March 6, 2025 • 33 mins
In this episode of The Deal, Alex Rodriguez and Jason Kelly talk with Katlyn Gao about how she founded a whole new women's professional sports league: League One Volleyball. Gao tells the hosts why LOVB chose their six inaugural team markets, how she got investors like Jayson Tatum and Candace Parker on board, and why women’s volleyball is uniquely situated to take off in the United States.
See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, Radio News.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Welcome back to the Deal.
Speaker 3 (00:13):
I'm Jason Kelly alongside my partner Alex Rodriguez. All Right,
so we're here in New York City at Bloomberg Invests.
We're literally minutes away from taping a live interview in
front of an audience with Melodie Hobson, one of the
most influential sports investors these days. So much get into
You're to hear that later on in the season. But
one of her most interesting investments to me, and I
(00:34):
think to you is League One Volleyball.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
This is a startup league. They're going youth to pro.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
We got a chance to sit down a couple of
weeks ago with their CEO and co founder, Caitlin Goo,
and I know one of the things that really jumped
out to you was this vast experience she had in
the consumer.
Speaker 4 (00:49):
World exactly, Jason. I was so impressed with her background.
When you look at lou Lemon, Sophora Bain, I mean,
that's as good as it gets. I was really interested
and curious to see how she was going to take
call that great experience and weave it into building on
this great league that she.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Wants it to be global.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
Yeah, and it's interesting and we talked about this in
the episode. I had gotten a chance go down to
Atlanta see their first serve. They called it the very
first match they played as pros. It was electric in
this arena, same arena that the Atlanta Dream play in.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
And you know, it.
Speaker 3 (01:17):
Speaks to a lot of things we talk about on
this show. This moment that's more than a moment. It's
a movement for women's sports. All this enthusiasm, you know,
you see it with the links, you see it with
other investments that you have so much emphasis and so
much money going toward women's sports right now.
Speaker 4 (01:35):
I think our listeners are going to be as impressed
as you and I were. And after this interview, I'm
very bullish in her vision for this league.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
All right, coming up Kaitlyn Gal. So we're really really
excited to have with us Kaitlyn Gal. He's the CEO,
co founder of League one Volleyball. We know it as Love.
(02:04):
I was there Alex for the first serve in the
atl They're in the midst of their inaugural season. It's
super exciting. How's it going so far?
Speaker 1 (02:13):
I think you're seeing me with all of the excitement
and adrenaline pumping up the lack of sleep.
Speaker 5 (02:20):
So that's how I'm doing.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (02:23):
A seminole moment for me, Caitlin was it was a
few years back and I was watching on Sports Center
and I was watching University of Nebraska and they played
volleyball outdoors and I read ninety one thousand people, and
I thought it was a type or something. And you
selected six obsessed markets with volleyball, Atlanta, Austin, Houston, Madison, Omaha,
(02:46):
and Salt Lake. Why those markets and where do you
see this expanding to other cities?
Speaker 1 (02:51):
Great question because this being the number one team sport
for girls across the US in terms of size of participation,
and the sky's the limit in terms of how far
this can go, how many teams we can have ultimately
as we build the NBA Volleyball To start with those six,
it was really important for us to really look at
(03:12):
a lot of different factors, whether it's the collegiate programs
like you mentioned. Obviously Nebraska was a no brainer given
how many people showed up was record breaking for any
women's sports event, and for us to also look at
what are the other dynamics of youth participation, of venue availability,
of the types of venues we felt very strongly about,
(03:35):
as well as also looking at who are the top
players in the world that are from the US, and
for us to see where do they come from, what
communities have they already resonated with while they were playing
college or while they're playing at the junior club level,
And because we have now seventy one junior club locations
(03:56):
across twenty seven states, it was also for us to
see how can we have a built in foundation and
that connection, you know, at our own junior clubs, so
that we could even physically house them together in terms
of where they're training, so that that premier league type
of youth to pro connection can be super authentic, very
(04:16):
grassroots and natural.
Speaker 3 (04:18):
All right, let's talk about the youth to pro because
that is it's a huge differentiator. And really this inaugural
season has been about the Pro League. It's the inaugural
season the Pro League. You've been in the in the
youth business. That is no small feat. It was the
idea from the beginning, how much risk was there in
(04:39):
your estimation as you sort of built this out, you
built out the business case of sort of taking on
an entire sport vertically.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Interestingly, for us, we really just focused on the size
of what the sport already is, the unique nature of
it being the sport that kind of was naturally women
led both participation as well as how well known it
is in terms of consumption, and while we really evaluated
what the space could be, it felt extremely underserved. So
(05:11):
you have this dichotomy of the participation level being so
high and not having necessarily sort of the NBA of
volleyball at the pro level, and at the youth level
it was extremely fragmented. There are about five thousand plus
of these junior clubs that exist in the US, and
they're all sort of separated. There's not really a ton
(05:32):
of scale, if you will, and what that comes with
is lack of investment and sometimes consistency.
Speaker 5 (05:37):
And so it was.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
Really very early on before we probably even came up
with the name Love that we felt very strongly that
the entire sport was undercommercialized and the fans were underserved.
And so for us to start with youth was actually
quite natural because that's where we're the most vibrant.
Speaker 5 (05:56):
Participation.
Speaker 1 (05:57):
Consumption already existed, and we felt very strongly that that
could also present in this opportunity to build an entire
brand for the entire ecosystem that creates as I mentioned,
this journey of belonging from youth to pro and to
purposely say no, we're not starting with pro. I mean,
you guys come across so many different startup leagues, right,
(06:18):
and a lot of times that rushing into something at
the pro level without having had the luxury or the
benefit of building it layer by layer, step by stet
brick by brick, that does sometimes lead into an unsustainability.
And for us to really kind of corral this foundation
of a network of clubs that have this day and
(06:40):
day out consumption at the youth level just created this
huge opportunity for us to drive lifetime consumption of volleyball
as opposed to just one part of it.
Speaker 4 (06:49):
Yeah, so, Kaylene, One of the things with my background,
I spent the first half of my life with Major
League Baseball that's been around for over one hundred years.
I think the back nine hopefully would be a lot
of NBA that's been around for over set twenty five years.
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Now.
Speaker 4 (07:01):
These are two blue chip companies. You're the epitome a
blue chip with your background Northwestern undergrad, Harvard Business School,
then you go to Sophora Bain lou Lemon. How do
you think about blue chip companies that we just mentioned
compared to a starter and what do you have to
do a little bit different to grab people's attentions, investors, etc.
Speaker 5 (07:22):
Well, first off, thank you.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
I think that we have this intentionality of building Love
as a legacy leak, and the characteristics of legacy leagues
are they're here to stay, they weather the storm, they
weather the up and downs, and I think that has to.
Speaker 5 (07:38):
Be built off of a really strong foundation. And that was.
Speaker 1 (07:41):
Exactly the justification, if you will, or the inspiration to say,
we have an opportunity to do this in a way
that felt very grounded, very disciplined, because we have a
very clear vision of this being a legacy leak.
Speaker 5 (07:57):
Success would be that this outlasts all of us.
Speaker 1 (08:00):
Right, this isn't just one person's league or here the
co founding team. No, this this is about each of
us are here and the time that we're here, we're
creating it to be even stronger so that it outlasts
for generations. So there are kids' kids get to experience
it the way that they get to experience the Bulls.
I mean, I grew up in Chicago and my identity
is deeply rooted in the nineties Chicago Bulls.
