How Chronic Illness Made Me Better at Sales And Business | Justine Beauregard - Business With Chronic Illness

Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
If you've been told thatsuccessful selling means being always
on, hustling harder, pushingthrough, trying all of the things,
doing the cookie cutterfunnels, sales funnels, and you know,
a lot of that works for a lotof people. But you're thinking that
sounds exhausting andimpossible for the capacity and the
life that I'm currentlyliving. You're right. But what if

(00:24):
I told you that strugglingwith traditional sales advice isn't
a weakness? What if the verythings that make those strategies
feel wrong for you areactually pointing you toward a better
way? In today's episode, wetalk about how some of us hide or
feel like we're not able to bewho we truly are when it comes to

(00:48):
showing up and selling in ourbusiness. And we've tried the proven
methods and it's just notproven for us. It's not working for
us.
Right?
This conversation, you guys,to be honest, brought up so much
for me long after we had the recording.
So much so that I have a.
Whole episode that I'm comingto share with you soon to debrief

(01:09):
my thoughts about thisepisode. But our guests, Justine
and I, talk about how theskills with chronic illness have
been teaching all of us allalong the core aspects of what makes
sales sell. Right?
And it's these things.
Deep listening, authenticcuriosity, and fierce self advocacy.

(01:33):
And these are not obstacles tosales. These are the very things
that make it work. Today, I'mjoined by Justine, host of the top
5% entrepreneurship podcastpeople Over Profit, award winning
sales strategist since 2007and writer for entrepreneur.
Com.
She's helped countlessentrepreneurs move from feast and

(01:53):
famine to consistent income byteaching them how to sell in ways
that feel authentic andsustainable to them. In this conversation,
Justine shares why traditionalsales advice fails people with chronic
illness, her never be outsoldmindset that changes everything,
and the practical curiosityframework that turns your health

(02:14):
challenges into businessadvantages. If you're ready to stop
forcing yourself into salesstrategies that don't fit and start
leveraging the skills youalready have, this episode will be
a help for you. Now, I want tobe clear. This is one of those episodes
where it left me thinking. Itleft me thinking. And I can't wait

(02:35):
to share with you all aboutthat in our next episode on my debrief
of this episode. But there'sso many goody nuggets in this episode
that I want you to stay tunedfor because you're going to learn
how chronic illness can makeyou better at sales and business.
Stay tuned.
Welcome to Business withchronic Illness. The Globally ranked

(02:57):
podcast for women living withchronic illness who want to start
and grow a business online.I'm your host, Nikita Williams and
I went from living a normallife to all of a sudden being in
constant pain with no answersto being diagnosed with multiple
chronic illnesses and tryingto make a livable income. I faced
the challenge of adaptingtraditional business advice to fit

(03:18):
my unique circumstances withchronic illness. Feeling frustrated
and more burned out than Ialready was while managing my chronic
illness to becoming an awardwinning coach with a flexible, sustainable
online coaching business, Ifound the surprisingly simple steps
to starting and growing aprofitable business without compromising
my health or my peace. Sincethen, I've helped double dozens of

(03:40):
women just like you learn howto do the same. If you're ready to
create a thriving businessthat aligns with your lifestyle and
well being, you're in theright place. Together, we're shifting
the narrative of what'spossible for women with chronic illness
and how we make a living. Thisis business with chronic illness.

(04:03):
I am really excited about thisconversation with Justine today.
I'm like always lookingforward to having conversations with
people, but Justine has beenworld of coaching and sales and consulting
for a long time and alsoliving with chronic illness. And
she's a sales strategist andso I just hit it off with her when
we connected. So please let usknow who you are. Like, how would

(04:25):
you describe yourself, Justine?
I'm Justine Beauregard and asyou said, I've been in the world
of sales and small businesssince 2007, so it's been almost 20
years and I have had my ownbusiness since 2014, officially LLC
in 2015. So it's been adecade. And I say that, you know,

(04:47):
I am a champion for underdogs.I've said that for many years because
I see myself as one. And Ialso love selling in ways that are
authentic to us. Because ifyou look around, even just like the
space that you're in now,everything in that space was bought
and sold. Yeah, it's part ofour culture. And so finding ways

(05:11):
to appreciate the gifts thatyou've been given and chosen to really
work on and perfect as anexpert at whatever it is that you
do and that you enjoy doing, Ifeel like you deserve to be paid
well for that expertise andthat there are plenty of people who
need what you sell. And sofinding a way to do that feels authentic

(05:32):
to who you are and your corevalues and it doesn't cause you to
step outside of your integrityor what you want to be doing or make
all These crazy sacrifices to,you know, bend over backwards and
follow someone else's strategyis really important. So I teach my
clients, who are experts andentrepreneurs, how to attract their

(05:55):
ideal buyers by default andhow to close sales quickly so that
they can get to the supportpiece and the fulfillment piece faster
and really spend all of theirtime focused on helping those that
they were put on this earth tohelp. And then also on the back end
of that, optimizing each stepof that process to be easier and
more efficient and moreproductive and more enjoyable for

(06:17):
them so that they're not justdoing things the same way because
that's how they've always donethem or because that's how they expected
it should be to do them, butbecause that's how they love doing
it, and it's what works bestfor them, and it's what takes the
least amount of effort andsacrifice and all of those things.
So that's really where myspecialty lies, is on the sales side,
but with a holistic view ofpeople and who we are and what we

(06:42):
need.
Yeah. I mean, co sign that.Like, yeah. I think we. We get so
much messaging in the worldwhen it comes to sales of how it's
supposed to look like, feellike, be like. And often I feel like
a lot of that noise is verybro marketing, like, very male, masculine.
I always think about, like,how, as women in general, the way

(07:06):
buy things often isn't fromthat space. It is truly from value,
connection, and, like, thatcompassionate empathy. Like, all
of those things, right? Like,I will buy a pair of shoes because
my friend said they'reamazing, right? Like, I don't need
a commercial that just isshoving down my throat that I should

(07:26):
buy these shoes. I needsomeone that I can relate to. I need
someone that I trust. And itfeels very different than when I'm
bombarded with some ads thatApple or somebody has said that I
should buy something. Right?Like, it's just. It's just a different
vibe. And I think we bothrelate to that. But sales, when you're

(07:47):
living with chronic illness, Ifeel like there's just a layer that
we've added on to that, that Idon't think the common thing I hear
from people who have chronicillness who are starting, they're
just starting, is they cannotdo. Do it the way they've been told
that they have to do it.Right? Like the. You know, you've.
What are some of the things,Justine? What are some of the things

(08:09):
you've heard people come intoyour world and be like, I've been
running my business like thisand doing sales like this. And you're
like, please don't. That's whyit's not working. Like, no. Yeah.
Well, first, it's verypersonal, right? Like when people
say business is not personaland like, that's a lie. It is the
most personal, especially whenyou sell services because you're

(08:35):
not selling something that'sdetached from you. It is you. It
is a part of who you are. Andit is a. It is your style. It is
your personal brand. It is allthese things rolled into it. And
so just to go back to yourpoint about women versus men or compassionate
sales tactics versus BROMarketing, it's what it really comes

(08:55):
down to. And there have beenmultiple studies like Harvard, Stanford,
multiple universities havestudied this. Women sell on average,
more than men by 5 to 20%. Andthat's not because of gender, in
my opinion. It is actuallybecause of the gender norms. So women

(09:18):
are predisposed to want tohave deeper conversations. Men are
more predisposed to get to thelogical, factual. Very like, to the
point, Kurt.
Yep.
End point. And so they don'twant to spend as much time hearing
about someone's background orlearning about their needs and preferences

(09:39):
because they see it as, I havea solution. You are in trouble. You
need it, so buy it. And womenare like, I have a solution and you
are in trouble. But let's makesure that it fits you before you
buy it. And that one extrastep. Step. It's really interesting.
As a sales trainer ofthousands and thousands of people
over the years, I have noticedit probably takes five more minutes,

(10:04):
like it's that simple, to justgather a bit of understanding about
that person to solidify thatthey are a fit, to qualify them truly
on every level, and to makesure that it's sticky. Right? Because
we can sell. That's theproblem with the style, where it's
very lodging and matter offact, you're selling them something

(10:26):
on paper. And if it's nottruly aligned, the likelihood that
they'll stay around is verylow versus someone who is emotionally
charged when they make thedecision. And they have clear lines
of sight between this is whatI feel, what I believe, and what
I need. And this is what yourbrand stands for and how it can help

(10:46):
me specifically. They havemuch more of an attachment to that
outcome. And so they want tostay with you. And in fact, they
will fight to stay with youmore than they will fight to leave,
which is the opposite with thevery logical sale. And so we do buy
with emotions and Back it upwith logic. That's how the human
brain works. And we do need tofeel supported and cared about. And

(11:10):
especially today, to yourpoint, we are bombarded with messaging
from big companies that aretelling us buy now. And, and we're
not sure who to choose. And sowe do default to the recommendation
of our friend or the review onAmazon quicker than we will default
to an ad that tells us thatthis cheeseburger is the one for

(11:31):
you. Like, we aren't sure andwe're skeptics more so ever than
before. So when it comes tothe nuance of the chronic illness
overlaid with that and how wehave to think differently, it's with
all of it that's, it's sort ofthat part overlaid with how you sell.

