May 25, 2023 • 52 mins
Roussillon in SW France borders the Pyrenees Mountains and Mediterranean Sea. Catalan flavors from nearby Spain can be tasted in the local cuisine. Roussillon’s distinctive red clay, iron-rich soils gave the region its name. Eric Aracil, co-director & export manager at the Conseil Interprofessional des Vins du Roussillon (CIVR), discusses the region’s diverse terroir and range of still dry reds, whites and rosé wines and renowned Vin Doux Naturels (VDN) fortified sweet wines. #roussillonwines
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The Connected Table Radio Show is broadcast on W4CY Radio (www.w4cy.com) part of Talk 4 Radio (www.talk4radio.com) on the Talk 4 Media Network (www.talk4media.com).
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(00:01):
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(00:22):
FORCY Radio. Welcome to the ConnectedTable Live. We're your hosts, Melana
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Young and David Ransom. You're insatiablycurious culinary couple. We bring you the
fascinating people we meet around the worldwho lead the industry in wine, spirits,
food and hospitality. We enjoy sharingtheir stories with you and inspiration from
the people we meet in the destinationswe visit, and we're doing that today
(01:08):
with a very special edition of TheConnected Table. Right David, absolutely,
Melanie. Recently we had the greatpleasure of going on our first actually wine
tour of Langedoc Roussillon in southwest France, which is a very big area and
region. Were familiar with the wines, but we never had the chance to
(01:30):
really deep dive in. What wereyour impressions, David Well, I thought
it was a fascinating region, again, a region we've known from Afar but
had never actually been to to experienceit firsthand, and I was pretty fascinated
with pretty much everything I saw.It's a beautiful region geographically, and the
wines are not only some of thebest I think in France, but they're
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really coming along in popularity as wellthese days, which is really nice to
see. And as we said,the region is called Lanedoc Roussillon, but
they're very separate and distinct, andtoday we are going to spotlight Roussillon,
which is the more southerly and smallerof the two regions, located just north
of the Spanish border, in thedepartment of the Pyrenees Oriental. That that
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it borders the Pyrenees and the Mediterraneancoast to the south, and then there
are these three rivers that run throughthe area, the Tet, the Agli
and the Tech and some mountains tothe north where there is Langadock and there's
some really important cities there as well, Perpignon in Montpelier. It's rich in
history, and we are so honoredto have someone who's an expert and native
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to Roussillon join us today. Hisname is Eric Arasil. He's born into
a wine growing family and a smallvillage just in the heart of the Asprey
region. The name Arisol we learnedas Catalan and we were I was surprised
at the Catalan influence in this area, very close to Spain and therefore Catalonia.
Yeah, so we'll talk about thatas well. So Eric grew up
(03:01):
in the area and studied analogy andbecame a consulting analogist at the four K
Laboratory for several years and then advanced. His current position now is export director
and he's with the basically von dRusslan, which is what it's called in
(03:21):
short, as the co director ofthe organization that hosted our trip, and
it's called the civ or Canseil Interprofessionalde von d Russlon. So he's co
director and export manager and he's beenthere for like twenty years or something.
So he lets some fascinating master classesthat we're going to discuss and just kind
of give all of you our listenersa kind of a great spotlight on Rousslon
(03:45):
and why you should be looking atthese wines and visiting this region ben Venue,
Eric, Hello, what are youwell? We're very good. We
enjoyed meeting you. Yeah, I'mreally happy to be with you. So
see you describe already a lot whoI am and what I am doing?
And uh and where is Rossio orarea? So this area is a fascinating
(04:11):
place for the wind for sure,and uh and for everything okay, because
it's full of story, a wonderfulculture. You talking about the Catalan position.
Uh. For sure. Arpinam isone of the main city for the
north Catalonia. Okay, is abrother or sister city of Barcelona, which
(04:33):
is just in the south in Spain. So in Aussio we have a we
have a wonderful expressional everything our culture. It's really deep and we can we
can see it for everything just lookingat around you. We can have we
can have some wonderful monuments, wecan have some wonderful expression just less lestening
(05:00):
the people talking, because we aretalking Catalan here for quite big part of
the people. And for sure weare French, so we are sharing Catalan
and French culture in the same time. I'm curious you grew up in a
wine making family and Catalan heritage wellas French. Feels like there are as
(05:24):
the food. What influences are Frenchand weather and Catalan in the in the
food and growing up? Can yougive some examples? Yeah, for sure.
In fact, just to keep inmind, we were several time invited
here in Oceo. So the peoplefrom Spain arrived during the i Middle Age
(05:46):
and the people from France arrived aroundthe seventeenth century, so we got we
got several influences, especially in thein the cooking, for example, coming
from Spain, we have some bayclassic one okay with rice or just with
no all. We have also somespecific influences from friends, for example with
(06:11):
the butter the butter cooking because herethe habit is to cook with oliver oil.
So a lot of different recipes okay. And nowadays we have we have
a big mix between Italian influences andSpanish influences Catalan for sure, because this
is we all Catalan cooking and Frenchinfluences. In terms of Catalan cooking,
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for example, I will give viewsome name, some special name of some
recipes like balls. The people,lads, I know that you are completely
aware of possibly the possibility to findsome wonderful meat balls everywhere in the world.
But here Rossillo, we have theseballers balls the people lad which are
(06:57):
cooked during all the year and thefor example, some good meat, good
mixed meat between veal, beef andpork, and we are we are putting
a little bit of salt, alittle bit of pepper, a little bit
of garlic, because the garlic it'slike the one of the main ingredients in
the in the Catalan kitchen. Andafter that we fried them and we can
(07:26):
do a special accommodation that the traditionis to use some mushrooms like porcini mushrooms
and uh and to have also justa little source made between garlic and at
the time onions, a little bitof tormento, and everything is completely reduced.
We are adding a main ingredient alsowhich is coming from our vines,
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which is called rancio sec I don'tknow if you remember that. You taste
it with me, some dry rancioand rossion and the dry rancio it's really
a very good ingredient for the kitchen. You can give a little bit of
kind of runs it. If Ican say it rands it style for the
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for the recipe, and this sauceis already used for example with some beans,
white beans, or with some stewlike a little bit of potatoes,
a little bit of carrod. Sodepending the period of the season, for
example, in the in the spring, we can have some potatoes and new
potatoes coming from Roston, for sure, and some carrods, and in them
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in the outen, for example,you can have some white beans. So
this is a wonderful recipe. Andwe have several recipes which are mixing in
the classic way a product from thesea and products from the ground. For
example, in France you can doa wonderful chicken roasted chicken. In Catalonia
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we are doing a chicken with promsokay, with a special sauce another time,
and with a special lion. Forthe sauce. We have a special
lion which is called picada. Idon't know if you are aware on that,
but picicad is something another time amazing, based on something always a little
bit brands it. We are usingus some bread, some old bread,
(09:26):
if I can say, or bread. We fried it in olive oil.
And we are doing exactly the samewith garlic, and we are crushing everything
together and we can add for example, if you want the name of this
link is called picada. And thispicada can be used for a white sauce
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for example, with just almond,we adding some almond powder fresh alman completely
crush it, mix it with thisspecial a picada. Otherwise, if you
want to do for examples two witha with a bronze sauce, for example,
with wine, you can add justin the past it was cocoa beans
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and nowadays it's a black chocolate andeven better chocolate. So we have some
specialties in or c which are reallyincredible. So with these lumber gambas chicken
with prawns, it's really a mixbetween the ad touch of the prawns and
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the crispiness in fact of the skinof the chicken. And it's really really
full of flavors and really tasty.And for sure always wines to accommodate with
and to pair with with the food. Catalan foods making me hungry. Crazy,
(10:58):
Yeah, it's crazy, crazy way. And what is really crazy it
is you can change your plate everyday. We have always a lot of
colors. We are playing a lotwith the vegetables also, and u and
with fruits also because in terms ofhabit and tradition, we are doing a
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lot of sweet and sole recipes andsweet and salt recipes or using some fruit
or spices more or less in thesame idea as you can find in Nassia.
So besides making us hungry, itmakes us curious to learn more and
come back and visit. Eric.You mentioned the word that we were going
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to dive into a little later,but I thought maybe since you brought it
up, I want to kind ofgo into it. It's we're gonna get
into litter. You mentioned the wordramco, which I think warrants some explanation
when you're discussing the food because itcan mean something else in English rancio as
a term. I'd like you toexplain it in the term for wine making
(12:07):
and food because it means something elsein English. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
for me, a problems the translation. It's always a problem because Rance
it is not really the right feelingsthat you can have with with a dry
rancio, even with a sweet rancio. For myself, the rancio expression,
it's mainly the expression of I wouldsay, we have a wide range of
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aromas. It can start with somethinglike a baby rans it batter with a
kind of freshness which is nearly likea minty freshness. Sorry, and we
can have at the end of youryour event dig we can have something very
(12:54):
dry expression of francio, very strongexpression like something quite natty. And we
have also some wonderful spiciness like cominglike specific I can't remember now the English
world for that, but it's afinny greg in French. Yeah, exactly.
