September 8, 2025 • 41 mins
- 00:07 – How the 5% deposit scheme (starting 1 Oct 2025) has started to affect the market today
- 03:47 – Why agents don’t have a respectable reputation
- 11:15 – My advice to an agent wanting to leave their office
My Clearance Rate: 10/10 SOLD
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:02):
Good afternoon everyone.
Welcome to our monthly catch-upahead of our Byron Bay retreat,
which I'm really lookingforward to.
John, good to see you again.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Good to see everybody .
We've still got a handful oftickets remaining, okay.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
We'll talk about that , because Susan was able to.
Well, actually I sort of did it, but Susan's executed it which
we were able to get another 10people in.
So I want to move.
So, johnny, let's just moveinto it, because I'm mindful of
our 30 minute.
So I was thinking to myself,based on the conversations that
(00:41):
I have with people and a lot ofthem are on Zooms with agents
and I was thinking to myselfwhat are the common denominators
?
I see the ones that are doingthe better.
To me, there are three types ofagents You've got your emerging
, you've got your growth, andthen you've got these pinnacle
agents out there, and it's thepinnacle that I was looking at.
So, john, I'm just going toshare my screen and I'm just
(01:07):
going to run through and you canchime in, because I'm pretty
certain that what I show youyou'll have a view or an
extension of what's been said.
The first one is and it doesn'tmake a difference where they are
in their real estate life.
They are always prospectinglike a machine.
And if it's not them, they'vegot team members, john, that
(01:30):
actually are doing the coldertype prospecting, but they're
doing the warmer typeprospecting, and we're talking
about calls, door knocks DMs,john.
I've had a lot of people tellme that they believe that
meeting people out in thestreets again might actually
sort of become more popular nowthat cold calling is going to be
(01:52):
difficult for people toactually build relationships.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
Yeah, I mean we've all seen I'm sure everyone on
the call has seen or experiencedyou know the roller coaster
where you've got six listings,so you think stopping
prospecting is a good idea andjust focus on the listings and
at the end of them you got nolistings, you got to start again
.
You lose two months.
Um, so you know the best agentsthat we have in our team they
(02:17):
could have 15 auctions on in twoweeks time, or six auctions
tomorrow, and they would stillhave in their ideal day, ideal
week, two hours of one hour, twohours of prospecting.
So yeah, I agree totally.
It's got to be consistent,non-negotiable, treated like an
open for inspection.
You don't cancel it.
Speaker 1 (02:37):
Beautiful.
Number two they manage vendors,not just listings, and I think
by saying that, trust, john, isnot lost when the truth, the
trust is lost, like a lot ofpeople have got this obsession.
Oh, I don't want to upset thevendor, but vendors lose trust
when the truth is hidden, notwhen the price isn't met,
(02:57):
because if you can actually showenough evidence to somebody on
why you're thinking, that Peopleget it, where the problem is is
when you're hiding the truth,you're hiding the data or you're
not using data to support whatyou're saying.
And, john, it doesn't matter,like if you're in Brisbane or
Perth, which we know themarket's probably a touch
(03:20):
stronger than in other states,but every vendor does need to be
managed in the process, don'tthey?
Speaker 2 (03:27):
well, not, yeah, they do, and not just need it, but
they deserve I mean anyone onthis call.
If I asked you, would yourather an agent hid the truth
from you or told you the way itis so you can make a decision
based on facts, not on your ownpotential fantasy, because
sometimes vendors start with abit of a fantastic expectation.
(03:48):
We had one recently where wehad a terrific offer for a
little apartment in inner Sydney.
It was $660,000 and it wouldhave been a record for the
suburb it was in.
Anyway, long story short is,and I said to the agent you've
got to make sure this vendortakes this offer.
It's a good offer.
We got him down to $665, dealfell over.
He'll now take $6.25 threeweeks later and he's ruining the
(04:11):
day.
But we've got to take a bit ofresponsibility because I think
the agent was a bit gentle andwas a bit trepidatious about
giving him the facts.
And that's just one of manyexamples that if you don't tell
people what they need to hearand give them the facts, so when
the right offer comes along,they grab it.
(04:32):
They don't miss it, especiallyin a market that's a little bit
less stable than it was a yearago.
It's a bit more nervous, soabsolutely critical.
Pete Chaunce says every vendor.
I deserve to hear the truth.
Speaker 1 (04:44):
Beautifully said.
Number three they work buyerslike they're sellers in a
waiting room.
That's what the smart ones do.
The smart ones do, in fact.
I can't remember who said it tome, john, but he said my open
home strategy changed the day Imade the decision that every
person that was going to walkthrough that door was a
(05:06):
potential vendor.
I said why is that?
And he goes because I treatedpotential vendors differently.
I said well, you shouldn't.
I said the reality is youshould actually go into every
interaction, thinking toyourself how can I best serve
this person?
But put that aside for a moment.
His own approach was that he'sopen home vendors.
He would actually give themthis incredible level of service
(05:29):
.
So, john, I know that you'vealways been a person that
preferred to actually build arelationship with a buyer than
actually go door knock a coldstranger, and that was your
approach.
Speaker 2 (05:43):
Tommy, you know one of our dear friends, matt
Steinleiginway, the best ever hetalks about.
Everyone he meets is a pipelineseller.
Just some won't be selling for20 years.
But he sees him and not in acommercial way, because he
actually firstly sees him ashuman beings, but from a
commercial or real estateperspective.
When someone says, oh you know,you take me out of here in a
box, matt says problem, I'mgoing to be around as long as
(06:06):
you want.
And if someone's going to be,you know, waiting until they
retire, which is 15 years awayMatt will be there ready and
he'll actually note it on hisform.
This seller might be looking atselling when he retires.
It was interesting about buyerwork.
I was talking to a buyer'sagent during the week or last
week.
Tommy and she does a lot ofwork with agents.
One is she said she's shockedat how many agents don't return
(06:29):
her call when she inquires onbehalf of a client about buying
one of their listings.
So interesting, return yourcalls.
Second one she said she workswith an agent in the inner west,
in Leichhardt, not far fromwhere you live, and she said
she'll often ring them on amonday with with a client who's
missed out on an auctionsaturday before and she'll say,
hey, this buyer, this is whatthey're looking for.
(06:51):
Here's what they missed out on.
Here are the non-negotiables.
And she said by friday thatagent will have two or three
properties ready to go, thatthey've door knocked, and.
And she said we'll often putthat buyer into a great home in
a week or two following theauction.
Buyer work is critical andbuyer work and seller work are
interlinked.
(07:11):
You can't see them as mutuallyexclusive.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
Now, john, I was going to say that another agent
told me today they love buyeragents because they're part of
their launch preview showcase.
And I said what do you mean bythat?
He said, okay, when I list aproperty, I say to the owners
we're not going to nail price.
(07:35):
It's a bit of your dialogue,john.
We're not going to nail pricetoday.
We're going to get a rough idea.
I'm going to give you somecomparables.
However, we're going to getsome great buyer intel over the
next few days and I'm going togive you some comparables.
However, we're going to getsome great buyer intel over the
next few days and I'm going toinvite the four buyer agents
that buy most properties in thispart of Sydney and then they
(07:55):
use the feedback from thebuyer's agents to give it to the
vendors and they found itextremely useful to be able to
go to the owner and say thesefour people between them are
buying X amount of properties ayear in this area and they
believe that this is where theproperty falls into.
And it's yeah.
I thought it was a fantasticidea.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
I mean buyers agents are the best.
I mean they're professionalbuyers, they're incentivized
about finding the right home andnegotiating a sale or purchase
on their behalf of their client.
Again, but I constantly hearwhich is, I have no idea why
that a lot of agents.
They either ignore them or theyalmost treat them with disdain,
like they're the opposition.
They'd be my best friends, forsure.
(08:39):
I'd be having a buyer's agentopen for inspection before
anyone else to get them throughand make them feel special.
They are the greatest thing youcan be, the greatest group you
can be working with, for sure.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
Beautiful Number four .
They own the auction arena andauctions look, auctions are
theatre.
And, john, you and I have asimilar approach.
Some people have a view thateverything's got to be an
auction.
I don't agree with that.
I think that, oh, everything'sgot to be an auction.
I don't agree with that.
I think that you know when yougo to a listing presentation,
(09:16):
you work that area in your heart.
You know whether a propertyshould go to auction or whether
it should be for sale.
But one thing is for sureagents that use the auction
system and Thomas McGlynn, john,which I know, you know very
well, very well, he indicated tome once.
He said to me, tommy, one thingthe auction clearance rates
don't actually have is operatorerror.
So you might have the economicsof the same, but there's one
(09:40):
agent that knows how to operatethe auction system properly and
another agent that doesn't andthat can also affect the
clearance rate.
And I think the best agents Iknow seem to have auction as
part of their strategy, eventhough it might not be their
whole strategy.
What's your view on auctionsand the percentage of properties
(10:01):
that should be going to auctionand how do you work out whether
you should be doing more orless auctions?
Speaker 2 (10:07):
Well, look, you're right, tom.
Most of our top agents andthose that I do or have coached
in the past, they're auctionorientated and I think it's an
efficient, effective and verygood quality way to sell
property, not just because it'sefficient and effective, because
it brings the best price inalmost every instance.
Having said that, I think youwant to have a toolbox with
(10:28):
three or four tools and youdon't want to just have the
auction hammer and then you'regoing to hope that everything
else is a nail.