(11:51):
Because you're not the onlyperson in the equation, but also
neither is your buyer. So whenyou're taking the time to care about
that person who's buying andyou're taking the time to think about
what they need and what wouldwork best for them and what they
care about and value, oftenyou don't reflect that back on yourself.
Like, you will tell yourfriend, oh, you can totally do this.

(12:15):
You're amazing, you'rebeautiful, you're wonderful, you're
smart. But then to your ownself, it's very self deprecating.
It's, you're not good enough,you're not trying hard enough, you're
a big old failure and all ofthese things. And so we need to turn
back the care that we reflectto our buyer back on ourselves in
how we sell to make theexperience enjoyable for both sides.

(12:38):
Yeah, I mean, it's. One of mycoaches says, you cannot sell what
you hate. Like, you cannot dowhat you hate. Like, if you hate
sales, you're not going to begood at sales.
Like, like, well, here's here.I will make a tweak to that statement
and say, you cannot sustain.
Oh, there you go.
Something that you hate.Because I'll use the example. This

(13:00):
is a parallel. I have been ona health journey for about a year
where my body has changed manytimes over the years, mostly due
to having children and alsohaving chronic illness. But one of
the reasons that my body haschanged recently is being in perimenopause.
My hormone levels arechanging. All the things are happening
right. My metabolism is slowerfor some reason. I look at pizza

(13:23):
and I gain five pounds. Idon't know what's going on. And you
would think that all the nightsweats help me shed the weight, but
no you think they don't?
They don't.
They don't. So I have. Youknow, I've been on this health journey,
and I've struggled with it.And when I was talking to. I had
all these people that weresupporting me. I had a personal trainer

(13:43):
and a nutritionist and amental health therapist and all of
these people. And my therapistone day asked me, she said, justine,
why are you trying to lose theweight? And I was like, because I
want to feel better in mybody, and I want my jeans to fit,
to be honest. And she waslike, okay, but, like, what's the

(14:08):
deeper reason? And I was like,I don't think I have one. I'm not
sure. And so we worked on itfor a couple of weeks. We kept having
sessions, talking about it,like, let's try to get to the root
of it. And then one day I justblurted out, because I hate myself,
like this. And she was like,that's it. And I was like, that's

(14:28):
what? And she's like, thereason why it's not working, because
you're coming at it from aplace of resentment for your body.
You're like, I hate my body.And it's not doing what it's supposed
to be doing. It's not treatingme as well as I've treated it, and
et cetera. Versus, if you cameat it from a place of, I love my

(14:49):
body. I want to nourish itwith really good food. I want it
to last for as long aspossible. I want to treat it well
and, you know, fill it withall of the nutrients and all of the
things and feel satiated andall of that. It totally changed my
perspective. And I think a lotof times when we approach sales,
we come at it from the sameway where we think, I hate that I'm

(15:10):
not getting paid well. I hatethat my business doesn't work for
me or my. You know, it's. I'mresentful of the fact that I've put
in 20 years becoming an expertat this thing, and nobody is valuing
it. And you have thisnegativity that's just underlaid.
And every action you take,it's like, ugh, just make it work.
Versus I love what I do somuch. I am so excited to bring it

(15:35):
to more people. I see thisperson who needs it, and I can't
wait to talk to them about it.I can't wait to give them at least
some clarity and potentially asolution. And, like. And this is
the part where you don't wantto Be as personally connected to
the outcomes. You just want toshow up and be helpful in terms of
helping people make a decisionthat fits them. And when they say

(15:58):
this isn't the right fit, youshould probably be in agreement.
It's like being in arelationship where one person's madly
in love and the other one'skind of neutral. That's not a relationship
you want to be in. You wantboth people to be like, you're it
for me. Not like, well, you'reokay for now until something better
comes along. You want all ofyour people to be all in with you.

(16:20):
And when they're not, there'sobviously a disconnect, and you either
need to work through it or youneed to accept that they're just
not the right fit and move tothe people who are the right fit.

(17:54):
I preach the same thing I tellmy clients all day long. It is so
important to approach it howwe're talking about it. Because if
you don't, you can't, youcannot keep a business. I mean, you
just won't. I think I've hadclients come into my space as well,
feel the same way. And becausethey've approached it, they've even

(18:16):
built a business that theydon't want that way. Right. They've
built a business that theyhate. And they're like, I can't keep
doing this. And like, thereason why people, we hear a lot
of this right now in thecoaching space, why a lot of people
are burning down theirbusinesses, it's not because that
they aren't good at what theydo. They just never really fell in
love with it enough to do itfrom that place. Right. You know,

(18:36):
I'm saying, so I feel likewhat you're saying is like, it should
serve somebody. Somebody.Listen, if you didn't listen to me,
listen to Justine. Like shesaid it, let's, you know, connect
with that. However, to yourpoint about the chronic illness piece
around, like, we will get, andI'm. I'll raise my hand as completely

(18:57):
vulnerable moment. I havetotally been in that place where
I am willing to give all ofthat compassion and self love to
my clients, to my process. Andthen at the same time, I'm on the
other end beating myself upabout not being good enough, not
this, all of these things,right? And I think to your point,
like, you have to turn thatcompassion on you. And when we were

(19:20):
talking, you know, you weretelling me initially before the show,
like, how you kind of came outwith your chronic illness after years
being in business. And I Waslike, this is funny. Like coming
out with chronic illness. Itsounds funny, but what are some of
the fears and misconceptionsthat kept you silent about coming
out about your chronic illness?

(19:42):
Yeah. Oh, my gosh, there areso many. I mean, anything that we
notice is different about ourselves.
Yeah.
There's fear behind that.Like, I am different from this person
and therefore I'm going to bejudged for that. Or there's going
to be some sort of assumptionbased on certain things. Like when
someone says that they havekids versus don't have kids, there

(20:05):
are assumptions that are made.Like, people without kids have more
flexibility. And some of thoseassumptions are true and some of
them are false. Right. Like,people without kids have more flexibility,
they have more disposableincome, they have more free time,
they have more whatever. Like those.
That's what you think, right?
That's your assumption. Right.And I know some people who don't

(20:28):
have kids who have none ofthose things.
Yeah, exactly.
And then I also know peoplewho do have kids like me, who have
all of those things, like.
Yeah.
And so, you know, you thinkabout it. As soon as I come out and
say this thing, there's goingto be assumptions made because there's
also with chronic illness,although I don't think I've met anybody
who doesn't have somethingthat could be considered a chronic

(20:51):
illness, like anxiety is achronic illness. There's a lot of
things that are included inthat bucket. So it's kind of broad.
But when I think about it, Ithink, you know, my fears around
the ones that I have inparticular, because I have to get
infusions every month and Ihave certain. What's the word for
it? It's like certainlimitations. Like, there are certain

(21:13):
days where I'm very tired or Ihave physical mobility kind of issues
that come into play ordifferent things, or I get debilitating
headaches. And so there's likethese moments where I know, but no
one else knows what goes on.And a lot of people don't know me
and how I show up yet whenthey meet me. And so when they see,

(21:36):
oh, she has multipleautoimmunes or chronic illnesses,
the assumption is she's lessreliable. She is not going to be
there when I need her. Youknow, she's not going to be able
to help me because I can'trelate to her because I don't have
those things. And so she'sprobably built her business in a

(21:57):
soft way to accommodate all ofthe things that she's got to deal
with. Where I really want togo hard and, you know, hit the ground
running. And I have noperceived limitations to what I can
do. And, and those were someof the fears that kind of initially
prevented me. It wasn't like Iwas wanting to not share it. It was

