September 6, 2012 • 43 mins
Nowadays more and more cars use remote keyless entry technology - but what happens when you push the unlock button on your car's keychain fob? How secure is the technology? How come your fob doesn't unlock every car in range? Tune in to learn more.
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Go behind the wheel, under the hood and beyond with
car stuff from how Stuff Works dot com. Everybody, welcome
to the podcast. I'm Scott Benchman and I'm Den Bull
And then well I espe should tell them this car
stuff right, Oh, yes, this show is car stuff. They
probably know that they clicked on the link. Well, yeah, yeah,
(00:22):
we got so, we got smart listeners. We have listeners
in the know, I think, so we'll here's something related
to cars we can talk about today. Keyless entry systems. Yes,
more and more. These are the norm for a lot
of car owners. Yeah, I would say, uh, well you
would expect it now at this point. I mean, I
don't think it's like an option anymore. Even I think
it's just a standard feature. Um, I don't think you
(00:44):
have the option of having just a standard key like
you can get cut at a at a harbor store,
versus having you know, the key FOP. And that's what
we're talking about. It is just the keyless entry systems. Um,
we're gonna talk about some more fancy systems later on.
You know that will actually start the vehicle. Yeah, well
with your put of a button. But um, you get
the point. We're gonna go from basic keys all the
(01:04):
way through. I guess the latest and greatest, and of
course we'll take some special detours for the weird stuff. Scott,
let's cast our memory back to when these systems actually began. Yeah,
you know, here's the thing, like you used to be
able to go to the Harvar store and have any
key cut for any car. It seem they had him
on the rack, you know, the key uh turnstile thing,
(01:26):
the that you'd be able to just put it in
the machine. I cut many keys when I worked at
a Harvard store for cars, and I've got, you know,
that old Chrysler project that I have that has just
a standard key. It doesn't have any kind of chip
involved or anything. It's not high tech. But nowadays you
do have to go to a high tech locksmith in
order to get some of these made. If at all
you may have to go to the dealership. You may
have to go directly back to the source, especially if
(01:48):
it's one with a chip embedded in a physical key,
or if there are security issues. And as we'll talk about,
security issues are one of the big concerns. Yeah, and
there's laser cut keys, and there's I mean, you're typical
Harvar store locksmith is not going to have the tools
or devices to create the key even um, and and
some of that is up to you or the dealer
(02:08):
to reprogram the whole thing. So well, we'll get into
that too, but um, basically, I mean from the very
very beginning, if you think about this, and I've been
trying to think of like something that kind of matches
up with this, and I think that garage door openers
are probably the most similar to this in the early
early days. Spot on, because as you said off of
off of the air, I'm gonna steal your line for
(02:30):
this just be so good, uh, Scott, you basically broke
down the evolution from garage door openers to queyless entry
systems by saying, somewhere in history, there was a guy
in his car opening his garage, and he said, why
can't I just do this with my car doors? Exactly?
Why can't I? Why can I lower my convertible top
that way? Or why can't I? Why can I do
(02:51):
a lot of things with the push of a button.
And that's how so many great inventions start, is uh.
They begin when somebody finally asked a new question. Yeah,
and here's Here's the other kind of a tangent to
this is that, um, the gardge door openers began relatively
simply also and they've advanced kind of in the similar
in the same way, um, and that you know they
(03:12):
were Originally they had kind of a universal signal where
you know, you may be going in the street and honestly,
you could push a button and it may open up
the neighbor's Gardge door. Depends on if you bought it
at you know, the same place, if you bought it
at Sears and you happen to have the same code installed, etcetera.
And that wouldn't happen that often either because not that
many people had actually you know what I misspoke, not
if you had the same code and installed. But that
(03:33):
was the frequency, because they operated on a simple frequency
early early on, and I'm gonna probably i'm generalizing that,
I know, but it wasn't unheard of. It could happen. Um.
Later they kind of got a little smarter and they
decided to go to a dip switch system. And that's
where you know, you've probably seen this on older Gardge
doors if you have ever opened one up, maybe eight
(03:55):
switches and you can choose like an updown position for
each one of those, and then you course on that
with your controller and up down each each one has
a number and uh and if your code your your
own personal code, and you can make that different from
your neighbor's code, and that way it won't you know, interfere.
And then later um, and you know, now we have
what are called rolling codes, and rolling codes are just
(04:16):
different frequencies or you know, there's an ext there's an
expected frequency, a pattern in the frequency, and it jumps
a little bit every time, so it's it's kind of
a it's not as close to random as you're gonna get,
I guess, yeah, for this kind of technology. I mean,
just for the sake of comparison, Scott, let's look at
the difference between the dip switch system and the more
(04:39):
modern rolling code. A dip switch system would have about
two hundred and fifty six possible combinations for for your code.
Not bad, not bad at all. And you're probably not
going to live near two hundred and fifty six uh.
Other garages with the identical switch, you know, or with
one of those at this point in time, uh, over
(05:02):
eighteen billion billion possible values in the modern rolling eighteen billion,
eighteen billion possible codes with the rolling code system. Yes,
well that means it's it's incredible. Go ahead. That means
that with uh, with a hundred code cracking computers, Logically
(05:22):
we would assume it would take several decades to find
the right company. Now, that's a lot of effort to
get into someone's criage, but that is a lot and
you know what if that person is not even checking
on their car for twenty years. Honestly, I don't mean
to sound like, well this is important because um, you
know this kind of this is where we're going, or
we have gone actually with that with the modern key
(05:42):
and the key fob and the transmitter and the receiver
and it's seter we're gonna we're gonna get into all
the hardware that goes along with us. But UM, let's
go back to keys then. Now, okay, so we started
out with the original just simple key. Uh. Then we
had something, you know, someone said, what a great idea,
let's do that, and UM, I'm gonna gloss over this
a bit, but um, basically the first ones were I
(06:03):
our systems, which is infrared. And the problem with infrared
system you have to know the problem with them laid
on me line of sight. You had to be within
line of sight of the vehicle, and it was a
you know, I don't know about range on these because
I never found a distinct range on an I R
system A limit. But um, you did have to be right.
(06:23):
I mean you had to be pointing the key directly
at the receiver, which was probably up on the dast
somewhere like an eye that was maybe or behind the
mirror somewhere like that that was visible. But if you
were not in direct line of sight of it. And
you can remember, like the old televisions that had IR systems,
now they typically don't. Um, some of them still do,
I guess, but um, you have to point the remote
(06:44):
at the TV in order to get a switch, and
if you're pointing at the wrong direction, it just won't work.
If you're if you're laying on the couch and the
remote is behind a pillow or something, that's I can work,
that's right. You gotta move the pizza box out of
the way. It's a pain in the rear, so you
gotta it's it's it's difficult. So you can see are
are that's our troubled lives here. Yeah, it really is,
(07:06):
It really is. So um we advanced to what they
call our F system and radio frequency exactly, radio frequency
and our F systems are I guess much better because
you know, you can have this. You can have the
key fib in your pocket and push the button and
it would still work. It doesn't have to be line
of sight. You could be anywhere within a certain range
and that system will work. It will it will receive
(07:28):
the signal, it will send the signal. Um doesn't have
to be direct line of sight. You don't have to
point it at the vehicle referred to work, although a
lot of people still do. Yeah, but that's kind of
the same way that when a lot of people are
playing video games and they're trying their best to, you know,
go for a hard right or hard left, they feel
like they have to move their hands. Yeah, exactly. It's
the same thing because I know, when I get out
(07:49):
of my car, I tend to if I'm going to
lock the door, I tend to stick my hand out
arms length at the vehicle and push the button. The
gesture sort of helps. You can usually see me reading
to these gestures. If I've forgotten where I parked or
what level I parked on, and I'm walking through the
parking deck tapping the button because I know that what
(08:10):
I get about twenty feet away from my car, I'm
gonna hear a beat if it's mine away you can't
see your car. Well, look, man, I live a complicated life.
And what that's uh, I think I'm sorry. So, okay,
you know what, let's just talk about ranges right now,
what we're talking about, because this is kind I found
this kind of interesting. You know, I remember this a
(08:31):
long time ago here in this uh some for some
some service guys, but um, automotive service guys. Okay, not
military service guys, but uh, you know, the key fobs
have different ranges and and there's not only a different range.
I think maybe that has something to do with manufacturer,
but there's also a kind of a standard for the
(08:52):
continent that we live on. Yes, I've read about this
the countries that we live in, and it's it's interesting.
It's that you know, the United States here, um, in
North America, we have a range of about what they
call I think it's twenty meters, which is about sixty
five ft. And that seems about right, Oh, I said, yeah,
I'm sorry, I meant meters earlier. Oh that's all right,
no problems, no wonder it sounded like. I mean that's
(09:15):
the length of the vehicle. You're almost in the car,
so okay, so twentys right, and that's about sixty five
ft and that seems about right. I mean when I
think back to how far it works and doesn't work
when I'm in the parking structure whatever. In Japan, they
only have a range. They're only allowed a range of
about five meters. That's interesting. Yeah, now I don't know
(09:36):
what this. I don't know. I really don't know why
that is. I mean it means the frequencies that are
available for them to use. But that's only about sixteen
feet then, so it's not used there. You know, how
we use it to find the vehicle in the park,
Like I mentioned, you can't do that. They're really because
you'll you'll be at the vehicle. So I mean this
is more I guess utilitarian, and that you know you're
able to just simply lock and unlocked the car and
(09:57):
that's it. It's not I don't know something that you
can use as a as a finder. I do want
to mention a trick here, and I'm gonna just let
this out right now. I was gonna wait till the
end for this one. O UM. I don't recommend this, okay,
I want to get that out right up front here.
