you, which is
really amazing.
But her commentary, too, on alot of just current events and
political stuff.
I mean, to your point, she iskind of a bellwether of like,
okay, there are certain peoplein my life that when– Things are
(20:38):
going crazy.
I sort of glance at to be like,are we okay?
SPEAKER_02 (20:44):
And I hate that she's the one that had to be
crucified for it, but it was notdone in vain.
SPEAKER_00 (20:50):
Right, right.
But even, like, there's so muchabout our current political
climate that it's hard to knowhow to respond to.
And so, on one hand, like, Idon't want to be an alarmist and
constantly think that the sky isfalling and constantly be
worried and concerned about, um,the state of Washington and our
(21:15):
political leaders and thingslike that.
And so I probably put too muchemphasis on looking to people
like her to be like, okay, areyou using the fascism word yet?
Because it's starting to seemlike this is what we're doing.
Are we okay with the factthat...
It
SPEAKER_02 (21:33):
kind of tempers your alarmist.
SPEAKER_00 (21:35):
Yes, it does.
I don't know when to reach forthe panic button, but if they're
reaching for the panic button,then oh boy.
And there's plenty to panicabout.
Right?
I've got a dear friend inWashington, D.C.
that she...
She actually works for a localpolitician there.
She was posting on one of hersocial profiles recently.
(21:59):
She was having a very pleasantday, and she had done some
reading and done some work andall this, and she was walking
past a lake by where they live,and there was like a National
Guard checkpoint that had beenset up right at that sidewalk.
And it just seemed so weird anddystopian to me that, you know,
(22:23):
I realize that there are crimein various places, but I've also
spent a lot of time walkingthrough Washington, D.C.
because I have a major client inthat area.
So I've been there a ton, andI've just not really felt all
that unsafe.
And so to have things likeNational Guard deployments, and
then I read this morning thatthere's a Texas National Guard
(22:44):
deployment that might behappening in Illinois.
Why are we sending one state'sNational Guard to a different
state Crime?
Well, and that's
SPEAKER_02 (22:54):
not what they're there for.
SPEAKER_00 (22:56):
Right.
That's
SPEAKER_02 (22:56):
not what they're trained to do.
They're not trained lawenforcement.
Last I heard, they're not evendoing anything.
They're cleaning up trash.
Right.
Exactly.
They're walking around like theydon't know what to do because
this isn't what they're trainedto do.
SPEAKER_00 (23:13):
Well, and thankfully, we have such
qualified, capable leadership atthe very top of our governmental
organization.
That is sarcasm for people whocannot see my face.
We have such qualifiedleadership at the top of all of
our organizations that we justhave nothing to be concerned
about because I'm sure they haveit under control.
Right, Jen Hatmaker?
SPEAKER_02 (23:32):
Right.
So, okay, and then I don't wantto belabor this point, but like,
oh, there's so much crime inD.C.
SPEAKER_01 (23:38):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (23:39):
Okay, what kind of crime?
What are we talking about here?
What kind of crime is going on?
I mean, they're not dispersingriots.
Like, are you going to happen tocatch the person who happens to
be walking down the street witha gun?
What are you going to do?
I mean, technically, I have aright until they actually shoot
somebody.
Well, what do you, I mean, howare you preventing that?
(24:00):
Like, you're not preventing drugcrime.
That's not going to happen outon the street.
Like, what are you, to me, it'sjust, I got thoughts.
I got thoughts, I got opinions,and I'm just like, it's
SPEAKER_01 (24:14):
bullshit.
SPEAKER_02 (24:16):
It's just, I'm like, oh, yeah, we got to fight crime.
What crime?
SPEAKER_00 (24:22):
Right.
I'm stealing this from a podcastthat you also should go listen
to if you're listening to ours,a brilliant podcast called
Pantsuit Politics.
They're also big Jen Hatmakerfans there.
SPEAKER_02 (24:32):
And they're from my state of Kentucky.
