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July 2, 2025 31 mins

In this MGMA Insights podcast episode, host Daniel Williams discusses behavioral health integration with clinical health psychologist and consultant Dr. Jonas Bromberg, Psy.D, of Crossroads Health Consulting. 

Dr. Bromberg explains how medical practices can incorporate mental health support and bridge the gap between physical and emotional healthcare. The conversation explores strategies for implementing behavioral health services, understanding the mind-body connection, and reducing mental health treatment stigma. 

Through research and practical examples, Dr. Bromberg shows how integrating behavioral health can improve both patient outcomes and practice efficiency. The discussion covers implementation strategies, billing considerations, and the importance of treating mental health as a core component of patient care. 


Key Takeaways:

  • [01:10] - Dr. Bromberg's Background
  • [05:20] - Understanding Behavioral Health Integration
  • [09:27] - Mind-Body Connection in Healthcare
  • [14:00] - Clarifying Terminology: Behavioral Health vs. Mental Health
  • [18:30] - Billing and Financial Considerations
  • [22:20] - Measuring Success Beyond Revenue
  • [26:15] - Implementation Strategy for Practices

Resources: 

Additional Resources:

Email us at dwilliams@mgma.com if you would like to appear on an episode. If you have a question about your practice that you would like us to answer, send an email to advisor@mgma.com. Don't forget to subscribe to our network wherever you get your podcasts.


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Transcript

Episode Transcript

Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Daniel Williams (00:53):
Well, hi, everyone. I'm Daniel Williams,
senior editor at MGMA and hostof the MGMA Podcast Network. We
have an MGMA Insights episodetoday, and we have a new guest
to the show, doctor JonasBromberg. He's a PsyD, and he's
a principal at Crossroads HealthConsulting. And I had an

(01:16):
opportunity to moderate hispresentation at our recent
summit event.
So many of you may have seen himthere. We just hit it off. And I
was so interested in what he hadto say about behavioral health
integration and how that can beapplied to medical practices. So
we have him on our show today.So, Doctor.

(01:37):
Bromberg, welcome.

Dr. Jonas Bromberg (01:39):
Thank you, Daniel. Thank you for having me.

Daniel Williams (01:41):
And for our visual listeners, we use both
audio and video. I asked you thesame question at Summit. You
have a beautiful background. Andtell us about that. What are we
looking at, and what does thisspace mean to you?

Dr. Jonas Bromberg (01:58):
That's a view of the skyline of Boston,
Massachusetts where I reside,and that's looking across the
Charles River at the part of thecity called Back Bay. Okay. And
it's a city I've been in forover thirty five years and now
call home.

Daniel Williams (02:16):
Wow. That is beautiful. And we talked about
this. MGMA in the last sevenyears has had our annual
conference twice in Boston. AndI told you back in 2018, I was
with a group that had rented outa little yacht, little boat, and
we just cruised around justwhere your images are showing.

(02:39):
And it was so much fun. Andeverybody that was there got
great photos. We went right itwas one of those sunset and
sunset mimosas or something likethat. I don't know exactly what
it was, but it was a lot of fun.And what a beautiful city.
I just I love Boston. And datingmyself a little bit back in the
eighties, I was just a fanaticalfollower of Larry Bird. I just

(03:03):
loved the Celtics, the BirdCeltics, and I actually got to
go there. Not in Boston, but,the Celtics played in Atlanta,
which was closer to where Ilived. And so I drove over there
and got to see them when I wasstill in high school.
So it was a lot of fun. So

Dr. Jonas Bromberg (03:21):
That's fantastic.

Daniel Williams (03:22):
Yeah. So you've been there thirty five years.
That is fantastic. So tell us alittle bit about your background
first. You have a PsyD.
Tell us about maybe a little bitof that academic background and
where you got involved where youwere really thinking about
behavioral health.

Dr. Jonas Bromberg (03:37):
Sure. So PsyD is a type of doctor of
doctoral degree in psychology.It's actually a doctor of
psychology rather than a doctorof philosophy PhD. And the PsyD
model of training sort ofemerged in the seventies as an
alternative to more traditionalacademic PhD type training. And

(03:58):
it was, you know, more of aclinician focused training,
training people to do, you know,psychotherapy, psychological
assessment, you know, hands onclinical practice.
And so that was the type ofprogram I chose. It offered a
lot of practical experiencewhile you're doing your academic
training, and I trained here inBoston. That's what brought me

