Ep. 690: Understanding Big Old Buck Behavior with Todd Graf

Episode Transcript
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Speaker 1 (00:01):
Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast, your guide to
the whitetail woods, presented by First Light, creating proven versatile
hunting apparel for the stand, saddle or blind. First Light,
Go Farther, Stay Longer, and now your host, Mark Kenyon.

Speaker 2 (00:19):
Welcome to the Wired to Hunt podcast. This week on
the show, we're chatting with Toddgraf of bowhunting dot Com
about the habits, personality, traits and behaviors of the biggest
oldest bucks he's ever hunted. All right, welcome back to

(00:41):
the Wired to Hunt podcast, brought to you by First
Light and their Camo for Conservation initiative, in which every
purchase of their white tail Camo products, if you pick
up their Solitude jacket or the Origin hoodie or anything
like that in the specter cameo pattern, which is the
whitetail pattern, a portion of that purchase goes back to

(01:03):
and is donated to the National Deer Association to help
them towards their mission of working towards deer and deer hunters.
Good stuff, right there. So today on the show, we
are kicking off a brand new series this month of September,
as deer hunting seasons are kicking off all over the country.
We're going to talk to a handful of some of

(01:23):
the best deer hunters across the country about the biggest
oldest bucks they've ever hunted. We're diving into the minds,
the personalities, the tendencies, the vulnerabilities of really old bucks.
Now here's the thing about old bucks. They are really cool.
But I want to point out the fact that you

(01:45):
don't need to chase big old bucks. So don't think
when you're here in this episode, in the next couple
that by any means you should feel obligated to chase
the deer like this. If you are into shooting the
first dear, you see more power to you. You are
a newer hunter and you are just figuring this stuff out.
Please do not think that you need to chase a
five or six year old buck. It is hard just

(02:07):
to kill a dough. It is hard just to kill
a year and a half old deer. Figure it out easier,
way into it. Enjoy every step of the process. Don't
feel any pressure to chase after one of these deer
or to do something like you're hearing about here today.
That said, if you are in a place where you
are interested in mature deer. These shows are definitely for you,

(02:27):
and you can learn a lot even if you're not
chasing deer like this. There's a lot to be learned here.
But if you appreciate a big, old stinky buck the
way that I do, there's nothing wrong with that either.
There is something special about a buck, a white tail buck,
when they get to that age of you know, five
or six or seven or older than that, in some places,

(02:50):
they just become a different creature. They move different, they
think different, They act in a way that causes all
the other deer around them to act differently. And when
you're gonna hunt them, you have to realize that. You
have to realize that this is a different ballgame. When
you're trying to chase those oldest of the deer that

(03:10):
top five percent of the age bracket in your neck
of the woods, those deer operate on a different plane.
And so this month we're gonna try to dig into
I'm trying to get behind the scenes, try to lift
up the covers on what those old bucks lives are like.
And to do that today, we're kicking it off with
mister Todd grafft Todd's one of the founders of bowhunting

(03:31):
dot Com, one of the co hosts of Bowhunt or Die,
a terrific YouTube series, and a diehard, longtime, super serious
whitetail bowhunter from Illinois. Spent a lot of time there
in his home state, done a lot of hunting in
Wisconsin and around that neck of the woods. He's killed
a lot of big, old deer. He's chased a whole

(03:52):
bunch of these old, gnarly grizzled mature bucks, the ones
that I know a lot of us lose a lot
of sleepover. So Todd's got a lot of experience to
bring to the table. He's got some strong perspectives, some
interesting ideas, and some great stories. So that is what
we get into here today, and then over the next

(04:12):
four weeks we'll have a whole bunch more of that
from some other folks too. So before we get into
that conversation with Todd, though, I do want to give
you a couple quick updates. Number one, One Week in
November Season two is now live on the meat Eater
YouTube channel. Hopefully you all caught one Week in November

(04:34):
season one. That was the show that I co hosted
over there. It came out in two thousand and twenty one.
I think it was. Maybe it was twenty one or
twenty I can't keep track. It's all kind of blur.
I'm pretty sure it's twenty one. But the idea of
the show is that it follows myself and four other
folks from the med Eater Whitetail team as we all

(04:54):
hunt across the country in different places on the same
seven days during one week in November, and each episode
follows one day. So episode one follows our experiences on
November first, Episode two shows our day on November two,
and so on, and so you get to foul along
with the white Tail Rut across wildly different places with

(05:16):
different people hunting in different ways. So it's very interesting
kind of getting that thirty thousand foot perspective of what
the rut looks like across the country during that week.
And it's a lot of fun too, you know, including myself.
There's also Tony Peterson, Spencer Newharth, Clay Newcomb, and Giannis
Ptellus joined us this year too, so we have a
lot of fun. We talks and smack and we shoot

(05:37):
some deer and episodes one and two are out now
and there is a very exciting hunt from yours truly
on there. That starts in episode one. It ends in
episode two, so highly recommend you check that out. If
you heard my story last year during the fall about
the Nebraska hunt, that's what you can watch now, So
head on over to the Meat Eater YouTube channel to

(05:58):
check that out. Hope you enjoy that. Update number two
rut Fresh Radio is kicking off this week, so hopefully
you already heard the first episode, which came out I
believe yesterday. But every Wednesday during the hunting season, we
have a mini series that comes out called rut Fresh Radio.
If you're not familiar, hopefully you are. It's been going

(06:19):
on for seven or eight years. But if you're new,
what this show is is, it's a short, maybe thirty
ish minute episode every Wednesday in which we hear from
four or five different hunters across the country in different
places every week, and we're asking them, what's the activity
been like from a deer hunting perspective, What have you
been seeing, What are the deer doing, what are they

(06:39):
keying in on, How are they, you know, relating to
certain things, how are they adjusting to weather conditions or
the moon phase? Or temperature or whatever might be going
on that week in the woods. We are asking them
to report back to us and then also predict, you know,
what should we expect over the next seven days. So
each week you're gonna get updates from different really good

(07:00):
deer hunters across the country to hearing about you know,
exactly what they're doing now and what you should be
thinking about in the coming days. It's it's a super
helpful resource I've found, at least for myself and hopefully
you do too. So that kicks off this week and
then every week for the rest of the hunting season
on Wednesday, so be sure to keep an eye out
for that as well. Last update here for you, I've

(07:23):
got another one of my Working for Wildlife tour events
coming up here at the end of September. If you
are down in the South, this is the event for you,
September twenty third. We're going to be in Mississippi in
the DeSoto National Forest. This is kind of I was
looking as kind of equidistant between Lake New Orleans and
I think Mobile, Alabama, Mobile Mobile Mobile. I don't know

(07:46):
how you guys say it down there, but it's that
city down in Alabama. That's where we're going to be at.
I want to see you, I want to shake your hand,
I want to take some pictures, we want to tell
some stories, and I want to do some good work
on the landscape for deer and turkeys and other c
We're going to be improving some wildlife habitat, a whole
bunch of different things we're gonna be doing down on
that National Forest to make it better for critters, to

(08:07):
make it better for hunters, and then we're gonna have
a good time afterwards, catching up, having a little social event,
and just enjoying ourselves here at the beginning of hunting season.
So please, if you've got a little extra time in
the middle of your day on September twenty third, would
love to meet you and spend some time. And I
really do believe that it's a little bit of donation

(08:28):
of your time there to volunteer to do some stuff
there on the land, but it's going to payback dividends.
I've done four of these now this year, and every
single one of them, I've had a blast, felt really
good coming out of it, made new friends, and I
just left me energize moving on from there. So I
think that will be a good thing for all of
us as we kick off the hunting season here. So
September twenty third in Mississippi, heading over to oh Google

(08:52):
Google the Working for Wildlife Tour to find the website
that will give you all the details for that. That's
probably your best bet and you can register at that website,
so please do that September twenty third. Hope to see
you there. And now with all that out of the way,
let's get to our main event today, my conversation with
Todd Graf and digging into the nitty gritty of the

(09:14):
biggest oldest bucks he has ever hunted. I hope you
guys enjoyed it all right here with me Now on
the line, we've got Todd Graf. Welcome to the show. Todd, Hey, Mark,

(09:36):
as always, thanks for having me. For sure, man, I'm
glad we're doing this. We've been in touch over the
years for a long time, and I'm pretty sure you
contributed on one of our Rough Fresh radio episodes at
some point along the way, but I don't think we've
done a main show, so this has been a long
time coming and I appreciate you making time to do this.

Speaker 3 (09:54):
Mark I'm gonna be honest with you. I just I'm
looking at you, I'm talking it. I just, I mean,
I remember the first time we met, literally when you
were working for Google, and I mean, what are we
talking about? Is that? Seriously ten years right now? How
many years was that? Now?

Speaker 2 (10:09):
It's it's pushing closer to like thirteen, fourteen years. I know,
it's we're getting old.

Speaker 3 (10:18):
I was trying to keep it less than more, but
holy cow, it is time fly for sure.

Speaker 2 (10:23):
It's nuts. But somehow we're still here, still doing this,
having a good time, so that that's got to count
for something, right.

Speaker 3 (10:31):
Hey, we both got smiles on our face. We know
we are weeks. Well, I'm actually five days a week.
So I'll be hunting in New Mexico here on some
private land for ELK in about four or five days
from now. So I'm pretty excited. Yeah, so we know
the best time of the year is right here, so.

Speaker 2 (10:50):
Coming, It's so true. So opening day in Illinois is
October first, Right, How are you feeling leading into the
Homestaate opener?