SPEAKER_00 (24:33):
They are from your state of Kentucky.
And they love it there.
They speak fondly of that partof the world.
And so Beth, one of the hosts ofthat podcast, said something
that I thought was so smart whenthey were talking about this.
She said that the...
Instead of sending NationalGuard people, send that budget
(24:57):
to local law enforcement so theycan expand their own presence in
ways that make sense for theirlocal districts.
SPEAKER_02 (25:05):
Exactly, because they know what's going on.
They're on the ground.
These are their beats.
These are their neighborhoods.
They know who these people are.
They know the offenders.
That makes perfect sense.
Because send a National Guard,National Guard doesn't know
what's going
SPEAKER_00 (25:18):
on.
Right, and it's more people tofigure out, okay, where do we
put all these people?
people?
Where do we put all theequipment they're bringing with
them?
There's so much in the way oflogistics when you're deploying
a unit of National Guard versusif you're just empowering local
law enforcement.
I don't know.
To me, that makes so much sense.
SPEAKER_02 (25:36):
I'm glad we took money away from Medicare and
Medicaid to fund
SPEAKER_00 (25:41):
that.
Yeah, it makes perfect sense.
Anyway,
SPEAKER_02 (25:44):
moving on.
SPEAKER_00 (25:46):
So have you ever had the experience where you find a
show and you get really excitedabout a show, and then as you
are watching the first couple ofepisodes, you find out that it's
already been canceled?
No, never.
It's never happened to me.
SPEAKER_02 (26:01):
Happens to almost every show I like.
So
SPEAKER_00 (26:05):
you are partially responsible for this, and
actually another friend of minehad mentioned this show to my
wife and I previously.
I
SPEAKER_02 (26:12):
shan't be held accountable.
SPEAKER_00 (26:13):
You shan't.
No, absolutely not.
There's this brilliant show onNetflix called Chaos, K-A-O-S,
and it's genius.
And so another friend hadrecommended it, and then our
families were all hanging out alittle while back, and you threw
an episode on just because y'alllove it.
(26:35):
And in 10 minutes, I was hooked.
I was like, this is brilliant.
It is.
It's a great concept.
SPEAKER_02 (26:41):
It's so creative.
SPEAKER_00 (26:42):
It's so creative.
So the general concept, andcorrect me if I'm wrong here,
but the general concept is it'ssort of a reframing of Greek
mythology based on actualcharacters from Greek mythology.
UNKNOWN (26:54):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (26:55):
But the stories are told in almost a modernized way.
Yes.
Is that fair to say?
SPEAKER_02 (26:59):
Yeah, it's like modern day.
SPEAKER_00 (27:01):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (27:01):
As though Crete is still an empire and Sparta and
all of those.
And yeah, so you've got Eurydiceand Orpheus and their story.
You've got Icarus and Daedalus.
But yeah, it's kind of like ifthose gods, like if we still
(27:24):
believe
SPEAKER_01 (27:25):
right in that
SPEAKER_02 (27:26):
today
SPEAKER_01 (27:27):
yeah
SPEAKER_02 (27:27):
as though those empires never fell
SPEAKER_01 (27:29):
right
SPEAKER_02 (27:30):
and I love Greek and Roman mythology and so this is
like right up my alley and hasJeff Goldblum yes who is Zeus
yeah yes and it's it's just veryclever yeah it's very creative
it was very well produced
SPEAKER_00 (27:51):
yes yeah Netflix spent some money on it you know
they the cast is excellent andJeff Goldblum is I think
probably the biggest name butit's got a lot of very
recognizable it
SPEAKER_02 (28:05):
has Helen
SPEAKER_00 (28:05):
Mirren oh Helen Mirren yeah
SPEAKER_02 (28:08):
she's Hera
SPEAKER_00 (28:08):
yeah that's probably definitely your top two cast but
absolute genius show it's sofunny
SPEAKER_02 (28:16):
not safe for children
SPEAKER_00 (28:17):
no don't watch it with your kids but it's
hilarious it's so smart andcreative I loved it and it's
gone now.