(04:20):
to Boston and trained primarilyin academic medical centers. And
very early on, I had sometraining experiences in with the
Department of BehavioralMedicine at Boston Children's
Hospital, did some training atthe Dana Farber Cancer Institute
where I worked with children andfamilies that were dealing with
cancer, worked in a cardiologyprogram. There was a joint

(04:41):
program between children's andBrigham and Women's Hospital.
So had a lot of opportunities towork at that intersection of
mental health and medicines ortaking care of the the emotional
life and spiritual life ofpeople that were also being
cared for by physicians for someprimary medical reason. And
that's sort of what got me intointo behavioral health

(05:02):
integration, which I would manyyears later, you know, helped
launch a program at at BostonChildren's Hospital that was
integrating mental healthclinicians directly into
pediatric primary care practicesacross the statewide network of
practices that were affiliatedwith the hospital.

Daniel Williams (05:19):
Okay. So we both have used that term
behavioral health integration.Let's define it. What is that?
What does it look like inpractice?
Just so all of our listenersknow exactly what we're talking
about.

Dr. Jonas Bromberg (05:33):
That's a great question, Daniel, because
it's one of those terms that

Daniel Williams (05:36):
It gets thrown around.

Dr. Jonas Bromberg (05:37):
Umbrella term and, you know, a lot of
different things. You know,there are there are different
models of behavioral healthintegration. There are different
levels of it. And to be veryspecific, you know, it's way of
working. You know, it'ssomething that primary care
tends to be the medical placewhere most of behavioral health
integration happens.

(05:57):
Although, you know, I wasintegrated at Dana Farber, I was
integrated at, you know, on theBoston Adult Congenital Heart
Program, so it can happen inspecialty medical programs as
well as primary care. Butprobably most of it, you know,
is happening in primary care.It's really a systematic way
that the clinical team workswith a mental health specialist

(06:20):
in the practice. Okay. Sothey're seeing common patients,
documenting in the sameelectronic health record, being
able to directly consult witheach other in the moment or in a
scheduled time, you know,follow-up with patients at, you
know, whatever intervals.
And so it's really an idealvenue for treating any kind of

(06:45):
mental health related concernand including substance use
concerns. Primary care is, youknow, one of the main locations
where those problems aredetected, come to light, Parents
especially turn to theirpediatricians first when their
children are struggling withbehavioral issues, emotional
issues. And so it's really anideal location to get involved

(07:09):
in caring for somebody with awith a mental health or
substance use concern reallyearly on. And obviously, you can
get involved and care forsomebody, provide treatment, you
know, early on, it's gonna be aneasier treatment. They're gonna
benefit from it.
You know, it's you change youreally have an opportunity to
get involved early. You know, alot of physicians, they'll take

(07:32):
a wait and see approach if it'snot really interfering with a
person's life because they don'tknow what to do. So, part of
what we did in our program wasprovide a lot of education to
physicians to help them not onlydetect mental health problems
with greater accuracy, but alsoto be able to ask patients

(07:52):
better questions to elicit thatinformation. We taught them how
to conduct routine screeningaround various types of mental
health and substance useconcerns, you know, so they can
really, you know, be that firstline. I mean, that's what
primary care is designed to do,be the first line of care.
And so why not provide mentalhealth in that same way that we

(08:13):
provide physical health? Themind and the body are connected.

Daniel Williams (08:16):
They are so connected and it just it brings
me back to some health issues Ihad about thirty years ago. I
kept having stomach issues. Andafter the second or third or
fourth oscopy that I had, youknow, there were the different
ones that I had, The doctorfinally, after not finding

(08:37):
anything there, coming up on thediagnosis there, really saying,
well, maybe this is more of amental health issue. And maybe
with this integration, justgiving that as an example for
you, if it was alreadyintegrated and you had some a
patient like me coming in withstomach problems and tests being
done and different question andanswer sessions with that

(09:00):
patient, what does it look likeif you have that integration?
Because this went on for, Iwould say, a couple of years
before they finally said, thedoctor just pulled me aside and
said, hey.
We're not good news. We're notfinding anything physically in
your stomach or in that areathere. However, you're still
having a lot of pain and a lotof problems with your stomach.

(09:21):
So what would that have lookedlike if we had had that
behavioral health integrationright off the bat?

Dr. Jonas Bromberg (09:26):
That's a good question. It's very likely,
Katie, that you could havespoken to somebody much earlier
on and gotten some guidancearound managing the physical
symptoms you're having through abehavioral approach or making
lifestyle changes. You know,many medical conditions can be,
you know, helped by lifestylebehavior change whether it's,

(09:48):
you know, exercise or diet or,you know, relaxation or, you
know, doing something to helpcalm the body that's connected
to the mind.

