June 23, 2025 • 58 mins
Olaplex pro artist award winner @jenthehairmagician fills her books with over 70% vivid clients living in a small suburb. We chat about how she built and maintains her clientele, how they handled her increasing prices twice in one year, and the challenges of being a lefty.
This Week's Topics:
• Growing Up in the Hair Industry
• Navigating Left-Handed Challenges in Hairdressing
• The Current State of the Vivid Hair Market
• Transitioning from Commission to Indie
• Managing Demand and Pricing Strategies
• Client Reactions to Pricing Changes
• The Shift to Hourly Pricing
• Managing Client Expectations
• Self-Care in the Service Industry
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Hey Jen, how you doing?
I'm doing great.
How are you?
uh
I'm doing great.
So you're in Chicagoland and this is now we're in June.
And so what is it like in Chicago in June?
Is the weather turn nice?
Chicago in June has been very unpredictable this year.
want to say it's like spring is still kind of springing.
(00:21):
We've been getting thunderstorms.
We've been getting rain.
um It's being 80 and then it's being 60.
It's being all sorts of things.
So I guess that is predictable for Chicagoland, but normally it would be nicer by now.
Okay, all right.
So I've never actually experienced the windy city as everybody calls it so windy becauseI've never been there when it's windy, which I guess is during the winter time, right?
(00:45):
Yeah, I mean, it can just be windy at multiple times per year, but specifically the wintertime is awful when it's windy.
It hurts.
Really?
Because it's cold too?
Yeah, like it bites, it bites your skin.
Wow.
I spent a spring break in New York City one year and I will never forget how that felt.
(01:05):
The wind on my face, I had to cover every square centimeter of my face because the windwas so biting and cold.
I never experienced that before.
That's exactly what you said, biting.
It bites you.
It hurts.
All right.
Well, the listeners already have figured out that you're from Chicagoland and I guessChicagoland because you're from kind of what the suburbs, northern suburbs.
(01:29):
Yes, I say Chicagoland because I mean if I got in the car I can get to Chicago in lessthan an hour but I'm towards the northern suburbs by Wisconsin.
Okay, very good.
Dated a girl from Wisconsin once.
Wisconsin.
She talked like a youper.
And of course, my accents are always horrible.
I'm surprised anybody even still listens to the podcast with my accents, how bad they are.
(01:54):
But she had a very endearing accent.
And...
accents can be so charming.
Yes, that's where we're gonna leave it.
We're gonna leave it there.
All right, so you're a Chicagoland hairdresser who focuses on creative color.
Your Instagram is just lit up like a rainbow.
It's something to behold.
(02:15):
And you're an Olaplex Award winner.
And so we're gonna get into all of that.
Let's start with where you're from originally and how you got into the business in thefirst place.
So I am also originally from here.
I haven't lived a life other than in this little area.
I'm from a town called Lake Villa and I moved to a town called Round Lake, which is aboutfive minutes outside of Lake Villa.
(02:39):
um And I got into the hair industry because my mom herself is a hairstylist and so I was asalon baby.
I dreamed of sweeping hair when I was like six years old.
I'd be spilling the nail polishes, sweeping hair, cleaning up, getting braids.
So I went to America's Beauty Show in my childhood because her boss was a Farouk educatorwho could get model passes.
(03:05):
immediately, other than like wanting to be a dolphin or horse, I wanted to be ahairstylist.
And uh I did beauty school while I was in high school.
So I got a really massive head start.
I was licensed uh with not only my high school diploma, but with a cosmetology licensewhen I was 18 years old.
And I dove right in.
(03:26):
Okay, so was the cosmetology program part of your high school or you were just doublingup?
You're going to a normal high school and you're going to a normal kind of afternooncosmetology program separately.
It's like a little bit of both.
So our community college had like a vocational school situation where it was specificallyfor high school students, but you could come as an adult if you joined once you were in
(03:50):
high school.
So I would leave school about lunchtime and, you know, skip the extra classes that weren'tnecessary for me to graduate.
And I would head over to, it's called Tech Campus.
I would head over to Tech Campus and spend several hours there.
And the program takes two years because it is such like a half and half situation, likehalf time and high.
(04:10):
school half time in cosmetology, but yeah.
Got it.
So super focused, never in doubt.
I'm really curious.
If you didn't become a hairstylist, what would you be?
Interestingly enough, in the beginning of my career, if you asked me maybe 10 years ago, Iwould say I would be doing gore makeup on movie sets.
(04:34):
um But that was one of my first favorite things or maybe even in nail tech.
But at this point, if you're asking me right now, I feel like I would still be in somesort of industry around helping people.
I really love that aspect of my career.
I really love
also just advocating for like how things should be.
So I still feel like even if it's in the beauty industry, outside of the beauty industry,just wanting people to like take care of themselves and grow as human beings, that has
(05:00):
become a passion of mine as well.
Okay, so you're gonna love one of my last questions, but I'm not there yet.
One of my last, well, I'm not even gonna tell you what the last, the listeners, myregulars, they know what I'm talking about.
Okay, so you graduate from high school and beauty school, and did you go to the salon thatyour mom was working in?
(05:23):
I actually worked there while I was in high school.
That's when I was kind of like a shampoo girl living the dream of sweeping up hair.
um But then, salon came to my beauty school and I knew one of the girls that worked thereat the time and so I did an apprenticeship there and I worked there for seven years.
um And that's where I got a lot of different education through like Redken, they wereRedken Salons.
(05:44):
So it was really cool to witness like going to Redken Symposium every other year.
But now I'm in a suite for the last three years.
So that's where I'm at now.
good.
Very good.
Seven years in kind of a traditional commission situation.
And then and then you have your own studio now.
OK, we'll we'll get there.
So I'm curious back to the.
(06:07):
The kind of very focused on being a hairstylist, never in doubt kind of situation.
Were you?
I imagine that you had had your fingers in hair before you got to high school.
I'm sure you were doing friends in your bathroom or kitchen or whatever.
And did you find that you were good at it?
(06:29):
Or are there parts of it that you didn't like?
Or have you been in the world so long that it was just kind of second nature, at leastfelt that way?
You know, it didn't feel like second nature.
would say I was good at a lot of things beauty.
I would go to my friend's house as early as middle school and give them a full set ofawesome nails and I would curl their hair.
(06:50):
I was the go-to to braid someone's hair in gym class or curl a friend's hair at theirhouse or even be the one to toss some box dye on their hair.
um But if you put scissors in my hand...
I would have a full blown meltdown.
I'm left handed and we're not in a world for left handed people and it took me a long timeto feel comfortable cutting hair well after I was even licensed.
(07:13):
So that was something that I did not feel confident in but as far as just like putting myhands in hair, the confidence has been there.
This is an interesting topic that I don't think I've ever talked about in 400 plusepisodes.
Left-handed versus right-handed.
Now, you're left-handed.
Do you cut left-handed or right-handed?
(07:35):
Okay.
And so I know a lot of shears are designed, you know, left-handed and right-handed.
um When you say that the world isn't designed for lefties, is that because the educationalvideos and the instructions, et cetera, isn't mirrored for you?
I would say it's a little bit better now, but there's a lot that's not out there forlefties.
(08:00):
mean, including the way products are built, like stations, the salon I worked at waspretty much all right-handed stations, and I'd be like choking my client out with the cord
if I wanted to be able to blow dry their hair.
um
even to get scissors and shears.
Like if I went to the beauty show, most of the supply they had on hand was right handed.
And if I wanted to leave with shears that day, I probably couldn't.
(08:23):
And I would normally have to place an order for them.
And then, yeah, like with education as well, a lot of the educators are right handed.
And it's, mean, I don't expect them to know how to do it left handed per se, but a lefthanded, being left handed, a lot of things are upside down and backwards.
Like you just flip it and reverse it.
And so.
A lot of the things that were taught to me were very frustrating, literally dating back tokindergarten I would get scolded for how I used my scissors because I just feel there's
(08:49):
not a lot out there for it.
You know what?
You left-handers need an advocate.
I never, I don't hear enough activism in support of lefties.
Do you know what?
Okay, trivia question.
The Hair Game Podcast trivia question.
Here it goes.
What percentage of the human population of the world is left handed?
(09:11):
this but I don't think I'm gonna guess it right because it's like a small percentage.
Is it like 20 % or something like that in my clothes?
Well, I don't know the answer, so I'm chat GPTing it.
Okay, what?
What?
Hold on.
Percentage of the world population is left handed.
(09:36):
Let's see what she says.
Okay, this is interesting.
This is fewer than I would have expected.
What would you guess?
Okay, so my brain wanted to say 2 % but that feels outrageous so then I jumped to 20 whichI'm not sure how that is gonna sound.
would have been somewhere in the 20 to 25 neighborhood because it's not that rare.
(10:00):
It just seems like in my friend network, you know, it's not that rare.
However, the answer is 10%.
my god, yeah, see we're rare out here.
We are rare.
m
in 10.
uh And it says that the, it's estimated, estimated obviously because there's no centraldata, but between nine and 10 or nine and 11 % left-handed.
(10:27):
Okay, so there you go.
And so you've had to contend with this handicap, if you will, of being left-handed and youfigured it out.
Yes, and I still to this day honestly sometimes feel insecure when I cut hair.
Like sometimes when I educate other stylists, like I'm, I haven't ever taught a haircut inclass because I'm almost insecure to be told that I'm doing it wrong because everything I
(10:55):
do is so weird with left-handed, being left-handed.
When I write it's like,
hooked upside down, revealing my cat hair.
It's hooked upside down.
And so there are ways I cut hair.
I cannot tell you if it's a hot tip to prevent carpal tunnel.
can't tell you that, but I can tell you that it looks good when it's done.
But I just know it looks a lot different than everything I see on stage, everything I seein videos.
(11:20):
So I've always been a little insecure of it, but at the same time, I call that intuitivehair cutting.
I am just cutting the hair and it is looking good when I'm done.
There you go, and that's what matters.
It's the outcome that matters.
You have your own little way of doing it.
Whether it's because you're lefty or not, I'm not sure it matters so much.
Okay, so you've dealt with the adversity of being a lefty.
(11:42):
When did you decide that you were going to focus?
Well, let me ask you this question first.
Are you focused on color versus cutting at this point in your career?
would say yes, but at the same time, I find myself fall in and out of love with cutting.
I don't not take haircuts.
I still do haircuts every day behind the chair, but as far as new clients, I don't takenew haircutting clients only.
(12:07):
It's usually just new, vivid clientele because I have a pretty full book.
So I would say just with that information alone, I would lean more towards color, but Ido, when the haircuts are interesting and fun, you know, if someone wants a shag or some
sort of edgy haircut, I have way more fun doing it than like just
busting out lot of trims.
I would say that's something that kind of reignites my love for it, but I mostly uh prefercolor.
(12:31):
And that makes sense.
And so how far in your career did you go before you decided to focus on Vivids?
