January 8, 2025 • 38 mins
Have you ever wondered how romance novels can tackle tough topics like trauma and healing?
Today, we're diving deep into the world of trauma-informed romance with author Jack Whitney. Jack writes romantic suspense with elements of dark romance and paranormal romance, and her books offer a unique perspective on healing and finding love amidst challenging circumstances. We discuss her Rockstar series (Young Decay), where characters navigate past traumas and find solace and strength in each other.
This episode contains the following potential triggers:
- Discussions of parental addiction, emotional neglect, and childhood trauma
- Mentions of suicidal thoughts and struggles with depression
- Brief mentions of stalking and past substance abuse
Jack Whitney is a dark, romantic suspense author from North Carolina, USA. She writes emotionally dark and high-angst stories with a twist. Her books explore themes of trauma, healing, and the power of love.
In this episode, we're discussing:
- Trauma-informed romance: How this subgenre allows for exploration of healing and healthy relationships in the context of past trauma.
- Characters who exist outside their romantic relationships: Jack emphasizes the importance of her characters having independent lives and not being solely defined by their romantic partners.
- The power of music: How music can be a source of comfort and connection for those who have experienced trauma.
- Neurodiversity representation: Jack discusses incorporating her own experiences with ADHD into her characters and the importance of authentic representation.
- Addiction and recovery: The Rockstar series touches on addiction and recovery with sensitivity and nuance, highlighting the importance of support systems and personal choice.
- Romance as a tool for healing: How romance novels can offer hope and empowerment to readers who have experienced trauma.
Jack Whitney's books offer a powerful and insightful look at how love and healing can intertwine. Be sure to check out her Rockstar series and other works on Amazon, and connect with her on Patreon, TikTok, Instagram, and Facebook! Let's continue the conversation about the power of romance to help us heal and grow.
CONNECT WITH JACK WHITNEY:
BOOKS MENTIONED:
Dirty Texas Series by JA Low (Amazon)
Built to Fall by Julia Wolf (Amazon)
Captivated by Danger by Endiya Carter (Amazon)
Haunting Adeline by HD Carlton (Amazon)
Running list of books mentioned (Doc)
Thank you for listening to the We Read Smut Podcast! If you enjoyed this episode, take a screenshot of the episode to post in your stories and tag @WeReadSmut. Don’t forget to follow, rate, and review the podcast.
Connect with Alesia:
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Alesia Galati (00:00):
Ever wondered how romance can tackle tough topics
(00:02):
like trauma and healing? Tune inas we chat with Jack Whitney
about her books and how they arereframing the narrative around
trauma. Listener discretion isadvised. This podcast contains
mature content intended foradult audiences only. In this
episode, we are talking aboutreframing trauma in romance. So
(00:23):
there are going to be somediscussions around traumatic
things that are happening to themain characters or have happened
to them. For a full list of thetrigger warnings, be sure to
check the podcast show notes orthe video description to make
sure that you are taking care ofyourself and your mental health.
Hi, Jack. I am so excited tohave you on the podcast. So if
(00:46):
you could start by tellingeveryone who you are and a bit
about your books,
Jack Whitney (00:50):
right? I am really excited to be here. My name is
Jack Whitney. I write romanticsuspense, Stark romance, little
bit of paranormal romance inthere. I'm from North Carolina.
That's you
Alesia Galati (01:04):
love it. So I was trying to explain your books to
someone, specifically your rockstar romances. I said it's not
your typical dark romance,because the characters and their
interactions are not dark in anyRight, right, there's maybe a
little mask play and a littlebit of that kind of play, but
(01:25):
it's not anything that's likeaggressive or assertive or what
you typically see in darkromances, but the external
situations are dark, and so it'smore of like a more suspense
type of thing, but that's verydifferent than a lot of, at
least the rock star romancesthat I have read, thinking back
(01:47):
in 2021 and actually, to writethis down, because I was like,
What the heck did I read in 2021it was the dirty Texas series by
Jay a low she's an Australianauthor, and it covers a rock
Star band that travels a lot,and the stories interconnected
in that a lot of their storiesoverlap. So you see the each of
(02:08):
the couples throughout each ofthe books, but there's a lot of
overlap in the stories as well.
So things that you maybe see inbook one you also see happening
in book two. And so it can beit's very interesting, but can
be a little redundant, just fromwhat I remember of reading it.
And then I read a Julia wolfthat was built to fall age gap.
He's a rock star. Terribleimage. She comes in this curvy
(02:31):
younger girl who's trying tohelp him and his PR and make him
look better. And they end upfalling in love. And
everybody's, oh, my god, hecould be her dad, and she's, I
don't care, like, very differentthan your stuff. So I, first and
foremost, I want to talk abouthow trauma informed your books
(02:51):
are. Because without giving toomany spoilers, let's talk first
about book one and thecharacters in there and some of
the baggage that they come tothe book with. Yeah,
Jack Whitney (03:06):
so Andy and Maddox are the two main characters, and
both of them just have reallycrappy, I don't want to say like
really crappy parents, becauseMads does, but Andy, it's her,
like birth mom, that was reallykind of she needed help, and she
(03:27):
wouldn't get it, and it justspiraled into affecting Andy.
Because I don't want tonecessarily say she's a bad
person, because if her mom hadgotten the help that she needed,
then maybe things would havebeen differently for her, but
she didn't get it. But thenMaddox, his dad, was just a
(03:49):
piece of shit, cut and dry, hewas just a piece shit.
Alesia Galati (03:55):
So they're coming to this relationship, right,
especially having grown uptogether, I think, and seeing
that happen to each other, Ithink at that level of intimacy
that you don't have to create,when you're like, Oh, we're
adults, and we're meeting forthe first time. And I hope all
this baggage is no I've beenthere with your baggage, and I
understand, and so created thisunderstanding between the
(04:18):
characters right out the gate ofmy darkness, sees your darkness.
It's like the opposite ofNamaste, but also Namaste,
right? Like ICU, yeah, in like,a really intimate way. And I
feel like that a lot, as someonewho has gone through some really
traumatic stuff, but also isADHD and has these compulsions
to just tell people my lifestory. I don't really care.
(04:41):
Sure. I'll tell you, I grew upin a cult. My mom was an addict
for the majority of my life. Sheoverdosed in 2019 she passed
away like and people are like,wait, wait a minute. Go back
Jack Whitney (04:55):
this up what you're speaking about this very
casually, right? No.
Alesia Galati (05:00):
Yeah, and to have to explain all that to someone,
right? Especially if you're,like, interested in them
romantically, or you'reexploring that can be like,
like, how are they gonna takeit? And are they gonna take it?
So they were able to cometogether in this secretive way,
though, because it's herbrother's best friend, yeah? Who
said, Hey, don't date my sister.
Don't look at her. And he'slike, can't really help myself.
(05:23):
Love that love that trope. Sorryabout that, exactly, but kind of
like this healing that happenswith the characters, and this is
something that I that I thinkyou do really well, is that they
heal together, but not in a waythat's co dependent. They don't
(05:44):
need each other for the rest,like, it'd be great to be
together for the rest of ourlives, but they don't need that
in order to be imperfectlyperfect, right? Like they don't
need that, but they still findhealing and understanding
together. And I think that'sthat you do that in such a
beautiful way. So as you werecreating this experience for
these characters, what were somethings that you wanted to make
(06:06):
sure that you brought into thelike creating something that was
very trauma focused but alsohealing?
