06: The Man Who Wasn't There

A deep dive on Joshua Bryden who says he left just before Amy died and returned just after. We reveal secret messages he shared with Amy and catch up with him at his home.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
This podcast contains information and details relating to suicide. We
urge anyone struggling with their emotions to contact Lifeline on
thirteen eleven fourteen thirteen eleven fourteen or visit them at
lifeline dot org dot au. A twenty four year old

(00:29):
devoted mother of two fleeing a violent relationship as a
bags packed car running her daughters strapped into the backseat.

Speaker 2 (00:45):
Mom told me that she needed to go back inside
to grab something.

Speaker 1 (00:50):
Panic. I Amy is dead, Sir Aim his dead? Eight
confusion than about five minutes, say sit n to suicide
one hundred percent. This is emersing. What do you think
is really the honest truth about Amy?

Speaker 3 (01:06):
The Truth About Amy?

Speaker 4 (01:15):
Episode six.

Speaker 1 (01:20):
I'm Liam Bartlett.

Speaker 4 (01:22):
And I'm Alison Sandy. It's another sunny day in Perth
and we're off to track down David Simmons and his mates.
We're taking two cars this time, Liam and the crew
in one, and I'm in the other with security guard Mark.
These guys have a history of violence and none of

(01:43):
us are looking for a fight. They all still live
in the same area a bit, so I have about
an hour with Mark to shoot the breeze. We discuss
alcohol and drug fueled violence, and mark indicates while the
race is about the same, it's the stimulants such as
methamphetamine which seemed to make the difference as to how

(02:06):
violent an incident can become.

Speaker 5 (02:09):
Definitely yeah, and people are powered up and they almost
lose the point of reason. It's very hard to talk
to someone when they're in that state because a level
of rationality is gone.

Speaker 4 (02:24):
In some space. Have you been out this way before?

Speaker 5 (02:28):
Not necessarily, munder John, But I have my sister living
in Byford as well, so really we'll see if we
bump into her at the shops maybe.

Speaker 4 (02:39):
So what was the brief mark that you got with
this one?

Speaker 5 (02:44):
It seems like it's a little bit up in the air.
But Liam did say there were a couple of guys
that he was trying to get hold of and have
a word with and see what they were thinking in
regards to I think there was something along the lines
of one of their friends might have been involved in
a case quite some time ago, maybe ten years or so,

(03:06):
and it seemed pretty serious, and they're probably going to
stick up for each other. It's probably pretty emotional. They're
probably going to be a little bit defensive or wary.

Speaker 4 (03:17):
You probably come across guys that are in and out
of court right for various physical altercations or things like that,
So you kind of would know the type of person
or people that we're dealing with on that basis.

Speaker 1 (03:31):
Yes, and no.

Speaker 5 (03:32):
I think there's a lot of people that fit that
category for a multitude of reasons. Homelessness or drug use.
There's a lot of mental illness, and some people are
also just prone to violence and they have bought impulse
control and if they have a bad day, they'll let
someone else feel the brunt of that. So there's a
lot of people that I'll deal with that have those

(03:53):
types of issues, but the actual cause or reason might
seem to vary quite significantly.

Speaker 1 (03:59):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (03:59):
Absolutely, Well a lot of them. It's tied up, right,
because drug use can lead to mental health, or mental
health leads to drug use. I mean it's all yeah connected, right, It's.

Speaker 5 (04:08):
Probably hard to separate one from the other. Yeah, it's
probably all feeding the same issue.

Speaker 4 (04:16):
Yeah, what's your analysis of those sorts of people when
it comes to just the physical violence aspect.

Speaker 5 (04:23):
I think most of the time it is my job
I do train a few aspects of this. We do
have our training for the company as well, So there's
a few things that will give me an advantage in
those types of scenarios. But having said that, you don't
know who you're dealing with. I don't know what these

(04:43):
guys are capable of. I don't know if they're going
to be armed, and you still need to have a
level of respect for the situation. Things can go wrong
and you need to be aware of that going in.
If you are all gung ho and think I'm the

(05:03):
man or I'm untouchable or something like that, then maybe
that's not the best thing. There's always other factors as
well that play into it. If you're trying to manage
a situation and really de escalated or something like that,
or you might make the wrong move, or you know,
you might not have enough situational awareness. It all opens

(05:26):
it up to change, and yeah, you need to stay
switched on regardless of who it is.

Speaker 4 (05:32):
Do you come across many domestic violence situations?

Speaker 5 (05:38):
Oh, very very sensitive subject, isn't it? In terms of
my relation to domestic violence with work in terms of
crowd control or those types of aspects of venues, fairly minimal.
But that's my workplaces outside of that there's some very
concerning what would go on behind closed doors type scenarios,

(06:03):
and a lot of it's probably not reported.

Speaker 4 (06:05):
It's always been a thing, right, but now it's out
in the open, like we've always known about it at all.

Speaker 1 (06:10):
But I think that's good.

Speaker 4 (06:11):
Yeah, it is good.

Speaker 5 (06:12):
We need people to understand how serious of an issue
it is. It's it's very hard to broad brushstroke an
issue as complex as that, but geez, we need to
come up with some solutions and fast. I think it's
scary how common this type of behavior is. And I
think what's more scary is any number that we hear

(06:34):
that's reported, that's reported, Imagine what we don't hear about.
Imagine all the cases where someone's too scared, they don't
want to say anything, they've been intimidated to the point
that they don't want to say anything about it, and
they're just suffering away and they're not in a position
where they feel like they can do anything about it
or they can speak about it. I think that that's

(06:56):
probably some really scary stats. If there was a way
to actually unreported and combined the two, I think that
would be a big wake up to a lot of people.

Speaker 4 (07:06):
Well, only ten percent are reported. That's the official staff,
only ten percent of report.

Speaker 1 (07:11):
There we go.

Speaker 5 (07:11):
I didn't know that, but I can really believe that. Yeah,
and that's scary. If only ten percent, that's scary. Out
of ten people that are in that situation, only one
of them feels like they can actually say something. There's
nine that won't. That that's really scary.

Speaker 1 (07:35):
While Allison and Market chatting, I'm going over my notes
about Joshua James Brydon. He's the youngest of the group,
born in nineteen ninety one, a year after Amy. And
Gareth Brydon was there the day Amy died, but says

(07:56):
he left shortly before the shooting and then return shortly after.
Despite this and having seen David Simmons and spoken to
Gareth Price several times after Amy's death, he says neither
of them told him, and he didn't find out about

(08:20):
Amy's death until the following afternoon when talking to someone else.
This is what he said in a statement to police
on the twenty eighth of June twenty fourteen.

Speaker 6 (08:36):
I am twenty three years old and reside in an
address in Byford. On Friday, the twenty seventh of June,
I was asked to attend the Munda John Police station
to provide a statement to the WA Police. I have
been advised that I do not have to accompany police,
that I am not under arrest, and that if I
do a company police, that I am free to leave
at any time unless I am placed under arrest. I

(08:56):
am friends with Simmo and Amy. Simmo is a David
Simmons who I have known through the family since I
was about fifteen years old. Hami is his partner. They
aren't married. I have known her for about two years
and met her through Simo. Simmo was someone that I've
only just started hanging out with the last two years,
but I've known him since I was about fifteen. I

(09:16):
consider him to be a good mate. I go to
his house and he comes to mind, not very often,
but I also see him at Gareth. When I see him,
we go out bush, you know, camping, pig hutt and
wood chopping, barbecues and hanging out at the house. I
usually go with a group of people who go On Wednesday,
twenty fifth of June twenty fourteen, the girls went out together.

