September 24, 2025 • 42 mins
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Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:05):
Welcome to Beyond Sunday the King of Kings podcast
, where we dive a little bitdeeper into our sermon series
and see what we are takingbeyond Sunday.
My name is Deena Newsom and I'mexcited to have some great
guests One I haven't seen for awhile and one brand new guest
today.
Go ahead and introduceyourselves, guys.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Well, I think I'm the one you haven't seen in a
little while.
I'm Zach Zender, a pastor hereat King of Kings, and get to
help with the multi-site side ofour ministry, which is super
fun.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
And I am Marianne.
I am the new kids ministrydirector here at King of Kings.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
Do we have sound effects?
Can we do like an applausesound effect?
Speaker 1 (00:41):
I don't know what's connected to what.
So I'm scared the students usethe same setup for their podcast
.
I'm not sure what will happenif I hit some buttons.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
Some of those sounds might not be pleasant.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
All right.
So, in light of part of whatZach talked about in his message
has inspired my openingquestion to you.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Wait what I talked about, or Seth I?
Speaker 1 (01:03):
mean Seth sorry.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
I was like wait, did I preach?
I'm looking right at you andyeah, you didn't remember that
it's so foggy Part of what Sethtalked about.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
he kind of quoted some stats from a Swedish survey
at the start of his message.
And in doing so he impersonatedthe Swedish chef from the
Muppets.
I don't want to repeat theimpersonation because I just
couldn't do it justice.
Watch it if you haven't yet.
But in light of that, I wantedto ask what's your favorite
Muppet?
(01:33):
Did you watch the Muppets whenyou were younger, and who is
your favorite Muppet?
Speaker 3 (01:39):
I did not watch the Muppets, but I do remember a
song where they come out andit's like that's all I remember
from the Muppets.
That's a great song.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Yeah, I am not a Muppet guy, believe it or not.
So was Kermit.
Was Kermit the frog a Muppet?
Okay, then I'm going to go,kermit, give me Pig and.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
Piggy and Ralph the dog, okay, and the two old guys
in the balcony and the eagle,the Swedish chef Beaker.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
It sounds like you're a Muppet.
Why don't you take all of ourfavorites and you just tell us
your three favorites?
Speaker 3 (02:16):
We're going to have to do a Muppet 101 with Dina.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
They were classic movies of my time, yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Yeah, kermit's got to be the.
Is he the most famous, or doyou think Piggy?
Speaker 1 (02:26):
I would think Kermit.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
I think Kermit has done a little bit more.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
Changed the world.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
His repertoire is a little larger.
Speaker 2 (02:33):
Yeah, nice.
Speaker 1 (02:34):
I really liked.
My favorite Muppet was Animal,who was the crazy drummer for
the band that was on there.
And I can't remember what theband was, except the singer was
like Hot Lips McGee or somethingI don't even remember.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
But all he would say was animal, animal, wasn't he
the like pink one, fuzzy one, hehad like a black collar on?
Yes, I remember that one and myolder brother had an animal
puppet and he would just tortureme with walking around
following me with that.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
But I loved him because Animal was very
passionate about whatever he wasdoing, which mostly was
drumming, but then he'd just getreally into it and that was
exciting to me.
That he was just really excitedabout what he was doing Was it
Jim Henson.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
Right, yeah, so I never was a Muppet guy, but the
cool part of the origin storythat I do remember was like
Kermit the Frog was the firstthat he created and it was like
out of a piece of like fabricthat was basically trash.
He came up with this Kermit theFrog with like just some,
(03:39):
really some, rubbish and put ittogether and like to think of
what came out of that franchise.
Through.
That is a pretty, pretty coolthing, like what, what's, you
know, what do we have that mightbe easily disposable, that in
the hands of the right personthe architect, the visionary,
the designer like what thingsmight be, and so that's
(04:01):
inspiring to me.
I think that's pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
This is a whole sermon series.
Yeah, probably I'll have toremember that's pretty cool.
This is a whole sermon series.
Yeah, probably.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
I'll have to remember that for next year.
Yeah, we'll have to have Sethprobably lead it, since it seems
like he's maybe got a littlemore wisdom.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
I did like the Swedish chef.
It was very funny.
I do also know that the Muppetstried to get famous when
Saturday Night Live was startingOn the very first episode of
Saturday Night Live.
Live was starting on the veryfirst episode of Saturday Night
Live, I don't remember if theymade the cut or maybe they
didn't make the cut but like Jimand Kermit and like was
supposed to be on that beforethey realized that those two
(04:33):
genres did not really mix Liketheir target audiences ended up
being different A little bitdifferent yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
Nice.
Speaker 1 (04:40):
All right.
So that's kind of a sidetrack,but we're going to interrupt
that with our switch to Pardonthis Interruption.
We're in week three of thismessage series and Pastor Seth
Flick is kind of taking usthrough the book of Mark, where
there's an interesting setupwhere Jesus has, like an inner
story interrupted or an outerstory interrupted by an inner
(05:01):
story, and then both stories getrevolved, interrupted by an
inner story, and then bothstories get revolved.
And so we're in week three ofthis.
And what are you guys takingbeyond Sunday from this week's
message?
Speaker 3 (05:12):
I'm going to start on that one.
I guess For me it's thereflection of what fears are
holding me back.
What am I not trusting Him with?
I like to consider myself as abrave person and that I'm
willing to try pretty muchanything, but when you really
break down into it, there's along list of things that I'm too
(05:34):
scared to even try or toconsider, and so I think that
this weekend's messagedefinitely spoke to me, because
fear is almost one of the thingsthat stopped me from taking
this role at King of Kings.
So when you break down the fearof like, how far are you
willing to push against thatfear?
It speaks volumes as to whereit'll take you.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
Awesome.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
Yeah, that are teenagers and just kind of a
love for the next generation anda belief in the next generation
as well, or strong belief thatyou know some of the stuff that
Seth talked about of how youknow they're considered the
anxious generation, they'renervous, they're mentally unwell
(06:17):
, you know all these things thatwe've heard, you know and we've
seen it.
And to know that, like previousgenerations play in, like we
can't just look at them and saythey're that way because they're
that way.
They're in many respects thatway because of how we've acted
and what we've modeled and and.
So I really appreciated justhis uh insight in this message
(06:41):
of how, when we live with fearor when we live with anxiety,
like that gets pressed down, umand so.
That that's the negative side,but the positive side, the
opportunity side, which would beon Sunday side for me is I get
to be a person who doesn't haveto live by those things and I
can and it's been modeled for meas well I can actually be a
(07:02):
positive voice to the nextgeneration, to my boys, to the
teenagers, to the youth, speaklife into them and hopefully we
can reverse what we're seeingand and and so that that real
sense of empowerment, of like,yeah, the things that I do, the
things that I say, the nextgeneration, my boys, like they,
they listen, they learn from it,their model, like, and so let's
(07:24):
, let's be a positive examplefor those things, as opposed to
the opposite.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
Yeah, I really like the phrasing that Seth Houston
used it too we're pressed down.
We're pressed down into thatgeneration, just the imagery
that gives of suppressing thatwhen we want to raise up the
next generation.
That's a really good point.
Yeah, what really spoke to mewas when he referred to things
as a big old bag of fear you putdown your big old bag of fear
(07:49):
and I just thought oh yeah, I'mcarrying that right now and
maybe I'll put down a few piecesof it this day and pick up a
few pieces another day, but Idon't always put down the whole
bag of fear and that was my bigold bag of fear.
Speaker 3 (08:04):
When he mentioned that like the visual of like me
hugging this bag of fear andlike crunched up in a ball is
all I could imagine.
Speaker 1 (08:10):
Yeah, that's what really got me too.
And the other thing that Ireally liked was when he said
you can't move forward in afetal position, and he literally
like squatted down in the fetalposition.
I was like you're not goingreally fast when he's trying to
move forward, and that waspowerful for me.
Oh yeah, it seems comfortingsometimes to be in that position
(08:33):
, but we aren't going forward,we're just standing still Okay.
So one of the questions Sethopened with was how have you
allowed fear to interrupt yourlife?
Would either one of you care tospeak to that on your own life?
How has fear interrupted yourlife?
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Yeah, I think fear.
So I tend to like, on thespiritual gift test, faith is
one of the top for me, and so Itend to think that I don't
struggle with fear as much, um,and I tend to operate more on
faith, and but that's also not ahundred percent true.
There's times when fear hasgotten the best of me.
(09:15):
And so for me, though I thinkthe the challenge is to know
like I'm.
I can be a pretty, and it'sgood or bad like a pretty good,
like big risk taker, and youknow, is that just being a risk
taker, is that operating byfaith?
And I'm not always sure.
Is it a risk?
Is it faith, is it God?
Is it my own selfish?
So, for me, I'm trying tofigure out less of like you know
(09:40):
, I'm trying to figure out likeis the things God is calling me
towards?
Is that God actually calling metowards that, or is that my own
selfish desires and intention?
And what's the boundary there?
Because I tend to operate with,if I know it's from God, like
cool, I'm going to go for it,I'm going to do it, do it.