But you know, there's a little trick for extending the
range of your key fob. What is the rate. It's
(10:19):
a little awkward, it's strange, but it really works if
you get if you find like, let's say that you're
in a parking lot and you walk away and you
got to push that you realize, like, I forgot to
lock my your garph. So you grab the keys out
and you're still walking towards the building, but you're like, away, Yeah,
you're sixty eight meters away, that's right. So you're a
little too far. You push the button, it doesn't work,
and it's okay, that's right, man, we're gonna catch this
(10:42):
both up, both of them. So sixty eight feet away
your three ft out of range. You don't want to
walk back that that come or some three ft to
to unlock push the unlock button. So what you do
is you turn around and you stand in place, and
you put the key fob under your chin and touch
it to your chin and the push the button and
your head acts as an antenna that amplifies this. It's
(11:04):
like an amplifier. It amplifies the signal and you are
then able to locker, unlock your car, actually even lock
your car. That is amazing and frightening. And we'll do
it all the time. It is, and you know what,
test it sometimes if you want. I wouldn't recommend doing
this all the time because I don't know what it
does to you know, That's exactly why I don't want
to tell anybody to do this. But go to like
(11:26):
just the edge of your car's range, like push the
button and keep pushing it until, like you just it
doesn't work, and then go about three or four ft
farther away and then put it under your chin, push
the button and see if it works. And it will.
Oh man, we've just we we've just everybody pretty cool
party trick like a medical show. We're a medical show
(11:46):
now too. So let's real quick if we can talk
about what's actually inside these mysterious little fops. Right yeah, okay,
so as we as we've said, your car fob is
probably an r F system, which means it has a
radio transmitter. That's the thing you're desperately pushing when you're
wondering if you parked on level three or level two
(12:09):
of the parking deck. And then inside your car there's
a radio receiver. It's tuned to the frequency of your
transmit transmitter and so that's usually going to be around
three hundred four hundred mega hurts in a modern system.
And then it's got the rolling code. It's a little
secret language. But let's talk about what's actually inside your
(12:31):
controller there. The transmitter has a has a controller chip, right,
and of course it has a transmitter. I know this
sounds kind of I don't know, a little too nuts
and bolts, maybe a little too basic. I've a dope
mind before to change your battery, right, And that's that's
exactly where I'm going here, because they still have a battery.
(12:55):
And sometimes you might think that you are out of
range or some things where you just need to change
the battery and you can do it yourself. Usually that's
not a difficult procedure, and that's usually I mean, they'll
have even a battery access panel for you to pry open,
and oftentimes even on the outside of the key fob itself.
It'll tell you what type battery and how many it requires. UM,
(13:18):
that's a simple, simple fix. UM. You know, I guess
we talked about you know, the rolling codes already, right
have we mentioned? Um? You know the the this this
correlation between transmitter receiver, that's where all of the that
that's where all of this happens. I mean that anything
that you can try. You can transmit a signal to
this receiver and then tell it to do anything you want.
(13:39):
You can program that to do anything you want. Their
number of features that can be programmed with this, you
can you can have you know, three pushes on the
unlocked button means that you know, all the driver's side
windows roll down halfway. You can you could push the
the out of the lock button twice, the unlocked button once,
and the and the convertible top goes down in the
(13:59):
sun or the suner of opens depends on which type
of vehicle you have. Um, you can program there's really honestly,
you can program just about anything that can automatically start
up itself in the vehicle. I mean, this is this
is for most people. This is a theoretical thing. Your
manufacturer may not put these in already, but there there
(14:21):
is an online community of people who program well look
at look at remote start systems. I mean, that's all
this is. It's the same, it's the same idea, but
there have to be certain things. You know, you have
to have it set up for that specifically, they have
to if you want to have your car cool on
on a hot summer day, Um, you have to make
sure that when you leave you remember to turn the
a c unfull and then turn the car off, etcetera.
There's a there's a whole procedural process to this thing. Um.
(14:46):
But I mean it's really it's kind of not limitless
because it does have its limits, but there's a multitude
of things you can do with a remote keyless entry system. Yeah,
and let me add while we're talking about these different functions,
there are probably a few people who are going, what
is this some sort of secret code like in a
video game? Not not particularly because it's it's not really
(15:12):
a cheat code. What happens is that when you are
transmitting this signal uh, this hopping or this rolling code
that provides security and lets your cars receiver know that
the right fob is calling it, it also includes a
function code, and that function code tells the cars memory
(15:35):
what you wanted to do exactly. So that's why instead
of lock, lock, unlock, you would get driver's windows down halfway. Yeah,
and and honestly, that's not an unheard of example. I
mean there's not at all. There are ways that you
can lower windows, you know, fully or halfway, or open
the convertible type you can do, open sun roof whatever
whatever it happens to be. The manufacturer can program a
(15:57):
lot of that. And in fact, there was a Volkswagen
commercial years and years ago that had that kind of trick,
like the guy calling his he's excitedly calling his wife
out to the front yard showing her what he could
do with a key fob. And you know, it's just
there's there's a ton of things you can do with this. Now.
Um oh, I've got a funny, funny question for you. Okay,
So what do you do if you're the hypothetical keyless
(16:20):
entry owner, right and your fob is not working and
you've replaced the battery and your kid loves key pops. Okay,
I know you're gonna get to this. This is a
funny Okay. Now, with the rolling codes, remember we we
talked about how you know, the code jumps around and
there's an expected sequence right, right, and so you know,
(16:41):
instead of having a dip switch system where it's always
the same code every time that's set, with a rolling
code system, that code is literally it's jumping around all
over the place. There's an expected sequence of it though,
of this code, however, but the the transmitter transmits a
code and the car except in the vehicle, accepts it.
(17:02):
But it may be shifted slight. Actually it is shifted
slightly from where it where the last one would have been.
There's no discernible pattern, and that's for safety. Now, the
problem comes in when you know that's good for a
certain number, it will still detect within a certain range.
Because you talked about what eighteen billion possibilities, right, And
this also means that you're not going to accidentally you're
(17:23):
gonna win the lottery twice before you accidentally unlocked somebody else.
That's probably right. Yeah. So let's say though, that you're
walking through the parking lot like you are, and you're
pushing the button trying to figure out where you are,
and you're just repeatedly you know, push push, push, push push.
That's a bad idea and I'll tell you why because
after about I'm gonna ballparking number here, there's a there's
an exact number right there. There is an exact number
(17:45):
for each I don't know if it's every manufacturer, if
it's just um, however, many codes are possible, but um,
I'm gonna say it's around two hundred. It is. It's
around to two hundred, maybe two and fifty six if
if you oh, that's if you push that. Let's say that. Okay,
so you're walking through the parking lot and you push
the button two hundred times on your two first push,
(18:05):
and you're near your vehicle, it's going to unlock and
you'll be able to figure out where your car is.
If you push it two five or fifty six times
on the two seventh time, you could be standing right
next to your car and it won't open. And the
problem with this, and you may think that's excessive, right,
that does sound like a lot, because maybe walking through
the parking lot, you might hit it fifteen times if
you really can't find your car, maybe twenty. Kids love keys,
(18:29):
and kids will do things in such a repetitive manner
that it's not unheard of for a kid to push
a button two hundred and fifty seven times, which will
easily desynchronize your vehicle if the kids out exactly and
that throws if you, yeah, if you're not in range,
like it's the car's not in the garage. Let's say
it's side. You know, your your husband's or wife's car,
(18:50):
and the cars that you know at the office, and
she or he is, you know, far far away, and
you're at home with the kid and you're pushing the button.
Are the kids pushing the button with the extra set
of keys, That extra set of keys is not gonna
work when mom or dad comes home. And the reason
is because it has desynchronized itself. It's it's it's so
far out of synchronization that it's just not going to operate.
(19:12):
And and really, I know it sounds absurd, but two
or fifty seven times for a kid to push a
button that that happens, it would it would happen. I think,
I mean during over the course of the day, if
a kid is playing with the keys of the button,
why not. Hey, I've had roommates that would do that.
Um so lost. Oh yeah, you can reprogram these things. Now,
(19:33):
that's the tricky part. Because you've probably looked this up
online before, right, or have you. I've looked it up,
never for myself, more for curiosity. I've never had to
reprogram a fob. It can be exceedingly simple, or it
could be one of the hardest things you ever do
in your life, because it's electronics and there's always something
(19:54):
that seems to be a little bit like for me,
that's that's kind of my achilles heel, Like I I
have really difficult time fixing or repairing electronics or electrical things. Um,
do you have one of those? Uh? Do you have
one of those cars that has a somewhat complicated synchronization.
(20:15):
I've never had to do it on my car, luckily,
but I have had to do it on my wife's jeep.
She has had a jeep, and I've had to do
it there. And I know there's some other cars. I've
looked at the procedures and I've I've done it for
uh some service information that I wrote a long time ago. Um,
and there were some exceedingly difficult ones. And I remember
how hard some of these were. And honestly, you know,
(20:37):
someone may have nine or ten steps and it gets
a little bit confusing. And the times you have to
do things like within three seconds, turn the key back,
don't start it, then hold down the the the the
the down window button at the same time, cycling the
ignition three times exactly, wait ten seconds, then turn everything off.
Then don't push it in locked button. But somehow get
(20:58):
out of the car, and do you know, it's like
there's a there's a there's a really difficult process for
some of these things, and if you don't follow it exactly,
you can kind of screw things up. Now. The other
thing is that when you do that, sometimes you've got
to be a careful attention to this. When you start
the programming procedure, sometimes you'll wipe out previous codes. Yes,
(21:19):
so you know, you're in a situation where you're trying
to program a new key fob to your vehicle. You know,
let's say that you've got a vehicle from a dealer
that only had one and you want to buy an
extra one and add this thing, or you have a
new driver to your your your car. Um A lot
of times you'll have a certain limit of key fobs
that are able to be programmed, like three or four.
