Family, Leadership, and Profitability | Jeff Whitted and Ryan Stones of Aslan Design & Build

Meet Jeff Whitted and Ryan Stones, leaders of Aslan Design & Build in Sellersville, Pennsylvania. In this episode, the dynamic father-and-son-in-law team explore the challenges and triumphs of running a family business. From navigating the complexities of working with family to maintaining profitability and preventing theft, Jeff and Ryan reveal their hard-earned wisdom and experiences. They also share valuable insights into leadership, processes, and company culture.

In this episode you will learn:

• The key to successfully working with family members
• The top rule for preventing theft in your business
• Key areas in a remodeling process where profitability can break down
• An important business practice Jeff and Ryan borrowed from the Navy SEALs
• Jeff's three essential secrets to being a great leader

 

Learn more about Aslan Design & Build here: https://aslaninteriors.com/

 

Own a construction company and want to share your story? Apply to be on an upcoming episode of Builder Stories at https://www.builderstories.com

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
Welcome to the podcast where we take a deep diveinto the stories behind construction business
leaders. We will share how they got started, howthey found success, and the lessons
learned along the way. I'm your host, EricFortenberry.
Welcome to Builder Stories.
Welcome back, everybody. Today I am reallyexcited.

(00:21):
I have got a very dynamic duo here. We've got a,uh, father and a son-in-law
who are coming together, gonna work, you know,building their company, so I've got Jeff Whitted and Ryan
Stones. They, uh, work together at Aslin Design &Build.
They're located in Sellersville, Pennsylvania.Really excited to have you guys on the show today.
Welcome to Builder Stories. Great to be here.

(00:42):
Thank you very much for the opportunity.
Yeah, thanks, Eric. Yeah, absolutely.
So, why, why don't you guys, you know, uh, may-maybe we'll start with Jeff here, you know, give us, give us
the backstory and how did you get intoconstruction? What led you to start this business?
Kinda what, what's the main focus?
Well, basically,
I went to college to learn to draw, uh, cadavers.
I wanted to be a medical illustrator, and, uh, Ichanged my mind after a number of

(01:05):
art programs. So I was paying my way throughschool so I worked with a carpenter for two years and then the
last two years
I worked for a painting contractor.
When I finished college, I didn't know what theheck I wanted to do.
So
my brother-in-law right outside Philadelphia, uh,had started an upholstery
business and, uh, so I joined that

(01:25):
and the next thing I knew I was learning how totie springs and do tufting and we were, uh,
we would upholster walls for the Four Seasons, uh,we did a lot of nightclubs
and, uh, so I basically became an upholsterer
and then this artistic part of me was like, "Well,I just don't want to sit at a
bench or, you know, on sight upholstering." So,and I started learning window

(01:48):
treatments
and then, um, I started actually doing work forother interior designers
and I started thinking, "I can do this."
And, uh, then I started teaching myself fauxfinishes which I did for about 12 years, wood
grain, marbleizing and so forth.
And I soon began to realize that I had theaptitudes

(02:10):
for
doing this work.
So I'd kind of come through a little bit ofcarpentry trade, a little bit of painting trade,
a lot of upholstery and a lot of windowtreatments.
And so by the time I got to '98, so at this pointI was like
13 years in business, I did my first kitchenremodel and

(02:32):
I've always been the type of person which if Idon't know how to do it,
I'll still take the job and then I'll just figureit out.
And, um, so this first kitchen was an old homedown in Philly that had
16-inch thick
stone walls, three stories high, and we actuallytore out the
16-foot section of wall, put a steel beam in tomake the kitchen

(02:55):
larger and I had no idea how to do that, but Ijust got someone that knew how to do it.
So fast-forward, I started, um, what I found isthat
a lot of people out there, they don't know who tocall to have work, and if you're working for people who are
professionals, they don't have the time to try tofigure out to do the work.
So I would start having people ask me questionslike, "Do you know a roofer?

(03:16):
Do you know someone that could p- put a newelectric panel box in the house?" And this and that.
And I thought, "This is, you know, I don't want tolose the opportunity to, to make some money, so
yeah, sure, we can do that." And we did it.
So, um, we increasingly moved towards more andmore build stuff
and
m- what I realized, because we were as-interiors,s- since I incorporated on my own in

(03:39):
'85, we were as-interiors and I realized that weactually were doing
design build,
and everybody and their brother seemed to behanging that shingle out because it was sort of a popular
concept. I thought, "We're really doing this."
And I like to tell people we do footers to fabricsbecause during the '80s and those '90s wh- when
I was doing the window treatments and theupholstery, I was starting to do interior design as well, the

(04:03):
carpet, pick the colors and whatnot, and I wastraining my daughter.
So I eventually was able to join ASID as an alliedmember
and, um,
so we kind of just kept doing the building and thedesign and then Ryan
married my fourth daughter, w- we have eight kids,and, uh, Brittany is
a few years older than Camille, whom Ryan married,and she, uh, she's an

(04:26):
allied member of ASID as well. She kind of grew upin the business,
and so... Then enter Ryan seven years ago.
Take it away, Ryan.
Take it away. Thanks, Pops. Uh,
try not to call him Pops in front of clients, butit comes out.
Um, but, uh, anyway, yeah, so, uh, I'm Ryan and,and I came into the

(04:46):
business kind of, um,
in a much different trajectory. I didn't comethrough the trades.
I actually came from, uh, a non-profit Christianministry of all things.
Um,
Jeff, at the time, seven years ago, needed help inthe office and needed help with project management, um,
implementing some systems, um, so in sort of a,um,

(05:07):
you know, backdoor way, that experience workingfor the non-profit, raising my own funds, I, I
kind of almost ran a mini small business, um, formy ministry,
and so, you know, I, I was doing all sorts ofcrazy stuff. I was doing the marketing.
I was doing, um, you know, managing projects,doing the work, um, planning, all
this kind of, kind of stuff.

(05:27):
Um, and really it was kind of exactly the skillsetthat the company needed, somebody to come in and
really help organize things, help to, to runthings, you know, start new initiatives, really help the
company grow and, uh, in professionalism,excellence, you know, just to do better what Jeff,
um, had done for years and years but to kind oftake it to the next level.
Um, so, you know, I, I didn't necessarily think I,I would be there when I first started long

(05:51):
term,
um, but, um, you know, eventually I, uh, when
the option to
kind of do something else or do this, I'm like,"I'm, I'm gonna stay with Aslin."
Um, and, you know, it's, it's, it's been a goodtime.
I'm really, really thankful to have, you know,jumped on board.
Um, you know, some of my favorite things thatwe've done is, is just implementing those systems, so

(06:15):
JobTred's one of them. We just started about ayear ago, but even before that we were, um, using,
um, a couple of other different systems in ourtech stack, um,
you know, Asana for project management, uh, usinga lot of like Google Sheets and that kind of thing, so we
really pumped about a year ago as we were, uh,thinking, you know, through, "Hey, how can we build for the
next season?" Um, a- and particularly as Jeff andI were working through, um, the succession

(06:38):
plan whereby I'll take over in the next 10 yearsor so.
Uh, one of the key things was we need to get, youknow, some better software in there, and so that's where
JobTred, uh, came in, um,
so.
So yeah, that's, that's a little bit of my story.
I did become, um, you know, after starting withnot much experience, um, we were doing a ton of
kitchens and baths. It was the bread and butter ofwhat we did, um, and eventually after