(10:09):
And so, probably in my life, thethings it feels like about
every three years, there'ssomething that if life doesn't
interrupt my own faith walk, Ifeel like I kind of have to do
that to just stay engaged, ifyou will, and to continue to
grow, because some people theyget put in really difficult
situations.
Life hands them some reallychallenging things and they're
forced to kind of grow in theirfaith, and sometimes those
(10:29):
things happen to me, but there'sother times where seasons are
pretty good and my faith canactually get really stale if I
just stay stable.
And so what can I do to kind ofpress and live and operate more
by faith?
And so I think that's a littlebit of where I'm trying to
figure out what that means forme right now, because it's been
a little more than three yearssince and my wife's probably
(10:50):
super grateful, because everytime it's like, oh, you got to
do something big, it's like, oh,it's a major.
But it's also led to somereally cool things, like 2011,
we planted a church.
2014 was the year I went for aworld record for the longest
speech ever.
2017 was the year we came outwith Red Letter Challenge.
2020 was the time we moved morefully into Red Letter and moved
(11:14):
to King of Kings in 2021.
And so it's been like everythree or four years, and I feel
like there's an itch there that,like again, nothing major needs
to change.
But what is it that's going totest my faith?
If that makes sense and sothat's really where I'm
wrestling right now is what doesthat next step look like for me
and my faith?
To really put it on the lineand not get comfortable and
(11:37):
complacent.
Speaker 3 (11:40):
Yeah, I feel like like Zach on my spiritual gifts
test faith is also one of mystrengths, and one of the things
I've found throughout the yearsas I've been growing in my
faith is the times that I'veallowed fear to intercede in my
life and just stop me from doingthings I've missed out.
(12:00):
The more I grow in my faith,the more I realize that fear is
one of those things that theenemy uses to stop us from
experiencing the gifts that Godhas for us.
I remember I was invited toEcuador one day prior to mission
tickets being bought and I wasterrified to say yes because I
(12:21):
was like, well, what does thatmean?
How do I pack?
Like what do I get, you know?
But I said yes.
I said God, like this issomething I'm going to go, we
get there and we go on.
I think day three or four weended up going to a cathedral
where you walk into this towerand there's this really small
staircase that takes you up tothis tower where there's no
(12:42):
protection and no limit as tohow many people can go up there.
No, wait, like there's just nocontrol and I'm terrified of
heights and I was not going todo it.
And then I kept telling myselfwhen will I have this
opportunity again to come andexperience this, this view, this
, this whole scenario?
So I forced myself to go upthere, this whole scenario.
(13:07):
So I forced myself to go upthere.
I was terrified and excited allat the same time.
And I came down and I was justin awe, in awe of what I saw, in
awe of just how beautiful itwas to be up there and then the
fact that I survived it all.
And so I keep telling myselfthat if fear is what's stopping
me from trying something, thenis that something that the enemy
is keeping me from enjoying inlife.
(13:30):
Like you said, zach, that everytime that you've said let's
move forward and let's dosomething big, it comes with
fear, but then you push past itand then even bigger blessing
comes from it.
And I think that's what a lotof us.
We get so stuck on the littledetails like what if the stairs
break, what if this, what ifthat?
But if you just kind of say I'mdoing it and you go, then
(13:54):
you're in awe of what you'veexperienced.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
So my family are big Disney fans and actually I'm
headed to Disneyland inCalifornia next week, so
there'll be, a fill-in for theBeyond Sunday podcast.
But I loved roller coasters whenI was younger and I was
fearless of them.
I didn't like the really,really crazy ones, but I could
go on them.
And then it had been many yearssince we've been.
(14:20):
And then when my childrenstarted to be like more adult
age and we were taking tripstogether, we went and I realized
I was terrified of some of theroller coasters and I wanted to
go on them and share them, thatexperience, with my kids.
But I was not able.
Like I couldn't get over the.
Nope, I can do this little,I'll go on the kiddie coaster
with the little grandkids.
(14:40):
I'll ride that all day.
But some of the big ones wasjust not my and my, um, my
children are 18, 27 and 28.
So they love to tease me aboutthis and so when we go they just
give me a hard time.
Oh, are you going to ride thisone this time, mom, um, or
they'll try to get me on onewithout telling me, like what
it's really like.
And so I finally said my sonhad been hounding me and I
(15:04):
finally was like, okay, I'll goon Thunder Road Mountain, I
think, is the name of it.
I'm really bad at the names,but it's not like there's no,
you don't go upside down,there's not like a huge drop or
anything like that, but it's aroller coaster and it was so
much fun and I just remembersitting on that ride going.
Okay, how can I use this andthe freedom I feel right now,
(15:25):
which seems like the smallest,stupidest thing, to translate
into other things in my lifewhere I'm scared to?
step out just like you talkedabout.
You know, if you can pushthrough that, what's waiting on
the other?
Speaker 3 (15:36):
side.
Speaker 1 (15:37):
And I, I just am still.
Maybe I'll ride a bigger rollercoaster.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
You got it.
You got it, Dina.
Come on Report back.
Got to report back.
Speaker 3 (15:49):
I'll validate that though, because as I've gotten
older, I'm scared of rollercoasters and I'm scared of the
Ferris wheel at Shields.
I cannot.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Oh wow.
Speaker 1 (15:53):
I think it comes more from my understanding now that
humans built this and it's justnuts and bolts that put it
together.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
And I do have a fear of that.
Would you rather AI build it?
Speaker 1 (16:07):
Dina, or is that taking this conversation off
track?
It's just when I didn't thinkabout that.
Speaker 3 (16:10):
It was just a perfectly safe structure.
As a kid, you didn't thinkabout how was this built?
You're just like this isawesome.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
Yeah, I'm not sure when we all turn lame and stop
enjoying roller coasters butcount me in that camp too.
So actually, now that we'vetalked about it a little bit
more, I think sometimes and thisis maybe true for others, but
true for me sometimes, when it'sthe bigger things, I'm not as
afraid, but it's like thesmaller things that I ought to
not be as afraid that I, that 2%of the people have had two
(16:44):
conversations or less, or 98%have had two conversations or
less about Jesus with others,and so, if we're going to be
sharing the good news, the fearthat I have of just having a
simple conversation shouldprovide itself an opportunity.
So those are things that I dostruggle with.
(17:04):
It's like why do I strugglesometimes on what feels tinier
or smaller and I don't struggleat the stuff that feels bigger
and larger?
Does that make sense?
Yes, why do I trust God for myeternity?
Right, so my eternal salvationis secure, which means I walk
and live differently now, andyet I trust him for that like
(17:26):
the end, but then the day to dayI don't.
So I don't know if there'sothers that feel that way too.
It's like we place these bigtrust in God on the biggest
thing that matters, and yet forme it's the smaller things that
sometimes I'm afraid of that.
I ought not be.
Speaker 1 (17:43):
I would agree with that.
I find that to be true in myown life too, and I don't know
why.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (17:48):
I think it.
I don't know.
I think sometimes the biggerthings it's easier to release
because we have the faith thathe can handle, the bigger things
feel like in my my littlethings are bothersome to him.
(18:10):
And that's not true, and I knowthat he cares about every hair
on my head and every tiny worryand concern that I have
throughout the day, but it feelslike it's too little that I
should be able to handle itmyself, and I'm not willing to
release those or trust himcompletely with those things
that seem almost too small forhim and that's I don't know.
I'm just thinking of this as I'mtalking.
All right, so we're talking inthis book of Mark how we have
(18:37):
the outer story and the innerstory, and so this week's was
really interesting.
Zach, can you kind of highlightwhat our outer story and inner
story were this week, the twostories that highlight what our
outer story and inner story werethis week the two stories that,
yeah, yeah, it was from Mark,chapter six.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
And so there were two stories.
The first was Jesus sending outthe 12 apostles, sending them
out two by two and commissioningthem to do incredible things,
right, having authority overunclean spirits and being able
to preach the good news andcasting out demons and anointing
with oil people who are sickand healing them.
So some really amazing things.
And sending them two by two andat the same time telling them
(19:17):
that you don't need to takeanything with you.
That's where Seth brought inthe bag idea that there's no bag
, there's no bread, there's nomoney, you're not taking
anything except for your sandals.
And that's no bag.
There's no bread, there's nomoney, you're not taking
anything except for your sandalsand that's pretty much it.
And so that was the outer storyof Jesus sending these
disciples out and reallycommissioning them to do big and
(19:40):
amazing things and to put theirfaith on the line and not bring
anything with them.
So that was the outer story.
And then the inner story was adisciple, not one of the 12, but
a prophet, jesus' cousin Johnthe Baptist.
A story of him actually beingbeheaded here was one that was
(20:01):
sent out that was doingincredible things and actually
his life ended as a martyr forJesus.
And so there's this one story.
He's sending them out two bytwo and don't take anything, but
don't be afraid.
And in the very next storywe're reading it actually caused
the death of John the Baptist.
(20:22):
And so Jesus brings these twostories at the same time, and I
think for us it's important tolook at these two next to each
other, like Seth did, and toremember that, no matter what
our lot is in this world, we'restill called to be the light of
(20:43):
Christ.
And at times that means we'regoing to be going into cities
and doing incredible things forthe Lord, and it's going to work
out.