It's usually three or four. Sometimes it goes up to seven.
(21:40):
Like I'll say, you about a work truck or something, Um,
a lot of a lot of you know, work truck
type vehicles. It may allow a few more, but four
is about right then. And so you know you can't
exceed that. And if you're trying to program a fifth one,
if you have a large family that all shares a
vehicle in some way like maybe that um, I don't know,
a jeep that has a lot of storage space that
(22:03):
you use on weekend or whatever, or camping or something. Um,
you know that fifth one will give you trouble. It
won't It won't work, and you'll wonder what what am
I doing wrong? But you gotta look all this information
up and find out, you know, from the manufacturer, that's
probably the best place to go. And it really does change.
It varies widely between manufacts. It's not the same for all.
(22:24):
So don't think that whatever works on your hand is
gonna work on your your Chevy. It just it just
isn't gonna work that way. UM. And you know, man,
there's so much that we want to talk about here.
Now there's there's new systems. I think we should just
touch on here because we don't have a whole lot
of um not information. We don't have a whole lot
of experience with these. There's a lot of information out there,
but you and I haven't. We don't have the fancy
(22:46):
cars that you can just walk up to in the unlock.
Where does the swells now? No, these are the keyless
GOHO systems like Mercedes Benz has right, which is just amazing.
It's like, because, okay, I'm sorry it Scott partial rants here,
like I will keep it short. It is amazing to
me that there are people out there who said, you know,
(23:07):
what's really inconvenient, uh, putting a key in my door lock?
I get I get that, Okay, I understand why that
can be inconvenient, raining or whatever. And there are other
people who said, uh, you know, and they're asking, wouldn't
be easier if I could push a button? I get
that completely, dude, But who were the people who said,
you know, I'm a go getter, I don't have time
(23:30):
to be pushing buttons while I'm walking. That is far
too complicated. I need a car that is just open
and turns on. I just want to walk into it,
push a button and go. And you know, we I
know that I sound like the crotchy old get off
my lawn man when I say stuff like this. But
this ties back to our earlier soapbox about the inevitability
(23:54):
of autonomous cars in some places. Yeah, yeah, this is
this is the kind of system bend just for people
that don't to understand what we're talking about. There's some
there's some keys out there that aren't really keys. I
guess that. I mean, if you well, I don't know that,
may I guess that it's that's all right. It's just that,
you know, they're more like credit cards. You put the
card in your pocket, and they're shaped. They they don't
(24:15):
have you know, the usual shape. They may look like
a fob or something like that. But they're relatively small
and all you do is you keep this in your pocket.
It's more of a proximity sensor and that you know,
there's a there's what they call a bubble around the car.
Imagine like a dome around the vehicle. There's a certain
range on either side. It's very small. It's not like
space bubble. It's really small. It's not it's not you
(24:35):
know twenty like we talked about before. This is really short,
like you know you're standing next to the vehicle. But
let's say you've got, um, you know, one of these
new keys, these let's say Mercedes Benz keyless ghost system.
And there's a lot of different names for these different
systems and the different manufacturers that have them now. But um,
it's kind of trickling down into some of the other
vehicles like as usual. But um, you walk up to
(24:55):
the car, and the car sensors that you're you know,
within six ft of the door and unlocks. What's here? Yeah, yeah,
the key is just now remember the keys in your
pocket full time. So you walk up to the door,
of the door unlocks, you get in, You sit down
on the driver's seat. There's no need to fish that
that fob or whatever out of the pot of your pocket.
You don't have to insert the fob into the dash
or anything. You don't have to turn the key, you
(25:17):
don't have to do anything. You just sit down, push
the star button, and the car to the car is
ready to go exactly And you know that's that's again,
that's still a a transmitter and a receiver working, but
they're they're working in a slightly different range. I guess
you know that it's shorter on the outside when you're
unlocking the door, a little bit longer on the inside
(25:39):
when you're actually starting the car. Because you know, even
though my car has a key fob and a key,
it has that big it's Ivan Honda, so it has
a key fob that I pushed the button on to
unlock the door and get in or lock it. When
I get in, I do have to put a key
in the ignition. When I put the key in the
ignition there's a there's a chip in the key still.
It's up in that that black I guess, the head
(26:00):
of the key um. When I put the key in.
There's a very short distance between the ignition um, the
unition ignition column, I guess, and the and the key itself,
and they're talking to each other right there. At that point,
it's verifying that I'm using the correct key to start
the vehicle. And there's a little key icon in the
in the dash that glows green or blink blink screen
says yeah, that's the right key to run this car.
(26:23):
UM And that's part of the mobilizer system. And so
there's still a chip that that speaks to it. So
you've got a fob that's you know, the keyless entry.
You've got the chip that's that's working with the ignition um.
There's a lot going on, and that's just a that's
a short you know, like a longer distance for this
these keyless GOH systems, and that you know, it's still
in your pocket or it may accommodate for someone who
(26:44):
has it in like a purse or bag and puts
it in the passenger seat. But that's about it. Now.
It does have a mobilizer system kind of built in
and that Let's say that you're out and this is
safety too. Let's say that you're you know, filling the
tank up with gas, so you're standing within the range
of the vehicle to be unlocked. Someone decides they I'm
going to jump in and take off in that car.
(27:05):
So they get in, and of course the car will
start because you know, you you've hear that within the distance,
so they can push the button, it will start. But
when the key and the vehicle get a certain distance
away from each other, that's when the system decides something's
not right and shuts down. It shuts down, that's right,
the fuel pump shuts off. Whatever the the system happens
(27:25):
to be. If it's electronic, you know, it'll it'll It'll
just shut down the fuel pump and the the thief
will only be able to get a certain distance from
the key before the vehicle shuts off. So it's kind
of uh, I don't know. It seems like it's a
good system. It is. It is a good system and
does have its flaws. It does have its flaws. Before
(27:46):
you get into those, I have to point out that
this is astonishing technology, and far be it from me
to call anyone lazy for lik inconvenience, because God knows,
I don't own an infra red remote control on my television,
you know what I mean. I'm that guy who doesn't
want to move the pizza bucks. So I see the
(28:07):
advantages of this technology. However, as we've said, there are
some clear disadvantages. One of those obviously being that someone
who loses their key less go entry and has someone
else take it, you know whoever, Johnny Anonymous takes it
and all of a sudden, Johnny Anonymous owns your car. Yeah,
(28:30):
that's true. Um. And the other thing is, let's say
you're filling up the tank with guests and you've got
your person the passenger seat, and someone does the exact
same trick. Um, the key and the vehicles stay together,
the key and the vehicles going to continue to run.
Uh So that doesn't that doesn't exempt you from that. Now,
that would I guess that would be akin to somebody
leaving the key in the ignition or throwing the keys
(28:51):
on the passengers seat. Also, so if you're somebody who's
cautious about this, it's not really gonna affect you. Um,
I always keep my keys in my pocket. Um, I know,
I mean, I guess it's it's different for ladies they
have a purse to carry around with them there, or
you know, typically they do, or some people just get
kind of lazy about it, you know, they've they've decided that,
you know, I'm gonna throw the keys up on the
dash when I fill up the fill up the tank.
(29:13):
And if you've always done that, there's a good chance
as we're going to keep your your keyless ghost system,
I suppose. I mean, let's say you've got a hundred
thousand dollar Mercedes. I I don't know if you're gonna
be as as free spirited with your keys and yeah, yeah, exactly,
that's the word I was looking for. But so, yeah,
this this makes sense. I think what we're what we're
both trying to get across here is that regardless of
(29:37):
the specific system that you're using, it really does come
down to personal responsibility. I have common sense, common sense, yes, yes,
to quote Thomas Payne here, and I have a little
I have a little bit of a hacker story. Oh
please don't want to here? Yeah, yeah, I think I do,
(29:57):
because I've got a few little odds and ends here
I'd like to clean up about about keys. There's some
interesting little things about these, Okay, we need so one
of the one of the most prominent names in this
kind of technology is a cipher called key lock, and
that's k E E l o Q A little different,
(30:20):
little different um. And this is used in multiple models
of vehicles, GM has it, Honda, Chrysler, Volkswagen, all the hits,
even Day, WOU and even day. And so each of
these devices is where I'm getting that number of eighteen
(30:42):
billion billion values. So, uh, this system is widely believed
to be secure. It would literally take you with a
hundred computers several decades. Then are you saying eighteen billion billion? Yeah,
you're saying eighteen billion billion. Yes, okay, I thought you
missed spoke earlier on I've been saying eighteen billion. But
(31:03):
holy cow, that's the key locks specifically tremendous amount of codes.
I know, it's like a billion billion. Okay, So now
we're a math show in addition to a medical as um.
So three research groups got together. Um. Then these guys
are from uh spanning countries to from Israel, one from Belgium,
(31:28):
and they found a way to hack this system in
less than a day. So to take the work of
several decades and reduce it to less than twenty four hours.
This requires access to the remote control, you know, but
not necessarily access to it in terms of physically opening
(31:50):
it up and tinkering with it. So they could be nearby,
they could be just in the same coffee shop, maybe
on a flight with somebody, perhaps on a flight that's
an excellent that's next the point. And so then once
they've nailed that key, once they've found that specific code,
they're able to deactivate the alarm and deactivate fail safes
(32:11):
like that and drive away with the vehicle. Okay, on
one quick thing here, I don't know if a flight
would be a good example that maybe let's say somebody's
in having lunch somewhere having lunch. But but you know
what if they and they throw the keys in up
on the on the tabletop as there, you know, and
somebody sits next to you and decides, I'm going to
steal that code. Well a day, but a full day
(32:34):
is what it takes to crack this code. Well, the
fully here's here's the thing. To get the data they need,
it takes um I think it takes about sixty five
minutes according to their APPSIL but here's where it gets tricky.
