April 2, 2025 • 46 mins
Doug Kobold, civil engineer & ED of the California Product Stewardship Council for 7 yrs, & his staff take concrete actions to decrease climate changes in measurable ways, tackling approaches to Old Textiles on reuse, repair, recycle options, 7 Single-Use Vaping Devices in CA. He spent 18 years w/ Sacramento County managing contracts, procurement, new recycling programs, HHW, & pending legislation; for 3 yrs he provided statewide consulting on solid waste & for 5 managed Yolo County’s landfill.
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It's Your Voice is broadcast live Wednesdays at 8PM ET Music on W4CY Radio (www.w4cy.com) part of Talk 4 Radio (www.talk4radio.com) on the Talk 4 Media Network (www.talk4media.com). It's Your Voice is viewed on Talk 4 TV (www.talk4tv.com).
It's Your Voice Podcast is also available on Talk 4 Media (www.talk4media.com), Talk 4 Podcasting (www.talk4podcasting.com), iHeartRadio, Amazon Music, Pandora, Spotify, Audible, and over 100 other podcast outlets.
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
The topics and opinions expressed in the following show are
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We make no recommendations or endorsements for radio show programs, services,
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Y Radio or its employees or affiliates. Any questions or
comments should be directed to those show hosts. Thank you
(00:20):
for choosing W four c Y Radioistic Let's Speak show.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
In lot, Let's breech in lot, Let's preach all in lot,
Let's breech and lot, let.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
In a lot of Hello, and welcome to It's Your Voice,
the show that hosts enrich conversations in diversity. My name
is Bihia Yaxon. I'm a diversity educator and a core
aliment coach, which means I support organizations and individuals in
aligning their actions with their values. If you're interested in
(01:15):
looking at some of the offerings I have, you can
check out my website at Know what you Want Coaching
dot worpress dot com. I'm super excited today to have
a guest we've had on before, Doug Cobold, and he
is worth the California Product Stewardship Council. I'm going to
read his bio in a minute, but I just want
(01:36):
to kind of a segue into his introduction. I just
want to encourage any listeners or viewers who have not
who did not get to witness one minute of a
record breaking floor speech by Senator Corey Booker. It's so empowering,
it's so encouraging, it's so inspiring. I'm sure there's all
kinds of clips on YouTube. Don't expect you to rewatch
(01:59):
twenty five hours and four minutes, but that's how long
it was and how powerful it was. And I referred
several times to John Lewis's dictate of make good trouble.
When you see something's not right, do something about it,
and my guest definitely does that. So Doug, welcome to
the show.
Speaker 4 (02:17):
I really am happy that you're here today and inspired
by you and your.
Speaker 3 (02:22):
Staff, And in my opinion, you guys are making good
trouble because you're seeing, you're thinking preventatively for climate resilience,
preventing negative climate change, and for the planet and all
the living creatures on the planet. So thanks for letting
me just refer to you as a trouble maker. It's
(02:43):
it's a huge compliment, and I think we should all
be troublemakers in such good ways.
Speaker 5 (02:47):
Thanks for being here.
Speaker 4 (02:49):
Thank you.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
So I'm going to tell you the title of this
show is hard to Manage Products? What's next for climate?
Doug has been, in his words, talking trash for over
thirty years. To August twenty eighteen, he has and continues
to be the executive director for the California Product Stewardship Council.
He will update us on concrete actions he and his
staff are taking to decrease climate changes in measurable ways,
(03:14):
tackling approaches to old textiles, on related to reuse, repair,
recycle options, and taking on single use vaping devices initiatives
in California. Previously, Doug spent over eighteen years with Sacramento
County managing contracts, procurement, new recycling programs, DEVELOPMENTHW which you'll
(03:37):
have to explain what that is, and pending legislation legislation.
Spent nearly three years with Edgar and Associates providing solid
waste consulting services statewide and over five years with Yolo
County managing the county's landfill. He holds a civil engineering
degree from California State University, Chico. That's a lot of experience.
Speaker 5 (04:00):
It sounds like, you know, Bill, you.
Speaker 4 (04:04):
Well, thank you again for being here.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
And I know we wanted to talk about at least
two of the initiatives and maybe start with the older
one from last year related to old textiles that you
and your staff put together and helped me.
Speaker 5 (04:18):
Cappen Absolutely, yeah, so thanks again for having me on
your show. I'd love to chat with you in your audience.
The bill that he is referring to is Senate Bill
seven O seven by Senator Newman, and we passed that
through the legislature last year and got up to the
governor for signature and he signed it. That bill is
(04:38):
what we call an Extended Producer Responsibility bill focused on
textile waste, and so textile waste is pretty much everything
that but he is wearing I'm wearing today, shoes, handbags,
It can be hospitality linens, which would be tablecloths, napkins, bedsheets, pillows,
(05:01):
if you think about it, if it's in the if
it's in the motel room, it could be washed. It
can also it also is called textile waste. At the
end of the day, belts are also part of that versus.
So the law covers a great deal of different textile
type materials that typically a lot of them end up
at thrift stores. When we're done with them. They go
(05:22):
to a thrift store, and the thrift store sorts through them,
tries to find what they can sell in their storefronts,
in their brick and mortar storefronts, and whatever they can't sell,
they end up bailing in a bail and shipping off
to a second or third world country, or possibly just
landfilling if it's too nasty or whatever. We thought it
was good and it just isn't useful to anybody, they'll
(05:44):
probably end up in the landfill here in California and
one of the landfills in California. But if it ends
up over in another country such as like Ghana or
other countries. Ghana has had a huge problem with the
extra textile waste going there because those bales get broke open.
The the usable sellable shirts, et cetera. Are sold on
(06:09):
roadside stands. You probably you may have seen that been
in those countries or otherwise it ends up on the
side of the road. And then in Chile they actually
burn the big textile burn files, and so you can
imagine what does doing to our climate. That's so we
obviously wanted to fix this problem best we could. One
of the issues with the thrift stores not being able
(06:32):
to resell these products is say I'm wearing a button
down shirt and I lose a button off that shirt.
If I turn that into the thrift store, that's a
nice thing to do, but they can't do anything with
it either, because they have no funding to be able
to put us find a new button, sew it on
there and then put it out in their storefront and
hope it sells. So what they end up doing is
putting that in that bail and then it might or
(06:52):
might not be used in another country, or it might
end up in a pile going to bad things. So
what the bill SB seven oh seven does is it
focuses on reuse and repair. First. It requires the producers
of all of our all of our fashions are textile fashions,
(07:13):
to be responsible for the end of life air of
these products. And so if it if it needs a button,
there's funding behind that So basically what will happen is
each manufacturer will pay a certain amount of money for
each clothing item or each tablecloth, each sheet, or our
napkin into a fund that is then used to support
(07:35):
the recycling and repair and recycling infrastructure. If it's reused,
they don't. They just need to try and get it
to reuse, real reuse more it's actually resold and actually
reused and step in commerce. If it has to be
repaired or if it has to be recycled, that's where
the producers are going to come in and they're going
to be required to actually fund that program, fund and
(07:55):
run that program to make sure those those textiles are
either repaired and put back into or they're going to
be recycled. And we like, we'd love to see if
it's upcycled that it should go to upcycling first.
Speaker 4 (08:06):
So the.
Speaker 5 (08:09):
Industry has to follow the waste hierarchy, which means reduce, reuse.
We like to assert repair in there, recycle and then
dispose if necessary, and so disposed being the last last resort.
So and I would also characterize shipping it offshore is
almost equal in a disbowl. So that's it's it may
(08:31):
get a little bit of recycled at the other end,
but not really so that bill again, it got passed
last year and I had no opposition. One hundred and
eighty different organizations supported that bill and had zero opposition
when it was presented for the last voting in both
the Senate and the Assembly. So that's uncharacteristic bill like ours.
(08:55):
And the governor had person had no problem signing that bill.
Of course with no opposition, he would have a hard
time justifying why you wouldn't sign it. And then the
regulatory process, the informal regulatory process is starting this year
to start establishing the rules around the law and how
this The stewardship organization that will run this program for
(09:16):
the state will enough for the state now the state
of California, but we'll run the program in the state.
They have to have certain rules and then they have
to come up with a plan on how they're going
to meet the rule of the law and also the
regulations which will dictate certain things they have to do
like reuse, repair, certain collection convenience standards. So we require
(09:40):
certain amount of collection points without throughout the state, within
every county to make sure it's almost as convenient to
take your old item back and recycle it than it
is to buy it. Because if it's if it's not
convenient enough, it's going to end up in the garbage camp,
or it's going to end up in the recyclement where
it shouldn't be places or shouldn't go is where it's
(10:01):
going to end up. And that's unfortunate, and we want
to try to avoid that. So that was a heavy lift. Fortunately,
I had I have a young lady on staff who
is a PhD in textile science, and so she was
the lead of that bill. It'd be probably better for
her to me talking to you today about that bill
than meet. But she got her master's here in Davis
(10:22):
and our master's enter PhD here in Davis, and so
she was a great person to lead that the lead
that effort, and she continues to lead that effort. We
actually have a working committee that is a stakeholder group
that's statewide and actually national now to help to in
form the regulators as they developed the regulations. And that
(10:42):
includes all kinds of stakeholders that might be interested in
the textile waste in the program in California. And I
should note that this law was the first one in
North America, and it was the second one in the
world that mandated the producer fund and run this design
and run this program. There is another law in I
(11:05):
believe it's in uh in one of the European countries
other than France, that is voluntary. So that's why I
didn't include that. Are the two laws France and Californias
are both mandatory because we find the voluntary doesn't always work.
So only if they really want to do it do
they actually do it, especially if it's going to cost
(11:25):
them money. So anyway, that was the textile bill and
what's happening with that, But again it's I think it's
going to be a really great program for California. Oh
and by the way, it also relies on the thrift stores,
So the thrift stores are still going to be your
go to place if you want. But if your store,
for if your retail store has a take back program
now for their their products, that will continue as well.