(13:20):
Yeah, So with a rantio wecan have some special discovery because in
fact, in the past, thedrive rancio was just dedicated from the kitchen
because everyone was not not a shame, but we had the habit too to
put it aside, this style ofwine just to have an apprivative, just
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to have a drink as an apprivative, otherwise just to use in the cooking.
Nowadays a lot of somebody else allover the world are looking for this
style of wine because they are oncewhich some wonderful partners to pair with a
special food. For example, wewere talking about mushroom just previously. If
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you have trafforms or if you havechanter, even some porsini, you will
be completely happy with with with apairing. If you have, in another
way some charcuteri and mainly quite oldcharcuteri, quite aged charcuteri, it would
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be wonderful because the fatness of theold charcuteri will give you a wonderful answer
to the to the romness and tothe very soft expression of the Ranci style.
And after that the spiciness of therancio will give a wonderful answer to
the saltiness. For example, ifyou have a piece of ham, salty
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ham, it would be good.But in another way, if you have
a salty for example anchovies okay,which is traditional from here from Klua in
basing Rucon that is from Coryon.So saltia and hubbies give a little touch
of nutty expression, and the iodineexpression will give a wonderful answer to the
(15:13):
espression of the of umami from theRancier style. So we can have something
amazing with ben donat dry Rancier.Well, you know, thank you for
explaining it, because that's a greatgateway into talking about the wines, because
it was an expression that was fairlynew. I know. To me,
what about you, David, I'dheard Abroutia before but never from this region
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exactly. But it's very specific hereabsolutely, So a couple of things.
Let's step back a minute and talkabout Rousselon, the region and it's unique
geography that creates these microclimates. Aswe said, it's a smaller of the
regions of longer like Rousselon and umthere's a specific it's got very specific geography
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and AOPs. Of course we'll getinto the dry wines and then vander natural.
Sure, sure, sure us planthat, I think, but I
think that it's really important to insiston that Russia area. It's a very
small Amphisiata open to the military.And see it is a mountain us Amphisiata.
So we can say that the vineyardis really nursauled directly in Descerentphithiata,
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and the vineyard is between zero upto roughly seven hundred eight hundred meters of
high and everything its own slopes,mainly eighty percent of the vineyard it's own
slopes. And because we are likeyou describe previously different valley, because we
have three different rivers, because wehave those mountains, we have an incredible
(16:44):
region with for sure an expression ofthe military and climate, but we seeveral
different expression of this military climate.So we have an incredible patchwork of tarua
of micro terro and on myself,the expression is something amazing in Ossio because
we have different soils, perhaps oneof the best expression of the diversities that
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you can find in terms of agronomyfor the soil and sub soil in the
world. Okay, we have alsothe possibility to played with a different altitude,
the possibility to play with a differentexposures, playing for sure with also
the environment. Because if we needto insist on that, Russia area is
(17:32):
one one of the more important vineyardwhich is situated between the mountain and the
sea. Okay, at the sametime, for example, if you want
to go to have a bus endof much beginning of April, you can
do it and after one hour youcan go to ski if you want,
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so it's not a problem. Sothis is a kind of paradise Roussio.
It's really really interesting now nowadays fora lot to Forgneus, a lot of
newcomers in terms of vineyards because wehave we have this unique unixity and something
amazing in terms of possibility to dofor terrours and for diversity of wines.
(18:21):
And for sure you were talking aboutvendor natural fortified sweet wines, but we
have also someone who dry wines andsomething also completely incredible. I think,
I believe completely sure that we thatwe are one one of the unique place
(18:41):
in France to have the possibility torevendicate all the vineyard in lp. So
the top of quality is not reallythe case nowadays in Luso, because we
are doing according to the demand.We are doing also some PGI. Okay,
we have a lot of video orroughly seventy percent of video and the
(19:03):
rest is PGI just to answer tothe demand, for example, for one
single variety, one special sing onespecial nification. So you need to keep
in mind that Rossio it's an amazingplace to make a wide range of wine
and always a wine for the pleasure. Okay, because for me Rossio,
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between dry and fortify sweet wines,we have something credible in terms of drink
ability, in terms of balance.For sure, we talk it also about
climate, but the climate here issomething very good for the body, is
something very pleasant for the tourists.Okay, but it's sometime too warm and
(19:51):
sometime to dry, and here inRossio, we are producing wines which are
completely unexpected. For example, whiteswines we are developed. We are developing
a lot of the production of whiteones with some specific varieties and what isn't
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credible, it's always the same thingusing the old traditional way of work,
mixing this with new technology for tohave a maximum of quality in the wines.
And when we have in mind thatin Russion the production is one of
the lowest that you can find inthe world. Because when you started for
(20:37):
the introduction, Melany, you saidLangodoc Chrossian region. But if you are
checking the Langoedoc production and the Russianproduction, we are good complimentarities as you
discover it by yourself. But interms of yield, the total average yield
for Russion production is less sense auctoralcharacter. So it's nothing okay. And
(20:59):
it's in terms of quality is puttingreally on the top of the energy of
Lusio. So that's interesting. Um, you know, I have a question
for you you reference the wine.We'd like to start on the dryways.
I think for our listeners it'll beinteresting too deep dive into you know.
There's fifteen AOPs. This is fromthe Jerusalem site. By the way,
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and twenty four grape varreadies. Whatare the standout grape varreadies starting with white
wines that our listeners would be thinkingabout looking for when they go to retailers
and styles. Yeah, in stylefor white wines. In fact, we
have traditional grape varieties. We areusing grapeieties which are really clean in terms
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of aromas or really fresh in termsof aromas. Also because sometimes we don't
have to mini acidity and thanks toweek and thanks to the technology and the
way of walk, we are ableto push the freshness of the wine,
you know, so the freshness cancome from the soil, sometimes from the
(22:06):
altitude and from the berries. Andin terms of varietals we are we are
using traditional one which is macabel okay, which is called also begin in Spain.
We are using more and more andbecause this is a dominant gray variety
in Lucio, Granacia okay, granashawhite and gnashal gray. With the granacial
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gray is something amazing because we havea good royal expression. We have a
good and insid flavors which is cominga classic way for the granasia. But
because it's a pink granaca gray pink, you can understand it. We have
structure and we have minivality also,and it's a kind of powered again miniality
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and also a situa cy miniarity andthe good freshness thanks to that and the
wine with structure, that means youcan you can bring them very quickly and
they are very pleasant like this,or you can lay down with our problem.
And this was that I said,they are sometimes unexpected because everybody in
(23:10):
the world, in the world's talkingabout Chardonnay or Sauvignon Blan or even Dionaea.
Okay, but when we are talkingabout Garnasa, for example, you
can be completely surprised. Okay.So for our CEO, what is really
important. Also we're talking about awide range of wine, different colors,
(23:30):
different aging, and you need toremember that we can play really with the
versatility of how old grapes, especiallyall grapes coming from all vines. Because
you need to keep in mind alsothat the vineyard in Oco, it's at
(23:51):
least fifty percent of the vineyard withat least fifteen years old, okay,
from fifteen years old too, Iwould say, and eighty years old for
the vine so you can expect somequintescence and really, when you have low
yield, you can put on thetop each element of the each element of
(24:11):
the gray varieties, each element ofthe benification. And when I talk about
technology for the unification, I'm notsure that people can understand it. But
the main improved movement that we gothere in Rousillon was a cooling machine.
And in fact we were doing somewonderful ones in a long time ago.
