July 14, 2024 • 58 mins
We uncover a vital clue which will prove critical for ongoing inquiries. Amy’s best friends spill the tea, revealing why she was so excited in the lead-up to her unexpected death.
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
This podcast contains information and details relating to suicide. We
urge anyone struggling with their emotions to contact Lifeline on
thirteen eleven fourteen thirteen eleven fourteen or visit them at
lifeline dot org dot AU. A twenty four year old
(00:29):
devoted mother of two fleeing a violent relationship. As bags
pack car running, her daughters strapped into the backseat.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Mom told me that she needed to go back inside
to grab something.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
Panic.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
I Amy is dead, Sir aim his dead?
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Eight confusion about five minutes, say sit not to suicide.
Speaker 4 (00:56):
One hundred percent.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
This is emersing. What do you think is really the
honest truth about Amy?
Speaker 5 (01:06):
The Truth About Amy?
Speaker 1 (01:15):
Episode four, I'm Liam Bartlett.
Speaker 6 (01:24):
And I'm Alison's Andy.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Amy sits on the end of her bed, brushing her
daughter's hair as they sing along to Taylor Swift Go Sing.
Amy knows her partner, David Simmons will be home any
(01:50):
minute now. Amy's smile fails. There are a lot of
home movies with Amy and her daughter's good job, including
(02:17):
Naya's second birthday party, excursions and activities explorer like painting
with watercolors in the park.
Speaker 4 (02:28):
Hey Hi.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
And family get togethers now.
Speaker 4 (02:34):
I am.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
Most of these don't include David, but when he is
in the frame, Amy certainly appears less comfortable. Fair to say,
her closest friends were completely aware of her problems with David.
Speaker 5 (02:55):
It was a rollercoaster on and off, up and down.
I think every relationship has their troubles, but theirs was
more bad than good.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
Eron Gower met Amy in high school. The pair had
children around the same age and trusted each other implicitly.
Speaker 5 (03:13):
Our long phone calls or just a quick text or.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Aaron says, while they could tell each other anything. She
regrets not being more critical of Amy's relationship with Simmons.
Speaker 5 (03:26):
I just wanted to be more of someone that she
could open up to if she had you know, everyone
wants someone to vent to about their relationship without any judgment.
If she was to complain to her mom or you know,
one of his family members, they might have tried to
steer away or make her feel bad for staying or so.
(03:46):
I always just wanted to be that person that she
could openly speak to.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
You tried very hard just to be non judgmental.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (03:53):
Yeah, I didn't want her to feel, you know, like
I was pushing her to leave or anything. But when
the times did come that they were in a down
place in their relationship, I always offered come and stay
with me, Like I just always tried to open my
door so that she knew that she had somewhere to
come and feel comfortable.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
And during those times, were you secretly hoping that she
would stay away? Oh?
Speaker 5 (04:19):
Yeah, yeah she. I think one time that they were
sort of apart, she started to talk to someone new
and that was exciting, and you know, sort of tried
to coach her and oh, this is fun, and you
know it's so good, and you probably feel regreat and
all that sort of thing. But then you know, David
had this way about him and he would sort of
(04:40):
lure her back in and then they were back on
the roller coaster again.
Speaker 1 (04:45):
What was it about their relationship that was that was
bad to you as an observer?
Speaker 5 (04:51):
I think Amy was She's a really nice person, a
people pleaser, and I think David was very demanding or controlling.
You know, he had to sort of have his say
in everything, and Amy wasn't really allowed to work, but
prior to him, she had multiple jobs. You know, she
was sort of really independent and a social butterfly, But yeah,
(05:14):
he sort of made sure that what he wanted was
sort of the path that they led. It was his
choice or you know, they had a nice house in Pinjarra,
but he didn't really want to work any steady jobs
or anything, so they went and moved in with his dad.
So it was sort of she didn't really have much
say in anything. He was the dominant in the relationship.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
Did you directly witness any of that controlling behavior.
Speaker 5 (05:42):
I saw him overpower her before physically, Yeah, physically in
what way. I've always went to her house for playdates.
You know, our kids were the same age. So one
time when I was at her house, he should have
been at work, but he came home really early. It
was before lunchtime. We were just in the lound room
and he sat on the couch next to her, and
(06:03):
I can't remember what the conversation was or anything, but
Amy was a really small, really little frame. Pretty petite, yeah,
very petite. He grabbed the back of her neck and
Amy was laughing, like joke, joking around and you know,
trying to play it off as it was okay, but
you could see in her face that she was uncomfortable.
(06:23):
Grabbed the back of her neck and like pushed her
head down, so like her head was sort of down
between her knees, and he was like, she laughed it
off like it was nothing, but you could see that
she was uncomfortable, and she's like, oh, leave us alone now,
And you know he went out and did whatever he
was doing, So there was that, and you know, he
(06:44):
was a big guy and wouldn't have taken much to
make her get in an uncomfortable posision.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
She would have been embarrassed.
Speaker 5 (06:52):
Also, Yeah, yeah, that's why she sort of laughed it
off as a you know, he's playing around or it's okay,
but you could see that it wasn't.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
And you could tell that it was obviously a forceful
grab around the neck.
Speaker 5 (07:06):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, No one really wants to be put
into that position of being folded in half.
Speaker 6 (07:17):
Liam pulls out a photograph of a woman's neck turned
to the side. Erin had told police about it when
she was finally able to speak to someone, and when
she followed it up, they said they couldn't find it.
I found it within twenty minutes of getting access to
Amy's iPhone data. There are visible red marks across the neck,
(07:41):
indicating a recent trauma. The image property shows the date
as Tuesday, the tenth of July twenty twelve, at about
six thirty pm.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
Erin, I've got a photograph that I believe Amy said
this to you on via tech? Is that right?
Speaker 5 (08:02):
She did send me a photo.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
We've got a photograph here that's blown up of a
rather large bruise on Amy's neck.
Speaker 5 (08:10):
That is it?
Speaker 3 (08:12):
See?
Speaker 5 (08:13):
I got told that they didn't find.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
This, The police didn't find it. Yeah, well we did,
and it's on her neck. I mean those sort of
bruises don't get there just by chance, do they.
Speaker 5 (08:28):
This is the first time I've seen it since it happened.
Speaker 1 (08:31):
I'm sorry, I didn't mean.
Speaker 5 (08:32):
To that's gay.
Speaker 3 (08:34):
See.
Speaker 5 (08:35):
I tried so hard to make sure that I could
get this available to Anna to back you know, the
stories of how he treated her.
Speaker 1 (08:44):
Well, I would have thought this is clear evidence of
the domestic violence that was going on, And for her
to take that photograph and text it on the phone
means that she was also very worried. Yeah, ye, why
did she send you that?
Speaker 5 (09:00):
She always told me all the bad things that had happened,
you know, when they fought and that sort of stuff.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
I mean, was that a cry for help or is
she just saying, look, this should be sort of on
the record.
Speaker 5 (09:12):
Maybe both. Maybe I just didn't take it as her
cry for help could have been. But yeah I didn't.
I don't know. I was the same age. I was
young as well, and you know, if I could go
back in time, definitely I would try and help her
get out quicker, knowing you know what was happening.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
It's hard, though, it was not when you get between
people in a relationship. Yeah, as you say, I mean,
it's a difficult thing to do anyway, full stop.
Speaker 5 (09:44):
Yeah, Like Amy didn't want to. She already had one
father to a child, and now she's got a second
child's dad in the picture, and so she.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
Was desperate to make this work.
Speaker 5 (09:57):
She wanted to make her family work. Was always on
and off. And you know, she gave him all these chances,
but he just never grew up.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
What sort of man does that?
Speaker 3 (10:06):
Though?
Speaker 1 (10:06):
It too? Yeah, a woman's.
Speaker 5 (10:08):
Name, yep, And like I said, she was tiny.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
One day, Amy sent erin a text about how she
hoped to escape her Bush prison.
Speaker 5 (10:21):
Back on Facebook.
Speaker 7 (10:22):
Loll erin, I'm so annoyed right now, David rocks up
at four point thirty am, jumps in bed. I ask
what's wrong. He said he's pissed off because he lost
his phone, Samsung Galaxy S two in Bush, no insurance.
I say, you're pissed off because you're on drugs. He
laid there quiet, so I asked him again. He replies, yeah,
(10:43):
I had a few tokes of crack. By this time,
my heart is pounding so hard. I see red and
start punching into him. He then man handles me, choking
me and chucking me around the room. My adrenaline is pumping,
so I didn't feel a thing. I calmed down on
because Tay is now awake. I'm so hurt that he
did drugs after I begged him not to take DEXI.
(11:05):
It fucks me right off. He gives in all the time.
I'll ring you later and fill you in. He has
to start work at seven am with his dad, and
he's not dumb. He will know David has been on drugs.
Useless piece of dirt. He is bloody disgusted in him.
Speaker 5 (11:20):
The first time that I got really worried was he
made jokes about if he was ever to do anything
to her, he was ever to kill Amy, He had
options of what he could do with her body.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
What possible context couldn't that have been.
Speaker 5 (11:38):
It was the end of one of their kid's birthday party,
so it was just us three sitting out the front
of the house in Pinjarra. Everyone had left and we're
just hanging out.
Speaker 1 (11:50):
Was he drunk, Yeah, he'd been drinking.
Speaker 5 (11:51):
Your day, Amy was sort of you know, dealing with
all the party or the guests and the kids and
all that sort of stuff. And this was the time
that I ever was like, this person's a little bit unhinged.
You don't really joke about what you've thought to do
about your partner's body if you ever killed them. His
two options were he could take her out bush, leave
(12:14):
her for the pigs to clean up. Or there was
a quarry that they'd broken into overnight or something in
the past, and he said he could take her up
the bext no one would find her there.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
So he was putting forward suggestions of what he would
do with her body yep, if he killed her yep.
Or was it a joke?
Speaker 5 (12:33):
Well, coming from him, he made it seem like he
was joking. But I certainly don't think that that's something
you joke about, especially if it sounds like you've thought.
Speaker 3 (12:43):
About it before.
Speaker 1 (12:45):
Clearly it stayed in your mind. Oh yeah, yep, so
you must have thought at the time it was it
was most unusual. Yeah, when you first heard how did
you hear about Amy being shot?
Speaker 5 (13:00):
This also has stuck with me. I woke up to
a text from Nancy that morning and it was something
really simple. Two lines said Aaron Amy's dead. She shot herself.
And I was like, what, like that doesn't this isn't
a funny joke. Oh, so I instantly rang Amy just
(13:27):
to you know, like your mums sent me this stupid
message like wrong, Yeah, and I went I went to voicemails.
I was like, Okay, that's weird. Try again, voicemail again.
And then my next feeling was she didn't do it.
(13:53):
I knew you had to vote to Amy boys to
her girls. Oh yeah, instantly, like from the beginning, I've
known in my heart that it wasn't suicide.
Speaker 1 (14:07):
So did you ring Nancy then?
Speaker 5 (14:09):
Or I sent her a message and I said I
took some time to you know, like got hit around it,
and then I sent her a message and got her
to call me. She sort of told me what happened
or what they say has happened.
Speaker 1 (14:23):
Did you express your doubt to her then?
Speaker 3 (14:25):
Ye?
Speaker 5 (14:26):
Yeah, I've always said to anyone that I've spoke to
about it that I don't think that she committed suicide.
She wasn't that sort of person. She didn't speak about suicide.
She loved her girls, and she was just such a
happy person. Like every time we were together it was
just laughter and like joking and fun and it just
(14:47):
wasn't It wasn't her.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
When was the last time you talked to Amy had
any sort of communication?
Speaker 5 (14:56):
Well, like I said, we were always just like you know,
little texts and stuff here and there. But our last
long conversation was I think the week.
Speaker 1 (15:03):
Before, only a week before. Yeah, And was there anything
in that that anything in her voice that you would
have thought was unusual.
Speaker 5 (15:12):
Or not well, unusual for the good I guess Amy
had a plan. She was so excited so because of
the car accident when she fructured her neck and stuff,
she was seeking compensation for that. She was excited. She
thought that it was almost finalized, so she was ready
(15:32):
to get her pay out for that, much to David's disappointment,
because he was upset that he would be the one
that had to pay for I don't know how those things.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
Work, but well, effectively that was a claim against David,
wasn't it. Yeah, because he was driving. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (15:47):
So he didn't want her to do it, obviously, because
then he would have had to pay this debt. But
she stuck to her guns with this, and she was
excited because it was almost done and she was ready
to get the girls out. She'd started looking for rentals,
you know. She wanted to get a little place for
her and the girls. And another thing she was really
(16:07):
excited for was to work. I think she knew someone
that had a cafe or something starting up, and she
wanted to go and work part time.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
So she knew there was money on the way, yep,
and she was making a plan to use that to
improve herself.