I would say I was kind of figuring out my niche for a long time and just kind of trying tolike please the people above me, please the people I work for just to get good numbers.
And I didn't really get to reflect on what is it that I enjoy doing until about 2020,which was a while into my career because I started in about 2014, 2015.
(13:02):
And I remember that because one of like my favorite vivid clients I started like goingbuck wild on in about 2019, 2020.
And that's when I kind of had this like, aha, that that's my favorite thing.
That's what I want to do more of.
And I think I want to honor what it is that makes me happy behind the chair so that I canshow up positively and show up in good spirits and deliver good results.
(13:26):
And I feel if you're not doing something that lights you up, then sometimes that can beaffected.
So I would say for
The last, what year is it?
2025?
I'd say for the last five years is me really honing in on what I love.
Okay, so if I did the math right, it took you about five years to decide to, well, it'stwo things.
(13:47):
It's one, deciding you wanna focus on something, in this case, vivid hair.
But the second part of that is that you have the luxury of focusing on something, right?
It's a bit of a luxury to say, I wanna just do vivid hair or I wanna just do haircuts,right?
Versus taking every client who walks in the door.
Right.
(14:07):
Right, I definitely agree that it's a luxury because there's kind of a fine line here.
I don't think people should be doing services that they don't feel good doing, but thatkind of has like a definition to it.
So in the beginning of my career when I had no clients, would I just turn down a roottouch up because I didn't feel like it?
Absolutely not.
But would I turn away a perm because I didn't know how to?
(14:31):
I would I would like to do that.
Like if I didn't know how to, if I couldn't deliver the result that someone's asking for,to me that's different.
But
Yeah, I think in the beginning there's a little less of a luxury depending on everyone'ssituations.
If you're just kind of doing it and growing quickly or financial reasons aren't anecessity for you, then sure, start picking and choosing from the beginning, I guess.
(14:52):
But at the same time, I'm really grateful for just like the principles that dabbling ineverything for a very long time has given me, there's a lot that I know and will forever
know, which means I have the choice to work.
these things out.
still have clients that are more of like the natural services, like I said, other haircutstoo, but um I'm very grateful because I do feel like it did teach me something to be able
(15:18):
to take all of those different services.
Yeah, sure.
All right, so what percentage are you these days?
uh Vivid colors versus other services.
I would really say probably like 70 30, like probably 70 % of my, like most of my work dayand work week is vivid color of some sort, whether it's just a little on the ends or fully
(15:41):
bleach root touch up wild stuff.
And then maybe like I said, a haircut or a root touch up in between here and there.
But yeah, for the most part, she's pretty full blown vivid.
So I can hear my listeners thinking, wait a second, this Jen Guido lady,
She could fill 75 % of her book with vivids working in Lake Villa, you know, north ofChicago little town.
(16:07):
you know, vivids have been around now for quite a while.
you know, mean, Pulp Riot didn't create them certainly, but maybe they made them slightlymore uh common, at least, yeah, maybe socialized.
uh
slightly more normal within our industry, you know, but there's been manic panic and otherthings going way back.
(16:30):
uh But we've been in this kind of vivid zone, or at least, you know, the trend has beenout there vividly, you know, for at least 10 years, right?
um And so I'm sure some people who tried vivid, some clients who tried vivids,
(16:52):
have decided not to keep them up and there's new clients coming into Vivids, how would yousay the market is, if you will?
In other words, the amount of clients, are there more people going Vivid or is it justkind of holding steady?
with your business, how do you feel like the market is?
(17:15):
I feel like the market is doing just fine for Vivids, but what's really interesting aboutit is some people's head spaces are kind of what like spoil the perception of this.
So throughout my career, mean, I remember, I remember being in like middle school andassociating someone with Vivid hair is just like a hot topic teen, like edgy, angsty teen.
And now it's just like everyone, like my clients are in their forties and fifties rockingrainbows and even in their sixties sometimes and yeah, twenties, thirties too.
(17:42):
But um now even
There was a point where my last boss told me that she wanted me to focus on natural colorsbecause she felt a recession was coming and that that would be more sustainable.
It's just I think it's more people's headspace than anything because Vivids can be lowmaintenance.
I have clients that come back every three months.
(18:03):
I air quoted low maintenance because there's still some rules that come with it, but Istill believe that there's a version of low maintenance Vivids for people.
So for me,
I don't see a decline or a struggle in the vivid industry.
think there's a price point, an amount of vivids and a look as far as maintenance goes forjust about everyone.
(18:24):
Like I said, it's a lot of people's beliefs that like kind of dirty it up and make it seemdifferent.
Mm-hmm.
Sure, sure, that makes sense.
So I'm looking at your Instagram and you have done a really good job of being searchableand discoverable for somebody in the Chicago area who wants rainbow hair because you put
(18:48):
it in your title really well, you put it everywhere.
And that's really, really good.
And I'm gonna take this moment for a PSA, public service announcement to the listeners.
If you don't have the city in which you work on your Instagram profile, please put it inthere.
Please stop the podcast and go put the city in which you work on your Instagram profile.
(19:14):
There's still so many people out there.
I see it on Instagram all the time.
within our community.
I see a hairdresser who comments on something or whatever.
I click on there and there's nothing.
It doesn't say Minneapolis.
It doesn't say Canarsie.
It says nothing.
And it's hard for people to find you.
Maybe they have full books of clients and that's great for them.
(19:36):
But if you want people to find you, please put the city where you work.
All right.
It makes you searchable.
All right.
So it looks like.
You're doing a great job of being searchable.
Is that how you find most of these vivid clients in this little town?
Interestingly enough, I think I get a little bit of it the...
(19:57):
New Age way and the old-fashioned way.
I have a lot of word-of-mouth clients, but I do also have a lot of I don't know anyonewho's your client, but I found you online so and I honestly this is not something that I
think is good per se but I'm not even on Google so they are finding me specificallythrough Instagram which uh says a lot about putting your freaking town right up in there
(20:19):
because Yes, I have I have become I don't know if this is for everyone, but it's for meI've become to the point
where I have a form for new clients.
It honestly just helps my energy level.
I'm just one person.
I get exhausted very easily.
being able to have someone like pop through everything that I would have asked them,because I'm sure every hairstylist relates, there's people in your DMs, how much?
(20:41):
And then they don't even answer when you respond.
um So for me, having this back and forth consultation that can last days or weeks is soexhausting, especially when the result isn't even getting the client.
So I have a form now and it teaches me a lot about people too when they fill out thisform.
but yeah, a lot of them are from this radius, which I also, you've brought up like thesmall town thing a couple times, I fully agree.
(21:06):
To me, I mean, everyone's got their own story, so I can't say that it's absolutelyimpossible that this is true, but I don't think the small town excuse is real.
I don't, because I live in...
near lots of low-income areas.
I'm not in like a glorious city and I'm about an hour from one and about an hour fromanother one and it's a lot of people's stories who are in small towns but yeah I find
(21:30):
people who are willing to drive and I find that small percentage of people locally thatare it's a big enough percent to fill my clientele but they come to me.
No excuses, I love it.
Let's get rid of all the excuses.
If Jen can do it in Lake Villa, I'm sorry, what's the other, you moved five minutes fromLake Villa to Lake Nona, around Lake.
(21:53):
Yeah, around Lake, you're in round Lake now.
If she can do it, you can do it too, listeners.
There you go, that's your pep talk for the day.
Okay, that's right.
All right, so you worked um in the traditional salon for seven years, then you moved to astudio.
How has that been?
The studio has been really great.
(22:14):
So I left the salon I was at for seven years just because I was really ready for somethingnew.
And in all honesty, my mental health was horrible because I think that's a lot of people'sstories when they work at commission salons.
hate to say it.
And I know there are great ones out there, but where I kind of felt like I was veryperformative and spread really, really thin and was not taught to take care of myself.
(22:38):
I didn't take breaks.
I worked long days.
I had three to four people at a time.
my clients literally described me as running around with my head cut off like is it achicken running around with your head cut off but I just
running around with their head cut off as bad.
is bad, yes, when you're running around with your head cut off.
it just, I think it took some time because when I started there, I was young, I mean, I'mstill young, but I was young, young.
(23:03):
And everyone there was doing it, everyone was there was swearing by it.
This is the way to make money.
And I believe that there are other ways to make money and to take care of yourself at thesame time.
And so when you start denying what your mind and body want, it starts to show up in otherways.
And it just, I wasn't well.
needed to make a change.
And so I left when my books were very full.
(23:27):
So luckily, I actually had so much coming to my suite that I could not like I stoppedtaking clients for a little bit.
But I was I was like, that's an income cap, Jen, what are you doing?
But at one point, I was like, there's no rate that I can raise my prices where I can clearthese clients out.
Like, that is an amazing thing.
But at the same time, it was really stressful in the beginning.
(23:48):
And now, I'm grateful to have openings here and there because if
I get sick or something happens or someone can reschedule.
It doesn't have to be for six months from now.
But the transition went really well.
It went really well.
I had a lot of fun doing it.
I found myself in a different way as like corny as that can sound.
I like found myself because I got to like connect and be balanced and not like in fight orflight all the time.
(24:15):
Okay, so a couple things I want to address there.
You use the word performative and um when you say that, do you mean that your time at thatsalon was really just measured by how much your, what your performance and productivity
was?
Like your numbers?
yes, it's all about being a team player and doing things to team player, but in the senseto where, you know, if that meant me being the front desk all day unpaid, that meant me
(24:44):
being the front desk all day unpaid or, um, yes.
Yes, and I mean, it wouldn't be all day, but it would be like in shifts, like Jen's got itfrom two to five and this person.
So, yes, but yes, it was all about the numbers.
I would have week or monthly performance.
uh meetings where I was really scared to even go into them because I would have someonelooking at me and say, why don't you think you hit your numbers this month?
(25:12):
And there was always something that I could be doing different and that was just reallyhard on the nervous system.
And I mean, I made a lot of money from it, but like at the same time at what cost?
Cause I was not doing okay.
Right.
Okay.
Well, that's amazing.
And this one of the great things about the industry is that you can keep, it's not likeyou have to leave the industry, right?
(25:33):
You can just change your working environment.
And,
And there's lots of them.
And there's lots of different working environments.
And of course, when it comes to studios, if you don't like one kind of studio, you canfind another kind of studio.
And then there's all sorts of different prices and styles and same with commission salons.
If you want to be in a commission salon, you find a different kind or a different group ofpeople or whatever.
(25:55):
And it's one of the great things about the industry.
uh Okay.
So when you transitioned from the commission salon to the studio, you had such
a high demand for your services that you needed to actually pare down a little bit, whichis an awesome situation to be in.
(26:16):
And you said that you couldn't raise your prices enough.
Did you raise your prices some?
Okay.
Awesome.
trying to throw some water on it because I had clients booking out for the whole year justto make sure they had appointments with me but there was no time for me to get sick or for
a life event to happen or for me to plan a vacation so I knew something wasn't workingthere too even though it was still a very wonderful thing to have that demand but had to
(26:43):
have the right balance to it.