Jack Whitney (06:16):
One of the big things I always want for my
characters is for them to beable to exist outside of their
romantic partners. So regardlessof how they feel about each
other and how much they say,You're mine, I'm yours, that
kind of thing, they're stillokay. They still don't need that
(06:39):
other person to come in and savethem from everything. Yes, the
other person can help them seethings. Andy was in therapy
already. And Maddox, I don'tknow about him with therapy
that, but he had really goodfriends and an outlet and things
like that that he was working onhimself with Yeah, Andy
(07:03):
definitely is part of whathelped him keep going. But at
the same time, I know that inhis past, he's had moments where
he had to call Reid and Reed hadto talk him down because he was
didn't know how to see tomorrow,and that's always been important
(07:26):
for me with any of mycharacters. Yeah, I don't know
if that answered. Yeah, no atall it
Alesia Galati (07:33):
does. It does for real. I think that there's just
something so beautiful in that,because when you add in darker
themes in books, not youspecifically, but when authors
add in darker themes into books,they can create more of a co
dependence than which, I mean isa fantasy of like, I don't have
(07:54):
to think about anything, I haveto do anything. I can just exist
in this relationship, andeverything's gonna be fine, and
it's great, but there's still somuch work to do, and I love that
you bring that realness to thecharacters in creating these
relationships that are healthy,but also aren't too fictitious
(08:15):
in the way of this is notachievable for someone who has
trauma. When you came up withthese ideas of the background,
what were some things that kindof inspired you, or were like
your own experience, or thingsthat you've seen that led you to
create these characters in thisway?
Jack Whitney (08:31):
With Maddox, I knew that he was going to be
mass. I wanted to do a Mass RockStar romance. So it started with
there, and I knew I've alwayswanted to do brother's best
friend, so those two wenttogether, but I needed something
like, why is he wearing thismask? I had to figure out, like,
(08:54):
why he was wearing it, and whyhe was still holding on to it,
and even, like, in interviewsand stuff, and not just on stage
as like a stage presence kind ofthing. And then with Andy, I
knew that her and Reed were stepsiblings, and so there had to be
some kind of catalyst as to whythey were step siblings. And I
(09:20):
don't know the it just meshedout to where, like Maddox, had
seen her in her lowest momentsgrowing up, and had watched her
being taken out the door andtried to stop it, and that kind
of thing. And it was just, itjust showed itself in a way that
helped show how much she meantto him, and even, like her
(09:44):
strength in in continuing onwith stuff while that was
happening to her, that helpedhim keep continuing on, too,
because it was, I don't know, Idon't want to say, like, if she
can do it, I can do it, but kindof like that.
Alesia Galati (10:00):
Yeah, I remember, as I was reading, I was like,
oh, man, did this chick watch mychild? Because I come from a
single parent home, they wereconstantly fighting over
custody, constantly fightingover I was there and I have her
this weekend. Or who are youbringing her around? I'm my
(10:20):
dad's only child, but I'm theoldest of five on my mom's side,
and so it was just always thisback and forth that I could
never relate to my siblings onbecause they didn't have the
same dad as me, and then beingthe oldest and having to, like,
protect the kids from my mom'saddiction and like her issues.
And there was just so manydifferent elements of it that I
(10:42):
was like, I feel like she wrotemy story, that i just i It felt
so empowering and to see myselfand like my own trauma, like
different but same, right, likethese feelings are very valid,
and that There is healing andthere is that raging is okay,
(11:03):
like breaking things, or goingto one of those, like, whatever
they're called, where you go tothe room and you, like, just
destroy a bunch of stuff, yeah,and like, they're okay. It's
okay to leave these emotionsout. And so I just, I loved that
you brought all of thosedifferent elements to the story
that even some of them, I waslike, Oh, wow, yeah, that
(11:24):
reminds me of, nope. Haven'tthought of that in a minute.
Whoa. It felt so like beautifulto see that reflected. Is like,
and I think this is somethingthat I've has encouraged people
when they hear my story, islike, you're not alone, right?
So, like, I remember when mysister and I started our first
(11:44):
podcast, which was of all aboutcults and growing up in one and
what it was like. And we got somany DMS, which you wouldn't
think, but we got so many DMS ofpeople saying, me too, I was in
a micro cult. Like, I was in acommunity that was definitely
cult ish or whatever, like somany people could relate, and so
I love that what you've brought,yes, it's romance and it's
(12:07):
fictitious, but there's so manyparts of it that I don't think
people realize how empoweringand powerful romance can be in
allowing us to evolve and growas people. Yeah,
Jack Whitney (12:22):
no, I had probably five other people messaged me
like the same thing, like youwrote my childhood, like I was
Andy, and I'm just like, oh mygod, I'm sorry. I'm so sorry.
But I hope this book helped,right?
Alesia Galati (12:41):
I think it does, I really do, and I think it
helps in such a beautiful way.
So moving on to book two, like,we're not gonna go too much into
like, spoilers for book one, goread the book for sure. Yeah,
but Book Two, Sunshine rockstar, that is, I don't think
I've ever read a sunshine rockstar before, but yeah, Reed's
energy was just off the charts,absolutely, just very golden
(13:06):
retriever energy. Loved it, andthen having the prickly autistic
ADHD,
Unknown (13:16):
you know,
Alesia Galati (13:17):
plant mom on the other side. I think it was just
chef's kiss. So how did that allcome about?
Jack Whitney (13:24):
So I actually so Nicole, we had talked about
having an ADHD FMC, because Iwas discovering that I was ADHD
around the time. I don't wantto. I don't know how long
Nicole's known that she's hadADHD, but
Alesia Galati (13:44):
for anyone who doesn't know or is new, Nicole
is the other part of we readSMUD. But
Jack Whitney (13:52):
like, there was just, like, some things that I
was discovering, I was sharing,and then she would be like,
that's an ADHD thing, right?
Like, the gym boxes and justlike, little stuff like that.
And so I started realizing allthese things. And then my son
was actually going through hisautistic evaluation at the time,
and I was starting to noticemore stuff with that that I
(14:13):
related to. And so I was like, Iguess I'm ADHD too. This
explains a lot. So we had talkedabout doing an ADHD FMC, and it
just fit in perfectly withReed's story, because he is the
(14:33):
golden retriever bouncing offthe wall, very typical ADHD boy,
and then adding in with Rin, herexperience with living like that
is my experience with livingwith it. And so a lot of things
that she has trouble with orstruggles with daily. Those are
(14:58):
things that I struggle withdaily, and writing that
experience out was just socathartic. They just worked out
really well. I knew that she hadto be grumpy and kind of like
have a chip on her shoulder, andshe had to have a big reason for
that why she didn't want to getclose to people, so that kind of
(15:19):
factored into it, but, yeah,they worked out perfectly. I'm
Alesia Galati (15:26):
curious if, for ren's ADHD, and how it showed up
for her, you said the things shestruggles with, and I'm curious
if that opinion changed as youwere writing her. I feel like a
lot of people see themselves andthey're like, Oh, I'm autistic,
where I have ADHD or I havethese struggles. I also have a
(15:47):
son who was diagnosed over thesummer, and saw a lot of my own
things in him, and was like,Okay, this feels like the
beginning of a really crazyjourney. There's definitely
gonna be dragons on it. It'sgonna be an adventure for both
of us, but I feel like I havefound so many coping mechanisms
to manage my day, to manage mytime, to get things done, to not
(16:11):
hyper fixate on things that Ican better support him, and so
reframing how these strugglesright and the things that I know
I'm going to struggle with, orhe's going to struggle with, and
being able to reframe them. Didwriting that character allow you
to personally, or even readers,if they read your book and were
like I saw those and yes, I feellike so much better empowered
(16:34):
that it's okay to have, I don'twant to say crutches, because
they're not crutches, butstructures in place to help us
navigate how our brain works.