Speaker 4 (16:20):
Yep.
Speaker 5 (16:21):
Yep. She was going to pay a car off, get
a place, and then set herself up for her and
her girls to go and live by themselves.
Speaker 1 (16:28):
But in none of these plans that you've just mentioned
is the notion of David being with her.
Speaker 5 (16:34):
She'd had enough.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
She'd had enough, yep. And she told you that in
very yep certain terms.
Speaker 5 (16:41):
Yep. She was ready to go, and that was.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
A week before this happened.
Speaker 6 (16:44):
Yeah, Amy had formulated a plan, a plan she was
confident enough in to communicate to erin just one week
before she died. Everything was in motion, and she was
excited about the prospect of a new life with her
two young daughters and without David.
Speaker 3 (17:08):
Amy.
Speaker 5 (17:08):
It also not long before it had happened, she found
out that she was pregnant, so she did not want
any more kids, especially in her state. You know, she's
very fragile. How is she going to be able to
carry a baby nine months and be as fragile as
(17:29):
she was. David wanted a son, so he was sort
of pushing her, but it didn't take into consideration how she felt,
you know, how she going to physically do this. He
didn't care. But that was another thing that she sort
of stuck to her guns.
Speaker 6 (17:45):
This was after the car accident where Simmons insisted on driving,
causing Amy serious injury, which resulted in her having a
permanent neck disability. Amy knew having another baby could exacerbate
her always delicate condition, and as it was very early days,
she was able to terminate the pregnancy safely. Amy was
(18:09):
taking back control of her life, looking at rental accommodation,
applying for jobs, and planning a way forward where she
could raise her daughters independently of him.
Speaker 1 (18:21):
Did he know about the termination?
Speaker 5 (18:23):
Ah, I don't actually remember. I'm not sure if she
had just gone to the doctor. I do know that
she she just got the you know, sometimes you've got
to go into a clinic or you just can take
the medication. She went the medication route, So I'm not
one hundred percent sure if she told him or not.
Speaker 1 (18:43):
Do you think David knew about her plans?
Speaker 5 (18:48):
I'm not sure. I have no idea.
Speaker 1 (18:51):
I wonder if he either had a feeling or was
across what she intended to do.
Speaker 5 (18:57):
Yeah, look, it's so long ago now, I don't remember
if she had told me that she did tell him
or not. But and that's always stuck with me, that
she was ready to get out and it was the
most exciting time, but it just never came.
Speaker 1 (19:20):
I'm sure you've gone over this a million times in
your mind, because there's been so many sort of false
starts in this story, hasn't there in trying to find
out the truth about Amy? How do you see what
happened in the ensuing hours and days and weeks with
the police action.
Speaker 5 (19:40):
Well, I never got contacted by police until Anna started
pushing for something to be done. That's one of the
things that has frustrated me this whole time is if
they actually looked into it properly at the beginning, they
would have seen what sort of a person Amy was
like compared to what David was like, how bad of
(20:03):
a temper he had, his drug use, his alcohol abuse,
all these sorts of things that I don't think that
they really took into consideration at the time. They just
labeled Amy suicide. And you know, that's stuck and that's
a hard thing for people to read about someone. She
committed suicide, that's a big deal. What are her girls
(20:23):
going to think when they grow up, Mum left us.
That's that's not a good thing for them to think
growing up.
Speaker 1 (20:30):
That's interesting you point that out. So it wasn't until
Anna started digging yep, and making noise and really creating
a problem for authorities, that there was any sort of action,
and that you were contacted her best friend to then
inquire about the background.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
Yep.
Speaker 5 (20:51):
Yeah, I think someone called me and it was just
sort of a quick phone call. Someone's going to be
in touch, you know, to get some more information from you.
And I ended up having to contact them a couple
of times. The left messages, you know, someone said that
they're going to be calling me for information, and no
one has. And I think by the end of it,
I did get a call, and it was just a
(21:13):
very quick phone call just to oh, yeah, what sort
of a person was she like? And you know, what
was a relationship like. It was nothing in detail, So
and I got me to do just do a statement.
We'll get in writing. So that's that's where sort of
we started.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
If it wasn't for her auntie, Yeah, some of this
would never have got to where we are today.
Speaker 5 (21:35):
No, not at all. I would have just gone through
as a suicide. And that's what everyone would have thought.
Speaker 1 (21:41):
So you get the distinct impression that really nobody in
a position of power really has ever wanted to genuinely
get to the bottom of it.
Speaker 3 (21:50):
Not at all.
Speaker 5 (21:51):
No, No, I think that there's they should have done
the right thing from the start. It's very frustrating. I
think I'm fueled by frustration now.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
One thing I still get stuck on with this is
the notion that you can have two little girls in
a car with a car running and their bags packed,
and the police get to know this information and still
decide that their mum has gone inside and committed suicide.
(22:20):
It just doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
Speaker 5 (22:24):
Just if anyone's got common sense, they would know that
that doesn't make sense. Two days later was her daughter's birthday.
She had the presence in the car like it just
and they don't know Amy's personality. They didn't know what
sort of a person she was. She would not have
done that. She didn't speak of suicide. She loved her daughters.
(22:46):
It just it doesn't make sense.
Speaker 1 (22:50):
And the toxicology reports show that she didn't have any
alcohol or drugs in her sister apart from very normal
levels of hand He depressed medication.
Speaker 5 (23:01):
That was one thing that also frustrated me. During the inquest,
they kept saying referring to Amy's mental health, and you
know she's depressed and all these things. So I sort
of piped up. David admitted that he had used drugs,
he'd been drinking all day, he had anger issues. Why
did no one think to take in all his sort
(23:24):
of mental health and where his mindset was at that day,
everyone just kept sort of pushing everything on Amy. Amy.
Amy her fault. You know, she had antidepressants in a system.
Consider what sort of a person he was, Like.
Speaker 1 (23:40):
Well, that supported the suicide theory, didn't it. Yeah, yep,
So it was able to be pushed. Yeah, there's hundreds
of thousands, if not millions, of Australians who were on
exactly the same antidepressant medication that Amy was on and
in the same dosages. Yeah, and they're not committing suicide.
Speaker 5 (24:00):
And she had many reasons to live. She was happy,
she had a goal and she was excited for that
to come through.
Speaker 1 (24:07):
So she had a longer term plan and she had
a very short term plan as well, So she was
planning all round.
Speaker 5 (24:15):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
Does someone like that then go back inside and commit suicide?
Speaker 5 (24:19):
Definitely not.
Speaker 1 (24:21):
Doesn't make a lot of sense, does it.
Speaker 5 (24:24):
Anyone with common sense that looks at the mountain of
stuff that's happened in this In Amy's case, you can
definitely see that there's something not right.
Speaker 1 (24:36):
Do you want somebody somewhere in a position of authority
to chase this all the way down the rabbit hole?
Speaker 5 (24:42):
Yep? I think with enough pressure, the truth will come
out and with some actual real police work to happen.
You know, they can't hold it in forever.
Speaker 1 (24:57):
Do you think there are people involved in this who
know a lot more than what they've ever said.
Speaker 5 (25:02):
Andre said, I think that that's something that you can't
hold into yourself. So someone's spoken to someone about what
happened to get it off their chest, and there's definitely
people that should come forward and think of the girls.
Someone needs to be held accountable for what happened.
Speaker 1 (25:20):
Does it strike he was a little bit strange that
those three guys who were there on the day, David Simmons,
Gareth Price and Joshua Brydon are still all very close.
Speaker 6 (25:34):
It's worth mentioning here that while Joshua Bridon was there
on the day, he apparently left before Amy was shot.
We'll be doing a deep dive on Bridon later in
the series and discuss whether the evidence actually supports this claim.
Speaker 5 (25:49):
Oh yeah, yep, I saw that Gareth on social media.
You know, he sort of said something along the lines
of oh, I can't take this anymore, and David was
straight in there with the comment and I'll be home,
I'll be home tomorrow or something. You know. It just
seemed very weird the way that he commented and reacted
to his posts.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
I just wanted to check with you something else. When
we had a chat, Gareth Price. He said a couple
of things about Amy. Yeah, and I want to check
them with you because you knew her a lot better
than he did. Did she like shooting?
Speaker 5 (26:21):
Amy loved animals. This was one of the things that
David had been doing, hunting and stuff for way before Amy,
so she needed to find a common ground, common interest.
She wasn't really a big drinker, she wasn't a camper,
She didn't go out camping prior to meeting David. So
(26:43):
it was sort of one of those things where this
is a really big coby of his. Maybe I can
take it up. We've got that common interest.
Speaker 1 (26:51):
She was trying to please him.
Speaker 5 (26:52):
Yeah, yeah, So it was definitely something that she just
wanted to do so that they had something that they
could do together.
Speaker 1 (27:02):
Gareth was insistent. He said she loved shooting. Amy loved shooting.
Speaker 5 (27:07):
Well, she got a pink gun. But you know, if
you can make anything girly, because she was a girly girl.
But yeah, she didn't. I don't think that she loved
it at all.
Speaker 1 (27:18):
He also said she loved skinning things.
Speaker 5 (27:21):
Nope, like I said, Amy loved animals.
Speaker 3 (27:25):
She had a little.
Speaker 5 (27:26):
Piglet at one stage, they had dogs and chickens and
all that sort of stuff. It was again, just something
that she could do to be on the same level
as him, something to try and make things work and
make the relationship easier for them to get along.
Speaker 1 (27:40):
So she certainly didn't love it.
Speaker 5 (27:42):
I did not love it.
Speaker 1 (27:43):
Why would Gareth say those things?
Speaker 5 (27:46):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
He also said that that four ten that shotgun was hers,
that was her gun.
Speaker 5 (27:51):
I'm not sure that. I only know that she had
the pink gun. That's totally Amy style, just to have
something girly. But I don't know. I didn't really. I'm
not a gun person. Again, we had the same sort
of personality, and I don't like guns or hunting or anything.
Speaker 1 (28:09):
So Gareth was wrong about the four to ten shotgun
being Amy's. Police records have Simmons admitting that the gun
did belong to him. Poor Cameron audio into the Ari
concode on ABC Sinclub. Now we turn to another close
(28:32):
friend of Amy's, Natasha Selsa. Okay, here we go. The
pair lived together when Amy was pregnant with Tay and
Natasha tells me she was horrified by what she witnessed. Well, listen,
thanks a lot for sitting down and talking to us
about this. Obviously, it's been traumatic for a lot of
people close to Amy, and you would have gone through
(28:55):
those feelings as well.
Speaker 3 (28:58):
How could you not?
Speaker 1 (28:59):
How have you interpreted all that Over the years.
Speaker 2 (29:03):
I think hindsight has made it so obvious to me
what was happening at the time. Now I don't think
I knew what was happening in the moment. I didn't
realize the abuse that was happening. I don't think it
was forefront of my mind that that is abuse. And
I just sort of wanted to do with my friend,
wanted to do I wanted to help her, she wanted
to be happy and everything like that. So over the
(29:24):
years I sort of think back on it, and I
just think, now she's gone, and it's just hard to
think about and to talk about and to know she's
not here. She's not here to see her girls, she's
not here to grow up and be with her family,
to see her friends, to do everything that she should
have been doing. They got taken away from her and
(29:44):
I think over the years it's just sort of got
to a point where I'm now angry and I don't
see any of all changes. I don't see us getting
justice because of what happened, because of the insufficient detective
work on the night.
Speaker 3 (30:00):
You've ruined it. You've ruined any hope of justice.
Speaker 2 (30:03):
We can now only pray that we get the justice
that Amy needs and she deserves, and those girls deserve,
her daughters.
Speaker 3 (30:10):
But yeah, it's a lot, a lot to think about.
Speaker 1 (30:15):
You don't think it was suicide.
Speaker 3 (30:16):
No, I don't.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
I got the phone call from Nancy and I remember
her saying to me, Amy's been shot. Amy's been shot.
And then she's saying the police are saying she shot herself.
The police are saying she shot herself. And I said, no,
this isn't Amy. No, no, No, that didn't happen. She
wouldn't have done that. And I know Amy well enough
to know that she wouldn't have done that, And she
(30:39):
wouldn't have done that with her two daughters in a car,
with her belongings.
Speaker 3 (30:42):
Packed ready to go, she had everything ready to go.
Speaker 2 (30:46):
I've seen her leave before, and I've never seen her
leave like that before.
Speaker 3 (30:52):
She's always come to me before, and she's left him.
Speaker 2 (30:55):
And he's always dragged her back in his way, he
charms her into coming back, and then nothing changes.