And at times it means we'regoing to go into the cities and
it's not going to work out.
And at times it's going to meanthat following Jesus will cost
you your life.
And we've seen that in ournation in the last couple of
weeks, with there's so much talkabout Charlie Kirk and what
(21:04):
happened and lots of opinions onhim as a person.
But he was a believer in Jesus,a follower of Jesus, and really
professed a faith in Jesus, andthat very well could be a major
reason why he's dead now.
And so this is not just 2,000years ago, it's today as well.
And to know that followingJesus has a cost to it, to know
(21:30):
that following Jesus has a costto it and, at the same time, the
worst thing that this worldcould bring to us as a follower
of Jesus, which is death, is thebest news for a guy like John
the Baptist or Charlie Kirk,like they're good right now.
Now it leaves behind it a waveof just trauma and tragedy and
sadness.
That is very real.
(21:53):
But for Charlie himself and forthose that follow Jesus, for
John the Baptist, for anyonethat follows Jesus, it's going
to end well and you have areally awesome future ahead of
you.
And so, anyway, I thought itwas kind of interesting that
these two are right next to eachother, because it's like
sending these two out two by two.
You're going to be doing greatthings.
(22:14):
Don't take any with you.
And then here's the story, thefirst story.
Right after that, we see onethat gave his life for Jesus.
And so you never know.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
Yeah, I really liked Seth kind of pointed out that
the disciples when he wassending them out, you know extra
provisions.
If they were going to try totake extra provisions, that was
weight that was holding themback.
But he asked them to take justtheir staff and sandals because
that was what they needed tomove forward.
I liked that analogy there thathe kind of made about just
keeping them forward being tomove forward.
Speaker 3 (22:50):
Yeah, as I think about how Jesus prepared the
disciples and told them just gowith the staff and the sandals,
I think it makes me reflectivehow many times we, as people,
try to use a list of excuses asto why not to go, and we're
constantly thinking about like,well, I still need to do this.
I still, like Seth mentioned.
Oh well, just one more training.
Well, I still need to do this.
I still, like Seth mentioned,oh well, just one more training,
(23:10):
one more class, one more.
But at what point, then, areyou going to actually move and
go?
Because that's what he calls usto do, is move and go.
He didn't say move and go whenI give you this, move and go,
when I've done this for you, hesays move and go and then he
will provide whatever it is thatyou need.
And I hadn't thought about thecomparison of how John the
(23:31):
Baptist was being beheaded andthen they were being sent out to
go and do His work.
I feel like a lot of times,people think going out and doing
God's work is simply just joyand spreading love and caring,
but you don't think about theugly, you don't think about the
people that are going tocriticize you and judge you and
(23:53):
hate you for speaking truth.
And just the comparison of thefact that that was happening to
John while the disciples weregoing out.
I'm sure they were scared atthat time too.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
And I think the key is that following Jesus, truly
doing it is dangerous work.
But Jesus, the question is, ishe enough Like, is he enough for
you that you're willing to gono matter where he calls, and
you're willing to go withnothing but him?
And that's, I think, theversion of Christianity that
(24:27):
Americans really struggle with.
It's like, yeah, we'll followJesus, but we want to make sure
we have our bank accounts ingood order and we've got a house
and a shelter and our 401ks andyou name it like whatever 15
things.
That's what I love so muchabout.
When the disciples followedJesus, they immediately jumped
left the boats and followed him.
(24:48):
I love the story of Elisha inthe Old Testament that when
Elijah tapped him on theshoulder and said, hey, let's go
, he burnt his plows and killedhis oxen and they had a party
that night and celebrated.
But he essentially left hispast behind because a better
opportunity for his future cameand in a way that he couldn't
(25:09):
actually get to his past becausehe burnt it down.
And I think a lot of us arelike one foot in, one foot out
disciples, where we'll trysomething but we're going to
hang on to everything.
We're going to make sure thatour bag, even if I'm not
carrying it like, I know whereit's packed and I can go get it
if I need it.
I can go get it right now.
And so what I love about thisstory is that, like it really
forces us to ask the question atthe end of the day, is Jesus,
(25:33):
and Jesus alone, enough for youto do what he calls you to do?
It's dangerous, but it'swholesome, it's rewarding, it's
fulfilling, and there's nocalling like it.
But it doesn't actually meanequal eternity success, sorry,
earthly success.
And that's the challenge, is, Ithink we like this.
(25:54):
One foot in, one foot out.
I'm going to keep my bags withme as I go.
Speaker 3 (25:58):
When I think, as people were taught to expect the
reward now.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (26:03):
We want the recognition now, we want
everything positive to happen assoon as we do it, like give me
my prize, whereas when it comesto doing this like, it doesn't
come until after death.
But we know that, just like wedo with Charlie Kirk, like we
know that he's up there and he'sreaping everything that he
(26:24):
worked so hard to sow right.
And so it's just, I think,having that mentality of like,
yeah, maybe right now I'm nothaving all of the prize, but I
know that in the end and I thinkthat's the question is it worth
it for you, is he enough foryou?
Is what is going like being inhis presence at some point going
(26:47):
to be enough for you and for me?
That's exciting.
The thought of when this worldis done for me, I will get to be
up there and I'll get toworship and I'll get to hear all
these people singing in thelight and just to experience His
joy so close is exciting.
But that's easy to lose whenyou're feeling down and scared
(27:09):
and, you know, exhausted.
So that's really good.
Speaker 1 (27:13):
So Seth kind of talked about three different
points in his message, where hetalked about faith fights, fear
folds and followers finish.
How did those jump out at youguys, or did one of those really
speak to you or made you thinkof something?
Speaker 2 (27:33):
Yeah, as a pastor, I love alliteration, so good job,
seth Followers.
Finish is the one that I yeah,they're all great Followers.
Finish is the one that I thinkis so fabulous, because the same
disciples that he sent out twoby two that would largely in the
gospels, go out and make a messof things Um yeah, end up
(27:55):
finishing really well for Jesusand it's super inspiring.
And it's one of the bestphysical, evidential aspects of
the resurrection is when youactually look at what happened
to the lives of the disciples,this cowardly.
How about let's keep on thealliteration?
These fickle failures becamefaithful followers once they saw
(28:19):
the post-resurrected Jesus.
Like they were changed.
Like Peter, the dude that deniedJesus three times by a charcoal
fire, 52 days later ispreaching in front of thousands
of people about who God is, whoJesus is.
He couldn't say the name Jesusin front of one servant girl 52
days prior.
He is a changed man.
He is the say the name Jesus infront of one servant girl 52
(28:39):
days prior.
He is a changed man.
He is the leader of the church,the fabulous church, and he
would go on to be martyred forhis faith, dying on a cross
upside down because he didn'tdeem himself worthy to die in
the same manner as his friendJesus, and all of the disciples
would end up giving their livesfor Jesus, martyred early, with
the exception of John, whosomehow got away to the island
(29:02):
of Patmos, which is where hewrote the book of Revelation and
where we have this beautifulvision right that you were just
talking about that one day we'regoing to be with the angels and
the light of Christ is going tobe enough light to light that
there will be no more sun neededat that point.
And so for me, I just love thatfollowers finish.
And it doesn't mean we're goingto get it perfect in this world
(29:23):
, because I certainly don't, andI struggle, but I do want to be
one that finishes well, andthat in Christ, I have
everything I need to finish.
Well, because of his grace,every time I screw up he brings
me right back and so I canfinish.
I can have 23 bad hours of theday, but I got the 24th hour
that I can turn my life aroundand I can start over again the
(29:44):
next day.
So followers finish issomething that speaks well to me
.
Speaker 3 (29:49):
Yeah, I love that.
For me it's going to be thefear fights.
I've seen so many people, somany amazing leaders, that
continue to fight for theirchurch, they continue to fight
for their family, they continueto fight for their loved ones,
and I think the biggest reasonthat they fight so hard is the
(30:10):
fear of not having them withthem in heaven.
Like, why would you push sohard and why would you push so
hard and why would you pray soconstantly?
Why would you encourage someoneso frequently and accept
heartbreak time after time aftertime?
It's because of that fear ofknowing that if they let go of
God, then they're not going tobe in the presence of God.
(30:34):
And I know that for me, that'sone of the things that I know.
(30:58):
He transformed my life and thefear of going back to what it
used to be is enough to push meand say, no, I parents, as
friends, we fight so hard forthe people that we love because
we fear not sharing that love ofChrist with them.
Speaker 1 (31:14):
So Seth made a parental reference and he talked
about how this story and theparenting of Herodias, who was
Herod's wife, that basicallytold her daughter.
When she was offered from Herodthe opportunity to ask for
anything that she wanted, thiswoman, who didn't like John the
Baptist, convinced her daughterto ask for his head.
(31:35):
That that's one example ofparenting, and Seth compared
that with, from the OldTestament, mordecai's influence
on Esther and how that reallyempowered and raised Esther up
to ask for things for thekingdom.
How does that comparison makeyou think about your own
(31:55):
parenting?
We're all parents here.
What does that do to convictyou or or celebrate you?
You know how did that jump outat you?
Speaker 3 (32:04):
Um, as so this, this is a season of a lot of changes
for my family.