(11:47):
So it's not going to disrupt the existing infrastructure that's
our collection infrastructure. It's just going to improve upon it.
Speaker 4 (11:53):
Wow.
Speaker 5 (11:54):
So that's that was Textiles.
Speaker 3 (11:57):
That's amazing that it seems so broad, broad sweeping and
so to meet.
Speaker 4 (12:03):
For me to be clear, it does sound like a
huge and heavy lift.
Speaker 3 (12:08):
So some of that it's still in the design, like
figuring out the regulations and the committee of regulators establishing it.
Speaker 4 (12:17):
It's still not completely established, is that right?
Speaker 5 (12:21):
Right? Right? So what do we do with these bills?
Because these are heavy lifts, they are they take a
lot of work in the background to get the program
up and running. We usually give four years from the
data passage to when the program should be starting to
be implemented. The state agency that's going to be providing
the oversight on this particular program, this cal Recycle, it's
(12:43):
our state waste agency, Waste and Recycling Agency CAW Recycle
has to do what we call informal rule making, where
they go and they solicit all kinds of feedback from
stakeholders across the spectrum to make sure that the regulations
that they draft and adopt pursuing to the law are
(13:03):
going to work and they're going to make sense. So
they'll they'll spend.
Speaker 6 (13:07):
A year doing that and then if that if that
doesn't work, expecially once that's done, then they'll go into
what we call formal rule making, and in the formal
rule making process.
Speaker 5 (13:18):
It's much more concise. There's less back and forth. It's
more about here's the regulations. All stakeholders get to comment
on them. They revise the regulations as they see necessary
to meet the antent of the law. Sometimes they can't
make changes because they don't have the statutory authority to
do that. It wasn't in the law to begin with.
(13:38):
So sometimes that can require clean up legislation later on
another bill to clean up the last bill. We do
have that from time to time. And then once the
regulations are finalized, then they go to the Office Administrative
Law for California who then reuse them, make sure it
works for all statutes, it's it's going and has no
conflicts with any other arts of existing law. And then
(14:02):
once they recommend its adoption and the state the par
cycle can adopt the regulations, then they become official. Then
that starts the plan process, and the plan process to
run this kind of a program is we give them
about nine months to get the plan together. They have
to get their members together. Hopefully they're already working on
that during the regulations process too, but they're trying to
(14:23):
figure out all the parties that are obligated under the law.
They have to bring them in, get them all signed
up because they're going to be paid into the program,
and they're developing the plan. So they got to develop
the plan around the regulations and the law, but also
around what the membership of the organization is going to require,
and then finalize that plan and then they can start implementation.
(14:46):
And then we usually give them at least a half
a year or a year to ramp up for implementation,
getting the program running, and then that kind of starts
the clock that they have to start being compliant with
the law. So it's about a four year process. Not
it's not an easy thing to do, but at least
we know in four years we're going to have.
Speaker 4 (15:06):
Something going that's that sounds tremendous.
Speaker 3 (15:09):
And how do you like, so, like does this include
all producers of textiles in California? Like, like, how many
producers are will be have to become accountable to this,
to these guidelines and regulations established?
Speaker 4 (15:25):
Is there?
Speaker 5 (15:27):
It's not, it's not just California. Yeah, it's so a
lot of the lot of the clothing we buy comes
from offshore, of course, and we don't have any we
have a cow recycle. The state has no influence or
has no enforcement capabilities for offshore entities, it has to
be a uh So what we do is we design
(15:49):
the law around who is bringing it into the state
so once it hits the state, because we can't enforce
beyond our own state boundaries. And so if you are
a like Target, I will pick on them just because
but I think they're going to be just fine. Target
has their own brand, and so when Target brings that item,
that article of clothing into the California marketplace, they are
(16:12):
now obligated under the law or that item because they
are brands. So if we can't get the producer, if
there's producers in California, then we can get them. So
if they're outside of California, it's less likely we're going
to be able to enforce on them. We've being calorcycle
of the state agency. So that but as long as
(16:33):
we can get somebody, so we either we go after
producer first. Our hierarchy, our kind of teared structure is
producers first, then first importer. So because folks can they
can bring material in that's already branded and ready to
come in, So we'll get the first importer of that,
or we'll get the brands, and so there might be
brand on the shirts or pants or whatever that come in,
(16:54):
and then they need they get a brand on them
by an entity here in either North Erica, California, you know,
the United States or California. So we'll get them under
the brands, and then we go down the list, and
at some point we may even get the retailers. But
typically the only time you're going to get the retailers
is when the retailer is the brand, like a Target,
for example, or a Walmart or something like that. So
(17:17):
we get a super majority of it. The one area
that we're still struggling with, and this is a struggle
in the law as well, is when you have direct consumer.
So TIMU, if you're familiar with TIMU, TIMU is a
direct to consumer type of operation. They will ship directly
from the producer in say Asia or another country, straight
(17:40):
to the consumer. Well, now there's no way to get
to that, and so those are we're still trying to
figure out how because those become free riders in the program,
and so how do we deal with the direct to
consumer and that we're hoping we'll try to figure out
in the regulations process. But that's the only kind of
escapee that we know of is going to happen. But otherwise,
prety much eyody else is going to be captured one
(18:01):
way or the other.
Speaker 4 (18:03):
That's incredible.
Speaker 3 (18:06):
I mean, I can't imagine the difference it's going to make,
and I know it's going to be measurable, but it's
like it's going to be I don't know, phenomenally impactful.
Speaker 4 (18:16):
It seems.
Speaker 5 (18:17):
Yeah, well, let's hope that we can. If we can,
and we see this younger generation that is coming up now,
they're going more to the thrift stores, so it wouldn't
it be wonderful for them to have more choices when
they go to the thrift stores or for other not
even to the thrift stores. Let's see if let's start
seeing the retailers and the brand names that have storefronts
starting to carry, you know, some of their older clothing
(18:38):
in case people don't want to pay for the new
clothing and they want to get there, they want the brand,
but they don't want the expense of the new. Maybe
they can buy the old and be very happy pat
So it'll be interesting to see what pathway this takes.
Speaker 3 (18:49):
Yeah, I imagine that could be popular, and I love
and a lot of people will love the take back
pro like the idea of a take back program.
Speaker 5 (18:57):
Yeah, I will say the thrift stores are going to
love too, because and they were, they were very helpful
because they get a lot of clothing they can't sell
and all they can do is bail it and ship
it and and maybe get a couple of pennies per
pound for it. So it'd be really nice for them
to have other options. And it's also instead of being
a waste product that ends up offshore somewhere else, these
(19:19):
we are now creating jobs, which everybody loves to hear
about creating jobs. Well, think about the repair industry. If
they if they are getting used clothing that just has
a small tear in the shoulder or something that they
can sew up or even put a patch on, it
looks really cool and then that can go back out
into the out into the commerce on the commerce, that's
a job, that's a job that's being supported that was
(19:41):
not there being supported before because that item or those
items were all being shipped away.
Speaker 3 (19:46):
And to think of like the negative impacts we're currently
having and have had a long time in other countries,
just the images you have of like the you know
burning you know, the burning practice in Chile, of the
bails we have.
Speaker 4 (20:01):
Sent and uh and Ghana example too.
Speaker 3 (20:06):
It's just like, just appreciate your helping us think much
more broadly about how we're impacting not just you know,
our home, our state, our country, but I think let's
be mindful and accountable for the rest of the world.
Speaker 5 (20:19):
And it's really hard to describe that scene of burning
piles of textiles or beaches beaches covered with us. If you,
if you're a listeners, google either clothing washed up on
beaches Ghana or or textile burn piles Chile. They will
see what we see.
Speaker 4 (20:38):
And that that will it's an eye open Oh gosh,
thank you.
Speaker 5 (20:42):
That's what we took on. That's one of the several
things we took on last year, the last couple of years. So,
but I'm happy to talk about where we're headed please. Yeah.
So we partnered up with a couple of our old
friends who we partnered up on a bad EPR bill.
So I've mentioned the extended producer responsibility who has to
(21:04):
fund and run and all that design, all that which
is the producers. So we had passed a battery bill
back in twenty twenty two that was going to require
the battery manufacturers, the d Dorsals energizers of the world,
the Kirklands so to fund and sign fund and run
a TakeBack program for household loose household batteries. So that
(21:24):
is in the regulations process right now. That's going to
start up here, and that was passing twenty twenty two
that particular thing. And then we was also an embedded
battery but those same So there was two other organizations
that teamed up with US Californians Against Waste and Rethink
Waste out of San Mateo County to get those two
bills passed. One was for embedded battery products. The other
(21:46):
one was the loose battery EPR program. So we've teamed
up again with them because we were so successful, and
we added another member to the band. So we got
the band back together and added to another member, which
is CALPERG as the Public Information Research Group. And so
the four are organizations teamed up to start to initiate
(22:10):
ABE seven sixty two under Assembly Member Jackie Irwin, and
that bill is to ban the sale of single use
vaping devices in California might ask why do we want
to do this, why do we want to ban these products? Well,
about one hundred and sixty million of those devices are
sold every year in the United States and put end
(22:33):
to end that can stretch from Sacramento, California, all the
way to Rome, Italy and back a little bit. And
those are the majority of them are are landfilled because
they're improperly disposed. Of about ten to fifteen percent maybe
properly collected. And if they are collected, they are incinerated,
(22:56):
they're burned because the problem with the vape devices is
you have a hazardous waste, a pharmaceutical hazardous waste, which
is the nicotine. You have a battery that is typically
a lithium ion battery that can cause fires, and I'll
get into that in a minute. And then it also
is e waste because it has a circuit board because
it's electronic, it's an e cigarette. And then it also
(23:19):
has plastic all around it, so it's a plastic waste.
