July 5, 2024 • 65 mins
This week we welcome Pastor Chris Battle, owner of BattleField Farm Gardens! We had a great conversation about his journey In ministry, and how he is bringing fresh food and spreading love to the community in such an amazing way!
Battle Field Farm is working to end food insecurity by partnering with community members to make fresh food accessible and to cultivate land-based sovereignty through education, workforce development, and direct relationships to land. To contact battlefield farm, check out their site. https://battlefieldfarm.org/about/
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Realty Executives Associates
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
Speaker 1 (00:00):
Check us out to hear the latest on life in the
volunteer state.
Yvonca and her guests discusseverything from life, love and
business with a Tennessee flair.
It's a Tennessee thing, alwaysrelatable, always relevant and
always a good time.
This is Talkin' Tennessee, andnow your host, yvonca.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
This episode is brought to you by the Landis
team, your go-to real estatefamily in East Tennessee.
If you are looking to buy orsell, we are the ones you should
call.
Give us a call at 865-660-1186or check out our website at
YvoncaSellsRealEstatecom.
That's Yvonca Y-V-O-N-N-C-Asalesrealestatecom.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Welcome back to Talking Tennessee with Yvonca.
I am your host and this week Iam featuring Pastor Chris Battle
.
Welcome to Talking Tennessee.
Speaker 4 (00:58):
Thank you for having me today.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
Most definitely, viewers.
This has been a work inprogress.
I reached out to Pastor Battlelast year and our schedules was
really packed and they staypacked, but I truly believe this
is when God really wanted tohappen.
I have to tell you that he hasbeen recommended to me by so
(01:24):
many different people in ourcommunity and they talked about
what all you're doing in thecommunity.
They talked about who you are,who you've been in the past.
They talked about differentthings, that they've watched you
evolve and just keep growingthis community.
So first let me give you yourflowers and tell you thank you
(01:47):
for everything that you do forour community, because that is
truly a God sent thing.
Thank you, thank you.
So let's get into it.
Who is Chris Battle?
Speaker 4 (01:57):
Who is Chris Battle?
I think, at the core, chrisBattle was this little, shy
little boy who loves God andwants to make everybody happy.
I think that's if you had totake off all the layers, yes, I
think that's who you would find.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
Yes, but throughout life I think you've probably
realized in certain areas youcan't make everybody happy Wish
you could.
Speaker 4 (02:28):
I have learned that the hard way, the hard way.
Yes.
Speaker 3 (02:34):
I think, we all learn that.
But I think that we have toremember that because there's
times that we really want tomake somebody happy in things,
but for whatever reason, it justdoesn't work that way.
But I think the best part aboutit is you having the heart to
want to be pleasing.
Speaker 4 (02:54):
Well, I shouldn't maybe my at my core, I want to
see a world which is at peaceand sh's shalom, you know where.
Everything is there.
Everybody's needs are metdoesn't mean you're gonna have
problems right but I thinkthat's what the kingdom is all
about.
It's about this, this place ofshalom, where everybody's whole
(03:17):
complete, um, dare I say, happyyes, yes, you know yes, um, but
but that's that's what I, that'swhat the goal I'm working for
in community, you know youbasically trying to do your part
and stay in my lane.
Speaker 3 (03:34):
Yes, yes, sometimes God will take you out of that
lane and God will say, okay, Ineed you to go over here.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
And you're like no.
Speaker 3 (03:40):
God and he's like yeah, you going.
Well, I think for me Willingly,or not willingly, for me it was
.
Speaker 4 (03:46):
I had to understand what that lane was.
I was kind of angry at God fortaking so long, you know.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Okay, or maybe I was Be honest.
Speaker 4 (03:55):
Maybe I was slow about listening yes.
Or maybe it was just for me.
It wasn't time yet you know, Iwas telling somebody the other
day.
I said I wish I would haveknown this work 20 years ago, oh
, you know, when my knees werefeeling a little bit.
Speaker 3 (04:12):
It's funny you say that because last week I was
thinking, you know, with thewisdom you get when you grow
older, I hope is that you think,gosh, I wish I would have known
that.
I don't know what I could have,how I could have applied that.
You think, gosh, I wish I wouldhave known that a long time ago
, how I could have applied thatand stopped a lot of things, and
so that went through my mindlast week.
So we got something in common.
(04:35):
So how long have you been inKnoxville?
Speaker 4 (04:38):
I moved to Knoxville in 2008.
2008.
I'm from Cincinnati, ohio,originally.
Grew up there left.
Went to college, go MorehouseLeft Morehouse.
Graduated from Morehouse, wentto Southern Seminary in
Louisville, kentucky.
(05:00):
Got called to a church inBowling Green, kentucky, which
was actually 38 years ago thispast Sunday, father's Day and
then went to Hackensack, newJersey.
Okay, from Hackensack I wentback to Cincinnati.
Speaker 3 (05:09):
Oh, wow.
Speaker 4 (05:09):
And stayed another about 15 years or so and then
got called here to TabernacleBaptist Church here in 2008.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
Okay, so you're married.
Speaker 4 (05:20):
Yes, I'm married to my wife.
Speaker 3 (05:23):
Please, yeah, please tell us who your wife is.
I guess it's good to be marriedto my wife.
Please tell us who your wife is.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
I guess it's good to be married to your wife.
Speaker 4 (05:31):
Her name is Toma Battle.
We have 19 children, 15 ofwhich we have adopted or have
legal custody over 19?
.
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
Viewers 19.
That's a lot of and let me saythis um, I have a biological
child and I have an adoptivechild and you can relate to this
we love it's, it's, there's nodifference, or we just love, you
know that type thing.
But it's such a great feelingto know that, for when you saved
(06:05):
a child and you gave that childlove and you showed them the
world, you know as best youcould.
So to do that for 19 kids,that's commendable in itself.
I mean to have the patience forone for 19 kids and just.
Life could be hard or lifecould be easy, but you chose.
(06:31):
You didn't choose either one.
Speaker 4 (06:32):
You just said I'm just gonna help somebody well,
yeah, um, I'm not gonna say, wecame out, that was our okay
we're gonna get married and haveall these children.
Yes, that was not, that was notthe case at all no and, and my
sister once asked me well, wewere talking.
She said, chris, I don't thinkI could go foster because as
(06:52):
soon as I get attached to thechild, yes.
They'll take the child.
Speaker 3 (06:56):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (06:59):
And remove like that.
How I look at this is give thatchild all the love you can,
show them some semblance of whatnormalcy looks like, some
semblance of functionality.
Speaker 3 (07:15):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (07:16):
I'm not saying my sister's just as dysfunctional
as I am.
But some semblance of what afamily looks like, but some
semblance of what a family lookslike.
So, even if they are taken away, even if they do leave, they'll
be able to reflect on thatperiod of time that you're
together and say hey thissituation here.
Speaker 3 (07:35):
it doesn't have to be like this.
There is another way.
Speaker 4 (07:38):
Yes, and I think, a lot of our young people some of
you have not seen options.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
Yes, they haven't seen that there are other ways
to do things.
Speaker 3 (07:48):
There's other options .
And then you know theopportunity to grow and the
opportunity to see throughsomeone else's lenses, that type
thing.
And I think with my son, youknow I've got a girl, a daughter
and a son and I'm learning thatraising a boy and a girl is so
(08:08):
different oh, it's so differentboys, give me boys oh okay, so
me, I would say give me girls.
Speaker 4 (08:16):
Yes, boys are hard girls are girls are they're
chatty?
Speaker 3 (08:19):
I'll say girls are chatty, I'll say girls are
chatty, but boys, they try you,they try you and you have to
show them who wins.
You know that type thing, but Ithink that was God's plan.
You know, we had had, at thetime when I adopted him, we had
(08:42):
had six miscarriages.
We've had a total of ten and wehad given up, you know, and my
husband's adopted.
And so David one day was likewhat do you think about adoption
?
Okay, this is way before my son, and I said I'd be open to that
.
And he said if I ever adopted achild, I'd want them, I would
want to really teach them youknow how to grow in life as an
(09:08):
adopted child.
He said because that was me.
And so months and months later,the opportunity came and so I
commend you for it because I'mlike I understand where your
sister's coming from, because wedid kinship, we didn't do
foster care we knew the familyand so I never forget.
(09:28):
When I got my son, uh, thesocial worker says to me okay,
do not get attached.
Well, the moment they hand youthat, baby, you're going to get
attacked.
That was the first thing theysaid to me is do not get
attached, and I was just likehow can you love and show this
kid, you know, especially infant?
You know love and you tell themno attachment.
Speaker 4 (09:51):
That's ridiculous.
Speaker 3 (09:53):
Yes, and so yeah, yeah, exactly, well, they did.
Speaker 4 (09:59):
And for us.
You know, I had two sons frommy first marriage and when me
and Toma toma got married, wehad five miscarriages and that's
why we went the adoptive route.
And I'll never forget um.
I was running a revival inbaltimore, maryland, and she
called me.
She said chris, they found asibling group of five.
(10:20):
Yeah, it was a sibling group offive, but they were living in
three different homes and theywanted to bring them together.
Can we take them?
I said, if you good baby, I'mgood with it, you know.
Speaker 3 (10:31):
And she said well, I already told him yes, but we'll
she said listen, I just want youto feel like that I can see.
And then we had then we.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
We had our first child together, then we had
another one yeah, and then youknow, but it's like, you know,
it's like if an elephant stepson your foot.
Speaker 3 (10:49):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (10:49):
And another elephant jumps on its back.
It ain't going to make adifference.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
Yes, it's not.
It's not.
That's the truth.
It's not.
It ain't going to make adifference.
Your situation was kind of likewith mine.
My husband, where we shoot inthis office is the studio in my
husband's office and he was inthe part of the house and he was
walking through and I told himthe situation and I said can we
(11:13):
take him?
And he goes, yeah, and he walksoff, okay.
He said, yeah, we can, and hewalks off and he walks back in
here, okay, and then he comesback and he he goes.
Did I just say we could take achild?
And from there on you know therest of the story.
He's 15 years old, he just umgraduated from ninth grade,
(11:34):
going to 10th grade, and we'reone big, happy family.
But I will say, adoption is agreat thing.
Uh, can it be trying?
Yes, I'm not going to telly'all it's not, but it is a
great thing and you're saving achild and it's a great option.
So let me ask you this why doyou love this community?
(11:55):
Why, yes?
Speaker 4 (12:03):
I'm trying to remember when I fell in love
with Knoxville.
Speaker 3 (12:11):
That's a darn good you should have sent that
question to me.
I told you I wouldn't throwsomething at you, but I'll give
you a good question ultimately,it's the people.
Speaker 4 (12:23):
It's the people in the community.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
I've met some wonderful, loving.
Speaker 4 (12:25):
I'm going to give you a good question.
Ultimately, it's the people.
Mm-hmm, it's the people in thecommunity.
Yes, I've met some wonderful,loving, crazy, peace-loving
people in this community andI've always invested in the
communities.
I've pastored Okay, I've alwayslived in the communities.
I've pastored, okay, pastored.
I've always lived in thecommunities.
(12:46):
I've pastored Because I work,play, pray, play in the same zip
code.
So I believe in that.
And I've always been one wholikes to see the beauty and the
wonder of people, the image ofGod in people, and grow on that.
(13:07):
Now, some folks, you've got tolook real hard.
You've got to look real hard,yeah, real hard, but we'll find
that there's beauty and wonderin everybody.
And I told somebody the otherday I said you know, I think one
of my faults is I genuinelylike people.
Speaker 3 (13:30):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (13:30):
I genuinely like people, so that's, it's the
people, it's the support thatI've received, you know, and
East Tennessee is different,it's definitely different.
Speaker 3 (13:41):
It's different and East Tennessee is different.
It's definitely different, it'sdifferent.
And I think the biggest thingwith East Tennessee is I'm not
trying to say East Tennessee isperfect, I'm not saying that,
but we know that, because somepeople are like, oh, we're all
balls.
You know, I'm like, no, there'ssome parts of East Tennessee
that could be better.
But I think the biggest thingabout our community is what I
(14:08):
appreciate that we can go in agrocery store, maybe not know
somebody, and they still speak,yeah, you know, what I'm saying.
When there's a call of duty,someone gets sick, someone is in
need, it just seems like easttennessee rallies.
(14:30):
And I'm speaking of, you know,from experience, when my husband
got sick, when I told you offcamera, uh, 11 years ago, there
were so many churches.
Well, first of all, his storyjust went like wildfire.
Well, first of all, his storyjust went like wildfire and grew
and a friend of mine put it onFacebook.
I didn't want it on Facebookbut God knew what he was doing
(14:55):
Because this friend put it onFacebook and he was the only one
that I didn't tell not to,because I didn't think he would.
He put it on Facebook and heasked people to pray for David
and it took off, just.
But there was so many peoplethat came together for me that
did not know me from Adam.
There were churches that werereaching out all over the
(15:18):
country, literally said he's onour prayer list, he's this, this
East Tennessee man, and that tome just I'm not saying other
cities are not great, but to meI'm East Tennessee All day,
every day, because I love how werally.
You know we may get mad at eachother at times, we may not
(15:42):
speak sometimes, but it'ssomething about East Tennessee
brings us back together.
Speaker 4 (15:48):
Do you agree with that?
I would agree with that to acertain extent.
Speaker 3 (15:50):
Yes, yes.
Speaker 4 (15:52):
I believe particularly in the African
American community.
We would see that yes.
Speaker 3 (15:56):
Even to the expanded community.
Speaker 4 (15:59):
We have some hurdles that we got to cross.
Speaker 3 (16:01):
We do, we do.
I agree with that, I totallyagree with that.
And that leads me to my nextquestion.
Uh-oh, two-part question whatled you into ministry in
Knoxville Tennessee?
Let's start with that.