Daniel Williams (09:57):
And that that's what they eventually found with
me. It was very stress related.I was literally stressing myself
out, you know, and just nothandling stress, life, whatever
in a very productive way. So itwould manifest itself, as you
were saying, that mind bodyconnection just having
incredible stomach pain andother things like that. Yeah.

Dr. Jonas Bromberg (10:18):
So it's interesting many what it made me
think about many years ago, Iwas involved in a project where
we created a website to helppeople with migraine headaches
do things to, you know, managetheir conditions, you know, with
self management to teach themself management skills to manage
their headaches. And we did somerig rigorous randomized control

(10:39):
research around this, looked atpeople before we intervened with
them and then afterward. And thereally interesting finding from
that research was while weweren't able to reduce the
reported level of physical painrelated to their migraines, a
lot of different things likefeeling more in control of it,

(10:59):
more confident that they coulddo things to manage their pain,
You know, those scores went upincredibly. Even though when we
didn't change the level of pain,we made people feel better, feel
more confident and capable ofmanaging their pain, which, you
know, led them to, you know,also report a greater quality of
life. So significant findingeven though he didn't change

(11:20):
their physical symptoms andhelped them live That's
wonderful.

Daniel Williams (11:24):
So let's talk about another aspect of
behavioral health. And there aresome stigmas related around
that. Some appear to be goingdown a bit, particularly what
I've noticed anecdotally inreading articles during the
pandemic, people feeling morevulnerable in a way and openly

(11:46):
vulnerable to say, hey, I'mstruggling. I'm feeling sad. I'm
feeling depressed.
I'm feeling anxious about allthat fear that was around COVID
nineteen and issues relatedaround that. Talk about how
having a behavioral healthintegration in a practice can
help perhaps reduce or at leastaddress some of those stigmas

(12:08):
around behavioral health.

Dr. Jonas Bromberg (12:10):
Yeah, no, that's a really important
connection that you're makingthere. And certainly, you know,
the idea that we would convey ata very high level was mental
health is health. Again, themind and the body are connected.
And, you know, we would teachdoctors to say things like, you
know, we're we're just asconcerned about how your
emotional health as we are aboutyour physical health, and we can

(12:32):
address all of that right righthere. Tremendous amount of
stigma around going for help formental health concerns, maybe
even more about substance useconcerns.
And, you know, we live in aworld that has a lot of
different kinds of people in it.Some of them grow up in cultures
where you don't talk about thiskind of stuff, you know, just
naturally. It's not part of whatyou do even when there's

(12:54):
recognition you could benefitfrom that kind of thing. You may
not even recognize it, I guess.But, you know, making it part of
the culture of primary care, youknow, really helps, you know,
convey that message.
You know, every part of yourhealth is why you're here.
Mental health, physical health,all of it. And it just makes I
don't know. I can't cite thepercentage, but it's a lot of

(13:15):
people that get referred to amental health specialist that
never follow-up. And, you know,many people go and, you know,
particularly people that live inrural communities where there's
a very identifiable mentalhealth center.
They don't want it they don'twant their car to be seen parked
in the lot of the health center.Right? They don't want people to
know. But if you're only goingto your doctor, that can be for

(13:37):
any kind of reason. And it justlowers the lowers the bar, makes
it easier.
And again, part of the approachthat we try to help practices
evolve is to say, you know,really so the patients get the
message that, you know, mentalhealth is health and you can
come here for any kind ofconcern, and that's normal. We
wanna care for you in that way.

Daniel Williams (13:56):
Okay. Let's define one more thing because
we've we've used the termsbehavioral health integration.
We've used behavioral health,and then you're also using
mental health. Are those thesame? How are or if they're not,
how are they different?
They

Dr. Jonas Bromberg (14:11):
get used interchangeably. Both of them
can be correct. I would saybehavioral health is kind of a
bigger umbrella term. Mentalhealth might be a large
component of behavioral health,but I also would put in in under
the behavioral health umbrellathings like, you know, lifestyle
change, people that are seekingto reduce weight or exercise

(14:33):
more, change their eatingbehavior. Those would I would
consider those more behavioralhealth issues related to
somebody's behavior rather thanmental health.
So I would say mental health maybe a a subset of behavioral
health, but they can be usedthey are used fairly
interchangeably, but it's a it'sa good point. I would say
behavioral health would also,you know, include substance use

(14:54):
and addiction sort of under thatumbrella. That's a bigger,
broader term, but often is usedin place of mental health.

