Gus Gilmore: Te Pūkenga CEO on the concerns that more than half of apprentices aren't finishing their training

There are concerns over the fact that more than half of trainees aren't completing their apprenticeships. 

Vocational Education Minister Penny Simmonds is seeking extra funding so new industry bodies can investigate low apprenticeship completion rates. 

She says the government could help through policy settings and funding, but the nature of the problem was likely to vary between industries. 

Te Pūkenga Chief Executive Gus Gilmore told Andrew Dickens things like training wage rates, low pay, and the economic downturn causing them to lose their job. 

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
All right. It turns out a trade apprenticeship isn't the
hal Mary. Some think it is. Over half of our
apprentice trainees in New Zealand drop out before they complete
their course. Last night, Vocational Education Minister Penny Simmons told
Ryan Bridge how much we've wasted on it. It's tens
of millions, probably getting close to hundreds of millions, so
it's quite a lot of money. But it's a waste

(00:21):
all round. Really, it's a waste for the government, but
it's also our waste for the employer. So Johnavan now
is the CEO of tipper Kinger Gus Gilmore, good morning to.

Speaker 2 (00:29):
You, Gus, Good morning Andrew.

Speaker 1 (00:31):
Is the money spent on your thing a waste?

Speaker 2 (00:35):
Look? I think the initiative from the minister she announced
yesterday is a really good thing. We need to continue
to research thoroughly why we're losing apprentices and a key
to there is first year attention rates. That's the canary
in the mind for us. And we've seen a steady
decline in those first year attention rates. Why due to

(00:56):
a number of factors.

Speaker 1 (00:57):
Yeah, why.

Speaker 2 (00:59):
The main categories from the research we did in twenty
twenty three, the first one is the system level type
factors where the apprentice and the employee don't have control
over things like training, wage rates, low pay, economic climate
where simply apprentices are unemployment and lose their job due

(01:21):
to the downturn in our economy. Second major area is
government compliance and immigration policy settings, so in some sectors
it's not a requirement to have apprenticeship qualification and we
see in those areas of our economy the dropout rates
are higher. And then the third major category is government

(01:43):
incentives and apprenticeship boost scheme is a really good one.
During twenty during the COVID period, there was an incentive
which paid employers to attract and retain apprentices. Unfortunately, that
turned into a bit of a sugar rush and we
saw huge growth and apprenticeship numbers, but the completion rates foul.

Speaker 1 (02:08):
So the ball is in your court. You're here to
train our next generation of workers. Can we fix it?

Speaker 2 (02:15):
Yeah? And there is an emerging positive picture. As I said,
the canary in the mind is our first year attention rates.
Last year in twenty twenty four, we saw those first
year rates move from sixty percent to seventy percent. So
we're going to see more apprentices completing over the next
three four years of their apprenticeship program, but important initiatives

(02:40):
likes providing support in the workplace. Two apprentices is important.
Apprentice is feeling valued, having the right culture in the workplace,
providing mentors from industry, those experienced people wrapping their support
around our young people learning on the job.

Speaker 1 (03:01):
Good stuff, Gus, I thank you so much for your
time today and I wish you were the very best
of luck.

Speaker 2 (03:06):
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