From the Mat to the Market | Johnny Buck of 13 Stripes Construction

Meet Johnny Buck, founder of 13 Stripes Construction in Marion, NC. In this episode, Buck shares his journey from MMA fighter to construction business owner with a mission to revolutionize the home services industry. After building a top 1% gym and navigating a hurricane that reshaped his business overnight, Buck brings a fresh perspective to construction rooted in discipline and repeatable systems and processes. He talks about scaling from the ground up, building a business designed to sell, and why customer service—not craftsmanship—is the ultimate differentiator.

 

In this episode, you will learn:

• The three things Buck put on his website that landed him his first jobs
• How to build a sellable construction business from day one
• Why thoughtful, non-branded client gifts are a game-changer, and exactly how much he spends on them
• What every successful business has in common (hint: it’s not tools or talent)
• The top two mistakes that all failing companies make
• How Buck is applying his personal brand to dominate a local market

 

Learn more about 13 Stripes Construction here: https://13stripesconstruction.com/

 

Own a construction company and want to share your story? Apply to be on an upcoming episode of Builder Stories at https://www.builderstories.com

Episode Transcript

(00:00):
[instrumental music plays] Welcome to the podcastwhere we take a deep dive into the stories behind

(00:03):
construction business leaders. We will share howthey got started, how they found
success, and the lessons learned along the way.I'm your host, Eric Fortenberry.
Welcome to Builder Stories.
Welcome back, everybody. Today, I am here withJohnny Buck.
He is with 13 Stripes Construction. They arelocated in Marion, North

(00:25):
Carolina. Really excited to have you on the show,Johnny. You got a great story.
So welcome to Builder Stories.
Yeah, man. Thank you for having me. I reallyappreciate it.
Yeah, absolutely. So why don't you kick us off byjust kinda sharing a little bit about, you know, your
background? You know, how- how'd you get intoconstruction? What do you guys do? Things like that.
Yeah. Uh, so my name's Johnny Buck. Um, I live inWest North Carolina. I live in Marion.

(00:46):
Uh, I started out... My dad was a GC, uh, when Iwas
younger. And I was, you know, semi-paid slavelabor for him.
Uh, but, uh, you know, I
went to a... Grew up playing sports, wrestled, uh,football and wrestling. I wrestled in college.
I wrestled D1 in college. Uh, went and spent fiveand a half years at the Citadel.

(01:08):
Um, and after- after grad... Or, well, actually,while I was in college, uh, I got into MMA.
Um, fell in love with that. You know, just get tocontinue being a, uh, a athlete
for as long as possible, a grown child. Um, we gotto travel all over the country.
You know, I fought in Bellator. I fought in theXFC. I got to be on TV a couple times.
And as I started

(01:30):
getting, like, deeper into my career, I opened anMMA gym, uh, on Rogue Combat Club
in Asheville, North Carolina.
And we, uh,
you know, long story short, I had an ugly lawsuitwith an ex-business partner. I decided to go out on my own.
That's when I started my MMA gym, uh, in 2013.
I was still fighting for Bellator, still hadfights left on my contract, and I just got into the business

(01:53):
side of it. Um, I retired in 2016, and I kind ofwas like,
"Hey, man, like, you need to do something.
Like, you need to either get the business going oryou need to go do something else."
Uh, so I decided to dive all in on theconstruction company. I quit my job.
S- I was working construction, working in a bar,uh, a little bit of everything.
And I decided to go full in on the gym. Um, so2017, I really dedicated

(02:17):
myself to that. And over the next four years, wehit the top 1% of the entire industry,
um, with just basically four years of- of doingit, uh, as a business.
And, um,
I re- when I retired, I, uh, kinda got bored.
Uh, so I s- was
self destructing, uh, finding things to fill thatvoid.

(02:39):
Um, and, uh, I ended up getting back into jujitsu,competing on just that
aspect. I've got a couple world titles. I wonIBJJF world title.
Um, couple... A Gracie world title, couple CatTresing world titles.
So I've always been competitive. And as I'mgetting older, I'm 39 now, I'll be 40 in June, uh,
my body does not, uh, like that. Um, [laughs] I'msupposed to take the...

(03:03):
All the guys try and kill me.
But during that process, I really fell in lovewith the business aspect.
Um, you know, uh, marketing, systems, processes.
Uh, client experience has always been one of thetop things for me to focus on, whether
it's the gym or, you know, obviously theconstruction company now.

(03:23):
And I really got into how all of that worked.
Um, you know, I work with Mike Claudio at Win RateConsulting. I'm a client and a coach there.
And he goes, "Man." He goes, "You have way toomany skillsets to make as little money as you do." He
goes, "You need to take that to another industry."And
with my background as construction and his- hisbackground with doing consulting for construction and

(03:45):
home services, it just made sense. Uh, so lastyear, so
2024, I pulled the trigger. Uh, got...
Started the- the paperwork for 13 StripesConstruction. We started.
Uh, I got my
LLC in July.
We had our first job. It was supposed to be thefinal...
So we did kitchen remodels, some structural workunderneath the house.

(04:06):
A super cool old house, or older house.
Been, uh, patched together multiple times. So itwas interesting seeing what we'd find.
But, uh,
we, uh, we were supposed to have our finalinspection on the 27th of September, and that was the
day Helene hit. So then it got kicked back threeweeks.
Um, and we have been drinking through a fire hoseever since,

(04:28):
uh, learning about insurance. I hate insurance. Ihate it with a passion.
Any of you guys who are watching this who doinsurance, hats off to you guys.
Um, but, like, I'm just not a fan of how it works.
It- it's- it's complete opposite of what I'mtrying to do with my company, is have a world-class client
experience. Uh,
so that's what we've been doing. And I saw howmuch money you can make

(04:52):
doing this, and I'm like, "Well, if I made thismuch money in that amount of time,"
I'm like, "I-
I can do a million in a year." So my goal thisyear is to sell $1
million. Uh, we may not be able to deliver all ofit 'cause of scheduling, but it's to sell $1
million in jobs, uh, b- into 2025. And we are wellon our way.