(09:37):
Amy sometimes goes out shooting, but only with Simo. We've
only been out with Simo and her once and she
only ever uses a twenty two because she has a
bad neck from a car accident. She'd never used the
shotguns she refuses to use it.

Speaker 1 (09:50):
So stopping here because think about it, Amy refuses to
use the shotgun because of her neck injury. Now remember
this statement was taken just two days after Amy's death.
It's understandable given the four to ten would be much
heavier and the recoil much stronger, but again something that

(10:11):
was brushed over during the inquest.

Speaker 6 (10:13):
My girls, I mean Amy and Rachel Price. Rachel is
Gareth's wife. They went to the movies I think it
was at Armadale and he saw twenty two Jump Street.
I was at Simo's house in Southwest Highway a certain
time when the girls left. Garetha was also there. We
were watching movies until the kids went to bed at
eight thirty because we stuffed at the TV. The movie

(10:34):
had finished and we didn't know how to use the TV,
so I couldn't get it back to Foxdell. That's what
I left. I had agreed to go back to Simo's
house in the morning to chop some wood. Simmo and
his dad have a logging business, and Simo still sells
some wood from his house. I didn't go back to
the house first thing in the morning because I slept in.
At about nine thirty am, I got a Facebook message

(10:54):
from Amy asking well we made what time me coming up?
Simoto's never phone on him, so I got to communicate
through Facebook. I said I was coming up. I was
in the car and on the way. Got there about
ten am. When I got to the house, I could
see Simo's car suber rumby, Amy's car, which was a
v Wire Commodol, and Rachel's car, which was a white

(11:15):
Toyota camera. Gareth and Rachel had stayed over the night,
but Garris Carr was already gone because he had gone
to work. I walked up to the house, knocked on
the door, and walked in. Simo and Amy were both
in good moods, you know, happy as Larry. Simo asked
if I was ready to go. Simo walked out to
his car. Amy walked out just behind him with a
box of rubbish frost, putting the bins down the end

(11:36):
of the driveway. We then left. I drove my car
and Simo drove his car behind me. Amy and Rachel
stayed back at the house. We dropped the rubbish in
the bins and then drove to the cow Text roadhouse
in Serpentine. Simo put some diesel in my car, bought
fuel for the chainsaw, and put fuel in his car.

Speaker 1 (11:55):
Brighton says Simmons was in a good mood. While they
found some logs and cut wood. They didn't get back
to simmons place Simo's place, as Brydon puts it, until
about twelve thirty.

Speaker 6 (12:09):
The girls had gone out. I don't know where they went.
Simmo got changed because it had been raining whilst we
were chopping wood, and I remember he had a b
loo sing one on and blue jeans. He got changed
into a pair of shorts, a black jumper and a
T shirt. I don't really remember his clothing. We stayed
and had some chips and left in Simo's car to
go to the bottle at Serpentine. Get a cart and

(12:29):
a piss, and you know by piss, I'm in beer.
Simo went desided to pay for it. It was about
fifteen minutes down the road. We put the piss in
the back of the ute and drove to Gareth's house
in Jaredale looked over his phone. Gareth had left his
phone on the bin that night. We couldn't find him
up there.

Speaker 1 (12:44):
After that, he and Simmons went out Bush again. At
about two fifteen, he received a Facebook message from Amy.

Speaker 6 (12:55):
She asked me to get simm to goober a call.
Simo tried to call on my phone but it kept
open in and out of some reception, so it never
rotecked it.

Speaker 1 (13:02):
Before going back to Simmos, they picked up Gareth. It
was about three thirty. Rachel had left and Amy had
gone to pick up her eldest daughter from school.

Speaker 6 (13:15):
I gave sim On my phone to call Amy because
he couldn't get her earlier. Lost he called, I went outside.
I couldn't hear the call. About fifteen twenty minutes later,
Amy arrived at the house with two kids. The kids
were excited, you know, as usual. I don't know why.
They went to the bedroom. After about ten minutes I
heard Amy start yelling. I couldn't hear Simmo. She came

(13:38):
running out and said, did David try to call me?
And I said, yeah, here's my call logue and I
showed her my phone. She said, don't worry about it
and turned back and went back into the bedroom. She
got a bit angry, started throwing stuff, and by angry
Ammy and she was out of order. It was out
of normal for me. Kath was down the hallway and
they were arguing, and you know, by arguing, I mean
Simmo was listening to Amy and he was saying a

(14:02):
few things to try and calm Amy down. I heard
Simmo say, have I ever hurt you? Have I ever
hit you? I've never hurt you, and I never will,
you know. Amy said, now, you've never hurt me, and
you've never hit me. Kareth grabbed a mirror from the
hallway next to the bedroom and walked back to the
dining table and put the mirror down near me. I
think he was just trying to do it to stop
it from getting broken. Simo came out and started talking

(14:25):
to us. We're still at the dining room table. Amy
came out and said I've had enough. I'm leaving. Simo said,
if you want to leave, leave, I'm not arguing with you.
Amy said, I'm taking all the money and I'm going
to get a new house. Simo said, you can take
the money, take both of the accounts. All I wanted
the roof over the kids heads. Simo was upset but
holding it together for the kids. You know, five said,

(14:47):
I mean he was a bit angry, but he was
holding in his temper. Andy then walked out the front door.
You know, I thought she was going to a car.
Simo stayed and was trying to talk to us, So
the girls went outside, playing in the shed out the back.
Whilst all this was.

Speaker 1 (14:59):
Happening, he says, Amy's oldest daughter started crying, so they
ran outside.

Speaker 6 (15:07):
Simmo said, I hope she doesn't hurt the kids.

Speaker 1 (15:10):
In anger, they noticed the lizard tank is smashed, and
Gareth and Brydon proceed to clean up.

Speaker 6 (15:18):
Gareth and I stayed with the girls in the shed
and looked after them, making sure they didn't run off
or do anything stupid. Simo came and told the girls
O had to go to the NaNs. At that point,
Simo was upset, but was, you know, putting on a
brave face with the kids. I would say that he
was frustrated. I don't think he was angry, and I
don't think he was sad, but I'd say it was
pretty calm though. Put the kids in Amy's car.

Speaker 1 (15:41):
Brydon says, He left at four forty seven pm. He
knows this because he just got a text message from
his old school friend Kay. He says he didn't respond
to this message, though, and went straight home and fed
his dogs. At about five point thirty pm, he drives

(16:04):
back to Simo's place.

Speaker 6 (16:08):
When I got there, Gareth is sitting on the fence.
I stopped to talk with him. He said, you don't
want to go up there, just leave and come back later.
He wouldn't tell me what happened. I thought Simmo had
started arguing back with Amy. Gareth is a bit strange,
like you know someone was wrong. I knew there was
something wrong, but I didn't do anything about it.

Speaker 1 (16:26):
So Brydon leaves again and apparently goes straight to his
mate Kaid's place, whose text he didn't respond to. Earlier.

Speaker 6 (16:36):
As I was driving to Caids, I got a message
from It was about five point fifty pm. The message
said come to mind. I didn't respond to that message.
I didn't receive any other calls that night or messages,
and I didn't make or send any.

Speaker 1 (16:50):
He and Caid apparently then go pig shooting until after midnight.
After that, he went home to bed Brighton says he
slept in the next morning to about eight am, and
after doing a few chores around the house, headed to
the bakery and then to get new tires for his car.

(17:11):
It's late morning when Gareth calls him.

Speaker 6 (17:16):
Gareth said to me, we need to talk.

Speaker 1 (17:18):
The call is from Brydon's sister's phone, and they hang
up quickly so he can get back home where Gareth
and Simo are waiting.