Speaker 4 (16:19):
Well, again I had started.
I've been pastoring indifferent cities across the
country, up and down the EastCoast.
Speaker 3 (16:26):
I guess you could say let's go back for one second
Viewers.
Pastor Battle has been inministry for 43 years.
He has been a pastor.
Am I?
Is it?
Speaker 4 (16:37):
Yeah, 43 years 33 of those were institutions.
Speaker 3 (16:42):
No, no.
43 years in ministry, 33 yearsin pastoring, so now go ahead.
I just want to give them theback um what was?
Your question.
Your question is what led youto ministry in knoxville?
Speaker 4 (16:56):
so we were um, we were a part of a congregation in
cincinnati, we were doing well,but we just felt it was time to
leave.
My wife put out the.
She started filling outapplications for me.
Speaker 1 (17:12):
She said let's she said it's time.
Speaker 4 (17:16):
Tabernacle extended a call to me and it was a fit.
I really believe I had comehere planning on retiring here.
Speaker 3 (17:26):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (17:27):
That was probably my last church and you know, boom,
I'm through.
You know.
But you know, then thetrajectory changed.
God threw me a curveball.
Speaker 3 (17:36):
Them curveballs.
They be brutal sometimes.
And that's my next questionwhat is your thoughts of the
church, of the current state ofthe church, the current state?
Speaker 4 (17:52):
I'm going to tell my story.
Go ahead, answer your question.
Speaker 3 (17:55):
Tell it.
Speaker 4 (17:56):
So when I moved here again, I had 30 years under my
belt and I said I'm going tocome approach this with a more
philosophical approach.
I think I know what I'm doingnow and my question was how can
our church impact the community?
(18:17):
And so we moved here in 08.
And one of the and during theinterviewing process, one of the
questions was if you become ourpastor, what would be one of
the first things you would do?
Ok, I had been on a tour ofEast Knoxville and I said well,
(18:41):
the first thing we're going todo is clean that cemetery across
the street.
I've been asked that question.
Before I give them, you know,brush off, you know.
Oh, I want to sit and look atthe community and sit with the
people and understand the needsof the city and you know, yes,
yes.
I said, no, we're going to cleanthat because Oddfellow.
(19:03):
Cemetery was a mess and I saidyou know it's overgrown,
headstones are knocked over andmost of the people buried there
were born in slavery.
I said it's an embarrassment toour history.
I'm not even from here.
I'm not even from here, andthat's an embarrassment.
Speaker 3 (19:20):
It is.
We're going to clean thatcemetery.
I'm not from here either.
Keep going.
So they called me, I think in.
Speaker 4 (19:27):
September, First week of December, I think it was.
We were out there cleaningabout 30 of us.
Speaker 3 (19:33):
I said we're going to clean this.
Speaker 4 (19:34):
He said we're going to go clean, we're going to
clean it and we're mowing, we'rechainsawing, we're putting
headstones back up, we we gotbags and bags of debris we've
collected.
And this brother pulls up in apickup truck.
He stops me and starts thankingus for what we're doing.
Thank you for investing in thecommunity, thank you for doing
this, da-da-da-da-da.
So me and my thinking I donecaught me a fish.
(19:58):
Okay, I got me a potentialmember.
Speaker 3 (20:01):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (20:04):
And I said, brother, won't you come join us at the
church?
And he looked me in the eye andhe said these words, and I
quote I ain't come to your damnchurch.
And he pulled off oh wow, well,that was my response too, so uh
, especially after he's yes his,his, his, his, his commendation
turned to consternation.
(20:24):
Yes, yes, and I'm flabbergasted,but it plagued me, it still
plagues me.
And then fast forward to 2016.
Okay, concord Baptist Churchdid a study on church attendance
in Knoxville and this is thebuckle of the Bible belt, and
(20:46):
20% of Knoxvillians go to churchon a regular basis 20%, and
regular was considered once amonth.
Yeah, and so roughly 40% aredone with church.
They used to go, don't goanymore.
Love Jesus can't stand theinstitution or consider
themselves spiritual and theother 40% from this study have
(21:11):
no religious affiliation.
And I'm like well, don't looklike.
Anybody's going to anybody'schurch and I'm talking to my
pastor.
Friends across denominationallines, across racial lines,
across the country, they'retelling me the same thing
Attendance is going down.
We're having to reconsider ourbudget, you know, because we're
not getting as much money.
(21:31):
And this is before the pandemic.
Right right, this is before thepandemic.
Speaker 3 (21:35):
Yeah, you're saying 2016.
Speaker 4 (21:37):
And I got to thinking I'm like, well, maybe we need
to do church differently, Okay,but I don't know.
I'm like, well, maybe we needto do church differently.
Speaker 3 (21:45):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (21:47):
But I don't know what that looks like.
I'm a baby boomer and I getthat.
Speaker 3 (21:52):
I get that I'm a baby boomer.
You may see that there needschange, but what change?
Speaker 4 (21:56):
I don't know what that looks like.
What is it supposed?
To be, and so the stuff we weredoing that we thought would you
know in retrospect the stuffthat I would do to try to get
attendance up, whatever wasreally for the folk who were
already coming.
You really teaching right nowso 2018,.
We had a piece of property andI've always done a little
(22:20):
gardening.
Speaker 3 (22:20):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (22:22):
I don't consider myself a good gardener.
Now I just know that God putssomething in a seed, that when
you put it in the soil, give ussome warmth and some water it's
going to grow.
Speaker 3 (22:32):
It's going to grow.
Speaker 4 (22:32):
Okay, you know, and I've also I've always done this
a little bit at the house, righthere and there and we had a
plot of land like two doors downfrom the church.
I'm like, why don't we do agarden here?
It took me three years to getthis garden going, okay.
So I started like in 2015.
Okay, it was 2018 when we gotit going.
(22:54):
Okay, and I called a friend ofmine who was working at the
botanical garden.
I said hey, come help me talk.
So I wanted to do a communitygarden.
You know, give me the ins andouts, you know, help me design
this space or whatever.
And in that conversation westart talking about food
disparity and food desert, andit was literally at that point
(23:22):
that the trajectory of my lifechanged.
I'm like hold up.
Speaker 3 (23:28):
I'm in a church.
Speaker 4 (23:29):
I'm in a church and we have a significant problem in
our community.
People are literally dying aslow death Hypertension, obesity
, sugar, diabetes, heart issueand it's all based on diet,
because they don't have accessto fresh fruits and vegetables.
Speaker 3 (23:46):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (23:47):
They have access to Burger King.
They can have it their way.
They got access to, you know,Pizza Palace and McDonald's and
all of these.
Chick-fil-A.
They got every corner store,every dollar store, but yet
there's no grocery store,there's no place to sell fresh
produce.
The USDA says if one third ofyour community is living in
(24:13):
poverty and more than a mileaway from a grocery store or
farmer's market, you'reconsidered a food desert.
We were two miles away, see.
And then places of poverty isalways a transportation problem.
People can't afford cars.
The median income in the zipcode that we're working in it's
(24:34):
seventeen thousand dollars ayear.
Yeah, it says they say they sayit takes like nine thousand
dollars a year just to maintaina car in knoxville.
Say, okay, so if I'm, if I, ifI'm making 17 and I got a car,
that knocks it down to what?
Eight thousand already, yeah,so we got some issues.
We got some issues, so I gotsome issues.
So I didn't know all this atfirst.
(24:54):
I just knew that there was aproblem here.
I'm like well, maybe what wecould do is get other churches
to start growing gardens.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
Okay, start doing gardens.
Speaker 4 (25:04):
Reached out to some pastor friends, but something
happened.
Something else happened.
I'm at the garden.
My wife would tell you I wasthere.
Every morning I would go toMcDonald's and get my coffee.
And get my coffee Right, andI'd wait for the sun.
Come on sun, let's go.
So I'm ready to go out here andwork in the garden Garden is
(25:28):
peaceful.
Yes, we come from the soil.
That's why there's that peacein the soil.
Speaker 3 (25:33):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (25:34):
Maybe that's what the song should have said.
There's peace in the soil forme.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
Anyway.
Speaker 4 (25:40):
Yeah, you can cut that part out.
But what happened, monica, waspeople started coming to the
garden Community.
People were coming to thegarden Community.
People were coming to thegarden.
I'm meeting people.
I'll never forget I met thiswoman, did you?
Speaker 3 (25:58):
hear him say they were coming to the garden.
Speaker 4 (26:01):
Who would never come to my Black Baptist brick and
mortar church Are y'all?
Speaker 3 (26:05):
hearing what he's saying.
They wouldn't, come to thechurch, but they would come to
the garden.
Speaker 4 (26:12):
Came to the garden.
Speaker 3 (26:13):
Why is that?
Speaker 4 (26:15):
I think because it is a place of peace.
There is no condemnation in thegarden Plus.
Speaker 3 (26:23):
I think it's seeing something grow.
It's visible, it is and itbrings joy.
You know what I'm saying andI'm not saying the church.
There's not joy in the church.
I'm not saying that.
What I'm saying is is that thejoy that garden signifies joy.
(26:46):
You know it doesn't signifyattitudes.
It doesn't signify, you know,people not getting along.
It doesn't signify people notgetting along.
It doesn't signify any of that.
It's only joy and growth.
I can see why you'd want to goto the garden.
People come to the garden.
Speaker 4 (27:03):
We had black folk, white folk, straight folk, gay
folk, old folk coming to thegarden.
Speaker 3 (27:12):
I'm like why is is that?
I didn't really care why.
Speaker 4 (27:18):
I'm like you're just happy they're coming to the
garden and I was going throughsomething in my life, in my
understanding of church.
I guess I think I said before Iwas really starting to realize
that church is not a space, it'snot a place, it's not an
address, it's not a point on myGPS.
Speaker 3 (27:41):
It's who I am, it's what we do, and it's going
against what you were taught.
Speaker 4 (27:45):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (27:47):
Let's talk about that , and I will.
And because, and I'm likeBecause we're taught go to
church, go to church, and churchis a building.
Speaker 2 (27:55):
And church is a building.
Speaker 3 (27:56):
Yeah, keep going.
Speaker 4 (27:57):
And the folks would come to the garden?
Yes, and they wouldn't come tomy.
There wasn't a building mybleep church?
Yes, and still won't.
I had a guy stop at the farmone day a few months ago.
He goes.
I love your mission, I justdon't like the god of your
mission oh, wow but he was in.
(28:18):
He was in the garden he stillwas in the garden.
You see, I think I think what,how?
I again, as I said, myunderstanding of church was
changing, okay, and I'm like,well, if they're coming to the
garden, maybe that should be thechurch.
Speaker 3 (28:37):
So let me ask you a question Historically, the
church has been in our community.
The church has been thecornerstone of our communities
for generation after generation.
But these days and times,people are running from the
(28:59):
church, people are not going tothe church.
What do you think of youropinion?
Why do you think that's beenthe cornerstone of our
communities?
Okay, I tell people let me goback a little bit.
I tell people I'm like the twothings that people don't get
(29:21):
that slavery taught us.
It taught us family and ittaught us God.
Okay, because that's all we had.
We didn't have a lot in slavery, you know so.
But in these days and times, somany people are running from
the church, so what do you thinkthe reason why is, I think?
Speaker 4 (29:43):
I think I think a few reasons actually, but I think
one is that I think oftentimesour churches have become
irrelevant.
Ok, we're, we're, we're solving, we're asked, we're solving
questions, we're answeringquestions that nobody's asking,
(30:04):
that the community is not asking.
Ok, secondly, we don't worktogether.
Secondly, we don't worktogether.
The civil rights movement wasstarted in the church, but
churches had to work together.
Yes, you know our church, theway our structures are built, is
(30:31):
because we're set up forcompetition, not cooperation.
Speaker 3 (30:33):
You know, teach, pastor and I could go on for
that, but I don't know how muchtime I don't understand.
What I don't understand is OK,we all say we love the Lord.
Well, the Lord is of love andunity.
Yeah, not division, unity, ok,not division, unity, okay.
I don't understand.
(30:58):
If I'm a pastor, you're apastor.
Why can't we be unified andworship together and not be
worried about?
Well, you know why.
Speaker 4 (31:10):
The reason why is because if I don't get the money
, that if I don't get people inthere, get the money to pay
these bills and to pay thesesalaries I don't have a job.
Okay, because our the way thestructure of our congregations
I've in my opinion, is reallybuilt around income oh it's
built around income, so thematrix that we use to determine
(31:34):
church success, I call them thebps the bps the bps, butts and
pews butts and pews okay bucksin the plate, baptisms in the
pool and building programs.
If you have that going on, ifyou got theisms in the pool and
building programs.
If you have that going on ifyou've got the butts in the pews
(31:56):
, which people tend to thinkbrings more bucks in the plate.
Right, right, right, and ifyou've got the people coming,
they'll have more baptisms inthe pool, right, and if you're
always building, it always lookslike you're successful.
That's the matrix we use forchurch success, and if we can
get more people in, we can getmore people.
That's the matrix we use forchurch success and if we can get
more people in, we can get morepeople.
That's why we're competitive.
That's why we're competitivebecause I need those people.
(32:19):
We're fighting for the samepeople.
We're in a small pool and we'retrying to fight for the same
fish, right?
Yes, I need you to come to mychurch, you need them to go to
your church or whatever.
I was telling a guy one.
I was like, hey, man, you guystalked, maybe start doing like,
um, we, we were, we were movingto, uh, small groups and homes
okay and the guy told me he's afriend of mine, he pastors
(32:40):
another, another state.
He goes no, I can't do thatbecause they might try to go and
start a church.
I'm like, well, what's wrongwith that right?
You know, but if they, go startanother church.
Speaker 3 (32:53):
That's money.
Then he loses members, that'sright.
Then he goes to the church, soit really gets based around that
Okay.
But if it's that, it's thewrong matrix.
