May 28, 2025 • 37 mins
How can you be authentic in a way that strengthens your leadership and personal success? Kevin sits down with Jeanne Sparrow to chat about what authenticity truly means, why it matters for leaders, and how you can live it out with courage and confidence. Jeanne explains that being authentic isn't simply about being yourself; it's about knowing yourself deeply, having the bravery to express it, and using it to advance your work and connect with others meaningfully. Kevin and Jeanne explore the relationship between authenticity and confidence, the role of leaders in creating environments where team members feel safe to be themselves, and the transformational power of understanding your value and values.
Listen For
00:00 Introduction: What is authenticity?
02:02 Meet Jeanne Sparrow
03:38 Jeanne’s media career highlights
04:59 How Jeanne’s podcast led to her book
07:09 The “inside knowledge” of broadcasting
08:03 Why this is still a leadership book
08:40 Jeanne’s definition of authenticity
09:46 A powerful example of authenticity at work
12:46 Creating safety for authenticity
13:49 Why "fearless" authenticity matters
16:00 Jeanne’s junior high story
18:00 Her dad’s three truths about authenticity
20:08 The link between identity, value, and service
21:14 What does authenticity sound like?
23:08 Code-switching and being real
24:16 The foundation Live it Tell it Sell it
26:08 Authenticity and confidence
29:18 Clarity as the source of confidence
30:41 Authentic leaders give others permission
31:02 Why authenticity matters at the top
32:17 We don’t have time to be inauthentic
33:34 Jeanne on food, wine, and salsa dancing
33:39 What she’s reading Atomic Habits
35:05 Where to find Jeanne and her book
36:05 Kevin’s final question Now what?
36:45 Wrap-up and next week’s teaser
Jeanne's Story: Jeanne Sparrow is the author of Fearless Authenticity: Lead Better, Sell More, and Speak Sensationally. She is a multi-hyphenate communicator. Her extensive repertoire includes hosting her own daily morning TV talk show for seven years, co-hosting daily radio shows with media giants Steve Harvey, George Wallace, and Doug Banks, and interviewing hundreds of Hollywood heavyweights. She now hosts a weekly radio show on V103, the top-ranked iHeart Radio station in Chicago, and hosts the “Fearless Authenticity with Jeanne Sparrow” podcast on the iHeart Podcast Network. She appears regularly on top-rated Chicago TV stations as a fill-in host and guest. She’s a long-time voiceover artist, doing hundreds of commercials for national brands, and an actor in commercials and on broadcast television, including Fox’s “Empire,” and NBC’s “Chicago Med, and Magnum P.I.” Jeanne has spoken to and consulted for many nonprofit organizations and corporations including: AES, Women in Insurance Leadership, AT&T, Guaranteed Rate, Ravinia, iHeartRadio, and Governors State University. She’s a respected faculty member at Northwestern University, teaching at the graduate level in the School of Communication
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Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:08):
Authenticityis a word we throw around a lot,
and we say we want it from our leadersand we expect it from ourselves.
The problemis, it's hard to deliver something
when we aren't exactly sure what it is.
After this conversation
with a master communicator,you will have a better idea of what it is
(00:29):
and how it can be more usefulfor you and others.
Welcome to another episodeof the Remarkable Leadership Podcast,
where we are helping leadersgrow personally and professionally
to lead more effectivelyand make a bigger, positive
difference for their teams, organizationsand the world.
If you are listening to this podcast,you could join us in the future.
(00:50):
Live!
It's too late for this one,but in the future you could join us.
Live and you meansyou need to know when those are happening.
And the way to do
that is to join one of our online groups,either on Facebook or LinkedIn.
Those are two of the platformswe run the lives on, and those will both
tell you when, whereand how you can join us.
Just go to remarkablepodcast eCommerce, Facebook
(01:13):
or remarkable podcast.com/linkedin.
It doesn't matterwhich both of them will get you connected.
Let you know when we're live
so you can join usand get valuable information like today.
Earlier, today's episodewas brought to you by my latest book,
Flexible Leadership Navigate Uncertaintyand Lead with Confidence.
It's timeto realize that styles can get in our way,
(01:35):
and that following our strengthsmight not always be the best approach.
In a worldmore complex and uncertain than ever.
Leaders need a new perspectiveand a new set of tools to create
the great results their organizationsand team members want and need.
That's what flexible
leadership can do for youand the leaders in your organization.
Learn more and order your copy todayat remarkable podcast.com/flexible.
(02:00):
And now I'm going to bring in our guest.
And before I introduce herI'm going to tell you I've got to bring
something back up on top hereso I can see it.
There we go.
I have to tell youand you will know why in a minute
that of all the people I've interviewed,this is one that I'm a little bit
nervous about.
You'll understand why in a second.
JeanneSparrow is a multi-hyphenate communicator.
(02:22):
How about that phrase, everybody?
She's hosted radio shows with mediagiants like Steve Harvey,
George Wallace and Danny Bonaduce,and hosted her own
dailymorning TV talk show for seven years.
Currently, she hosts a
weekly radio show on V 103,the top rated iHeart
radio station in Chicago, and hoststhe Fearless Authenticity
(02:45):
with Jeanne Speropodcast on the iHeart Podcast Network.
She appears regularly on top rated ChicagoTV stations as a fill in host and guest.
She's a long time voiceover artist
doing hundreds of commercialsfor national brands as an actor,
in commercialsand on broadcast TV, like on Fox's Empire.
Chicago Med, Magnum, P.I..
(03:07):
Do you? Are you starting to see why?
I'm just a little bit intimidatedabout this particular episode.
She has spoken to and consulted with manynot for profit and public corporations,
and she teaches graduate level coursesat Northwestern's School of Communication.
She is the author of FearlessAuthenticity,
Lead Better,Sell More, and Speak Sensationally.
(03:28):
And that's probably largelywhat we're going to talk about today.
As the title of this session tells you.
Jane, welcome to my guest.
Thank you so much for having me.
It is an honor to be here.
I'm already feeling judged.
Everybodyokay, so, let's just dive right in.
So you've done all this stuff.
(03:49):
That tells us a little bit aboutyour journey, but tell us a little bit.
I mean, I know morebecause I've read the book and
and we've got a lot of ground to cover.
But tell us a little bit about
your journey and then sort ofhow it ends up with this book.
Well, fill in a couple of the blanksin, in the story.
And then why this book?
So as I started talkingat a very young age and I haven't set up
(04:11):
since, and that's pretty much the essenceof who I am and what I do.
And I've just found different waysto do it.
But I have learned that the abilityto take skills from one place
and apply them to anotheris a the reason why we stay successful.
And through my podcast,I have learned that
through all the people that I talk tothat are also in the book.
(04:34):
That's the reasonwhy I started the podcast to begin
with,to get more material for my book and to.
Inside Baseball everybody. Right.
And also to prove to myselfthat my theory was correct,
because what I learned along the wayin my career in broadcast that I found out
a lot of people outside of our worlddidn't know,
is that who we are is the giftthat we have to share with people.
(04:57):
And it's also where we find our success.
But we often believe that,
you know,we have to do things to deserve that.
And we often believe that the world istelling us that who we are is not enough.
And, you know,I struggle with that myself.
I mean, all of us have, you know,there's some article recently out
that imposter syndrome is like at 100%in, in C suites across the country
(05:19):
because people like try to figure outhow they got where they are.
And I think part of that is because we,we even though our parents told us
that we are enough,
that we will find our people,that we don't actually believe it,
and we have to go through some thingsto do that.
So, when I was politely invited to find
my success elsewhere after my last show,which, was was canceled.
(05:46):
I started looking.
Away for a second because I was looking
I know that I'm doing an upcoming showwith someone about the imposter syndrome.
Oh, good.