Speaker 5 (08:23):
And so, however, you know, the success or.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
Lack of success or has been I could be in
London and I see somebody in a Bulls jersey and
I want to go up and talk to them because
we share something that is emotional, that's about a sense
of belonging and identity. And so I think that all
startup leagues should be thinking about what is the legacy
you're creating and how do you create that legacy in
a sustainable way. And I think that intentionality is really
(08:48):
coming through both in terms of what we have done
in five and a half years of building this youth
and junior club foundation, as well as having the patients
and the luxury if you well, of being in discussion
with our founding athletes starting when they were still in
Tokyo or getting prep for Tokyo Games, to say we're
(09:08):
building a league together. We're going about this differently. Would
you like to come along for this ride and how
would you like to give us the input to say,
if you were building league with that used to pro mindset,
this whole journey of belong in consumption, how would you
do it? And many of them were already situated in
Europe where they see that used to pro connection already
(09:30):
playing out in front of their eyes.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
Yeah, you know, Caitlyn, you mentioned something and I saw this.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
When I went to First SERF in Atlanta, sort of
the emotional reaction that these athletes have had to a
league being built where there wasn't one before. And it's
almost like a thought exercise for you, Alex to a
staid to be like, so you're playing baseball, but there
is no MLB, you know, and so like you have
(09:57):
to go abroad to make your living, and then all
this sudden someone says, you know what, We're going to
create major League Baseball. You can play in Miami. Like
it's a little mind bending to think about. But that
I mean, Caitlin and my right, I mean that was
essentially what was happening with these athletes who would go
and they'd play in Nebraska in front of ninety one
thousand people, but then to be a pro they'd have
(10:19):
to go live in Russia.
Speaker 5 (10:21):
Right, Yes, that was.
Speaker 1 (10:22):
Mind boggling to me, even you know, five and a
half years ago. Because Team USA women's indoor team has
meddled twenty years in a row. They're the best in
the world. And so you go from Nebraska in these
incredible collegiate settings.
Speaker 5 (10:38):
And then boom, you're gone.
Speaker 1 (10:40):
You're off to Turkyer, Italy, Russia, Korea, Japan, Brazil. But
you're not here, certainly, not at the level where you know,
we have ninety percent of our athletes represent their own countries, right,
So that's national leveled right in the Olympics exactly, so
as well as the equivalent of World Cups, right, that
(11:01):
happened every year. And so when you think about that level,
and especially for the predominantly US players that are in
our league, that's like you're playing at the NBA level,
but there isn't an NBA. So you play abroad in
other leagues for other countries, and then every year for
the World Cup equivalent or every four years, you're coming
(11:23):
back during your breaks to say, I want to represent
my country, but we don't have an opportunity for all
these athletes to be playing together in their home soil.
So Dream Team goes and wins medals coming back and
there's no NBA level. Now there are other leagues, obviously
since we started this at the youth level, that have
entered the space, but certainly not at the same level
(11:44):
of play as these Olympians, where ninety percent of them
are representing their home country and now they're coming and
playing the NBA volleyball here in the US.
Speaker 4 (11:53):
Yeah, I guess my next question is part statement, part question.
But do you think that part of what has you
so excited is the tailwinds? I mean, think about where
we are today in twenty twenty five versus even thirty
years ago. My parents would never take my sister to
a ballgame, right, it was just me and my buddies.
And today I couldn't imagine any of my friends just
(12:16):
taking their boys to Miami Heat game or Miami Dolphin.
Is always the boys and the girls, they all go together.
Do you think that the fan base, the consumer, the tailwinds,
the WNBA, all of this is in your favor as
far as storytelling, capital raising, etc.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
Absolutely true that this has been an amazing tailwind. Also
true that five and a half years ago this wasn't
exactly what you see today, so we really have benefited
from that since then. But the idea the vision the
start of our execution of building the strong foundation that
came from us just looking around and saying, Wow, we
(12:56):
have this incredibly popular sport that is completely under served.
What can we do about it with the purpose and
profit approach in mind of helping drive better life outcomes
through the commercial success that we can create.
Speaker 5 (13:10):
So this is an.
Speaker 1 (13:11):
Added bonus and one that's really I think overdue and
so exciting. I think a lot of it is driven
from a lot of the levers that you guys talk
about on this show, disaggregation of media, new patterns of consumption,
the recognition from brands that women's sports in particular represents
a really creative and very uniquely compelling way for brands
(13:32):
to come in and build that affinity with audience that
are watching women's sports, so that that partnership really becomes
less of just eyeballs and broad based recognition, but a
lot of depth and building that relationship with the fans
for the sponsors slash partners of these incredible leaks.
Speaker 3 (14:05):
All right, so let's get into the deal of it
all as it were, and talk about, you know, putting
this together as a business, and then you know, you
and your partners and I think especially Peter Hirshman going
out on the road and raising money for this, Like,
how do you even, you know, start that process of
(14:25):
knowing who you're going to talk to, knowing how you're
going to approach, what the pitch is going to be.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
Take us inside those early days.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
Yes, it seems like forever ago, but really it's just
been five and a half years of three rounds of
fundraising with some.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
Really well five and a half years, I mean, that's
that's not a short amount of time.
Speaker 5 (14:44):
You know, it's not.
Speaker 1 (14:44):
And it's been really an incredible experience of meeting folks
along the way that even if it's initially not the
right timing for what their investment thesis is that over time,
as they watch us execute up what we have laid
out years ago, I do believe that that creates a
sense of trust, It creates a sense of confidence and
(15:08):
your ability to set a really strong.
Speaker 5 (15:10):
And ambitious vision.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
As you mentioned, Jason, not everyone decides to take on
two really robust areas of opportunity here, both at the
junior level as well as at the pro level, and
all the other things that can come of it. Once
you have those two very important cornerstone set, which we
now do five and a half years later. So I'd
(15:31):
say that we've never wavered around our sequencing of Foundation first,
then the halo of the brand next, which is at
the pro level, and that journey has been one that
has been very purposely laid out in very sort of
structured fashion of what are all the milestones we want
to hit and so for having that laid out very
(15:52):
clearly and not deviating from it, and it kind of
just makes sense when you're thinking about driving lifetime consumption
and you start with youth and you go into pro
next with the best possible quality of play on the court,
all of that and thing made a lot of sense,
especially for folks that really look at it not just
as a pure sports opportunity, but one that's really driving
(16:16):
a holistic consumption opportunity. So you know, it's as much
of an entertainment product as it is a competition product,
a training product. And now merchandising has become a big
component of how we're engaging with our fans because we've
taken a very lifestyle as well as competitive approach on
what we're offering in our sort of budding program of
(16:40):
merchandising where you're actually wearing the league name in addition
to having the team names. Opportunities you don't really see
that in NWSL or the NFL or the MBA. That
comes sort of next, well below, kind of where you
your fan base typically engage at, which is at the
team level, and we think that there's an opportunity for
(17:00):
us to create it where it can be at each level.
Speaker 4 (17:03):
So, Caitlin, I'm fascinated by this question. I'm going to
ask you, and I think our listeners will be two.
If you think about you've raised, as I understand, one
hundred and sixty million dollars over three rounds of raising capital,
let's just divide them into three silos, three buckets. You
have institutional capital, you have family offices, and then you
have celebrities slash athletes. I guess my question to you
(17:27):
is what's the contrast or is it better yet like
one size fits all? Or is it more of a
tailor made approach the way you contrast institutional versus family
offices versus celebrities athletes.