It is because, if it's that, ifwe say we're a child of God and
we're following God, god said Iwill provide.
(33:14):
He said, just build a kingdom.
Speaker 4 (33:16):
He said I will provide but you said the key
word kingdom.
Kingdom is the key word.
He didn't say build individualkingdoms he said build a kingdom
and kingdom requirescooperation.
And I began to look at church.
So much different.
He said build a kingdom,kingdom, and kingdom requires
cooperation.
Yes, you see, and I began tolook at church so much different
(33:37):
.
I'm like you know what?
Speaker 3 (33:38):
We're supposed to be building kingdom we are.
Speaker 4 (33:41):
If I asked you what the gospel is, I ask this
question all the time to theclasses I teach and people give
me the same answer the gospel isthe death, burial and
resurrection, and soon returning, of Christ.
I'm like you haven't read theBible, because every time you
read gospel in the New Testament.
(34:02):
It's always followed by thegospel of the kingdom.
The gospel of the kingdom, thegospel of the kingdom.
It's the good news that there'sgoing to be a better way.
It's the good news that there'san alternate way of living way.
It's the good news that there'san alternate way of living.
Speaker 3 (34:16):
It's the good news that shalom is on the way and
people do not get right evenwhen they read it.
They miss, they miss thekingdom they miss the kingdom.
Speaker 4 (34:24):
And and how do you?
Speaker 3 (34:26):
sit and say that you read the bible and you study it,
and, and then you get up andpreach it, and you get up and
teach it, and all this, but Idon't see many pastors preach
kingdom.
Speaker 4 (34:38):
Because it doesn't fit into the BPs.
You're teaching, thank you, andI'm not mad.
I mean, I was involved in thattoo.
Yeah, I tried my best to do theBPs, but you learned something
different.
Speaker 3 (34:51):
I try my best to follow, do the BPs, but you
learn something different.
I learn something different.
Speaker 4 (34:55):
I begin to understand church.
I begin to understand whatkingdom is really all about.
Speaker 3 (35:01):
And it's not about competition.
It's not about competition, it'sreally not when you really
follow God and you.
One thing I'll say about ourrace we're history makers.
Okay, we love to be the first.
I'm the first, and I'm notsaying that's not a good thing,
(35:22):
but you can't be the first andstay the first.
You got to be able to see.
Okay, god allowed me to be thefirst, to be an example.
(35:42):
Now let others eat off of whatyou became the first of and
allow other people to do.
It may be similar, but God madeus one of a kind, so we don't
have to worry about competing ifyou really know God.
Well, jesus said that.
Do you get what I'm saying?
Speaker 4 (35:55):
Jesus said that the disciples told Jesus one day.
They said, hey, we had to stopthese cats because they're over
there healing folks in your name.
Jesus said why are you stoppingthem?
Why are you stopping them Justbecause they're not walking with
us?
They don't need to Let them goahead and do what they're doing.
But my thing is that when westart seeing it, I believe that
(36:20):
our churches should look likeour communities.
We complain about.
The communities are not.
They're drug infected, affected.
They're craziness going on,they're shooting each other.
But we got all these churchesin the community and nothing's
changing in the community.
Nothing, nothing's changing inthe community.
Speaker 3 (36:41):
This is what I don't understand about it and you can
please explain this to me.
True evangelism is in yourcommunity, being out in the
community, it's not in abuilding.
I don't understand about ourchurches that we want to keep
everything in house Okay.
(37:02):
But we want to say we work inour community Big piece.
Yes, we want to say we work inour community.
Speaker 2 (37:08):
but we don't see you in the community.
Speaker 3 (37:10):
We don't see you getting your hands dirty.
We do not see you telling yourmembers hey, let's go help
Pastor Battle If that meansgoing to pick the beans.
Do you get what I'm?
Speaker 4 (37:22):
saying I got saved the second time you got to have
one in one when I was in collegeIs that the second time.
When I was in Campus Crusadefor Christ right.
Yes and we had the fourspiritual laws.
You know God loves you and hasa wonderful plan.
I knew that whole thing, youknow.
And every church I pastored.
(37:42):
I taught them the fourspiritual laws taught them about
going out of the family.
Then it struck me one daybecause I would go to McDonald's
and get my coffee every morning.
And how long are you in thecoffee when you're in the
drive-thru and you see the?
Speaker 3 (37:55):
30 seconds.
Yeah, a minute is long, yes, 30seconds.
Yes.
Speaker 4 (38:02):
But it's amazing what you can learn about people.
Is McDonald's coffee that good,I thought?
Speaker 3 (38:06):
so, okay, okay, go try it.
I used to work at McDonald's,but back then.
Speaker 1 (38:09):
I wasn't drinking no coffee, so I kept going.
Speaker 4 (38:17):
It's amazing what people you can learn about
people in 30 second interactions.
You know I would go throughthere and the same lady, every
pastor pray for my son.
He's da, da, da, da da.
Speaker 2 (38:25):
You know, hey, pastor , how you doing.
Speaker 4 (38:27):
You know, I'm like, hmm, and so what I?
And so I started approaching itlike this.
I think I got to a point whereI discouraged the church,
discouraged them from going out,taking these pamphlets and
knocking on doors.
Speaker 3 (38:45):
I said no, we ain't doing that.
No more.
Speaker 4 (38:47):
Why are we going to knock on a stranger's door, who
we don't know?
Take them through this fourspiritual laws, or take them
down the Roman's road ofevangelism or salvation or
whatever, and they'll say asentence, prayer, and then, boom
, we'll say next, okay, I'm likeno, that's that's.
(39:11):
Let's not do it.
Let's do what I, what we call arelational evangelist, and
that's what we try to do at thefarm.
We try to live our life in sucha way that people will ask us
why we do what we do.
Peter talks about it in 1.
Peter talks about always beprepared to make a defense for
your faith.
But be prepared for what?
Because people should be askingyou why do you do this, chris?
Speaker 3 (39:34):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (39:35):
Why are you so kind to me?
And everybody else so you canshare.
I can share why, but it's aresult of the relationship, not
because I knocked on your door.
You've seen an example of it.
Speaker 3 (39:48):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (39:49):
You've seen an example of love.
You've seen an example of mercy.
You've seen an example of love.
Speaker 3 (39:53):
You've seen an example of mercy, you've seen an
example of grace and they needto see it in your wall.
Speaker 4 (39:55):
And I right, and I got guys folks that walk by my
garden every day and and some ofthem have even taken ownership.
You know, I saw somebodywalking through.
I told them to get out.
I mean, you know you're rightbecause they know me, they have
a relation.
I had a guy who was a houselessfellow and we were loading up
the truck one day and he said,pastor, I need to talk with you.
(40:17):
I said okay.
Speaker 2 (40:19):
When we get finished, I'll talk with you.
Speaker 4 (40:20):
I said okay.
Speaker 2 (40:22):
It was just kind of strange.
Speaker 4 (40:23):
Right.
So we got finished with what wewere doing and then he went
into his backpack and then I sawit.
Then I saw it, I saw it and Iknew what he was saying and he
came to me and said because whatit was was a camera he had
stolen.
Okay, it was a camera he wouldstole.
And he said I took it and I'msorry, I apologize when I took
(40:52):
it when we first met, but when Irealized what you guys are
doing, here, guilt was kickinghis mind and he said I hope you
can.
I hope you don't think.
Speaker 3 (41:05):
I said, brother, I think more of you now because
you made the mistake but youtried to rectify it and you did
rectify it, but yes, he didrectify it, but it goes back to
what you said a few minutes agowhen you said you know, I was
part of that belief of buildingchurches up that way, but I
don't think that way anymore.
(41:26):
So you changed your, yourbelief changed changed.
Your belief changed.
So your walk changed.
So to the church, part of it.
I'm like we're all going tomake mistakes but the one thing
we have to do is we've got togrow and we have to be able to
(41:57):
let God work in us.
I mean that type thing and I'llnever forget early in my walk
with God I was going to thischurch and I thought very highly
of the pastor and the wife andthe first lady and I'll never
forget a Christmas cake and I doa huge Christmas party every
year, show appreciation to myclients and all that.
Just say thank you, and thenpeople in the community that has
(42:17):
helped me all year longreferring me, and I'll never
forget that I'm a tree person,christmas tree person, so I put
up a lot of trees every year,and so people will call me and
ask me to come see the trees.
And so I'll never forget I wasgoing to this church and to me I
feel like God gave me my house,not just for me and my family,
he gave it to me to share, andso I've had church cookouts here
(42:40):
.
I've had all kinds of eventshere, okay, so this particular
Christmas I was talking to thepastor and first lady and I said
, oh, so-and-so, so-and-so,so-and-so is coming to see the
trees tonight, so we're going tohave hot cocoa and this
different stuff and some snacks.
You should come by.
(43:00):
I'll never forget.
This pastor said and his wifesaid this to me you are inviting
those people to your house.
And I said what?
You're inviting them?
You don't want all of them inyour house.
Pastor Battle, that's literallyhit me like a ton of bricks,
(43:23):
because this is why it hit me.
I'm like these people aremembers of your church and
you're calling them that peoplethose people we were taught the
Bible says it, you know shun.
Speaker 4 (43:38):
You know, to some folks you need to be shunning
and everything.
And it hit me one day, thepeople that we shun, we stay
away from that.
We don't invite to come to ourhouse to see the Christmas trees
and have hot cocoa with, or thesame people Jesus was sitting
with.
And I'm like whoa, if Jesus cansit with them.
Speaker 3 (44:03):
And those are the same people that if things got
tough and you got sick they'rethe same people that will show
up and nurse you back to health,but to hear a pastor tell me to
not invite them to my house,like they are a different set of
people and that like they arenot worthy, I was in shock.
Speaker 4 (44:27):
And I think that's the problem.
I think that's one of theproblems with our church.
That's a whole other issue.
Speaker 3 (44:33):
Right.
Speaker 4 (44:34):
But most of our churches don't look like our
communities.
Speaker 2 (44:38):
They just don't they don't.
Speaker 4 (44:41):
And nobody wants to admit that I mean because we got
white-collar churches, we gotblue-collar churches, we got
no-collar churches, churches,churches.
Speaker 2 (44:51):
I had a lady at my first church.
Speaker 4 (44:52):
My first church in Bowling Green was a first church
.
Speaker 2 (44:58):
And it was one of those.
Speaker 4 (44:59):
It was.
Anyway, and I asked a ladywalking down the street.
I'll never forget.
I said won't you come join usat church?
She goes, I don't wear silkdrawers and she kept on.
Speaker 1 (45:11):
She said that to me.
I'll never do that.
That's your battle.
Speaker 3 (45:15):
People say crazy things to me.
They say crazy things to me.
Speaker 4 (45:19):
They say crazy, and particularly at the farm.
Yes, I bet, but that's thebeauty of it to me.
That's the beauty of it to methat people can say what they
need to.
Because, I don't tell folk I'mpastor.
Speaker 3 (45:33):
I don't.
Speaker 4 (45:34):
I'm farming, I'm the gardener.
You know why?
Because when you tell peopleyou're pastor, they treat you
differently.
They talk differently when youput a title on it.
Speaker 3 (45:43):
I tell people titles.
We make titles.
Titles don't make us If yourname does not stand for anything
.
When people say to me now, likeif I go to like an event that
we have to use our titles, inreal estate or something like
that.
Then I want to say YvonneCalandas, I'm a real dad, but
(46:04):
outside of that, I'm YvonneCalandas, ok, because my name
means something to me.
You know what.
I'm Yvonne Galathas, because myname means something to me.
You know what I'm saying.
But I think a lot of timespeople get caught up into titles
and position because they don'tthink highly of themselves and
don't think and haven't doneanything to gain respect to
(46:27):
their name through life.
And that's where you have totap into yourself and say where
am I lacking and where do I needto get better than I?
That title is more importantthan my name.
I mean, you know what I'msaying.
I feel you on that one.
And so let me ask you this soup today, if you could give
(46:48):
advice to pastors, what would bename two things that you would
say?
If I was standing up in frontof a whole bunch of pastors and
they were asking me about makingan impact in ministry, what
(47:09):
would be the two things that youwould say Make sure you try
this or do this.
Speaker 4 (47:14):
I think I'd say two things.
Speaker 3 (47:16):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (47:17):
One cooperate and collaborate.
Don't fight each other.
That's a whole word, right there, you know we had, when I was
pastoring Tabernacle, fight eachother.
That's a whole work right there.
You know, um, we had, um, whenI was pastoring tabernacle, me
and the wife would walk goingdown the street one day, driving
, and we started counting thechurches that were on or about
(47:39):
Martin Luther King.
This was back in 20, early, 28,2000.
Um, and we counted 15, 15churches, Basically three
schools.
I'm like what if we all worktogether with and each, you know
(48:01):
, from this point, here we couldwork with Vine.
This school here could workwith Fair Garden.
These churches here could workwith AE, we could adopt these
schools, we could have impact inthese schools.
Speaker 3 (48:12):
And I tried my best to get it going, but nobody
wanted to work there.
Speaker 4 (48:16):
Some girls got into a fight and this kind of what
motivated it.
These girls two girls from Vinegot into a fight and I'm like
why don't we get our churchestogether and have a patrol?
Yeah, you know yeah, afterschool, and because first I
asked the church.
You know I asked the church andnobody's crickets, nobody
(48:39):
responded.
I asked the other church.
I've reached out to pastors.
They fighting, call the police.
I mean, those are literally theresponses I get.
I went to the secular communityand they all showed up.
So, cooperation andcollaboration.
I think the second thing.
Well, I might have three thingsCooperation and collaboration,
(49:00):
kingdom minded Be kingdom minded, which kind of goes with the
first, but kingdom minded tobuild community, to build shalom
, to look at more than yourlocation.
