Ep. 226: The New New Labour Honeymoon

With the July election already over the horizon, we discuss the early weeks of the first Labour government in this podcast's history (est. 2015). Over on the new opposition benches, the Conservative leadership jostle has begun in earnest. And across a pond, somebody took a shot at a certain orange man. Joining us is Jazza's visa application. Image generated by Microsoft Designer

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Hello, and welcome to the right historical podcast
as truthful as resources permit. Jazz, how did
your team do in the general election?
You mean the
the spoiled my ballot. Yeah. That's the word.
Yeah. Yeah.
I think we did really well.
We got,
about the right...
About our target seats. Actually.

(00:23):
Which considering the night for the S snp
and,
conservatives, especially,
is a pretty good night for us. So
I'm really looking forward
consolidating
our vote in this parliament,
and then moving forward, maybe becoming the official
opposition for 20 29.
I mean, it could happen,
particularly with

(00:43):
election turnout being slow this time around. I
think it was that depressing. And that's the
depressing thing about this election. I guess, yeah.
If you tally up the... Because, obviously, you
know, you you are pretending that sport ballot
is is noted by the authorities, but really,
you might as will not have turned up.
Which
Which I didn't to be fair.
Was I was still in New York where

(01:03):
I live,
and did get somebody else to mail my
ballot for me. So
I'm glad we've got in that that reference
So quickly in this podcast forecast.
Anytime. The turnout out was at 60 percent.
So I guess you can claim that you
got 40 percent of the vote.
Source of? Oh,
wow. That's correct. I mean, we'll be here
forming the next government. Sorry,

(01:25):
In this That's a high percentage that the
more labor got.
It is
maths in the Uk election makes no sense
to be? I hate it. Why do we
not have some kind of proportionate representation. Landslide,
but they have fewer votes than they did
last time? I hate it. I'm sure we're

(01:45):
gonna get into all of those numbers
in the in the company episode. But this
is the right historical podcast so we... Oh
hi. So Yeah. Paul
that's Jimmy. Yes. Yeah. It's politics social issues
current events, affairs, whatever.
So since we last spoke, there has been
a general election. We managed to squeak out
an episode just before. Yeah.

(02:06):
Emergency podcast,
election result podcast,
This is a slow running emergency.
Yeah. Exactly. It's important to keep everybody on
as all of the other podcasts are winding
down their daily election podcast,
cadence.
We're we're back on it.
Yeah. Yeah, would break you out the rear.

(02:27):
So. Mh.
As always.
But I I guess, you know, we've we've
had the first couple of weeks. Of labor,
being government. Since we start this podcast, Jazz
back in 20 13 or 20 15, depending
on how you how you wanna count it.
This... These are exciting times for the right
sum thing when you say.

(02:47):
Yeah.
The first
time ever,
we've
we're gonna be covering a labor government, which
I think is gonna be quite interesting. Mh.
And, like, obviously, we
Oh, I don't know if you... Could could
you vote in 2010?
Yeah. Yeah. Just about. Yeah. Yeah.

(03:08):
Yeah. I don't I think we were both
quite happy that label 1?
Yeah. I mean, I've heard. So, you know,
Yeah. I again. Quite happy. Again making election
winners cha. Yeah. I like. Still not still
not the largest,
still not the largest party though. Do not
decide. Largest party. Thank you.

(03:28):
None of the above lovely. None of the
above the party.
We're we're going gonna be talking about the
first couple of weeks of of labor. And
I guess how you know? How are? This
honeymoon period as many people have called it?
Yes. Yeah. Although that some people at argue
that's already come to an end given the
the rights and leads
but we can... We can talk a little
bit about that, what they've announced so far,

(03:49):
What they've not announced so far. Where we
think it's all going.
And it not the end of the Tory
psycho drama that we've been a bit annoying.
It was well, annoyed by and entertained by,
I think in an equal measure for the
past decade. It's R S is currently still
the leader of the conservative party. But I
I having a lovely time.

(04:11):
He seems pretty relax. Actually. It feels like
a weight off his shoulders when you hear
him speak. He actually seems like a reasonably
nice man now. He does. Yeah. What, I
mean, what happened? Where was this guy during
the election process?
He was being battered from all sides. Really,
and it turns out it when the stakes.
Is the whole stress thing if you want
to really like

(04:32):
be healthy and happy,
just stop being stressed all the time. And
I think because there's 0 stakes anymore. There's
no stress. And so he's just like, oh,
you know what? This is quite fun. All
I mean, if Tried explained this to previous
employees of mine several times and it's it's
just not gone down well. Just start using
Cena as a case. Study. I think that
should work. Well, I I will with the

(04:54):
future.
Su is look to be imposed for that
much longer. I think they're looking to replace.
Him as leader with the conservative party by
the conference season, which I... Oh, my god,
which is so long
away.
They're not they're not gonna be... From what
I understand, jimmy, they're not gonna be decided
by conference season, which is the end of...

(05:14):
I think the Tory cut party conference is
the end of September. Right? I'm So they
want them. They're to... They want the tory
conference to be a hu.
So they want to have a load of
the
Candidates there debating with another on stage.
Well, Be interesting, at least? Oh, it's so

(05:34):
long.
I don't... It's just their way of satisfying,
Jazz because you clearly love elections and... You
know, these kind of things. Yet, you you
you affect sending tense them boredom in in
terms of like, waiting for them to happen.
I...
It's it's the...
The suspense is it's boring me to pieces.

(05:54):
That's
is boring. Yeah.
Oh, well phrase.
But when do we talk about that particularly
because, as of the time of recording,
It looks like to had a bra the
might up defected to the reform party if
news reports are to be believed. Oh, I
haven't said this yet. That'll be fun. So
that will be interesting.
And,

(06:15):
I mean, last week as as a time
of recording, somebody finally decided to take a
shot at Donald Trump.
Jimmy,
we have to we have to couldn't
condone what happened?
That dev dev. Not condone. Sorry If we
have to... Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Go you said,

(06:35):
oh, shit. Oh, we fuck this up and
we. I'm did. It does
application curious shut up with deleting this episode.
It's bad.
Political violence is bad, don't shoot presidents,
even if they're awful.
Those our disclaimer. Thank you. Please do not

(06:56):
do anything bad. And this was a bad
thing that happened.
But he's paul little.
Sure. Sure. It was a bad thing that
happened, but we we're gonna be talking about
the implications of it.
What we think is gonna happen with Joe
Biden. Who who annoying between the time of
us recording this and it being released, may
well probably just get a step down. Yeah.
Oh, which it just just goes to show

(07:17):
know, Americans never think of, of their British
friends when they come to making these sorts
of decisions. Or any decision at all?
Yeah, disgraceful.
You should we play bit music talk about
the patreon accountant and and get on with
it, As? Yes, please. Condemn,
Condemn.

(07:49):
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(08:33):
John O Marlene Matt, Michael Ko, Michael Mark
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So ja.
At
Jimmy.
Fred of the show on, Actually, contacted me

(08:54):
on Twitter. Ahead of the general election and
said it was gonna be a big night
for the right honour, giving the impending lip
d surge. Yeah,
this is the kind of stuff I miss
on Twitter. Yeah. Yeah did date there was
a lift out search.
The was? They got, about...
Almost exactly a proportionate number of

(09:15):
seats based on their v share. Yeah. So
11 percent of Mps and 12 percent of
the the votes. Yeah. Is it's pretty good
girl. Which is the only party that I
think that works for? Isn't it? Yeah. The
tourism isn't wildly off labor, the seat share
is about double Yeah. Diabetes mps for what
what votes they've got.

