November 13, 2024 • 33 mins
How can embracing change and technology redefine the future of hospitality? In this episode, Sven Goosen, Chief Operating Officer of Yotel, reveals the transformative power of tech in enhancing guest experiences and operational efficiency.
Key Takeaways:
- Learn about the importance of a holistic tech stack and the role of customer interaction platforms like Zendesk in improving communication and satisfaction levels.
- Understand the balance between automation and personalized service, and how Yotel is leveraging AI to enhance guest interactions while maintaining a human touch.
- Regular tech stack reviews ensure alignment with business needs. Yotel's approach involves cross-departmental collaboration for continuous innovation.
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
At some or other point, you'll have a query.
You'll have a frustration wheresomething's not working and you
need to chat. And you click onthat chat button and you dread
when you start seeing the 3little dots moving and someone
or something is talking to you,and your frustration level goes
to the roof very quickly.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
From Hotel Tech Report, it's Hotel Tech Insider,
a show about the future ofhotels and the technology that
powers them.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
On this episode, we speak with Sven Hossen, the
chief operating officer ofYotel. This global tech forward
brand includes 23 properties allover the world that are managed,
leased, or franchised. One keyto Sven's success as a leader is
listening to feedback across alllevels of the organization, and
you'll want to hear his adviceon how to build a culture that
(00:49):
celebrates new ideas. I like tostart the conversation by
getting an understanding aboutwhat you do at Yotel as well as
the brand itself. So if youcould tell me a bit about the
company, a bit about your role,your areas of responsibility,
and and the things that you'reworking on.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
Great. Thank you very much, and thanks for having me
on the podcast today. So I'm thechief operating officer of
Yotel, and we currently operate23 properties from the West
Coast of the US in San Franciscothrough to our newest property
that will open at the end ofthis year in Ginza in Tokyo, and
(01:35):
that is across our managedleased and franchised portfolio.
We, as a hotel company, arebased out of London, but we have
regional offices across the USas well as in Asia. And my
responsibility is for theopening and the transitions as
(01:55):
well as the ongoing managementof all hotels within the global
portfolio, as well as the humanresource element that impacts
our business globally.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
How long have you been at Yotel?
Speaker 1 (02:08):
So I'm into my 8th year with Jotel, having just
completed 7 years with thecompany. So I've seen a huge
trajectory as we've expandedboth pre- and post COVID in
terms of geographic expansion,as well as the launch of our
long stay brand, Yotelpad. Andtogether with that, we've seen a
(02:30):
lot of change over the last 7years in terms of technology as
we've grown, and we've had to berather agile in terms of our
expansion and choosing the righttech partners depending on the
growth of the company.Obviously, as a small
entrepreneurial company, thetech requirements were very
(02:53):
different to what they aretoday, having 23 properties
across the globe.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
Can you tell me a bit about the tech stack? What would
you consider your most integralsoftware partner? And how do you
think about composing that techstack as the company changes?
Speaker 1 (03:09):
So, I think the, what I call the mothership of any
hotel, would be the PMS, theproperty management system.
That's the starting pointbecause that's what we use on a
daily basis, whether it be forfront of house or back of house
operations. That's where all theintegrations come into, together
with our websites in terms ofdistribution. So that's the most
(03:32):
integral part for me, and that'swhat, you know, at the end of
the day, it's the central systemsystem that we use to be able to
better manage our hotels andmonitor our key metrics. As we
run our businesses globally,we'll drive our average daily
rate, our occupancies, ourrevenue per available room.
And the PMS is, probably,although the most central
(03:56):
system, it's probably the mostbasic answer to you or the
easiest answer. But at the sametime, our customer relations and
our guest engagement tools aregrowing in importance and today
are probably just as importantas the PMS and our website in
terms of distribution. Becauseonce we've acquired the guest,
(04:17):
we then need to maintain themand to build that loyalty, and
there's always a cost ofacquisition. So I think it's not
just a case of the PMS being thecentral system from a day to day
operation, but in terms of thelongevity of the business and
growing as a global portfolioacross those managed, leased,
and franchised properties, theway we interact with guest
(04:40):
engagement and online sentimentanalysis is growing in
importance in this day and age.Especially post COVID, people
are becoming far more demandingin terms of service, and they
want resolution immediately.
And there's very littlepatience, and that then speaks
to the loyalty piece and speaksvery heavily to the tech piece.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
Well, I'd like to double click into the tech stack
a bit. What vendor are you usingfor your PMS?
Speaker 1 (05:10):
So we operate with 2 PMSs, one being Opera Cloud and
the other one being StayinTouch. So our transit hotels, so
Yotel Air, which is more of aproduct that is sold by hour
rather than by overnighttraditional stays, That has an
hourly functionality in terms ofthe sale of rooms by blocks of
(05:34):
hours. So we stay in touchthere, and then we use Opera
Cloud in our city center andlarger properties and long stay
market. But we're also workingon developing that hourly
functionality together withOpera as we move forward.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
How do you think about purposely composing your
tech stack? At what point do youconsider adding a new vendor, or
is there a point where youconsider offboarding a vendor
because you're not using enoughof the functionality to make it
worth the price?
Speaker 1 (06:07):
I think Yotel, being an entrepreneurial company
that's gone through dramaticchange in the last 7 years and
dramatic growth, that's exactlywhat we've had to do. We've had
to reinvent ourselves. We've hadto ask ourselves difficult
questions at times in terms ofour our tech stack. We've chosen
partners that are either legacypartners and software, which is,
(06:32):
again, nothing new. Everyone haslegacy products.
But it's about asking ourselvesand really doing a deep dive
into what it is that we requireand whether our partners are
offering us the best solution.So, you know, you've got
existing relationships. You'vegot best in class products.
You've got suppliers and vendorsthat are willing to tailor to
(06:54):
your specific needs, and it's acombination of all of that that
results in the adequate andappropriate tech stack at that
point in time. Now what thatrequires from us is a lot of
agility, and we need to lookourselves in the mirror and do
that, you know, post analysis,that post mortem on whether
(07:17):
something is working or not.
Because as we grow, we might belarge enough to make a change,
but we might not be large enoughto make the next step. So it's a
case of timing and, you know,constantly revising. And 2 of my
great industry mentors said tome early on in my career that if
(07:37):
you're green, you grow, and ifyou're not, you rot. And I
always keep that in mind interms of the tech stack. And the
other one was, if you always dowhat you always did, you'll
always get what you always got.