To uh make the correct calculations. They need sixty four
CPU cords and almost eight days of time. Okay, so
(32:58):
this is you know, so that's a you see how
that averages I understand. So so for the you know,
the people that say that these systems aren't really safe,
I mean, look what it takes to crack it. It
really does take an awful lot of of computer power
and time and the reremendous amount of effort. It's not
it's not as simple as somebody you know, running a
card reader pass the thing and it working. Like you know,
(33:19):
some of some of the the thieves are able to
do now, I mean even through your wallets or whatever
like do being meg strikes exactly. Not not even close
to as simple as that. This is a This is
a much more complex system. For now, these systems are
very secure. Um in the future will they remain so,
I don't know, but it is safe to say that
(33:41):
as UH technology evolves to exploit these systems, the protective
technology will evolved as well. I was just thinking, what
were you thinking? What if you ran a valet a
service and access to several you know, high end vehicles
for let's say about an hour and a half each.
You know, somebody's having dinner two hours maybe the restaurant,
nice restaurant, two and a half, maybe hours whatever, Um,
(34:03):
but you spot the vehicle that you want, and you
had all this computing power. I mean, this is like
like this could be almost like a gone in sixty
seconds move yeah, something like that. But I mean that's
kind of that. That would be the kind of access
that you would almost need, right, I mean, be able
to set the key in a cradle and then just
just I don't know, try to punish it with these
(34:24):
these RF signals until finally it reads right. I mean
that's about the only way. So, you know, mentioning valets
though that you know, the one thing about valet keys
is another thing we need to talk about. Um. Oftentimes
you'll get a valet key with your set of keys
from the dealer or from you know, the previous owner.
And what the heck is a valet key. Valet keys
are They don't operate the trunk area, you know, the
(34:46):
storage area, and they don't operate the glove box. Typically,
in some rare cases, um, supercars, a lot of supercars,
they'll have a reduced power key so that the valet
doesn't have access to the thousand horse power that the
car has. They only have access to, you know, the
two fifty horse power that, lets say, the six horse
(35:07):
power that you need to park the thing, right, okay,
so so something like that. But the valley keys sometimes,
now I hadn't heard about this. Now, the valley keys,
you know, they they're exclusive and that they only operate
the driver's door and the ignition. Well I just read
about this. I had no idea. But some valet keys
actually um inhibit the use of the electric fuel pump.
(35:28):
And that means that when the valet gets in with
the key turns, the key on the fuel pump doesn't operate,
and the only way that that vehicles running is on
the fuel that's stored in the fuel lines. So I
wonder how far what do you think A block blocks?
Maybe a block or two maybe at the most, I
would think. But but it's a it's a great safety feature.
(35:49):
I think that's fantastic. I mean, now nerve wracking for
the valet, well, they don't know, they have no idea,
but that's the thing, like, you know, you don't know
how limited the range of this thing is. That means
that you know, they would only be able to get
a block or two away at the most, and then
suddenly the car becomes you know, an anchor and that's it.
And I think the reduced power is also a very
good security measure for valet's I think so, although I know,
(36:10):
I'm sure there are scores of disappointed valets out there. Yeah,
I've I've had you know, I've seen many very disciplined
valets driving some very high end cars and they do
an excellent job. I also been have seen cars turned
sideways and parking lots um you know, at this one
specific example at a mall during Christmas time. So the
(36:33):
valets park at the back of the lot, right, the
person is in the mall within ten seconds, you know,
they park, they come up the front, they go inside,
They're done the very back end of the mall like that.
This is like two minutes after the person is inside. Yeah,
there are some shenanigans going on. Yeah, I know, but
it happens, and you know, maybe there's a little slick out.
Who knows. I mean, you know, how do you how
(36:53):
do you determine what's going on? You know what? That's
very fair of you. Yeah, yeah, I think So what's
higher smoke in the sideways driving ballets? What's kind of
kind of like to be that he's drifting in? So okay,
let's wrap this. I've got I've got a couple more
things I want to mention here, and let's just try
to go through them kind of rapid fire. But I
think that these are worth mentioning. Um. Okay, we talked
(37:17):
about key five ranges in the trick right in vallet keys. Okay,
that's good. We're getting through a lot of these. Um.
Every different manufacturer has different names for these systems, so
you know, whatever your system is called, like Mercedes Bens.
We've mentioned this a few times, but they may have
smart keys or keyless ghost systems. On a Ford, it's
called intelligent access with push button start. Um. You know
there's BMW which has comfort access. You know, I went
(37:41):
to Jaguars site and Jaguar has what they call the
smart key system and a lot of these are similar.
But you know, there were a lot of the same systems. Um,
I went to Jaguars site and I don't I was
just looking at the keys. They must have been thirty
five or forty different types of keys you can buy
for a Jaguar. So you've got to really know what
you're looking for when you buy a key. When you
(38:02):
go to buy a new key and having them programmed
and et cetera. You know, they may say that it's
a dealer only thing. If it is, you can ask
them if there's a proceedure to do it that you
can do, or you can take it and you can
suck it up and take it in and have it done.
But it may take a certain amount of time and
it may cost you quite a bit of money to
get it done. Now, the keys are expensive. Um, you know,
we've we've talked about how you could get one cut
(38:23):
at the the hardware store. Really that was like I
mean a dollar fifty, you know, or less, um, maybe
a dollar for a key. Now it's like it can
get into the hundreds of dollars if you have if
certain conditions are met. Let's say they've lost all of
the keys to the system, that's a big deal. If
you have one key remaining, that's less of a deal,
(38:45):
a big deal than it is if you have lost
all the keys to the system, because then you're you're
looking at a possible toe into the dealership to have
it reprogrammed, where you have the ignition and the key
reprogramed together, and they have to they have to match
them up because there's no way to prove which key
or no way to set one without the other. It's
a factory preset so um. And you can buy tools
(39:06):
to reset keys, you can reset chips and things like that,
but if you wanted to, but you're talking about like
maybe a two hundred or two more than that, uh
two D tool to do something like this. Um, we're
not talking about the key fob program. We're talking about
key chip programming and linking that with the ignition. Now,
one thing that I need to mention here is that
(39:27):
this is a good tip. This is somewhere out there
online I found but I hadn't even thought about this,
But this is a great way to save money, because
you know, some of these can get super expensive, hundreds
and hundreds of dollars. If you've lost all the keys,
and you know, you think all is lost, and you
know I'm gonna spend thousand dollars, you get this thing reprogrammed.
Sorry to college next year. Take a look online and
(39:47):
see if there's an option to buy a an Ignition
cylinder and a key set that are programmed to match.
And if you can buy that combination of hardware and
then install in your vehicle. Oftentimes that's far cheaper than
it is to buy if you've lost all your keys.
Now this is kind of an extreme example, but you
(40:08):
may end up having it. It may be much cheaper
to buy an Ignition and key their key together in
order for you to uh, you know, to to cut
some costs on that. Not bad. Yeah, I thought that
was a good tip. So, um, I probably got more,
but let's we should probably Yeah, I think so, because
we had guys, we had some other really cool stuff
to talk about, but we didn't want to. We don't
(40:29):
want to go too far past our time limit. I
think it's too late for that. Well, how about, by
way of compromise, we go out real quick with some
listener mail. Okay, so, Scott, this is actually a bit
of Facebook fan mail from our good friend and the
listener and David. David says, high, Scott and Dinner recently
(40:52):
listened to your Curiosity Rover episode. When talking about your tires.
The tires, you specifically mentioned the initials JPL. Uh the
company that made tires, and David says, JPL stands for
Jet Propulsion Laboratory. Uh. Since they've since they've built Curiosity
and controlling it from Pasadena, uh. He he thought they
(41:13):
were worth mentioning specifically, and David, we agree, So shout
out to you, Jet Propulsion Laboratory. Get Propulsion Laboratory. Would
be cool to work at place called Jet propulsion Laboratory.
That would be so awesome. Maybe we could I could
call my garadge the Jet Propulsion Laboratory. You could you? Um,
it would have no backing, no founding for that, But
I mean I was I was thinking, I was like,
what kind of engine work. Would we need to do
(41:35):
to your project? You know, need to even talk about that.
We just just call it that you need to get
to get some shirts like we worked there. We should
call your cubicle that that's going. Um, David, you're hired.
Welcome to our Welcome to our new jet propulsion laboratory.
Well thanks, That's that's cool because I think they do
deserve some credit because that's that's quite a system, if
you remember. Yeah, I've been kind of reading about that
(41:57):
stuff because more and more is coming out about that
and we're seeing better and better images and they're starting
to drive that thing now. I just started just the
other day. So, um, I think this is this is
really something we need to Yeah, it's one of the
most amazing road trips in history. We need to keep
us on the top of our minds. But the next
week he wants you No, Scott and I are gonna
go ahead and get out of here. We hope you
(42:19):
have enjoyed listening to the system. We hope you remember
some of the tricks we gave you. Startle and amaze
your friends by using your head as de fans but
an amplifier. I again, startle and irritate your friends use
by desynchronizing their remote entry. Use this trick sparingly. I
urge you use this trick sparingly please, but do not
(42:41):
use fan mail sparingly. Feel free to inundate us on Twitter.
We're also on Facebook. We'd love to hear from directly.