(09:35):
J it's clearly gonna use. This as a
jumping off point for complaining about first pass
post system. Me, this is your thing too.
Don't try and blame me about this.
We both think it's bad.
I... Yeah. I do. I I do think
it's bad.
III think I'm
I'm aware there would be other problems in
a more proportional system, but I I do
feel this is a slightly way of going

(09:56):
about things, and it it does dis franchise,
a lot of people. A lot of people,
like, there... I've mentioned this to a of
friends and they're like, yeah. But then reform
would have gotten a load of seats. And
then like, if people vote for them, they
should probably get to be represented by them
some way shape or form even if you
don't like them.

(10:19):
Yeah. That's true. So Reform she got 14
percent. Of the aggregate votes which,
acute listeners may notice is a larger number
than what the l got and Mh form
nevertheless ended up with a mere 5 seats,
including 1 for Nigel Arch.
I tell everyone... We've got finally in there.
Yeah. We've not spoken about how you'll be

(10:39):
left that it was for you, Jazz. Did
you did you start to watch most of
the results?
I've stayed up to watch all of. I
think I was awake until about 6AM your
time. So we do so I watched all
the way through
to care making here so then getting to
want... To 03:26.
Yeah. And care making his,

(11:00):
acceptance speech.
I did a little bit of a livestream
stream, which was very fun
until someone
Was transferred in my comments, so that was
fun.
Sorry about that, Joseph.
Yeah. I don't do it again, Jimmy. Thanks.
And
I I was just...
Because it was independence day here.

(11:21):
So... There were, like, fireworks going off everywhere,
and I was sat here with, like, a
couple of bottles of, like, half decent red
wine in a cheese plate.
But I was living my bet. I had
a lovely time
such a nice sign.
It's good good of the Americans to celebrate
a labor of victory in that way. 8
Yeah. Exactly. So it's better to have that

(11:42):
kind of, like,
international come. Yeah. I think so. Yeah.
Sounds like a very European celebration though, Jazz
just having cheese in wine, why you watch
the results for, Roland.
I would like to make it very clear.
I still think we should have stayed in
the European union.
Always bringing that up.
I had to a mate you feel better.
It was Californian and wine.

(12:04):
I don't feel strongly about it to be
honest to be.
But III
went to bed around 11 woke cup at
around 2
when the results actually start properly rolling in,
and I'd also stayed up until K
and had his victory speech.
I think it was I think it was
quite a good election to watch because there
there are a number of fairly prominent
Mps who

(12:26):
felt all the disorders as it were. There
were some interesting survival as well. I mean,
Jeremy Hunt actually was 1 I was expecting
to go the Now former chancellor.
Richie.
Yeah... No sorry. A moment for Liz trust
being. So, L, I think Liz Liz trust
would a very satisfying seat to watch and
it it happened quite late, so I actually

(12:47):
missed it, But Liz a what had a
seated in Norfolk.
And
apparently use that past tense. Come on.
Apparently had a massive Wobbly about
about Losing.
I think refused to actually give a concession
speech, which is Good. Is normal for
for most of the... Ceo. I mean, you
saw other so, like grant apps for example,

(13:09):
who lost to say. Penny more. Yeah. They
all get their go concessions features because that
is... I thought grand chapters was quite funny
because,
his was clearly written.
As like a launch pad for him to
then go for the leadership, but he just
had to, like change some of the words
around.
Because it was still like quite up upbeat

(13:30):
and optimistic. He tried to frame the fact
that he's had, like 75 cabinet positions. In
parliament as like a good thing and not
representative of the amount of chaos instability that
we've had for the past 14 years. But
there you go. It's it's old and how
you spin it.
But, I mean, in the end, it wasn't
it was at the the the tour results

(13:50):
terms of the number of mps they got
was it the upper reaches of what we
expected. I think it's fair to say.
They ended up with a hundred and 21
seats in the end.
And I I think the sort of midpoint
of expectations was around the hundred mark and
then the lowest
expectations the lowest reasonable expectations, I think, quote
would have had them getting about like about

(14:11):
6 days. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, yeah. It...
It would have ed to time be a
great deal if the lived had ended up
as the
opposition.
How? I have I think it would have
been terrible for democracy, but I've I'd have
absolute adored that? That's exactly the world that
I wanna live in. I'd have immediately returned
home. Why would you have thought why would
you have said it was terrible for Democracy

(14:32):
Just because the vote shares?
Because the right doesn't get represented at all,
and I think that that is sometimes when
a party is
especially from the right are able to run
up the large amounts of support if they're...
So because there are people that
think the way that the tourists then can
think the way the reform think. If they

(14:53):
don't see
anybody in the halls of power actually representing
them,
I think that,
animate that voter base
in a way that doesn't necessarily happen otherwise.
And
I think that the opposition should be at
least for... In some way you'll form the
other side of the aisle.

(15:14):
I think that does make sense to be
fair.
Sorry. I've mentioned the fact that reform managed
to get 5 seats. 1 of whom went
to Nigel Ferrari in climb. 86 if Su
jumps? Yeah. I mean, the
during the through the little break we had
I I Googled the sort bra story. And
she has officially denied.
That she's going over to reform, you can

(15:34):
met up your own mind as to whether
you trust her on that front. Her and
nigel raj, would rip each each apart. They
would not get on. It's hard to see
how there's room for both of them in
the same party to be honest with you.
There's barely room for the other 383 or
4 mps that Nigel arch Has a hang
around with. Yeah. So Nigel Ferrari has done

(15:55):
some restructuring.
Since the election, just putting people in slightly
different positions. And what I think was it
Ben H,
said he had some concerns about how the
party was being organized
I think I'm obliged to register at this
stage that reform is not a traditional political
part in terms of how it's struck. So
weird... It's a company
Yeah. It's a company with Nigel Controls 52

(16:17):
percent or something of the of the shares
when it might be 51 percent It's not
52 percent. Is it? That'll would be He
that would be... That that... I'd actually quite
enjoy that. I'd be like, you know what
we're not gonna get nigel, but that was
very funny.
I... It's 51 50 2II sort of hoping.
He he said 52
for the sake of bounce, but but I'm

(16:38):
not sure.
There was this great report and we won't
come on to talking about labor that you
go about at some point, but there was
this great report in the sun.
Where clearly reform her briefed to the sun,
and this... They were like, we're gonna come
in like reservoir dogs. It's the the foxes
have finally entered the head house sort of
thing.
And as I was kinda to you on
our previous, it's like guys, you have 5

(17:01):
mps at in a house of 650.
Nobody is get care about you. Right? Like
it's...
I still disagree degree of that. I think
that the star power of nigel garage and
the fuss that he's able to kick up.
And the media attention that he has been
so expert at
attracting over the last
2 decades.