(07:01):
about four or five years of doing it, I'm like,"Wow. I'm, I'm starting to know what I'm doing.
Like what, what is this?" And so I looked intothe, um, NKBA's
certification for certified kitchen and bathdesigner and I was, I was shocked at, "Wow.
I'm actually qualified (laughs) to do this." So Itook the tests and, and found out I pretty much
knew everything already just from, you know,learning on the street, uh, as it were,

(07:23):
like doi- doing kitchens under Jeff's, um,leadership and guidance and expertise, um,
learned a ton and, and then the, the courseworkwas really, um, you know, helpful in kind of polishing that
off for me. Um, and so now, you know, I'm, I'm,every kitchen and bath design comes through, you know,
through across my desk, um, so I'm, I'm doing allthe drawings.
Um, you know, Jeff is overseeing and guidingthings, but, um, but you know, we really work

(07:46):
hand-in-hand to make sure these, you know,kitchens and baths especially are, are, um, you
know, great designs, tight, you know, they, they,they're functional, they're beautiful, uh, that kind
of thing. So, that's a little bit of my story.
Man, that's, uh, he- that's quite the, uh, quitethe interesting story there.
You know, y- you guys had mentioned earlier yougot, you had an interesting journey to get here, but, uh,
yeah, I mean, Jeff, you know, from, from cadaversto, to upholstery to windows and

(08:09):
painting and, and I mean, (laughs) I l- I love howyou describe it, uh, you know, from footings to fabric.
I mean, that...That truly is, uh, the (laughs) thefull, the full circle, uh, full
process there. That's, uh, quite the story there.
And I mean, eight, eight kids sounds like, uh,it's, it's been, uh, you know, a, a family business, uh,
that the whole time you've had lots of involvementand, you know, super awesome to have, uh, have Ryan here

(08:30):
come in and joining you. I mean, you know, I, Ifind a lot of times some of the best businesses get built when
you can have both, you know, the person who justreally understands the trades and, and, and the
construction side of the house, you know, and thenalso having that, that strength on, on, on
the business side, the processes, you know,operations.
Being able to, to build something that, you know,can operate very efficiently and, you know, leveraging,

(08:53):
you know, all the, the, the, the latesttechnologies, marketing, you know, tools, techniques,
strategies, you know? Sounds like you guys havegot a really good, uh, you know, kind of combination
partnership going on here.
Well, well, you know, it's something which, uh, Iwanna stress.
So I, I, I'm 68, and so I'm hoping to work 'tilI'm 78.
And when Ryan came to me seven years ago, 'cause,you know, remember, uh, I would sell $100,000

(09:15):
and $200,000 projects by hand sketching,
you know, not even color. I, I would hand sketchand I would sell these projects.
And Ryan came to me and he said, "Listen." Hegoes, "There's some things that I wanna
do 'cause, you know, I'm younger. I'm, I'm verytechnical in, in how I think about things."
And I realized that if the business was going t-to grow, I needed to trust him,

(09:39):
not be afraid of the technology.
And I'm not the greatest with technology.
I, I do like JobTred, I do understand it somewhat.
Let's say I understand it well enough.
But the thing is, younger people, like Ryan hasdone with me, they will
work around the systems

(09:59):
so older folks like us can be comfortable,
you know? And I, I can't stress enough
how, like, if you're out there and you're thinkingabout bringing in younger people th- that want to change
maybe how you do what you do,
um,
it's probably a really good thing and y- youprobably should let them.
Yeah, I mean, I, I, I definitely see, you know,

(10:20):
z- there, there can ha- m- have a tendency for,like, kinda just resistance to change and-
Oh, yeah.
... you know, I hear all the time, "Well, we'vebeen, we've been doing it that way for the last, you know,
three or four decades. Like, why would we change?
Why would we do anything different?" But, youknow, it sounds like, you know, you, you might have kind of
been in that camp until Ryan came along.
And I mean, you know, so what, you know, when,when you're looking kind of back at the last few years when

(10:41):
Ryan's been, you know, able to really help youmodernize the business, I mean, sounds like it's been a
no-brainer, you know, to, to be able to get, getthat, uh, fresh perspective and adapt to the
times.
Well,
here's something. So,
you know, Ryan had had a lot of conversationsabout, you know, how do we wanna grow our business?
What's our ideal project? Because, m- I mean,we'll do addition, home, house remodels.

(11:03):
I have clients where we're just doing interiordesign, you know, the furnishing and, and finishes and
such.
But
if you really seek to be creative, if you reallyseek to kind of
set yourself apart from a lot of other people whoare doing what you're doing,
you've gotta be a good problem solver, right?
But

(11:24):
a lot of creativity really helps.
So the creativity actually complicates thebusiness.
I mean, if you think about we're lining up a guyto, to, to dig the footers
and we're figuring out, I mean, what the size ofthe drapery treatment's gonna be and the
size of the area rug and everything in between.
And what we have found is JobTred,

(11:47):
by far,
has been the best system
to keep track of all that. So what that means ismore profitability.
It, it means less stress for Ryan. I've, I've seenRyan's stress level go down like this. As he...
The more he gets into JobTred,
the,
his stress goes down.
The profitability goes up.

(12:09):
And what it does, it actually frees me up to bemore creative, and I'm...
I like to think I'm getting e- even better even atmy age of 68, that I'm even getting better on
this plane
because something like JobTred gets rid of a lotof the noise.
Yeah, that's great. I mean, Ryan, I'm, I'm, I'mcurious
from, you know, from your perspective.

(12:30):
I mean, obviously, you know, coming into thiswith, with your father-in-law, you know, y- you married his
daughter, you know, you got some sort of family,uh, you know, personal dynamics at play, but wha-
what was it like to, you know, to, to help kind ofget him to, you know, adopt
this technology? I mean, obviously we, we heardthat he was, you know, not, not super comfortable and, and
may, you know, may have been hesitant and, andpushing back a little, you know, early on.

(12:54):
Like, h- how did you, how did you navigate that?You know, honestly, it's...
I would say it's been easy. Um, you know, I th- Ithink, you know, even to say that he's pushing back is
like,
it's like an over-exaggeration. Um, I think, thinkthe only thing is, you know, there's this idea of, like,
technological natives versus technologicalimmigrants.
I mean, I, I grew up with a computer in my house,you know? Um, whereas, you know, Jeff didn't.

(13:16):
So, um, you know, so, so I think some of it isjust, um...
Number one, I think he has the humility to say,"Yeah, you know what? Uh, I just...
That's not gonna be my strength. So I, I wanna getthe systems that, that we need, but,
um, you know, I want, I wanna work within thatsystem, but, you know, I have limitations.
I'm just not gonna be able to use it, uh, youknow, as quickly or effectively, you know, as, say, I could or, or

(13:39):
someone in my generation." Um, so I, I...
Anyway, I think the huge thing is just that, thatcharacter of, of humility to, to kind of know
yourself and to, um... and, I mean, we can allbenefit from that in different areas.
You know, I mean, there's, there's things that Ijust, you know,
don't have me do that, have Jeff do that, becauseit'll stress me out or, or whatever, you know?
I mean, Jeff is just a, a master with the, thedesign, you know, um, you know, connecting with

(14:03):
people, um, you know, even if there's, there'sproblem solving stuff, like, just the, the 40 years of
experience and knowledge, like, he just can, can,can really handle things really well.
So, um, so yeah, I mean, h- honestly it wasn't...There w- uh, there wasn't pushback from him.
I think the, the hardest thing was just, you know,implementing the system, figuring out, uh, the best way
to use it. Um,
y- you know, we've, we've taken advantage of, um,other help too.

