Obafemi Ayanbadejo: Character is Rewarded

Miami Dolphins Tales From The Deep A two-sport star in high school and at Cabrillo College in Aptos, California, Obafemi Ayanbadejo strategically pursued an NFL career that was anything but handed to him. Ayanbadejo’s 13-year professional football journey included two seasons (2002-03) with the Miami Dolphins, highlighted by the 2003 season that allowed him to team with his brother Brendon. Along the way, he was part of the Baltimore Ravens Super Bowl XXXV Championship team, as well as the California Redwoods of the United Football League where his running backs coach was current Dolphins head coach, Mike McDaniel. Contributors to this episode include Sean “DJ Prec” Todd and Dolphins Productions. Theme song created and performed by The Honorable SoLo D.

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Episode Transcript

Speaker 1 (00:00):
You're now sitting down with and this is strictly for
them too. Fas number one one. Of course, this all

(00:22):
the net was talk Welcome back to the fish tank
right here on the Miami Dolphins podcast network. Seth Levit
DJ Priesch is in the back and of course looking
fresh with the new hat that I'm copping your style
here o J McDuffie, juice. How are you feeling, man, man?
You know, big Seth, I'm doing great, man. You know,
any time we're get in the tank, you know, I
feel about guys, especially guys on my side of football. Bro, Yes,

(00:45):
you know what I mean. Run of defensive guys here
for it was ridiculous. Man. I think you did that
on purpose. I think you did that shit on purpose. Bro,
you know what I mean. And you know now we're
now we're back on the right side of football. Brother. Well,
we had to keep your balanced. We definitely had to
keep your balance. I also think this is cool. So
we had years ago, we had the Palsy twins, right,
we had the Palsy brothers, and then we had Mike

(01:07):
by himself and we're kind of doing this in reverse.
So we just recently had Brandon Yambadejo here, but now
we got big bro. Oh but family, Yambadejo family, Welcome
to the fish tank. Man. Hey, guys, thanks for reaching out.
You know, it's interesting. I don't know, it's kind of
funny when I think about the different teams that I've
that I've played for, right, and I'm sure that you
guys know this, but I'm gonna nuance it just for

(01:28):
the record, Right, Starting as a Minnesota Viking, I look
at that as kind of like my my baptism by fire.
I had learned a lot a lot of season veterans
with the Vikings, and I was there, but I was
there to learn. I didn't have an impact on that team.
I didn't have all the confidence that I needed. Through
a lot of winding roads and different things, I ended

(01:49):
up in Baltimore, right, and then after Baltimore going to Miami,
And yeah, I'm not sure how many how many Dolphins
are former Ravens, but um, that's the team I associate with.
I don't associate with many other teams. I associate with
guys like o J. A prose pro I have. I
have memories of o J. Which I'll talk about as
we go through this. But what I what I love
about that two thousand three Dolphins team, and it etched

(02:11):
and burned something in my mind is that we want
we won ten games in spite of coaching, not because
of it, in spite of it. In my opinion, I
don't know what what o J. Thinks. We had guys
like Jason Taylor obviously, you know, Zach Thomas. O J.
Is a veteran, you know, Ricky Junior say out, and
I felt like that team, the core of guys. It's
hard to say that I've ever been around a better

(02:33):
group of guys other than that two thousand Ravens team
when we won a Super Bowl. That that two thousand
three Dolphins team deserved much more than we got. And
I've always remembered that in that group, and those guys
have always stuff with me. That's great stuff. And actually,
you know I kind of had that, you know, but
I mean, no, no, but we're here, right. And so
you mentioned the fact that you thought that team deserved

(02:54):
more and you played on a super Bowl team. What
And I guess you kind of alluded to it. What
didn't right? What didn't go right? No? Three? Oh man,
I have a I have bad memories of Tennessee getting
blown out in Tennessee. We just didn't show up that day.
I have bad memories of a snow game in New
England that was really close and I think Teddy Bruski

(03:15):
got to pick six like in the fourth quarter. I
think we ended up losing like seven three or something like.
That was at the game where they were playing the
music and throwing the snowball game. So there's a couple
of games where I feel like we didn't show up,
But then you know, we we started out good early
and I feel I feel like we remember smashing Dallas
and smashing Philly, and I remember thinking, like, man, we

(03:36):
got ten wins. We're not going to make the playoffs.
And when I do an autopsy on that season, it's
it's kind of wild when a leader, and I like
Dave wants that as a as a man, he's a
good man, he's a good guy. But I've had Dennis
Green as a head coach. You know, I've had Brian
exactly a few times. I've had Brian Billick as a

(03:57):
head coach. You know, my eleven years in the league,
I got to intern under John Harbaugh. I've never been
more beat up on a team than I was with
the Dolphins ever. I mean, training camp was was ridiculous,
Like the amount of hitting that we did. Dave was
an old school Chicago Bears, grinded out, pounded out, broken bodies.
Next man up. I just that that philosophy just doesn't work.

(04:18):
And I came from a place in Minnesota and Baltimore,
so I see that spark in that that special thing
that Danny Green had as a human, as a coach,
as an African American head coach. That's the guy that
I looked towards. How many Danny Danny Greens are out there?
Not many, obviously. Brian Billick was a technician when it
came to executing a game plan, giving guys rest. He
was so good about that. Yeah, yeah, And I understand

(04:40):
exactly what you're saying there him, because honestly, I think
even back then you could tell that you know, the
Brian Billicks and the you know and and Thenny Greens
were ahead of their time. You know, there are different
ways of doing things back in the day. You know,
I know that San Francisco and in the in the
in the Bills family did it kind of same attitude,
whereas the Amy Johnson's and day once that's we're college.

(05:03):
Like when the pounding we went fourteen days straight with
Jimmy in past in training camp. Nobody would ever do
that again. Man. You know ever, you know it's it's like,
you know what, why are you trying this as men?
We already know that we are men? And Seth you
know this. By the time we got to especially with Jimmy,
we got to the playoffs, we'd already just played a

(05:24):
playoff game in Seattle, and we came back and got
in pass in the playoffs on a short week, you
know what I mean. So that philosophy, it was archaic.
It was barbaric in my opinion, honestly. I mean some
of these some of these other coaches to figure it out.
I think our new coach now, Mike be Daniels, figured
that out. I got a story for you. I got

(05:46):
a story and I can't wait to hear that too. Man.
But I think you're going, man, yeah, because this yeah
so real. Quickly. I'll say this to answer my own
question from a first and juice, I agree with you
a hundred I was thinking, how many former Ravens that
are former Dolphins, My brother, my brother that there you go,

(06:08):
there's a there's another to the other order. Yeah exactly.
He Yeah, I got my ring and came to Miami.
He came to Miami and got his ring later, right,
you know what I'm saying in Baltimore. But um, I
think that, Um, what's interesting speaking about Denny Green. You know,
I played twelve years, actually thirteen seasons of football, and
you know, eleven of those were in the NFL. I
played one year in NFL Europe as an allocated Minnesota

(06:29):
Viking to the London Monarchs, and I played um in
the United Football League. I got a knee surgery and
I wanted to come back and play one more year.
I thought maybe finished the season with an NFL team.
I ended up playing for Denny Green again for the
California Redwoods. My running backs coach was Mike. Mike was
the running backs coach out of here running backs coach.
So was John David Washington on that team, and he

