July 4, 2025 • 54 mins
Han and Joyce get brutally honest about the chaos of running small businesses, the hidden economics behind markets and pop-ups, and why accepting a compliment can feel harder than any service rush.
They share vulnerable stories of burnout, picking yourself up (again and again), and the scrappy realities no one posts about. From bed-rotting afternoons and chicken therapy to unexpected mentorship moments and learning to surrender, it’s a raw, funny, and unexpectedly comforting look at survival, self-worth, and finding joy on the hardest days.
This episode is full of broken windows, truck break downs, and showing up with a smile.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Hey Hon. Hi, Joyce.
How's it going? It's great.
It was my birthday, Yeah. You're another year older.
I'm extra old, yeah, and I like getting older.
You have any words of wisdom forus?
No, no, I'm holding all that in.Actually, it's cool 'cause this
is the first time I celebrate mybirthday in a few years.
(00:21):
I I realized like something really traumatic happened on my
birthday, which is Anthony Bourdain died on my birthday.
True. Yeah, and then it's also Kanye's
birthday. Or is verified.
Yeah's birthday is verified. OK.
But then this year I was like, it's OK.
We'll celebrate the passing of Anthony Bourdain.
And like, Kanye made Graduation and I made the best hot dog in
(00:45):
the world. Same.
Same. But local, you know?
Yeah, So. Well, I'm glad you're turning a
corner. Yeah, I'm trying to be better
about being social. Yeah, no, that's super
important. Some of the best people I know
don't really like celebrating themselves or their birthdays,
so I'm glad you're there. Yeah.
I think also it's a little bit of, was that text I sent you
(01:06):
that one time? Like are we damaged Asians?
Yeah, yeah. It's a reoccurring topic.
Yeah, it is a reoccurring topic.I think that's something we can
always talk about, but I'm kind of, I don't want to over
glorify. Yeah, I know you.
Know that. But yeah, so like, yeah, it was
cool. I did.
I went to the river with a bunchof friends.
(01:27):
I'm so sorry that we missed eachother.
We both went to the wrong. Spots.
I know, I know, I really wanted to be there for sure, but.
Yeah, we really missed you. Then on my actual birthday on
Sunday, I went with Harlow and her mom and got lunch at Sugar
Pine. OK.
Which is really cool. Cute because I think it's so
(01:48):
important that we're very commutative or we Co parent
really well actually. Like fantastic actually.
And then it was just nice. I was like, this is like where I
wanted this is where everything should be.
Like everything clicked that dayand then I just went
skateboarding all night with a couple of friends.
Nice, so you guys are still goodfriends?
I believe yes, that's awesome. You know what, 100% we're really
(02:11):
good friends and I'm really, I'mvery proud of her and the work
that both of us have done. And I think it shows when you
meet Harlow, like you kind of see it and you see like the
relationship, the as good as yousee it is with Harlow and I, I'd
like to think it's you see it with her mom, her too.
That's great. Yeah, yeah.
Harlow's such a well adjusted kid.
(02:31):
I know I love her so much. Did you guys get soft serve?
We did get soft serve. I know the owners of Sugar Pond,
hi Ryan and Emily, and they are fantastic and they're very good
at what they do. Yeah.
And at that scale, I've said this before, like the amount of
people, how busy they are, it looks like ants on a lollipop,
(02:53):
you know, like, where did all these people come from?
It's it's a dream. It's really lovely to see
actually. I've only been once but big fan.
There's this weird thing like ifyour business but it's
profitable, but then you hit these other levels and these
other goals like you may find that cool.
I make the same amount of money,but I move so many more units.
(03:13):
And it's to me an indicator of like, oh, OK.
Like even though you have a business that's selling
$1,000,000 a year, it still feels the same or you get paid
the same as if it was like a $200,000 a year right business.
You're just dealing a different number of the kind of the same
enormous headaches as well. Maybe it's because the benefits
(03:35):
are always so subtle, you know what I mean?
Like no matter how good my business is doing, I never look
at like, oh, at least I cleared the bills this week, this month.
Yeah. Used to start taking your gains
and wins for granted. I'm sure that could happen.
Yeah, definitely. I like the idea of a seasonal
business, too. You like the idea of what?
A seasonal business not having to be open for all the seasons.
(04:00):
I feel like we're forced to be in a seasonal business in
Portland. To an extent, but you can't not
be open either. Yeah, that's very true.
For food carts, I think it's something like last year for me.
I think we dropped off like 65% in from like April till October
31st. Halloween.
And then N1, it just started, itsays nobody comes out.
(04:23):
It's like everybody's allergic to go out.
Dang, everybody's allergic to golike eat at a food truck.
I know during this last heat wave too, you guys had to close
a little early from from the heat.
Yeah, we have like different equipment in the food truck now.
We have a flat top, like a big flat top and a big grill.
So it's either blasting flames or it's radiant heat.
(04:45):
So the temperature gets pretty hot pretty quick.
So if anybody was ever wonderingwhy your favorite food truck is
closed, like between the hours of two and 536, o'clock is
simply because if it's 90° outside, it's about 110.
Yeah, it's a death trap. I think one time we clocked it
at like 120°, 'cause I was just curious and that was just the
floor. I felt like everything's gonna
(05:07):
start breaking. Oh.
My gosh. Yeah.
That's crazy. I'm I'm glad that the rest of
this week's gonna be a little bit cooler now.
I think we just got done with a week of Episode 4 having
launched and our producer said we've got at least 100 regular
(05:29):
listeners now. That's amazing.
Thank you so much to everybody. I think our our estimate was
like maybe maybe Sarah and Sonnywould listen, or maybe Noel did.
They even listen. I don't know.
I haven't heard. I don't know.
I haven't heard anything from them but I.
Don't know, maybe. I literally thought four people
would be listening to. This no, our friends did show up
(05:50):
for sure. Absolutely.
I was pretty shocked at how manypeople, how many compliments I
got at the cart and just DMS andstuff like that from people like
saying mainly that they listenedand they they thought that there
was some gems that they took away.
It's pretty nice. Yeah, I think I'm also
experiencing similar things. Definitely got some really nice
DMS, some surprisingly, like, nice interactions in person too,
(06:15):
with people saying that they tuned in and that's interesting.
I, like, wouldn't even expect tohear these things.
And it just catches me so off guard.
It's been a cool experience sharing.
Yeah. And like getting personal, it's
definitely a process. Yeah.
But yeah, hearing people's feedback and like the way that
they connect with some of these stories has been very
(06:35):
encouraging. I guess it's very culturally
Korean for us to like have low expectations for like kind of
our projects and stuff. Like I remember when I first
started, like maybe a couple of my friends will come out and
we'll have my blue Gogi one day.Yeah, yeah.
And it's so cute that I thought that.
Or even accepting compliments and positive feedback.
(06:57):
Yeah, that is a hard, hard thingto accept.
Definitely feel shy when it happens, but it definitely feels
good and I think we can totally accept that.
Yeah, yeah. I've come to realize we're the
generation that has to kind of kill that, and I think it's
already happening. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
We're like to be able to accept the compliment.
(07:17):
I say it all the time to people.I'll compliment somebody and
they'll just get very shy and I'll just be like, take the
fucking compliment. Yeah, I I'm like that too.
So I'm trying to talk to myself in that way as well.
But it's been really cool to seethe interactions on our social
media from people like we've putsome polls out there.
We got some really good questions for our last like
(07:39):
bonus episode Which. Yeah.
But yeah, it's super helpful when people have been engaging
with the polls. We've gotten some really good
ratings too. So subscribers and people
leaving us reviews, that's been really awesome.
So thank you everyone. Yeah, please keep doing that.
But yeah, we're deep in the beginning of summer now.
(08:00):
I don't know about your world, I'm assuming it's similar, but
all the events are starting now again. 100.
Deep in market season, do you have a lot of markets or events
coming up? I do.
I have events more so events in pop ups than markets that kind
of shy away from markets now because it's so rough, so hard
(08:22):
to do. First off, at least on the food
side on serving food, it's almost like sort of like
competition because you are set up with all these other food
vendors and you're kind of winning your clientele and then
you have to kind of make back that market fee that you have to
pay and the market fees are getting a lot higher.
Definitely. And I think it's really hard to
(08:42):
work around it. Actually.
This is funny that we're talkingabout market fees because
there's times where I have to tell them like, hey, I need you
to front me this because I'm just coming out of a rough
summer, rough or a rough winter,a rough spring, You know, like,
can I just hit that like after day one?
But I'm committed to come in is one of the ways that I'd have to
(09:03):
do it. But I had one person one time
from market put me on blast on Instagram and I was like, OK, I
guess I'll pay this right now. Before I kept to forfeit my
space. What?
Yeah. They called you out on social
media. Yeah, yeah, they tagged me and
like, hey, make sure to pay yourentrance fee, your market fee
(09:27):
for this. And then literally tagged us and
I was like, OK, so First off, 1,you just showed all your cards
that you're broke as fuck. And two, like you're doing the
same thing where we're all doing, we're banking on you to
put on a great event for us to vend out so we can make back the
market fee. And then we can in turn do it
again and commit to it again. And it is weird because
(09:51):
sometimes it gets to be kind of like, I think we, we talked
about this earlier. It's almost like a Ponzi scheme.
It's like, OK, I'm going to get all the money upfront from you
guys and then you guys will get all the money from the customer
level and then the customer level are going to win because
they really want this market to happen.
For sure, it's such a huge gamble for so many of the people
(10:13):
who choose to bend at these things.
At least that's how I felt over the years.
We're also investing a lot of time, resources and being there
and like fingers crossed that it's going to work out and
getting that market feedback is definitely an important piece.
Yeah. And honestly, there's a lot of
ways to kind of chill your mind on the gamble, but nothing is
(10:37):
more devastating than buying allthis product, renting all this
equipment, paying the market feeupfront and then having to vend.
I really wish some of these sometimes like the markets were
more based on like good percentage of your sales.
And I think that not a lot of people have that experience
because they think that's a sit.It's just like, oh, we just say
pay the $600.00 market fee or $400.00 market fee and then then
(10:59):
we get a shot at making, you know, like 5-10 KA day.
Yeah. And it's definitely different on
like the food side where you guys are cooking and have to
have you have perishables. Right.
But like how you get that marketfeedback, right?
Like you really have to look at your menu.
At least for me, I always look at my menu, right?
Because it's not always what I have to serve at the truck.
It's OK, how long is it going totake me to make $1000, right?
(11:22):
And what I do is I look at the price of my stuff.
I'm like, OK, so I got to sell ten of these items or 15 of
these items or twenty of these items.
And then I look at other people and what they're selling.
I'm like, Oh my gosh, you have to make back that money.
But you only can do it in $5 increments, whereas I can do it
in $1520 increments. So like really be realistic
about and that's something that I've always shield away from
(11:44):
markets before because I have been burned before and it is
just devastating to have to get back up from.
Yeah, definitely. So I tend to think that a lot of
people that throw these market events and stuff very social
facing, but they don't really understand like exactly how much
work it takes to vend your stuff, especially in the food.
(12:07):
Especially in the food, it's onething to have a product that
never goes bad that you put yourtime into, but it's another
thing to like race against the clock to get get that.
Done. Yeah, I'm definitely part of
some group chats that kind of help problem solve a lot of
these like and vet some of thesemarkets that are popping up.
Obviously there's a lot of good ones, a lot of bad ones
(12:29):
honestly, and very few great ones.