(14:26):
We've got, you know, admin assistants that, thathelp us and, you know, help kind of
use the JobTred systems. Um, and again, it's allabout freeing up Jeff to kind of do
what he does best. Um, you know, he shouldn't besitting in front of a computer doing admin work, right?
Um, y- you know, only what's necessary.
Like, he should be out, you know, with people,designing things, um,

(14:47):
y- you know, uh, solving problems, um, you know,face-to-face with people.
So, as you know, let him do that and then I'll,I'll handle the, the interior stuff.
You know, I'll work with the admin assistant, ourother project management, um, and design staff to, to
handle those kind of things. Sure. That, that ma-that makes a lot of sense.
And, and, you know, I think, you know, just likewhat you described, I mean, I, som- some of the most

(15:07):
successful best leaders out there are the ones whocan set their, their ego aside and say, "Hey,
you know, I, I know that I need to learn somethingnew and I, and I want to, you know, adopt and, and adapt to
the times." And like, "How can we be moreefficient?" And, and, and really, like, having that in-depth
understanding of, "Here's, you know, kind of whatI'm comfortable with.
Here's sort of where my boundaries are.
You know, what can you do to help get thisimplemented?" I mean, that's, that's a sign of, of, of a very great

(15:30):
leader and some- somebody who's genuinely puttingthe business ahead of their own
personal, you know, beliefs on, you know, whetherthey like technology, hate technology,
you know, want to use it or not use it. You know,I, I think that, that... You said it really well there.
I mean, that's a great, you know, lesson foreveryone out there to, to just always remember that, you know,
there are new, new techniques, new things thatcome along that, like, you gotta keep kind of learning and

(15:53):
being open-minded to.... if you want to be able toadapt with the times and, you know, I think that's
what, that's what keeps everything healthy and,you know, keeps the business growing.
And, you know, just, just like you said, I mean,it, it sounds like you guys really understand
yourselves and your own, you know, kind ofstrengths and weaknesses, and, and have done a good job
defining, you know, sort of your, your, your, yourlanes and, and, and you know, you know, what is

(16:16):
the best use of each of your time. And how do youreally maximize the value that you can
add to the business. And yeah, sitting behind acomputer is, is, is not the best use of Jeff's time, but
he, you know, he's been afforded the, theopportunity to go and do what is the best
use of his time, because you've been able to comein here and help, you know, build out the, the systems, the
processes. You've kinda got the, the operation ina better place where it doesn't need to have Jeff,

(16:40):
you know, doing all that stuff every single day.
He can be out focused on the customers and, andthe actual build, and, and so I think it's, it sounds like you
guys really have formed a great partnership herethat I think, you know, a lot of people sort of struggle
with kind of navigating, you know, okay, who'sgonna do what and how should we kind of run this together?
It sounds like there's a lot of trust, you know,between you to, to, to really implement and, and execute.

(17:01):
Yeah, you know, you, you said stay in your lane.
I feel like Jeff and I, we talk about that, like,every day.
(laughs) Uh, you know, 'cause it's, it's, wewant... I mean, it, it's just so many d- dynamics to that.
So it's Jeff staying in his lane, me staying inmine, um, it's even our, you know, our trade partners and
suppliers. Like, what lane do they have?
Um, y- and, you know, for our customer and theirparticular, uh, project, um, like,

(17:23):
what are the lanes that are part of their projectand who do we wanna put th- put in them?
You know, m- maybe we, um... And that's part ofour task as designers as
well, is, is understanding and, you know, what isthat lane and, you know, how do we get
the, the right
solution there? You know, we, we might design thisawesome custom cabinet for them,

(17:43):
um, but, you know, they actually need to be morein like a, a, a factory-made, uh, more
simple thing because of their budget.
So, um, anyway, yeah, staying in the lane, that'sth- it's so key on so many levels.
Well, the thing too, like, w- one of those lanesis like, we always tell clients that, you know,
look, I have two hands. My left hand is yourbudget,
my right hand is the design process.

(18:07):
So working with Ryan, you know, our lanes do join
and, you know, there again, JobTred kinda justhelps us keep track of
how much we're spending and, like, how we doing onbudget.
Okay, I can splurge a little bit on this selectionthen because we're still kind of in the range and, you
know, it's a constant back and forth of, you know,budget, design, budget, design,

(18:30):
you know?
So... And, and s- something too for the success isthat
Ryan and I know that we're not perfect people
by far
and we both really st- try to own it when we screwup.
And if we need to tell each other, "Hey, you knowwhat?
Um, I was impatient, I'm sorry." Or, "I was kindacranky today 'cause I'm on a cleanse,

(18:53):
you know, I'm sorry." Whatever, but that, but...
We have that in the family, right?
And we just keep it consistent in the workrelationship and when we hire
people, it's very important that they have thatsame culture
so,
you know, an employee can feel free to like, "Hey,you know, you're training me, but I feel kind of
overwhelmed," and, uh, you know, it's like they'refree to talk to us.

(19:18):
You know, it's all about being approachable 'causewe want our clients
to feel that we're approachable, you know?
And, uh...
Such a great point. I mean, I, I think that, youknow, that really...
Communication,
you know, is probably one of the, the, the thingsI hear the most that just, like, it, it, it, it really, it can
translate, you know, from, from your personalfamily life directly to, you know, the, the

(19:40):
business, with your employees, with your clients.
Like, you know, if there's any one skill thatanyone could develop to become a
better, you know, person, it's, it's the abilityto communicate and to, you
know, just kinda have those, th- even those hardconversations where, you know, you gotta just, you
know... If you come in, you know, hot and heavyand, and just get that other person on the defense, like, this

(20:01):
isn't gonna be a productive conversation.
It's, it's about coming in, making sure now's theright time and, and sort of having that, kind of that, the
goal of diffusing and, you know, you know,
making amends and rebuilding so that you cancontinue to move forward, you know, in, in, in the best kinda
possible manner. And, you know, it sounds likethat, maybe that family,
you know, love and, and trust and relationship hashelped to kinda

(20:24):
bring that into the business where now it's reallykinda part of the culture, you know, which is great.
I mean, I, I couldn't agree more. Like, I want allof my employees to also feel like, you know, they can come in
and, and talk to me about anything and thatthere's, you know, who cares what titles are and roles and, you
know, who's in the corner office. It's, it's aboutmaking sure people feel comfortable in having those
conversations. And, you know, I think when you dothat, you, you build a very strong culture that

(20:47):
will continue to, to build and, and help, youknow, the company, you know, go, go through the, the good times
and the bad times.
Right. And, and if I could add one other thing.
Th- so I was raised by my father, do the rightthing even to your own
hurt.
And
when we deal with clients, 'cause, you know, youalways hope that you just get the great client, but

(21:08):
sometimes you get someone who's,
you know, you wish kind of maybe you weren'tworking for them after you're halfway into the job.
But what I have found over the years is that
problems happen. You know, a vendor messes up, youknow, I make a mistake on
something, stuff just happens. Materials come inshort or they're damaged or
whatever.

