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July 15, 2025 38 mins

Today on The Breakfast Club, Malcolm D. Lee On 'The Best Man,' Spike Lee, Sable Bourbon, Essence, Peacock; Career Success. Listen For More!

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Episode Transcript

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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Wake that ass up in the morning. The Breakfast Club.

Speaker 2 (00:05):
Morning everybody, It's dj NV, just hilarious. Chelamaine the guy.
We are the Breakfast Club. Lola Rosa is here as well,
and we got a special guest in the building. Yes, indeed,
Malcolm d Lee. Good morning, what's going on? How are
you feeling? I'm great now. Malcolm de Lee is a.

Speaker 1 (00:21):
Writer, directing producer.

Speaker 2 (00:22):
He's worked on so many different things, The Best Man,
Girls Trip, Night School, The Best Man Final Chapter, so
many of the name. How are you feeling this morning.

Speaker 1 (00:29):
Brother, I'm fantastic. I'm very glad to be here, happy
to have you. Man.

Speaker 3 (00:34):
You just put out a book called The Best Man
Unfinished Business.

Speaker 1 (00:37):
I need to know.

Speaker 3 (00:38):
Why would you continue the Best Man series of a
book rather than a movie or TV show.

Speaker 1 (00:42):
Well, I've always loved the written word. Number one. I'm
a storyteller at heart.

Speaker 4 (00:48):
It's very difficult to mount a television show, in a
movie getting all those great actors back together, very difficult.
And I've fantasized about being a novelist. I thought, Okay,
here's an opportunity to try my hand at novel writing.
Do it with characters that are already established, they have
backstory already and let me give it a shot. Plus

(01:10):
it gets the story out faster. I mean, fans said
they wanted more, and I thought we were done at
the final chapters on Peacock. Still number one on Peacock
by the way, But I said, okay, this is a
way for me to, you know, try novel writing and
get the story out to fans quicker.

Speaker 3 (01:28):
But if you have another story, why wouldn't Peacock being
that y'all broke records on Peacock, as you said, it
was the number one show on Peacock, still number one
on Peacock, Why wouldn't they say no, no, no, no, no, Malcolm,
we need that here.

Speaker 4 (01:42):
Well listen, I'm not saying that they wouldn't or didn't ask,
but I thought at the time it was I was done.

Speaker 1 (01:51):
But then the idea came to be, Okay, let's.

Speaker 4 (01:54):
Try it as a as a book, and I think
we can tell more in depth story with the book.

Speaker 1 (02:00):
You know, there's you know, you get to use all
five senses.

Speaker 4 (02:03):
We're countering on three different characters in this Harper, Robin
and Jordan, right, and so they're the kind of like
the crux of the of the franchise, and I felt like,
here's an opportunity to not be more expansive in the storytelling,
but also let's get into the psyching of these characters
and in a more in depth way. Is it possible
to get every by everybody back together?

Speaker 1 (02:26):
Yes, but it's very difficult, very money money, keep yeah,
keep going.

Speaker 4 (02:32):
It's it's it's difficult. I mean like those those are
all working actors, right, and it's tough to get them
back together. And then you have you have budget constraints, uh,
you have the demands of the network.

Speaker 1 (02:44):
In the studio.

Speaker 4 (02:45):
With a book, it's just me and my co author
j and Allen to just say, okay, here's a story
that I want to tell.

Speaker 2 (02:50):
I want to go back if you don't mind, Malcolm
d Lee coming up in this industry. Yes, you write
The Best Man? Yep, So how do you go for me?
How do you get it to where it is? Being young,
being first time doing it, to getting an opportunity to
even do it. So break it down where you're from
and how how you even came up with the concept
and idea.

Speaker 4 (03:10):
Okay, so to start, you know, The Best Man was
my six screenplay and I wasn't even trying to direct
it at the time. At the time, I had written
another romantic comedy that I was trying the fund.

Speaker 1 (03:23):
I couldn't find the money for it.

Speaker 4 (03:24):
I said, I'm going to write something so commercial that
I'm going to take that money when I sell it
and make my my independent movie. But in the midst
of writing it, it was also called My Homeboy's Wedding
at the time, and I was like, I'm never going
to use that title, So it was called My Homeboy
It was in the beginning, That's why I named it.

Speaker 1 (03:42):
But I knew that was never going to be My.

Speaker 4 (03:44):
Homeboys winning that was not but my Homies, no, no,
But so I knew that wasn't gonna be the title.
But I was like, okay, So in the midst of writing,
I said I could, I could direct this, And I
remember giving it to Spike. Was he gonna be read
all my screenplays? I already had an agent by that
time as well, but no thing was happening.

Speaker 2 (04:00):
Where you originally from?

Speaker 4 (04:01):
I'm originally from Well. I was born in Queen's raised
in Brooklyn. Yeah, we're first cause his father and my
father was now deceased. My father's around, he's our brothers
and so yeah. So then I was in my parents' basement.
I finished the script and I said, if this ain't it, then,
you know, I don't know what I'm doing. I'm gonna

(04:22):
probably be a lawyer or or or or a teacher.
And so I handed the script to Spike and he said,
this is the one.