Um, alex jordan, our number oneagent, writes 10 million a year
, does no auctions as example.
Um, which is, which isinteresting.
Um, one of the best agents,anthony bakaris, down in, down
in the Campbelltown, macarthurregion.
He does mostly timed auctionsonline as opposed to, you know,
(10:51):
on-site auctions, but, as youand I know, if you're looking
for the majority and you'relooking for where most of the
greatest success is, it'sauctions, and whether it's
in-room or on-site probablydoesn't matter too much.
We like on-site, you like onsite, but um, I think the
auction process is is thepreferred method.
Now, what you have to do is notdecide based on what you want
you.
(11:12):
You've got to decide based onwhat fits the property, what
fits the market, what fits thattype of property at that time,
and if you're about to put aproperty up and there's six
others on the street, they'reall identical you maybe putting
it up for auction at that timeand place may not be that smart
and you might only bring out thebargain hunters.
But in most instances I'd saythat 80, 85% of the time when
(11:35):
I'm selling, I think auction isthe best method to get the best
price in a timely fashion forthe vendor.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
John, can I ask you and this came up yesterday I had
a vendor reach out to me onsocial media.
They've got the home up forauction.
And then another home cameavailable in the street.
It's a very similar property,right?
And it's obviously in the samestreet.
They're both renovated.
The only difference is thesecond property appears to have
(12:04):
an agent that's quoting 250grand less right.
And the owner reached out to meand said hey, listen, I just
got this funny feeling.
This property is going todestroy my campaign.
He says.
I've been in that otherproperty.
They're basically similarproperties, except buyers are
being led to believe thatthey're going to get at a lower
(12:27):
figure.
And they asked my view onwhether they should do the same.
I said well, look, I have aview that underquoting will get
you more bidders, butunderquoting won't necessarily
get you a better price.
You're going to get a lot ofwastage along the way.
And then they suggested shouldthey delay their auction till
(12:48):
after that property sells?
What's your view on situationslike that?
Speaker 2 (12:52):
Well, it's a hard one , because then you can.
You know.
Then the other party.
I've seen it before where theother party delays and then it
just ends up being a silly game.
I think, sadly, if you have acompetitor who thinks that
underquoting is the way and youhave similar properties and
they're quoting 200,000 less, Isay to the buyers, Tom, they're
quoting 1.6.
(13:13):
Both these properties are worth180 every day of the week.
Why don't you go and offer them1.750 and see what they say?
Because I'll guarantee youthey'll knock it back.
And then they say, yeah, you'reright, you know.
I went and spoke to them.
They said, oh, we're not takingoffers or bids before auction.
So I think you've got to tryand call their bluff.
I think for sure, because itcan screw an auction up.
(13:34):
And what I generally do if I'man agent and I'm called in on a
property and there's a similarone on the market, I usually say
to the vendor let me list it,but let's launch straight
following the other property.
Because do we really want tocreate competitive glut in the
street?
If it's similar, if it'sdifferent, it's no problem.
But I agree, I think you'vejust got to be careful you don't
(13:57):
play games with people'semotions and properties and
assets.
As an agent, what's the bestway to get this and what should
you be quoting?
And it's now illegal, as weknow, probably always has been,
but you're going to be caughtnow.
Speaker 1 (14:11):
Number five they live in the database.
That's what I've noticed aboutthe good ones and I'm not going
to turn around and say that theynecessarily are sitting in
front of a computer five hours aday flipping through agent box
and that.
But what I am saying is thattheir team normally has got an
(14:32):
electronic filing system, whichthat's what a database is, and
everything is noted, every call,every open call, and the memory
is not used as the system.
Look, the memory is a goodsystem if you want to do one or
two sales a month, but thememory is not a good system if
you've got to be doing six toeight sales a month.
Speaker 2 (14:50):
John, yeah, you've got to be.
I think the days of just havinga crack at remembering a few
people and calling them randomlyare gone.
I mean, that's better than notcalling them.
To be fair, I think the bestagents now have a systematic
precision, military precisionstyle approach and they are
(15:10):
calling, you know, past clientsevery six months.
Here's the conversation.
Pipeline sellers um, you knowhot spotting.
You know we do a lot around hotspotting.
So when a property sells, youknow who can we speak to that
has a similar asset that wouldwant to know this information.
I think that's critical.
And again, I look at our bestagents and their past masters at
(15:34):
this.
I think there are calls you'vegot to make yourself.
You can't delegate.
For me, a past client callshould not be delegated because
that's someone you've builtrapport with.
They should see themselves asbeing a VIP part of your family,
and it's delegating that'ssomeone you've built rapport
with.
They should see themselves asbeing a VIP part of your family,
and it's delegating that tosomeone potentially more junior
than yourself saying I'm callingon behalf of Tom because you
(15:54):
know we're so delighted havingyou as a client.
He couldn't be bothered ringingyou himself, type of thing.
You know the message is notgoing to be the right message.
So I think some things you candelegate hotspotting is a good
one, updating the community, butwith your VIP clients, with
your influencers, with your pastclients, I think you've got to
(16:14):
make those calls yourself.
Speaker 1 (16:17):
I think, john, we're moving into a now with the
privacy, the do not disturb andthe screen calling, with all
these new phone updates and wespoke about it at one of the
podcasts I think what's going toactually happen is the
databases that are going toflourish are the ones that are
smaller, less people, but peoplehave a relationship with those
(16:39):
and every time like I was todayI was in Manly and I asked
someone I go, how many people inyour database?
They said 14,000.
I said look for an officethat's got three salespeople
14,000.
I said I think that's going tohave a lot of people that are
buyers in there, that are peoplethat aren't alive, that people
that are tenants.
I think realistically, john, ifyou had 1,000 people that were
(17:02):
home sellers in your coremarketplace and we know that
roughly 5% of those sell there's50 deals a year that are
sitting there and you don't needa hundred thousand people.
You need a thousand people thatwant to get stuff from you
because they think you're betterthan the other 10 or 20 other
agents in the suburb.
Speaker 2 (17:20):
Tommy Seth Godin says you know, I'd rather have a
hundred raving fans in thecommunity than 10,000 people on
my database.
And that's what you're saying.
It's about the depth and thequality of the relationship.
Does someone, when they seeyour phone number a is your
phone number in their phone sodo they know it's you calling?
B is that they pick up thephone and answer you, or c is
(17:43):
that they see you as a pest.
So it's the quality of theinformation and the depth of the
relationship you build.
So go deeper, not wider.
I mean, if you can have 200roving fans, arguably that's
even better, but you can't have10,000 roving fans.
Speaker 1 (17:56):
Okay, let's move on to number six, and that is build
a magnetic brand.
Build a magnetic brand is builda magnetic brand, build a
magnetic brand.
And that means probably thevideo more than the newspaper.
It probably means that you'vegot to do really good killer
copy, because I think, john, thequality of your advertising
(18:17):
will attract other people thatwant that quality of marketing
themselves.
Right, I think you've got atriple down on social, now that
we know that ChatGPT is actuallyused by vendors on agent
selection to come to appraisals,and we know that social media
is one of the drivers of yourdigital footprint with AI.
(18:38):
And, john, like you always werea person prospecting versus
brand, your approach when youwere in real estate was hey, if
you build the brand, people willbe coming to you and then you
follow up with walk the calls.
That was your approach, wasn'tit?
Speaker 2 (18:59):
Yeah, tell me, look, the bar's risen.
So once upon a time, you knowif, when all agents were taking
their own photos, if you had aphotographer of any ilk, you'd
be shedding shoulders above.
Of course, now almost everygood agent has professional
photos and and so the bar'srisen.
So you have to keep workingharder to stand out.
(19:20):
So a couple of things videoyou've mentioned there I totally
agree out.
So a couple of things videoyou've mentioned there I totally
agree.
Video is an opportunity to standout, amongst others.
Why?
Because 80% of agents won't dovideo because they're
self-conscious and they, youknow it's too hard, it's too
expensive.
I don't like my, the way I lookand sound on video, whatever it
is.
So if you're prepared toactually bite the bullet and
(19:41):
become good at video, if youwant to see someone who's great
at video, go to Instagram and goto Bort B-O-U-G-H-T agency,
bort agency.
The principal there, biancaField, a blonde lady.
You'll see her on probablyevery second video.
She is as good as anyone I'veseen in front of camera talking
to customers in an authenticconversation.
Speaker 1 (20:03):
Where is Bort agency?
Speaker 2 (20:05):
They're in the inner conversation.
Where are they, chuck?
Where's board agency?
They're in the inner west.
I think they might be inNewtown, so you're talking about
the buyer's agency.
Buyer's agency.
Speaker 1 (20:12):
Sorry, yeah buyer's agency, and that's.
We spoke about her the otherday.
She's amazing.
That's the block-headed youngbuyer's agent.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
Brilliant.
Yeah, that's exactly right.
So you know all she's.
When I say all she's done, it'sa skill.
But she's become verycomfortable in front of camera
and she I said to her you know,do you employ someone to do this
and how much do you pay them?
She said, no, my PA does itwith her iPhone and when she's
got a spare moment I'll saylet's duck out and do a video.
So this is it doesn't have tobe expensive, Um, and you just
(20:42):
need to do it.
You know, you've just got toactually jump in and do it.
So I think it's important Killercopy.
Most agents are probably eitherusing a professional copywriter
or, more likely today, AI.