(05:13):
Um, it's been fun. It's been exciting. It's beenstressful.
There's these- these new grays that are showing upon the beard.
Uh, I blame my wife, but it's not her, so... Butyeah, that's the goal, man. It is...
You know, we started 13 Stripes Construction.
Um, sort of, you know, a play on the Americanflag, the- the 13, uh, 13 stripes,
uh, to revolutionize the home building experience.
And, you know, there's a lot of really goodbuilders out there.

(05:34):
There's actually, I know for a fact there's betterbuilders than I am.
Um, but
what they lack is the understanding or the- thecapability, because of, they have the tool
belt on still, uh, to- to focus on clientexperience.
Like, we all use the same subs. We all use thesame materials.
The difference is how it feels for that client,and that's what we're really focusing on.

(05:55):
That's great, man. And, you know, again, congratson all the- the success.
You know, I can only imagine your body is, uh,preferring you- you quit the fighting
and, uh, get into maybe something a little easier.
I mean, obviously, getting on the tools andclimbing on roofs and stuff might not- might not, uh, be any
easier, but, uh, you know, it's- it's super neatthough to see how, like, you know, y- you've- you've looked

(06:16):
at this thing and- and have approached it, Ithink, from a little bit different perspective than- than a lot
of builders. You know, most- most people I talkto, they, you know, kind of sort of just stumble into, you
know, taking over a business or starting their ownbusiness, like they're coming out of the tools, the
trades. But, you know, you came at this from,"Hey, I've- I've built another business.
I've seen what it takes to build and operate

(06:36):
a successful business." You- you learned about theimportance of having clients and providing a great
experience, and then, you know, again, through-through your partnership with- with Mike Claudio and
kind of learning more about construction, likeyou've said, "Hey, I'm going to set a goal to come out and-
and create a very successful business," which isawesome, man, and- and I love that you went into it with a
very specific goal and- and have been able to thenkind of use that to track your

(07:00):
progress and to motivate yourself, your team tokeep building it and growing.
So, you know, s- super cool, man.
Yep. Yeah, you know, it's like, there's all- allbusinesses are essentially the same.
Like, there's five buckets or five areas, youknow, sales, marketing, operations, production,
and then finance. Like, that's basically how itall- all ties in.
And where I'm really putting the emphasis formyself is on the operations

(07:23):
side, meaning, like...
And it sounds crazy. So, I built my first website,like, on GoHighLevel, just real quick, I needed a
website, just whatever. And, you know, we had ourlogo, we had our, some, like,
zero SEO. It was completely useless.
It was basically a landing page, and it said threethings on there.
It says, "We will call you back,

(07:45):
we will show up when we say we're gonna show up,and we will finish our work." That was all it- that's all it
said. And I
literally picked up jobs for that. And- and Ididn't have my GC license yet, which I...
Once Helene started, I just pushed it off.
I was like, "Let's go get people back in theirhouses." We did a lot of that stuff.
Um, but I- I just pushed my GC license back.
But one of the guys, like, "Hey, man, I've had,

(08:05):
you know,
two, three guys call me or never call me back."And unfortunately, the insurance quote was
over $300,000, uh, so I'm like, "Well, I can't dothat." Um, we- we're
limited to 40,000 without a license in NorthCarolina.
So, you know, I just figured, like, my- my gym isnot the cheapest in town.
I don't ever want to be the cheapest in town.
I don't think anybody should ever want to be thecheapest in town, less a used car salesman.

(08:29):
Um, and, uh, nobody, uh, using JobTread isprobably a used car salesman.
So, like, you should be focused on a- a higherquality experience, you know?
But the cheaper clients, any client I've ever hadwho asked for a discount was a pain in the ass the entire
time. Um, so it's, uh, it's, you know, me focusingon
that, what does it feel like to work with 13Stripes?

(08:51):
That's been the entire- entire process.
And so- so just to recap, so, the- the threethings that you put on your website were that, "We will
call you back, we'll do what we said, and we'llfinish what we start"?
Yup, that was it.
Man, that's- that's awesome. And that- thatbrought people to you?
Yeah. Yeah, and that was my first website.
Um, you know, I- I have WinRate, uh, orzero.market, it's all WinRate.
They have my website now, significantly more, uh,sophisticated than that- that mess I had.

(09:16):
But, you know, but those things are still onthere.
And, you know, one thing I pride myself in is,I've not...
There's never been a lead that I had that I didn'tfollow up with.
Um,
you know, it's... So,
like during Helene, I was getting messages onFacebook, personal Facebook, business Facebook,
text messages, Google. I was getting leads fromevery...

(09:37):
You know, it wasn't organized, I had no systemsand processes in- in order.
Um, that was not what I wanted. My goal,realistically, was do high-end remodels and custom homes, and then
that- that was my goal, and then this happened.
Uh, so,
I was like, "Well, we gotta do something." And I,as much as I hate insurance, as much as I hate dealing
with all this shit, it's, uh...

(09:58):
Like, if I don't do it... Uh, after I got my firstinsurance, I was like, "I'm never doing insurance again.
It sucks. The money's terrible." It almostbankrupt me 'cause I didn't understand it.
And I was like, and my wife was like, "Well, you-you need to." I was like, "Well, why?" She goes, "If you're
not gonna do it, who is?" I was like...
[laughs]
"These scumbags from out of state are gonna gougethese people." Or they're not gonna do it.
Like, I'm st- I'm working on a house right now.It's been seven months, they're still not in their house.