Speaker 1 (04:31):
And so right after that we went to Columbia Pictures.

Speaker 4 (04:36):
We had hit a deal at the time, and uh,
you know, the start of the process. We didn't land
anywhere until you know, maybe six eight months later at
Universal because Spike was you know, Spike was the kind
of person that dead says if they don't want to
do it, we move it on, right, and so meaning
meaning like we're not listening to any notes, but not
this is here's the script. We're making this movie, right.

(04:58):
And Columbia was like, well, like do a little to work.
He was like, f that, we're out of here. And
I was like, well, you know, I'm just kind of
playing catch with the whole time, kind of like okay,
all right maybe, And then we went to Disney and
then a few other places and we were getting like, well,
we'd like to do a little.

Speaker 1 (05:12):
Work and he was like, we're out of here. And
then I was like, can we slow down a little
bit please? So Universal said, hey, we'd like to see
the script. Okay, I get I get to.

Speaker 4 (05:21):
Pay pay you to to do the rewrite and then
if they don't like it at the end, we go
to someplace else. I said, all right, fine, we'll just
you know, we'll slow it down. So that's what happened,
and you know, the process started. I did a two
month rewrite and got to a place where it was
it was the right script at the right time. You know,
like if Love Jones or Where to Exhale or Soul

(05:45):
Food didn't proceed that movie, it wouldn't have gotten made.

Speaker 1 (05:50):
The acting community was ready for it. Here were eight.

Speaker 4 (05:53):
Roles for black actors that can just be people and
not you know, characterizations or caricatures or ide kick or
the sassy.

Speaker 1 (06:01):
One or the hood nigga or whatever. You know.

Speaker 4 (06:03):
It was like, hey, this is like just eight postgraduates
who were you know, coming back and it was you know,
had the right tone also, so you know, it kind
of worked out that way. And I and certainly my
idea was to make a classic movie. It was not
Thank you know, and and that was that was that
was the you know, the the intention. But beyond that,

(06:25):
I wasn't thinking about anything else. Just happened to be.

Speaker 1 (06:28):
You know, there's been able to like turn into something
more over the years.

Speaker 2 (06:32):
Now involved with Spike with the first Best Man movie.

Speaker 4 (06:35):
You know, Spike, you know pretty much like dude on
your own. Why that's pretty what it was. He said,
He said, Okay, you know the script is good. You know,
the the guy greenlit going. He showed up the day
the first day of shooting. I mean we had a
couple of you know, disagreements about casting and you know,
music and stuff like that, but you know, I stuck
to my guns about who I wanted and what I wanted,

(06:57):
and he was like very supportive of it. He was
there for day one of the shoot in the very
beginning in the morning, said good luck and he was out.

Speaker 1 (07:04):
And then you know I saw him in the edit.

Speaker 4 (07:07):
You know, he looked at it cut and he was
like change maybe considered changing this, change that, and.

Speaker 1 (07:12):
That was it.

Speaker 4 (07:13):
He let me, Spike is very much the person that's
like it's the director's vision.

Speaker 1 (07:18):
You do your you make your movie, right.

Speaker 5 (07:21):
I was going to ask you I was. I rewatched
the Best Man Final chapters before I started this, and
in one of those episodes, Harper hints at there's supposed
to be this spin off about the love story between
him and Nia Long, But then this book kind of
gives that vibe too. Was that did you drop that
egg on purpose? Or that just happened like that?

Speaker 2 (07:40):
Nah?

Speaker 4 (07:40):
I wish I could say that it was all like
part of a master plan, but no, you know, but
you you write things and then you see what's what
has been established, and you know, trying to build off
of that.

Speaker 5 (07:53):
So and building off of that because you decide to
explore Robin Harper and Joy his lives like separately, even
though there's still intertwined. Right, how did you decide that?
I know you mentioned it was only these three characters?
How do you know like this was the story because
there's so many spin offs that we learned about in
Final Tan.

Speaker 4 (08:09):
And we're going to like, right, so like this is
the book one of a trilogy, right, And so I
know that the plan was I'm gons start with these
three because I think these are the three that that
people are most interested or the most kind of polarizing,
because you know, Robin made some decisions in the last
in the final chapters that people were very upset about.
So I want to give her a chance to like
explain herself. And I will say, also, let this back up.

Speaker 1 (08:31):
A little bit.

Speaker 4 (08:32):
Doing a television show, as you said, it's like be
great to do, but like it's also very restrictive in
terms of budget.

Speaker 1 (08:38):
In front of the story. I want to tell you
we wanted to do ten episodes.

Speaker 4 (08:42):
We're only able to do eight because of again many
different things scheduled and whatnot.

Speaker 1 (08:46):
So again, be able to do it in a book
is different.

Speaker 4 (08:48):
So in doing these three characters, I wanted to like
kind of like get answer those questions about you know,
what's going to going on with Robin And I'm sorry with.

Speaker 1 (08:58):
Jordan and Harper, it's Robin doing.

Speaker 4 (09:01):
Because they're still intertwined, because there's there's still share a
child that's has been a long time together. And then
in book two and three, we get into Lance's POV
and we're getting into Quentin's pov uh Candice Shelby and
and and expand on the story from there.