And I think what really sets them apart are like when the
event producers actually do their job in really promoting
the event, getting people there,taking care of their vendors and
making sure that the curation isgood enough, where it doesn't
feel like there's so much overlap and competition of the
same kinds of things as well. But yeah, the business of
(12:52):
markets definitely can feel pretty exploitive.
From what I've seen and what I've also heard from the
community. A lot of people like are barely
scraping by and we're putting all this like weight, monetary
weight on the small makers and it just doesn't really add up to
me. And especially in the way that
sometimes these markets are advertised, it's like, oh, it's
(13:14):
for small makers and it's like, how is a small maker supposed to
afford $300 a day for a 5 hour event?
So that stuff kind of blows me away.
But I will say the most recent event we participated in was the
beginning of this month. It was Veganizer nice and it was
their first like Asian market style of this event.
We participated and it was awesome.
(13:36):
Like it was everything that we could have hoped for and really
started off the month strong. So feeling really good about
that and definitely can't wait to like do that again next year.
I feel as if the Veganizer is one of those events that is such
a passion project and it grew into a market.
So you won't get that curation, that extra 10% that they really
need. I think also like when it comes
(13:58):
to doing markets, one of the biggest red flags to me is when
people are just like, Oh well, you know, we have like 30,000
people coming through, so 30,000people will see you, right?
However, there is something to be said about the favor that you
bring, right? There's a draw that you bring to
people. And then there's the other
aspect of it. Where are you getting exposed to
these people? So a lot of times what I do is
(14:21):
like, I will be like, OK, so your market has how many people
come? Like let's just say it has like
10,015 thousand people a day. However, I could push those
numbers up to 20,000 a day because my name is attached to
it and I can use my social mediaand I can do this like we can do
this together and do the heavy lifting of, of promoting.
(14:42):
But that conversation very rarely happens.
It's usually just we're doing you a favor.
There's 30,000 people coming. Do you want this booth or not?
You know, and it's an extra $300.00 for a 10 by 10 instead
of a 10 by 8. No, yeah.
You know, and it's really, it should just be like, you ain't
got shit. You don't own the fucking real
estate. And on top of that, fuck you pay
me because I'm bringing so many more people.
(15:03):
You know what? You're right.
It's the positioning. Exactly.
Often is positioned that way andI think that's crazy.
Isn't it? Yeah, It's crazy to think that
does take a certain amount of posturing yourself to realizing,
OK, I like you have to have a quantifier in your brain like of
your value, of your value. And often times, especially when
(15:25):
I do pop ups now, I'm like, OK, am I doing you the favor?
Are you doing me the favor? Or is it a 5050 mix?
And I have been around this so long, I'm like, OK, of course,
like everybody wants to have this curated event with super
dope people making food. But if you can't all be dope, we
should give back. You know what I mean?
(15:46):
Like, like, some people aren't going to pull as hard as you,
and then some people really aren't going to sell a product
that's going to be $20. You know, they got to make their
money in $5 commitments and $20.00 because it gets this huge
circle. I'm always stoked and happy when
people hit me up like, hey, is this event worth it or what
should I do? I love that part of this part of
small business is being able to brainstorm with people you know.
(16:07):
Yeah, and we're all at differentstages.
Some people are just getting into the game and we need to be
able to support those people with what we've learned.
That stuff all matters, but being cognizant of the value
that you bring super key. I think we need to remember that
we all hold a lot of power in these kinds of decisions.
The way that I did that was I never compare myself to like
(16:31):
when I'm flying high, there's events left and right and it's
summertime. I can just like leave the car.
I always think of it in like thewinter time, like instead of
being like how good you are, like kind of glazing yourself
during the summer, like I look at like my winter numbers.
I'm like, oh man, how this sounds so bad, but like, how
(16:52):
close am I to suicide? Here we go again in this month.
How close am I? Like, how deep am I depressed?
If it wasn't that deep, then I'mjust like, oh man, people kind
of like my food, you know? But if I'm like in the throes of
it, I guess I could just leave town, I guess.
Things are bad. Yeah, I guess things are bad.
I'm being very extreme about it,but that's how I value the biz.
(17:13):
Even during our slow months, bills are still getting paid.
Even during our slow months, I have a little bit of a nest egg.
And that also does this other thing too where it really
sharpens your brain on like how not how to save money.
Everybody wants to talk about like, oh, make all this money to
the summer. And then that way you have money
in the winter to save. And it's like, dude, you're
going to end up in the same spot.
You're still going to end feel end up feeling like shit.
(17:34):
So I don't want to fucking hear it.
But reality is that you can extrapolate that data that you
need on how valuable you are. Like if you have people coming
to you like diehards and you have the small number, let's
just say you like year 1, you had 10 regulars that always came
by 4 * a month. Yes.
But then every winter, right, you're like, oh, I'm getting
(17:57):
like this year I have 11 diehards.
No, exactly. You know, And that's the way
that you you really have to lookat it.
Yes, that's that's a good way tolook at measuring success.
It's just consistency and building over time and just
having a little bit more trust in that and your people.
Yeah. Yeah, not acting out of
(18:17):
desperation, but you're right there.
Everything's negotiable. That's my motto in life.
And it's something that's been reinforced the more that I do
it. And luckily, I did learn a lot
of negotiation just kind of early on in my career, but it's
transferred over a lot here too and what we do here.
But some ways that I've taken some of that risk off when
(18:39):
trying to figure out if I want to participate in like a shiny
looking new market, right? Typically most of the marketing
opportunities that we do, we tryto keep it like no fee.
So we're always looking for things that make sense for the
time and resources that we're putting in.
I really like corporate events. They make a lot of sense for our
(19:00):
kind of business where it's likethey just welcome you in and
support you and it's a benefit to a lot of their staff.
It's like a little perk to have a little fun shopping experience
at work. Now with paid markets, we're
really frugal on what we choose to participate in each year.
I would say like realistically the kind of expensive big
(19:21):
markets multi day that we participate in a year is like 2
to 3 Max. And then maybe like some smaller
fee would look like 30 to $70 markets.
Maybe we'll do three or four of those a year Max too.
But anything beyond that, if it's not budgeted for and we
(19:41):
have incoming requests to be a part of something, I typically
communicate that openly and say,hey, I would love to try out and
see if this is a good fit for us.
Can you guys squeeze us in and let us try it out?
Yeah. And that's generally been a good
way for us to try things. Yeah, you're right.
That is very overlooked by a lotof small businesses because we
(20:03):
really do have this like not that pick me energy, but more of
I don't know if worthy of this event.
And I have to tell so many people like if they came to you
and they've heard of you and they're asking you, then you are
worth some. And again, you got to remind
yourself that you are negotiable.
(20:24):
Now, if you come out swinging thinking that everybody should
know who you are because you buyyour Instagram following or what
have you, or because you have one viral clip, then you should
really kind of second guess that.
But you just be surprised. Like when Instagram started and
people were getting followers left and right, people leaned
back on Instagram like, oh, but I got this many followers and
(20:46):
it's. Like don't want to get to your
head? Like yo don't let it get to your
head. These people are literally on
the toilets watching. It's really not that deep and
it's not as big as you think it is.
It has to be this overwhelming evidence if that's the case with
for sure or with social media especially.
But again, the social media is another thing that you can just
(21:06):
trick into having work for you too.
And. Social media is definitely, once
again, not everything. It's not actually really
happening in real life, yeah. It's my favorite when people are
like, you're kind of nice and like, oh, thank you.
Or when people see the Instagramlike you're so unhinged.
I'm like, am I unhinged? Or you're just not used to
(21:27):
seeing somebody cry online like me.
I think it's funny too because Idon't say this a lot and maybe I
said it last time, but the voiceof my Instagram is literally
especially my rants is coming from a fucking broken heart, you
(21:48):
know, like. Sad boy like.
Some sad boy shit and I don't, Idon't know, but people really
gravitate and rally towards it. They're just like fuck yeah
dude. I feel horrible too.
Like awesome. You're an entertainer.
Thank you. You channel all that pain into
something beautiful. No, please come eat my food.
(22:08):
I'm not. Serious.
Yeah, in small business you can get knocked down so many times,
but the main thing is getting back up.
Yeah, like how do you get back up, right?
Yeah, you got it. You have to figure out a way to
pick yourself back up. Sure, there are a lot of great
wins that we can all celebrate, too, but what goes mostly unseen
are definitely those those really dark days or big losses.
(22:32):
Yeah. And I think, yeah, ultimately
we're constantly having to figure out ways to get back up.
Yeah, so when I used to have a mobile truck, uh huh.
Oh, that was Kim Jong Un. Technically took Kim Jong Un
too, right? Like my first one burned down
and then the second one was actually a mobile truck and I
(22:53):
had to figure out how to put everything back together every
time I drove it because the fridges would not go over the
grill. Like you could try to tie
everything down, it didn't matter.
But the the thing's not structurally sound.
The whole thing will kind of bend at every turn and then
loosen anyways. But I remember there was one
event specifically that I did, Iagreed to.
(23:13):
There was no deposit, and there was so many people there, and I
pulled up and I should have madesure that their electrical was
right and it wasn't. But it was one of those events
that was so busy. There was so many people that
like, got pulled in. People were cheering.
And I was like, hell yeah, you know, like I didn't have a
generator, which I should have for my electrical needs, for my
fridges and stuff. So I try to plug in and they're
(23:36):
like, it wouldn't work, right? And I was like, OK, First off,
every left turn I made, something fell off the truck.
And now that I'm here, you're telling me, like, the
electrical's not going to work. So I'm just, I just got to sit
here and suffer and let all thisfood die.
And normally when you have a food truck, you have to have
somebody following you, just kind of really looking after
your back driving like, at leastfor my particular truck, we did.
(23:59):
And when we pulled up to this event, all of a sudden there
were so many people around. The electricity didn't work.
And I had a truck full of food. I didn't have a different truck
to serve out of. It was like my division location
had to move to see this under the bridge location and I was
like, so I guess I can't serve food.
(24:21):
I've spent all night prepping and then all the people blocked
me in so I couldn't drive away to a plug to plug in my
refrigerated goods. The other car that we came in,
there is no way we were going toleave and be able to come back
because the block was so packed and it was literally after
everything was just falling down.
(24:41):
I specifically remember this moment because I felt so
defeated. I was so low that I just pushed
myself to the lowest part and broke through to the other side
and was just like, well, fuck it, at least I'm here to have a
party. And like, that's one of the ways
that I have to, I've. It took a little bit to get to
(25:02):
that to be able to just, yeah, yeah.
Essentially you just have to surrender.
It makes more sense to surrenderand then just rebuild.
It's almost easier than just sithere and just try to like
problem solve every little thingthat went wrong.
That's true. And it also forces you to not
dwell on the problem. So if you just like literally
(25:24):
are just like, OK, everything sucks.
It can only go up from here is what I have to say to myself.
And in general, I think how I'velived a lot of my life.
I think I really got that from like when I used to get in
trouble. My God, this sounds like it's
not awful saying this, but everytime I've gotten arrested, it's
just like, OK, you know what cops are here.
(25:46):
If cops are going on me, I'm going to give them a piece of my
mind. Like I'm already going to jail,
you know? It's already a done deal.
Go push farther. Like fuck you and your mom.
Yeah, I said it, you know. Words to live by.
But that's where I think a lot of my scrappiness comes from.
(26:07):
Is this literally like it's in aform of saying fuck it and
giving up? You have to relinquish the
control of the chaos that comes with falling down.
Yeah, absolutely. I can't say I have as I
definitely don't have as much business experience as you.