Speaker 3 (11:00):
You know, I'm feeling pretty good. You know how we
are as white tail guys. I mean it's almost like
I'm talking to you, you start feeling like you have anxiety.
You know, you're starting to think like, oh my gosh,
I didn't go to that stand or I didn't do this.
But you know, Justin and I were even talking the
other day, and you know what, sometimes some of the
best hunts and some of the best year you shoot

(11:21):
sometimes are come from the stands that you haven't completely
prepped and you haven't done all the workload on. Sometimes
some of the best hunts are those ones where you
are either a traveling between those normal stands that you
hunt and something catches your eye and it draws you
in and then before you know it, you're hanging a
stand or jumping in the saddle. And sometimes some of

(11:42):
those hunts are some of the best ones, right, and
not always those ones that you have completely prepped and
have gotten ready to answer your question, I got a
couple of good ones, and I'm I'm feeling good, feeling
good good. Now.

Speaker 2 (11:58):
I know last year, kreit Ho, I'm wrong, but I
think last year your big big goal for the twenty
twenty two season was to kill a buck on your
new farm. Didn't happen the year before, So twenty twenty
two is all about getting one of these big deer
out there. Do you have a specific goal like that
or something different for this season out there or any
of your properties.

Speaker 3 (12:19):
Yeah, you are, first of all, you are correct. I
mean the first year that I bought my farm, I
was not able to successfully get the buck, my target
buck that I was after, the buck that I would
have liked it, I think died from e HD. Unfortunately,
we the neighbor, found that the buck that I wanted
it was a named kickstand. I was able to successfully
get that deer in year two over some property improvements

(12:41):
that I made on the property. So anytime you can
make improvements to a property your own and then you know,
be rewarded for the you rewarded for the efforts that
you put in is always always makes you feel good
for sure. You know, that was a woodland pond that
I put in kind of a nice high up on
top of a ridge that really worked out well. As
far as this year spot. It is a great spot.

(13:05):
And I actually went there about two days ago and
set a set a camera and we were driving in
there and our new guy Paul that's working for us,
we were driving and he's you know, he reminds me
of me when I was, you know, twenty two or
twenty three years old. And he's super excitable, right, you know,
and he's like, whoa, dude, there's a buck over there.
You know. I'm like, I'm like, Paul, dude, don't be yelling.

(13:26):
Just take take it down a notch man. We just
we want to act cool. We want to act like
we're just we want to act like we're that farmer
that's just just driving along. Man. He's almost jumping out
of the ranger. I'm like, whoa, take it easy, but
we want to get in it out of here stealth
mode wise. But honestly, this particular year, you know, anything

(13:47):
can show up. We don't to spend a bunch of
time in this, but I just I don't have a
target buck on that property. This year that I've seen
that I'm excited about, I really have done. I've been
working a little mini series, you know, and we've been
doing a lot of work on the property. Might've just
done some big, big projects that are honestly bigger than

(14:08):
what I'm used to doing. So some of these things,
you know, this big you know equip program I did,
It was like one hundred and ten loads or something
of rock they brought in to fix erosion, and so
many of the projects that I'm doing, Honestly, they're not
everybody always wants to do things necessarily for dear, dear, dear,
dear dear. This is more about everything, habits, rabbits, habitat, rabbits,

(14:32):
just everything. I just want everything, honestly, you know. So
it's more of a whole. Once I do what I'm
doing with this property, all the critters will ultimately want
to be on it at some point.

Speaker 2 (14:45):
So I think that's awesome.

Speaker 3 (14:48):
It's fun, it's fun.

Speaker 2 (14:50):
Yeah. So, so there's not a super I don't want
to say super exciting, but but there's not one yet
that has your attention. The theme for this month of
September here on the podcast, Todd is going to be
kind of exploring the hard to understand behind the curtain

(15:12):
mysterious world of those biggest oldest mature bucks, right, those
ones that fascinate us, those ones that keep us up
at night. That's what we're going to try to kind
of dial in on this month.

Speaker 4 (15:26):
Yeah.

Speaker 2 (15:27):
I've watched many many of your hunts over the years, Todd.
I've seen you chase big really old bucks, you know
for years now. I actually, just just for old time's sake,
I went back and watched the video of that one
hundred and ninety two inch buck you killed back I
don't know, ten plus years ago. Man, he was something.
But I'm curious what is it about a super mature

(15:53):
buck or mature bucks in general? But what is it
about that kind of deer that gets you so excited
and make who's so fascinated? Why is this something that
you you know, pursue to this degree and obsess over
to the degree that you do. You know, all deer cool,
but there's something about that really old buck. What's that

(16:15):
for you?

Speaker 3 (16:18):
That's a great question. I mean, that's that's a million
dollar question, right. It's the thing that just keeps is
coming back year after year. And I think that it's
funny because that is something that I think about. Right,
There's other sports and there's other things that we do
in our lives that kind of come and go, right,
like they kind of like come in your life and
then you're kind of like all hell bent about it.

(16:38):
You want to go get I don't know, I don't golf,
but whatever, you go out and buy a new golf clubs.
You're all excited or maybe it's yeah, you know, who
knows what. Right, there's all these different things that's kind
of come in and come out. But man, when it
comes the white tail hunting deer, I mean, man, I'm
as ate up with it at fifty one years old
as I was when I was saying, I mean, I

(17:00):
just love it, right, I mean, and I think truthfully
what it is. It's it's I'm actually getting like the
goosebumps right now. You know, it's different every year, right,
Like what's so fun about it is no deer is
the same. It's always different. The racks are different, the land,

(17:22):
the spots moving around, the stories, how it happens. It's
always new. It's not the same kind of just same thing.
It's always something different. And I don't know, it keeps
me coming back every year, you know. I mean, and
I'm just fueled about it now. You did bring up

(17:43):
that one hundred and ninety two inch dear, And we
want to stay focused to help people think about big Bucks.
And I wish I could honestly look in the eyeballs
mark and tell you I've killed you know, I have
this pedigree of killing you know, the most maturest monster
bucks in the world. I'm really good at finding them,
and it seems like everyone else always gets them. But

(18:05):
I have killed. I have killed some really good ones
in my life, for sure. And when you ask me
the question if I had a big one that I
was chasing, you asked it in a way that it
was in regards to my current farm, right And I
don't have one there, but I absolutely have a big

(18:26):
one that I really, really really will be putting a
significant amount of effort into this year. And it's a
little disheartening because it's not on my farm where I
want to be, and I have all my stuff and
I've done all this work, and it's like I kind
of want to be there mentally, But if I truly
want to get a big one like that one ninety two,

(18:48):
I'm going to have to hunt somewhere else. And I
think that's something that people have to keep in mind,
of course, when it comes to kill in big bucks. Right, Listen,
we all have trail cameras, we all have cellular cameras,
we're all running these things. At some point, you just
can't lie to yourself. They don't the cameras don't lie,
and we ought listen, every one of us want to

(19:09):
sneak into a stand and we never ever ever want
to lose the dream of that big monster, you know,
drop tyme gnarly Buck just coming through the woods. You know,
you know, we never want to lose that, right because
that's what keeps us getting up in the morning and
getting out there and going for it. Right. Well, let's
be honest, sometimes cellular or not cellular, but sometimes trail

(19:31):
cameras in general could take that away a little bit
because even like me at my current farm, like eh,
I'm just not seeing it. That doesn't mean that it's
not living somewhere else, which is a big topic that
we're going to talk about in this podcast because you know,
and I think I listened to one of your podcasts recently,
or maybe it was one of your other hosts that was,
you know, talking about Doze and you know, understanding the

(19:51):
Doze and Bucks want to be in a different place.
We'll get there, but I do have the point that
I was trying to make so it doesn't get lost
is specifically, at some point you can't lie to yourself
if you're hunting a spot and you truly, truly want
to kill a monster bucket. You say, Hey, listen, I've
killed the one twenties, I've killed the one thirties. I

(20:12):
on one hundred and fifty inch buck. Like, listen, at
the end of the day, if the data that you have,
either through scouting, your eyes, trail cameras, friends that hunt
the farm with you, whatever, if the deer's not there,
the deer's not there, you got to move on. You
got to go somewhere else, You got to find a
different spot. So to your point, absolutely, I do have

(20:34):
a sweet buck that I want to shoot this year,
and I'm going to be putting most of my effort
into that deer, even though it's completely far away from
my current spot, and I'll just have to deal with
not being able to be where I really want to
be with because of the moneies that I spent in
the efforts I put in. But this deer here is

(20:56):
living in a spot that is very, very very similar
to that one hundred and ninety two inch buck that
you brought up. And I recently did a little video
on overlooked hunting spots, and I think in the point
that we're trying to make is mature bucks do things

(21:21):
differently than what everybody else is doing, period, and your
brain has to get wired that way. Like we want
to go to the food plots. Why because it's fun,
it's exciting. You know you're going to have activity. You
know you're going to see deer. Generally, you've set these
spots up and because of the day that we live

(21:43):
in now, everyone's smart enough to realize, hey, if I
do a food plot, I'll set up two different stands
for two different wind directions. So it's easy, it's convenient,
you're going to have activity. You don't go home after
a weekend feeling like that was the least Yeah, yeah,
oh I didn't see anything. But when you start truly
trying to get the big guys, you're not going to

(22:04):
be going to those type of spots. You're looking for
those overlook spots. And per that conversation you brought up
with that one n it was a nasty cattail, smaller trees, CRP,
just low kind of a low area where I think

(22:27):
those areas are a little bit cooler, where it's not
as hot during those summer days where they could be
a little bit down and it's just kind of a.
I don't want to say it's like some big nasty
cattail swamp like my Wisconsin piece of property was, but
it's just this low lying area where they're just not
getting pressured. And I think when it comes to these

(22:48):
mature deer, it's about pressure. And I'm sure you've seen.

Speaker 2 (22:52):
That too, Yeah, yeah, At what age do you think
you see the biggest chain in a buck's behavior? Like
like when we talk about like a super like a
very mature buck, you start hearing people talk about different
behavior changes that they tend to see in them. For you,
where have you seen that? Like I might say, like

(23:13):
in my experiences, I was thinking about this, like I've
always seen a big change from a three year old
to a four year old where they go from like
a crazy teenager to like an adult sort of. But
then the five year olds, at least the five year
olds I've ever been been able to hunt become like ghosts.
So I almost think that from four to five it's
been bigger in my experience. At least, where have you

(23:35):
seen that? Or is there is there a totally different
category of maturreyer that I've never seen? Like do they
do something totally different at six or seven or eight,
because I've never got to hunt a deer like that.
Where do you see that big transition occurring from a
behavior standpoint?