Um, I was just telling youearlier that we're, you know,
hopefully going to close on ahouse by the end of this week,
and that means a move.
And my daughter has told metime and time again like I'm
scared, I don't want to leavethis house.
I'm scared.
And I tell her likeeverything's going to be okay,
(32:26):
like it's going to be fine,we're going to be together and
it'll be great.
And she's always asking me, likehow do you know?
I'm like, honestly, I don't, Idon't know.
But I do know that God is incontrol and we trust God and
that's enough.
But if I sit in it I'm like, ohmy gosh, how do I know?
How, like you know?
(32:47):
And that's when I start prayinglike Lord, help me out, because
I don't know.
But I think a lot of times I,my daughter, has seen me react
in fear and then push againstfear, react in fear and then
push against fear.
And I just hope that it's moretimes she sees me push against
it than submit to it.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
So yeah, and I don't think like living in this life's
all about like how do we avoidfear, you know, I think I think
that fear is going to come hereand there and that's actually,
if you're putting yourself outon the line for Christ like you
should expect some fear.
So I don't think it's likeavoid it, you know, and that you
know life's going to be perfect.
No, we're going to be okay,cause Christ is in us and with
us and around us and, worst casehappens, we're still great
(33:30):
Right.
And so yeah, for me, when Iwould ask about parent, I feel
better about my parenting afterI read a story like this,
because I'm not that bad right.
But I never made the connectionI thought that was really cool
to Esther and Mordecai of theOld Testament and how one sort
of family figure was so positivein that and of course, this one
(33:50):
in the New Testament with Johnthe Baptist and Herodias is so
negative.
And I just think it kind ofdoubles down what we talked
(34:21):
about earlier that like our, ourdecisions matter and if we a
disproportionate amount ofeffect in your life, positively
or negatively, like it was justone thing they said and it just
totally changed your life, on apositive or negative side, and
like so to know that my wordsmatter, what I say matters, what
I do, especially with my twoboys, like especially now when
they're in high school, like itreally matters.
Uh, it really matters is just areally cool thing, and I'd
never made that connectionbefore with Mordecai and Esther
(34:43):
and I thought that was awesome,that Seth made it, yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:46):
Yeah, I typically feel like a really great parent,
until I hear a message likethis and then I'm like oh well,
what about this?
And I really started thinkingkind of earlier when we were
talking about pressing thosefears down.
It really made me stop andthink.
What fears am I putting on mykids?
Not necessarily through fearsthat I'm convincing them to have
(35:11):
, but just things in my own lifethat I'm almost setting up an
expectation for in them.
And I'm thinking of when myex-husband and I were first
married.
Early on we had no money, likewe struggled financially, got
married very young, had a babyright away, and we for years
(35:33):
lived in a financial struggle.
And so when my daughter, who'snow married and has two kids,
when she was first married, Ikept expecting there to be this
financial struggle becausethat's what I had experienced
and it's kind of like astereotypical.
You know, you struggle when youfirst get married.
She and her husband were neverin that type of situation.
(35:54):
But I was constantly askingwell, are you okay on this money
?
And so was her father and hergrandfather, like all of us had
kind of pushed this fear intothem.
That then she was like gosh,are we okay?
Like I think we're doing fine?
And I started thinking of littlethings like that.
What fears have I pushed on mykids through my own experiences,
(36:17):
and while I think I'm teachingthem all the right things and
empowering them in all the rightways, what am I subconsciously
putting on them?
That is a fear of mine becauseof my experience that they've
never even had to go through,and I was thinking about when I
went through my divorce how Ifelt like I was starting over
(36:39):
and I was in my mid-40s andstarting over and the fears that
I had about just little simplethings that I would put on my
kids through that experiencethat they didn't need to know or
they didn't need thatexperience of just things that I
would in my daily life, like ohmy gosh, my headlight on my car
(37:01):
is out and I don't know how tochange it and I don't know who
to call to change it, becausethat was something that my
husband used to do and I wouldget all worked up and my kids
would get worked up.
Oh my gosh, mom's headlight isout.
Speaker 2 (37:11):
What are we?
Speaker 1 (37:11):
going to do Like somebody get the Google.
You know just of simple thingslike that that didn't need to be
.
There needed to be no anxietyin that situation, but my fear
then caused issues for them, andso I was just kind of like
ticking off the list of where Ithought I was a pretty good
(37:31):
parent.
This humbled me a little.
Thanks, Seth, but that's whereyou grow.
Those are the times that yougrow, because then I think about
how do I continue to influencethem in positive ways.
Like you said, words carryweight.
How do I speak life into themand into my grandchildren now,
like those are the next peoplethat I'm looking to impact?
Speaker 2 (37:48):
Yeah, and I think, too, like giving them
opportunity.
Right, I think some of us whoare older like who maybe have
positions or jobs, we haveopportunity to pass those on to
the younger generations and tolet them step into leadership
roles.
But it's actually our own fearthat sometimes we want to hold
(38:09):
on to.
So we're holding on to somethingand we're afraid and at the
same time we're keeping themfrom stepping into things that
God may be designed for them.
And so we still are living withthat fear, and I think we've
got to get better at just beingmore open-handed, not just with
words, but what about an actionto show I'm not afraid to let
you lead this and to let youstep into this, and I'll show
(38:32):
you once, but then I want you todo it the next time, right?
And so I think we have to bemore willing to not just with
our words but with our actionsshow especially the younger
generation that you are welcomeat the table, and you're welcome
at the table a heck of a lotearlier than you thought.
We already want you here.
So let's go and let's do thistogether and then let's have you
lead and God will take care ofus who are older.
(38:53):
We're going to be taken care ofif we're letting go of these
things.
That's what God wants.
Speaker 1 (38:59):
Well, and that's our way of showing him trust Like
you talked about earlier.
How is it easier to trust himwith the big things?
That's kind of a big thing, butit's maybe still sometimes hard
to let go.
All right.
So, as we wrap up today, whatare your final takeaways from
this message, or this series, asyou've?
Speaker 3 (39:21):
heard it.
What do you got, marianne?
I think one of my biggesttakeaways is yeah, what fears am
I pressing down onto my kidsand future generations?
Especially working in kids'ministry, I'm going to encounter
a lot of other generations, andso I want to be aware of where
(39:41):
it is that I need to grow andtrust more that.
And then I think just howtightly am I holding on to my
fear backpack A big old bag offear?
Am I cobbling it, or have Idecided to set it down for a
little bit?
Yeah, decided to set it downfor a little bit.
Speaker 1 (39:57):
Yeah, I really liked the halftime pep talk and where
Seth even got kind of specifictalking to those of you that are
in the first quarter, theyounger, and then those of you
that are in that mid-season andthose of you that are older.
I really liked that and Ireally related to like that's
what we need.
We need that, but that's whatwe have the opportunity to get
(40:18):
through.
Something like listening tothis podcast it's a little pep
talk, hopefully.
Or coming to worship and beingwith your Christ family, or
being in a connect group,spending some time in the
scripture those things are alllittle ways that God gives you a
pep talk and I liked the ideaof that, your little halftime
pep talk.
Speaker 2 (40:37):
Yeah, I'm actually reading that halftime book with
a few dads right now.
It's really great.
And yeah, I'm squarely in thatmiddle section right when, yeah,
I want to leave a life oflegacy of significance, and so
(40:58):
for me, yeah, it's challengingme to really do.
I, god, how do you want to useme?
Are you enough for me?
And if you're enough, then whatdoes that look like, um, and
how I, and how I pursue you, howI follow you, and and how can I
then, at the same time pursuingyou and following you, um,
raise up and help raise up thenext generation and pour into
(41:21):
them belief and words andopportunities.
What does that look like in mylife?
And I feel like God's allowingme to kind of dream a little bit
these last few weeks andcontinue to dream about what
that could look like, which isreally neat.
I've been on such a contentcreation marathon that's felt
like I've sprinted, and I thinkI just finished it, which, is
(41:42):
fabulous, and so now I'mstarting to dream, then, about
yeah, what does this look liketo really pour into the next
generation in a deeper way, toshow that you are enough?
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (41:54):
Yeah, your content creation guide we get to kind of
jump into in a couple of weeks.
We've got one more week of partin this interruption with Seth,
and then we're jumping into thegiving challenge.
Speaker 2 (42:03):
Yeah, we're going to get generous.
There you go.
Speaker 1 (42:04):
Yeah we are All right Red Letter Challenge go.
Okay.
Thank you guys so much forbeing here today and until we
get together again, let's keepliving our faith beyond Sunday.
You.
Welcome to Beyond Sunday the King of Kings podcast
, where we dive a little bitdeeper into our sermon series
and see what we are takingbeyond Sunday.
My name is Deena Newsom and I'mexcited to have some great
guests One I haven't seen for awhile and one brand new guest
today.
Go ahead and introduceyourselves, guys.
Speaker 2 (00:21):
Well, I think I'm the one you haven't seen in a
little while.
I'm Zach Zender, a pastor hereat King of Kings, and get to
help with the multi-site side ofour ministry, which is super
fun.
Speaker 3 (00:33):
And I am Marianne.
I am the new kids ministrydirector here at King of Kings.