(10:22):
We're still fighting with insurance.
So,
you know, so, I was kind of called to do that.Like, listen, you- you have to step up.
This will help people. That's always been mymission, is, uh, to help people.
So, you know, it's a little bit different path,but
one of the things is I have- I had one lead that Ilost, and
I don't know where... I had their number writtendown somewhere in one of my notebooks.

(10:44):
I went through every single page, I went throughall my text messages, I went through all my, uh,
DMs. And I'm like, "Man," I said, "I feelterrible," 'cause that tree went through their house.
And I'm like, "I've got their address in my GPS."So I drove all the way out
to their house, like, two months later, um, and Ifinally, like, got
to them. And luckily, somebody came in and helpedthem. Um, their insurance stepped up.

(11:07):
But I was like, yeah, I mean, so it's... For me,it's all gonna be about the client experience. Like, it's...
You know, this is gonna kinda
poke people. I'm like, "Listen, nobody's that goodat work." Like,
it's all the same thing. We're delivering...
You know, there's different levels of quality ofproduct, of course, but it's...
The difference is really how that client feels andhow smooth that is.

(11:29):
Yeah. No, 100%. So h- so, I'm- I'm curious.
I mean, you know, you- you went into this, youknow, and- and started 2024 kind of thinking that you were
gonna go in and do one thing, and then thishurricane came.
I mean, h-
you know, again, that- that- that just...
It's- it's not only disruptive, obviously, for allthe residents and everyone there, but, like, it
changed your business too. How did you...

(11:50):
You know, how did you adapt and- and- and kind of,you know, shift gears and...
You know, what- what- what would you say thebiggest impacts were on that?
So, we... So, the gym...... you know, the reason Istarted a construction company is 'cause the gym
was completely self-sustained. It was runningitself. My guys are awesome.
Um, and then,
when Helene hit, like, we lost half our clientbase overnight, and we can't, you know...

(12:13):
Our payroll is by far the highest part.
Uh, it's over half of our- our expense everymonth, so that's the only thing I could cut. Can't cut rent.
I did negotiate a deal with him. Um, can't cutpower, even though we didn't have power on for a
month, and my pho- my power bill is the exact samedespite not having it for 20 some days.
Uh, I'll figure that out eventually. Um, you know,so...

(12:33):
We couldn't cut anything, so we cut, we cut our,uh, our- our payroll.
And the guys volunteered. Um, you know, we builtan amazing culture,
so... But during that time, we turned the gym intoa distribution center.
We had, like, literally, uh, Chris Sweet with Sw-Swamp Rabbit Movers out of South Carolina
was bringing me, like, moving trucks full ofstuff.

(12:53):
We were coordinating helicopter landings andairplanes. Dude, it was just wild.
It's not what I ever asked for. Um, like I said,the initial plan was let the gym run
itself
and do one remodel, and then do one remodel, andthen do another remodel at a
time. And that's just not what happened, so
I had to go all in. So I took... I quit taking mypaycheck from the gym.

(13:16):
Um, you know, all my guys did. I ran through about40 grand of money from a rental
house I sold. Luckily, I had it, um, but that'show I kept the gym afloat.
That's how I kept the 13 stripes going.
That's how I floated the, you know, 12, $15,000that, uh...
You know, I didn't understand about insurancepayouts.
Um, and so we, uh, we just

(13:39):
started working. And, uh,
you know, it's...
Insurance is a very, very different game thancustom building, spec building,
because, like, you have very tight parameters, andthey want it written down a certain way.
So what we just did was, like, the only...
I wouldn't say as much of a sh- I think theclientele shifted, but I don't think the desired

(14:02):
outcome did. Like, "Hey, we're gonna call you."Like, you know,
I'm answering text messages at 9:00 PM. Youshouldn't do that in business.
Uh, it's not the best practice if you wanna stayhappily married, but my wife gets it.
She, you know, she helps me run the gym.
Um, and
she is... We- you met her at- at, uh, the bootcamp, so she may or may not work for

(14:22):
me. We'll see. Um,
but, you know, we just- we just wanted to delivera- a good exp- the best experience possible.
And so-
Yeah
... I think that shifted. The volume we're doingis significantly higher.
Um, we are doing elective builds, meaning
people want a remodel, people want to dosomething. You know, we have an Austin garage job.
Um,
and, you know, that's waiting on permits withthat.

(14:45):
And- and which is slowing everything down on thisend because,
you know, there's 90 permits ahead of you. Okay?
Why? Because the whole world got just smashed. So,it- it's- it is what it is.
And then, like, some of the supply houses are justdown. Like, Lowe's doesn't exist.
Like, one of the Lowe's locations is gone.
Like, "Oh."

(15:06):
Wow.
Um, so it- it's definitely changed the...
If you've been doing this a long time and you'renot willing to adapt, you're in trouble.
Like, that- that's a- that's a-
Yeah
... one thing I've really noticed.
Um, and I-
When it- and it- it sounds like, too, I mean,like, you- you were starting off.
And, I mean, you know, again, most- mostbusinesses, it takes time to sort of ramp up and- and
get things going, get that lead flow, but then,like, all of a sudden, there's just, like, this surge of

(15:29):
demand. And so, you know, I- I think it- it soundslike that might have kind of overwhelmed you a little bit.
I mean, how have you now kind of gotten moreorganized where you've got more systems and processes in
place? Like, how has that, you know, been able to-to kind of help you keep up with it and keep growing now?
Yeah. So, [gasps] like, I signed up with JobTribеa few months before I
even, like, had a clue it was going on, and thеrewas just so much demand

(15:52):
coming through that... I use a spreadsheet. So,like, I still have it.
Everybody's been transferred over to JobTread now,and- and I don't know how that- all that works, but I
laid out a spreadsheet. Name, number, email,address, and then a notes
section. And then I would, uh,
I use Google Sheets as like a dropdown menu. So Ijust had a list of, like, different phases.

