February 24, 2025 • 19 mins
Gavin Rubinstein is one of Australia’s top real estate agents, AREC speaker, and well-known for his unmatched record of achievements.
We cover:
- Why this market presents the best opportunity for good agents to become great
- Strategies for aligning buyers and vendors
- How eliminating excuses results in successful transactions
- How he creates clear swim lanes for his offshore team - Wingman
- How the Federal Election, is affecting stock volumes and buyer sentiment
This webinar is sponsored by Wingman
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Tom Panos (00:03):
And the gates are open.
Ladies and gentlemen, so pumpedMonday afternoon it's 4 o'clock
here in Sydney and I've gotwith me, of course, nick Georges
, one of the senior people ofWingman.
And I also have with me GavinRubenstein, who I've got to.
You know.
Someone said to me the otherday, mate, what's Gavin really
(00:25):
like?
I said, listen, I'll tell youwhat he's really like.
I looked up the stairs the daymy brother was getting buried
and he looked like he was thefirst person waiting.
I said that's all I've got tosay.
That's all I've got to say.
And, gav, you've just told meyou and your firm have had the
best six months of businesssince you've been opening up.
(00:49):
But you said that not showingoff.
You actually were talking to mebeforehand and you're telling
me how hard it is narrowing thegap, getting vendors and buyers
on the same page, but regardless, there's volume out there,
isn't there.
Gavin Rubinstein (01:04):
Gav.
I think there's opportunity outthere and I think that this is
the sort of climate for the bestto become great, which is an
opportunity that I relish.
It's an opportunity thateveryone at the firm, at TRG, is
excited by we know how to swimwith the current but I also
think it's a climate that'sgoing to kill off a lot of
people in the industry who havehad it easy for a long period of
(01:25):
time.
Like we quiz a lot of the topperforming agents in our Monday
morning sales meetings, whichdon't drag on, they last for 10
or 15 minutes.
Whoever's had a good week.
I kind of put them on the spotand unpack every one of their
sales and what they did, and sowhat we are noticing is like buy
work is becoming reallyimportant in terms of getting
deals done.
We're noticing expired listingsare a huge stream of revenue
(01:48):
because you know agents have hadthese properties who actually
don't know how to sell them.
We're picking up, we're sellingthem, and then what ties in
with that is probably the thirdother really important point is
really open and honestcommunication with your vendor
and with your client.
Right, and that's the reasonwe're picking these up, because
the agent initially did not havethat sort of open, honest
communication with their clientand we do, and it seems to be
(02:10):
making all of the difference.
But doing that stuff ain't easy.
If it was, everyone would do it, but yeah, it's hard to get it
together out there.
Nothing we can't do and do inspades, but definitely tougher
for sure.
Tom Panos (02:20):
I asked Gavin Nick before we came on out of
everything that's happened inreal estate.
When he looks at one of thehappiest times in award season,
he said it would have been theyear that both I got number one
principal and Oliver Lavers gotnumber one sales agent.
(02:42):
And I can see why you said it,gavin, because this guy here it
was like he was with you.
Was it five years before hewent out on his own?
Gavin Rubinstein (02:53):
longer, longer .
He was with me 10 years and he,um, he went out on his own now
four years ago, five years ago.
Um, oh no, so you're right.
Yeah, so he was with me fiveodd years before he went out on
his own.
Yeah, yeah.
Tom Panos (03:10):
Can I ask before we move on, because today we're
going to talk about the teambehind the team, and you know
I'm just delighted, gav, thatI'm going to have the
opportunity to interview you atthe great conference, profit,
which is being held nextThursday, which, by the way,
everyone this is officially nowthe largest number of people
(03:30):
that have gone to a leadershipconference in the history of
real estate.
At the moment it's tracking for600 people, some of the people
that are going to be speakingthere, apart from Gavin, anthony
Bell, john McGrath, phil Harris, of course, john Bell, nick,
you're also being part of it,there assisting me throughout
(03:52):
the day, and I'm pretty pumpedand excited because on that day
you're going to cover a lot morecontent.
But today, gav, I want to askyou Wingman has a very important
role in your business, but ithasn't taken the role of what
you do.
That's critical, and I'm justcurious what are the things that
you say, wingman?
(04:13):
I'm not touching this is mybaby.
I do this day in, day out.
What are those things?
Gavin Rubinstein (04:19):
So it's kind of two part.
