June 6, 2025 • 54 mins
Healer Dionne Eleanor joins us to discuss her unique healing method for trauma with the trifecta of the body, the mind, and relationships. We talk about our common background starting off as yoga teachers, what her method involves, and share some about how we run our businesses.
You’ll get some solid advice around how to find a good practitioner to help you on your healing journey.
Bonus: You’ll finally find out why Dr. Liz doesn’t have a professional FB page and what happened to her business after she deleted it.
About Dionne Eleanor
Dionne Eleanor is a global leader in integrative wellness and trauma-informed healing, known for her work in helping individuals heal emotional wounds and cultivate empowerment. She is the founder of The Body Sage Method and has over 14 years of international experience helping others heal. Dionne’s approach blends various techniques like Rapid Transformational Therapy (RTT) hypnosis, intergenerational trauma and ancestral healing, tantric philosophy, and somatic practices.
Contact Dionne at https://www.bodysageco.com
IG & Linked In: @DionneEleanor
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About Dr. Liz
Interested in hypnosis with Dr. Liz? Schedule your free consultation at https://www.drlizhypnosis.com
Winner of numerous awards including Top 100 Moms in Business, Dr. Liz provides psychotherapy, hypnosis, and neurodivergent supportive psychotherapy to people all around the world. She has a PhD in Clinical Psychology, is a Licensed Mental Health Counselor (LMHC) and has special certification in Hypnosis and Hypnotherapy. Specialty areas include Anxiety, Insomnia, and Deeper Emotional Healing.
A problem shared is a problem halved. In person and online hypnosis and CBT for healing and transformation.
Listened to in over 140 countries, Hypnotize Me is the podcast about hypnosis, transformation, and healing. Certified hypnotherapist and Licensed Mental Health Counselor, Dr. Liz Bonet, discusses hypnosis and interviews professionals doing transformational work.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Dr. Liz (00:00):
Hey everyone.
Dr Liz, here I do not quite sound like
myself because I am recovering from
pneumonia the past 10 days so there has
been a little bit of a delay on the podcast
getting episodes out.
But I finally have a little energy back and
I wanted to air the interview I did with
Dionne Eleanor.
(00:21):
She is lovely and we talk all about her
body sage method as well as wander into
some business topics and some things that
happened to us in our personal lives.
So I hope you enjoy the interview as much
as I enjoyed speaking with her.
Hope you're healthy and safe Peace.
(00:43):
I hope you're healthy and safe Peace.
Dionne Eleanor (00:53):
Hi Dionne, welcome to the Hypnotize Me
podcast.
Hello, nice to be here.
Dr. Liz (00:55):
Yeah, I'm so glad we finally connected.
We had a couple of reschedules in here
because of both of our busy busy schedules,
but finally, we're here together yes.
So why don't you let the audience know um a
little bit about yourself and then how it
led to the method that you've created, the
(01:15):
body sage method?
Dionne Eleanor (01:18):
okay, well, thank you.
So, um, yeah, for those listening, my name
is Dionne Eleanor.
I was born in the UK from parents that I
would say are dominantly from the Caribbean,
so I would be considered first or first and
a half generation born in the UK, and I
(01:39):
share that because I think it has a
significant part of the work that I've
ended up doing today being very much
focused around trauma-informed healing and
integrative wellness.
So the Body Sage Method, or the Body Sage,
is my organization, and the Body Sage
Method is really a combination of using
(01:59):
rapid transformation therapy, which is a
form of hypnotherapy, and combining that
with somatic work and relationship skills
training.
You know it's for me.
I don't really feel like I've created the
method.
I've just put things together in a very
specific way and called it my.
You know, called it my own, because there
is an order and a sequence to the way that
(02:21):
I work.
But I do want to give a lot of respect to
my mentors that have, you know, taught me
the original modalities, and I think that's
the way life goes right, where we are
constantly evolving through case study,
through research and through testing how
things can help people, and so, with that,
then, my focus is predominantly on women.
(02:45):
I would say women 35 to 45, sometimes a
little bit older, sometimes a little bit
younger, and then I work with them and then
I also work with their partners.
So again, this comes back to why I call it
a specific method.
So, rather than just doing the work with
women, I integrate partner work or
potential partner work, if they're dated as
(03:07):
part of the system, and my focus really is
on helping women that have had some type of
significant trauma or change connected with
their bodies, especially around child
release.
And I use child release very intentionally
because there's a huge focus in our world
(03:29):
still on childbirth and I think it's still
a little bit of a taboo about things like
miscarriage, abortion and child loss, and
so I really support women in all of those
areas, and saying child release rather than
childbirth and loss just makes it easier to
contain in in one sentence work with the
(03:50):
women for a period of time in an area of
empowerment and combination of.
We'll work together alternate weeks, and
one week we'll work with the mind, one week
we'll work with the body and then, after a
certain period of time, then we'll work
with the mind.
One week we'll work with the body and then,
after a certain period of time, then we'll
start to integrate work with the partner so
that if they are in a relationship or they
(04:10):
want to be in a relationship, so they're
not kind of going on this upward trajectory
and evolving and their partner feels left
behind, or then they've got issues then
relating and integrating with the world um
around them.
Dr. Liz (04:23):
So um, do you find the partners are very
willing to do this with them, or do you
have to sometimes, let's say, encourage
them?
Dionne Eleanor (04:36):
yeah, I mean it really is case by case.
I would say that a lot of the time, um, in
my experience, uh, the, the couples you
know, when it comes to couples work, the
partners being quite willing, um, and maybe,
like a site had a silent desire, um, but
the hurdle comes with just making sure that
(04:57):
that partner feels that there's a trust
there and that I'm not going to just side
with the female partner, especially because
I'm in a female body and because they know
that I've done a certain degree of work
with the partner already.
And so the way that I address that is
through clear guidelines written in black
and white before the clients work with me,
(05:20):
about boundaries, about consent, about
what's shared, what is not, when it's
shared, when it's not.
And then I do have one-on-one sessions with.
Usually I'm working with heterosexual
couples, not always I have worked with
people of different sexual orientations and
with that then we're just looking at
polarity, because there's masculine and
feminine energy in everybody, right, and so
(05:43):
it's just building that trust and having
those one-on-one sessions with them so that
they've got time to share things that they
wouldn't necessarily share in the sessions
when their partner is present.
And usually it happens all the time both
ways, but definitely for the masculine
partner they're a little bit more reserved
to share some things.
And then what I can do is from those
(06:04):
one-on-one sessions I can gracefully and
artfully weave in some couples work that I
focused on resolving some of the challenges
that he might face.
Dr. Liz (06:16):
Okay, Got it?
Where does your couples training come from?
Did you train originally in couples and
then this evolved as part of this method?
Or or you just found like, oh, this is
really necessary part of the work that I'm
doing yeah, I would say that it's.
Dionne Eleanor (06:34):
It's a case that I found that was really
necessary.
Before starting this, I my very first
wellness modality was actually teaching
yoga, so a lot of people know me around the
world for teaching yoga and meditation, and
before that I was in corporate and so that
gave me a good foundation of awareness of
the body, mindfulness and just getting into
(06:55):
the industry in general.
It was never my intention actually.
I just fell in love with it, became
obsessed with it because of how it helped
me heal my own self from spinal disorders
and different things, and then started
doing it more.
And then as I was working as a teacher and
as I was practicing, I started to feel like
(07:15):
why are all these amazing people single or
having relationship issues, like they're
good people, they are working on themselves,
they say that they have good morals and all
of this.
So I started to get really interested in in
relationships and I'd always had a little
bit of a interest in relationships and
sexuality.
(07:35):
I remember as a child I used to study I
mean not study but look up anatomy parts
and I was fascinated by my parents
relationship and their sex life, which
seemed.
If I look back now I don't know if my
memory is totally accurate, but like they
seem to have a good time.
And so I was just really intrigued by love
and by relationships in general, and so I
(07:57):
already had that passion there.
And then I did some studies with Layla
Martin, who has a certification in
relationship, sexuality and Tantra coaching.
I also studied with a mentor who's based in
Leila Martin's based in the US, studied
with a mentor in Portugal, peter Littlejohn
(08:18):
Cook, and that was focused on Tantra, and
then I did some workshops and trainings
with Jason Gaddis, who is the founder of
the Relationship School.
I believe he is based out of Colorado, and
that was really based on more relationship
psychology and skills training, and so
those are just to name a few.
But it's, I find, with relationships are
(08:39):
definitely, it's definitely an art and an
ongoing study and I think, combined with my
passion and these educational areas, that's
what gave me the foundation.
I did also study psychology, not degree
level, but a level we call it in the UK, so
I had a bit of foundation there in terms of
(08:59):
the way that my in general and in
relationships.
Dr. Liz (09:03):
Yeah, how did you discover the RTT training?
Because it's a very specific certification
method, something like within hypnosis.
So how did you yeah?
Dionne Eleanor (09:17):
I think it was phones, listening and seeing
an advertisement and then clicking through
and I I mean, how would I describe myself
as a purchaser?
I think I'm one of the.
I'm one of those people that I have great
intuition.
I do trust my intuition, but I still I'm
(09:39):
very happy that I can speed read because I
definitely still love to check terms and
conditions, refund policy, ask all the
difficult questions.
So it wasn't a quick decision.
But what I was really drawn to with RTT was
I think I had a bias because Marissa Peer,
who founded it, she's from the UK, so
there's definitely there.
But I was also drawn to the fact that of
(10:03):
the results, it said that you know talking
about rapid results because no matter how
much you try and encourage people that you
work with that, things take time.
They always want things quicker.
So I was very intrigued by being able to
bring in a method that might help speed
things up for people that just don't have
that time or don't feel they have that time.
Yes, I was also intrigued by the fact that
(10:24):
there was cognitive behavioral therapy
intertwined in the into the technique,
which I feel is really important and gave a
solid foundation, and then also the
neuro-linguistic programming, changing the
language, it felt quite comprehensive.
And then, looking at the way that the
course was led at that time and not when I
(10:46):
started my course, but after I had started
and I was continuing learning and the CPD
part after I got my certification it was
pandemic time, and so I really appreciated
how there was this up-to-date how would you
call it up-to-date initiative from the team
at Marissa Peer to say, okay, how can we
bring this online in a safe way, in an
(11:06):
effective way, in a way where we're not
making false promises, do they?