(16:14):
You know, same thing you guys have set up inJobTread.
So it's like new lead, um, and then I would justhave a description of what it is.
Like, appointment set, uh, you know, appointmentcoming up, whatever.
I just had it organized that way, and I thinkthat's what saved me.
Um, you know, I'm very familiar with CRMs. I havetwo for the gym.
Um, I have Go High Level, which I s- again,haven't messed with much.

(16:34):
Uh, I just haven't had time.
Um, but I, uh, I just think the organization ofunderstanding
lead flow and process has been huge for me. Iliterally drew...
Like, right before this all happened, I literallytook a note. I- I still have it.
It's like, "Lead process." Lead comes in, thishappens, this happens, this happens,
this happens. I have the whole 15, 20 steps.

(16:57):
And everything from, if they do answer my text orthey don't answer my text.
If they do answer my voicemail-
Yeah
... or they don't answer my voicemail. I have thatwhole series.
So I've got the entire client journey from-
Nice
... A to Z,
um, mapped out. An- and then organizing it on aspreadsheet,
um, wa- was a real big help for me.
Yeah. I mean, mo- most- most people, again, they-they- they don't map out their

(17:20):
processes. And then it... You know, when balls getdropped, it's very hard to know, well, where,
you know, or what happened or how did that happen?
And, like, you know, just again, having thosedetailed, you know, standard operating procedures is so
helpful. And then it's also not just all in yourhead.
You know, it allows other people to be able to seeand understand, what is the process?

(17:41):
What is the expectation for everyone? And thatreally will help you keep building and scaling.
Yeah. So this is something I did very different.So I started the gym because I needed a place to train.
I was st- still under contract with Bellator. Uh,I got kicked out of my gym 'cause of a lawsuit.
And I'm like, "Well, what am I gonna do? I'm gonnastart my own." And that was... Ran horribly.
But, um...I started 13 Stripes with every

(18:04):
intention of- of selling. Like,
people go, "What are you n-" I mean, "I'm gonnasell this thing.
What are you gonna do?" And like,
I read, uh, Buy Then Build.
Unbelievable book. Really good. I read that acouple years ago, and
what it did was like, "Hey, dude. You're runningyour business like shit.
You need to fix these things."

(18:26):
And
I was like, "Okay, cool." So once s-...
And I started changing the gym over how itoperated, and then once I started 13 Stripes, I went, "All right.
So what- what makes a- a business sellable?
What makes it appealing?" Well, profit. Likenumber one, profit. Let's just be honest.
Like, no matter how great your program is, if itdoesn't make money, it's not worth anything except what you
own. And as a GC with no assets,

(18:49):
you know, m- my DeWalt drills and stuff, like,cool.
[laughs]
Uh, I'm not selling those. I'm gonna use them inmy house.
But like-
[laughs]
... I have to have
profit, which is number one. All right?
The number two thing I think is systems andprocesses, because if everything
is in my head, right, and I know how to do it,
what happens when I need to bring somebody elseon?

(19:10):
Because I can realistically run four, maybe fiveprojects at a time.
Not scalable. But if I have me and all myprocesses, this is how I do it, this is how I do it, this is how I do it,
then I think that I'm able to hire somebody else.
And now I can run eight projects, and then I canrun 12 projects, and then I can run 20, you know, 20, 60, 80
projects because the systems and processes fromlead flow to delivery to

(19:32):
production to warranty t- to s- hey, thank youfor...
You know, I've got gifts I'm sending out thisweek, um, you know, tailored to each and every
client. I even have gifts for people who didn'twork with me.
Um, you know, saying front of mind, but we hadthat- all that system.
Like, I'm not randomly sending you shit.
I'm sending it to you on this point because ofthis.

(19:53):
So I- I had focused on profitability, systems, andthen, um,
technology is the last piece.
Uh, I think pen and paper's... I think it's thedevil.
Um, I- it's one of the worst things for business.If you lose it, it's gone.
I love internet. Uh, I love that. So that's thethird piece of what I'm focusing on, and that's

(20:13):
why I was so adamant about using JobTread to be abig part of that,
is like, "Hey, listen. This is a technology."
If I get to,
I don't know, seven, eight figures, maybe I'll buymy o- build my own software.
But like,
because it... Then proprie- proprietary softwareis valuable. It's an asset.

(20:34):
Um, you could white label it and sell it, but likehonestly, out- I just don't think there's a need, um, for
where I wanna go.
But yeah.
Sure.
That's how I decided to build it.
And so wh- where would you say... You know, again,you- you said you kind of started with the end in
mind, thinking that, you know, you want to build abusiness that you're- you're able to sell.
I mean, so h- kind of do you have any sort ofidea, or is there kind of that...

(20:56):
What's that larger goal? Like w- you know, when doyou think that you'll get the business to a sellable
point?
Um, I think this will be...
I think I'll be... Easily be able to sell it fortwo to three X in five
years. Um, I said because it... My only purpose ismake this
sellable. Um, that's not the goal, but like that'show I'm building it.

(21:21):
I, uh,
realistically, I have control issues.
Um, I'm probably going to after... So I'm notgonna try and sell
it in three to five years. I'm gonna hold onto itand build it and build it and build it, but I want to
probably buy other home service industries, uh,companies,
because, for lack of a better term, they runpoorly. Like, it's just...

(21:44):
I don't wanna be a dick, but like
there's so many, there's so many guys out therewho are awesome technicians
who are horrible operators, um, you know, to kindof follow the E-Myth.
Like, they're... Dude, you're excellent painter,you're excellent HVAC, excellent plumber, excellent
carpenter, whatever. You suck at business. Uh, andone of my main subs, I'm like, "Hey, man.