Speaker 1 (09:17):
But you know, and we were gonna end it, uh.

Speaker 4 (09:20):
With with with these three with these three characters were
going to be like, we're gonna wrap up their story,
but they're going to continue because we have a bit
of a cliffhanger at the end of unfinished business.

Speaker 3 (09:31):
You know, black content, uh can have tremendous success but
still not get respect from whatever platform or or our industry.
So how did Peacock react to the success of The
Best Man final chapters?

Speaker 4 (09:45):
They were ecstatic, you know, they were ecstatic. I mean
it was I don't I don't. I don't want to
say necessarily that it saved the network, but it certainly
was a big boost for the network. So they want
more from me. They you know, they would love to
have another or Best Man. But again, you know, it's
very very tough.

Speaker 3 (10:04):
Yeah, but saying you you would love to have something
as one thing, showing improving it through the actual budget
is another.

Speaker 1 (10:12):
Is that the problem? I think that's part of It's
a challenge. It's a real challenge.

Speaker 4 (10:17):
I mean, like you know, again in terms of like
what what they value and what they're like. This this book,
for instance, takes place in four different cities, two different continents.
To have that kind of budget to make that movie
with all these actors take Avengers type money, right, you know,
I mean I'm exaggerating, but like that's what it would
would take.

Speaker 1 (10:36):
Do they think it's worth it?

Speaker 4 (10:37):
I don't know, because it's like how much I don't
know how streaming works versus subscriptions, versus how much they
can they can afford, and how much they're going to
be able to expend, and how much they want what
they value.

Speaker 1 (10:47):
I don't know.

Speaker 4 (10:48):
But all I know is, Okay, here's here's an opportunity
to tell the story in another way. And listen, the
books get turned into television shows and movies all the time,
so you know, but that wasn't the intention.

Speaker 1 (11:00):
Here. We'll see what happens. We are all.

Speaker 2 (11:03):
Surprised with the success of The Best Man and how
as well as did since ninety nine, because it's like
another ending story that you know, it's generations and new
generations of kids watching and listening and viewing.

Speaker 1 (11:15):
Yeah, you know, I'll say that because.

Speaker 2 (11:17):
I'm surprised it was ninety nine. I had to look
at my damn ninety nine.

Speaker 1 (11:20):
Yeah, man, I don't know, but yeah, it was.

Speaker 4 (11:24):
I listened, like I said, I intended, and I thought
I could make a classic. But I thought that was
gonna be it, like you know, and I didn't want
to be, you know, a sequel type thing because like
it's like they wanted to a sequel right away, and
I said, no, I want.

Speaker 1 (11:37):
I want other stories to tell. I want these characters
to grow.

Speaker 4 (11:40):
And I'm glad I waited, because you know, there is
more story to tell as we as a people get
more mature and get you know, different stimuli and different
things that that enter our brain. It's like, you know,
and especially as we get older, right, and the culture
changes and shifts and whatnot. I wanted to be able
to infuse that with these characters as well. So well,

(12:00):
you know, the fact that I was able to do
it has been great, you know, like and really with
Best Man Holiday, it was also a very strategic move
in terms.

Speaker 1 (12:07):
Of like what's the what's what's.

Speaker 4 (12:10):
Everything was about branding around twenty twelve, right, you know,
twenty ten, right, and they were like, okay, what's my brand?
And I needed to need to work too, because I
wasn't working a whole bunch. And I said, okay, it's
time to make another sequel or make another Best Man movie.
And because my brand is the Best Man, so that's
what happened, and you know, we met made it so
that The Best Man Holiday had a cliffhanger, also that

(12:31):
we didn't tell another story. But you know, at the time,
Universal Pictures was not meeting where I wanted to meet
budget wise, you know, and for another movie. So so
I shifted to make a series because streaming was so
popular at the time, and I thought, Okay, we could
tell more story. And I knew I had two more
movies that I wanted to tell there and then I thought, Okay,

(12:54):
now we're done.

Speaker 1 (12:55):
But we're not done.

Speaker 5 (12:57):
It's crazy, though, because when you mentioned The Avengers, I
was sitting here thinking, like, how the universe of like
those type of characters work, and this is a universe
like I would literally follow those storylines and not even
just the main characters, but we're introduced to their children,
like LJ has a story, you know what I mean.
So it kind of is that. But it doesn't seem
like from what you're saying, it's getting that vibe when
you go to these networks.

Speaker 4 (13:18):
No mind you, I did not try. I did not
try to say, oh I want to make another.

Speaker 1 (13:25):
Show. I didn't say, like, let's make another one.

Speaker 4 (13:28):
There are other things in the works that may or
may not have to do it best Man, but I
wanted to write the book first. That's that's why I
felt like that was the next logical step. Again, mounting
a show is very difficult, and it's cost a lot
of money. There's a lot of demands, a lot of
compromises that have to happen. And again, gathering all that talent,

(13:50):
you know, for a span of time is also a challenge.

Speaker 1 (13:54):
And I'm getting old, you know.