And I know thatwe've done a couple in the past,
and so we'll put all those in the shownotes.
I wasn't, but I promise you,I wasn't, ignoring you. So,
so when you were told you were released,see your next opportunity, go ahead.
(06:06):
And I was invite. Yes.
I was invited to find success elsewhere.
I started my own businessbecause I had been wanting to
and had never quitefigured out what it was going to be.
But one thing I did learnwhen I went back to school was
that there were things we knew insidebroadcasting
that other people didn't know about,how we connect, how we communicate.
And I realized when I was ingrad school that it was about
(06:32):
leadership,like it was about how we take the things
we know, transfer them to other peopleand and inspire them to act
and to act in a waythat gets us closer to our goals.
And so that's where the impetus,like somebody
had to convince me to write the book.
But that was where the impetus
was to create the systemthat is now the foundation of the book.
(06:55):
Because once I startedworking with people, I realized how much,
how many secretswe held inside broadcasting that I assumed
everybody knew, because everybody inmy industry knew them too well.
Because the people you were around see,we as leaders have that problem
all the time.
There's a whole bunch of stuffthat we know,
we assume everybody else knows,so we don't tell anybody.
(07:17):
And that is a serious problem.
You know, it's interesting, Gina,as I'm listening to you, I'm thinking.
And so a little inside baseball back interms of the show, you know,
and not just for you,but for everybody, you know, there
if you're a long time listener. Watcher,
viewer, I guess is a better word.
You you know that sometimes we have books
that you would absolutely say, well,that's a leadership book,
(07:41):
right?
And sometimes we have
we have guests where it's really very much
about the US as individualsand how that connects to us as leaders.
And then sometimes
and by the way, all of those kindsof books do connect to us as leaders,
because as we become a better leader,we become better human and vice versa.
(08:03):
But the third thing is, and that's whereI think this book falls, is this is a book
that while while the word lead isin the subtitle, it's not really a book,
just about certainly not capitalL leadership, positional leadership.
And and yet it's about a topicthat's incredibly,
incredibly importantto leaders, that being authenticity.
So you we're we're able to havethis conversation today.
(08:25):
I think that sort of hooksthose things all together.
And so for those of you that are listeningnow, you know a little bit about why
I picked, to have Jean on the showwhen they pitched us her book.
So, we should probably start here.
What's your definition of authenticity?
Oh, it's a good one.
As in thequestion that is in the question, I hope.
(08:46):
I hope that my answer is good authenticity
in in the way I see it in work,
whether that as a leaderor as a rising leader
or as somebody who, you know, coaches,mentors, both of those authentic beauty
is bringing all of your experiencesto your work
(09:08):
in a way that advances your work forward.
So I like to tell a storythat is in the book
about how who we are personally impacts
what we do, and actually addsto the experience of what
what our goals are trying to to get to.
(09:31):
And I had a, producer we wereit was back in the day, like,
I don't know when when autism was firstbeing discussed publicly as,
a spectrum disorder, like it was,you know, it had gone through
so many, levels of awareness. Right.
And the autism Autism Awareness Month,I believe,
was called something differentat that time.
(09:54):
But we were trying because we serveda lot of women as our viewers.
We wanted to do,
you know, a series about thatto raise awareness
and to help momswho were trying to figure out
what might be going onwith their children.
So we start brainstormingin one of our meetings, and we think, we
we think we're cooking, right?
We think we got all we arepopping on all eight cylinders,
(10:16):
and one of our producers goes,
wait,
my twokids just got diagnosed on the spectrum,
and everything we just talked aboutis irrelevant and not helpful.
And we were all like, hey,because we didn't know
her children were on the spectrum,and two,
(10:36):
because we didn't realizewe thought we were doing something good.
And we in that moment,I think we all realized that
we could haveeither embarrassed ourselves.
Offended.
That you wanted to have first and depth,and then the third piece is done
the exact oppositeof what we had intended to do.
And in those moments
(10:58):
when we can bring our personal experiencesto bear in our work,
then we can do what we came there to do.
We can amplify the things that we wantto amplify
and impact people the way that we want toand and reach the goals that we intended.
And if I'm not mistaken,
(11:20):
I think we ended up getting somesome award nominations for that series
after we had all done itand we could have fallen flat on our face.
But that person deciding
to be authentic at work.
And here's the thingshe didn't have to disclose
that her childrenwere on the spectrum to be able.
She could have just said,
(11:40):
I know something about this,and we're wrong, and here's why.
But but, but and and and hadshe taken that approach,
it might nothave had the impact on all of, you.
Know, it wouldn't have. But I mean.
It probably would have changed.
It probably would have changedyour series.
But maybe you. Could have had. Yeah.
Yeah, it still could have had an impact.
(12:01):
And that's and that's really what this isabout, what she did in that moment.
Because this wasn't even her.
You know,she wasn't the one even pitching the idea.
Right.
It was somebody else's idea.
But she made that idea better.
She amplifiedhow that whole thing turned out.
But here's the thing.
I want people to know, Kevin,what happens?
(12:23):
And and we make these decisions every day.
What happens when we sit in a meeting,
when we know better
and we sit silent
and a lot of timesthat choice is determined
by how the leader makes it possiblefor that
(12:43):
kind of conversation to happen.
Yeah. There's two sides.
Yes, 100%. Everybody.
Thank you for that, Gene.
And there's there's two parts to that.
There's, there's us thinking about thatwhen we're in that meeting.
There's us thinking about thatwhen we're in the meeting
and we're the leader, because thensometimes we may need to share that,
(13:04):
but we need to make sure
we're not going firstbecause we want to make sure
we're not overwhelmingwhat else might show up.
And the third thing I would sayis, are we making it safe
for people to make the conscious choicein that meeting?
So, you know, Gene,you asked it as in the first person for me
as an individual in that meeting.
And I'm just saying there's two
there's two examples there when I'm, whenI have the boss hat on and when I don't.
(13:28):
But the third thing is so important,like if are we can we make it safe
for people to do that?
You. The book is titledFearless Authenticity,
and this exampleI think gets at that a little bit.
Yeah.
I'd like you to say a little bit moreabout why fearless?
(13:49):
Because it takes courage to stand
where you are and say who you are
or or even more importantly,show who you are
when we are pressed, like,
think about when you were a kid, rightyour first day.
That was a long time ago.
Same same star, same.
(14:12):
Back when we were in school, it was calledjunior high, not middle school.
You you are so correct about that.
I remember when I was in eighth grade,
it switched to middle schooland I was like, what's a middle school?
What is a middle school?
But he was freaking outabout going to high school as I was
at. Well, you know what?
Can I tell you something I wasn'tand I was I got you.
(14:34):
No, no, no, let me check.
Listen, I'm very easy to get off track,but I will get us back
to where we were going.
So I actually lived in a town where
it was a fairly small town in southwestLouisiana called New Iberia.
It's where they make the Tabasco sauce.I always get.
Asked. Yes.
So we had a freshman high school
because the way that the schoolswere integrated way back in the day,
(14:58):
the number of students that were there,it just couldn't at that time.
Right? Yeah, exactly.
I didn't have that. I hadI got dropped right in.
And of course it was a small school, butstill I'm still a little bit freaked out.
I'm just being honest.
I don't think I've ever said that outloud before.
Well, I didn't have.
The reason why I wasn't freaked out
is because we had a schoolthat was freshmen only.
So by the time you got,you got to build enough confidence
(15:23):
before you went to the big high school,ten through 12.
And so for me, it was a little bit easier.
And that's the reasonwhy I see junior high as the big like
I got to put on my big girl pantsnow like I'm at the I,
you know, and and here's the other thing.
I went from Catholic schoolto public school
and so I went from a much smaller
(15:46):
schooling situation into a largerI mean, it wasn't huge,
but it was large to me where I, you know,
had to make some new friends and,and do some things.