Yes, mm-hmm.
have to manage the lack of demand and you have to manage an abundance or let's say toomuch demand.
And that can be stressful too.
And of course the listeners who are maybe new hairstylists or hairstylists who are losingsome of their clients are thinking, why are you kidding?
She's complaining about having too much demand.
(27:05):
Of course, you know, there's stresses that come.
Not all stresses come from lack of money.
uh
So you have a lot of people who want things from you and if you can't deliver those,especially if you're a people pleaser and so many of us in the industry are, then that can
be extremely stressful, even if it means an extra $1,000 in your bank account that week.
(27:32):
Okay, so you raised your price twice in the first year, which is great.
And about what percentage do you remember?
It's been three years.
or two years.
say what specific percentage because I also...
after that I changed to hourly as well so that helped with a lot of things.
So I want to say it could have been like maybe 10 % but everything went up at least fiveto ten dollars.
(27:55):
Some things went up 20 to 30 that first time but then I changed it to hourly because italso helped me kind of throw uh throw I don't want to say throw away but like throw water
on the emotional discounting or the grandfathered in pricing things.
So even changing to hourly I think the second year um one of my clients for example
(28:16):
Her pricing went up $90 and then some it stayed the same some it went down $5 and some itwent up 1020 But it put me on an even playing field
so many different playing fields.
You had so many different pricing structures for different people, like you were talkingabout the grandfathering and the emotional discounting or whatever.
And we kill ourselves by doing this, don't we?
(28:39):
Over time.
And it's like death by cuts because when Janice comes in and she might complain about shelost her job and so you're like, okay, I'll give you a...
25 % discount, right?
And then six months later, of course, Janice has gotten a new job, but she's still gettingthe 25 % discount and you because you forgot or you feel bad or something else and that's,
(29:05):
how do you go back on that?
Well, that's part of running a business professionally, right?
Is we have to create those boundaries and we have to um keep the boundaries in mind.
And thankfully now we have software that kind of helps us.
you know, keep some of this stuff organized.
um I wanted to ask you, well, let's see, are we done talking about your price increases?
(29:26):
uh No, not yet.
Okay, so before I get too far off track, so you raised your prices twice and what was thereaction across your clientele?
My clientele was like almost too cool with it and that's why I had to do it a second timebecause everyone was like, that's perfect.
Can you see my mom and her sister too?
(29:48):
And so it went so well that I, I don't know, I would be scared every time I'd raise myprices, but it went, it went, I hate to say it, but like I said, too well because it, you
didn't get like the natural fallout that normally comes with it at all.
well you didn't do it enough, right?
Yeah.
One of my favorite interviews on this topic was with Patricia Nicole, Painted Hair, who Ibelieve, Patricia, you doubled your prices.
(30:17):
Her story, it's, you can find it in our annals of episodes, this is probably two or threeyears ago, where she talked about how she doubled her prices.
And she was petrified, of course, that people were gonna leave, because the doubling ofprices, you increase them 100%.
Like, who's gonna stay?
Right?
If you double your prices.
(30:38):
Well, she's like everybody stays, you know, not everybody, but like, you know, only 10 %of people didn't stay.
And all of a sudden she's doubled her income overnight like that.
And she just, that was so eye-opening for her.
And um yeah, so at 10%, that's not going to do it.
(30:58):
And also you're talking about a time in which inflation across the economy
was about 10%, you know, two, three years ago.
Right now, you know, we're in the four or so, four to 5%, and of course it depends on whatyou're talking about.
If you're about groceries, or you're talking about my favorite thing to talk about, whichis, which is deodorant.
(31:20):
You know, my deodorant used to be $4 and now it's like 12.
It's like, what?
I fully understand that.
I just bought more deodorant the other day and I was like, are you kidding me?
It's $12 for a little deodorant.
Yes, it's legitimately $12.
Next podcast.
talk about it too much, but um that was the period of time when things were getting veryexpensive and this was post-COVID and the government had washed everyone in cash.
(31:48):
And so 10%, that's just keeping up.
That's not even a price increase.
That's just keeping up with the value of the US dollar.
That didn't mean that you're going to be able to buy more things.
That just meant that you're going to buy the same number of things, you know, with theincome that you're getting.
(32:09):
So it's always, call it, they call it, you know, real or inflation adjusted.
When you increase your prices, what matters most is the increase above inflation, becauseyou want to be making more money every year, right?
So without necessarily working more hours.
uh It's hard to add hours to your day.
(32:33):
So you want to refine your services down into what you like to do.
You want to get the right clients in your chair.
Those who can pay you what the demand for your time is worth and all that kind of stuff.
And then increase your prices at a level that is above inflation.
So you can start putting money in the bank.
(32:54):
So that when you get older, like me, I'm almost 50.
you're like 22, but when you get like, see I was close.
When you get my age, you have to start putting money away.
Well, you have to start putting money away in your twenties.
But when you get to my age, you have to have like a nest egg building so that you canretire.
(33:19):
Like your body breaks down or you decide to do something else maybe or whatever.
ah It's good to have money and so you need to start early on these things and so priceincreases are very important, especially these days.
I completely agree and that's why I went in with that second one that year because I waslike, actually no, sorry everyone.
(33:40):
And I guess there was no apologizing necessary because everyone was like, yes ma'am, I'lltake it.
Thank you.
you increase prices since then.
sure I do it at least once a year, so yes I have.
um Maybe two or three more times, whatever the math on that would be.
It's been two years since I've had hourly pricing, um which has been very helpful for mein so many ways.
(34:07):
Okay, so let's talk about that.
There are some people who hate the idea of hourly pricing because they're afraid thattheir clients are going to think that they're just gonna take longer and run up the bills,
so to speak.
Kind of like an attorney.
You have them help you with a traffic ticket and then they send you a bill and it sayslike 28 hours and you're like, there's no fucking way you spent 28 hours.
(34:32):
So how do you respond to that criticism?
Well, I first of all, I tell my clients that it's not like I'm starting a timer.
My hourly pricing is more just like, how long is it taking me to create this look?
Now, of course, I catch the trends.
So if I book someone for three hours and it trends on taking four, I have thatconversation and we book them for four hours.
(34:54):
I think.
It is a fair concern.
There's a lot of people in the industry that really do take their sweet, sweet, sweet,sweet time.
And I mean, I don't want to say there's anything wrong with that, but for hourly pricing,I could see that concern there.
But I'm pretty quick with what I do.
So I don't think any of my clients have ever even questioned that I would be taking mytime too much.
But I definitely have had someone like ask if I'm keeping track of the time and makingsure that I started counting it right from when she started and wait from when she ended.
(35:25):
And that's
exactly what I explained to her is it was like, that's not how I'm timing it.
If we, if I choose to talk to you for 20 minutes after I finish your hair, I'm notcharging you for that 20 minutes.
It's how long this look takes to create.
And sometimes that's an average, but overall it's just worked for me.
So that's a really great thing that you addressed ah because that does handle some of thecriticism.
(35:50):
When does the clock begin and when does the clock end?
And I know that very much in client service businesses, it can be quite draining when atthe end of a service, not just for hairdressers but other things as well, the client...
(36:12):
hangs around a little bit and can continue to talk about their kid in school for like anextra 20 minutes and you're standing there and you're like, okay, you know, I need to go.
And maybe you don't have a client waiting, but you might need to get home to dinner orsomething, right?
(36:32):
And so the three hours or the two, let's say it's a haircut, it's an hour and a half,could turn into two hours just because the client's talking so much.
uh And of course vice versa if the hairdresser is talking too much.
I know that this can happen and I see it.
My wife does this.
My wife is a highly social person.
(36:52):
So she will, you know, go to the nail salon and then she'll just keep talking to theperson after she's done.
And I'm like, okay, it's time for them.
They want to go back to work and you and I need to leave or whatever, you know.
uh It's a very interesting thing that's not really discussed a whole lot.
I like defining kind of what they're paying for that can relieve some of the anxietyaround the client, making sure that they're paying for what they're getting.
(37:21):
But you said nobody's really giving you a hard time about it and that's awesome.
Couple of other things I wanna talk about, bond builders.
The bond builder world has been around 10, 11 years now since Olaplex came out.
Do you use it?
And if you do, do you have a preferred?
brand.
(37:43):
have been using bond builders for a very long time.
I don't know if it's been my whole career.
I think maybe a couple years because I don't even know how old Olaplex is.
think it might have been doing here.
Okay, so I want to say it got brought in maybe a couple years into when I started doinghair into the salon I was working at.
So I started with Olaplex and that is when I entered their they only had this one contestand it was the Pro Artist Awards and I entered it and I won in my category.
(38:12):
uh So I
spot for Olaplex for that reason, but I also really appreciate the science behind Olaplex.
I feel that they, I mean they've patented their stuff and they are very sciencey and Iabsolutely adore Olaplex.
So that is always my absolute most trusted bond builder.
It's the one I use all the time when the stakes are high, when they're not high.
(38:34):
I use other ones, but...
I don't, I'm not someone who has studied the science very hard behind the other ones.
I just know my trust lays in Olaplex.
So when I use the other ones, I almost use them as a treat.
I know that's really weird to word it that way, but like as a treat because I do know thatthey make the hair feel good, but my trust lies in Olaplex just a little bit more when it
(38:59):
comes to like bond protection, not breaking the hair, things like that.
Awesome.
Booking apps, we talked about this a little bit.
uh Supportive services for hairdressers in their everyday uh business needs.
You talked about having a form, an intake form, a consultation form, which is such a goodidea.
(39:24):
We've talked about that so many times.
We have so many guests who do that now.
uh Do you do the form separate?
oh Well, first of all, do you use a booking app?
I do, I use Gloss
Gloss Genius, and have you used others or just gloss?
I started setting up my business on Square, but I got a little confused and I switched toGloss Genius before my first day.
(39:47):
And that's no hate to Square.
I just, think something about Gloss Genius.
It could even just be the way it looks.
It was a little bit more attractive to me and my landlord, his wife is also um someone whoworks in the suites and she knew Gloss Genius.
So I knew if I needed any help, I could talk to her.
So that's what steered me to Gloss, but I haven't really explored other ones.
(40:08):
Yeah.
And how do you do your intake forms?
How do you do your consultation forms?
I started with JotForm, but now I have a Google Form.
Okay, Google Docs.
Is it Google Docs?
Is that the same as Google Form?
I think they actually have like Google forms, um but when I recall the forms on my phone,sometimes they do show up through docs, so they might just be kind of like sisters.
(40:35):
Yeah.
And clients, have they had any problems with them?
Do you have any like best practices for any listeners who might want to start doing those?
I don't have any clients who have had any issues with them.
Sometimes I need to direct them to it when they message me first.
But I would say my advice for listeners is, and I don't want to come off sounding nasty,but expect that people won't read.
(41:01):
So I don't want to say can't read, but won't read.
