Today on The Breakfast Club, Dr. Jay Barnett & Dr. Joel Tudman Talk Men's Mental Health, Friendships, Finding Yourself. Listen For More!
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Every day.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Up click up the Breakfast Club finish for y'all done. Yes,
it's the world was dangerous?
Speaker 3 (00:08):
Want to show to Breakfast Club the god DJ Envy
just hilarious. Envy's not here, but Lauren Lerosa is and
and we got some special guests in the building. Man,
the good brother, doctor J Barnett along with doctor Joel Tutman.
How y'all brothers doing man?
Speaker 1 (00:21):
Man, We're good Man, feeling good this morning, Man, feeling
real good.
Speaker 3 (00:25):
You know you see Doctor J on the Just Hill podcast.
Y'all y'all going to Just Hill tour together?
Speaker 1 (00:30):
Yeah? Yeah, Man, So it's been exciting man to Just
Hell podcast with doctor J. Man. We lunched back in
April and just to see how it's grown.
Speaker 4 (00:40):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (00:40):
Shaw was on me for years, like, bro, you gotta
do a podcast to like you gotta be on the network.
And I wasn't. If I could be honest, I wasn't
a podcaster because I'm like, man, Jess, how this is.
This is a gift that y'all do to get up
and and the talk and all of that. I love
to speak because when I speak, I have this this
(01:02):
structure that I follow and then I'm going these different places.
But the podcast has really grown me to hear other
people's stories, so it's like therapy and real time. And
from having my sister Raji on Kirk Franklin, Rico Love
and then I have some people who are just everyday
people that are sharing their healing journeys and just sharing
(01:24):
where they are. So it's been a fun journey.
Speaker 5 (01:26):
Man.
Speaker 1 (01:27):
So now I can officially say yes, I'm a podcast.
Speaker 5 (01:31):
Hell love it.
Speaker 6 (01:32):
You guys have like a really cool dynamic because I mean,
you're pastor you do mental health and like all these things. Right,
But y'all know in our community, a lot of times
when you're going through some people like just pray about it.
How do y'all have conversations around that.
Speaker 4 (01:44):
It's more than prayer. I think prayer is very essential,
but it's the backbone. It's a substratum of everything. But
there has to be practical application because you're human, so
that is the spiritual component. But if you don't have friendship,
you don't have people that can walk you through the journey,
then you'll often become lost. And I like to say
(02:05):
people become mystic. They just stay in this spooky vial
and uh and Again, that's not to talk about the
church background, because I have a strong church background, but
having therapists, having people that can actually supply sufficient support
really can help change the dynamic of what you're going through.
I think that's very important.
Speaker 3 (02:24):
And UH used to be associated pastor at the Potter House, right, Yes, sir,
But did you love to go to Florida?
Speaker 2 (02:31):
I didn't know that could happen. They made it sound
like you was transferring schools and something you were playing
one place.
Speaker 7 (02:38):
You know that could happen.
Speaker 3 (02:41):
I mean, I just the way they do I guess,
I guess the pothouse the way you know, the way
they worded it, I'm like, okay, Yeah, I.
Speaker 4 (02:47):
Went there to learn from who I believe to be
the greatest of all times. I think Mishop Jakes is
the greatest of all times. And I went there to
learn and there was an opportunity that opened up in Florida,
and so that's how I ended there. I ended up
there because he trained me. I was prepared and we
ended up in Florida. And God's been good to missus
have been there.
Speaker 2 (03:07):
How did that work?
Speaker 1 (03:08):
Though?
Speaker 2 (03:08):
Like when you like, like what does the spirit tell you?
Speaker 1 (03:11):
Like?
Speaker 3 (03:11):
I want to be. I need you to go, you know,
lead this congregation, that lead this flock.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Now, like, what is it?
Speaker 4 (03:17):
What hits you? When I was in Oklahoma originally, and
when I was there, I knew that I wasn't going
to be there forever. And so the opportunity for change
didn't start at the Potter's house. I was coaching at
Oklahoma State University and and pastoring at the same time,
and so the opportunity to shift came at a good season.
(03:38):
Church was doing fine, my work was doing great, and
I went to preach for Bishop Jakes. So I had
to sit back and realize, Okay, the things that I
wanted to see happened in the future career wise and
ministry wise, came through an opportunity of another individual. There
wasn't a voice from heaven, a chap that came down
and said move. It wasn't that. It was a man
(03:59):
of God looked at me and said, what's your future?
What do you What do you want to be? What
do you see happening where you want to go? And
when I told him that, then it unlocked something for
me to start looking at. And when I started looking
at it, I started saying all the insufficiencies, all the
places that needed work, all the places that needed a
model or mentor, and he filled that void. And then
(04:19):
from there it was a challenge, what do you want?
And I had to answer that question and that answer
was move. Wow.
Speaker 2 (04:26):
That's where y'all met, right, yeah?
Speaker 1 (04:27):
Yeah, yeah. We met in Dallas. A friend of mine
had sent me a video and like, yo, I just
found your spirit animal. I was like, all right, So
I started watching his clips. He in a gym, killing
it in you know, he's a strengthing conditioning code. So
we got the whole football background from watching how he speaks,
and I said, yo, I really rock with this dude.
So I'm say pause. I slid his DMS, but but
(04:55):
I hit him up and like, yo, brother, I love
what you're doing man, And we we had at some
exchange but didn't know that we both moved to Dallas
during the pandemic at the same time, and slowly, you know,
started kind of engaging. But I'd engage him to come
on my tour to Jessere Bro. I had four voices
and I was like, you know, we need a five,
(05:16):
and I could reached out to him. I said, Bro,
I want you to go on tour. Now here's the
story about the development of friendship. This brother was not
having it, Jess. And the more I would text him
and like, hey man, you know, brother, you know, look
forward to having your on tour. He would come on
the tour, he would get on stage, do his thing
and would just sit in the back and wouldn't say anything.
(05:37):
And I felt, you know, that he needed friendship. But
I also felt compelled like I just couldn't let it go.
And I would text him and check in on him, like,
hey man, I hope you all as well, brother, Just
checking in, and he would just text back the army, mooji,
the muscles because he was not And I understood as
(06:00):
we begin, because it's difficult men, and study shows this.
Men have a difficult time making friends after thirty five.
And this is the real reason why a lot of
men are suffering in silence and suffering in their mental
health because of the lack of community and the lack
of friendships there. They're not like women. They don't engage
(06:21):
and most men don't build friendships beyond their workplace. And
our friendship started from a challenge of who can lose
the most weight and get down to you know, get
down to the lowest body fat and that built the
friendship that people see that we have today and the
love that I have for this brother, and I saw
it in him. Like I said, Bro, you're one of
(06:42):
the best to me. And I think when you are
building friendships, you want to have friendships where somebody can
see more in you than you see in yourself in
that current space.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
Why were you so guard it, doctor Tuban?
Speaker 1 (06:55):
Yeah, please tell the world. How tell the world how
he would leave me on red And it didn't bother
me because and I want to add this, when you
have dealt with your rejection or abandonment issues, how a
person response doesn't trigger you. Yeah, because I didn't know
(07:16):
what his experience was, but I knew I wanted to
keep showing up for him.
Speaker 4 (07:21):
Friendship is important to me. It's very essential. And I'm
too old to start over in certain places. So for me,
I have fresh room, fresh wounds. As it pertains to
mail the male friendships, brothers real strong relationships, and I
had just gotten to the point to where I was
okay without the relationship, and so when this good brother
(07:45):
reached out to me, he was very persistent. I didn't
understand him. I didn't understand this process, his makeup. He's
a therapist, so his mental is really really strong, mind strong,
but it's more defensive versus just being vulnerable. So I
had a difficult trying to be vulnerable. And so he
kept pressing and kept pressing and kept pressing. I wasn't
(08:06):
really interested in that. I was okay. I wasn't. I wasn't.
I was okay with working out. So I was doing
a challenge. He jumped in on Instagram and said, yo,
I can I run you. I was like, man, get
out here with all that. You're too big, you know.
So that's what happened. So we went into this forty
day challenge, and then maybe twenty something days within to
(08:29):
the challenge, he kept coming on. My lives kept coming on,
kept coming on. He said, man, won't you meet me?
Let's box. So that's what happened. I met him at
the gym somewhere in the twenties of the count and
our friendship started taking off. Now, as it started taking off,
I was still very very guarded because I was not
going to get another homemade, another homeboy. I was fine, okay,
(08:49):
But as we continued to train. We started having therapeutic
conversations about what's going on in your mind? Why are
you having a hard time dealing with abandonment? Rejection actually happened,
and then as far as my career speaking, he said, hey, man,
I want you to come on a tour with me.
I went on the tour, but I still wasn't going
to get close to all the rest of the guys.
(09:10):
I had broken through with him just a little bit.
So we go on the tour, We're do our thing,
and I sit in the back, not talking because I
don't want to be involved emotionally again. That way. However,
we broke through. He's become a best friend. Over five years.
Now I have a much softer side. I was too hard,
(09:33):
and I think God did an amazing thing by bringing
him into my life. So now I don't have it.
I had what's called toxic masculinity, very toxic.
Speaker 1 (09:41):
And break that down because somebody gonna get it and
they gonna create their own definition with toxic. But but
you know what, JT. I don't think it was really toxic.
I just think it was guarded because we both had
father wounds. Yeah, and when you've had father wounds, it's
hard to build mail to male friendships because when you
(10:04):
have not been fathered well, you're very guarded and you're
very defensive because there's a part of you that have
not had a very safe relationship with another man. So
for another man, and you know, like, you know, I
bought flowers and you know, I mean, I'm all the things,
but then the duality of that I'm a lion and
(10:27):
a lamb, and so he got to see that. But
I understood it. And it wasn't that I needed a friend.
I just like, there's just some people that you just
felt drawn to, and I think that's beautiful. That's a
great way to put it.
Speaker 4 (10:39):
Lyon and lamb. I was all lyon, no lamb in sight.
So to actually start experiencing other men that were so
transparent that they could so show you the lamb, that
took time for me to adjust. So I wasn't going
to express how I felt. Bishop Jakes broke me from that.
He kept saying how do you feel? And I was
(11:00):
sending a strong arm emoji or I would send fire,
you know, and he says, I'm tired of that. Explain
to me what you feel. But I didn't have the language.
I didn't have the language to explain it. That's a
part of that toxicity as well, because if you can't
explain it, you throw signs okay. And so it took
me going through all of the therapy why I rejected
(11:25):
my father, why my father wasn't there, the terrible relationships
with my parents, the terrible relationships with my brothers and sisters,
all of the things that were wrong with me. I
started paying attention to the tension because the tension was
causing me to break. So if you don't pay attention
to the tension, you will pay for attention. And that's
(11:47):
what actually happened. So because I wasn't paying attention to
the tension, the tension started fracturing me. And not only
did it fracture me, it started fracturing the relationships around me.
And everybody knows what a Fraction's a fracture. It's a
break that you can't see, all right, it's a hairline fracture,
but there's a break there. And what ends up happening
is some kind of blow is going to create a
(12:10):
break to become visible to where you're going to have
to either cast it or break it completely so they
can reset it. And that's what happened to all of
the relationships that I was attached to.
Speaker 1 (12:20):
It wasn't their fault. It was my fault.
Speaker 4 (12:22):
Because I had allowed so much pressure, so much tension,
to come into my own personal life. It became difficult
for me to converse productively with other people, especially of
the man.
Speaker 3 (12:34):
But what about when it's not your fault? Because I
agree with you, know what you said, doctor j about
the father woman. But that homeboy woman is real too. Yeah,
that's a real wom too, because when I love I
love her. I called you my brother, and then you
betray me in some way. It's just like damn, it's
hard to let people in.
Speaker 4 (12:48):
I can't control what he does, but I can control
how I handle it. And that's what happened. I couldn't
control it. I was covering it, and I needed therapy
to deal with what happened between the two of us
the previous homie. And I think also to that JG
and then to what you said sharp like the same
experience that he had was a betrayal of a close friend.
(13:11):
I had the same thing, and it was so difficult
for me because I saw men as just being I
wouldn't say just a point of contact, but just almost
like you know, it's just a homeboard, a homeboy. But
for me to call your brother, that's it's like, that's
that's a different level of love. It's just like when
you tell somebody I love you, you know, I mean, that
(13:33):
changes your disposition toward them. That's why I don't throw
out I love you, you know what I mean?
Speaker 1 (13:37):
And so because that's now, that's now a different level
of expression of my of my feelings towards you. And
I think for me that betrayal man, I was just like, dude,
how do you even because when you're in your thirties
and you start an agent, I felt what he felt like, Man,
how do you start to build friendship again? Because we
(13:59):
all know friendship takes time and then now on that
friendship also requires a level of vulnerability, and I didn't
want to be vulnerable.
Speaker 4 (14:06):
Like that again. But I think for me, it's like this,
I had two of the same thing, two opposing things
happen at the same time. So I get betrayed by
this one guy that we've been boys for twenty something years.
Then I got this other guy that is trying to
befriend me, all right, and he is being one hundred
percent open, saying, hey, I don't want anything from you.