Speaker 3 (23:53):
I'm just you know, again, I can only relate this
to deer that I know that I've chased, you know.
So when I think of the bigger dear that I chase,
I think a sweetness. You probably remember that buck that
was a two hundred and twenty inch buck here shot
in Illinois by a good friend of mine, Mike, you know.
And I chased the daylights out of that deer and
finally had a chance sent him at late season. It
was a sixty yard shot and I don't feel comfortable taking,

(24:15):
you know, far shot, so I didn't shoot, and then
we ended up getting him the following year. And when
I think of sweetness, I think of that other big
buck coke Can that Kirk shot, you know on our team,
that was a big deer that I that I passed
that ended up getting a couple of years down the
road and really turned out to be a monster old buck. Again,
not necessarily a huge rack, but just old deer. So

(24:36):
I think I think what you said is pretty much
spot on. It seems like that that and the way
you and the way you posed it is pretty spot
on too, right, Like they're they're these wild teenagers and
they're full of and maybe they're just that way too
because they're trying to find their spot and they're trying
to find their place in the hierarchy, because there's always
somebody older than you, and there's always that, you know,

(24:58):
a deer that is probably already holding onto those quote
unquote better spots. Like if you're bass fishing, it seems
like there's certain spots you can always go to if
that tree limb comes out, it's like you can almost
always get a fish off it. But that's not necessary
where the big one is, right, So I think you're right.
I mean, it's at least from what I've seen from
trail camera data and the bucks that I've chased, it

(25:21):
seems like when they hit that four and a half boy,
they get elusive. Last year, we were chasing a pretty
big buck and on a different farm we were chasing,
and man we had we were getting shots of him
early season, cool deer, big deer, and just like you said,
light bulb went off, that deer was gone. And truly,

(25:42):
it's a special deer. This is a great buck. And
he disappeared off the radar and gone nothing on this deer.
And would you believe it, he's still alive. We just
got a picture of him, you know, a few weeks ago.
So just crazy enough. Like I mean, they got those
underground caves dug out somewhere, and they they don't get big.

(26:11):
They don't listen, they don't get that big being stupid.
They just don't. And and I don't know sleep listen.
I don't think they wake up in the morning and
have grafts and power points and charts and are tracking
every movement. You know that we do. I don't think
their brains work that way, you know, at all. I
think when it comes down to it, they know where

(26:33):
they're being bumped and where they're not being bumped. And
you know, the best, we always whenever I talk to
my friends, I always think about the same thing I'm
telling you, Like, PTSD is a real thing, right, And
if you're laying in your bed at night and you're
all cozy and you're sleeping there with your wife, I
promise you, if a fricking burglar comes busting through that

(26:53):
door and you fly out of that bed. I promise
you you're not going to sleep very good and that
bed for a long time to come. And we've all
been mister sneaky, tiptoeing into these spots that we know,
like we're a foot away from taking a step where

(27:14):
we know we know we're gonna bust one at any second,
right because you could just tell by the way the
spot looks, and I promise you you can. Man, you
can only get away with doing that a couple of times,
and they're not coming back. So personally, I just think
those big deer as they age, if they want to live,
they don't want to be bothered, They don't want to

(27:35):
be around all that dough pressure. They find those spots
where they're just not being pressure all the time. It's
like looking for a used car. Everyone always wants what, Man,
I found this car that was in this seventy five
year old ladies garage. She's never driven it. It's unbelievable,
it's never been touched, right, Like, we're all looking for
these hunting spots that they do exist, But what's the

(27:59):
first thing we do when we usually find these spots?
Walk all over go and then what do we do
the trail cameras follow and then maybe a food plot follows,
and then maybe oh gosh, I can't figure the spot out. Hey, Mark,
you got to You got a couple hours this weekend. Listen,
I need you to come over and take a look
at this spot, and and and and hey, that's fine.

(28:22):
If you want to bring Rover, you know, bring go
ahead and bring Rover to he can take a walk
along with us. You know, the bottom line, those best
spots that we find that are untouched whatever. Call it
the sanctuary, you call it the back forty, call it,
whatever you want to call it. Those spots do exist.

(28:45):
And if you can find them, know where they are,
stay out of them and figure out how to I mean,
you talk about that one hundred and ninety two inch
buck man, everything about killing that one ninety two, because
I that that was in the early days of filming
and I and I I wasn't filming everything that I
was doing, you know, some of the other encounters I
had with them and so forth. But everything about shooting

(29:09):
that deer was entry point and exit critical. I mean
it was I had the most pinpoint way of being
able to get in and get out, and it was
putting down the most minimal amount of scent and not
disturbing that key, betting your ear where he was, where

(29:29):
he was hung up. That was number one. Number two,
it was making sure that I just didn't go in
there on the wrong wind, because just because they're getting
in and out, if all of a sudden you're sitting there,
we've all been there before, We're sitting there, and all
of a sudden you're like that, you know, you feel
it against the back of your ears, and you're like, oh,
you know, and and what's the worst man? The worst

(29:50):
for me is I'm a filmer. So I'm sitting there,
going do I want to tear down all this equipment now?
And the answer should be yes, right, your brain, your
everything in your body's telling you no, I should move
right now. But then you're like, well, maybe it's going
to change an hour from now or maybe this, but
you probably have already blown it, you know. So I

(30:13):
think to answer your question specifically, I think you're right.
At four and a half, they start really just becoming
a lot harder to find, and their movements just become
a lot more at night, a lot more you know, nocturnal,
and that they're a little bit harder to pick up
and locating.

Speaker 2 (30:42):
You mentioned the entry and exit for that one, and
you said that was a just bulletproof entry and exit.
Can you describe how you were actually doing that that
made it so effective for a way to get in
and out?

Speaker 3 (31:00):
It was just easy, to be honest with you, you know,
I wish I could tell you, like this was like
super strategic. The area that I was hunting Number one
was flat. Anyone that hunts enough realizes that if you
can if the topology is flat, then the wind is
going to always be so much more consistent. You start

(31:23):
getting into any kind of hilly country and mountains, and
you know, you got your place in Idaho and whatever.
I mean, you start hunting different train. Anytime you start
hunting topology, topology, you know, you know, anytime you start hunting,
you know where it's hilly valleys, bottom areas, lowlands, and

(31:43):
you can't keep the wind consistent. Dude, it's a it's
a whole nother ball of axe. I mean, truthfully, I
was kind of fortunate when I first started hunting my
Wisconsin swamp. Dude, it was like flat, and then my
and then and then hunting here and ill More in
the northwest suburbs of Chicago where we live, it's flat.

(32:05):
So that particular entry point when it's a west wind,
it's a west wind, when it's even south west or whatever, like,
it is exactly what it is versus other stands. You
go to, Oh, it's going to be a west wind,
and you get up there and you're throwing the wind
check and you're like what you know, you know, and
it's going completely the wrong way because of the you know,

(32:26):
because of the land. So that particular hunt, I was
able to park the car in a spot to where
nobody was around. It was super easy. I was able
to keep my nose right into the wind. And honestly,
it wasn't like over the woods, you know, through a
cornfield up over there. I mean, it was just a

(32:47):
nice easy straight line. Now that was by design with
where I was parking, and I had to get some
access at that point in my life to be able
to allow me to pull that off. And luckily the
woman was nice enough to let me actually park the
and do what I was doing, so that worked out
like sweet as well.

Speaker 2 (33:04):
Yeah that's no small thing to go get that extra access.

Speaker 3 (33:07):
Yeah no, no, but you know, you know, years ago,
it's also seemed like it was a lot easier too.
I mean, listen with anyone that's been doing any kind
of door knocking nowadays. I talked to Paul our, our
new guy that's working with us. I mean, you know,
and I and I keep referring it to like the
salesmanship thing, right, like, you knock, got enough doors, eventually
somebody's going to answer. Right. He's like, oh, I've been
on twelve already and I've only had one. That's like ah,

(33:31):
And I said, hey, dude, that's how it works. You
just got to keep you got to keep going and
eventually you know you're going to find something. But so
having good entry points when you know where a good
betting here is, and of course that you know, you
you you you're always playing a game because it's how
close do I want to get? You know? Like sure, Mark,

(33:53):
I'm sure you've been in a lot of hunting situations
where yeah, you can sit way back and you can
watch them get up and you can see him and
then you're like, Okay, they need to come this way,
and then they go that way, right, Like I mean,
so it's always kind of determining how close can I
get without it being too close? And in that particular case,
I was able to legitimately get within about sixty yards

(34:18):
of this little favorite little spot where he was betting.
So that was key. And if there's anything to be
taken from this podcast right now that we're having, we're
not going to tell you till the end. I'm just kidding,
wait till you're gonna have to wait. Is if you

(34:42):
can find good solid buck betting areas of the buck
that you want to kill the buck that you want.
It's all about locating those areas and getting as close
to them as you can that I mean, that is key.
And you know what, and don't buck the spots up.
I do not put the trail cameras in those spots.