So I think, yep, you've got tohave the best quality copy.
I would say Kevin MacLeod fromGrand Designs UK.
If you want to know what thebenchmark in talking about a
(21:06):
property, presenting a property,talking with clients about
their vision for a property andtalking about the design
elements relevant to a property,go and binge.
Watch 10 episodes of KevinMcLeod, take down notes on some
of the things he says, and he,for me, is the benchmark on the
best person that I've seen talkabout a property's attributes.
(21:29):
He's extraordinary.
So look at Bianca for videos.
Look at Kevin McLeod forpresenting a property and
discussing it and talking toclients about it, and just use
more video.
Drone, of course, is anunderutilized and a very high
impact way of bringing somevideo to life.
So I think that it was ChrisGilmore, I think, does a lot of
(21:52):
drone timing up in Queensland.
Chris is a very successfulagent, as you know, and I think
he does quite a few fly throughtype things.
So look for a point ofdifference.
As long as it's not gimmicky,that's to add value.
So it's got to be useful to thebuyer, not just striking your
own ego.
But, um, yeah, you gotta man,you gotta stand out, you gotta
stand out johnny, I'm gonnasmall advertisement someday.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Joe bachara gave me this the other day or about a
month ago.
They're around 200 bucks.
It's always charged becausethey're like airpods and what it
is is.
This has to be the simplestplug and play mics I've ever
seen in my whole life.
They're always charged and youjust sticks on straight away and
(22:36):
it's it you're on, you'retalking and the sound.
I didn't realize that sounddoes impact the experience that
you have, like if you're like,if you're in a close direction,
you can speak into your phone.
But I swear by these $200,they're always charged and
they've got a second one in caseyou want to interview someone.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
And Tommy, on most Saturdays I watch a couple of
videos sorry live streaming thatyou do on your auctions.
I'm amazed more agents don'tlive stream their auctions.
Now you might want to cherrypick it, make sure you sort of
maybe live stream those thathave got the most amount of
interest so you can put yourselfin the best possible light.
But it's such an easy thinghave someone on your team hold,
(23:18):
I think you do it throughInstagram and TikTok or wherever
just do it and present it tothe market.
And then you do this greatlittle walkthrough at the end
where you show people the houseso they've seen it at the end.
And it's easy Again, just getout there and do it.
Speaker 1 (23:35):
Yeah, and I do look.
There's no question about it.
A successful auction that goeswell is going to be a lot better
on video.
But lately, John, I add theoccasional one that doesn't sell
, because I actually think tomyself that it is a more
realistic picture I want to getout there to people and that is
that.
Not everything is going off andlife is good.
Speaker 2 (24:01):
If you're thinking of going to a restaurant and you
go online, there's 155.0 perfectscores, or you know, let's call
it 30 perfect scores you knowit's probably friends and
relatives that have done it,Whereas if you know if there's
two or three that have said, ohyou know, geez, I kept waiting
for half an hour and I probablywon't go back again, but the
vast majority had a great meal,You're going to go there.
(24:21):
So I agree with you Peopledon't expect perfection.
Agents think they have to postperfection, whereas what the
consumer wants is actuallyauthenticity and reality.
So, yeah, if we shift ourbelief from it's got to be
perfect to it's just got to be,it's got to be out there, it's
got to be happening, it's got tobe real, it's a much better way
(24:43):
of doing it going forward.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
Next number seven run your day, don't let it run you.
And probably the big thingthere, john, I notice of that 1%
is that they're selfish withtheir.
They guard their time.
They feel guilty when theirtime is not being used properly.
(25:07):
They use a lot of time blockingon things.
So they've got this repeatable,predictable.
They know that this is the dayand the time that I do this
thing and I just know that I doit.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
And if you're not time blocking, tommy, you're not
efficient Because this is anindustry, the phone will ring
24-7.
Do I want you to be accessible?
Yes, do you have to beaccessible every second of every
day?
No, karen Terry, one of our topagents.
She hands her mobile phone toour receptionist as she arrives
because she's going to go and dotwo hours prospecting and she
(25:40):
says take the messages, givethem as much information, I'll
call them back at 10 o'clock.
If says take the messages, givethem as much information, I'll
call them back at 10 o'clock.
If there's something reallyurgent, come and let me know,
but otherwise I'm here toprospect, then she jumps on the
landline and makes all heroutbound calls.
So I think it's critical.
Phil Harris spoke at ARIC anumber of years ago and he's
talked about AM energy and PMenergy.
So for him AM the morning wasblock it out to generate new
(26:03):
business and new phone calls andnew prospects and so forth.
And then the PM is servicinggoing to meetings, going to
listing appointments, showingbuyers, doing open homes.
And it reminded me, tommy, ofRyan Holiday that spoke also at
ARIC a few years ago.
It was brilliant and he'swritten I think it's 12
bestsellers and he's written Ithink it's 12 bestsellers and he
(26:24):
says the secret to success tohim was simple he had two sacred
hours a day and it was in themorning, first thing.
I think it was like eighto'clock in the morning or nine
o'clock after his little one hadgone to school.
And he said he blocked out andit was non-negotiable.
And he said all I had to do waswrite a few crappy pages in two
hours.
So the two concepts there Ijust want to unpack quickly.
(26:47):
One was he called them sacredhours Like you do not break
these hours, this is not.
I'll get around to it, if I can.
So replace writing a book withprospecting as example, or buyer
work as example.
And the second thing he said allI had to do was write a few
crappy pages.
So he didn't say I do was writea few crappy pages.
Um, so he didn't say I have towrite a masterpiece, I have to
write a bestseller, I have towrite 10 pages.
(27:08):
He knew that if every day hedid a couple of hours and wrote
a few pages, call it three, four, five or six, and he, you know,
he said if they were justauthentic and real, he said an
editor or someone will clean itup later, but he just had to get
the words down on a pagewithout seeking perfection,
Because if you seek perfection,you're never actually going to
put the word down.
You're going to be thinkingabout it for the next six months
(27:29):
.
So a few crappy pages in acouple of sacred hours, making a
dozen connections with a fewpeople I've never met before in
my 60 minutes of prospecting.
That's probably a good metaphorfor real estate.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
John talking about Eric Peter Fuda, which you had
speaking at Eric probably aboutfive years ago thereabouts.
Speaker 2 (27:55):
More, yeah, more.
Speaker 1 (27:57):
More At the end.
I don't know whether hementioned it during his speech
he probably did but he mentionedit afterwards when I did a
quick video with him.
He said the minute you swaptime management for choice
management, you get more time inyour life and I thought that
was profound.
You can't actually massage time, but you can actually make a
(28:20):
decision at that time what isthe better decision to make?
Speaker 2 (28:27):
decision at that time .
What is the better decision tomake?
Yeah, I can tell you frompersonal experience he's
probably the most hardcore guyon his time that I know, and he
charges a million dollars a yearto coach people, so your
coaching fees are soundingpretty good at the moment, Tommy
.
And the people he coachesthey're CEOs of Fortune 500
companies and billion-dollarcompanies and so forth.
(28:50):
So you know, funny enough, themillion for them to be at their
peak state as a leader isprobably a great value.
But he's just hardcore on histime.
You know.
If you want to book in, you canbook in in two weeks' time.
It's a 15-minute slot and youbetter not miss it, because if
you're five minutes late, hesays, look, we haven't got the
time to cover it now, We'llre-book in.
(29:11):
He's very hardcore.
Speaker 1 (29:13):
Okay, let's move on.
Number eight building an EBU.
That's a weapon, because lonerangers burn out, lone rangers
blow head gaskets, the pilotdoesn't serve drinks on the
plane and, as they say, if youdon't have an assistant, you
probably are the assistantyourself.
So, john, have you ever?
(29:34):
I mean every business.
If you look at the top 20people in the McGrath group,
would you say they're all EBUs.
They'd have to be, wouldn'tthey?
Yeah, 100%.
Speaker 2 (29:46):
Right, but some of them, by the way, may only have
one.
I mean there's no need to havefive or six.
I mean Alex Jordan's got fivepeople, yeah, tarun's got five
people, so some will have aslightly bigger team, but
there's plenty that have justgot but one, probably two is
more.
They usually have one foradministration and marketing and
(30:07):
just running the teamofficially, and then one who's
either focused on buyerspecialization or prospecting or
both.
So I'd say the average one inour top 20 would have a team
themselves plus two.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
Okay, number nine.
They stay in training camp likeyou are right now.
They listen to podcasts, theygo to coaching.
They never graduate.
They never graduate.
It's not like you do a Bachelorof Education and I'm a school
teacher.
The real estate course seems togo for 50 years.
(30:42):
Isn't it weird, john?
Real estate is like it doesn'tmatter how long you've been
doing it, like today I waslistening to someone who was
telling me oh, they go aboutthis approach.
The other day, someone wastelling me that, hey, I go onto
RP Data every month and I have alook at all the transactions
(31:04):
that have got a dollar, thathave happened for that month and
I think to myself why is therea $1 transaction there?
Is there something going on?
Is there a separation?
Is there a deceased estatecoming on the market?
Right, I think there's a commontendency.
I noticed, john, of the goodones, they're feedback junkies.
(31:26):
That's probably the word I wasthinking of.
They're feedback junkies,whereas amateurs they hate
feedback because they always seeit as being criticism.
Speaker 2 (31:35):
Yeah, yeah, no, look, I think feedback's critical.
I think it was Jim Rowan yearsago.