But I think for everybody,junior high is kind of where you start to.
So our middle school was where you startto show your personality,
you start you because you know yourselfbetter at that point.
(16:08):
But it is also.
You think you do you think you did.
But you know yourself better than you didwhen you were five, right?
But the thing is, is you also care more
about what other people thinkbecause you are unsure.
You are looking around for cuesto see if what you're feeling
is normal, to see if you are normal.
(16:28):
And that is when we really startto feel inside outside groups.
I think it's happening younger now,but I think all of us can identify
with that feeling of fear,
you know, or at least hesitation of whowe are, where we fit in
and what we are willing to doto feel like we belong.
(16:49):
And it takes courageand being fearless to say, you know what?
This is who I am,and starting new jobs or new positions
brings backthose same feelings at some degree.
That's exactlywhat I was going to say. Like.
So again,if you're moving into a new role,
you've probably experienced that.
(17:09):
But as a leader,when you bring people into your team,
you aren't necessarily thinkingabout the fact that that's going on
for them, because everything,it's all it's all known to you.
It's not known to them.I think it's a really good point.
I think we can have an entire show
just about that transitionthat we all had as kids.
Even though my experiencewas quite different than yours.
(17:30):
There was no freshman center.
There was it wasthere was not even any new people.
We went to the high school.
My freak out was about the sophomores,juniors and and supposedly
the seniors like thisis going to be different and all that.
Like, we could have a whole show.
They're tying it to this bigger point,but maybe another day.
I want to get to do some more stuffin the book.
(17:52):
Early in the book,
you talk about something that your dadtaught you about authenticity.
He said three things.
What were those three things?
Oh, I don't remember.
Hold. Up. I'm here. The right below.
Here they are.
Oh, that those three things.
Okay, those three things.Because let me tell you something, Kevin.
I told youit wasn't going to be Mike Wallace.
I wasn't trying to trip you up.
(18:12):
My dad, he told me a lot of things.
Well. Fair.
My dad. He told me a lot of things.
I have a whole series on social mediaabout the stuff that my father has told
me. Okay, so, yes, three things
you need to have to be authentic.
To be fair,it was first, you have to be brave.
That's where the courage comesin, right? You got to take that step.
(18:35):
Then you have to
be free enoughto be able to express yourself, right.
It can't just be fearlessand standing on business silently, right?
You have to actually be freeenough to express,
not only feel it,but express it to other people.
(18:55):
And then finally, you just need to be you.
But you have to know who you are.
And exactly.
And I think that's where we'll spendthe rest of our time. Right.
So like it's really important.
I mean, it's easy to say, be brave,be free, be you.
It's a good look.
Say it though.
Admit it. It is. It's good.
(19:16):
It's really good.
But at that.
But in the open, I said, you know,sometimes we all talk about this
like we ought to be authentic, and yet wedon't always know what that really means.
And it starts with our identity. Right.
And that's what you're talking aboutnow is how does this all connect.
And and so our identity
and our authenticity. Right.
(19:39):
So do you have it. Go ahead.
I will even drill it downfurther from there.
It's about your value and your values,
right.
The valueyou bring, what you have to offer.
Because you know this.
If I learned nothing from my parents,both of them
(20:00):
were always of service,
always offering something that they had.
My mother was a musician.She played in the church choir.
She taught chorus.
She, you know, she shared her giftsand love for music with everyone.
My dad was always.
He was always driving miss Daisy.
(20:21):
Always.
Like there was always some little old ladyin the back seat taking them to go,
to go, as we used to say in Louisiana,go make groceries,
to go to church, to go to mass, wherever.
My daddy was that person.
He was always the one.
Who was your at your home accentjust came out in that moment.
I know
(20:41):
I've been
in Chicagoso long, but sometimes Louisiana
will come flying out of my mouthbecause as a broadcaster, you can't.
We have a standard accent. Right?
And so that's a really interestingpoint too. Right.
So being and that's I think rightthere is one of the things that people
get stuck with.
(21:02):
Right, as a leader,not that's not stuck with but
stuck around like
they may besomeone listening, may be thinking,
well, is is is Jean really authentic?
If she's if she's had to change the wayshe talks.
Because how we talk is who we are.
So like just take that as because I thinkthat's just a kernel of an example
of how authentic might not alwaysmean exactly what we think it means.
(21:26):
So I believe we all livein a range of authenticity,
and it looks different for differentpeople who I am and how I speak.
And and it's interesting
because this conversation about codeswitching has come up quite a bit.
And for and for people who don't know,code switching, at least for black people,
is speaking a certain wayin in your inner group.
(21:47):
Then you do say in a groupthat is mixed right.
And that I equate that to
you might talk in a certain waywhen you're with your guy friends
at the bar watching footballor basketball or whatever
your sport is, and speakvery differently to your wife,
to your daughter, or to your grandmother,let's take it back.
(22:10):
You know, you're going to like.
And when I'm talking to a girlfriend.
It's like, let's just speak.
When we're talking
in one place to peers, we're going to talkvery differently to our elders.
But are you a different person?
Absolutely not.
In fact, your grandmotherprobably knows about the colorful language
you use when you're in the in.
If you're assuming that I use colorfullanguage, Gina, let's be careful here.
(22:34):
I'm speaking to the audience.
Oh, okay. Fair.
No, I'm not. Making any assumptions.
There is somebody out therewho uses color for language
that his grandmother may be aware of,but that he would never say
to his grandmother.
I actually a conversation about that wordusing the word damn
with my grandmother once, and I said,you can say you can say a different word.
And it's the thought underneathit is exactly the same shoes.
(22:56):
It doesn't matter.I'm still not going to say it,
anyway,but I know I think that's a great example.
I mean, I'mglad that we just took that little detour,
because I think that'sa perfect example that
that that doesn't change who we are.
And and you are,
I'm confident,based on our short conversation
and having read your book, and we'retalking with Jean Spero about her
(23:17):
new book, fearless Authenticity,I'm confident in saying this, that
you are supremely proud of your kid hood,
and supremely comfortable
letting that South Louisiana accentcome back out.
And that that doesn't mean that.
And that's the other piece.
We're sorry. No. Go ahead.
(23:38):
I was like everybody else who doesn'tunderstand a South Louisiana accent, I,
I had to interpret from my
my grandmother'sfirst language was Creole French.
So we had to, you know,put somebody culture someplace else.
And you hear all the sighs,the babies and the blah, blah, blah.
Honey, they're not hearing it. Exactly.
So I'm sorry I interrupted.
No, no,that's okay. We have to we have to get at,
(24:00):
the foundation in the book.
You mentioned it earlier,and and I'm a little bit careful.
I want to be a little bitcareful on our time, but I want
you really to get to this foundationagain, a three part phrase,
and I'll just put it on the screen forthose watching live it, tell it, sell it.
Because again, I don't know thata lot of people would initially
(24:21):
put the word sell it with authenticity.
So can you just unpack this a little bit?
Not too much,
because everyone needs to gomake sure they go buy a copy of the book.
But when you say live it,tell it, sell it.
What are you talking about?
Those are my foundations for success.
And it's how I see the wayall of our interactions as people go.
Because here's that. Here'sthe bottom line, Kevin.
(24:42):
Everything we do is in that,that we are trying to produce at work,
to reach goals has to involve working withother people, whether that is an active,
sales effort
to external stakeholders, let's call them,
or whether that's internally organizingto get some process going.
(25:04):
Right.
Thosethese three things need to happen live.
It is about you and understandinghow you affect other people
and and where you areand what you have to bring to the table.
It is about the way you connectwith other people.
It's the stories that link us together,the stories we tell about what
we're doing, how we're going to do it,and where we're going and then sell it
(25:25):
is this idea that a lot of peoplehave had resistance to that.