(06:51):
was non Diego. Washington was on that team too. He
was running Yeah, so Johnaman that was too. So you know,
at SETH, I probably buried the league and I probably
cut you off by starting to talk without you kind
of I'm sure you have an intro that I just
know you got us to where we need good. So,
you know, I think so my rookie year was nineties seven.
Officially retired in two I played for Mike McDaniel in

(07:13):
twenty in two thousand nine as a California Redwood. You know,
there was a couple of former running backs in that
room with me and John David Washington. Denzel came to
a couple of games. Actually was pretty cool, and Mike
was one of the younger people in the room, you know,
the some of those he was, he was he was
younger than me. You know what I mean, I'm in
my I'm in my thirties. He's in his late maybe

(07:35):
mid twenties at that point. How was he now? Yeah,
so so that was two thousand nine, right, so you
you know, he was in his early mid twenties at
that point. And you know what, at a certain point,
you just forgot about how old he was. He just
knew football. He understood the Kubiak zone outside zone zone

(07:56):
run blocking scheme. You know, Denny put his spin and
brought the you know, uh and o J to piggyback
on what you said earlier, Danny Green is from the
Bill Wall Street, right, So Danny Green brought that what
West Coast offense? Coach Kubiak runs a West Coast offense
with that outside zone scheme, play action, boot bootlegs stuff,
and Mike helped us learn all that stuff. And one

(08:18):
of the reasons Danny Ham picked him was because I'm
not sure who who stood on the table and said,
you need to hire this young guy because he's he's
got a brilliant mind. But Danny did it, and Danny
listened to him. He would be teaching grown coaches and
grown former NFL guys about coach Kubiak's zone run game,
and he led the room and he and you just

(08:39):
forgot how old he wasn't You just listened to him talk.
And it's crazy to watch him now because he's the
exact same dude. He has not changed. So it's pretty amazing.
That is great. That is so good. And I didn't
even realize, you know, I didn't even put two two together.
I was golle. I think I can't believe I missed that.
But that is great stuff. You know that whole nicely,

(09:02):
you know that connection right there. That's outstanding. He did
well Femmily has always got my back, and so I'm
gonna go back to do that two thousand three season.
Actually it was in two thousand two when he first
came to camp with us, and my whole thing because
you know Harvey, as Harvey told me day one, I'm
Jimmy's PR guy and Danny's PR guy. So I you
know a lot of the other guys, especially guys who
came in his free agents, I would build that relationship.

(09:23):
And I want to know how to pronounce guy's names.
I'm a guy who everyone has spelled my name L E, V,
I T T my whole life. I hate that damn expertise.
They could keep that expertise. I don't want that expert
And so you got to be able to pronounce guys names, right,
So if Femi comes in and I'm looking at this
and I'm like, I got no shot, I have absolutely
no shot. And so Femmy, you told me how to
pronounce you, and you said, hey, you can call me Femi,

(09:43):
but it's oba Femmie, And is it I'm a day
Joe or I'm a day Joe Joe. Okay, And that's
so that was the one thing I guess after all
these years, I was getting wrong because uh, you know,
Brendan corrected me when we just had him on the show.
But he was like, wow, you got it pretty good.
I said, your brother taught me. Man, brother taught me,
so by the time you got out there, I knew
how to pronounce. It's funny because I think being mixed race,
people think we're all the things that were not Polynesian, Brazilian. No.

(10:09):
I'm like, no, I'm Irish and Nigerian. The name is Nigerian,
it's not Latino. So don't don't say a Yan Badejo,
don't say Joe. It's just it's just it's that's it,
you know I've said. But the thing is is that
I know how um how much stress you know how
many TV guys, announcers, just folks and media have come

(10:29):
up to me over the years about my name. And
I try to be I try to show a lot
of grace because I know that John Smith is you know,
John Smith is easy. There's a lot of John Smith.
There's not a whole lot of Obafemi Devon and Yan
Badejo's out there. I get that. I try and and
the thing is I want to be nice with these
guys too, because I do want them to say my
name when it when appropriate, and they might avoid saying
my name, and I might make a play. It might

(10:49):
be my time to shine. I might I might get
a chance to do something. Let's let's let's let's build
a relationship here, right, So you know, a little tongue
in cheek there, but I have I have grace and
I am empathy to people that you know, don't typically
have to say Nigerian names. But check it out though,
think about how many guys, going back to Christian h Quoi,
how many Nigerians are in the game now. It's wild,
so many Nigerians in the game now, and it's it's

(11:11):
it's amazing to see that trail that he blazed and
then to see how many young first and second generation Nigerians,
I mean in the Ravens have a number of Ojabos
and Nigerian you know what I'm saying, A Dafeo ways Nigerian.
I'm not sure how many Nigerians the Dolphins might have.
They've got they they've got to have a couple. Yeah,
I don't know currently, but we had We've had a
really good run because we just had Akin and we

(11:33):
called him Adela and he said he learned it's and
then we had your brother. Now we have yourself. So yeah, no,
it's a it's a great run. But I want to
talk about the first name for a minute here, because
I was like, Brendon Alam, you're Brandon and he's old femie.
And he gave us this whole story about leaving Chicago.
He said I left gangs for Granola and that he
thought it was easier to go with Brandon, but you

(11:55):
kept your your Nigerian given first name. I did because
I think that he was um. He was nine, and
I think that it doesn't sound like a big difference,
but the difference between being nine and being ten or
eleven is actually a big difference and huge. Yeah, And
I think that for me, I tried to go by Devon,

(12:18):
which is my middle name, and it just didn't feel right,
like I didn't like it. It was like Devin, who
oh me, oh Devin, Oh if not, I might not,
We're gonna stay with them, you know, and like and
and the cool thing is like once once people make
their little funny jokes, and you know how kids can
be cruel, especially back in the in the you know,
in the eighties growing up where it was we didn't
we didn't, we didn't give a damn. We said, kids

(12:41):
an hour, kids an hour a little bit better. But
kids now also there's so much more diversity in names,
and parents are going out of their way to choose
unique names, and there there's just a lot more people
from a lot more places now too, especially in sports.
So it's kind of cool for me now where there
are people that have far wilder names and me at
this point, you know what I mean, and femmi being

(13:02):
two syllables and pretty simple, I think I think we
can get by with that, right, you know, it was
for me something else that you know, Brendan mentioned that
really mean Seth and I really found this very interesting,
is that, Yeah, he looked up to you not only
as a big brother, but as a father figure man
in the house. Did you feel that weight growing up there?

(13:23):
And and what does it mean to you to hear
that now that that's how he felt about your upbringing
with him, my brothers my day one man like, I
can't say that anybody has been around me my whole
life other than him. There's been times when my mom
wasn't around. There's been times when my dad wasn't around,
times when my stepdad wasn't around. Uh, it's always been
me and him. And you know, being the oldest of three,

(13:44):
I took pride in being a leader. I took pride
in cooking and doing laundry and cleaning the house and
just it was. It was hard wired in me, you
know what I mean, It's just how I am. I
still do this day and and I didn't plan on
doing this, but we're walked into my room in my condo. Here,
my bed's made like every day. There's no I don't
got one dish in the sink. My fridge is immaculate,
my oven, my microwave immaculate. I'm just one of those people,

(14:06):
you know. I just I need things and I probably
got a twinge of O C D like legit. But
it's served me well. It served me well, and it's
it's kept me disciplined. And where people find angst in regiment,
I lean into it. I find peace. And where people
get uncomfortable with things that can be erratic or unpredictable.