(22:04):
I've got a great idea."
Um, so we started talking about that today, islike a partnership or a joint venture, but
I want to buy... I want to have a conglomerate of-
of... Or- or at least control
or major influence in everything that I mess with.
Sure.
Um, there'll be certain things that I- I would betoo hard to pick up, but, you know, I work with, uh, R&L Ward,

(22:29):
AWard Electric. Like, dude, he works- he's a winrate client.
Um, I don't need to talk to him. I've got anelectrician.
He- he operates extremely well. Um, you know, Idon't have
a plumber that I like working with right now.
Um, you know, so
it's... Because, you know, the- the clientexperience that- when somebody leaves like cigarette butts
and, you know, Mountain Dew bottles on, I- I'll- Ilose my damn mind.

(22:53):
You know, "Pick your shit up." Don't be a child.
But like,
I want to have control of that, and- and if Ican't, it makes things a lot more difficult.
So
that's-
Sure
... what I'm gonna do. So I- I'm gonna be... I'mgonna wrap them all up.
Like, I don't know how-
[laughs]
... that looks like. I'm gonna train them orpartner or something like that-
Yeah
... but that's- that's the long term 10-year goal.
I mean, that's... You know, again, that- that-that's the same strategy as, you know, a lot of these big

(23:16):
private equity firms out there that have, youknow, billion-dollar funds.
It's, you know, "Let's- let's go round up all ofthese, you know, individual home services businesses and
put them all together, and you know, try to getthem working together and sort of more cohesive." But, you
know, you- you- you would get a lot of, I think,you know, advantages of being able to have that influence and
control, you know, not only just like over theirschedule but, like you said, the quality.

(23:38):
You know, their processes, like being able tocoordinate amongst multiple jobs, and you know, I-
I- I think there are, you know, certainly a lot ofadvantages that could come from that.
Yeah. You know, like the other thing... Like forme, culture is more important than anything.
Um, you know, when I went out... You know, when Iwent out to your- your guys' place, I
messaged Mike. I was like, "Dude, this place is onpoint." I was like, "Eric is running one hell of a

(24:00):
business." Like it's... You know, it reminds meof-...
uh, being at one of mine, you know, something Iwork with or- or someone I work with, where
people want to be there. I don't think anybod-...I bet you nobody's ever left work early.
Like,
just, like, I mean, hey, m-... I bet you morelike, "Hey, man, you need to go home." Like, so, you
know, I d- that's why, like, my concrete guy'scoming out of Charlotte.

(24:23):
My painter is coming out of South Carolina. Um,becau- why? 'Cause they worked to learn...
They either are or were win rate clients, and-
Yeah
... that's, you know, it's...
I want that kind of thing. And there's, there's,there's great technicians out there.
I just, I think that
focusing on the business is hard, man.
It's hard taking the tool belt off because thenyou're not working on it, you know?

(24:45):
So it's, it, it's tough, man. It, it's
one thing that I was adamant about was not puttingthe tool belt on to do this.
And I've done s- I've done some stuff, but-
Yeah
... uh, it's just...
I mean, so, so, so what would you say, you know,again, I mean, kind of y- you've, you've mentioned, you know,
win rate a couple times here. We actually haveMike Claudio who's coming in, uh, t- tomorrow and, and Friday
to, to actually speak at this next boot camp.
But, like, you know, what would you say has beenthe biggest impact for, for you personally, you know, and

(25:10):
for your business, and then, and then what do yousee, you know, h- how do you see it impacting others?
Man, I think the biggest...
Man, it's t-... I, I think getting out of your ownway is a big part.
Like, um,
you know, outside perspective. Uh, we always jokelike if, if we all listened to our own advice that we gave
other people, we'd all be rich, jacked and happy.Like, but we don't, so having a co-...

(25:34):
Uh, Tyrin, every business I've touched that's beensuccessful had a coach behind it.
Um, so I worked with, uh, Combat Business Successfrom my MMA gym.
We scaled. I, I worked for them and coached forthem as well. Um, win rate, same thing.
It's having a coach
who... I think there's, there's couple things thatare important.
One, more than anything, you guys align.

(25:57):
Your core values, your, your goals, they have toalign. Um, that was...
that's a big part of it. Because if you don't likethem, very few people have the, the
mental
fortitude to be like, "I don't like them, but theyhave good advice, so I
can put it away." Because eventually, if someonegets annoying, I can't be around them, you know?
It's just part of it. I'll read their books.

(26:18):
Um, [laughs] but, uh, so the core value part's alot.
The other thing is they are,
they are
either where you wanna be or in the direction youwanna be, and they started where you were.
Um, there's so many coaches out there, "Oh, let meshow you how to make a seven figure business." I'm, "Let me
see your bank account."
Well, no, but I mean, yeah. Um, you know, I willnever tell anybody how to make a $1

(26:41):
million business.
And so, I hit that number. And honestly, can I forsure? Like, I'd have...
I know everything necessary, I just haven't doneit yet, so I could be wrong.
You know, I, I think the best thing for
business is find somebody who is where you wannabe and where, where you are now.
And I think that's gonna be the biggest thing, aslong as you guys align.

(27:05):
Yeah, absolutely. Now, h- how do you, you know...
Again, I, I see a lot of people who they, they,they worry and, and sort of, you know,
they're, they, they, they can't get past the cost.You know, the, you know, t-...
and, and they, they don't look at it as aninvestment.
They look at it, you know, as, as, you know, "He-how am I gonna, you know, make this payment?" You
know, it's, it's more of a cashflow issue that,that scares them a lot.