Speaker 6 (17:28):
Simma looked a mess. I mean, he wasn't talking. He
looked like he was going to cry. He wasn't happy.
Kara said, we're about to go up bush. Do you
want to come? I said, nah, I got to get
these tires put on. I didn't talk to them much
because my sister was there. I figured if they wanted
to talk, they would have said it with her.

Speaker 1 (17:46):
There, so if we still believe Joshua's story. Simmons and
Gareth then leave, having not discussed Amy's death. Brydon says
it wasn't until he drove to another mate's place and
talked to Rachel's brother Ray that he learned about what happened.

Speaker 6 (18:09):
He said that Amy had shot herself and I said, yeah,
I knew it. In myself kind of had a feel,
and I felt it because of the way that Simo
was when he was at my house. It was like
his heart had been torturous. Chest Simon and Gareth rocked up.
We were all at the back, and Gareth started talking
to us. Both looked a little better, like they had
refreshed themselves. Sim and I went out in the front.

(18:30):
He asked me if I had heard what had happened
to Amy said it was okay, and that he was
better than he was. There was not much you could
do about it now, I mean, it was too late.
We talked for a little bit and then walked out
the back. I tried talking to him some more, but
Simo wouldn't talk back. Gareth and Simo left to go
back to Gareth's house. I left as well. When I

(18:51):
got to Gareth's house, Simo started to let everything out emotionally.
He started crying and hating on himself or what Gareth
had to see. Gareth was saying, that's what made the
four here for you, no matter what.

Speaker 1 (19:05):
How prophetic those words would prove. Brydon doesn't say much more,
but lists the guns owned by Simmons, which included the
twelve gage shotgun, a three zero eight bolt action rifle,
a Browning twenty two lever action fifteen shot rifle, and

(19:25):
the four to ten shotgun. And there was also Amy's
pink twenty two rifle. He then says, Simmons and Amy's
relationship was very cheery and happy, a normal relationship, no
different to any other of his mate's relationships.

Speaker 4 (19:48):
At the time of his statement to police in twenty fourteen,
Brydon also mentioned that his dad's twin sister was in
a relationship with Simmons. Uncle. This is Brydon at the inquest.

Speaker 3 (20:05):
Could you tell the court your full name, please, Joshua
James Brydon. And my understanding is that you gave a
statement to the WA Police in relation to the investigation
into Amy's death. Do you remember that. Yes, It's dated
twenty eight June twenty fourteen, so two days after Amy died.
Do you recall giving that statement?

Speaker 6 (20:22):
Yes, I do.

Speaker 3 (20:23):
Is there anything that you would like to add or
change to that statement in evidence today?

Speaker 1 (20:28):
No?

Speaker 3 (20:28):
And do you call David Simmons Dave David Simo what Simo?

Speaker 4 (20:33):
Brydon outlines the history of his friendship with Simmo and
what they did together. And then he's asked about Amy.

Speaker 3 (20:40):
Did Amy go hunting?

Speaker 6 (20:41):
Not with me?

Speaker 2 (20:42):
No?

Speaker 3 (20:42):
Did you ever see Amy use a gun?

Speaker 4 (20:44):
No?

Speaker 3 (20:44):
Do you remember there being any issues of jealousy between
you speaking to Amy from David's perspective?

Speaker 6 (20:50):
No?

Speaker 3 (20:50):
Would it surprise you to hear that there were messages
sent between Amy and David where David expressed a bit
of displeasure about the suggestion that Amy might go out
shooting with you a min before she died.

Speaker 6 (21:01):
Yes, it would surprise me.

Speaker 3 (21:02):
Yes, that's news to you. Yes, Okay. Do you remember
offering to take Amy out shooting or talking to her
about that about a month before she died?

Speaker 6 (21:10):
Not really, I don't, but yes, all right, I'm.

Speaker 3 (21:12):
Going to ask you to cast your mind back six
and a half years. Do you have an independent memory
of the days before Amy died?

Speaker 6 (21:19):
No? I don't remember too much. But I mean I
know the day that she died, me and Simo went
and chopped firewood during the day.

Speaker 3 (21:26):
So the chopping of firewood, was that your job or
were you just helping out?

Speaker 6 (21:29):
I was just helping out.

Speaker 3 (21:30):
Was that something you did regularly?

Speaker 6 (21:32):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (21:32):
When you would go out chopping wood, would you and
David drink while doing that, Sorry, Simo.

Speaker 6 (21:37):
No, sometimes he might have stopped at the pub for
lunch or something like that.

Speaker 3 (21:41):
You didn't. No, we know from your statement that the
morning that you agreed to go and help Simo chop
some wood, you had some Facebook messenger conversations with Amy.
Do you remember that.

Speaker 6 (21:50):
Yes, that's how David was getting in touch with me
because his phone. He didn't have a phone at the time.

Speaker 3 (21:55):
So do you know why he didn't have a phone.

Speaker 6 (21:58):
His phone got damage from water damage.

Speaker 3 (22:00):
Do you know where that occurred or when he left.

Speaker 6 (22:02):
It on Gareth rubbish Benn at Garri's house. I think
a week a couple of weeks before and it got wet.

Speaker 4 (22:16):
Counsel assisting then discusses Facebook messages Amy sent to Brydon
the day she died. The first one was at eight
am asking when he was coming over. Brighton confirms Amy
was talking about him going out with Simmo to chop
wood as they discussed it the day before. Then Amy
sends another message asking him how is my chocolate slice?

Speaker 3 (22:38):
Do you remember what that was about?

Speaker 6 (22:40):
Not really, I'm guessing we on chocolate slice days before.
Maybe I don't know.

Speaker 3 (22:44):
You would have been at her house yeah, the day before,
is that right?

Speaker 6 (22:48):
Yes?

Speaker 3 (22:49):
All right? And you complimented her on her food, you
said it was good.

Speaker 6 (22:53):
Yes, yeah.

Speaker 4 (22:54):
Brighton confirms arriving at their house shortly after and driving
his utes separately from Simmer, who drove his own bhicle
out to chopwood, and bringing several loads back to the
house before finishing up. When prompted, he says, they went
back and forth about three times.

Speaker 3 (23:11):
Do you know how long those trips would have taken
back and forth?

Speaker 6 (23:14):
Probably between loads, I don't know, between a couple hours.

Speaker 3 (23:17):
My understanding is at about lunchtime you went back to
Simo's house and you had done your wood shopping for
the day. Does that is that your memory or is
the timing off.

Speaker 6 (23:26):
We had obviously gone back to Simo's house a couple
of times, but like the we got back there in
the afternoon pretty much. We picked up Gareth on the
way through, so it was at the end of the
day when we got there.

Speaker 3 (23:38):
I think in your statement you mentioned stopping to buy
some beer and go to Gareth's house. Does that sound right?

Speaker 6 (23:43):
We didn't stop and buy beer because we were nowhere
near a bot shop.

Speaker 3 (23:46):
All right? Do you agree that you were at David's
house at about lunchtime. That you would have been there
at some point around twelve.

Speaker 6 (23:53):
Yeah, yes, we would have been there.

Speaker 3 (23:55):
Yes, just based on the messages on Amy's phone. We
know that your phone, your Facebook messages. Sent a message
to Amy's phone at eleven forty six am, saying Simo
wants to know where you are. Do you remember anything
about that message?

Speaker 6 (24:08):
No?

Speaker 3 (24:08):
And we know that. Amy responded saying on my way home, yes,
you don't remember anything about that?

Speaker 1 (24:14):
No?

Speaker 6 (24:14):
Not really? I mean yes, yeah, I was communicating to
Amy four Simmo.

Speaker 3 (24:18):
So Simo was saying this, ask this is that right?