And if you keep those mantras inmind when you're looking at your
tech stack, and it's okay tochange direction. It's okay to
(08:01):
make mistakes at the end of theday, but being able to identify
where your shortfalls are from atech perspective and make the
changes and do those in a soundmanner, looking at what it is
that is required from yourportfolio at that point in time
is all positive. It doesn't needto be negative. Change is
(08:22):
constant. We know that.
Our guests and our stakeholdersare changing on a constant
basis, and that requires us tochange on a constant basis.
Speaker 3 (08:31):
Do you have any sort of regular cadence where you do
a review of the tech stack, or,you know, is that part of your
annual cadence, or is it on anad hoc basis?
Speaker 1 (08:42):
No. It is constant. So, internally, we have a
program which is about constantand never ending innovation. So
that obviously requires peoplefrom all the silos. So it's not
just operations on its own.
It's together with finance andIT. It's together with the brand
and the digital team, thecommercial team, the finance and
(09:03):
the development team, andworking with our owners on
innovation and bringing roboticsand AI and efficiencies into our
hotel buildings and into ourdevelopments to build smarter
hotels, to build more efficienthotels, which then impacts on
our efficiency and effectivenessof our internal processes,
(09:24):
whether they be brand standards,whether they be standard
operating procedures, serviceprinciples. All of them are
integrated, and they are allintegral to the future of our
brand. And it's not just a caseof doing this on an ad hoc
basis. It requires a constantview, whether it be technology
(09:45):
related to lighting or toventilation, to kiosk check-in,
to the website, to ourdistribution channels and
partners.
It really requires a holisticview, and it is constant, but it
is always done as a committee.It's not done in silos because
if you do it in silos, thenyou're going to run into
(10:06):
problems. So you have to setyourself up for success, and
that requires transparency, andthat requires us to work
together as a team.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
Is there an expectation that all of your
properties use the same techstack? Or do some properties
have some of their own software?Or maybe some of the properties
have amenities that requiredifferent software? How do you
think about that?
Speaker 1 (10:30):
So, obviously, we also have some legacy hotels, so
hotels that are older than ourbrand new properties that we're
launching. So we do deal withdifferent tech stacks or
different vendors, at least, indifferent territories. Whilst we
have our IT brand standard techstack that we try to funnel
(10:52):
everything through forefficiency, for standardization,
etcetera, we do come across,certain stumbling blocks, but at
the end of the day, as long asthe equipment delivers the same
service and serves the samepurpose, then we can work within
(11:12):
that environment together withthat vendor, whether it then
requires us to make a certainamount of tweaks on the back
end, whether we have to overlaya brand screensaver or we need
to make some small adjustmentsin terms of the standard
operating procedure, that can bedone. But for the vast majority,
(11:36):
we have a standardized techstack that we try to adopt
globally, but understanding thatyou do have franchise
properties, you've got legacyhotels that have existing
contracts, existing hardware. Soevery decision that we make at
the end of the day is made withprudence in mind.
(11:56):
We have to be cognizant of theexpenditure. And in a lot of
instances, tech is veryexpensive, so we need to make
the right decision at the righttime to be able to achieve the
best for our stakeholders, andthat is not only at the top
line, but that's at the bottomline as well.
Speaker 3 (12:18):
So going back to the tech itself, are there any other
vendors that you're especiallyexcited about or any vendors
that work really well for youruse case?
Speaker 1 (12:29):
Yeah. So in the last 18 months, we have started
working with Zendesk veryclosely, and we've transitioned
all of our hotels onto Zendeskin terms of our customer
interaction. So we now funnelwhether it be communication
through Facebook, through email,through telephone, through
WhatsApp, etcetera, throughZendesk. And that was a massive
(12:52):
undertaking in terms of thattransition. It's gone
exceptionally well.
There's a lot of benefits fromhaving done that. There's
obviously an adoption periodwhere at the hotel level and at
a head office level, it requiresour crew to change the way that
they do things. And humans liketo take the easiest route, and
(13:15):
it's very easy to create ahabit, and it's difficult to
break it. So there was obviouslya period of adoption, and that
required a lot of focus and timeand attention. But what it has
enabled us to do is to have fullvisibility of the communication
between hotel and guest.
There's a full escalationprocess. We can tailor the SLA
(13:39):
for each of the various types oftickets. It's easy to search for
the tickets. You can do it on amobile app. You can do it on a
desktop.
You've got translationfunctions. So it's enabled us to
communicate far quicker and farbetter with our guests than ever
before. It's linked to a contentcenter, so we can look at the
(14:02):
communication. We can slice anddice the information. We can
decide why it is that a guest iscontacting us, how quickly it
takes us to resolve an issue,whether that be a normal
question, a compliment, acomplaint.
We're able to have far moredetailed reporting and tracking
(14:23):
of those questions and queries.We can then create tailored
content to answer the guest'squery in a library of articles
and information sheets so thatthey get the information they
require and it's at theirfingertips rather than having to
wait in a queue on a telephonecall or speak to a chatbot to
(14:48):
try and get an answer and getfrustrated. And that has
dramatically decreased thenumber of complaints that we've
had. We've had a much higherresolution rate, and we have way
more visibility and reportingthan ever before. We understand
our business now.
(15:08):
We know why people arecontacting us. Is it to make a
reservation? Is it to ask for acopy of their bill? And as a
result of that, we are then ableto go back to our tech stack and
speak to our vendors in terms ofmaking small adjustments on
their side to be able tocounteract a guest having to
(15:30):
reach out to us, where we givethem what they want before they
ask for it. And that's what willenable us to get ahead, to build
the loyalty, to increase ourcustomer satisfaction, which
then improves our online guestsentiment.
Improving the sentiment scorewill drive the ranking. The
ranking then drives thevisibility, and the visibility
(15:53):
then drives the conversion,which, again, is a win win on
the top line for the hotels. So,again, it's all interconnected,
and it's a really excitingjourney that we're going on with
Zendesk. And, obviously, thenext level of discussion with
them is how we bring in AI andwhat AI can actually do for us
(16:18):
in terms of furtherenhancements, improvements,
efficiencies, effectivenessacross the company.
Speaker 3 (16:24):
Can you tell me a bit about 1 or 2 of your business
objectives? Thinking morebroadly, what are you working
toward at Yotel, and how istechnology part of the solution?