(14:29):
My routine doesn't change, doesn't matter where where I am,
it doesn't matter who I'm around. I have a way
of of going about things, analyzing, dissecting, and deploying a strategy.
And that's the one thing that I'm so proud of
that my brother has probably taken from me, is that
he's watched me execute and be predictable. I think as
a as a team member, as a parent, as a spouse,

(14:53):
as a leader of an organization, as a CEO of
a company. I'm a CEO of two companies. I never
want to be unpredictable. I was want people to know
exactly what the funk they're gonna get, because the minute
I start being unpredictable, everything I'm associated with becomes unpredictable.
I'm the leader, and if you can't count on me
to do my ship right, how the hell can I
expect anybody that I represent, teach, taught, live for an

(15:15):
example to how can I expect them to do anything right?
And so that idea and concept that once again just
lucky luckily was born. I was born with it. My
brother wasn't necessarily that way, but he didn't have to be.
I was kind of like a shield. I would come
up with a game plan, he would build on it
and maybe do it better sometimes actually, But the foundation
was what I laid out. And then as we've gotten older,

(15:36):
we've come we've become a lot more partners now, Like
when when his kids are with me, it's like him
being with his kids, and vice versa. When my kids
are with him, I trust him and to do everything
to to tell them what to do and then they
better listen to. And I've just seen him of all
of as a person and as a human and his
success speaks speaks towards that. And that goes back to
us being five and six and projects in Chicago on

(15:59):
welfare and food stamps and a and you know, in
a in a roach infested environment with drugs being sold
around us, when we found a way to continue to
rise above that. And that takes discipline, and that takes
a strategy, and that takes a good example. And so
there have been great coaches and great people that I've
pulled different pieces from along the way. I've never pity,
felt pity for myself. I've never played a victim role.
I've never complained. I just always tried to look for

(16:20):
an exit strategy and how to continue moving on an
upward trajectory with an upward slope. That's kind of always
been the mission. Sounds like it was a good mission
to follow, and you guys both carried it out. Well,
it's really cool. And not all siblings have that, by
the way, It's not like, well, of course they're brothers.
There are there are people who have siblings that they
wouldn't trust, you know, their enemy with, let alone their children.
I don't I don't think you can be more similar

(16:41):
than he and I are and not be twins. It's
almost even our mannerisms, like if you see us walking,
like I'm an inch taller than him, but generally speaking,
like if someone if I see him walking, I'm like,
damn that that looks kind of like me walking like
like like people even say that sometimes, like are people
you know people still call him me or me him.
But when you guys were in the locker room together
and Miami, you forget about it. It's a committed to

(17:01):
figure it all out. They would mess up some names
to begin. That's too funny, all right, So look, obviously
leadership was was in your DNA academics was also clearly
impressed upon you and your brother and your family and
your youth. And I want to get into how that's
impacted a lot of what you've done in your post

(17:24):
playing career. You know, clearly it was a big part
of the Yamade Joe household. Following high school, you attend
how's it pronounced, Cabrio College, Okay, Cabrio Junior College, and
you played football and baseball, and then you transferred to
San Diego State football, and then you know, we're gonna
get into the whole grind baseball sense. I know another
two sports star here for juice, and I was talking

(17:45):
about some baseball, not the baseball guy here. But my
question is as important as academics were, was playing in
the NFL or playing in Major League Baseball? Like? Was
was that the dream you were tracing the whole time?
Or was it I'm going to get an education. I've
got these other dreams and sports are what I'm gonna
do and if it works out, great, it works out.

(18:05):
But like I'm just trying to understand where that call
it a work life balance now. But I would say
that if you asked me, and I remember coaches that
I've had telling me these stories. They would ask me,
like when I was like eight, nine, ten, eleven, twelve,
my little league coaches would confirm this, and my flag
football coaches would confirm this if you asked them this question.
What if Emmi say when you asked him if he's
going to be a pro athlete, he'd say yeah, in

(18:27):
two sports. I would say that, you know what I mean.
And then as I got older, and one of the
things that's different about me is that I was a
sixteen year old senior in high school, like my senior year,
and I I bawled to in football and baseball. But
I was young, you know what I mean. I turned
seventeen before I graduated. And the reason why I was
so youngest because I skipped fourth grade. Double promotion was
a popular thing in private schools in Chicago. I think

(18:50):
it's the worst thing you can do for a kid.
And I think the way that schools now do it,
they just move a kid up within his grade or
his or her grade, so they're still with their peers,
but they just they just challenge them academically within the
confines of their grade. I think it was silly to
move me up, and I think it caused some developmental
stressors that I didn't I probably should have been shielded from.

(19:10):
But in the eighties. At that time, I don't think
people were thinking the way they think about psychology and
and uh adolescent development the way they do now. Right.
So so when I left Santa Cruz High, I basically
when got a job, and for a minute there, the
dream seemed real, real far away bro Bros Brothers. It
seemed real, far away, Like I didn't even I wasn't

(19:30):
even in school. I didn't even have a scholarship. How
can I be walking around saying I'm gonna be a
pro athlete? Right, So there was a while there where
as a young kid, when I was destroying everybody in
all these little rec leagues and stuff. I did really,
really well in high school, but I was just really young.
And then the dream became silent and I kept it
in my chest and I kept it in my head,
but I didn't talk about it. And then as I
took that year off and I grew an inch and

(19:50):
I gained twenty pounds, and I worked in a retirement
home and I just had a gym membership. I was
on groundhogs Day. I just went to the gym. I
went to work, I went to the gym. I went
I did that for a year. Can you imagine what
that does for you when you're eighteen now and you've
been out of high school for a year, you had
a real job, You're riding riding a bus to work
and just going to the gym, and your number one
focus was getting a Division one scholarship, and you didn't
care what sport, either football or baseball. Hence the fact

(20:11):
that I played football and baseball cabrio. And as I
found my groove and as I knocked the rust off
in my freshman year of both sports, all the schools
started recruiting me baseball scouts Division one school. I think
the first letter I ever got was from either Louisville
or the University of Kansas, And I was like, oh,
they know, they need they see me, they see who
I am. Okay, this is it's about to be on.

(20:32):
Right then, the dream just kindled up a little bit,
and I didn't talk about it because I wasn't in
a position to I wasn't even like, I mean, you
talk about top hundred, top two hundred, top three hundred,
I mean, what what would you put me top five thousand.
I don't even know, right, Like, there was no rank
for me at that point, right, I'm rind the bus
right exactly. But I knew what I had and I
knew what I could do, And when I got to Cabrio,

(20:54):
it was like a monster was unleashed. And I carried
that energy and I kept that same energy at SDSU
and I was actually gonna play baseball at San Diego State,
and Ted Toner, who is my head coach, said there's
a bunch of NFL scouts that are wondering who number
nine is with the visor. And we had a really
good team my junior and senior year at STSU beat Berkeley,
beat Oklahoma, one of the most potent offenses as a

(21:17):
Kim was on that team from Salam Kyle Turley, Uh,
George Jones, Will Blackwell. I mean, we had ten of
our eleven starters go to the league. Leroy Glover was
on that team, you know what I mean. We had
a we had I mean sand we had a good team.
And so when coach Toner said, look, if you don't
make it, like, why don't you just do the pro day?