So you have four different components to that device that
cannot be easily separated. And I actually and then the
single used devices is not meant to be separated. Now
to add to add to this, there is singly vaping
devices that are sold on the market that are actually
video games. If you haven't seen those, just do a
(23:41):
video game e cigarette. Oh yeah, yeah, so it comes
with one of the older style video games that you
can play when you're you're done puffing on your single
use cigarette e cigarette. And there are also baping devices
that are now embedded in hoodies, so instead of the
strings that you tie your hood together with, there are
(24:03):
tubes that come out you vape off of. There's also
vaping backpacks, and so the vaping industry is getting very
smart about how they market their their stuff. They're not
slowing down, but unfortunately they also are not. They don't
manage their waste. They don't have any responsibility whatsoever. Single
use vaping devices don't have a place in society. They
(24:24):
don't need to be here. There are refillable ones. You
can buy a refillable one. It's about four times the
cost of a single use, but a pays for itself
over time. And you can change the pod, the nicoteene pod,
which is the hazard's waste. You change that out. It's
a lot easier to dispose of for a household. Hazards
waste facilities. If it's just that pod, you have the
battery that's rechargeable, the device is long lasting, so there's
(24:46):
all the reasons in the world to use a refillable,
reusable device than the single use ones. But unfortunately the
single use ones are very prevalent. Here's another really interesting
fact about these single use vaping devices. The majority of
them are made in China. They are not legal to
sell in China. So product that is very popular here
(25:07):
is illegal to sell in China. Complicate things further, the
majority of the ones that get to our shores you
do not go through the proper channels, and they're called
illegal or illicit devices because they don't pay the taxes
the sales they and so they're sold illegally. And so
that because there's taxes on tobacco projects that the federal
(25:29):
government gets, the state governments get, the local governments get. Well,
if it doesn't show up on the books, it doesn't
get those taxes. So a lot of these devices are
actually sold illegally. So that it is a huge problem
because now if you even if you wanted to try
and fund this program, you're not going to get the
majority of then they're not going to fund the program
and so, but with the refillables, those are very much tracked,
(25:51):
They are very much have the taxes assus to them,
so they are a tax revenue for fighting against tobacco
in general, battery, nicotine use, et cetera. We're also not
singling out just nicotine devices. We're going after any e
cigarette type, single use e cigarette, So whether it's cannabis,
non nicotine, or nicotine, it doesn't matter. We're going after
(26:14):
all the single use devices. They just shouldn't exist. I
mentioned the fires, so here's one of many reasons why
these things are bad. We are having regular fires in
our collection trucks, were having regular fires in our material
recovery facilities, landfills. Even the day of your burying your
trash is getting buried, or weeks or months later, we're
(26:37):
having fires and landfills. There's a fire going on right
right now in the landfill in southern California that has
been going for so long they can't put it out.
It's an internal fire, but it's forced the closure of
that landfill, so that's no longer a resource. So and
it's hard to say whether that was a liftum battery
or not, but it likely was. But to put in perspective,
(26:57):
when a truck burns, garbage truck burns, that's four hundred
and fifty to five hundred thousand dollars loss to the
company that owns it or the city or county that
owns When a material recovery facility burns, that could be
millions of dollars in loss, depending on how bad the
fire gets. Not to mention now, all these fires are
being all of our fire fighters, our first responders are
(27:18):
being exposed to these unnecessary fires, and so that's why
we passed the battery bills. Battery bills I talked about
earlier two years ago, and why we're going after this
one now because we were hoping to deal with the
other types of batteries. But we still have these vaping
devices that shouldn't be on the market and shouldn't be sold.
So that's that's our target right now, ABE six seven
(27:39):
sixty two, to try and eliminate these vaping devices in general.
We've got some pretty interesting opposition mostly and I'm still
confused by this opposition because they state that yes, ninety
percent of the devices that are coming in are illicit,
they're illegal, So why are you banning the ten percent
that are legal, and I'm going to scratch my head.
(28:01):
Well wait minue. Okay, so is there a confus there's
confusion between which ones are leegal or not. Enforcement is difficult. Well,
if you've all of them, there's no question about. If
it's a single device, it's illegal, it's you can you
can go and take care of that situation. Another thing
we put into our bill was if you're a retailer,
you're if you have a tobacco license and you were
(28:22):
caught selling illegal devices, you lose your license to sell tobacco,
and that is the that's kind of the hammer to
stop that side of the trade. So if they're selling
behind the counter and they get caught, they lose their license,
they're out of business. So it's going to stop the
illegal trade at least from the storefronts selling these illegal devices.
(28:42):
So that was what we thought. That was a good thing.
But it's it's just interesting to see even a law
enforcement agency associations and say, well, this is not a
good bill. It's we oppose this bill. It's like, we're
going to try to make your job easier by giving
you more enforcement tools because less confusion and try to
get these is to go away, and you're worried about
the legal ones over the illicit ones which are much worse.
(29:04):
And so that that's been an interesting wake up call
that we didn't expect. We did expect the We thought
the cessation smoking cessation groups, we're going to come out
and oppose our bill because the fear would be take
away the vaping devices, they'll go back to cigarettes. Right.
The cessation folks don't feel that way. They agree. They
think get rid of the vape devices is one. It's
(29:26):
easy for the kids to get them, right. It's a
lot easier for a kid to hide that they're vaping
than to hide a cigarette. So definitely, so this should help.
This should help with that. So I think that's what
the cessation folks, I'm guessing that that's what the station
books are seeing, is that this will help to stop
the underage smoking an addiction that comes with it. It's uh,
(29:50):
we believe this is a good bill. We're hoping that
it'll get through. There's going to be a lot of
stiff opposition. The other the other challenge we have is
there for the legal ones that are sold, there is
tax tax, moneys funds that are associated with that, and
if you take away these products, argument is where you're
going to take away funds, and the state hates when
we take away funds and so, but I would argue
(30:12):
also as a counter argument, that you take away the
single use ones, the folks that are continuing to smoke
or use the bake devices will go to the reusable ones.
Like I mentioned before, about four times as much. So
they're going to pay the tax and on a legal
device as four times as much. Yes, they won't be
buying them over and over and over again for forever,
but they will will see I think we're going to
(30:34):
see either stabilization or even an increase in the tax
revenue judge for the legitimate devices will be will be
sold than the illegitimate. That's our bill.
Speaker 4 (30:44):
Wow, you guys have quite a think tank.
Speaker 5 (30:49):
Takes four divisions for this one. We're up against the
tobacco industry. That's that's a challenge.
Speaker 4 (30:54):
That's huge, that is huge. Wow.
Speaker 3 (30:57):
I have so many questions, but I just think, as
you mentioned under age, that it just coincidentally today that
the Supreme Court decided to uphold the FDA's block against flate.
Speaker 4 (31:09):
What was it flavored.
Speaker 5 (31:12):
Yeah, sale flavored tobacco and flavored advices.
Speaker 4 (31:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (31:16):
Yeah, so but that was only flavored. That doesn't get
to the mythol or you know, the other ones that
aren't unflavored, that are still getting in the hands of
the kids. Now, the flavored ones are still on the
black market. I mean, that's the challenge that the enforcement
agencies always have. They got to deal with the black market.
And that's where again they're saying that ninety percent of
these e cigarettes that we want to ban are also
(31:39):
sittings in that black market. So but if you, if
you can shut off this figot, why not cut them off?
Speaker 4 (31:45):
Yeah? They could. They could see you as like a
very helpful resource, we'd like to think.
Speaker 3 (31:50):
So yeah, well, how I was going to ask when
you So one question is how can people support this
still getting approved and moving forward.
Speaker 5 (32:02):
They should contact their legislator in their area, look up
their their assembly member, their senator. This is an Assembly bill,
so it is working through the Assembly now. It actually
goes up for a hearing next week. It's first hearing,
and it's so if they contact their local assembly member
and say, hey, now, since is in committee, it will
(32:23):
only be maybe up to nine committee members. Some committees
are a little larger, get to eleven. Those committee members
are going to be the first to see the bill.
They're going to be the first ones. They're the first
gate to get through, and so as long as you
get a simple majority vote out of that committee, it
moves on to the next policy committee. These are called
policy committees, and then from there it will likely go
(32:45):
to the Fiscal Committee, which is Appropriations. If there's a
cost to the state, then that needs to be considered.
And in this case, there's going to be two costs
to the state. There's going to be the enforcement cost,
and then there's also going to be the put potential
tax revenue loss that they think is going to happen,
and so those will be two things that will be
very challenging for the Appropriations Committee to to think about
(33:08):
and overcome and say, yeah, we want to still move
this bill forward. Now, it's very possible they'll see the
logic behind this, so they'll understand it's not as huge impact,
and they'll move it on to the next place, which
would be then to the floor of the Assembly. That's
when the majority of the Assembly members, all of them,
will see it, and that's the time when regardless where
you live, if you should reach out to your Assembly
(33:30):
member in your district and say, hey that this bill
AB seven sixty two is a good bill. We really
need to do this. You need to vote yes for that.
That's where that becomes important because then once it gets
approved in the Assembly, the entire process starts all over
again over in the second house, which would be in
this case the Senate and then the Senate, and then
(33:52):
you want to reach out to your senators in your
district to tell them, hey, hey, this is a good bill.
We want to see this get through. And so that's
how folks can get involved. It's just by reaching out
to their elected officials in their districts.
Speaker 4 (34:04):
Okay, and are you saying a D or as.
Speaker 7 (34:08):
In a B A B as and boy okay, Assembly
bill boy, yeah, Assembly bill, yeah, yeah exactly, and then
Senate bill as sph that's.
Speaker 5 (34:19):
Okay, yeah, easy.
Speaker 3 (34:23):
AB seven sixty two and yeah, well yeah, so it's
not too soon if it was it to to do that,
to make a call now that it's going to come.
Speaker 5 (34:33):
Okay, yeah, it's it's never too soon to make that
call and start help coouraging the like the electeds to
consider putting in favor of the bill without a doubt.