(35:03):
When you find that big buck bed. I think a
Matt Miller on our team. You know, he moved here
and was hunting a lease, and you know he found
a really decent bed of a buck up on a ridgetop,
and you know what, same thing goes. I think about
his hunt. I remember talking to him. This is years
ago too. I remember just talking to him and he
just he knew in your brain, it's almost like you

(35:25):
can close your eyes and you literally can execute the plan.
You know all the way from getting out of the car,
the path that you're gonna take, how you're gonna climb
that tree, how stealthy and quiet you're gonna be, and
and how quickly you know the timeliness it takes you
to get there. Like, you got to have all that
stuff in your brain. Big buck killers they got that

(35:49):
wired in their brain. It's not I'm gonna stop and
get this coffee and then I'm gonna do this, and
then you know I'm gonna I might wear those boots man,
big buck killers and people, and forget about the big
buck hillers. People that shoot bucks on a year to
year regular basis. Man, they've got a plan. It's in

(36:11):
their brains. You know. They know their gear, they know
what's in their pack, they know what's in the left
hand top pocket. They they you're dialed in, whether you're
a saddle guy, you just know what's in each pocket,
how you're gonna maneuver. Like that's the way you need
to train your brain. So when you can start getting
into those situations where you're gonna get tight on mature bucks,

(36:33):
you know where all your stuff is you're just dialed in.
All the guys that I meet that are crazy, I
shouldn't say crazy, but because one of them you're just
you're just you're you know, you're just you're dialed in. Mark,
you know, you know what I'm talking about. I mean,
you know those guys who are just walking around and
just kind of being lazy, and they wonder why they're
spooking deer and not seeing stuff. And then you got

(36:54):
your guys who are just man, they're on their a game,
and that's what you gotta be. Period of this. We
got off, we all get lucky, right, we all can
fall into one once in a while, and hey, that happens.
I'm not going to pass up those. But if you
really want to get those mature bucks, you got to
have a plan. You got to learn where they're living,

(37:14):
and you've got to find those overlooked spots, which you
know we talked about how you said, Hey, you know
you got to walk around. Yeah, you do have to scout,
like I mean, you know, there's a time to scout.
There's a time to do it effectively, and then there's
the times when you shouldn't. One of the things that
I've kind of gotten in the habit of doing is
we're all creatures of habit, right, So often we have

(37:38):
a stand You mentioned it in the beginning of this podcast.
You know you've trimmed your stuff out, you're kind of ready,
you kind of have your plan. What I try to
do when I go hunt one of those spots is
I try to always be scouting, right, you always got
to be scouting. So sometimes what I'll do is, even
though it's easier for me to maybe go out the

(38:00):
way that I came, and my brain is telling me that, hey,
I don't want to leave in the extra sin, I
don't want to do that. Sometimes you just got to
go some different routes and some different paths to be
able to see if things have changed, because in the
White Tails world, things are always always changing. I'll tell
you a little thing too. I got this really big
one that I told you earlier in this podcast that
I that I'm chasing. I went back there to this spot,

(38:26):
and man, I was like, I just I'm not getting
both of them anymore. I thought he died, honestly. I mean,
we have a drought here in Illinois, EHD. I'm sure
something you've heard people talking about here in the Midwest.
I mean, the drought is bad. It sucks. And I
could just smell I could smell, you know, something dead,
you know, you know, and if ben in the woods

(38:47):
enough to know when you smell that, you're kind of
you know, you're like you almost have to like it's
almost like a game, right, But it's like you gotta
go find it, Like there's something about us that this
is like I need to go find what this got
to well, you gotta know, right, And I haven't been
getting pictures of him for a month. He disappeared, This
big guy disappeared on me, and so so I am.

(39:11):
So I start, you know, looking around, Thank goodness, was
the dead raccoon. Okay, let's get that out of the way.
Round the bat good But I'm like, man, why is
this deer not coming through here? So he was always
coming through. This was like bulletproof.

Speaker 2 (39:24):
Man.

Speaker 3 (39:24):
I was getting pretty regular inns. Would you believe it?
We had a really big storm, a monster I mean,
a big tree fell down and this particular spot is
almost like a little funnel, almost like a little pinch point.
And sure enough it complete. I mean, this tree is
a huge cottonwood completely blocked the access because it wasn't

(39:45):
just so much that my big guy was missing. I
wasn't getting even my there's been one dough with one
fund coming through there, and even I was getting kind
of coyotes in a red like man, this just this this,
this is not something's not right. Well, sure enough, this
monster cottonwood came down and it hit completely like they
could not get through and they were going around and

(40:05):
completely avoiding this spot, like entirely. So I had to
go in there and get rid of that. And would
you believe it? You know, would you believe it when
you actually when you texted me, I was out in
Montana or Colorado. Forgot where I was at the time,
and I was finally starting to get pictures again because
before I, before I went on the trip, I went
into that particular spot. I cleaned it out, got it

(40:26):
trimmed out. Of course, you know, it took a lot
of work, chainsaws, blah blah blah. I had to do
way more disruption than I wanted to do. But after
about a week and a half, would you believe it,
there comes my going fawn again and here comes that
regular traffic, and sure enough, bam, you know, he showed
up a couple more times just because that path of easy,

(40:47):
path of least resistance wasn't there anymore and they just
weren't cutting through there. So just a little tidbit of
information there, right, You know, if something changes, you gotta
kind of got to figure out what happened. Like if
you're this awesome funnel on top of a ridge somewhere
and you're like, what is going on this thing? Just die? Well? Geez,
if you had a big, huge oak tree block it
sixty eighty one hundred yards up and you can't see

(41:09):
it and now they're screting the side, something can change.
You gotta always be scouting for sure.

Speaker 2 (41:15):
Yeah, there's that really tricky balancing act between maintaining you know,
current intel while also not over pressuring a location. And
you mentioned a second ago how the very most important
thing when it comes to these really mature boxes is
finding where they want to live and not screwing that up.
Can you share with me a little bit about the

(41:35):
kinds of specific places that you found over the years
that these big old like the top dog buck in
the area likes to hole up. I mean, we know
the general things like, oh, they're like thick stuff or
so on and so forth. But when you think about
some of these specific old deer that you've gotten to
know over the years, I'd be really curious about, like
if you can even recall, like what some of those
specific little bedrooms looked like that that top dog picked.

(41:59):
It's interesting to think about where like the number one
spots are because these bucks, you know, have a hierarchy, right,
and so the different betting years kind of get claimed
based on where you stand in a hierarchy sometimes, So
where's that top tier deer prefer to be.

Speaker 3 (42:17):
I definitely think it's different, you know, for all the
different areas you hunt. I think of this one buck
longhorn that I was chasing, and this was in more
western Illinois, and there's these rock croppings, right, And it's
funny because you think betting, you think betting years, you're

(42:38):
almost like you're almost your brains like thinking, oh, it
should be cushy, right, it should be like a temper
pedic mattress, and it should be super nice and comfortable,
and they're going to get in there and kind of
snuggle in. And this one buck uh longhorn that that
that I was chasing, Oh, just an awesome accounter with
never know whatever happened to that deer. He was awesome.

(43:02):
He had this spot that was on a I know
this isn't a video, but if you can almost imagine
a top of a ridge that comes to a point
and there is these big rock outcroppings and there is
just the biggest bed that I found in the longest

(43:23):
time on this point by these rocks, and it's like, shit,
I wouldn't I wouldn't have lasted there more than five
minutes sitting on there. But you know, that's not how
animals think, right, That's just how soft whimbs like me think.
But when you think of a big buck who wants
to have a great vantage point that you know, in

(43:44):
this particular spot in this country, it was up high,
the wind was good, they had, you know, they could
keep their back, you know, where they could smell stuff
coming from behind them. They could sit where they could
see you know, a whole area with multiple exits, you
know exits, you know, I mean if they if someone
would have jumped that deer, it literally could have gone

(44:05):
three different directions and within seconds you'd never see it again.
And that was one spot that I remember, and the
more that I've hunted in those areas where you have
hills with those rock croppings out on those points. Man,
they just really seem to like those spots because I
just think they literally can dart downhill and you'll never

(44:27):
see them ever again. And and the wind is just
so good for them up there that they can just
always feel safe, and you know, at the end of
the day, like they're just worried about predators, right, they're
not really thinking, oh shit, Mark kenyans after me. You know,
they're not you know, they're they're not thinking like that.
They're just thinking, like, you know, where can I get
the best rest, you know, for the longest amount of

(44:47):
time without being busted all the time. So I think
an area where a buck, you know, big mature buck
can sit have And it's funny because we think about
you know, sometimes we're always thinking about that thick, nasty stuff.
You know. I don't know if that's always the case, right,
Like I've seen plenty of big bucks be in areas
where there's not tons and tons of cover. They could

(45:09):
just see good, the wind's good, and they've got enough
exit points where they got cover that they know if
they need to get out get out of the area
that they can. But so I, you know, my favorite
spots where I generally find those big, bigger bucks. You know,
it seems to be those cat tail slews, those areas
that are just kind of thick and nasty that nobody

(45:31):
wants to go to and no one's really kind of
popping into it. And every time in my life that
I found those cattail slews, you walk around those things enough.
And the only reason why I even like those things
is because I was fortunate enough again to have that
property in Wisconsin that I was able to get purchased
from my dad years ago, and that's all I had
to hunt. And being a duck hunter when I was younger,

(45:51):
you walked around those cat tails enough. You were looking
for what when you were duck hunting, those spots that
just had the little open, little water spots right where
you'd see those buck, duck bucks, Jesu Louise bucks, ducks,
all of them. You'd see those ducks, you know, cupping
up and locking in and coming on in right. You
were looking for those spots for the ducks. But on
your way to getting to those spots, you'd be walking

(46:14):
along and all of a sudden, you'd come along the
spot where it's like, holy cow, look at this. You
could literally come right up and it's all just you know,
up and high and man, you're like, man, look at
the beds in here, like they could just you know,
you would never think that you could literally go out
into the middle of a cat tail nasty slew and
have completely dry ground where they can stand up, shake

(46:37):
it off, you know, eat a little bit, you know,
chew their cuds, turn around a little bit, lay back
down again. So I think the key of what we're
talking about here is you're looking. You're not always looking,
like you said, for those spots where the most thickest,
nastiest cover is. Those are good and those can be

(47:01):
really successful, but also be looking for those spots where
the deer just they've got the winning advantage, Like you know,
they've got those spots, and sometimes those spots you just
got to beat the deer back to them. You know,
you know you're there. You just got to be in
super early. You got to get there way before they're
going to get there, and hope that you're not going
to get detected while you're sitting there.