If you want to send us an email at car
stuff at Discovery dot com. For more on this and
thousands of other topics, is how stuffworks dot com. Us
know what you think, Send an email to podcast at
(43:03):
how stuff works dot com. Mh.
Go behind the wheel, under the hood and beyond with
car stuff from how Stuff Works dot com. Everybody, welcome
to the podcast. I'm Scott Benchman and I'm Den Bull
And then well I espe should tell them this car
stuff right, Oh, yes, this show is car stuff. They
probably know that they clicked on the link. Well, yeah, yeah,
(00:22):
we got so, we got smart listeners. We have listeners
in the know, I think, so we'll here's something related
to cars we can talk about today. Keyless entry systems. Yes,
more and more. These are the norm for a lot
of car owners. Yeah, I would say, uh, well you
would expect it now at this point. I mean, I
don't think it's like an option anymore. Even I think
it's just a standard feature. Um, I don't think you
(00:44):
have the option of having just a standard key like
you can get cut at a at a harbor store,
versus having you know, the key FOP. And that's what
we're talking about. It is just the keyless entry systems. Um,
we're gonna talk about some more fancy systems later on.
You know that will actually start the vehicle. Yeah, well
with your put of a button. But um, you get
the point. We're gonna go from basic keys all the
(01:04):
way through. I guess the latest and greatest, and of
course we'll take some special detours for the weird stuff. Scott,
let's cast our memory back to when these systems actually began. Yeah,
you know, here's the thing, like you used to be
able to go to the Harvar store and have any
key cut for any car. It seem they had him
on the rack, you know, the key uh turnstile thing,
(01:26):
the that you'd be able to just put it in
the machine. I cut many keys when I worked at
a Harvard store for cars, and I've got, you know,
that old Chrysler project that I have that has just
a standard key. It doesn't have any kind of chip
involved or anything. It's not high tech. But nowadays you
do have to go to a high tech locksmith in
order to get some of these made. If at all
you may have to go to the dealership. You may
have to go directly back to the source, especially if
(01:48):
it's one with a chip embedded in a physical key,
or if there are security issues. And as we'll talk about,
security issues are one of the big concerns. Yeah, and
there's laser cut keys, and there's I mean, you're typical
Harvar store locksmith is not going to have the tools
or devices to create the key even um, and and
some of that is up to you or the dealer
(02:08):
to reprogram the whole thing. So well, we'll get into
that too, but um, basically, I mean from the very
very beginning, if you think about this, and I've been
trying to think of like something that kind of matches
up with this, and I think that garage door openers
are probably the most similar to this in the early
early days. Spot on, because as you said off of
off of the air, I'm gonna steal your line for
(02:30):
this just be so good, uh, Scott, you basically broke
down the evolution from garage door openers to queyless entry
systems by saying, somewhere in history, there was a guy
in his car opening his garage, and he said, why
can't I just do this with my car doors? Exactly?
Why can't I? Why can I lower my convertible top
that way? Or why can't I? Why can I do
(02:51):
a lot of things with the push of a button.
And that's how so many great inventions start, is uh.
They begin when somebody finally asked a new question. Yeah,
and here's Here's the other kind of a tangent to
this is that, um, the gardge door openers began relatively
simply also and they've advanced kind of in the similar
in the same way, um, and that you know they
(03:12):
were Originally they had kind of a universal signal where
you know, you may be going in the street and honestly,
you could push a button and it may open up
the neighbor's Gardge door. Depends on if you bought it
at you know, the same place, if you bought it
at Sears and you happen to have the same code installed, etcetera.
And that wouldn't happen that often either because not that
many people had actually you know what I misspoke, not
if you had the same code and installed. But that
(03:33):
was the frequency, because they operated on a simple frequency
early early on, and I'm gonna probably i'm generalizing that,
I know, but it wasn't unheard of. It could happen. Um.
Later they kind of got a little smarter and they
decided to go to a dip switch system. And that's
where you know, you've probably seen this on older Gardge
doors if you have ever opened one up, maybe eight
(03:55):
switches and you can choose like an updown position for
each one of those, and then you course on that
with your controller and up down each each one has
a number and uh and if your code your your
own personal code, and you can make that different from
your neighbor's code, and that way it won't you know, interfere.
And then later um, and you know, now we have
what are called rolling codes, and rolling codes are just
(04:16):
different frequencies or you know, there's an ext there's an
expected frequency, a pattern in the frequency, and it jumps
a little bit every time, so it's it's kind of
a it's not as close to random as you're gonna get,
I guess, yeah, for this kind of technology. I mean,
just for the sake of comparison, Scott, let's look at
the difference between the dip switch system and the more
(04:39):
modern rolling code. A dip switch system would have about
two hundred and fifty six possible combinations for for your code.
Not bad, not bad at all. And you're probably not
going to live near two hundred and fifty six uh.
Other garages with the identical switch, you know, or with
one of those at this point in time, uh, over
(05:02):
eighteen billion billion possible values in the modern rolling eighteen billion,
eighteen billion possible codes with the rolling code system. Yes,
well that means it's it's incredible. Go ahead. That means
that with uh, with a hundred code cracking computers, Logically
(05:22):
we would assume it would take several decades to find
the right company. Now, that's a lot of effort to
get into someone's criage, but that is a lot and
you know what if that person is not even checking
on their car for twenty years. Honestly, I don't mean
to sound like, well this is important because um, you
know this kind of this is where we're going, or
we have gone actually with that with the modern key
(05:42):
and the key fob and the transmitter and the receiver
and it's seter we're gonna we're gonna get into all
the hardware that goes along with us. But UM, let's
go back to keys then. Now, okay, so we started
out with the original just simple key. Uh. Then we
had something, you know, someone said, what a great idea,
let's do that, and UM, I'm gonna gloss over this
a bit, but um, basically the first ones were I
(06:03):
our systems, which is infrared. And the problem with infrared
system you have to know the problem with them laid
on me line of sight. You had to be within
line of sight of the vehicle, and it was a
you know, I don't know about range on these because
I never found a distinct range on an I R
system A limit. But um, you did have to be right.
(06:23):
I mean you had to be pointing the key directly
at the receiver, which was probably up on the dast
somewhere like an eye that was maybe or behind the
mirror somewhere like that that was visible. But if you
were not in direct line of sight of it. And
you can remember, like the old televisions that had IR systems,
now they typically don't. Um, some of them still do,
I guess, but um, you have to point the remote
(06:44):
at the TV in order to get a switch, and
if you're pointing at the wrong direction, it just won't work.
If you're if you're laying on the couch and the
remote is behind a pillow or something, that's I can work,
that's right. You gotta move the pizza box out of
the way. It's a pain in the rear, so you
gotta it's it's it's difficult. So you can see are
are that's our troubled lives here. Yeah, it really is,
(07:06):
It really is. So um we advanced to what they
call our F system and radio frequency exactly, radio frequency
and our F systems are I guess much better because
you know, you can have this. You can have the
key fib in your pocket and push the button and
it would still work. It doesn't have to be line
of sight. You could be anywhere within a certain range
and that system will work. It will it will receive
(07:28):
the signal, it will send the signal. Um doesn't have
to be direct line of sight. You don't have to
point it at the vehicle referred to work, although a
lot of people still do. Yeah, but that's kind of
the same way that when a lot of people are
playing video games and they're trying their best to, you know,
go for a hard right or hard left, they feel
like they have to move their hands. Yeah, exactly. It's
the same thing because I know, when I get out
(07:49):
of my car, I tend to if I'm going to
lock the door, I tend to stick my hand out
arms length at the vehicle and push the button. The
gesture sort of helps. You can usually see me reading
to these gestures. If I've forgotten where I parked or
what level I parked on, and I'm walking through the
parking deck tapping the button because I know that what
(08:10):
I get about twenty feet away from my car, I'm
gonna hear a beat if it's mine away you can't
see your car. Well, look, man, I live a complicated life.
And what that's uh, I think I'm sorry. So, okay,
you know what, let's just talk about ranges right now,
what we're talking about, because this is kind I found
this kind of interesting. You know, I remember this a
(08:31):
long time ago here in this uh some for some
some service guys, but um, automotive service guys. Okay, not
military service guys, but uh, you know, the key fobs
have different ranges and and there's not only a different range.
I think maybe that has something to do with manufacturer,
but there's also a kind of a standard for the
(08:52):
continent that we live on. Yes, I've read about this
the countries that we live in, and it's it's interesting.
It's that you know, the United States here, um, in
North America, we have a range of about what they
call I think it's twenty meters, which is about sixty
five ft. And that seems about right, Oh, I said, yeah,
I'm sorry, I meant meters earlier. Oh that's all right,
no problems, no wonder it sounded like. I mean that's
(09:15):
the length of the vehicle. You're almost in the car,
so okay, so twentys right, and that's about sixty five
ft and that seems about right. I mean when I
think back to how far it works and doesn't work
when I'm in the parking structure whatever. In Japan, they
only have a range. They're only allowed a range of
about five meters. That's interesting. Yeah, now I don't know
(09:36):
what this. I don't know. I really don't know why
that is. I mean it means the frequencies that are
available for them to use. But that's only about sixteen
feet then, so it's not used there. You know, how
we use it to find the vehicle in the park,
Like I mentioned, you can't do that. They're really because
you'll you'll be at the vehicle. So I mean this
is more I guess utilitarian, and that you know you're
able to just simply lock and unlocked the car and
(09:57):
that's it. It's not I don't know something that you
can use as a as a finder. I do want
to mention a trick here, and I'm gonna just let
this out right now. I was gonna wait till the
end for this one. O UM. I don't recommend this, okay,
I want to get that out right up front here.