Speaker 2 (00:38):
Do we have sound effects?
Can we do like an applausesound effect?
Speaker 1 (00:41):
I don't know what's connected to what.
So I'm scared the students usethe same setup for their podcast
.
I'm not sure what will happenif I hit some buttons.
Speaker 3 (00:51):
Some of those sounds might not be pleasant.
Speaker 1 (00:53):
All right.
So, in light of part of whatZach talked about in his message
has inspired my openingquestion to you.
Speaker 2 (01:01):
Wait what I talked about, or Seth I?
Speaker 1 (01:03):
mean Seth sorry.
Speaker 2 (01:04):
I was like wait, did I preach?
I'm looking right at you andyeah, you didn't remember that
it's so foggy Part of what Sethtalked about.
Speaker 1 (01:13):
he kind of quoted some stats from a Swedish survey
at the start of his message.
And in doing so he impersonatedthe Swedish chef from the
Muppets.
I don't want to repeat theimpersonation because I just
couldn't do it justice.
Watch it if you haven't yet.
But in light of that, I wantedto ask what's your favorite
Muppet?
(01:33):
Did you watch the Muppets whenyou were younger, and who is
your favorite Muppet?
Speaker 3 (01:39):
I did not watch the Muppets, but I do remember a
song where they come out andit's like that's all I remember
from the Muppets.
That's a great song.
Speaker 2 (01:53):
Yeah, I am not a Muppet guy, believe it or not.
So was Kermit.
Was Kermit the frog a Muppet?
Okay, then I'm going to go,kermit, give me Pig and.
Speaker 1 (02:02):
Piggy and Ralph the dog, okay, and the two old guys
in the balcony and the eagle,the Swedish chef Beaker.
Speaker 2 (02:10):
It sounds like you're a Muppet.
Why don't you take all of ourfavorites and you just tell us
your three favorites?
Speaker 3 (02:16):
We're going to have to do a Muppet 101 with Dina.
Speaker 1 (02:19):
They were classic movies of my time, yeah.
Speaker 2 (02:22):
Yeah, kermit's got to be the.
Is he the most famous, or doyou think Piggy?
Speaker 1 (02:26):
I would think Kermit.
Speaker 2 (02:27):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (02:29):
I think Kermit has done a little bit more.
Speaker 2 (02:30):
Changed the world.
Speaker 1 (02:31):
His repertoire is a little larger.
Speaker 2 (02:33):
Yeah, nice.
Speaker 1 (02:34):
I really liked.
My favorite Muppet was Animal,who was the crazy drummer for
the band that was on there.
And I can't remember what theband was, except the singer was
like Hot Lips McGee or somethingI don't even remember.
Speaker 3 (02:50):
But all he would say was animal, animal, wasn't he
the like pink one, fuzzy one, hehad like a black collar on?
Yes, I remember that one and myolder brother had an animal
puppet and he would just tortureme with walking around
following me with that.
Speaker 1 (03:04):
But I loved him because Animal was very
passionate about whatever he wasdoing, which mostly was
drumming, but then he'd just getreally into it and that was
exciting to me.
That he was just really excitedabout what he was doing Was it
Jim Henson.
Speaker 2 (03:17):
Right, yeah, so I never was a Muppet guy, but the
cool part of the origin storythat I do remember was like
Kermit the Frog was the firstthat he created and it was like
out of a piece of like fabricthat was basically trash.
He came up with this Kermit theFrog with like just some,
(03:39):
really some, rubbish and put ittogether and like to think of
what came out of that franchise.
Through.
That is a pretty, pretty coolthing, like what, what's, you
know, what do we have that mightbe easily disposable, that in
the hands of the right personthe architect, the visionary,
the designer like what thingsmight be, and so that's
(04:01):
inspiring to me.
I think that's pretty cool.
Speaker 1 (04:02):
This is a whole sermon series.
Yeah, probably I'll have toremember that's pretty cool.
This is a whole sermon series.
Yeah, probably.
Speaker 2 (04:07):
I'll have to remember that for next year.
Yeah, we'll have to have Sethprobably lead it, since it seems
like he's maybe got a littlemore wisdom.
Speaker 1 (04:13):
I did like the Swedish chef.
It was very funny.
I do also know that the Muppetstried to get famous when
Saturday Night Live was startingOn the very first episode of
Saturday Night Live.
Live was starting on the veryfirst episode of Saturday Night
Live, I don't remember if theymade the cut or maybe they
didn't make the cut but like Jimand Kermit and like was
supposed to be on that beforethey realized that those two
(04:33):
genres did not really mix Liketheir target audiences ended up
being different A little bitdifferent yeah.
Speaker 2 (04:39):
Nice.
Speaker 1 (04:40):
All right.
So that's kind of a sidetrack,but we're going to interrupt
that with our switch to Pardonthis Interruption.
We're in week three of thismessage series and Pastor Seth
Flick is kind of taking usthrough the book of Mark, where
there's an interesting setupwhere Jesus has, like an inner
story interrupted or an outerstory interrupted by an inner
(05:01):
story, and then both stories getrevolved, interrupted by an
inner story, and then bothstories get revolved.
And so we're in week three ofthis.
And what are you guys takingbeyond Sunday from this week's
message?
Speaker 3 (05:12):
I'm going to start on that one.
I guess For me it's thereflection of what fears are
holding me back.
What am I not trusting Him with?
I like to consider myself as abrave person and that I'm
willing to try pretty muchanything, but when you really
break down into it, there's along list of things that I'm too
(05:34):
scared to even try or toconsider, and so I think that
this weekend's messagedefinitely spoke to me, because
fear is almost one of the thingsthat stopped me from taking
this role at King of Kings.
So when you break down the fearof like, how far are you
willing to push against thatfear?
It speaks volumes as to whereit'll take you.
Speaker 1 (05:55):
Awesome.
Speaker 2 (05:57):
Yeah, that are teenagers and just kind of a
love for the next generation anda belief in the next generation
as well, or strong belief thatyou know some of the stuff that
Seth talked about of how youknow they're considered the
anxious generation, they'renervous, they're mentally unwell
(06:17):
, you know all these things thatwe've heard, you know and we've
seen it.
And to know that, like previousgenerations play in, like we
can't just look at them and saythey're that way because they're
that way.
They're in many respects thatway because of how we've acted
and what we've modeled and and.
So I really appreciated justhis uh insight in this message
(06:41):
of how, when we live with fearor when we live with anxiety,
like that gets pressed down, umand so.
That that's the negative side,but the positive side, the
opportunity side, which would beon Sunday side for me is I get
to be a person who doesn't haveto live by those things and I
can and it's been modeled for meas well I can actually be a
(07:02):
positive voice to the nextgeneration, to my boys, to the
teenagers, to the youth, speaklife into them and hopefully we
can reverse what we're seeingand and and so that that real
sense of empowerment, of like,yeah, the things that I do, the
things that I say, the nextgeneration, my boys, like they,
they listen, they learn from it,their model, like, and so let's
(07:24):
, let's be a positive examplefor those things, as opposed to
the opposite.
Speaker 1 (07:29):
Yeah, I really like the phrasing that Seth Houston
used it too we're pressed down.
We're pressed down into thatgeneration, just the imagery
that gives of suppressing thatwhen we want to raise up the
next generation.
That's a really good point.
Yeah, what really spoke to mewas when he referred to things
as a big old bag of fear you putdown your big old bag of fear
(07:49):
and I just thought oh yeah, I'mcarrying that right now and
maybe I'll put down a few piecesof it this day and pick up a
few pieces another day, but Idon't always put down the whole
bag of fear and that was my bigold bag of fear.
Speaker 3 (08:04):
When he mentioned that like the visual of like me
hugging this bag of fear andlike crunched up in a ball is
all I could imagine.
Speaker 1 (08:10):
Yeah, that's what really got me too.
And the other thing that Ireally liked was when he said
you can't move forward in afetal position, and he literally
like squatted down in the fetalposition.
I was like you're not goingreally fast when he's trying to
move forward, and that waspowerful for me.
Oh yeah, it seems comfortingsometimes to be in that position
(08:33):
, but we aren't going forward,we're just standing still Okay.
So one of the questions Sethopened with was how have you
allowed fear to interrupt yourlife?
Would either one of you care tospeak to that on your own life?
How has fear interrupted yourlife?
Speaker 2 (08:53):
Yeah, I think fear.
So I tend to like, on thespiritual gift test, faith is
one of the top for me, and so Itend to think that I don't
struggle with fear as much, um,and I tend to operate more on
faith, and but that's also not ahundred percent true.
There's times when fear hasgotten the best of me.
(09:15):
And so for me, though I thinkthe the challenge is to know
like I'm.
I can be a pretty, and it'sgood or bad like a pretty good,
like big risk taker, and youknow, is that just being a risk
taker, is that operating byfaith?
And I'm not always sure.
Is it a risk?
Is it faith, is it God?
Is it my own selfish?
So, for me, I'm trying tofigure out less of like you know
(09:40):
, I'm trying to figure out likeis the things God is calling me
towards?
Is that God actually calling metowards that, or is that my own
selfish desires and intention?
And what's the boundary there?