Speaker 6 (24:22):
Yes?

Speaker 4 (24:23):
Amy then messaged Bridon's phone at twelve forty seven, asking
where the fuck are you? But it wasn't until two
forty two when Bridon replies out Bush. Three minutes later,
Amy messages again, saying, get Simo to call me.

Speaker 3 (24:39):
Do you remember that?

Speaker 6 (24:40):
Yes?

Speaker 3 (24:40):
Do you know why Amy was looking for you?

Speaker 5 (24:42):
No?

Speaker 3 (24:43):
Did you call her back when you got the message?

Speaker 6 (24:45):
Yes? We tried to call her back, but I had
a limited.

Speaker 3 (24:47):
Reception, couldn't get through.

Speaker 6 (24:49):
We couldn't get through, but we were heading home at
that point.

Speaker 3 (24:51):
What happened to you when you got home? To Simo's house.

Speaker 6 (24:54):
We were sitting in the kitchen. Amy was yelling at Simmo.

Speaker 3 (24:56):
So Amy got home? Or was she home already?

Speaker 6 (24:59):
She was home already with the kids home. Yes.

Speaker 3 (25:01):
Where were they?

Speaker 6 (25:02):
I think they were in their rooms. Gareth and me
were sitting in the kitchen.

Speaker 3 (25:05):
Were you having a drink or having a What were
you doing?

Speaker 6 (25:08):
We were just sitting there, just sitting chatting.

Speaker 1 (25:10):
Yes.

Speaker 3 (25:10):
And where was David?

Speaker 6 (25:11):
He was talking to Amy?

Speaker 3 (25:12):
What do you remember happening when you walked in?

Speaker 6 (25:14):
Amy yelling? Similar? Was trying to calm her down?

Speaker 3 (25:17):
What was she yelling?

Speaker 6 (25:18):
I could remember what she was yelling.

Speaker 3 (25:19):
Could you hear what they were saying?

Speaker 6 (25:21):
I could? I just couldn't remember what they were saying.

Speaker 3 (25:23):
You can't remember?

Speaker 1 (25:24):
No?

Speaker 3 (25:24):
Do you know why she was angry?

Speaker 6 (25:26):
Maybe because she thought we were ignoring her for the day,
but it wasn't the case. We just didn't have reception.

Speaker 3 (25:31):
Was David yelling back?

Speaker 6 (25:33):
No, just trying to yes, respond calmly?

Speaker 3 (25:36):
Were they trying to get away from each other? What
was happening?

Speaker 6 (25:39):
No, not really. Simia was just trying to explain himself
and calm her down.

Speaker 3 (25:43):
Really did Amy calm down?

Speaker 6 (25:44):
Not? Really? You know? The matter resolved itself a little bit.
Simmia was outside with us, you know, talking to the kids.
I think Amy's plan was just to go to a
mom's house for the night.

Speaker 3 (25:54):
Did you see the argument get physical at any point
while you were there?

Speaker 6 (25:57):
Yes, Amy tried to pick something up and hit them
with it, but she didn't hit him physically with it.

Speaker 3 (26:02):
What did you see her pick up?

Speaker 6 (26:03):
I can't remember. It was something next to the kitchen.

Speaker 3 (26:06):
We received a statement from Gareth that says he saw
Amy hitting Simo with a mirror. Does that refresh your
memory in any way?

Speaker 6 (26:12):
Yes? That sounds about right all right.

Speaker 3 (26:14):
Did the mirror break?

Speaker 6 (26:15):
Nah?

Speaker 3 (26:15):
No, I didn't do you know what happened to that mirror?

Speaker 6 (26:17):
Simoy managed to get it out of her hand and
threw it on the floor, and Gareth picked it up
and pulled it away so it couldn't be used.

Speaker 3 (26:23):
Was this in the bathroom?

Speaker 6 (26:24):
No, in the hallway.

Speaker 3 (26:25):
Was Simo just standing there while Amy tried to hit
him with his mirror.

Speaker 6 (26:28):
Or he was? Yes, he was standing there.

Speaker 3 (26:31):
He obviously wasn't trying to defend himself. No, he was
just standing there while she tried to hit him.

Speaker 6 (26:36):
Yes, he put his arms up, but he didn't.

Speaker 3 (26:38):
He managed to get his arms up and take the
mirror off her.

Speaker 6 (26:41):
Yes, I don't know. I can't remember if he took
it off her or if it just if she let
go of it.

Speaker 3 (26:46):
Do you know what happened after the mirror was moved
by Gareth?

Speaker 6 (26:48):
I'm pretty sure we went outside, All of us went outside. Okay,
the kids. Sim put the kids in the car. Yes.

Speaker 3 (26:54):
Where was Amy while this was happening.

Speaker 6 (26:55):
I'm pretty sure she was in a room. Okay.

Speaker 3 (26:57):
Were the kids upset?

Speaker 6 (26:58):
Yes, they were upset. I don't think they understood what
was going on.

Speaker 3 (27:02):
Do you know why Simo put them in the car.

Speaker 6 (27:04):
He put them in the car and explained to them
that they were going with Mommy to stay at Grandma's.

Speaker 3 (27:07):
Did you hear Amy and Simmo talking about that plan?
Do you know where that plan came from?

Speaker 6 (27:12):
No? I didn't hear them.

Speaker 3 (27:13):
We know that Amy called her mom after the fight
with David and said that she had thrown a beer
at him. Do you remember seeing that? No, you didn't
see anyone throwing any drinks.

Speaker 6 (27:21):
No, I don't remember that, but I mean it could happen. Yeah.

Speaker 3 (27:25):
Gareth also says that Simo had to wrestle Amy to
the ground and hold her by the arms to stop
her after she was hitting him. Do you remember that.

Speaker 6 (27:31):
Yes, he was trying to calm her down, and he
managed to calm her down enough for us for us
three to walk outside and separate the situation.

Speaker 3 (27:39):
Can you describe what he did to calm her down?

Speaker 6 (27:41):
He just held her down, that's it.

Speaker 3 (27:42):
Can you remember where he was holding her.

Speaker 6 (27:44):
He just held on to her arms.

Speaker 3 (27:46):
Did he take her to the ground to calm her down?

Speaker 6 (27:48):
I can't remember if he talked to the ground or not.

Speaker 3 (27:50):
Amy had butted David while that was happening and split
his lip. Do you remember anything about that?

Speaker 6 (27:55):
I remember him having split lip.

Speaker 3 (27:56):
He didn't see the head butt.

Speaker 6 (27:57):
I can't remember.

Speaker 3 (27:58):
Do you remember them saying to each other while they
were wrestling or while this was going on?

Speaker 6 (28:03):
Not really. It was more yelling, yelling from Amy's side
of things.

Speaker 3 (28:07):
And David didn't start yelling back her anything.

Speaker 6 (28:09):
Not really.

Speaker 3 (28:10):
Was Amy still just angry or did she start to
get upset?

Speaker 6 (28:13):
I think a bit of both.

Speaker 3 (28:14):
Can you describe what she seemed like what she was doing?

Speaker 6 (28:17):
Not really, I didn't see her after we went outside.

Speaker 3 (28:20):
Is there a reason. Did you try and intervene with
David and Amy?

Speaker 6 (28:23):
We tried to stay out of it as much as
we could, but yes, we were prepared to step in if, obviously,
if it got too physically out of hand to split
it up.

Speaker 3 (28:30):
But you didn't see anything that you thought was out
of hand.

Speaker 6 (28:33):
No, I mean, what happened so fast and it was over.
It was quick as before we could even get out
of the chairs. Anyway.

Speaker 3 (28:39):
Did you see a headlock at any point?

Speaker 1 (28:40):
No?