I mean the first part is it's ahuge help in our property
management business and I knowthat may not apply to everybody
who's in sales.
I know maybe business ownersand property management agents
will relish it and see hugeopportunity with it.
I know Jerome couldn't livewithout it.
In fact I actually did apodcast with the guys and
talking to John and Nick abouttheir growth and their personal
(04:42):
journey and seeing theimpressive things that they have
done, I've actually got Jerometo fly out to Brisbane to chat
to them in more depth so we cangrow our business as much as we
possibly can and learn from them.
So that's the first part.
The second part is they are andlook, it depends what level
you're at, tommy.
Like if you're zero to 500, youmay have different requirements
(05:03):
than if you're 500 to a mil andif you're one to two, two to
three and so on.
But at my level right, it's thecombination of when we've got
such crazy volume and things arespinning at a very high level.
Wingman plays the role of beingthe team behind my team as such
, so it's not necessarily that Ideal with them personally, but
you've got Montana who runs myadmin operations and pretty much
(05:26):
wears 10 different other hats.
Who has that resource availableto her?
And you know, I'm told it runsvery smoothly, right, if it
wasn't, I'm usually told whenthere's a problem.
When there's no problem, I knowthings are running smoothly.
So I call them the team behindmy team and, of course, super
valuable in the PM space as well.
Tom Panos (05:47):
You know a lot of the people that are on this webinar
I think about 140, and there'sa lot more that are registered,
and you know what webinars arelike Some people show up, others
don't show up, others watch iton repeat, some never watch it,
but we're going to make theassumption there's going to be
at least another 200 people thatare going to watch it.
So 340 people Out of the 340, Ireckon you have that.
(06:08):
There's probably 80% of thosepeople probably here are either
a principal or they're a salesagent, and even the principals
are selling agents, most of themlike yourself.
You've got your.
You're a director ZBU right.
So I want to ask if you were anagent alone, how would you use
Wingman?
(06:28):
If you were an agent writing,say, 500, 600, 700, how would
you use Wingman?
Gavin Rubinstein (06:33):
I would use them for everything that wasn't
dollar productive related, right?
So and it's interesting becausethat everyone has a different
interpretation of what that isso I think, as an agent or a
practitioner, you've got to workout what's the stuff that
really brings in the dollars forme.
Is that meeting with top buyers?
Is that building relationships?
Is that listing presentations?
(06:53):
Is that knocking on doors?
Whatever the case may be,whatever that looks like, focus
and dedicate your time, energyand attention just to those
aspects and avenues of yourbusiness.
And everything else and, as youknow, in real estate, I mean I
could sit here and list 200tasks, right, that are almost
admin based related, but stillneed to be done, still need to
be done at a high level,particularly when they're
(07:15):
connecting with the client.
I would find that out to awingman and essentially get
someone from the company totrain them how you like it being
done, which I know Montanaspent some time doing but
collectively as a team, I thinkthat can be very beneficial.
On that basis, the dollarproductive stuff use an agent,
handle the non-dollar productivebut necessary tasks.
Farm that out.
Tom Panos (07:36):
So I'm going to echo and extend on what you've just
said, gavin.
When I talk to all the clientsthat use Wingman in my real
estate gym, I find that the onesthat are doing more than 100
deals a year or are riding oneand a half million and over they
say this to me Tom Wingman doeseverything except look for my
(07:58):
next listing, go to my nextappraisal, sit with a buyer and
put a deal together, or sit withmy vendor and educate them on
this is what's happening in themarket.
This is what I think you shouldbe doing with your marketing
and your price at the moment.
Unless they're doing one ofthose four things, they feel
(08:18):
that they're not being incomeproducing and that they keep
palming it off.
So what you're saying soundsalong the lines of them.
But I know, gab, because I knowI've dealt with you.
I've worked with you for somany years it's decades, it's
not years now and I know you'vegot this high standard.
Like you would be obsessiveeven about the font or anything
(08:40):
in a brand or how photos andvideos look.
So I'm just curious about theclient experience that you've
had.
Has anything been coming upwhere people feel, oh it, it's
dropped?
Gavin Rubinstein (08:55):
I wouldn't think so nothing's perfect in
this world, like, whether it'soffshore, whether it's onshore,
like the, the like.
I've got people who've beenworking in my team for two,
three years and um weekly,sometimes daily, you know
talking to them about how we canrefine what we do in order to
be better, and that's thefastidious nature of, I guess,
(09:17):
my style and approach, whichsome people can find annoying
and, to be honest, even I findit annoying, but I can't help it
because it's who I am.