Speaker 1 (17:39):
It's a really good question because we've experienced different indexing
of those three categories depending on the rounds, Right, earlier rounds.
In terms of the capital that you need, it doesn't
really hit the radar some of the larger growth equity
or even above that in terms of kind of middle
of the road if you will, you know, private equity firms,
(18:01):
And that's really more of a mechanical differentiation. But I
think in terms of, you know, what folks are looking
for in their investment, both from celebrities, individuals, family offices
to institutional capital. Interestingly, I actually don't think there's a
huge difference. I think it's an appetite for risk in
(18:21):
the stage, but in terms of what they're actually looking for,
they're typically all looking for a really sizable market, right
it's the size of the addressable market, and we have
a huge one. They're also looking for what is your
business model, what is the talent on the team? You
know you mentioned Peter Hirshman. You know, he and I
met at Bay many years ago. We also have Kevin
(18:43):
Wong who has lived and breathed for decades. He himself
is an Olympian on the beach side, but started with indoor.
And also you know broadcasts on NBC for the Beach Olympics,
and that's just symbolic of all of the people that
we've corralled, both on the working team as well as
added benefit of these incredible youth club directors and owners
(19:06):
who have come into Love and helping us build all
of this, and all of that is information networks and
access to capital conversations, and so for us, it was
actually more so that we are being really clear about
what our envision is, but the fact that you can't
actually get there overnight.
Speaker 5 (19:24):
Nothing breaksthrough happens overnight.
Speaker 1 (19:26):
But it's really this methodical approach of what are we
doing this year, how we're thinking about the launch in
four years, and having a ton of those conversations with
the athletes, with the club directors, with the national team
coaches to really get the benefit of all of that
brain trust. And I think that's what was reflected in
all of our pitches, is a diversity of connections in
(19:50):
and outside of volleyball, in and outside of sports, and
the fact that we're very intentional about the Love brand.
Speaker 4 (19:58):
And a quick follow up there, I see some of
your noteworthy investors, Lindsay Vaughan, the great Candas Parker that
was on the deal, Amy Schumer. These are as big
as names as you can find. Are you pitching usually
to the business manager or do they actually make an appearance,
And if they do make an appearance, do they ask questions?
Speaker 1 (20:15):
They ask incredibly insightful questions because they have the lived
experience of being in highly pressurized environments. They've seen a
ton of these pitches come across their desks, and the
celebrities themselves, the high profile folks themselves as well as
their business teams, and we welcome that because they all have,
(20:38):
you know, collectively, really great insights. When you take Candas
Parker or even Jason Tatum for example, they all have
real personal connections to the sport. Canada's Parker had played
volleyball very competitively until she was a sophomore, and I
think some sort of negotiation or conversation happened with her
and her dad is like, you gotta pig one because
(21:00):
you're going to be playing at the highest level. And
it's too bad that love was and around. We didn't
have the NBA or the WNBA of volleyball for her
to play in. And Jason Tatum's mom actually was already
on her way to a D one scholarship and she
has a really kind of deep connection with the sport,
and she was really really competitive in that sport. So
(21:22):
there's family connections to the sport. In Jason's case, so
Amy Schumer played volleyball, and I think actually in her
show she has a character that plays volleyball. So there
is so much incredibly sort of genuine connection to the sport.
So that there is sort of this I'm going to
zoom out and hear what this unique opportunity is not
(21:45):
just an investment, but what you're trying to create in
the impact for the sport that is both for purpose
and for profit. So we're very fortunate to have that
level of connection to our investors in general.
Speaker 3 (21:57):
Yeah, wow, Alex, I mean that's like it's a sliding do.
I mean, just think the entire Candace Parker episode of
The Deal could have been about her being, you know,
this generational talent and volleyball.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
I mean, like unbelievable exact, it is amazing.
Speaker 3 (22:11):
I mean, as we were going through this, I did
note to Alex that you have a lot of members
of what we call the Deal cinematic universe, and you're
on your cap table. You have kandas Parker, you have
Billy Jean King, and Alana. You have I believe Carolyn
Tish Blodgett and next three as part of your investor
group as well, all who have appeared.
Speaker 2 (22:29):
On the deal.
Speaker 3 (22:30):
Just to be clear, so clearly we're doing the right
thing because we're talking to very smart investors and athletes
turned investors. I wonder how we got to that. I mean, oh, yeah, right, Alex,
I forgot about it. I forgot, I forgot we have
the og is one of the hosts of Filly Mate,
Luck and Talent. Yeah, yes, exactly exactly, But it is
interesting to think about, you know, sort of how they
(22:53):
got there. But you know, one thing that I wanted
to make sure we talked about a little bit, Caitlin,
is sort of how you got here.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
You know, we touched on it a little bit.
Speaker 3 (23:01):
And I do wonder as you reflect on this, you know,
almost six years into this journey. You know, Alex mentioned
your educational pedigree of the highest level, but also working
in consumer brands like Sephora and Lululemon, consulting with Bain, Like,
what are your reflections on sort of this moment in
your career. Because I think about a lot of our
listeners who they dream of doing something like this. You know,
(23:25):
they're working for big companies they may admire, but you know,
to go out and start something new in sports, there's
this you know, movement afoot of understanding the role that
sports plays in the broader culture, Like have you even
had a minute to sort of reflect on that for yourself?
Speaker 1 (23:39):
Only recently, I would say, having had the opportunity to
reflect on it.
Speaker 5 (23:44):
And it really kind of comes down.
Speaker 1 (23:46):
To this not necessarily being one of the kids say
these days, this was not in my bingo card. Yeah,
this was not in my bingo card. I have not
Alex Rodriguez level, not even close. Wasn't d one bound
for any sport. But maybe I'll come back to this
idea of I really think of sports as a business
of belonging. You know, I came to the States at
(24:08):
age twelve. You know, my mother being the reason that
we moved to the Stays. She was a physicist and
her job has you know, taken us a very very
drastic turn from a life that I would have lived
and my brother and myself would have lived if we
stayed in China. So her role, her profession really changed
the trajectory of our families lives and you know, to
(24:31):
this day, I think that has been a very strong
impact on how I think about what that purpose with
the capital P would be still thinking about what I
do when I grow up and along the way, you know,
having had the great opportunities that I've had in both
educational as well as professional settings, you just meet incredible
people and those relationships. Once you start to get into
(24:53):
a certain stage in your career, you're starting to connect
the dots and then also being a little bit more
clear about what are the things that motivate you. And
to me, this idea of being involved in a business
that is really about a business of belonging and that's
brought me so much joy just being a fan of
basketball growing up in Chicago in the nineties. Again not
a great athlete myself, but felt like, despite the language barrier,
(25:17):
I was able to feel a sense of belonging by
trying out different sports because you actually didn't even need
the verbal communication to feel belonging with your teammates. And
that's the sense of purpose that we think about in
driving and building love. And I'm just really grateful that
relationships got you know, this group of great founders coming
together and that you know, I've been part of really
(25:40):
driving a legacy creation that will hopefully outlast all of us.
Speaker 4 (25:45):
So sticking with you, Caitlin, as you think about your
great career that you've had going back to Harvard Business School,
bands for lul Lemon, which of those four do you
think you drew the most experience to help create love.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
I've actually never thought of it that way because so
much of it is really the culmination of all of it.
But perhaps one that stuck out at the time that
we were deciding what is the business model, because it's
very easy to just say, well, all these startup leagues
start with pro and then you go back and you
made the connection for fan base or for other reasons
into the youth and starting with youth. This idea of
(26:23):
grassroots up first really came from the most recent exposure
that I had by running globally commerce at Lululemon, where
I was maybe even shocked to find that there wasn't
a marketing department per se.