(17:21):
I I think that they are clearly going
to have an outweighed
influence I think
small numbers. Yeah. III agree with that, and
he he does have media cloud. I just
think that in terms of the actual parliamentary
impacts,
I think it's gonna be fairly muted. They're
not gonna have
power in the house of commons. They're not
gonna be able to sit on that many

(17:42):
committees because they're just not that. 5 of
this... Yeah. There's 5 of them. I, there's
just the shit ab power issue, but those
committees...
The positions are allocated based on how many
seats you have in the house of commons
and and where you're are on the peck
orders. So to return to that house mess
for that Nigel far ferrari was talking about.
Mh.
I I just think,
you know, and they were talked about oh,

(18:02):
you know. We've got a list of, like,
labor seats or something that we wanna target
at the next election, like, nobody nobody's thinking
about the next election right now. We've just
had 1
it's gonna be 5 4 or 5 years
of
not plain sailing labor government, that but the
the majority is overwhelming.
Know, they're they're not... It's not gonna be
a a chaotic government that's seeing rebellions and

(18:24):
a government that can't get its agenda through
the house of commons.
It's it's and
I feel also the wind just with them.
Generally, they've got disciplined party,
people wanted to change as well in terms
of the voting public.
III think I don't think reform and nigel
Fries are gonna be that relevant for a
little while. I mean, they might be relevant

(18:45):
in terms of the Tory part the leadership,
which we can come on too.
But I I don't think they're going, we
will. Yeah. Affecting the labor agenda too much
of this stage.
So labor have just had their king's speech
where they've outlined what they are, what they're
planning on doing this is 39 bills that
they want to pass in the... It's the

(19:05):
longer... It's the longest
king speech we've had in a very long
time. Might. I can't remember how long it
was, but it was a very... It
Oh, am I being really wonky and basically
doing their propaganda for them. It's a it's
ambitious.
Right to have that many? Like, you don't
often have that many in looking speech?
Yeah. So there was an interesting color in
the economist

(19:26):
this week where
he he made the point that the last
tory government
apart from all of the
insane stuff that was going on in terms
of scandals
and mishap and
just poor party discipline. It
at this... I mean, this goes for British
Soon, goes for Liz trust.
It goes to some extent for Boris Johnson
notwithstanding that they were dealing with a lot

(19:47):
of Covid stuff.
But
Since the 20 19 general election, the Tory
party just hasn't done very much in terms
of leg in terms of actually doing things
that going to change the country for best
or worse. Well small small government in it.
Well, yeah, very small it terms of its
ambitions. It it's bitty.

(20:07):
And the labor government already seems to be...
Does seem to be interested in actually getting
stuff done you a, in a serious way.
I mean, they was almost immediately. They revoked
that ban on
on a wind farm onshore wind farms. Mh.
That literally happened. In an afternoon seemingly.
Well, because they want the this is

(20:27):
very ambitious. I think they want to be
carbon neutral, the uk's grid to be carbon
neutral by 20 30. I think that's correct.
Yeah. Which is which is
less than 6 years away.
Yeah. I think again, this was the economist
column, but the the thinking of a lot
of experts is that they will miss that
target, but if they if they do everything

(20:49):
they say they're gonna do, they're gonna almost
hit it. Which means, which is still good
in the the scheme of things. Right,
see bet you you believe in the net
0 agenda.
But it don't start becoming a climate denial,
Jimmy, I don't think my heart would be.
But, you know, I'm just I'm just... We
have a diverse audience Jazz politically speaking. I'm
just 3 reaching out across the aisle to

(21:10):
them.
Okay. I did have time to go. I
don't have time to get into net 0
conspiracy theories. I'm just too busy. It sounds
was exhausting.
So either, aside from everything else. So I
just don't know anything that's on the cards
for me.
But, so some of the interesting... I mean,
actually, the Tory were sort of talking about

(21:30):
some of the things that they've actually... That
labour picked up here. So there's gonna be
a ban on no fault eviction.
Mh. Which should I think it's something that
Michael Gov was pursuing
that didn't actually. I mean, there was a...
He was never able to do it right
He couldn't get get landlords on side. Well,
I think that the child is the tory
are the party of landlords.
So Mh. Internally, it was that kind of

(21:50):
thing was very unpopular.
And get... I mean, Michael Gov
for all his, you know,
pretty... He's pretty a popular figure on the
on the left not least for the stuff
did around education when he was education secretary.
But
I think that he's... It Generally was regarded
as someone who did try and get stuff
done and was actually quite an effective.

(22:11):
And, yeah, he just he just met a
brick wall with those kind of reforms. There's
gonna be a lot of stuff around planning
in general and
I think the intention is that the labor
government is going to centralize planning a lot
more an overall local authorities which
generally speaking are very much in favor blocking
new buildings,
which is 1 of the reasons why we
have the housing crisis that we have

(22:33):
did you see did you see that the
the green coal leader,
opposed
the building of
wind farms in his constituency.
I did see that. I think to be
fair him
all of the Mps in who were competing
for his constituency,
so of candidates who are competing for that

(22:53):
seat.
They also opposed it
But I mean, this is a good example.
Yeah right right is that people say, oh,
is like, if the green n mp is
also going to be a n, what the
what the hell of the green party doing?
I think that's incredibly
embarrassing when your whole party
is founded on the idea that you should
and we should invest more in renewables. And

(23:15):
then you go, oh, no, but not in
Way valley.
Yeah. I mean I agree with you that
there's also definitely a line of thinking around
the greens that they oppose nuclear energy, which...
I mean, that
some some of the people, the proponents worried
about new nuclear sort of general free marketers,
and and that's the line they're coming up
from It. There are also quite a few
sensible people.

(23:37):
I would quite sort of bit of the
rogue people that you wouldn't expect be,
you know, enterprise for the sake of enterprise
where they're like, oh, yeah. New nuclear energy
is clearly like a really good thing, and
we should be doing more of it. And
the the greens oppose it. Seemingly for sort
of historical reasons and a certain factor around
the connections nuclear weapons as well.

(23:57):
Mh. There are arguments about nuclear waste,
which it... It's probably if you're if you're
on the green party side around the stuff,
you would raise those, but
I do agree that that there is there's
a bit of a trope of green part,
you know, pea green parties in general.
And this doesn't go. Just go for the
Uk, but,
in theory big in favor of of the

(24:17):
environment and green policies. But when you actually
name any single policy, they're like now, we
don't like that 1. Actually.
So that's kind of it kind... I feel
like they're boeing, that kind of attitude from
the l d. So trying to consolidate and,
like down in the super local nature of
it, where the l dams are incredibly good
at basically having different policies
depending on the constituency.

(24:39):
That you're in, which is very good at
winning like by election seats and winning local
seats, but it's not very good for party
cohesion. But also doesn't necessarily really matter. When
you're the third 4 for fifth largest party
in parliament. Yeah.
Yeah. Agree. And I I think if over
of those parties become more serious forces, than
noise, tensions are gonna become much bigger problems

(24:59):
for them. But for the time being, they'll
be alright.
In other kind of Tory
policies, labor is going to introduce this gradual
ban on smoking that we've discussed previously.
That's nice that we is soon acts
legacy is gonna be preserved by the labour
parties. Isn't it.
Maybe that's why he's big separately friendly pissed.
Exactly. He's like Please. It's the 1 thing.

(25:23):
Yeah. I guess he can still take some
sort of credit for that, possibly.
The
gonna remove the Vat exceptional private school phase,
which is is something else that they've
been talking. So many class people are gonna
be really annoyed.
I guess every We really talked about this.
I'm not really... I mean, we both went

(25:43):
to private school didn't away. But Yeah. I'm
personally know that bothered about the Va thing
1 way or the other. So...
I think it makes sense for it to
have Vat added on if it is then
going to be used to improve public.
Like state scores.
I guess... Yeah. I guess so.