Speaker 3 (34:45):
It's writing writing it down. Everybody write it down sixty
two another reason to call elective exactly, So, how how
much of what your job is as the executive to
di rector is planning the next target?
Speaker 5 (35:02):
Or is it?
Speaker 3 (35:04):
Or do you do you already have like you know
among your staff and partner agencies, like twenty other things already.
Speaker 4 (35:11):
That you know you need to address.
Speaker 5 (35:14):
We have a list we have keeps growing, and that's
that's because one of the problems we have with our
consumeristic economy is that products. New products are created every day,
which is great. I love new products, but none of
(35:35):
them are coming in with a end up life solution.
So none of them are being designed to be more
durable per se. Some are, They're not necessarily being designed
to be reusable. They're not designed to be repairable. They're
not designed to be recyclable. And when I say recyclable,
easy to take a part into their various components and
then those components are re or round up constantus Institute
(36:00):
didn't put back into a new product, maybe the same product.
And so without all those pieces we have, we generate
a lot of ways that we shouldn't generate. And that's
where the problem comes in is how do we how
do we shift all that? How do we shift that behavior?
And it's it's ingrained in us unfortunately. And so I'm
I regularly I don't drink out a plastic quad of
balls unless I have to. I always use a stainless
(36:20):
steel because it's better for my health. And I save
every time I have a bottle like that. I save
a plastic wad batle I didn't have to use. How
to mention, I don't get the microplastics from the plastic.
Speaker 3 (36:33):
So so many benefits, you know, just being more aware
and just change this, change things or habit, maybe one.
Speaker 4 (36:40):
Habit at a time exactly. That's kind of.
Speaker 3 (36:43):
Unbelievable that, I mean, that's one one pathways for all
of us individual to think of what what can I
could do now? What's the next step I can take
without overwhelming ourselves. But also it's it's kind of unbelievable
how we don't have accountability regulation in place yet, like
new products coming out, that's just, I don't know, unbelievable.
Speaker 5 (37:07):
Yeah. One of my board members, he's up in the
Pacific Northwest basically he's up in the bar reaches of California.
His position is no product should be introduced into the
California marketplace that doesn't have an end of life plan.
Speaker 4 (37:19):
Okay, so the bill, it's totally right. How about that.
That's a good way to put it.
Speaker 5 (37:25):
That is a bill that I don't think would survived.
I don't think it would survived. You are basically taking
a fight with every manufacturer of every product imported into
California or made in California. So you can imagine your
opposition how large that would be. So that's why we
we tend to pick our battles, and we picked product types,
(37:46):
and we picked the worst of the worst as much
as possible to get them out of the stream. We're
our focus because we are. We were created CPS in
two thousand and seven was created out of local government.
The low government wanted to have a single voice in
the in the capital. We talk about extended producer responsibility
and product stewardship. They form CPSC. It is its own
(38:07):
one seed three nonprofit and so we rely on contributions
of course, like like you do as a non profit
as well, and so so it makes it of course
a challenge. But we can also act on behalf of
the local government that the local governments to fund us
to make sure that they've got that voice in the
in the capital to try and by our sheer mission
(38:30):
is to take the obligation of the end of life
costs of products off of the local governments who pass
that on to the ratepayers at the curb, and push
that back to the producers so that they will make
those better design change decisions early on.
Speaker 4 (38:48):
You definitely have to you know what you're doing.
Speaker 3 (38:51):
It's easy for me to say, why don't you just
write that big, massive bill that will step any new
producer from doing anything unless it's durable. So you just
pick you have a long list, you pick the worst
of the worst. Try to tackle it in the most reasonable,
passable way.
Speaker 5 (39:11):
Yeah, and we so from that list, we reach out
to our local governments to find out what is their
biggest ain, biggest costs of the of that year. Each year,
we look to our our local governments to say, this
is really a problem for us, This is really a
problem for us, And then our board makes the final
(39:31):
decision on what product categories we choose. We try to
only pick two per year. Uh, they're they're always heavy lists,
and so there's only so much time for my staff,
there's only so much time for our hired lobbyists to
be able to spend time in the capital to fight
these bills. Unfortunately, right now I'm running three bills, so
we ended up for the third one, which was it's
(39:52):
a good thing is we're doing a carpet clean up bill,
carpet program cleanup bill this year under Assembly Member Aguali R. Curry,
who happens to be your in my assembly member hit
and then we're also doing it besides the Bay bill,
we brought back from last two year session which was
twenty three twenty four, we brought back our solar panel
(40:16):
EPR bill, Extended Produce Responsibility bills. So we're trying to
make sure that solar panels when they reach their end
of life have somewhere to go besides a landfill out
of state, which is what happens to a lot of them.
We want that those materials recovered and recycled and put
back into making new panels more a lot of the panels,
what we're finding which was really interesting there just to
change subjects a little bit, but for solar panels. We're
(40:37):
finding out that a twenty to thirty years solar panel,
the average life on a roof is nine years nine
point one years. Because people are upgrading their systems. They're
getting the second, the first or second electric vehicle, they're
getting a power they're getting a battery wall to power
their house at night. So all of that's putting demand
on their system, and so they need a better system.
(40:58):
If they don't have room to add more panel, they
replace the panels with higher efficiency panels that generate more
power for the same footprint. And so therefore these panels
are coming and they really should be going to reuse,
they should really be going to places where folks can
use them. But there's that infrastructure doesn't exist as it
should it really needs to. And so we're trying under
(41:20):
that bill to try and take the same textile approach
to solar panels and get the system where these panels
can be reused or refurbished so they could be repaired.
And so we live. We live to our hierarchy, which
is durable, durability, reuse, repair, and then recycle. When we
(41:40):
look at our bills.
Speaker 4 (41:41):
That's fantastic. So you're also doing this carpet initiative and
the solar panel. That's the second. Third ones you're working
on this year is the vake devices in the vaping
in addition to this year? Wow, can I ask how
many staff you have and how many lobbyists you have or.
Speaker 5 (41:58):
That there are? We have sixth staff including me or
six staff including me, and so I have two directors
under me who do an excellent job. I'm I'm running
I'm lead on the carpet bill. Joanne who I met
mentioned earlier my PhD with textile science did the text
style bill. She is on the solar panel bill this year.
Speaker 6 (42:19):
Uh.
Speaker 5 (42:19):
And then our director of Administration, Nate, he's running the
vapes bill. And then we back each other up. And
then we have three other staff that are support staff
that help us to get things done. And then I
have two loggists at the one firm that try to
help us get all is done. And they spend more
time in the capital than we do. We came up,
we come up with the right ideas and say come
(42:41):
make us work.
Speaker 4 (42:44):
Wow, what a help from us? Wow?
Speaker 3 (42:49):
Well, I see we only have four minutes left, which
is stunning how quickly this time goes by.
Speaker 4 (42:56):
It just when it went.
Speaker 5 (42:57):
Correction, We're gonna have too much time.
Speaker 3 (43:01):
No, I just wanted to clarify we're actually an LLC,
not a nonprofit, because I'm not added when you said
just like your just even though we don't make anything
close to profit, it's.
Speaker 4 (43:14):
Officially at LLC. So what are your closing thoughts?
Speaker 6 (43:19):
Like?
Speaker 4 (43:19):
What is like?
Speaker 3 (43:20):
What should we take away from this conversation? I like
the action of calling our assembly members and our senators
on at least on the vaping the vaping proposal and
telling them our representats vote yes on AB seven sixty two.
Speaker 5 (43:35):
What else could we do well, I would say, just
change your lifestyle a little bit like you saw with
me with the stainless steel water bottle. Don't buy the
plastic water balls if we don't have to. It's uh,
you know, there's a really good water coming out of
the tap or certainly out of a water filter system.
If you got that in your home, you don't need that.
You don't really need the water balls. So anything you
(43:56):
can do to reduce the consumption, so we liked. So
the harder starts with source reduction, which means don't make
it in the first place, or if you do mayke
it with as little material as possible. And so if
you don't use a you don't use a plastic water bottle,
that's source reduction. Then if you're going to get it,
make sure it's reusable like the water bottle. Make sure
(44:16):
it's a reusable water bowl. And then you know, try
to repair things before you just throw them away. Well,
try one, try to get somebody else reuse them if
you if you can, if someone else wants your even
if you give it away for free. It's amazing how
much stuff you can you can give away for free
people would love to have that, don't necessarily want to
go buy the new new item. And then certainly be
careful with your thrist stores. Don't don't innedate your thrist
(44:39):
stores with all the stuff a treasure for you may
not you have a treasure for them. So I'm always
always careful with our the thrist stores and make sure
we don't folks don't dump a lot on them. Because
what one thing I did find that was interesting was
in my time with the Sacral County was in being
in the landfill business, how much money thrist stores spend
on stuff they throw away every year. That was and
(45:00):
thousands of dollars they spend on just the landful disposal
fees because of stuff folks thought that they could really
use that they can't use. It's either guy, it's broken,
or and they don't fix it. So if you're if
your listeners think that they give them a broken device first,
it's not going to fix it. It's going to go
to the trash.
Speaker 3 (45:20):
We should just like show our own buttons back on
and keep wearing our shirts, or like there you go
wash the stain.
Speaker 5 (45:27):
Out exactly if you can do that. Should Yeah, that's good.
There's a lot of things folks can do in their
own lives. The choices they make make a big difference
every day.
Speaker 3 (45:39):
Excellent reminder and a great note to close on. Really,
thank you so much, Doug. You know, I really appreciate
you coming on. I appreciate all the work you and
your team do at the California Product Stewership Council. It's
really remarkable agency and always encouraging to hear your work
and to be encouraged to do our own individual work.
(45:59):
So thank you also for the inspiration. I also want
to thank.
Speaker 4 (46:03):
Our always always a pleasure glad to hear that, and.