And try to be very clear, very, very clear and include everything.
from your consultation to make it easier for you.
That's what I did.
Anything that I would ask someone prior to booking, other than just in the chairquestions, um it's all in that form because for me, I use that form to decide if we're a
(41:26):
good fit or not.
Not even just, this is the first step to booking with me and you'll definitely book withme after.
It's more of just almost like a screening and a consultation.
Clarity is extremely important.
You can't be too clear because confusion, if you don't put a lot of thought into thecreation of one of these things, it just breeds confusion and then you're gonna end up
(41:49):
spending more time on it than you even want.
Okay, really, really good advice.
Okay, so now we get to that question that I wanted to ask you in the beginning, which isthe wave your wand question.
If I handed you a wand,
and you're queen Jen hair magician.
(42:10):
I mean, you're already the Jen hair magician.
I said the head.
I said the Jen hair magician.
It's Jen the hair magician, which is your Instagram handle.
Here's your, you already have a wand.
So wave it and change anything about the industry at all.
What would it be?
oh
It would be about the hairstylists, not even the clients or like the know-how of thephysical, the tools, the work.
(42:37):
It's just more about the stylist.
If I could use my magic wand and tap right into it, it would be about the mindset andwellbeing of hairstylists.
I wish that more hairstylists were more self-assured and confident in their value and intheir livelihood because it's important that if you're doing this as your career that
you...
(42:57):
make the money that it takes for it to be a career and for you to live the life that youdeserve, but also that you take care of your vessel, your body, and what that comes with
as well.
And not just all the things that have been really normalized in the industry of just like,don't take care of yourself, hustle, hustle, hustle, who needs to eat?
I just, it's not for me.
And also the, to going hand in hand with the mental.
(43:21):
state of it is just all the fear.
Like always if you're so scared to raise your prices that means that part of you feelslike you're not good enough to raise your prices.
Probably.
There could be other things but like normally that fear has a story and I wish that Icould just use that magic wand to get rid of that story and for people to see their value
because we're doing this for other people but we're also doing this for ourselves.
(43:44):
Like we can't...
you need to be able to make it until you're 50, 60, 70, and to retire when your body wantsto or when you want to.
And that involves taking care of your mind and body.
Absolutely.
This is the analogy with uh the thing when you get on an airplane and they talk about theoxygen mask.
(44:05):
When you're going down and all the masks fall down and your kid is sitting next to you, doyou put on your kid's oxygen mask first or do you put on your oxygen mask first?
You put on yours because until you put on yours, you can't help somebody else.
You say, do this for other people, you know, or we do it for ourselves.
(44:28):
If we, if we, if we aren't taking care of ourselves, first and foremost, we can't do itfor other people.
So that has to be the priority.
Now, of course, people can take that way into an extreme and they go to the beach everyday.
Okay.
Well, that's not even being a professional, right?
But you absolutely have to make sure that your health and mental and physical is takencare of.
(44:51):
before you can help others and do your job really well.
Absolutely.
% that should be that should be a priority and seeing your value and wanting the best foryourself should be a priority and I totally understand that line because some people might
Yeah, well taking care of myself means I work one day a week and I can't pay my bills No,that's not what that means.
Yeah.
(45:12):
Yes Yeah, right,
Yes, but taking care of yourself and not worrying about pleasing others, because it is anindustry full of people pleasers, pleasing yourself first and listening to yourself, even
if someone, whether it be a boss that doesn't align with you or something someone elsesaid, it doesn't have to align with them, even if they don't agree.
(45:36):
sometimes you just, you know, it's best for yourself within reason, like we said, but youknow, it's best for yourself and we should take care of ourselves and listen to ourselves.
Amen.
All right, give me your best hair horror story.
my god, is this, oh I for sure do, but uh is this a hands and hair story or just anindustry working with clients story?
(46:02):
This could be either one.
yes, I cast a wide net with this question.
um It doesn't need to be uh a, you know, you didn't realize that there was so much uhmetal in the hair and so it roasted off.
It could be the person next to me accidentally slit the throat of their client and thehead went rolling down the aisle.
(46:27):
You know, it could be, you know, something like that.
Anything.
Okay, so have my tea.
Luckily, I don't have a horror story.
Where is wood for me to knock on?
I don't have a horror story of me doing anything terrible to someone's hair that wouldmake a horror story.
um Yes, thank you.
I've had my accidents that were not that bad, you know what I mean?
(46:48):
But my horror story that comes to mind is when I was, and I still am, but when I was in mywhat is best for Jen era that sometimes included letting people go and I've had to let go
of
maybe three or four clients in the 10 years that I've done hair, but one did make a horrorstory for me.
She really did.
(47:09):
I let go of her for the sake of my well-being.
There was a lot of reasons.
em How did I let go?
Well, I'm sorry, I shouldn't have interrupted.
that there you said there are a lot of reasons.
So why first maybe.
Okay, so first it started with when she first came to me, my gut instinct said no, but Isaid yes.
(47:31):
So that was my first is just like, sometimes that gut is instinct.
She has something to say.
I felt like she would spread me thin or just not be pleasable.
um And while I was able to please her,
She still was a level of maintenance, high maintenance, and just came with an energy thateventually deteriorated at me.
(47:53):
She kind of, she would, let's say I had to send her her pictures for her to Photoshop themand edit them and then send them back to me before I could post them.
Um, yes.
every message from her, even if it was just, Hey, can I reschedule was a full phone screenhad to swipe several, just a novel.
(48:14):
Everything was a novel from her.
me.
I know, I know.
so, um and she kind of, she got, she kind of got to the point where I think that shecreated the ego for herself, that she was my best client and that I should be.
doing absolutely everything for her that she has asked me to reschedule clients so thatshe could come in because the emergency was that it was her 35th birthday, which is
(48:38):
halfway to 70.
So she was a little bit of a diva.
So my icing on the cake was that she, this is so personal, but she started a personalargument with me at like one in the morning one night.
And she was just, she was going.
off and it was a misunderstanding and so I tried to let her know it was a misunderstandingand if you want to go there I and then Donovan can Donovan can cut this out if he wants to
(49:09):
but it was I shared a peaceful post about just it was a ceasefire post it was a ceasefirepost yes it was and um yep and it was uh nope uh
and she sent me message after message and I don't care if that airs but I didn't know ifyou wanted to let it go political but uh she sent she sent me message after message after
(49:35):
message and I told her she needed to stop.
I said you have to stop like my interest is just in
wanting people, innocent people to be okay, like chill out girl.
And she, she ripped me a new one.
And so I sat with it for a while and I eventually I texted her and because of how lengthyand wordy she always was, I sent her a really short text, which probably pissed her off
(49:58):
too.
But I just was like, thank you for everything.
But moving forward, I'm not the right stylist for you and I wish you all the best.
And she ripped me a new one once again.
I had to block her number because she told
me that, uh well first of all she said that she, benefited more from our relationship thanshe did.
(50:19):
uh A little, the ego was really coming out but yes she had me delete all of her picturesbecause she didn't want to be associated with my brand anymore.
So yeah, but I was like no problem girl.
uh But ah after, this is where the, this is where the horror story comes in.
It wasn't just the firing.
(50:39):
Well, it's been horrible so far, but there's more?
Okay.
So after I fired her, she made a fake phone number because I blocked her to remind me thatthere was two pictures I forgot to delete from four years ago and that she pretty much
threatened like almost like a legal action situation if I didn't remove them and comply.
(51:04):
yep and a- yep.
got way too much time on her hands.
Yes.
And remember, this was about politics, not about her hair.
She did the same thing every time and loved her hair.
But months after that, hadn't heard from her.
She filed a dispute to take the $500 from her last service months prior.
(51:24):
So that was a new can of worms that I had to deal with is like proving that I did theservice.
And then she started getting her hair done in the same suite building, the room parallelto mine.
So I would still have to see her come in.
It was insane.
She's a stalker.
Wow.
She's a stalker client.
(51:45):
She has made two more fake phone numbers since to let me know um To stop talking about herand I was like girl I would stop I've never texted her back But I would stop talking about
you if you stop trying to steal money from me first of all like the dispute and stuff Yes,I
by the way the 500 bucks did you were you able to keep it?
Good Okay Good
(52:09):
I was not talking about her regularly until the dispute came up months later.
So then I was triggered and talking about it again, because I was stressed.
But she sent me long messages, um two different ones, just like hashtag winning, hashtagstay triggered.
And I never would text her back.
And I know she wanted me to text her back so bad.
But yeah, she's made
(52:31):
She wants...
different fake phone numbers.
She's filed a dispute over it.
She comes to get her and she has her formulas and she chose the suite across from mine.
You know what I mean.
Like that's wild.
So to this day, um,
I hope that that is the craziest client experience I ever endured because that lastedmonths of her pretty much harassing me.
(52:57):
But because of the time she had on her hands, I didn't want to do like a restraining orderor anything because I felt like she would take it to court.
Like it was the best to just leave her alone.
um Even if she even like I kind of got in my head, like, should I have fired her the way Idid or should I have talked to her differently?
No, because her true colors would have shown anyways, no matter what happened.
(53:17):
um
You did it the...
Absolutely.
You did it the best way you could do it.
was insane.
It was insane.
You know what the reality is that some people are just crazy I think we know this anyonewho's been in the industry We have you know people in beauty school too who are yet to be
(53:41):
in the industry But I'm sure they know you don't have to be in the industry to know thatsome people in this world are crazy and they it's almost like they're put on this planet
to do it feels like
to drive us crazy.
Like, it feels personal.
But you, but I, you know, in my experience, it's not personal.
(54:01):
They're just nuts.
This is how they sometimes, somehow get value out of life is making people, you know,crazy.
And a lot of it has to do with their own sense of status.
uh Yes.
And it has to do with their own sense of status and their own sense of self-worth.
(54:21):
And, uh you know, they,
They get that by making other people jump, you know, and making other people worry and,you know, try to kowtow to what they want on the every day.
And these are people to avoid.
And so I, if I were you, I would be very grateful that you have her out of your life andout of your professional life too.
(54:43):
So, um yeah, just, uh I would say I am sorry that I even brought it up because, becausethat made you think about it again.
It is a really good story to bring up.
Like it is a story that if told people are like, what?
Like, so it's not triggering to tell the story, but with her level of wild, I'd be...
(55:04):
She could hear this, but that's fine.
She can make her fourth fake phone number and let me know.
But no, it's an entertaining story.
It is, but a wild one.
instructive.
That's why we talk about it.
Because it's good for other hairdressers to hear the bad things that happen, right?
Exactly, yeah, it's not all sunshine and rainbows.
(55:26):
I wish it was all rainbows, but sometimes...
sometimes...
Nope, not even in my studio!
All right, any last words for the community?
So my last word of advice is do what's best for you.
Follow your gut, take care of your mind, take care of your body.
We are in the service industry.
(55:47):
So like you said, we cannot put our other people's oxygen masks on before our own.