So don't have as many of those like super intense life changing
(26:30):
moments quite yet. Pray you don't.
I mean. Goodies is so cute.
Keep it pristine, keep it pretty.
Other than the way that we started.
I mean, we still are so scrappy,but we we started with literally
nothing. And it was just a lot of hope
and dreams. And for us, like the lowest
point was, yeah, we were still in the pandemic.
(26:52):
We were like, are we going to just sit here or are we going to
try to figure out something thatmaybe we can build together?
And our mentality was like, hey,times are really shitty right
now. I don't think it could be any
worse. So only it could only get better
from here was kind of our mindset.
And that's why we decided to risk it all with like almost
(27:15):
zero capital, Put everything on personal credit cards, which was
like the worst idea ever, but somehow made it work because no
one was going to give us a loan at that point.
Like, we were like literally nobody with this kind of
business history. So we just risked everything.
And yeah, honestly, it's still astruggle.
Like, some days, like the crunchliterally paralyzes me to the
(27:37):
point where I'm just like, I can't even speak through time.
Definitely working with, like, communicating things to my
partner and like us figuring it out.
It's definitely gotten better. But yeah, the financial side of
things is definitely something that almost used to be able to
Take Me Out. The fear of that and just so
(27:58):
much trauma from growing up withfinancial stuff with our family,
just even looking at a contract paralyzes me sometimes.
But things have gotten better just facing those fears and like
attacking it from the front. But because of a lot of this
like built in fear from past experiences, there's always a
(28:19):
self doubt of like, OK, things feel OK right now, but
something's going to go wrong. I don't know.
It's. Paranoia sets in.
Yeah, it doesn't happen as oftenas it used to, especially in the
beginning when it was just like everything was so fragile.
And day-to-day, sometimes it still feels that fragile.
But for the most part, when I feel those doubts and because of
(28:39):
the doubts, the strategies that we implement have become ways to
prevent all of these feelings from coming up too.
So I don't know for me, having contingency plans in place for
everything because we're still in the mindset of growing and
still betting on ourselves and moving forward and making big
plans. But because of that, like doubt
(29:01):
of that can also go away. Anything that seems to be going
good, just try to make a lot of good plans around, well, what's
Plan B, what's plan C, and how are we going to make that work
if this doesn't work out? Yeah, having contingency plans
is a hard lesson to they're so good to have.
And I also think sometimes it is.
(29:21):
What kind of mindset do you have?
Are you really good in chaos? Yeah, I think I thrive in chaos.
I know it's very on brand for me, but those are usually the
times like really a lot of brilliant stuff.
Yeah, no, absolutely. They're like really clever ways
to work around. Things have to come up.
There's also times when we don'thave a lot of people to bounce
(29:43):
these ideas off of, right? I've said this before, but I
also had this realization that you're not the only one that's
on that. Like when you probably open your
business on personal credit cards.
Like I think I'm still paying off the credit card that I did
for Kim. Jong UN do.
You know what I mean? Like seriously.
And that's The thing is that I have to remind myself a lot of
(30:04):
times, like I'm not the only onethat's done this.
I'm not the only one that has these moments of failures.
So you got to pick yourself backup and keep going.
Like not nothing runs always on all cylinders.
Now, the days that do run fantastic, those are the days I
really hold on to. I really hold on to that feeling
(30:27):
because I know too well the times that everything, like
everything goes to shit. Like, short of me injuring
myself, like, damn, everything that could have gone wrong not
only went wrong, it went wrong catastrophically.
So the days are almost like, oh,this is cool.
Like, you know, like you have toremind yourself that you know
(30:49):
you're not the only one. Yeah, that brings you back to
reality, which is super important.
But yeah, overall, having to keep moving forward and not
stalling, that's just something I have to constantly remind
myself to in in those hard moments.
The other hard moments I just try to burn up the clock too.
I'm just like, Oh, well, at least tomorrow's a new day.
(31:10):
Yeah, let's start again tomorrow.
I guess I'll just throw all thisaway today.
Start again tomorrow. There's been some days I'm just
like laugh crying and it's been like, OK, well tomorrow won't
hurt so bad 'cause it can't hurtanymore as it did today, and
then just jump back into it. So I just have to really put
(31:31):
this out there to everybody that's had a small business that
had those days where everything fails and nothing came out
right. Nothing you made worked.
I've been there. Yeah, we've all been there.
And just know that's so real. And I'm sure there's something
to pull away from it, but damn, you know, like.
Yeah, and you know what happens when you laugh and cry at the
(31:52):
same time, right? Oh yeah, yeah, you get a hairy
butt hole, is that right? But.
Yeah. In small business, it's kind of
interesting because not only do you have to invent and create
your own job, but also you're incharge of putting that carrot
where whatever that is, in frontof your face.
Yeah, yeah. It's interesting.
It is, it is interesting and there's a lot that I don't post
(32:16):
or a lot that I don't share withpeople that happen.
And I think it's honestly because I've seen, especially on
social media, people doing the trauma flex thing and just being
like, oh man, business is so hard and I can't get this off
the ground and this and that. It's kind of cringey to me
because there's advice that you can take and there's things that
(32:38):
you can do. I'm really trying not to be
insensitive to it, but I think alot of times people really over
celebrate the losses and it it just only ends the same.
It only ends like with the losing, you know, like the, the
pivot has to happen at some point.
I think I got caught up in that too with that, like especially
with my post, it's always just seem like everything's a downer.
But part of the reason why I do it is to tell people like, yo, I
(33:01):
went through this or this is what happened to me or this is
the realization I had. I hope you have it too.
It always comes back to that. But so done with talking to
other businesses and having these, Oh well, this is how bad
my month was and this, this happened and this and this.
I'm like, hey man, at least you're not working for anybody
else. Yeah, I think when you say
(33:21):
trauma flex, what I imagine is that there's like a very
consistent pattern to how peopleare communicating these things.
Yeah. And it may be real, it may be
very real, but I think especially if it's being
constantly portrayed on social media or just like the
negativity is just never breaking and it's never
solutions oriented, it, it does take a toll.
(33:44):
It's like wears down on people. Yeah, and also social media is
changing in the aspect of we're not so easily fooled, I guess.
At least that's maybe what I want to believe because I'm kind
of an optimist like that. But I always it seems as if we
see through a lot more stuff. It's like the consumers a little
bit more savvy. Yeah, I believe that.
(34:05):
Yeah, I think of newspaper ads and I'm like, how does that
work? Once I figured out, like
somebody told me like, oh, you have to be consistent with the
ads and it takes like 3 weeks for people to notice it.
And then she'll come in and it'slike, dude, that's crazy.
Don't you think it's just way better to be good at what you
do? Ads in general are still like
(34:25):
that. Yeah, I guess ads in general are
superiority. Yeah, I just feel like our our
general consumer and just the people in general like kind of
start seeing through that. It's like almost a trope.
Like I watched commercials the other day on an actual TV and I
was like, what? How does it does this work, you
know? It must, I guess it's there's
research to back it and I guess there is if your commercials on,
(34:48):
they've got the money to do the research.
But yeah, these like hardships and trauma that a lot of people
go through, they can be very real.
But is that what you want to be known for like all the time?
It's that part, yeah. And people remember these
things. And if that's the thing that
people associate you with too, it's not really helping the end
goal either, like if you want toget out of it.
(35:10):
But yeah, the self victimizationcan definitely be a big trap.
Even though like we've had our share of issues and hardships of
having a retail space in Old Town or anywhere in Portland,
but we don't necessarily broadcast all the things that we
go through, mainly because I just don't think it's helpful or
positive in most situations. But like the reality is, yeah,
(35:34):
like the first year that we wereopen, within our first week, we
had 6 broken windows. Yeah, over the last 2 1/2 years,
we've definitely had more than 10 windows broken at one point.
But we don't, we rarely ever share these things because it's
not helpful and a lot of people are going through it.
It's not like a just us kind of experience.
(35:56):
Sure, it sucks. And I don't think there's
anything wrong about sharing about these things, especially
if the community can get together and help.
But for us, it's just been important for us to try to keep
things positive if we can help it, if we need help, which is
once in a while. Recently, I did post on social
media. I was like, hey, it was a really
shitty month for us unexpectedly.
(36:18):
Really need you guys to show up,whether it be like leaving us a
Google review if you've been here before, Yeah, or coming in
in person. And that literally was super
helpful for me. Like I think we got 10 plus
Google reviews in like a couple days and that felt really nice
that people wanted to show up inthat way and needed support.
It was like, I think people can support us by doing this and it
(36:40):
doesn't cost them anything. I think for me it a lot of it
comes back to just seeing the outrage post.
Yeah. That's something that I'm very
sensitive and sick of now because I will get DMS this like
hey, can you repost this? This person did this, this and
I'm like, I don't, I don't recall ever being on your side,
you know, or I got to be real here, like I really just try not
(37:03):
to do. Spread.
I just really try not to spread it.
I've had really bad experiences being that person and doing
that, and that's kind of the reason why Cute Animal Thursday
exists. Yes, we already have enough
trauma. Yeah.
Like, I just, the whole reason behind it is let's just
celebrate something ridiculouslycute and so distracting to the
(37:28):
other direction just for a few slides, just so you can see if I
posted your animal, I agree. Just just for like a a minute or
like a few seconds, you know, I just man, yeah.
But again, if you are going through that and it's really
hard, I think you can reach out to people.
(37:49):
There's other people to reach out to because I definitely do
get DMS like hey, I just startedmy business.
How can I get from point A to point B?
I'm so happy to share, share my experiences.
Although I will say I am very selective just because I have
been in that position. I've been burned before and like
(38:11):
next thing you know, I cosigned on something that I did not
agree to or what have you. But I won't let those times
change the fact that like, I'll still answer the DM, I'll still
answer people's questions. And I think a big part of a big
reason of why I wanted to do this podcast with you is to be
able to share some of these experiences I've had with people
so they can learn from my mistakes.
(38:33):
I hope. Like make sure you strap every
all your equipment in your food truck before driving it.
Is that in your handbook? In my manifesto or?
Manifesto I. Haven't written it that in a
long time. I should add to it.
Yes, it should be, yeah. I hope that's that's going to
come out eventually. Food truck manifest.
(38:54):
Yeah, yeah. I've been kind of, I've been
writing it as posts. I think one day I'm going to
take all the things, all the unhinged things I've written,
put it in a book or a comic bookand just be like, shit, Han
said. I mean, for real.
There's so much truth in Nuggets.
(39:15):
Thank you. I would assume that you have
been in a mentor position to a lot of people.
Yeah, Yeah, I have, I think havehave you had, did you have a
mentor in this or? Over time, yeah, I've definitely
had a lot of different kinds of mentors through like my career
(39:35):
and starting from the beginning,I just always had kind of like
an entrepreneurial spirit. But I looked up to a lot of
people who were like maybe 5-10 years ahead of me.
I was super curious. So I just would get involved,
ask a lot of questions, just jump right in.
And yeah, through each part of my career, I've definitely
looked to people as mentors to learn a little bit more and like
(39:58):
mostly this like sounding boardsthrough like my process even
applied for like startup accelerator kind of things to
just to educate myself more. But I think in this process
specifically like. Terrance and I as partners have
been each other's mentors in many ways.
And like also oh. I see that.
Yeah, like we, we kind of just help coach each other and push
(40:21):
each other through the challenges.
But also, yeah, reaching out to friends and trusted people like
you like has been super helpful through this process.