Speaker 4 (13:57):
I want to do things that you know, that move me,
that motivate me, and I think this is a good
way to do it. And again it can always shift
and change, but I got I have to do wrote
this book and write two more.

Speaker 3 (14:10):
How do you navigate the balance between cultural storytelling and
commercial expectations?

Speaker 4 (14:16):
Interesting, I try not to worry too much about about
commercial success. I have an eye on it always. I mean,
when I wrote best Man, that was both commercial, and
I wanted to write something commercial, but something that I
thought would speak to me and the people that then

(14:37):
audience that that that that hadn't been had been underserved
at that point. So I always have one eye on
commerce and one eye on artistry, and then just try
to hopefully make those meld, and you have to keep
an eye on what's what's happening, you know, Like wedding
movies were very popular at that time. There had not
been a black wedding movie to date. And I said, okay, well,
I love ensemble movies. I love the dramedy tone of storytelling.

(15:02):
So that's what I want to try to do. And again,
it was the right script at the right time, and
I just try to make the best movie that I
possibly can. And if it's not my job to market it,
it's their job to market it, you know.

Speaker 1 (15:15):
And and if I've given.

Speaker 4 (15:17):
You a movie that's that's play has playability, it's your
job to make it marketable.

Speaker 5 (15:24):
I was going to say that finding the right movie
at the right time was kind of similar to what
you guys did with Girls Trip to or at this
point our networks coming to you trying to find that,
like what's the right movie at the right time, because
it seems like that's a part of your brain.

Speaker 4 (15:37):
Now, well, I think they're always trying to copy. It's
a copycat industry, right. Whatever successful, they're going to try
to make more of more of that. I think with
Girls Trip, you know both Hangover and Bride'smaids preceded that movie.
And Will Packer Hans to me and he said, maw,
let's take actors from Best Man and think like a man,

(16:01):
and let's make you know, the Hangover treating for black women.
At Essence, I said, I'm in right, and so you know,
it just kind of it was again another right place,
right time type of deal.

Speaker 1 (16:15):
It has to be the right script.

Speaker 5 (16:16):
Also, didn't break your heart when you saw this stuff
that was happening with Essence just recently.

Speaker 1 (16:21):
You know, It's funny I did not.

Speaker 4 (16:23):
I was there right, I was voting the book I
didn't have I didn't notice, you know what other folks
were noticing, because you know, I was being shifted from
this place to that place or whatever.

Speaker 1 (16:32):
I didn't really like get.

Speaker 4 (16:33):
You know, I wasn't really exploring and I went, you
know to the concerts and things like that.

Speaker 1 (16:38):
It's a little bit. The tenants was down right, but
I said, I was like, it wasn't as packed as
it usually right. But I think some of that has
to do with economics. I mean, folks, yeah, people don't
have the disposal income.

Speaker 4 (16:50):
You know, it's it's it's it's not strictly just because
you know, management has changed. I think that's part of it,
or at least that that's the sense I'm getting.

Speaker 1 (16:58):
From people online.

Speaker 4 (16:59):
I didn't have that experience that I felt like, oh,
like this is really changed.

Speaker 2 (17:03):
It's gonna sound stupid, but you should do a guide strip.
I've seen so many not stupid that go to New
Orleans because they're looking for women, right, and they know
that they're looking for whether it's married women that that
take their ring off for that weekend, or it's single
women that's out there. There's so many fellas that put
their flyers outfit on and they had and they.

Speaker 1 (17:23):
Go out there looking for it. Be called the Yian.
The young niggas gonna be you're old and you're doing
that that, Oh yeah, it is, like.

Speaker 5 (17:35):
Necessarily it's the older scale of men that come.

Speaker 3 (17:40):
You shouldn't be no forty fifty year old bachelor in
a pack still chasing women ence, because you should be
grown and mature.

Speaker 5 (17:48):
It should have been already. Person's rundown's that happens at
that point?

Speaker 1 (17:55):
How is any women?

Speaker 5 (17:56):
Are women raging age of essence? I'm sure yo, hey skin.
When we think about a girl's trip.

Speaker 1 (18:06):
Regina Hall was married yep.

Speaker 3 (18:08):
Right, Tiffany was the wild right one.

Speaker 4 (18:11):
But but but but Jada was divorced, and so was
and and and and Latifa was was free also, so itou.

Speaker 3 (18:17):
Have to be Yeah, so the guys have to have
a different backstory than just being a bunch of wild
by the.

Speaker 4 (18:21):
Way and be like that, Like like, I'm not saying
that we're not doing or we are doing a guys
trip movie, but you're not.

Speaker 1 (18:30):
You did not plant that idea in my head. Just
wanted to make just to be clear.

Speaker 2 (18:36):
But it's funny because you go out there and you know,
the guys that used to be able to drink, they
take two shots to pass out. Now guys me naps.

Speaker 1 (18:42):
Now it's funny though, But I agree, I agree, I mean, yeah,
I don't. I think we wouldn't do at essence for guys.

Speaker 4 (18:50):
But even though, like I had a best friend, a
really good friend rather who said, like I was telling
him I was doing uh girls trip and he was like, oh,
essence I got. I got a bunch of essence wives
And I was like, oh interesting. So like they say
to say, the women that you don't have a chance
with in regular time you gotta you gotta, you gotta
shot with that's this weekend.