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But nowadays we are able to makethe best and to keep them with our
program. And this is really important. And when I was talking about versatility,
you need to understand, for example, that all the family of the
grenage of white gray and even blackgranage or Yadna pollute are able to be
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produced also as a fortified sweet onevendu nature. So sorry for that,
I forgot to to to introduce youquickie, or is up to you if
you want, I can introduce itright now. What is a venduna because
is something quite unique. Well,we did want to We just wanted to
just quickly touch on the dry whitesfirst and then any dry reds and then
(25:21):
we were going to segue into anddo natural So we because we taste it,
because we did two seminars and onewas one was on the dry wines
and and and the various microclimates.And we taste it and we have we'll
have our notes in front of us. And we tasted some interesting the whites
Macabeo, which shows the Catalan influence. There's grenache blanc, as U said,
(25:41):
grenache gray. There was also Vermontino, which is role in the south,
and some marsan and were said.One of the wines also had a
Saverignon blanc in it. I can'tsee the notes from here. It was
a cooke Catalon blanc. Yeah,this is not so usual to find some
soil nowadays. It would be muchmore usual to find some carnian blam okay
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karnangly. This is more unique,you know, than svinium blam and by
itself, for example, Carnian blandkaryangri brings to the wine a wonderful acidity,
a natural acidity. And in thepast it was put on the side
because it was too acidic, butnowadays is important, especially according to global
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warming, and for sure because globalwarming. For example, the production of
servinium blan, which is not traditionaland as the time here is so difficult
because we have a lack of acidityin fact at the end, so just
talking talking about the break the breakdownof a different style of wines in dry
(26:53):
wines. So you need to keepin mind that in the past we were
producing a lot of red wines instill dry wines. Nowadays we can have
we can share in two pieces,one piece for the PGI, one piece
for the PDEO, for the video. We're still going on with a good
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production, a good quantity graphy seventypercent of red wine, we have roughly
twenty percent of rose wine and therest is wide. But for the PGI
we have something which is completely inthe opposition because nowadays we are increasing a
lot of production because the demand forwhite wines abroad main need. So we
(27:40):
have roughly twenty five to thirty percentof white wine in PGI. We have
roughly exactly the same in rose winerose one, which are nearly with a
full quantity consume here there is nota lot of exportation for rose wine from
ZEO and the rest for PGI isread so that means less than forty percent
(28:03):
of the production of PGI is red. Keep in mind also something very important
talking about red and white in Rosonjustus. Of all, the name of
Rosson is coming from the brown color. Who in frames okay, because we
have a lot of oxidized iron ina several types of soil we have oxidized
(28:26):
iron, and to produce white wine. Sometimes it's too difficult because, for
example, we can have some oxidizediron which which can go through the skin
of the of the babies, sodifficult to make a red vinification avoiding this
(28:47):
color. And on the other side, the production of red wine when you
have oxidized iron could be very pleasantbecause we insist thanks to the ron to
the color of the of the blackred violet teens. So we need to
keep in mind everything about pauses.I'm curious becauses that oxidized soil, that
(29:12):
red soil. Yeah, and whenthe people arrived from the noose of friends,
even from Languedoc. When you arefrom Languedoc, when you pass through
the Corbia mountain, you arrive andthe first soils that you are discovering here
it's red. It's a red claywith a lot of oxidized iron. So
(29:33):
it's for that people is calling Rossion. And remember also something or perhaps I
can give you an information that isquite important for me. The first implantation
of vine in Rosso was done duringthe seventh century before Christmas, and it
was done by the Greeks Corencient.And when the Corengian arrived arrived here in
(29:57):
Rosson, they were looking for salt, and in fact that they found salt,
but also iron okay, and theyplanted vineyard until the high plateau next
to the to the biggest mountain ofthe Canigou, and one of the vineyards
(30:17):
planted by the Greek people was nearlyaround one thousand and two hundred meters of
high. So this is really specialwhen you are thinking about that, you
know, because iron push a lotof people to climb to the mountain and
to go to restract the the ironitself, to make some weapons and one
(30:42):
thing another time perhaps interesting for you. You I don't know, I hope.
So during the Middle Age, forexample, we were very famous thanks
to the wines, thanks to thefind natural fortified sweet one. It was
a wonderful money to a change withthe other the land. And the second
money which was used was the weapons, okay, and the weapons, the
(31:07):
Catalan weapons. The Catalan walk forfor the iron was known all over the
Miniterarian sea so important to to toto link always the iron, the wine
and the and the and the cultureof the USA. Thank you so much
for that explanation. I think it'simportant, um, because it is such
(31:30):
a distinguishing factor. Um. Let'sdo talk about the vander natural which is
the other masterclass, and I thinkit's important that we learned. You know,
this region Rousselon, the vendors arelike the gems and it's like they
represent eighty percent of sweet wine productionof France and sixty percent worldwide. Thank
(31:51):
you vander Rousselin and Eric, sobig topic and fascinating range. Yeah,
this is this is incredible. Uh. In fact, when you when you
have in the memory that the fortificationwas born here in Rosello thanks to a
guy who was called Arnaldo Villanova.He was during the aim middle Age,
during the thirteenth century, the endof the thirteenth century. And this man
(32:16):
was a very book, very bigdoctor. It was a private doctor of
the king of Majorca because at thattime we were under the Kingdom of Majorca
and it was more or less I'mpretty sure that everyone is aware of who
was Leonard de Vincy. Okay,and Leonard Evinci did more as the same
(32:39):
things. And another billanover maid also, so that means it was a doctor.
He did a lot to improve themedicine all of our friends. It
was the first one in Europe towrite some book of dietetic and some book
of gastronomy pairing between food and wineanother time, if I can insist on
(33:04):
that, sorry for that, butI'm very proud of my region, you
know, and I can insist onthat. You need to understand that our
region was really with a big culturefor the for the for the cuisine and
for the moment of the tasting.At that moment, it was normal to
(33:25):
eat with some spoon and some knife, and some folk with a plate and
with glasses in front of us todrink the wine. Keep in mind that
when we became French during the seventeenthcentury, when the King of Friends came
here, it was completely surprised tosee that, because at that period in
(33:49):
France it was always the abbit toit with the end and with a bread,
taking the food directly by hand andjust drinking wind or water in a
in a special in a special Idon't know the word of that, sorry.
Like it was a glass, itwas used as a glass, but
(34:10):
it wasn't at that moment glass.Okay, so this is important to keep
it. So coming back one anotherwho receives is wonderful, know how,
a knowledgious from a guy who wasalso very important in the North Africa.
(34:30):
It was an Arabic guy and thatguy gave to another via the alymbic.
So another was the first one inOcciden to use the alymbic to create for
sure distillation, to use the distillateas a medicine. And he has the
idea, yes, yes, hehad sorry the idea to to mix this
(34:57):
distillate with a most informidation and soit created the fortification. And by the
fortification for sure, the wines werewas also a wonderful medicine but also something
very stable to able to to tobe transported with our program. Okay,
(35:17):
So nowadays, just to summarize veryquickly, what is a vendo natural?
Vendo naturally is a wine made withtraditional way variet tolls from grand nash,
white gray black from maccabello from malvasio, rossion from Muscat small grain or muscat
(35:40):
Alexandria. So he has a traditionalgray varieties used for vend natur and vendo
naturally is immersed that we are doinglike in the classic way to do a
dry wine. But at one momentyou need to stop the alcoholic commentation.
So this is important top in mind. Always alcoholic fermentation, always a production
(36:04):
of alcohol by the fermentation itself.And when you need to stop it,
you add alcohol, a pure andnutural alcohol coming nowadays from vinic origin,
and you kill the the east andyou keep a part of the natural sugar
without fermenting. So like that wecan balance with our problem because we are
(36:30):
nowadays eight century of know how withthis technique, so we can balance with
our problems sugar, the ras sugar, the alcohol produced and added, and
the balance between acidity and structure.So vendor natural nowadays is a wonderful range
(36:52):
of non oxidized wine and oxidized wine. So when I say nonoxidize, everybody
can understand that we are keeping reallythe ants of the wine in the bottle.
That means when you're opening a bottle, if you put a white or
rose or red wine, it wouldbe completely white rose red with all the
(37:15):
main characteristic of a white roseo red. Plus for sure always the Roserr sugar,
which is helped a lot for thebalance and which is like is not
the sweet wine? Sorry to saythat, but the question of sweet wine
for me sometimes is used in abad way. For me, it's a
(37:35):
vendom natural is a real wine.For sure, we have a kind of
sweetness, but it's not just sweetness. We are a lot of wonderful feeling,
a lot of wonderful balance, andit's still a wine. So you
can use it as a real winefrom the pervative to during a meal,
after the meal, just reading awonderful book, or just taking a sip
(38:00):
to recover your health, or Idon't know what. So it's the wine
vendo naturally amazing. So keep inmind we have the non oxidized style and
on the other side we have thetraditional wine, which are completely with oxidation.
So remember what I said previously.Another vill An hour was during the
(38:20):
Middle Eage and we talked about moneyto each change, and the vendor Natural
was a wonderful money for those exchanges. And at that moment it was
forbidden for us to go through theCarbia mountains, so the unique way was
to go through the seas some internsea by boat and people discover it.