I don't understandbecause we are always selling something.
As I like to say, even if it's what you'regoing to cook for dinner.
And anybody who has teenage
children knows this intimately.
Well, if you want them to eat it anyway.
So, so,
(25:47):
so, yes.
So you'll get a lot more about the idea.
And we've been talking about live itand obviously because if you
when you have your copy of the book,you're, you're hearing from a
experienced communicatorin a variety of media,
and you're going to get a lot of ideasaround the,
tell it and the communication piece andthen the sell a piece you just mentioned.
(26:10):
I want to
I want to keep us on authenticityas we start to wrap up.
And we bumped up against somethinga couple of times.
But I want to bring this word outbecause it's a really important word
as it relates to authenticity.And that's confidence.
I mean, you've talked about
we've talked about being fearless,and we talked about being willing.
But if we want to be more authentic
(26:34):
in the ways that we've talked about,confidence has to play a role.
I mean, you've used the wordfearless, you've used the word brave.
But we don't always think about thosewords in the same way as we do confidence.
So talk to us a minute about howyou connect confidence in authenticity.
I believe confidence comes throughauthenticity, true
authenticityin understanding what your worth is.
(26:56):
So when you know what lane
you drive in, you can drive as fastand as long as you'd like
because you're not trying to switch lanes,you're not trying to get off the road
and get back on.
And granite to understand what that is,sometimes you do have to switch lanes,
get off and get back on the highway.
But I believe when you explore
(27:17):
what value you have to offer other people,what thing you have to be of service
in, you can lean into thatin a way that gives you confidence.
When you know what you bring to the table,you start to walk differently.
You start to talk differently.
You start to understandwhere you fit in relationship
(27:38):
to other people,and you're no longer in competition.
A lot of people get false confidence,and sometimes that can elevate
to arrogancewhen they compare right with other people.
I'm better than so-and-so at this.
The problem with that is,as my mama used to tell me,
there will always be somebody smarter,somebody prettier, somebody faster,
(27:59):
somebodyyou know, somebody better than you.
Always.
There will always be somebody like that.
So if you only get your confidence
from the waythat you are comparing yourself
to others, eventually that confidenceis going to get knocked down because it's
not based on anything solid or real.
And if you do find your confidence
(28:21):
through what is inside of you,it is far more steady.
It is far more durable,it is far more sustainable.
And that's how I seeconfidence and authenticity.
And did I lose you, Kevin?
No, you didn't lose me.I'm still not with you.
I just know that the camera's not working.
Okay. That's all right.
Has has frozen.
So, it's a lovely place that it frozefor all of you that are watching,
(28:44):
I apologize.
I for those of you listening,it doesn't matter.
The thing that I loveabout what you just said,
Gene, is this idea that.
If we're we're sayingwe're saying we want to be fearless.
We say, like,how to be confident, to be fearless.
And yet, the starting point hereis clarity about self.
(29:05):
And when we have the clarity,the confidence will be there.
And so it's not like it's not likewe have to muster the confidence.
We have to let let the clarity show theconfidence through, if that makes sense.
100%.
I often tell people, that I'm trainingand working with that
(29:27):
we end up sometimes doubting ourselves.
And especially it happens at midlife,
where you let you look up one dayand you go, how did I get here?
And then we get on this whole tangent of,I gotta find purpose in my work
and this and that and other.
The reality is, is thatif you are stepping into who you are
and you understand your valueand what you have to offer,
(29:49):
your purpose will find you.
You just keep doing what you do well,what you know that you are here
to offer other people, and the valuethat you can transfer from yourself
to somebody else in service of some,you know, goal that you have together.
Hopefully a higher, greater good.
But even if it's just to get throughthe end of the day, like literally
(30:11):
if you have that, then you canyou can sustain the whole journey
and it will all find you.
I think a lot of times we chase things,
not realizing that things run awaywhen we chase them.
And the same thing is true of purposeand of confidence.
But when we find that kernel insideourselves, then we are able to do that.
(30:34):
And here's the most beautiful partabout it, Kevin, is that when we do that,
we give other people permissionand encouragement to do the same.
To do the same 100%.
So we had a little technical difficultywhen we when we were doing this live.
So hopefully this isn't too
out of sorts for all of youthat are listening to the podcast later.
But this is for you because we wantedto give you, all of the wisdom of Jeannie.
(30:58):
So, so, so, Jean, here's the question.
What didn'tI ask that you wish I would have?
It's not so much a question,
but it's a point that you touched onthat I wanted to expand on.
We talk about fearless authenticity,and I think a lot of people
look at the bookfor individual development, which it is.
It is absolutely about who you are andhow you contribute to the greater whole.
(31:20):
But one of the thingsI really want to bring forth is something
I've been seeing in my work as a trainerand as a speaker, and in
just having conversations with people,is that the higher we go up as leaders,
the lesswe are being authentic across the board.
Even if we are authenticand we think about how we impact people up
and down our flow as as a leader,we forget about how that happens across.
(31:45):
And a lot of times when you have peopleof similar power structure,
in the same room, there's a
lot of masks onbecause we have to show our power.
Right.
And the problem is,is that in a time when innovation
is of immediate necessitybecause of the speed
at which our world is progressingand changing every day,
(32:07):
we do not have the time to not be fearlessand to not be authentic with each other,
because that is how we willsolve problems, solve them quickly
and reach the goalsthat we are reaching for.
And maybe even tackle some thingsthat we weren't expecting to.
I love that.
So a couple of things before we go
(32:27):
that are not related to the book,
but are more just about you,I want to know, Jean, what you do for fun.
Oh, okay.
So I love my work so much.
It is hard to separate the two.
And that is an unfair answer.
I know that one's been listening to this,has already figured that out.
I want more than that.
(32:48):
So what do I do for fun?
Can I tell you something I love good food,good wine, and good conversation.
When I tell you that I do what I do
for a livingbecause I would do it for free.
Like that's the secretthat I don't tell anybody.
But my favorite thing is to sit aroundwith my friends and just talk about what's
(33:10):
happening in their lives, in the world,like if I can have a good conversation.
Kevin, I am happy. I also like to dance.
I usedto be a pretty doggone good salsa dancer,
and I need to get back in shape for that,
because let me tell you some,it takes some serious.
It takes some serious lung powerto be a good salsa dancer.
(33:30):
Well,the good news is you did do this for free.
So, hopefully it was a good conversation.
It absolutely.
Was. What are you.
What are you reading these days?
So I am reading.
I am trying to finish Atomic Habits.
I know I'm so late on it, but here'sthe thing that's really interesting.
Like, I'm a systems person,but it's very difficult for me to,
(33:55):
to create them, right?
I like I, I see things in systems,
but for myself, in my personal life,it can get a little chaotic.
Because as you've noticed,when you did my, bio intro,
I do a lot of different thingsbecause that's how my brain works.
But I see them all
as the same thing, like other peoplesee them as a bunch of different jobs.
(34:15):
I see them all on a continuum,so I need to get better.
As a as an entrepreneur with how,
structured and ritual ritual
that I am around, howI operate my business and conduct myself.
And I feel like I AtomicHabits has the answer for me,
(34:37):
but I haven't finished it yet.
There's a in my in my book.
I talk in my latest book,I talk a little bit about the difference
between and and James Cleardoes that in Atomic Habits.
Do the difference between habitsand rituals?
I think rituals are really important forus, you know, which go beyond routines.
And I think it's a really important piece.I'm glad that you brought that up.
(34:58):
So we've talked about somebody else'sbook.
Where can people learnmore about your work?
Where can they get your book?
Where do you want to point peoplebefore we finish up.
Fearless authenticity.com/book.
It is where all of the links tothe book are listed,
including the audio book,which just came out a couple of weeks ago.