But, like I said, you know,monty and I have worked with our
guys at Wingman to make surethat they do it in the way that
we like, and that takes a bit oftime.
But whether it's offshore oronshore, it takes a bit of time.
Anyway, you've got to make theinvestment Remember it's a third
(09:48):
of the price, um, so it'sworthwhile once you get them to
do it in the style that you likeand when and if there is an odd
or rare occasion where there'sa mistake, refine it.
Let them know, um and and look,unless they've put the best
guys onto us.
We haven't had any major, youknow, crashes or crazy issues
with it.
Tom Panos (09:57):
Nick, I'm gonna bring you into the conversation.
I want to ask you you know how.
There are various we've gotmarkets.
So Gavin works in a high valuemarket and many would say it's a
high value but lower turnovermarket than, say, blacktown,
(10:17):
which has got a low value but ahigh turnover market.
What's your experience withWingman working in different
markets, like Gav's?
Median price, I mean?
Off the top of my head, Ireckon it'd probably be around 4
, 5 mil.
Is that what it is?
Gav Up Six, seven, wow, okay.
(10:39):
So the bottom line is if you'rein Blacktown, you're going to
(11:00):
have to sell 10 houses, right,gavin will sell one.
That's the short summary ofwhat it is right.
Nick Georges (11:02):
They're all laughing.
Luke's laughing.
Luke's got on a seekcom.
He's looking in the east andthe north shore.
So what's your experience, nick, with?
Yeah, I think it doesn't reallymatter what marketplace you're
working in.
It's actually you have to bringit internally and it's what do
you want to achieve.
So, for example, you justmentioned, if you're in
Blacktown, you need to sell 10houses to Gavin's One.
But an agent that's selling 10to one homes might want a
(11:24):
different client experience.
So I know, working with Gavin,he's absolutely obsessed with
not only the client experiencebut exceeding the client's
experiences every time, which isone of the reasons why he's
been one of the best agents inthe country for such a long
period of time and why theclients keep coming back to him.
So actually tailoring a solutionfor TRG or for Gavin's way that
(11:49):
he wants to do it is very, verydifferent to an agent who's
starting off.
It doesn't matter whatmarketplace.
So the task list that we havefor Gavin's team is very, very
different to, potentially, anagent that's working in a
competitor's office next toGavin.
So that's one of the thingsthat we do we like to get under
(12:10):
the hood and understand what theagent wants to achieve and what
the office wants to achieve,and we can tailor a solution to
fit that.
Tom Panos (12:19):
Nick, can I ask you on property management, what are
you know?
Because I often get I hadmanagement.
What are you know?
Because I often get I hadanother I had you know the other
day, liam, from Byron Bay,which I put onto you.
They often ask me, right, like,what are the main stuff that a
wingman person in Manila can doin PM?
Right, they often feel like theinitial feeling is people say
(12:42):
no, man, I need to be able tospeak to them at the next table.
Right, tell me, what's the mainrole.
Description of a PM wingmanperson working in the
Philippines.
Nick Georges (12:59):
I can actually answer it the other way.
So what should a propertymanager be doing in Australia?
So a property manager inAustralia, all they should be
doing is building a relationshipwith the landlord and dealing
with escalated issues.
That's literally all theyshould be doing.
Everything else should bestripped away and given to
(13:22):
someone else, whether that beonshore or offshore, depending
on the style of office, whatthey want to achieve.
But if you're a new business,you should just be prospecting,
listing, selling or prospectingand signing managements.
Everything else should bestripped away.
In property management, all youshould be doing is building
relationships with the landlordsand dealing with escalated
(13:43):
issues.
Gavin Rubinstein (13:44):
Everything else.
Tom Panos (13:47):
You're muted.
You're muted, nick, just unmute.
Sorry, you just muted that lastfew seconds.
So basically, it's a little bitlike sales and what you're
saying is that essentially, whatyou're saying is divisions of
labour.
Make sure that you're notfocused in non-dollar productive
activity and do you find thatoffshore can achieve that?
Nick Georges (14:12):
Yeah, absolutely one of the reasons why we
actually have the academy, oneof the reasons why we're
training them in propertymanagement, why we're training
them in sales operations, andthat's why they're working so
well in EBUs and propertymanagement businesses across
Australia.