(22:20):
more that I didn't find anopportunity where contextually it
needed to be there. And so itwas sort of like a lie by omission
when people would say, youknow, tell me about yourself. I wasn't
going to lead with, hi, I havemultiple autoimmunes. Like, right,
yeah, it wasn't part of mybrand. It wasn't anything that I
felt like needed to come intothe conversation. And then once I

(22:42):
started realizing there was aperiod of time where I was having
a lot of flare ups, I wasbetween medications, I was going
through a really tough seasonin my life. And I just remember very
vividly thinking to myself, ifI don't proactively say something,

(23:02):
people are probably going tobe concerned, like the people who
know me. So I should probablysay something and just warn them,
like, this may be nothing. Itmay be something you might notice
that I'm offline at thesetimes or like, I'm going to have
to go in for this procedureand I'm going to be out for two days.
If you need something, youneed to do this, like kind of giving

(23:22):
instructions. And that's whenI started to say, why don't I just
get ahead of it so that when Ihave to do this, I don't have to
have the conversation twice.First part being, hey, by the way,
I know we've been workingtogether for a year and I never told
you all these things about me.And now I also have to tell you,
paired with that, that theseare things that you would have never
expected but are coming upversus just being open and being

(23:44):
like, yeah, I've got somethings and here they are. And if
it ever becomes something thatwe need to talk about, then we'll
talk about it. And that's kindof how I lead now is just by being
open. I don't talk about itall the time still because again,
it's not part of my corebranding. It's not part of things
that I think everybody needsto know. I talk about it very openly

(24:06):
and especially in settingslike this where I'm invited to share
about my background and mystory. And I do feel like it is a
part of who I am.
Yeah, I mean, yeah, it is.It's not a black and white situation
when it comes to like when youunveil. It sounds so funny, but when
you unveil, oh, I have achronic illness. And I appreciate

(24:29):
what you're saying aboutknowing when you want to share that.
I'm curious to know that whenyou did start telling people, what
was their response and wereyou surprised by it?
I was very surprised by it. Alot of people mirrored what I told
them in themselves. So when Iwould say, I have a chronic illness,

(24:53):
and they would be like, well,I have. Fill in the blank. So it
was a way to relate, Right?When you say something, usually people
who care about you or that arein your circle of trust will try
to find a way to relate toyou. So when someone loses a friend
or something like that, andthey're like, you know, my friend

(25:13):
just passed away. It's like,oh, yeah, I lost my grandpa last
year. Year. You know, like,we're trying. We're not saying that
to overshadow the thing thatyou just shared. We're saying that
as a way to try to relate toyou and show you I kind of get it.
I care about you. I've feltsimilar ways before. So you can trust
me to open up to me and toshare that. So I was really surprised

(25:35):
when I said, I have chronicillness. And a lot of people who
I never thought would havealso had chronic illnesses were like,
same. And I was like, wow,okay, that's interesting. Or when
I came out again withneurodivergence and said, I have
adhd. And then people arelike, oh, my gosh, I have social

(25:56):
anxiety. I also have adhd. Ihave dyslexia. I have, like, all
these things would come outand it was again, like, I think their
way of trying to show it'sokay. I kind of understand. I don't
have the same things that youhave or the same experiences that
you have, but I can relate toyou. And it made a lot of my connections

(26:18):
stronger with a lot of people.
I mean, yeah, that's a. That'sto your point, because we started
off with, you know, we look atthings that make us different, and
those fears makes us, like,stop from, you know, sharing. But
the things that make usdifferent often are the things that
make us connect with oneanother. Right? So it is like, that's

(26:41):
a fear. So relatable. We soget it. We've all been there. But
I also just can't help butthink, like, yeah, we all have some
of the same fears. We are allover here in the background being
like, I don't want to tellnobody about this, like, they don't
need to know. And then one dayyou say, and then you're, you find
yourself, oh my gosh, I'mtelling somebody else about this.

(27:01):
You're like, oh, my goodness.The difference is that we are always
like, defined by are thethings that actually can bring us
together is what I just heardjust in that story.
Yeah. And there were a lot ofpeople who also were like, do you
need anything? I wish I knew.You know, like, there was a lot of
outcry of support with itwhere they were like, oh my gosh,

(27:22):
I would have never known thatabout you. Like, are you okay? What
can I do? And you know, oneperson, I remember this one client
that I had was like, well thenwhy you were in the hospital when
you took that? Like when youresponded to my email, why did you
respond to me like, you didn'tneed to do that. And I was like,
because here's the thing, Ialso have my routines and things

(27:46):
that I like to do. And whenI'm in a hospital bed or getting
hours, long infusions and all,going through all of this stuff,
I don't want to just be bored.Right. And I want that sense of normalcy
in my routine. I love what Ido. I didn't take maternity leaves
with each either of my kids.And it wasn't because I felt crippled

(28:07):
by the demands on my time oranything like that. It was because,
and I tell people this all thetime. I have a client right now who's
like 37 weeks pregnant andshe's like, I'm going to want to
take this 16 week maternityleave. And I was like, guaranteed
you will not. And she waslike, what? I'm like, we are so similar.
You are going to be bored. Daytwo, your baby is going to sleep

(28:28):
like the majority of the timeand you're going to be looking down
and going, what am I doing? Ican only watch so much TV and read
so many books and play so manySudokus. Like, you're gonna want
your thing back and you'regonna want purpose and you're gonna
want to show up for otherpeople. And how that looks might
be different. I didn't want toget on camera right away. Right.

(28:51):
I didn't want to do fullmakeup when I hadn't showered in
three days and had throw up onme perpetually for months at a time.
But I did want to show up inthe way that felt good to me. And
so it was a new normal. But atwork was like my joy. It was that
foundation that I didn't wantto give up and I didn't feel like

(29:12):
I needed to be guilted into amaternity leave that I didn't want.
And the same thing withgetting infusions or being in the
hospital for procedures. Like,I just go and I work. And some of
the time I even sell from thebed to the nurses or the staff or.
Or people there, because Ijust love what I do. I can't help
myself.
Yeah, it is interesting, too,that connects to this other piece

(29:36):
of making sure you're sellingthe right thing, right? Like, making
sure you are in alignment withthe thing that you care about. Like,
you know what I'm saying?Like, because if I'm in bed and I
hate my job, I ain't talkingabout the job, I ain't talking about
it. I don't want to be dealingwith that. Right? So I think. Do
you find that because youenjoy what you do so much, and even

(30:01):
though you're going throughwhatever challenge that you're going
through, it doesn't feel ashard or like a force, I gotta push
through it kind of mentality,because you enjoy it 100%.
If you feel, and I say that, Isay this in every aspect of your
life, not just your offer orselling or business in general. If

(30:22):
there's any part of you thatlongs for a vacation day, from your
friendships, from yourpartnership, from your relate, like,
anything you have going on,from your life in general, from the
gym, like, anything, you'redoing it wrong for you, right? You

(30:43):
should never need a vacation.You should look forward to it. You
should enjoy it while you haveit. But if you're so like, oh, I
can't wait to get through thisweek because I just need a break,
something's not working,that's a red flag, right? Like, if
you're saying to yourself, Ican't wait to go on this girls trip

(31:06):
because I can't wait to getaway from my partner, there's a problem
in your partnership. Youfeeling that way is a signal. Something's
not a fit here. Something'snot working. And usually, again,
this goes back to just notspending enough time with ourselves
these days and not reallyknowing who we are or what we want

(31:32):
and taking in a lot offeedback from people who are not
qualified to give it to us.Like, we should not be taking feedback
from people who have notachieved what we want to achieve
or who have not, you know,gone ahead of us or have an opinion
that's relevant to what we'reexperiencing. Like, it's great to

(31:54):
gather feedback from peoplethat you know like and trust. But
at what point do you actuallylisten to you and your own intuition
and say something's right orsomething's wrong? And so anytime
I feel that sense of, oh, I'mnot looking forward to this thing,
it's not just a statement.It's not like I'm not looking forward

(32:16):
to that. It's a question, whyam I not looking forward to that?
What about that am I notlooking forward to? Because we need
to get to the root of thatthing. And there's so many people
who create businesses becauseit's something in their zone of excellence
instead. Like something thatthey're known for and they're good

(32:37):
at, but they don't wake upexcited to do it. And there's a book
that is called the Secret Doorto Success by a woman who was an
entrepreneur back in the 1920sin the US who, her name was Florence
Scovel Shin. And she says, thesecret door to success is to be so
obsessed with and interestedin the thing you're doing that other

(33:01):
people naturally findthemselves most interested and obsessed
with the thing that you'redoing. And I think that's the key
to it all. When you love itand you can't help but do it, and
you eat, sleep, and breathe itand it comes naturally to you and
it's joyful for you. Peoplewonder. It's like the When Harry
Met Sally. I'll have whatshe's having over and go, what's

(33:23):
up with that person? Versus,like, someone who's just like, I
gotta do another Instagrampost today. And they just, like,
show up and they go throughthe motions, but they're not. Like,
I get to go on Instagram todayand talk about this thing that's
so exciting, and I can't waitto share it. And it's energetically
so different.
Yeah.