Do people need more sessions?
So it felt it felt really, really, um good,
and it also felt really balanced that there
wasn't these false promises like, oh,
you're going to be a hypnotist and then
you're going to save people from this, and
that it was very the way that it was.
(11:29):
I was spoken to about and sold to.
You could say about.
It was in a very grounded way, so so that
gave me trust in sort of taking it on board
as another.
Dr. Liz (11:39):
I am part of a Facebook group like women in
hypnosis.
It's only women in that group and she
consistently gets rave reviews for
programming, her training, yeah, and her
techniques.
Actually, like people will reference her
techniques all the time because, yeah, well,
we'll post questions what I do in this case,
(11:59):
or something like that.
Dionne Eleanor (12:00):
And yeah, consistently they were yeah yeah,
she really I would say she really also
embodies her work right like she's so,
she's confident, but she admits when she's
not confident and she's a realist about you
know about things and really encouraging
people to step into an edge but also do
(12:21):
things safely and know when to safeguard,
know when to signpost, making sure that you
actually practice like live.
You know live real sessions and then you
know when I was studying it was working
with people on real issues and then having
those, you know it felt so laughing because
I remember feeling like the fear at the
(12:43):
time but having the videos analyzed and the
script analyzed, and to every detail, you
know, oh, your voice.
I think one of the feedback I had was that
my voice was a little too happy and I was
like but I like my voice, you know.
So you know and I you know just real,
honest, grounded feedback.
You know just real, honest, grounded
feedback.
(13:12):
And I think actually when I was coming
towards the end of my actual certification
and the time there wasn't this rush,
because obviously they have a vested
interest to certify people right in terms
of incentives, but I remember being very
close to that deadline and getting feedback
that I still I had a little bit of work to
do like a quite a bit of work to do, like I
passed everything.
I could tick all the boxes, but if I wanted
(13:32):
to really get the deep transformation that
I wanted to get for people, especially with
complex issues like severe trauma and PTSD,
I do need to make sure that I work on this.
And there was this offering from one of the
mentors within the team for me to even have
even more practice experience, and I really
like that because it would have been so
easy for them to have said you've done your
(13:52):
certification, keep practicing.
There you go.
I did get my certification, but it was, you
know, there was also very you know, very
clear and healthy responsibility there.
Dr. Liz (14:05):
Fantastic.
It's good to hear.
Yeah, yeah, I imagine it.
It was quite a nice integration with your
yoga experience.
I taught yoga for 20 years and hypnosis is
far more about the body.
I think that people realize like, yeah,
think about hypnosis, they think about just
the body.
I think than people realize Like, yeah,
think about hypnosis, they think about just
(14:26):
the mind, like I'm going to use my mind to,
you know, get very.
Sometimes it's not so quick, but that's
often the desire to get a quick response.
It often is the result, but sometimes it's
a little bit, you know, slower than quick,
let's say, or it takes a little bit longer
than that, but typically it's like the
(14:47):
transformation that occurs is not just the
mind, it's the body as well.
Dionne Eleanor (14:52):
Yeah, definitely, I've seen that the way
people stand after a session even if you've
not worked on something to do with their
posture like they stand differently, their
eyes are different.
One of my coolest memories with hypnosis
very, very early once had qualified in it
and started working I had a client that
wanted me to help him to stop smoking, and
(15:14):
so, part of the visualization when I was
doing the rewire of the belief, I had him
walk through a town that was full of smoke
and everything like that, things burning
down, and when he woke up, he had not
cognitively remembered.
You know.
You know, some people remember, some people
don't.
Yeah, it's like I just feel like I don't
know where I went.
(15:34):
I feel really good, though, but I said I
just feel like my eyes are burning and like
I've been walking through the fire and I
was like, well, you kind of have you know,
um, and his eyes were a little bit red and
so, and actually at this point I think it's
important maybe for the listeners is maybe
something that you've mentioned already,
because one of the things I have come up
(15:56):
with with hypnosis with new clients is fear
about forgetting or not knowing what's
going on.
And yeah, um, I was always trained to make
sure that there was a prompt in there for
people to keep themselves safe, that like
if they hear anything that they can,
they're in control, that they can come out
at any time and things like that.
And it really is, you know, repeated so
(16:17):
that people know that I'm not adding one
come out of hypnosis, but I have, you know,
I've had someone say I don't want to answer
that Right, and so there is.
You know, people do have control in that
space, yeah absolutely yes, and it depends
what type we're doing.
Dr. Liz (16:31):
But often when we're doing some habit,
change things, it's recorded.
And so I say you can always go back and
listen to the recording.
Sometimes, when we're doing, let's say,
deeper work, or we're changing beliefs or
going back in time, which we call
regression, that's not recorded.
But if someone wants me to, I absolutely
will like if they, so that they can listen.
(16:54):
It's an absolute yes, like absolutely yeah,
so that you can be safe, so that, yeah, I'm
doing my job here totally, totally fine.
And you know, it's not something that I
take personally.
That's, people have a different levels of
trust, that based on their own history in
life.
So, yeah, it's a good point to bring up,
(17:16):
yeah, so the body sage method.
Can you tell us more about your actual
method?
Dionne Eleanor (17:24):
I typically work with people for a minimum
of three months, sometimes six.
When somebody is very new, let's say new.
When I say very new, like I've never had
any contact with them before, I usually do
suggest three months for the purity of
safety.
Sometimes I'll suggest six months if I see
it's a very big issue, multiple issues,
(17:45):
yeah, but I usually ask for a three-month
window just so there's space for the
sessions, space for integration and
questions in between and to fit the partner
in there as well, because it's really not a
lot of time, um, even three months, you
know when you're working with someone by
bi-weekly, I either work bi-weekly or, if
somebody's got a little bit more um
(18:05):
challenges and I'll do a session every 10
days.
So they'll have three sessions in the month.
Um, the first week actually, I say
bi-weekly, but the first week we have two
sessions.
So we're really like hitting the ground,
running um and doing.
I tie in ritual work as well.
So we're open with a ceremonial way where I
(18:25):
have a script that I design that's
personalized for the person that was
stepping into a new area of their life, of
transformation, that they commit to it
fully, and so on.
I put them in a meditative, but not
hypnotic state for that, and the work that
I'm doing with the method is predominantly
online, but sometimes people do come in
(18:47):
person for some intensive three days or or
mini retreats as well.
Following that, then we'll rotate between
sessions that are based on the I call body
weeks, somatic weeks, and then brain weeks,
which they get the chance to.
With the brain weeks we'll get in the
chance to actually talk and do the
(19:08):
relationship skills training and and
mentoring.
I said mentoring rather than coaching
because my method is really focused on
after the period of time that we've worked
together, you've got your own tools and
system in place that you're not needing to
constantly have um therapy or with me or
any sessions with me, that you can sort of
go and live your life um, whereas coaching
(19:30):
is a little bit more motivational and
focused on keeping us going.
So I'm really like trying to teach those
skills, give them those resources, those
recordings if they want.
So in the brain weeks where we are, we've
got relationship skills training, anything
that they come up with.
But I do have a focal point, usually, so,
(19:50):
going back a step, when I have a
consultation with somebody, a woman that
I'm working with, I will listen deeply and
see what is it that she actually feels that
she wants to resolve in her life.
So maybe usually there's multiple things.
I'm feeling disconnected from my body.
I want to lose a certain amount of weight.
(20:11):
These are the common areas.
I'm feeling disconnected in my sexuality
and from my partner.
We're okay, but there's friction and I'm
scared about the relationship future.
Maybe they've got something that they're
feeling a bit disconnected from their own
sense of purpose and legacy and what
they're here to do.
They don't just want to be defined as a
(20:32):
mother or somebody who's gone through the
trauma that they've gone through.
And so then I'll bullet, point out and say
that these are the areas that we're going
to focus on and and I'll reverse them into
a positive statement.
So let's say, if the lady says she wants to
lose 20 pounds, so we we might say OK, by X
time we are going to commit to losing this
(20:55):
amount of weight.
This is the goal in our time working
together.
And the other goal is to have relationship
safety again, feel good in your body, have
good boundaries with your partner.
So I'll reverse them and then I'm fast
forwarding now, but at the end of the
period we will review those and see what
actually has been achieved.
So it keeps me accountable as well as the
(21:16):
client and I do.
I, behind the scenes, I'm reviewing mid as
well, and periodic to make sure that I'm
actually getting the results.
Of course In the body weeks we have
somatics.
Of course In the body weeks we have
somatics.
Again, it's personalized.
Now that I'm serving more people it's still
personalized, but I would definitely say
(21:37):
that I'm seeing patterns so I'm able then
to give myself some grace and reuse certain
things that I can see working.
But the somatics can be somatic therapy,
sort of shaking the body, the trauma
release exercise where you're shaking.
It can also be mindful movement.
Some people know that I'm qualified in yoga,
(21:58):
so they really request yoga and then it's a
mindful yoga movement.
And then we're also doing breath work and
vocal work as well.
Doing breath work and vocal work as well
vocal empowerment exercises A lot of the
women that I am working with.
(22:18):
They have challenges with speaking up with
confidence and maybe they feel that they've
gained a certain level of empowerment, but
then it's now moving it out into the world
and that's all part of the relationship as
well.
Going back to the brain, the only other
thing that I do also include is ancestral
intergenerational trauma work and it's case
by case.
I do offer some people if I see there's a
(22:39):
lot of complexity in family dynamics bonus
sessions where the mother can have a
session with let's say, it's me, the
daughter and the mother, so we can really
do some healing on that relationship.
Or maybe it's a specific child that they're
having challenges with, so call them family
sos sessions.
Um, love it.
Yeah.
So it's really an integrative approach
(23:01):
where we're involving all the key people,
but definitely the, the partner and then
any key people that there's challenges for
that are really affecting that woman.
Moving forward, one of my favorite moments
was working with a lady and she booked with
me for six months during that time.
She said it was, it was four and a half
months and she said I'm starting to feel
(23:23):
like I don't need you and I don't know if
I'm going to renew.
And I said well, don't worry, I was, you
know, because she had coached him before
and so she knows that typically I've also
received coaching and there's nothing wrong
with it.
But typically before when you come into the
end of your container, you do get reminders
that you can renew.
It's normal and I think it's very healthy.
Yeah that coach is and or mentor is
(23:43):
proactive, because sometimes we will just
slip off and back into our own habits,
right?