(14:29):
I just believe I'm supposed to be here for you,
all right. This is prior to him, and this guy's
pouring his heart out. But I don't have what I
need to give this guy. So it breaks this guy.
It breaks him so bad. To her, He's like, you
know what, man, I've given enough. So I got to
protect me. So when I felt like I was ready,
(14:52):
once I realized okay, I think I'm better now, I
tried to go back and repair that relationship and he
didn't receive me the way I thought he should receive me,
and I went back selfish again. I was like, hey, man,
I came to you. I'm apologizing. But then I realized
I hurt that guy even though I didn't have the language.
I didn't have everything to give to him, but I
(15:14):
learned it through him. He was a therapist. He's teaching me. He'sy,
hey man, you heard him. Now you got to go
through the process and walk that out. That's a part
of me understanding becoming more healthy, getting that toxicity out
of me, because if I hadn't learned the language. I
would have been ticked off at this dude said, Man,
I came to you, I tried to I said, I'm sorry.
I told you I didn't have a language. You can't
forgive me, But that's wrong. I got to give him
(15:36):
time to process. It is not his fault that I
didn't have what it took to give him what he needed.
So that's why I said, regardless of what the other
individual did, you got to fix you. If you don't
fix you, you can't help repair anything. It all starts
with you. You have to own the responsibility of what's
going on with you.
Speaker 5 (15:58):
How do you What.
Speaker 8 (15:59):
Does that process look like? Because I do the same thing,
I'm in the same boat. Like literally right now I have.
I've been betrayed by a friend at the friend at
the friend and that's fine. I'm getting all the sneaks
out the gud and that's cool, you know, because where
I'm going I can't take everybody, so that's fine. But
even in business, I don't trust nobody. That's that's my problem,
(16:19):
you know. And when somebody called me a sister, the
same thing, you know, I got friends called me sister,
whether it's friends in business, or whatever. You know, if
I call you my sister or my brother. Yeah, and
I feel like you do some somesh that will make
me sighe out of you. It's like, Yo, I don't
I don't know how to look at you. I don't
know how to continue to have you know, a level.
Speaker 5 (16:40):
Of loyalty or a level of respect, you know what
I mean, or just even want to be around you.
It just gets weird.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
You know.
Speaker 4 (16:45):
I got a question for you. Yeah, why do you
keep bringing that same type of person into your life
To even have to ask that question.
Speaker 5 (16:55):
I don't know how they get in. They be sneaking in.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
I don't be bringing.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
You know. So I think I think I think we
all can agree, right, Like you know, me and Shaw
talk about this all the time, right, I mean, I
think we can all agree that as we are elevated,
and particularly when you are elevated in the public's eye,
it requires Like Jess, I remember when you first started
(17:30):
right just with the messine, you know what I'm saying,
when you were just doing your thing. And I think
what happens is as God has elevated me, it has
required a level of sagaciousness, right, which is discernment that
I have to really operate in because now that you
at this place, everybody wants something. And one of the
(17:51):
things that Bishop told me, he said, You're going to
have to get accustomed to disappointing people that want to
be next to you. And so what I've had to
really look at him give attention to is why are
you here? You know, like if he would have never
responded in the way that was how long was that
(18:11):
period of time you went silent on me? Three months?
Three months? And I would text him Lauren and no response,
But it didn't bother me. Char I'll text him sometimes
like none of that bothers me because I know, But
I don't go into that. I do. I don't go
into that because the genuineness of who I am as
(18:32):
a person is that whether you respond or not, I
just want you to know that I'm here and that
your thought of And I think we have too many
people now because the world has become very transactional, and
that if we're honest, most individuals' mental health is on edge.
(18:52):
Most people are just one decision away from moving into
a psychosis. And I think it just requires another level
of of of discernment and then also realizing what types
of people do I need it in this season? You're
married now, right, so the people that you need in
(19:13):
your life right now, it's not necessarily that they have
to be married, but they have to be people that
have a level of authenticity, level of genuineness and wholeness,
lacking nothing, meaning that if I don't hear from you,
if I can't give you nothing, you're still here.
Speaker 2 (19:30):
Yes, he said wholesome.
Speaker 4 (19:40):
You're going to have to trust. You're going to have
to start trusting people and understand that a part of
trust it comes with being broken. I mean, it's that's
just a part of it.
Speaker 3 (19:51):
But it's not that doctor, because I could, I agree
with the trust.
Speaker 4 (19:56):
Got to be open to the fact that you may
get hurt. So protecting yourself, you're only hurting yourself because
you could be protecting yourself from what's going to actually
heal you. Okay, So you could be the cause of
staying in the same cycle because you won't trust, and
so because you don't trust, you state you stay fractured. Okay,
(20:17):
you got to trust people. That doesn't mean you have
to trust them at the same dimension. You know that
you don't have to trust me to take care of
your kids, you know, but you can do your work
to make sure that. Okay, I'm going to use him
to fix my car. So how many people have how
many cars have be fixed before? Do your work, do
your due diligence like you do with everybody else, and
then you got to step back and trust the process.
(20:39):
But knowing the process may break down.
Speaker 3 (20:42):
Is that the same mindset is like not expecting you
from other people?
Speaker 1 (20:46):
Absolutely?
Speaker 4 (20:47):
Yeah, and you I think a good friend of mine,
aching a Odal, told me divorce yourself from the results
and fall in love with the process.
Speaker 7 (20:58):
It's good I didn't done that.
Speaker 4 (21:01):
Yeah, that's easy for you to say that until you
start doing so, you're going to always say that. Most
people say this, He's just said and done. Try it.
There's going to be lessons that you learn from being broken.
There's going to be lessons that you learned from the
actual relationship actually formulating. So he talked about the time
that I didn't respond to him two months. I think
(21:23):
it was I didn't really three three I didn't respond
to him. I didn't respond to him. Because here's the deal.
My answer is the same now, listeners, my answers the
same I didn't have the language. I didn't have the
language for what I was going through. How long were
you going to use that story? But that answer is
not going to keep working for you if you want
to live your best life.
Speaker 1 (21:44):
But I think also I'm talking about me, but it
was valid because also you didn't really know what it was,
and you spelled trust T I m e is I
used to really spell trust It's time the time I would.
I mean, I was okay with him going through his process,
(22:05):
and I think what broke him was this brother's not
going He's there because it wasn't contingent upon him responding.
And I think what most of us, it's always about
what is the response because we live in such a
If I text you, most people have anxiety from okay,
(22:25):
they didn't text back. The job hasn't called yet, you
know what I mean? And so we we are, we are,
we are operating with this rapid response. You know, as
God began to expand me, I didn't realize, like just
sometimes I'm overwhelmed with text messages and I can't respond.
And it's not that I'm leaving you on red because
(22:46):
I don't want to talk to it it's like I'm
overwhelmed because it's like, man, I got to process what
I need to say. Then I'm thinking about this email
and then my manager's like, hey, can you give me
this publicist is saying can you send me that? So
I had to realize is that I need to change
my position even within myself, and to give myself grace
(23:08):
and man, I don't even have the words right now,
and being okay with that, and then being okay with
being perceived as oh, so you can't respond.
Speaker 5 (23:18):
Yeah, right, so you're right. That's that's me to see.
I don't trust you all. Y'all know too much. I'll
be thinking about the other person, like trying to think
for them. You can't.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
It's exhausted. It's exhausted.
Speaker 3 (23:32):
I'm gonna be asking both of you all a questions, Right,
can't time being illusion in a relationship? And what I
mean by that is you could be with something. You
can know somebody for years and years and years and
years and think you trust them, right, but then they
be the ones that betray you. But then you might
meet somebody that you knew for a short period of
time and you feel more loyalty to that, to that individual.
Speaker 4 (23:53):
Ooh, that's a that's that's a loaded question. That's a
loaded question because you can't effectively diagnose that statement without
hearing from the other individual. What is it that created
distrusting them? What is it that created them to pull
(24:13):
back from you? They may have found something on you
or in you, or with you that caused them to
pull away. So that's hard, that's hard. That's hard to
look at. And then with this new person, is it
a trauma bond? Are you connected to them because you've
broken over there and they were able to supply something
to you. Because the keyword you used was feel feelings
(24:36):
they come and go. You may feel that way right
now in thirty days and in the thirty first day
you feel like you felt with the last person that changed,
So we can't use that statement. I think at the
end of the day, when it comes to time, time
is what it is, whether you want to call it
an illusion or whether you want to call it reality,
is how you invested. Okay, what am I investing in
(24:58):
the moments of time and with the people that I
believe deserves my time?
Speaker 1 (25:04):
So my question to you is, and I'll ask you
this question because look at where we are today. Yeah,
And to your point, shar it's like Lauren and you
can hop in because I would want to know your
thoughts and process on how you've navigated this space, because
there's people that was rocking with me, and I think
as I begin to do this, it's shifted, and I
(25:27):
think the disloyalty was also if we're going to keep
it abuve some level of insecurity within themselves because most people,
if they're riding with you, most people's fears is that
they want to be left behind.
Speaker 7 (25:42):
A lot of people that if.
Speaker 1 (25:44):
You become what I see the trajective, the trajectory that
I see of you, and I think that disloyalty comes
in because it's like, man, they've gotten there and nothing
has happened. For me. I've seen a lot of that,
and then I've seen what you're saying where people that
I've met through the expo that we've been locked in,
(26:07):
you know what I mean, because our missions aligned. And
I also think too, for the public, it's be open
to levels of friendship shifting because your.
Speaker 4 (26:16):
Life is shifting, right, Yeah, that's beautiful.
Speaker 1 (26:20):
Like you have to be open because most people won't change,
and particularly if your life changed in a major way
because they're always going to see you how they met
you and how the world is coming to know you.
It's challenging for them because in their mind, I still
see your Lawrence from Dell State.
Speaker 7 (26:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (26:40):
I think I've been blessed to have people that always
saw me, sometimes bigger than I saw myself. So as
things are going up for me, like you know, not
everything has changed. But I think the hardest thing I
had to learn was I can't call everybody about everything,
and when people take offense to that, I can't take
it personal. And sometimes I do realize that maybe there's
(27:01):
an insecurity and like you know, people are trying to
like figure out where where they are positioned.
Speaker 7 (27:06):
In my life. Now it's like, well, why are you
doing this now?
Speaker 6 (27:08):
You didn't do that a year ago when I had
time to do different things, or when I needed to
call you more because at that season in my life
it made more sense. So that has made me think
about different things and different people and like not disassociating fully,
but just like being very careful about when I bring
those conversations those people into my life and where I
bring them into and what I bring them around, just
because I don't know how sure they are about themselves,
(27:30):
and I don't have time to.
Speaker 7 (27:32):
Like, I literally mentally can't.
Speaker 6 (27:34):
I'm I told you when you walked in here today
last night with the bet at eight pm. Normally I'm
at bed at like twelve thirty one o'clock and I'm
back up at four or five because I'm doing so
much to prepare for here, I don't have time to
figure out your insecurities in my.
Speaker 7 (27:46):
Own at the same time, you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 6 (27:48):
So I've just had to learn how to like really prioritize,
realize that I can't take anything personal because people take
everything personal now, and you know the people that make
like there are certain people I call about certain things
now that if I were to call other people, not
that I love them less, you wouldn't even understand what
I'm talking about.
Speaker 7 (28:05):
So I just can't do that.
Speaker 6 (28:08):
I also have been blessed to have like es Envy
and Charlemagne, so as that's happening, I can call them.
Speaker 7 (28:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (28:13):
I do call him a lot, though, and be like, hey,
I can't spend as much time my mom and my
grandma right now, and it's breaking my heart, and they
feel a way what do I do? I got family
members who are like, when you come home, you're so tired,
you don't want to spend time with us, but we
see you everywhere else. I got friends that you know,
I can't. I'm not texting back as much in the
group chat, you know, Yeah, but it's a part of it.
(28:35):
I'm lucky though, I do have good people around me
who kind of get it. But I think everybody, as
a human you want to make sure, oh am I
still important to you?
Speaker 7 (28:43):
You still love me? Like am I? And that's a
human thing?
Speaker 1 (28:45):
Has that and I'm not And it's not deep, but like,
does it in some way? You know? Maybe I want
to say impact your mental health? But it does? Does
it weigh on you?
Speaker 6 (28:57):
It does because you feel guilty. You feel like, am
I leaving people behind? Do I think I'm better than
people like you start second guessing things that you know
are not true about yourself. Like I know how I
was raised, I know what's important to me. I know
what my priorities are and all the things. But when
people you love and people that have been in your
life and seeing you forever feel like I'm competing with
(29:19):
people that are just starting to see you now you
feel a sense of responsibility for that, And for me,
I've had to be like oftentimes I sit and be
like how much of this do I need to be
accountable for? And how much of this I can't I
have no control over? And that's tough. That's really really
tough because a lot of it if you don't have
control over, you can't control, Like literally there's nothing I
can do. So it's nothing that you feel like you're
(29:43):
breaking something that has been like your stability for your
whole life because of a moment that's happening. And then
you second guess that, like, well, if all this stops,
y'all even still gonna love me anymore? Because y'all feel
like I'm being new to y'all and I'm not being new.