Speaker 5 (26:37):
It was really labeled community. It was all about getting
the community to corral around.
Speaker 1 (26:42):
This brand, and so it was a lot more about
depth than it was about breath, and that was very
different than a lot of other certain athletic brands or
other megabrands that have done a lot more emphasis on
tops down marketing as opposed to grass roots up marketing.
You know, the example I would give is that in
(27:03):
many cases, especially in the early years, Lululemon started with
really a pilate studio. For example, it might be even
a makeshift one that was only a six month short
term rental. And that's how they developed new markets or
new neighborhoods where they would bring in influencers from those
particular neighborhoods just so that they could yes, be doing
(27:25):
yoga together pilates, but then there's a rack of clothes
from lul Lemon where you're getting input. You're getting to
know their life stories and what functions do they care about,
down to by the time that they do open the
permanent space, what do you see on the wall. You
see actually local influencers. You see local heroes in you know,
(27:45):
various walks of the sporting life and the run clubs
still meet there at six am in the morning.
Speaker 5 (27:50):
You know.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
Regionally, they also had people who engaged with the community
specifically so that they're drawing into the grassroots influence as
opposed to tops down in pure digital marketing. So we felt
very strongly, especially sort of digging a little bit deeper
into what are the relevant learnings there that you know,
I think that helped us to double down on this
(28:13):
grassroots up approach.
Speaker 2 (28:14):
That's so interesting.
Speaker 3 (28:15):
You know, one thing that strikes me as you talk about,
you know, the business of belonging. And you know, the
other thing that I really do feel like I witnessed
there in Atlanta. I mean one and Alex you'll drive
with this, you know, one was the sort of the
support from the broader Atlanta sports community. You know, It's
(28:35):
like the president of the Atlanta Dream is there and
Derek Schiller, the CEO of the Atlanta Braves, like they're
there sort of showing support, which was interesting to sort
of see.
Speaker 2 (28:43):
The sports ecosystem.
Speaker 3 (28:45):
But also, and I think this goes all the way
back to the question of like why these certain markets
there was such a sense of sort of joy and
anticipation and excitement in the arena that evening from the fans.
And I do wonder, you know, Caitlin, as we start
(29:06):
to wrap up the conversation, like what are you taking
from the fans? You have developed this community and sort
of plugged into it in a way from the club
and the youth level. But what do you take away
from the fans and how does that inform where you
take the league from here? What have you learned so
far from the people who are in the seats.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
The most important lesson we're learning is that if you
are true to your intentionality of building a community, anything
as possible, and that community is a community of youth
clubs and their families. I mean, we had close to
nineteen thousand athletes and their families in our junior clubs
and that's expected to double probably in the next year
(29:50):
year and a half and goes from there as well
as us having had this intentionality of engaging with the
collegiate program and their athletes and their coaches engaging with
other sports. I mean, ultimately, the power really is in
the community. Why, Because relationships built, that's connected, fans activated,
(30:13):
all of those pieces, I think validate the fact that
starting with the community up was absolutely the right choice.
Even if it wasn't a choice that many others have
or anyone else has ever made, it felt right For
volleyball in particular, I mean, this is a sport where
your opponents are on the other side of the net.
You've got six starters on one side of the net
(30:33):
choreographing the most beautiful plays, right, And it's really a
special sport where it's deeply rooted in that sense of
belonging and coming together. I mean, win or lose, they
come together for each point to encourage each other. So
it's being true to who we are. It's always been
about community. That's what I think the power will continue
(30:54):
to be as we continue to grow.
Speaker 2 (31:08):
All right, so should we hit the lightning round? Alex? Yes,
let's do it. You're reading, okay? I am five questions.
Speaker 3 (31:14):
The only thing we say is keep it tight and
we'll bounce it back and forth.
Speaker 2 (31:18):
I'll start and then Alex will pick it up. Are
you reading?
Speaker 5 (31:20):
Let's go?
Speaker 2 (31:21):
No pressure?
Speaker 5 (31:21):
All right, no pressure.
Speaker 3 (31:22):
What's the best piece of advice you've ever received on
deal making or business?
Speaker 1 (31:26):
Being authentic, being true to who you are and tune
out the noise.
Speaker 4 (31:30):
Who's your dream deal making partner?
Speaker 3 (31:34):
Oh?
Speaker 5 (31:34):
I already have it my co founding team.
Speaker 3 (31:36):
So maybe someone you haven't worked with yet, but you
sort of imagine working with.
Speaker 5 (31:41):
Oh Man, that is an interesting Beyonce.
Speaker 3 (31:45):
Oh, that's a good one, right, ants that could be
the best answer we've gotten to that that question.
Speaker 1 (31:49):
Thanks all right, I'm also manifesting if you can't tell.
Speaker 4 (31:52):
Yeah, that's what we do with the deal.
Speaker 3 (31:56):
I love it exactly. We love deals that Lets start
on the deal. What's the most nervous you've ever been.
Speaker 5 (32:01):
Caitlin the weekend before first surf?
Speaker 4 (32:04):
What's your hype song before you go into a big
meeting or a negotiation?
Speaker 1 (32:09):
Not a very cool one, but I want to dance
with somebody by Whitney Houston.
Speaker 2 (32:14):
Oh well, that's good. That's a good one.
Speaker 3 (32:16):
And what's your advice for someone who might be listening
who wants to do what you've done?
Speaker 1 (32:22):
Take care of the relationships you have, be intentional about
developing those with people you admire, and connect the dots.
Speaker 3 (32:30):
All right, really good? I think that could be the
best lightning round we've ever done. Sorry, everyone else who's
been on the shack, Kaitlyn, good, this.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
Is a treat. I'd been really looking forward.
Speaker 3 (32:40):
To this, especially since we got to spend some time
together at the First Serve. Really really fun, Excited for
what you're building and can't wait to see where it
goes from here.
Speaker 2 (32:48):
Thank you for joining us.
Speaker 5 (32:49):
Thank you both. Great to be here.
Speaker 4 (32:51):
Thank you. And I can't wait to go to a match.
I'm excited.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
Yeah, you got to go. It's such a vibe. It's
such a vibe. It's so fun.
Speaker 1 (32:58):
Alex, we're trying to get you guys to our finals
in Kentucky. So Louisville on April thirteenth is our finals.
Speaker 5 (33:05):
Okay, so that'll be just as exciting, if not more
sale than our first serve.
Speaker 4 (33:10):
You got it.
Speaker 3 (33:18):
The Deal is hosted by Alex Rodriguez and me Jason Kelly.
This episode was made by Anna Maazarakus, Stacey Wong, and
Lizzie Phillip. Amy Keene is our editor. Our theme music
is made by Blake Maples. Our executive producers are Kelly Leferrier,
Ashley Honig, and Brenda Neonham. Sage Bauman is the head
of Bloomberg Podcasts. Additional support from Rachel Carnivali and Elena
(33:40):
sos Angeles. Thanks so much for listening to the Deal.
If you have a minute, subscribe, rate and review our show.
It'll help other listeners find us. I'm Jason Kelly. See
you next week.
Bloomberg Audio Studios, Podcasts, Radio News.
Speaker 2 (00:12):
Welcome back to the Deal.
Speaker 3 (00:13):
I'm Jason Kelly alongside my partner Alex Rodriguez. All Right,
so we're here in New York City at Bloomberg Invests.