Speaker 3 (31:01):
It's just the same and it's just all a facade.
Speaker 2 (31:05):
And then when she's backed, it's coercial control. If she's
got no money, you can't get a job. No, you
stay at home, you look after the kids, don't talk
to men. You can't do that, you can't do this.
You're a slut, you're that, you're this. It's just the
constant belittling and all that sort of stuff is it's
a lot.
Speaker 1 (31:25):
Did you ever witness any of that, Natasha.
Speaker 3 (31:28):
Yeah, one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (31:29):
So he's His demeanor towards Amy changed when she pretty
much got pregnant, and I saw it. I saw how
his demeanor was with her. He was very jealous. He
was very much I'm going to do.
Speaker 3 (31:41):
What I want to do.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
I'm going to go out. I'm going to go see
the boys. I'll be home when I get home. You
just stay here. And if she was to go out,
it would be well will free. So I don't know
she was pregnant.
Speaker 3 (31:53):
If she was to go out and didn't tell him,
it would be an issue.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
She would come home, he might be drunk or intoxicated
in any the other way, and it turns into an
argument because he starts getting jealous. Who have you been texting?
Show me your phone, show me this, show me that.
So she had a habit of always deleting her Facebook,
she had a habit of being quiet when he'd walk
in the room. He'd had like, it's just all these things.
Speaker 1 (32:15):
So you'd notice her it.
Speaker 2 (32:17):
Changed, it changed, And I remember when she moved from
the house Incomes got to the house in Pinjarra, we
would have a lot more phone conversations because she was
a lot further away from me then, so she was
about an hour drive from me, so we would be
on the phone a lot more. And I could tell
every time he came in the room or he came
home subject change. She would go quiet and then you
(32:41):
would just tell you could feel it like she didn't
want him knowing. She couldn't event she couldn't talk to me,
she couldn't say what she wanted to say, and then it.
Speaker 3 (32:48):
Was, oh, he's on the phone.
Speaker 2 (32:50):
So it's a very jealous sort of reaction every time
it came to that sort of thing. So she is
like eventually she just got it. And I remember her
deleting her Facebook so many times and him going through
her phone or like all these claims. But yet we're
hearing all this stuff about him cheating. So it's a
(33:11):
bit like it was projecting. I feel like he definitely
projected onto Amy, and then Amy sort of suffered at it,
like she suffered for whatever he's thinking in his head.
She got the brunt of that, so she just sort
of tried to pacify it and rub it off, and she.
Speaker 3 (33:25):
Would get angry. Don't get me wrong, Amy had a
fight and I like.
Speaker 2 (33:29):
Oh, good girl, should I reckon and she did. She'd
give it back to him if he gave it to her.
But he was nasty. It was nasty. It was not
just the physical demeanor and the standing over and just
the physical difference of them, like Amy was so pteite
and so little and David standing so tall and so muscly,
(33:51):
like at the time he was quite muscly.
Speaker 1 (33:53):
There was a suggestion at one stage, I think during
the inquest as well, this was brought up that they
had an argument earlier before the gun went off and
Amy had somehow head butted David.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
Oh I honestly, if that was the case, I would
say it was going to be a very volatile argument,
and I think it would be coming from both directions.
I don't say that Amy wouldn't have sat there and
probably got frustrated and done something.
Speaker 3 (34:24):
I can't say she wouldn't have. I don't know. I
wasn't there, But I.
Speaker 2 (34:28):
Would imagine knowing Amy and knowing the history of the
going out and not coming home, or coming home on drugs,
or coming home drunk or all those sort of things,
all those factors, I can imagine how angry she would
have been that night, and I can imagine the fight
that would have ensued from that.
Speaker 1 (34:46):
But with their size difference and with their height difference,
was Amy capable of being more aggressive toward him than
he didn't?
Speaker 3 (34:54):
I don't think so.
Speaker 2 (34:56):
I think at the end of the day, Amy may
have smashed a tank because he says, that's not hurting you.
Speaker 3 (35:03):
Like she's so petteeue. I can't explain it.
Speaker 2 (35:05):
She's just such so much a small person that man
could easily just push her over.
Speaker 3 (35:12):
That's the difference.
Speaker 2 (35:14):
Like, I don't see how she could sit there and
like head butt him and do any type of damage
that would be of any significance. I think it would
more be a case of they're in each other's face
and maybe he's come down and hit her head.
Speaker 3 (35:29):
I don't feel like Amy is that type of my I.
Speaker 2 (35:31):
Don't see her getting all hung through and head batting someone.
I see her being angry. I see her being volatile
in that sense and maybe smashing a tank. Because I'm
not gonna lie.
Speaker 3 (35:39):
It's a pattern.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
It's a many year long pattern of him going out, drinking,
doing drugs, coming home and just having an attitude. And
this is where I feel like on that night, it
was pretty final.
Speaker 3 (35:56):
I think she was done. I think he knew she
was done.
Speaker 1 (36:07):
Did you ever have a conversation with her about leaving
because you've got a great relationship? I mean, did you
ever say to her, look, you know you can have
a relationship like mine, for example, you don't have to
put up with this.
Speaker 3 (36:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (36:20):
And did she agree or did you have arguments about that?
Speaker 2 (36:24):
No, no arguments. She agreed and she left him. She
left many times. She came to me and she came
to my house. I've got text where she sat there
saying to me, like, you know, I've gone home but
he's done nothing. All he's done is he's just pulled
me back home. He's not talking to me all this
type of stuff, Like he.
Speaker 3 (36:41):
Would sit there and bait her to come home, say
all the right things, and then just act the same
way it would be every time. So he just keeps
repeating the same behaviors. That's all he does.
Speaker 1 (36:51):
One of the girls is his own, wouldn't you think
that he would be proud?
Speaker 3 (36:56):
I always think about that, But then I always flashed
back to when Amy was pregnant. She was giving birth
that weekend and he had his hands around her throat.
So was he thinking about his daughter?
Speaker 6 (37:05):
Then?
Speaker 3 (37:07):
No, I don't know if he's ever thought about his daughter.
Speaker 1 (37:09):
So sorry, just take me there.
Speaker 3 (37:11):
So back when.
Speaker 2 (37:12):
Amy was nine months pregnant with Tay, I was staying
at her house because we were obviously a bit concerned
she was going to go into labor, and David had
opted to go out for the weekend, so he had
been out I think since the Thursday night. So me
and Amy and Naa we went and pulled the matress
out and had a summer party in the lounge room
and we stayed in there pretty much the whole weekend.
(37:34):
Didn't really see David much until I think it was
Saturday afternoon he came home.
Speaker 1 (37:41):
He stayed out for a lot three days.
Speaker 3 (37:43):
Yeah, so this would probably be on the twenty sixth
of June. He came home and he had been out drinking.
He was obviously on drugs.
Speaker 2 (37:53):
Amy was livid, as I'm not going to lie now,
mother myself, any mother nine months pregnant would be with you,
partner out like that when you're about.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
To give birth. Well, she was full term, she was
full term, she.
Speaker 3 (38:03):
Was due, she was overdue. I'm pretty sure I think, yeah,
she was overdue. So she was. We were waiting, We
were very very close. He came home, very volatile. So
it started. He was intoxicated then drinking, was on drugs.
Amy started saying to him, this is a not I'm pregnant,
Like how I'm going to get to the hospital now,
like all this sort of stuff. Yeah, all valid, yeah,
(38:24):
all valid points. And it ended up getting quite heated
and it just ramped up. So I was staying that
night too, just to make sure everything was okay, and
Amy was okay, and.
Speaker 2 (38:37):
I don't know what happened, but they were fighting in
the kitchen and I turned to walk out the loundry
and back through the kitchen, and all I saw was
David with his hands around Amy's neck, bent over like
her back pushed up against the table, with his hands
around her neck, pushing her back, and She's reached out
and just twisted his gold chain around his neck. And
I remember just having to separate them and to send
(39:00):
him out front and like deal with Amy and then
like talk to it. And I remember mediating it and
I remember saying him, that's not okay, Like you can't
do that, Like she's nine months what.
Speaker 3 (39:11):
Is wrong with you?
Speaker 1 (39:12):
He had both of his hands around her, his hands.
Speaker 2 (39:15):
Around her neck, and she was sitting there with his
like trying to grab something. So she's scorn and sort
of wraps like her hand around his chain like that, and.
Speaker 1 (39:22):
He's bending her over the table at the same time.
Speaker 2 (39:25):
Yeah, bending her so pushing her back over the table
as she's reaching out to.
Speaker 3 (39:28):
Grab that chain around.
Speaker 1 (39:30):
So this is a woman who's nine months pregnant about
to give birth. Anymi teet as well.
Speaker 3 (39:34):
You've got to remember Amy was like it was like
a basketball that baby.
Speaker 1 (39:38):
She's pregnant. I'm just struggling with this what sort of
mentality is this.
Speaker 3 (39:42):
He'd been on drugs, and it was very obvious he'd
been on drugs. He'd been out parting with the boys.
He actually wanted to go back out again.
Speaker 2 (39:48):
And I think that was when that fight happened later
in the night, because he was trying to go back
out again, and that's when Amy was saying, no, you're
not right.
Speaker 1 (39:56):
Or thank goodness you were there to mediate.
Speaker 3 (39:59):
I know, I think about that. And then literally the
next day. I think I left at five o'clock on
the Sunday because I had worked the next day, and
I said to Amy, call me, I'll tell you to
the hospital, WILL do whatever whenever you need to go.
I don't think I got half an hour down the road.
She sat down in the land room and her waters broke,
and we were in hospital and she gave birth the
next morning.
Speaker 1 (40:17):
So you took her, You went back and took her.
Speaker 3 (40:19):
I took her, and I stayed for the birth of
Tay and where was he? He was there?
Speaker 2 (40:23):
So I ended up picking both of them up and
I took him with us. He was not okay to drive,
So I have photos of the whole birth and just
looking at him in the photos makes me so disappointed
and disgusted.
Speaker 3 (40:35):
It's just to see and you can tell when you
see the photos, you can see that he's not all there.
It's sad.
Speaker 1 (40:42):
That says a lot. That's not about the nature of
that relationship, as you say, Like I said.
Speaker 3 (40:47):
It changed when she got pregnant. This is within a
nine month period he had his hands around in it.
So if that's the start of their.
Speaker 1 (40:55):
Relationship, how long were your friends?
Speaker 2 (40:58):
I met Amy when she was about sixteen through one
of my other friends, and I.
Speaker 3 (41:03):
Didn't really talk to her much, like we said hello
and night. She I remember she had a kangaroo.
Speaker 2 (41:07):
She fostered a little Joey that the mum had died,
so she was fostering a baby Joey and she's walking
around at sixteen with a little Joey.
Speaker 3 (41:14):
And I remember meeting her and I was like, oh, yeah,
she's nice and that.
Speaker 2 (41:17):
And then on my eighteenth we sort of started talking
more and I invited her to my party and then yeah,
from there.
Speaker 3 (41:23):
Pretty much it was thick and faster and more friends
and that sort of that friend you see every day,
like you know, you're always hanging out, like she'd be
working at the pub at night, and I would go
down and sit at the pub and keeper company, like
you know. It was, Yeah it was.
Speaker 2 (41:38):
I was always at a house wearing sleepovers, it was
going out, would go camping or whatever it would be.
Speaker 3 (41:43):
Yeah it was.
Speaker 5 (41:44):
It was good friendship, good buddies.
Speaker 3 (41:46):
Yeah, and yeah I missing.
Speaker 1 (41:51):
Did you have a falling out with her?
Speaker 3 (41:53):
I had a little falling out.
Speaker 2 (41:54):
So just after bye, I just heard some stupid stuff,
and I think, being young and dumb, I regret it.
I can't tell you how much I can tell you
to love and forgive because I never get to say
what I really wanted to say to Amy now.
Speaker 1 (42:12):
So yeah, how long ago was that before?
Speaker 2 (42:14):
So we fell out for about start twenty twelve, and
then I started talking to her again.
Speaker 3 (42:19):
Was when the car accident happened.
Speaker 2 (42:22):
So I got word from Amy's sister that Amy was
in hospital and that she'd being involved in a car
accident with David and the girls.
Speaker 1 (42:31):
It was a bad accident for her, wasn't it.
Speaker 3 (42:33):
It was bad for Amy.
Speaker 2 (42:35):
Surprisingly for Amy, So that side of the cart somehow
got more damaged than anywhere else. So Amy ended up
in a halo. So I reached out to her then,
because as soon as I heard that, I it.
Speaker 3 (42:48):
Didn't feel right.