I'm still kind of like looking for a sort of mentorship in some
way. It's hard to find good mentors,
you know. Yeah, I don't think a lot of
them really make themselves available.
I have had many mentors in the food game and people that have
(40:46):
really nurtured. Yeah, that's good.
But I've also had it where I feel as if when the nurturing
stopped is when and it's never been an easy send off.
I guess for me, there's actuallya couple of food trucks that
come to mind when that I helped that I helped with their
business. The one that comes to mind I
think is crazy in my eyes, maybenot his successful be Frybaby
(41:09):
and really telling Sunny just like, oh, these are the mistakes
I made. Or more often than not, it's
usually him running an idea by me or asking me a question and
then me instantaneously like an older brother.
Just like you're fucking stupid.But the value in it is to be
able to be and hear to somebody and be that sounding board.
(41:32):
And I think that is very valuable to a lot of people that
have helped out in the food truck business.
Yeah. And I'm willing to do that a
lot. I think there's a fine line of
somebody like kind of grooming you to be a success or like
grooming you to be the success that they wanted.
And it's kind of hard to, I think that's why it's hard to
see and find a mentor. I think.
(41:55):
I think a lot of times I look back when I started and you
know, I got to, I have to give my props to the owner of Pizza
Shoals. He really puts himself out there
for the small businesses to helpgrow and Brian like really
helped me out. And then at certain points,
obviously No2 businesses are alike.
So at certain points, you know, you just kind of pull off.
(42:16):
But I think a lot of times it really helps to see somebody
that you have you that you want to be like or emulate and then
just kind of find your way there.
For sure. What do you think are some
qualities that make a good mentee?
Aside from the obvious of just being able to take advice, yeah,
(42:40):
I think on both ends, it's it's the trust.
It's the trust. I think it's really hard to have
have the responsibility that somebody trusts you so much, you
know, and you have to, I think also at the same time have the
same the humility to be like, hey, I was really wrong about
that. I think that's really valuable
(43:01):
too because, you know, like you,there's that saying like, never
meet your hero. Yeah.
And there's a reason for that. I think all too often people
that mentor others, they just don't admit that they're wrong.
That idea didn't take off. I think you just end up in this
(43:22):
like awkward space where it's aseasy for the person that's
mentoring, You know, it's like coaching too.
It's just like, hey, I was wrongabout that.
Let's try this. Let's try to apply this this
way. I hear it a lot, but I try not
to let it get to my head that like some of the things I've
said, like help people out because the last thing I want to
do is have it go to my head. Like I, I, I've, I've admitted
(43:45):
this on many platforms. Like I love the attention but at
the same time like I don't want it to get to the point where I'm
just like abusive about it either.
Yeah, you, you don't want to geta God complex.
No, but I do want free appetizers if and you guys see
me at your restaurants, like please send something out to me
'cause like like I went through the muck and dirt so you could
(44:07):
make salads at that restaurant. I'm totally joking, but honestly
there's a lot to be said about having their trust in somebody
and being able to admit you're wrong.
You know, like you're the peopleyou mentor should help you grow
to. You know, yeah, for sure.
That's that's beautifully said. OK so outside of just all your
(44:28):
your work hobbies of like being a mentor, solving problems,
putting out fires, what do you do to like unplug?
And what are your hobbies? I mean, I think I know some of
them, but I'm curious to know what your answers are going to
be. OK so like this is going to
sound so bad. One of the things I love doing
is bed rotting in the afternoon when it's like super sunny out
(44:52):
and super nice out and people are like out having fun and
doing shit. I'm just like Bah humbug.
That's so relatable. Fuck you.
What's up YouTube? What's so and so doing on
Instagram? That's a bad habit.
But my time outside of being a parent and being a business
owner, I'm a boxer as well. Oddly enough.
(45:14):
It's just work in a different form.
Yeah, training. It's just training.
I think this is kind of something new to a lot of people
that don't know that about me isI've been I've been boxing for
the past five years and it's so dearly.
And then I only have like one day off where I can have the
option to full throttle just be like, OK, it's do nothing
(45:35):
Monday. Yeah, yeah, yeah, do Jack and
shit Monday, you know, or it's just like go be social Monday or
break up that be social amongst the pop ups and stuff.
I think people have seen me out a lot more 'cause I I really
struggled to be social because Ithink so much of my job
requires. A yeah, yeah, I think we've
(45:55):
talked about this before too, but is it easier to be social
when you're working? Yes.
Yeah. 100% 'cause like my 'causemy niceness is hinged on you
buying my food. Anything for the money.
(46:18):
Don't front like, you're not thesame way.
No, no, I I'm laughing 'cause it's relatable.
Across all of us. But I don't know, I'm kind of
like a working animal in some ways because it's just like when
I have a job to do, I'm comfortable because I I know
what my job is. Yeah.
But if I don't have like a specific job, it's harder.
(46:41):
So it is harder, It is harder tounplug and shift skins.
What about you? What do you do on your day off?
Because I know you only give yourself one day off.
I know we have the same day off issue.
I mean I honestly have a hard time with this question.
It's really hard. I sound like a workaholic and
maybe that is true, but I actually really do like cleaning
(47:04):
my my spaces on my day off. Makes me feel better.
I know that's not a hobby but that's usually what I do on my
day off when I have the chance. I also like to rot when I can,
like when I'm over socialized. I just need a day to do nothing.
I guess it's a good example of when weather permits, like
(47:25):
yesterday, we missed each other at the river.
But yeah, Terrence and I really love to unplug by going out to
the river where we have no cell service, no distractions, and
that's kind of the only way thatwe can truly unplug.
And. Not, not get sucked into
anything else because there's nothing we can do out there from
that far away. And we feel super present, super
(47:49):
in tune with all the beauty around us, and it's just fun
being by water. It is so fun being by water.
Just like it's fun being by a fire.
Yeah, I totally agree. Yeah, so.
But I'm not to the camping plane.
Oh, OK. Like I won't cosplay poor, I
refuse, yeah, but I will. I will go to the river for a day
(48:11):
and enjoy a fire. But camping I'm like fuck no.
It's suffering for. You it's just an extra leb.
It it just you know what it is. It kind of reminds me it's, it's
too close cause at some point when it was when when I was
drinking and getting fucked up, it's like, hell yeah, go outside
and get fucked up. But now it's like at some point,
cause I've done this sober too, like at some point in camping,
(48:33):
it's like, huh. And everything could go wrong
and this could be every day in your life.
I'm like, fuck, you know, like Ihate it.
Oh. My goodness, I never even
thought of it like that. I know, I'm sorry, but it's so
true. But for me, when it's
role-playing in that like I kindof have, I'm like, it's like
survival. It's fun.
It's survival. Like I, I guess you're right, I
(48:55):
guess ultimately. I guess you know what you've
told me one of the highest compliments I've ever gotten,
which is like, Oh yeah, if a zombie apocalypse happens, we're
going to find you like that madethat warmed my heart.
Yeah, I I think you would be a great teammate.
Thank you. In disaster.
They just utter chaos like. I mean I, I I think so.
(49:16):
Yeah, 100%. Do you know how many times it's
going to come up from like, well, there's no more cops,
We're just going to eat this person?
Yeah. They stole from us.
We got to eat them now. It's the only way.
It's the only way people learn, you know?
Yeah. Do you have any?
Were they cleaning? You don't have like puzzles or
like you don't like build stuff or.
Like, no, I in theory would I, Iwant to like things like games,
(49:41):
but no, it doesn't really entertain me.
I used to read a lot more. I definitely don't do enough of
that anymore. Honestly, I like hanging out
with my chickens. I like to watch them eat and
forage. That's such a hobby.
That's so awesome though. It's peaceful.
That's kind of like my farming SIM, like it's IRL.
(50:04):
I love animals, I love my animals.
I love water in my plants, watching the growth on them.
Kind of like really grandma, I think.
Yeah. But just super chill things.
Chill not work related. Yeah, like maybe this happens to
you. Like you, you sometimes feel a
little guilty. Like bedrock to.
(50:26):
Yeah. What have you I, I hate that
feeling. I've never really quite figured
out how to like full on, like relax, you know, Yeah.
And I I'm so open to suggestionsand ideas people, so just go
ahead and. For sure.
Any comments? We shouldn't feel bad about
having to bed rot sometimes though.
What? Are you talking about?
Because I, I feel like even yourhobbies like boxing, you're
(50:49):
hella productive. And I forgot to add, but yeah, I
typically really like working out too.
I my form of working out typically looks like I like to
lift. I don't really like a lot of
cardio. But lately my main mode of
relaxing has been stretching because I need to be doing that.
Yeah, yeah. Sometimes I'll just Terrance is
like on his computer either working or playing games and
(51:12):
I'll just be stretching on the ground for like 40 minutes to an
hour and that's my self-care. I'm like, OK, I got that out of
the way. The other two things I do
habitually to relax is Harlow and I will get out of town.
We'll just have our drive. We'll just go east.
OK? Blindly.
Wow. Yeah.
(51:32):
Burning fuel. Yeah, I don't care.
That's fine, care. That's why.
Why did the dinosaurs walk? Before us, you know.
Yeah, I'll just. Yeah, we'll just drive I.
Don't care. That's really cool.
Yeah, I like, it's cool 'cause like, you know, we get to catch
up and stuff, but then it goes right back to boxing 'cause
we'll go to some place and I'll just put some gloves on her and
just be like. Oh yeah, you guys have the same
(51:52):
hobbies. Like hit dad for two minutes
straight and I won't hit back, but I just gotta work on my
defense. And then the other thing it's
completely 100% linked to my God, that sounds so gross when I
say like this, but I don't know what to say it.
It's a completely linked to my sobriety is that I have to keep
my hands busy. That's.
(52:12):
Fair. But I like to build stuff, so
like, I'll build, I'll rebuild. Game Boys and old video game
consoles. I think I build more now than I
play video games, which is cool,but they're like little puzzles
to me. And I have to keep my brain
stimulated. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I get it.
I think that is the link. I think that's the link between
(52:33):
all of us small business owners.It's like you have to stay
stimulated, so bed rotting feelsbad and relaxing feels bad, but
it's really good for you, yeah. It's interesting.
That is an interesting connection.
I don't think I can deny that either.
Yeah, 'cause like thinking aboutlike when you're like, oh, I
just like being with my animals and stuff.
That's so like, you still have to care, you know, you have to
keep tabs on them. So present.
(52:55):
You have to be present, which isfunny.
I just want to put out there anybody that made it to the end
of all of our podcasts. You guys are so, so, so real and
we are so, so grateful for you guys.
We started this as a passion project and it's cute and I love
it and thank you guys so much. We had, I personally had no idea
(53:17):
that we'd have so many people, the feedback and stuff like
that. So I really appreciate it for
real. Yeah, Thank you guys so much.
It's really cool when we get to connect in real life too and
hearing all the stories and feelings of connection
definitely keep driving this forward and we just want to keep
making a better product for you guys an your feedback really
(53:40):
matters so. Right back to work, we just need
to work hobbies to leave the feedback I.
Just want to make it better because I mean, like, you know,
Oh. Totally.
I I totally. Agree.
We started and it was very free flow.
It still is. It's a great creative outlet.
Yeah, it's starting to become a hobby.
It's starting to become a hobby.But yeah, I, I guess like it's
(54:00):
for the community. So like we want people to be
involved and the feedback matters.
Reach out to us, follow us on social, leave a review if you
can on Spotify or Apple podcast.But all of that helps and it
really helps guide the conversations that we continue
to have and the things that we kind of continue to do.