(27:26):
And so, how do you, you know, how do you seepeople, you know, sort of overcoming that?
Because, I mean, ul- ultimately, if you do thethings, you know, that, that, that you're being coached on
doing, if you actually implement, you take action,hold yourself accountable, like, you will have
success. But for those who don't, you know, thenyeah, you,
it's gonna be a very costly, you know, experience,you know, versus, like, when you do

(27:48):
implement, you know, th- the cost really shouldn'tbe that big of a factor because you're getting a huge
ROI on it. But, like, how do you get people overthat initial hurdle?
Yeah. You know, I easily spent over a quartermillion dollars on coaching.
Um, you know, i-
I'm not, I'm not very risk adverse. Like, I'll doall kinds of crazy things. Like, let's see what happens.
And, uh, and, you know, this is gonna soundarrogant. My default is winning.

(28:10):
Like,
when things happen, I will win. I will win nineoutta 10 times, eight outta 10
times because I'm willing... and, and this is thedifference, I'm willing to do the work to accomplish the
mission, whatever that is. Professional athlete,uh, jujitsu world
titles, um, business, whatever it is, I'm willingto do the work.
And I think

(28:30):
a lot of the,
uh... and that's where I kinda struggle is, like,how do you, how do you guys not bet on yourselves?
Like-
Hmm.
I mean, there, there's no other option.
Yeah.
So I, I think
the
most logical way to explain it is
what does it cost if you do

(28:52):
and what does it cost if you don't? And I think ifyou look at what happens if you continue
doing the exact same thing you're doing right nowover and over and over and over and over and over again,
you're gonna be exact same place or worse.
And, uh,
you know, I think the biggest thing is t- the painof change has to be less than the pain of
staying the same.

(29:13):
So putting
500, 5,000, whatever it is, dollars a month into acoaching
program has to hurt less than looking at your lifein 12 months,
18 months, two years, looking back like, "Shit.
I'm in the exact same place I was
there." And that's hard for people to do. Youknow, it's the devil we know.

(29:35):
Um-
Yep
... eh, I'd, I'd, I've never
put money
in a coaching program and done the work and itdidn't
ROI at least 10X.
Wow.
I've been in a few coaching programs where Ididn't do anything
because they weren't expensive enough to causeenough pain for me to do it, and

(29:58):
they're ju-... I have all kinds of stuff I'venever looked at.
Well, that's, uh, I mean that, [laughs] that's aninteresting perspective on, uh, you know, if, if, if, if
it, if it doesn't cost enough, then yeah, you're,you're not gonna value it, and
therefore you're not...... gonna use it, you know?
I mean, that's, it's, it's the whole kindafreemium model.
Like, you know, when things are free, people justdon't appreciate them, you know?

(30:20):
And when things are cheap, you just, it goes tothe bottom of the list of priorities.
But when you're, man, when you're writing a check,and that's not, you know, an easy check to write, like,
you wanna maximize [laughs] the value of whatyou're getting out of it.
And so maybe that does help, you know, make surethat people are fully committed and invested in it.
Well, I think the one thing about coaching peopledon't really understand is there's nothing out there
that... So, I work with Nate, uh, one of thecoaches, uh, at WinRate, and I've worked with Mike, and I

(30:43):
wa... you know, I've worked with all the coachesat different times.
There's not a single thing they have ever told methat I can't find online, in or in
a book, because that's probably where they learnedit. But the difference is with...
I, I think where
there's a big difference in success is the amountof count- accountability they deliver.
Like, so I, you know, uh, we moved this podcastback a half hour because I had my call with

(31:06):
Nate, and, like, we have task lists and, you know,the level of
accountability that a coach holds to you, that'sthe difference in ROI.
Um, I'm a huge fan of one-on-one coaching.
When you're in the beginning, you can't affordone-on-one coaching.
I, I think that's a big part of it, but, like,
just pay for accountability. Like, whether it'syou and your best friend, which is hard to do, or you and a

(31:30):
stranger,
accountability is what you're paying for. You'renot paying for tactics.
Um-
Yeah
... so-
Yeah
... it's tough.
Yeah. No, that's, that's...
And so how would you... You know, again, you, yousaid early on, you, you know, you just kinda created a
simple landing page, you know, but now you'reworking with a marketing agency that's, like, really helped
build out a, a full-blown website for you.
How, how has that impacted your, you know, yourlead flow, your marketing, getting everything out there?

(31:55):
So, I've run zero ads.
I... So, before I had the, their website, I ran$168 total on
lead... Not, I mean, it's just awareness ads, uh,on Facebook and Instagram, and it said my
price are the exact same they were six weeks ago.This was six weeks after the storm.
Um,
people were coming in and gouging people. That'sthe only ads I've run.

(32:18):
Uh, I had... [laughs] So, my lack of riskaversion, uh, I had a
bunch of money in cash from the sale of my rental.
I was like, "Hey, Sam, I wanna hold back..." Itwas, uh, Sam Kaufman, one of the, the guys at WinRate.
He's a sale... He does, uh, the marketing side.
I was like, "Hey, man, I wanna hold off on thewebsite." He goes, "No big deal." I was like, "Ah, nah, fuck it,
dude. Just send it. I'll figure it out." W- sothat's my lack of risk aversion. It's five grand, all right?

(32:41):
Um,
with that five-grand investment, I've landed twojobs specifically in my town.
Uh, one is a $60,000 garage and one is a
$3,000 door replacement, which I'm giving her adeal because she's a,
a fixed income holder lady and it's not a bigdeal.
Um, so I've made over 10X already on my, on myinvestment, um,

(33:04):
which... That's it. I, I think having a pr- I...
Early on in business, have a damn website and callpeople. Like, simple.
Like, you need to remo- remove as much friction aspossible.
Having that website tailored, big, big help.
Um, you know, it's very clean, it's veryprofessional, it's SEO ranked, uh...