I just I can't manage everything at one time, you know.
Speaker 1 (29:59):
What I mean?
Speaker 7 (30:00):
I mean like that mentally weighs on you a lot.
Speaker 4 (30:02):
That is so profound, man, Okay, because anybody that's achieved
anything is going to go through that. And if you
have a good support circle, so commendable for you, and
I would soak in it. I would soak in that
support circle, and then I would appreciate my support circle
so that my support circle can continue to feed into me. Yeah,
(30:25):
because that other crew is going to always say what
they feel. They don't even have an under like you said,
they don't even have the words to understand. They don't
even have the motions to understand what you're going through,
how your life is on the rise, and the demand
for your life to be everywhere. But at the same time,
now they want you to still do what you used
to do and you can't do it. So you've got
(30:45):
to feed that circle that's feeding you so you can
constantly stay uplifted, because if you don't, eventually that crew
could possibly turn into that crew if you don't feed
them to make sure they understand what the journey is
like for you. So kudos for you for having the
circle that actually can still feed you what you need
to still feel normal, because as you become more successful,
(31:09):
it seems like shots fire from everywhere and kind of
he and I were talking about it. When you have
to process publicly what you go through what should be privately,
it becomes so difficult and then that weighs so much
on you mentally, especially for pastors. That's why you see
so many pastors fall or commit suicide because it's difficult
(31:33):
to process publicly. Nobody wants to process public I don't
care what position you have in the world.
Speaker 6 (31:40):
I have a question for you off of that. Recently,
everything that happened with you in a faith city. So
you were there and then they sent out a letter
that you will no longer be seenior pastor. That was
very public, especially because you know the church. They want
to know what happened. No one knows why that happened.
So two questions, I don't know if you can share
what actually happened, and then second question, you spoke about it.
(32:02):
How was processing that publicly?
Speaker 4 (32:04):
What happened? We disagreed, were disagreed in mission. I didn't
do anything wrong, nothing illegal, but we disagreed and the
disagreement didn't allow us to go forward, so that relationship
was severed. Processing it has been difficult because it's public
(32:31):
and it hurts. I love those people. I love those people,
I love him, and trying to move forward is something
you have to do to live. I don't care what
the career is. And if you stay in a fracture,
you're going to break, You're going to crumble. So trying
(32:53):
to move forward with a cast when everyone is already determined,
predetermine what you've done and have absolutely no idea and
no information, no information. That's it's difficult. So trying to
talk to your children, pick your children up and move anywhere,
no matter what the career is, to get them to
(33:16):
trust you as a father. Hey, I made the right
decision to pick us up and move us across the
world and then have to turn to figure out how
we're going to make it. The pressure of this was
what it was. Now I got to figure out how
to make it what it is. It's difficult as a husband,
(33:36):
as a provider. Now do I trust in God one
hundred percent? I trust in all the skills that God
has given me, and He has opened up doors that
are just unbelievable for me. So processing it has been
I'm not going to say difficult, but it's been uneasy.
(34:01):
But through it all I still thank God. That's not
that's not a church answer. That's my faith because I
know all things work together for the good.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
I wish you was here this weekend because you know
we got the mental health.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
Expot this weekend. Got called and yeah, my good.
Speaker 3 (34:17):
Sister Debbie Brown came up with this, she wanted to
do this panel called Reclaiming Faith Healing from Religious Trauma
and Pastor Call Lynton, doctor Teddy.
Speaker 1 (34:25):
Reeves are on it.
Speaker 2 (34:26):
And I think it was crad I was up here
talking about church. Yes, it was cree right.
Speaker 3 (34:30):
It's just like, man, what do you do when when
your trauma comes from your sanctuary, when that hurt comes
from that place, you go for salvation?
Speaker 1 (34:40):
Man. I think one of the things that my father's
passed in thirty five years walking alongside you know him. Uh.
You know, when you look at church, it's a hospital,
and it's a hospital that has a lot of six
people who don't take their meads. And when you have
(35:01):
people who don't take their meds, you have people who
don't understand how their behaviors, don't understand how their reaction
impacts those that are in the hospital as well. So
it's almost like you in one room and you're trying
to get some rest because the doctors said you need
to rest, and you have somebody down here that is
having a breakdown because they just heard a diagnosis that
(35:23):
they can't change. And I think the unfortunate thing that
has happened is that a lot of churches have not
thought about mental health in the faith conversation. And I say,
you can't talk faith, you can't talk God, and omit
mental health. When God made us, he made mind, body,
(35:45):
and spirit. Mental health is your social it's your emotional
and physical makeup. It's how we do life. I call
mental health life in motion. There is nowhere around it.
And I think now you see in a turn some
passes are, you know, bringing in mental health professionals. Some
pastors are bringing in clinicians and different things like that,
(36:06):
because what I saw growing up is what you speak about.
I saw people that were embarrassed. I can see right
now this young girl when we were growing up who
got pregnant and they bring her before church, and I'm like,
all right, where's the guy? So you brought the girl
before church and that she's pregnant, but where's the guy? Right?
Takes two to tango, right. So now you have this
(36:29):
young girl who grows up with this level of shame
and it's trauma because they brought her out before and
you have a lot of embarrassment. And so I feel
that churches have focused on saving souls but not restoring minds. Wow,
you have to restore a person's mind. It's great that
we're going to get their spirits saved, and you want
people to you know, go to heaven. But I think
(36:50):
it's important that we begin helping people on how to
not just come to the altar and throw their hands
up and be you know, delivered, but how to walk
this thing out for their complete healing, because it's one
thing especially like like let's just take somebody who's dealt
with molestation, abandonment, rejection, and it's calls these unhealthy things. Yeah,
(37:14):
I pray for you, lay hands on you, put all
on you. You greases like greasy like a piece of chicken,
and you know what I'm saying. So but it's like
that now this person leaves and there's no support. And
the reason church hurt hurts so bad because people have
an expectation that I would be treated better in here
than I am out there. And it's just unfortunate, you
(37:36):
know that we you don't have so many people, particularly
in the black culture. And religious trauma is a real thing,
is called RTS. Religious traumatic syndrome. It's a real diagnosis
in the DSM, and most of us are challenged with
it because we thought we would see God in the
very people who said, come as you are. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (37:58):
Yeah, but let's make sure that we're clear. The church
is full of trauma. It is not absent of trauma.
The very church itself was founded on trauma. Okay, Jesus
being beaten, that's traumatic. Being betrayed prior to being beaten,
(38:23):
that's traumatic. His disciples leaving him, it's traumatic. Okay, All
that is trauma. You die the most horrible death, crown
of thorns, nails in your hands, in your feet, pierced
in the side, bloody and naked. That's trauma. The whole
(38:44):
thing is trauma. The twelve or the eleven that take
off running to go back to doing what they were
doing prior when they say that he's dead, they're dealing
with trauma. They're like, I'm going back fishing. Forget this,
I can't do this. Jesus comes back. There's so much
trouble with them. They don't believe it, even though Jesus
(39:05):
told them I'm coming back. Trauma change their brain. See
the trauma, that's all trauma. Well, Jesus comes back, boom,
He restores Peter. So there's the restoration that the church
should have. So he restores them. Hey do you love me? Yeah,
fema sheep, you love me, Feed my sheep, you love me,
Feed my sheep. Boom, He restores him. He does his thing.
Jesus gets ready to leave. He say, look y'all go
(39:27):
wait on the power. Wait on the power. And then
they come out. So they get the power. They start
evangelizing the Book of Acts. They're doing airy thing. The
church is built off of that. So it's got an
answer and it's got all these problems. So it's never
going to be a place that you're going to go
and it's absent of trauma or it's absent of the
(39:49):
things that you guys are talking about. I think the
issue is trying to find the fine balance of this
soul and spirit body balance when it comes to how
we're giving that information. You got some churches that believe
that Sunday morning is pure word driven. I'm going to
(40:09):
teach you, I'm going to disciple you spiritually. Then you
have some other churches that are little bit more free
and say hey, we're going to do mental health stuff
and therapy and fitness training on Sunday. There are other
people that don't like that. I ain't come to church
for that. I came to church for Genesis. I ain't
come to church for that, okay. And then you have
some churches that say we're gonna put together small groups
(40:30):
where you can come get this mental health. Then you
got other churches that say, look, we've hired ten therapists
that are here. I think we have to go back
to what I said earlier. You got to own your thing.
Something may have happened at the church, Okay, it's no
different than it happening right here in this company. But
you still got to own your thing. If this station,
(40:52):
a problem happens here, but you all still offer therapy.
It's still up to me as an employee to go
down to h R and say, listen, I need therapy.
Now I gotta do. I gotta own that now.
Speaker 2 (41:08):
I love your hospital analogy. I love everything that y'all saying.
Speaker 3 (41:12):
But if you went to a hospital where you were
hurt and practice, you probably wouldn't go back to that.
Speaker 1 (41:19):
Depending yeah, yeah, yeah, it depends though but you but
me personally, I'm like, I'm not going back. However, I
would have to see that you are up to par
I would have to go back.
Speaker 4 (41:32):
I'm coming in I'm coming in like Superman. I'm coming
back like I'm coming in like Superman.
Speaker 1 (41:37):
Hold on, because you said I wouldn't go back go
back to that institution, particularly, I wouldn't go back to Yeah,
but you're still going to another hospital. You don't got
enough church. They may hurt me over here.
Speaker 4 (41:51):
At first Baptist. I'm going a second Baptist.
Speaker 1 (41:56):
I'm not going to third Baptist because after that there's
too many fat I didn't change.
Speaker 4 (42:03):
Think it's very I think that we have to be
careful about what you just said. You're not going back
to that same local entity, but you will continue to
go and see God and build your relationship at another institution.
But you still need to do one thing before you transfer.
Go to therapy.
Speaker 1 (42:20):
Now, when we say go to therapy, JT. Because we
got some people that's going to say, well, I don't
believe in therapy. And particularly for us, health care has
not been on our side. Mental health was not made
for black folks. It was created for a wealthy white men.
And so what I tell people is that everyone is
(42:41):
not going to go to therapy, But there are experiences
that you can have that can be therapeutic, that can
encourage you on your journey because therapy, as we talked about,
it's scary. In fact, therapy causes such a disruption that
you feel worse after the sessions because they're breaking up stuff.
(43:02):
They got you unpacking, you know what I'm saying. They
got you, They got you really thinking about things that
you have moved into the back of your mind and said,
you know what, I don't want to deal with that.
And then and and and and if we're honest, there
is a pacity of clinicians right now that are not
I don't think and I tell this to every therapist.
(43:24):
Every therapist should have a therapist because you cannot take
and ingest all of this in from other people. You
have to go somewhere to process there. So if you
do go to therapy, make sure that you're a therapist,
not just ethically, but make sure that they are sound
even in their own practice and therapy. Finding a therapist,
just like dating, ask those questions do you have and
(43:47):
expertise in dealing with racial trauma? Have you work with
people who've been molested by the same sex? Like you
have to ask those questions because the worst thing that
I hate that I don't like rather is for someone
to be open up and not closed properly. That's what
you just said. You go and have surgery and these
joke who's leave something in you or they don't close
(44:11):
you up properly. Now it's turning into an infection. Now
it's turning to gang green. Now all of a sudden,
we got to move your whole liver because somebody mishandled
you properly.
Speaker 6 (44:20):
I was gonna say, but okay, we're comparing it to
mal practice in the hospital. What I realized about hospitals
is a lot of it is trial and era and
a lot of it is per person.
Speaker 1 (44:27):
Right, That's why it's called practice.
Speaker 6 (44:29):
Yeah, practice right. So I say that to say, you
can ask your therapists all those questions, but you don't
know until you get with that therapist if they're going
to close you black up properly, and then that makes
people not want to do therapy sometimes after that happens,
So it's like, what do you tell people?
Speaker 1 (44:43):
Then, well, therapy, you know, it's a relationship. The effectiveness
of any therapist is determined by the quality of relationship
that they build with the client. When I'm working with individuals,
when I was in private practice, it would be about
four sessions in before I start asking deep questions because
(45:05):
I'm mapping with them. I'm just talking to them because
I want them to feel like we're having a conversation.
Nobody wants to go in and all of a sudden,
it's like, all of a sudden, you know what happened
to you as a kid? Like wait a minute, right,
Like you're moving too fast? You know. It's like, you know,
at least you know, talk sweet to me and yeah, listen,
(45:26):
take me to the cheesecase faster something. And so I
think too, it's a journey. You know. I've been saying
this since I, you know, have been in this space.
Healing is a journey, man, It's truly a journey, and
it may take a few therapists for you to kind
of work through. And I know that can be emotional exhausting.
And this is why I'm careful for anybody. Do not
(45:47):
go in divulging everything. Use wisdom. That is my thing
when you're going into a clinical session, because I've had
people come to me and it's like, well, doctor, j
session turned into me helpen my therapist, you know. And
so you're right, Lauren, it can be very it could
be very scary, and then too, if you have somebody
(46:10):
who hasn't been processing. I tell every therapist you can
only take the client as deep as the work that
you've done internally within yourself, because it could be become
very pernicious, very dangerous for somebody to open up and
then all of a sudden they leave feeling like, man,
what did I just do?