(21:37):
See how you run, see how you I mean I'm
gonna work out. Well I already knew that, but let's
see what happens. And then you can just go back
and play baseball. You you still have three years of
baseball eligibility left. So I win, did my pro day?
Ran a four or five seven hit too, five twenty
eight times. You know, I had caught everything ran. So
I ran routes as a running back, as a fullback,
as a tight end because a cabrio, I played like

(21:58):
the slot in tight end. And then in the NFL
I was I was kind of a tween er slash,
you know, tailback, fullback. I could do kind of everything.
And so the Vikings were the only team that ended
up offering me a free agent contract. But that's all
I took. Just took one, right, just takes one, because
I always it just takes one. And so I never
let go of the dream. To get back to your
question seth about like, you know, did I believe I

(22:19):
could do it? There was a time there I got
real dark, and I didn't talk about it much, but
it was in my heart and it was in my head,
and I held onto it real tightly. And as a
seventeen year old I look back now I'm forty seven,
and I think, how the hell did I come up
with this strategy to get a job, go to the gym,
keep lifting, get stronger, save some money, be quite, to
be humble, have character, and I knew I would prove myself.

(22:43):
No one believed in me. I had people telling me
you didn't You're not going to school, like what are
you doing with yourself? Like You're never gonna go back now.
I'm like, no, I gotta plan. Seventeen year old, tell
and grown people, I got a plan. I mean I did,
and I executed my plan to a t. And my
brother actually executed the same plan, but ins to go
into San Diego State. He went to U c. L A.
Instead of planing. Instead of being a cabrio for three semesters,

(23:05):
he was a cabrio for two semesters. You know what
I'm saying. So like he he just has a knack
to just kind of see what I do and then go, Okay,
well I'm gonna do it a little bit better because
I wanted. I know the plan is good. And the
cool thing is is that because I put myself in
that position. By the time my sophomore year was over,

(23:29):
I had a number of different opportunities and a lot
of that came from just self belief. Um, you know,
executing a plan, and uh, it's kind of all she
wrote at that point, but that that thought process from
Santa Cruzie to Cabrio to San Diego State to the Vikings,
I still deploy a lot of those strategies. And what
I do now, I mean it's technically industry agnostic in

(23:51):
a way, right, it doesn't really matter what it is.
I mean, having a plan industry agnostic. Oh that's like
and that's a big word, like mayonnaise. Yeah there, yeah, exactly.
My point is that when you have a good plan,
it doesn't matter like what the desired outcome is, because

(24:13):
having a strategy at stay in the course, being rigorous,
being disciplined, that always works. That's that's always a good
part of a plan. And so what I'm saying is
is that I think that as a young kid, I
was already stress testing what I thought were good methodologies
and strategies for success. And a lot of it was

(24:33):
observing and just self belief to some degree, and luck,
luck and support from amazing other people's moms and dads
that helped me. Coaches that didn't have to help me,
that help me. So let me not forget about those people,
because without those people. I'm nowhere. You know how many
moms and dads took me in, fed me, gave me clothes,
gave me money, help me do things, I mean countless.

(24:55):
It's I can't even name them all. It is so
funny you say that, because I had a call last
night one of the guys I grew with. I spent
every single summer with him and his family and the
mom that I grew up with with them, you know,
that passed about a decade ago, but the dad wanted
to reach out and talk to me. And those people
who have no idea how instrumental they were in my

(25:17):
development or just in my life in general, because I
spent everything single summer playing baseball with their son. But
I was at their house every single day as well.
You know, so anytime we had to go on road trips,
anytime we had to go to the park, any time
I wrote with them, my mom was my help. My
mom was super young and working, you know, my my
grandparents were super young. I mean, they were working. But

(25:40):
you don't forget about those other people that that extended
family that helps you along the way. And so I
had a great conversation with the dad and it was
just amazing to even reminisce about all those people that
were there the longest journey that you know that led
us to where we are, where we where we were,
and where we are now. Man, it's it's pretty amazing.
And I do now. And what I love now is

(26:01):
whenever I can pay it forward. If my kids have
their friends over, I got it. I never asked parents
for anything. If my daughter has friends over, I cover
I never. I'm never gonna ask parents to pay for
their kids stuff, for a meal, or to go out
for a day, to go to a movie, to go
to a game, me, whatever it is. Yeah, I'm gonna
cover all of it. Because I had so many people
cover for me for so long. It's not even a thought.

(26:22):
I'm like, no, your kids with me, I got it.
I don't want any money from you because I had
all the I had parents taking care of me when
I didn't have a penny in my pocket, never asked
me for anything. And I'm gonna take care even though
you have money. I know you're good, that you're good.
It's not about that. It's about something for me. I
need to do this for me, exactly right. And I'm
not saying my kids with money either, so when I
come when they come to your house, you know, you know, yeah,

(26:43):
you know, maybe I love all this, man, and this
this really is like I think that's pretty much a
bread and butter off. Like a lot of guys that
you know in the league, in the league's have have
these other families that you know that they kind of
falster families. But as this is the Dolphin's focused podcast,
you know, we have to jump into some fans talk
as we do, you know, and I know we've talked

(27:05):
a little bit about what was going on, man, but
we we can't skip over this remarkable journey that you had,
you know, I mean from going undrafted as undrafted free
agent to a Super Bowl champion four years man. So
let's talk about that part of the journey as well, Man,
because damn, I mean, your brother really talked about how,
you know, all the problems he had to u C
l A. We talked a little bit about and then

(27:26):
having the same type of deal, but then he had
to you know, getting to go through all these different
things to get to where he was later in his career,
all the different leagues Europe, Canada, to finally get to
the dolphins. Talk about your journey a little bit. Yeah,
you know, I think that I look at our the
mountain that we have to climb as athletes. I look

(27:46):
at very similar to the mountains that actors and singers
have to climb. All artists have to climb, right or entertainers,
I should say, I think the ones that are willing
to stick it out, sleep in their car, do whatever
needs to be done, are are the ones who kind
of you know, character is is rewarded. You know what
I'm saying. Character is rewarded in the long run. And
I just think that I have I stuck with it

(28:08):
even though I got cut and brought back. I got
put on the practice squad, I got cut, I got activated,
I got put on the practice I got cut of
got brought back again. I'm not even exaggerating, you know
what I mean, Like this stuff all really happened, and
a lot of guys, after two or three times, they
just say, I don't have the heart or the or
the will or the mind to continue to get kicked
to the curb and then brought back when something goes wrong.
That's the nature of football. I mean, think about how
many guys didn't make it on the first go round

(28:30):
that were late round draft picks or undrafted free agents,
and they end up becoming Pro bowlers. You know. My
brother is a perfect example. And so for me, I
had the ability to just hang on long enough, you know,
And I never thought about giving up. I just knew
that if I got another chance, I could do it.
If I just got another chance, I could do it,
you know what I mean. And I just kept believing

(28:51):
in that. I also continue to go back to school
throughout that whole time, you know what I mean. Like
I never gave up on I mean, I didn't leave
STSU with my degree. I don't think I got my
degree to two thousand one. Maybe, Like I would go
back every spring and I would take a class, and
there was something cool, which I think we can pivot
to you later that I knew my education would be
valuable down the road, and I knew I would be
a lifelong student, like legit formal education, lifelong student. And

(29:15):
I think that what allowed me to stick or make
it eventually was that I earned respect from guys like
John Randall and Chris Carter, Jake Reid, Danny Green obviously
Coach Billy. They just saw like this guy won't die.
He's like a cockroach, you know. We tell him what
to do, he learns it. We we gotta keep him.
He knows our system, he knows everything. He's a fast learner.
He can play three different positions like come on, and