I heard him and he said you gotto work harder on yourself than
you do on your job, and Itotally agree with that.
It's all about you know.
What can you be?
What are you listening to?
What are you reading?
And, to be frank, I don't readthat much anymore.
If there's a book someonerecommends to me, my default is
(31:57):
I go to AI and I say the faultis I go to AI and I say I'm in
real estate, I'm a principal anda sales agent.
Can you read this book for meand tell me what are the 20 most
relevant things for aresidential real estate agent?
And I get a summary.
So I just, you know, just.
Speaker 1 (32:11):
That's gold, because I tell you, I saw you the other
day when we were sitting withAndrew Kazi talking about rugby
league coaching, and then whathappened is you walked away.
So Andrew's the Howard, is thatHoward Matthews or Howard
Matthews?
Yeah, howard Matthews.
Okay, he's the Tigers coach.
And then what you did is youwent on a chat, gpt, and you
(32:33):
asked for a summary of the book.
I think Legacy wasn't it.
Is that the book?
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
Legacy.
What I did say was you know, Ipretended I was him.
I said I'm a rugby league coachin Sydney, australia.
Can you read this book and tellme and I'm coaching younger
people, not older peoplegenerally, you know these are
sort of under 19s, can you?
And if you can give AI a reallyprecise brief, it will deliver
(32:59):
every time.
So yeah, I think you knowwhether it's that podcast.
I just you know I'm listeningall day long to podcasts and
stuff whenever I get a spareminute, walking the dog, walking
around, whatever in the car.
So I think it's really critical.
And you think about eliteathletes.
You know the Michael Jordan andthe late Kobe Bryant kind of
(33:21):
ilk.
These were the world's greatestelite athletes, probably
greatest in history and yet theyused to, on average, train for
six hours a day if they weren'tplaying.
Now, these are guys that youknow.
They didn't have to learn howto shoot or dribble.
They were like the best on theplanet, but they never stopped
training.
(33:41):
I remember Johnny Wilkinson, whowas the English goal kicker in
rugby union years ago and he's abit of a legend of a player,
plus probably the best goalkicker I've ever seen, and I
read a book about him and hesaid he used to arrive an hour
and a half before training everyday, so when everyone else was
doing whatever they were doing,they weren't at training.
He was there just kicking theball through the posts.
(34:02):
And he said anyone that thinksthat I was a natural born goal
kicker couldn't be more wrong.
But he said I work at it harderthan anyone else in the world
at goal kicking.
And I think it's the same list.
And you think about it.
If Michael Jordan can find fourto six hours a day to train to
be a better basketballer, howmany hours a day are we spending
in this industry on ourdialogue, on our negotiation
(34:25):
skills, on our closing skills,on our presenting skills?
The answer is not enough.
So, you know, I often talk topeople and I say you know what?
Are you zero to 10 as a lister?
And they say oh, and to behonest, I'm a six.
And I said you've been in thegame a few years, you're a six
(34:47):
out of 10.
If you're a nine, you'd beearning five times the GCI or
the income, and the only thingstopping you from a six to a
nine is putting the effort in.
It's all out there.
This is a smart brigade we'retalking to because they're
online now.
But the question is when you'renot online, when we finish,
what are you doing next?
Are you doing enough to youknow?
Polish up your skills Reallycritical.
Speaker 1 (35:06):
So, john, there's a soccer player that played for
the Socceroos, actually went tomy school, a lot younger than me
, tim Cahill.
It was actually in my youngbrother's year, tim Cahill, and
he played for a team that my dadwas involved in, sydney Olympic
.
He ended up, you know,obviously playing for Australia,
(35:27):
played for Everton probablyAustralia's biggest socceroo
export and I was talking tosomeone that played in the same
years with him at Sydney Olympicand he said, you know, it
really annoys me, he goes.
He was always on the bench andhe goes how.
He sort of got into the team,overtook us and went overseas.
He goes.
He was always on the bench.
I was a significantly betterplayer.
I said what do you reckon itwas?
(35:47):
He goes.
Look, he was just the first oneat training all the time.
When everything trainingfinished, he was the last one
out.
Everyone thought he was justdoing it to crawl, but he just
was there longer than all theothers and I think it paid off.
That's what this guy said 100%100%.
Number 10, and this is importantprotect your reputation,
(36:11):
because it can take you 30 yearsto build it.
Your name is your currency.
No underquoting, no shortcuts.
Play the long game.
Understand that we all havedigital footprints now.
But, john, you said it theother day, you said it to me
privately and we now live in aworld where you should be doing
(36:34):
the right thing all the time.
But if you're not, you shouldbe aware there's essentially a
speed camera every 50 meters nowBetween AI, voice recorders,
iphones.
Right, you can't get away withdoing the wrong thing.
I remember you telling me oneday oh why did Dewey or some
other player do something on thepark?
You said, mate, there's 100cameras watching there, as if
(36:57):
you're going to get away with it.
Speaker 2 (36:58):
Well, ai, you know and let's just stay in real
estate for a minute it's goingto impact the entire world, but
it's going to mean that thegoverning bodies, the NCATs and
VCATs and OFTs of the world aregoing to be able to monitor not
just properties they're focusedon.
If they get a complaint, everysingle transaction you do will
(37:19):
be put under the AI microscopeand you know, then they're going
to be naming and shaming andthere's going to be websites,
there's going to be fines andwhatever, whatever.
I'm with you, tom, you know,don't do it.
Don't change just because youdon't get caught.
Change because this is a worldof transparency where you should
be doing the right thing, andif you do the right thing
consistently in fact, every time, not just consistently
(37:42):
non-negotiably you're going tobuild an incredible reputation,
and there's not many in thisindustry with incredible
reputation, so you will standout like a beacon.
Speaker 1 (37:52):
John, one quick question what do you reckon is
more important, motivation ordiscipline?
Speaker 2 (37:58):
Discipline, discipline, habits, routine.
I think Trump motivationMotivation, by definition, tends
to come and go.
It'sine habits routine.
I think trump motivationMotivation, by definition, tends
to come and go.
It's like I got motivated I gotup early, I went to the gym, I
feel great, so I'm going to doit today.
Discipline is like everymorning.
I do this and I do my sacredtwo hours of calls and here's
how I set up for my listeningpresentation.
I think it's just habits anddiscipline routine process.
(38:26):
Now you can be both.
Ideally, you want to havediscipline, process, structure
and have it in as really goodenergy, but I think that process
trumps motivation.
Speaker 1 (38:34):
Okay, emma.
Hi, emma, good to see you.
I'm reading your question.
Emma Young, from Wellington,new Zealand, I've got to tell
you John Emma's a young womanKia ora Emma.
Look out for Emma.
I think Emma's riding around 2mil in an area in Wellington
where they've had 30% pricedrops.
(38:55):
It's been one of the mostchallenging markets, it says.
Am I being premature by askingshould we need to start ordering
this?
Shall we be waiting for theintel from you, or where should
we start looking to ordermarriage current database mess,
emma.
So I think what you'rereferring to there is how to
clean your database, right?
(39:17):
I think that's what you'retalking about and I think we're
going to do a special sessionthere.
But I can tell you, cleaning adatabase requires time.
I will say some of the CRMcompanies have got an added
service where you go to them andsay here's my issues, I want to
clean it up.
They can help with a few things.
Example they'll say we'll stripall the duplicates out, we'll
(39:39):
strip all the data that we thinkthat is faulty data, right.
But what they're not going todo and it's going to need human
intervention is to be able towork out whether some people are
alive or dead.
Where they are, are they stillselling or buying?
Hey, johnny has said there.
Terry added there, we're allgood, we're all good.
(40:00):
Next time we see you, team, I'llbe seeing you in Byron Bay.
Check out WhatsApp.
I'm going to have all theinformation there.
John, we are in the best Listen.
Winter's over, spring is here,daylight savings coming longer
days in the afternoons.
We've got the best real estate.
I mean real estate agents aresaying to me I'm happy with this
(40:21):
market.
Right and out of the blue, allof a sudden, john, I'm hearing a
lot of your agents are sayingstock is coming in.
Speaker 2 (40:31):
I've coached to one of them, alex DiMaggio ASB, our
friend Tommy.
She's got 35 auction listingssigned up and she basically does
a relatively small suburbcalled Earlwood, so her market
share must be phenomenal.
She does a few outside.
And the other one I was sittingdown with Patrick Byron today
who does botany for us Again,not a huge area, and he's just
signed up his 21st auction lastnight and some of them have
(40:55):
launched, but most of them willlaunch in the next two weeks.
There's business out there,business out there.
So two things make sure it'scoming your way.
As a part of Tom's elite teamhere, it should be coming your
way.
And I think the second thing ismake sure your vendors have got
offers on the table.
Realize there is a tsunami ofnew stock, in my opinion, about
(41:16):
to hit the market.
So if you've got an offer andit's close, I'd be doing
everything I can to close it,because it might be gone in a
week or two.
Speaker 1 (41:25):
And look, we know that spring's a good time in
real estate, but we also knowthat if you get double or triple
the amount of listings that youhave in spring than what you
have in winter, that that causesanother issue with getting
deals done.
But, john, thank you again,thank you Tame Good to see you.
Speaker 2 (41:43):
Thanks, tommy.
Speaker 1 (41:44):
See you next month.
Keep sending the numbers inQuenza.
Good afternoon everyone.