Yeah, so,
Jack Whitney (16:46):
like Reed was telling Ren about the magnets
that his mom used to have on thefridge. Yeah, I had seen those
somewhere, and so I actually gotsome of those. It does help me,
because I always forget, likethe laundry, or, Oh, I was
supposed to make something inthe crock pot today, little
(17:07):
things like that. I don't thinkpeople understand how
frustrating those little, teenywhat seems like little things
are just so like, you beatyourself up about it, because it
just feels like it's so easy forsomeone else, and it is a
(17:27):
struggle for me every singleday. And like the biggest thing
that I was actually like tellingmy sister about one day was like
my executive dysfunction on theperiods when I really struggle
with my depression, it's like,even on a day to day basis,
(17:48):
getting into the shower is astruggle for me. But on the days
that I'm in my head and I can'tit is absolutely debilitating,
and that seems like a such asimple thing, but it's not. But
I think that writing thecharacter and then realizing
(18:10):
these things about myself, thatit's okay to have those days
helped me accept that I needmore time to do X, Y and Z. I
need to move the magnets on thefridge, or whatever it might be
like, I need those little thingsto help me cope daily. Sometimes
(18:31):
it feels like I shouldn't needthose things, but I do need
those things because it's likeyou said. You don't want to call
it a crutch, but at the sametime, if it helps you get from A
to B, then you want to use it?
Yeah,
Alesia Galati (18:44):
I couldn't agree more. I have this conversation
with my husband quite regularlybecause I so I'm pretty sure he
has ADHD, but his shows up verydifferent in, like, need to
switch tasks a lot, yeah,whereas I'm more of the autistic
ADHD of like, hyper fixation.
Very lovely to have thatcombination. Yes, he's the kind
(19:05):
of person where it's like, oh,it's a commercial on a sports
team, and he's on to watching ashow. And I'm just like,
Jack Whitney (19:14):
that's exactly how my partner is too. I
Alesia Galati (19:17):
can't there's commercials on, and then he'll
go back to the other one. AndI'm like, I my brain can't,
like, just give me, like, a fewhours to sit and read something,
and I'll be doing that for hoursand hours on end, right? Or give
me an audio book and 1000 piecepuzzle, and I will do that,
whereas he's next and so, like,our calendar that we have up on
(19:37):
the wall, he's always trying todo it in like, a light color.
And I'm like, I can't see thatfrom far away. You need to
change it, yeah? Because I needto be able to see it in passing.
Putting the kids, okay, when didthe kids have medicine? We put
that on the fridge, on the dryerase board, because that way
whoever is going by and cangoing to the medicine cabinet
can see when did everybody elsehave meds? Because
Jack Whitney (19:58):
if I don't see it, it. Does not exist. Yep,
Alesia Galati (20:03):
there's so many different things that we use,
right, to make our lives betteror easier. And just thinking
about that, that one scene thatyou mentioned where Reid is
talking about how his mom usesthese different tools to try to
manage a house of a ton of kids,right? Like, yeah, totally get
that. But also the compassionthat he has for Ren in that
(20:28):
discussion is just so beautifuland so like, yes, it's okay.
Doesn't have to be such astruggle, even though it feels
like it is. It is not somethingthat is terrible about us. And
so I just, I loved, loved, lovedthat scene, yeah, and how you
created it in a way that waslike, No, I understand what
(20:49):
you're going through. I havepeople in my life who feel that
way too,
Jack Whitney (20:53):
yeah. Now that was really important to me, was for
him to see even with the foodthat she eats or something. He's
seeing these things, and he's, Iknow how you eat. I got you, I
can go get you something. It'sokay. And just such simple, tiny
(21:13):
stuff. And I wanted to make surethat he saw those things,
understood those things, and hewas essentially good to her
about those things, because Iknow that's a really important
thing in any relationship with adisability or neurodivergency or
anything like that. You have tounderstand those little things.
Alesia Galati (21:34):
So why Rockstar?
You could have gone anywherewith the these stories and these
people in any way. Why Rockstar?
How did that appeal to you andwhy do you think it is a good
backdrop for these kinds of moretrauma informed relationships. I
Jack Whitney (21:50):
chose Rockstar just because I love music. When
I was 11 years old, like Rockymusic essentially saved my life.
And again, at 19, like it wasjust, it's always been a thing
that I could listen to andthink, Okay, so I'm not the only
person having these thoughts,and there's always people out
(22:14):
there who are relating to it inthe same exact way, and that was
always my goal is to write somekind of book that someone could
read and go, Wow, this is how soand so's music makes me feel,
and just invoking that emotionalresponse and relating to
(22:38):
something else, like somethingthat The characters going
through like we were talkingabout, and just feeling seen and
heard and you're not alone.
That's just been my thing. And Idon't know, I just love rock
stars. I think that I chose thisfor such like a more trauma
based series, just because musicdoes go into depth with those
(23:01):
thoughts and feelings that noteveryone gets to hear. You may
be struggling with depression oreven thinking about suicide, but
you may not always voice that,and then you hear something in
the music, and it can help. Ijust figured that was a good
(23:24):
backdrop for it. Yeah,
Alesia Galati (23:28):
yeah, I definitely agree. I'm not
someone who grew up listening toa lot of music, and it's the
cult, but I do feel verystrongly in my adulthood that
music has played such animpactful role, especially in
dealing with big life changes,right? So, like, I remember the
few months after my mom passed,there was just like, certain
(23:51):
songs that would play on theradio, or certain songs that I
would have on repeat just tohelp me get through right the
day, or it'll get to workwithout breaking down on the
side of the road because I'msobbing Right? Like, exactly,
yeah, things that really help usemotionally connect with someone
else who understands, hey,you're not alone. I see you. I
(24:12):
understand what you're goingthrough. I've been through
something similar, and I feellike romances do that too in
such a really impactful way. Andyour books? Yeah, Lee, do that
in such an impactful way. Let'stalk about book three, which you
are currently working on, yes,and we'll probably be out soon
after this airs. I've alreadyread chapter one, and I'm like,
(24:35):
Oh my God, but Okay, first ofall, your rock star main
character, because it is an FFromance, correct your rock star,
female main character, she issober for quite some time now,
which I think is such a greatconversation to have, and also a
(24:55):
point of a rock star who'ssober, what? Yeah, right. Yes.
And being able to show up likereally well and have such and
then in book one and two, likethe support around her and her
recovery is just so beautiful,and just their connections as
well as just so beautiful. Andso how Where'd you come up with
that idea, as you were creatingthese characters with
Jack Whitney (25:18):
Bonnie, there was just something about her that I
or something about the band thatI knew. I didn't want them
completely Sex, drugs and rockand roll. And I feel like that's
a stereotype that a lot of rockstar romances get into. And I
(25:39):
didn't want that for young decayat all. I didn't want the
typical other woman drama orthey get high on coke every
night. They've been throughthat. They had their freshman
year fuck ups. They went throughthat they messed up, and they're
(26:01):
okay with bedlam. We actuallyget to go back and see some of
that, because that was when herstalker started coming to her.
We get to come go back and kindof see what drove her to
becoming sober and why that wassuch an important moment for
(26:24):
her? Yeah,
Alesia Galati (26:26):
and I think that it's the way you approach that I
would say all of these topics,is with such care. And they
understand their industry in away that's yes, we're rock
stars, and yes, there's going tobe quote, unquote, temptations
all around but we have oursupport system in place. We know
how to handle and manage thesethings in a way that really
(26:48):
allows us to do our jobs reallywell and also have fun doing our
jobs right. They take theirprofessions so serious that I
think it's it just makes it somuch, such a more beautiful and
less dramatic approach than I'veseen in most of the rock star
(27:09):
romances and even just like thisstuff. And I think that might
actually be why I tend to notlike rock star romances, and
why. But last rock star romanceswere in 2021 is because of that,
a
Jack Whitney (27:23):
few of the people who are, like my regular
readers, whenever I said rockstar romance, they were like,
it's not really my cup of tea,but I guess we're gonna give
this a try. And then they comeback and they're like, oh, okay,
this is better than I thought itwas gonna be. This is different.