And I have a chaos-shaped holein my heart that I didn't even
know I had.
It was really, really brilliant.
But what else should people bewatching?
What else have you been into outthere in the entertainment
(28:41):
scene?
SPEAKER_02 (28:42):
We're also watching the new season of Wednesday Just
Dropped.
Oh,
SPEAKER_01 (28:47):
yes.
SPEAKER_02 (28:48):
And so I grew up loving the Addams
SPEAKER_01 (28:52):
Family.
SPEAKER_02 (28:53):
Addams Family values All of those.
When Wednesday came out, I wassuper excited.
We actually didn't watch it withthe kids.
We watched it first.
It was not quite what I wasexpecting, but I'm not sure how
else they could have done it.
Because Wednesday kind ofbecomes like a Harry at the Spa.
SPEAKER_01 (29:16):
Yeah, yeah,
SPEAKER_02 (29:17):
yeah.
And I'm like, this justdoesn't...
feel like Wednesday but I don'tknow how else they could have
like I don't know what else theywould have done
SPEAKER_00 (29:29):
yeah and I think that they took so Tim Burton is
directing I love Tim Burton heis absolutely brilliant I love
his approach with how hedeveloped a lot of the
characters and things like thatit is it's intense and there are
parts especially towards the endof the first season that lean a
(29:50):
bit violent so if that somethingthat you're sensitive to,
especially as far as kids areconcerned.
That's a good thing to keep inmind.
Tim Burton really took somecreative license in ways that I
think work.
I've been impressed nonstop withJenna Ortega's performance.
The I read early on that shetried really hard when they were
(30:14):
doing any close-ups of her tonot blink.
SPEAKER_02 (30:17):
Oh, yeah, yeah, yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (30:17):
I heard about that.
Just to make herself a littlebit more imposing and
intimidating and for it to be alittle bit more disconcerting.
But, yeah, even that cast isabsolutely stacked.
I mean, Catherine Zeta-Jones isin it in the first season.
It's got Gwendolyn Christie init, who is awesome as Brienne of
Tarth in Game of Thrones.
She's also the silverstormtrooper from the Star Wars
(30:40):
movies like it's really justbrilliantly done and I'm excited
about it but yeah that show hasbeen a pleasant surprise and
then the second season just cameout and I've watched probably
about half of it I need to goback and rewatch a couple
episodes so I wasn't payingenough attention more recently
but like that's been a blast andI've really enjoyed all of that
(31:04):
I'm hoping that Netflix keeps itaround it seems to be one of
their major players so I I thinkthat's probably the case.
So we have kind of a sillytradition around entertainment
at my house.
We are normally watching acouple of more serious shows,
and then we have just absolutegarbage that we watch.
(31:25):
Unashamed, Love Island garbage.
That's our garbage of choiceright now.
I haven't tapped
SPEAKER_02 (31:31):
into that, but I've done Love is Blind.
I've done Perfect Match.
SPEAKER_00 (31:36):
We did Perfect Match, too.
Too
SPEAKER_02 (31:37):
Hot to Handle.
SPEAKER_00 (31:38):
We did Too Hot to Handle.
SPEAKER_02 (31:39):
Just...
SPEAKER_00 (31:41):
Crap.
Oh, yeah.
Junk.
I'm
SPEAKER_02 (31:43):
like, we could get rid of a few of those and have a
budget for chaos.
SPEAKER_00 (31:47):
I mean, you're not wrong.
The problem with reality showsis they're really cheap to
produce because you're notpaying major talent.
Even down to the kind of crewthat you have on a show like
that, most of those cameras areremote controlled.
They're not even paying a ton ofcameramen and stuff like that to
(32:08):
be out there.