Speaker 6 (28:41):
I didn't see the headlock.

Speaker 3 (28:42):
The reason I asked that is that Gareth says that
David had Amy in a headlock to try and get
her down to the ground. You didn't see that.

Speaker 6 (28:48):
No, I didn't see that.

Speaker 3 (28:49):
Okay, we know that the forensic pathologists that examined Amy
after she died saw that she had soft tissue injuries
to her wrists and other small bruises on her body.
Do you think that the scuffle between her and David
have resulted in those injuries based.

Speaker 6 (29:01):
On what you saw, could have done yes?

Speaker 3 (29:03):
Do you think he was holding her down forcefully enough
that it might have left a bruise?

Speaker 6 (29:07):
Yes?

Speaker 3 (29:08):
Yes, all right, But just again, you weren't concerned to
the degree that you would have stepped in.

Speaker 6 (29:12):
Well, in my eyes, he was trying to hold it down,
to calm her down for our own good. I think
you know, if the bruises are there, it's because she
was fighting him more than he was fighting her.

Speaker 3 (29:22):
So your perspective of this altercation was that Amy was
the aggressor, not David.

Speaker 6 (29:26):
Amy was the one that was angry, yes, and aggressive. Yes,
at that time.

Speaker 3 (29:29):
She was the one using violence against David.

Speaker 6 (29:32):
Yes.

Speaker 3 (29:32):
Okay. Amy was a pretty small woman, wasn't she.

Speaker 6 (29:35):
Yes, she was.

Speaker 3 (29:36):
He went worried that David was a fair bit bigger
than her.

Speaker 6 (29:38):
Yes, I mean he's a lot bigger than her, and
he yes, and in capabilities. If he was being violent,
he would be able to hurt her. But he wasn't
trying to be violent towards her in that day at all.
He just wanted her to calm down and stop.

Speaker 4 (29:52):
Miss Tyler then asked Brydon about whether he witnessed the
lizard tank being smashed. He replies he saw Amy push
a over and then head back inside. He confirms what
Gareth said, which is they cleaned it up while Simmo
put the kids in the car.

Speaker 3 (30:07):
At any point did Simmo go back inside and talk
to Amy while you and Gareth were outside?

Speaker 6 (30:12):
He tried to, but the door was locked.

Speaker 3 (30:13):
Which door was locked?

Speaker 6 (30:14):
The front door?

Speaker 3 (30:15):
Are you sure the door was locked? The reason I
asked that is because you didn't mention that in the
statement that you gave to police.

Speaker 6 (30:21):
Yes, I'm pretty I know the door was locked at
some point because he couldn't get into the house.

Speaker 1 (30:26):
This is a pretty big point, in fact, a very
big point. Amy had locked the front door. Now nobody
else mentioned this, and they didn't seem to be any
issue with a locked door when they ran into the
house later after hearing the thud, Brydon goes on to
say that Simmons wasn't really phased by Amy locking the door.

Speaker 3 (30:50):
Was he angry about that?

Speaker 6 (30:51):
No, not really. You just tried. He just wanted to
talk to her.

Speaker 3 (30:54):
You don't remember anything that David might have said through
the locked door to try and get Amy to open it.

Speaker 6 (31:00):
No, not really.

Speaker 3 (31:00):
Do you know what time you left? We know from
your statement that you told police you had a message
from a friend at four forty seven.

Speaker 6 (31:06):
Yes, that's when I was leaving. I was meant to
pick up my mate from the train. Station.

Speaker 3 (31:10):
Meant to pick up your mate from the train station.

Speaker 6 (31:12):
Oh, I had to after he finished work. We have
planned to go pick hunt in that night, so just
you two.

Speaker 3 (31:17):
Yeah, where did you go?

Speaker 6 (31:18):
I drove to my place where I was living.

Speaker 3 (31:20):
You went straight home.

Speaker 6 (31:21):
Straight home. I messaged my mate to see if he
still needed to be picked up. He had been picked
up by his girlfriend. So I drove back to Simo's
place before going to his, but Gareth was in the
front driveway and told me.

Speaker 3 (31:31):
To leave before we get to that. At the time,
did you live alone?

Speaker 6 (31:35):
No, I lived with my parents at the time.

Speaker 3 (31:37):
Were your parents home when you got home?

Speaker 6 (31:39):
No, they weren't all right.

Speaker 3 (31:40):
Why did you drive back to Simo's house?

Speaker 6 (31:41):
I just wanted to check and make sure things were okay?

Speaker 3 (31:44):
Is that because you were worried?

Speaker 6 (31:45):
I was just just want to check to see if
Amy was okay. She had calmed down, and yes, make
sure the kids were okay.

Speaker 3 (31:51):
What were you concerned would have happened? What were you
worried about?

Speaker 6 (31:53):
I was just worried that she might have been you know,
like you know, they were both my friends, Yes, and
I wanted to know why she was upset or what
was wrong.

Speaker 4 (32:01):
Brydon says, only Gareth was at the front gate when
he arrived.

Speaker 3 (32:05):
Do you remember talking to him?

Speaker 6 (32:07):
He just told me to leave.

Speaker 3 (32:08):
Did he tell you why?

Speaker 5 (32:09):
No?

Speaker 3 (32:09):
Did you ask him why?

Speaker 6 (32:10):
He told me just leave?

Speaker 3 (32:11):
Didn't give you any more detail than that?

Speaker 6 (32:13):
Didn't give me any more details.

Speaker 4 (32:15):
Brighton repeats what was in his statement about going out
pig hunting with his mate Kaid, and despite having seen
Gareth and Simmo the next morning at home, they still
didn't tell him what happened to Amy. He once again
says another mate told him, but changes it from being
in person to via text message.

Speaker 3 (32:33):
What was your reaction when you heard that news?

Speaker 6 (32:35):
I was upset?

Speaker 3 (32:36):
Were you surprised?

Speaker 6 (32:37):
I was? I was surprised, okay fair.

Speaker 3 (32:39):
Did you ever suspect she would be at risk of
committing suicide?

Speaker 6 (32:42):
No? I didn't.

Speaker 3 (32:43):
You didn't know anything about her being depressed or unhappy
or anything of that nature.

Speaker 6 (32:47):
No, I didn't know that she was depressed. She never
spoke to me about that.

Speaker 3 (32:50):
When you heard the news, were you concerned that David
might have done something to her?

Speaker 5 (32:54):
No?

Speaker 3 (32:54):
Were you told that she had committed suicide? Or were
you just told that she was dead?

Speaker 6 (32:58):
I was told that she had committed suicide.

Speaker 3 (32:59):
You didn't have a moment's doubt about how she had died. No, okay,
you had known Amy and David for a couple of years.
What was their relationship like? Generally?

Speaker 6 (33:08):
Mostly happy whenever I was there. I mean, every relationship
has their bad days and their good days, so most
of the time it was never in front of people.

Speaker 3 (33:15):
So did David ever confide in you about any difficulties
in their relationship?

Speaker 6 (33:19):
Not really, I mean never really spoke to me about them.

Speaker 3 (33:22):
Did Amy ever confide in you about any problems in
their relationship?

Speaker 6 (33:25):
No, she didn't.

Speaker 3 (33:27):
When you were all at Amy and Simmo's house, when
Amy had come home and there was an argument. Had
you all been drinking at all that day?

Speaker 6 (33:33):
Mind, had a couple of beers that day? I gotta.
I can't really.

Speaker 3 (33:37):
Recall you had been with David the whole day, right?

Speaker 1 (33:39):
Yeah?

Speaker 3 (33:40):
Was he in your view? Was he intoxicated?

Speaker 6 (33:43):
No? No, No?