Daniel Williams (15:01):
Okay. Thank you for clarifying that. So health
care is about caring forpatients, but there is also a
bottom line component to it. Sowhat is in it for providers? If
they go, Okay, I'm hearing whatDoctor.
Bromberg's saying, maybe I'llconsider this. But what is this
going to look like when theythink about their practice, the

(15:24):
model of their practice, andperhaps from the financial side
of it. Let's just start with themodel of it first, and then we
can look into the revenue sideof it, the bottom line part.

Dr. Jonas Bromberg (15:36):
Yeah. You know, the model that I have
worked most most of the workthat I've done is helping
practices implement what'scalled a primary care behavioral
health model, PCBH. And theemphasis here again is really,
you know, fulfill the samefunctions as primary care. This

(15:58):
is the first place people aregonna turn or gonna take a shot
at understanding what's going onand trying to intervene. But
recognizing like this is primarycare, and in the same way a
doctor might begin to interveneif you had a medical problem but
then pass you off to aspecialist, we're going to try
to do this here in an easysimple way, especially if it's

(16:20):
something you told us is reallyin an early stage.
We can probably take care ofthat in a primary care type
model. So it involves having oneor more mental health
clinicians, you know, a licensedpsychologist or a licensed
clinical social worker in thepractice and available to see
patients as these things comeup. Ideally, the mental health

(16:44):
practitioners that I think aremost ideally suited to work in
this type of environment, liketheir primary care medical
counterparts or or generalists,you know, anything that walks
through the door is sort of theethos of primary care. Try to
handle it here. And if we can,we send you the the appropriate
specialty place to have it takencare of.
But you wanna be able to thatold adage strike while iron's

(17:06):
hot, knowing that many peopledon't follow through with a
referral to a psychologist orsocial worker. If you can say,
wait a second. You know? I knowyou you know, you just told me
or I see on the screening formthat you completed that you're
struggling with anxiety ordepression or something. I have
somebody here that can talk toyou right now and help me by
talking to you, you know, in alittle bit greater depth to find

(17:28):
out a little bit more detailabout what's going on and really
start to help you today.
I mean, you can leave the officetoday with some with some
guidance on how to manage this.So that's the opportunity we're
trying to seize. Theseclinicians really to be
available right there whenpatients need them. And
obviously, you know, once youstart getting involved with

(17:48):
patients in that way, they mayneed some follow-up. So the
model actually builds in somescheduled follow-up as well.
And, you know, it's creatingthis balance between that real
time availability to, you know,step into the room and meet the
patient right now while they'rethere because they might not
come back. Right. Take take theopportunity when you can. You

(18:10):
know? And and many people needmore than that one shot consult,
so you have some scheduled timethat you can also see them for
follow-up and help them, youknow, in in in a little bit more
longitudinal kind of way.
Okay.

Daniel Williams (18:24):
So let's go to that part two of that question,
and that is the bottom linepart, the billing part. So what
do our listeners need to know asfar as the billing, if there are
any codes they need to knowabout how to how to bill, how to
get reimbursed just so they arecompensated for the work that's
being done?

Dr. Jonas Bromberg (18:44):
The program that I directed for more than a
decade so when we started thatprogram, one of the things that
we made available to everypractice was some billing
consultation. And the personthat we had, they used to say,
it's different but notdifficult. Any of many of the
standard business practices thatyou would use to make sure that

(19:07):
your revenue cycle is wellmanaged on the medical side is
gonna be very similar to whatyou're gonna do with this mental
health stuff too. Verifyinginsurance ahead of time, making
sure that there's coverage forthe things that you're the
services you're gonna provide.So, you know, all those things
that you routinely andrigorously do to run your
medical practice, you're gonnado many of those similar things

(19:30):
on the behavioral side.
The tricky you know, probablythe trickiest thing in
behavioral health is sometimesthe actual insurance benefit may
be carved out. So the billsmight be sent to a different
entity than the primary medicalinsurance. Once you understand
that and figure that out, it'sjust different, not difficult.