Tom Panos (14:29):
Okay, Gavin, I want to ask you did you notice at all
since rates have gone down, hasthere been any change
whatsoever in the economiclandscape from buyers or sellers
?
Too early or too early to call?
Gavin Rubinstein (14:46):
I reckon it's been like, I think it's been
seriously tumultuous sinceprobably august last year.
Like I'm not noticing adifference today versus august.
I just like I feel like themarket changes and correct me if
you think well, you're hearingdifferent.
I think last week is differentto this week.
I just I can't quite decipheror identify any particular
(15:12):
pattern or trend.
You know, like it's, it's, it'sdefinitely not that frothy,
crazy where you've got 10 buyersgoing nuts who will pay
anything and everything just tosecure it.
That it was a year and a half,two years ago, um, but I still
think stock is relatively tight,particularly in my market.
Like good choices, good optionsthere's a bit of shit around,
(15:33):
but like the good stuff is, isselling really well, um, and I
think you've got to know how toduck, weave, like I say,
communicate, eliminate allexcuses vendors may have through
the process and that isbecoming as fine as, like you
know, whether it's tasks,customer expectation, the
marketing spelling.
Photo order timing on doingwhat you say you're going to do
(15:55):
like really, really basic stuff.
Photo order timing on doingwhat you say you were going to
do, like really, really basicstuff.
If that's not done, it's goingto be very hard to have that
conversation with the vendorabout, you know, getting
realistic.
Tom Panos (16:04):
So, gav, at ARIC four or five years ago you had a
beautiful.
There are two sentences Iremember from you on stage.
The first one is you've got toclose the door of excuses.
And this happened on Saturdaybecause I got there, I met the
vendor.
There was already arelationship because there's a
(16:26):
connection through social media.
He opened up and he startedcomplaining about the fact that
the first week of the open whathad happened is there were the
ad.
He was not happy with somethingin the advert.
When the property didn't sellafterwards he just it was
(16:47):
because of the advert.
Yeah, he just patted me andgoes it's not your fault.
He goes what do you expect withthat?
And I'm thinking to myselfexactly that Every vendor will
look at every reason except forthe price.
So you've got to make sure thatthere is no other reason,
because if there is, you can'twin that battle.
(17:08):
And then the second thingyou've said, which I've
plagiarized and I say it overand over again at some point in
your life, if you're going tohave an elf business effortless,
lucrative and fun you've got tobe the prospected one, not the
one that prospects all the time.
And I saw that with my own eyesin Sylvania waters that day.
(17:32):
So, nick, listen to what happens.
I'm sitting on in the livingroom about to start an auction.
We were there 15, 20 minutesearly.
I don't do government auctions.
This was a one-off in the StGeorgia, in the Sylvania waters
area, and there's a guy hoveringaround and it was, like you
know, it was a bit like a guyhovering to get an autograph or
(17:54):
something.
And I just looked at this guyright and then I thought he
comes on.
Do you remember the moment,gavin, we're talking about?
He comes on over Nick and heturns around and he goes listen,
I've got this property.
And I mean, I know that you'renot in the area, but I think, if
you see this, so he has starttrying to convince Gavin, at
(18:16):
least come out and give me anappraisal.
It's like it's bizarre, likeit's always the other way around
, and I think when you talkabout being the prospected one
versus the prospector, it's allabout brand marketing, a magnet
profile already winning theinterview before there is an
(18:39):
interview, because they're justaware of it.
Gav, does that happen a lotsometimes, or was that, like Tom
, that's once a year?
You were just there at theright time.
Gavin Rubinstein (18:52):
No, no, no.
It happens a lot.
It happens a lot, but that's notto take anything away from um,
like the crazy level of of ofhustle that you need to have,
particularly when you you getthrough the door, because it's
not even if someone wants me tocome over and give them my view
on.
You know how to sell, maximizethe price and what I would do.
Like nine out of ten timesthey're seeing three other
(19:13):
agents, irrespective of howexcited that they may be, and so
that's like, and people forgethow many facets of the process
as a real estate agent you'veactually got a hit on.
That's just one of the manyfacets is getting through the
door and being able to pitch.
Then it's about how do I showthis vendor you know that I'm
100% the best person for the joband that's not through cutting
(19:35):
my fees and cutting my marketingplan, because that's
essentially how you do a greatjob, or part of the tools that
you use to do the great job.