(33:43):
And believe it or not, like,be woo or not woo. Having that energy
behind something.
Yes.
Is everything so much yourdifferentiator? Yeah.
Yeah. It is true. It is true.That's interesting. The whole conversation,
a whole different lane ofwhere we. I was thinking. But, like,
it is true. I think ingeneral, there are things that in

(34:07):
our buckets that we do needrestore, we need restoration. We
need all these things.However, I think, to your point about,
like, if you're feeling likeyou need to do something because
you're exhausted by theenvironment that you're in, then
something's not right. Right.Like, I think that's what you're
saying. Like, of course wewant to take vacations. Nothing wrong

(34:28):
with wanting to takevacations. But if you're wanting
to take a vacation because youare emotionally, mentally, in every
way drained from doing thatthing, maybe you weren't doing that
thing. Right? Like, maybe youaren't in that really. Like, maybe
you aren't. You'reauthentically you to the way you
need to be in order for it tobe actually not feeling like you

(34:50):
can't wait to get away from it.
Yeah, I will say there's nomaybe in that. Like, that is the
truth of it. Right. Andthere's another podcast, the Smart
List podcast, that I lovelistening to. And in one of the episodes,
Will Arnett says, the minuteyou try to be authentic is the minute

(35:10):
you failed to be authentic,because you can't try to be who you
are. You just are that person.And so the minute you're trying to
be like, I was just trying tobe authentic, well, if you were trying
to do it, then something isbeing manufactured there. I'm just
trying to make my businesswork. You shouldn't have to try to

(35:30):
make it work. Right? Like, inthat respect, you show up and you
do it and it clicks. And whensomething's not working, you're like,
why isn't it working? You'requestioning it, you're evaluating
it. You're looking forpatterns, you're iterating, you're
testing other things. And thatwhole process of building a business,
a lot of people startbusinesses who probably shouldn't

(35:53):
or aren't ready to becausethey come at it thinking, this is
something other people told meI should do, where I saw other people
building businesses similarly.And I thought, yeah, why not give
it a shot? Versus I'munemployable. Like, that's how I
feel about my business. I amunemployable. And I am so good at
sales. Nobody is better thanme. And it's not coming from a place

(36:17):
of ego. It's coming from aplace of certainty and practice and
expertise and coachingthousands of people and hundreds
of clients and doublingpeople's revenue over and over. It's
proof. It's patterns, it'spersistence, it's all the P's. I
love alliteration, so I'm herefor it. But it is literally all of
those things. It's passion.Like, I show up in my business every

(36:38):
day going, I love this somuch. I want to invest my free time
listening to podcasts andlearning and growing. I want to read
books, I want to talk to otherpeople. I Want to spend time researching
online. I want to spend timewith my clients. I want to be the
best, and then I want to getbetter the next day. And I also understand
the more that I learn and themore that I do, the less that I know

(37:00):
and the more curious I becomebecause I find all these gaps, and
instead of feeling plagued bythem, I think, how exciting that
this is just the beginning,and I have so much more to learn
and do and so much more to seeand grow into. And that, to me, doesn't
feel like a big, heavy load tobear. It feels like an exciting journey

(37:26):
I get to take. And the moreexcited you are by the idea that
you're only getting started.Like, I'm 10 years in. Some people.
A lot of people don't evenmake it this far.
Yeah.
And I'm like, I can't wait tosee what the next 40 years bring
me. And my husband's like,yeah, a lot of people are not like

(37:46):
you. They want to retireyesterday, and they don't want to
work. And I'm like, I willwork forever in some capacity, volunteering,
helping, doing the work. Like,I just love it. You cannot stop me
from working. It's my favorite.
Yeah. And, you know, it'spowerful to know that about yourself.
Like, to know what is yourthing, why you enjoy your thing,

(38:10):
why it's your thing. Right.And not be moved to believe that
it's not your thing. Like,yeah, like, you know, I think we.
We can sometimes be like,wait, is that really? Like, we can
allow other voices to crowdout our own? And we do that, too.
We do that too frequently.Like, we. We allow too many voices
to start questioning what weinnately know. I know. I'm totally

(38:32):
guilty of that myself, beinglike, no, I don't just love podcasting.
I shouldn't make podcasting abusiness. Like, that's not a real
Nikita. It's a thing like.Like, you know, like, it's not.
Yeah.
It's just one of those things.So I love how passionate and how
certain you are, and I love,like, how you said your confidence.
And it's not ego certainty.And that is a powerful shift of thought.

(38:55):
And of course I have ego. Ijust want to, like, put that out
there. Everybody does. Like,I'm not sitting here going like,
there's no ego in my work.There's lots of ego in my work. There's
lots of ego in everything thatwe do, especially the things that
we're good at. And we knowwe're good at because that's what
helps us persevere and that'swhat gives us that drive. It's a

(39:16):
lot of our actions are drivenby our ego and wanting more and demanding
that of ourselves and pushingthrough. And one of my number is
probably my number one rule ofselling. I teach it to all of my
clients and everybody who willlisten to me. So everybody here listening
is never be outsold. And I'mnot just talking about in a sales

(39:38):
conversation, I'm talkingabout in life. Like when you are
set on something and you'recertain this is for me, this is the
path, this is what I do. Don'tlet other people unsell you the minute
you're outsold because peopleare going to sell you their ideas
all day long because it's easyto do it and it's fun to do it right.

(40:02):
So we are competitive bynature. We want to get our thoughts
and ideas out there. We wantto win. That's just part of the drive
of being a human. And so whenpeople are outselling you, again,
that is a red flag. How did Iget to the point where they are more
sold than I am? So when you'reselling your offer, you definitely

(40:22):
don't want to be outsoldbecause any sort of objection or
hesitation is going to causethat sale to to die. Because you're
going to easily be outsold,which looks like immediately jumping
to a discount when peopleobject on price or someone saying
it's just not the right timeand you going, yes, I totally understand.
Just let me know when is theright time. That sale is dead. They're
not coming back to you. Youdid not try to work with them like

(40:46):
you were outsold. And that'sokay. You just need to know when
that's happening. So whensomeone says like to you or to me,
your chronic illness is goingto hold you back.
Oh my God.
I immediately say that. And Iviscerally am like yes, you're like
immediately like. And I tellmy clients this all the time. I'm

(41:06):
like, tell me anything youbelieve. Because I am a salesperson,
I've gotten really good at notbeing outsold. Like you can't unsell
me on my core beliefs and youcan't outsell me on things that I
believe about myself or that Iwant. And so the minute I'm sold
on something, you cannot flipme. Like it does not matter what
it is. That's why it's verychallenging for my husband to be

(41:26):
married to me. Because onceI'm sold on pizza for dinner, that's
what we're having like thereis no unselling me. And I think more
people need to get to thatplace of fierce belief, certainty
and putting a line in the sandand saying, I can't be outsold on
this thing. When someone saysI can't do it because of my chronic

(41:47):
illness, I go, I believe Ican. Watch me. When they say this
isn't the right offer for me,I'm like, I don't believe that. Tell
me why you think so. You know,like I'm getting curious and I'm
pushing back not because I'mtrying to coerce someone, but because
I can't be outsold.
Yeah, it's. It kind of goes tothe point that we were kind of thinking

(42:09):
about too is like when you areat the top of I. I feel like when
you're living with chronicillness, what appears on the outside
can appear. It's invisible.Most chronic illnesses are invisible.
I know we talk about this in alot of different ways. When it comes

(42:30):
to chronic illness, chronicpain, it's invisible. You can't see
it. But to your point ofearlier in the, in your story of
being like, yeah, I'm livingwith this. Other people are living
with these things and stillfunctioning, highly functioning and
not. It doesn't appear thatyou're struggling. It doesn't appear
that you're doing all fancy,you know, you're like on the clouds

(42:52):
apparently, but you're stilldealing with what you're dealing
with. And I think to this partof the conversation about not being
unsold by what you believeyou're capable of is an important
part of the conversation. Howdoes someone who does struggle with
self belief, who does strugglewith confidence and also because