Speaker 5 (46:28):
I just told you my business, and that is.
Speaker 4 (46:30):
What I want to add to it. You're gonna be twenty,
you're gonna be twenty five, you're gonna be thirty, you're
gonna be thirty five, you're gonna be forty, you're gonna
be forty five, you're gonna be fifty, and you're gonna
be fifty five. You gonna be sixty and you gotta
be sixty five. At what point are you going to
(46:54):
say I matter enough, Yeah, to express myself.
Speaker 1 (47:00):
M M.
Speaker 4 (47:00):
That's good because you're gonna you're going to continue to
get old if you don't die. And do you have
to ask you a question? How has life been working
for me? I'm the one that won't talk. I'm the
one that won't sit down and actually get help, it's
not the therapist's fault, and it's not about fault. It's
(47:21):
about me giving me a try to be better because
I deserve to be better. Yeah, and that process, it
is what it is. It's not cookie cutter. Mine's not
gonna be what Jay's is not gonna be what Charlomagne
is is. It's gonna be what it takes to get
me to where I need to be. And you got
to ask yourself the question, am I worth what it
(47:42):
takes to get where I need to be? And where
I need to be? It's not where you are, it's
where I need to be.
Speaker 3 (47:50):
You got to stop lying to yourself, right Like, at
some point you gotta be honest with who you know
you are because we know each other. Yeah, you know
yourself better than anybody. Got be honest with who you
are and what you're feeling. And I think one of
the hardest things for men to say to other men
and just in general, Yo, that hurt my feelings?
Speaker 2 (48:07):
Are you hurt my feeling period?
Speaker 4 (48:10):
Period? You know that's a good thing about to be
real hood right here?
Speaker 3 (48:17):
I want to brain love hoodies, but that is hardy
the fight, so.
Speaker 1 (48:25):
I would do the promotion for you, good brother, my
good brother, doctor Joe. I'm gonna let him talk about it,
but I'm excited because he's had to live this book
in real time. And I think this book it comes
out nover before before, and it's so powerful. So I
(48:46):
think it's so powerful because if it's going to be
a fight to find yourself, you know, you know, we've
been rocking for years and you know every time I share,
you know, my story about surviving to suicide attempts, it
was a fight because you know, we talked about when
even when Twitch passed, it was triggering to me. It's
(49:07):
a fight to find yourself. Man.
Speaker 4 (49:09):
So this book it's gonna cost you something. It's gonna
cost you something. That's why when you when we were there,
it was the perfect way for me to just bring
it up. It costs to find you. It costs you,
It costs pride, it costs relationships, and you have to
ask yourself the question, am I willing to pay that
price to find myself? And is it gonna be embarrassing? Probably?
(49:33):
Are there gonna be some things that come up that
you thought would never come up? Probably? But if you
think you're valuable enough to be who you know you're
supposed to be. It's worth the fight because most of
the time, in my life, it's all about what we do.
It's about what you do. What you do is what's
getting you paid, your performance, and so we become so
(49:55):
performance driven. Everything we do is based off performance. And
so just like you just I said earlier, four o'clock
in the morning, eight o'clock at night, that's our lives
because we got to perform. We got to be on
an a game. Every time we get behind a microphone,
it doesn't matter. But there's no mic in your private life.
There's no mic with your emotions. There's no mics with
how you love your mother, your children, you know your spouse,
(50:17):
And you got to figure out how do I fight
to just be me? And if I don't know who
I am, it becomes even harder because I got to
dig through performance to get there. And once you dig
through all of the awards and dig through all of
the accolades, what's there? Who am I? At the core?
And if you can't say who you are without presenting
(50:38):
what you do, it's a very cloudy picture. You have
no idea who you are. And I didn't find out
who I was until I was forty four years old
and I said it on a public stage and other
men said, I can't believe you just did that. And
I cried, what did you say? I don't know who
(50:58):
I am? And you know what, they said, We've seen
you preach on stages all over the world with thousands
of people. You're all over the place. People are being blessed,
people are buying all your books. And I said, yeah,
and I don't know who I am.
Speaker 3 (51:14):
Doesn't that change all the time. When I started going
to therapy in thirty six, I was the same way.
I was like, damn, I thought I knew who I was,
but I have no idea. But then like the older
I get, Yeah, you evolve the more things change in
your life. You know, you grow as a father, you
grow as a husband, and you just get older and
you just like, man, who am I?
Speaker 4 (51:32):
And it's normal and you have to continue to fight
to find who you are and lean into it that
it's actually okay, that this is a normal fight, and
learn how to fight right. As one of the chapters
in the book, fight right, because we fight wrong, We
fight wrong, we fight through you know, substance abuse, We
fight other people we fight with unhealthy practices, and when
(51:53):
you can learn how to fight right and actually say
healthy things to yourself and to other people, you actually
become a gold mind. Tell you you know what I mean,
and you don't have to have other people to tell
you that you're valuable. You realize that you really are
an incredible person and that God loves you the way
you are. I think it's incredible thought.
Speaker 2 (52:13):
That was Judge Matthews front.
Speaker 3 (52:26):
Is this first chapter why we don't believe what God
says about us?
Speaker 4 (52:32):
Well, he loves you, He loves you. And if you
can get to the point that He actually loves you
and you're not waiting on you to say it and
you to say it, and you to say it, and
you to say it, then I can emerge from ashes
Man because I know that He actually loves me. When
Jesus gets ready to get baptized by John the Baptist,
what happens. He gets baptized and God says, this is
(52:54):
my bee love son in whom I'm well pleased. That's
all he needed to was his father.
Speaker 1 (53:01):
Say I love him, I love him, and that val
him validated everything, because next thing he does, he goes
into the wilderness and the devil was something if you
do this, if you do that. If he didn't have
to do any of that, because he was already loved
prior to going into what he was getting ready to
battle for. So we just got to learn that, Hey,
he loves me like I am, broken, busted, disgusted. That's
(53:25):
the foundation of everything.
Speaker 4 (53:27):
He loves me. And if I can start there, man,
you can rise through anything. But it's all about you
actually being truthful to yourself and say, you know what,
I'm gonna come to you like I am because you
actually love me like I am.
Speaker 2 (53:40):
They'll keep you from having a podcast.
Speaker 1 (53:42):
Oh yeah, yeah yeah. And I think when you when
you embrace that, man, that that love, uh, that there
is an assurance that you have within self that you're
not waiting for something to happen, because oftentimes we move
with God performing a wave. Well, if I do good,
(54:03):
I can accept this love, and if I do well,
I can get someone this blessing. And I think that
chapter is good, man, because basically what you're saying, if
you did nothing else beyond just being you, his love
is not changing for you.
Speaker 4 (54:16):
Here's the beauty of it, which is when I made
that statement on stage. I went with him on a
trip and we had been going around for I think
two years, and we had went back around to Columbus, Ohio.
And so when we go out on stage, we have
this Hey, you know, we're gonna start this way, We're
gonna go this way, We're gonna segue it this way. Hey, Joe,
you take it here. That's kind of how we always
hit it. So when it got time for me to
(54:38):
tell this particular story, kind of how we always rotate,
I stopped dead in the middle of the story. I said, Man,
I'm not telling this story no more. And all of
the guys is looking like it's about eight hundred men
in the room, black men. I'm not telling this story
no more. I said, Man, I'm sorry, and.
Speaker 1 (54:55):
Like j T.
Speaker 4 (54:56):
Go ahead, He's like JG go on to speak. I said,
I'm tired of telling this story because I'm having to
relive this story every time I tell you this story.
And so I decided that moment, I said, I'm gonna
tell y'all a new story. I said, And it's not
a story that hasn't happened yet. It's the story I
want to see. And when I said what I wanted
(55:18):
to see. It wasn't a dry eye in.
Speaker 1 (55:20):
The room because I was going through the opposite of
what I was saying.
Speaker 4 (55:24):
That's how I end that book. Write a new story.
You want to get healthy mentally, write your story, create
a new narrative. You don't have to keep replaying the
same thing that happened to you. And I know it
was terrible, and I know it costs, and I know
it hurt. But every time you tell it, you feel
the costs again, you feel the terror again, you feel
(55:45):
the pain again, and it becomes so cyclical. Well, why
not write what you want? Why not see what you
want to see? And that's what's going to happen when
you fight to find yourself, because you control the narrative
and you can be who you want to be. You
can make what you want to make, you can marry
who you want to marry, you can do what you
want to do. That's the kind of power that you
actually possess if you can wake up to it and realize.
Speaker 3 (56:09):
Was a real preacher you preorder to fight to find yourself,
moving from uncertain to unstoppable right now to be in
bookstores November fourth, This was a powerful conversation to have
on World Mental Health Day.
Speaker 1 (56:20):
Man. Yeah, man, and always brother. You know I love
love you man to the moon and back. Man and
always man. We've been rocking for the past six for
five years, we've been doing the expo. Man. Uh, you know,
I just got to share this. Man. One of his
chapters is about our friendship, man, And and I would say,
get some people in your life, man, that just see
(56:41):
you like he was coming up here to support me
today and our friendship has been on display, and so
many men are watching me just staying with him, even
in his a situation. But just the beauty of man.
You know, this blesses me, my dog, to see the world,
(57:01):
get to hear him this morning on the breakfast club,
you know, and to be amongst y'all. Man. So this
is just beautiful. And this is what mental health really is,
because when you start to think better, you begin to
live better, and you start to attract better. You know
what I mean.
Speaker 4 (57:16):
Let me say this please. I came to support him.
He's a brother that supports me and everything that I do.
And I wanted to be here for him. And I
was sitting in there and then you walk in the
room and just say y'all want to do it together
and walked off. They didn't say nothing else, didn't wait
for me to respond, and nothing. And I'm like, he
looked at me, say you want to do it. I'm like, yeah,
(57:39):
he said, come on. And so I'm saying that to
say this. You position yourself with good people. You said
something earlier. I don't look for him to give me anything.
I'm here for him. I don't and it's vice versa.
And because we're friends and we've positioned ourselves to support
each other, we open up a new business together.
Speaker 1 (57:59):
Yes, I mean mental.
Speaker 5 (58:00):
Health practice congratulation than things.
Speaker 4 (58:04):
Just have been happening for us. So I don't take
it lightly. Thank you for the opportunity to come share
in your space. And it's a blessing. Man, thank you,
thank you very much.
Speaker 3 (58:12):
You can see doctor j He'll be at the Mental
Wealth Expo tomorrow in Newark, New Jersey at the Joel
and Diane Bloom Wellness and Events Center.
Speaker 2 (58:20):
I wish doctor Tubman was there too.
Speaker 4 (58:21):
Man, he got a geograph got. I don't know if
there's streaming or not. I know it's a conference in
Carolina for Bishop Michael Blue tomorrow night somewhere in South Carolina.
I think Columbia, South Carolina. I think that's correct.
Speaker 1 (58:37):
Is that right?
Speaker 4 (58:37):
Columbia South Carolina. I'll be with him tomorrow night. What
time is your expo?
Speaker 2 (58:42):
Eleven to four on Saturday.
Speaker 4 (58:44):
Yeah, I have to do a wellness event in Florida,
which would be mental health and physical fitness and everything
else that you can imagine.
Speaker 5 (58:52):
Please go to Florida. They need all the wellness.
Speaker 1 (58:57):
Yes, y'all be reporting every day Florida. Them people different. Bro,
come on.
Speaker 3 (59:05):
Back, but you know, the work not just this weekend.
I mean, this work is continuous. I do want to
ask about the Brain Love.
Speaker 1 (59:11):
Yeah. So this is my good brother Archie Man down
in Atlanta, Georgia. This brand is in Bloomingdale's in Atlanta.
Brain Love. He created this, uh this around mental health
and to getting a healthy brain and uh the work
that he's doing. Me and him partner uh to come
together and this this collection is in Bloomingdale. I mean,
(59:33):
y'all see the material and so he's also told me
I spoke to him, he's also gonna send everybody here gear.
So you guys a rock So yeah, and uh, the
materials is amazing and really his His message is really
to get us a healthier brain. And then you see
the message on the back of you know, telling you know,
to tell ourselves that we love ourselves. And for black people, listen, man,
(59:55):
our mental health is everything. And particularly in this time
politically and and in this time that we're in that
so much is attacking us. Take care of your mind.
Be careful of what you consume. Too much consumption of
this negativity with the news. I mean, every day we
it's something with this clown. You know, y'all know what
the clown talking about. But but man, that because this
(01:00:17):
crash out era that we're seeing right now is just overwhelming.
People are just losing it. So encourage everybody, man, keep
your brain healthy.
Speaker 3 (01:00:26):
That's right, is doctor j Bartnett, Doctor Joel tell mean,
thank you, brothers.
Speaker 1 (01:00:29):
Man.
Speaker 2 (01:00:31):
The Breakfast Club.
Speaker 3 (01:00:33):
Every day a week ago, clicks up the Breakfast Club.
Speaker 2 (01:00:37):
Finish y'all done.
Every day.
Speaker 2 (00:02):
Up click up the Breakfast Club finish for y'all done. Yes,
it's the world was dangerous?