Because I tend to operate with,if I know it's from God, like
cool, I'm going to go for it,I'm going to do it, do it.
(10:09):
And so, probably in my life, thethings it feels like about
every three years, there'ssomething that if life doesn't
interrupt my own faith walk, Ifeel like I kind of have to do
that to just stay engaged, ifyou will, and to continue to
grow, because some people theyget put in really difficult
situations.
Life hands them some reallychallenging things and they're
forced to kind of grow in theirfaith, and sometimes those
(10:29):
things happen to me, but there'sother times where seasons are
pretty good and my faith canactually get really stale if I
just stay stable.
And so what can I do to kind ofpress and live and operate more
by faith?
And so I think that's a littlebit of where I'm trying to
figure out what that means forme right now, because it's been
a little more than three yearssince and my wife's probably
(10:50):
super grateful, because everytime it's like, oh, you got to
do something big, it's like, oh,it's a major.
But it's also led to somereally cool things, like 2011,
we planted a church.
2014 was the year I went for aworld record for the longest
speech ever.
2017 was the year we came outwith Red Letter Challenge.
2020 was the time we moved morefully into Red Letter and moved
(11:14):
to King of Kings in 2021.
And so it's been like everythree or four years, and I feel
like there's an itch there that,like again, nothing major needs
to change.
But what is it that's going totest my faith?
If that makes sense and sothat's really where I'm
wrestling right now is what doesthat next step look like for me
and my faith?
To really put it on the lineand not get comfortable and
(11:37):
complacent.
Speaker 3 (11:40):
Yeah, I feel like like Zach on my spiritual gifts
test faith is also one of mystrengths, and one of the things
I've found throughout the yearsas I've been growing in my
faith is the times that I'veallowed fear to intercede in my
life and just stop me from doingthings I've missed out.
(12:00):
The more I grow in my faith,the more I realize that fear is
one of those things that theenemy uses to stop us from
experiencing the gifts that Godhas for us.
I remember I was invited toEcuador one day prior to mission
tickets being bought and I wasterrified to say yes because I
(12:21):
was like, well, what does thatmean?
How do I pack?
Like what do I get, you know?
But I said yes.
I said God, like this issomething I'm going to go, we
get there and we go on.
I think day three or four weended up going to a cathedral
where you walk into this towerand there's this really small
staircase that takes you up tothis tower where there's no
(12:42):
protection and no limit as tohow many people can go up there.
No, wait, like there's just nocontrol and I'm terrified of
heights and I was not going todo it.
And then I kept telling myselfwhen will I have this
opportunity again to come andexperience this, this view, this
, this whole scenario?
So I forced myself to go upthere, this whole scenario.
(13:07):
So I forced myself to go upthere.
I was terrified and excited allat the same time.
And I came down and I was justin awe, in awe of what I saw, in
awe of just how beautiful itwas to be up there and then the
fact that I survived it all.
And so I keep telling myselfthat if fear is what's stopping
me from trying something, thenis that something that the enemy
is keeping me from enjoying inlife.
(13:30):
Like you said, zach, that everytime that you've said let's
move forward and let's dosomething big, it comes with
fear, but then you push past itand then even bigger blessing
comes from it.
And I think that's what a lotof us.
We get so stuck on the littledetails like what if the stairs
break, what if this, what ifthat?
But if you just kind of say I'mdoing it and you go, then
(13:54):
you're in awe of what you'veexperienced.
Speaker 1 (13:58):
So my family are big Disney fans and actually I'm
headed to Disneyland inCalifornia next week, so
there'll be, a fill-in for theBeyond Sunday podcast.
But I loved roller coasters whenI was younger and I was
fearless of them.
I didn't like the really,really crazy ones, but I could
go on them.
And then it had been many yearssince we've been.
(14:20):
And then when my childrenstarted to be like more adult
age and we were taking tripstogether, we went and I realized
I was terrified of some of theroller coasters and I wanted to
go on them and share them, thatexperience, with my kids.
But I was not able.
Like I couldn't get over the.
Nope, I can do this little,I'll go on the kiddie coaster
with the little grandkids.
(14:40):
I'll ride that all day.
But some of the big ones wasjust not my and my, um, my
children are 18, 27 and 28.
So they love to tease me aboutthis and so when we go they just
give me a hard time.
Oh, are you going to ride thisone this time, mom, um, or
they'll try to get me on onewithout telling me, like what
it's really like.
And so I finally said my sonhad been hounding me and I
(15:04):
finally was like, okay, I'll goon Thunder Road Mountain, I
think, is the name of it.
I'm really bad at the names,but it's not like there's no,
you don't go upside down,there's not like a huge drop or
anything like that, but it's aroller coaster and it was so
much fun and I just remembersitting on that ride going.
Okay, how can I use this andthe freedom I feel right now,
(15:25):
which seems like the smallest,stupidest thing, to translate
into other things in my lifewhere I'm scared to?
step out just like you talkedabout.
You know, if you can pushthrough that, what's waiting on
the other?
Speaker 3 (15:36):
side.
Speaker 1 (15:37):
And I, I just am still.
Maybe I'll ride a bigger rollercoaster.
Speaker 2 (15:41):
You got it.
You got it, Dina.
Come on Report back.
Got to report back.
Speaker 3 (15:49):
I'll validate that though, because as I've gotten
older, I'm scared of rollercoasters and I'm scared of the
Ferris wheel at Shields.
I cannot.
Speaker 2 (15:52):
Oh wow.
Speaker 1 (15:53):
I think it comes more from my understanding now that
humans built this and it's justnuts and bolts that put it
together.
Speaker 2 (16:06):
And I do have a fear of that.
Would you rather AI build it?
Speaker 1 (16:07):
Dina, or is that taking this conversation off
track?
It's just when I didn't thinkabout that.
Speaker 3 (16:10):
It was just a perfectly safe structure.
As a kid, you didn't thinkabout how was this built?
You're just like this isawesome.
Speaker 2 (16:16):
Yeah, I'm not sure when we all turn lame and stop
enjoying roller coasters butcount me in that camp too.
So actually, now that we'vetalked about it a little bit
more, I think sometimes and thisis maybe true for others, but
true for me sometimes, when it'sthe bigger things, I'm not as
afraid, but it's like thesmaller things that I ought to
not be as afraid that I, that 2%of the people have had two
(16:44):
conversations or less, or 98%have had two conversations or
less about Jesus with others,and so, if we're going to be
sharing the good news, the fearthat I have of just having a
simple conversation shouldprovide itself an opportunity.
So those are things that I dostruggle with.
(17:04):
It's like why do I strugglesometimes on what feels tinier
or smaller and I don't struggleat the stuff that feels bigger
and larger?
Does that make sense?
Yes, why do I trust God for myeternity?
Right, so my eternal salvationis secure, which means I walk
and live differently now, andyet I trust him for that like
(17:26):
the end, but then the day to dayI don't.
So I don't know if there'sothers that feel that way too.
It's like we place these bigtrust in God on the biggest
thing that matters, and yet forme it's the smaller things that
sometimes I'm afraid of that.
I ought not be.
Speaker 1 (17:43):
I would agree with that.
I find that to be true in myown life too, and I don't know
why.
Speaker 2 (17:47):
I don't know.
Speaker 1 (17:48):
I think it.
I don't know.
I think sometimes the biggerthings it's easier to release
because we have the faith thathe can handle, the bigger things
feel like in my my littlethings are bothersome to him.
(18:10):
And that's not true, and I knowthat he cares about every hair
on my head and every tiny worryand concern that I have
throughout the day, but it feelslike it's too little that I
should be able to handle itmyself, and I'm not willing to
release those or trust himcompletely with those things
that seem almost too small forhim and that's I don't know.
I'm just thinking of this as I'mtalking.
All right, so we're talking inthis book of Mark how we have
(18:37):
the outer story and the innerstory, and so this week's was
really interesting.
Zach, can you kind of highlightwhat our outer story and inner
story were this week, the twostories that highlight what our
outer story and inner story werethis week the two stories that,
yeah, yeah, it was from Mark,chapter six.
Speaker 2 (18:54):
And so there were two stories.
The first was Jesus sending outthe 12 apostles, sending them
out two by two and commissioningthem to do incredible things,
right, having authority overunclean spirits and being able
to preach the good news andcasting out demons and anointing
with oil people who are sickand healing them.
So some really amazing things.
And sending them two by two andat the same time telling them
(19:17):
that you don't need to takeanything with you.
That's where Seth brought inthe bag idea that there's no bag
, there's no bread, there's nomoney, you're not taking
anything except for your sandals.
And that's no bag.
There's no bread, there's nomoney, you're not taking
anything except for your sandalsand that's pretty much it.
And so that was the outer storyof Jesus sending these
disciples out and reallycommissioning them to do big and
(19:40):
amazing things and to put theirfaith on the line and not bring
anything with them.
So that was the outer story.
And then the inner story was adisciple, not one of the 12, but
a prophet, jesus' cousin Johnthe Baptist.
A story of him actually beingbeheaded here was one that was
(20:01):
sent out that was doingincredible things and actually
his life ended as a martyr forJesus.
And so there's this one story.
He's sending them out two bytwo and don't take anything, but
don't be afraid.