(43:13):
maybe they were didn't alwayshave chronic illness and they just
all of a sudden one day wokeup and was like, okay, this new stuff
is going on and has shookentheir foundation. How would you tell
them to like get back to thatplace of being not able, just that
confidence, that certainty?
Well, I think it's more. Andfor context, I have had chronic illnesses

(43:38):
since before I had a businessand for many years of my life, more
than half of my life. And soI've never had my business without
a chronic illness, just asI've never had my business without
being a parent because I waspregnant with my first baby when
I first launched my business.And so I tell people it's hard because

(44:01):
in those scenarios I don'tnecessarily know that I'm the most
equipped to give advice tosomeone who just found out yesterday
that they have this reallydebilitating condition. Because I've
had 20 years plus to get usedto everything I've been going through
and integrate practices andcoping mechanisms and systems into

(44:23):
my life to make it so that Ican thrive with my chronic illnesses.
And I think that there's partof it that it. It does just take
time, yes, to build thosethings. And I. And my favorite definition
of happiness is it's the deltabetween expectations and reality.
And so when you expect it tobe really hard, and it's not as hard

(44:48):
as you thought, you're prettyhappy, right? But when you expect
it to be like it always was,or to come easy or to not have any
hiccups or issues, then yourreality is different and it's harder
than you thought it would be,and everything falls apart and you
feel like a failure every day,and you had no idea that this was

(45:09):
how it was going to be andthis is how hard it was going to
feel, then your happinessdramatically decreases. So I think
the first step is to reallyunderstand and set those expectations.
Set that bar low, right?Because you don't know. And so it's
like when you go to arestaurant and they say it'll be

(45:30):
15 minutes, and you wait anhour for your table, you're pissed,
right? You're like, why didyou tell me 15 minutes? All you had
to do was say an hour and thenI would have been fine. Yeah, but
if they tell you it's an hourand you get in 15 minutes, you're
like, this is the bestrestaurant I've been to all year.
Like, it's now your favoriteplace. You can't wait to go back.
And that's how you have totreat it, I think, is set the bar

(45:54):
low and be like, you knowwhat? I have no idea what I'm about
to expect. So it might bereally hard, it might be really easy.
I don't know. So I'm justgoing to assume that I'm going to
have to make some significantchanges to my lifestyle. I'm going
to assume I'm going to needmore time. I'm going to assume this,
that, and the other. And ifyou can talk to people who've had
similar experiences and say,hey, I just got diagnosed with the

(46:17):
same thing you got diagnosedwith what happened for you. And it
might, again, might not be thesame. They might come at you and
say, it was super easy andgreat, but you have to take those
experiences and decide foryourself, like, how do I want to
prepare myself so that I cangive Myself a better reality than
what I expect so that I cankeep my happiness at the level that

(46:41):
feels right for me. And thenthe second part of that is just taking
the time to understand as youmove through it. These are the things
that I'm noticing are notworking. Just like in a business,
these things are not working.These things are harder, these things
are easier. Okay, how do Iadjust and create systems that support
me? And after a certain amountof time, you'll notice the patterns

(47:04):
and you'll be able to makeadjustments in a more permanent way,
and you can support yourselfin the ways that you need. But through
it all, I mean, givingyourself grace and taking the time
that you need. And everybodyis different and not expecting that
because Jenny over here tookone month to get all her stuff in
order, and she's just livingher dream. And then, you know, Casey

(47:26):
over here had to spend 17months going through all the mud
and the muck and having aterrible time. That either one of
those is your guaranteedoutcome. You don't know. So you just
have to kind of go with theflow and see how it is for you.
Yeah, I think you hit that onthe nail. I mean, there isn't a wrong

(47:50):
or right way I feel, to yourpoint about being authentic. Either
you are you or you're not. AndI think in the journey of chronic
illness, and if you happen tobe in a business or starting a business,
you just have to give yourselfpermission to experience whatever
it is you have to go throughto get to the other side ultimately,

(48:12):
because it's not in there is.I've talked to hundreds of women
who have similar chronicillnesses, the same label of a chronic
illness, and not a one ofthem, not a one of them are exactly
the same.
Like, we might have, like,little flips.
Of things that we can. Oh,yeah, I experienced a little bit
of that. But no one isidentical in this. When I was doing

(48:34):
work to get my. Mycertification as an aroma psychologist,
something that impressed on mybrain so much is that even identical
twins are not identical.
Like.
Like in every sense of theway, they are still absolutely different,
even though they look on theoutside exactly the same. And even
with that, they're not exactlythe same.

(48:54):
Yeah.
And I think we have thatexpectation, right. That running
a business, to your point, is.And living with chronic illness is
somehow one size fits all. Idon't know who brought this into
our world and are thinkingthat, well, if such. And so is doing
a business this way, this isexactly how my business is going

(49:15):
to work. And this is exactlyhow my life is going to work. And
it's like, it can't be. Itcan't be. It doesn't work like that.
Yeah.
In your journey as a salesstrategist, what would you tell to
someone who is working intheir business? They have chronic
illness. They maybe they havefound their flow. They have found,
like, their ebbs and flows.They found some of the systems that

(49:35):
work, and yet they feel likethey're not where everyone else says
they should be. And theythink. And a lot of people feel this
way, oh, it's just because I'mlimited. It's because I'm limited
because of my chronic illness.It's. I'm not where I want to be
because I have this invisible,visible disability pain. What would

(49:56):
you say to that person?
Well, I wouldn't say anything.I would ask, right, like, why do
you feel that way? What proofdo you have? Yeah. You know where.
Show me the receipts. Give methe examples. Instead of making assumptions.
Again, this kind of goes towhat you know. They're being outsold

(50:19):
by someone else's idea of,first of all, what their business
should look like. So that'spart one, is like. Like, why did
you expect your business tolook like that? What made you believe
that it was going to be whereyou're explaining that it needed
to be and is not right? And inwhat ways is it not there? And why
do you think that is? And youget to the root of it pretty quickly

(50:42):
when you ask questions. Justlike you get to the root of what
someone wants to buy when youask questions on a sales call. Like,
you need to be more curiousand less statement driven in all
of your life. When you saidearlier, there's no right or wrong.
Wait, Justine, wait. Let's goback to that.
Say that again.
Say that last part again. Youneed to be more. What? Curious and

(51:06):
less statement driven. Is whatyou said.
Less statement driven? Yeah.Less driven by speaking and more
driven by asking. Your goal isto always listen, to, understand,
not just to others, but toyourself. Understand your body and

(51:27):
why it's not functioning inthe way that you think it should
be. And being an advocate,that's a big part of chronic illness.
I had to advocate for myselfin so many different ways. I don't
like how these meds make mefeel. Well, on paper, they shouldn't
be making you feel that way.And I said, well, they do, so I will
not be taking them any longer.And there were periods where I was

(51:48):
not under any treatment and mybody was literally breaking down.
And it was because I refusedto take certain medications that
I knew were not going to makeme feel good because they hadn't
made me feel good and nobodywas giving me an alternative. And
I said, well, this is betterthan the alternative. I'm not going
to put things in my body thatI don't agree are the right things

(52:09):
for me. And so back to yourpoint about right and wrong, I think
there actually is a right wayand a wrong way, and it's not a mass
application. It's a right wayand a wrong way for each of us. And
so we are her Seth Godin'swords in the book Linchpin. We have

(52:33):
been manipulated andbrainwashed and coerced into believing
a lot of things simply becauseof how our society is set up and
because of how everyone istrying to sell you on their methodology
and their belief system andtheir stuff, right? And so we see

(52:54):
a traditional businesses runin XYZ way, and we think we need
to fit that mold. We're toldthis is the right way to build a
business. What we don't do isget curious, ask ourselves, in what
ways does that fit me? And inwhat ways does it not? And here's

(53:15):
the reason why we don't askourselves those questions, because
we're not trained to askourselves those questions. And we
don't have a lot of the skillswe need to be able to answer those
questions. And so when we askourselves, what about this fits me?
And we're like, well, I knowwhat doesn't fit me, but I'm not

(53:35):
quite sure what will. So Iguess my default will be the thing
that I've been given insteadof how can I find those answers?
And I call that the web ofcuriosity. You ask one question and
then it becomes threequestions, and those three become
30 questions. And you keepgoing down this web of curiosity
until you get to your answer.And it takes time and it takes skill.