Speaker 2 (42:49):
I just felt really sick to my stomach, and just
knowing David, I wasn't comfortable. So I thought I'd reach
out to her, and that's when, thankfully we did start
to talk and men do.
Speaker 3 (43:05):
And all that sort of stuff. But she was very
hesitant for me to see her.
Speaker 2 (43:08):
I think that goes in part and parcel with I
wouldn't take a lot of David's crap if I saw it.
Speaker 3 (43:14):
I was very vocal.
Speaker 2 (43:15):
If I saw anything, I would intervene, I would say something.
I wouldn't allow her to be treated in any way
in front of me.
Speaker 3 (43:21):
So I feel like, yeah, it was good that we
sort of started to get back on track and we
were starting to talk, but she was a bit hesitant
to see me, and I have a feeling it's because
of the whole halo situation. I know she said to
me she didn't want me to see her in a halo.
Speaker 6 (43:35):
The car crash happened at about six pm on the
twentieth of January twenty thirteen. The girls were in the
back seat of a white nineteen ninety seven Toyota land
Cruiser along with Amy's younger step brother, Deacon, who was
twelve at the time. Amy was in the front passenger
seat and David Simmons was driving down Shrevena Road in Serpentine,
(44:00):
an unsealed grubble road. They were all wearing seat belts.
Simmons made a statement to the Insurance Commission of Western
Australia about six months later, where he said he was
only doing about sixty kilometers per hour at the time,
although claimed Shreidner Road didn't actually have a speed limit.
(44:20):
He said he was driving up a slight incline coming
out of a left hand bend when.
Speaker 8 (44:26):
The car started to slide and the rear canopy of
the car struck a burl of a tree which hangs
out over the road. As a result, this caused the
car to slide sideways and come off the road to
the right hand side in impact with a tree in
the dead center of the front of the car's bonnet.
(44:48):
I am unable to recall whether I had applied the
brakes or not, and really didn't have the time to
do anything. The impact caused me to smack my head
on the right hand side of the car. I was
a bit dazed and the kids were crying. I got
out and ran around to the passenger side and helped
the kids out, and Amy had already alighted from the vehicle.
(45:13):
Amy didn't say she was injured or in pain. A
short period of time later, a car drove past and
the occupants called an ambulance.
Speaker 6 (45:25):
The ambulance was taking a while to arrive, so Simmons
called a mate who came and picked them up. He
drove Amy and the kids to Armadale Hospital.
Speaker 8 (45:34):
We took Amy to the emergency department and she was
seen by doctors. They advised us Amy had to go
to Royal Perth Hospital and she was transferred by an ambulance.
Amy had scans on her neck, but I was also
on the bed getting checked over and had a few
stitches for a laceration above my right eye. Amy was
(45:58):
in hospital at least a week. She had a halo
placed around her head as she suffered a fractured vertebrae.
She had the halo removed about a month or so ago.
She is still suffering from pain as a result of
her injuries.
Speaker 1 (46:15):
It was pretty confronting and in fact, very lucky for
her it wasn't more serious.
Speaker 2 (46:20):
Per it could have been a lot more serious, like
they're off road, it's what would happen. I've seen it before.
You know, you go a throne and no rules apply.
But yeah, so that's when we sort of started reaching out.
Speaker 3 (46:33):
I'd be texting her in that and having a chat
and I would be asking her how are you going,
and that she's just the same old So to me,
it's the same old, same old stuff, David, same old drinking,
same old going out, not coming home.
Speaker 1 (46:49):
Nothing changed in that controlling sort of atmosphere. Though. She
probably didn't want you hanging around too much because it
would have made it tougher for her, wouldn't it.
Speaker 2 (46:57):
It would have, and I think I would. I'm not
type of person to ten a blind eye if I
saw something.
Speaker 5 (47:02):
I wouldn't be able to.
Speaker 3 (47:04):
Not do anything. I couldn't. I love her and I'll
do anything for her.
Speaker 8 (47:10):
At the time of the crash, I was not under
the influence of alcohol, prohibited drugs, or any other mind
altering substances. At the time, I was not taking any
prescribed medication. There is no medical reason which may have
affected my ability to operate a motor vehicle in a
safe manner. At the time of the road crash. There
(47:31):
were no witnesses to the crash. Police did not attend
the crash. I have no ongoing injuries of this crash.
As a result of this crash, my personal life has
not changed.
Speaker 6 (47:48):
However, less than a year later, his personal life would change.
On the twenty ninth of July twenty thirteen, the Insurance
Commission of Western Australia asked Simmons to admit full liability
for the claim made by Amy Wensley. Documents state that
until just a couple of days before her death, Amy
(48:09):
was not going to proceed with the claim, but she
changed her mind and told the Commission she would go
ahead after all. Two days later, Amy was dead.
Speaker 3 (48:29):
I never thought it would get to this point.
Speaker 2 (48:32):
I really thought that the day that Nancy was calling me,
I was getting a phone call to say Amy was
in hospital.
Speaker 1 (48:35):
More than anything, that's what immediately came to your mind.
Speaker 2 (48:38):
That's immediately because I hadn't really spoken with Amy. Go
to remember, I hadn't spoken with Amy for a while.
We've been texting. For me to get a phone call,
and I'm very close with Nancy, but for me to
get a phone call at.
Speaker 3 (48:48):
Work at like nine am. I was just a bit
what's going on?
Speaker 2 (48:53):
And as soon as I saw it, she wouldn't call
me during work hours, so I knew it was Amy.
Speaker 3 (48:57):
I knew, I knew him. My heart was Amy. And
then when she said, I don't know, when she says
you're shot, you just didn't feel real. It just didn't
sound right. It wasn't Amy.
Speaker 5 (49:09):
She would never do that.
Speaker 3 (49:10):
I know.
Speaker 1 (49:11):
She wouldn't let me play devil's advocate for a moment though, Natasha,
she was on antidepressant medication, and we know from the
toxicology reports from the coroner's court that the level of
the antidepressant in her system was totally normal. You know,
totally fine. But people who are depressed sometimes to varying degrees,
(49:37):
do silly things. And I'm sure this has gone through
your mind too, But knowing her as you did, is
there any degree of possibility, any chance in your mind
that it was her, that she did do it by
her own hand.
Speaker 3 (49:55):
I wouldn't be lying if I said I haven't thought
about it.
Speaker 2 (49:57):
I can only sit here and say that in my heart,
I one hundred percent believe that Amy would not have
done this, And every time I keep thinking about it,
and I think of all the possibilities, I just keep
coming back to she would not have done this. She
had her two daughters in the car.
Speaker 3 (50:12):
And to know Amy, to.
Speaker 2 (50:13):
Know that her daughters were her life, he would know
that she would never do that. In the vicinity of
her children. She wouldn't have done that.
Speaker 1 (50:21):
She just wouldn't have That's the deal breaker. That's the deal.
Speaker 3 (50:24):
Breaker for me. If he's had have been she was
at home on her own, or like the kids weren't around,
other circumstances, we could discuss this.
Speaker 2 (50:36):
No, her children were there, I don't care about the
frame of mind. I have seen Amy in hysterics before.
She will always put those children above herself, no matter
what the situation is, no matter what's going on, it
is those kids.
Speaker 3 (50:49):
So that for me to hear that they were sitting
in a car less than fifty meters away, No, there
is no way in hell that that happened.
Speaker 1 (51:01):
I'm just trying to be fair, and I'm trying to
look at every single possibility in this in looking at
that scenario. And you know, tragically, a lot of people
who commit suicide their relations and their loved ones. A
lot of them say later, you know, I never would
have thought XXX would have done this, so it's a
(51:25):
natural reaction. Also to those close by.
Speaker 3 (51:29):
It does play a big part.
Speaker 2 (51:30):
I do believe in my heart, with those girls there,
that was what it was. But then we start going
into the detail, what we found out after the fact,
what we found about the position of their body, what
we found out about how she was shot, all that
all plays into it too, And from that it.
Speaker 3 (51:47):
Just cements that for me, that would not have been
the case.
Speaker 2 (51:51):
And I'm sorry, I just there is nothing anyone could
say to me that would make me feel any other way.
Speaker 3 (51:56):
And now she's not here.
Speaker 1 (52:08):
Okay. The whole thing is incredibly sad, isn't It's just
because it's just seems so unnecessary.
Speaker 5 (52:18):
It so just feels surreal, just absolutely surreal. So much
could go wrong.
Speaker 1 (52:27):
The police have to a certain extent, admitted their mistakes
on the night, But do you think they're trying hard enough? Now?
Speaker 3 (52:34):
No?
Speaker 2 (52:35):
Have you seen the news every second day there's a
woman pretty much being murdered.
Speaker 3 (52:40):
What change have they made? What change? If there's change,
how is it not forefront in our minds.
Speaker 2 (52:47):
I can't even sit here and rattle off to you
anything that I've seen visually to promote or to help
with domestic violence, to help with the femicide that's going
on in Australia at the moment, no one is doing
much like more needs to be done. Where is the change?
Show me the change, because right now I just see
figures increasing year by year by year.
Speaker 3 (53:10):
It's horrible.
Speaker 1 (53:13):
Yes, there's a lot, doesn't it.
Speaker 3 (53:15):
Oh, there's a lot, a lot of women. But where's
their justice? There's no justice for them.
Speaker 6 (53:25):
Natasha is right. In twenty twenty four, a woman is
killed every four days, according to the Australian Femicide Watch.
The United Nations defines femicide as the most brutal and
extreme manifestation of violence against women and girls and intentional
(53:46):
killing with gender related motivation, mostly by intimate partners or
members of their own family, and National homicide statistics revealed
that last year, the rate of Australian women killed by
their partners increased by twenty eight percent. However, the rate
(54:09):
of domestic violence deaths remains underreported as many aren't captured
as such. Including this one.
Speaker 1 (54:17):
Good evening. We begin tonight with breaking news. There have
been shots fired and florious these pictures just coming into
the newsroom.
Speaker 6 (54:23):
Mark Bombara was on the hunt for his wife and daughter,
who had sought a restraining order against him from Wa
police after they noticed his handgun was missing. WA police
refused and they were forced into hiding.
Speaker 3 (54:38):
My mother and I made it clear that lives were
at risk, and we were repeatedly ignored.
Speaker 6 (54:43):
When Bombara couldn't find his intended victims, he sought out
his wife's best friend, and when she wouldn't tell him
where they were, he shot her and her daughter, Gretel,
before turning the gun on himself.
Speaker 7 (54:56):
We're being told three people have been shot.
Speaker 6 (54:59):
Seven news On understands those people have been killed because
neither were intimately connected or related to him. Their deaths
are not considered domestic violence related.
Speaker 7 (55:09):
What my father did was an act of domestic violence.
Speaker 1 (55:24):
It was it was it was so much. She shot herself.
That's what happened there.
Speaker 6 (55:28):
Next week, Gareth Price, No, he.
Speaker 7 (55:31):
Didn't do it.
Speaker 1 (55:32):
He didn't do it.
Speaker 3 (55:33):
Sorry. Simo is a good buddy, man.
Speaker 1 (55:35):
I you were done, You're not done.
Speaker 4 (55:37):
It so we was no.
Speaker 1 (55:58):
Jim say, if you knew Amy and have information, any
information about her death, we'd love to hear from you.
(56:19):
Just email us at the Truth about Amy at seven
dot com dot Au. That's s E v E N
The Truth about Amy at seven dot com dot Au,
or visit our website sevenews dot com dot Au forward
(56:40):
slash the Truth about Amy. You can also send us
an anonymous tip at www dot the Truth about Amy
dot com. If you're on Facebook or Instagram, you can
follow us to see photos and updates relevant to the case,
but for legal reasons, unfortunately, you won't be able to
(57:02):
make any comments. And remember, if you like what you're hearing,
don't forget to subscribe. Please rate and review our series
because it really helps new listeners to find us. Presenter
and executive producer Alison Sandy, Presenter and investigative journalist Liam Bartlett,
(57:31):
Sound design Mark Wright, Assistant producer Cassie Woodward, Graphics Jason Blandford,
and special thanks to Tim Clark and Brian Seymour. This
(57:56):
is a seven News production.
This podcast contains information and details relating to suicide. We
urge anyone struggling with their emotions to contact Lifeline on
thirteen eleven fourteen thirteen eleven fourteen or visit them at
lifeline dot org dot AU. A twenty four year old
(00:29):
devoted mother of two fleeing a violent relationship. As bags
pack car running, her daughters strapped into the backseat.
Speaker 2 (00:45):
Mom told me that she needed to go back inside
to grab something.
Speaker 1 (00:50):
Panic.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
I Amy is dead, Sir aim his dead?
Speaker 1 (00:53):
Eight confusion about five minutes, say sit not to suicide.