Speaker 2 (47:23):
Yeah, I've seen I've had some situations where I've seen this,
and I've certainly heard of other people mentioning this, but
always it still catches me by surprise. Sometimes. Have you
ever seen a buck that beds in a place that
you would think actually would put him around people and

(47:43):
human access more than you might expect, But he's actually
there because he's monitoring access, so he's able. He's out
on like a point leading out into a grassy field
or something that kind of goes by the access road,
so every time you go in there, he knows it.
That kind of thing. I've heard stories about that kind
of thing. I've had a couple situations where I thought
that might be what's going on, Like, man, how come

(48:03):
I can never get in here without this deer knowing
I'm here because he shows up in daylight on trail camera.
But whenever I'm in here, even though I think my
win's right, even though I think I'm doing everything right,
he never shows up. And then all of a sudden,
I find this little buck bed like right along where
I was coming along in a spot that doesn't make
any sense in most most ways of thinking about have
you ever seen that kind of thing?

Speaker 3 (48:25):
Yeah, that's interesting, Then you know, I guess I never
really I've heard people talk about this like maybe they're
just watching us coming in and coming out all the time,
you know, so maybe you know, But I don't know.
I you know, I I really truly don't think they're
that strategic. I just don't, you know, maybe I'm wrong.

(48:48):
I mean, I'm sure you can find sixteen guys or
you'll get a million comments. Now that just says I'm
an idiot, right, Like the keyboard guys will come and
start smashing it on this. You know, I really just
don't no matter what you say, it doesn't matter what
I say, right, I just I really don't think a
mature buck wakes up in the morning and it's like,
you know what, I'm gonna slip down and I'm gonna

(49:10):
park myself near that particular spot to see if anyone's
going to come into the hunt this public today. You know,
I just don't think they think that way. I think
the spots that they choose are chosen because they have
those vantage points. They feel safe, they've got the wind
at their advantage. They feel like if they do get busted,

(49:33):
they can get out of dodge, you know quickly. I
just I really don't think. I think for their brains,
it's where can I go and where can I sit
the longest before I ever get bumped by anything. If
you're out west, maybe it's cougar's you know, maybe it's
you know, maybe it's you know, a pack of coyotes. Whatever,
it's where can I go and be for the longest

(49:56):
period of time when no one's bugging me? I mean,
my opinion, I think that's what is truly going on
in a big buck's brain. Where can I be for
the longest period of time, get the most amount of sleep,
relax without being bumped constantly. That, in my opinion, I

(50:18):
just think that's the spots that they're looking for. I mean,
come on every podcast you always listen to when people
talk about public land, public land, public land, right, and
they want to go so much of everything you've thought
about as a kid when you were younger, was like
how much further can I go over the next guy? Right?
Like how much further back can I go? Because someone
to get away from that traffic, and generally speaking, you're

(50:40):
rewarded for doing that because the animals just aren't being bothered.
Some of the best, easiest punts are going into spots
where there is the least amount of pressure period. So
I think find those unpressured areas, and you're going to
put yourself most likely in an opportunity to find where

(51:03):
a big mature deer is hung up and is living.
And we'll also put you in a position. But they
have a chance to harvest them if you can get
in and get out. There are those spots, Mark, and
you and I both know it, where you're gonna find
a big mature bucks sign down in the bottoms, right,
I mean we've all been there, anybody who has spent

(51:24):
any time hunting. When you start hunting hilly country, you
get down in those bottoms and you're like, man, look
at this. We found a horizontal rub and I mean
look at the sign down here, and it's just tore
up and here's a bed. But whoo, trying to get
down in those spots and actually hunting them, it's not

(51:45):
not not good. It's not gonna happen. Maybe in the rut,
maybe get lucky, maybe the winds is right perfect, but
not often.

Speaker 2 (51:54):
Yeah. So, so speaking of these kinds of spots that
these big old bucks gravitate towards and as you mentioned,
I think it makes a lot of sense to remember
to keep it simple sometimes and just think like where
can they go and feel safe and comfortable. You know
one thing that I seem to hear consistently, and I
think I've seen this to a degree, is that once

(52:17):
those as those bucks get older and older, many of
them tend to become more and more of a homebody.
They tend to have a shrinking core area. Maybe at
least that's something I've seen a little bit and heard
of quite a bit, especially from folks that just have
a lot more mature bucks around. Have you seen that?

Speaker 3 (52:34):
Is that true?

Speaker 2 (52:36):
And because of that in your experience, have you found
with those like five year old plus bucks, are they
easier to pattern because of that or because of the
behavior traits that become harder.

Speaker 3 (52:50):
If it gets easier, I have a lot more five
and a half year old Bucks on my wall, that's
for sure. So so it definitely it can't get easier
because I'd have I'd have a lot more bigger Bucks
on my wall. I can tell you that for sure.
But I but I think of listen, I definitely agree
with you, for sure. I believe their ranges definitely get smaller.

(53:15):
I think there's something about being the top dog that
allows them the luxury of being able to And we've
seen this. We've all seen this bow hunting before, or
whatever type of hunting you do, we've all seen Let's
say you are hunting a food plot, right, and it's
almost like the tone let me let me switch this

(53:36):
up because my brain sometimes got eighty D and I'm
jumping around. It's almost like you're in the conference room, right,
four or five guys, You're all sitting around there talking
and man, now the boss steps into the now all
of a sudden, you know, bam, the boss comes walking
in the conference room. Donnarn is the tone of the
room just change? Am I right? Or am I wrong? Right?

(53:59):
It's different on hunt go hunt a food plot. You're
sitting there right. Let's say it's late season, right, it's cold,
you're in, You're in, You're in your box blind whatever, right,
doze are out? The young bucks are out, dude. It's
almost like the tone changes when that mature buck comes
out with the other bucks in the field. You know,

(54:19):
or even you know that first cold front that comes
in in October. We're all waiting for that first cold front, right,
because they can be super duper successful. And if there's
something about it when you get those young deer bucks
out there and you're sitting there hunting, and all of
a sudden, you almost can you almost can if you're
watching the tone of the deer and you're reading the deer,

(54:42):
you can almost see their behaviors starting to changing. Maybe
they're starting to kind of getting away from the spot,
their ears are getting in back, maybe they're getting little edgy,
and all of a sudden, those bigger bucks come out
Like the big guys definitely carry some weight to them,
which I think the older they get allows them the
ability to not have to travel as far because, you

(55:03):
know what, they kind of know who their girls are.
They kind of know who they're gonna breed man when
they're out checking those scrapes at night and they're they
know they are. I completely believed Listen. I'm not a biologist,
but I completely believe one that they know what dough
is going to come in first. They do know who

(55:25):
she is. They do generally know where she is living,
and they generally are able to because of the old guys,
and you know that they generally get to be able
to hold that dominance in an area, and I think
they can get away with traveling less. They don't have
to be running. It's almost like the big buck that
the coyle standing on top of the hill looking down
at all the coles and the young buck wants to

(55:47):
run down there, or the young con wants to run
down there and say, you know, let's get one, and
then the old bull says no, let's just walk down
and get them. All right, Like at the end of
the day, those big guys they've got their spot. They
know specifically which ones are going to come in. I
do think they travel less. And I'll tell you a
really cool story. This is. This is a cool story
if anyone ever watched the Sweetness story that we put

(56:09):
on bow hunting dot com years ago. I mean, I
chased that deer and we mentioned it earlier in this
That was an eight and a half year old deer
two hundred and twenty inch buck. The deer was shot
and wounded when he was four and a half years
old by my friend. He's gonna kill me right now
for doing this, but he shot him. It was a
high shot. It happens, guys. If we're bowhunters, come on man,

(56:29):
anybody who bow hunts, you know, things happen. There's a difference.
We always say the same thing. There's the difference between
doing the right thing ethically and having stuff go wrong
versus doing the wrong thing. And and and then you
got to live with that, do the right thing, and
you never have that. You can always sleep, you know,
good at night. But you know, it was a high shot.

(56:49):
Sweetness was fine. The deer lived on. I can't tell
you the strategies that we put in place to try
to kill that deer, right, and and it kind of
had its pad. It just seemed to like leave our property,
hit another property. Some other guys had the deer named
a different name than well, we had it named, you know,
and I'm sure three other properties they all everyone had

(57:11):
their own name for this deer. Right. And would you
believe it? Four years later, my friend who originally shot
Sweetness ends up harvesting Sweetness in the same stand four

(57:31):
years later. So, I mean, isn't it cool? I mean
it is wild, right, Like all this work, all this effort,
all these different locations, and to think four years later
he'd be harvested this unbelievable two hundred and twenty inch
deer would be harvested from the same stand that it

(57:53):
was wounded in. Right like, so maybe if you spook
a big buck out of his bed, after four years,
it will forget about it will come back to that bed,
right like you knows what the ultimate who knows what
the right. It may take a little bit of time
until you sleep back in that bed again. But the
point being, you know, per this, you know call what

(58:16):
we're talking about right now. Mature bucks one hundred percent
have those good key spots that they love, and you
gotta pay attention. You gotta look for them. You know,
it's not just aimlessly walking through the woods. You gotta
look at your maps. You gotta look at for the sign.
You know. No, you're not gonna get down and smell
the bed or do stupid stuff like you're gonna look

(58:38):
at the bed. You're gonna look at the size of
the bed and then and then maybe you're gonna come
back and check it, you know, a year later. Some
of the best times, honestly to find these big beds,
you know, and where we think these big guys are
are are living is really that early season. When I
say early season, I really like kind of that March
April time frame when you can really get out there

(58:59):
and really look around and really see what you have there.
But to answer your question, yes, I do believe as
deer get older, they gravitate to their favorite spots. They
don't travel as far for a couple of different reasons. One,
I think they've learned over the years where the good

(59:21):
food is, where the good water sources are, where the
girls are that they're gonna need at the time when
the rut comes along. And I think they just, through
time learn where those best spots are. And I really
do believe they don't travel as far. Now, again, guys,
you can analyze this all day long, and if you

(59:42):
live in an area where food sources are low and
they have to travel farther, or you're in a big drought,
I mean, there's a ten thousand variables that we could
go through right now. But generally speaking, I think is
deer age. I really do believe that that area that
they're they're monitoring just get smaller.