(35:18):
So I hope that everybody will go there.
And it's also how you connect with meon social media.
I'm fairly active on Instagram,Facebook, LinkedIn,
and sometimes the platformformerly known as Twitter.
I can't let it go.
You can find me all those places
and interact, and I talk about thingsthat are in the book.
(35:41):
And of course with my podcast and the linkto that is on the website as well.
Perfect.
Jean Spero, before we go, everybodyhave a question I want to ask you.
It's the questionif you've been here before,
you know, I'm going to askbecause I ask it every single week.
It's a routine.
It's a ritual.
I love it.
And the question is, now what?
So you got the chance to hear from Jeanand hopefully hear that
(36:04):
we enjoy each other's conversateand the conversation and the ideas.
And so maybe it was entertaining. Fine.
That's not why you came. Really.
You came here to leave.
Figuring out a little bit
more about being authentic,or maybe figuring out how you connect.
Authenticity with your role as a leaderwhen you have a leader head on.
Or maybe you're
just thinking about this as a humanand not necessarily only from your leader
(36:26):
role.
The point is, until you ask an answerthe question, now what?
What am I going to do with this?
It will just bean entertaining conversation.
And so my challenge toyou is to think back,
what did you get from this conversation?
What action will you take as a result?
And when you do that, this will have beenmuch more valuable for you.
(36:47):
Jean, thank you so much for being hereand for putting up
with our technical challengesbefore we got to the end.
It was such a pleasureto spend time with you.
It was lovely to spend timewith you, technical issues,
and it reminded me of my work daysand television.
Trust me, trust me.
So everybody, we'll be back next.
If you enjoyed this,make sure you're liking
and subscribing and referringfrom whatever platform you're watching
(37:11):
or listening this on right?
And then make sure you're back next weekfor another episode of Remarkable
The Remarkable LeadershipPodcast. We'll see you then.
Authenticityis a word we throw around a lot,
and we say we want it from our leadersand we expect it from ourselves.
The problemis, it's hard to deliver something
when we aren't exactly sure what it is.
After this conversation
with a master communicator,you will have a better idea of what it is
(00:29):
and how it can be more usefulfor you and others.
Welcome to another episodeof the Remarkable Leadership Podcast,
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(00:50):
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It's too late for this one,but in the future you could join us.
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Just go to remarkablepodcast eCommerce, Facebook
(01:13):
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Let you know when we're live
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Earlier, today's episodewas brought to you by my latest book,
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It's timeto realize that styles can get in our way,
(01:35):
and that following our strengthsmight not always be the best approach.
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That's what flexible
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Learn more and order your copy todayat remarkable podcast.com/flexible.
(02:00):
And now I'm going to bring in our guest.
And before I introduce herI'm going to tell you I've got to bring
something back up on top hereso I can see it.
There we go.
I have to tell youand you will know why in a minute
that of all the people I've interviewed,this is one that I'm a little bit
nervous about.
You'll understand why in a second.
JeanneSparrow is a multi-hyphenate communicator.
(02:22):
How about that phrase, everybody?
She's hosted radio shows with mediagiants like Steve Harvey,
George Wallace and Danny Bonaduce,and hosted her own
dailymorning TV talk show for seven years.
Currently, she hosts a
weekly radio show on V 103,the top rated iHeart
radio station in Chicago, and hoststhe Fearless Authenticity
(02:45):
with Jeanne Speropodcast on the iHeart Podcast Network.
She appears regularly on top rated ChicagoTV stations as a fill in host and guest.
She's a long time voiceover artist
doing hundreds of commercialsfor national brands as an actor,
in commercialsand on broadcast TV, like on Fox's Empire.
Chicago Med, Magnum, P.I..
(03:07):
Do you? Are you starting to see why?
I'm just a little bit intimidatedabout this particular episode.
She has spoken to and consulted with manynot for profit and public corporations,
and she teaches graduate level coursesat Northwestern's School of Communication.
She is the author of FearlessAuthenticity,
Lead Better,Sell More, and Speak Sensationally.
(03:28):
And that's probably largelywhat we're going to talk about today.
As the title of this session tells you.
Jane, welcome to my guest.
Thank you so much for having me.
It is an honor to be here.
I'm already feeling judged.
Everybodyokay, so, let's just dive right in.
So you've done all this stuff.
(03:49):
That tells us a little bit aboutyour journey, but tell us a little bit.
I mean, I know morebecause I've read the book and
and we've got a lot of ground to cover.
But tell us a little bit about
your journey and then sort ofhow it ends up with this book.
Well, fill in a couple of the blanksin, in the story.
And then why this book?
So as I started talkingat a very young age and I haven't set up
(04:11):
since, and that's pretty much the essenceof who I am and what I do.
And I've just found different waysto do it.
But I have learned that the abilityto take skills from one place
and apply them to anotheris a the reason why we stay successful.
And through my podcast,I have learned that
through all the people that I talk tothat are also in the book.
(04:34):
That's the reasonwhy I started the podcast to begin
with,to get more material for my book and to.
Inside Baseball everybody. Right.
And also to prove to myselfthat my theory was correct,
because what I learned along the wayin my career in broadcast that I found out
a lot of people outside of our worlddidn't know,
is that who we are is the giftthat we have to share with people.
(04:57):
And it's also where we find our success.
But we often believe that,
you know,we have to do things to deserve that.
And we often believe that the world istelling us that who we are is not enough.
And, you know,I struggle with that myself.
I mean, all of us have, you know,there's some article recently out
that imposter syndrome is like at 100%in, in C suites across the country
(05:19):
because people like try to figure outhow they got where they are.
And I think part of that is because we,we even though our parents told us
that we are enough,
that we will find our people,that we don't actually believe it,
and we have to go through some thingsto do that.
So, when I was politely invited to find
my success elsewhere after my last show,which, was was canceled.
(05:46):
I started looking.
Away for a second because I was looking
I know that I'm doing an upcoming showwith someone about the imposter syndrome.
Oh, good.
And I know thatwe've done a couple in the past,
and so we'll put all those in the shownotes.
I wasn't, but I promise you,I wasn't, ignoring you. So,
so when you were told you were released,see your next opportunity, go ahead.
(06:06):
And I was invite. Yes.
I was invited to find success elsewhere.
I started my own businessbecause I had been wanting to
and had never quitefigured out what it was going to be.
But one thing I did learnwhen I went back to school was
that there were things we knew insidebroadcasting
that other people didn't know about,how we connect, how we communicate.
And I realized when I was ingrad school that it was about
(06:32):
leadership,like it was about how we take the things
we know, transfer them to other peopleand and inspire them to act
and to act in a waythat gets us closer to our goals.
And so that's where the impetus,like somebody
had to convince me to write the book.
But that was where the impetus
was to create the systemthat is now the foundation of the book.
(06:55):
Because once I startedworking with people, I realized how much,
how many secretswe held inside broadcasting that I assumed
everybody knew, because everybody inmy industry knew them too well.
Because the people you were around see,we as leaders have that problem
all the time.
There's a whole bunch of stuffthat we know,
we assume everybody else knows,so we don't tell anybody.
(07:17):
And that is a serious problem.
You know, it's interesting, Gina,as I'm listening to you, I'm thinking.
And so a little inside baseball back interms of the show, you know,
and not just for you,but for everybody, you know, there
if you're a long time listener. Watcher,
viewer, I guess is a better word.
You you know that sometimes we have books
that you would absolutely say, well,that's a leadership book,
(07:41):
right?
And sometimes we have
we have guests where it's really very much
about the US as individualsand how that connects to us as leaders.
And then sometimes
and by the way, all of those kindsof books do connect to us as leaders,
because as we become a better leader,we become better human and vice versa.
(08:03):
But the third thing is, and that's whereI think this book falls, is this is a book
that while while the word lead isin the subtitle, it's not really a book,
just about certainly not capitalL leadership, positional leadership.