Speaker 4 (00:56):
One hundred percent.
Speaker 1 (00:58):
This is emersing. What do you think is really the
honest truth about Amy?
Speaker 5 (01:06):
The Truth About Amy?
Speaker 1 (01:15):
Episode four, I'm Liam Bartlett.
Speaker 6 (01:24):
And I'm Alison's Andy.
Speaker 1 (01:29):
Amy sits on the end of her bed, brushing her
daughter's hair as they sing along to Taylor Swift Go Sing.
Amy knows her partner, David Simmons will be home any
(01:50):
minute now. Amy's smile fails. There are a lot of
home movies with Amy and her daughter's good job, including
(02:17):
Naya's second birthday party, excursions and activities explorer like painting
with watercolors in the park.
Speaker 4 (02:28):
Hey Hi.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
And family get togethers now.
Speaker 4 (02:34):
I am.
Speaker 1 (02:36):
Most of these don't include David, but when he is
in the frame, Amy certainly appears less comfortable. Fair to say,
her closest friends were completely aware of her problems with David.
Speaker 5 (02:55):
It was a rollercoaster on and off, up and down.
I think every relationship has their troubles, but theirs was
more bad than good.
Speaker 1 (03:05):
Eron Gower met Amy in high school. The pair had
children around the same age and trusted each other implicitly.
Speaker 5 (03:13):
Our long phone calls or just a quick text or.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Aaron says, while they could tell each other anything. She
regrets not being more critical of Amy's relationship with Simmons.
Speaker 5 (03:26):
I just wanted to be more of someone that she
could open up to if she had you know, everyone
wants someone to vent to about their relationship without any judgment.
If she was to complain to her mom or you know,
one of his family members, they might have tried to
steer away or make her feel bad for staying or so.
(03:46):
I always just wanted to be that person that she
could openly speak to.
Speaker 1 (03:50):
You tried very hard just to be non judgmental.
Speaker 3 (03:52):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (03:53):
Yeah, I didn't want her to feel, you know, like
I was pushing her to leave or anything. But when
the times did come that they were in a down
place in their relationship, I always offered come and stay
with me, Like I just always tried to open my
door so that she knew that she had somewhere to
come and feel comfortable.
Speaker 1 (04:15):
And during those times, were you secretly hoping that she
would stay away? Oh?
Speaker 5 (04:19):
Yeah, yeah she. I think one time that they were
sort of apart, she started to talk to someone new
and that was exciting, and you know, sort of tried
to coach her and oh, this is fun, and you
know it's so good, and you probably feel regreat and
all that sort of thing. But then you know, David
had this way about him and he would sort of
(04:40):
lure her back in and then they were back on
the roller coaster again.
Speaker 1 (04:45):
What was it about their relationship that was that was
bad to you as an observer?
Speaker 5 (04:51):
I think Amy was She's a really nice person, a
people pleaser, and I think David was very demanding or controlling.
You know, he had to sort of have his say
in everything, and Amy wasn't really allowed to work, but
prior to him, she had multiple jobs. You know, she
was sort of really independent and a social butterfly, But yeah,
(05:14):
he sort of made sure that what he wanted was
sort of the path that they led. It was his
choice or you know, they had a nice house in Pinjarra,
but he didn't really want to work any steady jobs
or anything, so they went and moved in with his dad.
So it was sort of she didn't really have much
say in anything. He was the dominant in the relationship.
Speaker 1 (05:38):
Did you directly witness any of that controlling behavior.
Speaker 5 (05:42):
I saw him overpower her before physically, Yeah, physically in
what way. I've always went to her house for playdates.
You know, our kids were the same age. So one
time when I was at her house, he should have
been at work, but he came home really early. It
was before lunchtime. We were just in the lound room
and he sat on the couch next to her, and
(06:03):
I can't remember what the conversation was or anything, but
Amy was a really small, really little frame. Pretty petite, yeah,
very petite. He grabbed the back of her neck and
Amy was laughing, like joke, joking around and you know,
trying to play it off as it was okay, but
you could see in her face that she was uncomfortable.
(06:23):
Grabbed the back of her neck and like pushed her
head down, so like her head was sort of down
between her knees, and he was like, she laughed it
off like it was nothing, but you could see that
she was uncomfortable, and she's like, oh, leave us alone now,
And you know he went out and did whatever he
was doing, So there was that, and you know, he
(06:44):
was a big guy and wouldn't have taken much to
make her get in an uncomfortable posision.
Speaker 1 (06:50):
She would have been embarrassed.
Speaker 5 (06:52):
Also, Yeah, yeah, that's why she sort of laughed it
off as a you know, he's playing around or it's okay,
but you could see that it wasn't.
Speaker 1 (07:00):
And you could tell that it was obviously a forceful
grab around the neck.
Speaker 5 (07:06):
Yeah, yeah, yeah, No one really wants to be put
into that position of being folded in half.
Speaker 6 (07:17):
Liam pulls out a photograph of a woman's neck turned
to the side. Erin had told police about it when
she was finally able to speak to someone, and when
she followed it up, they said they couldn't find it.
I found it within twenty minutes of getting access to
Amy's iPhone data. There are visible red marks across the neck,
(07:41):
indicating a recent trauma. The image property shows the date
as Tuesday, the tenth of July twenty twelve, at about
six thirty pm.
Speaker 1 (07:52):
Erin, I've got a photograph that I believe Amy said
this to you on via tech? Is that right?
Speaker 5 (08:02):
She did send me a photo.
Speaker 1 (08:03):
We've got a photograph here that's blown up of a
rather large bruise on Amy's neck.
Speaker 5 (08:10):
That is it?
Speaker 3 (08:12):
See?
Speaker 5 (08:13):
I got told that they didn't find.
Speaker 1 (08:14):
This, The police didn't find it. Yeah, well we did,
and it's on her neck. I mean those sort of
bruises don't get there just by chance, do they.
Speaker 5 (08:28):
This is the first time I've seen it since it happened.
Speaker 1 (08:31):
I'm sorry, I didn't mean.
Speaker 5 (08:32):
To that's gay.
Speaker 3 (08:34):
See.
Speaker 5 (08:35):
I tried so hard to make sure that I could
get this available to Anna to back you know, the
stories of how he treated her.
Speaker 1 (08:44):
Well, I would have thought this is clear evidence of
the domestic violence that was going on, And for her
to take that photograph and text it on the phone
means that she was also very worried. Yeah, ye, why
did she send you that?
Speaker 5 (09:00):
She always told me all the bad things that had happened,
you know, when they fought and that sort of stuff.
Speaker 1 (09:07):
I mean, was that a cry for help or is
she just saying, look, this should be sort of on
the record.
Speaker 5 (09:12):
Maybe both. Maybe I just didn't take it as her
cry for help could have been. But yeah I didn't.
I don't know. I was the same age. I was
young as well, and you know, if I could go
back in time, definitely I would try and help her
get out quicker, knowing you know what was happening.
Speaker 1 (09:36):
It's hard, though, it was not when you get between
people in a relationship. Yeah, as you say, I mean,
it's a difficult thing to do anyway, full stop.
Speaker 5 (09:44):
Yeah, Like Amy didn't want to. She already had one
father to a child, and now she's got a second
child's dad in the picture, and so she.
Speaker 1 (09:56):
Was desperate to make this work.
Speaker 5 (09:57):
She wanted to make her family work. Was always on
and off. And you know, she gave him all these chances,
but he just never grew up.
Speaker 1 (10:05):
What sort of man does that?
Speaker 3 (10:06):
Though?
Speaker 1 (10:06):
It too? Yeah, a woman's.
Speaker 5 (10:08):
Name, yep, And like I said, she was tiny.
Speaker 1 (10:12):
One day, Amy sent erin a text about how she
hoped to escape her Bush prison.
Speaker 5 (10:21):
Back on Facebook.
Speaker 7 (10:22):
Loll erin, I'm so annoyed right now, David rocks up
at four point thirty am, jumps in bed. I ask
what's wrong. He said he's pissed off because he lost
his phone, Samsung Galaxy S two in Bush, no insurance.
I say, you're pissed off because you're on drugs. He
laid there quiet, so I asked him again. He replies, yeah,
(10:43):
I had a few tokes of crack. By this time,
my heart is pounding so hard. I see red and
start punching into him. He then man handles me, choking
me and chucking me around the room. My adrenaline is pumping,
so I didn't feel a thing. I calmed down on
because Tay is now awake. I'm so hurt that he
did drugs after I begged him not to take DEXI.
(11:05):
It fucks me right off. He gives in all the time.
I'll ring you later and fill you in. He has
to start work at seven am with his dad, and
he's not dumb. He will know David has been on drugs.
Useless piece of dirt. He is bloody disgusted in him.
Speaker 5 (11:20):
The first time that I got really worried was he
made jokes about if he was ever to do anything
to her, he was ever to kill Amy, He had
options of what he could do with her body.
Speaker 1 (11:36):
What possible context couldn't that have been.
Speaker 5 (11:38):
It was the end of one of their kid's birthday party,
so it was just us three sitting out the front
of the house in Pinjarra. Everyone had left and we're
just hanging out.
Speaker 1 (11:50):
Was he drunk, Yeah, he'd been drinking.
Speaker 5 (11:51):
Your day, Amy was sort of you know, dealing with
all the party or the guests and the kids and
all that sort of stuff. And this was the time
that I ever was like, this person's a little bit unhinged.
You don't really joke about what you've thought to do
about your partner's body if you ever killed them. His
two options were he could take her out bush, leave
(12:14):
her for the pigs to clean up. Or there was
a quarry that they'd broken into overnight or something in
the past, and he said he could take her up
the bext no one would find her there.
Speaker 1 (12:25):
So he was putting forward suggestions of what he would
do with her body yep, if he killed her yep.
Or was it a joke?
Speaker 5 (12:33):
Well, coming from him, he made it seem like he
was joking. But I certainly don't think that that's something
you joke about, especially if it sounds like you've thought.
Speaker 3 (12:43):
About it before.
Speaker 1 (12:45):
Clearly it stayed in your mind. Oh yeah, yep, so
you must have thought at the time it was it
was most unusual. Yeah, when you first heard how did
you hear about Amy being shot?
Speaker 5 (13:00):
This also has stuck with me. I woke up to
a text from Nancy that morning and it was something
really simple. Two lines said Aaron Amy's dead. She shot herself.
And I was like, what, like that doesn't this isn't
a funny joke. Oh, so I instantly rang Amy just
(13:27):
to you know, like your mums sent me this stupid
message like wrong, Yeah, and I went I went to voicemails.
I was like, Okay, that's weird. Try again, voicemail again.
And then my next feeling was she didn't do it.
(13:53):
I knew you had to vote to Amy boys to
her girls. Oh yeah, instantly, like from the beginning, I've
known in my heart that it wasn't suicide.
Speaker 1 (14:07):
So did you ring Nancy then?
Speaker 5 (14:09):
Or I sent her a message and I said I
took some time to you know, like got hit around it,
and then I sent her a message and got her
to call me. She sort of told me what happened
or what they say has happened.
Speaker 1 (14:23):
Did you express your doubt to her then?
Speaker 3 (14:25):
Ye?
Speaker 5 (14:26):
Yeah, I've always said to anyone that I've spoke to
about it that I don't think that she committed suicide.
She wasn't that sort of person. She didn't speak about suicide.
She loved her girls, and she was just such a
happy person. Like every time we were together it was
just laughter and like joking and fun and it just
(14:47):
wasn't It wasn't her.
Speaker 1 (14:50):
When was the last time you talked to Amy had
any sort of communication?
Speaker 5 (14:56):
Well, like I said, we were always just like you know,
little texts and stuff here and there. But our last
long conversation was I think the week.
Speaker 1 (15:03):
Before, only a week before. Yeah, And was there anything
in that that anything in her voice that you would
have thought was unusual.
Speaker 5 (15:12):
Or not well, unusual for the good I guess Amy
had a plan. She was so excited so because of
the car accident when she fructured her neck and stuff,
she was seeking compensation for that. She was excited. She
thought that it was almost finalized, so she was ready
(15:32):
to get her pay out for that, much to David's disappointment,
because he was upset that he would be the one
that had to pay for I don't know how those things.
Speaker 1 (15:41):
Work, but well, effectively that was a claim against David,
wasn't it. Yeah, because he was driving. Yeah.
Speaker 2 (15:46):
Yeah.
Speaker 5 (15:47):
So he didn't want her to do it, obviously, because
then he would have had to pay this debt. But
she stuck to her guns with this, and she was
excited because it was almost done and she was ready
to get the girls out. She'd started looking for rentals,
you know. She wanted to get a little place for
her and the girls. And another thing she was really
(16:07):
excited for was to work. I think she knew someone
that had a cafe or something starting up, and she
wanted to go and work part time.