We're literally minutes away from taping a live interview in
front of an audience with Melodie Hobson, one of the
most influential sports investors these days. So much get into
You're to hear that later on in the season. But
one of her most interesting investments to me, and I
(00:34):
think to you is League One Volleyball.
Speaker 2 (00:36):
This is a startup league. They're going youth to pro.
Speaker 3 (00:39):
We got a chance to sit down a couple of
weeks ago with their CEO and co founder, Caitlin Goo,
and I know one of the things that really jumped
out to you was this vast experience she had in
the consumer.
Speaker 4 (00:49):
World exactly, Jason. I was so impressed with her background.
When you look at lou Lemon, Sophora Bain, I mean,
that's as good as it gets. I was really interested
and curious to see how she was going to take
call that great experience and weave it into building on
this great league that she.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
Wants it to be global.
Speaker 3 (01:05):
Yeah, and it's interesting and we talked about this in
the episode. I had gotten a chance go down to
Atlanta see their first serve. They called it the very
first match they played as pros. It was electric in
this arena, same arena that the Atlanta Dream play in.
Speaker 2 (01:17):
And you know, it.
Speaker 3 (01:17):
Speaks to a lot of things we talk about on
this show. This moment that's more than a moment. It's
a movement for women's sports. All this enthusiasm, you know,
you see it with the links, you see it with
other investments that you have so much emphasis and so
much money going toward women's sports right now.
Speaker 4 (01:35):
I think our listeners are going to be as impressed
as you and I were. And after this interview, I'm
very bullish in her vision for this league.
Speaker 3 (01:42):
All right, coming up Kaitlyn Gal. So we're really really
excited to have with us Kaitlyn Gal. He's the CEO,
co founder of League one Volleyball. We know it as Love.
(02:04):
I was there Alex for the first serve in the
atl They're in the midst of their inaugural season. It's
super exciting. How's it going so far?
Speaker 1 (02:13):
I think you're seeing me with all of the excitement
and adrenaline pumping up the lack of sleep.
Speaker 5 (02:20):
So that's how I'm doing.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Yeah.
Speaker 4 (02:23):
A seminole moment for me, Caitlin was it was a
few years back and I was watching on Sports Center
and I was watching University of Nebraska and they played
volleyball outdoors and I read ninety one thousand people, and
I thought it was a type or something. And you
selected six obsessed markets with volleyball, Atlanta, Austin, Houston, Madison, Omaha,
(02:46):
and Salt Lake. Why those markets and where do you
see this expanding to other cities?
Speaker 1 (02:51):
Great question because this being the number one team sport
for girls across the US in terms of size of participation,
and the sky's the limit in terms of how far
this can go, how many teams we can have ultimately
as we build the NBA Volleyball To start with those six,
it was really important for us to really look at
(03:12):
a lot of different factors, whether it's the collegiate programs
like you mentioned. Obviously Nebraska was a no brainer given
how many people showed up was record breaking for any
women's sports event, and for us to also look at
what are the other dynamics of youth participation, of venue availability,
of the types of venues we felt very strongly about,
(03:35):
as well as also looking at who are the top
players in the world that are from the US, and
for us to see where do they come from, what
communities have they already resonated with while they were playing
college or while they're playing at the junior club level,
And because we have now seventy one junior club locations
(03:56):
across twenty seven states, it was also for us to
see how can we have a built in foundation and
that connection, you know, at our own junior clubs, so
that we could even physically house them together in terms
of where they're training, so that that premier league type
of youth to pro connection can be super authentic, very
(04:16):
grassroots and natural.
Speaker 3 (04:18):
All right, let's talk about the youth to pro because
that is it's a huge differentiator. And really this inaugural
season has been about the Pro League. It's the inaugural
season the Pro League. You've been in the in the
youth business. That is no small feat. It was the
idea from the beginning, how much risk was there in
(04:39):
your estimation as you sort of built this out, you
built out the business case of sort of taking on
an entire sport vertically.
Speaker 1 (04:48):
Interestingly, for us, we really just focused on the size
of what the sport already is, the unique nature of
it being the sport that kind of was naturally women
led both participation as well as how well known it
is in terms of consumption, and while we really evaluated
what the space could be, it felt extremely underserved. So
(05:11):
you have this dichotomy of the participation level being so
high and not having necessarily sort of the NBA of
volleyball at the pro level, and at the youth level
it was extremely fragmented. There are about five thousand plus
of these junior clubs that exist in the US, and
they're all sort of separated. There's not really a ton
(05:32):
of scale, if you will, and what that comes with
is lack of investment and sometimes consistency.
Speaker 5 (05:37):
And so it was.
Speaker 1 (05:39):
Really very early on before we probably even came up
with the name Love that we felt very strongly that
the entire sport was undercommercialized and the fans were underserved.
And so for us to start with youth was actually
quite natural because that's where we're the most vibrant.
Speaker 5 (05:56):
Participation.
Speaker 1 (05:57):
Consumption already existed, and we felt very strongly that that
could also present in this opportunity to build an entire
brand for the entire ecosystem that creates as I mentioned,
this journey of belonging from youth to pro and to
purposely say no, we're not starting with pro. I mean,
you guys come across so many different startup leagues, right,
(06:18):
and a lot of times that rushing into something at
the pro level without having had the luxury or the
benefit of building it layer by layer, step by stet
brick by brick, that does sometimes lead into an unsustainability.
And for us to really kind of corral this foundation
of a network of clubs that have this day and
(06:40):
day out consumption at the youth level just created this
huge opportunity for us to drive lifetime consumption of volleyball
as opposed to just one part of it.
Speaker 4 (06:49):
Yeah, so, Kaylene, One of the things with my background,
I spent the first half of my life with Major
League Baseball that's been around for over one hundred years.
I think the back nine hopefully would be a lot
of NBA that's been around for over set twenty five years.
Speaker 2 (07:01):
Now.
Speaker 4 (07:01):
These are two blue chip companies. You're the epitome a
blue chip with your background Northwestern undergrad, Harvard Business School,
then you go to Sophora Bain lou Lemon. How do
you think about blue chip companies that we just mentioned
compared to a starter and what do you have to
do a little bit different to grab people's attentions, investors, etc.
Speaker 5 (07:22):
Well, first off, thank you.
Speaker 1 (07:24):
I think that we have this intentionality of building Love
as a legacy leak, and the characteristics of legacy leagues
are they're here to stay, they weather the storm, they
weather the up and downs, and I think that has to.
Speaker 5 (07:38):
Be built off of a really strong foundation. And that was.
Speaker 1 (07:41):
Exactly the justification, if you will, or the inspiration to say,
we have an opportunity to do this in a way
that felt very grounded, very disciplined, because we have a
very clear vision of this being a legacy leak.
Speaker 5 (07:57):
Success would be that this outlasts all of us.
Speaker 1 (08:00):
Right, this isn't just one person's league or here the
co founding team. No, this this is about each of
us are here and the time that we're here, we're
creating it to be even stronger so that it outlasts
for generations. So there are kids' kids get to experience
it the way that they get to experience the Bulls.
I mean, I grew up in Chicago and my identity
is deeply rooted in the nineties Chicago Bulls.
Speaker 5 (08:23):
And so, however, you know, the success or.