(38:45):
The management of the oxidation at thatmoment, because the barrels or the corners
which were inside the boat and thebarrels or the corners which were on the
top of the of the boat werecompletely different. At the arrival on the
top it was with a kind ofoxidation with for example, from a young
(39:09):
black fruit, it became something alittle bit jemmy in something expressing us to
reflection notes some cocoa beans, somecoffee beans, some roasted expressions, special
spices, and so on and soon. So keep in mind also that
(39:30):
the oxidation is an illness, andwe are managing since already eight and a
year ago and nowadays the vendor naturalwith oxidation in one side amber style,
so they are mainly coming from fromwhite origin. And on the other side
we can have truly tawny red coloredwines which are coming mainly from red origin.
(39:53):
And to get the oxidation we havesome big, big ways to do.
We can we can use for example, some classic concrete tank, we
can use some wooden continents, wecan use different sides of condors. We
can make the oxidation inside the cellarsor acts out the sellers something a little
(40:19):
bit more incredible. When we areoutside. For example, we can use
some summign glass glass continers and heresorry to say that, but here sometimes
we are we have a mix inthe in the sentence because people understand that
is oxidation outside with summigon, butin fact it is mainly a destruction of
(40:43):
the wine than an oxidation, becausewe don't have any change with the with
the oxygen of the We have justa destruction by the photo of the light
and the changement of temperatures, sothe color is going down the room.
Us are completely changing. And forsure, like all the way of edging
(41:06):
and maturation, because I'm talking aboutmaturation much more sometimes than edging. The
way of maturation are really different andeach one is bringing something to the vendor.
Nature reloxid died, and it's notabout that we can find for example
just a single QV made with bombardedthere or SINGLEQV made with just power,
(41:32):
or just a concrete tank. Sosometimes we have a big mix to make
the main expression and the more beautifulexpression of the vintage. Because when we
are talking about oxidized wine, sometimeswe are talking about all vintages and we
are lacking nose on because for example, we can go down until the eighteen
(41:57):
seventy year, always available for cellsin some cellers. Otherwise we have also
the traditional way to make some blendbetween different vintages. And for sure we
can have some very variable wines nowadays, if I can summarize in just one
(42:19):
sentence, we have non oxidized wineswhich are really pleasant for I would say
new consumers or people who love thefreshness and the direct pleasure. And on
the other side we have wines whichare much more for conneiss with oxidative style
and where you will find always somethingamazing. They are wines I would say,
(42:46):
against the analogy, and they arereally magic wins. So do not
desitate to try those wins because becausethey have the expression of a full culture,
wonderful story. And remember that eightcenturyw of know how busy start off
point. So I think it's compulsoryfor me to go home with with this
(43:13):
production because nowaday unfortunately the sweet winein the wall are quite difficult to sell.
But zos wine as a place forall the table for all the people
with loves wine, you know,Melanie, I found the Vandue naturals fascinating
because there's so many there's so manydifferent ways to make it, and there's
(43:37):
also so many different styles of it. Yeah, that that there's a there's
a huge breadth of diversity in thewines. And I thought that was really
interesting, and I want to pointout that, you know, Eric,
you've been talking about the fact thatit's a fortified wine, but it's very
different from port because it's actually thefortification happens while the wine is still fermenting
to stop the fermentation, and it'snot added after the fermentation ends. So
(43:59):
that's a that's a the huge differencein the fact that what's then the natural
apart, Yeah, it happens duringfermentation. Yeah, it's append the imflementation
for both of them, Port andthen natural. But one thing important,
the port was creating during the eighteenthcentury. Okay, that means five century
(44:21):
after the creation of the fortification inOco. After that, keep in mind
that we have different laws for shorefor the production in the world, we
have more lay the same aim,but in the reality when you have a
look in the details, we havea different level for the compulsory mativity for
(44:42):
the berries for the crop. Okay, we have different alcohol use because for
example, port, it's your realspirit roughly seventy lbv, Severty seventy percent
LBV, and for a hoo areathen do natural. It's a pure and
natural alcohol from vinic origin, andfor sure because it's ninety six percent an
(45:05):
all, just an all. Thefour percent on the side is just water.
The quantity of alcohol added for Bendonatural is a very small ament between
five to ten percent of the ofthe volume of the master that you are
walking on, and for the portit could be more much more than that.
And another big difference for me,it's a LBV final BV for port
(45:31):
that is higher than d lbv.For then do not your average. For
vendonatural it's a sixteen sixteen point fiveperson volume and for port is at least
twenty one, okay, twenty two. So this is another world for me
and another thing very important. Whenyou are using nutural alcohol, we have
(45:54):
a marriage which is made immediately afterone week. If you want to have
a drink directly on the tank justproduced, you can do it. For
when natural both you need to waita little bit because the spirit as for
sure a pot of alcohol but alsoa no non alcohol and he needs to
(46:16):
wait a little bit. That wehave step by step kind of fusion,
you know, but for sure keepin mind at the end the aim is
the same and at the end theprofile would be very close one to one,
you know. You know, I'dlike to do um is explain some
(46:39):
of the different styles because we tastedthem and so that again our listeners can
seek them out, whether they're diningout or some ways can pick them out.
The very specific styles starting with Maria. Yeah, yeah, we have
we have specific styles. So soyou you're talking about one specific appellation more
(47:00):
just perhap very quickly to to tosay the name, to describe the name
of each appelation that you can findin Rostio. They are just a video.
So the biggest production of mus fortifiedmuscat in the world is called Muscasalt
is producing roseo and made just withmuscat gray varieties. It's a white o
(47:23):
region without oxidation. Normally. Afterthat we have reversalt, which is a
very typical appelation also quite important alsoin a different way, so mainly in
red without assidation, just a viewin rose and we have a lot in
number style and and a little bitless in Trili origin for more. More
(47:47):
is a very small appellation dedicated onlyto the to the to the village of
the movie and Morie as small asthe same ideas and the result. But
we find red which is called Grana. We find white without oxidation also and
(48:08):
we have amber and twilli, okay, and to finish for the different appellation,
we have banners and baneus Gang Crew, so Banyers and Banner Grand Crew
as the one of the biggest possibilityto produce. So in white rose red
(48:29):
without oxidation and amber and Twili withoxidation. And one thing about just to
come back on what you said previously, so when you have a look on
the on the production of those fortifiedstreet ones, those bender naturally. For
sure. The great varieties are exactlythe same. The way of unification is
(48:51):
exactly the same for the world washere. But what is changing a lot
is the terror. For example,when you are talking and Marie, it's
a black shist okay is next tothe Corbia Mountain, on the south face
of the Carbia Mountain, and it'sreally with a baby big wideness in terms
(49:13):
of embirollment with with the Gariga whichis mainly bay trees, mainly juniper trees
a lot of while avander a lotof sage. So between the low,
the low yield, the aromas fromthe gariga, and the expression of the
grenache itself, because the grenache isa king variet all there and the way
(49:38):
of work with a natural alcole,you can respect the full elements of what
is making the terra. This terwar can be completely different in valuals you
see facing the yeah values, facingthe sea with great shist not black,
so completely different. In terms ofexpression of soil. Let's concern tuition a
(50:00):
little, if I can say ita little bit more feminine, very dedicate
very salt intern of expression, abstructionand for sure the sea, the sea
with the seaweed expression, with freshair coming from the sea, with the
(50:20):
saltiness. So this can be incredible, you know, And for sure it's
always it's always the same idea.We can do always some specific details according
the production of vendor nature in rossion, according the great variety, use according
the way of work, because forsure you can when I told you that
(50:43):
we are doing like in a dryone and one moment, we are stopping
the alcorifementation. It depends what youare doing before to stop the alcor ifementation.
If you're doing a geore pressing forexample for a white wine or just
a skin marceration or just motification onthe solid phase. It's changing, always
a style. So imagine you canhave differencies thanks to the techline. You
(51:10):
can have differencies thanks to the greatvarieties. You can have differencies thanks to
the benification, thanks to the wayof aging. And this way of aging
is making at least fifty percent ofthe quality of the wine. You know,
Eric, you've given us such agreat explanation on all the wines of
Russalon, especially the Von Due Natural, which were really eye opening to us.
(51:34):
It's fascinating and we encourage everybody toconsider visiting Rousson and looking for the
wines in their retail stores or onrestaurant menus. They're great discovery. Again,
we've been speaking with Eric Arasil,who is with Von d Rusalon,
and if you would love to learnmore about this region and the wines,
(51:57):
you can visit Russian wine dot com. It's a great site, very good
with information. Eric, thank youfor joining us on the Connected Table.
My pleasure. Thank you very muchto invite me. And this is another
edition of the Connected Table. Wehope you enjoyed it. We hope you
will follow us as we continue totravel and share our discoveries with you,
our listeners. You can find uson Instagram at the Connected Table, check
(52:21):
out all our shows on more thanthirty five podcasts, including streamed at the
Connected table dot com, and alwaysour messages, stay insatiably curious. Thank you,
The topics and opinions expressed in thefollowing show are solely those of the hosts
and their guests and not those ofW FORCY Radio. It's employees are affiliates.