(33:25):
I, I think that's a big part of it. But having awebsite, period. It's 2025.
Yeah.
Like-
[laughs]
...
the town I live in-
Gotta have a website.
Dude, the town I live in, your... It took my wifealmost eight months to find a cleaning
service because nobody had a website.
Oh.
And then they wouldn't show up, or they smelledlike cigarettes, so...

(33:46):
Yeah. But, uh, yeah, man, I, I think technology'sa big part of it.
I think having a marketing front... An- and I'mnot gonna lie.
Like, a lot of the money that I've done so far isbecause of Storm
Work. That being said, there's companies who havebeen in business 25 years who I'm
getting their jobs because they're not answeringthe phone.
They don't have a website, or they do have awebsite, hasn't been updated since 1997.

(34:10):
Um, I, I think, you know, s-
I think working on your business is
significantly more impactful than working in yourbusiness.
Sure. So, are you gonna... I mean, what...
Now that you have the website though, are yougonna continually invest in it?
Are you, you know, gonna keep kinda putting out,you know, website content, blog content, like,

(34:31):
SEO? I mean, are, are you gonna look at runningads at some point?
Yeah, for sure. Um, soon as we get through thesenext few projects, we're gonna start with, uh,
we're gonna have to do SEO first. Um, I'm gonnatarget outside of the Asheville area, so the
perimeter. Um, there are a bunch of good buildersin this area, uh, who
have big reputations. Um, I'm just not gonna tryand compete with them.

(34:53):
So, what I'm gonna do is go to Henderson Countyor... So, the...
Where I live is low income, um, for the most part,
but we also have a lake where, like, the averagelake house is $800,000.
So, I can absolutely break into that market.
I can break into the Henderson County market,which is a, a hi- is a retirement area.
Um, the average... I think the, the average age is700 years old, uh, at this point, you know?

(35:17):
So, like, we're gonna get in that market.
We're gonna focus on doing high-end remodelsbecause, like, the interest rates are up, so let's just
refinance what you have. You don't need to buy abigger house, or you don't need to do that.
Let's just re- let's just remodel what you have.
So, I'm gonna start targeting specifically mydemographic, and a lot of it is, is understanding what
my demographic is, you know? I'd like to besitting around $350 to

(35:39):
$500 a square foot for first off right now.
Um,
and then... Honestly, higher, but I, I don't haveany problems starting there.
Yeah. So that... I mean, that's the... Sounds likea great strategy.
You're, you're kind of really geographicallyfocusing on areas where you know they've got,
you know, the ideal client, but in areas thatmight not have a bunch of big builders, and you

(36:02):
see that there's just this gap. And so you cancome in and really focus on them and target those, those
areas to, to hopefully pick up the work with a lotless competition.
Yeah. Yeah, I'm in a... The garage I'm doing is anice... It's a gated community, super cool spot.
It's like 1400 acres. It's massive....
um, they got like a five-acre pond on a bunch ofwalking trails. It was a really nice neighborhood.

(36:22):
Like, Brownhaven's in there. Um, you know, it's abig national chain,
um, I think. Um, but like,
I'm gonna be in that neighborhood. Like, I'm gonnatarget that neighborhood.
I got really
nerded into, uh, marketing early on with the gym.
Because a- and 2017 on Facebook, you put $5 onFacebook, you made

(36:44):
500 in every time, like all day. And so, themarketing game was interesting.
So I, I figured out, like, cool, how do we targetneighborhoods?
Um, it's getting a little more difficult now. Andso, I'm just put... So I'm...
This week, I'm putting my sign up, ThirteenStripes Construction, and there's gonna be a QR code which goes
to my website, and there's gonna be like physicallittle flyer things in a

(37:05):
tube you could take for people who wanna take withthem.
Um, and that, and that's just the direction I'mgoing.
Uh,
because it is targeted marketing, but you know,referrals are b- the absolute best.
Like, stay front of mind. Send your clients gifts.I budget 'em.
Um, but I'm gonna do SEO and I'm gonna target adsin
areas that I feel is gonna be a higher ROI.

(37:28):
So, so when... Can, can you talk a little bitmore? So what are these, these gifts that you're giving?
And, and you say you budget that, so are you kindof... You're building that into the project budget?
Yeah. I, I don't like, put a line item like,"Gift." Um, you know?
So if you
like... Like, so, so think about this.
A $500 gift is not that big of a deal. Like, youmade a mistake on one

(37:52):
thing and you lost 500, so why not just spend $500on a gift for somebody?
And
but don't like... Not like JobTred on it or, orThirteen Stripes Construction.
Like buy- So Nate bought his client a grill.Finished on the house, we've got a Blackstone.
Cool.
[laughs]
A couple hundred bucks. Every time they walkoutside, they're gonna be like,

(38:13):
"Nate bought me that." And every time someonegoes, "Yeah, man, I need to do an addition." "Hey, call
Nate." You know?
So, being front of mind, you know, for, for biggerjobs, obviously you can do that.
A small remodel, you know, a, a, a 30, 40, 50, 100dollar gift, like it's
not gonna break you. Like if you... So if youbroke your drill on the job, you're gonna replace it.

(38:33):
Would it ruin that job? Probably not.
So just spend $100 to do something positive forthat person.
Um, so right now I've got a, uh, a whiskey set,like a, like the
decanter, glasses, all that stuff, uh, and abottle of
whiskey I bought in Scotland for a client.
Um, he actually happened to s- see... We...