Speaker 1 (19:10):
The people that be like they free they seen that weekend.

Speaker 5 (19:12):
I've been no, no, no, I ain't. But I've seen
you know, I've seen all the know. I know. I'm
just saying I've seen that. Like I've seen people. And
there's a lot of stories too. People revisit Essence Fest
on their anniversary because they met there and now they're married.
Like there's a lot of that. It's kind of like homecoming. Yeah, yeah,
what happens. But I was asking you about that in
your branding and networks coming to you because in Best Man,

(19:35):
one of the things that Harper's trying so hard to
do is like not let the networks take too much
of him and be like white wish. How do you
do that? Because you're working with these big platforms, but
like it's still very much us and we feel it right.

Speaker 4 (19:46):
Well, you know, I first of all, try to have
as much integrity as possible in the storytelling. I'm trying
to tell I'm my mission on this earth is to
tell elevated stories about black people and making sure that
our humanity is highlighted and that we normalize black life
in America. That's my mission in life, particularly when it

(20:08):
comes to black men. That's what I've been put on
this earth to do. That's my that's and that's and
most of the time they respect that, particularly if they
think it's gonna make money, you know what I mean. So,
like that's just part of my DNA.

Speaker 3 (20:23):
Oh that's good because when you do this best Best Guy,
whatever it is, when you do this story about the
men going to Essence, you gotta have every single type
of man represented. You got to have the one man
that's there, letting these dudes know how stupid, Like.

Speaker 5 (20:39):
We should have been passed this already.

Speaker 1 (20:41):
We need to go back to the room. Now, we
got to go one more club, one more ball.

Speaker 3 (20:44):
Now, Okay, you know what I did, which happened after
The Best Man, the final chapter and because of the
success of The Girls Trip, I thought that was gonna
make other platforms say, you know what, there's other shows
we can do that with, like Girlfriends. I feel like
Girlfriends is just sitting there and Girlfriends is to show
that we didn't get no closure on So it would
make all the sense in the world to do something

(21:06):
like that.

Speaker 5 (21:07):
So I don't understand why.

Speaker 3 (21:08):
When we have success with something like The Best Man
Wed in Hollywood doesn't say that's the new mandate, we
need more of that.

Speaker 4 (21:14):
I think you know a lot of that has to
do with behind the scenes stuff too. You know, you know,
you don't know what's going on with again, with schedules,
with the with the creative process. You know, where people's
heads are, how much money they're offering to to to
produce something like that. I think Mara has talked about
doing a girlfriend a movie. I think uh if Bett

(21:37):
Lee Bowser has talked about, you know, rebooting living single
in some form of fashion. But I mean again, it's like,
you know, what they're currently doing versus what uh you
know it's on the horizon, versus what studios are gonna
do or pay for. I mean, the business of filmmaking
and in studios in Hollywood is contracting.

Speaker 1 (21:58):
It's shrinking.

Speaker 4 (21:58):
It's not expanding, you know, it's it's only getting smaller.
So you know, and they're only going to do things
that that have IP and and those are great examples
of you know IP that that's already exists that you
know they could build on.

Speaker 2 (22:13):
But is it difficult to do those positive type of
movies like you know, you look at what it costs
to do that Best Man and how much you made,
and how much you cost to do Girls Trip and
how much you made.

Speaker 1 (22:23):
I feel like we should get more of that.

Speaker 2 (22:24):
But we don't see any of that, Like you don't
see a Love and Basketball, you don't see a Best
Man anymore.

Speaker 1 (22:29):
You don't see a.

Speaker 2 (22:30):
Lot of those movies anymore. That's positive for our country.
You don't see it as many.

Speaker 5 (22:35):
Forevery on netflixt.

Speaker 2 (22:37):
Good I'm told about movies.

Speaker 4 (22:39):
Well, movies are very It's very hard to get people
to get out of their homes to go to a
movie theater nowadays because everything is so easy on streaming.

Speaker 1 (22:46):
It's like, oh, I'll just turn.

Speaker 4 (22:47):
It on to get people that come out of their
homes and.

Speaker 1 (22:52):
Buy popcorn or get a babysitter or whatever.

Speaker 4 (22:55):
That's a increasingly Yeah, it's got to feel like an
event otherwise, like or you know, I'm gonna miss out
on something if I don't go see it. And so
that's what the students are really struggling with right now.
It's like what what Because it costs so much to
not only make a movie, but to market and promote
a movie that like, it's got to be worth the shot.

Speaker 1 (23:15):
Can they make?

Speaker 2 (23:16):
Are they making them money back when it's on a
network like that, Like like you spend let's say whatever
the cost to do a movie and they put it
on a Netflix, right, Is Netflix making them money back?
Because it's suscriptions, They're gonna make that money monthly anyway?

Speaker 1 (23:28):
Are they?

Speaker 2 (23:28):
Is it worth it for them for that?

