Sascha Dov Bachmann: Canberra law professor on Donald Trump's discussions with Putin in bid to end Russia-Ukraine war

US moves to end the war in Ukraine could work in Russia's favour, according to one expert.

President Donald Trump says talks will start immediately - and he's had a phone call with Russian President Vladimir Putin.

Commentators say it's highly unlikely Ukraine will get back its pre-war borders - a bottom line for leader Volodymyr Zelenskyy.

Canberra law professor Sascha Dov Bachmann says Putin will tell his people any territory Russia takes is a win.

"And that is the dangerous thing, that is the first step in the wrong direction." 

LISTEN ABOVE

See omnystudio.com/listener for privacy information.

Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
Twelve minutes after five, the big world news is the
possibility a peace in the Ukraine. US President Donald Trump
says he intends to negotiate an end to the war
in Ukraine talking to Vladimir Putin, possibly in Saudi Arabia.
It sounds like any peace deal, he hammers out, won't
be very favorable to Ukraine. He's talking about landswaps. US

(00:20):
Defense Secretary Pete Higseth says a return to twenty fourteen
but borders unlikely. And you know what, President Trump agrees.

Speaker 2 (00:27):
They took a lot of land, and they fought for
that land, and they lost a lot of they lost
a lot of soldiers. But it would just seem to me.
And I'm not making an opinion on it, but I've
read a lot on it, and a lot of people
think that that's unlikely. Some of it will come back.
I think some of it will come back.

Speaker 3 (00:44):
Yeah.

Speaker 1 (00:44):
So, Sasha dov Buckman is a professor of international law
and security at Cambridge University, and he joins me, Now, Hello, Sasha.

Speaker 3 (00:52):
Hello Andrew, nice talking to you.

Speaker 1 (00:54):
So was this for real or is he caving into Putin?
Or is this actually what has to happen?

Speaker 3 (01:01):
I think it's for real. It's what a Trump prior
to the elections are. During the last months of the election,
actually flaunted as a so called Trump peace plan. So
he was committed. He actually was boasting about it twenty
four hours and he will sort it out. He gave
a couple of reasons. But what we have to go
in old fairness, we have to say he actually with

(01:24):
General Kellogg, he assembled a team to look into it
in more detail, and there were also discussions with President Zelenski.
So it's no surprise that this is happening now. But
the problem obviously is how was it communicated and also
what exactly did the Secretary of Defense Hexit actually say yes.

Speaker 1 (01:45):
And the problem with it is that the US has
no intention to play any role in enforcing any peace,
in enforcing any ceasefire, and the Europeans are saying, well,
we need some help here. Then you're not going to
be there. How can we enforce it? Isn't that a problem?

Speaker 3 (02:00):
I think it's a major problem. The thing is it
was always left a little bit open. But if you
look at the proposals that were basically discussion around the
beginning of November, it was number one territorial concessions that
means freezing along the conflict lines, the line of contact,
as you would say. And then for example, later negotiations,
that was something where even Ukrainians and the Ukraine president

(02:24):
actually for the time being was you can say, amicable too.
The next thing was, and that is the most important thing,
it was NATO membership. You know that Ukraine for seventeen
years has been basically on that pathway to NATO membership.
And there were discussions and that came from the Trump camp.
There might be, for example, the possibility of a moratorium
to freeze, for example, any further discussions for about twenty years.

(02:46):
But the one thing that really strikes me here is
that back then there was a discussion that, for example,
use US troops without for example, you can say not
acting under NATO authority, hence not protected under NATO Article
five for example assist and that if I listen to
a Secretary of Defense heck said, he has basically made
a statement which actually rules that out. And that is

(03:08):
what is very boriusome. No NATO membership and also no
basically NATO troops that includes US troops.

Speaker 1 (03:16):
And one last question, if Russia takes more territory. Now
putin will paint that as a win. Could they then
use that as a springboard to have another crack in
the future.

Speaker 3 (03:27):
Absolutely, for me Trump to zero, that plan here can
turn into a Munich agreement to zero. And Trump gives
actually put in open, you can say, carte blanche to
sell that to his population as a win. And that
is the dangerous thing. That is the first step in
the wrong direction.

Speaker 1 (03:48):
Sasia, I thank you for your time today. That is
Sasha dove Backman and he's talking to us from camera.

Speaker 3 (03:53):
For more from Hither Duplessy Allen Drive listen live to
news talks it'd be from four pm weekdays, or follow
a podcast on iHeartRadio.