(21:29):
And owning,
owning it
and just looking someone in the eye and takingresponsibility for it and then making it
right.
Oh, you know what? The paint got mixed the wrongcolor.
We just paid a painter $1500 to paint this room.It's our fault.
I'm not gonna argue with the client,
try to talk them into liking it. No, you knowwhat? Our bad. W- we'll make it right.

(21:53):
And
when those things happen, unfortunately, theydon't happen a lot,
but I've found generally speaking, unless somebodyis a really difficult person, but most
people, when you go through something like thatand they see that you do the right thing,
that actually makes the bond and l- loyalty evenstronger with that
client.
Absolutely. You know, sometimes it, it does take alittle, uh, little bump in the road

(22:18):
to really kinda help everyone see, you know,what's, what's under the, under the hood, you know,
kinda h- who, who are these people really? Dothey, do they genuinely care?
Do they do what they say they're gonna do?
And, you know, I think it is those, those littlemoments, those are opportunities to, to truly show, you
know, you're, who you are and that, that, thatbuilds your reputation that will, you know, precede
this job and this client. You know, I think that'sone of the most important things and I tell people all the

(22:41):
time too, like, you, you know, you gotta honoryour word.
If, if you screwed up, then, you know, own it andtake care of it and, and, and make it right.
You know, because, you know, one, one littlehiccup, you know, one dipping into that profit, you know, for
this one job, I mean, that's, that's veryshort-sighted when you try to kinda go back and, and squeeze,
you know, turn it on them somehow or another.
You know, it sounds like you guys really do, youknow, kinda have that, again, that long-term, you know,

(23:03):
vision here which is, you know, again, it's...
You're, you're already thinking about a 10-year,you know, succession plan and, you know, obviously
you've been in this since 19, you know, I think'85, you know, so it is, it- it's about seeing the, the
much bigger picture
and, uh, you know, leading, leading by, uh, youknow, kinda with, with your core values and who you are.
Yeah, absolutely.
W-

(23:24):
I'm curious, what is your... Can you kinda give usa little breakdown of like what's the total team look like
today?
So, um, so yeah, so Jeff's the, the CEO, leaddesigner, um,
so I'm kinda the chief of operations, um,
and, uh, you know, I do all the, the financialadmin stuff as well.
Um, and then, uh, we've got, um, two guys thatare, uh, project manager

(23:45):
estimators that just started in the last year.
Um, so th- they're part of, you know, the, thetrajectory of, you know, Jeff and I looking to the
future and growing over the next 10 years, uh,it's to bring people in, um, under
us to train them up to, to do the work. So, um,you know, one started in September,
um, his name is also Jeff.
Which is a little confusing. Uh, we're stilltrying to figure it out.

(24:07):
Uh, and then, uh, we got another guy, Nate, whostarted in January.
And so that's, that's our full-time crew. Uh,we're really small. We're lean and mean as we like to say.
Um, but, uh, but yeah, we're, we're getting itdone. We're having a lot of fun.
Um, it's been really awesome, uh, for me inparticular, but for Jeff as well, just to kind
of pass along the things that we've learned.
Um, some of the hard knocks over the past sevenyears for me and for, you know, for Jeff the past, you know,

(24:31):
35, 40 years, uh, for him, um, until...
To really, um, head off those mistakes so that,you know, these, these guys don't make the same mistakes.
Um, so that's, that's the full-time crew, butwe've got, um, Jeff's daughter Brittany,
um, my, uh, sister-in-law who, um, is, uh, she'sin part-time
a- as a designer, um, about one day a week. Um,and then we've got...

(24:52):
And here's the slew of other, um, uh, non-employeetrade partners, um,
uh, subcontractors that will come in and help useverything from admin assistant to the
actual, uh, work that's, that's going on.Carpenters, plumbers, electricians, HVAC.
And we have Emily too. We, we, we have E- Emily.She does...
She's sort of an admin assistant to me a littlebit, and she does marketing

(25:14):
as well, so.
That's great. So for all the... You know, for the,for the actual construction work, it sounds like you're,
you're leveraging subcontractors for the mostpart?
Mm-hmm.
Um, and I think that's really important because,uh, you know, when you're building a house or any type of
structure, um, you want to make sure that you'renot only getting the best quality materials, but you're
also making sure that you're getting the rightamount of laborers to do the job.
Um, and I think that's something that, uh, we'vereally tried to do is make sure that we have the right amount
of people on site at all times so that we can getthe job done on time and within budget.
Um, and I think that's something that, uh, we'vereally tried to do is make sure that we have the right amount
of people on site at all times so that we can getthe job done on time and within budget.
And we have Emily too. We, we, we have E- Emily.She does...
She's sort of an admin assistant to me a littlebit, and she does, uh, marketing as well, so.
That's great. So for all the... You know, for the,for the actual construction work, it sounds like you're,
you're leveraging subcontractors for the mostpart?
Mm-hmm.
Um, and I think that's really important because,uh, you know, when you're building a house or any type of
structure, um, you want to make sure that you'renot only getting the best quality materials, but you're
also making sure that you're getting the rightamount of laborers to do the job done on time and within
budget. Um, and I think that's something that, uh,we've really tried to do is make sure that we have the
right amount of people on site at all times sothat we can get the job done on time and within budget.
Well, time to-
It's definitely something that-
Time to turn a new leaf there, my friend.
(laughs) .
And it... And, and one thing I'll say too is thatI'll, I'll probably speak for your dad too, I bet, and I've
never even met him, but having your son-in-law,your daughter, daughter-in-law...
'Cause my daughter-in-law, until she had fourkids, she actually worked as a designer for me.
But, you know, it's really a very humbling thingthat your kids, you know, in-law...
you know, son, daughter-in-law
included, would
actually
want
to work for you.

(25:34):
I
mean,
I
almost

(31:55):
don't have words to even really
describe what a blessing th- that is.
Yeah.
Yeah. No, you know, and I... And, and, and I knowhe's just... ... extremely proud and it, it does...
It, it means a lot to, to both of us. I mean, youknow, a- again, I, I think life's too short to not spend it
doing the things that you love with the peoplethat, you know, you, you wanna spend your time and, and, and be

(32:17):
around. And, you know, I, I, you know, I say thatthough with, with an understanding that, again, it, it
doesn't work for everyone. And, you know, my, my,my wife at the very beginning of JobTred, she came
in and was helping, uh, you know, make cold callsand trying to kinda see what she could do to help out.
And she, you know, kinda, I don't know, a coupleweeks in, she's like, "Eric, uh, I just don't think this is my
thing. Like, I really wanna help you, but, uh, youknow, I, I don't know." And so I was like, "Look, n- no

(32:40):
worries." I, I, I very much appreciated, you know,the, the attempt and,
you know, the effort that, that she did put forth.
But, you know, we, we understood that, hey, look,l- you know, that's, that's not the best use of your time.
It's not, you know, if you're not passionate aboutit, you know, I don't wanna, you know, someone who
doesn't, like, you know, want to do that and be inthat role.
And so, you know, no, no, no harm, no foul.
We, you know, kind of kee- keep kind of doing, youknow, our things and, you know, I think it's, uh, it's, it's

(33:03):
important to make sure that you do, you know, if,if you are gonna go into business with your family, like,
you've really thought about, you know, what arethe boundaries? What are the lanes? What are the...
You know, when are we gonna have, you know, worktime versus family time?
And, you know, we've gotta take vacations. We'vegotta take breaks.
Like, we can't just grind, grind, grind, and, youknow, as, as entrepreneurs, we know, especially early
on, I mean, that, that, that can very quicklyconsume your entire, (laughs) you know, all of your

(33:27):
thoughts and your thinking and your time and yourenergies.
And so, you know, it is important going into itreally making sure that, you know, you, you've got some
sort of framework put in place for how are wegonna manage this?
And, and when thing, you know, when, when thingsget tough, because it will, you know, what is our...
What is our way to kinda deal with thosesituations so that we don't end up, you know, screwing the business
and the marriage or the family or whatever it maybe?