Speaker 2 (01:00:16):
So let's let's uh, I want to kind of get
your take on a few other different I don't know,
if there's a personality, maybe tendencies, maybe that you've seen
with these older bucks as far as behavior, and and
I know a lot of this. One of the things
you hear a lot about when people start, you know,
getting to know a mature buck is they'll say, well,
there's this personality trailer. This buck has got a unique personality.

(01:00:38):
So I think there's going to be a lot of
unique things depending on the deer. But I am curious
whether or not you've seen any consistencies of any kind.
Let's say, well, let's start first with like with how
a really mature buck uses the wind. Have you found
any consistency with those oldest bucks you've hunted, Man, they

(01:00:59):
they always like to bet with the wind in a
certain way, like at their back or is that not
the case? Have you always seen that? Man?

Speaker 3 (01:01:04):
They like me?

Speaker 2 (01:01:05):
You hear some people talk that, man, mature bucks really
want to move with the wind in their face or
quartering or crossed. And then you hear other people saying, nah,
that the rock of the tail wind. You know, anything
on the wind side. Have you seen anything that stands
out as a nugget of a tendency that's worth keeping
in the back of your mind when it comes to
these five year olds, these six year olds whatever.

Speaker 3 (01:01:29):
I think one of the hardest things that I've had
to learn, because anyone that knows me, dude, I'm hyper, right, Like,
I'm a hyper guy. I mean, I just I can't help.
I'm just a shaker. I'm a mover. I just you know,
I talk with my hands. I mean, I just I'm
a mover. And I think one thing and I'm excluding.

(01:01:50):
I'm excluding the rut right now when I get ready
to say this guy's okay. But one thing's for certain.
When you see big legitimate bucks man, and I'm talking
good mature bucks, they are slow movers. They take the time,

(01:02:11):
did they did? They're methodical. You just you can just
see that ever so slight, little you know, little lift
of that little lift of that head man just taking
in that little extra you know, scent coming across their nose. Man.
You really see big bucks. They you know, they're not
just oh, there's the playground, let's go, you know, like that.

(01:02:32):
They just take their time. Now again, I'm excluding the rut.
On a hot trail with a hot dough, obviously that's
completely different. But even when a big buck finally is
going to tend to a dough and he's decided that
she's gonna come in the heat. That's the dough. That's
the one I'm breeding. They, through vocalization, you know, are

(01:02:55):
able to like get that dough to kind of stay put.
I mean, every once in a while they take off
a generally speaking man when they just want things to
be calm. They have a way of doing that right.
And I have seen so many big Bucks they just
take their time. My point with me being kind of
a hyper shaky guy and trying to use this as
a tactic to be smart. You know, for me, the

(01:03:16):
tree stand is my yoga session. The tree stand is
the one time when I can, you know, you can
kind of like just get in there, snuggle in, be
smart and and and and try not to move right like,
because I'm telling you those big Bucks they're not just
using their nose. They're using their eyes too, and and

(01:03:39):
and when they start walking and they decide that they're
going to move from point A to point B and
they're gonna actually go do something, they're using everything they
got right their nose, their ears, their eyes, they're using
it at all. They're looking out for predators. And I'm
telling you, part of their strategic way of living longer
and getting bigger too, is they just move methodically and

(01:04:03):
they move a little slower, and man, you just see them.
You just see them stop right like you can see
them like they just if they get out of their bed.
Sometimes they just stand there for like forever, and you know,
and then they just they're so methodical about Okay, which
way am I gonna kind of pull out of here today?
And then they come down the tray a little bit,
and then they'll just stop and they'll just they'll literally
stand there for minutes. Some of the biggest bucks I've seen,

(01:04:25):
they'll just they'll just stand there and they'll just kind
of just smell and they'll just So the problem is
you might have you might be hunting to killer ridgeline, right,
you might be hunting something really good. And if you're
standing up and you know, talking to your buddies, or
you know, if they're filming you, or you're just you know,
moving a little too much in those stands, sometimes those

(01:04:47):
deer are just seeing you and you're never seeing you're
never even seeing them, right, They've already they WHOA what
was that? And and they just total away. How many
times have you spooked a big buck. Right you're in
the stand, you see them coming, and do they Mark,
do They usually go bolting out of there and running away,
the big.

Speaker 2 (01:05:03):
Guys sneaking on out turntail quickly and they're just scooting out.

Speaker 3 (01:05:09):
They just do they just did, you know? They don't
They don't need to make him listen, Spooking a buck
out of bed is one thing, because they aren't blowing yeah,
totally right, This isn't This isn't the big Nanny Doe
going like, Okay, I'm gonna I'm gonna blow here for
the next fifteen I mean, they just usually like, man,
if they get the scent to something, wron, they just man.

(01:05:29):
Sometimes I think they can just walk in reverse. You know.
It's like it's like, how will you just go? You know,
It's it's like that Bart Simpson's one of my favorite
little icons where he's like just kind of like kind
of just sneaks exactly.

Speaker 2 (01:05:41):
That's exactly. You know, you.

Speaker 3 (01:05:45):
Know what, Mark, you don't beat me to this. I'm
gonna take that meme and I'm gonna have a buck
just disappearing back in the books Hunting Seasons coming great,
don't you take that one? I'm gonna go I'm gonna
go make that one of course, but you know what
I'm talking about. I mean, that's exactly what I just think.
You know, they're methodical. They're slow, and again they're not

(01:06:08):
being methodical because they're like, oh, man, Todd's out here today.
I saw his truck pull in, or you know, or
the neighbor. They're just this is what they do, right,
Like they they don't want to get eaten for lunch.
They don't want coyotes chasing them, they don't want you know,
they just they're just methodical. They're just they those bigger guys,
they're just they take their time. They've been in the

(01:06:29):
woods a lot longer than the other deer. They just
know what they need to do to survive and and
to not be chased as much and and and not
be killed. Right, so, man, you watch them. They're slow,
So don't be moving around a lot in your stands.

Speaker 2 (01:06:44):
Yeah. So, so, so what's the hunting takeaway from that?
As you mentioned, one thing, don't be making them, you know,
don't do anything crazy up in the tree and let
them see you. But if they're given that they're so
slow and methodical, is one of the hunting takeaways like man.
Because of that, that's another really strong reason for why
you should try to be as close to their bedding

(01:07:04):
year as possible, because they're just not going to travel
seven hundred yards or whatever to go down the ridge
all the way. You gotta be close to their bedroom.
Is that it or what is it? In your mind?

Speaker 3 (01:07:13):
Yeah, that's always a good question mark. You want to
tip as many things in your favor as possible. We
know for a fact that big mature bucks generally are
just not okay I'm excluding the rut, but generally speaking

(01:07:35):
or just not out running around all day long. Okay,
I mean I live in areas where big bucks live.
I haven't fact, I haven't seen a monster buck this
year yet. I'm excluding the hunting season obviously in January,
but I have not seen a big buck, legitimate shooter

(01:07:55):
buck on their feet during day time. I think a Kurt,
you know Kurt, you know a guy on our team.
You know Kurt. You know he's killed a lot of deer.
You know, he does a lot of management on farms
and stuff like that. And I mean even he's out
in the daily you know, and he doesn't even see
that many big bucks during the day and moving around,

(01:08:17):
so you want to get as close as you can
number one without blowing out the areas. Number two, you
always have to be, you know, playing the win that
we've talked about. But at the end of the day,
you know, they just don't move a lot, so you
want to make sure you're putting yourself in the best

(01:08:39):
position for when they do make those moves before they
come out to those bigger fields and at night and
eat and so forth, that you have the best chance
at getting them. You're not going to have that happen
if you're just going to go to some big bean
plot on an evening hunt. Right. Like, again, there's always luck,
but when it comes to those big mature guys, you

(01:09:02):
better you'd better be close to where they're betting, and
you have to be able to get in there without
you know, busting them out and having them know that
you're there.

Speaker 2 (01:09:11):
Yeah, speaking of the fact that those big old guys
don't get up and move very far, very often, that
brings to mind another thing that hunters love to debate
and question, which is trying to predict the conditions that
might get a big old buck like that on his
feet a little bit earlier or moving just a little
bit further. So there's all sorts of you know, popular
apps these days of predicted deer movement, and there's all

(01:09:34):
sorts of theories about the moon and the wind and
the barometer and the temperature and humidity and YadA, YadA, YadA.
Is there anything from all those different factors that you
think does have the greatest influence on a mature, mature buck, Like,
is it, man, that barometer really does pressure really does

(01:09:54):
get a big old buck on his fear. Is there
anything like that in your mind that stands out that
is unique to getting those special deer out and moving
a little bit more?