Speaker 1 (16:14):
So she knew there was money on the way, yep,
and she was making a plan to use that to
improve herself.
Speaker 4 (16:20):
Yep.
Speaker 5 (16:21):
Yep. She was going to pay a car off, get
a place, and then set herself up for her and
her girls to go and live by themselves.
Speaker 1 (16:28):
But in none of these plans that you've just mentioned
is the notion of David being with her.
Speaker 5 (16:34):
She'd had enough.
Speaker 1 (16:36):
She'd had enough, yep. And she told you that in
very yep certain terms.
Speaker 5 (16:41):
Yep. She was ready to go, and that was.
Speaker 1 (16:43):
A week before this happened.
Speaker 6 (16:44):
Yeah, Amy had formulated a plan, a plan she was
confident enough in to communicate to erin just one week
before she died. Everything was in motion, and she was
excited about the prospect of a new life with her
two young daughters and without David.
Speaker 3 (17:08):
Amy.
Speaker 5 (17:08):
It also not long before it had happened, she found
out that she was pregnant, so she did not want
any more kids, especially in her state. You know, she's
very fragile. How is she going to be able to
carry a baby nine months and be as fragile as
(17:29):
she was. David wanted a son, so he was sort
of pushing her, but it didn't take into consideration how she felt,
you know, how she going to physically do this. He
didn't care. But that was another thing that she sort
of stuck to her guns.
Speaker 6 (17:45):
This was after the car accident where Simmons insisted on driving,
causing Amy serious injury, which resulted in her having a
permanent neck disability. Amy knew having another baby could exacerbate
her always delicate condition, and as it was very early days,
she was able to terminate the pregnancy safely. Amy was
(18:09):
taking back control of her life, looking at rental accommodation,
applying for jobs, and planning a way forward where she
could raise her daughters independently of him.
Speaker 1 (18:21):
Did he know about the termination?
Speaker 5 (18:23):
Ah, I don't actually remember. I'm not sure if she
had just gone to the doctor. I do know that
she she just got the you know, sometimes you've got
to go into a clinic or you just can take
the medication. She went the medication route, So I'm not
one hundred percent sure if she told him or not.
Speaker 1 (18:43):
Do you think David knew about her plans?
Speaker 5 (18:48):
I'm not sure. I have no idea.
Speaker 1 (18:51):
I wonder if he either had a feeling or was
across what she intended to do.
Speaker 5 (18:57):
Yeah, look, it's so long ago now, I don't remember
if she had told me that she did tell him
or not. But and that's always stuck with me, that
she was ready to get out and it was the
most exciting time, but it just never came.
Speaker 1 (19:20):
I'm sure you've gone over this a million times in
your mind, because there's been so many sort of false
starts in this story, hasn't there in trying to find
out the truth about Amy? How do you see what
happened in the ensuing hours and days and weeks with
the police action.
Speaker 5 (19:40):
Well, I never got contacted by police until Anna started
pushing for something to be done. That's one of the
things that has frustrated me this whole time is if
they actually looked into it properly at the beginning, they
would have seen what sort of a person Amy was
like compared to what David was like, how bad of
(20:03):
a temper he had, his drug use, his alcohol abuse,
all these sorts of things that I don't think that
they really took into consideration at the time. They just
labeled Amy suicide. And you know, that's stuck and that's
a hard thing for people to read about someone. She
committed suicide, that's a big deal. What are her girls
(20:23):
going to think when they grow up, Mum left us.
That's that's not a good thing for them to think
growing up.
Speaker 1 (20:30):
That's interesting you point that out. So it wasn't until
Anna started digging yep, and making noise and really creating
a problem for authorities, that there was any sort of action,
and that you were contacted her best friend to then
inquire about the background.
Speaker 3 (20:50):
Yep.
Speaker 5 (20:51):
Yeah, I think someone called me and it was just
sort of a quick phone call. Someone's going to be
in touch, you know, to get some more information from you.
And I ended up having to contact them a couple
of times. The left messages, you know, someone said that
they're going to be calling me for information, and no
one has. And I think by the end of it,
I did get a call, and it was just a
(21:13):
very quick phone call just to oh, yeah, what sort
of a person was she like? And you know, what
was a relationship like. It was nothing in detail, So
and I got me to do just do a statement.
We'll get in writing. So that's that's where sort of
we started.
Speaker 1 (21:30):
If it wasn't for her auntie, Yeah, some of this
would never have got to where we are today.
Speaker 5 (21:35):
No, not at all. I would have just gone through
as a suicide. And that's what everyone would have thought.
Speaker 1 (21:41):
So you get the distinct impression that really nobody in
a position of power really has ever wanted to genuinely
get to the bottom of it.
Speaker 3 (21:50):
Not at all.
Speaker 5 (21:51):
No, No, I think that there's they should have done
the right thing from the start. It's very frustrating. I
think I'm fueled by frustration now.
Speaker 1 (22:00):
One thing I still get stuck on with this is
the notion that you can have two little girls in
a car with a car running and their bags packed,
and the police get to know this information and still
decide that their mum has gone inside and committed suicide.
(22:20):
It just doesn't make a lot of sense to me.
Speaker 5 (22:24):
Just if anyone's got common sense, they would know that
that doesn't make sense. Two days later was her daughter's birthday.
She had the presence in the car like it just
and they don't know Amy's personality. They didn't know what
sort of a person she was. She would not have
done that. She didn't speak of suicide. She loved her daughters.
(22:46):
It just it doesn't make sense.
Speaker 1 (22:50):
And the toxicology reports show that she didn't have any
alcohol or drugs in her sister apart from very normal
levels of hand He depressed medication.
Speaker 5 (23:01):
That was one thing that also frustrated me. During the inquest,
they kept saying referring to Amy's mental health, and you
know she's depressed and all these things. So I sort
of piped up. David admitted that he had used drugs,
he'd been drinking all day, he had anger issues. Why
did no one think to take in all his sort
(23:24):
of mental health and where his mindset was at that day,
everyone just kept sort of pushing everything on Amy. Amy.
Amy her fault. You know, she had antidepressants in a system.
Consider what sort of a person he was, Like.
Speaker 1 (23:40):
Well, that supported the suicide theory, didn't it. Yeah, yep,
So it was able to be pushed. Yeah, there's hundreds
of thousands, if not millions, of Australians who were on
exactly the same antidepressant medication that Amy was on and
in the same dosages. Yeah, and they're not committing suicide.
Speaker 5 (24:00):
And she had many reasons to live. She was happy,
she had a goal and she was excited for that
to come through.
Speaker 1 (24:07):
So she had a longer term plan and she had
a very short term plan as well, So she was
planning all round.
Speaker 5 (24:15):
Yep.
Speaker 1 (24:15):
Does someone like that then go back inside and commit suicide?
Speaker 5 (24:19):
Definitely not.
Speaker 1 (24:21):
Doesn't make a lot of sense, does it.
Speaker 5 (24:24):
Anyone with common sense that looks at the mountain of
stuff that's happened in this In Amy's case, you can
definitely see that there's something not right.
Speaker 1 (24:36):
Do you want somebody somewhere in a position of authority
to chase this all the way down the rabbit hole?
Speaker 5 (24:42):
Yep? I think with enough pressure, the truth will come
out and with some actual real police work to happen.
You know, they can't hold it in forever.
Speaker 1 (24:57):
Do you think there are people involved in this who
know a lot more than what they've ever said.
Speaker 5 (25:02):
Andre said, I think that that's something that you can't
hold into yourself. So someone's spoken to someone about what
happened to get it off their chest, and there's definitely
people that should come forward and think of the girls.
Someone needs to be held accountable for what happened.
Speaker 1 (25:20):
Does it strike he was a little bit strange that
those three guys who were there on the day, David Simmons,
Gareth Price and Joshua Brydon are still all very close.
Speaker 6 (25:34):
It's worth mentioning here that while Joshua Bridon was there
on the day, he apparently left before Amy was shot.
We'll be doing a deep dive on Bridon later in
the series and discuss whether the evidence actually supports this claim.
Speaker 5 (25:49):
Oh yeah, yep, I saw that Gareth on social media.
You know, he sort of said something along the lines
of oh, I can't take this anymore, and David was
straight in there with the comment and I'll be home,
I'll be home tomorrow or something. You know. It just
seemed very weird the way that he commented and reacted
to his posts.
Speaker 1 (26:08):
I just wanted to check with you something else. When
we had a chat, Gareth Price. He said a couple
of things about Amy. Yeah, and I want to check
them with you because you knew her a lot better
than he did. Did she like shooting?
Speaker 5 (26:21):
Amy loved animals. This was one of the things that
David had been doing, hunting and stuff for way before Amy,
so she needed to find a common ground, common interest.
She wasn't really a big drinker, she wasn't a camper,
She didn't go out camping prior to meeting David. So
(26:43):
it was sort of one of those things where this
is a really big coby of his. Maybe I can
take it up. We've got that common interest.
Speaker 1 (26:51):
She was trying to please him.
Speaker 5 (26:52):
Yeah, yeah, So it was definitely something that she just
wanted to do so that they had something that they
could do together.
Speaker 1 (27:02):
Gareth was insistent. He said she loved shooting. Amy loved shooting.
Speaker 5 (27:07):
Well, she got a pink gun. But you know, if
you can make anything girly, because she was a girly girl.
But yeah, she didn't. I don't think that she loved
it at all.
Speaker 1 (27:18):
He also said she loved skinning things.
Speaker 5 (27:21):
Nope, like I said, Amy loved animals.
Speaker 3 (27:25):
She had a little.
Speaker 5 (27:26):
Piglet at one stage, they had dogs and chickens and
all that sort of stuff. It was again, just something
that she could do to be on the same level
as him, something to try and make things work and
make the relationship easier for them to get along.
Speaker 1 (27:40):
So she certainly didn't love it.
Speaker 5 (27:42):
I did not love it.
Speaker 1 (27:43):
Why would Gareth say those things?
Speaker 5 (27:46):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
He also said that that four ten that shotgun was hers,
that was her gun.
Speaker 5 (27:51):
I'm not sure that. I only know that she had
the pink gun. That's totally Amy style, just to have
something girly. But I don't know. I didn't really. I'm
not a gun person. Again, we had the same sort
of personality, and I don't like guns or hunting or anything.
Speaker 1 (28:09):
So Gareth was wrong about the four to ten shotgun
being Amy's. Police records have Simmons admitting that the gun
did belong to him. Poor Cameron audio into the Ari
concode on ABC Sinclub. Now we turn to another close
(28:32):
friend of Amy's, Natasha Selsa. Okay, here we go. The
pair lived together when Amy was pregnant with Tay and
Natasha tells me she was horrified by what she witnessed. Well, listen,
thanks a lot for sitting down and talking to us
about this. Obviously, it's been traumatic for a lot of
people close to Amy, and you would have gone through
(28:55):
those feelings as well.
Speaker 3 (28:58):
How could you not?
Speaker 1 (28:59):
How have you interpreted all that Over the years.
Speaker 2 (29:03):
I think hindsight has made it so obvious to me
what was happening at the time. Now I don't think
I knew what was happening in the moment. I didn't
realize the abuse that was happening. I don't think it
was forefront of my mind that that is abuse. And
I just sort of wanted to do with my friend,
wanted to do I wanted to help her, she wanted
to be happy and everything like that. So over the
(29:24):
years I sort of think back on it, and I
just think, now she's gone, and it's just hard to
think about and to talk about and to know she's
not here. She's not here to see her girls, she's
not here to grow up and be with her family,
to see her friends, to do everything that she should
have been doing. They got taken away from her and
(29:44):
I think over the years it's just sort of got
to a point where I'm now angry and I don't
see any of all changes. I don't see us getting
justice because of what happened, because of the insufficient detective
work on the night.
Speaker 3 (30:00):
You've ruined it. You've ruined any hope of justice.
Speaker 2 (30:03):
We can now only pray that we get the justice
that Amy needs and she deserves, and those girls deserve,
her daughters.
Speaker 3 (30:10):
But yeah, it's a lot, a lot to think about.
Speaker 1 (30:15):
You don't think it was suicide.
Speaker 3 (30:16):
No, I don't.
Speaker 2 (30:18):
I got the phone call from Nancy and I remember
her saying to me, Amy's been shot. Amy's been shot.
And then she's saying the police are saying she shot herself.
The police are saying she shot herself. And I said, no,
this isn't Amy. No, no, No, that didn't happen. She
wouldn't have done that. And I know Amy well enough
to know that she wouldn't have done that, And she
(30:39):
wouldn't have done that with her two daughters in a car,
with her belongings.