So, yeah, yeah, so, um, and I was like
that's great, and she was like, really, I
was like, exactly, that is, that is what I
want to happen.
If you're genuinely feeling that way and
let's keep making sure you're getting the
results, um, that you want.
Hypnosis fits into the brain weeks, but I
(24:04):
sort of do them separately, because the
rapid transformation hypnosis is a
three-hour session and it tends to come
later in the package.
If it's six months, they get two, if it's
three months they get one, and then we'll
either work on it's case by case it might
be the same issue if they get into hypnosis
sessions, it depends on how deeply rooted
(24:24):
it is or if something comes up after the
first or it might be two separate things
and we decide that, um, a little bit.
We have an idea at the beginning of the
relationship, working relationship, but we
might also tweak it, um throughout, um, and
then the couples integration.
That also comes in the final month of the
(24:44):
three month container or the final two
months, and then they'll get one session a
month, typically with their partner, unless
there's some deep issues, and then we just
do an add-on.
It works really well that way, because I
find that again we're looking at the.
I've built the trust with them so they can
go into that deep space.
They can also commit that time and carve it
(25:04):
out, because that's getting someone up
front three hours and then listen to
something each day, and then it also gives
them a continuum as well, um, and so the
noses will usually come in the three-month
container three weeks before they finished
working with me so they'll listen to the
recording for definitely, whilst I'm still
(25:24):
with them, and then they'll still be
listening to it hopefully after, and then I
usually check in with people after they've
finished the container work with me just to
see how they are, see if there's anything
that I can offer them in terms of resources
that they've lost, that I've sent them,
just that little bit of aftercare that I
think sometimes is missing, not
(25:46):
intentionally.
Again, I really believe there's a lot of us
are out there doing, you know, the best
that we can and we're just trying to
develop like systems of.
Sometimes for some people they do need that
little bit of checking in.
A lot of women I don't know about you, but
they common feelings are feeling invisible,
feeling unseen, alone, and so them knowing
(26:07):
that I do, because I do I generally care,
um, what's going on after they've finished
working with me, and they don't need to
sign up to anything, you know, they don't
need to spend another dollar for me to like
really know they're okay, is, um, it's
really important yeah, absolutely.
Dr. Liz (26:24):
In my own practice, since I hold a license,
we actually have some um, let's say,
guidelines around, like we're not allowed
to check on people after we finish working
with them unless we have their permission
to do that.
And so sometimes that's how I put it like
would you like for me to check on you?
And in a month or so?
Because I can't do that unless we make the
(26:46):
agreement for that.
But it's often very, very helpful, helpful,
I would say.
The majority of the time people say yes,
sometimes there's a no because they feel
like nope, I'm done, I'll call you when I
need you.
Dionne Eleanor (26:58):
You know exactly yeah, I'm the same, I do,
I do, I do definitely ask because, like you
said, people are they're different they're
different and they have needs, or maybe
they're just going on vacation and
Dr. Liz (27:10):
yeah, I love the term aftercare, though, as
you put it for some reason, like when
you're drawing and I do a lot of
watercolors and it's like the they call it
tending.
Tending is those little details you go back
to afterwards, that you're adding, that
really take that to another level and and
that's what you know visually popped up for
(27:31):
me in terms of aftercare, like you know, do
you need a little tending, are you okay?
How are you doing, like, how is it going
for you once you've completed this
transformation?
Dionne Eleanor (27:42):
Yeah, definitely.
And a question for you on that with clients
and sort of outside of sessions, it's
probably something that you experience.
So I'm on social media.
I'm not using it too heavily.
It's a nice tool but it can be very
distracting, you know personally.
But I have found in my experience that
(28:03):
people like to follow, or sometimes people
have you know, let's say, on Instagram,
followed me, me, and then I've had a client
ask me.
You know why I didn't follow them back and
I personally developed a policy where I
don't follow clients right on their social
media, unless the only case I would say, is
if we've totally finished working with each
other and there's a clear purpose and
consent um but, um, you know, a purpose
(28:27):
might be.
I'm following a new business and they've
asked if I can give them a like, and you
know there's no there's no conflict there
and if there's enough time passed.
Dr. Liz (28:36):
But yeah, I'm curious about your
experiences with that as well with with
that type of side of things yeah, in the us,
licensed psychologists are licensed mental
health counselors, um, lcsws, we're
actually not allowed to.
I mean mean, it's not a law, but it's an
ethical guideline that our profession, and
so I will say that in the first meeting
(28:57):
with someone, like it doesn't mean I don't
like you or think about you.
I think about you all the time actually,
but I am actually not allowed to follow you
on social media.
Know, this is why is to protect my
experience of you as objective, and you
know there's ethical guidelines, all that
stuff.
So I say it up front.
Um, I say you're allowed to follow my
(29:19):
professional accounts.
I'm not allowed to let you follow any
personal accounts.
So that's how I put it.
I am almost completely off of social media
in terms of my professional accounts.
Several of them got hacked and it is quite
a business task actually to keep up a
(29:42):
social media account in terms of
professionally.
So finally, I was like I'm just calling it
it and my business increased.
After that.
You know everybody says, oh my god, you
gotta have social media to have a business.
Even that was not my experience at all.
Dionne Eleanor (29:58):
So, which is very, very interesting to me,
that's so healing to hear right, because
obviously we're both humans and that's one
of my um standing in authenticity.
I think, like if I think of my one of my
younger brothers about three and at this
point in his life he is a social media
superstar and it gives him energy and it
(30:21):
works with his life and everything.
And for me, I'm not afraid of social media,
I'm not afraid of being on video, but I
being curious about how it's sustainable
and how authentic it is.
Like I'm okay to be on there when it's
authentic.
But, like you said, it is quite a task to
to do the frequency that they say is
(30:41):
required.
And you know, one of the things I was
speaking to one of my assistants about was
that okay middle ground, putting content
out there on my page that is supportive to
people, especially if I'm I work globally
and in different places.
Can we develop a faceless um strategy from
(31:04):
right now?
Um, yeah, I'm super excited about that
because, um, you know, I'll see how that
goes.
Um but, yeah, I've, I've moved away, I've
I've definitely gravitated away from
personal shares, um, that you know there's
some, but not less so sort of purposeful
and sharing something of inspiration, and I
(31:26):
agree with you, um, and I agree with the
ethical guidelines that it just I think one
of the things I feel it can create is
relational avoidance in the therapeutic
connection and work, because in a personal
relationship, right, I, for example,
updated someone that said oh, I saw that on
your status, and then they've made an
assumption of what's going on in my brain
(31:49):
because of something they've seen on my
social media, which actually was was dated
one year ago, but I'm just posting it
because it made me smile today, and so it's
so easy to not be objective when there's
oversharing and or inappropriate sharing
online, and so I think and I love that
(32:09):
you're that that's a huge I can't think of
the word in English but that's a huge like
woo for me.
Dr. Liz (32:18):
Yeah, yeah, mentor.
She sort of explained it from an energy
perspective.
I mean, I do keep my podcasts, which is
technically social media, which is
technically social media, or my YouTube
channel.
But it was finally my Facebook was hacked
and I I did not enjoy doing this Facebook
(32:38):
account.
I did it because I felt like I had to and
whoever hacked it was getting, I mean,
thousands of views on the videos they were
posting.
I'm like this is great, it's just like
publicity for me.
But then, of course, they started posting
videos I did not exactly approve of.
So my mentor said well, if you don't
actually like doing that, just drop it.
(32:59):
That's it.
It's done energetically.
That's not good and for your business, I
had to hire a hacker to hack my hacker.
Okay, so an ethical hacker is what they
call them.
Yeah, to delete the account was very easy.
To get my account back was expensive and
(33:20):
difficult.
So I said delete it and that was that and
it was expensive.
Dionne Eleanor (33:27):
Freedom, actually, that came with it,
you're also putting that energy into your
clients oh, yes, yeah, exactly.
Dr. Liz (33:35):
So the energy I think just gets shifted.
So it's like, instead of my energy going
here to something I really don't like or
feel like is really even supportive of my
business, then my energy is going over here.
Like you know, my hand is going a different
direction, because I know this is an audio,
not a video podcast.
Your energy just shifts into something
(33:58):
that's far more enjoyable around your
business or even personally, like, oh, it
frees up all kinds of personal time for me,
that I don't have to do this anymore.
Or even if you hire somebody, depending on
what level your business is, that you don't
have to supervise that person anymore.
(34:19):
All of that.
So it was very, very interesting to me know,
or all of that.
So it was very, very interesting to me,
very interesting that my business actually
increased after that.
Instead of you know the whatever, everybody
tells you that exactly for you.
Dionne Eleanor (34:31):
Thank you, um, I do have another question.
I know that you've got questions as well,
but I think also I don't know if you've
been asked this before but I feel it's an
important question and it is something that
I've experienced with my method and
actually, you know, right now I'm changing
things in my business to my, for example,
my domain will go to the body stage and the
(34:52):
method will still be considered a method,
but within my business really understand,
because one of the things I have a huge
respect for is the intersection of science
with modern holistic techniques.
I think there is a huge importance in what
we do in the clinical way and in the
(35:13):
licensed way, and I remember being very
early into my career, even before I was
doing hypnosis as.
I could technically call myself, you know,
a therapist, because it's rapid.
I'm a rapid transformational therapist and
then I also had qualified years back in
massage therapy.
(35:33):
So I could technically, you know and we see
this all the time right that especially on.
We were just talking about social media.
People are have these titles and they
aren't lying, but they are unintentionally
sometimes misinforming people because I
think it's just psychology.
Somebody might look at me and say she looks
trustworthy, she looks like she is this
(35:55):
type of therapist, so she's got therapy in
the therapist in the title.
So I'm gonna make this assumption.
Something that I always make sure that I
tell people up front is that I am a
therapist, like you know, like in in that
way, in this specific way, but I'm not a
licensed psychotherapist.
I have got ex experience.
(36:16):
I haven't got this experience and I go
through all of the safeguarding if I'm
concerned, and permission for me to share
data and all of that with certain
authorities and people.
Um, but I'm I'm really interested in your
perspective as well, like in terms of the
world that we're living in now, the, the
pros and the and even the areas to be
(36:39):
mindful of, of people that are licensed
versus non-licensed, right in the common
and common things.