Speaker 1 (16:37):
Well, I'm gonna answer it in a way that touches
on some of the concepts that Ispoke about earlier. It's about
being culturally aware andglobally minded. So,
understanding that a cookiecutter approach isn't always
possible, or it's not possibleto the nth degree. And I use the
analogy of the fast foodindustry. So you can't have a
(17:02):
KFC franchise and refuse toserve chicken.
You can't have a McDonald'sfranchise and refuse to serve
burgers. But in each territorywhere they operate, there are
local products that have beentailored to that local or
cultural nuance. So in Dubai,you might have a Middle Eastern
(17:25):
influence on a burger. InGreece, you'll have a Greek
influence on the burger. Andthat's what we need to remember.
We need to maintain the brandstandards and the ethos and the
values of the company, but weneed to be open and agile enough
to make tweaks to our tech stackand to our service delivery and
to our product, that makes thehotel more approachable for
(17:50):
guests and for our crew or ourstaff. So that is what we keep
in mind when we're making thedecisions. The cost of labor
globally is going up. Our guestsare becoming more and more
demanding. They want instantgratification.
They want instant resolution. Sowe know that in terms of choice,
(18:11):
choice is growing on a day today basis, whether it be a hard
brand or a soft brand. So weneed to make sure that our
decisions are based on longevityand about building the brand
awareness and building theloyalty and as a result,
impacting our business as wegrow. So one thing is about
(18:33):
growing our portfolio so that wecan be formidable in terms of an
RFP process for the salesenvironment or for distribution
because we have a hotel in everycity where our corporate client
needs to go. But the other thingis about building the brand
loyalty and awareness so thatour guests are talking about us
(18:55):
in a positive light and that westand apart from others.
So Yotel was quite innovative interms of our kiosk check-in or
our self-service stationcheck-in early on, well before
COVID came and required us tohave a tick forward and low
touch environment. We hadalready ticked that box years
(19:15):
ago. We use robotics within thehotel, whether that be the YoBot
luggage robot in New York, as anexample, or delivery bots in
Miami or in Singapore or inBoston. It's about constantly
evaluating that and decidingwhat is tech forward and what is
(19:36):
just a gimmick. You know, whatis going to bring about
efficiencies?
What's going to bring aboutsatisfaction on the guest side?
What is cost effective? But atthe same time, what is going to
add value to our operation,whether that be for eliminating
a position or whether it be anadded on additional service or
(19:58):
facility. It's not always aclear cut decision in each
territory. It changes from placeto place, but we need to push
our partners and our vendors tobe able to have that eyes wide
open and outward lookingapproach to things instead of
just being, you know, close eyedand focusing inwards on what it
(20:20):
is that we've always done.
We need to challenge ourselves.So we're working on breathing
new energy into all of ourexisting technology. We're
looking at our how our kioskscan be changed in terms of AI
functionality and chatfunctionality. It's a what is
the future of challenging thestatus quo? Because people you
(20:43):
know, competitors are catchingup.
There are new entrants into themarket. There's changing
customer demands. There'schanging customer patterns in
terms of purchasing and in termsof travel. COVID really changed
everything for the world ofhospitality. We had to close the
majority of our hotels, but westill had to keep them
operational because you need toprotect the building, protect
(21:07):
the asset.
You need to flush to avoidLegionella. So it's not a case
of just mothballing a hotel andwalking away and waiting for
COVID to disappear. We still hadto maintain each of these
hotels, and then we had torelaunch the hotels. And, again,
starting from scratch, and therewas a lot of noise and clutter
within the industry because weweren't the only people closing
(21:28):
and opening hotels. Everybodywas in the same boat.
So it's about reinventingourselves and our brands and
constantly challenging ourselvesin terms of longevity and
growth. And one of theinteresting things that I dealt
with recently, and specificallywith regards to chatbots and
virtual assistants is theemergence of AI voices. And we
(21:51):
were listening to, I think itwas 7 or 8 different voices from
Poly. And when we were lookingat leading chatbots for various
purposes, and we were listeningto the voices that AI was coming
up with, and one of mycolleagues asked me to try and
identify which were the fakevoices and which were the real
(22:13):
voices. And I very quickly said,fake, fake, fake, fake, fake,
until I got to one voice and Ihesitated.
And for the first time, I'veheard an automated voice that
was very, very difficult todifferentiate as to whether it
was a real human talking to meor whether it was a bot. And it
(22:37):
was only in at one point in theconversation where there was a
pause, like a human would pauseto think, followed by the
strange pronunciation of oneword that made me realize that
it was also an automated voiceand AI technology. So at the end
of the day, every single one wasAI, but some were really bad,
(23:04):
some were really good, and somewere brilliant. And it's quite
interesting to see thatevolution and the entry of AI
and automated technology intoour industry and into our daily
operations, whether it be avirtual bot that is processing
virtual credit cards on areservation, you know, auto
(23:25):
checking in a group, whether itbe a voice handling guests'
inquiries, all of that is, isinteresting. And, and for me,
the important thing is that oncenew technology arrives and once
you have that initial adoption,it then progresses very, very
quickly.
So I think the next 5 to 10years are super important for
(23:50):
our industry, and it's extremelyexciting to see how quickly
things develop and, you know,how fast things go, the pace of
adoption, you know, who gets onboard first, who is lagging.
That was really interesting tolisten to to those voices, and
it was pretty much a moment ofrealization that this is going
(24:12):
to happen, and it's going tohappen a lot faster than any of
us think. But that's theexciting bit because you need to
change, you need to embracechange. If you don't embrace
change, you end up goingbackwards. And going backwards
is not an option for anyone whowants longevity and to build
customer loyalty.
I think the frustration is thatwhen you go on any app, and all
(24:34):
of us have hundreds of apps onour phones, we interact, whether
it be a purchase through Amazonor Ebay, whether you're trying
to sell something on Vinted,whether you're checking in with
an airline, or you're using anapp at a fast food chain, we all
use them. And at some or otherpoint, you'll have a query,
you'll have a frustration wheresomething's not working and you
(24:56):
need to chat. And you click onthat chat button and you dread
when you start seeing the 3little dots moving and someone
or something is talking to you,and your frustration level goes
to the roof very quickly becauseyou want to speak to a person,
you want to speak to a piece oftechnology that can actually
understand you, that can solvethe problem and help you
(25:20):
instantly. You don't want tospend 15 minutes choosing
preselected drop down optionsthat do nothing but frustrate
you and make your concerns evenmore and more profound, and have
to fight with a piece oftechnology or a chatbot to speak
to a human. And you have to say,Human, human, human, agent,
agent, agent.