We make no recommendations or endorsements forradio show, program services, or
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(00:22):
FORCY Radio. Welcome to the ConnectedTable Live. We're your hosts, Melana
(00:45):
Young and David Ransom. You're insatiablycurious culinary couple. We bring you the
fascinating people we meet around the worldwho lead the industry in wine, spirits,
food and hospitality. We enjoy sharingtheir stories with you and inspiration from
the people we meet in the destinationswe visit, and we're doing that today
(01:08):
with a very special edition of TheConnected Table. Right David, absolutely,
Melanie. Recently we had the greatpleasure of going on our first actually wine
tour of Langedoc Roussillon in southwest France, which is a very big area and
region. Were familiar with the wines, but we never had the chance to
(01:30):
really deep dive in. What wereyour impressions, David Well, I thought
it was a fascinating region, again, a region we've known from Afar but
had never actually been to to experienceit firsthand, and I was pretty fascinated
with pretty much everything I saw.It's a beautiful region geographically, and the
wines are not only some of thebest I think in France, but they're
(01:51):
really coming along in popularity as wellthese days, which is really nice to
see. And as we said,the region is called Lanedoc Roussillon, but
they're very separate and distinct, andtoday we are going to spotlight Roussillon,
which is the more southerly and smallerof the two regions, located just north
of the Spanish border, in thedepartment of the Pyrenees Oriental. That that
(02:15):
it borders the Pyrenees and the Mediterraneancoast to the south, and then there
are these three rivers that run throughthe area, the Tet, the Agli
and the Tech and some mountains tothe north where there is Langadock and there's
some really important cities there as well, Perpignon in Montpelier. It's rich in
history, and we are so honoredto have someone who's an expert and native
(02:37):
to Roussillon join us today. Hisname is Eric Arasil. He's born into
a wine growing family and a smallvillage just in the heart of the Asprey
region. The name Arisol we learnedas Catalan and we were I was surprised
at the Catalan influence in this area, very close to Spain and therefore Catalonia.
Yeah, so we'll talk about thatas well. So Eric grew up
(03:01):
in the area and studied analogy andbecame a consulting analogist at the four K
Laboratory for several years and then advanced. His current position now is export director
and he's with the basically von dRusslan, which is what it's called in
(03:21):
short, as the co director ofthe organization that hosted our trip, and
it's called the civ or Canseil Interprofessionalde von d Russlon. So he's co
director and export manager and he's beenthere for like twenty years or something.
So he lets some fascinating master classesthat we're going to discuss and just kind
of give all of you our listenersa kind of a great spotlight on Rousslon
(03:45):
and why you should be looking atthese wines and visiting this region ben Venue,
Eric, Hello, what are youwell? We're very good. We
enjoyed meeting you. Yeah, I'mreally happy to be with you. So
see you describe already a lot whoI am and what I am doing?
And uh and where is Rossio orarea? So this area is a fascinating
(04:11):
place for the wind for sure,and uh and for everything okay, because
it's full of story, a wonderfulculture. You talking about the Catalan position.
Uh. For sure. Arpinam isone of the main city for the
north Catalonia. Okay, is abrother or sister city of Barcelona, which
(04:33):
is just in the south in Spain. So in Aussio we have a we
have a wonderful expressional everything our culture. It's really deep and we can we
can see it for everything just lookingat around you. We can have we
can have some wonderful monuments, wecan have some wonderful expression just less lestening
(05:00):
the people talking, because we aretalking Catalan here for quite big part of
the people. And for sure weare French, so we are sharing Catalan
and French culture in the same time. I'm curious you grew up in a
wine making family and Catalan heritage wellas French. Feels like there are as
(05:24):
the food. What influences are Frenchand weather and Catalan in the in the
food and growing up? Can yougive some examples? Yeah, for sure.
In fact, just to keep inmind, we were several time invited
here in Oceo. So the peoplefrom Spain arrived during the i Middle Age
(05:46):
and the people from France arrived aroundthe seventeenth century, so we got we
got several influences, especially in thein the cooking, for example, coming
from Spain, we have some bayclassic one okay with rice or just with
no all. We have also somespecific influences from friends, for example with
(06:11):
the butter the butter cooking because herethe habit is to cook with oliver oil.
So a lot of different recipes okay. And nowadays we have we have
a big mix between Italian influences andSpanish influences Catalan for sure, because this
is we all Catalan cooking and Frenchinfluences. In terms of Catalan cooking,
(06:35):
for example, I will give viewsome name, some special name of some
recipes like balls. The people,lads, I know that you are completely
aware of possibly the possibility to findsome wonderful meat balls everywhere in the world.
But here Rossillo, we have theseballers balls the people lad which are
(06:57):
cooked during all the year and thefor example, some good meat, good
mixed meat between veal, beef andpork, and we are we are putting
a little bit of salt, alittle bit of pepper, a little bit
of garlic, because the garlic it'slike the one of the main ingredients in
the in the Catalan kitchen. Andafter that we fried them and we can
(07:26):
do a special accommodation that the traditionis to use some mushrooms like porcini mushrooms
and uh and to have also justa little source made between garlic and at
the time onions, a little bitof tormento, and everything is completely reduced.
We are adding a main ingredient alsowhich is coming from our vines,
(07:49):
which is called rancio sec I don'tknow if you remember that. You taste
it with me, some dry rancioand rossion and the dry rancio it's really
a very good ingredient for the kitchen. You can give a little bit of
kind of runs it. If Ican say it rands it style for the
(08:13):
for the recipe, and this sauceis already used for example with some beans,
white beans, or with some stewlike a little bit of potatoes,
a little bit of carrod. Sodepending the period of the season, for
example, in the in the spring, we can have some potatoes and new
potatoes coming from Roston, for sure, and some carrods, and in them
(08:39):
in the outen, for example,you can have some white beans. So
this is a wonderful recipe. Andwe have several recipes which are mixing in
the classic way a product from thesea and products from the ground. For
example, in France you can doa wonderful chicken roasted chicken. In Catalonia
(09:01):
we are doing a chicken with promsokay, with a special sauce another time,
and with a special lion. Forthe sauce. We have a special
lion which is called picada. Idon't know if you are aware on that,
but picicad is something another time amazing, based on something always a little
bit brands it. We are usingus some bread, some old bread,
(09:26):
if I can say, or bread. We fried it in olive oil.
And we are doing exactly the samewith garlic, and we are crushing everything
together and we can add for example, if you want the name of this
link is called picada. And thispicada can be used for a white sauce
(09:48):
for example, with just almond,we adding some almond powder fresh alman completely
crush it, mix it with thisspecial a picada. Otherwise, if you
want to do for examples two witha with a bronze sauce, for example,
with wine, you can add justin the past it was cocoa beans
(10:13):
and nowadays it's a black chocolate andeven better chocolate. So we have some
specialties in or c which are reallyincredible. So with these lumber gambas chicken
with prawns, it's really a mixbetween the ad touch of the prawns and
(10:37):
the crispiness in fact of the skinof the chicken. And it's really really
full of flavors and really tasty.And for sure always wines to accommodate with
and to pair with with the food. Catalan foods making me hungry. Crazy,
(10:58):
Yeah, it's crazy, crazy way. And what is really crazy it
is you can change your plate everyday. We have always a lot of
colors. We are playing a lotwith the vegetables also, and u and
with fruits also because in terms ofhabit and tradition, we are doing a
(11:20):
lot of sweet and sole recipes andsweet and salt recipes or using some fruit
or spices more or less in thesame idea as you can find in Nassia.
So besides making us hungry, itmakes us curious to learn more and
come back and visit. Eric.You mentioned the word that we were going
(11:43):
to dive into a little later,but I thought maybe since you brought it
up, I want to kind ofgo into it. It's we're gonna get
into litter. You mentioned the wordramco, which I think warrants some explanation
when you're discussing the food because itcan mean something else in English rancio as
a term. I'd like you toexplain it in the term for wine making
(12:07):
and food because it means something elsein English. Yeah, yeah, yeah,
for me, a problems the translation. It's always a problem because Rance
it is not really the right feelingsthat you can have with with a dry
rancio, even with a sweet rancio. For myself, the rancio expression,
it's mainly the expression of I wouldsay, we have a wide range of
(12:31):
aromas. It can start with somethinglike a baby rans it batter with a
kind of freshness which is nearly likea minty freshness. Sorry, and we
can have at the end of youryour event dig we can have something very
(12:54):
dry expression of francio, very strongexpression like something quite natty. And we
have also some wonderful spiciness like cominglike specific I can't remember now the English
world for that, but it's afinny greg in French. Yeah, exactly.