Speaker 3 (00:08):
Want to show to Breakfast Club the god DJ Envy
just hilarious. Envy's not here, but Lauren Lerosa is and
and we got some special guests in the building. Man,
the good brother, doctor J Barnett along with doctor Joel Tutman.
How y'all brothers doing man?
Speaker 1 (00:21):
Man, We're good Man, feeling good this morning, Man, feeling
real good.
Speaker 3 (00:25):
You know you see Doctor J on the Just Hill podcast.
Y'all y'all going to Just Hill tour together?
Speaker 1 (00:30):
Yeah? Yeah, Man, So it's been exciting man to Just
Hell podcast with doctor J. Man. We lunched back in
April and just to see how it's grown.
Speaker 4 (00:40):
Uh.
Speaker 1 (00:40):
Shaw was on me for years, like, bro, you gotta
do a podcast to like you gotta be on the network.
And I wasn't. If I could be honest, I wasn't
a podcaster because I'm like, man, Jess, how this is.
This is a gift that y'all do to get up
and and the talk and all of that. I love
to speak because when I speak, I have this this
(01:02):
structure that I follow and then I'm going these different places.
But the podcast has really grown me to hear other
people's stories, so it's like therapy and real time. And
from having my sister Raji on Kirk Franklin, Rico Love
and then I have some people who are just everyday
people that are sharing their healing journeys and just sharing
(01:24):
where they are. So it's been a fun journey.
Speaker 5 (01:26):
Man.
Speaker 1 (01:27):
So now I can officially say yes, I'm a podcast.
Speaker 5 (01:31):
Hell love it.
Speaker 6 (01:32):
You guys have like a really cool dynamic because I mean,
you're pastor you do mental health and like all these things. Right,
But y'all know in our community, a lot of times
when you're going through some people like just pray about it.
How do y'all have conversations around that.
Speaker 4 (01:44):
It's more than prayer. I think prayer is very essential,
but it's the backbone. It's a substratum of everything. But
there has to be practical application because you're human, so
that is the spiritual component. But if you don't have friendship,
you don't have people that can walk you through the journey,
then you'll often become lost. And I like to say
(02:05):
people become mystic. They just stay in this spooky vial
and uh and Again, that's not to talk about the
church background, because I have a strong church background, but
having therapists, having people that can actually supply sufficient support
really can help change the dynamic of what you're going through.
I think that's very important.
Speaker 3 (02:24):
And UH used to be associated pastor at the Potter House, right, Yes, sir,
But did you love to go to Florida?
Speaker 2 (02:31):
I didn't know that could happen. They made it sound
like you was transferring schools and something you were playing
one place.
Speaker 7 (02:38):
You know that could happen.
Speaker 3 (02:41):
I mean, I just the way they do I guess,
I guess the pothouse the way you know, the way
they worded it, I'm like, okay, Yeah, I.
Speaker 4 (02:47):
Went there to learn from who I believe to be
the greatest of all times. I think Mishop Jakes is
the greatest of all times. And I went there to
learn and there was an opportunity that opened up in Florida,
and so that's how I ended there. I ended up
there because he trained me. I was prepared and we
ended up in Florida. And God's been good to missus
have been there.
Speaker 2 (03:07):
How did that work?
Speaker 1 (03:08):
Though?
Speaker 2 (03:08):
Like when you like, like what does the spirit tell you?
Speaker 1 (03:11):
Like?
Speaker 3 (03:11):
I want to be. I need you to go, you know,
lead this congregation, that lead this flock.
Speaker 1 (03:15):
Now, like, what is it?
Speaker 4 (03:17):
What hits you? When I was in Oklahoma originally, and
when I was there, I knew that I wasn't going
to be there forever. And so the opportunity for change
didn't start at the Potter's house. I was coaching at
Oklahoma State University and and pastoring at the same time,
and so the opportunity to shift came at a good season.
(03:38):
Church was doing fine, my work was doing great, and
I went to preach for Bishop Jakes. So I had
to sit back and realize, Okay, the things that I
wanted to see happened in the future career wise and
ministry wise, came through an opportunity of another individual. There
wasn't a voice from heaven, a chap that came down
and said move. It wasn't that. It was a man
(03:59):
of God looked at me and said, what's your future?
What do you What do you want to be? What
do you see happening where you want to go? And
when I told him that, then it unlocked something for
me to start looking at. And when I started looking
at it, I started saying all the insufficiencies, all the
places that needed work, all the places that needed a
model or mentor, and he filled that void. And then
(04:19):
from there it was a challenge, what do you want?
And I had to answer that question and that answer
was move. Wow.
Speaker 2 (04:26):
That's where y'all met, right, yeah?
Speaker 1 (04:27):
Yeah, yeah. We met in Dallas. A friend of mine
had sent me a video and like, yo, I just
found your spirit animal. I was like, all right, So
I started watching his clips. He in a gym, killing
it in you know, he's a strengthing conditioning code. So
we got the whole football background from watching how he speaks,
and I said, yo, I really rock with this dude.
So I'm say pause. I slid his DMS, but but
(04:55):
I hit him up and like, yo, brother, I love
what you're doing man, And we we had at some
exchange but didn't know that we both moved to Dallas
during the pandemic at the same time, and slowly, you know,
started kind of engaging. But I'd engage him to come
on my tour to Jessere Bro. I had four voices
and I was like, you know, we need a five,
(05:16):
and I could reached out to him. I said, Bro,
I want you to go on tour. Now here's the
story about the development of friendship. This brother was not
having it, Jess. And the more I would text him
and like, hey man, you know, brother, you know, look
forward to having your on tour. He would come on
the tour, he would get on stage, do his thing
and would just sit in the back and wouldn't say anything.
(05:37):
And I felt, you know, that he needed friendship. But
I also felt compelled like I just couldn't let it go.
And I would text him and check in on him, like,
hey man, I hope you all as well, brother, Just
checking in, and he would just text back the army, mooji,
the muscles because he was not And I understood as
(06:00):
we begin, because it's difficult men, and study shows this.
Men have a difficult time making friends after thirty five.
And this is the real reason why a lot of
men are suffering in silence and suffering in their mental
health because of the lack of community and the lack
of friendships there. They're not like women. They don't engage
(06:21):
and most men don't build friendships beyond their workplace. And
our friendship started from a challenge of who can lose
the most weight and get down to you know, get
down to the lowest body fat and that built the
friendship that people see that we have today and the
love that I have for this brother, and I saw
it in him. Like I said, Bro, you're one of
(06:42):
the best to me. And I think when you are
building friendships, you want to have friendships where somebody can
see more in you than you see in yourself in
that current space.
Speaker 2 (06:53):
Why were you so guard it, doctor Tuban?
Speaker 1 (06:55):
Yeah, please tell the world. How tell the world how
he would leave me on red And it didn't bother
me because and I want to add this, when you
have dealt with your rejection or abandonment issues, how a
person response doesn't trigger you. Yeah, because I didn't know
(07:16):
what his experience was, but I knew I wanted to
keep showing up for him.
Speaker 4 (07:21):
Friendship is important to me. It's very essential. And I'm
too old to start over in certain places. So for me,
I have fresh room, fresh wounds. As it pertains to
mail the male friendships, brothers real strong relationships, and I
had just gotten to the point to where I was
okay without the relationship, and so when this good brother
(07:45):
reached out to me, he was very persistent. I didn't
understand him. I didn't understand this process, his makeup. He's
a therapist, so his mental is really really strong, mind strong,
but it's more defensive versus just being vulnerable. So I
had a difficult trying to be vulnerable. And so he
kept pressing and kept pressing and kept pressing. I wasn't
(08:06):
really interested in that. I was okay. I wasn't. I wasn't.
I was okay with working out. So I was doing
a challenge. He jumped in on Instagram and said, yo,
I can I run you. I was like, man, get
out here with all that. You're too big, you know.
So that's what happened. So we went into this forty
day challenge, and then maybe twenty something days within to
(08:29):
the challenge, he kept coming on. My lives kept coming on,
kept coming on. He said, man, won't you meet me?
Let's box. So that's what happened. I met him at
the gym somewhere in the twenties of the count and
our friendship started taking off. Now, as it started taking off,
I was still very very guarded because I was not
going to get another homemade, another homeboy. I was fine, okay,
(08:49):
But as we continued to train. We started having therapeutic
conversations about what's going on in your mind? Why are
you having a hard time dealing with abandonment? Rejection actually happened,
and then as far as my career speaking, he said, hey, man,
I want you to come on a tour with me.
I went on the tour, but I still wasn't going
to get close to all the rest of the guys.
(09:10):
I had broken through with him just a little bit.
So we go on the tour, We're do our thing,
and I sit in the back, not talking because I
don't want to be involved emotionally again. That way. However,
we broke through. He's become a best friend. Over five years.
Now I have a much softer side. I was too hard,
(09:33):
and I think God did an amazing thing by bringing
him into my life. So now I don't have it.
I had what's called toxic masculinity, very toxic.
Speaker 1 (09:41):
And break that down because somebody gonna get it and
they gonna create their own definition with toxic. But but
you know what, JT. I don't think it was really toxic.
I just think it was guarded because we both had
father wounds. Yeah, and when you've had father wounds, it's
hard to build mail to male friendships because when you
(10:04):
have not been fathered well, you're very guarded and you're
very defensive because there's a part of you that have
not had a very safe relationship with another man. So
for another man, and you know, like, you know, I
bought flowers and you know, I mean, I'm all the things,
but then the duality of that I'm a lion and
(10:27):
a lamb, and so he got to see that. But
I understood it. And it wasn't that I needed a friend.
I just like, there's just some people that you just
felt drawn to, and I think that's beautiful. That's a
great way to put it.
Speaker 4 (10:39):
Lyon and lamb. I was all lyon, no lamb in sight.
So to actually start experiencing other men that were so
transparent that they could so show you the lamb, that
took time for me to adjust. So I wasn't going
to express how I felt. Bishop Jakes broke me from that.
He kept saying how do you feel? And I was
(11:00):
sending a strong arm emoji or I would send fire,
you know, and he says, I'm tired of that. Explain
to me what you feel. But I didn't have the language.
I didn't have the language to explain it. That's a
part of that toxicity as well, because if you can't
explain it, you throw signs okay. And so it took
me going through all of the therapy why I rejected
(11:25):
my father, why my father wasn't there, the terrible relationships
with my parents, the terrible relationships with my brothers and sisters,
all of the things that were wrong with me. I
started paying attention to the tension because the tension was
causing me to break. So if you don't pay attention
to the tension, you will pay for attention. And that's
(11:47):
what actually happened. So because I wasn't paying attention to
the tension, the tension started fracturing me. And not only
did it fracture me, it started fracturing the relationships around me.
And everybody knows what a Fraction's a fracture. It's a
break that you can't see, all right, it's a hairline fracture,
but there's a break there. And what ends up happening
is some kind of blow is going to create a
(12:10):
break to become visible to where you're going to have
to either cast it or break it completely so they
can reset it. And that's what happened to all of
the relationships that I was attached to.
Speaker 1 (12:20):
It wasn't their fault. It was my fault.
Speaker 4 (12:22):
Because I had allowed so much pressure, so much tension,
to come into my own personal life. It became difficult
for me to converse productively with other people, especially of
the man.
Speaker 3 (12:34):
But what about when it's not your fault? Because I
agree with you, know what you said, doctor j about
the father woman. But that homeboy woman is real too. Yeah,
that's a real wom too, because when I love I
love her. I called you my brother, and then you
betray me in some way. It's just like damn, it's
hard to let people in.
Speaker 4 (12:48):
I can't control what he does, but I can control
how I handle it. And that's what happened. I couldn't
control it. I was covering it, and I needed therapy
to deal with what happened between the two of us
the previous homie. And I think also to that JG
and then to what you said sharp like the same
experience that he had was a betrayal of a close friend.
(13:11):
I had the same thing, and it was so difficult
for me because I saw men as just being I
wouldn't say just a point of contact, but just almost
like you know, it's just a homeboard, a homeboy. But
for me to call your brother, that's it's like, that's
that's a different level of love. It's just like when
you tell somebody I love you, you know, I mean, that
(13:33):
changes your disposition toward them. That's why I don't throw
out I love you, you know what I mean?
Speaker 1 (13:37):
And so because that's now, that's now a different level
of expression of my of my feelings towards you. And
I think for me that betrayal man, I was just like, dude,
how do you even because when you're in your thirties
and you start an agent, I felt what he felt like, Man,
how do you start to build friendship again? Because we
(13:59):
all know friendship takes time and then now on that
friendship also requires a level of vulnerability, and I didn't
want to be vulnerable.
Speaker 4 (14:06):
Like that again. But I think for me, it's like this,
I had two of the same thing, two opposing things
happen at the same time. So I get betrayed by
this one guy that we've been boys for twenty something years.
Then I got this other guy that is trying to
befriend me, all right, and he is being one hundred
percent open, saying, hey, I don't want anything from you.
(14:29):
I just believe I'm supposed to be here for you,
all right. This is prior to him, and this guy's
pouring his heart out. But I don't have what I
need to give this guy. So it breaks this guy.