Speaker 3 (49:13):
And let me say this, he may not want to say it
Community is not inside yourchurch.
Speaker 4 (49:21):
When I say community, I'm talking about the
geographic location around yourchurch.
Speaker 3 (49:24):
Do you hear what?
Speaker 4 (49:25):
he's saying that's what I'm talking about Community
is not, I think, in the blackculture.
Speaker 3 (49:33):
I don't think nobody's teaching that.
Speaker 4 (49:37):
Well, I'm learning that they don't.
Speaker 1 (49:41):
I teach at Johnson.
Speaker 4 (49:42):
University right.
And one of the classes theclass, not one of the.
The class I teach is calledThriving Church, thriving
Communities.
Yes, and my whole argument forthat class is whatever matrix
you use the BPs to determine athriving for your church, if
it's not happening in yourcommunity, it's not happening at
(50:02):
all yeah.
Speaker 3 (50:03):
So you got to come out of the churches and you have
to realize that when you'resaying collaborate, you got to
come together and you have to beable to see that sometimes the
problem is not, you know, we'llsit and say the opposite race,
or we'll sit and say aboutdifferent things, but sometimes
(50:24):
it can be just in our mindset ofchanging our mindset and
telling your congregation it'sokay.
Speaker 4 (50:34):
When I was pastoring in Cincinnati we had planted a
church, and we had actuallypurchased an old kingdom hall.
Speaker 3 (50:42):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (50:44):
And there was a bar across the street from our
church and some folks were usingour parking lot before that to
go to the bar.
Well, I got a little attitudeokay, they go to bar, can't come
church, right yes and I neverforget.
I'm gonna put a chain up hereso they can stop, you know, and
(51:07):
something told me to go talk tomy church and community teacher
professor at the school.
Speaker 2 (51:13):
I said man, let me tell you what I'm thinking, Let
me tell you what's happening.
Speaker 4 (51:17):
He looked at me and said Chris, what message does
that give?
You don't want them folks here.
He said what you need to do isgo to the owner of the bar and
tell him that your parking lotis available If they can park in
as much as they want.
Just don't throw bottles on theground.
(51:38):
And I left there.
Speaker 2 (51:44):
But I did.
Speaker 4 (51:45):
Okay, I did, you know , and because what, what they
and they didn't?
Interesting thing is theydidn't park over there.
Ok, you know, but but what?
But what I learned?
What I realized is I could havemade an enemy or I could have
made a friend.
Speaker 3 (52:02):
I've been just a good neighbor is a lot of times,
when you're fighting against thegrain of something, sometimes
it's better to go and have aconversation.
I think a lot of times we getangry and we cut off
(52:24):
conversation and we cut offcommunication when God wants us
to build the kingdom and hewants us to bring people to the
kingdom.
Speaker 4 (52:34):
We're trying to stop people from doing what most of
us are doing.
You know what I'm saying.
Let me get a drink too.
Speaker 3 (52:42):
You better preach pastor.
Speaker 4 (52:44):
But I'm saying, you know, just because I close off
my parking lot, that ain't goingto stop the people from the bar
.
It's not and and cause, it'sabout relationship.
It's about relationship.
You know you.
You probably got you know umpeople going through AA, who you
know, whatever those are theones that need to be ministering
(53:05):
there.
Yeah, you know what I'm saying.
And, um, there, you know whatI'm saying.
And I had a guy once.
He said I'll preach on thestreets and everything.
I said we're going down.
I said we're going out there,let me see you preach.
He walked out my office went toon the sidewalk and started
preaching to the cars going by,did he?
And I'm like, look at this fool.
(53:26):
He's preaching to cars drivingby.
Speaker 3 (53:30):
Who going to?
To cars driving by?
Who going to hear him?
Nobody, no, you're just makingnoise, it ain't even joyful
because can't nobody hear it.
Speaker 4 (53:39):
He said it's not a joyful noise.
It ain't even a joyful noise,you know.
Third thing third thing Followyour passion.
I agree, God has a way.
What I've learned is this when Istarted the gardening thing, it
became like I said.
It just changed, my trajectorychanged, my passion changed.
(54:01):
I still love preaching.
I'm not, I'm not.
I don't think.
I don't know if I'll everpastor in the institutional
church again.
Okay, I can't see that.
But I love preaching, don't getthat wrong.
But it's the gardening thing,it's the feeding people, it's
giving people health.
Speaker 3 (54:17):
That's my passion, and ministry comes in all forms.
And what?
Speaker 4 (54:21):
I've learned is this I've learned a couple things
from that One.
When you follow your passion,you're less likely to burn out.
Speaker 3 (54:30):
You can, but you're less likely to burn out.
You can, but you're less likely.
Speaker 4 (54:32):
Because you do what you love and you love what you
do.
There you go.
Secondly, your passion attracts, like passions.
So when I you know, who loveswell everybody loves Chris
Battle right, but gardeners,farmers right, but gardeners,
farmers, people concerned aboutclimate control, climate care,
(54:56):
vegans they love what I do,people who are just as they love
what we're doing.
Speaker 3 (55:04):
And they reach out, and they reach out.
Speaker 4 (55:06):
And thirdly, and offer a hand.
Speaker 3 (55:09):
Not only some offer hands, but they offer financing
and support and you've got tohave that.
I tell people.
You know, a lot of times peoplewill be like I owe the church.
You know the money and all thatstuff.
And I'm like, okay, no, wait aminute.
I see both sides of it.
I say because no, it shouldn'tbe about the money, okay, but at
(55:29):
the same time the church doeshave to have money to grow and
pay bills.
Speaker 4 (55:35):
The question, though, is this it can't be all about
that, though, it can't be, yeah.
I looked at our budget once andI got angry.
Speaker 3 (55:45):
Okay, okay.
Speaker 4 (55:47):
I'm like we're spending almost 80% of our
budget on salaries andmaintaining this building.
Wow, and I got and that part itwas the maintaining the
building.
God, I needed my salary.
Speaker 2 (56:03):
I need my salary.
It was maintaining of thebuilding part that bugged me.
Speaker 4 (56:06):
I'm like we're spending a lot of money keeping
this building up to par KUB, allof that and nobody's here.
You better say that 90% of thetime this church goes empty.
Speaker 3 (56:27):
Something's wrong with that.
So you're paying to house abuilding For Sunday morning For
Sunday morning and no one's here, and that's what I don't get.
I'm like you got to get out ofthe building, you got to go out.
Speaker 4 (56:42):
Jesus said build my church Upon this rock, I'll
build my church.
But he never said I'm buildinga building.
Speaker 3 (56:48):
He never said that Matter of fact.
He said the temple was going tocome down build my church, but
he never said I'm building abuilding.
He never said that no, but butthat matter of fact.
Speaker 4 (56:51):
He said the temple was going to come down, it ain't
been built back okay, I ain't.
Speaker 3 (56:55):
but the problem is we've been taught in our
generation and back that the yougot to go to church, you got to
do this, you got to do that,you got to do that, it's got to
do that.
It's all about church.
But if you really read thatBible and you really first of
all God said put him first.
(57:15):
He didn't say the church.
If you really look in the order, church is farther down on
God's order.
I mean, you know what I'msaying Of who comes first.
He said put him first.
And I think that was thebiggest thing that taught me
when I was in the hospital whatDavid was.
Because I couldn't go to churchanymore because I was in a
hospital.
So I had to find church withinme, I had to build it up in me,
(57:40):
I had to search for God in me.
Speaker 4 (57:43):
I had a lady tell me why she goes because they had
left the church they were at andbecause the husband got called
to a church and she told me I somiss the relationship, the
fellowship with the other man,why you miss it.
I'm like you can't see them onother days of the week.
(58:05):
She's looking for the get down.
I couldn't figure out.
You missed them on Sundaymorning.
Speaker 3 (58:15):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (58:16):
You missed them in the choir.
It's not like you can't seethem throughout the week Again.
I think it's that matrix.
I remember when I left thepastorate and quit going to
church institutional church.
It took a while to get that outof my system, you know.
(58:38):
I mean because you're like oh,I didn't go to church, I'm going
to sin and fall and show to thegroup.
I remember that, you know, andI'm like I remember feeling that
and I felt like that andsometimes I mean and I, even
when I go now, I love it, yes,and pieces of me miss it.
Yes, you know, but you miss thegood times, but you don't miss
the other part, you know, but,yeah, I'm not going to go there.
Speaker 3 (59:00):
But you know, the biggest part about that is is
that, like how you said youmissed it, I missed it.
Like how you said you missed it, I missed it.
Okay, but I can honestly saythis this may not be your walk,
but I can honestly say this I domore ministry now than I ever
did when I was in the church.
I do way more in my community.
(59:23):
I'll do way more reading theword and seeking him and praying
way more than I ever did.
And I remember when I firststopped going in the hospital,
coming out because Davidcouldn't eat or feed himself, he
couldn't walk or anything, so Istill couldn't go.
You know what I'm saying when Igot out.
(59:46):
And I never forget.
Before I left the hospital I'mlike, oh, I can't wait, I can go
to church service.
But then it came that Icouldn't.
When David got out, and themore and more I grew in Christ,
that desire went away.
The desire of him came stronger, and that desire, and then I
(01:00:09):
was like, well, then I started.
There was different pastorsstarted asking me to speak at
their church, and I'm like Isaid to my husband, I'm like,
wow, they really want to hearwhat I got to say and I'm like
really and I'm not saying whatwe have now needs to be
(01:00:32):
destroyed.
Speaker 4 (01:00:35):
I do think it needs to be reformed.
Speaker 3 (01:00:37):
It does.
Speaker 4 (01:00:38):
Okay, I think it needs a restructuring.
Speaker 3 (01:00:42):
And people need to see God.
Speaker 4 (01:00:47):
I'm not saying they don't.
I'm not saying they don't.
I'm not saying they aren'ttruly saved.
Speaker 2 (01:00:52):
I'm not saying that Jesus is you know, I'm not
saying that.
Speaker 4 (01:00:56):
I'm just saying that there is something about
buildings that stop the movementit does.
Speaker 3 (01:01:02):
It does.
Speaker 4 (01:01:04):
That causes us to miss the kingdom.
Speaker 3 (01:01:06):
I think the building is, honestly what's the word?
Intimidating to people.
I don't think God isintimidating, but the building
and the pressure of going tothat building is intimidating to
(01:01:27):
the world now.
So people are.
Well, I would say, do you getwhat I'm saying?
I wouldn't say intimidate, Ithink the world out, so people
are.
Speaker 4 (01:01:30):
Well, I would say Do you get what I'm saying?
I wouldn't say intimidate.
I think the word I would use iswelcoming.
I don't think.
It's not as welcoming, it'skind of you know, but that's
because the people aren't.
Speaker 3 (01:01:42):
Yeah, but I'm going to tell you what my husband said
.
My husband's from Pittsburghand he said I hate Pittsburgh.
Speaker 4 (01:01:51):
I'm from Cincinnati.
Oh okay, Hootie Go Bengals.
Speaker 3 (01:01:53):
Look, y'all know black and yellow, black and
yellow.
But David made a valid point tome.
He said, yvonca, I have to sayhe said if I was not married to
you?
My husband grew up, hisadoptive parents was white.
David had never been in apredominantly black church till
(01:02:14):
he got me.
We've been together almost 25years.
I took him to our churches, Itook him, he got to see the good
and the real bad and the ugly,okay.
And he said, yvonca, they'renot welcoming at all.
He said if I wasn't married toyou, he said I'd feel like an
(01:02:38):
outsider and I was like, really,and he's like, seriously,
yvonca, and he goes, and I'm notfrom here, but I had been in
the church realm for so longthat several people knew me so
that they were more accepting tohim.
But for somebody that walks inthe door, that does I'm just
(01:02:58):
being honest that does not havea big checkbook, okay, does not
look like what whoever thinksthey need to look like.
And that's what I struggle with, because I'm like it shouldn't
be about what someone looks likeand what checkbook they can
write.
It was interesting when I gothere, Do you get me oh?
Speaker 4 (01:03:16):
yeah, I know, because I had locks when I first moved
here.
Speaker 1 (01:03:20):
Oh, did you yeah.
Speaker 4 (01:03:22):
I mean they were halfway down my back and I had
guys Chris, you might want tocut those locks off.
I'm like I had guys I'm that Iknew got up in the pulpit and
preaching against locks.
You know then looking oh notyou, Chris.
Oh yeah, you meant me yeah, yeahyou like, but but but again, I
(01:03:43):
think the when we can lookbeyond people's faults and our
own faults and you know, andbegin to see people from the
created in the image of God,that are kingdom built, that are
a part of our community, thenthat changes everything.
For me it did, you know, itchanges everything.
(01:04:05):
I don't care what you, I don'tcare what color you are, I don't
care what, I don't care whatcolor you are, I don't care what
, I don't even care what genderyou claim.
Speaker 2 (01:04:13):
Okay you know, the kingdom is.
Speaker 4 (01:04:16):
There's a space in the kingdom for you and if we
reject, there's a space in thekingdom, in the kingdom for you?
If there is, if I read, and ifI reject you, if I cut you off,
you'll never be able to see youoff.
Speaker 3 (01:04:31):
You'll never be able to see it.
He said you'll never be able tosee it.
I am really enjoying thisconversation with Pastor.
Battle Tune in next Friday forpart two of this powerful,
powerful conversation.
Bye, guys.
Speaker 1 (01:04:48):
Thanks for listening to Talkin' Tennessee with Yvonca
.
Watch out for our weeklyepisodes from the First Family
of Real Estate and check us outon the web
wwwyvoncasalesrealestatecom.
See our videos on Yvonca'sYouTube channel or find us on
Facebook under.
Yvonca Landis and Twitter atYvonca Landis.
(01:05:10):
And don't forget to tell afriend about us.
Until next time.
Yvonca signing off.