I I know I'm biased to say this, but I feel
like I'm okay because I'm I'm really
cautious, right, I was cautious as I can,
so it's in my my brain to make sure that I
don't overstep um, whereas, what do you see
(37:00):
that is positive about my method and where
they could also benefit from seeing
somebody that's maybe licensed or a bit
more clinical like who might be Okay, got
it.
Dr. Liz (37:12):
So let's start with.
I think often people find the practitioner
that they need at the time and so they do
that various ways and it is a caution to
make sure that okay, is this person trained
in what I'm seeking and are they upfront
(37:32):
about their credentials?
Like if you sense any shadiness, you got to
say okay, no, right.
Like if there's any shadiness here, it
varies worldwide.
So in the US there's certain guidelines of
things you can actually say that you do
with certain certifications call yourself
certain things and others but there's
(37:52):
incredible practitioners who are not
psychologists or licensed therapists or
licensed psychotherapists.
Psychologists or licensed therapists or
licensed psychotherapists.
That's an extremely long path to take,
education-wise, financially, and not
everyone is led to take that path or wants
to do that or sees like that's their path
(38:16):
to take.
They get their other ways.
Originally, I think, when coaching came on
the scene, um, and therapists licensed
therapists were sort of all up in arms like
these people are charging three times as us,
as they don't have the education behind it,
but yet they're doing things that
therapists do.
And then there became a little more
(38:36):
guidelines around coaching, around okay,
what is appropriate and and what do you
need to refer to.
As you know, training programs begin to pop
up and all that stuff.
When someone is dealing, I think, with
trauma, then you do want to know does this
person have some background in this and not
(38:57):
just personal?
Because often what I'll see for
practitioners is oh, personally, this, this,
this didn't happen.
And so then I evolved and it's like, okay,
I understand that and then did you seek
some training around that so that you can
help people?
And I think an important point that you've
talked about actually throughout the
(39:17):
interview is safety.
Are they setting up safety?
Do they talk about how to keep you safe?
Because that's a really important is a
safety factor when you're dealing with
trauma.
So you want to get a good sense of and I
was really drawn to the woman who was
leading it, who was trained in the Terry
(39:46):
Real system.
Terry Real is BFFs with Esther Perel, who's
much more popular, you know, but he has his
whole own system of couples and you know
how they operate and how they heal and how
they stay in relationship with each other
in a healthier way.
And she was trained in that system.
She's not a licensed therapist, but she was
fantastic, fantastic, far better than her
(40:11):
co-leader, who was a therapist because
that's who she is, and but also she had all
kinds of training in leadership and
presentation and this type of thing.
But the way that she created safety, which
was really important, and so that came
through in her, how she led the workshop on
(40:31):
her website, that type of thing.
So I think you've got to evaluate it that
way, like I'm led to this person.
Let me look at them a little bit more.
Some people are more analytical than others
as well, right, so some of us want to like
dig in a little bit and see, and other
people are just straight intuition.
Even if you're straight intuition, you
(40:53):
still need to think about can this person
keep me safe and what are they doing to
help keep me safe?
And so sometimes that may be their policies,
them between contact, aftercare, like you
say, that type of thing and also the
feeling you get from them.
I think that's really important and often,
as women, I think this is drastically
(41:15):
changing.
But traditionally we were taught to ignore
those feelings and now we're absolutely
raising generations of women who are taught
to ignore those feelings and now we're
absolutely raising generations of women who
are taught to absolutely you listen to
those feelings, you listen to your
intuition.
Your intuition is your best friend, so you
really want to tune into.
That is how I say someone doesn't
necessarily need to be licensed, but I
(41:36):
think they do need the training behind it.
Does that answer?
Yeah?
Dionne Eleanor (41:41):
yeah, definitely, and I love how you yeah,
yeah, I'm hearing like not necessarily
licensed, but the training and the
practices in place to keep somebody safe
and like that, not only the practices, but
that energetic value in themselves, like
they're admitting that, like that they care.
(42:02):
And, yeah, you know, for me that is, I
think it's come through, because safety is
hugely important to me.
It was a male friend that asked me and I'll
never forget it, it was after we had spent
10 days in.
Have you heard of the Vipassana meditation?
Yes, of course, yeah, yeah, so we'd spent
10 days not talking to each other.
(42:24):
Yeah, yeah, but um, huge crush, right, so,
telepathically, like crushing on each other
Now, now, like I think it was the
meditation energy.
Yeah, definitely not compatible for
anything more than a friendship, but I'll
(42:51):
never forget.
After that, he said I had so many questions
in my mind and he said, and one of them was
how does it feel to be a woman?
And I was like well, what do you mean?
Dr. Liz (42:57):
He was like well, I don't want to be a
woman.
I was like, okay, and I was like well, what
do you mean?
Dionne Eleanor (43:00):
He was like well, I don't want to be a
woman.
I was like okay, he was like, but he's like.
I feel like women are always specifically
women, almost every woman that I know.
Not a day goes by where she's not having to
think about her safety.
Dr. Liz (43:12):
Absolutely.
Dionne Eleanor (43:13):
Yeah, yeah.
And so you know that that really stuck with
me, that if I can create a container where,
at least for the most part, who I'm working
with does not have to think about that for
a period of time, that in itself is a
little bit healing.
Dr. Liz (43:31):
Yes, I love that turnaround.
Yes, like this is a safe environment and
you don't have to think about it for the
hour or two or three sometimes that you're
with me.
Dionne Eleanor (43:43):
Yeah yeah, yeah, exactly.
Dr. Liz (43:45):
Yeah, I mean it's.
There's a young man who came to my door the
other day and I'm probably 20s and 20s and
he was asking for like food and water.
And I felt so bad.
I said Do you have a phone?
He offered work, like I'll do anything,
I'll do some work for you or whatever.
And it wasn't a time that I could do that
(44:09):
and my husband wasn't home and I felt so
bad.
I said Do you have a phone?
Can I call you later and arrange the work?
And he said no, I don't have a phone.
I said I'm sorry, I you know I can't open
the door, but my daughter and her boyfriend
were here and so they went out and gave him
some food and water.
(44:29):
Okay, so that would not have happened if
the boyfriend wasn't here.
Yeah, I can tell you straight up.
And so I heard the door click and I was
like in my office I wasn't on with a client,
but I I sort of called out, I says the door
locked to my daughter and she said, yeah,
it's locked.
We gave him some food and water.
(44:50):
I said okay, and I said bear versus man,
eva, like I mean it's a, it's a reality and
it doesn't.
It doesn't feel good to have to say no to
some food and water to a young man in need,
sometimes because you're worried about your
own safety or your daughter's safety.
You know, he could have easily overpowered
(45:13):
us or what I don't know.
Once you open the door, you know, I don't
know.
Once you open the door, you know, I don't
know, and yeah exactly.
Dionne Eleanor (45:20):
There is a biological you know, talking
about the body, there is a biological
difference in the, in the, you know, in
terms of sex, the way that the body is
built and dominant areas of strength that
we, we cannot deny, and something that you
know.
When I'm working with women women
especially it's encouraging them that they
(45:40):
can, they can be empowered and they can do
things that they want to do.
And I kind of say tongue in cheeks, and you
can and cannot have it all right.
You don't need to have it all.
You don't need to have every single thing
that, or do every single thing that a man
does to be worthy and to be enough, as it's
a woman that you are.
There are some things that it's just like
(46:00):
out in nature, right, the, the piece of
concrete, is not saying, oh, I want to
desperately be a flower petal, like after a
certain point, it just I'm concrete, right,
and so this is how it is.
Um, and so we see this uh lesson about you
(46:21):
know the.
You could say I guess I don't know how I
would it or the laws of the universe, right,
that it's okay and we're not um, you know
um in, in theory.
In that way, I think that we are.
You know, one of the best things you know,
going back to social media, for, uh, for
just a second that's come out of that is
(46:41):
the vocalization, like there's more voices
and with that there's more opportunities
and there is a sense of empowerment that we
are starting to slowly unravel things and
people are at least being heard, and being
heard is the first step to changing things
and systems that aren't working.
And it's a practice like we are practicing
(47:01):
in relationship with ourself, we're
practicing relationship with our partners,
with our children, with our friends, and
then we're practicing systemically as a
community and we're not going to get it
right like the first time.
Oh yeah, it's so true.
Dr. Liz (47:16):
Yeah, right, it is, but it is um, it's a a
wonderful question and a wonderful way to
think of things and, um, a way to say, okay,
yeah, how do I heal in a safe way is how I
hear that right, and sometimes that is
through community in other ways.
You know, even this young man that was on
(47:36):
my doorstep, it's like I, I donate monthly
to feeding, feeding south florida, because
that's where I was for a long time like
food and hunger.
And then, you know, he shows up at my
doorstep and I'm not religious, but it was
around Easter, and so this religious
imagery is going like how, how, all of this
stuff that's part of community, but
(47:57):
ultimately we have to keep ourselves safe.
That's it Exactly, yeah.
And probably that man and you know he would
have had a little bit of awareness
sometimes not right, but a little bit of
awareness of, and with that, like he's
stepping into courage through it, but like
awareness that like people will be, you
(48:19):
know, preoccupied a little bit with their
safety and that's part of the risk he's
taking with asking um, and so it's like
that dance, you know, and and yes, and I
think his safety too, like I nearly thought
of where's, where's his mother or his
father, and it's like you know he's taking
a risk with his own safety knocking on
(48:40):
doors, and so I know there's different
parts of the world where it's a little bit
different, but it's just not that way here,
where I am in North Florida, and it's
there's a sadness with it and at the same
time, you have to acknowledge just our
basic needs of safety period.
(49:01):
But back to our body sage method, okay, to
the point where I interview.
I can be straight off here.
So I really um think that when you're
wanting to heal on a deep level, when
you're wanting to heal trauma in particular,
that safety is really important.
(49:21):
And so that is a physical safety and does a
person create a sense with their policies
and with their spirit, like who they are
with you, like how they're communicating
with you.
And we're not all perfect all the time that,
like you said, we do get distracted
sometimes.
But, yeah, general, is that coming across?
(49:43):
Yeah, yeah, so, yeah, we have chatted.
It's been great.
Now so we're coming to the end here,
unfortunately, because I think I could talk
to you forever, but please tell people how
to find you yes, definitely.