Speaker 3 (30:42):
Packed ready to go, she had everything ready to go.
Speaker 2 (30:46):
I've seen her leave before, and I've never seen her
leave like that before.
Speaker 3 (30:52):
She's always come to me before, and she's left him.
Speaker 2 (30:55):
And he's always dragged her back in his way, he
charms her into coming back, and then nothing changes.
Speaker 3 (31:01):
It's just the same and it's just all a facade.
Speaker 2 (31:05):
And then when she's backed, it's coercial control. If she's
got no money, you can't get a job. No, you
stay at home, you look after the kids, don't talk
to men. You can't do that, you can't do this.
You're a slut, you're that, you're this. It's just the
constant belittling and all that sort of stuff is it's
a lot.
Speaker 1 (31:25):
Did you ever witness any of that, Natasha.
Speaker 3 (31:28):
Yeah, one hundred percent.
Speaker 2 (31:29):
So he's His demeanor towards Amy changed when she pretty
much got pregnant, and I saw it. I saw how
his demeanor was with her. He was very jealous. He
was very much I'm going to do.
Speaker 3 (31:41):
What I want to do.
Speaker 2 (31:42):
I'm going to go out. I'm going to go see
the boys. I'll be home when I get home. You
just stay here. And if she was to go out,
it would be well will free. So I don't know
she was pregnant.
Speaker 3 (31:53):
If she was to go out and didn't tell him,
it would be an issue.
Speaker 2 (31:56):
She would come home, he might be drunk or intoxicated
in any the other way, and it turns into an
argument because he starts getting jealous. Who have you been texting?
Show me your phone, show me this, show me that.
So she had a habit of always deleting her Facebook,
she had a habit of being quiet when he'd walk
in the room. He'd had like, it's just all these things.
Speaker 1 (32:15):
So you'd notice her it.
Speaker 2 (32:17):
Changed, it changed, And I remember when she moved from
the house Incomes got to the house in Pinjarra, we
would have a lot more phone conversations because she was
a lot further away from me then, so she was
about an hour drive from me, so we would be
on the phone a lot more. And I could tell
every time he came in the room or he came
home subject change. She would go quiet and then you
(32:41):
would just tell you could feel it like she didn't
want him knowing. She couldn't event she couldn't talk to me,
she couldn't say what she wanted to say, and then it.
Speaker 3 (32:48):
Was, oh, he's on the phone.
Speaker 2 (32:50):
So it's a very jealous sort of reaction every time
it came to that sort of thing. So she is
like eventually she just got it. And I remember her
deleting her Facebook so many times and him going through
her phone or like all these claims. But yet we're
hearing all this stuff about him cheating. So it's a
(33:11):
bit like it was projecting. I feel like he definitely
projected onto Amy, and then Amy sort of suffered at it,
like she suffered for whatever he's thinking in his head.
She got the brunt of that, so she just sort
of tried to pacify it and rub it off, and she.
Speaker 3 (33:25):
Would get angry. Don't get me wrong, Amy had a
fight and I like.
Speaker 2 (33:29):
Oh, good girl, should I reckon and she did. She'd
give it back to him if he gave it to her.
But he was nasty. It was nasty. It was not
just the physical demeanor and the standing over and just
the physical difference of them, like Amy was so pteite
and so little and David standing so tall and so muscly,
(33:51):
like at the time he was quite muscly.
Speaker 1 (33:53):
There was a suggestion at one stage, I think during
the inquest as well, this was brought up that they
had an argument earlier before the gun went off and
Amy had somehow head butted David.
Speaker 2 (34:10):
Oh I honestly, if that was the case, I would
say it was going to be a very volatile argument,
and I think it would be coming from both directions.
I don't say that Amy wouldn't have sat there and
probably got frustrated and done something.
Speaker 3 (34:24):
I can't say she wouldn't have. I don't know. I
wasn't there, But I.
Speaker 2 (34:28):
Would imagine knowing Amy and knowing the history of the
going out and not coming home, or coming home on drugs,
or coming home drunk or all those sort of things,
all those factors, I can imagine how angry she would
have been that night, and I can imagine the fight
that would have ensued from that.
Speaker 1 (34:46):
But with their size difference and with their height difference,
was Amy capable of being more aggressive toward him than
he didn't?
Speaker 3 (34:54):
I don't think so.
Speaker 2 (34:56):
I think at the end of the day, Amy may
have smashed a tank because he says, that's not hurting you.
Speaker 3 (35:03):
Like she's so petteeue. I can't explain it.
Speaker 2 (35:05):
She's just such so much a small person that man
could easily just push her over.
Speaker 3 (35:12):
That's the difference.
Speaker 2 (35:14):
Like, I don't see how she could sit there and
like head butt him and do any type of damage
that would be of any significance. I think it would
more be a case of they're in each other's face
and maybe he's come down and hit her head.
Speaker 3 (35:29):
I don't feel like Amy is that type of my I.
Speaker 2 (35:31):
Don't see her getting all hung through and head batting someone.
I see her being angry. I see her being volatile
in that sense and maybe smashing a tank. Because I'm
not gonna lie.
Speaker 3 (35:39):
It's a pattern.
Speaker 2 (35:41):
It's a many year long pattern of him going out, drinking,
doing drugs, coming home and just having an attitude. And
this is where I feel like on that night, it
was pretty final.
Speaker 3 (35:56):
I think she was done. I think he knew she
was done.
Speaker 1 (36:07):
Did you ever have a conversation with her about leaving
because you've got a great relationship? I mean, did you
ever say to her, look, you know you can have
a relationship like mine, for example, you don't have to
put up with this.
Speaker 3 (36:20):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (36:20):
And did she agree or did you have arguments about that?
Speaker 2 (36:24):
No, no arguments. She agreed and she left him. She
left many times. She came to me and she came
to my house. I've got text where she sat there
saying to me, like, you know, I've gone home but
he's done nothing. All he's done is he's just pulled
me back home. He's not talking to me all this
type of stuff, Like he.
Speaker 3 (36:41):
Would sit there and bait her to come home, say
all the right things, and then just act the same
way it would be every time. So he just keeps
repeating the same behaviors. That's all he does.
Speaker 1 (36:51):
One of the girls is his own, wouldn't you think
that he would be proud?
Speaker 3 (36:56):
I always think about that, But then I always flashed
back to when Amy was pregnant. She was giving birth
that weekend and he had his hands around her throat.
So was he thinking about his daughter?
Speaker 6 (37:05):
Then?
Speaker 3 (37:07):
No, I don't know if he's ever thought about his daughter.
Speaker 1 (37:09):
So sorry, just take me there.
Speaker 3 (37:11):
So back when.
Speaker 2 (37:12):
Amy was nine months pregnant with Tay, I was staying
at her house because we were obviously a bit concerned
she was going to go into labor, and David had
opted to go out for the weekend, so he had
been out I think since the Thursday night. So me
and Amy and Naa we went and pulled the matress
out and had a summer party in the lounge room
and we stayed in there pretty much the whole weekend.
(37:34):
Didn't really see David much until I think it was
Saturday afternoon he came home.
Speaker 1 (37:41):
He stayed out for a lot three days.
Speaker 3 (37:43):
Yeah, so this would probably be on the twenty sixth
of June. He came home and he had been out drinking.
He was obviously on drugs.
Speaker 2 (37:53):
Amy was livid, as I'm not going to lie now,
mother myself, any mother nine months pregnant would be with you,
partner out like that when you're about.
Speaker 1 (38:01):
To give birth. Well, she was full term, she was
full term, she.
Speaker 3 (38:03):
Was due, she was overdue. I'm pretty sure I think, yeah,
she was overdue. So she was. We were waiting, We
were very very close. He came home, very volatile. So
it started. He was intoxicated then drinking, was on drugs.
Amy started saying to him, this is a not I'm pregnant,
Like how I'm going to get to the hospital now,
like all this sort of stuff. Yeah, all valid, yeah,
(38:24):
all valid points. And it ended up getting quite heated
and it just ramped up. So I was staying that
night too, just to make sure everything was okay, and
Amy was okay, and.
Speaker 2 (38:37):
I don't know what happened, but they were fighting in
the kitchen and I turned to walk out the loundry
and back through the kitchen, and all I saw was
David with his hands around Amy's neck, bent over like
her back pushed up against the table, with his hands
around her neck, pushing her back, and She's reached out
and just twisted his gold chain around his neck. And
I remember just having to separate them and to send
(39:00):
him out front and like deal with Amy and then
like talk to it. And I remember mediating it and
I remember saying him, that's not okay, Like you can't
do that, Like she's nine months what.
Speaker 3 (39:11):
Is wrong with you?
Speaker 1 (39:12):
He had both of his hands around her, his hands.
Speaker 2 (39:15):
Around her neck, and she was sitting there with his
like trying to grab something. So she's scorn and sort
of wraps like her hand around his chain like that, and.
Speaker 1 (39:22):
He's bending her over the table at the same time.
Speaker 2 (39:25):
Yeah, bending her so pushing her back over the table
as she's reaching out to.
Speaker 3 (39:28):
Grab that chain around.
Speaker 1 (39:30):
So this is a woman who's nine months pregnant about
to give birth. Anymi teet as well.
Speaker 3 (39:34):
You've got to remember Amy was like it was like
a basketball that baby.
Speaker 1 (39:38):
She's pregnant. I'm just struggling with this what sort of
mentality is this.
Speaker 3 (39:42):
He'd been on drugs, and it was very obvious he'd
been on drugs. He'd been out parting with the boys.
He actually wanted to go back out again.
Speaker 2 (39:48):
And I think that was when that fight happened later
in the night, because he was trying to go back
out again, and that's when Amy was saying, no, you're
not right.
Speaker 1 (39:56):
Or thank goodness you were there to mediate.
Speaker 3 (39:59):
I know, I think about that. And then literally the
next day. I think I left at five o'clock on
the Sunday because I had worked the next day, and
I said to Amy, call me, I'll tell you to
the hospital, WILL do whatever whenever you need to go.
I don't think I got half an hour down the road.
She sat down in the land room and her waters broke,
and we were in hospital and she gave birth the
next morning.
Speaker 1 (40:17):
So you took her, You went back and took her.
Speaker 3 (40:19):
I took her, and I stayed for the birth of
Tay and where was he? He was there?
Speaker 2 (40:23):
So I ended up picking both of them up and
I took him with us. He was not okay to drive,
So I have photos of the whole birth and just
looking at him in the photos makes me so disappointed
and disgusted.
Speaker 3 (40:35):
It's just to see and you can tell when you
see the photos, you can see that he's not all there.
It's sad.
Speaker 1 (40:42):
That says a lot. That's not about the nature of
that relationship, as you say, Like I said.
Speaker 3 (40:47):
It changed when she got pregnant. This is within a
nine month period he had his hands around in it.
So if that's the start of their.
Speaker 1 (40:55):
Relationship, how long were your friends?
Speaker 2 (40:58):
I met Amy when she was about sixteen through one
of my other friends, and I.
Speaker 3 (41:03):
Didn't really talk to her much, like we said hello
and night. She I remember she had a kangaroo.
Speaker 2 (41:07):
She fostered a little Joey that the mum had died,
so she was fostering a baby Joey and she's walking
around at sixteen with a little Joey.
Speaker 3 (41:14):
And I remember meeting her and I was like, oh, yeah,
she's nice and that.
Speaker 2 (41:17):
And then on my eighteenth we sort of started talking
more and I invited her to my party and then yeah,
from there.
Speaker 3 (41:23):
Pretty much it was thick and faster and more friends
and that sort of that friend you see every day,
like you know, you're always hanging out, like she'd be
working at the pub at night, and I would go
down and sit at the pub and keeper company, like
you know. It was, Yeah it was.
Speaker 2 (41:38):
I was always at a house wearing sleepovers, it was
going out, would go camping or whatever it would be.
Speaker 3 (41:43):
Yeah it was.
Speaker 5 (41:44):
It was good friendship, good buddies.
Speaker 3 (41:46):
Yeah, and yeah I missing.
Speaker 1 (41:51):
Did you have a falling out with her?
Speaker 3 (41:53):
I had a little falling out.
Speaker 2 (41:54):
So just after bye, I just heard some stupid stuff,
and I think, being young and dumb, I regret it.
I can't tell you how much I can tell you
to love and forgive because I never get to say
what I really wanted to say to Amy now.
Speaker 1 (42:12):
So yeah, how long ago was that before?
Speaker 2 (42:14):
So we fell out for about start twenty twelve, and
then I started talking to her again.
Speaker 3 (42:19):
Was when the car accident happened.