So that's the second part ofthe process.
And then you've got to convincethem once you've left an
impression, because they'reprobably seeing two or three
other people after right up tothe sharp end of signing an
agency agreement right, becauseno matter how good a salesperson
, salesman, saleswoman you are,you can't make a sale.
And the gates are open.
Ladies and gentlemen, so pumpedMonday afternoon it's 4 o'clock
here in Sydney and I've gotwith me, of course, nick Georges
, one of the senior people ofWingman.
And I also have with me GavinRubenstein, who I've got to.
You know.
Someone said to me the otherday, mate, what's Gavin really
(00:25):
like?
I said, listen, I'll tell youwhat he's really like.
I looked up the stairs the daymy brother was getting buried
and he looked like he was thefirst person waiting.
I said that's all I've got tosay.
That's all I've got to say.
And, gav, you've just told meyou and your firm have had the
best six months of businesssince you've been opening up.
(00:49):
But you said that not showingoff.
You actually were talking to mebeforehand and you're telling
me how hard it is narrowing thegap, getting vendors and buyers
on the same page, but regardless, there's volume out there,
isn't there.
Gavin Rubinstein (01:04):
Gav.
I think there's opportunity outthere and I think that this is
the sort of climate for the bestto become great, which is an
opportunity that I relish.
It's an opportunity thateveryone at the firm, at TRG, is
excited by we know how to swimwith the current but I also
think it's a climate that'sgoing to kill off a lot of
people in the industry who havehad it easy for a long period of
(01:25):
time.
Like we quiz a lot of the topperforming agents in our Monday
morning sales meetings, whichdon't drag on, they last for 10
or 15 minutes.
Whoever's had a good week.
I kind of put them on the spotand unpack every one of their
sales and what they did, and sowhat we are noticing is like buy
work is becoming reallyimportant in terms of getting
deals done.
We're noticing expired listingsare a huge stream of revenue
(01:48):
because you know agents have hadthese properties who actually
don't know how to sell them.
We're picking up, we're sellingthem, and then what ties in
with that is probably the thirdother really important point is
really open and honestcommunication with your vendor
and with your client.
Right, and that's the reasonwe're picking these up, because
the agent initially did not havethat sort of open, honest
communication with their clientand we do, and it seems to be
(02:10):
making all of the difference.
But doing that stuff ain't easy.
If it was, everyone would do it, but yeah, it's hard to get it
together out there.
Nothing we can't do and do inspades, but definitely tougher
for sure.
Tom Panos (02:20):
I asked Gavin Nick before we came on out of
everything that's happened inreal estate.
When he looks at one of thehappiest times in award season,
he said it would have been theyear that both I got number one
principal and Oliver Lavers gotnumber one sales agent.
(02:42):
And I can see why you said it,gavin, because this guy here it
was like he was with you.
Was it five years before hewent out on his own?
Gavin Rubinstein (02:53):
longer, longer .
He was with me 10 years and he,um, he went out on his own now
four years ago, five years ago.
Um, oh no, so you're right.
Yeah, so he was with me fiveodd years before he went out on
his own.
Yeah, yeah.
Tom Panos (03:10):
Can I ask before we move on, because today we're
going to talk about the teambehind the team, and you know
I'm just delighted, gav, thatI'm going to have the
opportunity to interview you atthe great conference, profit,
which is being held nextThursday, which, by the way,
everyone this is officially nowthe largest number of people
(03:30):
that have gone to a leadershipconference in the history of
real estate.
At the moment it's tracking for600 people, some of the people
that are going to be speakingthere, apart from Gavin, anthony
Bell, john McGrath, phil Harris, of course, john Bell, nick,
you're also being part of it,there assisting me throughout
(03:52):
the day, and I'm pretty pumpedand excited because on that day
you're going to cover a lot morecontent.
But today, gav, I want to askyou Wingman has a very important
role in your business, but ithasn't taken the role of what
you do.
That's critical, and I'm justcurious what are the things that
you say, wingman?
(04:13):
I'm not touching this is mybaby.
I do this day in, day out.
What are those things?
Gavin Rubinstein (04:19):
So it's kind of two part.
I mean the first part is it's ahuge help in our property
management business and I knowthat may not apply to everybody
who's in sales.
I know maybe business ownersand property management agents
will relish it and see hugeopportunity with it.
I know Jerome couldn't livewithout it.