Speaker 3 (33:44):
Do you remember drinking that day?

Speaker 5 (33:46):
No?

Speaker 6 (33:46):
I don't. I don't. Really. A lot of that day
is pretty blurring and scramble for me.

Speaker 3 (33:50):
If you had been drinking together, would it have been
beer or something harder?

Speaker 6 (33:54):
It would have been beer.

Speaker 3 (33:55):
Yes, okay, but you're pretty confident that you weren't intoxicated
that day.

Speaker 6 (33:58):
No, not to be the limit.

Speaker 3 (34:00):
David wasn't either, No, all right, to your knowledge, were
drugs ever an issue for Amy or David.

Speaker 6 (34:05):
I've never seen timodo drugs while he was with Amy.

Speaker 3 (34:08):
And you hadn't used drugs that day or any day
around it.

Speaker 4 (34:10):
No.

Speaker 3 (34:11):
One of the main reasons for holding this in quest is,
I'm sure you know, is that the family don't believe
that Amy committed suicide, and the police investigations haven't been
able to resolve the question of how she died one
way or the other. You've had six and a half
years to think about it, and you were one of
the last people to see Amy alive. Do you have
a view about how Amy died?

Speaker 5 (34:30):
No?

Speaker 6 (34:30):
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (34:31):
Yes.

Speaker 6 (34:31):
I mean, you can't really understand depression or what someone's
going through. You can't even try to understand it. You know,
the only person who knew what was going on that
day would have been Amy, And I mean it was
a pretty hard moment for me. I lost a friend.
I lost another friend twelve months later that committed suicide.
You know, right up to that point, I didn't know
that he was suffering what he was suffering either.

Speaker 4 (34:54):
So the Deputy State Currenter says, she has a question.

Speaker 7 (34:58):
I just wanted to ask you one thing, and it
might be testing your memory, but your statements there in
front of you. I think if you could go to
page eleven and just to paragraphs one hundred and fifteen
and one hundred and sixteen, and you obviously gave this
on twenty eighth of June, so very close in time.
You mentioned there about a conversation you heard Simo say,
have I ever hurt you? I've never hurt you and

(35:19):
I never will. And you said then Amy said, no,
You've never hurt me, You have never hit me. Do
you remember that conversation now on hearing.

Speaker 6 (35:27):
Those words, Yes, I do remember that conversation.

Speaker 7 (35:30):
Yes, And to the best of your recollection, had you
ever seen Simo hit Amy before that day?

Speaker 6 (35:34):
Oh, I've never seen him.

Speaker 7 (35:36):
And you mentioned Amy on the day. Did try and
hit Simo a few times?

Speaker 6 (35:40):
Yes?

Speaker 7 (35:40):
Had she ever tried to hit him before?

Speaker 6 (35:42):
No, I've never seen that before.

Speaker 7 (35:44):
So this fight between them was unusual. Would that be
fair to say.

Speaker 6 (35:48):
It's very unusual due to the fact that she was
so happy and cheerful in the morning we left chop Wood.
It was a completely different person, to tell you the truth.

Speaker 7 (35:57):
So the way she was in the afternoon was very
different to how she'd been during the day.

Speaker 6 (36:01):
Yeah.

Speaker 4 (36:02):
Counsel representing the family, Peter Ward, asks Bride and more
questions about his friendship with Amy and a Facebook message
where he offers to take her shooting while David Simmons
is away. Amy replies, sorry, mate, but Simo would be
funny about going shooting.

Speaker 2 (36:19):
You responded to say, I thought he would.

Speaker 6 (36:22):
Well, yeah, wouldn't you be funny if another guy was
going shoot?

Speaker 2 (36:26):
And didn't you tell her onor earlier that there was
no problem with you talking to Amy?

Speaker 6 (36:30):
Well, you know, obviously he's not going to want us
go friend going out shooting with another guy.

Speaker 2 (36:34):
So he was quite possessive, was he.

Speaker 6 (36:36):
I don't know, mate, I'm not Simmo. I can't ask
the questions on how Simo is as that person.

Speaker 2 (36:41):
I'm not asking you to answer questions about what Simo
himself thought. What I'm asking you about is on that
fourth message down you said I thought he would. You
thought that Simo would have a problem with it, didn't you. Yes,
And the reason why you thought that is because you
knew how possessive he was.

Speaker 6 (36:58):
Now I don't know how possessive he is.

Speaker 2 (37:00):
So he didn't even trust his girlfriend to go out
shooting with his mates. Is that right? Do you want
to answer that?

Speaker 6 (37:05):
No, he doesn't.

Speaker 2 (37:06):
Amy then responded that it's not like we ain't mates.
But oh well, now I know I'm not allowed to
have friends. That's pretty right, isn't it. She wasn't allowed
to have friends outside of Simo's group.

Speaker 4 (37:17):
Was she?

Speaker 6 (37:18):
I don't know.

Speaker 2 (37:18):
Did you ever see her with friends who weren't friends
with Simmo?

Speaker 5 (37:22):
No?

Speaker 6 (37:22):
I didn't.

Speaker 4 (37:23):
Mister Ward then quizzers Brydon about the day Amy died
and how he told police they went back to Gareth's
house to pick up his phone.

Speaker 2 (37:30):
Why were you going to look for Gareth's phone at
Gareth's house when Gareth wasn't there?

Speaker 6 (37:35):
It was Simmo's phone, and Gareth had left Simo's phone
on the bin that night.

Speaker 2 (37:38):
Right, So when you say Gareth had left his phone
on the bin, you meant Gareth had left Simo's phone
on the bin. Yes, okay, so you were going back
to Gareth to look for Simo's phone on the bin.

Speaker 6 (37:49):
Yes, that's correct.

Speaker 2 (37:50):
Why did you go and collect the phone if it
wasn't working?

Speaker 6 (37:53):
Obviously he wanted to simkid back out of it so
we could put in a new phone.

Speaker 2 (37:56):
You had already asked Amy earlier that day to go
and pick that phone up for him, hadn't you?

Speaker 6 (38:00):
Yes? I had.

Speaker 2 (38:01):
You sent her a message at quarter past twelve to
say did you go to Gareth to get Zima's phone?
And she responded at half past twelve to say got
his phone? And yet at quarter to three you say
you went to Gareth's house to get the phone that
she had already picked up.

Speaker 6 (38:15):
Well is that when? Is that? What the time was?

Speaker 1 (38:17):
When?

Speaker 6 (38:18):
What I said? Or has or did we go to
Gareth's house before that? So I don't remember all this
stuff six and a half years ago. So I know
we went to Garth's house and picked Gareth up, but
I don't know that was on the way home.

Speaker 4 (38:31):
Mister Ward mentions a few inconsistencies in the timeframe provided
by Brydon, and when asked by the Deputy coroner where
he's going with all this, he indicates he's underlining the
unreliability of the witness's evidence.

Speaker 2 (38:45):
The witness's account of his movements versus the messages that
were being sent and received is inaccurate. The account he
gave to police at the time he is inaccurate when
it was fresh in his mind, and that what appears
to have happened is that he has spent a significant
amount of time out pushed with Simo or back at
the house drinking with Simo, when what they should have
been doing is coming back to the house for the

(39:06):
wood buyer to collect. The fact that they weren't there
when the wood buyer was supposed to collect may provide
some explanation for why Amy is upset and why the
fight began.

Speaker 4 (39:17):
The Deputy coroner agrees there are discrepancies, but suggests this
line of questioning is unhelpful under the circumstances.