Dionne Eleanor (49:59):
Well, talking about social media, I'm still
currently on there and it's just my name on
Instagram, which is Dionne D-I-O-N-N-E, and
then my second name, e-l-e-a-n-o-r,
underscore Dionne Eleanor.
That's my Instagram and it's also the same
on LinkedIn, so you can find me on both of
(50:19):
those platforms.
I'm on Facebook as well, but I'm hardly
using it.
And then otherwise, if you go to my website,
which is wwwbodysagecocom, and you can find
me there, and you can find me there.
Dr. Liz (50:39):
Wonderful, and that will be in the show
notes as well as the website for everyone.
Yes, thank you so much for being on the
podcast.
I am so glad it all worked out after many
reschedules.
Yes, me too.
Dionne Eleanor (50:54):
It's been great, very happy to be here,
really wonderful talking to someone that is
kind of in in a similar, you know, a side,
side by side um ally, ally in this wellness
industry of you know, supporting and people
around the world.
And yeah, it's been really great speaking
to you.
Thank you so much.
Hey everyone.
Dr Liz, here I do not quite sound like
myself because I am recovering from
pneumonia the past 10 days so there has
been a little bit of a delay on the podcast
getting episodes out.
But I finally have a little energy back and
I wanted to air the interview I did with
Dionne Eleanor.
(00:21):
She is lovely and we talk all about her
body sage method as well as wander into
some business topics and some things that
happened to us in our personal lives.
So I hope you enjoy the interview as much
as I enjoyed speaking with her.
Hope you're healthy and safe Peace.
(00:43):
I hope you're healthy and safe Peace.
Dionne Eleanor (00:53):
Hi Dionne, welcome to the Hypnotize Me
podcast.
Hello, nice to be here.
Dr. Liz (00:55):
Yeah, I'm so glad we finally connected.
We had a couple of reschedules in here
because of both of our busy busy schedules,
but finally, we're here together yes.
So why don't you let the audience know um a
little bit about yourself and then how it
led to the method that you've created, the
(01:15):
body sage method?
Dionne Eleanor (01:18):
okay, well, thank you.
So, um, yeah, for those listening, my name
is Dionne Eleanor.
I was born in the UK from parents that I
would say are dominantly from the Caribbean,
so I would be considered first or first and
a half generation born in the UK, and I
(01:39):
share that because I think it has a
significant part of the work that I've
ended up doing today being very much
focused around trauma-informed healing and
integrative wellness.
So the Body Sage Method, or the Body Sage,
is my organization, and the Body Sage
Method is really a combination of using
(01:59):
rapid transformation therapy, which is a
form of hypnotherapy, and combining that
with somatic work and relationship skills
training.
You know it's for me.
I don't really feel like I've created the
method.
I've just put things together in a very
specific way and called it my.
You know, called it my own, because there
is an order and a sequence to the way that
(02:21):
I work.
But I do want to give a lot of respect to
my mentors that have, you know, taught me
the original modalities, and I think that's
the way life goes right, where we are
constantly evolving through case study,
through research and through testing how
things can help people, and so, with that,
then, my focus is predominantly on women.
(02:45):
I would say women 35 to 45, sometimes a
little bit older, sometimes a little bit
younger, and then I work with them and then
I also work with their partners.
So again, this comes back to why I call it
a specific method.
So, rather than just doing the work with
women, I integrate partner work or
potential partner work, if they're dated as
(03:07):
part of the system, and my focus really is
on helping women that have had some type of
significant trauma or change connected with
their bodies, especially around child
release.
And I use child release very intentionally
because there's a huge focus in our world
(03:29):
still on childbirth and I think it's still
a little bit of a taboo about things like
miscarriage, abortion and child loss, and
so I really support women in all of those
areas, and saying child release rather than
childbirth and loss just makes it easier to
contain in in one sentence work with the
(03:50):
women for a period of time in an area of
empowerment and combination of.
We'll work together alternate weeks, and
one week we'll work with the mind, one week
we'll work with the body and then, after a
certain period of time, then we'll work
with the mind.
One week we'll work with the body and then,
after a certain period of time, then we'll
start to integrate work with the partner so
that if they are in a relationship or they
(04:10):
want to be in a relationship, so they're
not kind of going on this upward trajectory
and evolving and their partner feels left
behind, or then they've got issues then
relating and integrating with the world um
around them.
Dr. Liz (04:23):
So um, do you find the partners are very
willing to do this with them, or do you
have to sometimes, let's say, encourage
them?
Dionne Eleanor (04:36):
yeah, I mean it really is case by case.
I would say that a lot of the time, um, in
my experience, uh, the, the couples you
know, when it comes to couples work, the
partners being quite willing, um, and maybe,
like a site had a silent desire, um, but
the hurdle comes with just making sure that
(04:57):
that partner feels that there's a trust
there and that I'm not going to just side
with the female partner, especially because
I'm in a female body and because they know
that I've done a certain degree of work
with the partner already.
And so the way that I address that is
through clear guidelines written in black
and white before the clients work with me,
(05:20):
about boundaries, about consent, about
what's shared, what is not, when it's
shared, when it's not.
And then I do have one-on-one sessions with.
Usually I'm working with heterosexual
couples, not always I have worked with
people of different sexual orientations and
with that then we're just looking at
polarity, because there's masculine and
feminine energy in everybody, right, and so
(05:43):
it's just building that trust and having
those one-on-one sessions with them so that
they've got time to share things that they
wouldn't necessarily share in the sessions
when their partner is present.
And usually it happens all the time both
ways, but definitely for the masculine
partner they're a little bit more reserved
to share some things.
And then what I can do is from those
(06:04):
one-on-one sessions I can gracefully and
artfully weave in some couples work that I
focused on resolving some of the challenges
that he might face.
Dr. Liz (06:16):
Okay, Got it?
Where does your couples training come from?
Did you train originally in couples and
then this evolved as part of this method?
Or or you just found like, oh, this is
really necessary part of the work that I'm
doing yeah, I would say that it's.
Dionne Eleanor (06:34):
It's a case that I found that was really
necessary.
Before starting this, I my very first
wellness modality was actually teaching
yoga, so a lot of people know me around the
world for teaching yoga and meditation, and
before that I was in corporate and so that
gave me a good foundation of awareness of
the body, mindfulness and just getting into
(06:55):
the industry in general.
It was never my intention actually.
I just fell in love with it, became
obsessed with it because of how it helped
me heal my own self from spinal disorders
and different things, and then started
doing it more.
And then as I was working as a teacher and
as I was practicing, I started to feel like
(07:15):
why are all these amazing people single or
having relationship issues, like they're
good people, they are working on themselves,
they say that they have good morals and all
of this.
So I started to get really interested in in
relationships and I'd always had a little
bit of a interest in relationships and
sexuality.
(07:35):
I remember as a child I used to study I
mean not study but look up anatomy parts
and I was fascinated by my parents
relationship and their sex life, which
seemed.
If I look back now I don't know if my
memory is totally accurate, but like they
seem to have a good time.
And so I was just really intrigued by love
and by relationships in general, and so I
(07:57):
already had that passion there.
And then I did some studies with Layla
Martin, who has a certification in
relationship, sexuality and Tantra coaching.
I also studied with a mentor who's based in
Leila Martin's based in the US, studied
with a mentor in Portugal, peter Littlejohn
(08:18):
Cook, and that was focused on Tantra, and
then I did some workshops and trainings
with Jason Gaddis, who is the founder of
the Relationship School.
I believe he is based out of Colorado, and
that was really based on more relationship
psychology and skills training, and so
those are just to name a few.
But it's, I find, with relationships are
(08:39):
definitely, it's definitely an art and an
ongoing study and I think, combined with my
passion and these educational areas, that's
what gave me the foundation.
I did also study psychology, not degree
level, but a level we call it in the UK, so
I had a bit of foundation there in terms of
(08:59):
the way that my in general and in
relationships.
Dr. Liz (09:03):
Yeah, how did you discover the RTT training?
Because it's a very specific certification
method, something like within hypnosis.
So how did you yeah?
Dionne Eleanor (09:17):
I think it was phones, listening and seeing
an advertisement and then clicking through
and I I mean, how would I describe myself
as a purchaser?
I think I'm one of the.
I'm one of those people that I have great
intuition.
I do trust my intuition, but I still I'm
(09:39):
very happy that I can speed read because I
definitely still love to check terms and
conditions, refund policy, ask all the
difficult questions.
So it wasn't a quick decision.
But what I was really drawn to with RTT was
I think I had a bias because Marissa Peer,
who founded it, she's from the UK, so
there's definitely there.
But I was also drawn to the fact that of
(10:03):
the results, it said that you know talking
about rapid results because no matter how
much you try and encourage people that you
work with that, things take time.
They always want things quicker.
So I was very intrigued by being able to
bring in a method that might help speed
things up for people that just don't have
that time or don't feel they have that time.
Yes, I was also intrigued by the fact that
(10:24):
there was cognitive behavioral therapy
intertwined in the into the technique,
which I feel is really important and gave a
solid foundation, and then also the
neuro-linguistic programming, changing the
language, it felt quite comprehensive.
And then, looking at the way that the
course was led at that time and not when I
(10:46):
started my course, but after I had started
and I was continuing learning and the CPD
part after I got my certification it was
pandemic time, and so I really appreciated
how there was this up-to-date how would you
call it up-to-date initiative from the team
at Marissa Peer to say, okay, how can we
bring this online in a safe way, in an
(11:06):
effective way, in a way where we're not
making false promises, do they?
Do people need more sessions?
So it felt it felt really, really, um good,
and it also felt really balanced that there
wasn't these false promises like, oh,
you're going to be a hypnotist and then
you're going to save people from this, and
that it was very the way that it was.
(11:29):
I was spoken to about and sold to.
You could say about.
It was in a very grounded way, so so that
gave me trust in sort of taking it on board
as another.
Dr. Liz (11:39):
I am part of a Facebook group like women in
hypnosis.
It's only women in that group and she
consistently gets rave reviews for
programming, her training, yeah, and her
techniques.
Actually, like people will reference her
techniques all the time because, yeah, well,
we'll post questions what I do in this case,
(11:59):
or something like that.
Dionne Eleanor (12:00):
And yeah, consistently they were yeah yeah,
she really I would say she really also
embodies her work right like she's so,
she's confident, but she admits when she's
not confident and she's a realist about you
know about things and really encouraging
people to step into an edge but also do
(12:21):
things safely and know when to safeguard,
know when to signpost, making sure that you
actually practice like live.