And and yet it's about a topicthat's incredibly,
incredibly importantto leaders, that being authenticity.
So you we're we're able to havethis conversation today.
(08:25):
I think that sort of hooksthose things all together.
And so for those of you that are listeningnow, you know a little bit about why
I picked, to have Jean on the showwhen they pitched us her book.
So, we should probably start here.
What's your definition of authenticity?
Oh, it's a good one.
As in thequestion that is in the question, I hope.
(08:46):
I hope that my answer is good authenticity
in in the way I see it in work,
whether that as a leaderor as a rising leader
or as somebody who, you know, coaches,mentors, both of those authentic beauty
is bringing all of your experiencesto your work
(09:08):
in a way that advances your work forward.
So I like to tell a storythat is in the book
about how who we are personally impacts
what we do, and actually addsto the experience of what
what our goals are trying to to get to.
(09:31):
And I had a, producer we wereit was back in the day, like,
I don't know when when autism was firstbeing discussed publicly as,
a spectrum disorder, like it was,you know, it had gone through
so many, levels of awareness. Right.
And the autism Autism Awareness Month,I believe,
was called something differentat that time.
(09:54):
But we were trying because we serveda lot of women as our viewers.
We wanted to do,
you know, a series about thatto raise awareness
and to help momswho were trying to figure out
what might be going onwith their children.
So we start brainstormingin one of our meetings, and we think, we
we think we're cooking, right?
We think we got all we arepopping on all eight cylinders,
(10:16):
and one of our producers goes,
wait,
my twokids just got diagnosed on the spectrum,
and everything we just talked aboutis irrelevant and not helpful.
And we were all like, hey,because we didn't know
her children were on the spectrum,and two,
(10:36):
because we didn't realizewe thought we were doing something good.
And we in that moment,I think we all realized that
we could haveeither embarrassed ourselves.
Offended.
That you wanted to have first and depth,and then the third piece is done
the exact oppositeof what we had intended to do.
And in those moments
(10:58):
when we can bring our personal experiencesto bear in our work,
then we can do what we came there to do.
We can amplify the things that we wantto amplify
and impact people the way that we want toand and reach the goals that we intended.
And if I'm not mistaken,
(11:20):
I think we ended up getting somesome award nominations for that series
after we had all done itand we could have fallen flat on our face.
But that person deciding
to be authentic at work.
And here's the thingshe didn't have to disclose
that her childrenwere on the spectrum to be able.
She could have just said,
(11:40):
I know something about this,and we're wrong, and here's why.
But but, but and and and hadshe taken that approach,
it might nothave had the impact on all of, you.
Know, it wouldn't have. But I mean.
It probably would have changed.
It probably would have changedyour series.
But maybe you. Could have had. Yeah.
Yeah, it still could have had an impact.
(12:01):
And that's and that's really what this isabout, what she did in that moment.
Because this wasn't even her.
You know,she wasn't the one even pitching the idea.
Right.
It was somebody else's idea.
But she made that idea better.
She amplifiedhow that whole thing turned out.
But here's the thing.
I want people to know, Kevin,what happens?
(12:23):
And and we make these decisions every day.
What happens when we sit in a meeting,
when we know better
and we sit silent
and a lot of timesthat choice is determined
by how the leader makes it possiblefor that
(12:43):
kind of conversation to happen.
Yeah. There's two sides.
Yes, 100%. Everybody.
Thank you for that, Gene.
And there's there's two parts to that.
There's, there's us thinking about thatwhen we're in that meeting.
There's us thinking about thatwhen we're in the meeting
and we're the leader, because thensometimes we may need to share that,
(13:04):
but we need to make sure
we're not going firstbecause we want to make sure
we're not overwhelmingwhat else might show up.
And the third thing I would sayis, are we making it safe
for people to make the conscious choicein that meeting?
So, you know, Gene,you asked it as in the first person for me
as an individual in that meeting.
And I'm just saying there's two
there's two examples there when I'm, whenI have the boss hat on and when I don't.
(13:28):
But the third thing is so important,like if are we can we make it safe
for people to do that?
You. The book is titledFearless Authenticity,
and this exampleI think gets at that a little bit.
Yeah.
I'd like you to say a little bit moreabout why fearless?
(13:49):
Because it takes courage to stand
where you are and say who you are
or or even more importantly,show who you are
when we are pressed, like,
think about when you were a kid, rightyour first day.
That was a long time ago.
Same same star, same.
(14:12):
Back when we were in school, it was calledjunior high, not middle school.
You you are so correct about that.
I remember when I was in eighth grade,
it switched to middle schooland I was like, what's a middle school?
What is a middle school?
But he was freaking outabout going to high school as I was
at. Well, you know what?
Can I tell you something I wasn'tand I was I got you.
(14:34):
No, no, no, let me check.
Listen, I'm very easy to get off track,but I will get us back
to where we were going.
So I actually lived in a town where
it was a fairly small town in southwestLouisiana called New Iberia.
It's where they make the Tabasco sauce.I always get.
Asked. Yes.
So we had a freshman high school
because the way that the schoolswere integrated way back in the day,
(14:58):
the number of students that were there,it just couldn't at that time.
Right? Yeah, exactly.
I didn't have that. I hadI got dropped right in.
And of course it was a small school, butstill I'm still a little bit freaked out.
I'm just being honest.
I don't think I've ever said that outloud before.
Well, I didn't have.
The reason why I wasn't freaked out
is because we had a schoolthat was freshmen only.
So by the time you got,you got to build enough confidence
(15:23):
before you went to the big high school,ten through 12.
And so for me, it was a little bit easier.
And that's the reasonwhy I see junior high as the big like
I got to put on my big girl pantsnow like I'm at the I,
you know, and and here's the other thing.
I went from Catholic schoolto public school
and so I went from a much smaller
(15:46):
schooling situation into a largerI mean, it wasn't huge,
but it was large to me where I, you know,
had to make some new friends and,and do some things.
But I think for everybody,junior high is kind of where you start to.
So our middle school was where you startto show your personality,
you start you because you know yourselfbetter at that point.
(16:08):
But it is also.
You think you do you think you did.
But you know yourself better than you didwhen you were five, right?
But the thing is, is you also care more
about what other people thinkbecause you are unsure.
You are looking around for cuesto see if what you're feeling
is normal, to see if you are normal.
(16:28):
And that is when we really startto feel inside outside groups.
I think it's happening younger now,but I think all of us can identify
with that feeling of fear,
you know, or at least hesitation of whowe are, where we fit in
and what we are willing to doto feel like we belong.
(16:49):
And it takes courageand being fearless to say, you know what?
This is who I am,and starting new jobs or new positions
brings backthose same feelings at some degree.
That's exactlywhat I was going to say. Like.
So again,if you're moving into a new role,
you've probably experienced that.
(17:09):
But as a leader,when you bring people into your team,
you aren't necessarily thinkingabout the fact that that's going on
for them, because everything,it's all it's all known to you.
It's not known to them.I think it's a really good point.
I think we can have an entire show
just about that transitionthat we all had as kids.
Even though my experiencewas quite different than yours.
(17:30):
There was no freshman center.
There was it wasthere was not even any new people.
We went to the high school.
My freak out was about the sophomores,juniors and and supposedly
the seniors like thisis going to be different and all that.
Like, we could have a whole show.
They're tying it to this bigger point,but maybe another day.
I want to get to do some more stuffin the book.
(17:52):
Early in the book,
you talk about something that your dadtaught you about authenticity.
He said three things.
What were those three things?
Oh, I don't remember.
Hold. Up. I'm here. The right below.
Here they are.
Oh, that those three things.
Okay, those three things.Because let me tell you something, Kevin.