(29:37):
he plays special teams like we this, and he's cheap.
I need myself valuable. And so that that kind of
thesis and that concept that those concepts, that's what really
allowed me to stay and eventually my confidence caught up
with my ability to learn in my talent, because I
don't think you can be successful without being confident you
no matter what people tell you, you decide how good

(29:59):
you you are until the absolute end of the like
the last second. You know, up until there's a hundred
seconds in this up until the last second, you believe
you can do anything until you until you can't. Until
I can't do it, and I know that I can't,
there's nothing to tell them that I don't believe I
can't do it. And I think that just that confidence,
of that grinded out mentality is what really allowed me

(30:21):
to kind of hang in there and keep going. And
I think that you know, once you get past a
certain point, you know, probably like year three. You know,
if you get year three, you should probably get at
least six at that point. You know, That's that's my philosophy, right,
You make yourself valuable. You you you build some relationships
with different coaches around the league, You learn different systems.
I think those those things had a big part in

(30:41):
big role in me just sticking O J and finding
my way and and and kind of you know, having
that kind of longer career. Yeah, I like that. I
like that, you know, three years and then you can
you figure it out and you know how to you know,
you know system, you know what coaches and and and
teams are looking for at that point, and you know
how to stand league. Right, Saying the league is the

(31:01):
hardest thing for a lot of guys, and leaving the
league is even harder for a lot of these guys. Man.
But you know, once you once you figure that part out,
you know, then you can get those extra years. Some
guys messled all up, don't they. Family, They they like,
you know, they eat those three years up, don't learn anything,
don't do anything special, you know next to you know
they're one and while the yor not. They don't have
a job. But you talked about how you played all

(31:24):
these positions, learn all these positions, played special teams. That
makes you invaluable when you look at the forty seven
men roster. Yeah know, for sure, I think that UM
and O J. I know that. In the locker room
when we're by ourselves, we talk about this thing I'm
about to I'm about to drop on you guys right here.
Think about how many guys out drink and I'll eat
themselves out of the league. Guys that came in hungry,

(31:45):
or guys that were so gifted so young, they never
knew what grinding or working hard was. They their first
round pick, second round picks, they are like, oh, I
gotta work hard to watch those first round picks. Femily things.
Sometimes Fami family talks about me all the time. Many
I didn't say, every time he gets a shot, he

(32:07):
takes it at me. Man, you know what I mean.
It's not amazing. And I still love him to death,
but you know it's a it's a show I love.
But you know what I'm saying. They're like, you know,
some guys, they they never figure out that, oh, this
is a job and this takes work and it takes consistency,
you know what I mean. I've seen a lot of
guys that come in highly touted, eat drink or don't
want to learn a playbook, don't want to understand concepts,

(32:29):
don't want to understand the details, you know, like what
you did in high school and college is not gonna
work here. And so I think that that's the mistake
some of the guys make. They don't they're not professionals.
And the thing that I prided myself on, whether it
was learning Norv's offense, or whether it was learning coach
Billick and Denny's offense, or whether it was learning you know,
the different offenses I ran across UH in NFL Europe

(32:51):
and then obviously in UH in the UFL it was
a hybrid offense. A lot of it was Denny's offense
though still too. So I think the thing I always
want to impress upon a coach and a position coach
and a coordinator is that, oh, I know the system already,
go ahead asking like I know, I know where the
checkdown is. I know we're supposed to be in past protection.
Because as a running back, and I did a lot
of three wise, a lot of single back stuff. Not
so much in Miami, but everywhere else I was, I did.

(33:14):
We had We had some pretty good backs in Miami. Actually,
you know what I'm saying. So I always wanted the
coaches to know that in a pinch, you could throw
me in anywhere from slot to slot, and I could.
I could do it. I knew what I knew the
route tree, I knew exactly what I had to do.
I understood all the motions, I understood all the complimentary stuff,
and damn sure, I'm not going to let the quarterback
get hit like in past protection. You've got a solid
guy on third down that can do it. And so

(33:35):
I found out how valuable those those features were for coaches,
and I leaned into it. Speaking of these Dolphins, we
are going to talk a little dolphins here. Uh. Even
though as you said, it was kind of a blip
on the radar of your the entirety of your journey,
clearly there were some lasting memories there, and one of
them to me has to be, well, look, so actually,
you you signed here in July of oh two, you

(33:56):
go through the whole training camp, you get to like
the last cut September first. I was the last person
literally you were the last guy, the last guy they
call upstairs and they tell you it's not was it still?
And honestly, I don't know who it was. I just
I just blacked out because I was like, there's no
way they're gonna cut me. I had a hell of
a training camp. I just I had. I did all

(34:17):
the work I could do, and obviously they're bringing me back.
Kind of just co sign on that, but exactly, And
so that's what I want to ask you. You you
basically have to spend the whole year, I imagine, continuing
to to stay in football shape, and then the season
ends and in January they bring you right back. But
then a month later, maybe even three weeks later after
they signed you, they signed your brother. What was that like,

(34:40):
All that you had gone through, all that he and
especially he hadn't even played on an NFL roster yet
up to that point, and you guys get to go
out there and suit up as teammates. He he told
us a great story for those who are listening. Femmy
told us at the beginning, he said, I didn't listen
to my brother's interview because he just wanted to hear
all of this for the first time and and not
come in here Jaden in any way. But he said

(35:03):
that in one of his you know and he's won
Super Bowl, he's you know, been the Pro Bowls, but
he said maybe his favor one of his favorite memories
of playing football his entire life, was standing in the
tunnel before the first game and he's getting ready, finally
made an NFL roster, He's getting ready to run out there,
and he looks next to him and you're there right
beside him, and you guys are wearing the same colors,

(35:23):
And like, what was that like? After even though you
had played, you had wanted to have Super Bowl, but
here you are with your little brother and you guys
are suiting up as Miami Dolphins come on. Man, I
tried to get you to motion um the Oprah moment.
At Oprah moment, I get. I get chills thinking about
it because I'll tell you guys a couple of things
about that. So when the Dolphins cut me, I knew

(35:47):
it was a mistake. I think that the guys in
the front office knew it was a mistake. They kept
Deon Dyer over me to have an Nutra back, and
Dion I like Deon Deon is a good dude. But
if you look at what I did over my career
and what I didn't know three Rob ended up getting hurt.
I ended up starting like the last half of the season,
you know. And I had some great games in Miami.