It breaks him so bad. To her, He's like, you
know what, man, I've given enough. So I got to
protect me. So when I felt like I was ready,
(14:52):
once I realized okay, I think I'm better now, I
tried to go back and repair that relationship and he
didn't receive me the way I thought he should receive me,
and I went back selfish again. I was like, hey, man,
I came to you. I'm apologizing. But then I realized
I hurt that guy even though I didn't have the language.
I didn't have everything to give to him, but I
(15:14):
learned it through him. He was a therapist. He's teaching me. He'sy,
hey man, you heard him. Now you got to go
through the process and walk that out. That's a part
of me understanding becoming more healthy, getting that toxicity out
of me, because if I hadn't learned the language. I
would have been ticked off at this dude said, Man,
I came to you, I tried to I said, I'm sorry.
I told you I didn't have a language. You can't
forgive me, But that's wrong. I got to give him
(15:36):
time to process. It is not his fault that I
didn't have what it took to give him what he needed.
So that's why I said, regardless of what the other
individual did, you got to fix you. If you don't
fix you, you can't help repair anything. It all starts
with you. You have to own the responsibility of what's
going on with you.
Speaker 5 (15:58):
How do you What.
Speaker 8 (15:59):
Does that process look like? Because I do the same thing,
I'm in the same boat. Like literally right now I have.
I've been betrayed by a friend at the friend at
the friend and that's fine. I'm getting all the sneaks
out the gud and that's cool, you know, because where
I'm going I can't take everybody, so that's fine. But
even in business, I don't trust nobody. That's that's my problem,
(16:19):
you know. And when somebody called me a sister, the
same thing, you know, I got friends called me sister,
whether it's friends in business, or whatever. You know, if
I call you my sister or my brother. Yeah, and
I feel like you do some somesh that will make
me sighe out of you. It's like, Yo, I don't
I don't know how to look at you. I don't
know how to continue to have you know, a level.
Speaker 5 (16:40):
Of loyalty or a level of respect, you know what
I mean, or just even want to be around you.
It just gets weird.
Speaker 1 (16:45):
You know.
Speaker 4 (16:45):
I got a question for you. Yeah, why do you
keep bringing that same type of person into your life
To even have to ask that question.
Speaker 5 (16:55):
I don't know how they get in. They be sneaking in.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
I don't be bringing.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
You know. So I think I think I think we
all can agree, right, Like you know, me and Shaw
talk about this all the time, right, I mean, I
think we can all agree that as we are elevated,
and particularly when you are elevated in the public's eye,
it requires Like Jess, I remember when you first started
(17:30):
right just with the messine, you know what I'm saying,
when you were just doing your thing. And I think
what happens is as God has elevated me, it has
required a level of sagaciousness, right, which is discernment that
I have to really operate in because now that you
at this place, everybody wants something. And one of the
(17:51):
things that Bishop told me, he said, You're going to
have to get accustomed to disappointing people that want to
be next to you. And so what I've had to
really look at him give attention to is why are
you here? You know, like if he would have never
responded in the way that was how long was that
(18:11):
period of time you went silent on me? Three months?
Three months? And I would text him Lauren and no response,
But it didn't bother me. Char I'll text him sometimes
like none of that bothers me because I know, But
I don't go into that. I do. I don't go
into that because the genuineness of who I am as
(18:32):
a person is that whether you respond or not, I
just want you to know that I'm here and that
your thought of And I think we have too many
people now because the world has become very transactional, and
that if we're honest, most individuals' mental health is on edge.
(18:52):
Most people are just one decision away from moving into
a psychosis. And I think it just requires another level
of of of discernment and then also realizing what types
of people do I need it in this season? You're
married now, right, so the people that you need in
(19:13):
your life right now, it's not necessarily that they have
to be married, but they have to be people that
have a level of authenticity, level of genuineness and wholeness,
lacking nothing, meaning that if I don't hear from you,
if I can't give you nothing, you're still here.
Speaker 2 (19:30):
Yes, he said wholesome.
Speaker 4 (19:40):
You're going to have to trust. You're going to have
to start trusting people and understand that a part of
trust it comes with being broken. I mean, it's that's
just a part of it.
Speaker 3 (19:51):
But it's not that doctor, because I could, I agree
with the trust.
Speaker 4 (19:56):
Got to be open to the fact that you may
get hurt. So protecting yourself, you're only hurting yourself because
you could be protecting yourself from what's going to actually
heal you. Okay, So you could be the cause of
staying in the same cycle because you won't trust, and
so because you don't trust, you state you stay fractured. Okay,
(20:17):
you got to trust people. That doesn't mean you have
to trust them at the same dimension. You know that
you don't have to trust me to take care of
your kids, you know, but you can do your work
to make sure that. Okay, I'm going to use him
to fix my car. So how many people have how
many cars have be fixed before? Do your work, do
your due diligence like you do with everybody else, and
then you got to step back and trust the process.
(20:39):
But knowing the process may break down.
Speaker 3 (20:42):
Is that the same mindset is like not expecting you
from other people?
Speaker 1 (20:46):
Absolutely?
Speaker 4 (20:47):
Yeah, and you I think a good friend of mine,
aching a Odal, told me divorce yourself from the results
and fall in love with the process.
Speaker 7 (20:58):
It's good I didn't done that.
Speaker 4 (21:01):
Yeah, that's easy for you to say that until you
start doing so, you're going to always say that. Most
people say this, He's just said and done. Try it.
There's going to be lessons that you learn from being broken.
There's going to be lessons that you learned from the
actual relationship actually formulating. So he talked about the time
that I didn't respond to him two months. I think
(21:23):
it was I didn't really three three I didn't respond
to him. I didn't respond to him. Because here's the deal.
My answer is the same now, listeners, my answers the
same I didn't have the language. I didn't have the
language for what I was going through. How long were
you going to use that story? But that answer is
not going to keep working for you if you want
to live your best life.
Speaker 1 (21:44):
But I think also I'm talking about me, but it
was valid because also you didn't really know what it was,
and you spelled trust T I m e is I
used to really spell trust It's time the time I would.
I mean, I was okay with him going through his process,
(22:05):
and I think what broke him was this brother's not
going He's there because it wasn't contingent upon him responding.
And I think what most of us, it's always about
what is the response because we live in such a
If I text you, most people have anxiety from okay,
(22:25):
they didn't text back. The job hasn't called yet, you
know what I mean? And so we we are, we are,
we are operating with this rapid response. You know, as
God began to expand me, I didn't realize, like just
sometimes I'm overwhelmed with text messages and I can't respond.
And it's not that I'm leaving you on red because
(22:46):
I don't want to talk to it it's like I'm
overwhelmed because it's like, man, I got to process what
I need to say. Then I'm thinking about this email
and then my manager's like, hey, can you give me
this publicist is saying can you send me that? So
I had to realize is that I need to change
my position even within myself, and to give myself grace
(23:08):
and man, I don't even have the words right now,
and being okay with that, and then being okay with
being perceived as oh, so you can't respond.
Speaker 5 (23:18):
Yeah, right, so you're right. That's that's me to see.
I don't trust you all. Y'all know too much. I'll
be thinking about the other person, like trying to think
for them. You can't.
Speaker 1 (23:30):
It's exhausted. It's exhausted.
Speaker 3 (23:32):
I'm gonna be asking both of you all a questions, Right,
can't time being illusion in a relationship? And what I
mean by that is you could be with something. You
can know somebody for years and years and years and
years and think you trust them, right, but then they
be the ones that betray you. But then you might
meet somebody that you knew for a short period of
time and you feel more loyalty to that, to that individual.
Speaker 4 (23:53):
Ooh, that's a that's that's a loaded question. That's a
loaded question because you can't effectively diagnose that statement without
hearing from the other individual. What is it that created
distrusting them? What is it that created them to pull
(24:13):
back from you? They may have found something on you
or in you, or with you that caused them to
pull away. So that's hard, that's hard. That's hard to
look at. And then with this new person, is it
a trauma bond? Are you connected to them because you've
broken over there and they were able to supply something
to you. Because the keyword you used was feel feelings
(24:36):
they come and go. You may feel that way right
now in thirty days and in the thirty first day
you feel like you felt with the last person that changed,
So we can't use that statement. I think at the
end of the day, when it comes to time, time
is what it is, whether you want to call it
an illusion or whether you want to call it reality,
is how you invested. Okay, what am I investing in
(24:58):
the moments of time and with the people that I
believe deserves my time?
Speaker 1 (25:04):
So my question to you is, and I'll ask you
this question because look at where we are today. Yeah,
And to your point, shar it's like Lauren and you
can hop in because I would want to know your
thoughts and process on how you've navigated this space, because
there's people that was rocking with me, and I think
as I begin to do this, it's shifted, and I
(25:27):
think the disloyalty was also if we're going to keep
it abuve some level of insecurity within themselves because most people,
if they're riding with you, most people's fears is that
they want to be left behind.
Speaker 7 (25:42):
A lot of people that if.
Speaker 1 (25:44):
You become what I see the trajective, the trajectory that
I see of you, and I think that disloyalty comes
in because it's like, man, they've gotten there and nothing
has happened. For me. I've seen a lot of that,
and then I've seen what you're saying where people that
I've met through the expo that we've been locked in,
(26:07):
you know what I mean, because our missions aligned. And
I also think too, for the public, it's be open
to levels of friendship shifting because your.
Speaker 4 (26:16):
Life is shifting, right, Yeah, that's beautiful.
Speaker 1 (26:20):
Like you have to be open because most people won't change,
and particularly if your life changed in a major way
because they're always going to see you how they met
you and how the world is coming to know you.
It's challenging for them because in their mind, I still
see your Lawrence from Dell State.
Speaker 7 (26:39):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (26:40):
I think I've been blessed to have people that always
saw me, sometimes bigger than I saw myself. So as
things are going up for me, like you know, not
everything has changed. But I think the hardest thing I
had to learn was I can't call everybody about everything,
and when people take offense to that, I can't take
it personal. And sometimes I do realize that maybe there's
(27:01):
an insecurity and like you know, people are trying to
like figure out where where they are positioned.
Speaker 7 (27:06):
In my life. Now it's like, well, why are you
doing this now?
Speaker 6 (27:08):
You didn't do that a year ago when I had
time to do different things, or when I needed to
call you more because at that season in my life
it made more sense. So that has made me think
about different things and different people and like not disassociating fully,
but just like being very careful about when I bring
those conversations those people into my life and where I
bring them into and what I bring them around, just
because I don't know how sure they are about themselves,
(27:30):
and I don't have time to.
Speaker 7 (27:32):
Like, I literally mentally can't.
Speaker 6 (27:34):
I'm I told you when you walked in here today
last night with the bet at eight pm. Normally I'm
at bed at like twelve thirty one o'clock and I'm
back up at four or five because I'm doing so
much to prepare for here, I don't have time to
figure out your insecurities in my.
Speaker 7 (27:46):
Own at the same time, you know what I'm saying.
Speaker 6 (27:48):
So I've just had to learn how to like really prioritize,
realize that I can't take anything personal because people take
everything personal now, and you know the people that make
like there are certain people I call about certain things
now that if I were to call other people, not
that I love them less, you wouldn't even understand what
I'm talking about.
Speaker 7 (28:05):
So I just can't do that.
Speaker 6 (28:08):
I also have been blessed to have like es Envy
and Charlemagne, so as that's happening, I can call them.
Speaker 7 (28:13):
Yeah.
Speaker 6 (28:13):
I do call him a lot, though, and be like, hey,
I can't spend as much time my mom and my
grandma right now, and it's breaking my heart, and they
feel a way what do I do? I got family
members who are like, when you come home, you're so tired,
you don't want to spend time with us, but we
see you everywhere else. I got friends that you know,
I can't. I'm not texting back as much in the
group chat, you know, Yeah, but it's a part of it.
(28:35):
I'm lucky though, I do have good people around me
who kind of get it. But I think everybody, as
a human you want to make sure, oh am I
still important to you?
Speaker 7 (28:43):
You still love me? Like am I? And that's a
human thing?
Speaker 1 (28:45):
Has that and I'm not And it's not deep, but like,
does it in some way? You know? Maybe I want
to say impact your mental health? But it does? Does
it weigh on you?
Speaker 6 (28:57):
It does because you feel guilty. You feel like, am
I leaving people behind? Do I think I'm better than
people like you start second guessing things that you know
are not true about yourself. Like I know how I
was raised, I know what's important to me. I know
what my priorities are and all the things. But when
people you love and people that have been in your
life and seeing you forever feel like I'm competing with
(29:19):
people that are just starting to see you now you
feel a sense of responsibility for that, And for me,
I've had to be like oftentimes I sit and be
like how much of this do I need to be
accountable for? And how much of this I can't I
have no control over? And that's tough. That's really really
tough because a lot of it if you don't have
control over, you can't control, Like literally there's nothing I
can do. So it's nothing that you feel like you're
(29:43):
breaking something that has been like your stability for your
whole life because of a moment that's happening. And then
you second guess that, like, well, if all this stops,
y'all even still gonna love me anymore? Because y'all feel
like I'm being new to y'all and I'm not being new.