(25:40):
That is not what hotel guestswant. That's not what any
consumer wants, and more sosince COVID. So it is important
that we embrace technology, butat the same time, there has to
be a vetting process. So I knowthat there's technology where AI
can manage your entire emailinbox. And maybe I'm just old
(26:05):
school, but I would always onthe side of caution where I
would allow AI to read myemails.
I would allow AI to summarize myemails. I would allow them to
propose a potential solution orresolution or an answer, but I
would always want to make surethat I verified in that adoption
(26:27):
stage that it is actuallyworking correctly. Because what
happens if your AI is hacked andAI is now on autopilot and
making decisions for yourbusiness and impacting your
employees and your customers,and you've allowed that to
happen. And that, for me, is,you know, the knife edge where
(26:51):
we are developing and we'reprogressing as an industry quite
quickly, where previously wewere very traditional and
clunky. Now it's a case of theadoption period and the very
fast paced development andprogress, but at the same time,
how do we maintain thatpersonalized touch and truly
(27:11):
understanding our business andmaintaining our business if we
allow everything to become tooautomated?
So making sure that you don'tallow it to go too far, where
everything is automated and thenyour risk is far greater and
you're reliant upon technology.And if something, God forbid,
something goes wrong, you thenhave no idea how to pick up the
(27:35):
pieces. So you always need tokeep a a certain percentage of
control when you're introducingnew technology to make sure that
this technology is operatingcorrectly, it's right for your
business. And as we saidnumerous times during this chat,
it's important to make sure thatyou're constantly checking and
(28:00):
having a post mortem review ofwhether something is actually
still delivering what you needwhen you need it, or whether you
need to deviate and make achange. So I think it's all a
very, very positive and veryexciting time for our industry
as a whole.
Speaker 3 (28:17):
One last question before we wrap up. I am curious
to hear from you. What is onething that you believe about
technology that your peers orcompetitors might disagree with?
Speaker 1 (28:28):
I think it's obvious that you need technical skill
sets when you're implementingtechnology. Now there's two
sides to the argument, whetheryou need to use a third party or
whether you need in house skilland, and resource. And I think
that over time, we moved awayfrom in house resource and we
(28:50):
outsourced everything. And a lotof third party tech companies
have delivered our tech stackfor years, and we've become
reliant on third party. A lot ofpeople still believe that that's
the way to go because yououtsource, there's less drain on
(29:11):
your resource.
My view, and growing view, isthat perhaps we need to go back
to bringing things in housebecause you then do away with
that redundancy that I spokeabout. There's always spare
capacity. So by having the inhouse resource, you can be more
(29:31):
agile, more flexible. You canensure that you don't have that
excess in terms of systemfunctionality and software that
you don't need, that you'rewasting money on. So I think
that that's probably one of theleading difficult questions
where you've definitely gotthose who support outsourcing
(29:52):
everything and then those whosupport bringing things back in
house.
And at the moment, I'm thinkingabout bringing resource back in
house because that's how you canbe faster, quicker to market,
and you can ensure that it'stailored and that it's
transparent and that it meetsyour needs 100%. Otherwise,
often or far too often, we'rereliant on third party software
(30:17):
and tech suppliers who then runinto, you know, a delay. They
change the parameters, andyou're at their mercy because
you've invested all your moneyand your resource in them, and
you may have nothing to show forit. Whereas if it's in house,
you've got greater control.There is the risk, as with
(30:37):
anything, but I think thatyou've got more agility, you've
got more flexibility, you cantailor make a product and a
solution that is truly what youneed and that it's giving you a
100% functionality and that youare utilizing a 100%
functionality.
So I think that's probably whatI would say in terms of a a
(30:57):
sensitive topic betweendifferent people where there's 2
very clear views.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
Well, I really appreciate you taking the time
to be on the podcast today.Loved hearing all your
experience with technology andand how you're thinking about
finding that right balance. Anyfinal thoughts or anything else
you'd like to add before we wrapup?
Speaker 1 (31:20):
Well, thank you for the opportunity, and I concur.
It was very interestingdiscussing these topics with
you. The only final word that Iwould have is about the concept
of enforced hospitality. Thereis so much choice in the
marketplace today, and, youknow, in terms of technology, if
(31:40):
we need to, as the hospitalityindustry, functionality that
exists in airlines and in fastfood currently far outweighs
what we have adopted withinhospitality. So we need to
(32:01):
remember that enforcedhospitality is where our clients
are staying with us because theydon't have a choice.
Soon, there will be way morechoice in terms of hotel brands
that provide true hospitalityand true tech innovation, and we
(32:22):
either need to get on board orwe're going to suffer the
consequences. So I think thatwould be my parting thought.
Speaker 3 (32:29):
Great. Well, thanks so much, Sven. Really appreciate
you taking the time.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
Pleasure.
Speaker 3 (32:34):
Look forward to hearing the episode when it
comes out.
Speaker 1 (32:37):
Great. Thank you very much.
Speaker 3 (32:38):
Thanks. Take care.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
That's all for today's episode. Thanks for
listening to Hotel Tech Insiderproduced by hoteltechreport.com.
Our goal with this podcast is toshow you how the best in the
business are leveragingtechnology to grow their
properties and outperform theconcept by using innovative
digital tools and strategies. Iencourage all of our listeners
to go try at least one of thesestrategies or tools that you
(33:03):
learned from today's episode.Successful digital
transformation is all aboutconsistent small experiments
over a long period of time, sodon't wait until tomorrow to try
something new.
Do you know a hotelier who wouldbe great to feature on this
show, or do you think that yourstory would bring a lot of value
to our audience? Reach out to medirectly on LinkedIn by
searching for Jordan Hollander.For more episodes like this,
(33:27):
follow Hotel Tech Insider on allmajor streaming platforms like
Spotify and Apple Music.
At some or other point, you'll have a query.
You'll have a frustration wheresomething's not working and you
need to chat. And you click onthat chat button and you dread
when you start seeing the 3little dots moving and someone
or something is talking to you,and your frustration level goes
to the roof very quickly.
Speaker 2 (00:19):
From Hotel Tech Report, it's Hotel Tech Insider,
a show about the future ofhotels and the technology that
powers them.
