John MacDonald: Lessons for the future from the ferry deal

For me, one of the best things to come out of yesterday’s announcement about the Cook Strait ferries has nothing to do with the ferries themselves. 

There’s still a bit of smoke and mirrors about the numbers and what it’s going to end up costing.  

Because what it still comes down to is that the Government poured $671 million down the drain when the Finance Minister pulled the plug on funding for the old ferry project. Which some —Nicola Willis included— thought was too Flash Harry with too many bells and whistles. 

They were, generally, the bells and whistles for the portside infrastructure. That’s where the concerns about the cost blow-outs came from. And that’s the side of it that could still blow out. Nevertheless, Rail Minister Winston Peters says it’s still a better deal. Even though it’s going to mean we get smaller ships, lower spec portside facilities, years later than planned. 

Nevertheless, I really like what he’s saying about the Government getting the experts in to provide advice and guidance from the get-go. And I want to see a lot more of this from the current government and future governments.  

Because one thing that’s always got me about politicians is how they can end up in government and find themselves in Cabinet and be put in charge of things they have absolutely no clue about.  

And politicians being politicians, full of ego and bluster, they plod along faking it and hoping they make it – without asking people who actually know stuff for help.  

We saw this with the last government when Jacinda Ardern invited senior business leaders to give their input into the COVID response planning, but they were left feeling ignored. I remember people like former Air NZ boss Rob Fyfe talking about it and how frustrating it was. 

But if this ferry project is back on track because the Government has actually asked people who know what they’re on about for advice and guidance and has actually listened, then that has to be a good thing.   

And I think politicians need to get out of the way more often and let experts have more of a say on big infrastructure projects, if it means things being done more efficiently and without the kind of cost blowouts that now seem to be par for the course.  

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:06):
You're listening to the Canterbury Mornings podcast with John McDonald
from News Talk ZB.

Speaker 2 (00:13):
For me, one of the best things to come out
of yesterday's announcement about the Cookstrait fairies actually has nothing
to do with the fairies themselves. I've got to say
that there's still a bit of smoke and mirrors a
involved about the numbers and what it's going to end
up costing, because what it still comes down to for
me anyway, is that the government poured six hundred and

(00:36):
seventy one million dollars down the train when Finance Minister
or the Finance Minister pulled the plug on the odd
project that was the Irex project, which some Nicola Willis
being one of them, thought was all to flash Harry
with too many bells and whistles, and they were generally

(00:57):
the bells and whistles for the port side infrastructure. That's
where the concerns about the cost blowouts came from, and
that's the bit that the government is still being pretty
cagey about and that's a side of it that could
still blow out. Nevertheless, Rail Minister Winston Peters says still
a better deal, even though it's going to mean we

(01:17):
get smaller ships, lower spec port side facilities years later
than planned. All of that on the timing front. By
the way, one of the fairies will be delivered at
the start of twenty twenty nine, the second the end
of twenty twenty nine. But this is the bit I
want to get to. If we give Winston the benefit

(01:38):
of the doubt, and we sit tight and we accept
as reassurances that what we end up with is going
to be much better value, et cetera, cetera, et cetera,
let me push that aside. Let me come to the
bit I'm really liking about yesterday's announcement and the bit
that I'm interested in getting your thoughts on. And it's
the reason Winston Peters is giving as to why or

(02:00):
as to how the government has been able to cut costs.
You might have heard him talking to Mike this morning,
was on with heavy yesterday as well. And as I say,
push all the smoke and mirror stuff about the numbers
aside for now, and I've got to say that I
really like what he's saying about the government getting the

(02:20):
experts in to provide advice and guidance, and I want
to see a lot more of this. I'm talking about
the current government, I'm talking about future governments. I'm talking
about all politicians because you know, one thing that's always
got me about politicians is how they can end up
in government and find themselves in cabinet and be put

(02:43):
in charge of things they have absolutely no clue about,
no idea there no politicians being politicians, full of ego,
full of bluster, they plod along, faking it and hoping
they'll make it without asking people who actually know stuff
for help. We saw this with the last government during

(03:05):
COVID when Cindra are doing put together that group of
senior business leaders, remember that put this group together to
give their input into the COVID response planning. What happened
they were pretty much ignored was because the politicians they
knew best. And I remember people like former Any Zealand
boss Rob Fife talking about it and how frustrating it was.

(03:27):
I think Sarah and Taylor might have been caught up
in that too, and he felt as well that he
wasn't being listened to. And I don't even think they
were asked leadlone listen to. But if this Fery project
is back on track because the government has actually asked
people who know what they're on about for advice and guidance,

(03:49):
as Winston says, and the government has actually listened, then
that has to be a good thing. I mean, it
has to be a brilliant thing. And I think politicians
need to get out of the way more often. Because
here's what Winston Peters said about it when he was
on with Mike earlier.

Speaker 3 (04:05):
We've got so many examples. We've got Transmission Gully, We've
got poor to work with her. Every contract blew out
massively and there were huge delays. We can't afford to
have that sort of behavior from central government. And what
I'm saying to a lot of these people is some
of the politicians need to get out down a way
and get the right smart experienced business people, experienced trades people,

(04:27):
the captains and the ship owners and people over there
who might know something. But what they're talking about that
we're going to be far more that in the future
rather than a cost plus blowout and massive expensive and
zeal taxpayer.

Speaker 2 (04:38):
I love that kind of talk, Winston. I love it.
Bring it on, which brings me to the question I've
got fit you do you think politicians need to get
out of the way more and let experts have more
of a say on things like big infrastructure projects if
it means things being done more efficiently and without the

(04:58):
kind of cost blowouts Winston was talking about there. I
think so bringing the experts put the politicians in the
back seat.

Speaker 1 (05:07):
For more from Category Mornings with John McDonald, listen live
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