Speaker 4 (23:30):
I think it is becausetherwise they stop making it. Yeah,
I mean I think that, yeah, they they they their
costs are are not as high when it comes to
market and promotion, and they can then it's you know,
available across the world, so they have a lot of.

Speaker 1 (23:45):
You know, ways that they can make money. I think
streaming is just.

Speaker 4 (23:48):
Just easier for people to like click on things, but
they also you have to have certain things happen right away.

Speaker 1 (23:56):
Althwise, people be like a I don't want to watch that,
I go onto something else. That's what it's. It's I've not.

Speaker 4 (24:00):
Made a movie for a streamer I mean other, I
mean television show. I think movies on streaming can be
very can get lost and be very forgettable because people are.

Speaker 1 (24:12):
Just kind of like whatever, you know, that's cool, that
was nice.

Speaker 4 (24:15):
But it's like and so that would be very hard
for me to to take and feel like, oh, I'm
making some kind of cultural impact. I think movies do
have the ability to coachally be impactful, and it's not
always the case. It's not you can't always be culturally impactful.
But in a in a movie where you know, grolture,
but obviously it's one of those movies. Best Man is

(24:36):
one of those movies you just hope that that deserve
a big canvas and you know people will go see him.

Speaker 3 (24:42):
I agree, because when you set it up as a
TV series, that's more of an event. When the Best
Man final chapter is eight episodes, it's like, oh, I
got right, But if it was this best Man in
the movie, I'll probably watch.

Speaker 1 (24:54):
But it's not right an event, right exactly exactly.

Speaker 4 (24:58):
I think, like, you know, fortunately we were able to
platform it in a way that you know, it gave
peacocka a lot of subscribers based on you know, that's
great cast and this great franchise.

Speaker 1 (25:09):
So you know, we were very very fortunate to do that.

Speaker 4 (25:12):
And I would like to keep doing that in television,
to tell those kind of event event tires type of stories.

Speaker 1 (25:20):
And it's why that we don't look at it like that, Beau.

Speaker 3 (25:21):
If you get in eight episodes of an hour series,
that's like four movies.

Speaker 4 (25:25):
Yep, it felt like it too.

Speaker 3 (25:28):
When it comes to the book, do you have to
run the characters arcs past the you know what the
actors and the world like this is where I'm taking
y'all characters?

Speaker 4 (25:40):
No, I mean, you know, especially in this form, it's
like these these characters came from me, so I own
them and I dictate where they go. It's you know what,
where they do have an influence is like you know
what they look like and their voices and their facial
looks Russians and you know, I think that's you know.

Speaker 1 (26:03):
Part of the storytelling. But no, I don't. I don't.
I wouldn't be consulting them.

Speaker 4 (26:07):
It's it's not the only time you have to consult
them is like when it's when it's time to actually
do it and then on that or to make a
movie or a television show. And in that instance, you know,
that's when the collaboration is happening. But on the book,
it's just me and my and my my co author
Jane Allen, and you know, the editor.

Speaker 3 (26:25):
The only reason is because you know one day you're
going to have to get them to play these characters
again for this story.

Speaker 5 (26:31):
They lived in real life.

Speaker 1 (26:32):
People still I don't know, you know again, but we
don't we don't know.

Speaker 4 (26:37):
I mean, but when that time comes, if that time comes,
then we'll we'll we'll cross that bridge.

Speaker 5 (26:43):
Now that the characters have called you about the book
and been like hold on, now, why did I have
to nobody, Neela, nobody has called you about that, yeah,
or like just being like yo, I like where you
took the character because like Nia long or Jordan's finally
getting a repeat of Reprieve.

Speaker 4 (26:57):
Well, well, Harold and uh Mare and Tane, my business
partners and Table have have read it and and they've
got given me feedback. The others I haven't heard from
yet in terms of that that they've read it.

Speaker 2 (27:08):
It depends on budget to because you can get a
cheap version of Morris right there. That's not cheap versions of.

Speaker 3 (27:14):
Things, but you know, but that would never work for this.

Speaker 1 (27:17):
You have to have ingredients.

Speaker 5 (27:19):
It would never kill you if you reach Oh you
can't say certain words either.

Speaker 1 (27:24):
That's what what can he say?

Speaker 5 (27:26):
Like words with words? Now you were talking about. You
were talking about your co author, Jane Allen. So she
did Black Girls Mess Die Exhausted?

Speaker 1 (27:42):
Correct?

Speaker 5 (27:42):
I read. I didn't know that there were different iterations
of the book. I read the first one that she did, Yes,
there's two more, okay, and that one. I mean, I
work in media, so it spoke to me like so clearly.
When I saw that she was your co author, I'm like, oh,
Jordan's life is literally like a lot about what Jane
writes about interesting, like just because she talks a lot
about black women trying to figure out basically not like

(28:05):
to wither yourself away by like surviving life? How can
you live life? And then I thought about the black
women in this series, and I'm like, ooh, I wonder
if you all came together because you thought that way
or did it just happen?

Speaker 4 (28:15):
Well, I mean when I interviewed with Jaye, I read her,
I'd read her books, and then I sat down with
her to talk about the collaboration process.

Speaker 1 (28:24):
I really liked her her life experience.