Speaker 3 (00:27):
On this episode, we speak with Sven Hossen, the
chief operating officer ofYotel. This global tech forward
brand includes 23 properties allover the world that are managed,
leased, or franchised. One keyto Sven's success as a leader is
listening to feedback across alllevels of the organization, and
you'll want to hear his adviceon how to build a culture that
(00:49):
celebrates new ideas. I like tostart the conversation by
getting an understanding aboutwhat you do at Yotel as well as
the brand itself. So if youcould tell me a bit about the
company, a bit about your role,your areas of responsibility,
and and the things that you'reworking on.
Speaker 1 (01:11):
Great. Thank you very much, and thanks for having me
on the podcast today. So I'm thechief operating officer of
Yotel, and we currently operate23 properties from the West
Coast of the US in San Franciscothrough to our newest property
that will open at the end ofthis year in Ginza in Tokyo, and
(01:35):
that is across our managedleased and franchised portfolio.
We, as a hotel company, arebased out of London, but we have
regional offices across the USas well as in Asia. And my
responsibility is for theopening and the transitions as
(01:55):
well as the ongoing managementof all hotels within the global
portfolio, as well as the humanresource element that impacts
our business globally.
Speaker 3 (02:06):
How long have you been at Yotel?
Speaker 1 (02:08):
So I'm into my 8th year with Jotel, having just
completed 7 years with thecompany. So I've seen a huge
trajectory as we've expandedboth pre- and post COVID in
terms of geographic expansion,as well as the launch of our
long stay brand, Yotelpad. Andtogether with that, we've seen a
(02:30):
lot of change over the last 7years in terms of technology as
we've grown, and we've had to berather agile in terms of our
expansion and choosing the righttech partners depending on the
growth of the company.Obviously, as a small
entrepreneurial company, thetech requirements were very
(02:53):
different to what they aretoday, having 23 properties
across the globe.
Speaker 3 (02:58):
Can you tell me a bit about the tech stack? What would
you consider your most integralsoftware partner? And how do you
think about composing that techstack as the company changes?
Speaker 1 (03:09):
So, I think the, what I call the mothership of any
hotel, would be the PMS, theproperty management system.
That's the starting pointbecause that's what we use on a
daily basis, whether it be forfront of house or back of house
operations. That's where all theintegrations come into, together
with our websites in terms ofdistribution. So that's the most
(03:32):
integral part for me, and that'swhat, you know, at the end of
the day, it's the central systemsystem that we use to be able to
better manage our hotels andmonitor our key metrics. As we
run our businesses globally,we'll drive our average daily
rate, our occupancies, ourrevenue per available room.
And the PMS is, probably,although the most central
(03:56):
system, it's probably the mostbasic answer to you or the
easiest answer. But at the sametime, our customer relations and
our guest engagement tools aregrowing in importance and today
are probably just as importantas the PMS and our website in
terms of distribution. Becauseonce we've acquired the guest,
(04:17):
we then need to maintain themand to build that loyalty, and
there's always a cost ofacquisition. So I think it's not
just a case of the PMS being thecentral system from a day to day
operation, but in terms of thelongevity of the business and
growing as a global portfolioacross those managed, leased,
and franchised properties, theway we interact with guest
(04:40):
engagement and online sentimentanalysis is growing in
importance in this day and age.Especially post COVID, people
are becoming far more demandingin terms of service, and they
want resolution immediately.
And there's very littlepatience, and that then speaks
to the loyalty piece and speaksvery heavily to the tech piece.
Speaker 3 (05:03):
Well, I'd like to double click into the tech stack
a bit. What vendor are you usingfor your PMS?
Speaker 1 (05:10):
So we operate with 2 PMSs, one being Opera Cloud and
the other one being StayinTouch. So our transit hotels, so
Yotel Air, which is more of aproduct that is sold by hour
rather than by overnighttraditional stays, That has an
hourly functionality in terms ofthe sale of rooms by blocks of
(05:34):
hours. So we stay in touchthere, and then we use Opera
Cloud in our city center andlarger properties and long stay
market. But we're also workingon developing that hourly
functionality together withOpera as we move forward.
Speaker 3 (05:50):
How do you think about purposely composing your
tech stack? At what point do youconsider adding a new vendor, or
is there a point where youconsider offboarding a vendor
because you're not using enoughof the functionality to make it
worth the price?
Speaker 1 (06:07):
I think Yotel, being an entrepreneurial company
that's gone through dramaticchange in the last 7 years and
dramatic growth, that's exactlywhat we've had to do. We've had
to reinvent ourselves. We've hadto ask ourselves difficult
questions at times in terms ofour our tech stack. We've chosen
partners that are either legacypartners and software, which is,
(06:32):
again, nothing new. Everyone haslegacy products.
But it's about asking ourselvesand really doing a deep dive
into what it is that we requireand whether our partners are
offering us the best solution.So, you know, you've got
existing relationships. You'vegot best in class products.
You've got suppliers and vendorsthat are willing to tailor to
(06:54):
your specific needs, and it's acombination of all of that that
results in the adequate andappropriate tech stack at that
point in time. Now what thatrequires from us is a lot of
agility, and we need to lookourselves in the mirror and do
that, you know, post analysis,that post mortem on whether
(07:17):
something is working or not.
Because as we grow, we might belarge enough to make a change,
but we might not be large enoughto make the next step. So it's a
case of timing and, you know,constantly revising. And 2 of my
great industry mentors said tome early on in my career that if
(07:37):
you're green, you grow, and ifyou're not, you rot. And I
always keep that in mind interms of the tech stack. And the
other one was, if you always dowhat you always did, you'll
always get what you always got.
And if you keep those mantras inmind when you're looking at your
tech stack, and it's okay tochange direction. It's okay to
(08:01):
make mistakes at the end of theday, but being able to identify
where your shortfalls are from atech perspective and make the
changes and do those in a soundmanner, looking at what it is
that is required from yourportfolio at that point in time
is all positive. It doesn't needto be negative. Change is
(08:22):
constant. We know that.
Our guests and our stakeholdersare changing on a constant
basis, and that requires us tochange on a constant basis.
Speaker 3 (08:31):
Do you have any sort of regular cadence where you do
a review of the tech stack, or,you know, is that part of your
annual cadence, or is it on anad hoc basis?
Speaker 1 (08:42):
No. It is constant. So, internally, we have a
program which is about constantand never ending innovation. So
that obviously requires peoplefrom all the silos. So it's not
just operations on its own.