I just I can't manage everything at one time, you know.
Speaker 1 (29:59):
What I mean?
Speaker 7 (30:00):
I mean like that mentally weighs on you a lot.
Speaker 4 (30:02):
That is so profound, man, Okay, because anybody that's achieved
anything is going to go through that. And if you
have a good support circle, so commendable for you, and
I would soak in it. I would soak in that
support circle, and then I would appreciate my support circle
so that my support circle can continue to feed into me. Yeah,
(30:25):
because that other crew is going to always say what
they feel. They don't even have an under like you said,
they don't even have the words to understand. They don't
even have the motions to understand what you're going through,
how your life is on the rise, and the demand
for your life to be everywhere. But at the same time,
now they want you to still do what you used
to do and you can't do it. So you've got
(30:45):
to feed that circle that's feeding you so you can
constantly stay uplifted, because if you don't, eventually that crew
could possibly turn into that crew if you don't feed
them to make sure they understand what the journey is
like for you. So kudos for you for having the
circle that actually can still feed you what you need
to still feel normal, because as you become more successful,
(31:09):
it seems like shots fire from everywhere and kind of
he and I were talking about it. When you have
to process publicly what you go through what should be privately,
it becomes so difficult and then that weighs so much
on you mentally, especially for pastors. That's why you see
so many pastors fall or commit suicide because it's difficult
(31:33):
to process publicly. Nobody wants to process public I don't
care what position you have in the world.
Speaker 6 (31:40):
I have a question for you off of that. Recently,
everything that happened with you in a faith city. So
you were there and then they sent out a letter
that you will no longer be seenior pastor. That was
very public, especially because you know the church. They want
to know what happened. No one knows why that happened.
So two questions, I don't know if you can share
what actually happened, and then second question, you spoke about it.
(32:02):
How was processing that publicly?
Speaker 4 (32:04):
What happened? We disagreed, were disagreed in mission. I didn't
do anything wrong, nothing illegal, but we disagreed and the
disagreement didn't allow us to go forward, so that relationship
was severed. Processing it has been difficult because it's public
(32:31):
and it hurts. I love those people. I love those people,
I love him, and trying to move forward is something
you have to do to live. I don't care what
the career is. And if you stay in a fracture,
you're going to break, You're going to crumble. So trying
(32:53):
to move forward with a cast when everyone is already determined,
predetermine what you've done and have absolutely no idea and
no information, no information. That's it's difficult. So trying to
talk to your children, pick your children up and move anywhere,
no matter what the career is, to get them to
(33:16):
trust you as a father. Hey, I made the right
decision to pick us up and move us across the
world and then have to turn to figure out how
we're going to make it. The pressure of this was
what it was. Now I got to figure out how
to make it what it is. It's difficult as a husband,
(33:36):
as a provider. Now do I trust in God one
hundred percent? I trust in all the skills that God
has given me, and He has opened up doors that
are just unbelievable for me. So processing it has been
I'm not going to say difficult, but it's been uneasy.
(34:01):
But through it all I still thank God. That's not
that's not a church answer. That's my faith because I
know all things work together for the good.
Speaker 2 (34:11):
I wish you was here this weekend because you know
we got the mental health.
Speaker 1 (34:14):
Expot this weekend. Got called and yeah, my good.
Speaker 3 (34:17):
Sister Debbie Brown came up with this, she wanted to
do this panel called Reclaiming Faith Healing from Religious Trauma
and Pastor Call Lynton, doctor Teddy.
Speaker 1 (34:25):
Reeves are on it.
Speaker 2 (34:26):
And I think it was crad I was up here
talking about church. Yes, it was cree right.
Speaker 3 (34:30):
It's just like, man, what do you do when when
your trauma comes from your sanctuary, when that hurt comes
from that place, you go for salvation?
Speaker 1 (34:40):
Man. I think one of the things that my father's
passed in thirty five years walking alongside you know him. Uh.
You know, when you look at church, it's a hospital,
and it's a hospital that has a lot of six
people who don't take their meads. And when you have
(35:01):
people who don't take their meds, you have people who
don't understand how their behaviors, don't understand how their reaction
impacts those that are in the hospital as well. So
it's almost like you in one room and you're trying
to get some rest because the doctors said you need
to rest, and you have somebody down here that is
having a breakdown because they just heard a diagnosis that
(35:23):
they can't change. And I think the unfortunate thing that
has happened is that a lot of churches have not
thought about mental health in the faith conversation. And I say,
you can't talk faith, you can't talk God, and omit
mental health. When God made us, he made mind, body,
(35:45):
and spirit. Mental health is your social it's your emotional
and physical makeup. It's how we do life. I call
mental health life in motion. There is nowhere around it.
And I think now you see in a turn some
passes are, you know, bringing in mental health professionals. Some
pastors are bringing in clinicians and different things like that,
(36:06):
because what I saw growing up is what you speak about.
I saw people that were embarrassed. I can see right
now this young girl when we were growing up who
got pregnant and they bring her before church, and I'm like,
all right, where's the guy? So you brought the girl
before church and that she's pregnant, but where's the guy? Right?
Takes two to tango, right. So now you have this
(36:29):
young girl who grows up with this level of shame
and it's trauma because they brought her out before and
you have a lot of embarrassment. And so I feel
that churches have focused on saving souls but not restoring minds. Wow,
you have to restore a person's mind. It's great that
we're going to get their spirits saved, and you want
people to you know, go to heaven. But I think
(36:50):
it's important that we begin helping people on how to
not just come to the altar and throw their hands
up and be you know, delivered, but how to walk
this thing out for their complete healing, because it's one
thing especially like like let's just take somebody who's dealt
with molestation, abandonment, rejection, and it's calls these unhealthy things. Yeah,
(37:14):
I pray for you, lay hands on you, put all
on you. You greases like greasy like a piece of chicken,
and you know what I'm saying. So but it's like
that now this person leaves and there's no support. And
the reason church hurt hurts so bad because people have
an expectation that I would be treated better in here
than I am out there. And it's just unfortunate, you
(37:36):
know that we you don't have so many people, particularly
in the black culture. And religious trauma is a real thing,
is called RTS. Religious traumatic syndrome. It's a real diagnosis
in the DSM, and most of us are challenged with
it because we thought we would see God in the
very people who said, come as you are. Yeah.
Speaker 4 (37:58):
Yeah, but let's make sure that we're clear. The church
is full of trauma. It is not absent of trauma.
The very church itself was founded on trauma. Okay, Jesus
being beaten, that's traumatic. Being betrayed prior to being beaten,
(38:23):
that's traumatic. His disciples leaving him, it's traumatic. Okay, All
that is trauma. You die the most horrible death, crown
of thorns, nails in your hands, in your feet, pierced
in the side, bloody and naked. That's trauma. The whole
(38:44):
thing is trauma. The twelve or the eleven that take
off running to go back to doing what they were
doing prior when they say that he's dead, they're dealing
with trauma. They're like, I'm going back fishing. Forget this,
I can't do this. Jesus comes back. There's so much
trouble with them. They don't believe it, even though Jesus
(39:05):
told them I'm coming back. Trauma change their brain. See
the trauma, that's all trauma. Well, Jesus comes back, boom,
He restores Peter. So there's the restoration that the church
should have. So he restores them. Hey do you love me? Yeah,
fema sheep, you love me, Feed my sheep, you love me,
Feed my sheep. Boom, He restores him. He does his thing.
Jesus gets ready to leave. He say, look y'all go
(39:27):
wait on the power. Wait on the power. And then
they come out. So they get the power. They start
evangelizing the Book of Acts. They're doing airy thing. The
church is built off of that. So it's got an
answer and it's got all these problems. So it's never
going to be a place that you're going to go
and it's absent of trauma or it's absent of the
(39:49):
things that you guys are talking about. I think the
issue is trying to find the fine balance of this
soul and spirit body balance when it comes to how
we're giving that information. You got some churches that believe
that Sunday morning is pure word driven. I'm going to
(40:09):
teach you, I'm going to disciple you spiritually. Then you
have some other churches that are little bit more free
and say hey, we're going to do mental health stuff
and therapy and fitness training on Sunday. There are other
people that don't like that. I ain't come to church
for that. I came to church for Genesis. I ain't
come to church for that, okay. And then you have
some churches that say we're gonna put together small groups
(40:30):
where you can come get this mental health. Then you
got other churches that say, look, we've hired ten therapists
that are here. I think we have to go back
to what I said earlier. You got to own your thing.
Something may have happened at the church, Okay, it's no
different than it happening right here in this company. But
you still got to own your thing. If this station,
(40:52):
a problem happens here, but you all still offer therapy.
It's still up to me as an employee to go
down to h R and say, listen, I need therapy.
Now I gotta do. I gotta own that now.
Speaker 2 (41:08):
I love your hospital analogy. I love everything that y'all saying.
Speaker 3 (41:12):
But if you went to a hospital where you were
hurt and practice, you probably wouldn't go back to that.
Speaker 1 (41:19):
Depending yeah, yeah, yeah, it depends though but you but
me personally, I'm like, I'm not going back. However, I
would have to see that you are up to par
I would have to go back.
Speaker 4 (41:32):
I'm coming in I'm coming in like Superman. I'm coming
back like I'm coming in like Superman.
Speaker 1 (41:37):
Hold on, because you said I wouldn't go back go
back to that institution, particularly, I wouldn't go back to Yeah,
but you're still going to another hospital. You don't got
enough church. They may hurt me over here.
Speaker 4 (41:51):
At first Baptist. I'm going a second Baptist.
Speaker 1 (41:56):
I'm not going to third Baptist because after that there's
too many fat I didn't change.
Speaker 4 (42:03):
Think it's very I think that we have to be
careful about what you just said. You're not going back
to that same local entity, but you will continue to
go and see God and build your relationship at another institution.
But you still need to do one thing before you transfer.
Go to therapy.
Speaker 1 (42:20):
Now, when we say go to therapy, JT. Because we
got some people that's going to say, well, I don't
believe in therapy. And particularly for us, health care has
not been on our side. Mental health was not made
for black folks. It was created for a wealthy white men.
And so what I tell people is that everyone is
(42:41):
not going to go to therapy, But there are experiences
that you can have that can be therapeutic, that can
encourage you on your journey because therapy, as we talked about,
it's scary. In fact, therapy causes such a disruption that
you feel worse after the sessions because they're breaking up stuff.
(43:02):
They got you unpacking, you know what I'm saying. They
got you, They got you really thinking about things that
you have moved into the back of your mind and said,
you know what, I don't want to deal with that.
And then and and and and if we're honest, there
is a pacity of clinicians right now that are not
I don't think and I tell this to every therapist.
(43:24):
Every therapist should have a therapist because you cannot take
and ingest all of this in from other people. You
have to go somewhere to process there. So if you
do go to therapy, make sure that you're a therapist,
not just ethically, but make sure that they are sound
even in their own practice and therapy. Finding a therapist,
just like dating, ask those questions do you have and
(43:47):
expertise in dealing with racial trauma? Have you work with
people who've been molested by the same sex? Like you
have to ask those questions because the worst thing that
I hate that I don't like rather is for someone
to be open up and not closed properly. That's what
you just said. You go and have surgery and these
joke who's leave something in you or they don't close
(44:11):
you up properly. Now it's turning into an infection. Now
it's turning to gang green. Now all of a sudden,
we got to move your whole liver because somebody mishandled
you properly.
Speaker 6 (44:20):
I was gonna say, but okay, we're comparing it to
mal practice in the hospital. What I realized about hospitals
is a lot of it is trial and era and
a lot of it is per person.
Speaker 1 (44:27):
Right, That's why it's called practice.
Speaker 6 (44:29):
Yeah, practice right. So I say that to say, you
can ask your therapists all those questions, but you don't
know until you get with that therapist if they're going
to close you black up properly, and then that makes
people not want to do therapy sometimes after that happens,
So it's like, what do you tell people?
Speaker 1 (44:43):
Then, well, therapy, you know, it's a relationship. The effectiveness
of any therapist is determined by the quality of relationship
that they build with the client. When I'm working with individuals,
when I was in private practice, it would be about
four sessions in before I start asking deep questions because
(45:05):
I'm mapping with them. I'm just talking to them because
I want them to feel like we're having a conversation.
Nobody wants to go in and all of a sudden,
it's like, all of a sudden, you know what happened
to you as a kid? Like wait a minute, right,
Like you're moving too fast? You know. It's like, you know,
at least you know, talk sweet to me and yeah, listen,
(45:26):
take me to the cheesecase faster something. And so I
think too, it's a journey. You know. I've been saying
this since I, you know, have been in this space.
Healing is a journey, man, It's truly a journey, and
it may take a few therapists for you to kind
of work through. And I know that can be emotional exhausting.
And this is why I'm careful for anybody. Do not
(45:47):
go in divulging everything. Use wisdom. That is my thing
when you're going into a clinical session, because I've had
people come to me and it's like, well, doctor, j
session turned into me helpen my therapist, you know. And
so you're right, Lauren, it can be very it could
be very scary, and then too, if you have somebody
(46:10):
who hasn't been processing. I tell every therapist you can
only take the client as deep as the work that
you've done internally within yourself, because it could be become
very pernicious, very dangerous for somebody to open up and
then all of a sudden they leave feeling like, man,
what did I just do?
