March 14, 2025 • 45 mins
Struggling to balance work, marriage, and parenting? In this video, we dive into expert marriage advice and relationship tips to help you navigate how to keep your marriage strong while prioritizing mental health in marriage. Learn practical strategies for work-life balance, parenting and marriage, and get busy parents marriage tips from a family therapist. We also explore couples therapy, pelvic floor health and relationships, and the key to intimacy in marriage. From communication in marriage to how to improve your relationship, these strong marriage tips will transform your connection. Prioritize relationship wellness, marriage and mental health, and healthy relationships with expert guidance. To learn more about Hillary & Renewed Hope Family Therapy, visit her website!: renewedhopefamilytherapy.com
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:00):
Welcome to another episode of the Edmunds Mom's Room podcast. Today,
I am joined here with an expert in humans. Oh
oh yeah, human psychology, really counseling. We're going to talk
a little bit about counseling human relationships, maybe dive into
a little bit of marriage and fun things. So thanks
(00:22):
for being yeah, yeah, thanks. Tell us a little bit
about yourself and then we'll dive right in.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Yeah. So my name is Hillary.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
I am a licensed marriage and family therapy associate in
the state of Washington, and I.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
Live here in Edmunds. I love it here, and I'm just.
Speaker 3 (00:43):
Trying to be a business person and help people and
keep my family together and everything.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
So that's kind of what I'm doing right now. I
love that. Yeah. So we had a really cool conversation.
I think this was like two or three months ago.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
Yeah, and I was telling you about this book I
was reading about marriage and families, and I was like,
it really helped me change my perspective. And you said
one thing that I like. I was like, genius, it
was so amazing. You're like, oh, the key to successful
marriage is the ability to change your perspective.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
And I was like, oh, that's all I had to do.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
But no, really, it was like I think that was
such a golden ticket. And I was like, we have
to get you on a podcast, like, let's talk about relationships.
I know you do like a lot of pre mariital counseling.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
Yeah, well so I do some premarital.
Speaker 3 (01:36):
I have a lot of different kind of like things
that I've been trained in. Yeah, but actually right now
I'm doing a lot of marriage counseling.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Love it tis a season.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Yeah, so let's talk about keeping these marriages together?
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Is that the goal? Oh yeah, I mean that's a
big question. I know I have to say this too. Yeah,
I was.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
I just to finish the book The Value of Others.
I think I told you I was reading. Yeah, and
he it's by oriyan Tera ron Terra Britt. Okay, so
he's a man and it's kind of like it's a
little an unpopular opinion, and I feel like the book
was not written for women.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
Yeah, I remember telling me that, but it was so
good because it just gave me a different perspective.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
And he at the end of the book, he's like,
you get married and all of a sudden, you expect
your partner to be your soulmate. Your co parent, your
counselor your like your sexual partner, and like they have
all these roles that they're supposed to fill, but yet
like we were never meant to have all those Like
(02:45):
not one person can be excellent at all those things
or have all those jobs. So it's like that is
such an interesting facet to like look at marriage from
that lens. I don't even know where I'm going with this,
but I was like, that was just it was funny
to hear that yesterday and then to know that we're
coming on here today to talk all about relationships. Yeah,
and yeah, so tell us a little bit about I mean, yeah,
(03:08):
what people are coming for as far as like, oh,
counseling goes and.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
Yeah, I mean people that I see in my practice
are coming for like I mean, I think they come
to me because of the type of therapy that I
do is kind of geared toward like identifying negative patterns,
like what you do when you're just feeling like stuck
(03:32):
in conflict or just like a cycle of just feeling
like really disconnected, and that can be for a ton
of different reasons, and I think that's, yeah, that's mainly
what people are coming to me. For it's pretty broad.
I see a lot of different things happening. I think,
(03:53):
I don't know if this is everybody, but it's true
that when there's like a life cycle change, so like
if you're going through a transition in your family, like
adding children to your family, your kids are transitioning from
like little kids to teenagers, or even like teens to
(04:15):
out of the house, like any of those like family
life cycle transitions.
Speaker 2 (04:21):
That's just those are stressors.
Speaker 3 (04:23):
And I think people don't necessarily say, oh, we're going
through a transition, that's why we're feeling stuffy, so we
need to go to therapy. It's like I keep having
the same fight with my partner over and over again,
and we can never get out of it, Like we
never resolve this fight, and maybe it feels like one
(04:45):
person doesn't even care about resolving it and the other
person's like, I.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
Must resolve this thing.
Speaker 3 (04:50):
Like just even different approaches to like what do we
do about conflict?
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Yeah, And I think that's.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
A lot of times when people come and then the
more we kind of like dig into what's going not
a lot of times it's like, oh, you guys are
actually going through a big life change, right, now, so no,
there's a lot of stress. So no, wonder everything is
heightened and it's harder to like move through conflict or
there is more conflict and that's overwhelming.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
Right, So is that I'm from? So you are a perspective.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
Changer I guess, or like you bring.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
Those you bring those transitions to life. Yeah, I mean,
like we talk about a lot of things. So the
type of therapy that I do is called emotionally focused therapy.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
Okay, I am getting training in it, so I'm not
like a certified EFT therapist, although.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
That seems like it could be a goal for me
because I really like the work that I do. Regardless
of your certification, this is what you.
Speaker 2 (05:50):
Use, Yeah, this is what I use.
Speaker 3 (05:52):
This is like what I'm being trained in and this therapy,
like there's a lot.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
Of different stages and all this stuff.
Speaker 3 (06:00):
Basically the number one like first goal is can we
just try to understand what's going on here? Like let's
just figure out what is this negative pattern, Like what happens,
what are the triggers, what's going on with each person,
what's happening in between you guys, Like what's kind of
the like the outcome of like an individual getting triggered
(06:22):
and like what happens kind of in the relationship.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
And part of that is actually, which this isn't for everybody,
but part of.
Speaker 3 (06:32):
The work is going back and seeing like, Okay, like
how were you raised, who what kind of models of
marriage or like relationships did you have? What other significant
relationships have you had before this one? Oh, like how
is all of that kind of like playing a role
in what's going on in each individual person. And the
(06:55):
idea is to kind of just like get perspective. Okay,
what is actually happening here, what's happening under the surface,
what's going on? Because what we see is like a reaction,
but what we want to know is like what is
the root cause Like that's I think what everyone kind
of is like, but why do I do this?
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Why do I do this? Why am I the way
that I am? Like why is my partner the way
that they are?
Speaker 4 (07:20):
I mean?
Speaker 2 (07:22):
And so yeah, there's just like.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
A lot of kind of revealing that happens, and through
that process we can kind of like take a deep
breath a lot of times and say, oh my gosh, Okay, actually.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
My partner is not maliciously doing this to me?
Speaker 3 (07:39):
It's because that's actually just like how they did things
in their family. You know, Oh my gosh, I'm not
super super needy. I just had a really bad relationship
experience in my twenties or whatever that now I have
like this underlying fear. It makes me like anxious that
(08:01):
my partner can't talk about something right.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
Away or whatever.
Speaker 3 (08:07):
So that's that's kind of like the perspective taking, perspective
shifting and also blame shifting, right. We always want to
like blame someone, blame something, and the idea is like.
Speaker 2 (08:20):
Shift the blame from yourself from your partner.
Speaker 3 (08:23):
Can we just shift it to like this cycle that
happens between you guys, Like that's really the thing to blame.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
Yeah, that's what we need to like fight.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
I mean, that sounds wonderful, and I feel like that
does diffuse the situation. But all I can think about
is my perfect marriage that I'm in total joke.
Speaker 5 (08:42):
I did one too, Yeah, what's your secret? It's it's
definitely really good, but.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
For real, like, how how do you and we all
have our bigage right from like our past and how
we show up and they say and how we get
triggered and and even if we can own it and
be like, yeah, it's how you know he loved his
mother so deeply. Just kidding, but really, you know, like
(09:12):
it's like those relationships. So it's like how so we
recognize it and there's obviously then so much onus and like.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
Having to shift that and like work through that.
Speaker 1 (09:24):
So do people come to you because I could just
see it being a brick wall in a lot of spouses, right, Like,
first off, I mean, if you get someone to sign
up for marriage counseling, it's usually probably one partner more.
Speaker 2 (09:35):
So than the other.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
Yeah, like in some cases, in some cases, I in
my experience, maybe one person's driving it okay, but the
other person is acknowledging that, yeah, this is like there's
an issue and I don't really know if this is
gonna like fix it.
Speaker 2 (09:53):
But I don't want that thing to happen in.
Speaker 3 (09:56):
My marriage anymore so, right because I think sometimes you're relationships,
there's usually like one person who's like the one that's
making things happen.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
Right, Like I've.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
Literally had couples come in, Oh, it was my idea,
but like my partner executed it, and I'm like, actually,
I don't know, that's just how things work in your marriage. Fine,
but yeah, so sometimes yeah, maybe.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
Somebody is like not wanting to be there. So but
most of the.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
Time, people they want the change, they want the solution,
right if they.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
Don't want to live in a life of chaos.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
And you know, we always want our relationships to be
better and more fulfilling of.
Speaker 2 (10:33):
Course, So how do you break down those barriers? Though?
Speaker 1 (10:37):
Like you get to those and if you have an example,
you can share it, but like, yeah, how I guess
my answer? My question is like people have to want
to change and to want to do the work when
they come to you. So is there a secret sauce
that you have to help show them that path or
is it.
Speaker 2 (10:55):
I'm not a fair I don't know if.
Speaker 3 (10:56):
It's like secret and I hate to be the therapist.
That's like, this is what my model says.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
Like this is like what's wing But but the way that.
Speaker 3 (11:06):
I work, it's like that's step one is de escalating,
figure out what's going on. Step two is how do
we actually change the pattern? What do we do differently?
And it can happen and that's what happens in therapy.
Speaker 2 (11:18):
Yeah, like bringing in what happened this week?
Speaker 3 (11:22):
Oh, you guys have been working through kind of like
a difficult situation. What's the conversation been like about that?
Speaker 2 (11:31):
Okay?
Speaker 3 (11:31):
You know, one partner usually like, well, this is what
I'm feeling, like this is happening for me, and then
we just.