Speaker 1 (08:26):
Lack of success or has been I could be in
London and I see somebody in a Bulls jersey and
I want to go up and talk to them because
we share something that is emotional, that's about a sense
of belonging and identity. And so I think that all
startup leagues should be thinking about what is the legacy
you're creating and how do you create that legacy in
a sustainable way. And I think that intentionality is really
(08:48):
coming through both in terms of what we have done
in five and a half years of building this youth
and junior club foundation, as well as having the patients
and the luxury if you well, of being in discussion
with our founding athletes starting when they were still in
Tokyo or getting prep for Tokyo Games, to say we're
(09:08):
building a league together. We're going about this differently. Would
you like to come along for this ride and how
would you like to give us the input to say,
if you were building league with that used to pro mindset,
this whole journey of belong in consumption, how would you
do it? And many of them were already situated in
Europe where they see that used to pro connection already
(09:30):
playing out in front of their eyes.
Speaker 2 (09:32):
Yeah, you know, Caitlyn, you mentioned something and I saw this.
Speaker 3 (09:35):
When I went to First SERF in Atlanta, sort of
the emotional reaction that these athletes have had to a
league being built where there wasn't one before. And it's
almost like a thought exercise for you, Alex to a
staid to be like, so you're playing baseball, but there
is no MLB, you know, and so like you have
(09:57):
to go abroad to make your living, and then all
this sudden someone says, you know what, We're going to
create major League Baseball. You can play in Miami. Like
it's a little mind bending to think about. But that
I mean, Caitlin and my right, I mean that was
essentially what was happening with these athletes who would go
and they'd play in Nebraska in front of ninety one
thousand people, but then to be a pro they'd have
(10:19):
to go live in Russia.
Speaker 5 (10:21):
Right, Yes, that was.
Speaker 1 (10:22):
Mind boggling to me, even you know, five and a
half years ago. Because Team USA women's indoor team has
meddled twenty years in a row. They're the best in
the world. And so you go from Nebraska in these
incredible collegiate settings.
Speaker 5 (10:38):
And then boom, you're gone.
Speaker 1 (10:40):
You're off to Turkyer, Italy, Russia, Korea, Japan, Brazil. But
you're not here, certainly, not at the level where you know,
we have ninety percent of our athletes represent their own countries, right,
So that's national leveled right in the Olympics exactly, so
as well as the equivalent of World Cups, right, that
(11:01):
happened every year. And so when you think about that level,
and especially for the predominantly US players that are in
our league, that's like you're playing at the NBA level,
but there isn't an NBA. So you play abroad in
other leagues for other countries, and then every year for
the World Cup equivalent or every four years, you're coming
(11:23):
back during your breaks to say, I want to represent
my country, but we don't have an opportunity for all
these athletes to be playing together in their home soil.
So Dream Team goes and wins medals coming back and
there's no NBA level. Now there are other leagues, obviously
since we started this at the youth level, that have
entered the space, but certainly not at the same level
(11:44):
of play as these Olympians, where ninety percent of them
are representing their home country and now they're coming and
playing the NBA volleyball here in the US.
Speaker 4 (11:53):
Yeah, I guess my next question is part statement, part question.
But do you think that part of what has you
so excited is the tailwinds? I mean, think about where
we are today in twenty twenty five versus even thirty
years ago. My parents would never take my sister to
a ballgame, right, it was just me and my buddies.
And today I couldn't imagine any of my friends just
(12:16):
taking their boys to Miami Heat game or Miami Dolphin.
Is always the boys and the girls, they all go together.
Do you think that the fan base, the consumer, the tailwinds,
the WNBA, all of this is in your favor as
far as storytelling, capital raising, etc.
Speaker 1 (12:33):
Absolutely true that this has been an amazing tailwind. Also
true that five and a half years ago this wasn't
exactly what you see today, so we really have benefited
from that since then. But the idea the vision the
start of our execution of building the strong foundation that
came from us just looking around and saying, Wow, we
(12:56):
have this incredibly popular sport that is completely under served.
What can we do about it with the purpose and
profit approach in mind of helping drive better life outcomes
through the commercial success that we can create.
Speaker 5 (13:10):
So this is an.
Speaker 1 (13:11):
Added bonus and one that's really I think overdue and
so exciting. I think a lot of it is driven
from a lot of the levers that you guys talk
about on this show, disaggregation of media, new patterns of consumption,
the recognition from brands that women's sports in particular represents
a really creative and very uniquely compelling way for brands
(13:32):
to come in and build that affinity with audience that
are watching women's sports, so that that partnership really becomes
less of just eyeballs and broad based recognition, but a
lot of depth and building that relationship with the fans
for the sponsors slash partners of these incredible leaks.
Speaker 3 (14:05):
All right, so let's get into the deal of it
all as it were, and talk about, you know, putting
this together as a business, and then you know, you
and your partners and I think especially Peter Hirshman going
out on the road and raising money for this, Like,
how do you even, you know, start that process of
(14:25):
knowing who you're going to talk to, knowing how you're
going to approach, what the pitch is going to be.
Speaker 2 (14:30):
Take us inside those early days.
Speaker 1 (14:32):
Yes, it seems like forever ago, but really it's just
been five and a half years of three rounds of
fundraising with some.
Speaker 3 (14:39):
Really well five and a half years, I mean, that's
that's not a short amount of time.
Speaker 5 (14:44):
You know, it's not.
Speaker 1 (14:44):
And it's been really an incredible experience of meeting folks
along the way that even if it's initially not the
right timing for what their investment thesis is that over time,
as they watch us execute up what we have laid
out years ago, I do believe that that creates a
sense of trust, It creates a sense of confidence and
(15:08):
your ability to set a really strong.
Speaker 5 (15:10):
And ambitious vision.
Speaker 1 (15:11):
As you mentioned, Jason, not everyone decides to take on
two really robust areas of opportunity here, both at the
junior level as well as at the pro level, and
all the other things that can come of it. Once
you have those two very important cornerstone set, which we
now do five and a half years later. So I'd
(15:31):
say that we've never wavered around our sequencing of Foundation first,
then the halo of the brand next, which is at
the pro level, and that journey has been one that
has been very purposely laid out in very sort of
structured fashion of what are all the milestones we want
to hit and so for having that laid out very
(15:52):
clearly and not deviating from it, and it kind of
just makes sense when you're thinking about driving lifetime consumption
and you start with youth and you go into pro
next with the best possible quality of play on the court,
all of that and thing made a lot of sense,
especially for folks that really look at it not just
as a pure sports opportunity, but one that's really driving
(16:16):
a holistic consumption opportunity. So you know, it's as much
of an entertainment product as it is a competition product,
a training product. And now merchandising has become a big
component of how we're engaging with our fans because we've
taken a very lifestyle as well as competitive approach on
what we're offering in our sort of budding program of
(16:40):
merchandising where you're actually wearing the league name in addition
to having the team names. Opportunities you don't really see
that in NWSL or the NFL or the MBA. That
comes sort of next, well below, kind of where you
your fan base typically engage at, which is at the
team level, and we think that there's an opportunity for
(17:00):
us to create it where it can be at each level.
Speaker 4 (17:03):
So, Caitlin, I'm fascinated by this question. I'm going to
ask you, and I think our listeners will be two.
If you think about you've raised, as I understand, one
hundred and sixty million dollars over three rounds of raising capital,
let's just divide them into three silos, three buckets. You
have institutional capital, you have family offices, and then you
have celebrities slash athletes. I guess my question to you
(17:27):
is what's the contrast or is it better yet like
one size fits all? Or is it more of a
tailor made approach the way you contrast institutional versus family
offices versus celebrities athletes.