You know live real sessions and then you
know when I was studying it was working
with people on real issues and then having
those, you know it felt so laughing because
I remember feeling like the fear at the
(12:43):
time but having the videos analyzed and the
script analyzed, and to every detail, you
know, oh, your voice.
I think one of the feedback I had was that
my voice was a little too happy and I was
like but I like my voice, you know.
So you know and I you know just real,
honest, grounded feedback.
You know just real, honest, grounded
feedback.
(13:12):
And I think actually when I was coming
towards the end of my actual certification
and the time there wasn't this rush,
because obviously they have a vested
interest to certify people right in terms
of incentives, but I remember being very
close to that deadline and getting feedback
that I still I had a little bit of work to
do like a quite a bit of work to do, like I
passed everything.
I could tick all the boxes, but if I wanted
(13:32):
to really get the deep transformation that
I wanted to get for people, especially with
complex issues like severe trauma and PTSD,
I do need to make sure that I work on this.
And there was this offering from one of the
mentors within the team for me to even have
even more practice experience, and I really
like that because it would have been so
easy for them to have said you've done your
(13:52):
certification, keep practicing.
There you go.
I did get my certification, but it was, you
know, there was also very you know, very
clear and healthy responsibility there.
Dr. Liz (14:05):
Fantastic.
It's good to hear.
Yeah, yeah, I imagine it.
It was quite a nice integration with your
yoga experience.
I taught yoga for 20 years and hypnosis is
far more about the body.
I think that people realize like, yeah,
think about hypnosis, they think about just
the body.
I think than people realize Like, yeah,
think about hypnosis, they think about just
(14:26):
the mind, like I'm going to use my mind to,
you know, get very.
Sometimes it's not so quick, but that's
often the desire to get a quick response.
It often is the result, but sometimes it's
a little bit, you know, slower than quick,
let's say, or it takes a little bit longer
than that, but typically it's like the
(14:47):
transformation that occurs is not just the
mind, it's the body as well.
Dionne Eleanor (14:52):
Yeah, definitely, I've seen that the way
people stand after a session even if you've
not worked on something to do with their
posture like they stand differently, their
eyes are different.
One of my coolest memories with hypnosis
very, very early once had qualified in it
and started working I had a client that
wanted me to help him to stop smoking, and
(15:14):
so, part of the visualization when I was
doing the rewire of the belief, I had him
walk through a town that was full of smoke
and everything like that, things burning
down, and when he woke up, he had not
cognitively remembered.
You know.
You know, some people remember, some people
don't.
Yeah, it's like I just feel like I don't
know where I went.
(15:34):
I feel really good, though, but I said I
just feel like my eyes are burning and like
I've been walking through the fire and I
was like, well, you kind of have you know,
um, and his eyes were a little bit red and
so, and actually at this point I think it's
important maybe for the listeners is maybe
something that you've mentioned already,
because one of the things I have come up
(15:56):
with with hypnosis with new clients is fear
about forgetting or not knowing what's
going on.
And yeah, um, I was always trained to make
sure that there was a prompt in there for
people to keep themselves safe, that like
if they hear anything that they can,
they're in control, that they can come out
at any time and things like that.
And it really is, you know, repeated so
(16:17):
that people know that I'm not adding one
come out of hypnosis, but I have, you know,
I've had someone say I don't want to answer
that Right, and so there is.
You know, people do have control in that
space, yeah absolutely yes, and it depends
what type we're doing.
Dr. Liz (16:31):
But often when we're doing some habit,
change things, it's recorded.
And so I say you can always go back and
listen to the recording.
Sometimes, when we're doing, let's say,
deeper work, or we're changing beliefs or
going back in time, which we call
regression, that's not recorded.
But if someone wants me to, I absolutely
will like if they, so that they can listen.
(16:54):
It's an absolute yes, like absolutely yeah,
so that you can be safe, so that, yeah, I'm
doing my job here totally, totally fine.
And you know, it's not something that I
take personally.
That's, people have a different levels of
trust, that based on their own history in
life.
So, yeah, it's a good point to bring up,
(17:16):
yeah, so the body sage method.
Can you tell us more about your actual
method?
Dionne Eleanor (17:24):
I typically work with people for a minimum
of three months, sometimes six.
When somebody is very new, let's say new.
When I say very new, like I've never had
any contact with them before, I usually do
suggest three months for the purity of
safety.
Sometimes I'll suggest six months if I see
it's a very big issue, multiple issues,
(17:45):
yeah, but I usually ask for a three-month
window just so there's space for the
sessions, space for integration and
questions in between and to fit the partner
in there as well, because it's really not a
lot of time, um, even three months, you
know when you're working with someone by
bi-weekly, I either work bi-weekly or, if
somebody's got a little bit more um
(18:05):
challenges and I'll do a session every 10
days.
So they'll have three sessions in the month.
Um, the first week actually, I say
bi-weekly, but the first week we have two
sessions.
So we're really like hitting the ground,
running um and doing.
I tie in ritual work as well.
So we're open with a ceremonial way where I
(18:25):
have a script that I design that's
personalized for the person that was
stepping into a new area of their life, of
transformation, that they commit to it
fully, and so on.
I put them in a meditative, but not
hypnotic state for that, and the work that
I'm doing with the method is predominantly
online, but sometimes people do come in
(18:47):
person for some intensive three days or or
mini retreats as well.
Following that, then we'll rotate between
sessions that are based on the I call body
weeks, somatic weeks, and then brain weeks,
which they get the chance to.
With the brain weeks we'll get in the
chance to actually talk and do the
(19:08):
relationship skills training and and
mentoring.
I said mentoring rather than coaching
because my method is really focused on
after the period of time that we've worked
together, you've got your own tools and
system in place that you're not needing to
constantly have um therapy or with me or
any sessions with me, that you can sort of
go and live your life um, whereas coaching
(19:30):
is a little bit more motivational and
focused on keeping us going.
So I'm really like trying to teach those
skills, give them those resources, those
recordings if they want.
So in the brain weeks where we are, we've
got relationship skills training, anything
that they come up with.
But I do have a focal point, usually, so,
(19:50):
going back a step, when I have a
consultation with somebody, a woman that
I'm working with, I will listen deeply and
see what is it that she actually feels that
she wants to resolve in her life.
So maybe usually there's multiple things.
I'm feeling disconnected from my body.
I want to lose a certain amount of weight.
(20:11):
These are the common areas.
I'm feeling disconnected in my sexuality
and from my partner.
We're okay, but there's friction and I'm
scared about the relationship future.
Maybe they've got something that they're
feeling a bit disconnected from their own
sense of purpose and legacy and what
they're here to do.
They don't just want to be defined as a
(20:32):
mother or somebody who's gone through the
trauma that they've gone through.
And so then I'll bullet, point out and say
that these are the areas that we're going
to focus on and and I'll reverse them into
a positive statement.
So let's say, if the lady says she wants to
lose 20 pounds, so we we might say OK, by X
time we are going to commit to losing this
(20:55):
amount of weight.
This is the goal in our time working
together.
And the other goal is to have relationship
safety again, feel good in your body, have
good boundaries with your partner.
So I'll reverse them and then I'm fast
forwarding now, but at the end of the
period we will review those and see what
actually has been achieved.
So it keeps me accountable as well as the
(21:16):
client and I do.
I, behind the scenes, I'm reviewing mid as
well, and periodic to make sure that I'm
actually getting the results.
Of course In the body weeks we have
somatics.
Of course In the body weeks we have
somatics.
Again, it's personalized.
Now that I'm serving more people it's still
personalized, but I would definitely say
(21:37):
that I'm seeing patterns so I'm able then
to give myself some grace and reuse certain
things that I can see working.
But the somatics can be somatic therapy,
sort of shaking the body, the trauma
release exercise where you're shaking.
It can also be mindful movement.
Some people know that I'm qualified in yoga,
(21:58):
so they really request yoga and then it's a
mindful yoga movement.
And then we're also doing breath work and
vocal work as well.
Doing breath work and vocal work as well
vocal empowerment exercises A lot of the
women that I am working with.
(22:18):
They have challenges with speaking up with
confidence and maybe they feel that they've
gained a certain level of empowerment, but
then it's now moving it out into the world
and that's all part of the relationship as
well.
Going back to the brain, the only other
thing that I do also include is ancestral
intergenerational trauma work and it's case
by case.
I do offer some people if I see there's a
(22:39):
lot of complexity in family dynamics bonus
sessions where the mother can have a
session with let's say, it's me, the
daughter and the mother, so we can really
do some healing on that relationship.
Or maybe it's a specific child that they're
having challenges with, so call them family
sos sessions.
Um, love it.
Yeah.
So it's really an integrative approach
(23:01):
where we're involving all the key people,
but definitely the, the partner and then
any key people that there's challenges for
that are really affecting that woman.
Moving forward, one of my favorite moments
was working with a lady and she booked with
me for six months during that time.
She said it was, it was four and a half
months and she said I'm starting to feel
(23:23):
like I don't need you and I don't know if
I'm going to renew.
And I said well, don't worry, I was, you
know, because she had coached him before
and so she knows that typically I've also
received coaching and there's nothing wrong
with it.
But typically before when you come into the
end of your container, you do get reminders
that you can renew.
It's normal and I think it's very healthy.
Yeah that coach is and or mentor is
(23:43):
proactive, because sometimes we will just
slip off and back into our own habits,
right?
So, yeah, yeah, so, um, and I was like
that's great, and she was like, really, I
was like, exactly, that is, that is what I
want to happen.
If you're genuinely feeling that way and
let's keep making sure you're getting the
results, um, that you want.
Hypnosis fits into the brain weeks, but I
(24:04):
sort of do them separately, because the
rapid transformation hypnosis is a
three-hour session and it tends to come
later in the package.
If it's six months, they get two, if it's
three months they get one, and then we'll
either work on it's case by case it might
be the same issue if they get into hypnosis
sessions, it depends on how deeply rooted
(24:24):
it is or if something comes up after the
first or it might be two separate things
and we decide that, um, a little bit.
We have an idea at the beginning of the
relationship, working relationship, but we
might also tweak it, um throughout, um, and
then the couples integration.
That also comes in the final month of the
(24:44):
three month container or the final two
months, and then they'll get one session a
month, typically with their partner, unless
there's some deep issues, and then we just
do an add-on.