We got to take care of ourselves.
And that looks like a lot of different things in a lot of different ways.
And I think we're taught to do the exact opposite.
So let's take that back.
100%.
Love it.
Love it.
All right, Jen Guido, this has been a lot of fun.
Thank you so much.
(56:08):
been so much fun.
Thank you for having me.
Hey Jen, how you doing?
I'm doing great.
How are you?
uh
I'm doing great.
So you're in Chicagoland and this is now we're in June.
And so what is it like in Chicago in June?
Is the weather turn nice?
Chicago in June has been very unpredictable this year.
want to say it's like spring is still kind of springing.
(00:21):
We've been getting thunderstorms.
We've been getting rain.
um It's being 80 and then it's being 60.
It's being all sorts of things.
So I guess that is predictable for Chicagoland, but normally it would be nicer by now.
Okay, all right.
So I've never actually experienced the windy city as everybody calls it so windy becauseI've never been there when it's windy, which I guess is during the winter time, right?
(00:45):
Yeah, I mean, it can just be windy at multiple times per year, but specifically the wintertime is awful when it's windy.
It hurts.
Really?
Because it's cold too?
Yeah, like it bites, it bites your skin.
Wow.
I spent a spring break in New York City one year and I will never forget how that felt.
(01:05):
The wind on my face, I had to cover every square centimeter of my face because the windwas so biting and cold.
I never experienced that before.
That's exactly what you said, biting.
It bites you.
It hurts.
All right.
Well, the listeners already have figured out that you're from Chicagoland and I guessChicagoland because you're from kind of what the suburbs, northern suburbs.
(01:29):
Yes, I say Chicagoland because I mean if I got in the car I can get to Chicago in lessthan an hour but I'm towards the northern suburbs by Wisconsin.
Okay, very good.
Dated a girl from Wisconsin once.
Wisconsin.
She talked like a youper.
And of course, my accents are always horrible.
I'm surprised anybody even still listens to the podcast with my accents, how bad they are.
(01:54):
But she had a very endearing accent.
And...
accents can be so charming.
Yes, that's where we're gonna leave it.
We're gonna leave it there.
All right, so you're a Chicagoland hairdresser who focuses on creative color.
Your Instagram is just lit up like a rainbow.
It's something to behold.
(02:15):
And you're an Olaplex Award winner.
And so we're gonna get into all of that.
Let's start with where you're from originally and how you got into the business in thefirst place.
So I am also originally from here.
I haven't lived a life other than in this little area.
I'm from a town called Lake Villa and I moved to a town called Round Lake, which is aboutfive minutes outside of Lake Villa.
(02:39):
um And I got into the hair industry because my mom herself is a hairstylist and so I was asalon baby.
I dreamed of sweeping hair when I was like six years old.
I'd be spilling the nail polishes, sweeping hair, cleaning up, getting braids.
So I went to America's Beauty Show in my childhood because her boss was a Farouk educatorwho could get model passes.
(03:05):
immediately, other than like wanting to be a dolphin or horse, I wanted to be ahairstylist.
And uh I did beauty school while I was in high school.
So I got a really massive head start.
I was licensed uh with not only my high school diploma, but with a cosmetology licensewhen I was 18 years old.
And I dove right in.
(03:26):
Okay, so was the cosmetology program part of your high school or you were just doublingup?
You're going to a normal high school and you're going to a normal kind of afternooncosmetology program separately.
It's like a little bit of both.
So our community college had like a vocational school situation where it was specificallyfor high school students, but you could come as an adult if you joined once you were in
(03:50):
high school.
So I would leave school about lunchtime and, you know, skip the extra classes that weren'tnecessary for me to graduate.
And I would head over to, it's called Tech Campus.
I would head over to Tech Campus and spend several hours there.
And the program takes two years because it is such like a half and half situation, likehalf time and high.
(04:10):
school half time in cosmetology, but yeah.
Got it.
So super focused, never in doubt.
I'm really curious.
If you didn't become a hairstylist, what would you be?
Interestingly enough, in the beginning of my career, if you asked me maybe 10 years ago, Iwould say I would be doing gore makeup on movie sets.
(04:34):
um But that was one of my first favorite things or maybe even in nail tech.
But at this point, if you're asking me right now, I feel like I would still be in somesort of industry around helping people.
I really love that aspect of my career.
I really love
also just advocating for like how things should be.
So I still feel like even if it's in the beauty industry, outside of the beauty industry,just wanting people to like take care of themselves and grow as human beings, that has
(05:00):
become a passion of mine as well.
Okay, so you're gonna love one of my last questions, but I'm not there yet.
One of my last, well, I'm not even gonna tell you what the last, the listeners, myregulars, they know what I'm talking about.
Okay, so you graduate from high school and beauty school, and did you go to the salon thatyour mom was working in?
(05:23):
I actually worked there while I was in high school.
That's when I was kind of like a shampoo girl living the dream of sweeping up hair.
um But then, salon came to my beauty school and I knew one of the girls that worked thereat the time and so I did an apprenticeship there and I worked there for seven years.
um And that's where I got a lot of different education through like Redken, they wereRedken Salons.
(05:44):
So it was really cool to witness like going to Redken Symposium every other year.
But now I'm in a suite for the last three years.
So that's where I'm at now.
good.
Very good.
Seven years in kind of a traditional commission situation.
And then and then you have your own studio now.
OK, we'll we'll get there.
So I'm curious back to the.
(06:07):
The kind of very focused on being a hairstylist, never in doubt kind of situation.
Were you?
I imagine that you had had your fingers in hair before you got to high school.
I'm sure you were doing friends in your bathroom or kitchen or whatever.
And did you find that you were good at it?
(06:29):
Or are there parts of it that you didn't like?
Or have you been in the world so long that it was just kind of second nature, at leastfelt that way?
You know, it didn't feel like second nature.
would say I was good at a lot of things beauty.
I would go to my friend's house as early as middle school and give them a full set ofawesome nails and I would curl their hair.
(06:50):
I was the go-to to braid someone's hair in gym class or curl a friend's hair at theirhouse or even be the one to toss some box dye on their hair.
um But if you put scissors in my hand...
I would have a full blown meltdown.
I'm left handed and we're not in a world for left handed people and it took me a long timeto feel comfortable cutting hair well after I was even licensed.
(07:13):
So that was something that I did not feel confident in but as far as just like putting myhands in hair, the confidence has been there.
This is an interesting topic that I don't think I've ever talked about in 400 plusepisodes.
Left-handed versus right-handed.
Now, you're left-handed.
Do you cut left-handed or right-handed?
(07:35):
Okay.
And so I know a lot of shears are designed, you know, left-handed and right-handed.
um When you say that the world isn't designed for lefties, is that because the educationalvideos and the instructions, et cetera, isn't mirrored for you?
I would say it's a little bit better now, but there's a lot that's not out there forlefties.
(08:00):
mean, including the way products are built, like stations, the salon I worked at waspretty much all right-handed stations, and I'd be like choking my client out with the cord
if I wanted to be able to blow dry their hair.
um
even to get scissors and shears.
Like if I went to the beauty show, most of the supply they had on hand was right handed.
And if I wanted to leave with shears that day, I probably couldn't.
(08:23):
And I would normally have to place an order for them.
And then, yeah, like with education as well, a lot of the educators are right handed.
And it's, mean, I don't expect them to know how to do it left handed per se, but a lefthanded, being left handed, a lot of things are upside down and backwards.
Like you just flip it and reverse it.
And so.
A lot of the things that were taught to me were very frustrating, literally dating back tokindergarten I would get scolded for how I used my scissors because I just feel there's
(08:49):
not a lot out there for it.
You know what?
You left-handers need an advocate.
I never, I don't hear enough activism in support of lefties.
Do you know what?
Okay, trivia question.
The Hair Game Podcast trivia question.
Here it goes.
What percentage of the human population of the world is left handed?
(09:11):
this but I don't think I'm gonna guess it right because it's like a small percentage.
Is it like 20 % or something like that in my clothes?
Well, I don't know the answer, so I'm chat GPTing it.
Okay, what?
What?
Hold on.
Percentage of the world population is left handed.
(09:36):
Let's see what she says.
Okay, this is interesting.
This is fewer than I would have expected.
What would you guess?
Okay, so my brain wanted to say 2 % but that feels outrageous so then I jumped to 20 whichI'm not sure how that is gonna sound.
would have been somewhere in the 20 to 25 neighborhood because it's not that rare.
(10:00):
It just seems like in my friend network, you know, it's not that rare.
However, the answer is 10%.
my god, yeah, see we're rare out here.
We are rare.
m
in 10.
uh And it says that the, it's estimated, estimated obviously because there's no centraldata, but between nine and 10 or nine and 11 % left-handed.
(10:27):
Okay, so there you go.
And so you've had to contend with this handicap, if you will, of being left-handed and youfigured it out.
Yes, and I still to this day honestly sometimes feel insecure when I cut hair.
Like sometimes when I educate other stylists, like I'm, I haven't ever taught a haircut inclass because I'm almost insecure to be told that I'm doing it wrong because everything I
(10:55):
do is so weird with left-handed, being left-handed.
When I write it's like,
hooked upside down, revealing my cat hair.
It's hooked upside down.
And so there are ways I cut hair.
I cannot tell you if it's a hot tip to prevent carpal tunnel.
can't tell you that, but I can tell you that it looks good when it's done.
But I just know it looks a lot different than everything I see on stage, everything I seein videos.
(11:20):
So I've always been a little insecure of it, but at the same time, I call that intuitivehair cutting.
I am just cutting the hair and it is looking good when I'm done.
There you go, and that's what matters.
It's the outcome that matters.
You have your own little way of doing it.
Whether it's because you're lefty or not, I'm not sure it matters so much.
Okay, so you've dealt with the adversity of being a lefty.
(11:42):
When did you decide that you were going to focus?
Well, let me ask you this question first.
Are you focused on color versus cutting at this point in your career?
would say yes, but at the same time, I find myself fall in and out of love with cutting.
I don't not take haircuts.
I still do haircuts every day behind the chair, but as far as new clients, I don't takenew haircutting clients only.
(12:07):
It's usually just new, vivid clientele because I have a pretty full book.
So I would say just with that information alone, I would lean more towards color, but Ido, when the haircuts are interesting and fun, you know, if someone wants a shag or some
sort of edgy haircut, I have way more fun doing it than like just
busting out lot of trims.
I would say that's something that kind of reignites my love for it, but I mostly uh prefercolor.
(12:31):
And that makes sense.
And so how far in your career did you go before you decided to focus on Vivids?
I would say I was kind of figuring out my niche for a long time and just kind of trying tolike please the people above me, please the people I work for just to get good numbers.
And I didn't really get to reflect on what is it that I enjoy doing until about 2020,which was a while into my career because I started in about 2014, 2015.
(13:02):
And I remember that because one of like my favorite vivid clients I started like goingbuck wild on in about 2019, 2020.