Fauci story is it's a littledarker than the first two. As
(27:46):
far as their relationship goes.
It's not sunshine and rainbowsat all, because she is sober,
but she is I feel like you, younever stop fighting that, and
she's not just happyeverything's fine and have no
more trauma. I'm perfect. Blah,blah, blah, no, no, like we're
(28:07):
still battling that. She stilllooks can look at a drink in her
hardest times and have to fightthat urge. And she has her
sponsor that she does call, shehas Reid, is one of her huge
support systems, and he callshim or something like just she
(28:27):
has people around her who can belike, I'm going to support you
no matter what. I'm not going tosit here and tell you absolutely
not I'm going to throw thisdrink in your face or anything,
but I think you know the choicethat you want to make, and that
was important to me too, becauseI never wanted anyone to look at
(28:50):
her and say, You're nothing ifyou take this next drink like
it's it's your choice, but thinkabout What's gonna happen if you
do go down this road again? Youknow what I mean?
Alesia Galati (29:05):
Yeah, I can even think about like, conversations
that I had with my mom where shewould get high and I would be
like, Why, I don't understandwhy. And she would say, I don't
just wake up and say, I'm gonnaget high today. It's not like a
conscious this is what I'm gonnado or this is what I'm gonna
wear today. It doesn't feel likethat. It's an evolution of the
(29:28):
day. It's an evolution of mydepression and my pain and my
the things that I'm strugglingwith that lead me to that that
is what and I'm like, I don'tunderstand, I hear you and I
don't understand. Yeah, I thinkthat the more that I've read in,
like getting in the minds ofcharacters who do struggle with
(29:51):
addiction, or do struggle withsubstance abuse of any kind, or
any addictions, that it isreally allowed me to see. Oh.
Oh, okay, I understand thisbetter, and I understand what
she was going through, and Iwish I would have had that like
knowledge at the time. But thenI think, okay, I didn't have it,
(30:13):
then I have it now. How can Iuse this now to have more
insightful conversations withother people, or to be more
compassionate towards someonewho's struggling, or to maybe
say something to someone who'sbeing less compassionate and
expressing this is probably whatthey're struggling with. And you
wouldn't know unless you werethem, right? No one else knows
(30:33):
unless you're that personstruggling. I love that you're
approaching it, and I like thatyou're also approaching it from
the way of, hey, you get to makethe choice. Either way, it's up
to you. You're the one thatmakes that decision. There's so
many one book I was readingrecently, and I cannot think of
what it was. Oh, nope. Iremember captivated by danger,
by Oh, man. I cannot rememberthe name of the author now,
(30:56):
ADINA, yeah, I will make sureit's in the show notes. But she
was trying to decide if sheshould talk to her very toxic
mother, and if she should havethese conversations. And he was
a DOM, she was a sub, and so shewas looking for him to tell her
what to do. And he was like, I'mnot gonna do that. Yeah, in the
(31:17):
bedroom, sure. Yeah, in this.
This is up to you, like, I'm notgonna tell you yay or nay. This
is something that you have todecide for yourself. You're
looking for me to take thatchoice away from you, and that's
not something I can do, which Ithink was such a really powerful
way to support someone in makinga decision right or wrong for
themselves. Yeah,
Jack Whitney (31:39):
and I even going back to in madness with Andy's
mom I never wanted because shewas also an addict, and that was
her choice not to go get thehelp that she needed, that she
had a daughter who was yellingat her to get the help, and a ex
husband who was yelling at herto get the help, and she never
(32:02):
did that for herself. So withBonnie showing a different side
of it, and that she is gettingthe help, and you know, she's
doing that same struggle, butshe's doing everything she can
to not be that person that sheknows she shouldn't be or the
(32:23):
person that she was at the endof that first tour. Yeah, no,
Alesia Galati (32:29):
so good. And I love your approach to all this.
I think that you're like when Ithought about this podcast and
how I wanted to take a differentapproach toward romance and the
discussions that I think aren'treally being had in either
podcasting space about romancenovels or even about smut as a
(32:49):
whole, and just the power of itto really change our lives, and
how we can reframe trauma insuch a beautiful way through
romance and it helps us heal ashuman beings and as authors and
readers and all of that.
Jack Whitney (33:05):
Yeah, and I feel like romance gets such a bad rap
because of these things thatpeople are looking at, people
will say, like it, it glorifieslike rape or kidnapping or
anything like that. That's notwhat it's doing that is not what
it's doing. There are so many,like essay survivors that read
(33:28):
the dark romance because ithelps them, like control over
the situation. There are somewho don't because of that
reason, and that's why we havetrigger warnings. Yep. And I
wish that more people gave darkromance a chance to see that
it's not glorifying all of thesethings that we absolutely do not
(33:49):
support in real life. Yeah,
Alesia Galati (33:53):
you've got the authors who will have the pre
trigger warnings where they'relike everything in this book. If
it was happening to a real womanin real life, I would tell her
to get the hell out out ofthere. Yes, so this is
fictitious guys, not real. Thisis not healthy at all. It is
simply a fantastical story thatI created.
Jack Whitney (34:13):
Yes, I don't know.
There's just, even if you lookat let's just go with the very
most popular one, hauntingAdeline. And how many people are
actually reading that book andrealizing that it's more than
shock value? I guess you couldsay yeah,
Alesia Galati (34:34):
but because book talk, yeah, I think it steers
too young for me to be, like,interested in like, their
opinions. It's like, Oh, baby,you haven't lived.
Jack Whitney (34:48):
Yeah, I know. I just look at some of those
comments. I'm like, You fourthing, sweet
Alesia Galati (34:53):
summer child.
Exactly. I love it. I think the.
Romance is such a great way tomake a difference in somebody's
life, and I hope that throughthese discussions, people will
see that. But for people who arelike, Yeah, I need these books.
Where can they find you? Get toknow you. Where do you hang out
(35:14):
on social where can they buyyour books?
Jack Whitney (35:16):
All of my books are available on Amazon, and
hopefully by the time this airs,I will have a release date for
madness on Audible. We shallsee. And you can find me on
Patreon, Tiktok, Instagram,Facebook, I think that's all the
(35:37):
things,
Alesia Galati (35:38):
yes, and I highly recommend reading them, you also
have some other books. So ifpeople want to get, like, a
quick synopsis of some of theother series that you have, if
they're like, I'm not sure, Iwant to jump right into the rock
star ones, you have some reallyincredible starter ones that I
think are really good too, foreither fantasy or the really
dark romance, or even thelighter was sweet girl, yeah,
(36:02):
with the arrows one, that one isreally good too, so he can give
us, like a quick rundown of yourbacklog. So
Jack Whitney (36:08):
I have a arrows and psyche reimagining, and that
is called sweet girl. Andfinding you. Sweet girl is a
Valentine's Day novella, andit's probably aside from
madness, it's probably my mostpopular book, and one that I
(36:28):
would say to would probably be agood intro, as long as you are
into really smutty, spicythings, which
Alesia Galati (36:37):
we are here we Read.
Jack Whitney (36:40):
Yeah, exactly, yeah. Start with that one. And
then I have a couple ofnovellas. I have a fall one.
It's like a fall carnival,grumpy sunshine. It's called,
anyone in you break the glass isa Bloody Mary inspired demon,
demon hunter erotica novella.