(33:49):
You know, that, I think, is the worst thing thatcould happen.
You know, I see a lot of people too where it's,you know, their spouse wants to help out with, with the books
and it's like, well, you better make sure they'requalified and, and, and, you know, it's, it's so much
better to go get a, you know, a, a bookkeeper whoknows what they're doing.
You know, even if someone's offering to help, youknow, e- if, if they're, if they are gonna help, you gotta
put them in the right role and make sure that theycan really, you know, add value and

(34:13):
not end up, you know, kinda causing, causing morechallenges down the road, 'cause I see-
Y-
... that all the time too.
Well, you know, in the
m- from... I, I had a
extended family member worked f- for me from '98to '06, and he
stole $600,000
and we almost went out of business.
And the, uh,
forensic accountant said, "Never have the sameperson

(34:37):
open and enter the bills as pays the bills."
And ju- just as, as a word of advice to everybody,you know, it's...
That, that, that's kind of important, you know, int- in those roles to, to really have people that you
trust.
Yeah. That's, uh... That, that's great advice. AndI, and I, and I...
Man, I, I hate hearing that, you know? And it'slike a... It's just such a...

(34:59):
It's so unfortunate, and, I mean, I...
The, the, the contractor that I first worked withactually before I took over the construction company I
built, this was an outdoor, outdoor living, youknow, uh, contractor and, and, and she was
just like working her tail off and she kept, youknow, just...
You know, she kept growing the top line revenue,but didn't understand why she wasn't making any money.

(35:19):
You know, she just kept selling jobs and over andover, and finally when we started doing the job costing, I
was like, "What's happening here?" Like, you know,and, and we started kinda trying to track back.
You know, we found that basically her own crewswere overbuying material at, you know, at the
hardware store, and then would, you know...
Would, would basically go do the job and then takeall the excess back, and they're returning it for store
credit to a different store. And like, she justdidn't have a handle on that.

(35:41):
And it's like, you know, hundreds of thousands ofdollars just went out the door and like, she had no, you
know, accounting for, for weight. "We, we wayoverbought." And so it's like, you know, it ended up putting
her in tremendous debt, and, you know, i- it'sjust such an unfortunate thing.
And, you know, I, I, I think you're... You're,you're totally right.
It's, it's so important that you have kind ofmultiple people keeping an eye on the books and, and the
finances.

(36:02):
Well, I, I mean, again, I don't know a lot aboutJobTred, but I got the idea, th- the
impression that
from doing estimates and fat-fingering something
to someone else trying to steal something, JobTredis sort of a
firewall against some of that stuff.
Absolutely.
Okay. So, yeah. Uh, I understand enough to s-

(36:24):
(laughs) Yeah. I mean, you know, it's, it's...
So many people though, they never take the timeto, you know, to, to analyze the, the job
and the performance. And, I mean, the, the jobcosting is such an important piece to make sure that
everything is tracking back and is on the rightjobs, like, you know, at the...
At the construction company, you know, we, wefound, you know, when I started digging into their books, I

(36:45):
mean, I found jobs where we were, you know, doublebilled, overbilled.
We had materials on the wrong job. And, you know,that's where I learned, you know, again, like, we had this
disconnect between the back office and theaccounting system and, and what was actually happening in the
field on the jobs. And it just... You know, it waslike death by 1,000 cuts, and, and nobody
realized it or saw it because it was just... Itwas just so rampant that you just never would have known.

(37:06):
And that's why it's so important, you know, andwhy we're so passionate about it.
Like, you gotta do the job costing. You gottaanalyze how did you perform on every job
and take that time, you know, to, to meet with theteam and say, "Hey, what went well?
What didn't go well? Here's how we performfinancially. Like, what could we do differently?
What changes do we need to make?" I mean, doyou... W- What you...
What you guys kinda close out or, you know, kindof the a- What's... What do you guys do after every job?

(37:30):
So, um, so we took it from the Navy SEALs. It'scalled an after action review.
I don't know if you've heard of that. Um, but it'sexactly what you're talking about.
Um, you know, as the job closes out, "Here we go.Here's the numbers.
Um, yeah, we're, we're a thousand bucks in thered.
Like, why?" And, um, we, we kind of have a cultureof, "Hey, y- you know,
mistakes happen. It's an imperfect world." And aswe talked about before, we're not perfect.

(37:52):
But let's try not to make the same mistake twice.Right? So, so yeah.
JobTred's like super powerful for that, you know?
Before,
I was using spreadsheets and kinda manuallyentering stuff, and it took forever and,
you know, you, you add an extra zero somewhere,it's like, "Huh." (laughs) You know? It's just...
It's, uh, it's, it's awesome, the JobTred systemonce you get it up and running.
Um, you know, just the, the, the quick numbersthat it gives you right away.

(38:15):
And so that's, that's been really helpful for usas a business to, to try to do, you know, things more
efficiently, to, to learn from our mistakes, toestimate better for the next one, you
know? Um, so, but yeah, that after action review,um, as a job closes out is,
is key for, for all of us. Yeah. That's great. I'mcurious. What do you...
You know, when, when you think about, you know,goals, goals for the team, whether it's your annual

(38:39):
goal, monthly goals. Like, how do you guys goabout kinda planning out...
You know, do you, do you have an annual budget anddo you b- do you break it down into, into months?
You know, what do you do in that regard? Um, yeah.So we've, um...
We've got a, an annual goal for this year, um,that we're working towards, uh, and, you
know, brea- breaking it down, uh, each month.

(39:00):
Um, we've kinda got like a stretch goal.
We're like, "Man, if we could reach this, that'dbe awesome." Um, you know, part of it's challenging for us
this year just 'cause it's the first year. We'vegot these new hires.
Um, so, you know, we're t- we're trying to just,you know, figure out how, how productive, how quickly will
they, you know, kinda get up to speed on stuff.They're doing... They're doing awesome.
Um, but, you know, we just have to have, have moretime go by.

(39:22):
Um, but yeah, JobTred's part of that, you know,just laying out, um, you know, the, the contracts that we
have, the, the total, um, you know, approved pricei- in there and the profit
that's involved. So, yeah. Sure. So how did you d-how did you know, you know, when...
kinda when you made that first hire, like h- w- h-how did you know that that was the right time to
bring someone on? Because I, I see a lot ofbusiness owners struggle, you know, that there's this fear of

(39:46):
like, "I, I, I don't know. Am I gonna be able to,you know, make payroll?
Like, can we afford to bring on another full-timeperson?" Like, you know, they, they, they...
You know, as, as entrepreneurs, right, we all justwanna put on the hat, you know, and, and keep kinda doing
it 'cause we think, "Oh, we can do it the bestourselves." But like, it...
You know, again, you, you can grow and scale thebusiness a lot faster when you can build out a team.
But it's like h- how do you... How did you knowthat it was... it was what you needed to do?