Check us out to hear the latest on life in the
volunteer state.
Yvonca and her guests discusseverything from life, love and
business with a Tennessee flair.
It's a Tennessee thing, alwaysrelatable, always relevant and
always a good time.
This is Talkin' Tennessee, andnow your host, yvonca.
Speaker 2 (00:23):
This episode is brought to you by the Landis
team, your go-to real estatefamily in East Tennessee.
If you are looking to buy orsell, we are the ones you should
call.
Give us a call at 865-660-1186or check out our website at
YvoncaSellsRealEstatecom.
That's Yvonca Y-V-O-N-N-C-Asalesrealestatecom.
Speaker 3 (00:49):
Welcome back to Talking Tennessee with Yvonca.
I am your host and this week Iam featuring Pastor Chris Battle
.
Welcome to Talking Tennessee.
Speaker 4 (00:58):
Thank you for having me today.
Speaker 3 (00:59):
Most definitely, viewers.
This has been a work inprogress.
I reached out to Pastor Battlelast year and our schedules was
really packed and they staypacked, but I truly believe this
is when God really wanted tohappen.
I have to tell you that he hasbeen recommended to me by so
(01:24):
many different people in ourcommunity and they talked about
what all you're doing in thecommunity.
They talked about who you are,who you've been in the past.
They talked about differentthings, that they've watched you
evolve and just keep growingthis community.
So first let me give you yourflowers and tell you thank you
(01:47):
for everything that you do forour community, because that is
truly a God sent thing.
Thank you, thank you.
So let's get into it.
Who is Chris Battle?
Speaker 4 (01:57):
Who is Chris Battle?
I think, at the core, chrisBattle was this little, shy
little boy who loves God andwants to make everybody happy.
I think that's if you had totake off all the layers, yes, I
think that's who you would find.
Speaker 3 (02:17):
Yes, but throughout life I think you've probably
realized in certain areas youcan't make everybody happy Wish
you could.
Speaker 4 (02:28):
I have learned that the hard way, the hard way.
Yes.
Speaker 3 (02:34):
I think, we all learn that.
But I think that we have toremember that because there's
times that we really want tomake somebody happy in things,
but for whatever reason, it justdoesn't work that way.
But I think the best part aboutit is you having the heart to
want to be pleasing.
Speaker 4 (02:54):
Well, I shouldn't maybe my at my core, I want to
see a world which is at peaceand sh's shalom, you know where.
Everything is there.
Everybody's needs are metdoesn't mean you're gonna have
problems right but I thinkthat's what the kingdom is all
about.
It's about this, this place ofshalom, where everybody's whole
(03:17):
complete, um, dare I say, happyyes, yes, you know yes, um, but
but that's that's what I, that'swhat the goal I'm working for
in community, you know youbasically trying to do your part
and stay in my lane.
Speaker 3 (03:34):
Yes, yes, sometimes God will take you out of that
lane and God will say, okay, Ineed you to go over here.
Speaker 2 (03:39):
And you're like no.
Speaker 3 (03:40):
God and he's like yeah, you going.
Well, I think for me Willingly,or not willingly, for me it was
.
Speaker 4 (03:46):
I had to understand what that lane was.
I was kind of angry at God fortaking so long, you know.
Speaker 2 (03:54):
Okay, or maybe I was Be honest.
Speaker 4 (03:55):
Maybe I was slow about listening yes.
Or maybe it was just for me.
It wasn't time yet you know, Iwas telling somebody the other
day.
I said I wish I would haveknown this work 20 years ago, oh
, you know, when my knees werefeeling a little bit.
Speaker 3 (04:12):
It's funny you say that because last week I was
thinking, you know, with thewisdom you get when you grow
older, I hope is that you think,gosh, I wish I would have known
that.
I don't know what I could have,how I could have applied that.
You think, gosh, I wish I wouldhave known that a long time ago
, how I could have applied thatand stopped a lot of things, and
so that went through my mindlast week.
So we got something in common.
(04:35):
So how long have you been inKnoxville?
Speaker 4 (04:38):
I moved to Knoxville in 2008.
2008.
I'm from Cincinnati, ohio,originally.
Grew up there left.
Went to college, go MorehouseLeft Morehouse.
Graduated from Morehouse, wentto Southern Seminary in
Louisville, kentucky.
(05:00):
Got called to a church inBowling Green, kentucky, which
was actually 38 years ago thispast Sunday, father's Day and
then went to Hackensack, newJersey.
Okay, from Hackensack I wentback to Cincinnati.
Speaker 3 (05:09):
Oh, wow.
Speaker 4 (05:09):
And stayed another about 15 years or so and then
got called here to TabernacleBaptist Church here in 2008.
Speaker 3 (05:18):
Okay, so you're married.
Speaker 4 (05:20):
Yes, I'm married to my wife.
Speaker 3 (05:23):
Please, yeah, please tell us who your wife is.
I guess it's good to be marriedto my wife.
Please tell us who your wife is.
Speaker 2 (05:26):
I guess it's good to be married to your wife.
Speaker 4 (05:31):
Her name is Toma Battle.
We have 19 children, 15 ofwhich we have adopted or have
legal custody over 19?
.
Yeah.
Speaker 3 (05:42):
Viewers 19.
That's a lot of and let me saythis um, I have a biological
child and I have an adoptivechild and you can relate to this
we love it's, it's, there's nodifference, or we just love, you
know that type thing.
But it's such a great feelingto know that, for when you saved
(06:05):
a child and you gave that childlove and you showed them the
world, you know as best youcould.
So to do that for 19 kids,that's commendable in itself.
I mean to have the patience forone for 19 kids and just.
Life could be hard or lifecould be easy, but you chose.
(06:31):
You didn't choose either one.
Speaker 4 (06:32):
You just said I'm just gonna help somebody well,
yeah, um, I'm not gonna say, wecame out, that was our okay
we're gonna get married and haveall these children.
Yes, that was not, that was notthe case at all no and, and my
sister once asked me well, wewere talking.
She said, chris, I don't thinkI could go foster because as
(06:52):
soon as I get attached to thechild, yes.
They'll take the child.
Speaker 3 (06:56):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (06:59):
And remove like that.
How I look at this is give thatchild all the love you can,
show them some semblance of whatnormalcy looks like, some
semblance of functionality.
Speaker 3 (07:15):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (07:16):
I'm not saying my sister's just as dysfunctional
as I am.
But some semblance of what afamily looks like, but some
semblance of what a family lookslike.
So, even if they are taken away, even if they do leave, they'll
be able to reflect on thatperiod of time that you're
together and say hey thissituation here.
Speaker 3 (07:35):
it doesn't have to be like this.
There is another way.
Speaker 4 (07:38):
Yes, and I think, a lot of our young people some of
you have not seen options.
Speaker 2 (07:45):
Yes, they haven't seen that there are other ways
to do things.
Speaker 3 (07:48):
There's other options .
And then you know theopportunity to grow and the
opportunity to see throughsomeone else's lenses, that type
thing.
And I think with my son, youknow I've got a girl, a daughter
and a son and I'm learning thatraising a boy and a girl is so
(08:08):
different oh, it's so differentboys, give me boys oh okay, so
me, I would say give me girls.
Speaker 4 (08:16):
Yes, boys are hard girls are girls are they're
chatty?
Speaker 3 (08:19):
I'll say girls are chatty, I'll say girls are
chatty, but boys, they try you,they try you and you have to
show them who wins.
You know that type thing, but Ithink that was God's plan.
You know, we had had, at thetime when I adopted him, we had
(08:42):
had six miscarriages.
We've had a total of ten and wehad given up, you know, and my
husband's adopted.
And so David one day was likewhat do you think about adoption
?
Okay, this is way before my son, and I said I'd be open to that
.
And he said if I ever adopted achild, I'd want them, I would
want to really teach them youknow how to grow in life as an
(09:08):
adopted child.
He said because that was me.
And so months and months later,the opportunity came and so I
commend you for it because I'mlike I understand where your
sister's coming from, because wedid kinship, we didn't do
foster care we knew the familyand so I never forget.
(09:28):
When I got my son, uh, thesocial worker says to me okay,
do not get attached.
Well, the moment they hand youthat, baby, you're going to get
attacked.
That was the first thing theysaid to me is do not get
attached, and I was just likehow can you love and show this
kid, you know, especially infant?
You know love and you tell themno attachment.
Speaker 4 (09:51):
That's ridiculous.
Speaker 3 (09:53):
Yes, and so yeah, yeah, exactly, well, they did.
Speaker 4 (09:59):
And for us.
You know, I had two sons frommy first marriage and when me
and Toma toma got married, wehad five miscarriages and that's
why we went the adoptive route.
And I'll never forget um.
I was running a revival inbaltimore, maryland, and she
called me.
She said chris, they found asibling group of five.
(10:20):
Yeah, it was a sibling group offive, but they were living in
three different homes and theywanted to bring them together.
Can we take them?
I said, if you good baby, I'mgood with it, you know.
Speaker 3 (10:31):
And she said well, I already told him yes, but we'll
she said listen, I just want youto feel like that I can see.
And then we had then we.
Speaker 2 (10:40):
We had our first child together, then we had
another one yeah, and then youknow, but it's like, you know,
it's like if an elephant stepson your foot.
Speaker 3 (10:49):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (10:49):
And another elephant jumps on its back.
It ain't going to make adifference.
Speaker 3 (10:53):
Yes, it's not.
It's not.
That's the truth.
It's not.
It ain't going to make adifference.
Your situation was kind of likewith mine.
My husband, where we shoot inthis office is the studio in my
husband's office and he was inthe part of the house and he was
walking through and I told himthe situation and I said can we
(11:13):
take him?
And he goes, yeah, and he walksoff, okay.
He said, yeah, we can, and hewalks off and he walks back in
here, okay, and then he comesback and he he goes.
Did I just say we could take achild?
And from there on you know therest of the story.
He's 15 years old, he just umgraduated from ninth grade,
(11:34):
going to 10th grade, and we'reone big, happy family.
But I will say, adoption is agreat thing.
Uh, can it be trying?
Yes, I'm not going to telly'all it's not, but it is a
great thing and you're saving achild and it's a great option.
So let me ask you this why doyou love this community?
(11:55):
Why, yes?
Speaker 4 (12:03):
I'm trying to remember when I fell in love
with Knoxville.
Speaker 3 (12:11):
That's a darn good you should have sent that
question to me.
I told you I wouldn't throwsomething at you, but I'll give
you a good question ultimately,it's the people.
Speaker 4 (12:23):
It's the people in the community.
Speaker 3 (12:24):
I've met some wonderful, loving.
Speaker 4 (12:25):
I'm going to give you a good question.
Ultimately, it's the people.
Mm-hmm, it's the people in thecommunity.
Yes, I've met some wonderful,loving, crazy, peace-loving
people in this community andI've always invested in the
communities.
I've pastored Okay, I've alwayslived in the communities.
I've pastored, okay, pastored.
I've always lived in thecommunities.
(12:46):
I've pastored Because I work,play, pray, play in the same zip
code.
So I believe in that.
And I've always been one wholikes to see the beauty and the
wonder of people, the image ofGod in people, and grow on that.
(13:07):
Now, some folks, you've got tolook real hard.
You've got to look real hard,yeah, real hard, but we'll find
that there's beauty and wonderin everybody.
And I told somebody the otherday I said you know, I think one
of my faults is I genuinelylike people.
Speaker 3 (13:30):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (13:30):
I genuinely like people, so that's, it's the
people, it's the support thatI've received, you know, and
East Tennessee is different,it's definitely different.
Speaker 3 (13:41):
It's different and East Tennessee is different.
It's definitely different, it'sdifferent.
And I think the biggest thingwith East Tennessee is I'm not
trying to say East Tennessee isperfect, I'm not saying that,
but we know that, because somepeople are like, oh, we're all
balls.
You know, I'm like, no, there'ssome parts of East Tennessee
that could be better.
But I think the biggest thingabout our community is what I
(14:08):
appreciate that we can go in agrocery store, maybe not know
somebody, and they still speak,yeah, you know, what I'm saying.
When there's a call of duty,someone gets sick, someone is in
need, it just seems like easttennessee rallies.
(14:30):
And I'm speaking of, you know,from experience, when my husband
got sick, when I told you offcamera, uh, 11 years ago, there
were so many churches.
Well, first of all, his storyjust went like wildfire.
Well, first of all, his storyjust went like wildfire and grew
and a friend of mine put it onFacebook.
I didn't want it on Facebookbut God knew what he was doing
(14:55):
Because this friend put it onFacebook and he was the only one
that I didn't tell not to,because I didn't think he would.
He put it on Facebook and heasked people to pray for David
and it took off, just.
But there was so many peoplethat came together for me that
did not know me from Adam.
There were churches that werereaching out all over the
(15:18):
country, literally said he's onour prayer list, he's this, this
East Tennessee man, and that tome just I'm not saying other
cities are not great, but to meI'm East Tennessee All day,
every day, because I love how werally.
You know we may get mad at eachother at times, we may not
(15:42):
speak sometimes, but it'ssomething about East Tennessee
brings us back together.
Speaker 4 (15:48):
Do you agree with that?
I would agree with that to acertain extent.
Speaker 3 (15:50):
Yes, yes.
Speaker 4 (15:52):
I believe particularly in the African
American community.
We would see that yes.
Speaker 3 (15:56):
Even to the expanded community.
Speaker 4 (15:59):
We have some hurdles that we got to cross.
Speaker 3 (16:01):
We do, we do.
I agree with that, I totallyagree with that.
And that leads me to my nextquestion.
Uh-oh, two-part question whatled you into ministry in
Knoxville Tennessee?
Let's start with that.
Speaker 4 (16:19):
Well, again I had started.
I've been pastoring indifferent cities across the
country, up and down the EastCoast.