And so those shows are reallyinexpensive to produce.
which is great but also meansthat we have too many of them
and then like one of the showsthat we just finished we watched
it on a delay but the we werehuge fans of The Last of Us on
HBO oh yeah
SPEAKER_02 (32:26):
yeah my husband was a big fan of the game
SPEAKER_00 (32:30):
yeah
SPEAKER_02 (32:31):
and so when the show came out we had to literally had
to get an HBO subscription
SPEAKER_01 (32:36):
to
SPEAKER_02 (32:37):
watch it and that's the only time we have HBO is
when the That show comes out.
SPEAKER_00 (32:43):
Yeah, I mean, it's incredible.
And everything Pedro Pascaltouches has been turning to
gold.
And, like, he just...
SPEAKER_02 (32:51):
He is a treasure.
SPEAKER_00 (32:53):
He is a treasure.
And, man, I'll die on that hill.
That guy is incredible.
And he's not just incredible,like, in the various acting
roles that...
He's in because he's freakingeverywhere all the time.
SPEAKER_01 (33:05):
He
SPEAKER_00 (33:06):
also, from the outside looking in, seems to be
a wonderful human being.
Oh,
SPEAKER_02 (33:13):
yeah.
SPEAKER_00 (33:13):
Just a delightful guy.
Did you know he just turned 50?
That dude is 50.
UNKNOWN (33:21):
Like...
SPEAKER_02 (33:22):
I can see it only because they aged him in The
Last of Us.
So when I realized that that isnot his default persona, I was
like, oh.
Because he just plays thatcharacter so well.
SPEAKER_00 (33:40):
Oh, absolutely.
SPEAKER_02 (33:42):
And yeah, to find out.
Doesn't he have like an accent?
SPEAKER_00 (33:46):
Oh, yeah.
Yeah.
I'm pretty sure.
Is he Chilean?
I think he's Chilean.
It's either that or Peruvian.
It's somewhere South America.
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (33:53):
I mean, to play...
a guy from Texas that's, youknow...
SPEAKER_00 (33:59):
Who's got a southern drawl and...
All of that,
SPEAKER_02 (34:01):
yeah.
And then,
SPEAKER_00 (34:03):
yeah.
But in The Mandalorian, hebasically has no accent.
He has to be, like, super flat,you know, as far as that's
concerned.
And he does a wonderful job inthat show.
And so, yeah, I just...
I'm a huge, huge, huge fan ofhis.
The Last of Us is so brilliantlydone.
It was a great show.
And, you know, I...
(34:26):
Stuff like that, though, I haveto have a palate cleanser
afterward.
I'll watch one of those, andthen my wife and I will be like,
okay, so now I want to watchsomething stupid.
I need a food show.
I need like, oh, have you everwatched on Netflix Somebody Feed
Phil?
SPEAKER_02 (34:44):
No.
Never heard
SPEAKER_00 (34:46):
of it.
I'm excited to tell you aboutthis right now.
Okay.
For real.
So Phil Rosenthal is the host ofthis show.
Phil Rosenthal kind of rose tofame because he was one of the
writers and showrunners forEverybody Loves Raymond.
SPEAKER_02 (34:59):
Okay, I was going to say that name sounds
SPEAKER_00 (35:01):
familiar.
So he had some huge hits in the90s and early 2000s as far as
sitcoms and things like that.
He was very, very instrumentalin the writing for those shows
and then just the development ofother stuff.
And he might be the most likableperson I've ever seen on
television.
SPEAKER_02 (35:20):
Okay.
SPEAKER_00 (35:21):
He is...
hilarious.
He's also unfailingly kind.
And he has a way of just gettingaway with saying whatever he
wants and making you feel greatabout it.
Interesting.
But his show on Netflix now iscalled Somebody Feed Phil.
And it's a food show where hetravels the world and eats in
(35:42):
all these different places.
And he eats in restaurants andpeople's homes and street food
and all sorts of things.