And then I have Ballad ofnightmares, which the second
(37:04):
part of it come out next fall.
And then that is a paranormalromance, and the main character
is death. The character for thatone
Alesia Galati (37:19):
is chef's kiss. I have it on my shelf here with
all my other dark romance, yeah,
Jack Whitney (37:24):
yeah. The artwork for that one came out amazing. I
can't wait to do some specialeditions for it or something,
because, yeah, it's just gonnabe so esthetically pleasing.
This is my esthetic book, allvibes, all the vibes, yes. And
then I have my dark fantasyseries, which is actually going
(37:46):
to get a huge revamp in 2026,nice, yeah, we are. We're gonna
revamp and re edit, and probablyrecover and all the things
you're just gonna relaunch
Alesia Galati (38:02):
that is exciting.
Yeah, Jack, thanks so much thatthis was such a wonderful
conversation. Thank you so muchfor having it with me and i
Everybody just having goes andreads all of these books,
because they're wonderful andfantastic. Highly recommend you
guys check out the Rock StarSeries and thank again, thank
you so much,
Jack Whitney (38:22):
of course, thank you for having me. You.
Ever wondered how romance can tackle tough topics
(00:02):
like trauma and healing? Tune inas we chat with Jack Whitney
about her books and how they arereframing the narrative around
trauma. Listener discretion isadvised. This podcast contains
mature content intended foradult audiences only. In this
episode, we are talking aboutreframing trauma in romance. So
(00:23):
there are going to be somediscussions around traumatic
things that are happening to themain characters or have happened
to them. For a full list of thetrigger warnings, be sure to
check the podcast show notes orthe video description to make
sure that you are taking care ofyourself and your mental health.
Hi, Jack. I am so excited tohave you on the podcast. So if
(00:46):
you could start by tellingeveryone who you are and a bit
about your books,
Jack Whitney (00:50):
right? I am really excited to be here. My name is
Jack Whitney. I write romanticsuspense, Stark romance, little
bit of paranormal romance inthere. I'm from North Carolina.
That's you
Alesia Galati (01:04):
love it. So I was trying to explain your books to
someone, specifically your rockstar romances. I said it's not
your typical dark romance,because the characters and their
interactions are not dark in anyRight, right, there's maybe a
little mask play and a littlebit of that kind of play, but
(01:25):
it's not anything that's likeaggressive or assertive or what
you typically see in darkromances, but the external
situations are dark, and so it'smore of like a more suspense
type of thing, but that's verydifferent than a lot of, at
least the rock star romancesthat I have read, thinking back
(01:47):
in 2021 and actually, to writethis down, because I was like,
What the heck did I read in 2021it was the dirty Texas series by
Jay a low she's an Australianauthor, and it covers a rock
Star band that travels a lot,and the stories interconnected
in that a lot of their storiesoverlap. So you see the each of
(02:08):
the couples throughout each ofthe books, but there's a lot of
overlap in the stories as well.
So things that you maybe see inbook one you also see happening
in book two. And so it can beit's very interesting, but can
be a little redundant, just fromwhat I remember of reading it.
And then I read a Julia wolfthat was built to fall age gap.
He's a rock star. Terribleimage. She comes in this curvy
(02:31):
younger girl who's trying tohelp him and his PR and make him
look better. And they end upfalling in love. And
everybody's, oh, my god, hecould be her dad, and she's, I
don't care, like, very differentthan your stuff. So I, first and
foremost, I want to talk abouthow trauma informed your books
(02:51):
are. Because without giving toomany spoilers, let's talk first
about book one and thecharacters in there and some of
the baggage that they come tothe book with. Yeah,
Jack Whitney (03:06):
so Andy and Maddox are the two main characters, and
both of them just have reallycrappy, I don't want to say like
really crappy parents, becauseMads does, but Andy, it's her,
like birth mom, that was reallykind of she needed help, and she
(03:27):
wouldn't get it, and it justspiraled into affecting Andy.
Because I don't want tonecessarily say she's a bad
person, because if her mom hadgotten the help that she needed,
then maybe things would havebeen differently for her, but
she didn't get it. But thenMaddox, his dad, was just a
(03:49):
piece of shit, cut and dry, hewas just a piece shit.
Alesia Galati (03:55):
So they're coming to this relationship, right,
especially having grown uptogether, I think, and seeing
that happen to each other, Ithink at that level of intimacy
that you don't have to create,when you're like, Oh, we're
adults, and we're meeting forthe first time. And I hope all
this baggage is no I've beenthere with your baggage, and I
understand, and so created thisunderstanding between the
(04:18):
characters right out the gate ofmy darkness, sees your darkness.
It's like the opposite ofNamaste, but also Namaste,
right? Like ICU, yeah, in like,a really intimate way. And I
feel like that a lot, as someonewho has gone through some really
traumatic stuff, but also isADHD and has these compulsions
to just tell people my lifestory. I don't really care.
(04:41):
Sure. I'll tell you, I grew upin a cult. My mom was an addict
for the majority of my life. Sheoverdosed in 2019 she passed
away like and people are like,wait, wait a minute. Go back
Jack Whitney (04:55):
this up what you're speaking about this very
casually, right? No.
Alesia Galati (05:00):
Yeah, and to have to explain all that to someone,
right? Especially if you're,like, interested in them
romantically, or you'reexploring that can be like,
like, how are they gonna takeit? And are they gonna take it?
So they were able to cometogether in this secretive way,
though, because it's herbrother's best friend, yeah? Who
said, Hey, don't date my sister.
Don't look at her. And he'slike, can't really help myself.
(05:23):
Love that love that trope. Sorryabout that, exactly, but kind of
like this healing that happenswith the characters, and this is
something that I that I thinkyou do really well, is that they
heal together, but not in a waythat's co dependent. They don't
(05:44):
need each other for the rest,like, it'd be great to be
together for the rest of ourlives, but they don't need that
in order to be imperfectlyperfect, right? Like they don't
need that, but they still findhealing and understanding
together. And I think that'sthat you do that in such a
beautiful way. So as you werecreating this experience for
these characters, what were somethings that you wanted to make
(06:06):
sure that you brought into thelike creating something that was
very trauma focused but alsohealing?
Jack Whitney (06:16):
One of the big things I always want for my
characters is for them to beable to exist outside of their
romantic partners. So regardlessof how they feel about each
other and how much they say,You're mine, I'm yours, that
kind of thing, they're stillokay. They still don't need that
(06:39):
other person to come in and savethem from everything. Yes, the
other person can help them seethings. Andy was in therapy
already. And Maddox, I don'tknow about him with therapy
that, but he had really goodfriends and an outlet and things
like that that he was working onhimself with Yeah, Andy
(07:03):
definitely is part of whathelped him keep going. But at
the same time, I know that inhis past, he's had moments where
he had to call Reid and Reed hadto talk him down because he was
didn't know how to see tomorrow,and that's always been important
(07:26):
for me with any of mycharacters. Yeah, I don't know
if that answered. Yeah, no atall it
Alesia Galati (07:33):
does. It does for real. I think that there's just
something so beautiful in that,because when you add in darker
themes in books, not youspecifically, but when authors
add in darker themes into books,they can create more of a co
dependence than which, I mean isa fantasy of like, I don't have
(07:54):
to think about anything, I haveto do anything. I can just exist
in this relationship, andeverything's gonna be fine, and
it's great, but there's still somuch work to do, and I love that
you bring that realness to thecharacters in creating these
relationships that are healthy,but also aren't too fictitious
(08:15):
in the way of this is notachievable for someone who has
trauma. When you came up withthese ideas of the background,
what were some things that kindof inspired you, or were like
your own experience, or thingsthat you've seen that led you to
create these characters in thisway?