In fact I actually did apodcast with the guys and
talking to John and Nick abouttheir growth and their personal
(04:42):
journey and seeing theimpressive things that they have
done, I've actually got Jerometo fly out to Brisbane to chat
to them in more depth so we cangrow our business as much as we
possibly can and learn from them.
So that's the first part.
The second part is they are andlook, it depends what level
you're at, tommy.
Like if you're zero to 500, youmay have different requirements
(05:03):
than if you're 500 to a mil andif you're one to two, two to
three and so on.
But at my level right, it's thecombination of when we've got
such crazy volume and things arespinning at a very high level.
Wingman plays the role of beingthe team behind my team as such
, so it's not necessarily that Ideal with them personally, but
you've got Montana who runs myadmin operations and pretty much
(05:26):
wears 10 different other hats.
Who has that resource availableto her?
And you know, I'm told it runsvery smoothly, right, if it
wasn't, I'm usually told whenthere's a problem.
When there's no problem, I knowthings are running smoothly.
So I call them the team behindmy team and, of course, super
valuable in the PM space as well.
Tom Panos (05:47):
You know a lot of the people that are on this webinar
I think about 140, and there'sa lot more that are registered,
and you know what webinars arelike Some people show up, others
don't show up, others watch iton repeat, some never watch it,
but we're going to make theassumption there's going to be
at least another 200 people thatare going to watch it.
So 340 people Out of the 340, Ireckon you have that.
(06:08):
There's probably 80% of thosepeople probably here are either
a principal or they're a salesagent, and even the principals
are selling agents, most of themlike yourself.
You've got your.
You're a director ZBU right.
So I want to ask if you were anagent alone, how would you use
Wingman?
(06:28):
If you were an agent writing,say, 500, 600, 700, how would
you use Wingman?
Gavin Rubinstein (06:33):
I would use them for everything that wasn't
dollar productive related, right?
So and it's interesting becausethat everyone has a different
interpretation of what that isso I think, as an agent or a
practitioner, you've got to workout what's the stuff that
really brings in the dollars forme.
Is that meeting with top buyers?
Is that building relationships?
Is that listing presentations?
(06:53):
Is that knocking on doors?
Whatever the case may be,whatever that looks like, focus
and dedicate your time, energyand attention just to those
aspects and avenues of yourbusiness.
And everything else and, as youknow, in real estate, I mean I
could sit here and list 200tasks, right, that are almost
admin based related, but stillneed to be done, still need to
be done at a high level,particularly when they're
(07:15):
connecting with the client.
I would find that out to awingman and essentially get
someone from the company totrain them how you like it being
done, which I know Montanaspent some time doing but
collectively as a team, I thinkthat can be very beneficial.
On that basis, the dollarproductive stuff use an agent,
handle the non-dollar productivebut necessary tasks.
Farm that out.
Tom Panos (07:36):
So I'm going to echo and extend on what you've just
said, gavin.
When I talk to all the clientsthat use Wingman in my real
estate gym, I find that the onesthat are doing more than 100
deals a year or are riding oneand a half million and over they
say this to me Tom Wingman doeseverything except look for my
(07:58):
next listing, go to my nextappraisal, sit with a buyer and
put a deal together, or sit withmy vendor and educate them on
this is what's happening in themarket.
This is what I think you shouldbe doing with your marketing
and your price at the moment.
Unless they're doing one ofthose four things, they feel
(08:18):
that they're not being incomeproducing and that they keep
palming it off.
So what you're saying soundsalong the lines of them.
But I know, gab, because I knowI've dealt with you.
I've worked with you for somany years it's decades, it's
not years now and I know you'vegot this high standard.
Like you would be obsessiveeven about the font or anything
(08:40):
in a brand or how photos andvideos look.
So I'm just curious about theclient experience that you've
had.
Has anything been coming upwhere people feel, oh it, it's
dropped?
Gavin Rubinstein (08:55):
I wouldn't think so nothing's perfect in
this world, like, whether it'soffshore, whether it's onshore,
like the, the like.
I've got people who've beenworking in my team for two,
three years and um weekly,sometimes daily, you know
talking to them about how we canrefine what we do in order to
be better, and that's thefastidious nature of, I guess,
(09:17):
my style and approach, whichsome people can find annoying
and, to be honest, even I findit annoying, but I can't help it
because it's who I am.
But, like I said, you know,monty and I have worked with our
guys at Wingman to make surethat they do it in the way that
we like, and that takes a bit oftime.