Speaker 2 (42:22):
So I got word from Amy's sister that Amy was
in hospital and that she'd being involved in a car
accident with David and the girls.
Speaker 1 (42:31):
It was a bad accident for her, wasn't it.
Speaker 3 (42:33):
It was bad for Amy.
Speaker 2 (42:35):
Surprisingly for Amy, So that side of the cart somehow
got more damaged than anywhere else. So Amy ended up
in a halo. So I reached out to her then,
because as soon as I heard that, I it.
Speaker 3 (42:48):
Didn't feel right.
Speaker 2 (42:49):
I just felt really sick to my stomach, and just
knowing David, I wasn't comfortable. So I thought I'd reach
out to her, and that's when, thankfully we did start
to talk and men do.
Speaker 3 (43:05):
And all that sort of stuff. But she was very
hesitant for me to see her.
Speaker 2 (43:08):
I think that goes in part and parcel with I
wouldn't take a lot of David's crap if I saw it.
Speaker 3 (43:14):
I was very vocal.
Speaker 2 (43:15):
If I saw anything, I would intervene, I would say something.
I wouldn't allow her to be treated in any way
in front of me.
Speaker 3 (43:21):
So I feel like, yeah, it was good that we
sort of started to get back on track and we
were starting to talk, but she was a bit hesitant
to see me, and I have a feeling it's because
of the whole halo situation. I know she said to
me she didn't want me to see her in a halo.
Speaker 6 (43:35):
The car crash happened at about six pm on the
twentieth of January twenty thirteen. The girls were in the
back seat of a white nineteen ninety seven Toyota land
Cruiser along with Amy's younger step brother, Deacon, who was
twelve at the time. Amy was in the front passenger
seat and David Simmons was driving down Shrevena Road in Serpentine,
(44:00):
an unsealed grubble road. They were all wearing seat belts.
Simmons made a statement to the Insurance Commission of Western
Australia about six months later, where he said he was
only doing about sixty kilometers per hour at the time,
although claimed Shreidner Road didn't actually have a speed limit.
(44:20):
He said he was driving up a slight incline coming
out of a left hand bend when.
Speaker 8 (44:26):
The car started to slide and the rear canopy of
the car struck a burl of a tree which hangs
out over the road. As a result, this caused the
car to slide sideways and come off the road to
the right hand side in impact with a tree in
the dead center of the front of the car's bonnet.
(44:48):
I am unable to recall whether I had applied the
brakes or not, and really didn't have the time to
do anything. The impact caused me to smack my head
on the right hand side of the car. I was
a bit dazed and the kids were crying. I got
out and ran around to the passenger side and helped
the kids out, and Amy had already alighted from the vehicle.
(45:13):
Amy didn't say she was injured or in pain. A
short period of time later, a car drove past and
the occupants called an ambulance.
Speaker 6 (45:25):
The ambulance was taking a while to arrive, so Simmons
called a mate who came and picked them up. He
drove Amy and the kids to Armadale Hospital.
Speaker 8 (45:34):
We took Amy to the emergency department and she was
seen by doctors. They advised us Amy had to go
to Royal Perth Hospital and she was transferred by an ambulance.
Amy had scans on her neck, but I was also
on the bed getting checked over and had a few
stitches for a laceration above my right eye. Amy was
(45:58):
in hospital at least a week. She had a halo
placed around her head as she suffered a fractured vertebrae.
She had the halo removed about a month or so ago.
She is still suffering from pain as a result of
her injuries.
Speaker 1 (46:15):
It was pretty confronting and in fact, very lucky for
her it wasn't more serious.
Speaker 2 (46:20):
Per it could have been a lot more serious, like
they're off road, it's what would happen. I've seen it before.
You know, you go a throne and no rules apply.
But yeah, so that's when we sort of started reaching out.
Speaker 3 (46:33):
I'd be texting her in that and having a chat
and I would be asking her how are you going,
and that she's just the same old So to me,
it's the same old, same old stuff, David, same old drinking,
same old going out, not coming home.
Speaker 1 (46:49):
Nothing changed in that controlling sort of atmosphere. Though. She
probably didn't want you hanging around too much because it
would have made it tougher for her, wouldn't it.
Speaker 2 (46:57):
It would have, and I think I would. I'm not
type of person to ten a blind eye if I
saw something.
Speaker 5 (47:02):
I wouldn't be able to.
Speaker 3 (47:04):
Not do anything. I couldn't. I love her and I'll
do anything for her.
Speaker 8 (47:10):
At the time of the crash, I was not under
the influence of alcohol, prohibited drugs, or any other mind
altering substances. At the time, I was not taking any
prescribed medication. There is no medical reason which may have
affected my ability to operate a motor vehicle in a
safe manner. At the time of the road crash. There
(47:31):
were no witnesses to the crash. Police did not attend
the crash. I have no ongoing injuries of this crash.
As a result of this crash, my personal life has
not changed.
Speaker 6 (47:48):
However, less than a year later, his personal life would change.
On the twenty ninth of July twenty thirteen, the Insurance
Commission of Western Australia asked Simmons to admit full liability
for the claim made by Amy Wensley. Documents state that
until just a couple of days before her death, Amy
(48:09):
was not going to proceed with the claim, but she
changed her mind and told the Commission she would go
ahead after all. Two days later, Amy was dead.
Speaker 3 (48:29):
I never thought it would get to this point.
Speaker 2 (48:32):
I really thought that the day that Nancy was calling me,
I was getting a phone call to say Amy was
in hospital.
Speaker 1 (48:35):
More than anything, that's what immediately came to your mind.
Speaker 2 (48:38):
That's immediately because I hadn't really spoken with Amy. Go
to remember, I hadn't spoken with Amy for a while.
We've been texting. For me to get a phone call,
and I'm very close with Nancy, but for me to
get a phone call at.
Speaker 3 (48:48):
Work at like nine am. I was just a bit
what's going on?
Speaker 2 (48:53):
And as soon as I saw it, she wouldn't call
me during work hours, so I knew it was Amy.
Speaker 3 (48:57):
I knew, I knew him. My heart was Amy. And
then when she said, I don't know, when she says
you're shot, you just didn't feel real. It just didn't
sound right. It wasn't Amy.
Speaker 5 (49:09):
She would never do that.
Speaker 3 (49:10):
I know.
Speaker 1 (49:11):
She wouldn't let me play devil's advocate for a moment though, Natasha,
she was on antidepressant medication, and we know from the
toxicology reports from the coroner's court that the level of
the antidepressant in her system was totally normal. You know,
totally fine. But people who are depressed sometimes to varying degrees,
(49:37):
do silly things. And I'm sure this has gone through
your mind too, But knowing her as you did, is
there any degree of possibility, any chance in your mind
that it was her, that she did do it by
her own hand.
Speaker 3 (49:55):
I wouldn't be lying if I said I haven't thought
about it.
Speaker 2 (49:57):
I can only sit here and say that in my heart,
I one hundred percent believe that Amy would not have
done this, And every time I keep thinking about it,
and I think of all the possibilities, I just keep
coming back to she would not have done this. She
had her two daughters in the car.
Speaker 3 (50:12):
And to know Amy, to.
Speaker 2 (50:13):
Know that her daughters were her life, he would know
that she would never do that. In the vicinity of
her children. She wouldn't have done that.
Speaker 1 (50:21):
She just wouldn't have That's the deal breaker. That's the deal.
Speaker 3 (50:24):
Breaker for me. If he's had have been she was
at home on her own, or like the kids weren't around,
other circumstances, we could discuss this.
Speaker 2 (50:36):
No, her children were there, I don't care about the
frame of mind. I have seen Amy in hysterics before.
She will always put those children above herself, no matter
what the situation is, no matter what's going on, it
is those kids.
Speaker 3 (50:49):
So that for me to hear that they were sitting
in a car less than fifty meters away, No, there
is no way in hell that that happened.
Speaker 1 (51:01):
I'm just trying to be fair, and I'm trying to
look at every single possibility in this in looking at
that scenario. And you know, tragically, a lot of people
who commit suicide their relations and their loved ones. A
lot of them say later, you know, I never would
have thought XXX would have done this, so it's a
(51:25):
natural reaction. Also to those close by.
Speaker 3 (51:29):
It does play a big part.
Speaker 2 (51:30):
I do believe in my heart, with those girls there,
that was what it was. But then we start going
into the detail, what we found out after the fact,
what we found about the position of their body, what
we found out about how she was shot, all that
all plays into it too, And from that it.
Speaker 3 (51:47):
Just cements that for me, that would not have been
the case.
Speaker 2 (51:51):
And I'm sorry, I just there is nothing anyone could
say to me that would make me feel any other way.
Speaker 3 (51:56):
And now she's not here.
Speaker 1 (52:08):
Okay. The whole thing is incredibly sad, isn't It's just
because it's just seems so unnecessary.
Speaker 5 (52:18):
It so just feels surreal, just absolutely surreal. So much
could go wrong.
Speaker 1 (52:27):
The police have to a certain extent, admitted their mistakes
on the night, But do you think they're trying hard enough? Now?
Speaker 3 (52:34):
No?
Speaker 2 (52:35):
Have you seen the news every second day there's a
woman pretty much being murdered.
Speaker 3 (52:40):
What change have they made? What change? If there's change,
how is it not forefront in our minds.
Speaker 2 (52:47):
I can't even sit here and rattle off to you
anything that I've seen visually to promote or to help
with domestic violence, to help with the femicide that's going
on in Australia at the moment, no one is doing
much like more needs to be done. Where is the change?
Show me the change, because right now I just see
figures increasing year by year by year.
Speaker 3 (53:10):
It's horrible.
Speaker 1 (53:13):
Yes, there's a lot, doesn't it.
Speaker 3 (53:15):
Oh, there's a lot, a lot of women. But where's
their justice? There's no justice for them.
Speaker 6 (53:25):
Natasha is right. In twenty twenty four, a woman is
killed every four days, according to the Australian Femicide Watch.
The United Nations defines femicide as the most brutal and
extreme manifestation of violence against women and girls and intentional
(53:46):
killing with gender related motivation, mostly by intimate partners or
members of their own family, and National homicide statistics revealed
that last year, the rate of Australian women killed by
their partners increased by twenty eight percent. However, the rate
(54:09):
of domestic violence deaths remains underreported as many aren't captured
as such. Including this one.
Speaker 1 (54:17):
Good evening. We begin tonight with breaking news. There have
been shots fired and florious these pictures just coming into
the newsroom.
Speaker 6 (54:23):
Mark Bombara was on the hunt for his wife and daughter,
who had sought a restraining order against him from Wa
police after they noticed his handgun was missing. WA police
refused and they were forced into hiding.
Speaker 3 (54:38):
My mother and I made it clear that lives were
at risk, and we were repeatedly ignored.
Speaker 6 (54:43):
When Bombara couldn't find his intended victims, he sought out
his wife's best friend, and when she wouldn't tell him
where they were, he shot her and her daughter, Gretel,
before turning the gun on himself.
Speaker 7 (54:56):
We're being told three people have been shot.
Speaker 6 (54:59):
Seven news On understands those people have been killed because
neither were intimately connected or related to him. Their deaths
are not considered domestic violence related.
Speaker 7 (55:09):
What my father did was an act of domestic violence.
Speaker 1 (55:24):
It was it was it was so much. She shot herself.
That's what happened there.
Speaker 6 (55:28):
Next week, Gareth Price, No, he.
Speaker 7 (55:31):
Didn't do it.
Speaker 1 (55:32):
He didn't do it.
Speaker 3 (55:33):
Sorry. Simo is a good buddy, man.
Speaker 1 (55:35):
I you were done, You're not done.
Speaker 4 (55:37):
It so we was no.
Speaker 1 (55:58):
Jim say, if you knew Amy and have information, any
information about her death, we'd love to hear from you.
(56:19):
Just email us at the Truth about Amy at seven
dot com dot Au. That's s E v E N
The Truth about Amy at seven dot com dot Au,
or visit our website sevenews dot com dot Au forward
(56:40):
slash the Truth about Amy. You can also send us
an anonymous tip at www dot the Truth about Amy
dot com. If you're on Facebook or Instagram, you can
follow us to see photos and updates relevant to the case,
but for legal reasons, unfortunately, you won't be able to
(57:02):
make any comments. And remember, if you like what you're hearing,
don't forget to subscribe. Please rate and review our series
because it really helps new listeners to find us. Presenter
and executive producer Alison Sandy, Presenter and investigative journalist Liam Bartlett,
(57:31):
Sound design Mark Wright, Assistant producer Cassie Woodward, Graphics Jason Blandford,
and special thanks to Tim Clark and Brian Seymour. This
(57:56):
is a seven News production.
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