(26:05):
And it it doesn't really seem to deal
with the fundamental grip that
although lot of its proponents have that private
schools are just an innate unfair, and they
should be abolished. So it does it slightly
seem to be a case of shuffling the
dirt chairs and the titanic. If that's the
right metaphor.
But love that.
Fiat don't saw or not. I mean,
it's the daily available or the telegraph or

(26:27):
both have been sort of running quite real
campaigns about this and and how successfully unfair.
It is, and,
you know, these poor families who who save
up to get their kids into private. I,
I'm sure those families do exist. So I'd
being slightly sc when I say this, but
I I don't think there are a lot.
I mean, we my family saved up so

(26:48):
that me and my brother could go private
school. Yeah.
And it was an awful lot of money,
But I didn't test... I I didn't do
well enough in the eleventh plus, so then
we had to just pay our way. That's
right. Not really it's just what happened because
the the...
There was at least a perception when I
was going up that the state schools went
went very good.
And so it was the only option we

(27:10):
had
really outside the Grammar school I mean, there
there definitely are those there were some
areas. This is actually the Irr up actually
had grammar schools still, and they're they're seen
as a kind of academic
option by a lot of families Be. There
are there are some places where state schools...
The state schools that exist to have bad
reputation and Mh. People who can just about

(27:31):
afford it
will save up and put their kids into
private school and some of those people will
not be able to afford anymore,
assuming that,
assuming all the taxes is just passed on
to the
the students, which, you know, is isn't something
the private calls actually have to do? Well,
to the parent Well, that's the parents hospital,
but you know what I mean?

(27:51):
So
those are 2 things that they've brought through
House of Lords, no more,
hereditary
hereditary peers. So this is jo... It's 20
24. Come on. This is something that
Tony blair wanted to do our way back
in the day. And
his compromise that the was that the hereditary

(28:12):
peers
I think when Knee Covid, I'm I'm hoping
I'm getting this roughly correct. When Knee came
in it was all the registry pairs.
And I think that Tony Blair wanted to
completely removed the hereditary peers, but he actually
reduced it down to...
I wanna say it's like a hundred and
50 or something, and then when 1 of
the dies, there's the should a bug.
They're remaining hereditary pairs. And they choose someone

(28:33):
else.
So fucking die. It's something like something like
that. And I guess that'll just be,
that all just be appointed by the government
or officially, I guess there'll be appointed by
the king on the recommendation of the prime
minister and the
the lead with the opposition, and that sort
of thing.
I'm not sure this is

(28:55):
I'm not sure this is exactly that satisfying
for me. I mean, I I agree with
you the hereditary peers thing is is ridiculous.
But... Well, there was there was talk of
them doing full order reform. So, like, chuck
them all out and having, like, the Gordon
brown
recommendation he did, like, a consultation for K
labor. Things. He's called a commission in fact.

(29:16):
Commission. Thank you. Yeah.
They
this commission came up with there being an
abolishing of the House of Lords, and then
it being replaced by
a
a house representative of, like the country, the
nations and regions.
And it looks like they're not doing that.
At least for the first

(29:37):
for this first kind of, like, period of
the government. And it is also worth bearing
in mind. I think a lot of people
were like, oh, they didn't bring forward, votes
at 16, which was in the.
They didn't bring forwards.
This reform stuff blah.
But this is, like the first king's speech.
There's gonna be Yeah. Other ones. And so
they may be choosing to

(29:59):
use that political capital further down the line.
Yeah. I I just don't think that cons
constitutional reform is ever the main priority for
a government coming in.
Just pick... You know, unless you're the And
p, and you wanna, you know, declare independence
from the Uk. But but, you know, the
people if you're reform and you agree representative

(30:19):
in the in the system or... Yeah. But
then this not bit of the government. Right?
Like, by definition, if you're the governor but
the the previous system has actually suited you
a reasonably well because you managed within an
election type power. But
it it doesn't sprite. I mean, there's some
stuff around dev evolution where again, it seems
to be continuing the...

(30:39):
What the Tori did with dev evolution because
there there's all these talk of, like,
Us style city mayors
or Metropolitan mayors.
They do it in a very piece
case by case basis. So if you're a
local
area, and you want to effectively like apply
to have a a man, a combined authority.
Yeah I mean, you you just put to
together an up again. I mean, yeah you

(31:00):
can you can also takeaway, you can also
remove it. It was, like, bristol had there,
Metro
abolished only a couple of years ago. Yeah.
Yeah. That did happen.
But it it's done on a very gradual
basis.
And
there's something...
I guess... I mean, it isn't... It it
fits the general process of British culture should
reform is that you'll just do it. You

(31:20):
know, in a kind of hap way at
done this really
uneven,
hard to understand system that
I guess the proponents would say well, you
know, we assessed in, and we didn't thought
we'd give them these powers and that powers,
but
that whole thing seems a little bit of
a a mess.
Yeah. I I'd... Maybe they will come forward

(31:41):
with more things like the votes for 16,
and they'll do more wholesale reform on the
house of lords to.
The region's thing is interesting although I think
it would be such a big change in
how Uk politics operates because you'd have the
the house of the upper house
the upper chamber would have its own mandate
effectively and how that would shake out. I
have no idea, but changing it into a
kind of house of experts seems a little

(32:03):
bit of experts here this... In this house,
we love house of experts.
Although, you could argue though the ex, you
know, expertise is is kind of dealt with
at the
at committee stage when legislation goes through? So
do you really need... Is it really a
good idea to have a separate upper chamber
for that I don't know. Sure. It'll, like,
abolish an napa chamber. Why have we got

(32:24):
1? Well, I think new Zealand only has
1 chamber. New zealand only got 1 chamber
there's a few places that Only got 1
chamber.
And Easy Linda doesn't have a
constitution, either. I think it's le and Israel,
possibly. Although they're kinda major democracy of our
Oh, extensions. What a trifecta. Yeah. Exactly. Like
it's like the power girls.
It's exactly like that.

(32:47):
I think those are the main things.
It's probably april Some... I just wanna I
just wanna appreciate how
normal
everything feels
on the Uk side of things. No. There
are some things that I'm quite,
concerned about,
and we won't talk about it today. Jimmy.
We won't talk about today, but like a

(33:08):
a lot of the stance that they're taking
around, trans android. So I'm finding
that makes me really uneasy,
but I'm quite... It feels like people who
know what they are doing in power... I'm
in power now.
And
it genuinely felt like, in the the couple
of days out of the election. It was

(33:28):
like a big, like, oh then god.
I mean, like, he looks like he should
be doing that job.
Are you not just being swayed by the
image of a, an old white guy suit
with a chin?
Yeah. That's it.
I do know what you. I mean, that
that has been a lot of gus.