Speaker 1 (17:39):
It's a really good question because we've experienced different indexing
of those three categories depending on the rounds, Right, earlier rounds.
In terms of the capital that you need, it doesn't
really hit the radar some of the larger growth equity
or even above that in terms of kind of middle
of the road if you will, you know, private equity firms,
(18:01):
And that's really more of a mechanical differentiation. But I
think in terms of, you know, what folks are looking
for in their investment, both from celebrities, individuals, family offices
to institutional capital. Interestingly, I actually don't think there's a
huge difference. I think it's an appetite for risk in
(18:21):
the stage, but in terms of what they're actually looking for,
they're typically all looking for a really sizable market, right
it's the size of the addressable market, and we have
a huge one. They're also looking for what is your
business model, what is the talent on the team? You
know you mentioned Peter Hirshman. You know, he and I
met at Bay many years ago. We also have Kevin
(18:43):
Wong who has lived and breathed for decades. He himself
is an Olympian on the beach side, but started with indoor.
And also you know broadcasts on NBC for the Beach Olympics,
and that's just symbolic of all of the people that
we've corralled, both on the working team as well as
added benefit of these incredible youth club directors and owners
(19:06):
who have come into Love and helping us build all
of this, and all of that is information networks and
access to capital conversations, and so for us, it was
actually more so that we are being really clear about
what our envision is, but the fact that you can't
actually get there overnight.
Speaker 5 (19:24):
Nothing breaksthrough happens overnight.
Speaker 1 (19:26):
But it's really this methodical approach of what are we
doing this year, how we're thinking about the launch in
four years, and having a ton of those conversations with
the athletes, with the club directors, with the national team
coaches to really get the benefit of all of that
brain trust. And I think that's what was reflected in
all of our pitches, is a diversity of connections in
(19:50):
and outside of volleyball, in and outside of sports, and
the fact that we're very intentional about the Love brand.
Speaker 4 (19:58):
And a quick follow up there, I see some of
your noteworthy investors, Lindsay Vaughan, the great Candas Parker that
was on the deal, Amy Schumer. These are as big
as names as you can find. Are you pitching usually
to the business manager or do they actually make an appearance,
And if they do make an appearance, do they ask questions?
Speaker 1 (20:15):
They ask incredibly insightful questions because they have the lived
experience of being in highly pressurized environments. They've seen a
ton of these pitches come across their desks, and the
celebrities themselves, the high profile folks themselves as well as
their business teams, and we welcome that because they all have,
(20:38):
you know, collectively, really great insights. When you take Candas
Parker or even Jason Tatum for example, they all have
real personal connections to the sport. Canada's Parker had played
volleyball very competitively until she was a sophomore, and I
think some sort of negotiation or conversation happened with her
and her dad is like, you gotta pig one because
(21:00):
you're going to be playing at the highest level. And
it's too bad that love was and around. We didn't
have the NBA or the WNBA of volleyball for her
to play in. And Jason Tatum's mom actually was already
on her way to a D one scholarship and she
has a really kind of deep connection with the sport,
and she was really really competitive in that sport. So
(21:22):
there's family connections to the sport. In Jason's case, so
Amy Schumer played volleyball, and I think actually in her
show she has a character that plays volleyball. So there
is so much incredibly sort of genuine connection to the sport.
So that there is sort of this I'm going to
zoom out and hear what this unique opportunity is not
(21:45):
just an investment, but what you're trying to create in
the impact for the sport that is both for purpose
and for profit. So we're very fortunate to have that
level of connection to our investors in general.
Speaker 3 (21:57):
Yeah, wow, Alex, I mean that's like it's a sliding do.
I mean, just think the entire Candace Parker episode of
The Deal could have been about her being, you know,
this generational talent and volleyball.
Speaker 2 (22:08):
I mean, like unbelievable exact, it is amazing.
Speaker 3 (22:11):
I mean, as we were going through this, I did
note to Alex that you have a lot of members
of what we call the Deal cinematic universe, and you're
on your cap table. You have kandas Parker, you have
Billy Jean King, and Alana. You have I believe Carolyn
Tish Blodgett and next three as part of your investor
group as well, all who have appeared.
Speaker 2 (22:29):
On the deal.
Speaker 3 (22:30):
Just to be clear, so clearly we're doing the right
thing because we're talking to very smart investors and athletes
turned investors. I wonder how we got to that. I mean, oh, yeah, right, Alex,
I forgot about it. I forgot, I forgot we have
the og is one of the hosts of Filly Mate,
Luck and Talent. Yeah, yes, exactly exactly, But it is
interesting to think about, you know, sort of how they
(22:53):
got there. But you know, one thing that I wanted
to make sure we talked about a little bit, Caitlin,
is sort of how you got here.
Speaker 2 (22:58):
You know, we touched on it a little bit.
Speaker 3 (23:01):
And I do wonder as you reflect on this, you know,
almost six years into this journey. You know, Alex mentioned
your educational pedigree of the highest level, but also working
in consumer brands like Sephora and Lululemon, consulting with Bain, Like,
what are your reflections on sort of this moment in
your career. Because I think about a lot of our
listeners who they dream of doing something like this. You know,
(23:25):
they're working for big companies they may admire, but you know,
to go out and start something new in sports, there's
this you know, movement afoot of understanding the role that
sports plays in the broader culture, Like have you even
had a minute to sort of reflect on that for yourself?
Speaker 1 (23:39):
Only recently, I would say, having had the opportunity to
reflect on it.
Speaker 5 (23:44):
And it really kind of comes down.
Speaker 1 (23:46):
To this not necessarily being one of the kids say
these days, this was not in my bingo card. Yeah,
this was not in my bingo card. I have not
Alex Rodriguez level, not even close. Wasn't d one bound
for any sport. But maybe I'll come back to this
idea of I really think of sports as a business
of belonging. You know, I came to the States at
(24:08):
age twelve. You know, my mother being the reason that
we moved to the Stays. She was a physicist and
her job has you know, taken us a very very
drastic turn from a life that I would have lived
and my brother and myself would have lived if we
stayed in China. So her role, her profession really changed
the trajectory of our families lives and you know, to
(24:31):
this day, I think that has been a very strong
impact on how I think about what that purpose with
the capital P would be still thinking about what I
do when I grow up and along the way, you know,
having had the great opportunities that I've had in both
educational as well as professional settings, you just meet incredible
people and those relationships. Once you start to get into
(24:53):
a certain stage in your career, you're starting to connect
the dots and then also being a little bit more
clear about what are the things that motivate you. And
to me, this idea of being involved in a business
that is really about a business of belonging and that's
brought me so much joy just being a fan of
basketball growing up in Chicago in the nineties. Again not
a great athlete myself, but felt like, despite the language barrier,
(25:17):
I was able to feel a sense of belonging by
trying out different sports because you actually didn't even need
the verbal communication to feel belonging with your teammates. And
that's the sense of purpose that we think about in
driving and building love. And I'm just really grateful that
relationships got you know, this group of great founders coming
together and that you know, I've been part of really
(25:40):
driving a legacy creation that will hopefully outlast all of us.
Speaker 4 (25:45):
So sticking with you, Caitlin, as you think about your
great career that you've had going back to Harvard Business School,
bands for lul Lemon, which of those four do you
think you drew the most experience to help create love.
Speaker 1 (26:00):
I've actually never thought of it that way because so
much of it is really the culmination of all of it.