Speaker 5 (46:28):
I just told you my business, and that is.
Speaker 4 (46:30):
What I want to add to it. You're gonna be twenty,
you're gonna be twenty five, you're gonna be thirty, you're
gonna be thirty five, you're gonna be forty, you're gonna
be forty five, you're gonna be fifty, and you're gonna
be fifty five. You gonna be sixty and you gotta
be sixty five. At what point are you going to
(46:54):
say I matter enough, Yeah, to express myself.
Speaker 1 (47:00):
M M.
Speaker 4 (47:00):
That's good because you're gonna you're going to continue to
get old if you don't die. And do you have
to ask you a question? How has life been working
for me? I'm the one that won't talk. I'm the
one that won't sit down and actually get help, it's
not the therapist's fault, and it's not about fault. It's
(47:21):
about me giving me a try to be better because
I deserve to be better. Yeah, and that process, it
is what it is. It's not cookie cutter. Mine's not
gonna be what Jay's is not gonna be what Charlomagne
is is. It's gonna be what it takes to get
me to where I need to be. And you got
to ask yourself the question, am I worth what it
(47:42):
takes to get where I need to be? And where
I need to be? It's not where you are, it's
where I need to be.
Speaker 3 (47:50):
You got to stop lying to yourself, right Like, at
some point you gotta be honest with who you know
you are because we know each other. Yeah, you know
yourself better than anybody. Got be honest with who you
are and what you're feeling. And I think one of
the hardest things for men to say to other men
and just in general, Yo, that hurt my feelings?
Speaker 2 (48:07):
Are you hurt my feeling period?
Speaker 4 (48:10):
Period? You know that's a good thing about to be
real hood right here?
Speaker 3 (48:17):
I want to brain love hoodies, but that is hardy
the fight, so.
Speaker 1 (48:25):
I would do the promotion for you, good brother, my
good brother, doctor Joe. I'm gonna let him talk about it,
but I'm excited because he's had to live this book
in real time. And I think this book it comes
out nover before before, and it's so powerful. So I
(48:46):
think it's so powerful because if it's going to be
a fight to find yourself, you know, you know, we've
been rocking for years and you know every time I share,
you know, my story about surviving to suicide attempts, it
was a fight because you know, we talked about when
even when Twitch passed, it was triggering to me. It's
(49:07):
a fight to find yourself. Man.
Speaker 4 (49:09):
So this book it's gonna cost you something. It's gonna
cost you something. That's why when you when we were there,
it was the perfect way for me to just bring
it up. It costs to find you. It costs you,
It costs pride, it costs relationships, and you have to
ask yourself the question, am I willing to pay that
price to find myself? And is it gonna be embarrassing? Probably?
(49:33):
Are there gonna be some things that come up that
you thought would never come up? Probably? But if you
think you're valuable enough to be who you know you're
supposed to be. It's worth the fight because most of
the time, in my life, it's all about what we do.
It's about what you do. What you do is what's
getting you paid, your performance, and so we become so
(49:55):
performance driven. Everything we do is based off performance. And
so just like you just I said earlier, four o'clock
in the morning, eight o'clock at night, that's our lives
because we got to perform. We got to be on
an a game. Every time we get behind a microphone,
it doesn't matter. But there's no mic in your private life.
There's no mic with your emotions. There's no mics with
how you love your mother, your children, you know your spouse,
(50:17):
And you got to figure out how do I fight
to just be me? And if I don't know who
I am, it becomes even harder because I got to
dig through performance to get there. And once you dig
through all of the awards and dig through all of
the accolades, what's there? Who am I? At the core?
And if you can't say who you are without presenting
(50:38):
what you do, it's a very cloudy picture. You have
no idea who you are. And I didn't find out
who I was until I was forty four years old
and I said it on a public stage and other
men said, I can't believe you just did that. And
I cried, what did you say? I don't know who
(50:58):
I am? And you know what, they said, We've seen
you preach on stages all over the world with thousands
of people. You're all over the place. People are being blessed,
people are buying all your books. And I said, yeah,
and I don't know who I am.
Speaker 3 (51:14):
Doesn't that change all the time. When I started going
to therapy in thirty six, I was the same way.
I was like, damn, I thought I knew who I was,
but I have no idea. But then like the older
I get, Yeah, you evolve the more things change in
your life. You know, you grow as a father, you
grow as a husband, and you just get older and
you just like, man, who am I?
Speaker 4 (51:32):
And it's normal and you have to continue to fight
to find who you are and lean into it that
it's actually okay, that this is a normal fight, and
learn how to fight right. As one of the chapters
in the book, fight right, because we fight wrong, We
fight wrong, we fight through you know, substance abuse, We
fight other people we fight with unhealthy practices, and when
(51:53):
you can learn how to fight right and actually say
healthy things to yourself and to other people, you actually
become a gold mind. Tell you you know what I mean,
and you don't have to have other people to tell
you that you're valuable. You realize that you really are
an incredible person and that God loves you the way
you are. I think it's incredible thought.
Speaker 2 (52:13):
That was Judge Matthews front.
Speaker 3 (52:26):
Is this first chapter why we don't believe what God
says about us?
Speaker 4 (52:32):
Well, he loves you, He loves you. And if you
can get to the point that He actually loves you
and you're not waiting on you to say it and
you to say it, and you to say it, and
you to say it, then I can emerge from ashes
Man because I know that He actually loves me. When
Jesus gets ready to get baptized by John the Baptist,
what happens. He gets baptized and God says, this is
(52:54):
my bee love son in whom I'm well pleased. That's
all he needed to was his father.
Speaker 1 (53:01):
Say I love him, I love him, and that val
him validated everything, because next thing he does, he goes
into the wilderness and the devil was something if you
do this, if you do that. If he didn't have
to do any of that, because he was already loved
prior to going into what he was getting ready to
battle for. So we just got to learn that, Hey,
he loves me like I am, broken, busted, disgusted. That's
(53:25):
the foundation of everything.
Speaker 4 (53:27):
He loves me. And if I can start there, man,
you can rise through anything. But it's all about you
actually being truthful to yourself and say, you know what,
I'm gonna come to you like I am because you
actually love me like I am.
Speaker 2 (53:40):
They'll keep you from having a podcast.
Speaker 1 (53:42):
Oh yeah, yeah yeah. And I think when you when
you embrace that, man, that that love, uh, that there
is an assurance that you have within self that you're
not waiting for something to happen, because oftentimes we move
with God performing a wave. Well, if I do good,
(54:03):
I can accept this love, and if I do well,
I can get someone this blessing. And I think that
chapter is good, man, because basically what you're saying, if
you did nothing else beyond just being you, his love
is not changing for you.
Speaker 4 (54:16):
Here's the beauty of it, which is when I made
that statement on stage. I went with him on a
trip and we had been going around for I think
two years, and we had went back around to Columbus, Ohio.
And so when we go out on stage, we have
this Hey, you know, we're gonna start this way, We're
gonna go this way, We're gonna segue it this way. Hey, Joe,
you take it here. That's kind of how we always
hit it. So when it got time for me to
(54:38):
tell this particular story, kind of how we always rotate,
I stopped dead in the middle of the story. I said, Man,
I'm not telling this story no more. And all of
the guys is looking like it's about eight hundred men
in the room, black men. I'm not telling this story
no more. I said, Man, I'm sorry, and.
Speaker 1 (54:55):
Like j T.
Speaker 4 (54:56):
Go ahead, He's like JG go on to speak. I said,
I'm tired of telling this story because I'm having to
relive this story every time I tell you this story.
And so I decided that moment, I said, I'm gonna
tell y'all a new story. I said, And it's not
a story that hasn't happened yet. It's the story I
want to see. And when I said what I wanted
(55:18):
to see. It wasn't a dry eye in.
Speaker 1 (55:20):
The room because I was going through the opposite of
what I was saying.
Speaker 4 (55:24):
That's how I end that book. Write a new story.
You want to get healthy mentally, write your story, create
a new narrative. You don't have to keep replaying the
same thing that happened to you. And I know it
was terrible, and I know it costs, and I know
it hurt. But every time you tell it, you feel
the costs again, you feel the terror again, you feel
(55:45):
the pain again, and it becomes so cyclical. Well, why
not write what you want? Why not see what you
want to see? And that's what's going to happen when
you fight to find yourself, because you control the narrative
and you can be who you want to be. You
can make what you want to make, you can marry
who you want to marry, you can do what you
want to do. That's the kind of power that you
actually possess if you can wake up to it and realize.
Speaker 3 (56:09):
Was a real preacher you preorder to fight to find yourself,
moving from uncertain to unstoppable right now to be in
bookstores November fourth, This was a powerful conversation to have
on World Mental Health Day.
Speaker 1 (56:20):
Man. Yeah, man, and always brother. You know I love
love you man to the moon and back. Man and
always man. We've been rocking for the past six for
five years, we've been doing the expo. Man. Uh, you know,
I just got to share this. Man. One of his
chapters is about our friendship, man, And and I would say,
get some people in your life, man, that just see
(56:41):
you like he was coming up here to support me
today and our friendship has been on display, and so
many men are watching me just staying with him, even
in his a situation. But just the beauty of man.
You know, this blesses me, my dog, to see the world,
(57:01):
get to hear him this morning on the breakfast club,
you know, and to be amongst y'all. Man. So this
is just beautiful. And this is what mental health really is,
because when you start to think better, you begin to
live better, and you start to attract better. You know
what I mean.
Speaker 4 (57:16):
Let me say this please. I came to support him.
He's a brother that supports me and everything that I do.
And I wanted to be here for him. And I
was sitting in there and then you walk in the
room and just say y'all want to do it together
and walked off. They didn't say nothing else, didn't wait
for me to respond, and nothing. And I'm like, he
looked at me, say you want to do it. I'm like, yeah,
(57:39):
he said, come on. And so I'm saying that to
say this. You position yourself with good people. You said
something earlier. I don't look for him to give me anything.
I'm here for him. I don't and it's vice versa.
And because we're friends and we've positioned ourselves to support
each other, we open up a new business together.
Speaker 1 (57:59):
Yes, I mean mental.
Speaker 5 (58:00):
Health practice congratulation than things.
Speaker 4 (58:04):
Just have been happening for us. So I don't take
it lightly. Thank you for the opportunity to come share
in your space. And it's a blessing. Man, thank you,
thank you very much.
Speaker 3 (58:12):
You can see doctor j He'll be at the Mental
Wealth Expo tomorrow in Newark, New Jersey at the Joel
and Diane Bloom Wellness and Events Center.
Speaker 2 (58:20):
I wish doctor Tubman was there too.
Speaker 4 (58:21):
Man, he got a geograph got. I don't know if
there's streaming or not. I know it's a conference in
Carolina for Bishop Michael Blue tomorrow night somewhere in South Carolina.
I think Columbia, South Carolina. I think that's correct.
Speaker 1 (58:37):
Is that right?
Speaker 4 (58:37):
Columbia South Carolina. I'll be with him tomorrow night. What
time is your expo?
Speaker 2 (58:42):
Eleven to four on Saturday.
Speaker 4 (58:44):
Yeah, I have to do a wellness event in Florida,
which would be mental health and physical fitness and everything
else that you can imagine.
Speaker 5 (58:52):
Please go to Florida. They need all the wellness.
Speaker 1 (58:57):
Yes, y'all be reporting every day Florida. Them people different. Bro,
come on.
Speaker 3 (59:05):
Back, but you know, the work not just this weekend.
I mean, this work is continuous. I do want to
ask about the Brain Love.
Speaker 1 (59:11):
Yeah. So this is my good brother Archie Man down
in Atlanta, Georgia. This brand is in Bloomingdale's in Atlanta.
Brain Love. He created this, uh this around mental health
and to getting a healthy brain and uh the work
that he's doing. Me and him partner uh to come
together and this this collection is in Bloomingdale. I mean,
(59:33):
y'all see the material and so he's also told me
I spoke to him, he's also gonna send everybody here gear.
So you guys a rock So yeah, and uh, the
materials is amazing and really his His message is really
to get us a healthier brain. And then you see
the message on the back of you know, telling you know,
to tell ourselves that we love ourselves. And for black people, listen, man,
(59:55):
our mental health is everything. And particularly in this time
politically and and in this time that we're in that
so much is attacking us. Take care of your mind.
Be careful of what you consume. Too much consumption of
this negativity with the news. I mean, every day we
it's something with this clown. You know, y'all know what
the clown talking about. But but man, that because this
(01:00:17):
crash out era that we're seeing right now is just overwhelming.
People are just losing it. So encourage everybody, man, keep
your brain healthy.
Speaker 3 (01:00:26):
That's right, is doctor j Bartnett, Doctor Joel tell mean,
thank you, brothers.
Speaker 1 (01:00:29):
Man.
Speaker 2 (01:00:31):
The Breakfast Club.
Speaker 3 (01:00:33):
Every day a week ago, clicks up the Breakfast Club.
Speaker 2 (01:00:37):
Finish y'all done.
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