Speaker 2 (11:38):
Work with it. In session, we just say like, okay,
can we.
Speaker 3 (11:42):
Slow this down, like if one if that partner starts
to get like starts to you know, get triggered or
like get like emotional in session Okay, wow, you're.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
Like getting emotional, Like what's happening right now?
Speaker 3 (11:55):
Can we just slow this way down so that we
can actually identify what is going on, what's the underlying emotion,
so we can help your partner see not just the reaction,
but the underlying emotion, Like what are you actually feeling
about this? What makes this so important to you that
you are getting like escalated just talking about it?
Speaker 2 (12:18):
Okay? Can we talk about that? Can we talk through that?
Can you share that with your partner?
Speaker 3 (12:25):
Partner, what do you think when they shared that, it's
really it can be like so awkward.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
Yeah, no, honest, honestly, I love that, but it's like
it's it's choreographed, right.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
Yeah, hm, and I feel like you need that because
in the home, when you're in the kitchen and you're
making dinner for the children and like that, like that
tends to be when my triggers.
Speaker 2 (12:46):
It's like you know, there's all triggers abound the kitchen. Yeah, and.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
So it's just fascinating like to be because you can't
have those conversations in the moment and so to really
pull out, yeah, and to achieve that level of like
in depth awareness, Yeah, yeah, that's interesting. And the idea
is that like the.
Speaker 2 (13:07):
More you have those.
Speaker 3 (13:11):
Kind of like specific, like dedicated conversations in therapy that
are de escalated, oh, you're actually understanding.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
Even more about your partner.
Speaker 3 (13:21):
You're going deeper into what's happening for them, what they need,
what you know, what they do to like protect themselves,
and things get kind of scary. Oh. The more understanding
you have, the idea is the more that that actually
translates to real life. Like in your example, maybe it's
just like yeah, the kitchen and making dinner is just
(13:44):
like not the time.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
Yeah, so like have.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
A conversation like that, Okay, great, we're just never going
to do that out of the kitchen again.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
And if we do and if something starts.
Speaker 3 (13:54):
Happening, we have so much awareness and so much practice
from therapy that somebody can be like, hey, wait, actually
just like no, we're not going to do this.
Speaker 2 (14:02):
Let's just stop this right now before it escalates.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
It's funny you say that because I always say I'm
not prime time right now.
Speaker 3 (14:09):
I don't primetime.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
I can't have that conversation.
Speaker 1 (14:12):
Yeah, like or you know if it's like yeah, I
fade real fast invite and that is not my optimal
like time to get into it with you about if
I'm going to be rational and like, yeah, bring my
best self to the conversation.
Speaker 2 (14:23):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:24):
It's an interesting phenomenon. And his prime time is the evening,
and so we don't connect on the like our prime times,
and so it's a hard you know shift of like
making sure we can have those high value conversations. I
guess m H need to happen more, of course. Yeah,
but yeah, it's interesting to hear you, yeah say that, Yeah,
removing that from that conversation.
Speaker 2 (14:46):
Yeah, right.
Speaker 3 (14:49):
And I also, like, I think a lot of people
want to come in and say, like give us tools,
like tell us how to have like not tell us
how to have these conversations that tell us when to
have these conversations make solution for us. And I always
just tell people, you know, if like that was really
your the thing, I see such intelligent people.
Speaker 2 (15:11):
Now you're intelligent.
Speaker 3 (15:13):
If that was what the issue was, you would have
already figured it out. You would have already figured out, like, oh,
all we need to do is have this at a
different time. It's not usually like the thing.
Speaker 6 (15:23):
And only when in my experience, like and this is
my personal experience too, like only when you're kind of
understanding what the dynamic is and that you just all
the different factors that go.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
Into the dynamic, can you say, Okay, we know that
this isn't good. Can we just like when do do
we just need to start putting something on the calendar
at another time to have this?
Speaker 2 (15:48):
Okay? Fine, But like that becomes a.
Speaker 3 (15:50):
Lot easier when you know, like really why you can't
engage in that other way, and like what the issues.
Speaker 2 (15:58):
Are with doing that? I don't know?
Speaker 6 (16:00):
Interesting, so schedule it, I mean essentially, I mean that's
what I would personally do, but like that's only because that.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
Is what works for my relationship. I'm not really the therapist.
Speaker 3 (16:12):
It's like everybody need telling people, yeah what to do? Yeah,
I mean I'm open to brainstorming, and a lot of
my clients want to brainstorm in session.
Speaker 2 (16:24):
Okay, great, that's like you guys problem solving. Yeah that's awesome.
Speaker 3 (16:27):
Yeah that's just not really how I work, but that's okay, Okay,
So this sounds so good.
Speaker 1 (16:35):
It sounds like we've just talked about like the perfect
marriage couple of counseling session. But like behind closed doors,
a lot of people don't like each other.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
They not don't like each other.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
Like of course, like you bond, you come in a
relationship because you have the same values, or you find
each other attractive, or you want to have children and
breed together. And then and maybe people lose the value
of the other person.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
When that is gone, or they just can't find happiness
with that.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
Like I guess what I'm trying to say here is
that sounds beautiful, But what about for the folks that
there is so much rage, There's so much hurt, there's
so much anger, there's so much I guess resentment.
Speaker 2 (17:25):
Would be the word.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
Yeah, where let's like what happens there? Same shit, yeah,
I mean kind of same, kind of same thing, you know.
Speaker 3 (17:36):
I mean I think like, okay, so this is not
this is from this is wisdom from others, right, who
are like training me and kind of what because I
have questions about that too, like what happens when oh man,
they're like this relationship is like actually the next step
is divorce?
Speaker 2 (17:57):
Can there be work?
Speaker 5 (17:59):
Right?
Speaker 2 (17:59):
And what real what's realistic to expect?
Speaker 3 (18:03):
And I would just what I've kind of gathered and
what I what makes sense to me is that like, hey,
for the negative patterns, they reinforce each other, right, it
just reinforces, reinforces. So the longer something has been going on, Yes,
the harder it is to break it down, to de escalate.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
It, to do something new.
Speaker 3 (18:27):
It's hard, and it's it takes time and not through
all sorts of circumstances.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
It's like not for.
Speaker 3 (18:37):
Everybody, right, I I mean I have my personal views
about marriage. Well, I mean, like I want to know, oh,
I mean, I think like marriage is a really important decision.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
Yea yeah, I like want to not be taken lightly.
Speaker 3 (18:55):
Absolutely, That's just my perspective based on my yeah yeah yeah.
Speaker 2 (19:02):
And then you know I was I kind of have
this thing where life.
Speaker 3 (19:06):
I met my husband, and then I decided eight months
later that I wanted to change my career in advertising
corporate advertising and having so much fun and like making
money and not like having to really work super super hard.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
Sorry, I love you guys.
Speaker 3 (19:24):
I worked hard, but like you know, it was like
fun and not so challenging for me at the time.
Speaker 4 (19:30):
Right, easy money, it was well, it was not like
so easy, but it was like, you know, it was yeah, anyways,
a good career and it was great.
Speaker 2 (19:41):
And then la, yeah totally. Yeah eight months later like.
Speaker 3 (19:46):
Hey, yeah, actually I want to go back to school
and become a marriage and family therapist. And we have
a funny story about that I won't share, but like
he was like okay, yeah totally. And then he's the
type of person that he doesn't when you tell him
this is my goal.
Speaker 2 (20:03):
He just like doesn't let you not do your goal. Oh,
like okay, you know what I mean. Yeah, I don't
know anything about that. It makes him a good coach.
Speaker 3 (20:13):
It makes him a good coach, right, really holds you accountable.
Speaker 2 (20:16):
So anyways, I don't really know where it was going.
Speaker 3 (20:18):
With this other than like, well, we want to know
as much of your story will share. Where was I, oh,
this is like the importance in marriage. So you know,
then we take this journey and then it you know,
I'm in school, We're about to get engaged, and I
and it was just there was a lot going on,
(20:38):
but I was like, I don't care anything else about
this wedding.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
We're going to premier atal counseling.
Speaker 3 (20:47):
Not because I think there's something really wrong with this relationship,
but we both are kids of divorce, and I know
the statistics right, and we have we've got stuff that
we are aware that we're talking about, but like we
need we got to have somebody in.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
Our like Arsenal right to help us. And I have
to say it was.
Speaker 3 (21:10):
The best money we spent as part of our wedding planning.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
And it was like a.
Speaker 3 (21:16):
Drop in the bucket in comparison to the other stuff.
Speaker 2 (21:20):
But it was the time, you know that we dedicated.
Speaker 3 (21:22):
And so I think, and this isn't to say that
like I have the best marriage of all time, but
that this is the perspective I'm coming with like somebody
who I'm like, I just really want this to be
good and I want this to work, and I want
the tools and I want like, you know, the arsenal,
(21:43):
Like I want this therapist in my back pocket so
when we do go through like a big life transition
and it rocks us, I want to be able to
go to somebody now.
Speaker 2 (21:54):
So that's my perspective on marriage. It is that like
it is.
Speaker 3 (21:59):
Work, but it's worth it, and I don't think it
should be It's not a decision that like should be
taken lightly my perspective, that's just like not everybody's reality though.
That's not how like a lot of marriage relationships had
come to be. Like my husband and I were a
little older when we got married, so that was not
like old, but you know, just like older than some
of our friends. We had other things going on anyways,
(22:22):
So I back to the question around like is it
kind of like is it ever too late? Yeah, I don't.
I don't think so, Yeah, that's not like I wouldn't.
I don't think I would be doing my job and
like you know, holding hope for my clients and I
(22:43):
didn't really believe that, like, yeah, like marriages can be saved,
but that's not necessary. But it takes two people, right right, Yeah,
And it takes a lot of like intention and a
lot of dedication, especially if things have been really hard
for a.
Speaker 2 (23:01):
Long time, because that takes time to it.
Speaker 3 (23:07):
Maybe not an equal amount of time, but it could
take years.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
And that's just not necessarily like.
Speaker 3 (23:18):
Everyone's not everyone has the ability to dedicate yours totally.