(40:09):
Fred.
(laughs) Yeah, there you go.
(laughs) Te- te- tell me about Fred.
Yeah. So, uh, so Fred's our, our business coach.
Um, so th- that was one of the things in thesuccession plan.
We realized w- we need somebody w- way moreexperienced and smarter than us on these things to kind of
guide us through it. Um, so, you know, I thinkit's, it's a number of things.

(40:30):
It's just, you know, kind of looking at, um, hey,what's it gonna cost us?
You know, worst case scenario, right? Let's seethis, the, the, we, we just need to break even.
And, you know, Jeff and I are looking at, hey,what can we do together versus what can we do if we add somebody
else in, and, um, and, you know, I think the, the,
um, return on investment, it just, it just makessense. And I think too, we just, we needed help.

(40:51):
You know, it's, it's sort of, again, we need tostay in our lanes.
We need somebody that is gonna be a really awesomekind of site project manager, face-to-face
kind of person. Um, those things kind of tend tostress me out.
I'm better on the, in the office admin, you know,um, stuff rather than, than on the site.
You know, Jeff is, is really great at it, butagain, like best use of his time is not nitty-gritty project

(41:12):
management, but more bigger picture kind of stuff,right?
So it's just, it's, it's kind of those things oftrying to, again, multiply our time, get you in the right
lane, uh, and productive, most productive in thething that you're, you're best at, right?
Um, a- and I think it's, you know, it's thingstoo, working really hard, you know, after, after, um, you
know, before I came on board, you know, with theembezzlement and stuff, just, you know, making sure the

(41:33):
business was in a healthy position. And, you know,it's just, it's awesome and, um,
when we made the decision to hire these guys, wewere in a, a good cash position, um, you know, g-
good, good systems, you know, good book of work,you know, so th- those things are probably kind of, you
know, go without saying, but, you know, thosethings were kind of in place, and then I think with our
business coach help us to think big picturestrategy long term, I just, it was kind of a no-brainer

(41:57):
for, with both of these guys too. And I think,
you know, when we met, uh, the one guy two yearsago, we were like, "Oh, man.
Like, I, I feel like we're probably gonna hire himsomeday." A- and ac- actually, he asked us first.
Um,
yeah, it was a little bit,
uh, slightly awkward, but it's, it's actuallyfine.
Um, he used to work for our plumber actually, andso we, he came on, onto

(42:19):
our team. Um, so our plumber, again, is our, afriend, like, you know, and it's, and it's all good.
It's, it was the best thing for, you know, forJeff, uh, to come over.
But, um,
uh, yeah, I think, I think just realizing that,that these guys had that, you know, um,
character that, that Jeff and I, you know, it'spart of who we are, uh, part of who we are as a company.
And then these guys w- would ha- have theirparticular gifts are gonna help to grow our company in the

(42:43):
way that we want to is, it was kind of a, I mean,kind of a no-brainer.
I don't know if you wanna add anything to that,Jeff.
I, I think our business coach was really helpfulbecause
Ryan and I had done the DiSC assessment test, andit's interesting 'cause our letters were opposite,
our, our strengths and weaknesses. But, so he hadeach of these two guys go through
that, and he actually interviewed them,

(43:05):
and that was also helpful 'cause we weren't justtrusting our own instincts, but we wanted someone
who, who really was impartial, who knew a lotabout the business, and
so th- that, that was very helpful.
Yeah.
Yeah, man. So it sounds like it, it was, it was alittle bit of, like, y- you got to the point where
it was, it became a necessity and you're feelingkind of stressed and, you know, realize that, again, it's

(43:27):
like this, th- these, these tasks that arecontinuing to pile up aren't the best use of our time.
Maybe we need to, to bring in someone who canhelp.
But like you also, you know,
analyzed the, the, the performance, the, thefinancials of the business, like is this a good
time? Can we afford it, you know, and then doingyour due diligence and making sure that that was the right
hire to bring on. 'Cause I mean, m- hey, you know,just the wrong hire could, can

(43:51):
be so much more costly than, you know, not makingthat move at all.
And so, you know, it sounds like y- you had a lotof those things in, in place and you didn't necessarily like
rush into it, but you knew that you needed to makea move and, and, and needed to kind of grow the team, and
sounds like it's, it's, it's worked really wellfor you.
Y- yes. You know, it's sort of like
you can be at peace

(44:11):
and be scared at the same time.
(laughs) Yeah.
It was like, yeah, we know, you know, we've doneour due diligence in every way we can think of,
financials, business coach, interviews,
strengths, weaknesses, all that.
So that's the peace part. But the scary part is,well, okay, th-
they're family men. And one's got three kids, theother one's got one kid, you know, they're married and

(44:36):
th- so it's, that's sort of the scary part.
But if you just listen to scary,
you'll never take a step forward. You, you, you'llnever get on that bike and take the training wheels off.
Yeah. Yeah, absolutely. So, you know, with, withyour first hire, I mean, o-
obviously you probably didn't have any sort oftraining or, you know, hadn't done that or gone through

(44:56):
that. So how did you, you know, how did you kindof onboard them and, and, and what was the, what was that
training process like and how long did it takethem to, to really get up to speed and become productive?
Good question. Answer... Go ahead and answer it.
Look, it's taken Jeff 40 years and it's taken meseven, we're still onboarding, so.
Um,
no, I, I, uh, yeah, honestly, that, that wholeprocess has been really, really fun for me.

(45:19):
I mean, I, I think I've always enjoyed, um,
even back, thinking back to high school, liketutoring my math class, you know, just, just loving
teaching, training, has just been part of my DNA,um, and it's how my parents raised me as
well. So, um, so, you know, getting to be a partof that's been great.
Um, yeah, I mean, I, we've, um,
you know, we're really have designed it from theground up.

(45:41):
Um, we've, you know, sought advice from otherpeople that have done it.
Um, you know, our business coach has been helpfulthere too, you know, just 'cause he's, he's, uh, built and
helped, you know, as a coach build, you know,dozens of businesses.
So, so that's been helpful just, you know, askingthe right questions.
Um,
and, um, and yeah, just taking each step as itcomes.
Um, I mean, I, I was joking about the 40 years ofonboarding, but I really, you know, I mean, Jeff and I, and

(46:06):
Jeff will even say, "You know, I learn somethingnew every week, um, because of the breadth-"
No, every day. Every day.
Oh, every day, yeah.
Yeah.
Um, the breadth of what we do, it's, it'simportant to constantly be a learner, um, you know, to,
to know what you don't know.
Um, you know, that's, that's the biggest thing iswhen you're new, you don't know what you don't know.
Um, but whereas now after seven years, I, I knowpretty well what I don't know.