(36:08):
I think one game I had seven catches, you know,
another game I had five catches, a couple of special
teams tackles. I mean, I feel like I was always
trying to prove myself. What I did was never good enough,
you know what I mean. It just felt like that,
And so it didn't detract from how how I felt
about the team. I still had a positive experience, and
a lot of that had to do was because every

(36:28):
day when I went home, my brother and I roommates again,
you know what I'm saying, Like, we were sharing an
apartment um in Davy, and we had each other. We
had a routine, we had a workout routine, we had
our favorite place we go eat at. You had a routine.
He just was following. That's what. Actually, that's a really
good way to play it. No, It's true. It was
funny because that's the last time that we've ever really,

(36:50):
you know, spent multiple months, weeks under the same roof.
It's never happened since then, and it hadn't happened for
years before that probably. I mean, he lived in my
house in San Diego while he was finding his way
a little bit. But I was playing the league. I
wasn't around a lot of the time, you know what
I mean. He was trying to figure out I was
the one. He had like five teams that were recruiting him.
And I was like, come to Miami, I go, you,

(37:11):
this can work for you. We could be here together.
I think it can work. And he just trusted that,
and slowly but surely, he was on the bottom of
the roster, and guys started getting hurt. And you know, Miami,
you know how you know how those training camps are,
you know what I'm saying, the survival of the fittest, right,
and a little bit of luck. And I watched linebackers
go down, and my brother just kept going up the
depth chart. And by the time we got to the

(37:31):
end of training camp, him and I were starting on
all the special teams, and guys had gone down, and
he had already proved himself. I'd already proved myself. At
that point, I felt pretty good about my chances at
that time. And I remember us going down on a
kickoff probably the first or second game, and we converged
on the on the ball. Both of us actually have

(37:52):
it on tape, and we want to see that right there.
You know, it's amazing and we're just going nuts, you
know what I'm saying, And like it ended up kind
of like we would make stuff up sometimes and Keith,
Keith hated when we would do this stuff every Keith,
I tell you guys to trade, I tell you guys

(38:14):
to cross. Okay, good, good job. Did it worked, but
don't again. But you know, it was. It was amazing,
And I don't think in the moment I had the
capacity to understand how special it was because I was
just still that free agent, grind it out one day
at a time guy. I was still my my my lens,
and my focus was just right in front of me.

(38:36):
Never looked up, never looked around, because if I did
for a second, I felt like I lose my focus
and ship would get sideways at that point. But I
love the fact that we had that year together and
then we did end up in Chicago together for a
little bit, but we were we both had kids, at
that point and we had separate departments. It wasn't it
wasn't the same thing. But that year in Miami, man
special group of guys, a real good football team, a

(38:58):
really really really good defense. Obviously we we had our
moments on offense. And that season for me will always
be bittersweet. That's how That's how I characterize it. Yeah,
for sure. I mean there were a lot of, honestly,
a lot of missed opportunities in terms of the success
that team could have had. But I mean, I can
only imagine I'm the only child, so I don't get

(39:19):
the benefit of loving, how you know, playing next to
your brother and dominating teams like that, or just you know,
just the picture we got the big staff coming out
of tunnel together, you know what I mean. You look
up that both your names on the back of those jerseys. Man,
that's that's some special so sweet. Really, yes, man, it
really is special. Man. You you alluded to a little

(39:39):
earlier about the running backs in the running back rooms,
especially in two thousand three, So Joe Carlier is your
position coach, and of course yeah yeah, and you were
in there with with Travis Minor and Charlie Rodgers, and
a guy some people may remember by the name of
Ricky Williams. Yeah, I don't know if they do or not,
you know what I mean, don't remember. I'll help remind

(40:02):
them you remembered, Help remind them, you know. And I
feel like they had to be a pretty cerebral room,
but also a room full of unique personalities. Absolutely wonder
what your relationship was a Ricky, especially being two CALLI guys.
I know you you know from you know, from gangs
to to granola when you get to CALLI, But you

(40:22):
got two CALLI guys. Man, how was that? Man? Man?
I got? I got two great stories for you guys
about Ricky. So when I was at St. SU, Ricky
went up I think Patrick Henry High School, which is
in San Diego. So Ricky's from San Diego, so he,
out of courtesy, I'm pretty sure, took a trip to
SD s U. I got to be one of his hosts,
me and will Blackwell that the very first time I

(40:45):
met Ricky was a senior in high school. That's when
I first met Ricky. So we already knew each other
by the time I got to the by the time
I got to the Dolphins, and he was there. We
had already remembered that time we had met and we
had ran into each other randomly here and there. And
so rick Key is a cool just cool cat, just
such a genuine dude. He really helped me get set

(41:07):
up in Miami because you know my current background now
and what I do after, I'm a human performance expert.
A lot of that is nutrition based supplementation, bio hacking.
Ricky was one of the first people that I ever
heard talking about metabolic typing and he actually got me.
And there was a bunch of us. I think Zach
was doing it. I think uh, I think Junior was
doing it. I don't know if Jason was doing it

(41:28):
or not, but those guys and Ricky and I were
definitely doing the diet. And we had this lady who
did our blood work. We had people bringing our food
to us. Ricky had his wife cooking me food, you
know what I mean, Like it was amazing. Ricky was
looking out. We had running in the game of the
game ahead of the game, right we had running Back
Night and we went I can't even tell you what
we did on Running Back Night, you can't, but we'll

(41:48):
do it. We'll do it. We we can't do it,
and we can't do it all here because you can't
even do that stuff now like nowadays, you can't even
talk about that stuff. But Ricky and Ricky, Ricky would
have the limo come get all of us. We did
a dinner at Emeralds and then we went out to
the club and we were just out getting you know
what I mean, having a good time. And Ricky just
chilled just you know, got a big drinker, but just
would hang out and you know, just socialized and just
be so gracious and kind with people. And I remember

(42:12):
one of our last nights out together in Miami, He's like, Yo,
I'm gonna come pick you up and we're gonna go
head out to Fort Lauderdale. And I don't remember the
bar that we went to. He's like, we're gonna go
meet up with somebody and I was like who. He's like,
I'm not gonna tell you. And I'm like why not.
He's like, just because I just want you to see dude.

(42:33):
We were hanging out with O J. Yeah. I thought
I was concerned about Yeah, And I was like, I'm like,
what are we doing? You know what I mean? And
and and Ricky was like, you know, I just know him.
You know how it is, all these all these elite
running backs know each other. We're hanging right. And so

(42:56):
I spent an evening at a bar with O. J
and E Williams. That was wild, and if the whole
time I just is like, just keep bringing me vaka
sodas because I just need to keep drinking because I
don't know what I'm doing here. You know, it was
just a random thing. But those are those are my
two uh two Ricky Williams so femi. As you said,
eleven seasons in the NFL. Uh you played the season

(43:18):
in the UFL as well. But the reality is this
stage of your life football does not define you. And
we have had this juice. We've had this unbelievable run
of guests who are not only so bright, but after
they retired, they went back and and they got their
master's degrees. They're doing all these amazing things. Talk about
your post playing career journey that has taken you to
John Johns Hopkins University, NASA. I'm reading about NASA over here,

(43:43):
and now the founder and CEO of your own company,
Health Reel just kind of fill us in on on
how you decided, Okay, football's in the rear view mirror now,
and now I'm going to dominate in another way. When
I retired, I knew that I wanted to be in
the fitness, wellness performance space and the best way to
go about that right when I retired, presented itself, in

(44:05):
my opinion, with some high level fitness experts in the
San Diego kind of Lajoia area. And so I basically
found a group of folks that had a part in
training me when I was in the league, and they said, hey,
we want to build our own fitness facility. You could
be a co founder, you could become a trainer if
you wanted to. You could find out what you want
to do in that space. And so we formed an LLC.

(44:27):
I had a thirty five percent equity stake and as
a founder of that business. And for five years, I basically,
you know, I I got my personal training certification, I
got my nutrition certification. I mean I already had a
pH d in in doing it for myself. Now now
I just had to have the search to prove that
I could do as a business. And I went head
on into that and after about five years, I went

(44:49):
through the NFL and I did UM a one week
MBA immersion program which happened to be at Stanford UM
in twenty twelve. Uh and I left that program. I
I wanted to get my m b A. And the
thing that was keeping me up at night was that
my kids were in Baltimore. I met their mom when
I played for the Ravens. We were never married, but
my kids were across the country and I had either
go to Baltimore they had to come here. And that really,

(45:11):
at my core bothered me because I didn't want them
to not have me around when they needed me all
the time. So I started once again, Femi goes into
strategy mode. Okay, I want to go back to grad school.
I don't see myself training people on the floor for
the rest of my life. What's the next thing. I
started studying digital health technologies like Fitbit and Garment and
these activity trackers, and I started falling in love with data.