I will say, I think I told you about this,
But there is a type of counseling, like if you
are or somebody is in a real spot where you're
like I just need to know if this is this working, is.
Speaker 2 (23:39):
This gonna work or is it not gonna work?
Speaker 3 (23:42):
There is a type of couples counseling called discernment counseling.
There are discernment counselors in the areas. It's definitely a
certification you have to get because it's a really specific
structured like five sessions, really specific goals for each session
kind of thing. But that would be really good for
(24:05):
people who are like I don't I don't want to
spend or I don't have a bunch of years to
spend trying to figure out if this relationship is going
to work. Yeah, I want some clarity like soon. I
don't know a whole lot about it anyway, that's kind
of like all I really know about it. Other than Yeah,
(24:26):
it's a short term thing to help couples figure discern
like are we in this?
Speaker 1 (24:34):
And so once they go through discernment counseling, that's when
then it's like, Okay, if we're in this, we want
to say this.
Speaker 3 (24:39):
I think some people I think some people could do
it that way. Some people do it the opposite way though,
Like we've been in couples counseling for so long, I
see it's not we're getting stuck or whatever, and then
we transition to discernment counseling to really make sure like
are we.
Speaker 2 (24:57):
Going to end this?
Speaker 1 (24:58):
Yeah, no, that's great, that's a that's a very valuable
that's value.
Speaker 3 (25:01):
But I do think that if you're somebody who or
if you're in a you know, partnership that's like you
don't really know and you kind of just want to
check good, check in, that would actually probably be a
good place to start.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Okay, we're with you, I mean, or come.
Speaker 3 (25:16):
To count therapy and see like oh wait, oh wait, if.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
We just understand each other, Hey we just did that better. Yeah,
just like I had a different perspective, maybe it would
be maybe we wouldn't feel so hopeless. Yeah, no, I
love that. I absolutely love that.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
It's interesting to say, here you be like, you're a
kid of divorced. So then you went into your marriage
with a lot more or not a lot more, but
a lot of intention to ensure that this is you
can say intensity too, intensity and he still sign up.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
Okay, you've never met Sean. He's really intense. Was the
intense one. We're both intense, Okay, Okay.
Speaker 1 (25:57):
So yeah, see I'm the I'm the one that holds
intensity of Dylan, like, oh, calms it down.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
Yeah okay, Yeah, but that's nice. Okay, So you guys
both brought the energy to the marriage. Yea, yeah, full force.
Speaker 1 (26:09):
No, that's great, but it is such a reality, Like
fifty percent of people get divorced, over right, I think
we're over Probably half of those people are unhappily married,
I would assume.
Speaker 2 (26:20):
Yeah, I agree, there's a lot of unhappy people.
Speaker 1 (26:22):
Yeah, and so you you have like which is sad, right,
And I think it's not just a work of like
a couple, like you have to be invested in your
own self in order to be able to have a
joyful partnership of course, yea, so and so yeah, knowing
most people are unhappy in this lifetime probably suggests that
like maybe more than maybe about ten percent of people
(26:45):
are happily married.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
Oh, I don't know. I would actually love to know that.
Would that be cool? Like the survey or, I hope
it's higher the ten percent.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
I hope it is too, because then it's like, what
are we even doing in society?
Speaker 2 (26:56):
Like, yeah, I know, well, oh gosh.
Speaker 3 (26:59):
And this is it's a hard thing for like just
to even think about because I'm thinking about how you know,
as humans, we are just not meant to go through
life alone totally.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
There are some.
Speaker 3 (27:13):
People that do, but as a species, like we are
not meant for isolation. We're meant to be in community completely,
like the family.
Speaker 2 (27:26):
I'm a huge fan of the family and obviously family.
Speaker 3 (27:31):
Therapist, but like I just firmly believe like we are
like born into these systems, like because we are meant
to be in community, right, We're meant to have close
relationships and being community because life is really.
Speaker 2 (27:47):
Hard and we need people, like we need our significant other.
Speaker 3 (27:55):
But that you were telling something.
Speaker 2 (27:58):
You were saying something earlier and I was thinking about.
Speaker 3 (28:00):
This, like we also need support outside of our partner too, Yeah,
like our partner isn't meant to be like everything.
Speaker 1 (28:10):
Right, right, I'm not meant to be our psychologists, our
business coach are no right, our sexual partner are everything?
Yeah right, yes, no, it's it's truly. I think that's
an important delineation mm hmm yeah, probably for.
Speaker 2 (28:28):
Success, I think so, yeah.
Speaker 3 (28:31):
Yeah, I mean there's like so much I could say
because and it's hard because I can like say something,
but then people were like, but if I'm like, how
do I get community?
Speaker 2 (28:43):
Right? And that's a really hard question to answer.
Speaker 1 (28:47):
I think that has to do with what do you
feel like you have the deepest connections with?
Speaker 2 (28:51):
Yeah, a lot of that.
Speaker 1 (28:52):
It's so interesting to hear you say this about community
and like then to say that your family is your community,
because I actually never hearing you say that is a
huge eye opening thing for me to be to hear that.
I don't know why I don't think of my family
unit as a community, but you saying it and like
labeling that as a word of community, I'm like, oh,
you're so right, Like and actually that alone is just
(29:14):
like a really good shift for me to work on
finding more fulfillment within that. And like not that I
don't support my family unit, but like I could definitely
do a better job, and I think just like hearing
you say it that way is a really beautiful shift
for me, So thank you. Yeah. And then the other
thing I was gonna mention as far as your like
(29:37):
community goes, when they do studies, there is a study
and I can't remember the name of the study. I
have to look it up, but there's a study about
like total health and like the healthiest people at the
end of their lives, do you.
Speaker 2 (29:49):
Know, I don't.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
I can't remember the name of the study, but it
was like they're in their eighty they're older people, and
they looked at like their total value of health and
the people that had deep relationships, and it didn't mean
that they had hundreds.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
It just meant that, like if.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
They had a couple close relationships that provided that deep fulfillment,
they actually had their biometric markers, their health markers. They
were healthier people because of those relationships. And I think
that just speaks tremendously to that importance of community, and
like I think community as itself and it's that's why
(30:24):
I'm like, oh, yes, family is community is It's the energy, right,
Like you're like from an energetic standpoint, like you're one
source of energy, but when you have everybody's energy, that
just amplifies. Oh yeah, that's the chaos and the noise
in my house that like can be so triggering, but
like truly, like you know, like that is the amplification
(30:46):
of energy. And I do think that that's where it's
like you're right, Like the value of like keeping the
family together, the value of having that community is so important.
And probably if you're like asked seeing a mom that's
listening to this podcast and she's probably wondering, like, yeah,
my freaking marriage, isn't that happy or isn't that great?
Speaker 2 (31:08):
Of course there's good times and.
Speaker 1 (31:10):
Like we share certain moments and like we're doing this
for the kids, But like I think that there's a
lot of people that crew desire more from their current marriage,
and so I think to look at it from that perspective,
like just to hear you shift that and be like, Okay,
you're right, Like it is worth every single second to
(31:31):
make sure that we make our appointments at your office, yeah,
and just get in there, so you know, like there
is a reason to keep it all together. Yeah, I yes, definitely,
And I would just like there's kind.
Speaker 3 (31:44):
Of there's a couple of different things I want to
say about this, but it is worth it and not that,
like I said, not every marriage is meant to stay together.
And that's the reality of the situation, right, Like we're
just saying at the very wain, we're not, like you know,
we don't always make like perfect choices, and that's okay.
Speaker 2 (32:05):
And there are ways to like have really strong co
parenting relationships.
Speaker 3 (32:10):
That really like help your kids and all that, like
so so much, like there's still so much hope, right
even in that situation. But I yeah, it is worth it.
And I what I tell people like parents who are
coming to see me, not necessarily for parenting stuff, but
(32:32):
like for marriage stuffy. I almost always kids like if
they have children, if they want children, whatever. It always
kind of like comes up right, like because there're kids
are stressful.
Speaker 2 (32:48):
Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 3 (32:48):
I don't know, but I have younger siblings and a
lot of cousins and they're stressful.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
And but I always tell these people like you.
Speaker 3 (33:00):
Are the leaders of your family, like you are, and
this like the the more kind of work and dedication
you can put into your relationship, even if it is
literally just showing up here one hour a week, that's
better than zero hours a week, right, Like this is time, true,
(33:21):
you don't you're saying like you don't have alone time whatever. Okay,
you know what here you are, you do have time.
Speaker 2 (33:27):
You have one hour. We're gonna use that hour. You
are the leaders of your family. You can do this.
Speaker 3 (33:34):
Like the health of your relationship like needs to come
first so that you can be like the best parents
to your kids. And that might just sound so obvious
and like okay, yeah, Hillary, like you know whatever, that
sounds great, but what if this and what if that?
Speaker 2 (33:56):
Totally there are a lot of barriers.
Speaker 3 (33:57):
There's tons of barriers to getting in to.
Speaker 2 (34:02):
See a therapist. But the reality is is that like
if you want it, you're gonna do it.
Speaker 1 (34:07):
And liked the same thing with the fitness, right, like
if you want to be in shape, like you're gonna
go to the gym.
Speaker 2 (34:12):
You're gonna find a way to work out or exercise,
you know.
Speaker 1 (34:16):
I mean, yeah, I don't know if you do zoom sessions,
but like that's also an option, right yeah, And it's
like so you don't have to be in person, And
this is funny because now dyl and I like, I
think it started last year or two years ago. I
was like, we're going on a date every single week.
Speaker 2 (34:31):
Yeah, that is what we're doing.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
Like we're committing to like spending time together, and like
we'll have days this is so tm I, but like
we'll have days where we like fight all day and
we're like I don't want to spend time with you,
like we're not gonna go, and then like we go
and it's like this is all we needed to do.
Speaker 2 (34:47):
Yeah, Like but now you're making me want to shift
our date night to a counseling. Well, I don't know
if I recommend.
Speaker 3 (34:53):
That, like, Okay, we need to die another hour. When
I that, don't go, don't take things away, you know,
I like, what are we doing when I got a bar?
Speaker 2 (35:08):
Like we're gonna watch this game together? Yeah? Oh my gosh.