And that's when I kind of had this like, aha, that that's my favorite thing.
That's what I want to do more of.
And I think I want to honor what it is that makes me happy behind the chair so that I canshow up positively and show up in good spirits and deliver good results.
(13:26):
And I feel if you're not doing something that lights you up, then sometimes that can beaffected.
So I would say for
The last, what year is it?
2025?
I'd say for the last five years is me really honing in on what I love.
Okay, so if I did the math right, it took you about five years to decide to, well, it'stwo things.
(13:47):
It's one, deciding you wanna focus on something, in this case, vivid hair.
But the second part of that is that you have the luxury of focusing on something, right?
It's a bit of a luxury to say, I wanna just do vivid hair or I wanna just do haircuts,right?
Versus taking every client who walks in the door.
Right.
(14:07):
Right, I definitely agree that it's a luxury because there's kind of a fine line here.
I don't think people should be doing services that they don't feel good doing, but thatkind of has like a definition to it.
So in the beginning of my career when I had no clients, would I just turn down a roottouch up because I didn't feel like it?
Absolutely not.
But would I turn away a perm because I didn't know how to?
(14:31):
I would I would like to do that.
Like if I didn't know how to, if I couldn't deliver the result that someone's asking for,to me that's different.
But
Yeah, I think in the beginning there's a little less of a luxury depending on everyone'ssituations.
If you're just kind of doing it and growing quickly or financial reasons aren't anecessity for you, then sure, start picking and choosing from the beginning, I guess.
(14:52):
But at the same time, I'm really grateful for just like the principles that dabbling ineverything for a very long time has given me, there's a lot that I know and will forever
know, which means I have the choice to work.
these things out.
still have clients that are more of like the natural services, like I said, other haircutstoo, but um I'm very grateful because I do feel like it did teach me something to be able
(15:18):
to take all of those different services.
Yeah, sure.
All right, so what percentage are you these days?
uh Vivid colors versus other services.
I would really say probably like 70 30, like probably 70 % of my, like most of my work dayand work week is vivid color of some sort, whether it's just a little on the ends or fully
(15:41):
bleach root touch up wild stuff.
And then maybe like I said, a haircut or a root touch up in between here and there.
But yeah, for the most part, she's pretty full blown vivid.
So I can hear my listeners thinking, wait a second, this Jen Guido lady,
She could fill 75 % of her book with vivids working in Lake Villa, you know, north ofChicago little town.
(16:07):
you know, vivids have been around now for quite a while.
you know, mean, Pulp Riot didn't create them certainly, but maybe they made them slightlymore uh common, at least, yeah, maybe socialized.
uh
slightly more normal within our industry, you know, but there's been manic panic and otherthings going way back.
(16:30):
uh But we've been in this kind of vivid zone, or at least, you know, the trend has beenout there vividly, you know, for at least 10 years, right?
um And so I'm sure some people who tried vivid, some clients who tried vivids,
(16:52):
have decided not to keep them up and there's new clients coming into Vivids, how would yousay the market is, if you will?
In other words, the amount of clients, are there more people going Vivid or is it justkind of holding steady?
with your business, how do you feel like the market is?
(17:15):
I feel like the market is doing just fine for Vivids, but what's really interesting aboutit is some people's head spaces are kind of what like spoil the perception of this.
So throughout my career, mean, I remember, I remember being in like middle school andassociating someone with Vivid hair is just like a hot topic teen, like edgy, angsty teen.
And now it's just like everyone, like my clients are in their forties and fifties rockingrainbows and even in their sixties sometimes and yeah, twenties, thirties too.
(17:42):
But um now even
There was a point where my last boss told me that she wanted me to focus on natural colorsbecause she felt a recession was coming and that that would be more sustainable.
It's just I think it's more people's headspace than anything because Vivids can be lowmaintenance.
I have clients that come back every three months.
(18:03):
I air quoted low maintenance because there's still some rules that come with it, but Istill believe that there's a version of low maintenance Vivids for people.
So for me,
I don't see a decline or a struggle in the vivid industry.
think there's a price point, an amount of vivids and a look as far as maintenance goes forjust about everyone.
(18:24):
Like I said, it's a lot of people's beliefs that like kind of dirty it up and make it seemdifferent.
Mm-hmm.
Sure, sure, that makes sense.
So I'm looking at your Instagram and you have done a really good job of being searchableand discoverable for somebody in the Chicago area who wants rainbow hair because you put
(18:48):
it in your title really well, you put it everywhere.
And that's really, really good.
And I'm gonna take this moment for a PSA, public service announcement to the listeners.
If you don't have the city in which you work on your Instagram profile, please put it inthere.
Please stop the podcast and go put the city in which you work on your Instagram profile.
(19:14):
There's still so many people out there.
I see it on Instagram all the time.
within our community.
I see a hairdresser who comments on something or whatever.
I click on there and there's nothing.
It doesn't say Minneapolis.
It doesn't say Canarsie.
It says nothing.
And it's hard for people to find you.
Maybe they have full books of clients and that's great for them.
(19:36):
But if you want people to find you, please put the city where you work.
All right.
It makes you searchable.
All right.
So it looks like.
You're doing a great job of being searchable.
Is that how you find most of these vivid clients in this little town?
Interestingly enough, I think I get a little bit of it the...
(19:57):
New Age way and the old-fashioned way.
I have a lot of word-of-mouth clients, but I do also have a lot of I don't know anyonewho's your client, but I found you online so and I honestly this is not something that I
think is good per se but I'm not even on Google so they are finding me specificallythrough Instagram which uh says a lot about putting your freaking town right up in there
(20:19):
because Yes, I have I have become I don't know if this is for everyone, but it's for meI've become to the point
where I have a form for new clients.
It honestly just helps my energy level.
I'm just one person.
I get exhausted very easily.
being able to have someone like pop through everything that I would have asked them,because I'm sure every hairstylist relates, there's people in your DMs, how much?
(20:41):
And then they don't even answer when you respond.
um So for me, having this back and forth consultation that can last days or weeks is soexhausting, especially when the result isn't even getting the client.
So I have a form now and it teaches me a lot about people too when they fill out thisform.
but yeah, a lot of them are from this radius, which I also, you've brought up like thesmall town thing a couple times, I fully agree.
(21:06):
To me, I mean, everyone's got their own story, so I can't say that it's absolutelyimpossible that this is true, but I don't think the small town excuse is real.
I don't, because I live in...
near lots of low-income areas.
I'm not in like a glorious city and I'm about an hour from one and about an hour fromanother one and it's a lot of people's stories who are in small towns but yeah I find
(21:30):
people who are willing to drive and I find that small percentage of people locally thatare it's a big enough percent to fill my clientele but they come to me.
No excuses, I love it.
Let's get rid of all the excuses.
If Jen can do it in Lake Villa, I'm sorry, what's the other, you moved five minutes fromLake Villa to Lake Nona, around Lake.
(21:53):
Yeah, around Lake, you're in round Lake now.
If she can do it, you can do it too, listeners.
There you go, that's your pep talk for the day.
Okay, that's right.
All right, so you worked um in the traditional salon for seven years, then you moved to astudio.
How has that been?
The studio has been really great.
(22:14):
So I left the salon I was at for seven years just because I was really ready for somethingnew.
And in all honesty, my mental health was horrible because I think that's a lot of people'sstories when they work at commission salons.
hate to say it.
And I know there are great ones out there, but where I kind of felt like I was veryperformative and spread really, really thin and was not taught to take care of myself.
(22:38):
I didn't take breaks.
I worked long days.
I had three to four people at a time.
my clients literally described me as running around with my head cut off like is it achicken running around with your head cut off but I just
running around with their head cut off as bad.
is bad, yes, when you're running around with your head cut off.
it just, I think it took some time because when I started there, I was young, I mean, I'mstill young, but I was young, young.
(23:03):
And everyone there was doing it, everyone was there was swearing by it.
This is the way to make money.
And I believe that there are other ways to make money and to take care of yourself at thesame time.
And so when you start denying what your mind and body want, it starts to show up in otherways.
And it just, I wasn't well.
needed to make a change.
And so I left when my books were very full.
(23:27):
So luckily, I actually had so much coming to my suite that I could not like I stoppedtaking clients for a little bit.
But I was I was like, that's an income cap, Jen, what are you doing?
But at one point, I was like, there's no rate that I can raise my prices where I can clearthese clients out.
Like, that is an amazing thing.
But at the same time, it was really stressful in the beginning.
(23:48):
And now, I'm grateful to have openings here and there because if
I get sick or something happens or someone can reschedule.
It doesn't have to be for six months from now.
But the transition went really well.
It went really well.
I had a lot of fun doing it.
I found myself in a different way as like corny as that can sound.
I like found myself because I got to like connect and be balanced and not like in fight orflight all the time.
(24:15):
Okay, so a couple things I want to address there.
You use the word performative and um when you say that, do you mean that your time at thatsalon was really just measured by how much your, what your performance and productivity
was?
Like your numbers?
yes, it's all about being a team player and doing things to team player, but in the senseto where, you know, if that meant me being the front desk all day unpaid, that meant me
(24:44):
being the front desk all day unpaid or, um, yes.
Yes, and I mean, it wouldn't be all day, but it would be like in shifts, like Jen's got itfrom two to five and this person.
So, yes, but yes, it was all about the numbers.
I would have week or monthly performance.
uh meetings where I was really scared to even go into them because I would have someonelooking at me and say, why don't you think you hit your numbers this month?
(25:12):
And there was always something that I could be doing different and that was just reallyhard on the nervous system.
And I mean, I made a lot of money from it, but like at the same time at what cost?
Cause I was not doing okay.
Right.
Okay.
Well, that's amazing.
And this one of the great things about the industry is that you can keep, it's not likeyou have to leave the industry, right?
(25:33):
You can just change your working environment.
And,
And there's lots of them.
And there's lots of different working environments.
And of course, when it comes to studios, if you don't like one kind of studio, you canfind another kind of studio.
And then there's all sorts of different prices and styles and same with commission salons.
If you want to be in a commission salon, you find a different kind or a different group ofpeople or whatever.
(25:55):
And it's one of the great things about the industry.
uh Okay.
So when you transitioned from the commission salon to the studio, you had such
a high demand for your services that you needed to actually pare down a little bit, whichis an awesome situation to be in.
(26:16):
And you said that you couldn't raise your prices enough.
Did you raise your prices some?
Okay.
Awesome.
trying to throw some water on it because I had clients booking out for the whole year justto make sure they had appointments with me but there was no time for me to get sick or for
a life event to happen or for me to plan a vacation so I knew something wasn't workingthere too even though it was still a very wonderful thing to have that demand but had to
(26:43):
have the right balance to it.
Yes, mm-hmm.
have to manage the lack of demand and you have to manage an abundance or let's say toomuch demand.
And that can be stressful too.
And of course the listeners who are maybe new hairstylists or hairstylists who are losingsome of their clients are thinking, why are you kidding?