Jack Whitney (08:31):
With Maddox, I knew that he was going to be
mass. I wanted to do a Mass RockStar romance. So it started with
there, and I knew I've alwayswanted to do brother's best
friend, so those two wenttogether, but I needed something
like, why is he wearing thismask? I had to figure out, like,
(08:54):
why he was wearing it, and whyhe was still holding on to it,
and even, like, in interviewsand stuff, and not just on stage
as like a stage presence kind ofthing. And then with Andy, I
knew that her and Reed were stepsiblings, and so there had to be
some kind of catalyst as to whythey were step siblings. And I
(09:20):
don't know the it just meshedout to where, like Maddox, had
seen her in her lowest momentsgrowing up, and had watched her
being taken out the door andtried to stop it, and that kind
of thing. And it was just, itjust showed itself in a way that
helped show how much she meantto him, and even, like her
(09:44):
strength in in continuing onwith stuff while that was
happening to her, that helpedhim keep continuing on, too,
because it was, I don't know, Idon't want to say, like, if she
can do it, I can do it, but kindof like that.
Alesia Galati (10:00):
Yeah, I remember, as I was reading, I was like,
oh, man, did this chick watch mychild? Because I come from a
single parent home, they wereconstantly fighting over
custody, constantly fightingover I was there and I have her
this weekend. Or who are youbringing her around? I'm my
(10:20):
dad's only child, but I'm theoldest of five on my mom's side,
and so it was just always thisback and forth that I could
never relate to my siblings onbecause they didn't have the
same dad as me, and then beingthe oldest and having to, like,
protect the kids from my mom'saddiction and like her issues.
And there was just so manydifferent elements of it that I
(10:42):
was like, I feel like she wrotemy story, that i just i It felt
so empowering and to see myselfand like my own trauma, like
different but same, right, likethese feelings are very valid,
and that There is healing andthere is that raging is okay,
(11:03):
like breaking things, or goingto one of those, like, whatever
they're called, where you go tothe room and you, like, just
destroy a bunch of stuff, yeah,and like, they're okay. It's
okay to leave these emotionsout. And so I just, I loved that
you brought all of thosedifferent elements to the story
that even some of them, I waslike, Oh, wow, yeah, that
(11:24):
reminds me of, nope. Haven'tthought of that in a minute.
Whoa. It felt so like beautifulto see that reflected. Is like,
and I think this is somethingthat I've has encouraged people
when they hear my story, islike, you're not alone, right?
So, like, I remember when mysister and I started our first
(11:44):
podcast, which was of all aboutcults and growing up in one and
what it was like. And we got somany DMS, which you wouldn't
think, but we got so many DMS ofpeople saying, me too, I was in
a micro cult. Like, I was in acommunity that was definitely
cult ish or whatever, like somany people could relate, and so
I love that what you've brought,yes, it's romance and it's
(12:07):
fictitious, but there's so manyparts of it that I don't think
people realize how empoweringand powerful romance can be in
allowing us to evolve and growas people. Yeah,
Jack Whitney (12:22):
no, I had probably five other people messaged me
like the same thing, like youwrote my childhood, like I was
Andy, and I'm just like, oh mygod, I'm sorry. I'm so sorry.
But I hope this book helped,right?
Alesia Galati (12:41):
I think it does, I really do, and I think it
helps in such a beautiful way.
So moving on to book two, like,we're not gonna go too much into
like, spoilers for book one, goread the book for sure. Yeah,
but Book Two, Sunshine rockstar, that is, I don't think
I've ever read a sunshine rockstar before, but yeah, Reed's
energy was just off the charts,absolutely, just very golden
(13:06):
retriever energy. Loved it, andthen having the prickly autistic
ADHD,
Unknown (13:16):
you know,
Alesia Galati (13:17):
plant mom on the other side. I think it was just
chef's kiss. So how did that allcome about?
Jack Whitney (13:24):
So I actually so Nicole, we had talked about
having an ADHD FMC, because Iwas discovering that I was ADHD
around the time. I don't wantto. I don't know how long
Nicole's known that she's hadADHD, but
Alesia Galati (13:44):
for anyone who doesn't know or is new, Nicole
is the other part of we readSMUD. But
Jack Whitney (13:52):
like, there was just, like, some things that I
was discovering, I was sharing,and then she would be like,
that's an ADHD thing, right?
Like, the gym boxes and justlike, little stuff like that.
And so I started realizing allthese things. And then my son
was actually going through hisautistic evaluation at the time,
and I was starting to noticemore stuff with that that I
(14:13):
related to. And so I was like, Iguess I'm ADHD too. This
explains a lot. So we had talkedabout doing an ADHD FMC, and it
just fit in perfectly withReed's story, because he is the
(14:33):
golden retriever bouncing offthe wall, very typical ADHD boy,
and then adding in with Rin, herexperience with living like that
is my experience with livingwith it. And so a lot of things
that she has trouble with orstruggles with daily. Those are
(14:58):
things that I struggle withdaily, and writing that
experience out was just socathartic. They just worked out
really well. I knew that she hadto be grumpy and kind of like
have a chip on her shoulder, andshe had to have a big reason for
that why she didn't want to getclose to people, so that kind of
(15:19):
factored into it, but, yeah,they worked out perfectly. I'm
Alesia Galati (15:26):
curious if, for ren's ADHD, and how it showed up
for her, you said the things shestruggles with, and I'm curious
if that opinion changed as youwere writing her. I feel like a
lot of people see themselves andthey're like, Oh, I'm autistic,
where I have ADHD or I havethese struggles. I also have a
(15:47):
son who was diagnosed over thesummer, and saw a lot of my own
things in him, and was like,Okay, this feels like the
beginning of a really crazyjourney. There's definitely
gonna be dragons on it. It'sgonna be an adventure for both
of us, but I feel like I havefound so many coping mechanisms
to manage my day, to manage mytime, to get things done, to not
(16:11):
hyper fixate on things that Ican better support him, and so
reframing how these strugglesright and the things that I know
I'm going to struggle with, orhe's going to struggle with, and
being able to reframe them. Didwriting that character allow you
to personally, or even readers,if they read your book and were
like I saw those and yes, I feellike so much better empowered
(16:34):
that it's okay to have, I don'twant to say crutches, because
they're not crutches, butstructures in place to help us
navigate how our brain works.
Yeah, so,
Jack Whitney (16:46):
like Reed was telling Ren about the magnets
that his mom used to have on thefridge. Yeah, I had seen those
somewhere, and so I actually gotsome of those. It does help me,
because I always forget, likethe laundry, or, Oh, I was
supposed to make something inthe crock pot today, little
(17:07):
things like that. I don't thinkpeople understand how
frustrating those little, teenywhat seems like little things
are just so like, you beatyourself up about it, because it
just feels like it's so easy forsomeone else, and it is a
(17:27):
struggle for me every singleday. And like the biggest thing
that I was actually like tellingmy sister about one day was like
my executive dysfunction on theperiods when I really struggle
with my depression, it's like,even on a day to day basis,
(17:48):
getting into the shower is astruggle for me. But on the days
that I'm in my head and I can'tit is absolutely debilitating,
and that seems like a such asimple thing, but it's not. But
I think that writing thecharacter and then realizing
(18:10):
these things about myself, thatit's okay to have those days
helped me accept that I needmore time to do X, Y and Z. I
need to move the magnets on thefridge, or whatever it might be
like, I need those little thingsto help me cope daily. Sometimes
(18:31):
it feels like I shouldn't needthose things, but I do need
those things because it's likeyou said. You don't want to call
it a crutch, but at the sametime, if it helps you get from A
to B, then you want to use it?