I mean that sounds like way more fun.
Speaker 3 (35:14):
Although I will say, like there's a lot of laughter
in my therapy office, so it's not all like scary
and sad and bad, like you can actually be like joyful.
Speaker 2 (35:28):
But I like what you were saying.
Speaker 3 (35:30):
It reminds me of like when there's that tension when
there's the fighting when there's one.
Speaker 2 (35:36):
Person's feeling like, you know, really whatever it is.
Speaker 3 (35:43):
So often it's like that's if you can reframe like
that type of behavior or those interactions as actually just
like need for connection.
Speaker 2 (35:56):
So often that's what is needed.
Speaker 3 (35:59):
Yeah, right, total, I mean, the negative cycle wants to
take you guys apart to like come in there and
be like no, like you guys, separate, disengage, disconnect when
the antidote is connection. And it's like so freaking hard
when you're mad, right, but I love that you guys
just still do it because that shows that, like, Okay,
(36:21):
we intuitively understand that we need this, and it's maybe
part of why we're fighting is that actually we do
need to feel connected really and that is that's hard
to do. But and it's just like that counterintuitive thing,
one of those counterintuitive things like oh you know, I
(36:43):
mean it's like kids who are.
Speaker 2 (36:46):
Acting out and you know, as a parent.
Speaker 3 (36:50):
Right, you know, like the acting out is like I
actually need more from my parents, Like I need something
from that I'm not getting that only my parent can
give me. Yeah, And it's like why do you why
do you get you just say that to me.
Speaker 2 (37:08):
They are saying that too, right, just from a behavioral standpoint, Yeah,
no different.
Speaker 1 (37:12):
Yeah, it's such good insight. I love what you're dropping
with us. Thank Yeah, of course it feels really good.
And it's interesting like to like go back to that
date night and like like it that is so it's
so clear, like to hear you put different words on
it obviously takes me out of my perspective. And of
course I'm always glad we end up going. And it
(37:33):
kind of is funny how it does diffuse every stupid
thing about like unloading the dishwasher or the dirty yeah whatever.
Speaker 2 (37:39):
Yeah, like it was never about that in the first place.
Speaker 1 (37:42):
And and so it is fascinating to hear you say
like just into like obviously lean into.
Speaker 2 (37:48):
What is needed. But I you know, when you hear.
Speaker 1 (37:52):
People say, like you have to do day nights with
your partners, Oh, you have to connect, you know. But
I think as a parent and as a mom, it's
so hard. And like in the beginning when we had
two kids, and we would give my mom to babysit
and we'd get my dad to babysit sometimes, and it
just always felt like we didn't want to burden them
unless we've really had something good to do. Yeah, But
(38:14):
then I had a mentor once and this is when
we started tell him. Like he was like, we go
on date nights at least once a lot of times,
two or three times a week.
Speaker 2 (38:21):
Like they hold their kids and go do this, and.
Speaker 1 (38:24):
It's not always sexy, like a lot of times it's
like they're scheduling their kids ever, you know whatever.
Speaker 2 (38:29):
Yeah, And I was like, Okay, if he's going.
Speaker 1 (38:31):
To do that, like I can do one night a week,
like and like you I would would we budget for it,
like it is in the budget now and it is
part of the system and.
Speaker 2 (38:40):
That's happening regardless.
Speaker 1 (38:42):
And I will say though, like until I saw someone
doing that, it's hard to validate and hard to be
like is that worth it?
Speaker 2 (38:50):
Is?
Speaker 1 (38:50):
I have sacrifice I want to make, But like the
reality is probably the one thing that is always probably
kept us together, right, Yeah, I mean maybe we would
have been, but I don't know. I think it is
a huge aspect of the importance of like re engaging
because when you have three kids, you're not talking at
home at night, like there's sports going on, Like there's
(39:10):
hockey for one kid, soccer and basketball, for the other
and then the other one's a floating kid right now
because she's only three.
Speaker 2 (39:15):
But like you know, it's like the dynamic.
Speaker 1 (39:17):
Of like shifting everybody where they need to go with
even our household helper. Like it's hard, right, Yeah, there's
not conversation happening between you.
Speaker 2 (39:25):
No, you're logistics only, right. Logistics is the name of
the game.
Speaker 1 (39:30):
And so that's interesting, Like it's just interesting to hear
you like validate, validate, are tying making that And I
do think though that like we're probably overdue for some
family marriage counseling maybe, yeah, so maybe just the conversations
that you don't want to have at the bar, maybe, yeah.
Speaker 3 (39:50):
I mean right, there are probably always like deeper things
that can be kind of talked about. And I'm I mean,
I definitely have people.
Speaker 2 (40:02):
Who see me who are like, we're not we're not bad.
Speaker 3 (40:07):
It's just that like things are kind of creeping in
and we just don't want it.
Speaker 2 (40:12):
I love that we just don't want that because we're trying.
Speaker 3 (40:15):
To start having kids or whatever else, Like we know
life is going to get crazy and so we want
to figure that out, figure these things out now, which is.
Speaker 2 (40:27):
Beautiful, Like I am.
Speaker 3 (40:29):
I'm always just like so blown away by how intentional
people are about their relationships.
Speaker 2 (40:38):
There is there are like two things I want to
say about this.
Speaker 3 (40:40):
There's a statistic that I think it's like people weighed
an average of seven years to go to counseling, Like
from the time where they have an inkling that something
is wrong and probably needs outside help, it takes like
an average of seven years like before they actually seek help.
Speaker 2 (41:02):
Wow, think about that, Like.
Speaker 3 (41:07):
It's super normal to put it off and to feel like,
maybe we don't need this if you have so much
else going on, maybe we're not bad enough to go
to therapy.
Speaker 2 (41:18):
I only there's ever like bad enough, Like you know,
so there's that, But then I always here's another one.
Speaker 3 (41:28):
It's like, Okay, so therapists costs. Couples therapy in the
Seattle area can be really really expensive. But I mean
you can find a therapist for one hundred and fifty
dollars a session.
Speaker 2 (41:44):
One hundred fifty dollars per week for like a year.
Speaker 3 (41:49):
I think'd be horrible at math, but think about how.
Speaker 2 (41:54):
Much money you know before lawyer costs. That's exactly what
I was going to say, Or even if you're not
doing even if you don't involve like a lawyer.
Speaker 3 (42:05):
But it's still like costly and expensive to break up
a family, so expensive, right, So anyways, that's not too
guilt or shame anyone. It's just like you're comment about
the value with the value of a date night. Yeah,
it actually is incredibly valuable over time, right, Yeah, so
(42:26):
we're probably.
Speaker 2 (42:26):
Saving money with the date. You're saving by saving money. Donebody,
It's it's basically.
Speaker 3 (42:32):
The cost per wear. I'm like, yeah, yeah, I can
buy these seven hundred dollars shoes because I'm gonna wear
them so many times, and yeah, I'm saving money by
these shoes.
Speaker 2 (42:40):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I could say.
Speaker 1 (42:43):
No, same thing with therapy. I mean I think that
way about PELBT florid therapy. I'm like, oh, yeah, I
don't want to you. This is gonna save you the
cost of a C section overnight from the hospital. And
then let's talk about when you're fifty and you need
that hip replacement and seventy when you're in the diapers
and how much that costs, right, I mean I could
go on, and prevention is the name of the game.
Speaker 2 (43:03):
And it sounds like you're saying the same exact thing, yeah, standpoint. Yeah, yeah, No,
that's great. Is there any other things that you want
to leave us with?
Speaker 7 (43:12):
No, I think I kind of said all my things.
I love it, and I wanted to say I love
where you took this, I love what you brought to
the show. And I feel like people are going to
really there is such a good Listen.
Speaker 2 (43:23):
This is so important because you can be at any point.
Speaker 1 (43:27):
I feel like in your relationship, like there's highs and
lows right Like I mean, of course most people are
just happy, go lucky all the time.
Speaker 2 (43:34):
But the high that most.
Speaker 8 (43:36):
People, the highs and the lows are so for real
and I feel like they are especially when you've been
married and you have kids for over you know, multiple years,
maybe your partners a long time before that.
Speaker 1 (43:46):
Yeah, And so I think like like anyone can really
find value and a lot of the perspectives that you
share with us.
Speaker 2 (43:54):
So thank you so much. Tell us a little bit
about your practice and where we can find you. How
can we book you? Yes, So I am l M
F T A here and Edmunds.
Speaker 3 (44:08):
My practice is called Renewed Hope Family Therapy, and you
can go to my website Renewed Hope Family Therapy dot
com and it has all the information there about me,
my training, how much sessions cost, who I treat like.
I definitely work with a lot of couples. I also
(44:31):
see families. I also see teens and tweens.
Speaker 1 (44:35):
Yeah all right, and you're accepting new patients.
Speaker 2 (44:38):
Oh yeah, okay, I act, Yeah I am. Okay, we'll
put the we'll put your.
Speaker 1 (44:42):
Website in the show notes and maybe if you have
like social media hashtags and.
Speaker 3 (44:46):
Yeah, I don't have social media, we'll put your We'll
put your who my website is, We'll put.
Speaker 2 (44:52):
Your website and running love that for you. Okay, Well,
thank you so much for being here. Fun episode. Yeah,
thank you so much.
Welcome to another episode of the Edmunds Mom's Room podcast. Today,
I am joined here with an expert in humans. Oh
oh yeah, human psychology, really counseling. We're going to talk
a little bit about counseling human relationships, maybe dive into
a little bit of marriage and fun things. So thanks
(00:22):
for being yeah, yeah, thanks. Tell us a little bit
about yourself and then we'll dive right in.
Speaker 2 (00:27):
Yeah. So my name is Hillary.
Speaker 3 (00:30):
I am a licensed marriage and family therapy associate in
the state of Washington, and I.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
Live here in Edmunds. I love it here, and I'm just.
Speaker 3 (00:43):
Trying to be a business person and help people and
keep my family together and everything.
Speaker 2 (00:52):
So that's kind of what I'm doing right now. I
love that. Yeah. So we had a really cool conversation.
I think this was like two or three months ago.