Speaker 3 (46:07):
Thank you rebel our engineer, and Dean Piper, our producer,
and all the listeners and viewers, and thanks for spreading
the word and producing our use of products we don't
need and maybe we all have enriching conversations and diversity
next week and I'll see you dex Wednesday a pm
Eastern Time on Talk for TV or W four c
Y dot com.
Speaker 4 (46:28):
Thank you.
Speaker 5 (46:30):
Let's speech, let's speech.
Speaker 2 (46:38):
In, let's speak in Lot, Let's beach in loch, Let's
peek lot, Let's
The topics and opinions expressed in the following show are
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(00:20):
for choosing W four c Y Radioistic Let's Speak show.
Speaker 2 (00:35):
In lot, Let's breech in lot, Let's preach all in lot,
Let's breech and lot, let.
Speaker 3 (00:54):
In a lot of Hello, and welcome to It's Your Voice,
the show that hosts enrich conversations in diversity. My name
is Bihia Yaxon. I'm a diversity educator and a core
aliment coach, which means I support organizations and individuals in
aligning their actions with their values. If you're interested in
(01:15):
looking at some of the offerings I have, you can
check out my website at Know what you Want Coaching
dot worpress dot com. I'm super excited today to have
a guest we've had on before, Doug Cobold, and he
is worth the California Product Stewardship Council. I'm going to
read his bio in a minute, but I just want
(01:36):
to kind of a segue into his introduction. I just
want to encourage any listeners or viewers who have not
who did not get to witness one minute of a
record breaking floor speech by Senator Corey Booker. It's so empowering,
it's so encouraging, it's so inspiring. I'm sure there's all
kinds of clips on YouTube. Don't expect you to rewatch
(01:59):
twenty five hours and four minutes, but that's how long
it was and how powerful it was. And I referred
several times to John Lewis's dictate of make good trouble.
When you see something's not right, do something about it,
and my guest definitely does that. So Doug, welcome to
the show.
Speaker 4 (02:17):
I really am happy that you're here today and inspired
by you and your.
Speaker 3 (02:22):
Staff, And in my opinion, you guys are making good
trouble because you're seeing, you're thinking preventatively for climate resilience,
preventing negative climate change, and for the planet and all
the living creatures on the planet. So thanks for letting
me just refer to you as a trouble maker. It's
(02:43):
it's a huge compliment, and I think we should all
be troublemakers in such good ways.
Speaker 5 (02:47):
Thanks for being here.
Speaker 4 (02:49):
Thank you.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
So I'm going to tell you the title of this
show is hard to Manage Products? What's next for climate?
Doug has been, in his words, talking trash for over
thirty years. To August twenty eighteen, he has and continues
to be the executive director for the California Product Stewardship Council.
He will update us on concrete actions he and his
staff are taking to decrease climate changes in measurable ways,
(03:14):
tackling approaches to old textiles, on related to reuse, repair,
recycle options, and taking on single use vaping devices initiatives
in California. Previously, Doug spent over eighteen years with Sacramento
County managing contracts, procurement, new recycling programs, DEVELOPMENTHW which you'll
(03:37):
have to explain what that is, and pending legislation legislation.
Spent nearly three years with Edgar and Associates providing solid
waste consulting services statewide and over five years with Yolo
County managing the county's landfill. He holds a civil engineering
degree from California State University, Chico. That's a lot of experience.
Speaker 5 (04:00):
It sounds like, you know, Bill, you.
Speaker 4 (04:04):
Well, thank you again for being here.
Speaker 3 (04:06):
And I know we wanted to talk about at least
two of the initiatives and maybe start with the older
one from last year related to old textiles that you
and your staff put together and helped me.
Speaker 5 (04:18):
Cappen Absolutely, yeah, so thanks again for having me on
your show. I'd love to chat with you in your audience.
The bill that he is referring to is Senate Bill
seven O seven by Senator Newman, and we passed that
through the legislature last year and got up to the
governor for signature and he signed it. That bill is
(04:38):
what we call an Extended Producer Responsibility bill focused on
textile waste, and so textile waste is pretty much everything
that but he is wearing I'm wearing today, shoes, handbags,
It can be hospitality linens, which would be tablecloths, napkins, bedsheets, pillows,
(05:01):
if you think about it, if it's in the if
it's in the motel room, it could be washed. It
can also it also is called textile waste. At the
end of the day, belts are also part of that versus.
So the law covers a great deal of different textile
type materials that typically a lot of them end up
at thrift stores. When we're done with them. They go
(05:22):
to a thrift store, and the thrift store sorts through them,
tries to find what they can sell in their storefronts,
in their brick and mortar storefronts, and whatever they can't sell,
they end up bailing in a bail and shipping off
to a second or third world country, or possibly just
landfilling if it's too nasty or whatever. We thought it
was good and it just isn't useful to anybody, they'll
(05:44):
probably end up in the landfill here in California and
one of the landfills in California. But if it ends
up over in another country such as like Ghana or
other countries. Ghana has had a huge problem with the
extra textile waste going there because those bales get broke open.
The the usable sellable shirts, et cetera. Are sold on
(06:09):
roadside stands. You probably you may have seen that been
in those countries or otherwise it ends up on the
side of the road. And then in Chile they actually
burn the big textile burn files, and so you can
imagine what does doing to our climate. That's so we
obviously wanted to fix this problem best we could. One
of the issues with the thrift stores not being able
(06:32):
to resell these products is say I'm wearing a button
down shirt and I lose a button off that shirt.
If I turn that into the thrift store, that's a
nice thing to do, but they can't do anything with
it either, because they have no funding to be able
to put us find a new button, sew it on
there and then put it out in their storefront and
hope it sells. So what they end up doing is
putting that in that bail and then it might or
(06:52):
might not be used in another country, or it might
end up in a pile going to bad things. So
what the bill SB seven oh seven does is it
focuses on reuse and repair. First. It requires the producers
of all of our all of our fashions are textile fashions,
(07:13):
to be responsible for the end of life air of
these products. And so if it if it needs a button,
there's funding behind that So basically what will happen is
each manufacturer will pay a certain amount of money for
each clothing item or each tablecloth, each sheet, or our
napkin into a fund that is then used to support
(07:35):
the recycling and repair and recycling infrastructure. If it's reused,
they don't. They just need to try and get it
to reuse, real reuse more it's actually resold and actually
reused and step in commerce. If it has to be
repaired or if it has to be recycled, that's where
the producers are going to come in and they're going
to be required to actually fund that program, fund and
(07:55):
run that program to make sure those those textiles are
either repaired and put back into or they're going to
be recycled. And we like, we'd love to see if
it's upcycled that it should go to upcycling first.
Speaker 4 (08:06):
So the.
Speaker 5 (08:09):
Industry has to follow the waste hierarchy, which means reduce, reuse.
We like to assert repair in there, recycle and then
dispose if necessary, and so disposed being the last last resort.
So and I would also characterize shipping it offshore is
almost equal in a disbowl. So that's it's it may
(08:31):
get a little bit of recycled at the other end,
but not really so that bill again, it got passed
last year and I had no opposition. One hundred and
eighty different organizations supported that bill and had zero opposition
when it was presented for the last voting in both
the Senate and the Assembly. So that's uncharacteristic bill like ours.
(08:55):
And the governor had person had no problem signing that bill.
Of course with no opposition, he would have a hard
time justifying why you wouldn't sign it. And then the
regulatory process, the informal regulatory process is starting this year
to start establishing the rules around the law and how
this The stewardship organization that will run this program for
(09:16):
the state will enough for the state now the state
of California, but we'll run the program in the state.
They have to have certain rules and then they have
to come up with a plan on how they're going
to meet the rule of the law and also the
regulations which will dictate certain things they have to do
like reuse, repair, certain collection convenience standards. So we require
(09:40):
certain amount of collection points without throughout the state, within
every county to make sure it's almost as convenient to
take your old item back and recycle it than it
is to buy it. Because if it's if it's not
convenient enough, it's going to end up in the garbage camp,
or it's going to end up in the recyclement where
it shouldn't be places or shouldn't go is where it's
(10:01):
going to end up. And that's unfortunate, and we want
to try to avoid that. So that was a heavy lift. Fortunately,
I had I have a young lady on staff who
is a PhD in textile science, and so she was
the lead of that bill. It'd be probably better for
her to me talking to you today about that bill
than meet. But she got her master's here in Davis
(10:22):
and our master's enter PhD here in Davis, and so
she was a great person to lead that the lead
that effort, and she continues to lead that effort. We
actually have a working committee that is a stakeholder group
that's statewide and actually national now to help to in
form the regulators as they developed the regulations. And that
(10:42):
includes all kinds of stakeholders that might be interested in
the textile waste in the program in California. And I
should note that this law was the first one in
North America, and it was the second one in the
world that mandated the producer fund and run this design
and run this program. There is another law in I
(11:05):
believe it's in uh in one of the European countries
other than France, that is voluntary. So that's why I
didn't include that. Are the two laws France and Californias
are both mandatory because we find the voluntary doesn't always work.
So only if they really want to do it do
they actually do it, especially if it's going to cost
(11:25):
them money. So anyway, that was the textile bill and
what's happening with that, But again it's I think it's
going to be a really great program for California. Oh
and by the way, it also relies on the thrift stores,
So the thrift stores are still going to be your
go to place if you want. But if your store,
for if your retail store has a take back program
now for their their products, that will continue as well.
(11:47):
So it's not going to disrupt the existing infrastructure that's
our collection infrastructure. It's just going to improve upon it.
Speaker 4 (11:53):
Wow.
Speaker 5 (11:54):
So that's that was Textiles.
Speaker 3 (11:57):
That's amazing that it seems so broad, broad sweeping and
so to meet.
Speaker 4 (12:03):
For me to be clear, it does sound like a
huge and heavy lift.