And he always is working with alocal fixer of some sort.
So he's got a guide.
One of my Yeah, yeah, yeah.
(36:23):
and local fixers and producersand whatever.
And I love that about it as aproduction guy because it sort
of brings a little bit ofhumanity to something that
usually is not ever seen.
So I love that.
But also Phil's the kind of guywho, like there's an episode, I
don't remember what city he wasin, I think it was somewhere in
the States, but he is at thispizza place, a famous pizza
(36:46):
place, and he orders just a tonof pizza.
And there's a line of people outthe door.
And so he walks out the door andhe literally just starts opening
up his pizza boxes and he'slike, hey, you want a slice of
this?
And he's literally just givingaway food to everyone who's in
line waiting.
He is just remarkably kind andfunny and the whole show is a
(37:09):
palate cleanser.
It is impossible to watch thatshow and be in a bad mood.
It's so good.
So anyway, I'm going to forcefeed you some Somebody Feed Phil
at some point.
You know,
SPEAKER_02 (37:19):
and I'm just sitting here thinking like, They could
have done, they could have hadfun with that title.
SPEAKER_00 (37:26):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (37:26):
Like, eat your fill.
Or.
SPEAKER_00 (37:30):
Oh my God, that's really smart.
Eat your fill or
SPEAKER_02 (37:33):
something.
I don't know.
UNKNOWN (37:34):
Eat your fill.
SPEAKER_00 (37:35):
Oh, that's so good.
We should call Netflix.
it needs a rebrand
SPEAKER_02 (37:40):
yep anyway no that sounds like fun
SPEAKER_00 (37:44):
yeah we'll definitely check it out no it is
a lot of fun one of the thingsthat I know you're pretty
excited about that's coming upin March of next year there's a
huge festival in Austin Texascalled South by Southwest and it
does it's kind of a lot ofdifferent things it's evolved a
lot over the years and I thinkand I'm sure there are people
who can correct me on this but Ithink that it actually started
(38:06):
purely as a music festival umAnd it's evolved into almost
like a music and tech thing.
So I know you're interested init, excited about it.
What do you know about it?
What drew your attention towardsthat?
What makes it interesting foryou?
SPEAKER_02 (38:22):
I've just seen some posts about it and people
talking about...
They always just seem excitedabout anything that's kind of
coming out of that industry.
Conference or whatever it'scalled.
I'll be honest.
I thought it was put on bySouthwest Airlines.
(38:45):
I was like, South by Southwest.
And then I'm seeing all thistech stuff and I was like,
interesting.
SPEAKER_01 (38:50):
Yeah.
SPEAKER_02 (38:50):
Having trouble putting those pieces together
until I realized they don't fit.
So, yeah, I don't know muchabout it, but I did see like
it's in Austin in March.
And so I put a feeler out to ourgroup chat just saying like hey
I kind of want to go to this
SPEAKER_00 (39:08):
yeah well so I've been it's been a few years and
it's it is both a tremendousamount of fun and something you
have to have a lot of patiencewith because Austin as a city is
a decent sized city.
I mean, it's obviously thecapital of Texas, but it's
(39:30):
congested.
Exactly.
Austin's already congested andthen you bring a huge festival
into that space and it is worse.
And so that's where you have toexercise some patience and it's
going to take you forever to getaround.
It's going to, you're not goingto get a restaurant reservation
at all.
You have to think through theexperience you're wanting to
(39:51):
have.
The actual event itself isincredible.
I actually had a friend a fewyears ago speak out there he's a
South African friend of mine whohas done a tremendous amount of
work in like the conservationspace and a lot of environmental
work and stuff and he's used hisknowledge of video production
(40:14):
and specifically virtual realityvideo production to just create
a lot of awareness aroundenvironmental issues and things
like that and so he was invitedto speak out there a few years
ago and I wish I had gone whenhe was there I don't remember
why I couldn't but it's just, itis a unique experience for sure.