(19:50):
But I think early on, that'soften something that billers in
a medical practice may not haveever encountered before, but
it's not a difficult concept tomaster. You know, there's really
about you know, in the work thatwe did, I would say it's much
simpler than medical billing.
They're probably seven to 10procedure codes that make up

(20:12):
like 90% of your billing. So,you know, once you figure out
those codes and the modifiersyou need to use and, know,
again, there's there's a littletrial and error maybe, but
hopefully not trial and error.Hopefully, there's good
knowledge out there. Everyinsurance company, you know, is
a little bit different in termsof the modifiers and, you know,

(20:33):
you have to decode what theirinstructions are and, you know,
to be able to do that regularly.And, you know, and, you know so
beforehand, we made sure thatthat mental health visits were
gonna be able to be billable thesame day as medical visits in
the practice.
There was maybe a small numberof insurance companies we needed

(20:53):
to, you know, make a stipulatedsort of change in a contract.
But otherwise, you know, becausethey were different types of
services, mental health andmedicine, medical services, that
that largely wasn't a problem.But, you know, it was a concern
or something people thoughtabout. You know? And and again,
once bills are submitted, thatsame sort of just disciplined
revenue management stufffollowing up, knowing how to,

(21:16):
you know, deal with claims thatare sent back in a in an
efficient way.
And, again, it's a learningcurve, and it's it's just
different, but not notdifficult. Almost every single
practice that we taught to dothis was at least able to break
even, if not add to their bottomline a little bit. I don't think
anybody's getting rich do itproviding mental health

(21:36):
services, but, you know, manyprograms were able to derive a
level of revenue from that thatintegrated work that not only
supported the mental healthclinician, but allowed them over
time to add other staffresources, coordinator type
people that would focus on, youknow, that population, you
build, you know, sort of theadministrative staff to support

(21:58):
the behavioral team in the sameway that, you know, there's a
sort of a legion of peoplebehind every physician on the
back end that do things. Andprograms that were really
successful were able to, youknow, generate enough revenue to
cover their clinician. Andsometimes, you know, those those
special staffing positions that,support the behavioral
clinicians in the practice.

Daniel Williams (22:19):
Okay. Now you said that a practice may not get
rich or so by integrating it.However, what are some of the
measurements? How do you know ifyou're succeeding in what you're
doing? What what should apractice be looking at?

Dr. Jonas Bromberg (22:36):
Generating revenue is is one way of looking
at the value proposition. Well,there is a a managing partner in
one of the practices I workedwith for many years who said, it
doesn't matter to me if we breakeven because this frees up
physician time. You know, Ithink every one of my doctors
can see one or two more patientsa day when they're able to, you

(22:56):
know, not get bogged down in oneof these mental health things
they can hand off in real timeto somebody else that can take
over, and then they can go onand not get their schedule
backed up and see more patients,be more efficient. Another way
of looking at the the value andwhat can be added, if a
physician can be moreproductive, you don't need the
the revenue from the mentalhealth person maybe to be as

(23:18):
great. Families absolutely lovehaving this kind of access.
What it does in terms ofcreating loyalty and
satisfaction on the patient endis just enormous. I mean, you
should you know, testimonials ofpatients, families would offer
were just incredible about howhelpful it was to have, you

(23:39):
know, somebody be able to bethere right away for the family.
And certainly when, you know,urgent things come up to be able
to access somebody right away,they really value it. So those
are other ways of looking at thevalue. So remind me again of
where you wanted me to go.
What was the next question?

Daniel Williams (23:55):
Yeah. So, no, I think you answered that. I was
looking at how do you measure itand it sounds like patient
satisfaction and also providersatisfaction by really freeing
up those providers for questionsthat they're going to have to
refer anyway when they starthearing that mental health
aspect of the visit coming up.They can move them into that

(24:17):
next room and have thatprofessional work with the
patient in that capacity. Yeah.

Dr. Jonas Bromberg (24:23):
And it reminds me of something, a
conversation I had with one ofthe pediatricians who said, you
know, the integration ofbehavioral health and medicine,
he thought was the mostimportant thing to happen in
pediatrics since the inventionof the vaccine. Wow. And I said,
John, really? There's been a lotof advances in pediatric

(24:43):
medicine since the invention ofthe vaccine. He says, no.
This is the most important thingbecause what it's done to sort
of teach me about how to takecare of my patients and empower
me to do that is is isremarkable. You know, I'm I'm
way more, you know, capable thanI was earlier in my career. And,
you know, when I thought aboutit, yeah, that's incredible. You

(25:05):
know, every at the beginning, Iwas really thrilled about how
many kids and families weregetting care. You know, the
volume of care that we weredelivering was enormous.
But then I thought, you know,this comment, each one of those
doctors we taught, they touchhundreds or thousands of lives.
So to empower these doctors totake care of thousands, hundreds
of thousands of patients we carefor in our network, you know,

(25:27):
that was really something. Thatwas, you know, to empower
doctors in this way felt reallyimportant. And we had actually
done some research about we,again, some sort of pre
intervention and postintervention with the with
providing educationalintervention of physicians, the
comfort and confidence they hadin addressing mental health
concerns that, you know, wentnothing but up, you know? Mhmm.