Yeah,
Alesia Galati (18:44):
I couldn't agree more. I have this conversation
with my husband quite regularlybecause I so I'm pretty sure he
has ADHD, but his shows up verydifferent in, like, need to
switch tasks a lot, yeah,whereas I'm more of the autistic
ADHD of like, hyper fixation.
Very lovely to have thatcombination. Yes, he's the kind
(19:05):
of person where it's like, oh,it's a commercial on a sports
team, and he's on to watching ashow. And I'm just like,
Jack Whitney (19:14):
that's exactly how my partner is too. I
Alesia Galati (19:17):
can't there's commercials on, and then he'll
go back to the other one. AndI'm like, I my brain can't,
like, just give me, like, a fewhours to sit and read something,
and I'll be doing that for hoursand hours on end, right? Or give
me an audio book and 1000 piecepuzzle, and I will do that,
whereas he's next and so, like,our calendar that we have up on
(19:37):
the wall, he's always trying todo it in like, a light color.
And I'm like, I can't see thatfrom far away. You need to
change it, yeah? Because I needto be able to see it in passing.
Putting the kids, okay, when didthe kids have medicine? We put
that on the fridge, on the dryerase board, because that way
whoever is going by and cangoing to the medicine cabinet
can see when did everybody elsehave meds? Because
Jack Whitney (19:58):
if I don't see it, it. Does not exist. Yep,
Alesia Galati (20:03):
there's so many different things that we use,
right, to make our lives betteror easier. And just thinking
about that, that one scene thatyou mentioned where Reid is
talking about how his mom usesthese different tools to try to
manage a house of a ton of kids,right? Like, yeah, totally get
that. But also the compassionthat he has for Ren in that
(20:28):
discussion is just so beautifuland so like, yes, it's okay.
Doesn't have to be such astruggle, even though it feels
like it is. It is not somethingthat is terrible about us. And
so I just, I loved, loved, lovedthat scene, yeah, and how you
created it in a way that waslike, No, I understand what
(20:49):
you're going through. I havepeople in my life who feel that
way too,
Jack Whitney (20:53):
yeah. Now that was really important to me, was for
him to see even with the foodthat she eats or something. He's
seeing these things, and he's, Iknow how you eat. I got you, I
can go get you something. It'sokay. And just such simple, tiny
(21:13):
stuff. And I wanted to make surethat he saw those things,
understood those things, and hewas essentially good to her
about those things, because Iknow that's a really important
thing in any relationship with adisability or neurodivergency or
anything like that. You have tounderstand those little things.
Alesia Galati (21:34):
So why Rockstar?
You could have gone anywherewith the these stories and these
people in any way. Why Rockstar?
How did that appeal to you andwhy do you think it is a good
backdrop for these kinds of moretrauma informed relationships. I
Jack Whitney (21:50):
chose Rockstar just because I love music. When
I was 11 years old, like Rockymusic essentially saved my life.
And again, at 19, like it wasjust, it's always been a thing
that I could listen to andthink, Okay, so I'm not the only
person having these thoughts,and there's always people out
(22:14):
there who are relating to it inthe same exact way, and that was
always my goal is to write somekind of book that someone could
read and go, Wow, this is how soand so's music makes me feel,
and just invoking that emotionalresponse and relating to
(22:38):
something else, like somethingthat The characters going
through like we were talkingabout, and just feeling seen and
heard and you're not alone.
That's just been my thing. And Idon't know, I just love rock
stars. I think that I chose thisfor such like a more trauma
based series, just because musicdoes go into depth with those
(23:01):
thoughts and feelings that noteveryone gets to hear. You may
be struggling with depression oreven thinking about suicide, but
you may not always voice that,and then you hear something in
the music, and it can help. Ijust figured that was a good
(23:24):
backdrop for it. Yeah,
Alesia Galati (23:28):
yeah, I definitely agree. I'm not
someone who grew up listening toa lot of music, and it's the
cult, but I do feel verystrongly in my adulthood that
music has played such animpactful role, especially in
dealing with big life changes,right? So, like, I remember the
few months after my mom passed,there was just like, certain
(23:51):
songs that would play on theradio, or certain songs that I
would have on repeat just tohelp me get through right the
day, or it'll get to workwithout breaking down on the
side of the road because I'msobbing Right? Like, exactly,
yeah, things that really help usemotionally connect with someone
else who understands, hey,you're not alone. I see you. I
(24:12):
understand what you're goingthrough. I've been through
something similar, and I feellike romances do that too in
such a really impactful way. Andyour books? Yeah, Lee, do that
in such an impactful way. Let'stalk about book three, which you
are currently working on, yes,and we'll probably be out soon
after this airs. I've alreadyread chapter one, and I'm like,
(24:35):
Oh my God, but Okay, first ofall, your rock star main
character, because it is an FFromance, correct your rock star,
female main character, she issober for quite some time now,
which I think is such a greatconversation to have, and also a
(24:55):
point of a rock star who'ssober, what? Yeah, right. Yes.
And being able to show up likereally well and have such and
then in book one and two, likethe support around her and her
recovery is just so beautiful,and just their connections as
well as just so beautiful. Andso how Where'd you come up with
that idea, as you were creatingthese characters with
Jack Whitney (25:18):
Bonnie, there was just something about her that I
or something about the band thatI knew. I didn't want them
completely Sex, drugs and rockand roll. And I feel like that's
a stereotype that a lot of rockstar romances get into. And I
(25:39):
didn't want that for young decayat all. I didn't want the
typical other woman drama orthey get high on coke every
night. They've been throughthat. They had their freshman
year fuck ups. They went throughthat they messed up, and they're
(26:01):
okay with bedlam. We actuallyget to go back and see some of
that, because that was when herstalker started coming to her.
We get to come go back and kindof see what drove her to
becoming sober and why that wassuch an important moment for
(26:24):
her? Yeah,
Alesia Galati (26:26):
and I think that it's the way you approach that I
would say all of these topics,is with such care. And they
understand their industry in away that's yes, we're rock
stars, and yes, there's going tobe quote, unquote, temptations
all around but we have oursupport system in place. We know
how to handle and manage thesethings in a way that really
(26:48):
allows us to do our jobs reallywell and also have fun doing our
jobs right. They take theirprofessions so serious that I
think it's it just makes it somuch, such a more beautiful and
less dramatic approach than I'veseen in most of the rock star
(27:09):
romances and even just like thisstuff. And I think that might
actually be why I tend to notlike rock star romances, and
why. But last rock star romanceswere in 2021 is because of that,
a
Jack Whitney (27:23):
few of the people who are, like my regular
readers, whenever I said rockstar romance, they were like,
it's not really my cup of tea,but I guess we're gonna give
this a try. And then they comeback and they're like, oh, okay,
this is better than I thought itwas gonna be. This is different.
Fauci story is it's a littledarker than the first two. As
(27:46):
far as their relationship goes.
It's not sunshine and rainbowsat all, because she is sober,
but she is I feel like you, younever stop fighting that, and
she's not just happyeverything's fine and have no
more trauma. I'm perfect. Blah,blah, blah, no, no, like we're
(28:07):
still battling that. She stilllooks can look at a drink in her
hardest times and have to fightthat urge. And she has her
sponsor that she does call, shehas Reid, is one of her huge
support systems, and he callshim or something like just she
(28:27):
has people around her who can belike, I'm going to support you
no matter what. I'm not going tosit here and tell you absolutely
not I'm going to throw thisdrink in your face or anything,
but I think you know the choicethat you want to make, and that
was important to me too, becauseI never wanted anyone to look at
(28:50):
her and say, You're nothing ifyou take this next drink like
it's it's your choice, but thinkabout What's gonna happen if you
do go down this road again? Youknow what I mean?