(53:57):
But a lot of people live intheir head and they theorize about
what could work. And they havelots of great ideas for what they
want to do. Very few of themexecute on those ideas or those theories
because they're waiting forclarity, which is actually the opposite

(54:19):
of what you need to be doing.Clarity comes from action and execution.
You do not get clear onwhether or not your sales message
is going to land until youshare it with your ideal buyer and
they say yes or no. You do notget clear as to whether this thing
you've set up in your businessto support your chronic illness is
the best thing for you at thismoment until you implement it and

(54:42):
go, yeah, that did work, but Ididn't like this part of it, or that
worked 100% exactly the way Ianticipated, or that didn't work
at all. And I need to scrapthat and find a new idea. But instead,
we spend time in our mindstrying to get clear and perfect and
build these things that arereally just thoughts and ideas. They're

(55:05):
not substantiated or validatedby actual proof. And a lot of us
are missing the proof.
Yeah, that's the thing. I lovethat you said that, because I think
the biggest thing is, like, wewant certainty without action.
Yeah, that sounds crazy.
Like, when you actually saythat out loud, you're like, wait
a second. Like, you want toknow that something 100% is a thing,

(55:29):
but you're not willing to takethe action to find out. Well, it
doesn't even matter. Itdoesn't even matter if you don't
do the action. It is such apowerful thing to be able. And it
is a skill, I think, Justine,I think it's a huge skill, as you
mentioned, to be able to askthe question, not be afraid to ask
the questions, not to doubtyour doubts. Like, if you have doubts,

(55:51):
then figure them out. Like, dothe research. Doubts are questions.
Lean in. Figure it out. And Ithink the world, to your point and
to that point itself, we havebeen bombarded not to think, think.
We have been trained not tothink. We have been trained not to
do the action behind whatcomes with thinking. Right. Like,
you can think all day long,but until you, like, go about doing

(56:12):
the actions to disprove orapprove, you cannot make a movement.
You cannot make a decision. Ifyou do, you're making it on default
versus on actual informationthat you have seen the proof of.
And I think to your point,that's a huge thing. And that's.
That's definitely true withchronic illness. If anything I've
learned with chronic illness,it's what taught me how to run a

(56:36):
business. It still is thething that teaches me how to run
a business. Because even whenthey say, you can't do this, says
who? Like, says who how? I'malways curious. And I think, to your
point, learning how toadvocate for yourself, learning how
to believe what your body istelling you, learning how to lean
into that. We can take so muchlessons just from the fact of living

(56:58):
with chronic illness. Thatmakes us better entrepreneurs.
Yeah. I can give you a dozenexamples right now of why chronic
illness has helped me so much.First of all, the Advocacy piece
for sure. Advocating for whatI need and what I want and why, and
getting curious aboutlistening and what is coming up and

(57:22):
why that is. Like, why do Ihave a headache today? Is it because
I haven't drank enough wateror is it because I'm about to have
a chronic migraine? Why am,you know, why am I tired today? Is
it because I need certainvegetables or nutrients or fruits
or like something to build meup or I need more vitamin D and I
need to get outside in thesunshine? Is it because I just had

(57:43):
an infusion? Is it because ofthis? And sometimes it's even more
than like, sometimes the whydoesn't matter as much as or if at
all. But like, sometimes thewhy doesn't matter as much as the
what. Like, what am I going todo about it? I feel tired right now.
Okay, what are you going to doabout it? Like, are you going to

(58:04):
rest your body and take a nap?Are you going to push through and
sleep better later? Do youplan on taking some sort of supplement
before bed to try to get amore restful night's sleep? Were
you up late last night? Andmaybe tonight you're going to try
something different likewhat's the action step that you're
going to take based on theknowledge that you have? And I live
by the mantra, of course. Soif I'm like, of course I'm having

(58:28):
a headache because I only hadone cup of water and it's 3pm okay,
then I drink more water. Butif I'm like, I have a headache but
I've been drinking water allday and I've had a lot of water based
food and I do feel like, likeit's probably something else going
on. And then I'm looking at mycalendar and I'm like, when did I
have my infusion or what, youknow, changed about my routine this

(58:51):
week or, you know, what arethe things that I would typically
notice? And I start to getcurious about it and come up with
some solutions. Because justlike in any scenario, you don't just
want to show up to your life,show up to your business with a problem.
You want to show up with ideason how to improve it or make it better
or fix it. You don't want tobe like, okay, I have a headache

(59:13):
today and then that's the endof it. And you just think, so today
is going to be horrible andeverything is going to be hard and
I'm going to just suffer allday. That's not the way that you
want to move Forward you wantto go. I have a headache today. What
am I willing to do about it?What have I not tried? What could
I try? What's worked before?And then how do I get a little bit

(59:35):
closer to a solution? Andsometimes that's taking Excedrin
right away, and sometimesthat's drinking more water and waiting
it out a little bit. Andsometimes that's. Sometimes it's
recognizing. Like, I'm runningon low sleep and my body is just
tired right now, or I'm on mymenstrual cycle.
I need to go to bed.
I need to just go take a nap.You know, like, you'll feel it. And

(59:57):
I think the more you practicethis, because it is a practice and
that's how we build skills, isto really center in on listening
to what you need in everycapacity across every area of your
life at all points in time.And it becomes a habit. The longer
you do it, it becomes yourdefault. Like, I don't sit around

(01:00:19):
and listen to my body everysecond of the day. I just know it
because I am so used to doingit. So a lot of my doctors, which
I have so many specialistsbecause I have so many different
things, I'll go to them andI'm like, here's what's happening.
Here's what I've noticed.Here's what's changed. Here's what
I think needs to happen. Whatare your thoughts? And every time

(01:00:42):
my doctors are like, you areso aware of your body and what is
going on. Like, I trust you tobring me things and to ask me and
push back on me because you'reso in tune with your body and your
needs and all of those things.Like, I wish everybody would do that
more. Yeah. And I think a lotof people want to help us and they

(01:01:05):
want to support us. But whenyou go to the doctor and you're just
like, doctor, I have aheadache every day. You need to help
me. Right. Because the ideabehind that, too, it's really helpful
to displace responsibility forour own selves to feel better. Like,
it's not my job. I'm not adoctor. It's not my job to diagnose

(01:01:28):
my headaches. So I don't needto think about it. I just need to
go and say, fix me. But whatthe doctor is thinking is, I can't
help you without moreinformation. If you just walk into
a doctor's office and you say,I'm having chest pain, and they're
like, get out the VFITpaddles, We gotta get this person,
you know, like this procedure,you would be like, this doctor is

(01:01:49):
a hack. Like we can't, I can'tgo to this doctor. Who would do that.
A doctor says, tell me more.Yeah. What are your symptoms? They're
inquiring so that they can getto the root of it to figure out is
it heartburn, is it a panicattack, is it a heart attack, is
it a cardiac event? Like, andto what extent are those things happening
and what do you need fromthere? And we need to start treating

(01:02:12):
ourselves like that in everyrespect, business and life.
Yeah. I mean that's such agood example, especially with the
doctor. Right. Because eventhey have information that's outdated.
But you're the one living inyour body. Like most medical information
out there is about a middleaged white man. Like that's the research.

(01:02:34):
Like it's not based on womenand it's definitely not based on
women of color. So likethere's. So you have to be the person
that knows you best. And toyour point, that is a skill. That
is something you have to getcomfortable with. And bringing that
to the table, that's how youbecome an advocate. That's how you
become your best advocate. AndI believe you're also saying that's

(01:02:56):
how you become a goodsalesperson is by knowing yourself
and knowing the people you arewanting to serve 100%.
And that what you said therewith comfort is the key. Because
anything that's unfamiliar isgoing to be uncomfortable. It's out
of our realm of expertise ornormalcy or understanding. And so

(01:03:19):
there's a gap.
Yeah.
And anytime that we feeluncomfortable, uncomfortable, I don't
know why I have a headache.And just going back to this example,
it's like, of course you don'tknow. It's not a problem that you
don't know. Now it's time toget curious so that you can help
and support yourself and youcan get clear on some things that

(01:03:40):
you're feeling, you know. Andthe same thing happens with even
writing messaging and like theuse of AI. I talk about this all
the time. AI is not meant to.You don't type in. Write some great
social posts. For me as asales coach, it's going to give you
garbage because it doesn'tknow anything about you. Right. The
way to use AI is to say,here's a post I wrote as a sales

(01:04:04):
expert. Tell me the thingsthat you notice are different about
this compared to things youmight find in a Google search. Extract
the uniqueness from this ashow it pertains to my brand and apply
it to my podcast episode, ortell me the three things that stand
out most to you about this andwhy, and you start using it for prompting,