It's together with finance andIT. It's together with the brand
and the digital team, thecommercial team, the finance and
(09:03):
the development team, andworking with our owners on
innovation and bringing roboticsand AI and efficiencies into our
hotel buildings and into ourdevelopments to build smarter
hotels, to build more efficienthotels, which then impacts on
our efficiency and effectivenessof our internal processes,
(09:24):
whether they be brand standards,whether they be standard
operating procedures, serviceprinciples. All of them are
integrated, and they are allintegral to the future of our
brand. And it's not just a caseof doing this on an ad hoc
basis. It requires a constantview, whether it be technology
(09:45):
related to lighting or toventilation, to kiosk check-in,
to the website, to ourdistribution channels and
partners.
It really requires a holisticview, and it is constant, but it
is always done as a committee.It's not done in silos because
if you do it in silos, thenyou're going to run into
(10:06):
problems. So you have to setyourself up for success, and
that requires transparency, andthat requires us to work
together as a team.
Speaker 3 (10:14):
Is there an expectation that all of your
properties use the same techstack? Or do some properties
have some of their own software?Or maybe some of the properties
have amenities that requiredifferent software? How do you
think about that?
Speaker 1 (10:30):
So, obviously, we also have some legacy hotels, so
hotels that are older than ourbrand new properties that we're
launching. So we do deal withdifferent tech stacks or
different vendors, at least, indifferent territories. Whilst we
have our IT brand standard techstack that we try to funnel
(10:52):
everything through forefficiency, for standardization,
etcetera, we do come across,certain stumbling blocks, but at
the end of the day, as long asthe equipment delivers the same
service and serves the samepurpose, then we can work within
(11:12):
that environment together withthat vendor, whether it then
requires us to make a certainamount of tweaks on the back
end, whether we have to overlaya brand screensaver or we need
to make some small adjustmentsin terms of the standard
operating procedure, that can bedone. But for the vast majority,
(11:36):
we have a standardized techstack that we try to adopt
globally, but understanding thatyou do have franchise
properties, you've got legacyhotels that have existing
contracts, existing hardware. Soevery decision that we make at
the end of the day is made withprudence in mind.
(11:56):
We have to be cognizant of theexpenditure. And in a lot of
instances, tech is veryexpensive, so we need to make
the right decision at the righttime to be able to achieve the
best for our stakeholders, andthat is not only at the top
line, but that's at the bottomline as well.
Speaker 3 (12:18):
So going back to the tech itself, are there any other
vendors that you're especiallyexcited about or any vendors
that work really well for youruse case?
Speaker 1 (12:29):
Yeah. So in the last 18 months, we have started
working with Zendesk veryclosely, and we've transitioned
all of our hotels onto Zendeskin terms of our customer
interaction. So we now funnelwhether it be communication
through Facebook, through email,through telephone, through
WhatsApp, etcetera, throughZendesk. And that was a massive
(12:52):
undertaking in terms of thattransition. It's gone
exceptionally well.
There's a lot of benefits fromhaving done that. There's
obviously an adoption periodwhere at the hotel level and at
a head office level, it requiresour crew to change the way that
they do things. And humans liketo take the easiest route, and
(13:15):
it's very easy to create ahabit, and it's difficult to
break it. So there was obviouslya period of adoption, and that
required a lot of focus and timeand attention. But what it has
enabled us to do is to have fullvisibility of the communication
between hotel and guest.
There's a full escalationprocess. We can tailor the SLA
(13:39):
for each of the various types oftickets. It's easy to search for
the tickets. You can do it on amobile app. You can do it on a
desktop.
You've got translationfunctions. So it's enabled us to
communicate far quicker and farbetter with our guests than ever
before. It's linked to a contentcenter, so we can look at the
(14:02):
communication. We can slice anddice the information. We can
decide why it is that a guest iscontacting us, how quickly it
takes us to resolve an issue,whether that be a normal
question, a compliment, acomplaint.
We're able to have far moredetailed reporting and tracking
(14:23):
of those questions and queries.We can then create tailored
content to answer the guest'squery in a library of articles
and information sheets so thatthey get the information they
require and it's at theirfingertips rather than having to
wait in a queue on a telephonecall or speak to a chatbot to
(14:48):
try and get an answer and getfrustrated. And that has
dramatically decreased thenumber of complaints that we've
had. We've had a much higherresolution rate, and we have way
more visibility and reportingthan ever before. We understand
our business now.
(15:08):
We know why people arecontacting us. Is it to make a
reservation? Is it to ask for acopy of their bill? And as a
result of that, we are then ableto go back to our tech stack and
speak to our vendors in terms ofmaking small adjustments on
their side to be able tocounteract a guest having to
(15:30):
reach out to us, where we givethem what they want before they
ask for it. And that's what willenable us to get ahead, to build
the loyalty, to increase ourcustomer satisfaction, which
then improves our online guestsentiment.
Improving the sentiment scorewill drive the ranking. The
ranking then drives thevisibility, and the visibility
(15:53):
then drives the conversion,which, again, is a win win on
the top line for the hotels. So,again, it's all interconnected,
and it's a really excitingjourney that we're going on with
Zendesk. And, obviously, thenext level of discussion with
them is how we bring in AI andwhat AI can actually do for us
(16:18):
in terms of furtherenhancements, improvements,
efficiencies, effectivenessacross the company.
Speaker 3 (16:24):
Can you tell me a bit about 1 or 2 of your business
objectives? Thinking morebroadly, what are you working
toward at Yotel, and how istechnology part of the solution?
Speaker 1 (16:37):
Well, I'm gonna answer it in a way that touches
on some of the concepts that Ispoke about earlier. It's about
being culturally aware andglobally minded. So,
understanding that a cookiecutter approach isn't always
possible, or it's not possibleto the nth degree. And I use the
analogy of the fast foodindustry. So you can't have a
(17:02):
KFC franchise and refuse toserve chicken.
You can't have a McDonald'sfranchise and refuse to serve
burgers. But in each territorywhere they operate, there are
local products that have beentailored to that local or
cultural nuance. So in Dubai,you might have a Middle Eastern
(17:25):
influence on a burger. InGreece, you'll have a Greek
influence on the burger. Andthat's what we need to remember.