Speaker 3 (16:26):
I guess you could say let's go back for one second
Viewers.
Pastor Battle has been inministry for 43 years.
He has been a pastor.
Am I?
Is it?
Speaker 4 (16:37):
Yeah, 43 years 33 of those were institutions.
Speaker 3 (16:42):
No, no.
43 years in ministry, 33 yearsin pastoring, so now go ahead.
I just want to give them theback um what was?
Your question.
Your question is what led youto ministry in knoxville?
Speaker 4 (16:56):
so we were um, we were a part of a congregation in
cincinnati, we were doing well,but we just felt it was time to
leave.
My wife put out the.
She started filling outapplications for me.
Speaker 1 (17:12):
She said let's she said it's time.
Speaker 4 (17:16):
Tabernacle extended a call to me and it was a fit.
I really believe I had comehere planning on retiring here.
Speaker 3 (17:26):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (17:27):
That was probably my last church and you know, boom,
I'm through.
You know.
But you know, then thetrajectory changed.
God threw me a curveball.
Speaker 3 (17:36):
Them curveballs.
They be brutal sometimes.
And that's my next questionwhat is your thoughts of the
church, of the current state ofthe church, the current state?
Speaker 4 (17:52):
I'm going to tell my story.
Go ahead, answer your question.
Speaker 3 (17:55):
Tell it.
Speaker 4 (17:56):
So when I moved here again, I had 30 years under my
belt and I said I'm going tocome approach this with a more
philosophical approach.
I think I know what I'm doingnow and my question was how can
our church impact the community?
(18:17):
And so we moved here in 08.
And one of the and during theinterviewing process, one of the
questions was if you become ourpastor, what would be one of
the first things you would do?
Ok, I had been on a tour ofEast Knoxville and I said well,
(18:41):
the first thing we're going todo is clean that cemetery across
the street.
I've been asked that question.
Before I give them, you know,brush off, you know.
Oh, I want to sit and look atthe community and sit with the
people and understand the needsof the city and you know, yes,
yes.
I said, no, we're going to cleanthat because Oddfellow.
(19:03):
Cemetery was a mess and I saidyou know it's overgrown,
headstones are knocked over andmost of the people buried there
were born in slavery.
I said it's an embarrassment toour history.
I'm not even from here.
I'm not even from here, andthat's an embarrassment.
Speaker 3 (19:20):
It is.
We're going to clean thatcemetery.
I'm not from here either.
Keep going.
So they called me, I think in.
Speaker 4 (19:27):
September, First week of December, I think it was.
We were out there cleaningabout 30 of us.
Speaker 3 (19:33):
I said we're going to clean this.
Speaker 4 (19:34):
He said we're going to go clean, we're going to
clean it and we're mowing, we'rechainsawing, we're putting
headstones back up, we we gotbags and bags of debris we've
collected.
And this brother pulls up in apickup truck.
He stops me and starts thankingus for what we're doing.
Thank you for investing in thecommunity, thank you for doing
this, da-da-da-da-da.
So me and my thinking I donecaught me a fish.
(19:58):
Okay, I got me a potentialmember.
Speaker 3 (20:01):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (20:04):
And I said, brother, won't you come join us at the
church?
And he looked me in the eye andhe said these words, and I
quote I ain't come to your damnchurch.
And he pulled off oh wow, well,that was my response too, so uh
, especially after he's yes his,his, his, his, his commendation
turned to consternation.
(20:24):
Yes, yes, and I'm flabbergasted,but it plagued me, it still
plagues me.
And then fast forward to 2016.
Okay, concord Baptist Churchdid a study on church attendance
in Knoxville and this is thebuckle of the Bible belt, and
(20:46):
20% of Knoxvillians go to churchon a regular basis 20%, and
regular was considered once amonth.
Yeah, and so roughly 40% aredone with church.
They used to go, don't goanymore.
Love Jesus can't stand theinstitution or consider
themselves spiritual and theother 40% from this study have
(21:11):
no religious affiliation.
And I'm like well, don't looklike.
Anybody's going to anybody'schurch and I'm talking to my
pastor.
Friends across denominationallines, across racial lines,
across the country, they'retelling me the same thing
Attendance is going down.
We're having to reconsider ourbudget, you know, because we're
not getting as much money.
(21:31):
And this is before the pandemic.
Right right, this is before thepandemic.
Speaker 3 (21:35):
Yeah, you're saying 2016.
Speaker 4 (21:37):
And I got to thinking I'm like, well, maybe we need
to do church differently, Okay,but I don't know.
I'm like, well, maybe we needto do church differently.
Speaker 3 (21:45):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (21:47):
But I don't know what that looks like.
I'm a baby boomer and I getthat.
Speaker 3 (21:52):
I get that I'm a baby boomer.
You may see that there needschange, but what change?
Speaker 4 (21:56):
I don't know what that looks like.
What is it supposed?
To be, and so the stuff we weredoing that we thought would you
know in retrospect the stuffthat I would do to try to get
attendance up, whatever wasreally for the folk who were
already coming.
You really teaching right nowso 2018,.
We had a piece of property andI've always done a little
(22:20):
gardening.
Speaker 3 (22:20):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (22:22):
I don't consider myself a good gardener.
Now I just know that God putssomething in a seed, that when
you put it in the soil, give ussome warmth and some water it's
going to grow.
Speaker 3 (22:32):
It's going to grow.
Speaker 4 (22:32):
Okay, you know, and I've also I've always done this
a little bit at the house, righthere and there and we had a
plot of land like two doors downfrom the church.
I'm like, why don't we do agarden here?
It took me three years to getthis garden going, okay.
So I started like in 2015.
Okay, it was 2018 when we gotit going.
(22:54):
Okay, and I called a friend ofmine who was working at the
botanical garden.
I said hey, come help me talk.
So I wanted to do a communitygarden.
You know, give me the ins andouts, you know, help me design
this space or whatever.
And in that conversation westart talking about food
disparity and food desert, andit was literally at that point
(23:22):
that the trajectory of my lifechanged.
I'm like hold up.
Speaker 3 (23:28):
I'm in a church.
Speaker 4 (23:29):
I'm in a church and we have a significant problem in
our community.
People are literally dying aslow death Hypertension, obesity
, sugar, diabetes, heart issueand it's all based on diet,
because they don't have accessto fresh fruits and vegetables.
Speaker 3 (23:46):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (23:47):
They have access to Burger King.
They can have it their way.
They got access to, you know,Pizza Palace and McDonald's and
all of these.
Chick-fil-A.
They got every corner store,every dollar store, but yet
there's no grocery store,there's no place to sell fresh
produce.
The USDA says if one third ofyour community is living in
(24:13):
poverty and more than a mileaway from a grocery store or
farmer's market, you'reconsidered a food desert.
We were two miles away, see.
And then places of poverty isalways a transportation problem.
People can't afford cars.
The median income in the zipcode that we're working in it's
(24:34):
seventeen thousand dollars ayear.
Yeah, it says they say they sayit takes like nine thousand
dollars a year just to maintaina car in knoxville.
Say, okay, so if I'm, if I, ifI'm making 17 and I got a car,
that knocks it down to what?
Eight thousand already, yeah,so we got some issues.
We got some issues, so I gotsome issues.
So I didn't know all this atfirst.
(24:54):
I just knew that there was aproblem here.
I'm like well, maybe what wecould do is get other churches
to start growing gardens.
Speaker 2 (25:01):
Okay, start doing gardens.
Speaker 4 (25:04):
Reached out to some pastor friends, but something
happened.
Something else happened.
I'm at the garden.
My wife would tell you I wasthere.
Every morning I would go toMcDonald's and get my coffee.
And get my coffee Right, andI'd wait for the sun.
Come on sun, let's go.
So I'm ready to go out here andwork in the garden Garden is
(25:28):
peaceful.
Yes, we come from the soil.
That's why there's that peacein the soil.
Speaker 3 (25:33):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (25:34):
Maybe that's what the song should have said.
There's peace in the soil forme.
Speaker 2 (25:38):
Anyway.
Speaker 4 (25:40):
Yeah, you can cut that part out.
But what happened, monica, waspeople started coming to the
garden Community.
People were coming to thegarden Community.
People were coming to thegarden.
I'm meeting people.
I'll never forget I met thiswoman, did you?
Speaker 3 (25:58):
hear him say they were coming to the garden.
Speaker 4 (26:01):
Who would never come to my Black Baptist brick and
mortar church Are y'all?
Speaker 3 (26:05):
hearing what he's saying.
They wouldn't, come to thechurch, but they would come to
the garden.
Speaker 4 (26:12):
Came to the garden.
Speaker 3 (26:13):
Why is that?
Speaker 4 (26:15):
I think because it is a place of peace.
There is no condemnation in thegarden Plus.
Speaker 3 (26:23):
I think it's seeing something grow.
It's visible, it is and itbrings joy.
You know what I'm saying andI'm not saying the church.
There's not joy in the church.
I'm not saying that.
What I'm saying is is that thejoy that garden signifies joy.
(26:46):
You know it doesn't signifyattitudes.
It doesn't signify, you know,people not getting along.
It doesn't signify people notgetting along.
It doesn't signify any of that.
It's only joy and growth.
I can see why you'd want to goto the garden.
People come to the garden.
Speaker 4 (27:03):
We had black folk, white folk, straight folk, gay
folk, old folk coming to thegarden.
Speaker 3 (27:12):
I'm like why is is that?
I didn't really care why.
Speaker 4 (27:18):
I'm like you're just happy they're coming to the
garden and I was going throughsomething in my life, in my
understanding of church.
I guess I think I said before Iwas really starting to realize
that church is not a space, it'snot a place, it's not an
address, it's not a point on myGPS.
Speaker 3 (27:41):
It's who I am, it's what we do, and it's going
against what you were taught.
Speaker 4 (27:45):
Yes.
Speaker 3 (27:47):
Let's talk about that , and I will.
And because, and I'm likeBecause we're taught go to
church, go to church, and churchis a building.
Speaker 2 (27:55):
And church is a building.
Speaker 3 (27:56):
Yeah, keep going.
Speaker 4 (27:57):
And the folks would come to the garden?
Yes, and they wouldn't come tomy.
There wasn't a building mybleep church?
Yes, and still won't.
I had a guy stop at the farmone day a few months ago.
He goes.
I love your mission, I justdon't like the god of your
mission oh, wow but he was in.
(28:18):
He was in the garden he stillwas in the garden.
You see, I think I think what,how?
I again, as I said, myunderstanding of church was
changing, okay, and I'm like,well, if they're coming to the
garden, maybe that should be thechurch.
Speaker 3 (28:37):
So let me ask you a question Historically, the
church has been in our community.
The church has been thecornerstone of our communities
for generation after generation.
But these days and times,people are running from the
(28:59):
church, people are not going tothe church.
What do you think of youropinion?
Why do you think that's beenthe cornerstone of our
communities?
Okay, I tell people let me goback a little bit.
I tell people I'm like the twothings that people don't get
(29:21):
that slavery taught us.
It taught us family and ittaught us God.
Okay, because that's all we had.
We didn't have a lot in slavery, you know so.
But in these days and times, somany people are running from
the church, so what do you thinkthe reason why is, I think?
Speaker 4 (29:43):
I think I think a few reasons actually, but I think
one is that I think oftentimesour churches have become
irrelevant.
Ok, we're, we're, we're solving, we're asked, we're solving
questions, we're answeringquestions that nobody's asking,
(30:04):
that the community is not asking.
Ok, secondly, we don't worktogether.
Secondly, we don't worktogether.
The civil rights movement wasstarted in the church, but
churches had to work together.
Yes, you know our church, theway our structures are built, is
(30:31):
because we're set up forcompetition, not cooperation.
Speaker 3 (30:33):
You know, teach, pastor and I could go on for
that, but I don't know how muchtime I don't understand.
What I don't understand is OK,we all say we love the Lord.
Well, the Lord is of love andunity.
Yeah, not division, unity, ok,not division, unity, okay.
I don't understand.
(30:58):
If I'm a pastor, you're apastor.
Why can't we be unified andworship together and not be
worried about?
Well, you know why.
Speaker 4 (31:10):
The reason why is because if I don't get the money
, that if I don't get people inthere, get the money to pay
these bills and to pay thesesalaries I don't have a job.
Okay, because our the way thestructure of our congregations
I've in my opinion, is reallybuilt around income oh it's
built around income, so thematrix that we use to determine
(31:34):
church success, I call them thebps the bps the bps, butts and
pews butts and pews okay bucksin the plate, baptisms in the
pool and building programs.
If you have that going on, ifyou got theisms in the pool and
building programs.
If you have that going on ifyou've got the butts in the pews
(31:56):
, which people tend to thinkbrings more bucks in the plate.
Right, right, right, and ifyou've got the people coming,
they'll have more baptisms inthe pool, right, and if you're
always building, it always lookslike you're successful.
That's the matrix we use forchurch success, and if we can
get more people in, we can getmore people.
That's the matrix we use forchurch success and if we can get
more people in, we can get morepeople.
That's why we're competitive.
That's why we're competitivebecause I need those people.
(32:19):
We're fighting for the samepeople.
We're in a small pool and we'retrying to fight for the same
fish, right?
Yes, I need you to come to mychurch, you need them to go to
your church or whatever.
I was telling a guy one.
I was like, hey, man, you guystalked, maybe start doing like,
um, we, we were, we were movingto, uh, small groups and homes
okay and the guy told me he's afriend of mine, he pastors
(32:40):
another, another state.
He goes no, I can't do thatbecause they might try to go and
start a church.
I'm like, well, what's wrongwith that right?
You know, but if they, go startanother church.
Speaker 3 (32:53):
That's money.
Then he loses members, that'sright.
Then he goes to the church, soit really gets based around that
Okay.
But if it's that, it's thewrong matrix.