But you know, there's a little trick for extending the
range of your key fob. What is the rate. It's
(10:19):
a little awkward, it's strange, but it really works if
you get if you find like, let's say that you're
in a parking lot and you walk away and you
got to push that you realize, like, I forgot to
lock my your garph. So you grab the keys out
and you're still walking towards the building, but you're like, away, Yeah,
you're sixty eight meters away, that's right. So you're a
little too far. You push the button, it doesn't work,
and it's okay, that's right, man, we're gonna catch this
(10:42):
both up, both of them. So sixty eight feet away
your three ft out of range. You don't want to
walk back that that come or some three ft to
to unlock push the unlock button. So what you do
is you turn around and you stand in place, and
you put the key fob under your chin and touch
it to your chin and the push the button and
your head acts as an antenna that amplifies this. It's
(11:04):
like an amplifier. It amplifies the signal and you are
then able to locker, unlock your car, actually even lock
your car. That is amazing and frightening. And we'll do
it all the time. It is, and you know what,
test it sometimes if you want. I wouldn't recommend doing
this all the time because I don't know what it
does to you know, That's exactly why I don't want
to tell anybody to do this. But go to like
(11:26):
just the edge of your car's range, like push the
button and keep pushing it until, like you just it
doesn't work, and then go about three or four ft
farther away and then put it under your chin, push
the button and see if it works. And it will.
Oh man, we've just we we've just everybody pretty cool
party trick like a medical show. We're a medical show
(11:46):
now too. So let's real quick if we can talk
about what's actually inside these mysterious little fops. Right yeah, okay,
so as we as we've said, your car fob is
probably an r F system, which means it has a
radio transmitter. That's the thing you're desperately pushing when you're
wondering if you parked on level three or level two
(12:09):
of the parking deck. And then inside your car there's
a radio receiver. It's tuned to the frequency of your
transmit transmitter and so that's usually going to be around
three hundred four hundred mega hurts in a modern system.
And then it's got the rolling code. It's a little
secret language. But let's talk about what's actually inside your
(12:31):
controller there. The transmitter has a has a controller chip, right,
and of course it has a transmitter. I know this
sounds kind of I don't know, a little too nuts
and bolts, maybe a little too basic. I've a dope
mind before to change your battery, right, And that's that's
exactly where I'm going here, because they still have a battery.
(12:55):
And sometimes you might think that you are out of
range or some things where you just need to change
the battery and you can do it yourself. Usually that's
not a difficult procedure, and that's usually I mean, they'll
have even a battery access panel for you to pry open,
and oftentimes even on the outside of the key fob itself.
It'll tell you what type battery and how many it requires. UM,
(13:18):
that's a simple, simple fix. UM. You know, I guess
we talked about you know, the rolling codes already, right
have we mentioned? Um? You know the the this this
correlation between transmitter receiver, that's where all of the that
that's where all of this happens. I mean that anything
that you can try. You can transmit a signal to
this receiver and then tell it to do anything you want.
(13:39):
You can program that to do anything you want. Their
number of features that can be programmed with this, you
can you can have you know, three pushes on the
unlocked button means that you know, all the driver's side
windows roll down halfway. You can you could push the
the out of the lock button twice, the unlocked button once,
and the and the convertible top goes down in the
(13:59):
sun or the suner of opens depends on which type
of vehicle you have. Um, you can program there's really honestly,
you can program just about anything that can automatically start
up itself in the vehicle. I mean, this is this
is for most people. This is a theoretical thing. Your
manufacturer may not put these in already, but there there
(14:21):
is an online community of people who program well look
at look at remote start systems. I mean, that's all
this is. It's the same, it's the same idea, but
there have to be certain things. You know, you have
to have it set up for that specifically, they have
to if you want to have your car cool on
on a hot summer day, Um, you have to make
sure that when you leave you remember to turn the
a c unfull and then turn the car off, etcetera.
There's a there's a whole procedural process to this thing. Um.
(14:46):
But I mean it's really it's kind of not limitless
because it does have its limits, but there's a multitude
of things you can do with a remote keyless entry system. Yeah,
and let me add while we're talking about these different functions,
there are probably a few people who are going, what
is this some sort of secret code like in a
video game? Not not particularly because it's it's not really
(15:12):
a cheat code. What happens is that when you are
transmitting this signal uh, this hopping or this rolling code
that provides security and lets your cars receiver know that
the right fob is calling it, it also includes a
function code, and that function code tells the cars memory
(15:35):
what you wanted to do exactly. So that's why instead
of lock, lock, unlock, you would get driver's windows down halfway. Yeah,
and and honestly, that's not an unheard of example. I
mean there's not at all. There are ways that you
can lower windows, you know, fully or halfway, or open
the convertible type you can do, open sun roof whatever
whatever it happens to be. The manufacturer can program a
(15:57):
lot of that. And in fact, there was a Volkswagen
commercial years and years ago that had that kind of trick,
like the guy calling his he's excitedly calling his wife
out to the front yard showing her what he could
do with a key fob. And you know, it's just
there's there's a ton of things you can do with this. Now.
Um oh, I've got a funny, funny question for you. Okay,
So what do you do if you're the hypothetical keyless
(16:20):
entry owner, right and your fob is not working and
you've replaced the battery and your kid loves key pops. Okay,
I know you're gonna get to this. This is a
funny Okay. Now, with the rolling codes, remember we we
talked about how you know, the code jumps around and
there's an expected sequence right, right, and so you know,
(16:41):
instead of having a dip switch system where it's always
the same code every time that's set, with a rolling
code system, that code is literally it's jumping around all
over the place. There's an expected sequence of it though,
of this code, however, but the the transmitter transmits a
code and the car except in the vehicle, accepts it.
(17:02):
But it may be shifted slight. Actually it is shifted
slightly from where it where the last one would have been.
There's no discernible pattern, and that's for safety. Now, the
problem comes in when you know that's good for a
certain number, it will still detect within a certain range.
Because you talked about what eighteen billion possibilities, right, And
this also means that you're not going to accidentally you're
(17:23):
gonna win the lottery twice before you accidentally unlocked somebody else.
That's probably right. Yeah. So let's say though, that you're
walking through the parking lot like you are, and you're
pushing the button trying to figure out where you are,
and you're just repeatedly you know, push push, push, push push.
That's a bad idea and I'll tell you why because
after about I'm gonna ballparking number here, there's a there's
an exact number right there. There is an exact number
(17:45):
for each I don't know if it's every manufacturer, if
it's just um, however, many codes are possible, but um,
I'm gonna say it's around two hundred. It is. It's
around to two hundred, maybe two and fifty six if
if you oh, that's if you push that. Let's say that. Okay,
so you're walking through the parking lot and you push
the button two hundred times on your two first push,
(18:05):
and you're near your vehicle, it's going to unlock and
you'll be able to figure out where your car is.
If you push it two five or fifty six times
on the two seventh time, you could be standing right
next to your car and it won't open. And the
problem with this, and you may think that's excessive, right,
that does sound like a lot, because maybe walking through
the parking lot, you might hit it fifteen times if
you really can't find your car, maybe twenty. Kids love keys,
(18:29):
and kids will do things in such a repetitive manner
that it's not unheard of for a kid to push
a button two hundred and fifty seven times, which will
easily desynchronize your vehicle if the kids out exactly and
that throws if you, yeah, if you're not in range,
like it's the car's not in the garage. Let's say
it's side. You know, your your husband's or wife's car,
(18:50):
and the cars that you know at the office, and
she or he is, you know, far far away, and
you're at home with the kid and you're pushing the button.
Are the kids pushing the button with the extra set
of keys, That extra set of keys is not gonna
work when mom or dad comes home. And the reason
is because it has desynchronized itself. It's it's it's so
far out of synchronization that it's just not going to operate.
(19:12):
And and really, I know it sounds absurd, but two
or fifty seven times for a kid to push a
button that that happens, it would it would happen. I think,
I mean during over the course of the day, if
a kid is playing with the keys of the button,
why not. Hey, I've had roommates that would do that.
Um so lost. Oh yeah, you can reprogram these things. Now,
(19:33):
that's the tricky part. Because you've probably looked this up
online before, right, or have you. I've looked it up,
never for myself, more for curiosity. I've never had to
reprogram a fob. It can be exceedingly simple, or it
could be one of the hardest things you ever do
in your life, because it's electronics and there's always something
(19:54):
that seems to be a little bit like for me,
that's that's kind of my achilles heel, Like I I
have really difficult time fixing or repairing electronics or electrical things. Um,
do you have one of those? Uh? Do you have
one of those cars that has a somewhat complicated synchronization.
(20:15):
I've never had to do it on my car, luckily,
but I have had to do it on my wife's jeep.
She has had a jeep, and I've had to do
it there. And I know there's some other cars. I've
looked at the procedures and I've I've done it for
uh some service information that I wrote a long time ago. Um,
and there were some exceedingly difficult ones. And I remember
how hard some of these were. And honestly, you know,
(20:37):
someone may have nine or ten steps and it gets
a little bit confusing. And the times you have to
do things like within three seconds, turn the key back,
don't start it, then hold down the the the the
the down window button at the same time, cycling the
ignition three times exactly, wait ten seconds, then turn everything off.
Then don't push it in locked button. But somehow get
(20:58):
out of the car, and do you know, it's like
there's a there's a there's a really difficult process for
some of these things, and if you don't follow it exactly,
you can kind of screw things up. Now. The other
thing is that when you do that, sometimes you've got
to be a careful attention to this. When you start
the programming procedure, sometimes you'll wipe out previous codes. Yes,
(21:19):
so you know, you're in a situation where you're trying
to program a new key fob to your vehicle. You know,
let's say that you've got a vehicle from a dealer
that only had one and you want to buy an
extra one and add this thing, or you have a
new driver to your your your car. Um A lot
of times you'll have a certain limit of key fobs
that are able to be programmed, like three or four.