(13:20):
Yeah, So with a rantio wecan have some special discovery because in
fact, in the past, thedrive rancio was just dedicated from the kitchen
because everyone was not not a shame, but we had the habit too to
put it aside, this style ofwine just to have an apprivative, just
(13:43):
to have a drink as an apprivative, otherwise just to use in the cooking.
Nowadays a lot of somebody else allover the world are looking for this
style of wine because they are oncewhich some wonderful partners to pair with a
special food. For example, wewere talking about mushroom just previously. If
(14:05):
you have trafforms or if you havechanter, even some porsini, you will
be completely happy with with with apairing. If you have, in another
way some charcuteri and mainly quite oldcharcuteri, quite aged charcuteri, it would
(14:26):
be wonderful because the fatness of theold charcuteri will give you a wonderful answer
to the to the romness and tothe very soft expression of the Ranci style.
And after that the spiciness of therancio will give a wonderful answer to
the saltiness. For example, ifyou have a piece of ham, salty
(14:48):
ham, it would be good.But in another way, if you have
a salty for example anchovies okay,which is traditional from here from Klua in
basing Rucon that is from Coryon.So saltia and hubbies give a little touch
of nutty expression, and the iodineexpression will give a wonderful answer to the
(15:13):
espression of the of umami from theRancier style. So we can have something
amazing with ben donat dry Rancier.Well, you know, thank you for
explaining it, because that's a greatgateway into talking about the wines, because
it was an expression that was fairlynew. I know. To me,
what about you, David, I'dheard Abroutia before but never from this region
(15:35):
exactly. But it's very specific hereabsolutely, So a couple of things.
Let's step back a minute and talkabout Rousselon, the region and it's unique
geography that creates these microclimates. Aswe said, it's a smaller of the
regions of longer like Rousselon and umthere's a specific it's got very specific geography
(15:56):
and AOPs. Of course we'll getinto the dry wines and then vander natural.
Sure, sure, sure us planthat, I think, but I
think that it's really important to insiston that Russia area. It's a very
small Amphisiata open to the military.And see it is a mountain us Amphisiata.
So we can say that the vineyardis really nursauled directly in Descerentphithiata,
(16:22):
and the vineyard is between zero upto roughly seven hundred eight hundred meters of
high and everything its own slopes,mainly eighty percent of the vineyard it's own
slopes. And because we are likeyou describe previously different valley, because we
have three different rivers, because wehave those mountains, we have an incredible
(16:44):
region with for sure an expression ofthe military and climate, but we seeveral
different expression of this military climate.So we have an incredible patchwork of tarua
of micro terro and on myself,the expression is something amazing in Ossio because
we have different soils, perhaps oneof the best expression of the diversities that
(17:08):
you can find in terms of agronomyfor the soil and sub soil in the
world. Okay, we have alsothe possibility to played with a different altitude,
the possibility to play with a differentexposures, playing for sure with also
the environment. Because if we needto insist on that, Russia area is
(17:32):
one one of the more important vineyardwhich is situated between the mountain and the
sea. Okay, at the sametime, for example, if you want
to go to have a bus endof much beginning of April, you can
do it and after one hour youcan go to ski if you want,
(17:55):
so it's not a problem. Sothis is a kind of paradise Roussio.
It's really really interesting now nowadays fora lot to Forgneus, a lot of
newcomers in terms of vineyards because wehave we have this unique unixity and something
amazing in terms of possibility to dofor terrours and for diversity of wines.
(18:21):
And for sure you were talking aboutvendor natural fortified sweet wines, but we
have also someone who dry wines andsomething also completely incredible. I think,
I believe completely sure that we thatwe are one one of the unique place
(18:41):
in France to have the possibility torevendicate all the vineyard in lp. So
the top of quality is not reallythe case nowadays in Luso, because we
are doing according to the demand.We are doing also some PGI. Okay,
we have a lot of video orroughly seventy percent of video and the
(19:03):
rest is PGI just to answer tothe demand, for example, for one
single variety, one special sing onespecial nification. So you need to keep
in mind that Rossio it's an amazingplace to make a wide range of wine
and always a wine for the pleasure. Okay, because for me Rossio,
(19:26):
between dry and fortify sweet wines,we have something credible in terms of drink
ability, in terms of balance.For sure, we talk it also about
climate, but the climate here issomething very good for the body, is
something very pleasant for the tourists.Okay, but it's sometime too warm and
(19:51):
sometime to dry, and here inRossio, we are producing wines which are
completely unexpected. For example, whiteswines we are developed. We are developing
a lot of the production of whiteones with some specific varieties and what isn't
(20:11):
credible, it's always the same thingusing the old traditional way of work,
mixing this with new technology for tohave a maximum of quality in the wines.
And when we have in mind thatin Russion the production is one of
the lowest that you can find inthe world. Because when you started for
(20:37):
the introduction, Melany, you saidLangodoc Chrossian region. But if you are
checking the Langoedoc production and the Russianproduction, we are good complimentarities as you
discover it by yourself. But interms of yield, the total average yield
for Russion production is less sense auctoralcharacter. So it's nothing okay. And
(20:59):
it's in terms of quality is puttingreally on the top of the energy of
Lusio. So that's interesting. Um, you know, I have a question
for you you reference the wine.We'd like to start on the dryways.
I think for our listeners it'll beinteresting too deep dive into you know.
There's fifteen AOPs. This is fromthe Jerusalem site. By the way,
(21:22):
and twenty four grape varreadies. Whatare the standout grape varreadies starting with white
wines that our listeners would be thinkingabout looking for when they go to retailers
and styles. Yeah, in stylefor white wines. In fact, we
have traditional grape varieties. We areusing grapeieties which are really clean in terms
(21:44):
of aromas or really fresh in termsof aromas. Also because sometimes we don't
have to mini acidity and thanks toweek and thanks to the technology and the
way of walk, we are ableto push the freshness of the wine,
you know, so the freshness cancome from the soil, sometimes from the
(22:06):
altitude and from the berries. Andin terms of varietals we are we are
using traditional one which is macabel okay, which is called also begin in Spain.
We are using more and more andbecause this is a dominant gray variety
in Lucio, Granacia okay, granashawhite and gnashal gray. With the granacial
(22:27):
gray is something amazing because we havea good royal expression. We have a
good and insid flavors which is cominga classic way for the granasia. But
because it's a pink granaca gray pink, you can understand it. We have
structure and we have minivality also,and it's a kind of powered again miniality
(22:49):
and also a situa cy miniarity andthe good freshness thanks to that and the
wine with structure, that means youcan you can bring them very quickly and
they are very pleasant like this,or you can lay down with our problem.
And this was that I said,they are sometimes unexpected because everybody in
(23:10):
the world, in the world's talkingabout Chardonnay or Sauvignon Blan or even Dionaea.
Okay, but when we are talkingabout Garnasa, for example, you
can be completely surprised. Okay.So for our CEO, what is really
important. Also we're talking about awide range of wine, different colors,
(23:30):
different aging, and you need toremember that we can play really with the
versatility of how old grapes, especiallyall grapes coming from all vines. Because
you need to keep in mind alsothat the vineyard in Oco, it's at
(23:51):
least fifty percent of the vineyard withat least fifteen years old, okay,
from fifteen years old too, Iwould say, and eighty years old for
the vine so you can expect somequintescence and really, when you have low
yield, you can put on thetop each element of the each element of
(24:11):
the gray varieties, each element ofthe benification. And when I talk about
technology for the unification, I'm notsure that people can understand it. But
the main improved movement that we gothere in Rousillon was a cooling machine.
And in fact we were doing somewonderful ones in a long time ago.