Speaker 3 (01:10:06):
Yes, yes, I do. I know there's the moon, guys
that really, really really foul the moon years ago. I
used to you know, foul the moon and kind of
kind of stop fouling the moon as much. But there
is no doubt when it comes to barometric pressure. Pressure

(01:10:26):
is a biggie. I mean, I don't care. You watch
pressure enough, and you know, it's funny because so many
people stop watching the pressure since the hunting season's over, right,
But pay attention to the pressure even when the hunting
season is not going on. You know those days where
you're just like, dang, I really have seen a lot
of deer today, take the time to, you know, remember
to go look at so many people forget about looking

(01:10:48):
at that once the hunting season's over, right, So pressure
is a big one for sure. I mean there is
no doubt after running you know, our web series Bowhunter
Die for as many years as we have, I can
almost guarantee if me and Justin are talking about when

(01:11:12):
we think the first couple of deer kills are going
to come in. Generally that first high pressure system that
comes in in the beginning when you can hunt deer. Obviously,
you know when your season starts, that first one. If
you can get catch that first high pressure system, that's
almost always always always a good one. But I do

(01:11:34):
watch the pressure quite a bit. I do have some
of my best hunting daring high pressure. But Mark, that
doesn't mean that I'm not going to go hunt, you
know a day where maybe the pressure is not as good.
I mean, everyone's lives are different, everyone's work schedules are different.
Everyone has different times that they can hunt and how
much they can hunt. But for the average guy who

(01:11:58):
has some control over their schedule, that can save some vacations,
that can bank some vacation days. I think if you
can be lucky enough to time a high pressure hunt
with when you're going versus just aimlessly going into spots
when you shouldn't be going into some of your better spots,

(01:12:19):
is going to make a difference. And generally speaking, on
those high pressure situations, it does seem like those bigger
mature bucks do get out of their beds a little
bit earlier and people can say, well, geez, I hunted
high pressure, but I just didn't see the mature deer. Well,
at the end of the day, let's be realistic, how
many big mature deer are in your area? Number one right,

(01:12:40):
and he just doesn't have one spot that he goes to.
So just because I'm having bag luck this day, I
could be literally texting you, who could be completely on
the other side of the fire, and you're like, dude,
you were right. Today was the day. You know, you know,
there's let's be honest, there's only so many these four

(01:13:00):
and a half five and have six year old deer
and they just don't do the same thing. Every single day.
I hit Starbucks, I go to the Walmart, I go
to the office, Like Okay, like you know, that's just
not how it works. You know. They just they have
other spots, their appetite might be desiring something different. They
just might go to a different area. So just because
you're like, oh, I'm hunting this high pressure day and
I'm not seeing any activity, doesn't you may have just

(01:13:21):
chose the dang wrong spot too, you know, And that
can completely happen, right Like, sometimes you just got to
have all those all those things line up, and there's
just not enough really legitimately big bucks for everything that
line up perfectly for all of us all the time.
So I do like the pressure my absolute man. I
we all only get so many opportunities at shooting a

(01:13:45):
quality deer each year, right, Like, I mean you can
pretty much guarantee like every season, you know, what is it,
maybe three, you know, maybe four, I mean, like not many,
and you know, and you're just hoping.

Speaker 2 (01:13:57):
And that's for those of us that have a lot
of time to do it on.

Speaker 3 (01:14:01):
Your hundred percent for you know, it can be very
different for everybody else. But let's just say you get
three legitimate chances, right, you know, so you got to
be you know, you got to make sure you're on
your eight game in your prepaid because you start messing
those up, like you can't get time back right, and
the season, you know, it starts off and it just

(01:14:23):
kind of gets going. And the next the point that
I'm trying to make here is if it's if it's
not barometer or barometric pressure, right, that the next thing
that I really, really, really, man, I love those those
those pre rut those pre rut days are just I

(01:14:45):
would take the pre rut over the rut any day
of any day of the week. You know, I would
much rat even though you can't see as far because
there's more foliage. You know, corn still love blah blah blah.
That pre rut you can pretty much count on. They

(01:15:08):
just they know it, man, They just got it in
their body. They know they know what's coming. It's built
into their everything that a deer does, like they have
to breathe. It's just it's the way it works. And
that pre rut, they start getting up, they get up
a little bit earlier, they start checking those scrapes, they
start checking those line and man, I loved I love

(01:15:31):
that pre rut time that that for hair in Illinois.
Sometimes that twenty second. I'd killed some of my best
deer between the twenty second and the twenty eighth of
October compared to November first through the seventh. Hands down.
If I went back, I wish I would have done
a better job, you know, keeping track of the stuff,

(01:15:52):
you know, as I was younger. But there is no
doubt I would take the twenty second to the thirty
first over the first through the seventh, any day of
the week or eighth anytime. I just pluster calmer too.

Speaker 2 (01:16:06):
Yeah. I was gonna ask, you know, when you think
if you could pick any you know, week during the
hunting season to kill a buck like this, if there's
like a six year older after or something, and you
had to pick one week, would it be that last
week of October? Sounds like maybe that's the case.

Speaker 3 (01:16:24):
Yes, Yes, I really try my hardest every year not
to screw that last week up. I mean, like, you know,
being sick, I may still be the guy wearing masks.

Speaker 2 (01:16:38):
You you know, I do don't want to miss those days,
you know.

Speaker 3 (01:16:44):
I love that. You know that that last ten days
of October. I love that last ten days of October.
I just I just I really, really really those are
my fa I will take those days anytime over the run.
I mean, don't get me wrong. I mean the ruts
fun and you can see chasing, and you can see
him further away, and you know, and you can and

(01:17:05):
I've still killed there during those times. And it's not like, oh,
October thirty for halloweens here, I'm done. I'm hanging up
the boat. No, of course, not no, sure, no, I
mean it's been plenty years. I haven't even had a
tag notched by then, you know. But but there's no
doubt when it comes to filming mature bucks, getting close

(01:17:27):
in on them. Man, that is the time to do it.
I just, I just I love that window. That's a
great window of time. I mean, especially if you haven't
been fortunate enough to locate that big buck. Right, Like,
let's just forget about everything that we've been talking about,
you know, in terms of okay, Todd, you know what,
I hun a small piece of property or mark. I
don't have an opportunity to hunt a lot of land.

(01:17:49):
Let me, let's face it, just because you even got
two hundred acres doesn't mean doesn't mean that the big
guy is living on you, right, So you still got
to then figure out, Okay, you know, if when time
comes and he's gonna and I want to kill that
mature buck, where is the highest likelihood spot that he's
gonna be on my place, whether that's ten acres, five acres,
forty acres, or a thousand acres. Right, You're always trying

(01:18:12):
to find those spots where those mature bucks generally like
to travel, you know, so you got to keep that
in mind too. But I I I do love that
end of that end of October mark for sure.

Speaker 2 (01:18:25):
Yeah, when you're coming in.

Speaker 3 (01:18:26):
Also, let's change this up when you kind.

Speaker 2 (01:18:30):
Of come home, let's go. I need to get there soon.
I know.

Speaker 3 (01:18:35):
Well, the man, let's go. I just gave it to you,
So let's go. Let's do it.

Speaker 2 (01:18:42):
Be careful what you ask for, Todd, I might be
kno going to the door this fall.

Speaker 3 (01:18:46):
Let's go, man. I I told Justin I'm all about
doing new and different things. You know, my boys in
college now and trying to mix things up and do
different things. And uh, and it's fun. It's always fun
to meet new people, hear different edies, do different things,
listen to podcasts like this, Like that's what makes it fun, right, like, Hey,
there's gonna be plenty of people take little nuggets of

(01:19:07):
this podcast and they're going to hopefully gonna be able
to implement it to their style and what they're doing,
and hopefully it helps them bag their first big buck, right, Like,
that's that's what it's all about. It's all about experiences,
and it's like everything in life. You know, if you
get a couple of good nuggets from everything you do
in life, I mean that's and you and you keep

(01:19:28):
and you hold those that usually end up panning, you know,
paying out for sure.

Speaker 2 (01:19:34):
Yeah, So that's a perfect segue todd to the final
question I want to run by you, which was if
there's any particular big old buck from your past that
gave you one of those nuggets, one of those lessons
learned that stands out more than any other. If if
you were to think back over all of the years,

(01:19:56):
over all those biggest oldest ghosts that haunted you, maybe
you got him, maybe you didn't get them, does one
of them stand out as having taught you the most
important lesson or taught to you the most that has
impacted your hunting still to this day. What would that lesson?
What would that buck be, and what would that lesson be.

Speaker 3 (01:20:19):
I'm gonna that's a great question. It's a very very
very good question, and I already have the answer. It's
stay put if you've done your homework. I think of Longhorn,
that buck. He pisses me off to this day. I'm

(01:20:42):
not gonna lie. I mean, I'll just even just drive
cellular my stealth cams, you know, cellular trail cameras. I
had one on. Remember I was describing that knob with
that rock cropping. There literally was a spot over here
and then they're literally on the other side of the

(01:21:04):
valley was another spot where he came out. I'm telling you, like,
I know this is a podcast, and I know you're
watching me, and I'm literally like messing with my hand.
I'm like squeezing my head right now, like that stupid buck.
I mean that that was such a cool buck. I'm
gonna get your photo of him. Yeah, Longhorn was this

(01:21:28):
amazing buck and son of a gun dude. I'm telling you,
I had pictures of him like crazy and videos. I'm
like crazy, I finally finally had an opportunity at him,
and I mean, stay put. Your question specifically was what
did you learn from the biggest bucks. Longhorn kept coming

(01:21:54):
out on these two spots, and and and I was
an idiot, and I would try to like squeak in
and move a stand. And if I would have just
stayed put in those two spots, dude, I would go
to the one spot and I'd be sitting there shoot,
and he'd be at the other spot, you know, And
then and then I'd go to that spot, and then

(01:22:16):
he'd be And it was a joke, man. I mean
a couple of my buddies, you know, literally who also
super good, good friends of mindy, really good people where
where you know are are are not able to hunt
as much as I am. And so they're always watching
the cameras right and literally they would be like, you
screwed up. He's over there, you know. I'm like, oh

(01:22:37):
my dude, I had to like I had to turn
the phone off. I couldn't even watch that crap anymore
because I'd be sitting there and it's like, oh, well,
there is there he is, you know. And he would
any any any and never never would he go from
this spot during the during the hunt and come all
the way over to the spot. It was just too far.
It was to it was it was. I mean, as

(01:22:58):
far as the crow flies, it was that big of
a deal. But in terms of like the terrain going
all the way down, crossing the ag field, coming all
the way up to the other spot, it just wasn't
gonna happen. And and I honestly, I should have just
stopped going from A to B to A to B
and then trying to stick in the C and the D.
I should have just been like, now you know what,
I'm hunting B. I'm just staying at B. I know

(01:23:20):
he's gonna come here. I know this is one of
the scrapes that he frequently checks. I'm just going to
stay here. And if I would have done that, I
probably would have had a second chance. And I did
finally end up getting a chance at Longhorn, and I
literally had him at I don't know, five yards and
I just did not have an ethical shot and there's
just no way. And heck, I was going to take that,

(01:23:41):
take that chance. So you know, I so so. And
then and then the last final thing, let's just talk
about and let's just talk about sweetness for two seconds,
right four years later, what did we talk about earlier
in this show, he ends up being shot right right

(01:24:02):
out of the same darn spot. Sorry, Mark, I'm trying
to put my laptop in here, same spot four years later.
So dude, good spots are good spots, right, and we
keep trying to add more spots. But man, when you
get a good one sometimes, I've learned from Big Bucks, Dude,

(01:24:27):
hold the line, and it's so easy to get carried.
It's so easy to want to do what go to
and do spot? I mean, Mark, we hang all these stands.
How many stands you got hung right now?