(01:04:29):
curiosity and supporting youto be better at your job so you can
iterate faster and better.It's not meant. You know, I heard
a really interesting podcastepisode about education and they
were talking about, should wegive students AI to support them
in their education? Becausethe way things are moving, they have

(01:04:50):
access to these tools andthey're going to use it whether we
approve of it or not. And thewoman said so brilliantly. She said,
absolutely. It's like acalculator. You can't take tools
away that have already beencreated and are available and are
going to be used the minutethat they're out of this environment.
Right? Like as soon as they gointo a job, they're going to use

(01:05:11):
ChatGPT or any other AI toolto go write content. So don't inhibit
them from doing that. But whatwe should do is have them write the
essays with AI and then comeinto school and use their human brain
to dissect those articles. Todo what we're asking what I was just

(01:05:34):
saying we should ask chat, GBTor any other AI tools to do, which
is evaluate it. Why is thisgood? Why is this not yet done? What
about this stands out to me?What about this feels unique and
interesting? What about thisdoesn't feel complete and using and
training ourselves to bebetter problem solvers and to develop

(01:05:57):
common sense and the abilityto think critically, skills that
humans are so good at, likethings that we want to train the
next generation to be able todo instead of relying on AI to do
for them them. We need to usethe tools just like we need to use
medications to help us in someway shape or form with chronic illnesses

(01:06:21):
that pop up. But instead ofjust saying, oh, I always take this
medication, or like, I'm justgoing to be on this medication for
life, you take the medicationto help you manage your symptoms
while you also, if you're nota big fan of it, or you're noticing,
like, this medication makes metake these other three medications,
which has happened to meseveral times. You start to ask yourself,

(01:06:42):
like, what would it take toget off this medication? Could I
adjust my nutrition and haveone less medication? Could I change
something about my lifestylethat would make this easier for me
to navigate? Could I have aprocedure that would help me and
what's available to me? Whathave other people done? And you do
research and that is again, toYour point Point, a form of advocacy.

(01:07:05):
You're showing up and you'reasking the questions and you're thinking
critically and findingsolutions for you. So it all kind
of comes full circle back towhen something doesn't feel quite
right, when something's off,when you feel like it's just not
working, or you can't wait toescape, or there's resentment building.

(01:07:25):
Those are all clear signs thatit's not the right solution for you.
That doesn't mean it's not theright solution for someone else.
But who cares if it is? Theminute you recognize it's not right
for me, that's when you needto step in and say, why not?
Yeah.
You don't necessarily need toknow what might work. Better yet,

(01:07:46):
you just need to understandwhat about that isn't working. So
I can start to look and getcurious about what's available to
me as a solution and start tojust check things off the list until
I get to one that feels better.
Yeah. All of that is like,good stuff for life. And like business.

(01:08:09):
I mean, I am a huge believer.I see it all the time like, business
is personal, like we said atthe top of this conversation. And
on top of that, the two lanesof. I feel like personal development
and growth. I feel like anentrepreneurship. Not everyone can
be an entrepreneur. Trust me,I know this. But if you do choose
to be an entrepreneur and youfeel like that's who you are and
that's what you do, the growthyou experience in that space comes

(01:08:33):
from all of these steps ofbeing curious and not judging yourself
for being curious, not being.Not beating yourself up for trying
something that didn't workexactly how you thought. I mean,
if I did that to myself whenit comes to, like, my chronic illness
stuff, I don't know if I wouldstill be here. Right. I think it's
an important piece to be like,you know, you're not always going

(01:08:55):
to get it right. One of thethings that I. You're saying there's
a lot of change. I think we'reall kind of aversive to change. But
even with this conversation,of all the little things you can
do, just start with just beingcurious. Like, if that's the one
thing you can figure out islike, get out of being. Just taking

(01:09:15):
things for face value. Becurious. I have phrasing that I always
love asking people, like, whatthey would like, how they can reframe
statements into questions.What is a favorite question that
you think will help someone,like, get out of the. Taking things
for face value? And being andlike stopping their brain from being

(01:09:38):
dead end thought processes tomore open.
Well I think it's as simple aswe talk, just adding a why in front
of the statement instead ofsaying I have a headache. Why do
I have a headache? Instead ofsaying my lead gen system isn't working,

(01:09:58):
why isn't my lead gen systemworking? Or what about it isn't working?
But more important than thereframe because I think that part
is actually pretty easy. Ithink most people know how to shift
a statement into a question. Ithink where most people struggle
is remembering to do it.Because we go through the day, all

(01:10:19):
day, every day makingstatements to ourselves internally.
Like I think there's someresearch about how it's like 9,000
statements a day that we maketo ourselves. So our brain is wired
to make statements, not askquestions. And so to teach yourself,
I as someone with ADHD who'sterrible at developing new routines

(01:10:41):
by default, like I have totrain myself to do anything new and
go out of my comfort zone inany way. And especially because I
found coping mechanisms forchronic illness and I have a busy
business and I have kids andall the things I have had to create
redundancies in order to getit to work. And so more than what's

(01:11:03):
the reframe for me, it's howam I going? What is one thing actually
is a better phrasing. What isone thing I can do to remind myself
to be curious every day? Andthen you test that thing for a week
and you see if you actually doit. So for me, one example, if anyone
wants to borrow this, who'sstruggling with the curiosity, I

(01:11:24):
love an end of day wrap up ora first day wrap up. So like if you
are at the top of your day, Ilove habit stacking. So if you're
like I have coffee everysingle morning, I don't get started
to my day without coffee.Okay, great. So when you're having
your morning coffee, askyourself what's one way I can be
more curious today? Or what'sone thing that didn't work for me

(01:11:46):
yesterday? Or what's one thingI'm looking forward to changing today
or something and tie aquestion to that habit. Or for me,
all of this really startedwith setting an alarm in my phone
for because I have a prettyconsistent bedtime routine. So I
would set an alarm for myphone five minutes before bed and

(01:12:06):
I would brush my teeth andwhile I was brushing my teeth, which
I would normally do whenever,like now I'm like, I'm doing it five
minutes before bed everysingle night. And that allowed me
that alarm going off was like,brush your teeth. Ask yourself, what
happened today and what couldI change for tomorrow? And that was
as simple as that. And then Iwould have a little post posted on

(01:12:27):
my computer screen that Iwould put up at the end of the day.
That was my little routine. Ikept it near my desk. I would put
it up and it would say, like,what's one way you can be curious
today? And I would just, like,my screensaver on my computer, as
crazy as this sounds would be,how can you be more curious today?
There were multiple visualaudio reminders that were going on

(01:12:48):
in my life that were like,okay, how can I be more curious?
I even created a little systemwith where I went to the dollar store
and I got all these littlestickers of different colors. And
when I was curious aboutsomething that was health related,
I would give myself a blueone. And if I was curious about something
that was work related, I wouldgive myself a gold one. And I would
allow myself to just buildthese little fun, gamified ways.

(01:13:11):
And you just do it until itworks. You try a bunch of different
things. Again, you need to becommitted to. I want to be more curious.
I know that's going to help mein my life and business until you
decide that if you're justlistening to this and going, nikita
and Justine are wild. Like,they're just. They are like, cracking

(01:13:32):
the whip on me. And I refuse.Like, I don't want to be a part.
You're not gonna be curious,right? Like, it's not something that
you want to do. But the minuteyou're like, these ladies make a
lot of sense. I probably needto adjust some things. Okay, what
am I willing to try? Andagain, like, kudos to you just for
asking the question, becauseyou're starting the whole process

(01:13:52):
by being curious. And I tellpeople all the time, I have become
such a great human beingbecause I'm so good at sales. Because
as a salesperson, I have tothink about the other person before
I think about myself in theway that I teach sales. As a salesperson,
I have to live in curiosity.As a salesperson, I have to check

(01:14:16):
for alignment. As asalesperson, I have to spend quality
time with people. And so a lotof the things that I do as a salesperson
make me a better partner. Theymake me a better mother, they make
me a better friend. Becausethe way that I sell is all reflective
of my core values and how Iwant to show up in the world. So

(01:14:37):
it's an experience extensionof me. And so when I'm perfecting
these skills, I'm thinking I'mperfecting my ability to be a great
support person for somebody inneed. Like, when I hear I had someone
in my life recently who lost aloved one, and my typical response,

(01:14:58):
the one that we've been fed,which we talked about earlier, is
like a point of resonance, islike a, I'm so sorry I lost so and
so. And in some ways, that iskind in a way to do not support them.
Right?
Yeah.
But the. What's the mo. Ithought to myself, what's the most

(01:15:18):
helpful thing I could do forthem? And the answer was, I'm not
sure, because I don't knowwhat they want or need. And I came
to the conclusion that mostpeople, in terms of. In, like, a
place of grief in their life,also don't know what they want and
need because they'reprocessing something that's new and
unfamiliar and hard anduncertain and all of the things.