Speaker 4 (28:26):
You know, she had been an attorney, she had worked
for Prince, she had worked for Lady Gaga, she had
had a number of entrepreneurial businesses before she decided to
become an author, and so I really like that, and uh,
and I liked her writing, and I thought she'd be additive,
particularly as a black woman, you know, who had had
corporate experience, you know, with with the telling of these stories.

Speaker 1 (28:45):
So it was pretty much a no brainer.

Speaker 4 (28:47):
And well, it really wasn't a no brainer until she
said to me, like, why are you doing this? I said, well,
I'm trying to excise new muscle. I'm trying to get
into the novel run. And she's like, no, no, what for,
Like what are you doing?

Speaker 1 (28:56):
I said, I don't know.

Speaker 4 (28:57):
I thought that was pretty explanatory. And then she said,
do you want to win? And I was like, huh, yeah,
I want to win? Do you want to be you
want this? Are you all in on this book? Are
you just trying to like just be like whatever with it?
And I was like, no, I'm all in. I'm I'm
I'm I want And I love that spirit, you know,
of like someone that's like got the same kind of
work ethic that I do. It's like, Okay, let's push

(29:18):
ourselves to make the best product possible. And I think
we've done that with the book, you know, I think
the people are really going to if they've loved The
Best Man, The Best Man Holiday and the and the series,
they're gonna love the book because it's more expansive storytelling.
It's it's, it's it's I think in more more depth
than the movies and television. You're you're able to do
things in movies intellivision that you can't or in a

(29:40):
novel that you can't.

Speaker 1 (29:40):
Do in movies and television.

Speaker 4 (29:42):
It's like that you use all five senses you need
to feel, taste, smell, see here, it's it's all all
those things are engaged, and it's a very cinematic experience
because you already know who the characters are, what they look.

Speaker 3 (29:54):
Like, what what legacy are you personally building. That's distinc
from the family the lene.

Speaker 4 (30:03):
I think it's there are some intersectionality between what Spike
has done and what I'm doing, what Spike is continuing
to do, And primarily that's that's that's elevating, you know,
the humanity of black people, on the normalization.

Speaker 1 (30:17):
Of black life. Don't forget Joey Joey Lee my cousin.

Speaker 4 (30:24):
Yeah that's okay, no, no, and yeah no, trust me,
Like you know, you know, uh, Spike's brother David as
a photographer, you know, and so so I don't know,
like I I I'm trying to create my own lane.
I have, I have, I have created my own lane.
It's different from what Spike does. Spike is like, you know,
a true filmmaker artist, right, you know, I'm I'm I

(30:44):
tend to make movies, although I'm trying to like be
an artist, you know, but you know, my lane has
been like.

Speaker 1 (30:51):
Trying to be much more of the commercial route.

Speaker 4 (30:54):
And and again it's about normalization of of black life
in America and abroad.

Speaker 5 (31:00):
How did you know or why did you decide to
finally explore Ty Diggs in uh in SNAILI Than's character
like not trying to get back together because Harper and Robin,
Harper and Robert, yes, right, like, because I feel like
there's been times where like we see them go apart,
but then I always thought that they would try and
figure it out again. Especially Yeah, I.

Speaker 4 (31:20):
Mean, I wanted to explore, you know, what life was like,
you know, post divorce, and you know the circumstances behind that,
because I mean, you know, Harper you know, could have
probably made some different choices, you know, you know, and
and and but now he's he's got all the trappings
of success. He's got the you know, he got the
bachelor pad and in Dumbo Brooklyn, he's got you know,
critical successes, being a Pulitzerprise winner.

Speaker 1 (31:43):
But he's alone, right, I mean, he not lonely, but
he alone.

Speaker 4 (31:47):
And you know, he's enjoying his bachelor life style, but
he doesn't quite fit into his life the way he
used to, and especially with his friends.

Speaker 1 (31:54):
He's the seventh wheel. And in this in this, in
this book, he is kind of ask himself.

Speaker 4 (32:00):
The question, did I do the right thing? Have I
could I have done better? And so is there gonna
be a reconciliation perhaps? You know, Robbin's over in Ghana,
And I went to Ghana by the way to do
some exploration and just probably get put my foot on
the soil and and breathe the air and taste.

Speaker 1 (32:16):
The food and be with the people.

Speaker 4 (32:18):
So I could really fill out that side of the
story and explore like what life was like for a
returney to to Ghana. Uh So, yeah, I mean there's
there's there's a lot of explanation or I was an
exploration of what's what was the right thing?

Speaker 1 (32:35):
And should he return to a woman that was like
made him the man that he is.

Speaker 4 (32:42):
And you know, also he's got his daughter's preteen daughter
that's missing him as well, you know, across the Atlantic.

Speaker 1 (32:48):
So it's lots for him to be thinking about.

Speaker 4 (32:50):
And there's also his friendship, his long term friendship with Jordan,
and you know, are they going to finally link up
and finally get together and are they really soulmates or not?

Speaker 1 (33:02):
You're smiling. Have you finished the book?