Welcome to our monthly catch-upahead of our Byron Bay retreat,
which I'm really lookingforward to.
John, good to see you again.
Speaker 2 (00:15):
Good to see everybody .
We've still got a handful oftickets remaining, okay.
Speaker 1 (00:20):
We'll talk about that , because Susan was able to.
Well, actually I sort of did it, but Susan's executed it which
we were able to get another 10people in.
So I want to move.
So, johnny, let's just moveinto it, because I'm mindful of
our 30 minute.
So I was thinking to myself,based on the conversations that
(00:41):
I have with people and a lot ofthem are on Zooms with agents
and I was thinking to myselfwhat are the common denominators
?
I see the ones that are doingthe better.
To me, there are three types ofagents You've got your emerging
, you've got your growth, andthen you've got these pinnacle
agents out there, and it's thepinnacle that I was looking at.
So, john, I'm just going toshare my screen and I'm just
(01:07):
going to run through and you canchime in, because I'm pretty
certain that what I show youyou'll have a view or an
extension of what's been said.
The first one is and it doesn'tmake a difference where they are
in their real estate life.
They are always prospectinglike a machine.
And if it's not them, they'vegot team members, john, that
(01:30):
actually are doing the coldertype prospecting, but they're
doing the warmer typeprospecting, and we're talking
about calls, door knocks DMs,john.
I've had a lot of people tellme that they believe that
meeting people out in thestreets again might actually
sort of become more popular nowthat cold calling is going to be
(01:52):
difficult for people toactually build relationships.
Speaker 2 (01:57):
Yeah, I mean we've all seen I'm sure everyone on
the call has seen or experiencedyou know the roller coaster
where you've got six listings,so you think stopping
prospecting is a good idea andjust focus on the listings and
at the end of them you got nolistings, you got to start again
.
You lose two months.
Um, so you know the best agentsthat we have in our team they
(02:17):
could have 15 auctions on in twoweeks time, or six auctions
tomorrow, and they would stillhave in their ideal day, ideal
week, two hours of one hour, twohours of prospecting.
So yeah, I agree totally.
It's got to be consistent,non-negotiable, treated like an
open for inspection.
You don't cancel it.
Speaker 1 (02:37):
Beautiful.
Number two they manage vendors,not just listings, and I think
by saying that, trust, john, isnot lost when the truth, the
trust is lost, like a lot ofpeople have got this obsession.
Oh, I don't want to upset thevendor, but vendors lose trust
when the truth is hidden, notwhen the price isn't met,
(02:57):
because if you can actually showenough evidence to somebody on
why you're thinking, that Peopleget it, where the problem is is
when you're hiding the truth,you're hiding the data or you're
not using data to support whatyou're saying.
And, john, it doesn't matter,like if you're in Brisbane or
Perth, which we know themarket's probably a touch
(03:20):
stronger than in other states,but every vendor does need to be
managed in the process, don'tthey?
Speaker 2 (03:27):
well, not, yeah, they do, and not just need it, but
they deserve I mean anyone onthis call.
If I asked you, would yourather an agent hid the truth
from you or told you the way itis so you can make a decision
based on facts, not on your ownpotential fantasy, because
sometimes vendors start with abit of a fantastic expectation.
(03:48):
We had one recently where wehad a terrific offer for a
little apartment in inner Sydney.
It was $660,000 and it wouldhave been a record for the
suburb it was in.
Anyway, long story short is,and I said to the agent you've
got to make sure this vendortakes this offer.
It's a good offer.
We got him down to $665, dealfell over.
He'll now take $6.25 threeweeks later and he's ruining the
(04:11):
day.
But we've got to take a bit ofresponsibility because I think
the agent was a bit gentle andwas a bit trepidatious about
giving him the facts.
And that's just one of manyexamples that if you don't tell
people what they need to hearand give them the facts, so when
the right offer comes along,they grab it.
(04:32):
They don't miss it, especiallyin a market that's a little bit
less stable than it was a yearago.
It's a bit more nervous, soabsolutely critical.
Pete Chaunce says every vendor.
I deserve to hear the truth.
Speaker 1 (04:44):
Beautifully said.
Number three they work buyerslike they're sellers in a
waiting room.
That's what the smart ones do.
The smart ones do, in fact.
I can't remember who said it tome, john, but he said my open
home strategy changed the day Imade the decision that every
person that was going to walkthrough that door was a
(05:06):
potential vendor.
I said why is that?
And he goes because I treatedpotential vendors differently.
I said well, you shouldn't.
I said the reality is youshould actually go into every
interaction, thinking toyourself how can I best serve
this person?
But put that aside for a moment.
His own approach was that he'sopen home vendors.
He would actually give themthis incredible level of service
(05:29):
.
So, john, I know that you'vealways been a person that
preferred to actually build arelationship with a buyer than
actually go door knock a coldstranger, and that was your
approach.
Speaker 2 (05:43):
Tommy, you know one of our dear friends, matt
Steinleiginway, the best ever hetalks about.
Everyone he meets is a pipelineseller.
Just some won't be selling for20 years.
But he sees him and not in acommercial way, because he
actually firstly sees him ashuman beings, but from a
commercial or real estateperspective.
When someone says, oh you know,you take me out of here in a
box, matt says problem, I'mgoing to be around as long as
(06:06):
you want.
And if someone's going to be,you know, waiting until they
retire, which is 15 years awayMatt will be there ready and
he'll actually note it on hisform.
This seller might be looking atselling when he retires.
It was interesting about buyerwork.
I was talking to a buyer'sagent during the week or last
week.
Tommy and she does a lot ofwork with agents.
One is she said she's shockedat how many agents don't return
(06:29):
her call when she inquires onbehalf of a client about buying
one of their listings.
So interesting, return yourcalls.
Second one she said she workswith an agent in the inner west,
in Leichhardt, not far fromwhere you live, and she said
she'll often ring them on amonday with with a client who's
missed out on an auctionsaturday before and she'll say,
hey, this buyer, this is whatthey're looking for.
(06:51):
Here's what they missed out on.
Here are the non-negotiables.
And she said by friday thatagent will have two or three
properties ready to go, thatthey've door knocked, and.
And she said we'll often putthat buyer into a great home in
a week or two following theauction.
Buyer work is critical andbuyer work and seller work are
interlinked.
(07:11):
You can't see them as mutuallyexclusive.
Speaker 1 (07:15):
Now, john, I was going to say that another agent
told me today they love buyeragents because they're part of
their launch preview showcase.
And I said what do you mean bythat?
He said, okay, when I list aproperty, I say to the owners
we're not going to nail price.
(07:35):
It's a bit of your dialogue,john.
We're not going to nail pricetoday.
We're going to get a rough idea.
I'm going to give you somecomparables.
However, we're going to getsome great buyer intel over the
next few days and I'm going togive you some comparables.
However, we're going to getsome great buyer intel over the
next few days and I'm going toinvite the four buyer agents
that buy most properties in thispart of Sydney and then they
(07:55):
use the feedback from thebuyer's agents to give it to the
vendors and they found itextremely useful to be able to
go to the owner and say thesefour people between them are
buying X amount of properties ayear in this area and they
believe that this is where theproperty falls into.
And it's yeah.
I thought it was a fantasticidea.
Speaker 2 (08:17):
I mean buyers agents are the best.
I mean they're professionalbuyers, they're incentivized
about finding the right home andnegotiating a sale or purchase
on their behalf of their client.
Again, but I constantly hearwhich is, I have no idea why
that a lot of agents.
They either ignore them or theyalmost treat them with disdain,
like they're the opposition.
They'd be my best friends, forsure.
(08:39):
I'd be having a buyer's agentopen for inspection before
anyone else to get them throughand make them feel special.
They are the greatest thing youcan be, the greatest group you
can be working with, for sure.
Speaker 1 (08:50):
Beautiful Number four .
They own the auction arena andauctions look, auctions are
theatre.
And, john, you and I have asimilar approach.
Some people have a view thateverything's got to be an
auction.
I don't agree with that.
I think that, oh, everything'sgot to be an auction.
I don't agree with that.
I think that you know when yougo to a listing presentation,
(09:16):
you work that area in your heart.
You know whether a propertyshould go to auction or whether
it should be for sale.
But one thing is for sureagents that use the auction
system and Thomas McGlynn, john,which I know, you know very
well, very well, he indicated tome once.
He said to me, tommy, one thingthe auction clearance rates
don't actually have is operatorerror.
So you might have the economicsof the same, but there's one
(09:40):
agent that knows how to operatethe auction system properly and
another agent that doesn't andthat can also affect the
clearance rate.
And I think the best agents Iknow seem to have auction as
part of their strategy, eventhough it might not be their
whole strategy.
What's your view on auctionsand the percentage of properties
(10:01):
that should be going to auctionand how do you work out whether
you should be doing more orless auctions?
Speaker 2 (10:07):
Well, look, you're right, tom.
Most of our top agents andthose that I do or have coached
in the past, they're auctionorientated and I think it's an
efficient, effective and verygood quality way to sell
property, not just because it'sefficient and effective, because
it brings the best price inalmost every instance.
Having said that, I think youwant to have a toolbox with
(10:28):
three or four tools and youdon't want to just have the
auction hammer and then you'regoing to hope that everything
else is a nail.
Um, alex jordan, our number oneagent, writes 10 million a year
, does no auctions as example.
Um, which is, which isinteresting.
Um, one of the best agents,anthony bakaris, down in, down
in the Campbelltown, macarthurregion.