Speaker 7 (39:25):
Yes, and I've worked that out from the evidence. I mean,
she's clearly annoyed that the buyer is coming and no
one is responding. And I mean whether Josh Briden is
part of the problem in the fact that David Simmons
hasn't come back, that's kind of neither here nor there.
But I can understand from the evidence that Amy's becoming
frustrated because she's not being contacted, and that seems to

(39:45):
have been accepted by Josh Bridon in the sense of
saying it appears she was angry because it seemed like
they were ignoring David was ignoring her. There's nothing to
suggest Josh Bridon is in some conspiracy where he's actually
been at the house during all these events. And I
just can't see how questioning this witness unless he suddenly
completely changes his story and announces that he was there

(40:07):
when he wasn't, and you can put that to him,
but I can't see any evidence to suggest that at
this stage, and I'm unlikely to be hearing evidence of that,
however long I give you. I would have thought, I
accept that his evidence is not reliable in some parts,
and I mean, he kind of almost concedes that throughout,
but by all means put a little bit more to him.

(40:28):
But I just think we have time pressures here in
the sense of getting through the witnesses today. And also
I don't want people to come to an inquest and
feel like they're being cross examined in a criminal trial
when they're not. That's not the purpose of it. You're
not being aggressive or anything I'm not suggesting your manner
is inappropriate, but I just think that kind of pinning
down for all the inconsistencies in prior statements is probably

(40:51):
not perfectly suited to this jurisdiction.

Speaker 4 (40:54):
I think the corony is missing the point here. Why
would they need to go back to Gareth's house for
Simo's phone when they already had it. Could the reason
for the trip have been obtaining illegal drugs? Instead? Mister
Ward is allowed to proceed with the witness and Brydon
is brought back in.

Speaker 2 (41:10):
So, mister Brydon, we were talking about where you had
been when you received those messages. So you eventually went
to Garrett's house. You then went from Garret's house to
Simo's house, and that was after Gareth had knocked off
work about three o'clock, so you would have got back
to Simo's about three thirty somewhere.

Speaker 6 (41:27):
There, thirty four o'clock. Yes, So how.

Speaker 2 (41:30):
Long after you got there did the fight between Amy
and Simo start? Did the fight between Amy and Simo
start before or after the lizard tank got broken?

Speaker 6 (41:40):
Before?

Speaker 2 (41:41):
How long did the fight go for?

Speaker 6 (41:42):
I don't know. I wasn't wearing a stopwatch, are.

Speaker 2 (41:44):
We talking about a minute? Or are we talking about
fifteen minutes?

Speaker 6 (41:48):
Fifteen minutes?

Speaker 4 (41:49):
Brighton then confirms the rest of the events were just
as he'd mentioned in his statement, but mister Ward requires
one more clarification regarding his decision to leave and come
back shortly after.

Speaker 2 (42:01):
If you were coming back to check if Amy was okay,
why didn't you just send her a Facebook message?

Speaker 6 (42:06):
I didn't just go there to check Amy was okay.
I went there to check if everyone was okay.

Speaker 2 (42:10):
So isn't it the case that one of the reasons
why you went back there rather than just send a
message was because you were actually worried about whether anyone
might be okay?

Speaker 6 (42:18):
I said I was going back, So I went back.
That's what I said before I left. I said I'm
coming back, all right? So I went back.

Speaker 2 (42:25):
And when you got back there and there's just Garreth
sitting on the gate and he says, go away, doesn't
it make you suspicious that things aren't all right?

Speaker 6 (42:32):
Not? Really.

Speaker 2 (42:33):
The reason why that didn't make you suspicious is because
you knew that there was a problem, didn't you know?
You knew that the way that David had been acting
up earlier that day, that there might be a problem.

Speaker 6 (42:43):
David wasn't acting up in any way that day. It
was just a normal day.

Speaker 4 (43:00):
Eventually we make it to Byford, where Joshua Brydon lives
with his parents. Both cars pull up and Mark jumps
out to join Liam and the crew.

Speaker 1 (43:20):
Yeah good Joshua, Joshua, yeah exactly, mister Brydon. Yeah, Hi,
how are you too bad? Good? Thank you? Liam Bartlett
from seven News spotler, is your son Joshua here? Please?

Speaker 4 (43:35):
He is?

Speaker 1 (43:35):
Yeah? Why he is? Or he would we be able
to have a word to it? Well? Four? Well, we
want to ask him some questions questions online. We're looking
into the death of Amy Wensley. Ask him he's film
and a yes, we are, Well you can on that
Phil film right now? So can all right, Well, we'd

(43:58):
just like to ask josh are a few questions, thank
you very much. No, he doesn't want anything to do
with it. He doesn't want anything to do with it. No,
he doesn't want that. He's not well. Unfortunately, he has
got something to do with it. Well has he got
to do with it? Well, he was there on the day. Yea,

(44:19):
so he's inexorably linked to it. You can't know he wasn't.
He wasn't. He was there on the day, but he
wasn't there when it happened. He can't be. He can't
be unlinked to it. He was there. It's the trial
has been done and finished and all ways there was
no there was never a trial. There's a coronial inquest.

(44:42):
Are you filming still? Yes, we are. You can get
off my property. Per starts. He is, he is? He
all brave enough to come and talk to us. He
doesn't want to talk about it. It's a sad thing
that happened. He doesn't want to talk about it, and
so well, how much does he know about it? Don't know.
I'm not talking about I've with my life. I've told

(45:05):
the reporters one hundred times before. Leave me alone. I
can't see you film. Can't you can see me or not?

Speaker 6 (45:12):
Don't you You're invading our privacy on our property.

Speaker 1 (45:17):
All right, I don't have to talk to you. You
don't have to know. You don't have to. But for
the sake of Amy's family, I would have thought it'd
be big enough to do that. Amy's family need to
let it go. Well, they can't. They can't let it go. Well,
the truth was found that the cronial inquest. It wasn't
there wasn't a truth and you know that, Joshua. It

(45:38):
was an open finding. I've already told what I know
that day in court.

Speaker 6 (45:46):
I don't need to keep going through this ship, keep
beating for going through that day.

Speaker 1 (45:51):
Well, that's that's exactly what the family says, guys, that's
exactly what the family says, Joshua. If this case the
TV Amy's family, I don't know Amy at all. I
don't even know. Well, don't you even feel anything for that?
It's kind of happen to do with me. I've had Look,
I've been through life of my stuff. It's got nothing

(46:13):
to do with me. I don't know her. That's a
pretty heartless attitude. Why isn't that? Why is that because
I don't know if it was your daughter, mate, you
wouldn't feel too good about it either, would you.

Speaker 6 (46:24):
Of course I wouldn't feel too good about it.

Speaker 1 (46:26):
Well, you'd want answers if it was your family, if
it was your son, Joshua.

Speaker 6 (46:30):
Well, he wasn't there, so what's it good to you?

Speaker 1 (46:32):
He was there that day. He's friends with David Simmons
and Gareth Price. You know very well what the situation.
He wasn't there that day when that happened. He was
there that day, but he wasn't there. He was not there.
You don't think he knows what happened. No, guys, all right,
thank you.

Speaker 4 (46:54):
Despite admitting there were credibility issues with Brydon's evidence, the
Deputy current Is still seemed to give it a lot
of weight compared to the testimony provided by Amy's closest friends,
Erin and Tash. The incidents they described where Simmons overpowered
Amy and how Simmons joked he would dispose of Amy's body,
and then Nancy revealing what Amy said on the phone,

(47:17):
how Simmons threw her around the room, and Nancy's partner
making a statement about how Amy told him four days
before she died that Simmons had held a knife to
a throat. We'll go into more detail on that in
a future episode. None of that seemed to make any
difference because Gareth and Josh said they had a great relationship,

(47:40):
but Amy hadn't reported the domestic violence, and police couldn't
find the photo of Amy covered in bruises that she
sent to Erin.