It's usually three or four. Sometimes it goes up to seven.
(21:40):
Like I'll say, you about a work truck or something, Um,
a lot of a lot of you know, work truck
type vehicles. It may allow a few more, but four
is about right then. And so you know you can't
exceed that. And if you're trying to program a fifth one,
if you have a large family that all shares a
vehicle in some way like maybe that um, I don't know,
a jeep that has a lot of storage space that
(22:03):
you use on weekend or whatever, or camping or something. Um,
you know that fifth one will give you trouble. It
won't It won't work, and you'll wonder what what am
I doing wrong? But you gotta look all this information
up and find out, you know, from the manufacturer, that's
probably the best place to go. And it really does change.
It varies widely between manufacts. It's not the same for all.
(22:24):
So don't think that whatever works on your hand is
gonna work on your your Chevy. It just it just
isn't gonna work that way. UM. And you know, man,
there's so much that we want to talk about here.
Now there's there's new systems. I think we should just
touch on here because we don't have a whole lot
of um not information. We don't have a whole lot
of experience with these. There's a lot of information out there,
but you and I haven't. We don't have the fancy
(22:46):
cars that you can just walk up to in the unlock.
Where does the swells now? No, these are the keyless
GOHO systems like Mercedes Benz has right, which is just amazing.
It's like, because, okay, I'm sorry it Scott partial rants here,
like I will keep it short. It is amazing to
me that there are people out there who said, you know,
(23:07):
what's really inconvenient, uh, putting a key in my door lock?
I get I get that, Okay, I understand why that
can be inconvenient, raining or whatever. And there are other
people who said, uh, you know, and they're asking, wouldn't
be easier if I could push a button? I get
that completely, dude, But who were the people who said,
you know, I'm a go getter, I don't have time
(23:30):
to be pushing buttons while I'm walking. That is far
too complicated. I need a car that is just open
and turns on. I just want to walk into it,
push a button and go. And you know, we I
know that I sound like the crotchy old get off
my lawn man when I say stuff like this. But
this ties back to our earlier soapbox about the inevitability
(23:54):
of autonomous cars in some places. Yeah, yeah, this is
this is the kind of system bend just for people
that don't to understand what we're talking about. There's some
there's some keys out there that aren't really keys. I
guess that. I mean, if you well, I don't know that,
may I guess that it's that's all right. It's just that,
you know, they're more like credit cards. You put the
card in your pocket, and they're shaped. They they don't
(24:15):
have you know, the usual shape. They may look like
a fob or something like that. But they're relatively small
and all you do is you keep this in your pocket.
It's more of a proximity sensor and that you know,
there's a there's what they call a bubble around the car.
Imagine like a dome around the vehicle. There's a certain
range on either side. It's very small. It's not like
space bubble. It's really small. It's not it's not you
(24:35):
know twenty like we talked about before. This is really short,
like you know you're standing next to the vehicle. But
let's say you've got, um, you know, one of these
new keys, these let's say Mercedes Benz keyless ghost system.
And there's a lot of different names for these different
systems and the different manufacturers that have them now. But um,
it's kind of trickling down into some of the other
vehicles like as usual. But um, you walk up to
(24:55):
the car, and the car sensors that you're you know,
within six ft of the door and unlocks. What's here? Yeah, yeah,
the key is just now remember the keys in your
pocket full time. So you walk up to the door,
of the door unlocks, you get in, You sit down
on the driver's seat. There's no need to fish that
that fob or whatever out of the pot of your pocket.
You don't have to insert the fob into the dash
or anything. You don't have to turn the key, you
(25:17):
don't have to do anything. You just sit down, push
the star button, and the car to the car is
ready to go exactly And you know that's that's again,
that's still a a transmitter and a receiver working, but
they're they're working in a slightly different range. I guess
you know that it's shorter on the outside when you're
unlocking the door, a little bit longer on the inside
(25:39):
when you're actually starting the car. Because you know, even
though my car has a key fob and a key,
it has that big it's Ivan Honda, so it has
a key fob that I pushed the button on to
unlock the door and get in or lock it. When
I get in, I do have to put a key
in the ignition. When I put the key in the
ignition there's a there's a chip in the key still.
It's up in that that black I guess, the head
(26:00):
of the key um. When I put the key in.
There's a very short distance between the ignition um, the
unition ignition column, I guess, and the and the key itself,
and they're talking to each other right there. At that point,
it's verifying that I'm using the correct key to start
the vehicle. And there's a little key icon in the
in the dash that glows green or blink blink screen
says yeah, that's the right key to run this car.
(26:23):
UM And that's part of the mobilizer system. And so
there's still a chip that that speaks to it. So
you've got a fob that's you know, the keyless entry.
You've got the chip that's that's working with the ignition um.
There's a lot going on, and that's just a that's
a short you know, like a longer distance for this
these keyless GOH systems, and that you know, it's still
in your pocket or it may accommodate for someone who
(26:44):
has it in like a purse or bag and puts
it in the passenger seat. But that's about it. Now.
It does have a mobilizer system kind of built in
and that Let's say that you're out and this is
safety too. Let's say that you're you know, filling the
tank up with gas, so you're standing within the range
of the vehicle to be unlocked. Someone decides they I'm
going to jump in and take off in that car.
(27:05):
So they get in, and of course the car will
start because you know, you you've hear that within the distance,
so they can push the button, it will start. But
when the key and the vehicle get a certain distance
away from each other, that's when the system decides something's
not right and shuts down. It shuts down, that's right,
the fuel pump shuts off. Whatever the the system happens
(27:25):
to be. If it's electronic, you know, it'll it'll It'll
just shut down the fuel pump and the the thief
will only be able to get a certain distance from
the key before the vehicle shuts off. So it's kind
of uh, I don't know. It seems like it's a
good system. It is. It is a good system and
does have its flaws. It does have its flaws. Before
(27:46):
you get into those, I have to point out that
this is astonishing technology, and far be it from me
to call anyone lazy for lik inconvenience, because God knows,
I don't own an infra red remote control on my television,
you know what I mean. I'm that guy who doesn't
want to move the pizza bucks. So I see the
(28:07):
advantages of this technology. However, as we've said, there are
some clear disadvantages. One of those obviously being that someone
who loses their key less go entry and has someone
else take it, you know whoever, Johnny Anonymous takes it
and all of a sudden, Johnny Anonymous owns your car. Yeah,
(28:30):
that's true. Um. And the other thing is, let's say
you're filling up the tank with guests and you've got
your person the passenger seat, and someone does the exact
same trick. Um, the key and the vehicles stay together,
the key and the vehicles going to continue to run.
Uh So that doesn't that doesn't exempt you from that. Now,
that would I guess that would be akin to somebody
leaving the key in the ignition or throwing the keys
(28:51):
on the passengers seat. Also, so if you're somebody who's
cautious about this, it's not really gonna affect you. Um,
I always keep my keys in my pocket. Um, I know,
I mean, I guess it's it's different for ladies they
have a purse to carry around with them there, or
you know, typically they do, or some people just get
kind of lazy about it, you know, they've they've decided that,
you know, I'm gonna throw the keys up on the
dash when I fill up the fill up the tank.
(29:13):
And if you've always done that, there's a good chance
as we're going to keep your your keyless ghost system,
I suppose. I mean, let's say you've got a hundred
thousand dollar Mercedes. I I don't know if you're gonna
be as as free spirited with your keys and yeah, yeah, exactly,
that's the word I was looking for. But so, yeah,
this this makes sense. I think what we're what we're
both trying to get across here is that regardless of
(29:37):
the specific system that you're using, it really does come
down to personal responsibility. I have common sense, common sense, yes, yes,
to quote Thomas Payne here, and I have a little
I have a little bit of a hacker story. Oh
please don't want to here? Yeah, yeah, I think I do,
(29:57):
because I've got a few little odds and ends here
I'd like to clean up about about keys. There's some
interesting little things about these, Okay, we need so one
of the one of the most prominent names in this
kind of technology is a cipher called key lock, and
that's k E E l o Q A little different,
(30:20):
little different um. And this is used in multiple models
of vehicles, GM has it, Honda, Chrysler, Volkswagen, all the hits,
even Day, WOU and even day. And so each of
these devices is where I'm getting that number of eighteen
(30:42):
billion billion values. So, uh, this system is widely believed
to be secure. It would literally take you with a
hundred computers several decades. Then are you saying eighteen billion billion? Yeah,
you're saying eighteen billion billion. Yes, okay, I thought you
missed spoke earlier on I've been saying eighteen billion. But
(31:03):
holy cow, that's the key locks specifically tremendous amount of codes.
I know, it's like a billion billion. Okay, So now
we're a math show in addition to a medical as um.
So three research groups got together. Um. Then these guys
are from uh spanning countries to from Israel, one from Belgium,
(31:28):
and they found a way to hack this system in
less than a day. So to take the work of
several decades and reduce it to less than twenty four hours.
This requires access to the remote control, you know, but
not necessarily access to it in terms of physically opening
(31:50):
it up and tinkering with it. So they could be nearby,
they could be just in the same coffee shop, maybe
on a flight with somebody, perhaps on a flight that's
an excellent that's next the point. And so then once
they've nailed that key, once they've found that specific code,
they're able to deactivate the alarm and deactivate fail safes
(32:11):
like that and drive away with the vehicle. Okay, on
one quick thing here, I don't know if a flight
would be a good example that maybe let's say somebody's
in having lunch somewhere having lunch. But but you know
what if they and they throw the keys in up
on the on the tabletop as there, you know, and
somebody sits next to you and decides, I'm going to
steal that code. Well a day, but a full day
(32:34):
is what it takes to crack this code. Well, the
fully here's here's the thing. To get the data they need,
it takes um I think it takes about sixty five
minutes according to their APPSIL but here's where it gets tricky.