(33:49):
About... I say this is somebody going if
the labor government basically because I thought that
they would roughly do a reasonable job of
run the country.
But there's been a lot of Actually, roughly
reasonable was another name of this podcast.
Oh, that should be the tag.
But, yeah, you know, I... I'm hoping the
gus who will stop soon. I think we
can have a Honeymoon beans who a gus,

(34:10):
and then the slag elf can begin an
earnest once again because I think that is
healthier
for the the media in general. No. Speaking
of slug off. Yes.
God.
To be,
I think it would be the it would
be so interesting
to be a Tory mp right now. Yeah.
I think this is where, like, the interesting

(34:32):
stuff is happening in politics. Yeah. They're gonna
be out of power for until the next
election, and there's not money of them.
But right now, all of this like jo,
and everybody mis
and people doing leaks.
It's
It's the drama I've been looking for It's
basically if I can game the thrones, but
in parliament.
And I guess now it's quite low extra

(34:52):
because whatever happens to the Yeah. Kinda of
does it bat for well. Yeah. Who cares.
Yeah.
How do we wanna approach this? So
there's obviously only a hundred and 21
toys
left in the house of commons.
There's only 1 new 1.
Is there any anyone?
They only have... What that might not be

(35:13):
the case, but there's only 1 gain.
They only gained 1 seat in the whole
night and that was leads...
Well, I guess there'll be there'll be some
I'm sure there'll be some constituencies where the
incumbent m mp stood down and then you
could place 1 more. Yeah. So I I
think there's probably more than 1 new mp,
but Correct. Yeah. And your probably constituency wise.

(35:35):
And now, it looks like we're gonna have
Tory. They're... There's... They still... We still don't
know what a conservative leadership election is going
to look like. For now, Sun is staying.
As the,
like interim
leader seems like he's having a lovely time
as the leader of the opposition gorgeous.

(35:57):
But at the moment, there's all of these,
like, back office
meetings that are happening.
People are leaking
information and speeches that people have made.
It's all very
dramatic and clan. And I
I love. Shall we go through the and
riders? I think so. Yeah.

(36:17):
Oh, who
are you most scared of? Let's do it
like this.
Scared in the sense of, I would want
them to be prime minister.
Yes.
For the future of the country that the
Toy party.
Because it's country first,
party second.

(36:38):
I think... I mean,
this is is gonna gonna out me as
a a Soggy centrist interest, but
a out bra it seem a little bit
worrying just because she seems kind of un
unchanged
and slightly out of touch with reality.
That is that harsh?
No. I think she's a crazy lady.
You know what also I've kind of decided.

(37:00):
I think that she'd probably be really, really
nice to you 1 on 1.
But then,
casually over dinner will, like, slip out the
the tran... The,
pride flag is, like we're being invaded.
And then you're, like, did did Just say
that.
Yeah. Didn't... Know Didn't she say

(37:21):
cards. Maybe it wasn't her of
could be an even bit.
Is the trouble.
I mean, there's actually... There's to use your
word again, trifecta.
There's a trifecta of...
Can I say anti woke that is a
fair description of pretty Patel Ka knock and
Sur Bra? They've all had quite strong Yeah.

(37:42):
Anti work positions and that is
probably the main thing that ties their leadership
pitches together, and it's probably the main thing
that makes them notable as Mps, I would
say.
Yeah.
That really is their thing. Although I don't
really, it's only people who are terminally online
that I ever hear talk about,
like woke culture,
really? Yeah. That I... Well, I think some

(38:03):
of it has, like, bled into people who
read the male and stuff like that, but
otherwise, not really.
Yeah. But I I suppose the the whole...
I mean, the folk has
as a concept has big imported from America
en graft on British politics. And
but but I do think it it does
speak to...
I think it speaks to a broader concern

(38:25):
that certainly a lot of conservative voters would
have that the,
you know, there's... I... I mean, this is
a a long run thing in, in British
products in general are the of political correctness
and and all the rest of it. The
idea that there's people trying to do the
country down in various ways or under undermine.
Sort of fifth column as well. There's kind
of echoes of that in terms of anti

(38:45):
work rhetoric.
So I I do agree with you, but
I do think it's describes something that is
more generally felt. And secondly,
what happens on Twitter matters in as much
as
political politically engage people, such as us, such
as politicians, such as activists, do engage with
that stuff. Yeah. We that... Yeah. And then
we talk to others for some years.

(39:07):
So I don't think we should be allowed
to that should all stay online.
But, yeah, possibly. But is it, you know,
it does it does leak out ultimately.
I mean actually saw quite a. There's a
quite a funny speech during the rounds on
social media where Kenny Bad is
speaking to Angela Rain in their

(39:27):
roles as
set the secretary for the department that covers
housing
name escapes me at the moment,
and shadow to that role. U. And
yeah I think since the election Yeah. Yeah.
Since the election, I do... I mean it
it's quite funny. I mean, it's not
effectively Kelly Ban No Sent Rein that she's

(39:47):
been given a talk it that is slightly
una unbelievable
in terms of house building. And it is
is try to sort of raise this issue
that Angela Rain is constantly being
cons conspired against by K and his is
allies within the labour party.
And then Carrie Bad docs also talking about
some of the constraints that the labour party
or the labour is going to run into

(40:08):
as it tries to achieve these sort of
goals.
The delivery is quite funny. I think whatever
you think of coming bad knock as a
politician.
And I think I'm I'm most scared of
her. She's my number 1 scary. So, why
do you find it scary then?
Because I think she makes very extreme views.
I think she it... From what I've seen

(40:29):
she has very similar views to her so
Black.
But she is a much better communicator of
them. She's less likely to go off and
do something really, ko bananas and crazy,
like calling the fried flag like an hanging,
on regent street as like an.
Like she's not dumb enough to say that
kind of stuff, but I think she thinks
a lot of the same
thing things.

(40:52):
I think there's some truth to that. I
remember what the problem and signal was actually,
she. I think she was, let's say,
She was at the Popcorn thing in the
Us. At Pop the Uk,
body you're thinking of art... Is it Arp
pack or something?
I can't remember. But, like, Jacob r Was
there. This trust was also there.
Yes. Possibly is a national conservative conference in

(41:12):
the Us? Things was involved. Some like that.
It was just... Just before the the Republican
National convention She just wrapped up. Yes.
And she said that when she was government
minister, she just couldn't get the pride flag
removed from
her department building,
which
it's quite funny.
I I can sort see why...

(41:34):
I mean, she obviously doesn't like that flag
what it represents and I can see why
she wanted it removed but it. It doesn't
speak well as your own.
If that's right word effectiveness.
When
you can't get a flat removed for the
cover building.
But I think this was this was raised
as a kind of blob story that

(41:55):
the civil service has divided divided of its
own and won't won't comply. With conservative
ministerial demands, which III think there is some
truth to to be honest of you, but
I don't necessarily think the story reflects well
on her. Maybe maybe use some of your
clout as a fuck minister to do something
other than with me the fucking flag from
a building. Well, I mean, that that is
the main thing. I would say. Is it...

(42:15):
There was a question priorities there.
Getting So so there is that. III do
think you're right. I think that of the
for, you know, pretty patel Kelly Bad knock.
And sort of brave have all been known
for
actually sorts of
anti immigration views as well. As anti white
views, but Chem Bad nokia is

(42:35):
certainly from media reports I've read and from
what I've seen of her, the 1 that
seems the most professional and the least K
Bananas youngest as well. I think... Yeah. She's
in her forties.
Yeah.
So Think she's the youngest. And she's been
talked up as a potential
She feels like the future of the conservative
party.
She I think goes back to her. Right?