Speaker 7 (47:48):
There were differing accounts of the nature of Amy and
David's relationship. Those witnesses associated with Amy described a relationship
characterized by coercive control and verbal abuse by David towards Amy,
and suspicions of physical violence.

Speaker 4 (48:04):
They were more than just suspicions. They witnessed it. However,
for some reason authorities did not consider those actions as violent.

Speaker 7 (48:13):
Those people more closely associated with David Simmons suggested the
relationship was volatile, with poor behavior on the part of
both parties at times. Both sides agreed the problems were
exacerbated by David's drinking and drug use. They had broken
up a few times, either briefly or for a longer period,
but always seemed to get back together. However, in more

(48:35):
recent times, Amy's family and friends felt she had seemed
to indicate she was starting to consider a permanent end
to their relationship.

Speaker 4 (48:42):
Again, it was not a seeming indication, but a fact.
Here her Honor refers to Erin's evidence.

Speaker 7 (48:50):
Erin ascribed David's behavior as very controlling and jealous of Amy,
and he would bully her and belittle her in front
of other people. Erin recalled she witnessed coless times when
David was verbally abusive towards Amy. David also apparently made
inappropriate jokes in front of Erin about the means by
which he would dispose of Amy's body if he killed her,

(49:11):
which he appeared to find funny and Amy would brush off,
although David would regularly make Amy delete her Facebook account
due to his jealousy. Facebook messages between Amy and Erin
were provided to the police spanning a number of years.
As early as the eighth of July twenty twelve, Amy
told Erin that she had an argument with David about
his drug use and started punching him, and in response,

(49:34):
he had man handled her, choked her, and chucked her
around the room. She said at the time her adrenaline
was pumping, so she didn't feel anything. Erin also recalled
that prior to moving to Broom in late twenty twelve,
Amy sent her photographs of bruises to her neck, which
she told Erin had been caused by David.

Speaker 4 (49:53):
The deputy coroner then refers to Natasha Cels's evidence.

Speaker 7 (49:57):
On one occasion, when Amy was nine months pregate, Natasha
recalled that David came home drunk and a fight started
as Amy was unhappy with him. For going out drinking
at such a time. Amy began yelling at him, and
then they both had a grip on each other, pushing
and shoving. David eventually pushed Amy into the kitchen and
grabbed her around the neck while she was still grabbing

(50:17):
on to him, as she never backed down. Amy and
Natasha had spoken about suicide in two thousand and nine
when Natasha was experiencing her own relationship issues, and Natasha
strongly recalled Amy telling her that no man is ever
worth killing yourself over. Natasha believed that Amy's view on
that would never change. One of Amy's more recent friends,

(50:41):
Shelley Stanley, who was still in close contact with Amy
before her death, also prepared a statement and gave evidence
at the inquest. Shelley met with Amy in twenty twelve
and saw her for the last time about twelve days
before her death at a barbecue. Miss Stanley described Amy
as a kind, thoughtful, and insl rightful person who was

(51:01):
mature beyond her years, and an amazing mother. Shelley and
her ex partner used to regularly go camping with Amy
and David, and Shelley and Amy became close. Shelley became
aware that things weren't going well between Amy and David,
and she understood Amy was saving money so she could
leave him and move out with her daughters. Amy told
Shelley she just wanted a peaceful, quiet house without all

(51:25):
the anger and aggression that came with David. The text
messages that Amy and Shelley exchanged certainly indicate that Amy
was very unhappy about David's drinking and felt he wasn't
willing to put in the effort to save their relationship,
so even though she wanted to keep her family together,
in May twenty fourteen, she had been making plans to
take her daughters and move out. Based on all the

(51:48):
information obtained, the WA police concluded Amy and David's relationship
had been tumultuous and characterized by arguments, but there was
no confirmed evidence of physical violence by David towards.

Speaker 4 (52:00):
I'm just going to stop here and repeat what the
coroner just said, No confirmed evidence of physical violence by
David towards Amy. She goes on to say.

Speaker 7 (52:11):
Indeed, the only direct witness accounts of any physical violence
between the pair came from evidence of the two friends
who were present on the day of Amy's death, Gareth
and Josh, where they witnessed Amy assaulting David and David
physically restraining Amy. Both these witnesses described this incident as
out of character for both of them, and Amy as

(52:31):
the aggressor. It's clear from the evidence that despite the
difficulties in the relationship, Amy was committed to trying to
make it work. In my opinion, some of the most
compelling evidence of Amy and David's relationship comes from reading
their messages to each other that were downloaded from their phones.
They were obviously private messages, so I won't repeat them

(52:52):
in too much detail.

Speaker 4 (52:53):
However, there are.

Speaker 7 (52:54):
Messages on the twenty sixth of May twenty fourteen that
indicate David and Amy were talking about getting married. Their
message exchanges are generally affectionate, although there is some obvious
jealousy on both their parts. On the twenty ninth of
May twenty fourteen, they had an argument and Amy offered
to move out and complained about the fact it was

(53:14):
David's father's property so she wanted to get her own place.

Speaker 3 (53:18):
She also suggested she.

Speaker 7 (53:19):
Would leave both girls with David, at least temporarily until
she found a place of her own. However, this blew
over quickly and the messages returned to normal. These messages
support the descriptions of the relationship being volatile and subject
to jealousy and threats of separation, but also that they
also appeared committed to each other. Although they had separated

(53:41):
a couple of times, particularly due to David's drinking, Amy
had taken him back each time as he promised he
would change. However, Nancy believes that on the night Amy died,
things had changed and Amy had had enough she wasn't
going back. David, on the other hand, gave evidence that
he thought it was their usual kind of fight and

(54:01):
she would leave and then return as usual.

Speaker 4 (54:04):
So in short, there was not enough evidence of domestic
violence extraordinary.

Speaker 1 (54:17):
Next week, we probe deeper into why Robert Simmons' first
thought upon finding Amy dead was that his son killed her,
and how Amy's friend and Gareth's ex wife. We made
las bar slice for the kids, We got vegetables ready
for dinner, and then the boys were late, so I

(54:38):
went home and then that was it was threatened after
she was accused of being a snitch.

Speaker 4 (54:44):
Rachel, you're a give up dog.

Speaker 3 (54:46):
I no longer have a sister.

Speaker 4 (54:47):
It's gloves off. When I see your next maggot, I'll
be coming for you, So take your big hole and
fuck off somewhere for good.

Speaker 6 (54:53):
You listen your c.

Speaker 5 (55:08):
SO deation.

Speaker 2 (55:13):
We both know the now set you me.

Speaker 5 (55:23):
S.

Speaker 1 (55:30):
If you knew Amy and have information, any information about
her death, we'd love to hear from you. Just email
us at The Truth about Amy at seven dot com
dot au. That's s e V E N The Truth
about Amy at seven dot com dot Au, or visit

(55:56):
our website sevenews dot com dot Au forward slash the
Truth about Amy. You can also send us an anonymous
tip at www dot the Truth about Amy dot com.
If you're on Facebook or Instagram, you can follow us
to see photos and updates relevant to the case, but

(56:19):
for legal reasons, unfortunately, you won't be able to make
any comments. And remember, if you like what you're hearing,
don't forget to subscribe. Please rate and review our series
because it really helps new listeners to find us. Presenter

(56:41):
and executive producer Alison Sandy, Presenter and investigative journalist Liam Bartlett,
sound design Mark Wright, Assistant producer Cassie Woodward, Graphics Jason Blandford,
and special thanks to Tim Clark and Brian Seymour. This

(57:15):
is a seven News production.