(25:49):
Just by providing, know, good,solid education and some
availability to consultation, Imean, just made them feel much
more capable. Because prior tothat, you know, the patients
would come into their office andthey wouldn't know what to do.
They wouldn't, you know, knowhow to even reliably utilize the
system outside the office to toengage patients in care. But it

(26:13):
it the world sort of changed forthem.

Daniel Williams (26:16):
Yeah. Last question then. You I made a note
during the summit conference inyour presentation there. You
said the biggest challenge forpractices isn't whether to do
it, behavioral healthintegration, but it's knowing
how to do it. You've beencovering that, but we've covered
a lot of ground here today.
So for a practice that's hearingyou today, what's maybe a first

(26:40):
step or two they should look atdoing to bring that integration
into the practice?

Dr. Jonas Bromberg (26:46):
So when we you know, in the work that I do
when I work with a practice, Ithink the first thing I wanna do
is, you know, not after Iunderstand what they're doing
now, you know, is help themunderstand what their needs are.
Not not every practice, youknow, given their location, the
population they care for, whothey are as a care team, you
know, what do they need? Whatare the most common sorts of

(27:06):
concerns that they're seeing?And, you know, so we, you know,
would often ask practices do abit of a a time study or, you
know, use the data that theyhave to look at, you know, what
the most prominent concerns are.And not only that only not only
helps you think about how tostructure the program you're
gonna build, but also the typesof clinicians you might wanna

(27:27):
look for when you go to hire.
The other thing I think is superimportant, we always approach
this in a every time I work witha practice, I approach this in a
ecosystem kinda way that thisinvolves a bit of change in, you
know, organization and structurein the way certain things happen
in an office, and that affects alot of different people from the

(27:48):
person that greets a patientwhen they walk through the door
to the person that sends out thebill on the back end. It touches
a lot of people in between. Sowe want every member of the
staff to know about what we'redoing, why we're doing it, to
understand the value that itprovides to families and how
satisfied they are so that thewhole ecosystem in the office

(28:09):
can, you know, buy into it. Youknow? You really want a high
level of, you know, sort of buyin and engagement.
Yeah. We're doing this for theright reasons. So that's a
really important first step totake too to, you know, make sure
everybody's on board because itit's gonna affect a lot of
people in a very positive way,and that's a story you wanna
tell. And I always encouragepractices that are doing this to

(28:32):
with some frequency to highlightthose success stories, remind
everybody, reengage everybodyabout why we're doing this. It
certainly doesn't make lifeeasier to take this on.
But it but, you know, for allthe right reasons, it it makes
sense. It it empowersphysicians, provides higher
quality care, generates patientand provider satisfaction. So

(28:54):
it's worth the lift.

Daniel Williams (28:56):
Well, doctor Bromberg, before we sign off, I
wanna give our listeners anopportunity to connect with you
if you have any additionalinformation you would like to
share. So provide, if if youwould like, any kind of contact
information or any otherbenefits they might learn from
you about that health care,behavioral health integration in

(29:17):
their practice.

Dr. Jonas Bromberg (29:18):
Yeah. I'd be happy to, you know, fill
questions, follow-up with any ofyour listeners who would like to
if they wanna, you know, sort oflearn more. You know? And this
is this is what I do day in, dayout at Crossroads Health
Consulting is, you know, supportpractices that wanna do this in
a variety of ways. So, you know,I'd be happy to have you put my
information in your your shownotes and have people contact

(29:40):
me.
I'd be happy to continue theconversation, and I'm available
to help practices, you know, dothis kind of work if if they
want an experienced guide to tohelp them.

Daniel Williams (29:51):
Alright. Well, doctor Jonas Bromberg, thank you
again for joining us on the MGMApodcast.

Dr. Jonas Bromberg (29:56):
Thanks, Daniel. I really appreciate the
opportunity, and it's always funto talk about something I, am
really passionate about. Sothank you.

Daniel Williams (30:03):
It is very clear your passion shines
through, and thank you for thework you're doing. And
everybody, as doctor Brombergsaid, we will put those
resources and links in theepisode show notes. I'll also
provide a link to an articlewe're gonna develop on this
conversation here. So untilthen, thank you all for being
MGMA podcast listeners. Hi.
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