He does mostly timed auctionsonline as opposed to, you know,
(10:51):
on-site auctions, but, as youand I know, if you're looking
for the majority and you'relooking for where most of the
greatest success is, it'sauctions, and whether it's
in-room or on-site probablydoesn't matter too much.
We like on-site, you like onsite, but um, I think the
auction process is is thepreferred method.
Now, what you have to do is notdecide based on what you want
you.
(11:12):
You've got to decide based onwhat fits the property, what
fits the market, what fits thattype of property at that time,
and if you're about to put aproperty up and there's six
others on the street, they'reall identical you maybe putting
it up for auction at that timeand place may not be that smart
and you might only bring out thebargain hunters.
But in most instances I'd saythat 80, 85% of the time when
(11:35):
I'm selling, I think auction isthe best method to get the best
price in a timely fashion forthe vendor.
Speaker 1 (11:43):
John, can I ask you and this came up yesterday I had
a vendor reach out to me onsocial media.
They've got the home up forauction.
And then another home cameavailable in the street.
It's a very similar property,right?
And it's obviously in the samestreet.
They're both renovated.
The only difference is thesecond property appears to have
(12:04):
an agent that's quoting 250grand less right.
And the owner reached out to meand said hey, listen, I just
got this funny feeling.
This property is going todestroy my campaign.
He says.
I've been in that otherproperty.
They're basically similarproperties, except buyers are
being led to believe thatthey're going to get at a lower
(12:27):
figure.
And they asked my view onwhether they should do the same.
I said well, look, I have aview that underquoting will get
you more bidders, butunderquoting won't necessarily
get you a better price.
You're going to get a lot ofwastage along the way.
And then they suggested shouldthey delay their auction till
(12:48):
after that property sells?
What's your view on situationslike that?
Speaker 2 (12:52):
Well, it's a hard one , because then you can.
You know.
Then the other party.
I've seen it before where theother party delays and then it
just ends up being a silly game.
I think, sadly, if you have acompetitor who thinks that
underquoting is the way and youhave similar properties and
they're quoting 200,000 less, Isay to the buyers, Tom, they're
quoting 1.6.
(13:13):
Both these properties are worth180 every day of the week.
Why don't you go and offer them1.750 and see what they say?
Because I'll guarantee youthey'll knock it back.
And then they say, yeah, you'reright, you know.
I went and spoke to them.
They said, oh, we're not takingoffers or bids before auction.
So I think you've got to tryand call their bluff.
I think for sure, because itcan screw an auction up.
(13:34):
And what I generally do if I'man agent and I'm called in on a
property and there's a similarone on the market, I usually say
to the vendor let me list it,but let's launch straight
following the other property.
Because do we really want tocreate competitive glut in the
street?
If it's similar, if it'sdifferent, it's no problem.
But I agree, I think you'vejust got to be careful you don't
(13:57):
play games with people'semotions and properties and
assets.
As an agent, what's the bestway to get this and what should
you be quoting?
And it's now illegal, as weknow, probably always has been,
but you're going to be caughtnow.
Speaker 1 (14:11):
Number five they live in the database.
That's what I've noticed aboutthe good ones and I'm not going
to turn around and say that theynecessarily are sitting in
front of a computer five hours aday flipping through agent box
and that.
But what I am saying is thattheir team normally has got an
(14:32):
electronic filing system, whichthat's what a database is, and
everything is noted, every call,every open call, and the memory
is not used as the system.
Look, the memory is a goodsystem if you want to do one or
two sales a month, but thememory is not a good system if
you've got to be doing six toeight sales a month.
Speaker 2 (14:50):
John, yeah, you've got to be.
I think the days of just havinga crack at remembering a few
people and calling them randomlyare gone.
I mean, that's better than notcalling them.
To be fair, I think the bestagents now have a systematic
precision, military precisionstyle approach and they are
(15:10):
calling, you know, past clientsevery six months.
Here's the conversation.
Pipeline sellers um, you knowhot spotting.
You know we do a lot around hotspotting.
So when a property sells, youknow who can we speak to that
has a similar asset that wouldwant to know this information.
I think that's critical.
And again, I look at our bestagents and their past masters at
(15:34):
this.
I think there are calls you'vegot to make yourself.
You can't delegate.
For me, a past client callshould not be delegated because
that's someone you've builtrapport with.
They should see themselves asbeing a VIP part of your family,
and it's delegating that'ssomeone you've built rapport
with.
They should see themselves asbeing a VIP part of your family,
and it's delegating that tosomeone potentially more junior
than yourself saying I'm callingon behalf of Tom because you
(15:54):
know we're so delighted havingyou as a client.
He couldn't be bothered ringingyou himself, type of thing.
You know the message is notgoing to be the right message.
So I think some things you candelegate hotspotting is a good
one, updating the community, butwith your VIP clients, with
your influencers, with your pastclients, I think you've got to
(16:14):
make those calls yourself.
Speaker 1 (16:17):
I think, john, we're moving into a now with the
privacy, the do not disturb andthe screen calling, with all
these new phone updates and wespoke about it at one of the
podcasts I think what's going toactually happen is the
databases that are going toflourish are the ones that are
smaller, less people, but peoplehave a relationship with those
(16:39):
and every time like I was todayI was in Manly and I asked
someone I go, how many people inyour database?
They said 14,000.
I said look for an officethat's got three salespeople
14,000.
I said I think that's going tohave a lot of people that are
buyers in there, that are peoplethat aren't alive, that people
that are tenants.
I think realistically, john, ifyou had 1,000 people that were
(17:02):
home sellers in your coremarketplace and we know that
roughly 5% of those sell there's50 deals a year that are
sitting there and you don't needa hundred thousand people.
You need a thousand people thatwant to get stuff from you
because they think you're betterthan the other 10 or 20 other
agents in the suburb.
Speaker 2 (17:20):
Tommy Seth Godin says you know, I'd rather have a
hundred raving fans in thecommunity than 10,000 people on
my database.
And that's what you're saying.
It's about the depth and thequality of the relationship.
Does someone, when they seeyour phone number a is your
phone number in their phone sodo they know it's you calling?
B is that they pick up thephone and answer you, or c is
(17:43):
that they see you as a pest.
So it's the quality of theinformation and the depth of the
relationship you build.
So go deeper, not wider.
I mean, if you can have 200roving fans, arguably that's
even better, but you can't have10,000 roving fans.
Speaker 1 (17:56):
Okay, let's move on to number six, and that is build
a magnetic brand.
Build a magnetic brand is builda magnetic brand, build a
magnetic brand.
And that means probably thevideo more than the newspaper.
It probably means that you'vegot to do really good killer
copy, because I think, john, thequality of your advertising
(18:17):
will attract other people thatwant that quality of marketing
themselves.
Right, I think you've got atriple down on social, now that
we know that ChatGPT is actuallyused by vendors on agent
selection to come to appraisals,and we know that social media
is one of the drivers of yourdigital footprint with AI.
(18:38):
And, john, like you always werea person prospecting versus
brand, your approach when youwere in real estate was hey, if
you build the brand, people willbe coming to you and then you
follow up with walk the calls.
That was your approach, wasn'tit?
Speaker 2 (18:59):
Yeah, tell me, look, the bar's risen.
So once upon a time, you knowif, when all agents were taking
their own photos, if you had aphotographer of any ilk, you'd
be shedding shoulders above.
Of course, now almost everygood agent has professional
photos and and so the bar'srisen.
So you have to keep workingharder to stand out.
(19:20):
So a couple of things videoyou've mentioned there I totally
agree out.
So a couple of things videoyou've mentioned there I totally
agree.
Video is an opportunity to standout, amongst others.
Why?
Because 80% of agents won't dovideo because they're
self-conscious and they, youknow it's too hard, it's too
expensive.
I don't like my, the way I lookand sound on video, whatever it
is.
So if you're prepared toactually bite the bullet and
(19:41):
become good at video, if youwant to see someone who's great
at video, go to Instagram and goto Bort B-O-U-G-H-T agency,
bort agency.
The principal there, biancaField, a blonde lady.
You'll see her on probablyevery second video.
She is as good as anyone I'veseen in front of camera talking
to customers in an authenticconversation.
Speaker 1 (20:03):
Where is Bort agency?
Speaker 2 (20:05):
They're in the inner conversation.
Where are they, chuck?
Where's board agency?
They're in the inner west.
I think they might be inNewtown, so you're talking about
the buyer's agency.
Buyer's agency.
Speaker 1 (20:12):
Sorry, yeah buyer's agency, and that's.
We spoke about her the otherday.
She's amazing.
That's the block-headed youngbuyer's agent.
Speaker 2 (20:19):
Brilliant.
Yeah, that's exactly right.
So you know all she's.
When I say all she's done, it'sa skill.
But she's become verycomfortable in front of camera
and she I said to her you know,do you employ someone to do this
and how much do you pay them?
She said, no, my PA does itwith her iPhone and when she's
got a spare moment I'll saylet's duck out and do a video.
So this is it doesn't have tobe expensive, Um, and you just
(20:42):
need to do it.
You know, you've just got toactually jump in and do it.
So I think it's important Killercopy.
Most agents are probably eitherusing a professional copywriter
or, more likely today, AI.
So I think, yep, you've got tohave the best quality copy.
I would say Kevin MacLeod fromGrand Designs UK.