Speaker 1 (01:01):
Yeah, and I was telling you about this book I
was reading about marriage and families, and I was like,
it really helped me change my perspective. And you said
one thing that I like. I was like, genius, it
was so amazing. You're like, oh, the key to successful
marriage is the ability to change your perspective.
Speaker 2 (01:20):
And I was like, oh, that's all I had to do.
Speaker 1 (01:24):
But no, really, it was like I think that was
such a golden ticket. And I was like, we have
to get you on a podcast, like, let's talk about relationships.
I know you do like a lot of pre mariital counseling.
Speaker 2 (01:34):
Yeah, well so I do some premarital.
Speaker 3 (01:36):
I have a lot of different kind of like things
that I've been trained in. Yeah, but actually right now
I'm doing a lot of marriage counseling.
Speaker 2 (01:44):
Love it tis a season.
Speaker 1 (01:47):
Yeah, so let's talk about keeping these marriages together?
Speaker 2 (01:51):
Is that the goal? Oh yeah, I mean that's a
big question. I know I have to say this too. Yeah,
I was.
Speaker 1 (01:59):
I just to finish the book The Value of Others.
I think I told you I was reading. Yeah, and
he it's by oriyan Tera ron Terra Britt. Okay, so
he's a man and it's kind of like it's a
little an unpopular opinion, and I feel like the book
was not written for women.
Speaker 2 (02:18):
Yeah, I remember telling me that, but it was so
good because it just gave me a different perspective.
Speaker 1 (02:24):
And he at the end of the book, he's like,
you get married and all of a sudden, you expect
your partner to be your soulmate. Your co parent, your
counselor your like your sexual partner, and like they have
all these roles that they're supposed to fill, but yet
like we were never meant to have all those Like
(02:45):
not one person can be excellent at all those things
or have all those jobs. So it's like that is
such an interesting facet to like look at marriage from
that lens. I don't even know where I'm going with this,
but I was like, that was just it was funny
to hear that yesterday and then to know that we're
coming on here today to talk all about relationships. Yeah,
and yeah, so tell us a little bit about I mean, yeah,
(03:08):
what people are coming for as far as like, oh,
counseling goes and.
Speaker 3 (03:12):
Yeah, I mean people that I see in my practice
are coming for like I mean, I think they come
to me because of the type of therapy that I
do is kind of geared toward like identifying negative patterns,
like what you do when you're just feeling like stuck
(03:32):
in conflict or just like a cycle of just feeling
like really disconnected, and that can be for a ton
of different reasons, and I think that's, yeah, that's mainly
what people are coming to me. For it's pretty broad.
I see a lot of different things happening. I think,
(03:53):
I don't know if this is everybody, but it's true
that when there's like a life cycle change, so like
if you're going through a transition in your family, like
adding children to your family, your kids are transitioning from
like little kids to teenagers, or even like teens to
(04:15):
out of the house, like any of those like family
life cycle transitions.
Speaker 2 (04:21):
That's just those are stressors.
Speaker 3 (04:23):
And I think people don't necessarily say, oh, we're going
through a transition, that's why we're feeling stuffy, so we
need to go to therapy. It's like I keep having
the same fight with my partner over and over again,
and we can never get out of it, Like we
never resolve this fight, and maybe it feels like one
(04:45):
person doesn't even care about resolving it and the other
person's like, I.
Speaker 2 (04:48):
Must resolve this thing.
Speaker 3 (04:50):
Like just even different approaches to like what do we
do about conflict?
Speaker 2 (04:53):
Yeah, And I think that's.
Speaker 3 (04:55):
A lot of times when people come and then the
more we kind of like dig into what's going not
a lot of times it's like, oh, you guys are
actually going through a big life change, right, now, so no,
there's a lot of stress. So no, wonder everything is
heightened and it's harder to like move through conflict or
there is more conflict and that's overwhelming.
Speaker 1 (05:17):
Right, So is that I'm from? So you are a perspective.
Speaker 2 (05:21):
Changer I guess, or like you bring.
Speaker 1 (05:23):
Those you bring those transitions to life. Yeah, I mean,
like we talk about a lot of things. So the
type of therapy that I do is called emotionally focused therapy.
Speaker 3 (05:34):
Okay, I am getting training in it, so I'm not
like a certified EFT therapist, although.
Speaker 1 (05:43):
That seems like it could be a goal for me
because I really like the work that I do. Regardless
of your certification, this is what you.
Speaker 2 (05:50):
Use, Yeah, this is what I use.
Speaker 3 (05:52):
This is like what I'm being trained in and this therapy,
like there's a lot.
Speaker 2 (05:58):
Of different stages and all this stuff.
Speaker 3 (06:00):
Basically the number one like first goal is can we
just try to understand what's going on here? Like let's
just figure out what is this negative pattern, Like what happens,
what are the triggers, what's going on with each person,
what's happening in between you guys, Like what's kind of
the like the outcome of like an individual getting triggered
(06:22):
and like what happens kind of in the relationship.
Speaker 2 (06:26):
And part of that is actually, which this isn't for everybody,
but part of.
Speaker 3 (06:32):
The work is going back and seeing like, Okay, like
how were you raised, who what kind of models of
marriage or like relationships did you have? What other significant
relationships have you had before this one? Oh, like how
is all of that kind of like playing a role
in what's going on in each individual person. And the
(06:55):
idea is to kind of just like get perspective. Okay,
what is actually happening here, what's happening under the surface,
what's going on? Because what we see is like a reaction,
but what we want to know is like what is
the root cause Like that's I think what everyone kind
of is like, but why do I do this?
Speaker 2 (07:16):
Why do I do this? Why am I the way
that I am? Like why is my partner the way
that they are?
Speaker 4 (07:20):
I mean?
Speaker 2 (07:22):
And so yeah, there's just like.
Speaker 3 (07:24):
A lot of kind of revealing that happens, and through
that process we can kind of like take a deep
breath a lot of times and say, oh my gosh, Okay, actually.
Speaker 2 (07:37):
My partner is not maliciously doing this to me?
Speaker 3 (07:39):
It's because that's actually just like how they did things
in their family. You know, Oh my gosh, I'm not
super super needy. I just had a really bad relationship
experience in my twenties or whatever that now I have
like this underlying fear. It makes me like anxious that
(08:01):
my partner can't talk about something right.
Speaker 2 (08:04):
Away or whatever.
Speaker 3 (08:07):
So that's that's kind of like the perspective taking, perspective
shifting and also blame shifting, right. We always want to
like blame someone, blame something, and the idea is like.
Speaker 2 (08:20):
Shift the blame from yourself from your partner.
Speaker 3 (08:23):
Can we just shift it to like this cycle that
happens between you guys, Like that's really the thing to blame.
Speaker 2 (08:30):
Yeah, that's what we need to like fight.
Speaker 1 (08:33):
I mean, that sounds wonderful, and I feel like that
does diffuse the situation. But all I can think about
is my perfect marriage that I'm in total joke.
Speaker 5 (08:42):
I did one too, Yeah, what's your secret? It's it's
definitely really good, but.
Speaker 1 (08:52):
For real, like, how how do you and we all
have our bigage right from like our past and how
we show up and they say and how we get
triggered and and even if we can own it and
be like, yeah, it's how you know he loved his
mother so deeply. Just kidding, but really, you know, like
(09:12):
it's like those relationships. So it's like how so we
recognize it and there's obviously then so much onus and like.
Speaker 2 (09:21):
Having to shift that and like work through that.
Speaker 1 (09:24):
So do people come to you because I could just
see it being a brick wall in a lot of spouses, right, Like,
first off, I mean, if you get someone to sign
up for marriage counseling, it's usually probably one partner more.
Speaker 2 (09:35):
So than the other.
Speaker 3 (09:36):
Yeah, like in some cases, in some cases, I in
my experience, maybe one person's driving it okay, but the
other person is acknowledging that, yeah, this is like there's
an issue and I don't really know if this is
gonna like fix it.
Speaker 2 (09:53):
But I don't want that thing to happen in.
Speaker 3 (09:56):
My marriage anymore so, right because I think sometimes you're relationships,
there's usually like one person who's like the one that's
making things happen.
Speaker 2 (10:05):
Right, Like I've.
Speaker 3 (10:06):
Literally had couples come in, Oh, it was my idea,
but like my partner executed it, and I'm like, actually,
I don't know, that's just how things work in your marriage. Fine,
but yeah, so sometimes yeah, maybe.
Speaker 2 (10:20):
Somebody is like not wanting to be there. So but
most of the.
Speaker 1 (10:23):
Time, people they want the change, they want the solution,
right if they.
Speaker 2 (10:27):
Don't want to live in a life of chaos.
Speaker 1 (10:29):
And you know, we always want our relationships to be
better and more fulfilling of.
Speaker 2 (10:33):
Course, So how do you break down those barriers? Though?
Speaker 1 (10:37):
Like you get to those and if you have an example,
you can share it, but like, yeah, how I guess
my answer? My question is like people have to want
to change and to want to do the work when
they come to you. So is there a secret sauce
that you have to help show them that path or
is it.
Speaker 2 (10:55):
I'm not a fair I don't know if.
Speaker 3 (10:56):
It's like secret and I hate to be the therapist.
That's like, this is what my model says.
Speaker 2 (11:02):
Like this is like what's wing But but the way that.
Speaker 3 (11:06):
I work, it's like that's step one is de escalating,
figure out what's going on. Step two is how do
we actually change the pattern? What do we do differently?
And it can happen and that's what happens in therapy.
Speaker 2 (11:18):
Yeah, like bringing in what happened this week?
Speaker 3 (11:22):
Oh, you guys have been working through kind of like
a difficult situation. What's the conversation been like about that?
Speaker 2 (11:31):
Okay?
Speaker 3 (11:31):
You know, one partner usually like, well, this is what
I'm feeling, like this is happening for me, and then
we just.
Speaker 2 (11:38):
Work with it. In session, we just say like, okay,
can we.
Speaker 3 (11:42):
Slow this down, like if one if that partner starts
to get like starts to you know, get triggered or
like get like emotional in session Okay, wow, you're.
Speaker 2 (11:53):
Like getting emotional, Like what's happening right now?