(45:33):
This was right after I went to the Stanford program,
and I said, you know what, I want to get
my m b A. And I want to do it
at A at a credible university that's gonna give me
some cash A and show the business world that I
take this very seriously and that I'm I am Femi
the former athlete, but it doesn't define me. And I'm
willing to grind as hard as I did to play
in the league, I'm willing to do that in my
next career. So I looked at I looked at Stanford,

(45:55):
but Stanford wasn't in Baltimore. And also ultimately I landed
on Georgetown Universe see in Maryland, JOHNS. Hopkins and George
Washington my brother Georgia Universities. Are you kidding me? Yeah?
So I got into Hopkins and it was a rap.
Once I got into Hopkins, I was like, I'm not
gonna I mean, no other name in my opinion around
here is going to have the cachet that Hopkins does.
Plus with the school of Medicine here and a School

(46:17):
of Public Health with which are both top three in
the world, I was like, I can immerse myself in
this environment. I get to be a dad. My kids
were at that time. I think my my son was
six and my daughter was like seven. She just turned
eighteen the other day. So I think Shesgittarius, Hittarius, you
have my son, my son Samy Jr. I kept the

(46:39):
name going. He's a sophomore right now. He actually he's
a track meet like right now and indoor track meat.
But it's a d C, so I'm not I'm not
gonna go to that. Him and I traveled damn across
the state of Maryland. Hey you track this summer. I'm like, no, man,
you got this, Your coaches got you. I'm just on
the side right now. But that's what I came back for.
I came back to rebuild, rebuild, and build cash in

(47:00):
the business industry, be around my kids, and I got
to once again, I got to reassociate myself back with
the Ravens. I ended up doing some work for them
in media and things like that. And while I was
at Hopkins, I walked onto campus with the capstone in mind.
I knew I wanted to build a digital health platform
that really helped people understand kind of health literacy and

(47:20):
really understanding what it means to have a behavioral change
approach that's rooted in diagnostics and assessments and coaching and
really having people help other people help experts, meeting people
that need help. And I started chipping away at different
patents and how to use a smart phone and and

(47:41):
and leveraging the camera on a smart device creating different reports.
Things that were brick and mortar, costly expensive things I
turned into an assessment on a phone. And so I
started partnering with NASA. I was able to acquire um
an algorithm from them through a program called tech Partner
Technology Transfer that's a partnership program. And then I've also

(48:02):
partnered with NASA on bringing in other athletes and running
boot camps with NASA on helping other athletes like myself
and NBA athletes, NFL and Major League Baseball. And so
I was the first athlete to ever do that with NASA,
the first one to ever sign a tech Transfer partnership agreement.
And I've been a part of five other cohorts as
a consultant, helping them and being a proved a use

(48:25):
case to show these athletes and someone's partnered with NASA
and they actually got the I P and they're using
it for something. And so with my time and yeah,
and I'm and and I'm still grinding on some things
with them. But one of the coolest things that came
out of all this is that I've become a bit
of of an analytics UH data scientists, and I've been

(48:46):
working on some other projects that involve NFL predictive analytics
on performance and with the mobile sports book gambling stuff
being legalized, like really looking at kind of arbitrage opportunities,
and so I'm looking at those details and those relationships,
and we're matt thing all this stuff out. It's a
rabbit hole. I'm trying to, like, just give you guys
a sliver, because if I start talking about it's gonna
be half an hour and me talking straight. You don't
want that the next episode. Yeah, exactly. So in general,

(49:08):
what I'm saying is is that I could never imagine
that when I left San Diego, when I retired in
and I was on in my gym that I helped build.
When I left that gym and I sold my house
and I sold my business, and if it didn't fit
in my car, I left it and I moved back
to Maryland. I never really understood what a great decision
that was gonna be from my family, from my kids,
for me, and the opportunities that would provide so really

(49:29):
happy that I made. I distruggled like you did. It
sounds like you had some understanding right, because you were
doing that was your motivation and maybe you didn't know
the degree, but it sounds like you did have some idea.
But think about this though, isn't it the same thing
I did when I was when I left Santa Cruce,
sid and I went to Cabrillo like I had a plan,
I had some idea of what was gonna happen. It's
the same thing I've been. I've been blessed, I've been

(49:49):
lucky to meet some amazing people in California is amazing,
and I'm a California and like I's how I look
at myself. I'm Santa Cruz and San Diego. Those are
those like my my home hometown a and home town beat.
But had I not disrupted my own life and been
comfortable like kind of starting over again, I wouldn't be
where I am right now. I wouldn't have these opportunities
because these opportunities exist here. These opportunities don't exist in

(50:11):
San Diego. And although it's beautiful there and it's comfortable,
and my mom is there, my brothers in l A,
my kids are here, and my life is here, and
what I needed to do, I just had a feeling
it was here and it has been here. Well, you know,
I mean that's such that's such great talk. And you
know we've taken up a lot of your time. I know, man,
but we and honestly, we've had we've had a run

(50:32):
of smart, driven guys who have smart back to school
and but also a bunch of you know, we're like
a bunch of defensive guys. Unfortunately, he's been in his
feelings about yeah, you can tell. And for this segment,
we have our two minutes, you'd dog, and that's when
you and I, that's when you and I. You know,
that's when we vibe. You know, in two minutes, let's go,

(50:54):
we're gonna try to score score a touchdown and we're
gonna stop all these defensive haters that that have been
on this show as well, who want to get a turnover,
forces out on downs or whatever. We're gonna score a
touchdown right here. Now. Most defensive guys don't care about
time outs. But since we're both offensive guys, I'm giving
us both one time out for this two minutes. You
that that cool with you? Big said, I know you,

(51:14):
I know you represented Jayson Taylor Foundation, and you guys
don't want any time out. We're trying to get off time. Wow,
you can have your time out and here you ready,
here we go. Clearly, you and your brother are intelligent guys,
and both of you have your master's degrees. But which
I'm I'm Joe brother. I got it was a better
student growing up. Not even question. So we'll tell me

(51:36):
explain that a little bit. So why is why is there?
Why is that an easy answer? I mean, wow, I
don't even know where to start. Honestly, it's not even
a question. I always enjoyed school, and I always took
it seriously. He was always intelligent, but I don't think
he enjoyed school. He liked to be a joker and
a class clown once in a while, you know what
I mean. Where he's baking an eggs pajamas to school,
you know what I mean, Like that's the stuff he

(51:57):
would do. Well. I'm trying to get straight. I'm trying
to get a's. I'm trying to I'm trying to be
like class valedictorian or something. You know. That's everything is
a competition for me and and and my brother. I
think is a little more easy going when it comes
to certain things. So I took school very seriously. He
took school very seriously later, but early on. Hands down,
your boy's got it. You got not surprised. I think
that answers the next question. More. We know who's gotten