It is because, if it's that, ifwe say we're a child of God and
we're following God, god said Iwill provide.
(33:14):
He said, just build a kingdom.
Speaker 4 (33:16):
He said I will provide but you said the key
word kingdom.
Kingdom is the key word.
He didn't say build individualkingdoms he said build a kingdom
and kingdom requirescooperation.
And I began to look at church.
So much different.
He said build a kingdom,kingdom, and kingdom requires
cooperation.
Yes, you see, and I began tolook at church so much different
(33:37):
.
I'm like you know what?
Speaker 3 (33:38):
We're supposed to be building kingdom we are.
Speaker 4 (33:41):
If I asked you what the gospel is, I ask this
question all the time to theclasses I teach and people give
me the same answer the gospel isthe death, burial and
resurrection, and soon returning, of Christ.
I'm like you haven't read theBible, because every time you
read gospel in the New Testament.
(34:02):
It's always followed by thegospel of the kingdom.
The gospel of the kingdom, thegospel of the kingdom.
It's the good news that there'sgoing to be a better way.
It's the good news that there'san alternate way of living way.
It's the good news that there'san alternate way of living.
Speaker 3 (34:16):
It's the good news that shalom is on the way and
people do not get right evenwhen they read it.
They miss, they miss thekingdom they miss the kingdom.
Speaker 4 (34:24):
And and how do you?
Speaker 3 (34:26):
sit and say that you read the bible and you study it,
and, and then you get up andpreach it, and you get up and
teach it, and all this, but Idon't see many pastors preach
kingdom.
Speaker 4 (34:38):
Because it doesn't fit into the BPs.
You're teaching, thank you, andI'm not mad.
I mean, I was involved in thattoo.
Yeah, I tried my best to do theBPs, but you learned something
different.
Speaker 3 (34:51):
I try my best to follow, do the BPs, but you
learn something different.
I learn something different.
Speaker 4 (34:55):
I begin to understand church.
I begin to understand whatkingdom is really all about.
Speaker 3 (35:01):
And it's not about competition.
It's not about competition, it'sreally not when you really
follow God and you.
One thing I'll say about ourrace we're history makers.
Okay, we love to be the first.
I'm the first, and I'm notsaying that's not a good thing,
(35:22):
but you can't be the first andstay the first.
You got to be able to see.
Okay, god allowed me to be thefirst, to be an example.
(35:42):
Now let others eat off of whatyou became the first of and
allow other people to do.
It may be similar, but God madeus one of a kind, so we don't
have to worry about competing ifyou really know God.
Well, jesus said that.
Do you get what I'm saying?
Speaker 4 (35:55):
Jesus said that the disciples told Jesus one day.
They said, hey, we had to stopthese cats because they're over
there healing folks in your name.
Jesus said why are you stoppingthem?
Why are you stopping them Justbecause they're not walking with
us?
They don't need to Let them goahead and do what they're doing.
But my thing is that when westart seeing it, I believe that
(36:20):
our churches should look likeour communities.
We complain about.
The communities are not.
They're drug infected, affected.
They're craziness going on,they're shooting each other.
But we got all these churchesin the community and nothing's
changing in the community.
Nothing, nothing's changing inthe community.
Speaker 3 (36:41):
This is what I don't understand about it and you can
please explain this to me.
True evangelism is in yourcommunity, being out in the
community, it's not in abuilding.
I don't understand about ourchurches that we want to keep
everything in house Okay.
(37:02):
But we want to say we work inour community Big piece.
Yes, we want to say we work inour community.
Speaker 2 (37:08):
but we don't see you in the community.
Speaker 3 (37:10):
We don't see you getting your hands dirty.
We do not see you telling yourmembers hey, let's go help
Pastor Battle If that meansgoing to pick the beans.
Do you get what I'm?
Speaker 4 (37:22):
saying I got saved the second time you got to have
one in one when I was in collegeIs that the second time.
When I was in Campus Crusadefor Christ right.
Yes and we had the fourspiritual laws.
You know God loves you and hasa wonderful plan.
I knew that whole thing, youknow.
And every church I pastored.
(37:42):
I taught them the fourspiritual laws taught them about
going out of the family.
Then it struck me one daybecause I would go to McDonald's
and get my coffee every morning.
And how long are you in thecoffee when you're in the
drive-thru and you see the?
Speaker 3 (37:55):
30 seconds.
Yeah, a minute is long, yes, 30seconds.
Yes.
Speaker 4 (38:02):
But it's amazing what you can learn about people.
Is McDonald's coffee that good,I thought?
Speaker 3 (38:06):
so, okay, okay, go try it.
I used to work at McDonald's,but back then.
Speaker 1 (38:09):
I wasn't drinking no coffee, so I kept going.
Speaker 4 (38:17):
It's amazing what people you can learn about
people in 30 second interactions.
You know I would go throughthere and the same lady, every
pastor pray for my son.
He's da, da, da, da da.
Speaker 2 (38:25):
You know, hey, pastor , how you doing.
Speaker 4 (38:27):
You know, I'm like, hmm, and so what I?
And so I started approaching itlike this.
I think I got to a point whereI discouraged the church,
discouraged them from going out,taking these pamphlets and
knocking on doors.
Speaker 3 (38:45):
I said no, we ain't doing that.
No more.
Speaker 4 (38:47):
Why are we going to knock on a stranger's door, who
we don't know?
Take them through this fourspiritual laws, or take them
down the Roman's road ofevangelism or salvation or
whatever, and they'll say asentence, prayer, and then, boom
, we'll say next, okay, I'm likeno, that's that's.
(39:11):
Let's not do it.
Let's do what I, what we call arelational evangelist, and
that's what we try to do at thefarm.
We try to live our life in sucha way that people will ask us
why we do what we do.
Peter talks about it in 1.
Peter talks about always beprepared to make a defense for
your faith.
But be prepared for what?
Because people should be askingyou why do you do this, chris?
Speaker 3 (39:34):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (39:35):
Why are you so kind to me?
And everybody else so you canshare.
I can share why, but it's aresult of the relationship, not
because I knocked on your door.
You've seen an example of it.
Speaker 3 (39:48):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (39:49):
You've seen an example of love.
You've seen an example of mercy.
You've seen an example of love.
Speaker 3 (39:53):
You've seen an example of mercy, you've seen an
example of grace and they needto see it in your wall.
Speaker 4 (39:55):
And I right, and I got guys folks that walk by my
garden every day and and some ofthem have even taken ownership.
You know, I saw somebodywalking through.
I told them to get out.
I mean, you know you're rightbecause they know me, they have
a relation.
I had a guy who was a houselessfellow and we were loading up
the truck one day and he said,pastor, I need to talk with you.
(40:17):
I said okay.
Speaker 2 (40:19):
When we get finished, I'll talk with you.
Speaker 4 (40:20):
I said okay.
Speaker 2 (40:22):
It was just kind of strange.
Speaker 4 (40:23):
Right.
So we got finished with what wewere doing and then he went
into his backpack and then I sawit.
Then I saw it, I saw it and Iknew what he was saying and he
came to me and said because whatit was was a camera he had
stolen.
Okay, it was a camera he wouldstole.
And he said I took it and I'msorry, I apologize when I took
(40:52):
it when we first met, but when Irealized what you guys are
doing, here, guilt was kickinghis mind and he said I hope you
can.
I hope you don't think.
Speaker 3 (41:05):
I said, brother, I think more of you now because
you made the mistake but youtried to rectify it and you did
rectify it, but yes, he didrectify it, but it goes back to
what you said a few minutes agowhen you said you know, I was
part of that belief of buildingchurches up that way, but I
don't think that way anymore.
(41:26):
So you changed your, yourbelief changed changed.
Your belief changed.
So your walk changed.
So to the church, part of it.
I'm like we're all going tomake mistakes but the one thing
we have to do is we've got togrow and we have to be able to
(41:57):
let God work in us.
I mean that type thing and I'llnever forget early in my walk
with God I was going to thischurch and I thought very highly
of the pastor and the wife andthe first lady and I'll never
forget a Christmas cake and I doa huge Christmas party every
year, show appreciation to myclients and all that.
Just say thank you, and thenpeople in the community that has
(42:17):
helped me all year longreferring me, and I'll never
forget that I'm a tree person,christmas tree person, so I put
up a lot of trees every year,and so people will call me and
ask me to come see the trees.
And so I'll never forget I wasgoing to this church and to me I
feel like God gave me my house,not just for me and my family,
he gave it to me to share, andso I've had church cookouts here
(42:40):
.
I've had all kinds of eventshere, okay, so this particular
Christmas I was talking to thepastor and first lady and I said
, oh, so-and-so, so-and-so,so-and-so is coming to see the
trees tonight, so we're going tohave hot cocoa and this
different stuff and some snacks.
You should come by.
(43:00):
I'll never forget.
This pastor said and his wifesaid this to me you are inviting
those people to your house.
And I said what?
You're inviting them?
You don't want all of them inyour house.
Pastor Battle, that's literallyhit me like a ton of bricks,
(43:23):
because this is why it hit me.
I'm like these people aremembers of your church and
you're calling them that peoplethose people we were taught the
Bible says it, you know shun.
Speaker 4 (43:38):
You know, to some folks you need to be shunning
and everything.
And it hit me one day, thepeople that we shun, we stay
away from that.
We don't invite to come to ourhouse to see the Christmas trees
and have hot cocoa with, or thesame people Jesus was sitting
with.
And I'm like whoa, if Jesus cansit with them.
Speaker 3 (44:03):
And those are the same people that if things got
tough and you got sick they'rethe same people that will show
up and nurse you back to health,but to hear a pastor tell me to
not invite them to my house,like they are a different set of
people and that like they arenot worthy, I was in shock.
Speaker 4 (44:27):
And I think that's the problem.
I think that's one of theproblems with our church.
That's a whole other issue.
Speaker 3 (44:33):
Right.
Speaker 4 (44:34):
But most of our churches don't look like our
communities.
Speaker 2 (44:38):
They just don't they don't.
Speaker 4 (44:41):
And nobody wants to admit that I mean because we got
white-collar churches, we gotblue-collar churches, we got
no-collar churches, churches,churches.
Speaker 2 (44:51):
I had a lady at my first church.
Speaker 4 (44:52):
My first church in Bowling Green was a first church
.
Speaker 2 (44:58):
And it was one of those.
Speaker 4 (44:59):
It was.
Anyway, and I asked a ladywalking down the street.
I'll never forget.
I said won't you come join usat church?
She goes, I don't wear silkdrawers and she kept on.
Speaker 1 (45:11):
She said that to me.
I'll never do that.
That's your battle.
Speaker 3 (45:15):
People say crazy things to me.
They say crazy things to me.
Speaker 4 (45:19):
They say crazy, and particularly at the farm.
Yes, I bet, but that's thebeauty of it to me.
That's the beauty of it to methat people can say what they
need to.
Because, I don't tell folk I'mpastor.
Speaker 3 (45:33):
I don't.
Speaker 4 (45:34):
I'm farming, I'm the gardener.
You know why?
Because when you tell peopleyou're pastor, they treat you
differently.
They talk differently when youput a title on it.
Speaker 3 (45:43):
I tell people titles.
We make titles.
Titles don't make us If yourname does not stand for anything
.
When people say to me now, likeif I go to like an event that
we have to use our titles, inreal estate or something like
that.
Then I want to say YvonneCalandas, I'm a real dad, but
(46:04):
outside of that, I'm YvonneCalandas, ok, because my name
means something to me.
You know what.
I'm Yvonne Galathas, because myname means something to me.
You know what I'm saying.
But I think a lot of timespeople get caught up into titles
and position because they don'tthink highly of themselves and
don't think and haven't doneanything to gain respect to
(46:27):
their name through life.
And that's where you have totap into yourself and say where
am I lacking and where do I needto get better than I?
That title is more importantthan my name.
I mean, you know what I'msaying.
I feel you on that one.
And so let me ask you this soup today, if you could give
(46:48):
advice to pastors, what would bename two things that you would
say?
If I was standing up in frontof a whole bunch of pastors and
they were asking me about makingan impact in ministry, what
(47:09):
would be the two things that youwould say Make sure you try
this or do this.
Speaker 4 (47:14):
I think I'd say two things.
Speaker 3 (47:16):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (47:17):
One cooperate and collaborate.
Don't fight each other.
That's a whole word, right there, you know we had, when I was
pastoring Tabernacle, fight eachother.
That's a whole work right there.
You know, um, we had, um, whenI was pastoring tabernacle, me
and the wife would walk goingdown the street one day, driving
, and we started counting thechurches that were on or about
(47:39):
Martin Luther King.
This was back in 20, early, 28,2000.
Um, and we counted 15, 15churches, Basically three
schools.
I'm like what if we all worktogether with and each, you know
(48:01):
, from this point, here we couldwork with Vine.
This school here could workwith Fair Garden.
These churches here could workwith AE, we could adopt these
schools, we could have impact inthese schools.
Speaker 3 (48:12):
And I tried my best to get it going, but nobody
wanted to work there.
Speaker 4 (48:16):
Some girls got into a fight and this kind of what
motivated it.
These girls two girls from Vinegot into a fight and I'm like
why don't we get our churchestogether and have a patrol?
Yeah, you know yeah, afterschool, and because first I
asked the church.
You know I asked the church andnobody's crickets, nobody
(48:39):
responded.
I asked the other church.
I've reached out to pastors.
They fighting, call the police.
I mean, those are literally theresponses I get.
I went to the secular communityand they all showed up.
So, cooperation andcollaboration.
I think the second thing.
Well, I might have three thingsCooperation and collaboration,
(49:00):
kingdom minded Be kingdom minded, which kind of goes with the
first, but kingdom minded tobuild community, to build shalom
, to look at more than yourlocation.
Speaker 3 (49:13):
And let me say this, he may not want to say it
Community is not inside yourchurch.