Speaker 3 (11:55):
Can we just slow this way down so that we
can actually identify what is going on, what's the underlying emotion,
so we can help your partner see not just the reaction,
but the underlying emotion, Like what are you actually feeling
about this? What makes this so important to you that
you are getting like escalated just talking about it?
Speaker 2 (12:18):
Okay? Can we talk about that? Can we talk through that?
Can you share that with your partner?
Speaker 3 (12:25):
Partner, what do you think when they shared that, it's
really it can be like so awkward.
Speaker 2 (12:31):
Yeah, no, honest, honestly, I love that, but it's like
it's it's choreographed, right.
Speaker 1 (12:36):
Yeah, hm, and I feel like you need that because
in the home, when you're in the kitchen and you're
making dinner for the children and like that, like that
tends to be when my triggers.
Speaker 2 (12:46):
It's like you know, there's all triggers abound the kitchen. Yeah, and.
Speaker 1 (12:52):
So it's just fascinating like to be because you can't
have those conversations in the moment and so to really
pull out, yeah, and to achieve that level of like
in depth awareness, Yeah, yeah, that's interesting. And the idea
is that like the.
Speaker 2 (13:07):
More you have those.
Speaker 3 (13:11):
Kind of like specific, like dedicated conversations in therapy that
are de escalated, oh, you're actually understanding.
Speaker 2 (13:20):
Even more about your partner.
Speaker 3 (13:21):
You're going deeper into what's happening for them, what they need,
what you know, what they do to like protect themselves,
and things get kind of scary. Oh. The more understanding
you have, the idea is the more that that actually
translates to real life. Like in your example, maybe it's
just like yeah, the kitchen and making dinner is just
(13:44):
like not the time.
Speaker 2 (13:45):
Yeah, so like have.
Speaker 3 (13:46):
A conversation like that, Okay, great, we're just never going
to do that out of the kitchen again.
Speaker 2 (13:51):
And if we do and if something starts.
Speaker 3 (13:54):
Happening, we have so much awareness and so much practice
from therapy that somebody can be like, hey, wait, actually
just like no, we're not going to do this.
Speaker 2 (14:02):
Let's just stop this right now before it escalates.
Speaker 1 (14:06):
It's funny you say that because I always say I'm
not prime time right now.
Speaker 3 (14:09):
I don't primetime.
Speaker 2 (14:10):
I can't have that conversation.
Speaker 1 (14:12):
Yeah, like or you know if it's like yeah, I
fade real fast invite and that is not my optimal
like time to get into it with you about if
I'm going to be rational and like, yeah, bring my
best self to the conversation.
Speaker 2 (14:23):
Yeah. Yeah.
Speaker 1 (14:24):
It's an interesting phenomenon. And his prime time is the evening,
and so we don't connect on the like our prime times,
and so it's a hard you know shift of like
making sure we can have those high value conversations. I
guess m H need to happen more, of course. Yeah,
but yeah, it's interesting to hear you, yeah say that, Yeah,
removing that from that conversation.
Speaker 2 (14:46):
Yeah, right.
Speaker 3 (14:49):
And I also, like, I think a lot of people
want to come in and say, like give us tools,
like tell us how to have like not tell us
how to have these conversations that tell us when to
have these conversations make solution for us. And I always
just tell people, you know, if like that was really
your the thing, I see such intelligent people.
Speaker 2 (15:11):
Now you're intelligent.
Speaker 3 (15:13):
If that was what the issue was, you would have
already figured it out. You would have already figured out, like, oh,
all we need to do is have this at a
different time. It's not usually like the thing.
Speaker 6 (15:23):
And only when in my experience, like and this is
my personal experience too, like only when you're kind of
understanding what the dynamic is and that you just all
the different factors that go.
Speaker 3 (15:34):
Into the dynamic, can you say, Okay, we know that
this isn't good. Can we just like when do do
we just need to start putting something on the calendar
at another time to have this?
Speaker 2 (15:48):
Okay? Fine, But like that becomes a.
Speaker 3 (15:50):
Lot easier when you know, like really why you can't
engage in that other way, and like what the issues.
Speaker 2 (15:58):
Are with doing that? I don't know?
Speaker 6 (16:00):
Interesting, so schedule it, I mean essentially, I mean that's
what I would personally do, but like that's only because that.
Speaker 2 (16:07):
Is what works for my relationship. I'm not really the therapist.
Speaker 3 (16:12):
It's like everybody need telling people, yeah what to do? Yeah,
I mean I'm open to brainstorming, and a lot of
my clients want to brainstorm in session.
Speaker 2 (16:24):
Okay, great, that's like you guys problem solving. Yeah that's awesome.
Speaker 3 (16:27):
Yeah that's just not really how I work, but that's okay, Okay,
So this sounds so good.
Speaker 1 (16:35):
It sounds like we've just talked about like the perfect
marriage couple of counseling session. But like behind closed doors,
a lot of people don't like each other.
Speaker 2 (16:48):
They not don't like each other.
Speaker 1 (16:50):
Like of course, like you bond, you come in a
relationship because you have the same values, or you find
each other attractive, or you want to have children and
breed together. And then and maybe people lose the value
of the other person.
Speaker 2 (17:04):
When that is gone, or they just can't find happiness
with that.
Speaker 1 (17:09):
Like I guess what I'm trying to say here is
that sounds beautiful, But what about for the folks that
there is so much rage, There's so much hurt, there's
so much anger, there's so much I guess resentment.
Speaker 2 (17:25):
Would be the word.
Speaker 1 (17:27):
Yeah, where let's like what happens there? Same shit, yeah,
I mean kind of same, kind of same thing, you know.
Speaker 3 (17:36):
I mean I think like, okay, so this is not
this is from this is wisdom from others, right, who
are like training me and kind of what because I
have questions about that too, like what happens when oh man,
they're like this relationship is like actually the next step
is divorce?
Speaker 2 (17:57):
Can there be work?
Speaker 5 (17:59):
Right?
Speaker 2 (17:59):
And what real what's realistic to expect?
Speaker 3 (18:03):
And I would just what I've kind of gathered and
what I what makes sense to me is that like, hey,
for the negative patterns, they reinforce each other, right, it
just reinforces, reinforces. So the longer something has been going on, Yes,
the harder it is to break it down, to de escalate.
Speaker 2 (18:26):
It, to do something new.
Speaker 3 (18:27):
It's hard, and it's it takes time and not through
all sorts of circumstances.
Speaker 2 (18:36):
It's like not for.
Speaker 3 (18:37):
Everybody, right, I I mean I have my personal views
about marriage. Well, I mean, like I want to know, oh,
I mean, I think like marriage is a really important decision.
Speaker 2 (18:52):
Yea yeah, I like want to not be taken lightly.
Speaker 3 (18:55):
Absolutely, That's just my perspective based on my yeah yeah yeah.
Speaker 2 (19:02):
And then you know I was I kind of have
this thing where life.
Speaker 3 (19:06):
I met my husband, and then I decided eight months
later that I wanted to change my career in advertising
corporate advertising and having so much fun and like making
money and not like having to really work super super hard.
Speaker 2 (19:22):
Sorry, I love you guys.
Speaker 3 (19:24):
I worked hard, but like you know, it was like
fun and not so challenging for me at the time.
Speaker 4 (19:30):
Right, easy money, it was well, it was not like
so easy, but it was like, you know, it was yeah, anyways,
a good career and it was great.
Speaker 2 (19:41):
And then la, yeah totally. Yeah eight months later like.
Speaker 3 (19:46):
Hey, yeah, actually I want to go back to school
and become a marriage and family therapist. And we have
a funny story about that I won't share, but like
he was like okay, yeah totally. And then he's the
type of person that he doesn't when you tell him
this is my goal.
Speaker 2 (20:03):
He just like doesn't let you not do your goal. Oh,
like okay, you know what I mean. Yeah, I don't
know anything about that. It makes him a good coach.
Speaker 3 (20:13):
It makes him a good coach, right, really holds you accountable.
Speaker 2 (20:16):
So anyways, I don't really know where it was going.
Speaker 3 (20:18):
With this other than like, well, we want to know
as much of your story will share. Where was I, oh,
this is like the importance in marriage. So you know,
then we take this journey and then it you know,
I'm in school, We're about to get engaged, and I
and it was just there was a lot going on,
(20:38):
but I was like, I don't care anything else about
this wedding.
Speaker 2 (20:44):
We're going to premier atal counseling.
Speaker 3 (20:47):
Not because I think there's something really wrong with this relationship,
but we both are kids of divorce, and I know
the statistics right, and we have we've got stuff that
we are aware that we're talking about, but like we
need we got to have somebody in.
Speaker 2 (21:05):
Our like Arsenal right to help us. And I have
to say it was.
Speaker 3 (21:10):
The best money we spent as part of our wedding planning.
Speaker 2 (21:15):
And it was like a.
Speaker 3 (21:16):
Drop in the bucket in comparison to the other stuff.
Speaker 2 (21:20):
But it was the time, you know that we dedicated.
Speaker 3 (21:22):
And so I think, and this isn't to say that
like I have the best marriage of all time, but
that this is the perspective I'm coming with like somebody
who I'm like, I just really want this to be
good and I want this to work, and I want
the tools and I want like, you know, the arsenal,
(21:43):
Like I want this therapist in my back pocket so
when we do go through like a big life transition
and it rocks us, I want to be able to
go to somebody now.
Speaker 2 (21:54):
So that's my perspective on marriage. It is that like
it is.
Speaker 3 (21:59):
Work, but it's worth it, and I don't think it
should be It's not a decision that like should be
taken lightly my perspective, that's just like not everybody's reality though.
That's not how like a lot of marriage relationships had
come to be. Like my husband and I were a
little older when we got married, so that was not
like old, but you know, just like older than some
of our friends. We had other things going on anyways,
(22:22):
So I back to the question around like is it
kind of like is it ever too late? Yeah, I don't.
I don't think so, Yeah, that's not like I wouldn't.
I don't think I would be doing my job and
like you know, holding hope for my clients and I
(22:43):
didn't really believe that, like, yeah, like marriages can be saved,
but that's not necessary. But it takes two people, right right, Yeah,
And it takes a lot of like intention and a
lot of dedication, especially if things have been really hard
for a.