(42:57):
I think I did back her up 1
stage. Yeah. Whenever.
I think Pretty return is quite interesting. She
was... If not the first 1 of the
first
to
say, oh, I'm probably gonna run guys. Yeah.
And I found that really interesting because it
feels like she's been out because she stepped
down after
alongside Boris Johnson. She was home secretary for

(43:19):
all of bios johnson's
period as prime minister.
And then steps down, it felt like
I don't really know why she stepped down.
I found found the whole thing a little
bit weird. But I she was was.
Compared to she compared to Su and to
Ke.
She seems like a wet label in my

(43:40):
memory. I'm sure she isn't.
But I think she's less impressive
as like a speaker than the other 2.
And I... I've seen her speaker on panels
and that sort of thing, and she seems
fine.
Really?
I was gonna say she was actually sacked
when she was serving as a This is

(44:03):
This was under theresa Sam. She had an
extra extracurricular.
No. I think this was international development. Which
just it doesn't really seem like her back.
I think her her policy was, she was
the minister
of the department that she wanted to abolish.
Yeah. Yeah. I I think that sort of
but she she took her an extra extracurricular
meeting in Israel.

(44:26):
I then had to resign because it's kind
of again government protocol and and all the
rest of it.
And I think you're right. She did basically
just go down with the the Johnson government.
And
and then we haven't really heard very much
from her sense, actually,
which is kind of interesting. So
it'll be interesting see what

(44:46):
to how how... Well, she does. I I
think the sense is that this is why
the Brave story is has come up is
that she doesn't necessarily have the backing of
Mps. In order to become the next lead
leader of the tory party. And that's 1
decided that she's gonna move to reform has
been floated. So I think she's probably the
least slightly of the free to end up
as leader.
Mh. The only other person that's been floated
and this guy is very much on the,

(45:09):
more centrist
quote sensible side of the Tory party is
Tom Too. Tom. Oh, the Tub,
Tom Tug end hat.
Is it acceptable to mis mispronounce his name
in that way? I don't know what you're
talking about, but how it's it's phonetic? Is
it not Yeah. Yeah. Sure.
So he's a former soldier.

(45:32):
I think I have a feeling that he
wants in the wake of the Rush evasion
he came out and said,
something like we should,
ban Russians from coming to the country or
something crazy like that.
I
I'm allowed to look that before we publish
this to sure I'm not too favor again.
But
generally. I mean, he, he's been quite

(45:53):
bullish around foreign defense issues as he might
expect from somebody who said in the military.
I think he once had his phone hacked
by
or targeted by Chinese intelligence,
because he's he's been a big critic of
of China's sort of negative role in the
world.
Oh, he's he's actually been sanctioned by China.
China accused him of spreading lies and disinformation.

(46:17):
Fun. So I don't I don't know very
much about what else he stands for.
And I saw him... I saw give a
speech or defense wanted to remember was thinking
it was quite sensible, but
beyond that, I don't really have
a great view of him. And I I
don't...
And I guess if the stories want to
go for somebody who will seem fairly
you know, Star Arrest in the sense of

(46:38):
being a light, so the older guy in
a suit,
possibly with a chin
that, then, yeah, he he he'll be the
candidate go for. But
if if I had to put money on,
I would say the next leader of the
tour part is probably gonna be AAA
woman who is nor white, so it's gonna
be pretty patel and it's gonna be chemicals.

(46:59):
I that they seem to be doing the
man, woman, man, woman thing? Isn't it?
Do do you support this in general? Do
you think it... Well but it feels very
labor, but doesn't it?
Well Labour having.
I... Yeah, a female. Yeah They and they
they talk up, all female shortlist and,
has still yet to have a, a, woman
as leader.

(47:22):
I...
Well, like it feels like 1 of
that's write out Si, like, she's probably not
gonna,
she's probably not going to get through to
her final to or anything like.
But a... 1 of either pretty patel
inn versus a more centrist candidate like

(47:42):
Tom To hat.
What was the name of the
home secretary? The guy who was the foot
previous home secretary?
Hey, James Cl.
James Cleverly. Some people talked to about him
well and. But, yeah. He's... They they probably
like, the more centrist 1. So it's going
to probably be a run off between that

(48:02):
right wing element,
who all of color.
And
the centrist
blokes.
And
I don't know. I feel like before it
can... Because if we've learned anything from
this labor
victory, it's that,

(48:22):
when there isn't like a wedge issue like
Brexit or voting on being part part the
European Union or not. That I think carried
the conservatives over the last couple elections,
you need to win
the consensus of winning is like for... You
become a winning party from the.
But I think that the tory almost inevitably

(48:44):
going to attack right
because they fear form.
Before they then tax center
and can win.
I mean, that I don't know how long
those things are take took what was
like kind of the they ended up taking
in the Tony Blair years. I think, William
Hague was the first
tory leader. And the idea that William Hague

(49:06):
is right wing. His hilarious nowadays. Well, I
I think he... I think he was a
bit right wearing or at least here him.
He's a bit right way. He but he's
no fucking still. Is he? He's not no.
And then,
iain Duncan Smith,
we didn't mention Hilariously managed to keep his
seat
because
because the labour party selected its candida over

(49:26):
some,
you know, insider w and then she decided
to continue running as an independent and then
the it that split the labor votes.
And Ids imagine to sneak through at the
end, which is very funny.
So,
yeah. So so... And then, Michael Howard,
as well, have possibly in the wrong order.
But
yeah, they saw tax tact to the right,

(49:48):
and then finally, they chose David Cameron as
late later and he was obviously able to
win in 20 10.
So,
yeah. It's
I sort of set... I sense that's the
way they're going and, you know, but it's
kind of a question of how cha their
feeling in the the wake of labour
overwhelming victory.
And there's definitely a sense the vote is
more volatile now than

(50:10):
it was back in the new.
So I
I think that
Mean I think I think it... This is
thing. In 20 19, we were like, oh,
Boris Johnson, s, 80 seat,
Majority to use the the word of... The
docking. Dunking king. And the tory managed to
erode that majority throughout the course of the

(50:32):
parliament and then lose to labor in totally
spoke spectacular fashion.
1 election later. So
while at them lily, it looks like it'd
be impossible for labor to to lose this
completely lose majority at the next general election.
It... Yeah. It does feel like the vote
is more volatile than it used to be
It I suppose it's also worth saying then

(50:52):
that we didn't bring up in the previous
segment that there were quite a lot of
labor seats where they retain the seat, but
their majority was reduced people going off to
sometimes independent canada so sometimes the green party.
Yeah.
And III do think that's a weakness in
Labour current position is that they're at there's
quite a lot of
more let of left wing people who who
were willing not to back labor at the

(51:14):
election. I think Polly it because they they...
New labor we're gonna win. So like, what
I'll just vote for who I want to
vote for this time. Don't worry about tat
converting.
That's what the owner jones and Viral media
will Well, some people...
We know they're gonna get a huge majority
so vote who for whoever you want. Yeah.
And I I think some people clearly saw
it the same way. So...

(51:35):
But
I I think it's unlikely that, labor won't
be... Won't win a majority to the next
general, but there are... There's a few factors
in play
that do raise some questions over that, I
think.
Who do you think will be the next
tour leader.
I felt if you if I had to
bet an now I'd say. We also actually
technically don't know

(51:57):
what the process is gonna be. Well, yeah.
There is that. Yeah.
Because if it stands,
the parliamentary party, the hundred and 20 mps
will go through rounds to create a final
2, and then that goes to the membership.
Or they just choose whoever they want.
Like they did lift act. Yeah. I think
there's there's nothing stopping them just saying, we're

(52:17):
just go to cheese among ourselves, and, you're
Yeah. They have no
I didn't surprise if they tried to bypass
the membership after what happened with trust.
You know, I I kind of... I can
see why a if you remember a political
party, you would want the opportunity to vote
for who's gonna lead it, but I

(52:39):
I think when you've got established presence in
Parliament. So I wouldn't necessarily say this was
true of, like, a smaller party that only
has a handful of seats or a a
new party that doesn't have any seats
in the house of commons but,
I think it's kind of fine for a
major political party say, alright, we're gonna let
the mp decide the leader because, we just
think that makes more sense. And we think

(52:59):
it's more strategic. It it's likely to
put us in government next time around.
And if you don't like it, you could
let your membership card lapse,
I I think that... I I don't think
there's anything offensive anti democratic about that. I
I think it is a reasonable way to
to run a political party. So I wouldn't
even blame them for taking that sweet.