We need to maintain the brandstandards and the ethos and the
values of the company, but weneed to be open and agile enough
to make tweaks to our tech stackand to our service delivery and
to our product, that makes thehotel more approachable for
(17:50):
guests and for our crew or ourstaff. So that is what we keep
in mind when we're making thedecisions. The cost of labor
globally is going up. Our guestsare becoming more and more
demanding. They want instantgratification.
They want instant resolution. Sowe know that in terms of choice,
(18:11):
choice is growing on a day today basis, whether it be a hard
brand or a soft brand. So weneed to make sure that our
decisions are based on longevityand about building the brand
awareness and building theloyalty and as a result,
impacting our business as wegrow. So one thing is about
(18:33):
growing our portfolio so that wecan be formidable in terms of an
RFP process for the salesenvironment or for distribution
because we have a hotel in everycity where our corporate client
needs to go. But the other thingis about building the brand
loyalty and awareness so thatour guests are talking about us
(18:55):
in a positive light and that westand apart from others.
So Yotel was quite innovative interms of our kiosk check-in or
our self-service stationcheck-in early on, well before
COVID came and required us tohave a tick forward and low
touch environment. We hadalready ticked that box years
(19:15):
ago. We use robotics within thehotel, whether that be the YoBot
luggage robot in New York, as anexample, or delivery bots in
Miami or in Singapore or inBoston. It's about constantly
evaluating that and decidingwhat is tech forward and what is
(19:36):
just a gimmick. You know, whatis going to bring about
efficiencies?
What's going to bring aboutsatisfaction on the guest side?
What is cost effective? But atthe same time, what is going to
add value to our operation,whether that be for eliminating
a position or whether it be anadded on additional service or
(19:58):
facility. It's not always aclear cut decision in each
territory. It changes from placeto place, but we need to push
our partners and our vendors tobe able to have that eyes wide
open and outward lookingapproach to things instead of
just being, you know, close eyedand focusing inwards on what it
(20:20):
is that we've always done.
We need to challenge ourselves.So we're working on breathing
new energy into all of ourexisting technology. We're
looking at our how our kioskscan be changed in terms of AI
functionality and chatfunctionality. It's a what is
the future of challenging thestatus quo? Because people you
(20:43):
know, competitors are catchingup.
There are new entrants into themarket. There's changing
customer demands. There'schanging customer patterns in
terms of purchasing and in termsof travel. COVID really changed
everything for the world ofhospitality. We had to close the
majority of our hotels, but westill had to keep them
operational because you need toprotect the building, protect
(21:07):
the asset.
You need to flush to avoidLegionella. So it's not a case
of just mothballing a hotel andwalking away and waiting for
COVID to disappear. We still hadto maintain each of these
hotels, and then we had torelaunch the hotels. And, again,
starting from scratch, and therewas a lot of noise and clutter
within the industry because weweren't the only people closing
(21:28):
and opening hotels. Everybodywas in the same boat.
So it's about reinventingourselves and our brands and
constantly challenging ourselvesin terms of longevity and
growth. And one of theinteresting things that I dealt
with recently, and specificallywith regards to chatbots and
virtual assistants is theemergence of AI voices. And we
(21:51):
were listening to, I think itwas 7 or 8 different voices from
Poly. And when we were lookingat leading chatbots for various
purposes, and we were listeningto the voices that AI was coming
up with, and one of mycolleagues asked me to try and
identify which were the fakevoices and which were the real
(22:13):
voices. And I very quickly said,fake, fake, fake, fake, fake,
until I got to one voice and Ihesitated.
And for the first time, I'veheard an automated voice that
was very, very difficult todifferentiate as to whether it
was a real human talking to meor whether it was a bot. And it
(22:37):
was only in at one point in theconversation where there was a
pause, like a human would pauseto think, followed by the
strange pronunciation of oneword that made me realize that
it was also an automated voiceand AI technology. So at the end
of the day, every single one wasAI, but some were really bad,
(23:04):
some were really good, and somewere brilliant. And it's quite
interesting to see thatevolution and the entry of AI
and automated technology intoour industry and into our daily
operations, whether it be avirtual bot that is processing
virtual credit cards on areservation, you know, auto
(23:25):
checking in a group, whether itbe a voice handling guests'
inquiries, all of that is, isinteresting. And, and for me,
the important thing is that oncenew technology arrives and once
you have that initial adoption,it then progresses very, very
quickly.
So I think the next 5 to 10years are super important for
(23:50):
our industry, and it's extremelyexciting to see how quickly
things develop and, you know,how fast things go, the pace of
adoption, you know, who gets onboard first, who is lagging.
That was really interesting tolisten to to those voices, and
it was pretty much a moment ofrealization that this is going
(24:12):
to happen, and it's going tohappen a lot faster than any of
us think. But that's theexciting bit because you need to
change, you need to embracechange. If you don't embrace
change, you end up goingbackwards. And going backwards
is not an option for anyone whowants longevity and to build
customer loyalty.
I think the frustration is thatwhen you go on any app, and all
(24:34):
of us have hundreds of apps onour phones, we interact, whether
it be a purchase through Amazonor Ebay, whether you're trying
to sell something on Vinted,whether you're checking in with
an airline, or you're using anapp at a fast food chain, we all
use them. And at some or otherpoint, you'll have a query,
you'll have a frustration wheresomething's not working and you
(24:56):
need to chat. And you click onthat chat button and you dread
when you start seeing the 3little dots moving and someone
or something is talking to you,and your frustration level goes
to the roof very quickly becauseyou want to speak to a person,
you want to speak to a piece oftechnology that can actually
understand you, that can solvethe problem and help you
(25:20):
instantly. You don't want tospend 15 minutes choosing
preselected drop down optionsthat do nothing but frustrate
you and make your concerns evenmore and more profound, and have
to fight with a piece oftechnology or a chatbot to speak
to a human. And you have to say,Human, human, human, agent,
agent, agent.
(25:40):
That is not what hotel guestswant. That's not what any
consumer wants, and more sosince COVID. So it is important
that we embrace technology, butat the same time, there has to
be a vetting process. So I knowthat there's technology where AI
can manage your entire emailinbox. And maybe I'm just old
(26:05):
school, but I would always onthe side of caution where I
would allow AI to read myemails.