Speaker 2 (23:01):
Long time, because that takes time to it.
Speaker 3 (23:07):
Maybe not an equal amount of time, but it could
take years.
Speaker 2 (23:14):
And that's just not necessarily like.
Speaker 3 (23:18):
Everyone's not everyone has the ability to dedicate yours totally.
I will say, I think I told you about this,
But there is a type of counseling, like if you
are or somebody is in a real spot where you're
like I just need to know if this is this working, is.
Speaker 2 (23:39):
This gonna work or is it not gonna work?
Speaker 3 (23:42):
There is a type of couples counseling called discernment counseling.
There are discernment counselors in the areas. It's definitely a
certification you have to get because it's a really specific
structured like five sessions, really specific goals for each session
kind of thing. But that would be really good for
(24:05):
people who are like I don't I don't want to
spend or I don't have a bunch of years to
spend trying to figure out if this relationship is going
to work. Yeah, I want some clarity like soon. I
don't know a whole lot about it anyway, that's kind
of like all I really know about it. Other than Yeah,
(24:26):
it's a short term thing to help couples figure discern
like are we in this?
Speaker 1 (24:34):
And so once they go through discernment counseling, that's when
then it's like, Okay, if we're in this, we want
to say this.
Speaker 3 (24:39):
I think some people I think some people could do
it that way. Some people do it the opposite way though,
Like we've been in couples counseling for so long, I
see it's not we're getting stuck or whatever, and then
we transition to discernment counseling to really make sure like
are we.
Speaker 2 (24:57):
Going to end this?
Speaker 1 (24:58):
Yeah, no, that's great, that's a that's a very valuable
that's value.
Speaker 3 (25:01):
But I do think that if you're somebody who or
if you're in a you know, partnership that's like you
don't really know and you kind of just want to
check good, check in, that would actually probably be a
good place to start.
Speaker 2 (25:12):
Okay, we're with you, I mean, or come.
Speaker 3 (25:16):
To count therapy and see like oh wait, oh wait, if.
Speaker 2 (25:22):
We just understand each other, Hey we just did that better. Yeah,
just like I had a different perspective, maybe it would
be maybe we wouldn't feel so hopeless. Yeah, no, I
love that. I absolutely love that.
Speaker 1 (25:35):
It's interesting to say, here you be like, you're a
kid of divorced. So then you went into your marriage
with a lot more or not a lot more, but
a lot of intention to ensure that this is you
can say intensity too, intensity and he still sign up.
Speaker 2 (25:50):
Okay, you've never met Sean. He's really intense. Was the
intense one. We're both intense, Okay, Okay.
Speaker 1 (25:57):
So yeah, see I'm the I'm the one that holds
intensity of Dylan, like, oh, calms it down.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
Yeah okay, Yeah, but that's nice. Okay, So you guys
both brought the energy to the marriage. Yea, yeah, full force.
Speaker 1 (26:09):
No, that's great, but it is such a reality, Like
fifty percent of people get divorced, over right, I think
we're over Probably half of those people are unhappily married,
I would assume.
Speaker 2 (26:20):
Yeah, I agree, there's a lot of unhappy people.
Speaker 1 (26:22):
Yeah, and so you you have like which is sad, right,
And I think it's not just a work of like
a couple, like you have to be invested in your
own self in order to be able to have a
joyful partnership of course, yea, so and so yeah, knowing
most people are unhappy in this lifetime probably suggests that
like maybe more than maybe about ten percent of people
(26:45):
are happily married.
Speaker 2 (26:46):
Oh, I don't know. I would actually love to know that.
Would that be cool? Like the survey or, I hope
it's higher the ten percent.
Speaker 1 (26:53):
I hope it is too, because then it's like, what
are we even doing in society?
Speaker 2 (26:56):
Like, yeah, I know, well, oh gosh.
Speaker 3 (26:59):
And this is it's a hard thing for like just
to even think about because I'm thinking about how you know,
as humans, we are just not meant to go through
life alone totally.
Speaker 2 (27:13):
There are some.
Speaker 3 (27:13):
People that do, but as a species, like we are
not meant for isolation. We're meant to be in community completely,
like the family.
Speaker 2 (27:26):
I'm a huge fan of the family and obviously family.
Speaker 3 (27:31):
Therapist, but like I just firmly believe like we are
like born into these systems, like because we are meant
to be in community, right, We're meant to have close
relationships and being community because life is really.
Speaker 2 (27:47):
Hard and we need people, like we need our significant other.
Speaker 3 (27:55):
But that you were telling something.
Speaker 2 (27:58):
You were saying something earlier and I was thinking about.
Speaker 3 (28:00):
This, like we also need support outside of our partner too, Yeah,
like our partner isn't meant to be like everything.
Speaker 1 (28:10):
Right, right, I'm not meant to be our psychologists, our
business coach are no right, our sexual partner are everything?
Yeah right, yes, no, it's it's truly. I think that's
an important delineation mm hmm yeah, probably for.
Speaker 2 (28:28):
Success, I think so, yeah.
Speaker 3 (28:31):
Yeah, I mean there's like so much I could say
because and it's hard because I can like say something,
but then people were like, but if I'm like, how
do I get community?
Speaker 2 (28:43):
Right? And that's a really hard question to answer.
Speaker 1 (28:47):
I think that has to do with what do you
feel like you have the deepest connections with?
Speaker 2 (28:51):
Yeah, a lot of that.
Speaker 1 (28:52):
It's so interesting to hear you say this about community
and like then to say that your family is your community,
because I actually never hearing you say that is a
huge eye opening thing for me to be to hear that.
I don't know why I don't think of my family
unit as a community, but you saying it and like
labeling that as a word of community, I'm like, oh,
you're so right, Like and actually that alone is just
(29:14):
like a really good shift for me to work on
finding more fulfillment within that. And like not that I
don't support my family unit, but like I could definitely
do a better job, and I think just like hearing
you say it that way is a really beautiful shift
for me, So thank you. Yeah. And then the other
thing I was gonna mention as far as your like
(29:37):
community goes, when they do studies, there is a study
and I can't remember the name of the study. I
have to look it up, but there's a study about
like total health and like the healthiest people at the
end of their lives, do you.
Speaker 2 (29:49):
Know, I don't.
Speaker 1 (29:49):
I can't remember the name of the study, but it
was like they're in their eighty they're older people, and
they looked at like their total value of health and
the people that had deep relationships, and it didn't mean
that they had hundreds.
Speaker 2 (30:02):
It just meant that, like if.
Speaker 1 (30:03):
They had a couple close relationships that provided that deep fulfillment,
they actually had their biometric markers, their health markers. They
were healthier people because of those relationships. And I think
that just speaks tremendously to that importance of community, and
like I think community as itself and it's that's why
(30:24):
I'm like, oh, yes, family is community is It's the energy, right,
Like you're like from an energetic standpoint, like you're one
source of energy, but when you have everybody's energy, that
just amplifies. Oh yeah, that's the chaos and the noise
in my house that like can be so triggering, but
like truly, like you know, like that is the amplification
(30:46):
of energy. And I do think that that's where it's
like you're right, Like the value of like keeping the
family together, the value of having that community is so important.
And probably if you're like asked seeing a mom that's
listening to this podcast and she's probably wondering, like, yeah,
my freaking marriage, isn't that happy or isn't that great?
Speaker 2 (31:08):
Of course there's good times and.
Speaker 1 (31:10):
Like we share certain moments and like we're doing this
for the kids, But like I think that there's a
lot of people that crew desire more from their current marriage,
and so I think to look at it from that perspective,
like just to hear you shift that and be like, Okay,
you're right, Like it is worth every single second to
(31:31):
make sure that we make our appointments at your office, yeah,
and just get in there, so you know, like there
is a reason to keep it all together. Yeah, I yes, definitely,
And I would just like there's kind.
Speaker 3 (31:44):
Of there's a couple of different things I want to
say about this, but it is worth it and not that,
like I said, not every marriage is meant to stay together.
And that's the reality of the situation, right, Like we're
just saying at the very wain, we're not, like you know,
we don't always make like perfect choices, and that's okay.
Speaker 2 (32:05):
And there are ways to like have really strong co
parenting relationships.
Speaker 3 (32:10):
That really like help your kids and all that, like
so so much, like there's still so much hope, right
even in that situation. But I yeah, it is worth it.
And I what I tell people like parents who are
coming to see me, not necessarily for parenting stuff, but
(32:32):
like for marriage stuffy. I almost always kids like if
they have children, if they want children, whatever. It always
kind of like comes up right, like because there're kids
are stressful.
Speaker 2 (32:48):
Yeah, I don't know.
Speaker 3 (32:48):
I don't know, but I have younger siblings and a
lot of cousins and they're stressful.
Speaker 2 (32:56):
And but I always tell these people like you.
Speaker 3 (33:00):
Are the leaders of your family, like you are, and
this like the the more kind of work and dedication
you can put into your relationship, even if it is
literally just showing up here one hour a week, that's
better than zero hours a week, right, Like this is time, true,
(33:21):
you don't you're saying like you don't have alone time whatever. Okay,
you know what here you are, you do have time.
Speaker 2 (33:27):
You have one hour. We're gonna use that hour. You
are the leaders of your family. You can do this.
Speaker 3 (33:34):
Like the health of your relationship like needs to come
first so that you can be like the best parents
to your kids. And that might just sound so obvious
and like okay, yeah, Hillary, like you know whatever, that
sounds great, but what if this and what if that?
Speaker 2 (33:56):
Totally there are a lot of barriers.
Speaker 3 (33:57):
There's tons of barriers to getting in to.
Speaker 2 (34:02):
See a therapist. But the reality is is that like
if you want it, you're gonna do it.
Speaker 1 (34:07):
And liked the same thing with the fitness, right, like
if you want to be in shape, like you're gonna
go to the gym.
Speaker 2 (34:12):
You're gonna find a way to work out or exercise,
you know.