And in the very next storywe're reading it actually caused
the death of John the Baptist.
(20:22):
And so Jesus brings these twostories at the same time, and I
think for us it's important tolook at these two next to each
other, like Seth did, and toremember that, no matter what
our lot is in this world, we'restill called to be the light of
(20:43):
Christ.
And at times that means we'regoing to be going into cities
and doing incredible things forthe Lord, and it's going to work
out.
And at times it means we'regoing to go into the cities and
it's not going to work out.
And at times it's going to meanthat following Jesus will cost
you your life.
And we've seen that in ournation in the last couple of
weeks, with there's so much talkabout Charlie Kirk and what
(21:04):
happened and lots of opinions onhim as a person.
But he was a believer in Jesus,a follower of Jesus, and really
professed a faith in Jesus, andthat very well could be a major
reason why he's dead now.
And so this is not just 2,000years ago, it's today as well.
And to know that followingJesus has a cost to it, to know
(21:30):
that following Jesus has a costto it and, at the same time, the
worst thing that this worldcould bring to us as a follower
of Jesus, which is death, is thebest news for a guy like John
the Baptist or Charlie Kirk,like they're good right now.
Now it leaves behind it a waveof just trauma and tragedy and
sadness.
That is very real.
(21:53):
But for Charlie himself and forthose that follow Jesus, for
John the Baptist, for anyonethat follows Jesus, it's going
to end well and you have areally awesome future ahead of
you.
And so, anyway, I thought itwas kind of interesting that
these two are right next to eachother, because it's like
sending these two out two by two.
You're going to be doing greatthings.
(22:14):
Don't take any with you.
And then here's the story, thefirst story.
Right after that, we see onethat gave his life for Jesus.
And so you never know.
Speaker 1 (22:24):
Yeah, I really liked Seth kind of pointed out that
the disciples when he wassending them out, you know extra
provisions.
If they were going to try totake extra provisions, that was
weight that was holding themback.
But he asked them to take justtheir staff and sandals because
that was what they needed tomove forward.
I liked that analogy there thathe kind of made about just
keeping them forward being tomove forward.
Speaker 3 (22:50):
Yeah, as I think about how Jesus prepared the
disciples and told them just gowith the staff and the sandals,
I think it makes me reflectivehow many times we, as people,
try to use a list of excuses asto why not to go, and we're
constantly thinking about like,well, I still need to do this.
I still, like Seth mentioned.
Oh well, just one more training.
Well, I still need to do this.
I still, like Seth mentioned,oh well, just one more training,
(23:10):
one more class, one more.
But at what point, then, areyou going to actually move and
go?
Because that's what he calls usto do, is move and go.
He didn't say move and go whenI give you this, move and go,
when I've done this for you, hesays move and go and then he
will provide whatever it is thatyou need.
And I hadn't thought about thecomparison of how John the
(23:31):
Baptist was being beheaded andthen they were being sent out to
go and do His work.
I feel like a lot of times,people think going out and doing
God's work is simply just joyand spreading love and caring,
but you don't think about theugly, you don't think about the
people that are going tocriticize you and judge you and
(23:53):
hate you for speaking truth.
And just the comparison of thefact that that was happening to
John while the disciples weregoing out.
I'm sure they were scared atthat time too.
Speaker 2 (24:07):
And I think the key is that following Jesus, truly
doing it is dangerous work.
But Jesus, the question is, ishe enough Like, is he enough for
you that you're willing to gono matter where he calls, and
you're willing to go withnothing but him?
And that's, I think, theversion of Christianity that
(24:27):
Americans really struggle with.
It's like, yeah, we'll followJesus, but we want to make sure
we have our bank accounts ingood order and we've got a house
and a shelter and our 401ks andyou name it like whatever 15
things.
That's what I love so muchabout.
When the disciples followedJesus, they immediately jumped
left the boats and followed him.
(24:48):
I love the story of Elisha inthe Old Testament that when
Elijah tapped him on theshoulder and said, hey, let's go
, he burnt his plows and killedhis oxen and they had a party
that night and celebrated.
But he essentially left hispast behind because a better
opportunity for his future cameand in a way that he couldn't
(25:09):
actually get to his past becausehe burnt it down.
And I think a lot of us arelike one foot in, one foot out
disciples, where we'll trysomething but we're going to
hang on to everything.
We're going to make sure thatour bag, even if I'm not
carrying it like, I know whereit's packed and I can go get it
if I need it.
I can go get it right now.
And so what I love about thisstory is that, like it really
forces us to ask the question atthe end of the day, is Jesus,
(25:33):
and Jesus alone, enough for youto do what he calls you to do?
It's dangerous, but it'swholesome, it's rewarding, it's
fulfilling, and there's nocalling like it.
But it doesn't actually meanequal eternity success, sorry,
earthly success.
And that's the challenge, is, Ithink we like this.
(25:54):
One foot in, one foot out.
I'm going to keep my bags withme as I go.
Speaker 3 (25:58):
When I think, as people were taught to expect the
reward now.
Speaker 2 (26:02):
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (26:03):
We want the recognition now, we want
everything positive to happen assoon as we do it, like give me
my prize, whereas when it comesto doing this like, it doesn't
come until after death.
But we know that, just like wedo with Charlie Kirk, like we
know that he's up there and he'sreaping everything that he
(26:24):
worked so hard to sow right.
And so it's just, I think,having that mentality of like,
yeah, maybe right now I'm nothaving all of the prize, but I
know that in the end and I thinkthat's the question is it worth
it for you, is he enough foryou?
Is what is going like being inhis presence at some point going
(26:47):
to be enough for you and for me?
That's exciting.
The thought of when this worldis done for me, I will get to be
up there and I'll get toworship and I'll get to hear all
these people singing in thelight and just to experience His
joy so close is exciting.
But that's easy to lose whenyou're feeling down and scared
(27:09):
and, you know, exhausted.
So that's really good.
Speaker 1 (27:13):
So Seth kind of talked about three different
points in his message, where hetalked about faith fights, fear
folds and followers finish.
How did those jump out at youguys, or did one of those really
speak to you or made you thinkof something?
Speaker 2 (27:33):
Yeah, as a pastor, I love alliteration, so good job,
seth Followers.
Finish is the one that I yeah,they're all great Followers.
Finish is the one that I thinkis so fabulous, because the same
disciples that he sent out twoby two that would largely in the
gospels, go out and make a messof things Um yeah, end up
(27:55):
finishing really well for Jesusand it's super inspiring.
And it's one of the bestphysical, evidential aspects of
the resurrection is when youactually look at what happened
to the lives of the disciples,this cowardly.
How about let's keep on thealliteration?
These fickle failures becamefaithful followers once they saw
(28:19):
the post-resurrected Jesus.
Like they were changed.
Like Peter, the dude that deniedJesus three times by a charcoal
fire, 52 days later ispreaching in front of thousands
of people about who God is, whoJesus is.
He couldn't say the name Jesusin front of one servant girl 52
days prior.
He is a changed man.
He is the say the name Jesus infront of one servant girl 52
(28:39):
days prior.
He is a changed man.
He is the leader of the church,the fabulous church, and he
would go on to be martyred forhis faith, dying on a cross
upside down because he didn'tdeem himself worthy to die in
the same manner as his friendJesus, and all of the disciples
would end up giving their livesfor Jesus, martyred early, with
the exception of John, whosomehow got away to the island
(29:02):
of Patmos, which is where hewrote the book of Revelation and
where we have this beautifulvision right that you were just
talking about that one day we'regoing to be with the angels and
the light of Christ is going tobe enough light to light that
there will be no more sun neededat that point.
And so for me, I just love thatfollowers finish.
And it doesn't mean we're goingto get it perfect in this world
(29:23):
, because I certainly don't, andI struggle, but I do want to be
one that finishes well, andthat in Christ, I have
everything I need to finish.
Well, because of his grace,every time I screw up he brings
me right back and so I canfinish.
I can have 23 bad hours of theday, but I got the 24th hour
that I can turn my life aroundand I can start over again the
(29:44):
next day.
So followers finish issomething that speaks well to me
.
Speaker 3 (29:49):
Yeah, I love that.
For me it's going to be thefear fights.
I've seen so many people, somany amazing leaders, that
continue to fight for theirchurch, they continue to fight
for their family, they continueto fight for their loved ones,
and I think the biggest reasonthat they fight so hard is the
(30:10):
fear of not having them withthem in heaven.
Like, why would you push sohard and why would you push so
hard and why would you pray soconstantly?
Why would you encourage someoneso frequently and accept
heartbreak time after time aftertime?
It's because of that fear ofknowing that if they let go of
God, then they're not going tobe in the presence of God.
(30:34):
And I know that for me, that'sone of the things that I know.
(30:58):
He transformed my life and thefear of going back to what it
used to be is enough to push meand say, no, I parents, as
friends, we fight so hard forthe people that we love because
we fear not sharing that love ofChrist with them.
Speaker 1 (31:14):
So Seth made a parental reference and he talked
about how this story and theparenting of Herodias, who was
Herod's wife, that basicallytold her daughter.