But whether it's offshore oronshore, it takes a bit of time.
Anyway, you've got to make theinvestment Remember it's a third
(09:48):
of the price, um, so it'sworthwhile once you get them to
do it in the style that you likeand when and if there is an odd
or rare occasion where there'sa mistake, refine it.
Let them know, um and and look,unless they've put the best
guys onto us.
We haven't had any major, youknow, crashes or crazy issues
with it.
Tom Panos (09:57):
Nick, I'm gonna bring you into the conversation.
I want to ask you you know how.
There are various we've gotmarkets.
So Gavin works in a high valuemarket and many would say it's a
high value but lower turnovermarket than, say, blacktown,
(10:17):
which has got a low value but ahigh turnover market.
What's your experience withWingman working in different
markets, like Gav's?
Median price, I mean?
Off the top of my head, Ireckon it'd probably be around 4
, 5 mil.
Is that what it is?
Gav Up Six, seven, wow, okay.
(10:39):
So the bottom line is if you'rein Blacktown, you're going to
(11:00):
have to sell 10 houses, right,gavin will sell one.
That's the short summary ofwhat it is right.
Nick Georges (11:02):
They're all laughing.
Luke's laughing.
Luke's got on a seekcom.
He's looking in the east andthe north shore.
So what's your experience, nick, with?
Yeah, I think it doesn't reallymatter what marketplace you're
working in.
It's actually you have to bringit internally and it's what do
you want to achieve.
So, for example, you justmentioned, if you're in
Blacktown, you need to sell 10houses to Gavin's One.
But an agent that's selling 10to one homes might want a
(11:24):
different client experience.
So I know, working with Gavin,he's absolutely obsessed with
not only the client experiencebut exceeding the client's
experiences every time, which isone of the reasons why he's
been one of the best agents inthe country for such a long
period of time and why theclients keep coming back to him.
So actually tailoring a solutionfor TRG or for Gavin's way that
(11:49):
he wants to do it is very, verydifferent to an agent who's
starting off.
It doesn't matter whatmarketplace.
So the task list that we havefor Gavin's team is very, very
different to, potentially, anagent that's working in a
competitor's office next toGavin.
So that's one of the thingsthat we do we like to get under
(12:10):
the hood and understand what theagent wants to achieve and what
the office wants to achieve,and we can tailor a solution to
fit that.
Tom Panos (12:19):
Nick, can I ask you on property management, what are
you know?
Because I often get I hadmanagement.
What are you know?
Because I often get I hadanother I had you know the other
day, liam, from Byron Bay,which I put onto you.
They often ask me, right, like,what are the main stuff that a
wingman person in Manila can doin PM?
Right, they often feel like theinitial feeling is people say
(12:42):
no, man, I need to be able tospeak to them at the next table.
Right, tell me, what's the mainrole.
Description of a PM wingmanperson working in the
Philippines.
Nick Georges (12:59):
I can actually answer it the other way.
So what should a propertymanager be doing in Australia?
So a property manager inAustralia, all they should be
doing is building a relationshipwith the landlord and dealing
with escalated issues.
That's literally all theyshould be doing.
Everything else should bestripped away and given to
(13:22):
someone else, whether that beonshore or offshore, depending
on the style of office, whatthey want to achieve.
But if you're a new business,you should just be prospecting,
listing, selling or prospectingand signing managements.
Everything else should bestripped away.
In property management, all youshould be doing is building
relationships with the landlordsand dealing with escalated
(13:43):
issues.
Gavin Rubinstein (13:44):
Everything else.
Tom Panos (13:47):
You're muted.
You're muted, nick, just unmute.
Sorry, you just muted that lastfew seconds.
So basically, it's a little bitlike sales and what you're
saying is that essentially, whatyou're saying is divisions of
labour.
Make sure that you're notfocused in non-dollar productive
activity and do you find thatoffshore can achieve that?
Nick Georges (14:12):
Yeah, absolutely one of the reasons why we
actually have the academy, oneof the reasons why we're
training them in propertymanagement, why we're training
them in sales operations, andthat's why they're working so
well in EBUs and propertymanagement businesses across
Australia.
Tom Panos (14:29):
Okay, Gavin, I want to ask you did you notice at all
since rates have gone down, hasthere been any change
whatsoever in the economiclandscape from buyers or sellers
?
Too early or too early to call?