(24:33):
But nowadays we are able to makethe best and to keep them with our
program. And this is really important. And when I was talking about versatility,
you need to understand, for example, that all the family of the
grenage of white gray and even blackgranage or Yadna pollute are able to be
(24:56):
produced also as a fortified sweet onevendu nature. So sorry for that,
I forgot to to to introduce youquickie, or is up to you if
you want, I can introduce itright now. What is a venduna because
is something quite unique. Well,we did want to We just wanted to
just quickly touch on the dry whitesfirst and then any dry reds and then
(25:21):
we were going to segue into anddo natural So we because we taste it,
because we did two seminars and onewas one was on the dry wines
and and and the various microclimates.And we taste it and we have we'll
have our notes in front of us. And we tasted some interesting the whites
Macabeo, which shows the Catalan influence. There's grenache blanc, as U said,
(25:41):
grenache gray. There was also Vermontino, which is role in the south,
and some marsan and were said.One of the wines also had a
Saverignon blanc in it. I can'tsee the notes from here. It was
a cooke Catalon blanc. Yeah,this is not so usual to find some
soil nowadays. It would be muchmore usual to find some carnian blam okay
(26:06):
karnangly. This is more unique,you know, than svinium blam and by
itself, for example, Carnian blandkaryangri brings to the wine a wonderful acidity,
a natural acidity. And in thepast it was put on the side
because it was too acidic, butnowadays is important, especially according to global
(26:30):
warming, and for sure because globalwarming. For example, the production of
servinium blan, which is not traditionaland as the time here is so difficult
because we have a lack of acidityin fact at the end, so just
talking talking about the break the breakdownof a different style of wines in dry
(26:53):
wines. So you need to keepin mind that in the past we were
producing a lot of red wines instill dry wines. Nowadays we can have
we can share in two pieces,one piece for the PGI, one piece
for the PDEO, for the video. We're still going on with a good
(27:15):
production, a good quantity graphy seventypercent of red wine, we have roughly
twenty percent of rose wine and therest is wide. But for the PGI
we have something which is completely inthe opposition because nowadays we are increasing a
lot of production because the demand forwhite wines abroad main need. So we
(27:40):
have roughly twenty five to thirty percentof white wine in PGI. We have
roughly exactly the same in rose winerose one, which are nearly with a
full quantity consume here there is nota lot of exportation for rose wine from
ZEO and the rest for PGI isread so that means less than forty percent
(28:03):
of the production of PGI is red. Keep in mind also something very important
talking about red and white in Rosonjustus. Of all, the name of
Rosson is coming from the brown color. Who in frames okay, because we
have a lot of oxidized iron ina several types of soil we have oxidized
(28:26):
iron, and to produce white wine. Sometimes it's too difficult because, for
example, we can have some oxidizediron which which can go through the skin
of the of the babies, sodifficult to make a red vinification avoiding this
(28:47):
color. And on the other side, the production of red wine when you
have oxidized iron could be very pleasantbecause we insist thanks to the ron to
the color of the of the blackred violet teens. So we need to
keep in mind everything about pauses.I'm curious becauses that oxidized soil, that
(29:12):
red soil. Yeah, and whenthe people arrived from the noose of friends,
even from Languedoc. When you arefrom Languedoc, when you pass through
the Corbia mountain, you arrive andthe first soils that you are discovering here
it's red. It's a red claywith a lot of oxidized iron. So
(29:33):
it's for that people is calling Rossion. And remember also something or perhaps I
can give you an information that isquite important for me. The first implantation
of vine in Rosso was done duringthe seventh century before Christmas, and it
was done by the Greeks Corencient.And when the Corengian arrived arrived here in
(29:57):
Rosson, they were looking for salt, and in fact that they found salt,
but also iron okay, and theyplanted vineyard until the high plateau next
to the to the biggest mountain ofthe Canigou, and one of the vineyards
(30:17):
planted by the Greek people was nearlyaround one thousand and two hundred meters of
high. So this is really specialwhen you are thinking about that, you
know, because iron push a lotof people to climb to the mountain and
to go to restract the the ironitself, to make some weapons and one
(30:42):
thing another time perhaps interesting for you. You I don't know, I hope.
So during the Middle Age, forexample, we were very famous thanks
to the wines, thanks to thefind natural fortified sweet one. It was
a wonderful money to a change withthe other the land. And the second
money which was used was the weapons, okay, and the weapons, the
(31:07):
Catalan weapons. The Catalan walk forfor the iron was known all over the
Miniterarian sea so important to to toto link always the iron, the wine
and the and the and the cultureof the USA. Thank you so much
for that explanation. I think it'simportant, um, because it is such
(31:30):
a distinguishing factor. Um. Let'sdo talk about the vander natural which is
the other masterclass, and I thinkit's important that we learned. You know,
this region Rousselon, the vendors arelike the gems and it's like they
represent eighty percent of sweet wine productionof France and sixty percent worldwide. Thank
(31:51):
you vander Rousselin and Eric, sobig topic and fascinating range. Yeah,
this is this is incredible. Uh. In fact, when you when you
have in the memory that the fortificationwas born here in Rosello thanks to a
guy who was called Arnaldo Villanova.He was during the aim middle Age,
during the thirteenth century, the endof the thirteenth century. And this man
(32:16):
was a very book, very bigdoctor. It was a private doctor of
the king of Majorca because at thattime we were under the Kingdom of Majorca
and it was more or less I'mpretty sure that everyone is aware of who
was Leonard de Vincy. Okay,and Leonard Evinci did more as the same
(32:39):
things. And another billanover maid also, so that means it was a doctor.
He did a lot to improve themedicine all of our friends. It
was the first one in Europe towrite some book of dietetic and some book
of gastronomy pairing between food and wineanother time, if I can insist on
(33:04):
that, sorry for that, butI'm very proud of my region, you
know, and I can insist onthat. You need to understand that our
region was really with a big culturefor the for the for the cuisine and
for the moment of the tasting.At that moment, it was normal to
(33:25):
eat with some spoon and some knife, and some folk with a plate and
with glasses in front of us todrink the wine. Keep in mind that
when we became French during the seventeenthcentury, when the King of Friends came
here, it was completely surprised tosee that, because at that period in
(33:49):
France it was always the abbit toit with the end and with a bread,
taking the food directly by hand andjust drinking wind or water in a
in a special in a special Idon't know the word of that, sorry.
Like it was a glass, itwas used as a glass, but
(34:10):
it wasn't at that moment glass.Okay, so this is important to keep
it. So coming back one anotherwho receives is wonderful, know how,
a knowledgious from a guy who wasalso very important in the North Africa.
(34:30):
It was an Arabic guy and thatguy gave to another via the alymbic.
So another was the first one inOcciden to use the alymbic to create for
sure distillation, to use the distillateas a medicine. And he has the
idea, yes, yes, hehad sorry the idea to to mix this
(34:57):
distillate with a most informidation and soit created the fortification. And by the
fortification for sure, the wines werewas also a wonderful medicine but also something
very stable to able to to tobe transported with our program. Okay,
(35:17):
So nowadays, just to summarize veryquickly, what is a vendo natural?
Vendo naturally is a wine made withtraditional way variet tolls from grand nash,
white gray black from maccabello from malvasio, rossion from Muscat small grain or muscat
(35:40):
Alexandria. So he has a traditionalgray varieties used for vend natur and vendo
naturally is immersed that we are doinglike in the classic way to do a
dry wine. But at one momentyou need to stop the alcoholic commentation.
So this is important top in mind. Always alcoholic fermentation, always a production
(36:04):
of alcohol by the fermentation itself.And when you need to stop it,
you add alcohol, a pure andnutural alcohol coming nowadays from vinic origin,
and you kill the the east andyou keep a part of the natural sugar
without fermenting. So like that wecan balance with our problem because we are
(36:30):
nowadays eight century of know how withthis technique, so we can balance with
our problems sugar, the ras sugar, the alcohol produced and added, and
the balance between acidity and structure.So vendor natural nowadays is a wonderful range
(36:52):
of non oxidized wine and oxidized wine. So when I say nonoxidize, everybody
can understand that we are keeping reallythe ants of the wine in the bottle.
That means when you're opening a bottle, if you put a white or
rose or red wine, it wouldbe completely white rose red with all the
(37:15):
main characteristic of a white roseo red. Plus for sure always the Roserr sugar,
which is helped a lot for thebalance and which is like is not
the sweet wine? Sorry to saythat, but the question of sweet wine
for me sometimes is used in abad way. For me, it's a
(37:35):
vendom natural is a real wine.For sure, we have a kind of
sweetness, but it's not just sweetness. We are a lot of wonderful feeling,
a lot of wonderful balance, andit's still a wine. So you
can use it as a real winefrom the pervative to during a meal,
after the meal, just reading awonderful book, or just taking a sip
(38:00):
to recover your health, or Idon't know what. So it's the wine
vendo naturally amazing. So keep inmind we have the non oxidized style and
on the other side we have thetraditional wine, which are completely with oxidation.
So remember what I said previously.Another vill An hour was during the
(38:20):
Middle Eage and we talked about moneyto each change, and the vendor Natural
was a wonderful money for those exchanges. And at that moment it was
forbidden for us to go through theCarbia mountains, so the unique way was
to go through the seas some internsea by boat and people discover it.