(52:21):
more trouble growing up just by hearing that. So I'm
gonna skip through this one. You played under Denny Green
on three separate occasions. We talked about him a lot
already in this interview. You played for him in Minnesota
and Arizona and with California Redwoods. What is one piece
of advice or saying that you will never forget that
he left you? I mean, do I need to say it?
I mean, it's pretty obvious, right. They are who we

(52:41):
thought they were Bears, and my brother was on that team.
Wasn't that crazy? I love it. I remember. The thing
that stands out for me is I felt bad that
we let that get away. And I felt bad because
Denny told us everything. He said that we came true
and that we'd be in a position to win, and
that we were gonna be the better team that night,
and that we we let him, We let him off

(53:02):
the hook, we let it get away. And when Danny
had that press conference and he smacked the microphone. To
this day, I hear little kids saying that. I'm like,
how does this little kid just saying? By the way,
even though you guys rolled me on this, I was
the coach that ran down the sidelines. I've already called
time out for it, so I stopped the clocks the world. Okay,
on time, Okay, make you good to go, good to go?
All right, let's keep it rolling in man. All right, here,

(53:25):
here's a going right here. You and your brother Finni's
first and third and Special teams tackles for the Dolphins
in two thousand three. Do you remember who was first?
And do you remember how many tackles each of you had?
So o J let me let me provide a little context. Okay,
I know for a fact I led he was in
total Special Teams points. I know that for a fact

(53:45):
I was number one because my brother ended up getting
taken off of a couple of special teams. He may
not remember that or remind you of it. So I
ended up with more points. I don't know if I
ended up with more tackles, and since he ended up
being a three time for buller, I'm gonna say he
probably had more tackles and I had I was probably third,
but I wish I was first. But was he first

(54:06):
and I was third? That is correct? That is correct. Yeah.
I like that you guys were closing because it's it's
all encompassing. He had a whole Keith is one of
the best busial teams coaches. I've ever had one, two, three,
Take the ground that belongs to me, four or five, six,
you know. Turn he had all these little things. He
would say, I still remember them. They're in my brain.

(54:28):
You know. If I want to ask you that, since
we're since we've got the time out and everything, how
much of those things are you taking to life now? Man?
Some of those things you hear from Danny Green, some
of those things you hear from Keith Armstrong, because all
that stuff kind of relates to real life at times. No, absolutely,
I think like I said when I when I was
using the big words, right, you know, I'm saying yeah

(54:50):
exactly for me. You know, I think that football is
a microcosm of real life. Football lessons and apply to anything,
and that ship fits always. I think, no matter what
you talked about it before, are you carry your on water?
Which means do you do your job. He's gonna do
his job, and we all do our job. We're gonna
be fucking successful. Bro. Well, if we're doing our drives,
we need to score here in this two minute drill

(55:10):
has become a six minute drill. But that's okay, June.
So here's the last question for your family. What was
more difficult taking on a linebacker in the a gap
coming to kickoff or developing technology with NASA? I probably
developing technology the hardest because I didn't know what I
was getting into. I've been playing football in my whole life,
and I know the pain that comes with it, and
I accepted that a long time ago. You know. So

(55:32):
the job requirement for you know, covering a kick or
or blocking somebody in the hole, or do whatever you
gotta do. How to do that? I figured that out
very early on bunology, understanding AI and machine learning and
regression and all the different mathematics and concepts that go
into build not working and you gotta test it, you
gotta market it, you gotta sell it. Hey, there's nothing harder.
In my opinion, the hardest thing I'm doing is what

(55:53):
I'm doing right now. It really is. But it's but
but I love it. I wouldn't change it for anything. Well,
there you go, that's your two minute drill. I don't
know that I can clean that up in two minutes.
I might have to give you three time outs. We'll
retroactively figure all out. But great, great stuff, Femi a Yamba, Dae,
Joe Man, your brother was awesome. But you know, I
think we're gonna have to let the people decide which

(56:14):
one of you guys gave the better show, because these
were both incredible, you know, and Femy. One thing that
I really loved and Seth and I talked about before
we even recorded the last few weeks actually was how
intelligent ball players like yourself, your brother, like Akin r
Man because people think that, you know, we're about the
dumbass athletes to go out there and just run through
brick walls and do nothing. To have you, your brother

(56:37):
and Aiken and all the even somebody got the current guys,
you know, Jalen Phillips. The intelligence level that it takes
to be a professional athlete, a professional football player, it's understated, man,
it really is, because there's so much that goes on.
We had our fallback on Alec Ingle and Mike McDaniel
you talked about he puts in a hundred plays a week.

(56:59):
I love I love having players brothers that can talk
about the intellect of everything, not just football, but life.
You know what I mean? So do people that listened
to our show. They don't think of us. It's just
dumbass jocks getting paid to play a damn sport. They
don't get how smart you have to be, how how
how tough you have to be mentally and physically to

(57:20):
play in this game. Now they call a game, we
call life. I just want to say this, and please,
whatever you cut, don't cut this part, because this is
this is gonna be. This is something that that O
J just inspired in me, and I carry it with
me quite a bit, and sometimes it comes out organically.
I'm an ambassador. I represent the league, I represent my family,
and I take pride in the professional athlete that many

(57:43):
people have ever met. And I want them to take
me seriously. I know. I want them to know that
I'm thoughtful. I want them to know that I'm intelligent.
And it doesn't matter if it's catching a football, running
through some d lineman on third and one, if it's
speaking to kids at a hospital, or getting a speech
to MMC Bank executives about trauma and fitness and health
and wellness, which I've done all the above, or signing

(58:05):
a partnership with NASA. When I when I talk to people,
I'm representing o J. I'm representing my brother, I'm representing
every guy that came before me and every guy that
will come after me. And I don't ever want them
to put us in a box. I will never ever
ever accept being put in a box. I will never
let anyone question my character, my integrity. Ever that knowing
that I'm not perfect, I'm gonna make mistakes, but that

(58:28):
I will apologize, I will acknowledge them, and I will
never settle for something below the standard of the people
that have helped paved the way for me. Like that,
I think of time and so when I see people
getting frustrated when somebody bothers them. Now, you should never
approach any celebrity. And I'm not a celebrity by the way,
I'm form a professional athlete, but you should never invade
someone's privacy when they're with their family, and if someone does,

(58:50):
you should still have grace with those people and say, hey,
ma'am sir, like this isn't the time, but maybe when
I get down, I can help you out. I never
want a person to walk away thinking that all he's
he's a he's a former athlete, he thinks he's special
where he doesn't have time, he's too cool. So I
try to balance privacy, respect, and boundaries by also recognizing
that sometimes people are just excited and where they're coming

(59:12):
from as a good place, even though even if they
didn't handle it the right way, their intent is good
and the way you respond on your intent or your
response should also be good. And I try to do
that all the time. And that's a that's a macro
and a micro thing. So don't cut that set. No,
there's no need to cut that. That's good stuff. You're
asking me not to cut it. You checked all the boxes,

(59:32):
all the things that are your goals. Every time you
meet somebody who checked all the boxes here in this interview.
So I appreciate your time that you spent with us.
I appreciate here learning more about your story. Really cool
to connect back with you. I hope that we can
stay connected and again, just you know, thank you so
much for spending some time with us. Hey, Finny, thanks
for having in man, you're now diving a little minute

(01:00:02):
pitch take who that sitting down with step living o
Ja And this is strictly for them true fans, golf
fans number one one of course, y'all. This has ordinary
sports talk. Ever been that pitch tank? Don't get quit, ye,

(01:00:22):
It's time to never been that pitch tank.