Gavin Rubinstein (14:46):
I reckon it's been like, I think it's been
seriously tumultuous sinceprobably august last year.
Like I'm not noticing adifference today versus august.
I just like I feel like themarket changes and correct me if
you think well, you're hearingdifferent.
I think last week is differentto this week.
I just I can't quite decipheror identify any particular
(15:12):
pattern or trend.
You know, like it's, it's, it'sdefinitely not that frothy,
crazy where you've got 10 buyersgoing nuts who will pay
anything and everything just tosecure it.
That it was a year and a half,two years ago, um, but I still
think stock is relatively tight,particularly in my market.
Like good choices, good optionsthere's a bit of shit around,
(15:33):
but like the good stuff is, isselling really well, um, and I
think you've got to know how toduck, weave, like I say,
communicate, eliminate allexcuses vendors may have through
the process and that isbecoming as fine as, like you
know, whether it's tasks,customer expectation, the
marketing spelling.
Photo order timing on doingwhat you say you're going to do
(15:55):
like really, really basic stuff.
Photo order timing on doingwhat you say you were going to
do, like really, really basicstuff.
If that's not done, it's goingto be very hard to have that
conversation with the vendorabout, you know, getting
realistic.
Tom Panos (16:04):
So, gav, at ARIC four or five years ago you had a
beautiful.
There are two sentences Iremember from you on stage.
The first one is you've got toclose the door of excuses.
And this happened on Saturdaybecause I got there, I met the
vendor.
There was already arelationship because there's a
(16:26):
connection through social media.
He opened up and he startedcomplaining about the fact that
the first week of the open whathad happened is there were the
ad.
He was not happy with somethingin the advert.
When the property didn't sellafterwards he just it was
(16:47):
because of the advert.
Yeah, he just patted me andgoes it's not your fault.
He goes what do you expect withthat?
And I'm thinking to myselfexactly that Every vendor will
look at every reason except forthe price.
So you've got to make sure thatthere is no other reason,
because if there is, you can'twin that battle.
(17:08):
And then the second thingyou've said, which I've
plagiarized and I say it overand over again at some point in
your life, if you're going tohave an elf business effortless,
lucrative and fun you've got tobe the prospected one, not the
one that prospects all the time.
And I saw that with my own eyesin Sylvania waters that day.
(17:32):
So, nick, listen to what happens.
I'm sitting on in the livingroom about to start an auction.
We were there 15, 20 minutesearly.
I don't do government auctions.
This was a one-off in the StGeorgia, in the Sylvania waters
area, and there's a guy hoveringaround and it was, like you
know, it was a bit like a guyhovering to get an autograph or
(17:54):
something.
And I just looked at this guyright and then I thought he
comes on.
Do you remember the moment,gavin, we're talking about?
He comes on over Nick and heturns around and he goes listen,
I've got this property.
And I mean, I know that you'renot in the area, but I think, if
you see this, so he has starttrying to convince Gavin, at
(18:16):
least come out and give me anappraisal.
It's like it's bizarre, likeit's always the other way around
, and I think when you talkabout being the prospected one
versus the prospector, it's allabout brand marketing, a magnet
profile already winning theinterview before there is an
(18:39):
interview, because they're justaware of it.
Gav, does that happen a lotsometimes, or was that, like Tom
, that's once a year?
You were just there at theright time.
Gavin Rubinstein (18:52):
No, no, no.
It happens a lot.
It happens a lot, but that's notto take anything away from um,
like the crazy level of of ofhustle that you need to have,
particularly when you you getthrough the door, because it's
not even if someone wants me tocome over and give them my view
on.
You know how to sell, maximizethe price and what I would do.
Like nine out of ten timesthey're seeing three other
(19:13):
agents, irrespective of howexcited that they may be, and so
that's like, and people forgethow many facets of the process
as a real estate agent you'veactually got a hit on.
That's just one of the manyfacets is getting through the
door and being able to pitch.
Then it's about how do I showthis vendor you know that I'm
100% the best person for the joband that's not through cutting
(19:35):
my fees and cutting my marketingplan, because that's
essentially how you do a greatjob, or part of the tools that
you use to do the great job.
So that's the second part ofthe process.
And then you've got to convincethem once you've left an
impression, because they'reprobably seeing two or three
other people after right up tothe sharp end of signing an
agency agreement right, becauseno matter how good a salesperson
, salesman, saleswoman you are,you can't make a sale.
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