I want to go to, I think ourcrew should just all go down
(40:39):
there and make plans and justknow that it's going to be a
little bonkers.
But it's, it's a ton of fun.
And if you're into live music atall, it's a great place to be.
And they usually bring in somereally legit headliners and,
When I went, so they'll convertparts of like the open air
(41:03):
spaces in Austin's parks andthings like that.
Last time I went, they wereusing some of those spaces as
venues.
And so, you know, there would bestages set up and people
everywhere and vendorseverywhere, you know, And being
in March in Central Texas,that's usually a pretty good
time to be down there.
(41:24):
The weather in March here can goa million directions, but it
usually is a pretty greatexperience.
A lot of bands work really,really hard to get into South By
so that they can kind of get infront of larger audiences, have
an opportunity to open forbigger acts and things like
that.
One of my favorite bands, a bandcalled Lawrence, they kind of
(41:47):
had their big break prior toSouth By, but then that got them
a lot of attention when theyactually played that festival.
It's really cool.
And Austin's just a fun place tobe.
Oh, I
SPEAKER_02 (41:57):
love Austin.
I love it.
So Louisville steals a lot ofculture from Austin.
Several years ago, there was aKeep Austin Weird.
SPEAKER_00 (42:10):
Oh, yeah.
Yeah, that's an
SPEAKER_02 (42:12):
initiative.
And Louisville took that fromAustin.
They did credit Austin, butyeah, there was Keep Louisville
Weird, Which then became theslogan for the Louisville
Independent Business Alliance,and I volunteered for them.
Oh, cool.
This was several years ago, butI used to have a Keep Louisville
Weird sticker.
(42:32):
They just draw a lot from Austinbecause it's a really cool
culture.
It is.
It kind of reminds me almost,and I think friends back home
will understand this, it'salmost like if you took
Louisville and Nashville and putthem together.
SPEAKER_01 (42:48):
Mm-hmm.
is Austin.
SPEAKER_02 (42:50):
There's a little more cowboy, but it's got the
eclectic feel.
SPEAKER_00 (42:58):
It's very artistic.
Yes,
SPEAKER_02 (43:00):
very indie.
SPEAKER_00 (43:02):
So I've only been to Louisville once, and it was for
work, and I stayed like onenight, and I squeezed in one
distillery tour while I wasthere.
That was the only kind oftouristy thing I did.
But what makes Louisville weird?
So if they're embracing thatkind of language, what is it
(43:22):
about them that is...
It's
SPEAKER_02 (43:24):
a very indie culture.
SPEAKER_00 (43:25):
Cool.
SPEAKER_02 (43:26):
It's a very indie culture.
Now, granted, we've been gonefor a couple of years.
COVID made the mess.
The Breonna Taylor situationkind of rocked the area.
SPEAKER_01 (43:39):
And
SPEAKER_02 (43:40):
I think there's still some...
fall out from that a little bitbut it's live bands local bands
uh very foodie city um you knowthere are a couple of streets
that i hung out on in my teenageyears uh college years um where
(44:02):
we literally just walk up anddown the street and go to
different shops and um yeah ilistened to live music and there
were some clubs at night butthey were all Irish-themed pubs.
SPEAKER_00 (44:17):
Absolutely.
SPEAKER_02 (44:18):
There's just a certain culture there that you
don't find everywhere.
I think it mimics Austin a lot.
I don't think that we...
I think they were both kind ofnaturally in their respective
cities, and then maybe somebodyjust went to Austin.
(44:39):
It was like, wait a minute.
They have like a sister cityover here.
SPEAKER_00 (44:43):
Yeah, no, it's fun.
The distillery tour I went on, Iwent to Angel's Envy and did
that whole tour and learned aton.
It was fascinating, and I verymuch enjoyed it.
There was a season in my lifewhere I was really big into
bourbon, and actually I wascollecting it.
And kind of part of the resalemarket and stuff.