To uh make the correct calculations. They need sixty four
CPU cords and almost eight days of time. Okay, so
(32:58):
this is you know, so that's a you see how
that averages I understand. So so for the you know,
the people that say that these systems aren't really safe,
I mean, look what it takes to crack it. It
really does take an awful lot of of computer power
and time and the reremendous amount of effort. It's not
it's not as simple as somebody you know, running a
card reader pass the thing and it working. Like you know,
(33:19):
some of some of the the thieves are able to
do now, I mean even through your wallets or whatever
like do being meg strikes exactly. Not not even close
to as simple as that. This is a This is
a much more complex system. For now, these systems are
very secure. Um in the future will they remain so,
I don't know, but it is safe to say that
(33:41):
as UH technology evolves to exploit these systems, the protective
technology will evolved as well. I was just thinking, what
were you thinking? What if you ran a valet a
service and access to several you know, high end vehicles
for let's say about an hour and a half each.
You know, somebody's having dinner two hours maybe the restaurant,
nice restaurant, two and a half, maybe hours whatever, Um,
(34:03):
but you spot the vehicle that you want, and you
had all this computing power. I mean, this is like
like this could be almost like a gone in sixty
seconds move yeah, something like that. But I mean that's
kind of that. That would be the kind of access
that you would almost need, right, I mean, be able
to set the key in a cradle and then just
just I don't know, try to punish it with these
(34:24):
these RF signals until finally it reads right. I mean
that's about the only way. So, you know, mentioning valets
though that you know, the one thing about valet keys
is another thing we need to talk about. Um. Oftentimes
you'll get a valet key with your set of keys
from the dealer or from you know, the previous owner.
And what the heck is a valet key. Valet keys
are They don't operate the trunk area, you know, the
(34:46):
storage area, and they don't operate the glove box. Typically,
in some rare cases, um, supercars, a lot of supercars,
they'll have a reduced power key so that the valet
doesn't have access to the thousand horse power that the
car has. They only have access to, you know, the
two fifty horse power that, lets say, the six horse
(35:07):
power that you need to park the thing, right, okay,
so so something like that. But the valley keys sometimes,
now I hadn't heard about this. Now, the valley keys,
you know, they they're exclusive and that they only operate
the driver's door and the ignition. Well I just read
about this. I had no idea. But some valet keys
actually um inhibit the use of the electric fuel pump.
(35:28):
And that means that when the valet gets in with
the key turns, the key on the fuel pump doesn't operate,
and the only way that that vehicles running is on
the fuel that's stored in the fuel lines. So I
wonder how far what do you think A block blocks?
Maybe a block or two maybe at the most, I
would think. But but it's a it's a great safety feature.
(35:49):
I think that's fantastic. I mean, now nerve wracking for
the valet, well, they don't know, they have no idea,
but that's the thing, like, you know, you don't know
how limited the range of this thing is. That means
that you know, they would only be able to get
a block or two away at the most, and then
suddenly the car becomes you know, an anchor and that's it.
And I think the reduced power is also a very
good security measure for valet's I think so, although I know,
(36:10):
I'm sure there are scores of disappointed valets out there. Yeah,
I've I've had you know, I've seen many very disciplined
valets driving some very high end cars and they do
an excellent job. I also been have seen cars turned
sideways and parking lots um you know, at this one
specific example at a mall during Christmas time. So the
(36:33):
valets park at the back of the lot, right, the
person is in the mall within ten seconds, you know,
they park, they come up the front, they go inside,
They're done the very back end of the mall like that.
This is like two minutes after the person is inside. Yeah,
there are some shenanigans going on. Yeah, I know, but
it happens, and you know, maybe there's a little slick out.
Who knows. I mean, you know, how do you how
(36:53):
do you determine what's going on? You know what? That's
very fair of you. Yeah, yeah, I think So what's
higher smoke in the sideways driving ballets? What's kind of
kind of like to be that he's drifting in? So okay,
let's wrap this. I've got I've got a couple more
things I want to mention here, and let's just try
to go through them kind of rapid fire. But I
think that these are worth mentioning. Um. Okay, we talked
(37:17):
about key five ranges in the trick right in vallet keys. Okay,
that's good. We're getting through a lot of these. Um.
Every different manufacturer has different names for these systems, so
you know, whatever your system is called, like Mercedes Bens.
We've mentioned this a few times, but they may have
smart keys or keyless ghost systems. On a Ford, it's
called intelligent access with push button start. Um. You know
there's BMW which has comfort access. You know, I went
(37:41):
to Jaguars site and Jaguar has what they call the
smart key system and a lot of these are similar.
But you know, there were a lot of the same systems. Um,
I went to Jaguars site and I don't I was
just looking at the keys. They must have been thirty
five or forty different types of keys you can buy
for a Jaguar. So you've got to really know what
you're looking for when you buy a key. When you
(38:02):
go to buy a new key and having them programmed
and et cetera. You know, they may say that it's
a dealer only thing. If it is, you can ask
them if there's a proceedure to do it that you
can do, or you can take it and you can
suck it up and take it in and have it done.
But it may take a certain amount of time and
it may cost you quite a bit of money to
get it done. Now, the keys are expensive. Um, you know,
we've we've talked about how you could get one cut
(38:23):
at the the hardware store. Really that was like I
mean a dollar fifty, you know, or less, um, maybe
a dollar for a key. Now it's like it can
get into the hundreds of dollars if you have if
certain conditions are met. Let's say they've lost all of
the keys to the system, that's a big deal. If
you have one key remaining, that's less of a deal,
(38:45):
a big deal than it is if you have lost
all the keys to the system, because then you're you're
looking at a possible toe into the dealership to have
it reprogrammed, where you have the ignition and the key
reprogramed together, and they have to they have to match
them up because there's no way to prove which key
or no way to set one without the other. It's
a factory preset so um. And you can buy tools
(39:06):
to reset keys, you can reset chips and things like that,
but if you wanted to, but you're talking about like
maybe a two hundred or two more than that, uh
two D tool to do something like this. Um, we're
not talking about the key fob program. We're talking about
key chip programming and linking that with the ignition. Now,
one thing that I need to mention here is that
(39:27):
this is a good tip. This is somewhere out there
online I found but I hadn't even thought about this,
But this is a great way to save money, because
you know, some of these can get super expensive, hundreds
and hundreds of dollars. If you've lost all the keys,
and you know, you think all is lost, and you
know I'm gonna spend thousand dollars, you get this thing reprogrammed.
Sorry to college next year. Take a look online and
(39:47):
see if there's an option to buy a an Ignition
cylinder and a key set that are programmed to match.
And if you can buy that combination of hardware and
then install in your vehicle. Oftentimes that's far cheaper than
it is to buy if you've lost all your keys.
Now this is kind of an extreme example, but you
(40:08):
may end up having it. It may be much cheaper
to buy an Ignition and key their key together in
order for you to uh, you know, to to cut
some costs on that. Not bad. Yeah, I thought that
was a good tip. So, um, I probably got more,
but let's we should probably Yeah, I think so, because
we had guys, we had some other really cool stuff
to talk about, but we didn't want to. We don't
(40:29):
want to go too far past our time limit. I
think it's too late for that. Well, how about, by
way of compromise, we go out real quick with some
listener mail. Okay, so, Scott, this is actually a bit
of Facebook fan mail from our good friend and the
listener and David. David says, high, Scott and Dinner recently
(40:52):
listened to your Curiosity Rover episode. When talking about your tires.
The tires, you specifically mentioned the initials JPL. Uh the
company that made tires, and David says, JPL stands for
Jet Propulsion Laboratory. Uh. Since they've since they've built Curiosity
and controlling it from Pasadena, uh. He he thought they
(41:13):
were worth mentioning specifically, and David, we agree, So shout
out to you, Jet Propulsion Laboratory. Get Propulsion Laboratory. Would
be cool to work at place called Jet propulsion Laboratory.
That would be so awesome. Maybe we could I could
call my garadge the Jet Propulsion Laboratory. You could you? Um,
it would have no backing, no founding for that, But
I mean I was I was thinking, I was like,
what kind of engine work. Would we need to do
(41:35):
to your project? You know, need to even talk about that.
We just just call it that you need to get
to get some shirts like we worked there. We should
call your cubicle that that's going. Um, David, you're hired.
Welcome to our Welcome to our new jet propulsion laboratory.
Well thanks, That's that's cool because I think they do
deserve some credit because that's that's quite a system, if
you remember. Yeah, I've been kind of reading about that
(41:57):
stuff because more and more is coming out about that
and we're seeing better and better images and they're starting
to drive that thing now. I just started just the
other day. So, um, I think this is this is
really something we need to Yeah, it's one of the
most amazing road trips in history. We need to keep
us on the top of our minds. But the next
week he wants you No, Scott and I are gonna
go ahead and get out of here. We hope you
(42:19):
have enjoyed listening to the system. We hope you remember
some of the tricks we gave you. Startle and amaze
your friends by using your head as de fans but
an amplifier. I again, startle and irritate your friends use
by desynchronizing their remote entry. Use this trick sparingly. I
urge you use this trick sparingly please, but do not
(42:41):
use fan mail sparingly. Feel free to inundate us on Twitter.
We're also on Facebook. We'd love to hear from directly.
If you want to send us an email at car
stuff at Discovery dot com. For more on this and
thousands of other topics, is how stuffworks dot com. Us
know what you think, Send an email to podcast at
(43:03):
how stuff works dot com. Mh.
CarStuff News
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