Speaker 3 (12:08):
So some of that it's still in the design, like
figuring out the regulations and the committee of regulators establishing it.
Speaker 4 (12:17):
It's still not completely established, is that right?
Speaker 5 (12:21):
Right? Right? So what do we do with these bills?
Because these are heavy lifts, they are they take a
lot of work in the background to get the program
up and running. We usually give four years from the
data passage to when the program should be starting to
be implemented. The state agency that's going to be providing
the oversight on this particular program, this cal Recycle, it's
(12:43):
our state waste agency, Waste and Recycling Agency CAW Recycle
has to do what we call informal rule making, where
they go and they solicit all kinds of feedback from
stakeholders across the spectrum to make sure that the regulations
that they draft and adopt pursuing to the law are
(13:03):
going to work and they're going to make sense. So
they'll they'll spend.
Speaker 6 (13:07):
A year doing that and then if that if that
doesn't work, expecially once that's done, then they'll go into
what we call formal rule making, and in the formal
rule making process.
Speaker 5 (13:18):
It's much more concise. There's less back and forth. It's
more about here's the regulations. All stakeholders get to comment
on them. They revise the regulations as they see necessary
to meet the antent of the law. Sometimes they can't
make changes because they don't have the statutory authority to
do that. It wasn't in the law to begin with.
(13:38):
So sometimes that can require clean up legislation later on
another bill to clean up the last bill. We do
have that from time to time. And then once the
regulations are finalized, then they go to the Office Administrative
Law for California who then reuse them, make sure it
works for all statutes, it's it's going and has no
conflicts with any other arts of existing law. And then
(14:02):
once they recommend its adoption and the state the par
cycle can adopt the regulations, then they become official. Then
that starts the plan process, and the plan process to
run this kind of a program is we give them
about nine months to get the plan together. They have
to get their members together. Hopefully they're already working on
that during the regulations process too, but they're trying to
(14:23):
figure out all the parties that are obligated under the law.
They have to bring them in, get them all signed
up because they're going to be paid into the program,
and they're developing the plan. So they got to develop
the plan around the regulations and the law, but also
around what the membership of the organization is going to require,
and then finalize that plan and then they can start implementation.
(14:46):
And then we usually give them at least a half
a year or a year to ramp up for implementation,
getting the program running, and then that kind of starts
the clock that they have to start being compliant with
the law. So it's about a four year process. Not
it's not an easy thing to do, but at least
we know in four years we're going to have.
Speaker 4 (15:06):
Something going that's that sounds tremendous.
Speaker 3 (15:09):
And how do you like, so, like does this include
all producers of textiles in California? Like, like, how many
producers are will be have to become accountable to this,
to these guidelines and regulations established?
Speaker 4 (15:25):
Is there?
Speaker 5 (15:27):
It's not, it's not just California. Yeah, it's so a
lot of the lot of the clothing we buy comes
from offshore, of course, and we don't have any we
have a cow recycle. The state has no influence or
has no enforcement capabilities for offshore entities, it has to
be a uh So what we do is we design
(15:49):
the law around who is bringing it into the state
so once it hits the state, because we can't enforce
beyond our own state boundaries. And so if you are
a like Target, I will pick on them just because
but I think they're going to be just fine. Target
has their own brand, and so when Target brings that item,
that article of clothing into the California marketplace, they are
(16:12):
now obligated under the law or that item because they
are brands. So if we can't get the producer, if
there's producers in California, then we can get them. So
if they're outside of California, it's less likely we're going
to be able to enforce on them. We've being calorcycle
of the state agency. So that but as long as
(16:33):
we can get somebody, so we either we go after
producer first. Our hierarchy, our kind of teared structure is
producers first, then first importer. So because folks can they
can bring material in that's already branded and ready to
come in, So we'll get the first importer of that,
or we'll get the brands, and so there might be
brand on the shirts or pants or whatever that come in,
(16:54):
and then they need they get a brand on them
by an entity here in either North Erica, California, you know,
the United States or California. So we'll get them under
the brands, and then we go down the list, and
at some point we may even get the retailers. But
typically the only time you're going to get the retailers
is when the retailer is the brand, like a Target,
for example, or a Walmart or something like that. So
(17:17):
we get a super majority of it. The one area
that we're still struggling with, and this is a struggle
in the law as well, is when you have direct consumer.
So TIMU, if you're familiar with TIMU, TIMU is a
direct to consumer type of operation. They will ship directly
from the producer in say Asia or another country, straight
(17:40):
to the consumer. Well, now there's no way to get
to that, and so those are we're still trying to
figure out how because those become free riders in the program,
and so how do we deal with the direct to
consumer and that we're hoping we'll try to figure out
in the regulations process. But that's the only kind of
escapee that we know of is going to happen. But otherwise,
prety much eyody else is going to be captured one
(18:01):
way or the other.
Speaker 4 (18:03):
That's incredible.
Speaker 3 (18:06):
I mean, I can't imagine the difference it's going to make,
and I know it's going to be measurable, but it's
like it's going to be I don't know, phenomenally impactful.
Speaker 4 (18:16):
It seems.
Speaker 5 (18:17):
Yeah, well, let's hope that we can. If we can,
and we see this younger generation that is coming up now,
they're going more to the thrift stores, so it wouldn't
it be wonderful for them to have more choices when
they go to the thrift stores or for other not
even to the thrift stores. Let's see if let's start
seeing the retailers and the brand names that have storefronts
starting to carry, you know, some of their older clothing
(18:38):
in case people don't want to pay for the new
clothing and they want to get there, they want the brand,
but they don't want the expense of the new. Maybe
they can buy the old and be very happy pat
So it'll be interesting to see what pathway this takes.
Speaker 3 (18:49):
Yeah, I imagine that could be popular, and I love
and a lot of people will love the take back
pro like the idea of a take back program.
Speaker 5 (18:57):
Yeah, I will say the thrift stores are going to
love too, because and they were, they were very helpful
because they get a lot of clothing they can't sell
and all they can do is bail it and ship
it and and maybe get a couple of pennies per
pound for it. So it'd be really nice for them
to have other options. And it's also instead of being
a waste product that ends up offshore somewhere else, these
(19:19):
we are now creating jobs, which everybody loves to hear
about creating jobs. Well, think about the repair industry. If
they if they are getting used clothing that just has
a small tear in the shoulder or something that they
can sew up or even put a patch on, it
looks really cool and then that can go back out
into the out into the commerce on the commerce, that's
a job, that's a job that's being supported that was
(19:41):
not there being supported before because that item or those
items were all being shipped away.
Speaker 3 (19:46):
And to think of like the negative impacts we're currently
having and have had a long time in other countries,
just the images you have of like the you know
burning you know, the burning practice in Chile, of the
bails we have.
Speaker 4 (20:01):
Sent and uh and Ghana example too.
Speaker 3 (20:06):
It's just like, just appreciate your helping us think much
more broadly about how we're impacting not just you know,
our home, our state, our country, but I think let's
be mindful and accountable for the rest of the world.
Speaker 5 (20:19):
And it's really hard to describe that scene of burning
piles of textiles or beaches beaches covered with us. If you,
if you're a listeners, google either clothing washed up on
beaches Ghana or or textile burn piles Chile. They will
see what we see.
Speaker 4 (20:38):
And that that will it's an eye open Oh gosh,
thank you.
Speaker 5 (20:42):
That's what we took on. That's one of the several
things we took on last year, the last couple of years. So,
but I'm happy to talk about where we're headed please. Yeah.
So we partnered up with a couple of our old
friends who we partnered up on a bad EPR bill.
So I've mentioned the extended producer responsibility who has to
(21:04):
fund and run and all that design, all that which
is the producers. So we had passed a battery bill
back in twenty twenty two that was going to require
the battery manufacturers, the d Dorsals energizers of the world,
the Kirklands so to fund and sign fund and run
a TakeBack program for household loose household batteries. So that
(21:24):
is in the regulations process right now. That's going to
start up here, and that was passing twenty twenty two
that particular thing. And then we was also an embedded
battery but those same So there was two other organizations
that teamed up with US Californians Against Waste and Rethink
Waste out of San Mateo County to get those two
bills passed. One was for embedded battery products. The other
(21:46):
one was the loose battery EPR program. So we've teamed
up again with them because we were so successful, and
we added another member to the band. So we got
the band back together and added to another member, which
is CALPERG as the Public Information Research Group. And so
the four are organizations teamed up to start to initiate
(22:10):
ABE seven sixty two under Assembly Member Jackie Irwin, and
that bill is to ban the sale of single use
vaping devices in California might ask why do we want
to do this, why do we want to ban these products? Well,
about one hundred and sixty million of those devices are
sold every year in the United States and put end
(22:33):
to end that can stretch from Sacramento, California, all the
way to Rome, Italy and back a little bit. And
those are the majority of them are are landfilled because
they're improperly disposed. Of about ten to fifteen percent maybe
properly collected. And if they are collected, they are incinerated,
(22:56):
they're burned because the problem with the vape devices is
you have a hazardous waste, a pharmaceutical hazardous waste, which
is the nicotine. You have a battery that is typically
a lithium ion battery that can cause fires, and I'll
get into that in a minute. And then it also
is e waste because it has a circuit board because
it's electronic, it's an e cigarette. And then it also
(23:19):
has plastic all around it, so it's a plastic waste.