Alesia Galati (29:05):
Yeah, I can even think about like, conversations
that I had with my mom where shewould get high and I would be
like, Why, I don't understandwhy. And she would say, I don't
just wake up and say, I'm gonnaget high today. It's not like a
conscious this is what I'm gonnado or this is what I'm gonna
wear today. It doesn't feel likethat. It's an evolution of the
(29:28):
day. It's an evolution of mydepression and my pain and my
the things that I'm strugglingwith that lead me to that that
is what and I'm like, I don'tunderstand, I hear you and I
don't understand. Yeah, I thinkthat the more that I've read in,
like getting in the minds ofcharacters who do struggle with
(29:51):
addiction, or do struggle withsubstance abuse of any kind, or
any addictions, that it isreally allowed me to see. Oh.
Oh, okay, I understand thisbetter, and I understand what
she was going through, and Iwish I would have had that like
knowledge at the time. But thenI think, okay, I didn't have it,
(30:13):
then I have it now. How can Iuse this now to have more
insightful conversations withother people, or to be more
compassionate towards someonewho's struggling, or to maybe
say something to someone who'sbeing less compassionate and
expressing this is probably whatthey're struggling with. And you
wouldn't know unless you werethem, right? No one else knows
(30:33):
unless you're that personstruggling. I love that you're
approaching it, and I like thatyou're also approaching it from
the way of, hey, you get to makethe choice. Either way, it's up
to you. You're the one thatmakes that decision. There's so
many one book I was readingrecently, and I cannot think of
what it was. Oh, nope. Iremember captivated by danger,
by Oh, man. I cannot rememberthe name of the author now,
(30:56):
ADINA, yeah, I will make sureit's in the show notes. But she
was trying to decide if sheshould talk to her very toxic
mother, and if she should havethese conversations. And he was
a DOM, she was a sub, and so shewas looking for him to tell her
what to do. And he was like, I'mnot gonna do that. Yeah, in the
(31:17):
bedroom, sure. Yeah, in this.
This is up to you, like, I'm notgonna tell you yay or nay. This
is something that you have todecide for yourself. You're
looking for me to take thatchoice away from you, and that's
not something I can do, which Ithink was such a really powerful
way to support someone in makinga decision right or wrong for
themselves. Yeah,
Jack Whitney (31:39):
and I even going back to in madness with Andy's
mom I never wanted because shewas also an addict, and that was
her choice not to go get thehelp that she needed, that she
had a daughter who was yellingat her to get the help, and a ex
husband who was yelling at herto get the help, and she never
(32:02):
did that for herself. So withBonnie showing a different side
of it, and that she is gettingthe help, and you know, she's
doing that same struggle, butshe's doing everything she can
to not be that person that sheknows she shouldn't be or the
(32:23):
person that she was at the endof that first tour. Yeah, no,
Alesia Galati (32:29):
so good. And I love your approach to all this.
I think that you're like when Ithought about this podcast and
how I wanted to take a differentapproach toward romance and the
discussions that I think aren'treally being had in either
podcasting space about romancenovels or even about smut as a
(32:49):
whole, and just the power of itto really change our lives, and
how we can reframe trauma insuch a beautiful way through
romance and it helps us heal ashuman beings and as authors and
readers and all of that.
Jack Whitney (33:05):
Yeah, and I feel like romance gets such a bad rap
because of these things thatpeople are looking at, people
will say, like it, it glorifieslike rape or kidnapping or
anything like that. That's notwhat it's doing that is not what
it's doing. There are so many,like essay survivors that read
(33:28):
the dark romance because ithelps them, like control over
the situation. There are somewho don't because of that
reason, and that's why we havetrigger warnings. Yep. And I
wish that more people gave darkromance a chance to see that
it's not glorifying all of thesethings that we absolutely do not
(33:49):
support in real life. Yeah,
Alesia Galati (33:53):
you've got the authors who will have the pre
trigger warnings where they'relike everything in this book. If
it was happening to a real womanin real life, I would tell her
to get the hell out out ofthere. Yes, so this is
fictitious guys, not real. Thisis not healthy at all. It is
simply a fantastical story thatI created.
Jack Whitney (34:13):
Yes, I don't know.
There's just, even if you lookat let's just go with the very
most popular one, hauntingAdeline. And how many people are
actually reading that book andrealizing that it's more than
shock value? I guess you couldsay yeah,
Alesia Galati (34:34):
but because book talk, yeah, I think it steers
too young for me to be, like,interested in like, their
opinions. It's like, Oh, baby,you haven't lived.
Jack Whitney (34:48):
Yeah, I know. I just look at some of those
comments. I'm like, You fourthing, sweet
Alesia Galati (34:53):
summer child.
Exactly. I love it. I think the.
Romance is such a great way tomake a difference in somebody's
life, and I hope that throughthese discussions, people will
see that. But for people who arelike, Yeah, I need these books.
Where can they find you? Get toknow you. Where do you hang out
(35:14):
on social where can they buyyour books?
Jack Whitney (35:16):
All of my books are available on Amazon, and
hopefully by the time this airs,I will have a release date for
madness on Audible. We shallsee. And you can find me on
Patreon, Tiktok, Instagram,Facebook, I think that's all the
(35:37):
things,
Alesia Galati (35:38):
yes, and I highly recommend reading them, you also
have some other books. So ifpeople want to get, like, a
quick synopsis of some of theother series that you have, if
they're like, I'm not sure, Iwant to jump right into the rock
star ones, you have some reallyincredible starter ones that I
think are really good too, foreither fantasy or the really
dark romance, or even thelighter was sweet girl, yeah,
(36:02):
with the arrows one, that one isreally good too, so he can give
us, like a quick rundown of yourbacklog. So
Jack Whitney (36:08):
I have a arrows and psyche reimagining, and that
is called sweet girl. Andfinding you. Sweet girl is a
Valentine's Day novella, andit's probably aside from
madness, it's probably my mostpopular book, and one that I
(36:28):
would say to would probably be agood intro, as long as you are
into really smutty, spicythings, which
Alesia Galati (36:37):
we are here we Read.
Jack Whitney (36:40):
Yeah, exactly, yeah. Start with that one. And
then I have a couple ofnovellas. I have a fall one.
It's like a fall carnival,grumpy sunshine. It's called,
anyone in you break the glass isa Bloody Mary inspired demon,
demon hunter erotica novella.
And then I have Ballad ofnightmares, which the second
(37:04):
part of it come out next fall.
And then that is a paranormalromance, and the main character
is death. The character for thatone
Alesia Galati (37:19):
is chef's kiss. I have it on my shelf here with
all my other dark romance, yeah,
Jack Whitney (37:24):
yeah. The artwork for that one came out amazing. I
can't wait to do some specialeditions for it or something,
because, yeah, it's just gonnabe so esthetically pleasing.
This is my esthetic book, allvibes, all the vibes, yes. And
then I have my dark fantasyseries, which is actually going
(37:46):
to get a huge revamp in 2026,nice, yeah, we are. We're gonna
revamp and re edit, and probablyrecover and all the things
you're just gonna relaunch
Alesia Galati (38:02):
that is exciting.
Yeah, Jack, thanks so much thatthis was such a wonderful
conversation. Thank you so muchfor having it with me and i
Everybody just having goes andreads all of these books,
because they're wonderful andfantastic. Highly recommend you
guys check out the Rock StarSeries and thank again, thank
you so much,
Jack Whitney (38:22):
of course, thank you for having me. You.
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