Speaker 1 (34:16):
I mean, yeah, I don't know if you do zoom sessions,
but like that's also an option, right yeah, And it's
like so you don't have to be in person, And
this is funny because now dyl and I like, I
think it started last year or two years ago. I
was like, we're going on a date every single week.
Speaker 2 (34:31):
Yeah, that is what we're doing.
Speaker 1 (34:32):
Like we're committing to like spending time together, and like
we'll have days this is so tm I, but like
we'll have days where we like fight all day and
we're like I don't want to spend time with you,
like we're not gonna go, and then like we go
and it's like this is all we needed to do.
Speaker 2 (34:47):
Yeah, Like but now you're making me want to shift
our date night to a counseling. Well, I don't know
if I recommend.
Speaker 3 (34:53):
That, like, Okay, we need to die another hour. When
I that, don't go, don't take things away, you know,
I like, what are we doing when I got a bar?
Speaker 2 (35:08):
Like we're gonna watch this game together? Yeah? Oh my gosh.
I mean that sounds like way more fun.
Speaker 3 (35:14):
Although I will say, like there's a lot of laughter
in my therapy office, so it's not all like scary
and sad and bad, like you can actually be like joyful.
Speaker 2 (35:28):
But I like what you were saying.
Speaker 3 (35:30):
It reminds me of like when there's that tension when
there's the fighting when there's one.
Speaker 2 (35:36):
Person's feeling like, you know, really whatever it is.
Speaker 3 (35:43):
So often it's like that's if you can reframe like
that type of behavior or those interactions as actually just
like need for connection.
Speaker 2 (35:56):
So often that's what is needed.
Speaker 3 (35:59):
Yeah, right, total, I mean, the negative cycle wants to
take you guys apart to like come in there and
be like no, like you guys, separate, disengage, disconnect when
the antidote is connection. And it's like so freaking hard
when you're mad, right, but I love that you guys
just still do it because that shows that, like, Okay,
(36:21):
we intuitively understand that we need this, and it's maybe
part of why we're fighting is that actually we do
need to feel connected really and that is that's hard
to do. But and it's just like that counterintuitive thing,
one of those counterintuitive things like oh you know, I
(36:43):
mean it's like kids who are.
Speaker 2 (36:46):
Acting out and you know, as a parent.
Speaker 3 (36:50):
Right, you know, like the acting out is like I
actually need more from my parents, Like I need something
from that I'm not getting that only my parent can
give me. Yeah, And it's like why do you why
do you get you just say that to me.
Speaker 2 (37:08):
They are saying that too, right, just from a behavioral standpoint, Yeah,
no different.
Speaker 1 (37:12):
Yeah, it's such good insight. I love what you're dropping
with us. Thank Yeah, of course it feels really good.
And it's interesting like to like go back to that
date night and like like it that is so it's
so clear, like to hear you put different words on
it obviously takes me out of my perspective. And of
course I'm always glad we end up going. And it
(37:33):
kind of is funny how it does diffuse every stupid
thing about like unloading the dishwasher or the dirty yeah whatever.
Speaker 2 (37:39):
Yeah, like it was never about that in the first place.
Speaker 1 (37:42):
And and so it is fascinating to hear you say
like just into like obviously lean into.
Speaker 2 (37:48):
What is needed. But I you know, when you hear.
Speaker 1 (37:52):
People say, like you have to do day nights with
your partners, Oh, you have to connect, you know. But
I think as a parent and as a mom, it's
so hard. And like in the beginning when we had
two kids, and we would give my mom to babysit
and we'd get my dad to babysit sometimes, and it
just always felt like we didn't want to burden them
unless we've really had something good to do. Yeah, But
(38:14):
then I had a mentor once and this is when
we started tell him. Like he was like, we go
on date nights at least once a lot of times,
two or three times a week.
Speaker 2 (38:21):
Like they hold their kids and go do this, and.
Speaker 1 (38:24):
It's not always sexy, like a lot of times it's
like they're scheduling their kids ever, you know whatever.
Speaker 2 (38:29):
Yeah, And I was like, Okay, if he's going.
Speaker 1 (38:31):
To do that, like I can do one night a week,
like and like you I would would we budget for it,
like it is in the budget now and it is
part of the system and.
Speaker 2 (38:40):
That's happening regardless.
Speaker 1 (38:42):
And I will say though, like until I saw someone
doing that, it's hard to validate and hard to be
like is that worth it?
Speaker 2 (38:50):
Is?
Speaker 1 (38:50):
I have sacrifice I want to make, But like the
reality is probably the one thing that is always probably
kept us together, right, Yeah, I mean maybe we would
have been, but I don't know. I think it is
a huge aspect of the importance of like re engaging
because when you have three kids, you're not talking at
home at night, like there's sports going on, Like there's
(39:10):
hockey for one kid, soccer and basketball, for the other
and then the other one's a floating kid right now
because she's only three.
Speaker 2 (39:15):
But like you know, it's like the dynamic.
Speaker 1 (39:17):
Of like shifting everybody where they need to go with
even our household helper. Like it's hard, right, Yeah, there's
not conversation happening between you.
Speaker 2 (39:25):
No, you're logistics only, right. Logistics is the name of
the game.
Speaker 1 (39:30):
And so that's interesting, Like it's just interesting to hear
you like validate, validate, are tying making that And I
do think though that like we're probably overdue for some
family marriage counseling maybe, yeah, so maybe just the conversations
that you don't want to have at the bar, maybe, yeah.
Speaker 3 (39:50):
I mean right, there are probably always like deeper things
that can be kind of talked about. And I'm I mean,
I definitely have people.
Speaker 2 (40:02):
Who see me who are like, we're not we're not bad.
Speaker 3 (40:07):
It's just that like things are kind of creeping in
and we just don't want it.
Speaker 2 (40:12):
I love that we just don't want that because we're trying.
Speaker 3 (40:15):
To start having kids or whatever else, Like we know
life is going to get crazy and so we want
to figure that out, figure these things out now, which is.
Speaker 2 (40:27):
Beautiful, Like I am.
Speaker 3 (40:29):
I'm always just like so blown away by how intentional
people are about their relationships.
Speaker 2 (40:38):
There is there are like two things I want to
say about this.
Speaker 3 (40:40):
There's a statistic that I think it's like people weighed
an average of seven years to go to counseling, Like
from the time where they have an inkling that something
is wrong and probably needs outside help, it takes like
an average of seven years like before they actually seek help.
Speaker 2 (41:02):
Wow, think about that, Like.
Speaker 3 (41:07):
It's super normal to put it off and to feel like,
maybe we don't need this if you have so much
else going on, maybe we're not bad enough to go
to therapy.
Speaker 2 (41:18):
I only there's ever like bad enough, Like you know,
so there's that, But then I always here's another one.
Speaker 3 (41:28):
It's like, Okay, so therapists costs. Couples therapy in the
Seattle area can be really really expensive. But I mean
you can find a therapist for one hundred and fifty
dollars a session.
Speaker 2 (41:44):
One hundred fifty dollars per week for like a year.
Speaker 3 (41:49):
I think'd be horrible at math, but think about how.
Speaker 2 (41:54):
Much money you know before lawyer costs. That's exactly what
I was going to say, Or even if you're not
doing even if you don't involve like a lawyer.
Speaker 3 (42:05):
But it's still like costly and expensive to break up
a family, so expensive, right, So anyways, that's not too
guilt or shame anyone. It's just like you're comment about
the value with the value of a date night. Yeah,
it actually is incredibly valuable over time, right, Yeah, so
(42:26):
we're probably.
Speaker 2 (42:26):
Saving money with the date. You're saving by saving money. Donebody,
It's it's basically.
Speaker 3 (42:32):
The cost per wear. I'm like, yeah, yeah, I can
buy these seven hundred dollars shoes because I'm gonna wear
them so many times, and yeah, I'm saving money by
these shoes.
Speaker 2 (42:40):
Yeah, yeah, yeah. I could say.
Speaker 1 (42:43):
No, same thing with therapy. I mean I think that
way about PELBT florid therapy. I'm like, oh, yeah, I
don't want to you. This is gonna save you the
cost of a C section overnight from the hospital. And
then let's talk about when you're fifty and you need
that hip replacement and seventy when you're in the diapers
and how much that costs, right, I mean I could
go on, and prevention is the name of the game.
Speaker 2 (43:03):
And it sounds like you're saying the same exact thing, yeah, standpoint. Yeah, yeah, No,
that's great. Is there any other things that you want
to leave us with?
Speaker 7 (43:12):
No, I think I kind of said all my things.
I love it, and I wanted to say I love
where you took this, I love what you brought to
the show. And I feel like people are going to
really there is such a good Listen.
Speaker 2 (43:23):
This is so important because you can be at any point.
Speaker 1 (43:27):
I feel like in your relationship, like there's highs and
lows right Like I mean, of course most people are
just happy, go lucky all the time.
Speaker 2 (43:34):
But the high that most.
Speaker 8 (43:36):
People, the highs and the lows are so for real
and I feel like they are especially when you've been
married and you have kids for over you know, multiple years,
maybe your partners a long time before that.
Speaker 1 (43:46):
Yeah, And so I think like like anyone can really
find value and a lot of the perspectives that you
share with us.
Speaker 2 (43:54):
So thank you so much. Tell us a little bit
about your practice and where we can find you. How
can we book you? Yes, So I am l M
F T A here and Edmunds.
Speaker 3 (44:08):
My practice is called Renewed Hope Family Therapy, and you
can go to my website Renewed Hope Family Therapy dot
com and it has all the information there about me,
my training, how much sessions cost, who I treat like.
I definitely work with a lot of couples. I also
(44:31):
see families. I also see teens and tweens.
Speaker 1 (44:35):
Yeah all right, and you're accepting new patients.
Speaker 2 (44:38):
Oh yeah, okay, I act, Yeah I am. Okay, we'll
put the we'll put your.
Speaker 1 (44:42):
Website in the show notes and maybe if you have
like social media hashtags and.
Speaker 3 (44:46):
Yeah, I don't have social media, we'll put your We'll
put your who my website is, We'll put.
Speaker 2 (44:52):
Your website and running love that for you. Okay, Well,
thank you so much for being here. Fun episode. Yeah,
thank you so much.
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