So you have four different components to that device that
cannot be easily separated. And I actually and then the
single used devices is not meant to be separated. Now
to add to add to this, there is singly vaping
devices that are sold on the market that are actually
video games. If you haven't seen those, just do a
(23:41):
video game e cigarette. Oh yeah, yeah, so it comes
with one of the older style video games that you
can play when you're you're done puffing on your single
use cigarette e cigarette. And there are also baping devices
that are now embedded in hoodies, so instead of the
strings that you tie your hood together with, there are
(24:03):
tubes that come out you vape off of. There's also
vaping backpacks, and so the vaping industry is getting very
smart about how they market their their stuff. They're not
slowing down, but unfortunately they also are not. They don't
manage their waste. They don't have any responsibility whatsoever. Single
use vaping devices don't have a place in society. They
(24:24):
don't need to be here. There are refillable ones. You
can buy a refillable one. It's about four times the
cost of a single use, but a pays for itself
over time. And you can change the pod, the nicoteene pod,
which is the hazard's waste. You change that out. It's
a lot easier to dispose of for a household. Hazards
waste facilities. If it's just that pod, you have the
battery that's rechargeable, the device is long lasting, so there's
(24:46):
all the reasons in the world to use a refillable,
reusable device than the single use ones. But unfortunately the
single use ones are very prevalent. Here's another really interesting
fact about these single use vaping devices. The majority of
them are made in China. They are not legal to
sell in China. So product that is very popular here
(25:07):
is illegal to sell in China. Complicate things further, the
majority of the ones that get to our shores you
do not go through the proper channels, and they're called
illegal or illicit devices because they don't pay the taxes
the sales they and so they're sold illegally. And so
that because there's taxes on tobacco projects that the federal
(25:29):
government gets, the state governments get, the local governments get. Well,
if it doesn't show up on the books, it doesn't
get those taxes. So a lot of these devices are
actually sold illegally. So that it is a huge problem
because now if you even if you wanted to try
and fund this program, you're not going to get the
majority of then they're not going to fund the program
and so, but with the refillables, those are very much tracked,
(25:51):
They are very much have the taxes assus to them,
so they are a tax revenue for fighting against tobacco
in general, battery, nicotine use, et cetera. We're also not
singling out just nicotine devices. We're going after any e
cigarette type, single use e cigarette, So whether it's cannabis,
non nicotine, or nicotine, it doesn't matter. We're going after
(26:14):
all the single use devices. They just shouldn't exist. I
mentioned the fires, so here's one of many reasons why
these things are bad. We are having regular fires in
our collection trucks, were having regular fires in our material
recovery facilities, landfills. Even the day of your burying your
trash is getting buried, or weeks or months later, we're
(26:37):
having fires and landfills. There's a fire going on right
right now in the landfill in southern California that has
been going for so long they can't put it out.
It's an internal fire, but it's forced the closure of
that landfill, so that's no longer a resource. So and
it's hard to say whether that was a liftum battery
or not, but it likely was. But to put in perspective,
(26:57):
when a truck burns, garbage truck burns, that's four hundred
and fifty to five hundred thousand dollars loss to the
company that owns it or the city or county that
owns When a material recovery facility burns, that could be
millions of dollars in loss, depending on how bad the
fire gets. Not to mention now, all these fires are
being all of our fire fighters, our first responders are
(27:18):
being exposed to these unnecessary fires, and so that's why
we passed the battery bills. Battery bills I talked about
earlier two years ago, and why we're going after this
one now because we were hoping to deal with the
other types of batteries. But we still have these vaping
devices that shouldn't be on the market and shouldn't be sold.
So that's that's our target right now, ABE six seven
(27:39):
sixty two, to try and eliminate these vaping devices in general.
We've got some pretty interesting opposition mostly and I'm still
confused by this opposition because they state that yes, ninety
percent of the devices that are coming in are illicit,
they're illegal, So why are you banning the ten percent
that are legal, and I'm going to scratch my head.
(28:01):
Well wait minue. Okay, so is there a confus there's
confusion between which ones are leegal or not. Enforcement is difficult. Well,
if you've all of them, there's no question about. If
it's a single device, it's illegal, it's you can you
can go and take care of that situation. Another thing
we put into our bill was if you're a retailer,
you're if you have a tobacco license and you were
(28:22):
caught selling illegal devices, you lose your license to sell tobacco,
and that is the that's kind of the hammer to
stop that side of the trade. So if they're selling
behind the counter and they get caught, they lose their license,
they're out of business. So it's going to stop the
illegal trade at least from the storefronts selling these illegal devices.
(28:42):
So that was what we thought. That was a good thing.
But it's it's just interesting to see even a law
enforcement agency associations and say, well, this is not a
good bill. It's we oppose this bill. It's like, we're
going to try to make your job easier by giving
you more enforcement tools because less confusion and try to
get these is to go away, and you're worried about
the legal ones over the illicit ones which are much worse.
(29:04):
And so that that's been an interesting wake up call
that we didn't expect. We did expect the We thought
the cessation smoking cessation groups, we're going to come out
and oppose our bill because the fear would be take
away the vaping devices, they'll go back to cigarettes. Right.
The cessation folks don't feel that way. They agree. They
think get rid of the vape devices is one. It's
(29:26):
easy for the kids to get them, right. It's a
lot easier for a kid to hide that they're vaping
than to hide a cigarette. So definitely, so this should help.
This should help with that. So I think that's what
the cessation folks, I'm guessing that that's what the station
books are seeing, is that this will help to stop
the underage smoking an addiction that comes with it. It's uh,
(29:50):
we believe this is a good bill. We're hoping that
it'll get through. There's going to be a lot of
stiff opposition. The other the other challenge we have is
there for the legal ones that are sold, there is
tax tax, moneys funds that are associated with that, and
if you take away these products, argument is where you're
going to take away funds, and the state hates when
we take away funds and so, but I would argue
(30:12):
also as a counter argument, that you take away the
single use ones, the folks that are continuing to smoke
or use the bake devices will go to the reusable ones.
Like I mentioned before, about four times as much. So
they're going to pay the tax and on a legal
device as four times as much. Yes, they won't be
buying them over and over and over again for forever,
but they will will see I think we're going to
(30:34):
see either stabilization or even an increase in the tax
revenue judge for the legitimate devices will be will be
sold than the illegitimate. That's our bill.
Speaker 4 (30:44):
Wow, you guys have quite a think tank.
Speaker 5 (30:49):
Takes four divisions for this one. We're up against the
tobacco industry. That's that's a challenge.
Speaker 4 (30:54):
That's huge, that is huge. Wow.
Speaker 3 (30:57):
I have so many questions, but I just think, as
you mentioned under age, that it just coincidentally today that
the Supreme Court decided to uphold the FDA's block against flate.
Speaker 4 (31:09):
What was it flavored.
Speaker 5 (31:12):
Yeah, sale flavored tobacco and flavored advices.
Speaker 4 (31:15):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (31:16):
Yeah, so but that was only flavored. That doesn't get
to the mythol or you know, the other ones that
aren't unflavored, that are still getting in the hands of
the kids. Now, the flavored ones are still on the
black market. I mean, that's the challenge that the enforcement
agencies always have. They got to deal with the black market.
And that's where again they're saying that ninety percent of
these e cigarettes that we want to ban are also
(31:39):
sittings in that black market. So but if you, if
you can shut off this figot, why not cut them off?
Speaker 4 (31:45):
Yeah? They could. They could see you as like a
very helpful resource, we'd like to think.
Speaker 3 (31:50):
So yeah, well, how I was going to ask when
you So one question is how can people support this
still getting approved and moving forward.
Speaker 5 (32:02):
They should contact their legislator in their area, look up
their their assembly member, their senator. This is an Assembly bill,
so it is working through the Assembly now. It actually
goes up for a hearing next week. It's first hearing,
and it's so if they contact their local assembly member
and say, hey, now, since is in committee, it will
(32:23):
only be maybe up to nine committee members. Some committees
are a little larger, get to eleven. Those committee members
are going to be the first to see the bill.
They're going to be the first ones. They're the first
gate to get through, and so as long as you
get a simple majority vote out of that committee, it
moves on to the next policy committee. These are called
policy committees, and then from there it will likely go
(32:45):
to the Fiscal Committee, which is Appropriations. If there's a
cost to the state, then that needs to be considered.
And in this case, there's going to be two costs
to the state. There's going to be the enforcement cost,
and then there's also going to be the put potential
tax revenue loss that they think is going to happen,
and so those will be two things that will be
very challenging for the Appropriations Committee to to think about
(33:08):
and overcome and say, yeah, we want to still move
this bill forward. Now, it's very possible they'll see the
logic behind this, so they'll understand it's not as huge impact,
and they'll move it on to the next place, which
would be then to the floor of the Assembly. That's
when the majority of the Assembly members, all of them,
will see it, and that's the time when regardless where
you live, if you should reach out to your Assembly
(33:30):
member in your district and say, hey that this bill
AB seven sixty two is a good bill. We really
need to do this. You need to vote yes for that.
That's where that becomes important because then once it gets
approved in the Assembly, the entire process starts all over
again over in the second house, which would be in
this case the Senate and then the Senate, and then
(33:52):
you want to reach out to your senators in your
district to tell them, hey, hey, this is a good bill.
We want to see this get through. And so that's
how folks can get involved. It's just by reaching out
to their elected officials in their districts.
Speaker 4 (34:04):
Okay, and are you saying a D or as.
Speaker 7 (34:08):
In a B A B as and boy okay, Assembly
bill boy, yeah, Assembly bill, yeah, yeah exactly, and then
Senate bill as sph that's.
Speaker 5 (34:19):
Okay, yeah, easy.
Speaker 3 (34:23):
AB seven sixty two and yeah, well yeah, so it's
not too soon if it was it to to do that,
to make a call now that it's going to come.
Speaker 5 (34:33):
Okay, yeah, it's it's never too soon to make that
call and start help coouraging the like the electeds to
consider putting in favor of the bill without a doubt.
Speaker 3 (34:45):
It's writing writing it down. Everybody write it down sixty
two another reason to call elective exactly, So, how how
much of what your job is as the executive to
di rector is planning the next target?
Speaker 5 (35:02):
Or is it?
Speaker 3 (35:04):
Or do you do you already have like you know
among your staff and partner agencies, like twenty other things already.
Speaker 4 (35:11):
That you know you need to address.