Speaker 2 (01:24:40):
Well, not as many because I'm mostly saddle hunt now.
But there's a lot of prep trees ready for saddles
and a lot of locations.

Speaker 3 (01:24:46):
Okay, yeah, Hey listen, I haven't killed a deer with
the sald yet. I'm all in this year. I really
do want to shoot a deer with a saddle, for sure.
It's fun, it's new, it's different, it's exciting, right, It's
just it's it's just it's something different. And but not

(01:25:06):
that I'm dissing saddle hunting or tree stand hunting, right, Like,
the saddle almost is like adds a whole nother mind,
like a whole nother mind boggling dimension to it now,
because now I'm walking around going like, Okay, I got
a tree stand hung there, I could saddle hunt there,

(01:25:27):
and I can saddle hunt there. Now. It's like my
inventory of spots has gone up, you know, but I.

Speaker 2 (01:25:35):
Can go too far. Sometimes it can go too far.

Speaker 3 (01:25:39):
Sometimes. The point is that we're trying to make with
this last and final question. When you find a big
buck and you know that he has been frequently coming
to an area, clearly that can change. Like listen, right now,
apples are falling, and you know you'd go stick a

(01:26:01):
trail camera underneath an apple tree, and right now apples
are kind of hot, and it's a fun way to
get some inventorysm deer. Yes, that's going to probably change.
But generally speaking, this whole podcast has been about mature
deer where they like to live, and when you find
and when you believe you have one of those spots

(01:26:22):
and you get your stand or you get your saddle position,
hold the line and hang in there. That that would
be my personal you know, recommendation period. Yeah, sweetness, I
had strong, strong advice. Ton I had ten probably stands
for sweetness. I probably should have just kept going back

(01:26:45):
to the ladder stand that my friend shot for years ago,
and I would add a chance at a you know,
and longhorn. I should have just kept sticking with the spot.
But hue in nature is you know, you want to
shake and move, you want to do different things. You
start letting your brain get in the way in terms

(01:27:07):
of like, oh gosh, does the deer think that he's
onto me here? So again, the best lesson I could
say when it comes to that last question you asked, specifically,
what have we learned from hunting big mature bucks. When
you find a good spot that they like the frequent,
make that saddle or tree stand bulletproof. From how you

(01:27:30):
get in, how you get out. Make sure you understand
the wind on multiple different conditions. There when it's not right,
don't hunt it, leave it alone, pay attention to the
bear the pressure, and I can pretty much guarantee that

(01:27:50):
you will be tipping the odds in your favor of
shooting that big buck this fall.

Speaker 2 (01:27:58):
Man, it's a perfect boat to put on top of
the whole conversation. Tod, that's perfect. Thank you for that.
So let's let's end it with this. Can you give
folks a quick rundown of where they can connect with
you guys, where they can see all the bowhunting dot
Com content. Is there anything in particular they should be
keeping an eye out this year for anything like that.
Please let us know.

Speaker 3 (01:28:20):
Yeah, Mark, thanks for that. I appreciate it. For those
of you that follow us, I mean, you know I
I websites and have been in my blood forever. I
mean I started literally like in nineteen ninety six. I'm
gonna end this with a really fun story about and
I'll save that for the end. But bowhunting dot Com
is a great resource for a lot of great information.

(01:28:45):
Justin and Paul and our team and Brody. We got
a lot of writers, We got a lot of good
content on there. Mark, I actually am going to pose
a question to you right now that puts you in
a position where you just can't say no. That's why
I'm saving this too as well. We do a really
cool thing with age, the age this buck, and I
would love it if you, guys, if I sent you
about twelve different bucks that we're going to be yeah aging,

(01:29:08):
if you could give us your opinion on the age
of these bucks, and of course you know it will
be from Mark Kenyon what he thinks the age of
those deer ours. We love to have to be a
part of that. So if you want to have fun, guys,
go to bowhunting dot com. We've got some sweep steaks,
We've got a lot of good content and we can
answer a lot of your questions with our bow Hunt
one or one section. As far as YouTube goes, guys,

(01:29:31):
you can pull up our channel, which is you know,
bow hunting dot com. We've got a series that has
been called Bowhunter Die. You've never heard of it. Check
it out for those of the people that haven't been
following along with Bowhunter Die. It's really cool because a
lot of our teammates are just like probably a lot
of the audience, right they're not doing this full time

(01:29:53):
like we're doing. They are guys who have full time jobs.
They're working, they're eight up with this stuff. They're and
they're trying to do the most with their time and
getting out there, and they have found a little knack
for filming their hunts and they've been on board for years.
So definitely take a peek at our YouTube series Bowhunter Die.
Justin my right hand Man has also started a podcast

(01:30:17):
along with the stuff that we do called pinch points.
So we've got a lot of different content, a lot
of different things that we're doing to help, you know,
the average bowhunter get out there and get started and
have a great time in the woods. Of course, social
channels and all that stuff. But last, but not least,
you know, one of the questions I always get asked
a lot is how the heck did you get that

(01:30:41):
domain name bowhunting dot com? And it was probably one
of my most favorite purchases ever. I literally I think
I still owned this date over two thousand hunting related
domain names, but you name it, I own it. Food
plots dot com or dear ticks dot com. Yeah, I
own a lot of them, but this one, specifically, I

(01:31:06):
really wanted bow hunting dot com right, it's my favorite
thing to do.

Speaker 4 (01:31:09):
And I was looking up the domainium This is literally
about like nineteen ninety six or seven, and a lady
in Canada owned it and I called her up and
I said, Hey, what do I need to do to
buy this domain niume for me? She's like, jeez, Louise,
I get so many phone calls to people who want
to buy this name, and it must be really popular.

Speaker 3 (01:31:29):
I'm like, well, i'll tell you what. I'll give you
two thousand dollars for it. And back then like, seriously, guys,
I was probably living on my credit cards. Like it's
probably not the smartest thing, but man, I was buying
every domain name I could think of. I knew the
Internet was going to go somewhere one day. And she's
like two thousand dollars. You got to be kidding me.

(01:31:49):
She said, I'll be more unhappy to sell that name
due and I said, great. You know, so I got
a certified check man, I sent it to her, and finally,
once the transaction was done, I said to her, I said, man,
if you don't mind me asking, you know, why did
you buy that domain name? Oh, me and my daughters

(01:32:10):
love collecting bows for our hair, you know, so we're out,
you know, bow hunting for bows for our hair.

Speaker 5 (01:32:16):
And I was like, I mean, I was like, you
gotta be kidding me, But that is how I am
getting the domain name bon hunting dot com.

Speaker 3 (01:32:27):
But Mark, it's been a it's been an absolute pleasure.
I appreciate, you know, meat eater and all the great
stuff that you guys do. You guys do a fantastic
job as well, and I appreciate the fact that you're,
you know, willing to have a have me on today
and talk about this big buck strategy. I will say

(01:32:48):
it's a lot easier to kill those three and a
half year olds at the end of this but and
I might not pass up one of those if it
comes by. But I do appreciate it for sure.

Speaker 2 (01:32:59):
You.

Speaker 3 (01:33:00):
I do appreciate it, and you do a great job.
And with all getting aside, Mark, love to have you down.
We got some great spots and if you want to
come down, have a great time, filmed some videos whatever.
Love to have you down. The doors open, so just
you got my cell number, give me a shout, tell
me when you're coming. Let's get it done.

Speaker 2 (01:33:17):
Awesome. Well, he thank you for that invite and for
being here to do this and for sharing all your insight.
This is as I knew it would be. It's been great,
it's been fun, and we'll have to make a point
to do this again soon.

Speaker 3 (01:33:30):
Sounds really good. Thanks so much.

Speaker 2 (01:33:31):
Appreciate it all right, and that is a wrap. Thank
you for joining me. Appreciate you tuning in. Got to
just leave you with one last ask. Make sure you're
following Wired to Hunt over on Instagram if you want
the latest and greatest updates from my hunts, from my fall,
from the content we're putting out there. That's where I'm

(01:33:53):
posting a lot of my stories and little snippets from
different experiences and different content pieces I'm working on. As
I mentioned, I think per week prior. My season's kicking
off here in about a week, so I will have
some deer hunting stories very soon, and I hope you'll
follow along there. Over on the Wired Hunt Instagram account,
We've also got a newsletter. If you go to the

(01:34:14):
meat Eater dot com, it will prompt you to sign
up for the Wired to Hunt weekly newsletter. Make sure
you're signed up there to get our latest content delivered
right to your inbox as well. So with all that
out of the way, I appreciate you listening today, Thanks
for being a part of this community. Best of luck
out there. If you guys are hunting already, I know
a lot of you are. I hope that some of

(01:34:35):
the things you've learned this year from the podcast are
coming in handy, and I hope if stay Wired to
Hunt

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Host

Mark Kenyon

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