It works really well that way, because I
find that again we're looking at the.
I've built the trust with them so they can
go into that deep space.
They can also commit that time and carve it
(25:04):
out, because that's getting someone up
front three hours and then listen to
something each day, and then it also gives
them a continuum as well, um, and so the
noses will usually come in the three-month
container three weeks before they finished
working with me so they'll listen to the
recording for definitely, whilst I'm still
(25:24):
with them, and then they'll still be
listening to it hopefully after, and then I
usually check in with people after they've
finished the container work with me just to
see how they are, see if there's anything
that I can offer them in terms of resources
that they've lost, that I've sent them,
just that little bit of aftercare that I
think sometimes is missing, not
(25:46):
intentionally.
Again, I really believe there's a lot of us
are out there doing, you know, the best
that we can and we're just trying to
develop like systems of.
Sometimes for some people they do need that
little bit of checking in.
A lot of women I don't know about you, but
they common feelings are feeling invisible,
feeling unseen, alone, and so them knowing
(26:07):
that I do, because I do I generally care,
um, what's going on after they've finished
working with me, and they don't need to
sign up to anything, you know, they don't
need to spend another dollar for me to like
really know they're okay, is, um, it's
really important yeah, absolutely.
Dr. Liz (26:24):
In my own practice, since I hold a license,
we actually have some um, let's say,
guidelines around, like we're not allowed
to check on people after we finish working
with them unless we have their permission
to do that.
And so sometimes that's how I put it like
would you like for me to check on you?
And in a month or so?
Because I can't do that unless we make the
(26:46):
agreement for that.
But it's often very, very helpful, helpful,
I would say.
The majority of the time people say yes,
sometimes there's a no because they feel
like nope, I'm done, I'll call you when I
need you.
Dionne Eleanor (26:58):
You know exactly yeah, I'm the same, I do,
I do, I do definitely ask because, like you
said, people are they're different they're
different and they have needs, or maybe
they're just going on vacation and
Dr. Liz (27:10):
yeah, I love the term aftercare, though, as
you put it for some reason, like when
you're drawing and I do a lot of
watercolors and it's like the they call it
tending.
Tending is those little details you go back
to afterwards, that you're adding, that
really take that to another level and and
that's what you know visually popped up for
(27:31):
me in terms of aftercare, like you know, do
you need a little tending, are you okay?
How are you doing, like, how is it going
for you once you've completed this
transformation?
Dionne Eleanor (27:42):
Yeah, definitely.
And a question for you on that with clients
and sort of outside of sessions, it's
probably something that you experience.
So I'm on social media.
I'm not using it too heavily.
It's a nice tool but it can be very
distracting, you know personally.
But I have found in my experience that
(28:03):
people like to follow, or sometimes people
have you know, let's say, on Instagram,
followed me, me, and then I've had a client
ask me.
You know why I didn't follow them back and
I personally developed a policy where I
don't follow clients right on their social
media, unless the only case I would say, is
if we've totally finished working with each
other and there's a clear purpose and
consent um but, um, you know, a purpose
(28:27):
might be.
I'm following a new business and they've
asked if I can give them a like, and you
know there's no there's no conflict there
and if there's enough time passed.
Dr. Liz (28:36):
But yeah, I'm curious about your
experiences with that as well with with
that type of side of things yeah, in the us,
licensed psychologists are licensed mental
health counselors, um, lcsws, we're
actually not allowed to.
I mean mean, it's not a law, but it's an
ethical guideline that our profession, and
so I will say that in the first meeting
(28:57):
with someone, like it doesn't mean I don't
like you or think about you.
I think about you all the time actually,
but I am actually not allowed to follow you
on social media.
Know, this is why is to protect my
experience of you as objective, and you
know there's ethical guidelines, all that
stuff.
So I say it up front.
Um, I say you're allowed to follow my
(29:19):
professional accounts.
I'm not allowed to let you follow any
personal accounts.
So that's how I put it.
I am almost completely off of social media
in terms of my professional accounts.
Several of them got hacked and it is quite
a business task actually to keep up a
(29:42):
social media account in terms of
professionally.
So finally, I was like I'm just calling it
it and my business increased.
After that.
You know everybody says, oh my god, you
gotta have social media to have a business.
Even that was not my experience at all.
Dionne Eleanor (29:58):
So, which is very, very interesting to me,
that's so healing to hear right, because
obviously we're both humans and that's one
of my um standing in authenticity.
I think, like if I think of my one of my
younger brothers about three and at this
point in his life he is a social media
superstar and it gives him energy and it
(30:21):
works with his life and everything.
And for me, I'm not afraid of social media,
I'm not afraid of being on video, but I
being curious about how it's sustainable
and how authentic it is.
Like I'm okay to be on there when it's
authentic.
But, like you said, it is quite a task to
to do the frequency that they say is
(30:41):
required.
And you know, one of the things I was
speaking to one of my assistants about was
that okay middle ground, putting content
out there on my page that is supportive to
people, especially if I'm I work globally
and in different places.
Can we develop a faceless um strategy from
(31:04):
right now?
Um, yeah, I'm super excited about that
because, um, you know, I'll see how that
goes.
Um but, yeah, I've, I've moved away, I've
I've definitely gravitated away from
personal shares, um, that you know there's
some, but not less so sort of purposeful
and sharing something of inspiration, and I
(31:26):
agree with you, um, and I agree with the
ethical guidelines that it just I think one
of the things I feel it can create is
relational avoidance in the therapeutic
connection and work, because in a personal
relationship, right, I, for example,
updated someone that said oh, I saw that on
your status, and then they've made an
assumption of what's going on in my brain
(31:49):
because of something they've seen on my
social media, which actually was was dated
one year ago, but I'm just posting it
because it made me smile today, and so it's
so easy to not be objective when there's
oversharing and or inappropriate sharing
online, and so I think and I love that
(32:09):
you're that that's a huge I can't think of
the word in English but that's a huge like
woo for me.
Dr. Liz (32:18):
Yeah, yeah, mentor.
She sort of explained it from an energy
perspective.
I mean, I do keep my podcasts, which is
technically social media, which is
technically social media, or my YouTube
channel.
But it was finally my Facebook was hacked
and I I did not enjoy doing this Facebook
(32:38):
account.
I did it because I felt like I had to and
whoever hacked it was getting, I mean,
thousands of views on the videos they were
posting.
I'm like this is great, it's just like
publicity for me.
But then, of course, they started posting
videos I did not exactly approve of.
So my mentor said well, if you don't
actually like doing that, just drop it.
(32:59):
That's it.
It's done energetically.
That's not good and for your business, I
had to hire a hacker to hack my hacker.
Okay, so an ethical hacker is what they
call them.
Yeah, to delete the account was very easy.
To get my account back was expensive and
(33:20):
difficult.
So I said delete it and that was that and
it was expensive.
Dionne Eleanor (33:27):
Freedom, actually, that came with it,
you're also putting that energy into your
clients oh, yes, yeah, exactly.
Dr. Liz (33:35):
So the energy I think just gets shifted.
So it's like, instead of my energy going
here to something I really don't like or
feel like is really even supportive of my
business, then my energy is going over here.
Like you know, my hand is going a different
direction, because I know this is an audio,
not a video podcast.
Your energy just shifts into something
(33:58):
that's far more enjoyable around your
business or even personally, like, oh, it
frees up all kinds of personal time for me,
that I don't have to do this anymore.
Or even if you hire somebody, depending on
what level your business is, that you don't
have to supervise that person anymore.
(34:19):
All of that.
So it was very, very interesting to me know,
or all of that.
So it was very, very interesting to me,
very interesting that my business actually
increased after that.
Instead of you know the whatever, everybody
tells you that exactly for you.
Dionne Eleanor (34:31):
Thank you, um, I do have another question.
I know that you've got questions as well,
but I think also I don't know if you've
been asked this before but I feel it's an
important question and it is something that
I've experienced with my method and
actually, you know, right now I'm changing
things in my business to my, for example,
my domain will go to the body stage and the
(34:52):
method will still be considered a method,
but within my business really understand,
because one of the things I have a huge
respect for is the intersection of science
with modern holistic techniques.
I think there is a huge importance in what
we do in the clinical way and in the
(35:13):
licensed way, and I remember being very
early into my career, even before I was
doing hypnosis as.
I could technically call myself, you know,
a therapist, because it's rapid.
I'm a rapid transformational therapist and
then I also had qualified years back in
massage therapy.
(35:33):
So I could technically, you know and we see
this all the time right that especially on.
We were just talking about social media.
People are have these titles and they
aren't lying, but they are unintentionally
sometimes misinforming people because I
think it's just psychology.
Somebody might look at me and say she looks
trustworthy, she looks like she is this
(35:55):
type of therapist, so she's got therapy in
the therapist in the title.
So I'm gonna make this assumption.
Something that I always make sure that I
tell people up front is that I am a
therapist, like you know, like in in that
way, in this specific way, but I'm not a
licensed psychotherapist.
I have got ex experience.
(36:16):
I haven't got this experience and I go
through all of the safeguarding if I'm
concerned, and permission for me to share
data and all of that with certain
authorities and people.
Um, but I'm I'm really interested in your
perspective as well, like in terms of the
world that we're living in now, the, the
pros and the and even the areas to be
(36:39):
mindful of, of people that are licensed
versus non-licensed, right in the common
and common things.
I I know I'm biased to say this, but I feel
like I'm okay because I'm I'm really
cautious, right, I was cautious as I can,
so it's in my my brain to make sure that I
don't overstep um, whereas, what do you see
(37:00):
that is positive about my method and where
they could also benefit from seeing
somebody that's maybe licensed or a bit
more clinical like who might be Okay, got
it.
Dr. Liz (37:12):
So let's start with.
I think often people find the practitioner
that they need at the time and so they do
that various ways and it is a caution to
make sure that okay, is this person trained
in what I'm seeking and are they upfront
(37:32):
about their credentials?
Like if you sense any shadiness, you got to
say okay, no, right.
Like if there's any shadiness here, it
varies worldwide.
So in the US there's certain guidelines of
things you can actually say that you do
with certain certifications call yourself
certain things and others but there's
(37:52):
incredible practitioners who are not
psychologists or licensed therapists or
licensed psychotherapists.
Psychologists or licensed therapists or
licensed psychotherapists.