(54:22):
So thank you so much. We really, really appreciate
you. Yeah, and don't, don't ever stop
asking the questions because we'll probably pop up and
inspire us to talk about it too.So.
Yes. Don't shy away.
We'll keep collecting. Thank you.
Bye. Bye.
Thanks. Thanks.
Hey Hon. Hi, Joyce.
How's it going? It's great.
It was my birthday, Yeah. You're another year older.
I'm extra old, yeah, and I like getting older.
You have any words of wisdom forus?
No, no, I'm holding all that in.Actually, it's cool 'cause this
is the first time I celebrate mybirthday in a few years.
(00:21):
I I realized like something really traumatic happened on my
birthday, which is Anthony Bourdain died on my birthday.
True. Yeah, and then it's also Kanye's
birthday. Or is verified.
Yeah's birthday is verified. OK.
But then this year I was like, it's OK.
We'll celebrate the passing of Anthony Bourdain.
And like, Kanye made Graduation and I made the best hot dog in
(00:45):
the world. Same.
Same. But local, you know?
Yeah, So. Well, I'm glad you're turning a
corner. Yeah, I'm trying to be better
about being social. Yeah, no, that's super
important. Some of the best people I know
don't really like celebrating themselves or their birthdays,
so I'm glad you're there. Yeah.
I think also it's a little bit of, was that text I sent you
(01:06):
that one time? Like are we damaged Asians?
Yeah, yeah. It's a reoccurring topic.
Yeah, it is a reoccurring topic.I think that's something we can
always talk about, but I'm kind of, I don't want to over
glorify. Yeah, I know you.
Know that. But yeah, so like, yeah, it was
cool. I did.
I went to the river with a bunchof friends.
(01:27):
I'm so sorry that we missed eachother.
We both went to the wrong. Spots.
I know, I know, I really wanted to be there for sure, but.
Yeah, we really missed you. Then on my actual birthday on
Sunday, I went with Harlow and her mom and got lunch at Sugar
Pine. OK.
Which is really cool. Cute because I think it's so
(01:48):
important that we're very commutative or we Co parent
really well actually. Like fantastic actually.
And then it was just nice. I was like, this is like where I
wanted this is where everything should be.
Like everything clicked that dayand then I just went
skateboarding all night with a couple of friends.
Nice, so you guys are still goodfriends?
I believe yes, that's awesome. You know what, 100% we're really
(02:11):
good friends and I'm really, I'mvery proud of her and the work
that both of us have done. And I think it shows when you
meet Harlow, like you kind of see it and you see like the
relationship, the as good as yousee it is with Harlow and I, I'd
like to think it's you see it with her mom, her too.
That's great. Yeah, yeah.
Harlow's such a well adjusted kid.
(02:31):
I know I love her so much. Did you guys get soft serve?
We did get soft serve. I know the owners of Sugar Pond,
hi Ryan and Emily, and they are fantastic and they're very good
at what they do. Yeah.
And at that scale, I've said this before, like the amount of
people, how busy they are, it looks like ants on a lollipop,
(02:53):
you know, like, where did all these people come from?
It's it's a dream. It's really lovely to see
actually. I've only been once but big fan.
There's this weird thing like ifyour business but it's
profitable, but then you hit these other levels and these
other goals like you may find that cool.
I make the same amount of money,but I move so many more units.
(03:13):
And it's to me an indicator of like, oh, OK.
Like even though you have a business that's selling
$1,000,000 a year, it still feels the same or you get paid
the same as if it was like a $200,000 a year right business.
You're just dealing a different number of the kind of the same
enormous headaches as well. Maybe it's because the benefits
(03:35):
are always so subtle, you know what I mean?
Like no matter how good my business is doing, I never look
at like, oh, at least I cleared the bills this week, this month.
Yeah. Used to start taking your gains
and wins for granted. I'm sure that could happen.
Yeah, definitely. I like the idea of a seasonal
business, too. You like the idea of what?
A seasonal business not having to be open for all the seasons.
(04:00):
I feel like we're forced to be in a seasonal business in
Portland. To an extent, but you can't not
be open either. Yeah, that's very true.
For food carts, I think it's something like last year for me.
I think we dropped off like 65% in from like April till October
31st. Halloween.
And then N1, it just started, itsays nobody comes out.
(04:23):
It's like everybody's allergic to go out.
Dang, everybody's allergic to golike eat at a food truck.
I know during this last heat wave too, you guys had to close
a little early from from the heat.
Yeah, we have like different equipment in the food truck now.
We have a flat top, like a big flat top and a big grill.
So it's either blasting flames or it's radiant heat.
(04:45):
So the temperature gets pretty hot pretty quick.
So if anybody was ever wonderingwhy your favorite food truck is
closed, like between the hours of two and 536, o'clock is
simply because if it's 90° outside, it's about 110.
Yeah, it's a death trap. I think one time we clocked it
at like 120°, 'cause I was just curious and that was just the
floor. I felt like everything's gonna
(05:07):
start breaking. Oh.
My gosh. Yeah.
That's crazy. I'm I'm glad that the rest of
this week's gonna be a little bit cooler now.
I think we just got done with a week of Episode 4 having
launched and our producer said we've got at least 100 regular
(05:29):
listeners now. That's amazing.
Thank you so much to everybody. I think our our estimate was
like maybe maybe Sarah and Sonnywould listen, or maybe Noel did.
They even listen. I don't know.
I haven't heard. I don't know.
I haven't heard anything from them but I.
Don't know, maybe. I literally thought four people
would be listening to. This no, our friends did show up
(05:50):
for sure. Absolutely.
I was pretty shocked at how manypeople, how many compliments I
got at the cart and just DMS andstuff like that from people like
saying mainly that they listenedand they they thought that there
was some gems that they took away.
It's pretty nice. Yeah, I think I'm also
experiencing similar things. Definitely got some really nice
DMS, some surprisingly, like, nice interactions in person too,
(06:15):
with people saying that they tuned in and that's interesting.
I, like, wouldn't even expect tohear these things.
And it just catches me so off guard.
It's been a cool experience sharing.
Yeah. And like getting personal, it's
definitely a process. Yeah.
But yeah, hearing people's feedback and like the way that
they connect with some of these stories has been very
(06:35):
encouraging. I guess it's very culturally
Korean for us to like have low expectations for like kind of
our projects and stuff. Like I remember when I first
started, like maybe a couple of my friends will come out and
we'll have my blue Gogi one day.Yeah, yeah.
And it's so cute that I thought that.
Or even accepting compliments and positive feedback.
(06:57):
Yeah, that is a hard, hard thingto accept.
Definitely feel shy when it happens, but it definitely feels
good and I think we can totally accept that.
Yeah, yeah. I've come to realize we're the
generation that has to kind of kill that, and I think it's
already happening. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
We're like to be able to accept the compliment.
(07:17):
I say it all the time to people.I'll compliment somebody and
they'll just get very shy and I'll just be like, take the
fucking compliment. Yeah, I I'm like that too.
So I'm trying to talk to myself in that way as well.
But it's been really cool to seethe interactions on our social
media from people like we've putsome polls out there.
We got some really good questions for our last like
(07:39):
bonus episode Which. Yeah.
But yeah, it's super helpful when people have been engaging
with the polls. We've gotten some really good
ratings too. So subscribers and people
leaving us reviews, that's been really awesome.
So thank you everyone. Yeah, please keep doing that.
But yeah, we're deep in the beginning of summer now.
(08:00):
I don't know about your world, I'm assuming it's similar, but
all the events are starting now again. 100.
Deep in market season, do you have a lot of markets or events
coming up? I do.
I have events more so events in pop ups than markets that kind
of shy away from markets now because it's so rough, so hard
(08:22):
to do. First off, at least on the food
side on serving food, it's almost like sort of like
competition because you are set up with all these other food
vendors and you're kind of winning your clientele and then
you have to kind of make back that market fee that you have to
pay and the market fees are getting a lot higher.
Definitely. And I think it's really hard to
(08:42):
work around it. Actually.
This is funny that we're talkingabout market fees because
there's times where I have to tell them like, hey, I need you
to front me this because I'm just coming out of a rough
summer, rough or a rough winter,a rough spring, You know, like,
can I just hit that like after day one?
But I'm committed to come in is one of the ways that I'd have to
(09:03):
do it. But I had one person one time
from market put me on blast on Instagram and I was like, OK, I
guess I'll pay this right now. Before I kept to forfeit my
space. What?
Yeah. They called you out on social
media. Yeah, yeah, they tagged me and
like, hey, make sure to pay yourentrance fee, your market fee
(09:27):
for this. And then literally tagged us and
I was like, OK, so First off, 1,you just showed all your cards
that you're broke as fuck. And two, like you're doing the
same thing where we're all doing, we're banking on you to
put on a great event for us to vend out so we can make back the
market fee. And then we can in turn do it
again and commit to it again. And it is weird because
(09:51):
sometimes it gets to be kind of like, I think we, we talked
about this earlier. It's almost like a Ponzi scheme.
It's like, OK, I'm going to get all the money upfront from you
guys and then you guys will get all the money from the customer
level and then the customer level are going to win because
they really want this market to happen.
For sure, it's such a huge gamble for so many of the people
(10:13):
who choose to bend at these things.
At least that's how I felt over the years.
We're also investing a lot of time, resources and being there
and like fingers crossed that it's going to work out and
getting that market feedback is definitely an important piece.
Yeah. And honestly, there's a lot of
ways to kind of chill your mind on the gamble, but nothing is
(10:37):
more devastating than buying allthis product, renting all this
equipment, paying the market feeupfront and then having to vend.
I really wish some of these sometimes like the markets were
more based on like good percentage of your sales.
And I think that not a lot of people have that experience
because they think that's a sit.It's just like, oh, we just say
pay the $600.00 market fee or $400.00 market fee and then then
(10:59):
we get a shot at making, you know, like 5-10 KA day.
Yeah. And it's definitely different on
like the food side where you guys are cooking and have to
have you have perishables. Right.
But like how you get that marketfeedback, right?
Like you really have to look at your menu.
At least for me, I always look at my menu, right?
Because it's not always what I have to serve at the truck.
It's OK, how long is it going totake me to make $1000, right?
(11:22):
And what I do is I look at the price of my stuff.
I'm like, OK, so I got to sell ten of these items or 15 of
these items or twenty of these items.
And then I look at other people and what they're selling.
I'm like, Oh my gosh, you have to make back that money.
But you only can do it in $5 increments, whereas I can do it
in $1520 increments. So like really be realistic
about and that's something that I've always shield away from
(11:44):
markets before because I have been burned before and it is
just devastating to have to get back up from.
Yeah, definitely. So I tend to think that a lot of
people that throw these market events and stuff very social
facing, but they don't really understand like exactly how much
work it takes to vend your stuff, especially in the food.
(12:07):
Especially in the food, it's onething to have a product that
never goes bad that you put yourtime into, but it's another
thing to like race against the clock to get get that.
Done. Yeah, I'm definitely part of
some group chats that kind of help problem solve a lot of
these like and vet some of thesemarkets that are popping up.
Obviously there's a lot of good ones, a lot of bad ones
(12:29):
honestly, and very few great ones.
And I think what really sets them apart are like when the
event producers actually do their job in really promoting
the event, getting people there,taking care of their vendors and
making sure that the curation isgood enough, where it doesn't
feel like there's so much overlap and competition of the
same kinds of things as well. But yeah, the business of
(12:52):
markets definitely can feel pretty exploitive.