Speaker 4 (49:21):
When I say community, I'm talking about the
geographic location around yourchurch.
Speaker 3 (49:24):
Do you hear what?
Speaker 4 (49:25):
he's saying that's what I'm talking about Community
is not, I think, in the blackculture.
Speaker 3 (49:33):
I don't think nobody's teaching that.
Speaker 4 (49:37):
Well, I'm learning that they don't.
Speaker 1 (49:41):
I teach at Johnson.
Speaker 4 (49:42):
University right.
And one of the classes theclass, not one of the.
The class I teach is calledThriving Church, thriving
Communities.
Yes, and my whole argument forthat class is whatever matrix
you use the BPs to determine athriving for your church, if
it's not happening in yourcommunity, it's not happening at
(50:02):
all yeah.
Speaker 3 (50:03):
So you got to come out of the churches and you have
to realize that when you'resaying collaborate, you got to
come together and you have to beable to see that sometimes the
problem is not, you know, we'llsit and say the opposite race,
or we'll sit and say aboutdifferent things, but sometimes
(50:24):
it can be just in our mindset ofchanging our mindset and
telling your congregation it'sokay.
Speaker 4 (50:34):
When I was pastoring in Cincinnati we had planted a
church, and we had actuallypurchased an old kingdom hall.
Speaker 3 (50:42):
Okay.
Speaker 4 (50:44):
And there was a bar across the street from our
church and some folks were usingour parking lot before that to
go to the bar.
Well, I got a little attitudeokay, they go to bar, can't come
church, right yes and I neverforget.
I'm gonna put a chain up hereso they can stop, you know, and
(51:07):
something told me to go talk tomy church and community teacher
professor at the school.
Speaker 2 (51:13):
I said man, let me tell you what I'm thinking, Let
me tell you what's happening.
Speaker 4 (51:17):
He looked at me and said Chris, what message does
that give?
You don't want them folks here.
He said what you need to do isgo to the owner of the bar and
tell him that your parking lotis available If they can park in
as much as they want.
Just don't throw bottles on theground.
(51:38):
And I left there.
Speaker 2 (51:44):
But I did.
Speaker 4 (51:45):
Okay, I did, you know , and because what, what they
and they didn't?
Interesting thing is theydidn't park over there.
Ok, you know, but but what?
But what I learned?
What I realized is I could havemade an enemy or I could have
made a friend.
Speaker 3 (52:02):
I've been just a good neighbor is a lot of times,
when you're fighting against thegrain of something, sometimes
it's better to go and have aconversation.
I think a lot of times we getangry and we cut off
(52:24):
conversation and we cut offcommunication when God wants us
to build the kingdom and hewants us to bring people to the
kingdom.
Speaker 4 (52:34):
We're trying to stop people from doing what most of
us are doing.
You know what I'm saying.
Let me get a drink too.
Speaker 3 (52:42):
You better preach pastor.
Speaker 4 (52:44):
But I'm saying, you know, just because I close off
my parking lot, that ain't goingto stop the people from the bar
.
It's not and and cause, it'sabout relationship.
It's about relationship.
You know you.
You probably got you know umpeople going through AA, who you
know, whatever those are theones that need to be ministering
(53:05):
there.
Yeah, you know what I'm saying.
And, um, there, you know whatI'm saying.
And I had a guy once.
He said I'll preach on thestreets and everything.
I said we're going down.
I said we're going out there,let me see you preach.
He walked out my office went toon the sidewalk and started
preaching to the cars going by,did he?
And I'm like, look at this fool.
(53:26):
He's preaching to cars drivingby.
Speaker 3 (53:30):
Who going to?
To cars driving by?
Who going to hear him?
Nobody, no, you're just makingnoise, it ain't even joyful
because can't nobody hear it.
Speaker 4 (53:39):
He said it's not a joyful noise.
It ain't even a joyful noise,you know.
Third thing third thing Followyour passion.
I agree, God has a way.
What I've learned is this when Istarted the gardening thing, it
became like I said.
It just changed, my trajectorychanged, my passion changed.
(54:01):
I still love preaching.
I'm not, I'm not.
I don't think.
I don't know if I'll everpastor in the institutional
church again.
Okay, I can't see that.
But I love preaching, don't getthat wrong.
But it's the gardening thing,it's the feeding people, it's
giving people health.
Speaker 3 (54:17):
That's my passion, and ministry comes in all forms.
And what?
Speaker 4 (54:21):
I've learned is this I've learned a couple things
from that One.
When you follow your passion,you're less likely to burn out.
Speaker 3 (54:30):
You can, but you're less likely to burn out.
You can, but you're less likely.
Speaker 4 (54:32):
Because you do what you love and you love what you
do.
There you go.
Secondly, your passion attracts, like passions.
So when I you know, who loveswell everybody loves Chris
Battle right, but gardeners,farmers right, but gardeners,
farmers, people concerned aboutclimate control, climate care,
(54:56):
vegans they love what I do,people who are just as they love
what we're doing.
Speaker 3 (55:04):
And they reach out, and they reach out.
Speaker 4 (55:06):
And thirdly, and offer a hand.
Speaker 3 (55:09):
Not only some offer hands, but they offer financing
and support and you've got tohave that.
I tell people.
You know, a lot of times peoplewill be like I owe the church.
You know the money and all thatstuff.
And I'm like, okay, no, wait aminute.
I see both sides of it.
I say because no, it shouldn'tbe about the money, okay, but at
(55:29):
the same time the church doeshave to have money to grow and
pay bills.
Speaker 4 (55:35):
The question, though, is this it can't be all about
that, though, it can't be, yeah.
I looked at our budget once andI got angry.
Speaker 3 (55:45):
Okay, okay.
Speaker 4 (55:47):
I'm like we're spending almost 80% of our
budget on salaries andmaintaining this building.
Wow, and I got and that part itwas the maintaining the
building.
God, I needed my salary.
Speaker 2 (56:03):
I need my salary.
It was maintaining of thebuilding part that bugged me.
Speaker 4 (56:06):
I'm like we're spending a lot of money keeping
this building up to par KUB, allof that and nobody's here.
You better say that 90% of thetime this church goes empty.
Speaker 3 (56:27):
Something's wrong with that.
So you're paying to house abuilding For Sunday morning For
Sunday morning and no one's here, and that's what I don't get.
I'm like you got to get out ofthe building, you got to go out.
Speaker 4 (56:42):
Jesus said build my church Upon this rock, I'll
build my church.
But he never said I'm buildinga building.
Speaker 3 (56:48):
He never said that Matter of fact.
He said the temple was going tocome down build my church, but
he never said I'm building abuilding.
He never said that no, but butthat matter of fact.
Speaker 4 (56:51):
He said the temple was going to come down, it ain't
been built back okay, I ain't.
Speaker 3 (56:55):
but the problem is we've been taught in our
generation and back that the yougot to go to church, you got to
do this, you got to do that,you got to do that, it's got to
do that.
It's all about church.
But if you really read thatBible and you really first of
all God said put him first.
(57:15):
He didn't say the church.
If you really look in the order, church is farther down on
God's order.
I mean, you know what I'msaying Of who comes first.
He said put him first.
And I think that was thebiggest thing that taught me
when I was in the hospital whatDavid was.
Because I couldn't go to churchanymore because I was in a
hospital.
So I had to find church withinme, I had to build it up in me,
(57:40):
I had to search for God in me.
Speaker 4 (57:43):
I had a lady tell me why she goes because they had
left the church they were at andbecause the husband got called
to a church and she told me I somiss the relationship, the
fellowship with the other man,why you miss it.
I'm like you can't see them onother days of the week.
(58:05):
She's looking for the get down.
I couldn't figure out.
You missed them on Sundaymorning.
Speaker 3 (58:15):
Yes.
Speaker 4 (58:16):
You missed them in the choir.
It's not like you can't seethem throughout the week Again.
I think it's that matrix.
I remember when I left thepastorate and quit going to
church institutional church.
It took a while to get that outof my system, you know.
(58:38):
I mean because you're like oh,I didn't go to church, I'm going
to sin and fall and show to thegroup.
I remember that, you know, andI'm like I remember feeling that
and I felt like that andsometimes I mean and I, even
when I go now, I love it, yes,and pieces of me miss it.
Yes, you know, but you miss thegood times, but you don't miss
the other part, you know, but,yeah, I'm not going to go there.
Speaker 3 (59:00):
But you know, the biggest part about that is is
that, like how you said youmissed it, I missed it.
Like how you said you missed it, I missed it.
Okay, but I can honestly saythis this may not be your walk,
but I can honestly say this I domore ministry now than I ever
did when I was in the church.
I do way more in my community.
(59:23):
I'll do way more reading theword and seeking him and praying
way more than I ever did.
And I remember when I firststopped going in the hospital,
coming out because Davidcouldn't eat or feed himself, he
couldn't walk or anything, so Istill couldn't go.
You know what I'm saying when Igot out.
(59:46):
And I never forget.
Before I left the hospital I'mlike, oh, I can't wait, I can go
to church service.
But then it came that Icouldn't.
When David got out, and themore and more I grew in Christ,
that desire went away.
The desire of him came stronger, and that desire, and then I
(01:00:09):
was like, well, then I started.
There was different pastorsstarted asking me to speak at
their church, and I'm like Isaid to my husband, I'm like,
wow, they really want to hearwhat I got to say and I'm like
really and I'm not saying whatwe have now needs to be
(01:00:32):
destroyed.
Speaker 4 (01:00:35):
I do think it needs to be reformed.
Speaker 3 (01:00:37):
It does.
Speaker 4 (01:00:38):
Okay, I think it needs a restructuring.
Speaker 3 (01:00:42):
And people need to see God.
Speaker 4 (01:00:47):
I'm not saying they don't.
I'm not saying they don't.
I'm not saying they aren'ttruly saved.
Speaker 2 (01:00:52):
I'm not saying that Jesus is you know, I'm not
saying that.
Speaker 4 (01:00:56):
I'm just saying that there is something about
buildings that stop the movementit does.
Speaker 3 (01:01:02):
It does.
Speaker 4 (01:01:04):
That causes us to miss the kingdom.
Speaker 3 (01:01:06):
I think the building is, honestly what's the word?
Intimidating to people.
I don't think God isintimidating, but the building
and the pressure of going tothat building is intimidating to
(01:01:27):
the world now.
So people are.
Well, I would say, do you getwhat I'm saying?
I wouldn't say intimidate, Ithink the world out, so people
are.
Speaker 4 (01:01:30):
Well, I would say Do you get what I'm saying?
I wouldn't say intimidate.
I think the word I would use iswelcoming.
I don't think.
It's not as welcoming, it'skind of you know, but that's
because the people aren't.
Speaker 3 (01:01:42):
Yeah, but I'm going to tell you what my husband said
.
My husband's from Pittsburghand he said I hate Pittsburgh.
Speaker 4 (01:01:51):
I'm from Cincinnati.
Oh okay, Hootie Go Bengals.
Speaker 3 (01:01:53):
Look, y'all know black and yellow, black and
yellow.
But David made a valid point tome.
He said, yvonca, I have to sayhe said if I was not married to
you?
My husband grew up, hisadoptive parents was white.
David had never been in apredominantly black church till
(01:02:14):
he got me.
We've been together almost 25years.
I took him to our churches, Itook him, he got to see the good
and the real bad and the ugly,okay.
And he said, yvonca, they'renot welcoming at all.
He said if I wasn't married toyou, he said I'd feel like an
(01:02:38):
outsider and I was like, really,and he's like, seriously,
yvonca, and he goes, and I'm notfrom here, but I had been in
the church realm for so longthat several people knew me so
that they were more accepting tohim.
But for somebody that walks inthe door, that does I'm just
(01:02:58):
being honest that does not havea big checkbook, okay, does not
look like what whoever thinksthey need to look like.
And that's what I struggle with, because I'm like it shouldn't
be about what someone looks likeand what checkbook they can
write.
It was interesting when I gothere, Do you get me oh?
Speaker 4 (01:03:16):
yeah, I know, because I had locks when I first moved
here.
Speaker 1 (01:03:20):
Oh, did you yeah.
Speaker 4 (01:03:22):
I mean they were halfway down my back and I had
guys Chris, you might want tocut those locks off.
I'm like I had guys I'm that Iknew got up in the pulpit and
preaching against locks.
You know then looking oh notyou, Chris.
Oh yeah, you meant me yeah, yeahyou like, but but but again, I
(01:03:43):
think the when we can lookbeyond people's faults and our
own faults and you know, andbegin to see people from the
created in the image of God,that are kingdom built, that are
a part of our community, thenthat changes everything.
For me it did, you know, itchanges everything.
(01:04:05):
I don't care what you, I don'tcare what color you are, I don't
care what, I don't care whatcolor you are, I don't care what
, I don't even care what genderyou claim.
Speaker 2 (01:04:13):
Okay you know, the kingdom is.
Speaker 4 (01:04:16):
There's a space in the kingdom for you and if we
reject, there's a space in thekingdom, in the kingdom for you?
If there is, if I read, and ifI reject you, if I cut you off,
you'll never be able to see youoff.
Speaker 3 (01:04:31):
You'll never be able to see it.
He said you'll never be able tosee it.
I am really enjoying thisconversation with Pastor.
Battle Tune in next Friday forpart two of this powerful,
powerful conversation.
Bye, guys.
Speaker 1 (01:04:48):
Thanks for listening to Talkin' Tennessee with Yvonca
.
Watch out for our weeklyepisodes from the First Family
of Real Estate and check us outon the web
wwwyvoncasalesrealestatecom.
See our videos on Yvonca'sYouTube channel or find us on
Facebook under.
Yvonca Landis and Twitter atYvonca Landis.
(01:05:10):
And don't forget to tell afriend about us.
Until next time.
Yvonca signing off.
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