That's an extremely long path to take,
education-wise, financially, and not
everyone is led to take that path or wants
to do that or sees like that's their path
(38:16):
to take.
They get their other ways.
Originally, I think, when coaching came on
the scene, um, and therapists licensed
therapists were sort of all up in arms like
these people are charging three times as us,
as they don't have the education behind it,
but yet they're doing things that
therapists do.
And then there became a little more
(38:36):
guidelines around coaching, around okay,
what is appropriate and and what do you
need to refer to.
As you know, training programs begin to pop
up and all that stuff.
When someone is dealing, I think, with
trauma, then you do want to know does this
person have some background in this and not
(38:57):
just personal?
Because often what I'll see for
practitioners is oh, personally, this, this,
this didn't happen.
And so then I evolved and it's like, okay,
I understand that and then did you seek
some training around that so that you can
help people?
And I think an important point that you've
talked about actually throughout the
(39:17):
interview is safety.
Are they setting up safety?
Do they talk about how to keep you safe?
Because that's a really important is a
safety factor when you're dealing with
trauma.
So you want to get a good sense of and I
was really drawn to the woman who was
leading it, who was trained in the Terry
(39:46):
Real system.
Terry Real is BFFs with Esther Perel, who's
much more popular, you know, but he has his
whole own system of couples and you know
how they operate and how they heal and how
they stay in relationship with each other
in a healthier way.
And she was trained in that system.
She's not a licensed therapist, but she was
fantastic, fantastic, far better than her
(40:11):
co-leader, who was a therapist because
that's who she is, and but also she had all
kinds of training in leadership and
presentation and this type of thing.
But the way that she created safety, which
was really important, and so that came
through in her, how she led the workshop on
(40:31):
her website, that type of thing.
So I think you've got to evaluate it that
way, like I'm led to this person.
Let me look at them a little bit more.
Some people are more analytical than others
as well, right, so some of us want to like
dig in a little bit and see, and other
people are just straight intuition.
Even if you're straight intuition, you
(40:53):
still need to think about can this person
keep me safe and what are they doing to
help keep me safe?
And so sometimes that may be their policies,
them between contact, aftercare, like you
say, that type of thing and also the
feeling you get from them.
I think that's really important and often,
as women, I think this is drastically
(41:15):
changing.
But traditionally we were taught to ignore
those feelings and now we're absolutely
raising generations of women who are taught
to ignore those feelings and now we're
absolutely raising generations of women who
are taught to absolutely you listen to
those feelings, you listen to your
intuition.
Your intuition is your best friend, so you
really want to tune into.
That is how I say someone doesn't
necessarily need to be licensed, but I
(41:36):
think they do need the training behind it.
Does that answer?
Yeah?
Dionne Eleanor (41:41):
yeah, definitely, and I love how you yeah,
yeah, I'm hearing like not necessarily
licensed, but the training and the
practices in place to keep somebody safe
and like that, not only the practices, but
that energetic value in themselves, like
they're admitting that, like that they care.
(42:02):
And, yeah, you know, for me that is, I
think it's come through, because safety is
hugely important to me.
It was a male friend that asked me and I'll
never forget it, it was after we had spent
10 days in.
Have you heard of the Vipassana meditation?
Yes, of course, yeah, yeah, so we'd spent
10 days not talking to each other.
(42:24):
Yeah, yeah, but um, huge crush, right, so,
telepathically, like crushing on each other
Now, now, like I think it was the
meditation energy.
Yeah, definitely not compatible for
anything more than a friendship, but I'll
(42:51):
never forget.
After that, he said I had so many questions
in my mind and he said, and one of them was
how does it feel to be a woman?
And I was like well, what do you mean?
Dr. Liz (42:57):
He was like well, I don't want to be a
woman.
I was like, okay, and I was like well, what
do you mean?
Dionne Eleanor (43:00):
He was like well, I don't want to be a
woman.
I was like okay, he was like, but he's like.
I feel like women are always specifically
women, almost every woman that I know.
Not a day goes by where she's not having to
think about her safety.
Dr. Liz (43:12):
Absolutely.
Dionne Eleanor (43:13):
Yeah, yeah.
And so you know that that really stuck with
me, that if I can create a container where,
at least for the most part, who I'm working
with does not have to think about that for
a period of time, that in itself is a
little bit healing.
Dr. Liz (43:31):
Yes, I love that turnaround.
Yes, like this is a safe environment and
you don't have to think about it for the
hour or two or three sometimes that you're
with me.
Dionne Eleanor (43:43):
Yeah yeah, yeah, exactly.
Dr. Liz (43:45):
Yeah, I mean it's.
There's a young man who came to my door the
other day and I'm probably 20s and 20s and
he was asking for like food and water.
And I felt so bad.
I said Do you have a phone?
He offered work, like I'll do anything,
I'll do some work for you or whatever.
And it wasn't a time that I could do that
(44:09):
and my husband wasn't home and I felt so
bad.
I said Do you have a phone?
Can I call you later and arrange the work?
And he said no, I don't have a phone.
I said I'm sorry, I you know I can't open
the door, but my daughter and her boyfriend
were here and so they went out and gave him
some food and water.
(44:29):
Okay, so that would not have happened if
the boyfriend wasn't here.
Yeah, I can tell you straight up.
And so I heard the door click and I was
like in my office I wasn't on with a client,
but I I sort of called out, I says the door
locked to my daughter and she said, yeah,
it's locked.
We gave him some food and water.
(44:50):
I said okay, and I said bear versus man,
eva, like I mean it's a, it's a reality and
it doesn't.
It doesn't feel good to have to say no to
some food and water to a young man in need,
sometimes because you're worried about your
own safety or your daughter's safety.
You know, he could have easily overpowered
(45:13):
us or what I don't know.
Once you open the door, you know, I don't
know.
Once you open the door, you know, I don't
know, and yeah exactly.
Dionne Eleanor (45:20):
There is a biological you know, talking
about the body, there is a biological
difference in the, in the, you know, in
terms of sex, the way that the body is
built and dominant areas of strength that
we, we cannot deny, and something that you
know.
When I'm working with women women
especially it's encouraging them that they
(45:40):
can, they can be empowered and they can do
things that they want to do.
And I kind of say tongue in cheeks, and you
can and cannot have it all right.
You don't need to have it all.
You don't need to have every single thing
that, or do every single thing that a man
does to be worthy and to be enough, as it's
a woman that you are.
There are some things that it's just like
(46:00):
out in nature, right, the, the piece of
concrete, is not saying, oh, I want to
desperately be a flower petal, like after a
certain point, it just I'm concrete, right,
and so this is how it is.
Um, and so we see this uh lesson about you
(46:21):
know the.
You could say I guess I don't know how I
would it or the laws of the universe, right,
that it's okay and we're not um, you know
um in, in theory.
In that way, I think that we are.
You know, one of the best things you know,
going back to social media, for, uh, for
just a second that's come out of that is
(46:41):
the vocalization, like there's more voices
and with that there's more opportunities
and there is a sense of empowerment that we
are starting to slowly unravel things and
people are at least being heard, and being
heard is the first step to changing things
and systems that aren't working.
And it's a practice like we are practicing
(47:01):
in relationship with ourself, we're
practicing relationship with our partners,
with our children, with our friends, and
then we're practicing systemically as a
community and we're not going to get it
right like the first time.
Oh yeah, it's so true.
Dr. Liz (47:16):
Yeah, right, it is, but it is um, it's a a
wonderful question and a wonderful way to
think of things and, um, a way to say, okay,
yeah, how do I heal in a safe way is how I
hear that right, and sometimes that is
through community in other ways.
You know, even this young man that was on
(47:36):
my doorstep, it's like I, I donate monthly
to feeding, feeding south florida, because
that's where I was for a long time like
food and hunger.
And then, you know, he shows up at my
doorstep and I'm not religious, but it was
around Easter, and so this religious
imagery is going like how, how, all of this
stuff that's part of community, but
(47:57):
ultimately we have to keep ourselves safe.
That's it Exactly, yeah.
And probably that man and you know he would
have had a little bit of awareness
sometimes not right, but a little bit of
awareness of, and with that, like he's
stepping into courage through it, but like
awareness that like people will be, you
(48:19):
know, preoccupied a little bit with their
safety and that's part of the risk he's
taking with asking um, and so it's like
that dance, you know, and and yes, and I
think his safety too, like I nearly thought
of where's, where's his mother or his
father, and it's like you know he's taking
a risk with his own safety knocking on
(48:40):
doors, and so I know there's different
parts of the world where it's a little bit
different, but it's just not that way here,
where I am in North Florida, and it's
there's a sadness with it and at the same
time, you have to acknowledge just our
basic needs of safety period.
(49:01):
But back to our body sage method, okay, to
the point where I interview.
I can be straight off here.
So I really um think that when you're
wanting to heal on a deep level, when
you're wanting to heal trauma in particular,
that safety is really important.
(49:21):
And so that is a physical safety and does a
person create a sense with their policies
and with their spirit, like who they are
with you, like how they're communicating
with you.
And we're not all perfect all the time that,
like you said, we do get distracted
sometimes.
But, yeah, general, is that coming across?
(49:43):
Yeah, yeah, so, yeah, we have chatted.
It's been great.
Now so we're coming to the end here,
unfortunately, because I think I could talk
to you forever, but please tell people how
to find you yes, definitely.
Dionne Eleanor (49:59):
Well, talking about social media, I'm still
currently on there and it's just my name on
Instagram, which is Dionne D-I-O-N-N-E, and
then my second name, e-l-e-a-n-o-r,
underscore Dionne Eleanor.
That's my Instagram and it's also the same
on LinkedIn, so you can find me on both of
(50:19):
those platforms.
I'm on Facebook as well, but I'm hardly
using it.
And then otherwise, if you go to my website,
which is wwwbodysagecocom, and you can find
me there, and you can find me there.
Dr. Liz (50:39):
Wonderful, and that will be in the show
notes as well as the website for everyone.
Yes, thank you so much for being on the
podcast.
I am so glad it all worked out after many
reschedules.
Yes, me too.
Dionne Eleanor (50:54):
It's been great, very happy to be here,
really wonderful talking to someone that is
kind of in in a similar, you know, a side,
side by side um ally, ally in this wellness
industry of you know, supporting and people
around the world.
And yeah, it's been really great speaking
to you.
Thank you so much.
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