(01:15:40):
And so instead of saying, ifyou need anything, let me know, or,
I'm here for you, which putsthe burden on them, I just do the
thing that I think would behelpful for them, like showing up
with a meal or offering tohelp them with something or asking,

(01:16:02):
you know, is it okay if. Andthen fill in the blank. So for some
people, it's like, is it okayif I swing by and drop off? Or whatever,
instead of just like, goingand giving them a casserole when
they have 900 casseroles intheir fridge already, and they're
like, please don't bother me.
Right?
So it, like, starts with, whatdo I think will be helpful? Let me

(01:16:22):
validate this with thatperson. And let me just. And if they.
And also adding disclaimerslike, I always. When someone's. And
this is a very particularscenario, but when someone's operating
a situation of grief, I willsay something like. And you don't
have to respond just to givethem the permission, like, I need
to be alone right now, and Idon't want to respond. And sometimes

(01:16:45):
they don't. And I don't takeit personal. I'm like, hey, I can't
imagine what you're goingthrough. Happy to give you dinner.
Not sure if that's somethingthat would be helpful for you. Just
let me know if you want it.And if not, no need to respond. That's
like, one example. And then ifthey're like, dinner would be great.

(01:17:07):
I wouldn't just make what Iwant to eat. I Would say, okay, what
would be something you wouldlike to eat today? And if you don't
know, I'll order you a pizza.So again, I'm giving them options,
but like, not forcing theminto it. I'm making it easy for them
to decide. You can default topizza and be like, pizza's fine.

(01:17:29):
Or you can be like, I reallywant tacos from this place that's
an hour away. And I'm like,done. I'll drive there and I'll go
pick those up for you. I'lldoordash them or whatever, right?
And you figure it out. Andthat's the same thing in a sales
conversation. When someone'slike, I'm not getting sales. I'm
not just like, okay, time torun a webinar. Let's do it. I'm like,

(01:17:49):
why? What's happening? What doyou want to happen? What have you
tried so far? Like, I'm reallysitting with them and getting all
this information. And then Ifigure out, like, this person hates
events. I would never tellthem to sell through webinars. They're
gonna be terrible at it and.
Have the worst time.
Like, as soon as they're like,I just love being in person with
people. I'm like, cool, great.What are some ways that you've done

(01:18:12):
that before? They starttelling me more information and I'm
like, let's do that. Let's trythat. I had this one person who he
lived in this rural area andhe was so far from the city. I said,
what's your favorite thing todo to sell? And he's like, honestly,
I love grabbing a coffee inthe city. It's like a two hour drive.
I love grabbing a coffee inthe city and walking through different,

(01:18:33):
like, art galleries and thingsand just like meeting people who
share my values. And he was alifelong coach, so he could literally
coach anybody and was justlike, I just love, like talking to
people. When I get into aconversation and I notice an opportunity,
it's just natural for me. ButI live so far out of the city and
I'm like, okay, well what areyour options? And we talk through

(01:18:53):
it and we came up with thisplan that once a month on a Friday,
when he had a lighter scheduleand it was a lighter flow of traffic,
he would drive up to the cityin the morning, first thing, and
he would grab a coffee andwalk through town and go to different
galleries and meet differentpeople. And that was just like a
non negotiable part of hissales strategy and routine because

(01:19:13):
it filled him up and worstcase, he would have a great day,
really good energy, lots totalk about, lots of conversations.
And on the best case scenario,he would get multiple clients from
his conversations andrelationship building. And then outside
of that, it was like, well, Ican't rely on one day a month to
go meet people, so how can Ialso create those experiences? And

(01:19:36):
for him, because being inperson, what's the best next step?
It was to figure out how do Icultivate, how do I take some of
those characteristics of thatexperience and infuse them into what
I can do, which is show uponline. So it was, let's have an
open talk with a featuredartist, and they come on, you know,

(01:19:57):
we can put play with theseideas and build an environment that
suits you, that fits you. Andmaybe some of it, like that example,
is ideal and some of it's lessthan ideal.
Yeah.
But it's what you have to workwith. And I think giving yourself
again that grace and cuttingyourself a little bit of slack and
getting creative and curiousabout what your options are, he could

(01:20:19):
either choose to move so thathe could have the experience all
the time, which is, again, achoice, or continue to be where he
was, but make it work for himin the way that he found to do that,
or that we work together tofind it. And that's the name of the
game really is like, you haveto decide where your priorities are.

(01:20:41):
And if you're like, once amonth is not enough for me, then
you're probably not living inthe right place and you probably
need to make some moresignificant adjustments. But in the
meantime, you're not justgoing to blame and shame yourself
and do nothing and make noprogress. You're going to make it
work while you find betteralternatives. And that's another
thing to learn is through itall, you're still making it work

(01:21:03):
for you. You're still findingwhat's right for you for now, and
accepting it's not alwaysgoing to be this way, but it needs
to be this way right now forme to get to where I want to go.
I'm not just going to sit hereand say, suffer until that happens,
because there's too manythings between now and then. And
you deserve to have a goodexperience in life and in your work.

(01:21:25):
Yeah, such a good. So manygood points in there. Justine, if
someone wants to get connectedwith you or be in your world, learn
more about you, how can theydo that if they're doing it online?
Well, it's funny, I will oftenanswer this question and say, if
you listen to podcasts, thenyou should probably, probably check
mine out, which is People OverProfit. That's the name of my show.

(01:21:47):
But I will also say I am amillennial and am really good at
marketing and selling. So ifyou Google Justine Beauregard, my
website is going to be thefirst one that pops up. My entrepreneur.com
articles are going to pop up.My LinkedIn profile is going to pop
up. Like, there are probablyso many of us, but it's me that's
going to be at the top ofthose search queries. So you can

(01:22:08):
find me pretty easily. But mywebsite is just my name. And you
can find me on Instagram atJustine Beauregard Coach, and on
LinkedIn under my name aswell. So it's pretty easy to find
me.
Sweet. We'll have all that inthe show. Notes. One last question
before we close. This is aquestion I've been asking people.
What is one thing that youused to believe was true, that you

(01:22:32):
no longer believe is true?
That it takes time. I don'tthink time is the metric that I subscribe
to. Because, you know, we canbe sold again on many ideas. And
the minute you tell yourselfit takes time, it will, because that

(01:22:56):
is what you've told yourself.That's what you believe. The minute
you tell yourself doesn't takemuch time at all. You start to notice
a much faster outcome. Like,I've gotten on calls with people
that I just met, and 45minutes later, they're paying me
$5,000 in cash over the phone.Done deal. And it's because my belief

(01:23:21):
is it doesn't take time. Ittakes skill. It takes knowing. It
takes curiosity. It takesintention. It takes connection. And
so the minute you tell. Watchwhat you tell yourself. Be careful
and mindful about the storiesthat you believe and subscribe to,

(01:23:43):
because they will often becometrue, even if they don't need to
be. So anytime you tellyourself something, just make sure
that you're not reporting itlike the news, that you're actually
like, do I want to believethis? Do I want to be outsold on
this idea or not?
Okay, that's a good. I lovehow you ended that, though, is like,

(01:24:05):
do you want to be sold onthis? Because some. Right. Because
ultimately you might want tobe sold that it takes time to give
yourself permission. And ifyou aren't that kind of person, you
might want to be sold like,no, it don't take that much time.
Yeah.
So it's really about again, toour whole, whole point of this whole
conversation. What's authenticto you. What is you.

(01:24:25):
Yes.
So I love it. Okay. Thank youfor being on. I so appreciate it.
Thank you so much for havingme. It was so great.
That's a wrap for this episodeof Business with Chronic Illness.
If you would like to start andgrow an online coaching business
with me, head to the ShowNotes to click a link to book a sales
call and learn how to makemoney with chronic illness. You can

(01:24:48):
also check out our website@wwcraftedtothrive.com for this episode's
show notes and join our emaillist to get exclusive content where
I coach you on how tochronically grow a profitable business
while living with chronicillness. Until next time, remember,
yes, you are Crafted to thrive.

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