If you want to know what thebenchmark in talking about a
(21:06):
property, presenting a property,talking with clients about
their vision for a property andtalking about the design
elements relevant to a property,go and binge.
Watch 10 episodes of KevinMcLeod, take down notes on some
of the things he says, and he,for me, is the benchmark on the
best person that I've seen talkabout a property's attributes.
(21:29):
He's extraordinary.
So look at Bianca for videos.
Look at Kevin McLeod forpresenting a property and
discussing it and talking toclients about it, and just use
more video.
Drone, of course, is anunderutilized and a very high
impact way of bringing somevideo to life.
So I think that it was ChrisGilmore, I think, does a lot of
(21:52):
drone timing up in Queensland.
Chris is a very successfulagent, as you know, and I think
he does quite a few fly throughtype things.
So look for a point ofdifference.
As long as it's not gimmicky,that's to add value.
So it's got to be useful to thebuyer, not just striking your
own ego.
But, um, yeah, you gotta man,you gotta stand out, you gotta
stand out johnny, I'm gonnasmall advertisement someday.
Speaker 1 (22:15):
Joe bachara gave me this the other day or about a
month ago.
They're around 200 bucks.
It's always charged becausethey're like airpods and what it
is is.
This has to be the simplestplug and play mics I've ever
seen in my whole life.
They're always charged and youjust sticks on straight away and
(22:36):
it's it you're on, you'retalking and the sound.
I didn't realize that sounddoes impact the experience that
you have, like if you're like,if you're in a close direction,
you can speak into your phone.
But I swear by these $200,they're always charged and
they've got a second one in caseyou want to interview someone.
Speaker 2 (22:55):
And Tommy, on most Saturdays I watch a couple of
videos sorry live streaming thatyou do on your auctions.
I'm amazed more agents don'tlive stream their auctions.
Now you might want to cherrypick it, make sure you sort of
maybe live stream those thathave got the most amount of
interest so you can put yourselfin the best possible light.
But it's such an easy thinghave someone on your team hold,
(23:18):
I think you do it throughInstagram and TikTok or wherever
just do it and present it tothe market.
And then you do this greatlittle walkthrough at the end
where you show people the houseso they've seen it at the end.
And it's easy Again, just getout there and do it.
Speaker 1 (23:35):
Yeah, and I do look.
There's no question about it.
A successful auction that goeswell is going to be a lot better
on video.
But lately, John, I add theoccasional one that doesn't sell
, because I actually think tomyself that it is a more
realistic picture I want to getout there to people and that is
that.
Not everything is going off andlife is good.
Speaker 2 (24:01):
If you're thinking of going to a restaurant and you
go online, there's 155.0 perfectscores, or you know, let's call
it 30 perfect scores you knowit's probably friends and
relatives that have done it,Whereas if you know if there's
two or three that have said, ohyou know, geez, I kept waiting
for half an hour and I probablywon't go back again, but the
vast majority had a great meal,You're going to go there.
(24:21):
So I agree with you Peopledon't expect perfection.
Agents think they have to postperfection, whereas what the
consumer wants is actuallyauthenticity and reality.
So, yeah, if we shift ourbelief from it's got to be
perfect to it's just got to be,it's got to be out there, it's
got to be happening, it's got tobe real, it's a much better way
(24:43):
of doing it going forward.
Speaker 1 (24:46):
Next number seven run your day, don't let it run you.
And probably the big thingthere, john, I notice of that 1%
is that they're selfish withtheir.
They guard their time.
They feel guilty when theirtime is not being used properly.
(25:07):
They use a lot of time blockingon things.
So they've got this repeatable,predictable.
They know that this is the dayand the time that I do this
thing and I just know that I doit.
Speaker 2 (25:19):
And if you're not time blocking, tommy, you're not
efficient Because this is anindustry, the phone will ring
24-7.
Do I want you to be accessible?
Yes, do you have to beaccessible every second of every
day?
No, karen Terry, one of our topagents.
She hands her mobile phone toour receptionist as she arrives
because she's going to go and dotwo hours prospecting and she
(25:40):
says take the messages, givethem as much information, I'll
call them back at 10 o'clock.
If says take the messages, givethem as much information, I'll
call them back at 10 o'clock.
If there's something reallyurgent, come and let me know,
but otherwise I'm here toprospect, then she jumps on the
landline and makes all heroutbound calls.
So I think it's critical.
Phil Harris spoke at ARIC anumber of years ago and he's
talked about AM energy and PMenergy.
So for him AM the morning wasblock it out to generate new
(26:03):
business and new phone calls andnew prospects and so forth.
And then the PM is servicinggoing to meetings, going to
listing appointments, showingbuyers, doing open homes.
And it reminded me, tommy, ofRyan Holiday that spoke also at
ARIC a few years ago.
It was brilliant and he'swritten I think it's 12
bestsellers and he's written Ithink it's 12 bestsellers and he
(26:24):
says the secret to success tohim was simple he had two sacred
hours a day and it was in themorning, first thing.
I think it was like eighto'clock in the morning or nine
o'clock after his little one hadgone to school.
And he said he blocked out andit was non-negotiable.
And he said all I had to do waswrite a few crappy pages in two
hours.
So the two concepts there Ijust want to unpack quickly.
(26:47):
One was he called them sacredhours Like you do not break
these hours, this is not.
I'll get around to it, if I can.
So replace writing a book withprospecting as example, or buyer
work as example.
And the second thing he said allI had to do was write a few
crappy pages.
So he didn't say I do was writea few crappy pages.
Um, so he didn't say I have towrite a masterpiece, I have to
write a bestseller, I have towrite 10 pages.
(27:08):
He knew that if every day hedid a couple of hours and wrote
a few pages, call it three, four, five or six, and he, you know,
he said if they were justauthentic and real, he said an
editor or someone will clean itup later, but he just had to get
the words down on a pagewithout seeking perfection,
Because if you seek perfection,you're never actually going to
put the word down.
You're going to be thinkingabout it for the next six months
(27:29):
.
So a few crappy pages in acouple of sacred hours, making a
dozen connections with a fewpeople I've never met before in
my 60 minutes of prospecting.
That's probably a good metaphorfor real estate.
Speaker 1 (27:46):
John talking about Eric Peter Fuda, which you had
speaking at Eric probably aboutfive years ago thereabouts.
Speaker 2 (27:55):
More, yeah, more.
Speaker 1 (27:57):
More At the end.
I don't know whether hementioned it during his speech
he probably did but he mentionedit afterwards when I did a
quick video with him.
He said the minute you swaptime management for choice
management, you get more time inyour life and I thought that
was profound.
You can't actually massage time, but you can actually make a
(28:20):
decision at that time what isthe better decision to make?
Speaker 2 (28:27):
decision at that time .
What is the better decision tomake?
Yeah, I can tell you frompersonal experience he's
probably the most hardcore guyon his time that I know, and he
charges a million dollars a yearto coach people, so your
coaching fees are soundingpretty good at the moment, Tommy
.
And the people he coachesthey're CEOs of Fortune 500
companies and billion-dollarcompanies and so forth.
(28:50):
So you know, funny enough, themillion for them to be at their
peak state as a leader isprobably a great value.
But he's just hardcore on histime.
You know.
If you want to book in, you canbook in in two weeks' time.
It's a 15-minute slot and youbetter not miss it, because if
you're five minutes late, hesays, look, we haven't got the
time to cover it now, We'llre-book in.
(29:11):
He's very hardcore.
Speaker 1 (29:13):
Okay, let's move on.
Number eight building an EBU.
That's a weapon, because lonerangers burn out, lone rangers
blow head gaskets, the pilotdoesn't serve drinks on the
plane and, as they say, if youdon't have an assistant, you
probably are the assistantyourself.
So, john, have you ever?
(29:34):
I mean every business.
If you look at the top 20people in the McGrath group,
would you say they're all EBUs.
They'd have to be, wouldn'tthey?
Yeah, 100%.
Speaker 2 (29:46):
Right, but some of them, by the way, may only have
one.
I mean there's no need to havefive or six.
I mean Alex Jordan's got fivepeople, yeah, tarun's got five
people, so some will have aslightly bigger team, but
there's plenty that have justgot but one, probably two is
more.
They usually have one foradministration and marketing and
(30:07):
just running the teamofficially, and then one who's
either focused on buyerspecialization or prospecting or
both.
So I'd say the average one inour top 20 would have a team
themselves plus two.
Speaker 1 (30:22):
Okay, number nine.
They stay in training camp likeyou are right now.
They listen to podcasts, theygo to coaching.
They never graduate.
They never graduate.
It's not like you do a Bachelorof Education and I'm a school
teacher.
The real estate course seems togo for 50 years.
(30:42):
Isn't it weird, john?
Real estate is like it doesn'tmatter how long you've been
doing it, like today I waslistening to someone who was
telling me oh, they go aboutthis approach.
The other day, someone wastelling me that, hey, I go onto
RP Data every month and I have alook at all the transactions
(31:04):
that have got a dollar, thathave happened for that month and
I think to myself why is therea $1 transaction there?
Is there something going on?
Is there a separation?
Is there a deceased estatecoming on the market?
Right, I think there's a commontendency.
I noticed, john, of the goodones, they're feedback junkies.
(31:26):
That's probably the word I wasthinking of.
They're feedback junkies,whereas amateurs they hate
feedback because they always seeit as being criticism.
Speaker 2 (31:35):
Yeah, yeah, no, look, I think feedback's critical.