She's complaining about having too much demand.
(27:05):
Of course, you know, there's stresses that come.
Not all stresses come from lack of money.
uh
So you have a lot of people who want things from you and if you can't deliver those,especially if you're a people pleaser and so many of us in the industry are, then that can
be extremely stressful, even if it means an extra $1,000 in your bank account that week.
(27:32):
Okay, so you raised your price twice in the first year, which is great.
And about what percentage do you remember?
It's been three years.
or two years.
say what specific percentage because I also...
after that I changed to hourly as well so that helped with a lot of things.
So I want to say it could have been like maybe 10 % but everything went up at least fiveto ten dollars.
(27:55):
Some things went up 20 to 30 that first time but then I changed it to hourly because italso helped me kind of throw uh throw I don't want to say throw away but like throw water
on the emotional discounting or the grandfathered in pricing things.
So even changing to hourly I think the second year um one of my clients for example
(28:16):
Her pricing went up $90 and then some it stayed the same some it went down $5 and some itwent up 1020 But it put me on an even playing field
so many different playing fields.
You had so many different pricing structures for different people, like you were talkingabout the grandfathering and the emotional discounting or whatever.
And we kill ourselves by doing this, don't we?
(28:39):
Over time.
And it's like death by cuts because when Janice comes in and she might complain about shelost her job and so you're like, okay, I'll give you a...
25 % discount, right?
And then six months later, of course, Janice has gotten a new job, but she's still gettingthe 25 % discount and you because you forgot or you feel bad or something else and that's,
(29:05):
how do you go back on that?
Well, that's part of running a business professionally, right?
Is we have to create those boundaries and we have to um keep the boundaries in mind.
And thankfully now we have software that kind of helps us.
you know, keep some of this stuff organized.
um I wanted to ask you, well, let's see, are we done talking about your price increases?
(29:26):
uh No, not yet.
Okay, so before I get too far off track, so you raised your prices twice and what was thereaction across your clientele?
My clientele was like almost too cool with it and that's why I had to do it a second timebecause everyone was like, that's perfect.
Can you see my mom and her sister too?
(29:48):
And so it went so well that I, I don't know, I would be scared every time I'd raise myprices, but it went, it went, I hate to say it, but like I said, too well because it, you
didn't get like the natural fallout that normally comes with it at all.
well you didn't do it enough, right?
Yeah.
One of my favorite interviews on this topic was with Patricia Nicole, Painted Hair, who Ibelieve, Patricia, you doubled your prices.
(30:17):
Her story, it's, you can find it in our annals of episodes, this is probably two or threeyears ago, where she talked about how she doubled her prices.
And she was petrified, of course, that people were gonna leave, because the doubling ofprices, you increase them 100%.
Like, who's gonna stay?
Right?
If you double your prices.
(30:38):
Well, she's like everybody stays, you know, not everybody, but like, you know, only 10 %of people didn't stay.
And all of a sudden she's doubled her income overnight like that.
And she just, that was so eye-opening for her.
And um yeah, so at 10%, that's not going to do it.
(30:58):
And also you're talking about a time in which inflation across the economy
was about 10%, you know, two, three years ago.
Right now, you know, we're in the four or so, four to 5%, and of course it depends on whatyou're talking about.
If you're about groceries, or you're talking about my favorite thing to talk about, whichis, which is deodorant.
(31:20):
You know, my deodorant used to be $4 and now it's like 12.
It's like, what?
I fully understand that.
I just bought more deodorant the other day and I was like, are you kidding me?
It's $12 for a little deodorant.
Yes, it's legitimately $12.
Next podcast.
talk about it too much, but um that was the period of time when things were getting veryexpensive and this was post-COVID and the government had washed everyone in cash.
(31:48):
And so 10%, that's just keeping up.
That's not even a price increase.
That's just keeping up with the value of the US dollar.
That didn't mean that you're going to be able to buy more things.
That just meant that you're going to buy the same number of things, you know, with theincome that you're getting.
(32:09):
So it's always, call it, they call it, you know, real or inflation adjusted.
When you increase your prices, what matters most is the increase above inflation, becauseyou want to be making more money every year, right?
So without necessarily working more hours.
uh It's hard to add hours to your day.
(32:33):
So you want to refine your services down into what you like to do.
You want to get the right clients in your chair.
Those who can pay you what the demand for your time is worth and all that kind of stuff.
And then increase your prices at a level that is above inflation.
So you can start putting money in the bank.
(32:54):
So that when you get older, like me, I'm almost 50.
you're like 22, but when you get like, see I was close.
When you get my age, you have to start putting money away.
Well, you have to start putting money away in your twenties.
But when you get to my age, you have to have like a nest egg building so that you canretire.
(33:19):
Like your body breaks down or you decide to do something else maybe or whatever.
ah It's good to have money and so you need to start early on these things and so priceincreases are very important, especially these days.
I completely agree and that's why I went in with that second one that year because I waslike, actually no, sorry everyone.
(33:40):
And I guess there was no apologizing necessary because everyone was like, yes ma'am, I'lltake it.
Thank you.
you increase prices since then.
sure I do it at least once a year, so yes I have.
um Maybe two or three more times, whatever the math on that would be.
It's been two years since I've had hourly pricing, um which has been very helpful for mein so many ways.
(34:07):
Okay, so let's talk about that.
There are some people who hate the idea of hourly pricing because they're afraid thattheir clients are going to think that they're just gonna take longer and run up the bills,
so to speak.
Kind of like an attorney.
You have them help you with a traffic ticket and then they send you a bill and it sayslike 28 hours and you're like, there's no fucking way you spent 28 hours.
(34:32):
So how do you respond to that criticism?
Well, I first of all, I tell my clients that it's not like I'm starting a timer.
My hourly pricing is more just like, how long is it taking me to create this look?
Now, of course, I catch the trends.
So if I book someone for three hours and it trends on taking four, I have thatconversation and we book them for four hours.
(34:54):
I think.
It is a fair concern.
There's a lot of people in the industry that really do take their sweet, sweet, sweet,sweet time.
And I mean, I don't want to say there's anything wrong with that, but for hourly pricing,I could see that concern there.
But I'm pretty quick with what I do.
So I don't think any of my clients have ever even questioned that I would be taking mytime too much.
But I definitely have had someone like ask if I'm keeping track of the time and makingsure that I started counting it right from when she started and wait from when she ended.
(35:25):
And that's
exactly what I explained to her is it was like, that's not how I'm timing it.
If we, if I choose to talk to you for 20 minutes after I finish your hair, I'm notcharging you for that 20 minutes.
It's how long this look takes to create.
And sometimes that's an average, but overall it's just worked for me.
So that's a really great thing that you addressed ah because that does handle some of thecriticism.
(35:50):
When does the clock begin and when does the clock end?
And I know that very much in client service businesses, it can be quite draining when atthe end of a service, not just for hairdressers but other things as well, the client...
(36:12):
hangs around a little bit and can continue to talk about their kid in school for like anextra 20 minutes and you're standing there and you're like, okay, you know, I need to go.
And maybe you don't have a client waiting, but you might need to get home to dinner orsomething, right?
(36:32):
And so the three hours or the two, let's say it's a haircut, it's an hour and a half,could turn into two hours just because the client's talking so much.
uh And of course vice versa if the hairdresser is talking too much.
I know that this can happen and I see it.
My wife does this.
My wife is a highly social person.
(36:52):
So she will, you know, go to the nail salon and then she'll just keep talking to theperson after she's done.
And I'm like, okay, it's time for them.
They want to go back to work and you and I need to leave or whatever, you know.
uh It's a very interesting thing that's not really discussed a whole lot.
I like defining kind of what they're paying for that can relieve some of the anxietyaround the client, making sure that they're paying for what they're getting.
(37:21):
But you said nobody's really giving you a hard time about it and that's awesome.
Couple of other things I wanna talk about, bond builders.
The bond builder world has been around 10, 11 years now since Olaplex came out.
Do you use it?
And if you do, do you have a preferred?
brand.
(37:43):
have been using bond builders for a very long time.
I don't know if it's been my whole career.
I think maybe a couple years because I don't even know how old Olaplex is.
think it might have been doing here.
Okay, so I want to say it got brought in maybe a couple years into when I started doinghair into the salon I was working at.
So I started with Olaplex and that is when I entered their they only had this one contestand it was the Pro Artist Awards and I entered it and I won in my category.
(38:12):
uh So I
spot for Olaplex for that reason, but I also really appreciate the science behind Olaplex.
I feel that they, I mean they've patented their stuff and they are very sciencey and Iabsolutely adore Olaplex.
So that is always my absolute most trusted bond builder.
It's the one I use all the time when the stakes are high, when they're not high.
(38:34):
I use other ones, but...
I don't, I'm not someone who has studied the science very hard behind the other ones.
I just know my trust lays in Olaplex.
So when I use the other ones, I almost use them as a treat.
I know that's really weird to word it that way, but like as a treat because I do know thatthey make the hair feel good, but my trust lies in Olaplex just a little bit more when it
(38:59):
comes to like bond protection, not breaking the hair, things like that.
Awesome.
Booking apps, we talked about this a little bit.
uh Supportive services for hairdressers in their everyday uh business needs.
You talked about having a form, an intake form, a consultation form, which is such a goodidea.
(39:24):
We've talked about that so many times.
We have so many guests who do that now.
uh Do you do the form separate?
oh Well, first of all, do you use a booking app?
I do, I use Gloss
Gloss Genius, and have you used others or just gloss?
I started setting up my business on Square, but I got a little confused and I switched toGloss Genius before my first day.
(39:47):
And that's no hate to Square.
I just, think something about Gloss Genius.
It could even just be the way it looks.
It was a little bit more attractive to me and my landlord, his wife is also um someone whoworks in the suites and she knew Gloss Genius.
So I knew if I needed any help, I could talk to her.
So that's what steered me to Gloss, but I haven't really explored other ones.
(40:08):
Yeah.
And how do you do your intake forms?
How do you do your consultation forms?
I started with JotForm, but now I have a Google Form.
Okay, Google Docs.
Is it Google Docs?
Is that the same as Google Form?
I think they actually have like Google forms, um but when I recall the forms on my phone,sometimes they do show up through docs, so they might just be kind of like sisters.
(40:35):
Yeah.
And clients, have they had any problems with them?
Do you have any like best practices for any listeners who might want to start doing those?
I don't have any clients who have had any issues with them.
Sometimes I need to direct them to it when they message me first.
But I would say my advice for listeners is, and I don't want to come off sounding nasty,but expect that people won't read.
(41:01):
So I don't want to say can't read, but won't read.
And try to be very clear, very, very clear and include everything.
from your consultation to make it easier for you.
That's what I did.
Anything that I would ask someone prior to booking, other than just in the chairquestions, um it's all in that form because for me, I use that form to decide if we're a
(41:26):
good fit or not.
Not even just, this is the first step to booking with me and you'll definitely book withme after.