Speaker 5 (35:14):
We have a list we have keeps growing, and that's
that's because one of the problems we have with our
consumeristic economy is that products. New products are created every day,
which is great. I love new products, but none of
(35:35):
them are coming in with a end up life solution.
So none of them are being designed to be more
durable per se. Some are, They're not necessarily being designed
to be reusable. They're not designed to be repairable. They're
not designed to be recyclable. And when I say recyclable,
easy to take a part into their various components and
then those components are re or round up constantus Institute
(36:00):
didn't put back into a new product, maybe the same product.
And so without all those pieces we have, we generate
a lot of ways that we shouldn't generate. And that's
where the problem comes in is how do we how
do we shift all that? How do we shift that behavior?
And it's it's ingrained in us unfortunately. And so I'm
I regularly I don't drink out a plastic quad of
balls unless I have to. I always use a stainless
(36:20):
steel because it's better for my health. And I save
every time I have a bottle like that. I save
a plastic wad batle I didn't have to use. How
to mention, I don't get the microplastics from the plastic.
Speaker 3 (36:33):
So so many benefits, you know, just being more aware
and just change this, change things or habit, maybe one.
Speaker 4 (36:40):
Habit at a time exactly. That's kind of.
Speaker 3 (36:43):
Unbelievable that, I mean, that's one one pathways for all
of us individual to think of what what can I
could do now? What's the next step I can take
without overwhelming ourselves. But also it's it's kind of unbelievable
how we don't have accountability regulation in place yet, like
new products coming out, that's just, I don't know, unbelievable.
Speaker 5 (37:07):
Yeah. One of my board members, he's up in the
Pacific Northwest basically he's up in the bar reaches of California.
His position is no product should be introduced into the
California marketplace that doesn't have an end of life plan.
Speaker 4 (37:19):
Okay, so the bill, it's totally right. How about that.
That's a good way to put it.
Speaker 5 (37:25):
That is a bill that I don't think would survived.
I don't think it would survived. You are basically taking
a fight with every manufacturer of every product imported into
California or made in California. So you can imagine your
opposition how large that would be. So that's why we
we tend to pick our battles, and we picked product types,
(37:46):
and we picked the worst of the worst as much
as possible to get them out of the stream. We're
our focus because we are. We were created CPS in
two thousand and seven was created out of local government.
The low government wanted to have a single voice in
the in the capital. We talk about extended producer responsibility
and product stewardship. They form CPSC. It is its own
(38:07):
one seed three nonprofit and so we rely on contributions
of course, like like you do as a non profit
as well, and so so it makes it of course
a challenge. But we can also act on behalf of
the local government that the local governments to fund us
to make sure that they've got that voice in the
in the capital to try and by our sheer mission
(38:30):
is to take the obligation of the end of life
costs of products off of the local governments who pass
that on to the ratepayers at the curb, and push
that back to the producers so that they will make
those better design change decisions early on.
Speaker 4 (38:48):
You definitely have to you know what you're doing.
Speaker 3 (38:51):
It's easy for me to say, why don't you just
write that big, massive bill that will step any new
producer from doing anything unless it's durable. So you just
pick you have a long list, you pick the worst
of the worst. Try to tackle it in the most reasonable,
passable way.
Speaker 5 (39:11):
Yeah, and we so from that list, we reach out
to our local governments to find out what is their
biggest ain, biggest costs of the of that year. Each year,
we look to our our local governments to say, this
is really a problem for us, This is really a
problem for us, And then our board makes the final
(39:31):
decision on what product categories we choose. We try to
only pick two per year. Uh, they're they're always heavy lists,
and so there's only so much time for my staff,
there's only so much time for our hired lobbyists to
be able to spend time in the capital to fight
these bills. Unfortunately, right now I'm running three bills, so
we ended up for the third one, which was it's
(39:52):
a good thing is we're doing a carpet clean up bill,
carpet program cleanup bill this year under Assembly Member Aguali R. Curry,
who happens to be your in my assembly member hit
and then we're also doing it besides the Bay bill,
we brought back from last two year session which was
twenty three twenty four, we brought back our solar panel
(40:16):
EPR bill, Extended Produce Responsibility bills. So we're trying to
make sure that solar panels when they reach their end
of life have somewhere to go besides a landfill out
of state, which is what happens to a lot of them.
We want that those materials recovered and recycled and put
back into making new panels more a lot of the panels,
what we're finding which was really interesting there just to
change subjects a little bit, but for solar panels. We're
(40:37):
finding out that a twenty to thirty years solar panel,
the average life on a roof is nine years nine
point one years. Because people are upgrading their systems. They're
getting the second, the first or second electric vehicle, they're
getting a power they're getting a battery wall to power
their house at night. So all of that's putting demand
on their system, and so they need a better system.
(40:58):
If they don't have room to add more panel, they
replace the panels with higher efficiency panels that generate more
power for the same footprint. And so therefore these panels
are coming and they really should be going to reuse,
they should really be going to places where folks can
use them. But there's that infrastructure doesn't exist as it
should it really needs to. And so we're trying under
(41:20):
that bill to try and take the same textile approach
to solar panels and get the system where these panels
can be reused or refurbished so they could be repaired.
And so we live. We live to our hierarchy, which
is durable, durability, reuse, repair, and then recycle. When we
(41:40):
look at our bills.
Speaker 4 (41:41):
That's fantastic. So you're also doing this carpet initiative and
the solar panel. That's the second. Third ones you're working
on this year is the vake devices in the vaping
in addition to this year? Wow, can I ask how
many staff you have and how many lobbyists you have or.
Speaker 5 (41:58):
That there are? We have sixth staff including me or
six staff including me, and so I have two directors
under me who do an excellent job. I'm I'm running
I'm lead on the carpet bill. Joanne who I met
mentioned earlier my PhD with textile science did the text
style bill. She is on the solar panel bill this year.
Speaker 6 (42:19):
Uh.
Speaker 5 (42:19):
And then our director of Administration, Nate, he's running the
vapes bill. And then we back each other up. And
then we have three other staff that are support staff
that help us to get things done. And then I
have two loggists at the one firm that try to
help us get all is done. And they spend more
time in the capital than we do. We came up,
we come up with the right ideas and say come
(42:41):
make us work.
Speaker 4 (42:44):
Wow, what a help from us? Wow?
Speaker 3 (42:49):
Well, I see we only have four minutes left, which
is stunning how quickly this time goes by.
Speaker 4 (42:56):
It just when it went.
Speaker 5 (42:57):
Correction, We're gonna have too much time.
Speaker 3 (43:01):
No, I just wanted to clarify we're actually an LLC,
not a nonprofit, because I'm not added when you said
just like your just even though we don't make anything
close to profit, it's.
Speaker 4 (43:14):
Officially at LLC. So what are your closing thoughts?
Speaker 6 (43:19):
Like?
Speaker 4 (43:19):
What is like?
Speaker 3 (43:20):
What should we take away from this conversation? I like
the action of calling our assembly members and our senators
on at least on the vaping the vaping proposal and
telling them our representats vote yes on AB seven sixty two.
Speaker 5 (43:35):
What else could we do well, I would say, just
change your lifestyle a little bit like you saw with
me with the stainless steel water bottle. Don't buy the
plastic water balls if we don't have to. It's uh,
you know, there's a really good water coming out of
the tap or certainly out of a water filter system.
If you got that in your home, you don't need that.
You don't really need the water balls. So anything you
(43:56):
can do to reduce the consumption, so we liked. So
the harder starts with source reduction, which means don't make
it in the first place, or if you do mayke
it with as little material as possible. And so if
you don't use a you don't use a plastic water bottle,
that's source reduction. Then if you're going to get it,
make sure it's reusable like the water bottle. Make sure
(44:16):
it's a reusable water bowl. And then you know, try
to repair things before you just throw them away. Well,
try one, try to get somebody else reuse them if
you if you can, if someone else wants your even
if you give it away for free. It's amazing how
much stuff you can you can give away for free
people would love to have that, don't necessarily want to
go buy the new new item. And then certainly be
careful with your thrist stores. Don't don't innedate your thrist
(44:39):
stores with all the stuff a treasure for you may
not you have a treasure for them. So I'm always
always careful with our the thrist stores and make sure
we don't folks don't dump a lot on them. Because
what one thing I did find that was interesting was
in my time with the Sacral County was in being
in the landfill business, how much money thrist stores spend
on stuff they throw away every year. That was and
(45:00):
thousands of dollars they spend on just the landful disposal
fees because of stuff folks thought that they could really
use that they can't use. It's either guy, it's broken,
or and they don't fix it. So if you're if
your listeners think that they give them a broken device first,
it's not going to fix it. It's going to go
to the trash.
Speaker 3 (45:20):
We should just like show our own buttons back on
and keep wearing our shirts, or like there you go
wash the stain.
Speaker 5 (45:27):
Out exactly if you can do that. Should Yeah, that's good.
There's a lot of things folks can do in their
own lives. The choices they make make a big difference
every day.
Speaker 3 (45:39):
Excellent reminder and a great note to close on. Really,
thank you so much, Doug. You know, I really appreciate
you coming on. I appreciate all the work you and
your team do at the California Product Stewership Council. It's
really remarkable agency and always encouraging to hear your work
and to be encouraged to do our own individual work.
(45:59):
So thank you also for the inspiration. I also want
to thank.
Speaker 4 (46:03):
Our always always a pleasure glad to hear that, and.
Speaker 3 (46:07):
Thank you rebel our engineer, and Dean Piper, our producer,
and all the listeners and viewers, and thanks for spreading
the word and producing our use of products we don't
need and maybe we all have enriching conversations and diversity
next week and I'll see you dex Wednesday a pm
Eastern Time on Talk for TV or W four c
Y dot com.
Speaker 4 (46:28):
Thank you.
Speaker 5 (46:30):
Let's speech, let's speech.
Speaker 2 (46:38):
In, let's speak in Lot, Let's beach in loch, Let's
peek lot, Let's
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