But perhaps one that stuck out at the time that
we were deciding what is the business model, because it's
very easy to just say, well, all these startup leagues
start with pro and then you go back and you
made the connection for fan base or for other reasons
into the youth and starting with youth. This idea of
(26:23):
grassroots up first really came from the most recent exposure
that I had by running globally commerce at Lululemon, where
I was maybe even shocked to find that there wasn't
a marketing department per se.
Speaker 5 (26:37):
It was really labeled community. It was all about getting
the community to corral around.
Speaker 1 (26:42):
This brand, and so it was a lot more about
depth than it was about breath, and that was very
different than a lot of other certain athletic brands or
other megabrands that have done a lot more emphasis on
tops down marketing as opposed to grass roots up marketing.
You know, the example I would give is that in
(27:03):
many cases, especially in the early years, Lululemon started with
really a pilate studio. For example, it might be even
a makeshift one that was only a six month short
term rental. And that's how they developed new markets or
new neighborhoods where they would bring in influencers from those
particular neighborhoods just so that they could yes, be doing
(27:25):
yoga together pilates, but then there's a rack of clothes
from lul Lemon where you're getting input. You're getting to
know their life stories and what functions do they care about,
down to by the time that they do open the
permanent space, what do you see on the wall. You
see actually local influencers. You see local heroes in you know,
(27:45):
various walks of the sporting life and the run clubs
still meet there at six am in the morning.
Speaker 5 (27:50):
You know.
Speaker 1 (27:51):
Regionally, they also had people who engaged with the community
specifically so that they're drawing into the grassroots influence as
opposed to tops down in pure digital marketing. So we felt
very strongly, especially sort of digging a little bit deeper
into what are the relevant learnings there that you know,
I think that helped us to double down on this
(28:13):
grassroots up approach.
Speaker 2 (28:14):
That's so interesting.
Speaker 3 (28:15):
You know, one thing that strikes me as you talk about,
you know, the business of belonging. And you know, the
other thing that I really do feel like I witnessed
there in Atlanta. I mean one and Alex you'll drive
with this, you know, one was the sort of the
support from the broader Atlanta sports community. You know, It's
(28:35):
like the president of the Atlanta Dream is there and
Derek Schiller, the CEO of the Atlanta Braves, like they're
there sort of showing support, which was interesting to sort
of see.
Speaker 2 (28:43):
The sports ecosystem.
Speaker 3 (28:45):
But also, and I think this goes all the way
back to the question of like why these certain markets
there was such a sense of sort of joy and
anticipation and excitement in the arena that evening from the fans.
And I do wonder, you know, Caitlin, as we start
(29:06):
to wrap up the conversation, like what are you taking
from the fans? You have developed this community and sort
of plugged into it in a way from the club
and the youth level. But what do you take away
from the fans and how does that inform where you
take the league from here? What have you learned so
far from the people who are in the seats.
Speaker 1 (29:28):
The most important lesson we're learning is that if you
are true to your intentionality of building a community, anything
as possible, and that community is a community of youth
clubs and their families. I mean, we had close to
nineteen thousand athletes and their families in our junior clubs
and that's expected to double probably in the next year
(29:50):
year and a half and goes from there as well
as us having had this intentionality of engaging with the
collegiate program and their athletes and their coaches engaging with
other sports. I mean, ultimately, the power really is in
the community. Why, Because relationships built, that's connected, fans activated,
(30:13):
all of those pieces, I think validate the fact that
starting with the community up was absolutely the right choice.
Even if it wasn't a choice that many others have
or anyone else has ever made, it felt right For
volleyball in particular, I mean, this is a sport where
your opponents are on the other side of the net.
You've got six starters on one side of the net
(30:33):
choreographing the most beautiful plays, right, And it's really a
special sport where it's deeply rooted in that sense of
belonging and coming together. I mean, win or lose, they
come together for each point to encourage each other. So
it's being true to who we are. It's always been
about community. That's what I think the power will continue
(30:54):
to be as we continue to grow.
Speaker 2 (31:08):
All right, so should we hit the lightning round? Alex? Yes,
let's do it. You're reading, okay? I am five questions.
Speaker 3 (31:14):
The only thing we say is keep it tight and
we'll bounce it back and forth.
Speaker 2 (31:18):
I'll start and then Alex will pick it up. Are
you reading?
Speaker 5 (31:20):
Let's go?
Speaker 2 (31:21):
No pressure?
Speaker 5 (31:21):
All right, no pressure.
Speaker 3 (31:22):
What's the best piece of advice you've ever received on
deal making or business?
Speaker 1 (31:26):
Being authentic, being true to who you are and tune
out the noise.
Speaker 4 (31:30):
Who's your dream deal making partner?
Speaker 3 (31:34):
Oh?
Speaker 5 (31:34):
I already have it my co founding team.
Speaker 3 (31:36):
So maybe someone you haven't worked with yet, but you
sort of imagine working with.
Speaker 5 (31:41):
Oh Man, that is an interesting Beyonce.
Speaker 3 (31:45):
Oh, that's a good one, right, ants that could be
the best answer we've gotten to that that question.
Speaker 1 (31:49):
Thanks all right, I'm also manifesting if you can't tell.
Speaker 4 (31:52):
Yeah, that's what we do with the deal.
Speaker 3 (31:56):
I love it exactly. We love deals that Lets start
on the deal. What's the most nervous you've ever been.
Speaker 5 (32:01):
Caitlin the weekend before first surf?
Speaker 4 (32:04):
What's your hype song before you go into a big
meeting or a negotiation?
Speaker 1 (32:09):
Not a very cool one, but I want to dance
with somebody by Whitney Houston.
Speaker 2 (32:14):
Oh well, that's good. That's a good one.
Speaker 3 (32:16):
And what's your advice for someone who might be listening
who wants to do what you've done?
Speaker 1 (32:22):
Take care of the relationships you have, be intentional about
developing those with people you admire, and connect the dots.
Speaker 3 (32:30):
All right, really good? I think that could be the
best lightning round we've ever done. Sorry, everyone else who's
been on the shack, Kaitlyn, good, this.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
Is a treat. I'd been really looking forward.
Speaker 3 (32:40):
To this, especially since we got to spend some time
together at the First Serve. Really really fun, Excited for
what you're building and can't wait to see where it
goes from here.
Speaker 2 (32:48):
Thank you for joining us.
Speaker 5 (32:49):
Thank you both. Great to be here.
Speaker 4 (32:51):
Thank you. And I can't wait to go to a match.
I'm excited.
Speaker 2 (32:54):
Yeah, you got to go. It's such a vibe. It's
such a vibe. It's so fun.
Speaker 1 (32:58):
Alex, we're trying to get you guys to our finals
in Kentucky. So Louisville on April thirteenth is our finals.
Speaker 5 (33:05):
Okay, so that'll be just as exciting, if not more
sale than our first serve.
Speaker 4 (33:10):
You got it.
Speaker 3 (33:18):
The Deal is hosted by Alex Rodriguez and me Jason Kelly.
This episode was made by Anna Maazarakus, Stacey Wong, and
Lizzie Phillip. Amy Keene is our editor. Our theme music
is made by Blake Maples. Our executive producers are Kelly Leferrier,
Ashley Honig, and Brenda Neonham. Sage Bauman is the head
of Bloomberg Podcasts. Additional support from Rachel Carnivali and Elena
(33:40):
sos Angeles. Thanks so much for listening to the Deal.
If you have a minute, subscribe, rate and review our show.
It'll help other listeners find us. I'm Jason Kelly. See
you next week.
Popular Podcasts
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!
Stuff You Should Know
If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com