It's more of just almost like a screening and a consultation.
Clarity is extremely important.
You can't be too clear because confusion, if you don't put a lot of thought into thecreation of one of these things, it just breeds confusion and then you're gonna end up
(41:49):
spending more time on it than you even want.
Okay, really, really good advice.
Okay, so now we get to that question that I wanted to ask you in the beginning, which isthe wave your wand question.
If I handed you a wand,
and you're queen Jen hair magician.
(42:10):
I mean, you're already the Jen hair magician.
I said the head.
I said the Jen hair magician.
It's Jen the hair magician, which is your Instagram handle.
Here's your, you already have a wand.
So wave it and change anything about the industry at all.
What would it be?
oh
It would be about the hairstylists, not even the clients or like the know-how of thephysical, the tools, the work.
(42:37):
It's just more about the stylist.
If I could use my magic wand and tap right into it, it would be about the mindset andwellbeing of hairstylists.
I wish that more hairstylists were more self-assured and confident in their value and intheir livelihood because it's important that if you're doing this as your career that
you...
(42:57):
make the money that it takes for it to be a career and for you to live the life that youdeserve, but also that you take care of your vessel, your body, and what that comes with
as well.
And not just all the things that have been really normalized in the industry of just like,don't take care of yourself, hustle, hustle, hustle, who needs to eat?
I just, it's not for me.
And also the, to going hand in hand with the mental.
(43:21):
state of it is just all the fear.
Like always if you're so scared to raise your prices that means that part of you feelslike you're not good enough to raise your prices.
Probably.
There could be other things but like normally that fear has a story and I wish that Icould just use that magic wand to get rid of that story and for people to see their value
because we're doing this for other people but we're also doing this for ourselves.
(43:44):
Like we can't...
you need to be able to make it until you're 50, 60, 70, and to retire when your body wantsto or when you want to.
And that involves taking care of your mind and body.
Absolutely.
This is the analogy with uh the thing when you get on an airplane and they talk about theoxygen mask.
(44:05):
When you're going down and all the masks fall down and your kid is sitting next to you, doyou put on your kid's oxygen mask first or do you put on your oxygen mask first?
You put on yours because until you put on yours, you can't help somebody else.
You say, do this for other people, you know, or we do it for ourselves.
(44:28):
If we, if we, if we aren't taking care of ourselves, first and foremost, we can't do itfor other people.
So that has to be the priority.
Now, of course, people can take that way into an extreme and they go to the beach everyday.
Okay.
Well, that's not even being a professional, right?
But you absolutely have to make sure that your health and mental and physical is takencare of.
(44:51):
before you can help others and do your job really well.
Absolutely.
% that should be that should be a priority and seeing your value and wanting the best foryourself should be a priority and I totally understand that line because some people might
Yeah, well taking care of myself means I work one day a week and I can't pay my bills No,that's not what that means.
Yeah.
(45:12):
Yes Yeah, right,
Yes, but taking care of yourself and not worrying about pleasing others, because it is anindustry full of people pleasers, pleasing yourself first and listening to yourself, even
if someone, whether it be a boss that doesn't align with you or something someone elsesaid, it doesn't have to align with them, even if they don't agree.
(45:36):
sometimes you just, you know, it's best for yourself within reason, like we said, but youknow, it's best for yourself and we should take care of ourselves and listen to ourselves.
Amen.
All right, give me your best hair horror story.
my god, is this, oh I for sure do, but uh is this a hands and hair story or just anindustry working with clients story?
(46:02):
This could be either one.
yes, I cast a wide net with this question.
um It doesn't need to be uh a, you know, you didn't realize that there was so much uhmetal in the hair and so it roasted off.
It could be the person next to me accidentally slit the throat of their client and thehead went rolling down the aisle.
(46:27):
You know, it could be, you know, something like that.
Anything.
Okay, so have my tea.
Luckily, I don't have a horror story.
Where is wood for me to knock on?
I don't have a horror story of me doing anything terrible to someone's hair that wouldmake a horror story.
um Yes, thank you.
I've had my accidents that were not that bad, you know what I mean?
(46:48):
But my horror story that comes to mind is when I was, and I still am, but when I was in mywhat is best for Jen era that sometimes included letting people go and I've had to let go
of
maybe three or four clients in the 10 years that I've done hair, but one did make a horrorstory for me.
She really did.
(47:09):
I let go of her for the sake of my well-being.
There was a lot of reasons.
em How did I let go?
Well, I'm sorry, I shouldn't have interrupted.
that there you said there are a lot of reasons.
So why first maybe.
Okay, so first it started with when she first came to me, my gut instinct said no, but Isaid yes.
(47:31):
So that was my first is just like, sometimes that gut is instinct.
She has something to say.
I felt like she would spread me thin or just not be pleasable.
um And while I was able to please her,
She still was a level of maintenance, high maintenance, and just came with an energy thateventually deteriorated at me.
(47:53):
She kind of, she would, let's say I had to send her her pictures for her to Photoshop themand edit them and then send them back to me before I could post them.
Um, yes.
every message from her, even if it was just, Hey, can I reschedule was a full phone screenhad to swipe several, just a novel.
(48:14):
Everything was a novel from her.
me.
I know, I know.
so, um and she kind of, she got, she kind of got to the point where I think that shecreated the ego for herself, that she was my best client and that I should be.
doing absolutely everything for her that she has asked me to reschedule clients so thatshe could come in because the emergency was that it was her 35th birthday, which is
(48:38):
halfway to 70.
So she was a little bit of a diva.
So my icing on the cake was that she, this is so personal, but she started a personalargument with me at like one in the morning one night.
And she was just, she was going.
off and it was a misunderstanding and so I tried to let her know it was a misunderstandingand if you want to go there I and then Donovan can Donovan can cut this out if he wants to
(49:09):
but it was I shared a peaceful post about just it was a ceasefire post it was a ceasefirepost yes it was and um yep and it was uh nope uh
and she sent me message after message and I don't care if that airs but I didn't know ifyou wanted to let it go political but uh she sent she sent me message after message after
(49:35):
message and I told her she needed to stop.
I said you have to stop like my interest is just in
wanting people, innocent people to be okay, like chill out girl.
And she, she ripped me a new one.
And so I sat with it for a while and I eventually I texted her and because of how lengthyand wordy she always was, I sent her a really short text, which probably pissed her off
(49:58):
too.
But I just was like, thank you for everything.
But moving forward, I'm not the right stylist for you and I wish you all the best.
And she ripped me a new one once again.
I had to block her number because she told
me that, uh well first of all she said that she, benefited more from our relationship thanshe did.
(50:19):
uh A little, the ego was really coming out but yes she had me delete all of her picturesbecause she didn't want to be associated with my brand anymore.
So yeah, but I was like no problem girl.
uh But ah after, this is where the, this is where the horror story comes in.
It wasn't just the firing.
(50:39):
Well, it's been horrible so far, but there's more?
Okay.
So after I fired her, she made a fake phone number because I blocked her to remind me thatthere was two pictures I forgot to delete from four years ago and that she pretty much
threatened like almost like a legal action situation if I didn't remove them and comply.
(51:04):
yep and a- yep.
got way too much time on her hands.
Yes.
And remember, this was about politics, not about her hair.
She did the same thing every time and loved her hair.
But months after that, hadn't heard from her.
She filed a dispute to take the $500 from her last service months prior.
(51:24):
So that was a new can of worms that I had to deal with is like proving that I did theservice.
And then she started getting her hair done in the same suite building, the room parallelto mine.
So I would still have to see her come in.
It was insane.
She's a stalker.
Wow.
She's a stalker client.
(51:45):
She has made two more fake phone numbers since to let me know um To stop talking about herand I was like girl I would stop I've never texted her back But I would stop talking about
you if you stop trying to steal money from me first of all like the dispute and stuff Yes,I
by the way the 500 bucks did you were you able to keep it?
Good Okay Good
(52:09):
I was not talking about her regularly until the dispute came up months later.
So then I was triggered and talking about it again, because I was stressed.
But she sent me long messages, um two different ones, just like hashtag winning, hashtagstay triggered.
And I never would text her back.
And I know she wanted me to text her back so bad.
But yeah, she's made
(52:31):
She wants...
different fake phone numbers.
She's filed a dispute over it.
She comes to get her and she has her formulas and she chose the suite across from mine.
You know what I mean.
Like that's wild.
So to this day, um,
I hope that that is the craziest client experience I ever endured because that lastedmonths of her pretty much harassing me.
(52:57):
But because of the time she had on her hands, I didn't want to do like a restraining orderor anything because I felt like she would take it to court.
Like it was the best to just leave her alone.
um Even if she even like I kind of got in my head, like, should I have fired her the way Idid or should I have talked to her differently?
No, because her true colors would have shown anyways, no matter what happened.
(53:17):
um
You did it the...
Absolutely.
You did it the best way you could do it.
was insane.
It was insane.
You know what the reality is that some people are just crazy I think we know this anyonewho's been in the industry We have you know people in beauty school too who are yet to be
(53:41):
in the industry But I'm sure they know you don't have to be in the industry to know thatsome people in this world are crazy and they it's almost like they're put on this planet
to do it feels like
to drive us crazy.
Like, it feels personal.
But you, but I, you know, in my experience, it's not personal.
(54:01):
They're just nuts.
This is how they sometimes, somehow get value out of life is making people, you know,crazy.
And a lot of it has to do with their own sense of status.
uh Yes.
And it has to do with their own sense of status and their own sense of self-worth.
(54:21):
And, uh you know, they,
They get that by making other people jump, you know, and making other people worry and,you know, try to kowtow to what they want on the every day.
And these are people to avoid.
And so I, if I were you, I would be very grateful that you have her out of your life andout of your professional life too.
(54:43):
So, um yeah, just, uh I would say I am sorry that I even brought it up because, becausethat made you think about it again.
It is a really good story to bring up.
Like it is a story that if told people are like, what?
Like, so it's not triggering to tell the story, but with her level of wild, I'd be...
(55:04):
She could hear this, but that's fine.
She can make her fourth fake phone number and let me know.
But no, it's an entertaining story.
It is, but a wild one.
instructive.
That's why we talk about it.
Because it's good for other hairdressers to hear the bad things that happen, right?
Exactly, yeah, it's not all sunshine and rainbows.
(55:26):
I wish it was all rainbows, but sometimes...
sometimes...
Nope, not even in my studio!
All right, any last words for the community?
So my last word of advice is do what's best for you.
Follow your gut, take care of your mind, take care of your body.
We are in the service industry.
(55:47):
So like you said, we cannot put our other people's oxygen masks on before our own.
We got to take care of ourselves.
And that looks like a lot of different things in a lot of different ways.
And I think we're taught to do the exact opposite.
So let's take that back.
100%.
Love it.
Love it.
All right, Jen Guido, this has been a lot of fun.
Thank you so much.
(56:08):
been so much fun.
Thank you for having me.
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