From what I've seen and what I've also heard from the
community. A lot of people like are barely
scraping by and we're putting all this like weight, monetary
weight on the small makers and it just doesn't really add up to
me. And especially in the way that
sometimes these markets are advertised, it's like, oh, it's
(13:14):
for small makers and it's like, how is a small maker supposed to
afford $300 a day for a 5 hour event?
So that stuff kind of blows me away.
But I will say the most recent event we participated in was the
beginning of this month. It was Veganizer nice and it was
their first like Asian market style of this event.
We participated and it was awesome.
(13:36):
Like it was everything that we could have hoped for and really
started off the month strong. So feeling really good about
that and definitely can't wait to like do that again next year.
I feel as if the Veganizer is one of those events that is such
a passion project and it grew into a market.
So you won't get that curation, that extra 10% that they really
need. I think also like when it comes
(13:58):
to doing markets, one of the biggest red flags to me is when
people are just like, Oh well, you know, we have like 30,000
people coming through, so 30,000people will see you, right?
However, there is something to be said about the favor that you
bring, right? There's a draw that you bring to
people. And then there's the other
aspect of it. Where are you getting exposed to
these people? So a lot of times what I do is
(14:21):
like, I will be like, OK, so your market has how many people
come? Like let's just say it has like
10,015 thousand people a day. However, I could push those
numbers up to 20,000 a day because my name is attached to
it and I can use my social mediaand I can do this like we can do
this together and do the heavy lifting of, of promoting.
(14:42):
But that conversation very rarely happens.
It's usually just we're doing you a favor.
There's 30,000 people coming. Do you want this booth or not?
You know, and it's an extra $300.00 for a 10 by 10 instead
of a 10 by 8. No, yeah.
You know, and it's really, it should just be like, you ain't
got shit. You don't own the fucking real
estate. And on top of that, fuck you pay
me because I'm bringing so many more people.
(15:03):
You know what? You're right.
It's the positioning. Exactly.
Often is positioned that way andI think that's crazy.
Isn't it? Yeah, It's crazy to think that
does take a certain amount of posturing yourself to realizing,
OK, I like you have to have a quantifier in your brain like of
your value, of your value. And often times, especially when
(15:25):
I do pop ups now, I'm like, OK, am I doing you the favor?
Are you doing me the favor? Or is it a 5050 mix?
And I have been around this so long, I'm like, OK, of course,
like everybody wants to have this curated event with super
dope people making food. But if you can't all be dope, we
should give back. You know what I mean?
(15:46):
Like, like, some people aren't going to pull as hard as you,
and then some people really aren't going to sell a product
that's going to be $20. You know, they got to make their
money in $5 commitments and $20.00 because it gets this huge
circle. I'm always stoked and happy when
people hit me up like, hey, is this event worth it or what
should I do? I love that part of this part of
small business is being able to brainstorm with people you know.
(16:07):
Yeah, and we're all at differentstages.
Some people are just getting into the game and we need to be
able to support those people with what we've learned.
That stuff all matters, but being cognizant of the value
that you bring super key. I think we need to remember that
we all hold a lot of power in these kinds of decisions.
The way that I did that was I never compare myself to like
(16:31):
when I'm flying high, there's events left and right and it's
summertime. I can just like leave the car.
I always think of it in like thewinter time, like instead of
being like how good you are, like kind of glazing yourself
during the summer, like I look at like my winter numbers.
I'm like, oh man, how this sounds so bad, but like, how
(16:52):
close am I to suicide? Here we go again in this month.
How close am I? Like, how deep am I depressed?
If it wasn't that deep, then I'mjust like, oh man, people kind
of like my food, you know? But if I'm like in the throes of
it, I guess I could just leave town, I guess.
Things are bad. Yeah, I guess things are bad.
I'm being very extreme about it,but that's how I value the biz.
(17:13):
Even during our slow months, bills are still getting paid.
Even during our slow months, I have a little bit of a nest egg.
And that also does this other thing too where it really
sharpens your brain on like how not how to save money.
Everybody wants to talk about like, oh, make all this money to
the summer. And then that way you have money
in the winter to save. And it's like, dude, you're
going to end up in the same spot.
You're still going to end feel end up feeling like shit.
(17:34):
So I don't want to fucking hear it.
But reality is that you can extrapolate that data that you
need on how valuable you are. Like if you have people coming
to you like diehards and you have the small number, let's
just say you like year 1, you had 10 regulars that always came
by 4 * a month. Yes.
But then every winter, right, you're like, oh, I'm getting
(17:57):
like this year I have 11 diehards.
No, exactly. You know, And that's the way
that you you really have to lookat it.
Yes, that's that's a good way tolook at measuring success.
It's just consistency and building over time and just
having a little bit more trust in that and your people.
Yeah. Yeah, not acting out of
(18:17):
desperation, but you're right there.
Everything's negotiable. That's my motto in life.
And it's something that's been reinforced the more that I do
it. And luckily, I did learn a lot
of negotiation just kind of early on in my career, but it's
transferred over a lot here too and what we do here.
But some ways that I've taken some of that risk off when
(18:39):
trying to figure out if I want to participate in like a shiny
looking new market, right? Typically most of the marketing
opportunities that we do, we tryto keep it like no fee.
So we're always looking for things that make sense for the
time and resources that we're putting in.
I really like corporate events. They make a lot of sense for our
(19:00):
kind of business where it's likethey just welcome you in and
support you and it's a benefit to a lot of their staff.
It's like a little perk to have a little fun shopping experience
at work. Now with paid markets, we're
really frugal on what we choose to participate in each year.
I would say like realistically the kind of expensive big
(19:21):
markets multi day that we participate in a year is like 2
to 3 Max. And then maybe like some smaller
fee would look like 30 to $70 markets.
Maybe we'll do three or four of those a year Max too.
But anything beyond that, if it's not budgeted for and we
(19:41):
have incoming requests to be a part of something, I typically
communicate that openly and say,hey, I would love to try out and
see if this is a good fit for us.
Can you guys squeeze us in and let us try it out?
Yeah. And that's generally been a good
way for us to try things. Yeah, you're right.
That is very overlooked by a lotof small businesses because we
(20:03):
really do have this like not that pick me energy, but more of
I don't know if worthy of this event.
And I have to tell so many people like if they came to you
and they've heard of you and they're asking you, then you are
worth some. And again, you got to remind
yourself that you are negotiable.
(20:24):
Now, if you come out swinging thinking that everybody should
know who you are because you buyyour Instagram following or what
have you, or because you have one viral clip, then you should
really kind of second guess that.
But you just be surprised. Like when Instagram started and
people were getting followers left and right, people leaned
back on Instagram like, oh, but I got this many followers and
(20:46):
it's. Like don't want to get to your
head? Like yo don't let it get to your
head. These people are literally on
the toilets watching. It's really not that deep and
it's not as big as you think it is.
It has to be this overwhelming evidence if that's the case with
for sure or with social media especially.
But again, the social media is another thing that you can just
(21:06):
trick into having work for you too.
And. Social media is definitely, once
again, not everything. It's not actually really
happening in real life, yeah. It's my favorite when people are
like, you're kind of nice and like, oh, thank you.
Or when people see the Instagramlike you're so unhinged.
I'm like, am I unhinged? Or you're just not used to
(21:27):
seeing somebody cry online like me.
I think it's funny too because Idon't say this a lot and maybe I
said it last time, but the voiceof my Instagram is literally
especially my rants is coming from a fucking broken heart, you
(21:48):
know, like. Sad boy like.
Some sad boy shit and I don't, Idon't know, but people really
gravitate and rally towards it. They're just like fuck yeah
dude. I feel horrible too.
Like awesome. You're an entertainer.
Thank you. You channel all that pain into
something beautiful. No, please come eat my food.
(22:08):
I'm not. Serious.
Yeah, in small business you can get knocked down so many times,
but the main thing is getting back up.
Yeah, like how do you get back up, right?
Yeah, you got it. You have to figure out a way to
pick yourself back up. Sure, there are a lot of great
wins that we can all celebrate, too, but what goes mostly unseen
are definitely those those really dark days or big losses.
(22:32):
Yeah. And I think, yeah, ultimately
we're constantly having to figure out ways to get back up.
Yeah, so when I used to have a mobile truck, uh huh.
Oh, that was Kim Jong Un. Technically took Kim Jong Un
too, right? Like my first one burned down
and then the second one was actually a mobile truck and I
(22:53):
had to figure out how to put everything back together every
time I drove it because the fridges would not go over the
grill. Like you could try to tie
everything down, it didn't matter.
But the the thing's not structurally sound.
The whole thing will kind of bend at every turn and then
loosen anyways. But I remember there was one
event specifically that I did, Iagreed to.
(23:13):
There was no deposit, and there was so many people there, and I
pulled up and I should have madesure that their electrical was
right and it wasn't. But it was one of those events
that was so busy. There was so many people that
like, got pulled in. People were cheering.
And I was like, hell yeah, you know, like I didn't have a
generator, which I should have for my electrical needs, for my
fridges and stuff. So I try to plug in and they're
(23:36):
like, it wouldn't work, right? And I was like, OK, First off,
every left turn I made, something fell off the truck.
And now that I'm here, you're telling me, like, the
electrical's not going to work. So I'm just, I just got to sit
here and suffer and let all thisfood die.
And normally when you have a food truck, you have to have
somebody following you, just kind of really looking after
your back driving like, at leastfor my particular truck, we did.
(23:59):
And when we pulled up to this event, all of a sudden there
were so many people around. The electricity didn't work.
And I had a truck full of food. I didn't have a different truck
to serve out of. It was like my division location
had to move to see this under the bridge location and I was
like, so I guess I can't serve food.
(24:21):
I've spent all night prepping and then all the people blocked
me in so I couldn't drive away to a plug to plug in my
refrigerated goods. The other car that we came in,
there is no way we were going toleave and be able to come back
because the block was so packed and it was literally after
everything was just falling down.
(24:41):
I specifically remember this moment because I felt so
defeated. I was so low that I just pushed
myself to the lowest part and broke through to the other side
and was just like, well, fuck it, at least I'm here to have a
party. And like, that's one of the ways
that I have to, I've. It took a little bit to get to
(25:02):
that to be able to just, yeah, yeah.
Essentially you just have to surrender.
It makes more sense to surrenderand then just rebuild.
It's almost easier than just sithere and just try to like
problem solve every little thingthat went wrong.
That's true. And it also forces you to not
dwell on the problem. So if you just like literally
(25:24):
are just like, OK, everything sucks.
It can only go up from here is what I have to say to myself.
And in general, I think how I'velived a lot of my life.
I think I really got that from like when I used to get in
trouble. My God, this sounds like it's
not awful saying this, but everytime I've gotten arrested, it's
just like, OK, you know what cops are here.
(25:46):
If cops are going on me, I'm going to give them a piece of my
mind. Like I'm already going to jail,
you know? It's already a done deal.
Go push farther. Like fuck you and your mom.
Yeah, I said it, you know. Words to live by.
But that's where I think a lot of my scrappiness comes from.
(26:07):
Is this literally like it's in aform of saying fuck it and
giving up? You have to relinquish the
control of the chaos that comes with falling down.
Yeah, absolutely. I can't say I have as I
definitely don't have as much business experience as you.
So don't have as many of those like super intense life changing
(26:30):
moments quite yet. Pray you don't.
I mean. Goodies is so cute.
Keep it pristine, keep it pretty.
Other than the way that we started.
I mean, we still are so scrappy,but we we started with literally
nothing. And it was just a lot of hope
and dreams. And for us, like the lowest
point was, yeah, we were still in the pandemic.