(53:20):
Okay.
It sounds like you disagree.
Wait Yeah. But I...
You wanna be. I'm busy and have to
leave soon. So
so we're here to,
formally...
Say that
shooting presidents, you shouldn't do that.

(53:41):
Is that your position? That's my official position.
Don't shoot precedence. Also anyone actually. If I
avoid? Pointing a gun at anyone.
Obviously, Americans you love rights.
I I don't have a gun, so
I die.
Well, what what about reasonable self defense?

(54:03):
Reasonable self... I just I'd
So Trump got shot in the ear.
I feel like everyone knows the details of
this, but Trump was at a rally outside
of Pittsburgh in Pennsylvania.
Yeah. So he's gonna carry that state in
November. That's good.
And a guy, even though there was there
was ample amounts of the Us security secret

(54:26):
service there.
That a guy climbed up on a roof
that had not been
occupied by the secret service snipers, and then
he took. So it 5 or 6 shots
at Trump and... Yeah. I've put a variety,
a a very number of shots shots. And
1 of them hit trump in the air,
1 of them killed somebody who was, sitting

(54:46):
in the stands behind. Yeah and
2 other people were were critically injured, but
now in a stable condition.
That's the background right. Right. And nas bad
and nas bad isn't it.
It is... Yeah. I mean, it is bad.
I'm Despite taking the book out of you.
I I'm j of the view that in

(55:07):
democracies, people shouldn't
shoot political candidates even when they dislike them.
In fact, I think I've probably said that
people shouldn't, throw milkshake over political candidates they
dislike
or a assault piece. Yeah. I. I think
I I think I grew with you about
the milkshake thing even though
it's so hard for me to say that
when it happens to an nigel for us.

(55:29):
And the thing is, it's okay people have
a tremendous cognitive distance with about this. It's
okay to find it very funny when somebody
throws a big book check garage and still
think it shouldn't happen. It's it... You could
hold those 2 thoughts in ahead at the
same time.
I do struggle with without jimmy.
They're not contradictory.
It's okay to laugh at some balls. I

(55:49):
think it should be happened.
Yeah.
So there... There's a few things that are
happening around the story.
2 of the
big
ones
there's maybe be 3 things I wanna... Oh,
you wanna touch on this Jimmy.
And, these 3 alone.
1, is the Sql service clearly fucked up.

(56:09):
Sure. Like yeah.
In retrospect, there the is who were there
on the ground, we're released slow to respond
to people who are at the rally,
pointing out the gunman taking his position on
the roof.
It's incredibly
embarrassing.
So there was... There's quite a famous or
infamous Bbc

(56:31):
interview with, a member of the crowd who
Yeah. Basically tells that story we were standing
there. We noticed the on the roof. We
pointed it out to
some... I think was police officers. I mean,
this is a this is what always happens
in situations like this is that various different
law enforcement agencies within the Us fail to
communicate with 1 another. Yeah. And that is
what causes the problem. But, yeah. Yeah.

(56:55):
So they
I can't remember what my point was. But
that... That's like a really,
bad thing. I believe there's an inquiry around
the lacks
like what went wrong there.
I think the second
thing
reading about this gunman respects my heart.
And I know that that's not really what

(57:16):
you're meant to feel when you read about
somebody who's try to kill somebody.
Seemed like commit, like an assassination.
But, I Think when I think we did
mention he he was killed by
he was he was think diapers. He's a
20 year old guy called Thomas Crooks.
I think his. Name is.
Yeah. And we don't a great deal about

(57:36):
him at the s.
It's it sounds like it's quite difficult to
find very much. He didn't have very much
of an online
footprint.
He was 20 years old there's been people
who who've been interviewed who went to school
with him, who various described him as,
someone who's the odd 1 out. He was
really... He didn't have any friends. He

(57:56):
wore... He was a bit gut obsessed, wore
cam,
wore surgical masks.
A lot.
There's...
He just seems like a really os sized,
lonely weird person. People said that he had
B and was bullied about it and on
a kind of the things. And whenever I
hear about, like, the way that people,
like, even though he's ended up doing an
awful

(58:17):
stupid thing,
it always really
it makes me feel really sad that he
had that
experience,
like that loneliness in school. I really empathize
with it. Well, this is this is trim
a lot of Gunmen and domestic. A lot
of them are. Yeah. The classic white
young white loner. Isn't it?

(58:38):
He was a registered
don't know how important this is. People are
really trying to make this like a... Oh,
he was... He donated to a liberal cause.
Like 2 years ago, or he's a registered
Republican. I don't think that really tells us
very much about it at all.
Because people... I was a registered conservative
party member for, like, 2 years as a
joke. Like, I don't... I don't think we

(59:00):
should
put too much weight on those kinds of
things.
Well, I mean, if you ever commit a
an active domestic tourism of jo, there's copious
information online about you. So... There is 2
years. You've got you've got a really feel
for the agents that gonna have to come
through your your case. It's gonna take them
years, I think. Poor guys. So many so
many picks.

(59:21):
III agree with what you're suggesting there that
I... From the information that has emerged, there's
nothing really coherent or cohesive. About what went
On. It didn't have a know. There's no
real, like motive that we seemingly not. I
mean, possibly, he was just apart from, like
killing an person episode. Yeah. Say possibly,
you know, this is harsh. He was just

(59:42):
a a loser who decided to do something
dramatic, which
you know. Well, was actually to be fair.
Was the case in the the Jfk
assassination.
The, I forget the guy's name, but he
was just Mean, that guy had much more
political history than than Thomas Crooks. But
it's at Leigh Harvey oswald world. Is that
the guy's name?

(01:00:02):
Sure. But
and I think he'd had connections with. I
think he'd lived abroad in a communist country,
but found it wasn't really to his liking,
and he was sort of kind of disillusioned
and dis disinfected.
But you know, often it, it's people who
who feel a bit
isolated
and unimportant and they want to feel important.
And that that seems to be a major

(01:00:23):
motivation in quite a lot of these cases.
Mh.
But it it may have no real political
meaning, which is is a weird thing to
say about a an attempted assassination of a
former Us president.
Apart from the fact that
means that Trump's probably gonna win now. So
is this your third point that you wanted
to get to?
Oh, it wasn't.