I told youit wasn't going to be Mike Wallace.
I wasn't trying to trip you up.
(18:12):
My dad, he told me a lot of things.
Well. Fair.
My dad. He told me a lot of things.
I have a whole series on social mediaabout the stuff that my father has told
me. Okay, so, yes, three things
you need to have to be authentic.
To be fair,it was first, you have to be brave.
That's where the courage comesin, right? You got to take that step.
(18:35):
Then you have to
be free enoughto be able to express yourself, right.
It can't just be fearlessand standing on business silently, right?
You have to actually be freeenough to express,
not only feel it,but express it to other people.
(18:55):
And then finally, you just need to be you.
But you have to know who you are.
And exactly.
And I think that's where we'll spendthe rest of our time. Right.
So like it's really important.
I mean, it's easy to say, be brave,be free, be you.
It's a good look.
Say it though.
Admit it. It is. It's good.
(19:16):
It's really good.
But at that.
But in the open, I said, you know,sometimes we all talk about this
like we ought to be authentic, and yet wedon't always know what that really means.
And it starts with our identity. Right.
And that's what you're talking aboutnow is how does this all connect.
And and so our identity
and our authenticity. Right.
(19:39):
So do you have it. Go ahead.
I will even drill it downfurther from there.
It's about your value and your values,
right.
The valueyou bring, what you have to offer.
Because you know this.
If I learned nothing from my parents,both of them
(20:00):
were always of service,
always offering something that they had.
My mother was a musician.She played in the church choir.
She taught chorus.
She, you know, she shared her giftsand love for music with everyone.
My dad was always.
He was always driving miss Daisy.
(20:21):
Always.
Like there was always some little old ladyin the back seat taking them to go,
to go, as we used to say in Louisiana,go make groceries,
to go to church, to go to mass, wherever.
My daddy was that person.
He was always the one.
Who was your at your home accentjust came out in that moment.
I know
(20:41):
I've been
in Chicagoso long, but sometimes Louisiana
will come flying out of my mouthbecause as a broadcaster, you can't.
We have a standard accent. Right?
And so that's a really interestingpoint too. Right.
So being and that's I think rightthere is one of the things that people
get stuck with.
(21:02):
Right, as a leader,not that's not stuck with but
stuck around like
they may besomeone listening, may be thinking,
well, is is is Jean really authentic?
If she's if she's had to change the wayshe talks.
Because how we talk is who we are.
So like just take that as because I thinkthat's just a kernel of an example
of how authentic might not alwaysmean exactly what we think it means.
(21:26):
So I believe we all livein a range of authenticity,
and it looks different for differentpeople who I am and how I speak.
And and it's interesting
because this conversation about codeswitching has come up quite a bit.
And for and for people who don't know,code switching, at least for black people,
is speaking a certain wayin in your inner group.
(21:47):
Then you do say in a groupthat is mixed right.
And that I equate that to
you might talk in a certain waywhen you're with your guy friends
at the bar watching footballor basketball or whatever
your sport is, and speakvery differently to your wife,
to your daughter, or to your grandmother,let's take it back.
(22:10):
You know, you're going to like.
And when I'm talking to a girlfriend.
It's like, let's just speak.
When we're talking
in one place to peers, we're going to talkvery differently to our elders.
But are you a different person?
Absolutely not.
In fact, your grandmotherprobably knows about the colorful language
you use when you're in the in.
If you're assuming that I use colorfullanguage, Gina, let's be careful here.
(22:34):
I'm speaking to the audience.
Oh, okay. Fair.
No, I'm not. Making any assumptions.
There is somebody out therewho uses color for language
that his grandmother may be aware of,but that he would never say
to his grandmother.
I actually a conversation about that wordusing the word damn
with my grandmother once, and I said,you can say you can say a different word.
And it's the thought underneathit is exactly the same shoes.
(22:56):
It doesn't matter.I'm still not going to say it,
anyway,but I know I think that's a great example.
I mean, I'mglad that we just took that little detour,
because I think that'sa perfect example that
that that doesn't change who we are.
And and you are,
I'm confident,based on our short conversation
and having read your book, and we'retalking with Jean Spero about her
(23:17):
new book, fearless Authenticity,I'm confident in saying this, that
you are supremely proud of your kid hood,
and supremely comfortable
letting that South Louisiana accentcome back out.
And that that doesn't mean that.
And that's the other piece.
We're sorry. No. Go ahead.
(23:38):
I was like everybody else who doesn'tunderstand a South Louisiana accent, I,
I had to interpret from my
my grandmother'sfirst language was Creole French.
So we had to, you know,put somebody culture someplace else.
And you hear all the sighs,the babies and the blah, blah, blah.
Honey, they're not hearing it. Exactly.
So I'm sorry I interrupted.
No, no,that's okay. We have to we have to get at,
(24:00):
the foundation in the book.
You mentioned it earlier,and and I'm a little bit careful.
I want to be a little bitcareful on our time, but I want
you really to get to this foundationagain, a three part phrase,
and I'll just put it on the screen forthose watching live it, tell it, sell it.
Because again, I don't know thata lot of people would initially
(24:21):
put the word sell it with authenticity.
So can you just unpack this a little bit?
Not too much,
because everyone needs to gomake sure they go buy a copy of the book.
But when you say live it,tell it, sell it.
What are you talking about?
Those are my foundations for success.
And it's how I see the wayall of our interactions as people go.
Because here's that. Here'sthe bottom line, Kevin.
(24:42):
Everything we do is in that,that we are trying to produce at work,
to reach goals has to involve working withother people, whether that is an active,
sales effort
to external stakeholders, let's call them,
or whether that's internally organizingto get some process going.
(25:04):
Right.
Thosethese three things need to happen live.
It is about you and understandinghow you affect other people
and and where you areand what you have to bring to the table.
It is about the way you connectwith other people.
It's the stories that link us together,the stories we tell about what
we're doing, how we're going to do it,and where we're going and then sell it
(25:25):
is this idea that a lot of peoplehave had resistance to that.
I don't understandbecause we are always selling something.
As I like to say, even if it's what you'regoing to cook for dinner.
And anybody who has teenage
children knows this intimately.
Well, if you want them to eat it anyway.
So, so,
(25:47):
so, yes.
So you'll get a lot more about the idea.
And we've been talking about live itand obviously because if you
when you have your copy of the book,you're, you're hearing from a
experienced communicatorin a variety of media,
and you're going to get a lot of ideasaround the,
tell it and the communication piece andthen the sell a piece you just mentioned.
(26:10):
I want to
I want to keep us on authenticityas we start to wrap up.
And we bumped up against somethinga couple of times.
But I want to bring this word outbecause it's a really important word
as it relates to authenticity.And that's confidence.
I mean, you've talked about
we've talked about being fearless,and we talked about being willing.
But if we want to be more authentic
(26:34):
in the ways that we've talked about,confidence has to play a role.
I mean, you've used the wordfearless, you've used the word brave.
But we don't always think about thosewords in the same way as we do confidence.
So talk to us a minute about howyou connect confidence in authenticity.
I believe confidence comes throughauthenticity, true
authenticityin understanding what your worth is.
(26:56):
So when you know what lane
you drive in, you can drive as fastand as long as you'd like
because you're not trying to switch lanes,you're not trying to get off the road
and get back on.
And granite to understand what that is,sometimes you do have to switch lanes,
get off and get back on the highway.
But I believe when you explore
(27:17):
what value you have to offer other people,what thing you have to be of service
in, you can lean into thatin a way that gives you confidence.
When you know what you bring to the table,you start to walk differently.
You start to talk differently.
You start to understandwhere you fit in relationship
(27:38):
to other people,and you're no longer in competition.
A lot of people get false confidence,and sometimes that can elevate
to arrogancewhen they compare right with other people.