(26:52):
We were like, are we going to just sit here or are we going to
try to figure out something thatmaybe we can build together?
And our mentality was like, hey,times are really shitty right
now. I don't think it could be any
worse. So only it could only get better
from here was kind of our mindset.
And that's why we decided to risk it all with like almost
(27:15):
zero capital, Put everything on personal credit cards, which was
like the worst idea ever, but somehow made it work because no
one was going to give us a loan at that point.
Like, we were like literally nobody with this kind of
business history. So we just risked everything.
And yeah, honestly, it's still astruggle.
Like, some days, like the crunchliterally paralyzes me to the
(27:37):
point where I'm just like, I can't even speak through time.
Definitely working with, like, communicating things to my
partner and like us figuring it out.
It's definitely gotten better. But yeah, the financial side of
things is definitely something that almost used to be able to
Take Me Out. The fear of that and just so
(27:58):
much trauma from growing up withfinancial stuff with our family,
just even looking at a contract paralyzes me sometimes.
But things have gotten better just facing those fears and like
attacking it from the front. But because of a lot of this
like built in fear from past experiences, there's always a
(28:19):
self doubt of like, OK, things feel OK right now, but
something's going to go wrong. I don't know.
It's. Paranoia sets in.
Yeah, it doesn't happen as oftenas it used to, especially in the
beginning when it was just like everything was so fragile.
And day-to-day, sometimes it still feels that fragile.
But for the most part, when I feel those doubts and because of
(28:39):
the doubts, the strategies that we implement have become ways to
prevent all of these feelings from coming up too.
So I don't know for me, having contingency plans in place for
everything because we're still in the mindset of growing and
still betting on ourselves and moving forward and making big
plans. But because of that, like doubt
(29:01):
of that can also go away. Anything that seems to be going
good, just try to make a lot of good plans around, well, what's
Plan B, what's plan C, and how are we going to make that work
if this doesn't work out? Yeah, having contingency plans
is a hard lesson to they're so good to have.
And I also think sometimes it is.
(29:21):
What kind of mindset do you have?
Are you really good in chaos? Yeah, I think I thrive in chaos.
I know it's very on brand for me, but those are usually the
times like really a lot of brilliant stuff.
Yeah, no, absolutely. They're like really clever ways
to work around. Things have to come up.
There's also times when we don'thave a lot of people to bounce
(29:43):
these ideas off of, right? I've said this before, but I
also had this realization that you're not the only one that's
on that. Like when you probably open your
business on personal credit cards.
Like I think I'm still paying off the credit card that I did
for Kim. Jong UN do.
You know what I mean? Like seriously.
And that's The thing is that I have to remind myself a lot of
(30:04):
times, like I'm not the only onethat's done this.
I'm not the only one that has these moments of failures.
So you got to pick yourself backup and keep going.
Like not nothing runs always on all cylinders.
Now, the days that do run fantastic, those are the days I
really hold on to. I really hold on to that feeling
(30:27):
because I know too well the times that everything, like
everything goes to shit. Like, short of me injuring
myself, like, damn, everything that could have gone wrong not
only went wrong, it went wrong catastrophically.
So the days are almost like, oh,this is cool.
Like, you know, like you have toremind yourself that you know
(30:49):
you're not the only one. Yeah, that brings you back to
reality, which is super important.
But yeah, overall, having to keep moving forward and not
stalling, that's just something I have to constantly remind
myself to in in those hard moments.
The other hard moments I just try to burn up the clock too.
I'm just like, Oh, well, at least tomorrow's a new day.
(31:10):
Yeah, let's start again tomorrow.
I guess I'll just throw all thisaway today.
Start again tomorrow. There's been some days I'm just
like laugh crying and it's been like, OK, well tomorrow won't
hurt so bad 'cause it can't hurtanymore as it did today, and
then just jump back into it. So I just have to really put
(31:31):
this out there to everybody that's had a small business that
had those days where everything fails and nothing came out
right. Nothing you made worked.
I've been there. Yeah, we've all been there.
And just know that's so real. And I'm sure there's something
to pull away from it, but damn, you know, like.
Yeah, and you know what happens when you laugh and cry at the
(31:52):
same time, right? Oh yeah, yeah, you get a hairy
butt hole, is that right? But.
Yeah. In small business, it's kind of
interesting because not only do you have to invent and create
your own job, but also you're incharge of putting that carrot
where whatever that is, in frontof your face.
Yeah, yeah. It's interesting.
It is, it is interesting and there's a lot that I don't post
(32:16):
or a lot that I don't share withpeople that happen.
And I think it's honestly because I've seen, especially on
social media, people doing the trauma flex thing and just being
like, oh man, business is so hard and I can't get this off
the ground and this and that. It's kind of cringey to me
because there's advice that you can take and there's things that
(32:38):
you can do. I'm really trying not to be
insensitive to it, but I think alot of times people really over
celebrate the losses and it it just only ends the same.
It only ends like with the losing, you know, like the, the
pivot has to happen at some point.
I think I got caught up in that too with that, like especially
with my post, it's always just seem like everything's a downer.
But part of the reason why I do it is to tell people like, yo, I
(33:01):
went through this or this is what happened to me or this is
the realization I had. I hope you have it too.
It always comes back to that. But so done with talking to
other businesses and having these, Oh well, this is how bad
my month was and this, this happened and this and this.
I'm like, hey man, at least you're not working for anybody
else. Yeah, I think when you say
(33:21):
trauma flex, what I imagine is that there's like a very
consistent pattern to how peopleare communicating these things.
Yeah. And it may be real, it may be
very real, but I think especially if it's being
constantly portrayed on social media or just like the
negativity is just never breaking and it's never
solutions oriented, it, it does take a toll.
(33:44):
It's like wears down on people. Yeah, and also social media is
changing in the aspect of we're not so easily fooled, I guess.
At least that's maybe what I want to believe because I'm kind
of an optimist like that. But I always it seems as if we
see through a lot more stuff. It's like the consumers a little
bit more savvy. Yeah, I believe that.
(34:05):
Yeah, I think of newspaper ads and I'm like, how does that
work? Once I figured out, like
somebody told me like, oh, you have to be consistent with the
ads and it takes like 3 weeks for people to notice it.
And then she'll come in and it'slike, dude, that's crazy.
Don't you think it's just way better to be good at what you
do? Ads in general are still like
(34:25):
that. Yeah, I guess ads in general are
superiority. Yeah, I just feel like our our
general consumer and just the people in general like kind of
start seeing through that. It's like almost a trope.
Like I watched commercials the other day on an actual TV and I
was like, what? How does it does this work, you
know? It must, I guess it's there's
research to back it and I guess there is if your commercials on,
(34:48):
they've got the money to do the research.
But yeah, these like hardships and trauma that a lot of people
go through, they can be very real.
But is that what you want to be known for like all the time?
It's that part, yeah. And people remember these
things. And if that's the thing that
people associate you with too, it's not really helping the end
goal either, like if you want toget out of it.
(35:10):
But yeah, the self victimizationcan definitely be a big trap.
Even though like we've had our share of issues and hardships of
having a retail space in Old Town or anywhere in Portland,
but we don't necessarily broadcast all the things that we
go through, mainly because I just don't think it's helpful or
positive in most situations. But like the reality is, yeah,
(35:34):
like the first year that we wereopen, within our first week, we
had 6 broken windows. Yeah, over the last 2 1/2 years,
we've definitely had more than 10 windows broken at one point.
But we don't, we rarely ever share these things because it's
not helpful and a lot of people are going through it.
It's not like a just us kind of experience.
(35:56):
Sure, it sucks. And I don't think there's
anything wrong about sharing about these things, especially
if the community can get together and help.
But for us, it's just been important for us to try to keep
things positive if we can help it, if we need help, which is
once in a while. Recently, I did post on social
media. I was like, hey, it was a really
shitty month for us unexpectedly.
(36:18):
Really need you guys to show up,whether it be like leaving us a
Google review if you've been here before, Yeah, or coming in
in person. And that literally was super
helpful for me. Like I think we got 10 plus
Google reviews in like a couple days and that felt really nice
that people wanted to show up inthat way and needed support.
It was like, I think people can support us by doing this and it
(36:40):
doesn't cost them anything. I think for me it a lot of it
comes back to just seeing the outrage post.
Yeah. That's something that I'm very
sensitive and sick of now because I will get DMS this like
hey, can you repost this? This person did this, this and
I'm like, I don't, I don't recall ever being on your side,
you know, or I got to be real here, like I really just try not
(37:03):
to do. Spread.
I just really try not to spread it.
I've had really bad experiences being that person and doing
that, and that's kind of the reason why Cute Animal Thursday
exists. Yes, we already have enough
trauma. Yeah.
Like, I just, the whole reason behind it is let's just
celebrate something ridiculouslycute and so distracting to the
(37:28):
other direction just for a few slides, just so you can see if I
posted your animal, I agree. Just just for like a a minute or
like a few seconds, you know, I just man, yeah.
But again, if you are going through that and it's really
hard, I think you can reach out to people.
(37:49):
There's other people to reach out to because I definitely do
get DMS like hey, I just startedmy business.
How can I get from point A to point B?
I'm so happy to share, share my experiences.
Although I will say I am very selective just because I have
been in that position. I've been burned before and like
(38:11):
next thing you know, I cosigned on something that I did not
agree to or what have you. But I won't let those times
change the fact that like, I'll still answer the DM, I'll still
answer people's questions. And I think a big part of a big
reason of why I wanted to do this podcast with you is to be
able to share some of these experiences I've had with people
so they can learn from my mistakes.
(38:33):
I hope. Like make sure you strap every
all your equipment in your food truck before driving it.
Is that in your handbook? In my manifesto or?
Manifesto I. Haven't written it that in a
long time. I should add to it.
Yes, it should be, yeah. I hope that's that's going to
come out eventually. Food truck manifest.
(38:54):
Yeah, yeah. I've been kind of, I've been
writing it as posts. I think one day I'm going to
take all the things, all the unhinged things I've written,
put it in a book or a comic bookand just be like, shit, Han
said. I mean, for real.
There's so much truth in Nuggets.
(39:15):
Thank you. I would assume that you have
been in a mentor position to a lot of people.
Yeah, Yeah, I have, I think havehave you had, did you have a
mentor in this or? Over time, yeah, I've definitely
had a lot of different kinds of mentors through like my career
(39:35):
and starting from the beginning,I just always had kind of like
an entrepreneurial spirit. But I looked up to a lot of
people who were like maybe 5-10 years ahead of me.
I was super curious. So I just would get involved,
ask a lot of questions, just jump right in.
And yeah, through each part of my career, I've definitely
looked to people as mentors to learn a little bit more and like
(39:58):
mostly this like sounding boardsthrough like my process even
applied for like startup accelerator kind of things to
just to educate myself more. But I think in this process
specifically like. Terrance and I as partners have
been each other's mentors in many ways.
And like also oh. I see that.
Yeah, like we, we kind of just help coach each other and push
(40:21):
each other through the challenges.
But also, yeah, reaching out to friends and trusted people like
you like has been super helpful through this process.
I'm still kind of like looking for a sort of mentorship in some
way. It's hard to find good mentors,
you know. Yeah, I don't think a lot of
them really make themselves available.
I have had many mentors in the food game and people that have
(40:46):
really nurtured. Yeah, that's good.
But I've also had it where I feel as if when the nurturing
stopped is when and it's never been an easy send off.