(46:27):
And so then I know I need to, I need to findsomebody that really does know and trust and rely
on them. You know, if, if I got a lighting designquestion, you know, I probably know the answer, but I'm
gonna t- talk to our, you know, lighting, lightingdesigner, um, and really make sure I'm set straight.
And boy, I'm glad, I'm glad I did when I do thatkind of thing.
You know, I think your, your f- your focus andunderstanding on, you know, kind of process,

(46:49):
you know, is, it can, can be very helpful as longas you take the time to say, okay, like, you know, e- even
though we don't have this all documented, like,you know, you, you know you're bringing on one person, but
like if you take the time to kind of really, youknow, document out everything that, you know, that that
person would need to learn. And, and obviouslyyou're not gonna know everything going into it, but like as
those things keep coming up, you keep kind ofadding them, you know, to this documentation so that that next

(47:11):
person you bring on, hopefully you can do it alittle bit faster and it's a little bit easier, you know?
And then that third person, and it's like, youknow, I think a lot of people that I see don't...
You know, they just, they, they hire someone andthen they think they're just gonna sort of learn by osmosis
or they're just gonna shadow them and, and, andthey don't take the time though because, I mean, you know,
obviously Fred has got a, you know, a plethora ofknowledge up in his head, but, you know, if that doesn't,

(47:33):
you know, get, get out and, and translated into aform that can be, you know, coached and
trained on, then it, it, it does, it makes itharder and it draws out that whole, you know, let's,
let's get somebody up to speed and productivebecause as soon as they can become productive for the
business, you know, the hope is that they're now,you know,
paying for themselves, right? You know, they're,they're generating enough value where it's, it's, it's

(47:54):
a no-brainer and, and we're growing and thebusiness is improving and the cashflow,
you know, just 'cause you're now paying out onemore person, you know, it's still, you know, net, a net
positive and a net gain for the business, but yougot to get them up to speed and, and I think it's important
that you take the time, you know, to, to in- andinvest.
I mean, you, you know, it is, it's an investmentupfront and, uh, you know, along the way with every employee

(48:14):
that you bring on. But, you know, the better thatyou can kind of come up with a, a systemized approach to
onboarding, I think it really helps, you know,speed that, that whole, that whole process up.
I have three-
Yeah, we've, um... Or should I go ahead, Jeff?
I have to say three really important things.Yeah,I mean, if- whoever's listening to this, no matter
where you are with your business,
one is we need to be good listeners. So that's toour clients, but it's to our

(48:37):
employees. It's to our partners.
Two,
we need to be good teachers.
Ryan is a really good teacher. You know, heunderstands all the aspects of what it involves
being a teacher.
Three, be an encourager. I'm an encourager.
And, uh, we've had our employees tell us

(48:57):
that
between the combination of
his willingness to teach, patient, it's okay ifyou make a mistake,
and then the encourager part
has just really, I think, more than anything,
has put a smile in our employees' hearts.
Because they just love being here, and we laugh alot, and we still get, get

(49:21):
to work done. And I think it's 'cause w- we'vedeveloped that culture, that...
In a sense, we teach each other 'cause we learnfrom each other.
You know, we all need encouragement.
You know, that's one thing with having all thekids, you know, and if I went back, I would want to do this even
more. It's just encouraging your kids with
where they do well. And, you know, every person,uh, on this planet needs that.

(49:42):
Yeah. Such, such, such great advice there, Jeff.
I couldn't, couldn't agree more. I mean, h- how doyou, you know, with...
When you think about your, your broader team, youknow, inc- including all your, you know, your subs and,
and vendors and, and everybody who's, who'sinvolved in, you know, working with you all, I mean, what, what
do you do
to, to really try to foster that, that culture andthat team building?

(50:04):
Like do you guys re- meet regularly? Do you have,you know, events? What, what does that look like?
Yeah. We, um... I mean, as, uh, internally as ateam, we're, we're meeting all the time.
Um, you know, it's, it's important that we have areally strong culture.
Um, you know, it's been fun. W- one of ourinitiatives this quarter is to, to up our,
um, online presence. And we've had a social mediaaccount.

(50:26):
We're trying to, trying to make it better, morereflective of who we are.
Um, you know, we're trying, you know, more organicposts and reels and that kind of thing.
Um, but it's been a, it's been a all hands on deckkind of thing.
Um, and, um,
yeah, just, just kind of making sure, you know,we're actually tracking, you know, face-to-face with
our employees as well. Um, and, yeah, with our,you know, vendors and trade partners, you know, it's

(50:47):
taking advantage of, um, that sort of, um,
um, you know, the, the added stuff outside of thework.
Um, so, you know, it's, it's on a job siteactually being interested in caring,
you know, how somebody's doing. You know, it's notjust, um...
And I'm not talking about having two hours ofconversation with them, but
th- so th- they know that I actually care how our,our electrician's, you know, wife and kids are doing, you

(51:11):
know. Um, you know, on, on a day where there's alot of craziness going on, Yum Yum Donuts are
showing up, you know, uh, or, or coffee, or we're,we're getting lunch for people.
It's just, you know, sort of these added touchesof, you know, that, that we care and this is, this is more
than just cogs in a machine. Yeah. I love that.
You know, I think, again, bu- buying your teamfood, giving them, you know, just things like that, I mean,

(51:32):
it's, it's such a nominal expense, but it showsthat you care.
It shows that, you know, you, you, you really wantthem to be happy and to enjoy, you know,
working with you. And so I, I, I love those, Ilove those things.
Um, you know, as, as, as we kind of, you know,come, come u- come, come here to a, to a close, I'm, I'm curious,
Ryan, like, you know, you, you've been with thebusiness for seven years now. Is there...

(51:52):
You know, wh- when you think back about what youknow now, is there anything that, like, if, if, if you would
have known everything that you know now and whereyou would have gotten to, is there anything that you would
have, would have done differently when you joinedJeff seven years ago?
And, and, and how do you think that would haveaffected you? Oh, man. So much.
I mean, I probably would have... I mean, if I knewnow what I...

(52:14):
If I knew now back then, like, I just would havedone everything different.
I mean, there's, there's so much, um... And Ithink Jeff would say the same thing.
You know, as we...
You know, hindsight's 20/20, right?
Um, so it's, it's really be hard for me todistill,
you know, everything that I learned.
But at the same time, you know, wh- what I, themistakes I made along the way, um,

(52:36):
I went to school.
And in some cases, it was real expensive school.
Um, but it was a better, better school, um, tomake a mistake than, you know, I could
ever receive in a classroom. So, so yeah, it's,it's really a hard question, you know.
What would I have done differently? Um, you know,there, there were, you know, certain,
uh, systems we tried to implement that didn'treally work. So yeah, I wouldn't have done that.

(52:57):
But again, I wouldn't have known unless I did it,right?
So,
um,
yeah, I mean, I think there's, there's some, youknow, personal, um,
you know, managing my own stress and, and, andwhatnot, and you know, sort of having boundaries about
stuff that, you know, I've been historicallypretty bad at and, you know, had periods of burnout at
different points. You know, I wish I, thatwouldn't happen.
You know, Jeff pa- paid the cost a little bit tobe, you know, to be around me.

(53:21):
I'm just, you know, real negative and stuff at,at, you know, a handful of times over the past seven
years. Uh,
but we got through it. And, you know, it, it, itwas humbling for me as well to realize, yeah, you know what?
I need to rely on people around me and I need tobe smart and wise, um, about things.
I need to not let certain things get to me, youknow? So I'm curious, you know, you, you...