Speaker 5 (33:04):
No? I didn't finish it. But the last time that
we talked, I asked, you, did you give my girl
Jordan a reprieve? Does she finally get her situation together?
And say, you were at Rooth's picnic. You said I
had to read the book. You wouldn't tell me anything.
But in reading it so far, I feel like it's
like she's in the middle. It's like, yes, and no.

Speaker 1 (33:22):
You finished the book.

Speaker 5 (33:24):
It was a long book to a whole conclusions. No,
I was just about to ask about So where I'm
at so far? I think she's doing a lot of
like self like.

Speaker 1 (33:34):
Yeah, she's in therapy right now.

Speaker 4 (33:36):
Yeah, Yeah, she's she's doing some self help in choosing
herself and trying to like, you know, get herself write
and ask herself the questions of why she is the
way she is. We get to explore when where she
grew up and how she grew up, and we get
this to meet her parents in this in this book
as well. So I mean, I think we're doing a
lot of exploration with with Jordan and the choices that

(33:57):
she made, and you know she does and for the long,
long at time, she was always about the grind and
like making sure that she could get to the top
of that corporate ladder, and it really didn't serve her
at the end of the day. And now she's like,
you know what, my heart has never been what's led me.
And now I do want love, I want to be chosen,
I want I want all the things that you know
a woman like her should have.

Speaker 5 (34:19):
I was wondering if that decision to go that route
was yours fully, or Jane's or both of you guys together,
just because we didn't really know. I never realized until
reading the book, I didn't really know much about Jordan
outside of all her accomplishments, right, And that's been a
big conversation with black women.

Speaker 4 (34:33):
Yeah, yeah, no, I mean, you know, I certainly wanted
to explore all those things. I wanted to explore some
of them in the series, but you know, time constraints, right,
I'm able to do that now, And certainly collaborating with
Jane was a great help, you know what I mean,
we crafted the story together.

Speaker 1 (34:49):
I knew kind of the general direction I wanted to go.

Speaker 4 (34:52):
But when you start, you know, working with somebody, and
particularly you know, a black woman that gives you a
different perspective than you have, this is you know, great
story building.

Speaker 1 (35:00):
So so it was. It was a collaboration.

Speaker 2 (35:02):
I'll say, that's right, Well, we appreciate you for joining us.

Speaker 3 (35:06):
Yes, go get the book, Man the Best Man, Unfinished Business.

Speaker 4 (35:11):
And I want to say it's particularly you know, black
women are going to read this book and engage, and
they're going to like it. But I want it not
to be I want people to be reminded that I
did write this for black men. I wrote the original
for and about black men, and I want black men
to read the book.

Speaker 1 (35:30):
And if they don't want to read, listen.

Speaker 4 (35:32):
To it on audio, right, you know, like just I
want them engaged and I want them to have. We
had a very spirit of debate on one of my
book tour stops in Baltimore where like men and women
started like going at it, you know about like different perspectives.
And I think this is it's a it's a healthy,
robust debate that can be had.

Speaker 1 (35:48):
And if black men will engage.

Speaker 3 (35:50):
On this, is there any singular love story in The
Best Man that's a reflection of your personal views on love?

Speaker 4 (35:56):
My personal views on love, I don't know about. Well,
maybe there's definitely parts of me in it, you know
what I'm saying. So like, fortunately, I, unlike Harper, even
though I've been selfish in my in my time, I
am not divorced, and I'm not planning on it, and
and and and you know, there's a balance that has
to happen with your career aspirations and your family life

(36:19):
and your partner that's going to you know, uh, either.

Speaker 1 (36:22):
Support you or not, you know.

Speaker 4 (36:25):
And so you know, I think what's important is you know,
the love that not only that that that the characters
have without one another, men and the women, the husbands
and the wives, but also amongst the fellas, right like
the brotherhood, the friendship that support that they have for
one another and holding each other accountable as well. So
that's certainly a personal thing of mine for sure.

Speaker 2 (36:48):
All right, well, Malcolm, de late ladies and gentlemen, appreciate
you for joining us.

Speaker 1 (36:51):
Thank you, thank you very much. Oh you are. How
about that sable bourbon owned by you more as not
Harold Parano and t Diggs.

Speaker 4 (37:02):
And so we came out last August and we're getting
around the country and and and exposing people to disabled.

Speaker 1 (37:08):
It's a great, great poor.

Speaker 3 (37:10):
What's the title mean?

Speaker 1 (37:11):
I mean the name well, disable is another name for black.

Speaker 4 (37:16):
It's you know, luxurious, it's it's it's rich, and I
think it's it's very much emblematic of you know, what
we consider as our friendship and our brotherhood. And it's
this this, this, this bourbon is bottling brotherhood. And so
you know, it's we wanted to bring the best man
experience because every every scene where the fellas got together

(37:38):
were drinking a brown spirit and we said, okay, like,
let's make our own. And so it's it's emblematic of
that experience of brotherhood. And you can take it away
with you and have a sip.

Speaker 1 (37:47):
With your fellas.

Speaker 2 (37:49):
All the ladies Lauren's got it up already. Yeah, see
Malcolm d Lee.

Speaker 1 (37:54):
It's the Breakfast Club. Wake that ass up in the morning.
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