(45:03):
And I've gotten out of all ofthat.
It just got too crazy expensiveand all that.
But it did kind of endear me tothat part of the world.
And I would have loved to havespent more time even doing like
big distillery tours and stuff.
I know there's a whole, thebourbon trail that you can go on
and check all that out.
Because I don't, like I stillknow a lot about it.
(45:25):
But I'm pretty out of the, I'mout of the like aftermarket
bourbon scene.
Because it was just.
The
SPEAKER_02 (45:30):
bourbon black market.
SPEAKER_00 (45:31):
Yeah.
Basically, yeah.
It
SPEAKER_02 (45:32):
is what it is.
It's crazy.
It's fun.
I have friends who are involvedor were involved.
I'm not sure if they areanymore.
It's kind of an exciting, funlittle thing to basically hear
that very rare bourbons aregoing to be available at some
obscure liquor store around thecity and people line up to get
(45:56):
it and there's raffles and allsorts of things.
Now, I'm going to get crucifiedfor this, but But I've never
actually been on a bourbon tour.
UNKNOWN (46:05):
Wow.
SPEAKER_02 (46:06):
Just like I've also never been to the actual Derby.
Now, to be fair, locals don't goto the Derby.
SPEAKER_01 (46:12):
Right.
SPEAKER_02 (46:13):
But I haven't done the bourbon thing.
SPEAKER_00 (46:16):
Well, it's kind of like I've lived in Dallas for, I
mean, ages.
I've been in North Texas most ofmy life.
And just last year, I finallywent to the JFK Museum and
Memorial.
SPEAKER_01 (46:31):
that's here
SPEAKER_00 (46:32):
and I've been here forever and so I think when
you're a local you tend to notgravitate towards the things
that are more touristy and I'msure there's plenty of other
stuff in Dallas I haven't donethat you know people would be
like are you serious but yeah Imean I just
SPEAKER_02 (46:49):
what's so funny is my relationship with bourbon is
kind of like a sibling like it'snot like we don't get along but
I will fight somebody like Oversomeone saying, oh, yeah, I had
bourbon from Tennessee.
No, you didn't.
SPEAKER_01 (47:08):
Uh-uh.
SPEAKER_02 (47:08):
Nope.
You had whiskey because onlybourbon is made in Kentucky.
SPEAKER_00 (47:12):
Right.
Yeah.
And it's a fun kind ofsubculture, too.
That's part of why I got intoit.
It was just the entertainment offollowing these distilleries and
really– I don't know.
Being interested in themanufacturing process, the
flavor profiles, all that.
I don't know.
I really nerded out on all thatstuff and I enjoyed it a lot.
(47:34):
Anyhow, I wonder if JenHammacher likes bourbon.
We should ask her.
You should ask her.
Write her another letter.
SPEAKER_02 (47:39):
I'll just hang out in her driveway.
I'll just block her in again andbe like, I need you to taste
SPEAKER_00 (47:44):
this.
Which won't be suspicious atall.
At all.
I promise it's just whiskey.
Or bourbon.
It's not.
That's
SPEAKER_02 (47:57):
it.
Cut.
We're done.
I'm out.
You just
SPEAKER_00 (48:01):
committed a cardinal sin.
I know, but I figured I'd drawyou off sides.
That worked beautifully.
I'm really going to have a
SPEAKER_02 (48:11):
restraining
SPEAKER_00 (48:12):
order
SPEAKER_02 (48:13):
now.
Well, that's it for PremeditatedOpinions, where the thoughts
were fully baked and only mildlyregrettable.
SPEAKER_00 (48:18):
And if you enjoyed today's episode, congrats on
having truly excellent taste inpodcasts and also opinions.
SPEAKER_02 (48:24):
Send this to someone who needs it.
And until then, please stay
SPEAKER_00 (48:32):
hydrated and behave yourself in the comments.
SPEAKER_02 (48:39):
But if you don't, share them with us.
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