(53:42):
O- obviously, Jeff has, has already stated, youknow, he's, he's kind of got a, a goal here to, to, to be
able to retire, you know, in the next, uh, youknow, 10 years or so.
I mean, w- what, what is your plan to, you know,to, to replace Jeff
and how are you... You know, 'cause he, he'sbringing a ton of, you know, uh, just value in, in everything
that he does. I mean, he's, he's kind of like thesecond half, you know, second part of the brain, if you will,

(54:03):
like, you know, between the two of you, so, sowhat's the plan, you know, when, when Jeff is ready to, to
go out and, and retire and kind of be, be, be lessactive in the business?
Like how, how are you gonna, how are you gonnakind of keep going and, and charging ahead? Yeah.
I mean, I, I think the, the thing that, you know,I've, I, I've said a lot, you know, over the past
year especially as we've been thinking about this,is that, you know, replacing Jeff is

(54:26):
kind of impossible. He's just, he's, he's one of akind.
Um, and, and so what, what we'll do and what ourplan is, is to grow and
replace parts of what he brings to the table.
Um, and as he decreases, certain things willincrease.
So, you know, right now, he, he's, he's like thefirst person people talk to.
He's the one that, uh, that, you know, people, um,

(54:48):
uh, meet with, you know, our, our first kind ofin-home meeting.
And, you know, that, that role would shift, uh,potentially to me, potentially to someone else.
Um, and, and so basically, we're taking all thesehats that Jeff wears and kind of shifting them, them
around somewhere else. Um, now, we, we may, um,try to, to hire
a, a kind of a lead designer at some point.

(55:09):
Um, you know, we may just shift the scope of whatwe do.
Uh, you know, a lot of what Jeff brings to thetable is his interior design designation and, and
just really the ability to do anything under thesun.
Like, I mean, literally anything, we'll do it.
Um, and, and there's real value to that, um, thatwe bring.
Um, but, you know, in,
uh, as the business grows and shifts, you know,may- maybe we're honing into certain things or certain

(55:33):
kinds of projects maybe we won't take, or maybecertain things that we've, have done in-house
that, you know, now, hey, we'll, we'll bring insomebody else to kind of handle it or cover it.
But, but yeah, it's really, um, you know, tryingto learn and download as much from him as
we possibly can, for me and, and the rest of ourteam too.
You know, Jeff's very involved every day training,you know, these new hires.

(55:54):
Um, you know, just kind of imparting the, the, thestuff that he's learned.
And, you know, Lord willing, we're hoping that,you know, at, at 78, you know, he can still be
involved. You know, he can, he can be an advisor,he can be a, um, you know, a, a, a
counselor. You know, I, I, I anticipate, you know,if he still wants to and still able
to, like, that, you know, he's guiding me throughthe really difficult

(56:16):
stuff as, as we do now.
Yeah, absolutely. So, so Jeff, my, my question toyou here, uh, you know, wrapping up is, I mean, you
know, obviously, you've, you've seen a lot.
You know, you, you've already shared some, somereally great, you know, advice.
I mean, is there, is there anything, you know, in,in particular, you know, anything else that, you know,
you might...... encourage Ryan, you know, when,when the time comes?

(56:38):
Like, is there, is there anything that you wannamake sure that, you know, the business continues to do
these things? But, you know, maybe, maybe, youknow, is there some kind of larger goal?
Where do you want the business to go even beyondyou?
I mean, obviously this is, this is creating afamily legacy for all of you, but, you know, what are, what are
your aspirations and what do you hope to see, youknow, when Ryan does take the full reins?
Well,

(56:59):
I told Ryan that we can always... As I phase out,you can always stop doing the crazy.
K- Keep it a little bit more simple.
But the craziest kind of, I guess, is some of ourjobs too.
Um,
Jeff is very artistic. He's actually a prettyamazing illustrator.
Um,

(57:19):
you know, I could see Jeff and, and my daughterBrittany, her two kids, by the time I'm out of here, sh-
she'd probably be able to work full-time. She'sreally good.
She, she's been doing design probably for 15 yearsalready.
So
he's probably more concerned about it than, than Iam w- when the time comes.
And, uh, you know, I have good health at, uh, 78.

(57:40):
I'm still... I hope I'm moving around. I sure do.
I, I could easily see myself working a couplehalf-days a week and whatnot.
And the thing is,
because of t- seriously JobTread and some othersystems,
he's less stressed.
Uh, it's affording me with these new hires to domore of what I love, so I'm not feeling s- really

(58:01):
stressed.
So... And one of the worst things on your body iswhen you feel stressed.
So
most of what I spend time doing is design andclients and, and some problem
solving and, uh, it doesn't even feel like work alot of times.
So as far as the long term, you know, I don'tthink...
I mean, my wife and I get along great, but I don'tthink she'd want me hanging around an extra 40

(58:26):
hours a week. That, all four hours (laughs) she'dbe glad if I was working, and I think it'd be
good for me 'cause it keeps your mind going, youknow.
Mo- Motion is lotion, not just physically butmentally too.
So, hey, I'm, I'm very blessed. I'm very grateful.
Man. Well, look guys, I, I, I... This has beenjust such an awesome time
getting to, to talk to both of you and, and, andtruly hearing, you know, how passionate you are

(58:50):
about what you're doing. And, and, you know, it,it sounds like, you know, y- you guys have really, you know,
built just an amazing vehicle for you to, to notonly, you know,
work and, and make money but, I mean, it's, it's,it's, it's what you want to be doing.
It's, it's what you're passionate about.
And, and I think that's, you know, that's whatlife is all about is finding that thing that you're truly
passionate about where you can wake up every dayand, and you don't feel like it's just gonna

(59:15):
be another, you know, beat-down of a day and agrind.
It's, it's all about finding those, those thingsand those people that you wanna spend your time with, and
that you're excited, and that you're adding valueand you're helping your clients and you're, you know,
just... I- I- It's so neat to, to be able to seewhat you all are building together.
And,
you know, I, I, I have no doubt that, you know,there will be a lot more success in your future and that you're

(59:35):
gonna continue to build an incredible team, anincredible company.
You know, your, your work is obviously top-notchand, and I think that that, you know, just it, it comes from
the leadership that, that both of you areproviding to the business and, and, and, and to the
clients, the subs, everyone that gets involvedwith you. And I just...
Uh, uh, i- it always gets me excited to see, youknow, and, and be able to talk to people who truly have

(59:56):
that heart, you know. I think at, at the end ofthe day, I mean, it's, uh, you know...
Behind every business is, is, is people, and whenyou put great people who really
love and, and want to do the best possible jobthat they can, I mean, that, that's, that is what
creates a successful business. Is when it's notjust about, you know, the, the dollars and
cents, it's, it's about the value. It's about, youknow, building people up, encouraging them, you know,

(01:00:19):
helping train and develop and, and create, youknow, leaders who will, you know, one day, you know, succeed
you and, and, and be able to keep that going. Andso I just...
You know, I, I appreciate you guys coming on and,and, and sharing this.
You know, it's always, uh, a- always awesome andunique to, to be able to kind of have that, that, that, that
family, you know, connection. But you know also,you know, we're, we're your business partners and you're
working together. So, you know, it's, uh, it- it'ssomething that I just, uh, I appreciate it.

(01:00:43):
You know, I wanna, you know, to tell you guys, youknow, from, from the outside looking in, it, it
just seems like you guys have built somethingreally special and, and I can't wait to see where you take it.
Thank you very much.
Yeah. Thanks, Eric. Really appreciate it.
Absolutely. Thanks for coming on too, guys.
See you next year in Texas.
Yes. Doing-
All right.
Right.
(upbeat music) Thanks for joining us for thisepisode of Builder Stories.

(01:01:03):
We hope you enjoyed the conversation and gainedvaluable insights that can help you in your
journey along the way.
Don't forget to subscribe to this show and leaveus a review.
And as always, if you or someone you know has astory to share, please contact
us at builderstories.com. We'd love to hear fromyou.
I'm Eric Fortenberry, and remember, every builderhas a unique story.

(01:01:26):
Keep building yours.