(38:45):
The management of the oxidation at thatmoment, because the barrels or the corners
which were inside the boat and thebarrels or the corners which were on the
top of the of the boat werecompletely different. At the arrival on the
top it was with a kind ofoxidation with for example, from a young
(39:09):
black fruit, it became something alittle bit jemmy in something expressing us to
reflection notes some cocoa beans, somecoffee beans, some roasted expressions, special
spices, and so on and soon. So keep in mind also that
(39:30):
the oxidation is an illness, andwe are managing since already eight and a
year ago and nowadays the vendor naturalwith oxidation in one side amber style,
so they are mainly coming from fromwhite origin. And on the other side
we can have truly tawny red coloredwines which are coming mainly from red origin.
(39:53):
And to get the oxidation we havesome big, big ways to do.
We can we can use for example, some classic concrete tank, we
can use some wooden continents, wecan use different sides of condors. We
can make the oxidation inside the cellarsor acts out the sellers something a little
(40:19):
bit more incredible. When we areoutside. For example, we can use
some summign glass glass continers and heresorry to say that, but here sometimes
we are we have a mix inthe in the sentence because people understand that
is oxidation outside with summigon, butin fact it is mainly a destruction of
(40:43):
the wine than an oxidation, becausewe don't have any change with the with
the oxygen of the We have justa destruction by the photo of the light
and the changement of temperatures, sothe color is going down the room.
Us are completely changing. And forsure, like all the way of edging
(41:06):
and maturation, because I'm talking aboutmaturation much more sometimes than edging. The
way of maturation are really different andeach one is bringing something to the vendor.
Nature reloxid died, and it's notabout that we can find for example
just a single QV made with bombardedthere or SINGLEQV made with just power,
(41:32):
or just a concrete tank. Sosometimes we have a big mix to make
the main expression and the more beautifulexpression of the vintage. Because when we
are talking about oxidized wine, sometimeswe are talking about all vintages and we
are lacking nose on because for example, we can go down until the eighteen
(41:57):
seventy year, always available for cellsin some cellers. Otherwise we have also
the traditional way to make some blendbetween different vintages. And for sure we
can have some very variable wines nowadays, if I can summarize in just one
(42:19):
sentence, we have non oxidized wineswhich are really pleasant for I would say
new consumers or people who love thefreshness and the direct pleasure. And on
the other side we have wines whichare much more for conneiss with oxidative style
and where you will find always somethingamazing. They are wines I would say,
(42:46):
against the analogy, and they arereally magic wins. So do not
desitate to try those wins because becausethey have the expression of a full culture,
wonderful story. And remember that eightcenturyw of know how busy start off
point. So I think it's compulsoryfor me to go home with with this
(43:13):
production because nowaday unfortunately the sweet winein the wall are quite difficult to sell.
But zos wine as a place forall the table for all the people
with loves wine, you know,Melanie, I found the Vandue naturals fascinating
because there's so many there's so manydifferent ways to make it, and there's
(43:37):
also so many different styles of it. Yeah, that that there's a there's
a huge breadth of diversity in thewines. And I thought that was really
interesting, and I want to pointout that, you know, Eric,
you've been talking about the fact thatit's a fortified wine, but it's very
different from port because it's actually thefortification happens while the wine is still fermenting
to stop the fermentation, and it'snot added after the fermentation ends. So
(43:59):
that's a that's a the huge differencein the fact that what's then the natural
apart, Yeah, it happens duringfermentation. Yeah, it's append the imflementation
for both of them, Port andthen natural. But one thing important,
the port was creating during the eighteenthcentury. Okay, that means five century
(44:21):
after the creation of the fortification inOco. After that, keep in mind
that we have different laws for shorefor the production in the world, we
have more lay the same aim,but in the reality when you have a
look in the details, we havea different level for the compulsory mativity for
(44:42):
the berries for the crop. Okay, we have different alcohol use because for
example, port, it's your realspirit roughly seventy lbv, Severty seventy percent
LBV, and for a hoo areathen do natural. It's a pure and
natural alcohol from vinic origin, andfor sure because it's ninety six percent an
(45:05):
all, just an all. Thefour percent on the side is just water.
The quantity of alcohol added for Bendonatural is a very small ament between
five to ten percent of the ofthe volume of the master that you are
walking on, and for the portit could be more much more than that.
And another big difference for me,it's a LBV final BV for port
(45:31):
that is higher than d lbv.For then do not your average. For
vendonatural it's a sixteen sixteen point fiveperson volume and for port is at least
twenty one, okay, twenty two. So this is another world for me
and another thing very important. Whenyou are using nutural alcohol, we have
(45:54):
a marriage which is made immediately afterone week. If you want to have
a drink directly on the tank justproduced, you can do it. For
when natural both you need to waita little bit because the spirit as for
sure a pot of alcohol but alsoa no non alcohol and he needs to
(46:16):
wait a little bit. That wehave step by step kind of fusion,
you know, but for sure keepin mind at the end the aim is
the same and at the end theprofile would be very close one to one,
you know. You know, I'dlike to do um is explain some
(46:39):
of the different styles because we tastedthem and so that again our listeners can
seek them out, whether they're diningout or some ways can pick them out.
The very specific styles starting with Maria. Yeah, yeah, we have
we have specific styles. So soyou you're talking about one specific appellation more
(47:00):
just perhap very quickly to to tosay the name, to describe the name
of each appelation that you can findin Rostio. They are just a video.
So the biggest production of mus fortifiedmuscat in the world is called Muscasalt
is producing roseo and made just withmuscat gray varieties. It's a white o
(47:23):
region without oxidation. Normally. Afterthat we have reversalt, which is a
very typical appelation also quite important alsoin a different way, so mainly in
red without assidation, just a viewin rose and we have a lot in
number style and and a little bitless in Trili origin for more. More
(47:47):
is a very small appellation dedicated onlyto the to the to the village of
the movie and Morie as small asthe same ideas and the result. But
we find red which is called Grana. We find white without oxidation also and
(48:08):
we have amber and twilli, okay, and to finish for the different appellation,
we have banners and baneus Gang Crew, so Banyers and Banner Grand Crew
as the one of the biggest possibilityto produce. So in white rose red
(48:29):
without oxidation and amber and Twili withoxidation. And one thing about just to
come back on what you said previously, so when you have a look on
the on the production of those fortifiedstreet ones, those bender naturally. For
sure. The great varieties are exactlythe same. The way of unification is
(48:51):
exactly the same for the world washere. But what is changing a lot
is the terror. For example,when you are talking and Marie, it's
a black shist okay is next tothe Corbia Mountain, on the south face
of the Carbia Mountain, and it'sreally with a baby big wideness in terms
(49:13):
of embirollment with with the Gariga whichis mainly bay trees, mainly juniper trees
a lot of while avander a lotof sage. So between the low,
the low yield, the aromas fromthe gariga, and the expression of the
grenache itself, because the grenache isa king variet all there and the way
(49:38):
of work with a natural alcole,you can respect the full elements of what
is making the terra. This terwar can be completely different in valuals you
see facing the yeah values, facingthe sea with great shist not black,
so completely different. In terms ofexpression of soil. Let's concern tuition a
(50:00):
little, if I can say ita little bit more feminine, very dedicate
very salt intern of expression, abstructionand for sure the sea, the sea
with the seaweed expression, with freshair coming from the sea, with the
(50:20):
saltiness. So this can be incredible, you know, And for sure it's
always it's always the same idea.We can do always some specific details according
the production of vendor nature in rossion, according the great variety, use according
the way of work, because forsure you can when I told you that
(50:43):
we are doing like in a dryone and one moment, we are stopping
the alcorifementation. It depends what youare doing before to stop the alcor ifementation.
If you're doing a geore pressing forexample for a white wine or just
a skin marceration or just motification onthe solid phase. It's changing, always
a style. So imagine you canhave differencies thanks to the techline. You
(51:10):
can have differencies thanks to the greatvarieties. You can have differencies thanks to
the benification, thanks to the wayof aging. And this way of aging
is making at least fifty percent ofthe quality of the wine. You know,
Eric, you've given us such agreat explanation on all the wines of
Russalon, especially the Von Due Natural, which were really eye opening to us.
(51:34):
It's fascinating and we encourage everybody toconsider visiting Rousson and looking for the
wines in their retail stores or onrestaurant menus. They're great discovery. Again,
we've been speaking with Eric Arasil,who is with Von d Rusalon,
and if you would love to learnmore about this region and the wines,
(51:57):
you can visit Russian wine dot com. It's a great site, very good
with information. Eric, thank youfor joining us on the Connected Table.
My pleasure. Thank you very muchto invite me. And this is another
edition of the Connected Table. Wehope you enjoyed it. We hope you
will follow us as we continue totravel and share our discoveries with you,
our listeners. You can find uson Instagram at the Connected Table, check
(52:21):
out all our shows on more thanthirty five podcasts, including streamed at the
Connected table dot com, and alwaysour messages, stay insatiably curious. Thank you,
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