(01:00:43):
I think my third point is... The third
1. I think, Actually, I don't think we
really
may I propose that we don't really talk
about, like, the effect on that... I think
that that topic has been done to death.
Like the fact that this is,
boosted Trump's numbers.
Biden is probably going to drop out in
the next couple of days. It seems like,
he's really struggling after the debate performance that

(01:01:04):
was really dire a few weeks ago.
Well, my my sense is, I don't think
it it will have a long term impacts
on the Us election. I think there's possibly
been a a short term boost to Trump's
polling numbers and
perhaps in in Pennsylvania
that will be more long lasting, but in
general, I'm with the analysts who think that

(01:01:25):
it's not really gonna matter come November. That
people will have
forgotten about it or it will be in
the back of their minds
right to the back, that it's not really
impacting their decision making at the pot at
the ballot box.
I just don't.
I understand people who were like, oh, you
know, this is big when it happened, like,
this is gonna... This is guaranteed. He's gonna

(01:01:45):
win.
I I don't...
It seems a bit of a bit of
a nothing really in the end.
I would say.
So the thing that I I don't know
if I agree of that. I think this
is, like,
I think this is the thing that pushes
it over to Trump.
Winning.

(01:02:05):
The thing that I do think is interesting
for us to talk about is
So you kyle gas
of 10 d.
I'm so pleased to break this up.
While on tour in America,
10 is like a a comedy rock band,
headed by Jack Black. Yes.

(01:02:26):
And they on antonio in Australia and it
was
the Guitar Kyle gases
birthday and they asked him for a birthday
gift for a birthday wish before he blew
out the candles. Mh. And he said, for
them to not miss next time.
He said he said Trump expert it's explicitly.
He said, don't miss trump next time. Yeah.
Yeah. Yeah.

(01:02:47):
And
The audience laughed. They then they after because
they're Australians, you know, long.
The audience laughed because it funny.
I think.
I think
condemn and
but then they had to cancel the rest

(01:03:08):
of their tour. The rest of they didn't
have to. They didn't have to... So they
chose... Okay. They chose to
cancel this time at all. Chat Black who
is a is a guy who I Generally
a buyer because III think he's really funny.
I've I've liked a lot of the stuff
he's done. And I... He's...
My favorite streamer, Jack Black. Of what 8
Does he do twitch streams or something? He
does. Okay. I believe those are good. Knowing

(01:03:29):
about. But
per pathetic behavior, like, you know, carried on
with a gig got out of it like,
a day later or something when the backlash
was brewing was like, Oh, you know, I
caught off guards at the gig. Guy I
I condemn political violence yet yada yada. I
put the band on hold and Mike.
He's had a 30 year partnership with Kyle
Gas.
And
is some loyalty? There's is that, like, out

(01:03:51):
of the question, I... I'm not saying you
have to you know, If if if you
may be honest, I think it... I would
be scared,
if I were in their position to put
to align myself so clearly
as like a... An enemy of
the mag of the republicans.
But like,
you know, I think that you
comedy Ro acts I think I know. But

(01:04:13):
I don't... But the but the republicans do
not care and they are a Banana as
bunch. Did you see them all wearing the
fake air bandages?
Advantages. Yeah, to in it's in Sell Solids
trump, But I mean, they were good... I
mean just finish the tour. They were they
rid the Australia and to go to Go
finish the tour. People forgot about it, you

(01:04:33):
know, come back to the Us and then
let... You Do what you're gonna do anyway,
Leave it a bit then organize another
tour at sub... It's a comedy act. Like,
just say, you know, it was a joke.
It was clearly a joke. It was cleaned
delivered as a it's clearly received as a
joke.
People can make jokes about current affairs even
seriously but give much here. It's so interesting

(01:04:55):
here.
Nobody...
It is not joke material. I really like
it. Yeah. It is very. So it almost
feels like
I remember when Queen elizabeth have died and
some Americans and not, like, non brits
wanted to make jokes about her dying.
Immediately, and I was like.

(01:05:17):
I I I'd take those Jokes. Maybe Ba
would have because you're... I've make
Eat you, I think you did, actually.
And I think that, like, this is a
similar thing where
for a lot of us foreigners.
Like, political violence is actually very, very scary.

(01:05:39):
And I think that this happening is really
scary for a lot of people. And I
don't think a lot of... There are few
Americans who find this funny right now. To
the point where beyond the... When it happened,
everybody was, like, because I live in New
York where I live. And so I'm I'm
on the ground. Experiencing this firsthand. But new
New york isn't in very democrat leading place.
It is, but even here Jimmy people are

(01:06:00):
like
skirt around it, don't say. But that that's
what's interesting about it, that's when. Mh. You
know, if it was a very Republican state
you could understand the
taboo that's been erected around it, but it
is interesting that even in a a relatively
left place.
And you were. It does feel very egg
actually. Yeah. Very actually.
That is very interesting.

(01:06:23):
It's...
I, he wasn't that more interesting than Us
go like, oh, When Biden got do a
power.
Mean III still stand on my comments about
Chad Black. I do you think. Because now
Kyle Gas has apologized. I just think it's
it's ridiculous the whole thing.
I think it was obviously a joke that
should have been taken to the spirit, it
was obviously intended. I would say. Mh. And,

(01:06:45):
actually, you know should tell him that pre
the era of smartphone
they'd have made that joke. The audience would
have enjoyed it. Would have got a home.
Never would have bled up. Never would have
been a thing. And yeah.
It would have been fine.
It is a... I mean, maybe this is
an exactly connected, but
there is a solid old thing about American

(01:07:05):
culture, which is in in many ways is
is more free wheel and at least has
the image of being more free willing than
British culture, but there is an odd attitude
a difference towards politicians. And
the military as well actually that you just
don't really get in the Uk. I I
think if if somebody attempted to assassinate a
British prime minister.

(01:07:25):
I think people would have been much more
comfortable making jokes about it.
Judging by what you said.
Mean, I certainly heard loads of jokes about
the queen and the royal family in the
wake of. Well, remember, I I don't think
where was much hard about it for in
my circles.
Well, I think the closest thing we've had
in recent days in recent years,

(01:07:45):
sure the Queen's death. Mh but,
remember when
not Trump.
Johnson got Covid. Yeah. Yeah.
I think that was kind of like of
it. But I remember everybody was like our
I've god I hope he dies.
That's kinda what I mean.
Yeah. I mean, Ed,

(01:08:06):
you know, Yeah. Sure. Condemn condemn condemn. There
is a not insignificant contained portion of the
population. It wouldn't mined
sig junk killed.
Don't think he's a particularly pleasant person.
Yeah. And we condemn each and every 1
of those people.
Oh, there's certainly
con
d.

(01:08:27):
That certainly s with the there would be
Assassins
position. Is this is the is this is
the sympathize in the room with us right
now? No. Because III do think it would
have been totally. I mean, when I first
heard the news, I thought, I... Because I,
I didn't realize that, I think it was
before it was revealed that Trump was okay.
I'm like, oh,
this is a good example a Joke culture.

(01:08:48):
I texted her friend said, oh, it looks
like the second American Civil War is about
to starts.
So, you know, Ceo guy. I... Even I
don't find that funny. That movie that came
out called Civil war, which is like, what
if the Us went to war with itself?
I don't need... That's too close to reality.
I don't need that. That's not escape his

(01:09:10):
for me. That's horror.
Okay. I think got that night. We should
we should wrap things up here.
I think So. Yeah yeah.
We're gonna do it about a second on
or the something. And if you're you're interested
in and what that something might be, then
you can you can sign up via the
usual. Yeah. We haven't decided what it is

(01:09:31):
that. It'll be like a little. It'll be
incredibly
interesting mate. Yeah. That'd be great.
Okay.
But yeah. I see some on the other
side and see the rest of you next
main episode.
Bye. Bye bye.