I'm better than so-and-so at this.
The problem with that is,as my mama used to tell me,
there will always be somebody smarter,somebody prettier, somebody faster,
(27:59):
somebodyyou know, somebody better than you.
Always.
There will always be somebody like that.
So if you only get your confidence
from the waythat you are comparing yourself
to others, eventually that confidenceis going to get knocked down because it's
not based on anything solid or real.
And if you do find your confidence
(28:21):
through what is inside of you,it is far more steady.
It is far more durable,it is far more sustainable.
And that's how I seeconfidence and authenticity.
And did I lose you, Kevin?
No, you didn't lose me.I'm still not with you.
I just know that the camera's not working.
Okay. That's all right.
Has has frozen.
So, it's a lovely place that it frozefor all of you that are watching,
(28:44):
I apologize.
I for those of you listening,it doesn't matter.
The thing that I loveabout what you just said,
Gene, is this idea that.
If we're we're sayingwe're saying we want to be fearless.
We say, like,how to be confident, to be fearless.
And yet, the starting point hereis clarity about self.
(29:05):
And when we have the clarity,the confidence will be there.
And so it's not like it's not likewe have to muster the confidence.
We have to let let the clarity show theconfidence through, if that makes sense.
100%.
I often tell people, that I'm trainingand working with that
(29:27):
we end up sometimes doubting ourselves.
And especially it happens at midlife,
where you let you look up one dayand you go, how did I get here?
And then we get on this whole tangent of,I gotta find purpose in my work
and this and that and other.
The reality is, is thatif you are stepping into who you are
and you understand your valueand what you have to offer,
(29:49):
your purpose will find you.
You just keep doing what you do well,what you know that you are here
to offer other people, and the valuethat you can transfer from yourself
to somebody else in service of some,you know, goal that you have together.
Hopefully a higher, greater good.
But even if it's just to get throughthe end of the day, like literally
(30:11):
if you have that, then you canyou can sustain the whole journey
and it will all find you.
I think a lot of times we chase things,
not realizing that things run awaywhen we chase them.
And the same thing is true of purposeand of confidence.
But when we find that kernel insideourselves, then we are able to do that.
(30:34):
And here's the most beautiful partabout it, Kevin, is that when we do that,
we give other people permissionand encouragement to do the same.
To do the same 100%.
So we had a little technical difficultywhen we when we were doing this live.
So hopefully this isn't too
out of sorts for all of youthat are listening to the podcast later.
But this is for you because we wantedto give you, all of the wisdom of Jeannie.
(30:58):
So, so, so, Jean, here's the question.
What didn'tI ask that you wish I would have?
It's not so much a question,
but it's a point that you touched onthat I wanted to expand on.
We talk about fearless authenticity,and I think a lot of people
look at the bookfor individual development, which it is.
It is absolutely about who you are andhow you contribute to the greater whole.
(31:20):
But one of the thingsI really want to bring forth is something
I've been seeing in my work as a trainerand as a speaker, and in
just having conversations with people,is that the higher we go up as leaders,
the lesswe are being authentic across the board.
Even if we are authenticand we think about how we impact people up
and down our flow as as a leader,we forget about how that happens across.
(31:45):
And a lot of times when you have peopleof similar power structure,
in the same room, there's a
lot of masks onbecause we have to show our power.
Right.
And the problem is,is that in a time when innovation
is of immediate necessitybecause of the speed
at which our world is progressingand changing every day,
(32:07):
we do not have the time to not be fearlessand to not be authentic with each other,
because that is how we willsolve problems, solve them quickly
and reach the goalsthat we are reaching for.
And maybe even tackle some thingsthat we weren't expecting to.
I love that.
So a couple of things before we go
(32:27):
that are not related to the book,
but are more just about you,I want to know, Jean, what you do for fun.
Oh, okay.
So I love my work so much.
It is hard to separate the two.
And that is an unfair answer.
I know that one's been listening to this,has already figured that out.
I want more than that.
(32:48):
So what do I do for fun?
Can I tell you something I love good food,good wine, and good conversation.
When I tell you that I do what I do
for a livingbecause I would do it for free.
Like that's the secretthat I don't tell anybody.
But my favorite thing is to sit aroundwith my friends and just talk about what's
(33:10):
happening in their lives, in the world,like if I can have a good conversation.
Kevin, I am happy. I also like to dance.
I usedto be a pretty doggone good salsa dancer,
and I need to get back in shape for that,
because let me tell you some,it takes some serious.
It takes some serious lung powerto be a good salsa dancer.
(33:30):
Well,the good news is you did do this for free.
So, hopefully it was a good conversation.
It absolutely.
Was. What are you.
What are you reading these days?
So I am reading.
I am trying to finish Atomic Habits.
I know I'm so late on it, but here'sthe thing that's really interesting.
Like, I'm a systems person,but it's very difficult for me to,
(33:55):
to create them, right?
I like I, I see things in systems,
but for myself, in my personal life,it can get a little chaotic.
Because as you've noticed,when you did my, bio intro,
I do a lot of different thingsbecause that's how my brain works.
But I see them all
as the same thing, like other peoplesee them as a bunch of different jobs.
(34:15):
I see them all on a continuum,so I need to get better.
As a as an entrepreneur with how,
structured and ritual ritual
that I am around, howI operate my business and conduct myself.
And I feel like I AtomicHabits has the answer for me,
(34:37):
but I haven't finished it yet.
There's a in my in my book.
I talk in my latest book,I talk a little bit about the difference
between and and James Cleardoes that in Atomic Habits.
Do the difference between habitsand rituals?
I think rituals are really important forus, you know, which go beyond routines.
And I think it's a really important piece.I'm glad that you brought that up.
(34:58):
So we've talked about somebody else'sbook.
Where can people learnmore about your work?
Where can they get your book?
Where do you want to point peoplebefore we finish up.
Fearless authenticity.com/book.
It is where all of the links tothe book are listed,
including the audio book,which just came out a couple of weeks ago.
(35:18):
So I hope that everybody will go there.
And it's also how you connect with meon social media.
I'm fairly active on Instagram,Facebook, LinkedIn,
and sometimes the platformformerly known as Twitter.
I can't let it go.
You can find me all those places
and interact, and I talk about thingsthat are in the book.
(35:41):
And of course with my podcast and the linkto that is on the website as well.
Perfect.
Jean Spero, before we go, everybodyhave a question I want to ask you.
It's the questionif you've been here before,
you know, I'm going to askbecause I ask it every single week.
It's a routine.
It's a ritual.
I love it.
And the question is, now what?
So you got the chance to hear from Jeanand hopefully hear that
(36:04):
we enjoy each other's conversateand the conversation and the ideas.
And so maybe it was entertaining. Fine.
That's not why you came. Really.
You came here to leave.
Figuring out a little bit
more about being authentic,or maybe figuring out how you connect.
Authenticity with your role as a leaderwhen you have a leader head on.
Or maybe you're
just thinking about this as a humanand not necessarily only from your leader
(36:26):
role.
The point is, until you ask an answerthe question, now what?
What am I going to do with this?
It will just bean entertaining conversation.
And so my challenge toyou is to think back,
what did you get from this conversation?
What action will you take as a result?
And when you do that, this will have beenmuch more valuable for you.
(36:47):
Jean, thank you so much for being hereand for putting up
with our technical challengesbefore we got to the end.
It was such a pleasureto spend time with you.
It was lovely to spend timewith you, technical issues,
and it reminded me of my work daysand television.
Trust me, trust me.
So everybody, we'll be back next.
If you enjoyed this,make sure you're liking
and subscribing and referringfrom whatever platform you're watching
(37:11):
or listening this on right?
And then make sure you're back next weekfor another episode of Remarkable
The Remarkable LeadershipPodcast. We'll see you then.
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