When she was offered from Herodthe opportunity to ask for
anything that she wanted, thiswoman, who didn't like John the
Baptist, convinced her daughterto ask for his head.
(31:35):
That that's one example ofparenting, and Seth compared
that with, from the OldTestament, mordecai's influence
on Esther and how that reallyempowered and raised Esther up
to ask for things for thekingdom.
How does that comparison makeyou think about your own
(31:55):
parenting?
We're all parents here.
What does that do to convictyou or or celebrate you?
You know how did that jump outat you?
Speaker 3 (32:04):
Um, as so this, this is a season of a lot of changes
for my family.
Um, I was just telling youearlier that we're, you know,
hopefully going to close on ahouse by the end of this week,
and that means a move.
And my daughter has told metime and time again like I'm
scared, I don't want to leavethis house.
I'm scared.
And I tell her likeeverything's going to be okay,
(32:26):
like it's going to be fine,we're going to be together and
it'll be great.
And she's always asking me, likehow do you know?
I'm like, honestly, I don't, Idon't know.
But I do know that God is incontrol and we trust God and
that's enough.
But if I sit in it I'm like, ohmy gosh, how do I know?
How, like you know?
(32:47):
And that's when I start prayinglike Lord, help me out, because
I don't know.
But I think a lot of times I,my daughter, has seen me react
in fear and then push againstfear, react in fear and then
push against fear.
And I just hope that it's moretimes she sees me push against
it than submit to it.
Speaker 2 (33:07):
So yeah, and I don't think like living in this life's
all about like how do we avoidfear, you know, I think I think
that fear is going to come hereand there and that's actually,
if you're putting yourself outon the line for Christ like you
should expect some fear.
So I don't think it's likeavoid it, you know, and that you
know life's going to be perfect.
No, we're going to be okay,cause Christ is in us and with
us and around us and, worst casehappens, we're still great
(33:30):
Right.
And so yeah, for me, when Iwould ask about parent, I feel
better about my parenting afterI read a story like this,
because I'm not that bad right.
But I never made the connectionI thought that was really cool
to Esther and Mordecai of theOld Testament and how one sort
of family figure was so positivein that and of course, this one
(33:50):
in the New Testament with Johnthe Baptist and Herodias is so
negative.
And I just think it kind ofdoubles down what we talked
(34:21):
about earlier that like our, ourdecisions matter and if we a
disproportionate amount ofeffect in your life, positively
or negatively, like it was justone thing they said and it just
totally changed your life, on apositive or negative side, and
like so to know that my wordsmatter, what I say matters, what
I do, especially with my twoboys, like especially now when
they're in high school, like itreally matters.
Uh, it really matters is just areally cool thing, and I'd
never made that connectionbefore with Mordecai and Esther
(34:43):
and I thought that was awesome,that Seth made it, yeah.
Speaker 1 (34:46):
Yeah, I typically feel like a really great parent,
until I hear a message likethis and then I'm like oh well,
what about this?
And I really started thinkingkind of earlier when we were
talking about pressing thosefears down.
It really made me stop andthink.
What fears am I putting on mykids?
Not necessarily through fearsthat I'm convincing them to have
(35:11):
, but just things in my own lifethat I'm almost setting up an
expectation for in them.
And I'm thinking of when myex-husband and I were first
married.
Early on we had no money, likewe struggled financially, got
married very young, had a babyright away, and we for years
(35:33):
lived in a financial struggle.
And so when my daughter, who'snow married and has two kids,
when she was first married, Ikept expecting there to be this
financial struggle becausethat's what I had experienced
and it's kind of like astereotypical.
You know, you struggle when youfirst get married.
She and her husband were neverin that type of situation.
(35:54):
But I was constantly askingwell, are you okay on this money
?
And so was her father and hergrandfather, like all of us had
kind of pushed this fear intothem.
That then she was like gosh,are we okay?
Like I think we're doing fine?
And I started thinking of littlethings like that.
What fears have I pushed on mykids through my own experiences,
(36:17):
and while I think I'm teachingthem all the right things and
empowering them in all the rightways, what am I subconsciously
putting on them?
That is a fear of mine becauseof my experience that they've
never even had to go through,and I was thinking about when I
went through my divorce how Ifelt like I was starting over
(36:39):
and I was in my mid-40s andstarting over and the fears that
I had about just little simplethings that I would put on my
kids through that experiencethat they didn't need to know or
they didn't need thatexperience of just things that I
would in my daily life, like ohmy gosh, my headlight on my car
(37:01):
is out and I don't know how tochange it and I don't know who
to call to change it, becausethat was something that my
husband used to do and I wouldget all worked up and my kids
would get worked up.
Oh my gosh, mom's headlight isout.
Speaker 2 (37:11):
What are we?
Speaker 1 (37:11):
going to do Like somebody get the Google.
You know just of simple thingslike that that didn't need to be
.
There needed to be no anxietyin that situation, but my fear
then caused issues for them, andso I was just kind of like
ticking off the list of where Ithought I was a pretty good
(37:31):
parent.
This humbled me a little.
Thanks, Seth, but that's whereyou grow.
Those are the times that yougrow, because then I think about
how do I continue to influencethem in positive ways.
Like you said, words carryweight.
How do I speak life into themand into my grandchildren now,
like those are the next peoplethat I'm looking to impact?
Speaker 2 (37:48):
Yeah, and I think, too, like giving them
opportunity.
Right, I think some of us whoare older like who maybe have
positions or jobs, we haveopportunity to pass those on to
the younger generations and tolet them step into leadership
roles.
But it's actually our own fearthat sometimes we want to hold
(38:09):
on to.
So we're holding on to somethingand we're afraid and at the
same time we're keeping themfrom stepping into things that
God may be designed for them.
And so we still are living withthat fear, and I think we've
got to get better at just beingmore open-handed, not just with
words, but what about an actionto show I'm not afraid to let
you lead this and to let youstep into this, and I'll show
(38:32):
you once, but then I want you todo it the next time, right?
And so I think we have to bemore willing to not just with
our words but with our actionsshow especially the younger
generation that you are welcomeat the table, and you're welcome
at the table a heck of a lotearlier than you thought.
We already want you here.
So let's go and let's do thistogether and then let's have you
lead and God will take care ofus who are older.
(38:53):
We're going to be taken care ofif we're letting go of these
things.
That's what God wants.
Speaker 1 (38:59):
Well, and that's our way of showing him trust Like
you talked about earlier.
How is it easier to trust himwith the big things?
That's kind of a big thing, butit's maybe still sometimes hard
to let go.
All right.
So, as we wrap up today, whatare your final takeaways from
this message, or this series, asyou've?
Speaker 3 (39:21):
heard it.
What do you got, marianne?
I think one of my biggesttakeaways is yeah, what fears am
I pressing down onto my kidsand future generations?
Especially working in kids'ministry, I'm going to encounter
a lot of other generations, andso I want to be aware of where
(39:41):
it is that I need to grow andtrust more that.
And then I think just howtightly am I holding on to my
fear backpack A big old bag offear?
Am I cobbling it, or have Idecided to set it down for a
little bit?
Yeah, decided to set it downfor a little bit.
Speaker 1 (39:57):
Yeah, I really liked the halftime pep talk and where
Seth even got kind of specifictalking to those of you that are
in the first quarter, theyounger, and then those of you
that are in that mid-season andthose of you that are older.
I really liked that and Ireally related to like that's
what we need.
We need that, but that's whatwe have the opportunity to get
(40:18):
through.
Something like listening tothis podcast it's a little pep
talk, hopefully.
Or coming to worship and beingwith your Christ family, or
being in a connect group,spending some time in the
scripture those things are alllittle ways that God gives you a
pep talk and I liked the ideaof that, your little halftime
pep talk.
Speaker 2 (40:37):
Yeah, I'm actually reading that halftime book with
a few dads right now.
It's really great.
And yeah, I'm squarely in thatmiddle section right when, yeah,
I want to leave a life oflegacy of significance, and so
(40:58):
for me, yeah, it's challengingme to really do.
I, god, how do you want to useme?
Are you enough for me?
And if you're enough, then whatdoes that look like, um, and
how I, and how I pursue you, howI follow you, and and how can I
then, at the same time pursuingyou and following you, um,
raise up and help raise up thenext generation and pour into
(41:21):
them belief and words andopportunities.
What does that look like in mylife?
And I feel like God's allowingme to kind of dream a little bit
these last few weeks andcontinue to dream about what
that could look like, which isreally neat.
I've been on such a contentcreation marathon that's felt
like I've sprinted, and I thinkI just finished it, which, is
(41:42):
fabulous, and so now I'mstarting to dream, then, about
yeah, what does this look liketo really pour into the next
generation in a deeper way, toshow that you are enough?
Yeah?
Speaker 1 (41:54):
Yeah, your content creation guide we get to kind of
jump into in a couple of weeks.
We've got one more week of partin this interruption with Seth,
and then we're jumping into thegiving challenge.
Speaker 2 (42:03):
Yeah, we're going to get generous.
There you go.
Speaker 1 (42:04):
Yeah we are All right Red Letter Challenge go.
Okay.
Thank you guys so much forbeing here today and until we
get together again, let's keepliving our faith beyond Sunday.
You.
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