I would allow AI to summarize myemails. I would allow them to
propose a potential solution orresolution or an answer, but I
would always want to make surethat I verified in that adoption
(26:27):
stage that it is actuallyworking correctly. Because what
happens if your AI is hacked andAI is now on autopilot and
making decisions for yourbusiness and impacting your
employees and your customers,and you've allowed that to
happen. And that, for me, is,you know, the knife edge where
(26:51):
we are developing and we'reprogressing as an industry quite
quickly, where previously wewere very traditional and
clunky. Now it's a case of theadoption period and the very
fast paced development andprogress, but at the same time,
how do we maintain thatpersonalized touch and truly
(27:11):
understanding our business andmaintaining our business if we
allow everything to become tooautomated?
So making sure that you don'tallow it to go too far, where
everything is automated and thenyour risk is far greater and
you're reliant upon technology.And if something, God forbid,
something goes wrong, you thenhave no idea how to pick up the
(27:35):
pieces. So you always need tokeep a a certain percentage of
control when you're introducingnew technology to make sure that
this technology is operatingcorrectly, it's right for your
business. And as we saidnumerous times during this chat,
it's important to make sure thatyou're constantly checking and
(28:00):
having a post mortem review ofwhether something is actually
still delivering what you needwhen you need it, or whether you
need to deviate and make achange. So I think it's all a
very, very positive and veryexciting time for our industry
as a whole.
Speaker 3 (28:17):
One last question before we wrap up. I am curious
to hear from you. What is onething that you believe about
technology that your peers orcompetitors might disagree with?
Speaker 1 (28:28):
I think it's obvious that you need technical skill
sets when you're implementingtechnology. Now there's two
sides to the argument, whetheryou need to use a third party or
whether you need in house skilland, and resource. And I think
that over time, we moved awayfrom in house resource and we
(28:50):
outsourced everything. And a lotof third party tech companies
have delivered our tech stackfor years, and we've become
reliant on third party. A lot ofpeople still believe that that's
the way to go because yououtsource, there's less drain on
(29:11):
your resource.
My view, and growing view, isthat perhaps we need to go back
to bringing things in housebecause you then do away with
that redundancy that I spokeabout. There's always spare
capacity. So by having the inhouse resource, you can be more
(29:31):
agile, more flexible. You canensure that you don't have that
excess in terms of systemfunctionality and software that
you don't need, that you'rewasting money on. So I think
that that's probably one of theleading difficult questions
where you've definitely gotthose who support outsourcing
(29:52):
everything and then those whosupport bringing things back in
house.
And at the moment, I'm thinkingabout bringing resource back in
house because that's how you canbe faster, quicker to market,
and you can ensure that it'stailored and that it's
transparent and that it meetsyour needs 100%. Otherwise,
often or far too often, we'rereliant on third party software
(30:17):
and tech suppliers who then runinto, you know, a delay. They
change the parameters, andyou're at their mercy because
you've invested all your moneyand your resource in them, and
you may have nothing to show forit. Whereas if it's in house,
you've got greater control.There is the risk, as with
(30:37):
anything, but I think thatyou've got more agility, you've
got more flexibility, you cantailor make a product and a
solution that is truly what youneed and that it's giving you a
100% functionality and that youare utilizing a 100%
functionality.
So I think that's probably whatI would say in terms of a a
(30:57):
sensitive topic betweendifferent people where there's 2
very clear views.
Speaker 3 (31:04):
Well, I really appreciate you taking the time
to be on the podcast today.Loved hearing all your
experience with technology andand how you're thinking about
finding that right balance. Anyfinal thoughts or anything else
you'd like to add before we wrapup?
Speaker 1 (31:20):
Well, thank you for the opportunity, and I concur.
It was very interestingdiscussing these topics with
you. The only final word that Iwould have is about the concept
of enforced hospitality. Thereis so much choice in the
marketplace today, and, youknow, in terms of technology, if
(31:40):
we need to, as the hospitalityindustry, functionality that
exists in airlines and in fastfood currently far outweighs
what we have adopted withinhospitality. So we need to
(32:01):
remember that enforcedhospitality is where our clients
are staying with us because theydon't have a choice.
Soon, there will be way morechoice in terms of hotel brands
that provide true hospitalityand true tech innovation, and we
(32:22):
either need to get on board orwe're going to suffer the
consequences. So I think thatwould be my parting thought.
Speaker 3 (32:29):
Great. Well, thanks so much, Sven. Really appreciate
you taking the time.
Speaker 1 (32:34):
Pleasure.
Speaker 3 (32:34):
Look forward to hearing the episode when it
comes out.
Speaker 1 (32:37):
Great. Thank you very much.
Speaker 3 (32:38):
Thanks. Take care.
Speaker 2 (32:42):
That's all for today's episode. Thanks for
listening to Hotel Tech Insiderproduced by hoteltechreport.com.
Our goal with this podcast is toshow you how the best in the
business are leveragingtechnology to grow their
properties and outperform theconcept by using innovative
digital tools and strategies. Iencourage all of our listeners
to go try at least one of thesestrategies or tools that you
(33:03):
learned from today's episode.Successful digital
transformation is all aboutconsistent small experiments
over a long period of time, sodon't wait until tomorrow to try
something new.
Do you know a hotelier who wouldbe great to feature on this
show, or do you think that yourstory would bring a lot of value
to our audience? Reach out to medirectly on LinkedIn by
searching for Jordan Hollander.For more episodes like this,
(33:27):
follow Hotel Tech Insider on allmajor streaming platforms like
Spotify and Apple Music.
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If you've ever wanted to know about champagne, satanism, the Stonewall Uprising, chaos theory, LSD, El Nino, true crime and Rosa Parks, then look no further. Josh and Chuck have you covered.
Dateline NBC
Current and classic episodes, featuring compelling true-crime mysteries, powerful documentaries and in-depth investigations. Follow now to get the latest episodes of Dateline NBC completely free, or subscribe to Dateline Premium for ad-free listening and exclusive bonus content: DatelinePremium.com
On Purpose with Jay Shetty
I’m Jay Shetty host of On Purpose the worlds #1 Mental Health podcast and I’m so grateful you found us. I started this podcast 5 years ago to invite you into conversations and workshops that are designed to help make you happier, healthier and more healed. I believe that when you (yes you) feel seen, heard and understood you’re able to deal with relationship struggles, work challenges and life’s ups and downs with more ease and grace. I interview experts, celebrities, thought leaders and athletes so that we can grow our mindset, build better habits and uncover a side of them we’ve never seen before. New episodes every Monday and Friday. Your support means the world to me and I don’t take it for granted — click the follow button and leave a review to help us spread the love with On Purpose. I can’t wait for you to listen to your first or 500th episode!