I think it was Jim Rowan yearsago.
I heard him and he said you gotto work harder on yourself than
you do on your job, and Itotally agree with that.
It's all about you know.
What can you be?
What are you listening to?
What are you reading?
And, to be frank, I don't readthat much anymore.
If there's a book someonerecommends to me, my default is
(31:57):
I go to AI and I say the faultis I go to AI and I say I'm in
real estate, I'm a principal anda sales agent.
Can you read this book for meand tell me what are the 20 most
relevant things for aresidential real estate agent?
And I get a summary.
So I just, you know, just.
Speaker 1 (32:11):
That's gold, because I tell you, I saw you the other
day when we were sitting withAndrew Kazi talking about rugby
league coaching, and then whathappened is you walked away.
So Andrew's the Howard, is thatHoward Matthews or Howard
Matthews?
Yeah, howard Matthews.
Okay, he's the Tigers coach.
And then what you did is youwent on a chat, gpt, and you
(32:33):
asked for a summary of the book.
I think Legacy wasn't it.
Is that the book?
Yeah, yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:38):
Legacy.
What I did say was you know, Ipretended I was him.
I said I'm a rugby league coachin Sydney, australia.
Can you read this book and tellme and I'm coaching younger
people, not older peoplegenerally, you know these are
sort of under 19s, can you?
And if you can give AI a reallyprecise brief, it will deliver
(32:59):
every time.
So yeah, I think you knowwhether it's that podcast.
I just you know I'm listeningall day long to podcasts and
stuff whenever I get a spareminute, walking the dog, walking
around, whatever in the car.
So I think it's really critical.
And you think about eliteathletes.
You know the Michael Jordan andthe late Kobe Bryant kind of
(33:21):
ilk.
These were the world's greatestelite athletes, probably
greatest in history and yet theyused to, on average, train for
six hours a day if they weren'tplaying.
Now, these are guys that youknow.
They didn't have to learn howto shoot or dribble.
They were like the best on theplanet, but they never stopped
training.
(33:41):
I remember Johnny Wilkinson, whowas the English goal kicker in
rugby union years ago and he's abit of a legend of a player,
plus probably the best goalkicker I've ever seen, and I
read a book about him and hesaid he used to arrive an hour
and a half before training everyday, so when everyone else was
doing whatever they were doing,they weren't at training.
He was there just kicking theball through the posts.
(34:02):
And he said anyone that thinksthat I was a natural born goal
kicker couldn't be more wrong.
But he said I work at it harderthan anyone else in the world
at goal kicking.
And I think it's the same list.
And you think about it.
If Michael Jordan can find fourto six hours a day to train to
be a better basketballer, howmany hours a day are we spending
in this industry on ourdialogue, on our negotiation
(34:25):
skills, on our closing skills,on our presenting skills?
The answer is not enough.
So, you know, I often talk topeople and I say you know what?
Are you zero to 10 as a lister?
And they say oh, and to behonest, I'm a six.
And I said you've been in thegame a few years, you're a six
(34:47):
out of 10.
If you're a nine, you'd beearning five times the GCI or
the income, and the only thingstopping you from a six to a
nine is putting the effort in.
It's all out there.
This is a smart brigade we'retalking to because they're
online now.
But the question is when you'renot online, when we finish,
what are you doing next?
Are you doing enough to youknow?
Polish up your skills Reallycritical.
Speaker 1 (35:06):
So, john, there's a soccer player that played for
the Socceroos, actually went tomy school, a lot younger than me
, tim Cahill.
It was actually in my youngbrother's year, tim Cahill, and
he played for a team that my dadwas involved in, sydney Olympic
.
He ended up, you know,obviously playing for Australia,
(35:27):
played for Everton probablyAustralia's biggest socceroo
export and I was talking tosomeone that played in the same
years with him at Sydney Olympicand he said, you know, it
really annoys me, he goes.
He was always on the bench andhe goes how.
He sort of got into the team,overtook us and went overseas.
He goes.
He was always on the bench.
I was a significantly betterplayer.
I said what do you reckon itwas?
(35:47):
He goes.
Look, he was just the first oneat training all the time.
When everything trainingfinished, he was the last one
out.
Everyone thought he was justdoing it to crawl, but he just
was there longer than all theothers and I think it paid off.
That's what this guy said 100%100%.
Number 10, and this is importantprotect your reputation,
(36:11):
because it can take you 30 yearsto build it.
Your name is your currency.
No underquoting, no shortcuts.
Play the long game.
Understand that we all havedigital footprints now.
But, john, you said it theother day, you said it to me
privately and we now live in aworld where you should be doing
(36:34):
the right thing all the time.
But if you're not, you shouldbe aware there's essentially a
speed camera every 50 meters nowBetween AI, voice recorders,
iphones.
Right, you can't get away withdoing the wrong thing.
I remember you telling me oneday oh why did Dewey or some
other player do something on thepark?
You said, mate, there's 100cameras watching there, as if
(36:57):
you're going to get away with it.
Speaker 2 (36:58):
Well, ai, you know and let's just stay in real
estate for a minute it's goingto impact the entire world, but
it's going to mean that thegoverning bodies, the NCATs and
VCATs and OFTs of the world aregoing to be able to monitor not
just properties they're focusedon.
If they get a complaint, everysingle transaction you do will
(37:19):
be put under the AI microscopeand you know, then they're going
to be naming and shaming andthere's going to be websites,
there's going to be fines andwhatever, whatever.
I'm with you, tom, you know,don't do it.
Don't change just because youdon't get caught.
Change because this is a worldof transparency where you should
be doing the right thing, andif you do the right thing
consistently in fact, every time, not just consistently
(37:42):
non-negotiably you're going tobuild an incredible reputation,
and there's not many in thisindustry with incredible
reputation, so you will standout like a beacon.
Speaker 1 (37:52):
John, one quick question what do you reckon is
more important, motivation ordiscipline?
Speaker 2 (37:58):
Discipline, discipline, habits, routine.
I think Trump motivationMotivation, by definition, tends
to come and go.
It'sine habits routine.
I think trump motivationMotivation, by definition, tends
to come and go.
It's like I got motivated I gotup early, I went to the gym, I
feel great, so I'm going to doit today.
Discipline is like everymorning.
I do this and I do my sacredtwo hours of calls and here's
how I set up for my listeningpresentation.
I think it's just habits anddiscipline routine process.
(38:26):
Now you can be both.
Ideally, you want to havediscipline, process, structure
and have it in as really goodenergy, but I think that process
trumps motivation.
Speaker 1 (38:34):
Okay, emma.
Hi, emma, good to see you.
I'm reading your question.
Emma Young, from Wellington,new Zealand, I've got to tell
you John Emma's a young womanKia ora Emma.
Look out for Emma.
I think Emma's riding around 2mil in an area in Wellington
where they've had 30% pricedrops.
(38:55):
It's been one of the mostchallenging markets, it says.
Am I being premature by askingshould we need to start ordering
this?
Shall we be waiting for theintel from you, or where should
we start looking to ordermarriage current database mess,
emma.
So I think what you'rereferring to there is how to
clean your database, right?
(39:17):
I think that's what you'retalking about and I think we're
going to do a special sessionthere.
But I can tell you, cleaning adatabase requires time.
I will say some of the CRMcompanies have got an added
service where you go to them andsay here's my issues, I want to
clean it up.
They can help with a few things.
Example they'll say we'll stripall the duplicates out, we'll
(39:39):
strip all the data that we thinkthat is faulty data, right.
But what they're not going todo and it's going to need human
intervention is to be able towork out whether some people are
alive or dead.
Where they are, are they stillselling or buying?
Hey, johnny has said there.
Terry added there, we're allgood, we're all good.
(40:00):
Next time we see you, team, I'llbe seeing you in Byron Bay.
Check out WhatsApp.
I'm going to have all theinformation there.
John, we are in the best Listen.
Winter's over, spring is here,daylight savings coming longer
days in the afternoons.
We've got the best real estate.
I mean real estate agents aresaying to me I'm happy with this
(40:21):
market.
Right and out of the blue, allof a sudden, john, I'm hearing a
lot of your agents are sayingstock is coming in.
Speaker 2 (40:31):
I've coached to one of them, alex DiMaggio ASB, our
friend Tommy.
She's got 35 auction listingssigned up and she basically does
a relatively small suburbcalled Earlwood, so her market
share must be phenomenal.
She does a few outside.
And the other one I was sittingdown with Patrick Byron today
who does botany for us Again,not a huge area, and he's just
signed up his 21st auction lastnight and some of them have
(40:55):
launched, but most of them willlaunch in the next two weeks.
There's business out there,business out there.
So two things make sure it'scoming your way.
As a part of Tom's elite teamhere, it should be coming your
way.
And I think the second thing ismake sure your vendors have got
offers on the table.
Realize there is a tsunami ofnew stock, in my opinion, about
(41:16):
to hit the market.
So if you've got an offer andit's close, I'd be doing
everything I can to close it,because it might be gone in a
week or two.
Speaker 1 (41:25):
And look, we know that spring's a good time in
real estate, but we also knowthat if you get double or triple
the amount of listings that youhave in spring than what you
have in winter, that that causesanother issue with getting
deals done.
But, john, thank you again,thank you Tame Good to see you.
Speaker 2 (41:43):
Thanks, tommy.
Speaker 1 (41:44):
See you next month.
Keep sending the numbers inQuenza.
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