I guess for me, there's actuallya couple of food trucks that
come to mind when that I helped that I helped with their
business. The one that comes to mind I
think is crazy in my eyes, maybenot his successful be Frybaby
(41:09):
and really telling Sunny just like, oh, these are the mistakes
I made. Or more often than not, it's
usually him running an idea by me or asking me a question and
then me instantaneously like an older brother.
Just like you're fucking stupid.But the value in it is to be
able to be and hear to somebody and be that sounding board.
(41:32):
And I think that is very valuable to a lot of people that
have helped out in the food truck business.
Yeah. And I'm willing to do that a
lot. I think there's a fine line of
somebody like kind of grooming you to be a success or like
grooming you to be the success that they wanted.
And it's kind of hard to, I think that's why it's hard to
see and find a mentor. I think.
(41:55):
I think a lot of times I look back when I started and you
know, I got to, I have to give my props to the owner of Pizza
Shoals. He really puts himself out there
for the small businesses to helpgrow and Brian like really
helped me out. And then at certain points,
obviously No2 businesses are alike.
So at certain points, you know, you just kind of pull off.
(42:16):
But I think a lot of times it really helps to see somebody
that you have you that you want to be like or emulate and then
just kind of find your way there.
For sure. What do you think are some
qualities that make a good mentee?
Aside from the obvious of just being able to take advice, yeah,
(42:40):
I think on both ends, it's it's the trust.
It's the trust. I think it's really hard to have
have the responsibility that somebody trusts you so much, you
know, and you have to, I think also at the same time have the
same the humility to be like, hey, I was really wrong about
that. I think that's really valuable
(43:01):
too because, you know, like you,there's that saying like, never
meet your hero. Yeah.
And there's a reason for that. I think all too often people
that mentor others, they just don't admit that they're wrong.
That idea didn't take off. I think you just end up in this
(43:22):
like awkward space where it's aseasy for the person that's
mentoring, You know, it's like coaching too.
It's just like, hey, I was wrongabout that.
Let's try this. Let's try to apply this this
way. I hear it a lot, but I try not
to let it get to my head that like some of the things I've
said, like help people out because the last thing I want to
do is have it go to my head. Like I, I, I've, I've admitted
(43:45):
this on many platforms. Like I love the attention but at
the same time like I don't want it to get to the point where I'm
just like abusive about it either.
Yeah, you, you don't want to geta God complex.
No, but I do want free appetizers if and you guys see
me at your restaurants, like please send something out to me
'cause like like I went through the muck and dirt so you could
(44:07):
make salads at that restaurant. I'm totally joking, but honestly
there's a lot to be said about having their trust in somebody
and being able to admit you're wrong.
You know, like you're the peopleyou mentor should help you grow
to. You know, yeah, for sure.
That's that's beautifully said. OK so outside of just all your
(44:28):
your work hobbies of like being a mentor, solving problems,
putting out fires, what do you do to like unplug?
And what are your hobbies? I mean, I think I know some of
them, but I'm curious to know what your answers are going to
be. OK so like this is going to
sound so bad. One of the things I love doing
is bed rotting in the afternoon when it's like super sunny out
(44:52):
and super nice out and people are like out having fun and
doing shit. I'm just like Bah humbug.
That's so relatable. Fuck you.
What's up YouTube? What's so and so doing on
Instagram? That's a bad habit.
But my time outside of being a parent and being a business
owner, I'm a boxer as well. Oddly enough.
(45:14):
It's just work in a different form.
Yeah, training. It's just training.
I think this is kind of something new to a lot of people
that don't know that about me isI've been I've been boxing for
the past five years and it's so dearly.
And then I only have like one day off where I can have the
option to full throttle just be like, OK, it's do nothing
(45:35):
Monday. Yeah, yeah, yeah, do Jack and
shit Monday, you know, or it's just like go be social Monday or
break up that be social amongst the pop ups and stuff.
I think people have seen me out a lot more 'cause I I really
struggled to be social because Ithink so much of my job
requires. A yeah, yeah, I think we've
(45:55):
talked about this before too, but is it easier to be social
when you're working? Yes.
Yeah. 100% 'cause like my 'causemy niceness is hinged on you
buying my food. Anything for the money.
(46:18):
Don't front like, you're not thesame way.
No, no, I I'm laughing 'cause it's relatable.
Across all of us. But I don't know, I'm kind of
like a working animal in some ways because it's just like when
I have a job to do, I'm comfortable because I I know
what my job is. Yeah.
But if I don't have like a specific job, it's harder.
(46:41):
So it is harder, It is harder tounplug and shift skins.
What about you? What do you do on your day off?
Because I know you only give yourself one day off.
I know we have the same day off issue.
I mean I honestly have a hard time with this question.
It's really hard. I sound like a workaholic and
maybe that is true, but I actually really do like cleaning
(47:04):
my my spaces on my day off. Makes me feel better.
I know that's not a hobby but that's usually what I do on my
day off when I have the chance. I also like to rot when I can,
like when I'm over socialized. I just need a day to do nothing.
I guess it's a good example of when weather permits, like
(47:25):
yesterday, we missed each other at the river.
But yeah, Terrence and I really love to unplug by going out to
the river where we have no cell service, no distractions, and
that's kind of the only way thatwe can truly unplug.
And. Not, not get sucked into
anything else because there's nothing we can do out there from
that far away. And we feel super present, super
(47:49):
in tune with all the beauty around us, and it's just fun
being by water. It is so fun being by water.
Just like it's fun being by a fire.
Yeah, I totally agree. Yeah, so.
But I'm not to the camping plane.
Oh, OK. Like I won't cosplay poor, I
refuse, yeah, but I will. I will go to the river for a day
(48:11):
and enjoy a fire. But camping I'm like fuck no.
It's suffering for. You it's just an extra leb.
It it just you know what it is. It kind of reminds me it's, it's
too close cause at some point when it was when when I was
drinking and getting fucked up, it's like, hell yeah, go outside
and get fucked up. But now it's like at some point,
cause I've done this sober too, like at some point in camping,
(48:33):
it's like, huh. And everything could go wrong
and this could be every day in your life.
I'm like, fuck, you know, like Ihate it.
Oh. My goodness, I never even
thought of it like that. I know, I'm sorry, but it's so
true. But for me, when it's
role-playing in that like I kindof have, I'm like, it's like
survival. It's fun.
It's survival. Like I, I guess you're right, I
(48:55):
guess ultimately. I guess you know what you've
told me one of the highest compliments I've ever gotten,
which is like, Oh yeah, if a zombie apocalypse happens, we're
going to find you like that madethat warmed my heart.
Yeah, I I think you would be a great teammate.
Thank you. In disaster.
They just utter chaos like. I mean I, I I think so.
(49:16):
Yeah, 100%. Do you know how many times it's
going to come up from like, well, there's no more cops,
We're just going to eat this person?
Yeah. They stole from us.
We got to eat them now. It's the only way.
It's the only way people learn, you know?
Yeah. Do you have any?
Were they cleaning? You don't have like puzzles or
like you don't like build stuff or.
Like, no, I in theory would I, Iwant to like things like games,
(49:41):
but no, it doesn't really entertain me.
I used to read a lot more. I definitely don't do enough of
that anymore. Honestly, I like hanging out
with my chickens. I like to watch them eat and
forage. That's such a hobby.
That's so awesome though. It's peaceful.
That's kind of like my farming SIM, like it's IRL.
(50:04):
I love animals, I love my animals.
I love water in my plants, watching the growth on them.
Kind of like really grandma, I think.
Yeah. But just super chill things.
Chill not work related. Yeah, like maybe this happens to
you. Like you, you sometimes feel a
little guilty. Like bedrock to.
(50:26):
Yeah. What have you I, I hate that
feeling. I've never really quite figured
out how to like full on, like relax, you know, Yeah.
And I I'm so open to suggestionsand ideas people, so just go
ahead and. For sure.
Any comments? We shouldn't feel bad about
having to bed rot sometimes though.
What? Are you talking about?
Because I, I feel like even yourhobbies like boxing, you're
(50:49):
hella productive. And I forgot to add, but yeah, I
typically really like working out too.
I my form of working out typically looks like I like to
lift. I don't really like a lot of
cardio. But lately my main mode of
relaxing has been stretching because I need to be doing that.
Yeah, yeah. Sometimes I'll just Terrance is
like on his computer either working or playing games and
(51:12):
I'll just be stretching on the ground for like 40 minutes to an
hour and that's my self-care. I'm like, OK, I got that out of
the way. The other two things I do
habitually to relax is Harlow and I will get out of town.
We'll just have our drive. We'll just go east.
OK? Blindly.
Wow. Yeah.
(51:32):
Burning fuel. Yeah, I don't care.
That's fine, care. That's why.
Why did the dinosaurs walk? Before us, you know.
Yeah, I'll just. Yeah, we'll just drive I.
Don't care. That's really cool.
Yeah, I like, it's cool 'cause like, you know, we get to catch
up and stuff, but then it goes right back to boxing 'cause
we'll go to some place and I'll just put some gloves on her and
just be like. Oh yeah, you guys have the same
(51:52):
hobbies. Like hit dad for two minutes
straight and I won't hit back, but I just gotta work on my
defense. And then the other thing it's
completely 100% linked to my God, that sounds so gross when I
say like this, but I don't know what to say it.
It's a completely linked to my sobriety is that I have to keep
my hands busy. That's.
(52:12):
Fair. But I like to build stuff, so
like, I'll build, I'll rebuild. Game Boys and old video game
consoles. I think I build more now than I
play video games, which is cool,but they're like little puzzles
to me. And I have to keep my brain
stimulated. Yeah, yeah, yeah, I get it.
I think that is the link. I think that's the link between
(52:33):
all of us small business owners.It's like you have to stay
stimulated, so bed rotting feelsbad and relaxing feels bad, but
it's really good for you, yeah. It's interesting.
That is an interesting connection.
I don't think I can deny that either.
Yeah, 'cause like thinking aboutlike when you're like, oh, I
just like being with my animals and stuff.
That's so like, you still have to care, you know, you have to
keep tabs on them. So present.
(52:55):
You have to be present, which isfunny.
I just want to put out there anybody that made it to the end
of all of our podcasts. You guys are so, so, so real and
we are so, so grateful for you guys.
We started this as a passion project and it's cute and I love
it and thank you guys so much. We had, I personally had no idea
(53:17):
that we'd have so many people, the feedback and stuff like
that. So I really appreciate it for
real. Yeah, Thank you guys so much.
It's really cool when we get to connect in real life too and
hearing all the stories and feelings of connection
definitely keep driving this forward and we just want to keep
making a better product for you guys an your feedback really
(53:40):
matters so. Right back to work, we just need
to work hobbies to leave the feedback I.
Just want to make it better because I mean, like, you know,
Oh. Totally.
I I totally. Agree.
We started and it was very free flow.
It still is. It's a great creative outlet.
Yeah, it's starting to become a hobby.
It's starting to become a hobby.But yeah, I, I guess like it's
(54:00):
for the community. So like we want people to be
involved and the feedback matters.
Reach out to us, follow us on social, leave a review if you
can on Spotify or Apple podcast.But all of that helps and it
really helps guide the conversations that we continue
to have and the things that we kind of continue to do.
(54:22):
So thank you so much. We really, really appreciate
you. Yeah, and don't, don't ever stop
asking the questions because we'll probably pop up and
inspire us to talk about it too.So.
Yes. Don't shy away.
We'll keep collecting. Thank you.
Bye. Bye.
Thanks. Thanks.
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