(38:56):
I coached, uh, Deuce, one of my fighters, uh, wehad two world titles over in Scotland last
summer. And, uh, so we went over there, and heactually saw me and Deuce walking through
Edinburgh, uh, from his hotel room. I was like-
[laughs]
... "Are, are you guys in Scotland?" He'm like,"Are you watching me?" And yeah, he was.
Uh, so we're gonna send him that because that'ssomething that's impactful for him, like a meaning to

(39:17):
him. Uh, another one of my clients, she's gettinglike a whole charcuterie set.
I got like a little cutting board type thing.
I don't know what they're called, but charcuterieboard basically.
Um, and I put something about like sh- dude, shegot the coolest chickens, the fluffy
chickens, the furry feet chickens, all these crazychickens.
So I got a little quote about chickens on there.
So she's gonna get that, and then, and you know,obviously her probably 50, $80 worth of...

(39:40):
I bought $200 worth of charcuterie for my butchershop. I didn't realize how much that was.
That's a lot. So, I'm redoing that package forher.
Um, you know, so these are just kinda the giftsI'm doing.
And like
I'm, I'm gonna send them to my suppliers are gonnaget stuff. I'm just, I'm staying front of mind.
Um-
Yeah.
It, it's a client experience. Like-
Yeah, that's, that's awesome. And, and you know,again, I'm, I'm starting to hear more and more builders

(40:03):
talk about how they found that like not brandingthe gifts and not like, you know...
It, it doesn't have to be this thing that, youknow, it, it, it, it's got your logo and your brand
in front of them every time. Because those are thethings that people probably aren't gonna leave sitting
out and they might not use. You know, I couldchunk in the trash even or put it in the back drawer or something.
But like, it's, it's when you are thoughtful, youknow, and you give them something that actually has

(40:25):
meaning and value that, that they will use andthat they will keep around, it's about them
continuing to think of you. You know, I thinkthat, that's a much better approach here.
Yeah. Like, what are they gonna use all the time?You know, it, it's a big part of, of...
And like it...
Like give 'em a... Like if you give them a, apencil with your name on it, that's one thing.
They're gonna have it, they don't give a shit, soit'll go in their drawer.

(40:47):
But if you give them something that's actuallythoughtful...
Like I have in my notes on JobTread, like notes ofmy... All right, cool. Gift ideas.
What are they into?
Why?
Nice.
'Cause now I know, you know? And it's aconversation piece. We talk about different things.
Um, you know, i- it's...
I, I think it's important that you treat them likepeople, not profit.

(41:10):
That's a big part of it.
Yeah.
And that's how you're gonna make more profit.
And so you're... And you're also doing this for,sounds like your subs, suppliers, vendors?
Yep. Yeah.
Yeah, I'm actually...
Yeah
... I paid for one of my subs to go to Job... Um,not JobTread.
Um,
he uses like QuickBooks. W- we'll work on it.
But, uh, I'm paying for him to go to Winrate, um,you know, the leadership thing this week, or next week.

(41:30):
Uh, I think it's gonna be impactful. It's one ofthe... He's a good friend of mine as well.
Um, you know, he's helping me out. But I'm like,"Hey, listen, it's $1,000." Like, not the
end of the world, you know?
Yeah.
I've lost out on jobs by making mistakes.
So, you know-
[laughs]
... this is a good investment. I, I think doingstuff like that makes a big difference.
That's awesome, man. I mean, again, and, and i-and it's like those, those things that, you know, a little

(41:51):
bit today can, can turn around and earn you somuch more in the future.
And they see that you care. You know, it's likeit's, it's the passion.
It's, it's the c- the compassion. The, you know,the, the ability to win people's hearts, you know,
is, is ultimately gonna go so much farther for youthan, you know, having an expense here and there that,
again, should be nominal rounding error in, in thegreater scheme of things.

(42:13):
Yeah. Yeah, my first... So my first job that, uh,that kitchen remodel that happened with Helene,
I f- met her because she came and trained at mygym and loved how the
experience was. When she found-
Hm
... that I was doing construction, she went, "Oh,that's gonna be cool."You know, so like, that client
experience matters. And- and- and how you-
Well
... carry yourself and- and- and all of thatmatters. Like, I'm a big, scary dude. I get it.

(42:36):
Like, I'm 240 pounds. I got a head like a caveman.I'm fully tattooed. Like, it's just...
Like, I get it. Um, you know, so but, like, howyou carry yourself, how you present
yourself, how you do that makes a big difference.Like, uh, so my gym is next to a bar.
If I see you there every day at 11:00 AM, there'szero chance you ever sub for me.
Like, it's just not happening.
[laughs]

(42:56):
Like-
Yeah
... you know? So a lot of that matters, and Ithink personal branding has
been big for me as well, you know?
Yeah.
But talk about...
Like, nobody cares about two-by-fours.
Nobody cares about this new drywall mud you'reusing.
What they care about is the experience, and whatthey care about is how

(43:18):
that client feels when they walk into their house,and that's what you talk about.
So h- how do you go about trying to... I mean,are- are you capturing that with, you know, videos, photos,
putting it out on, you know, Instagram, socialthings like that?
Yeah, I do. Man, honestly,
I think for as far as, like, business goes formost people, um, unless you have an ad

(43:38):
budget. So Facebook algorithm changes constantly.
They're smashing pa- you know, pages, so personalbranding is big.
Um, I put... So I get video testimonials, um, so alot of my
testimonials are- they're video. "Hey, man, justtell me about your project." Um, I actually coach
my guys how to- or my clients how to u- leavereviews.
Like, "Hey, where do you live?" So Black Mountain,Hendersonville, wherever.

(44:01):
"What do we do? What did you like that we did?"
Um, so I have that, but yeah, I- I do... I- I talkabout...
So for me personally, I talk about core values,mission, vision for the company on my page.
Again,
nobody cares about two-by-fours and drywall andwhatever it is.
They care about people and- and that connection.Like, they're... I- I align with certain people.

(44:25):
I know there are other people out there who do agreat job, I just don't like them, so I don't work with them.
Yeah.
Um, you know, I think personally, on your personalpage is number one, because
people have to know, like and trust you to buyfrom you, and know is first,
right?
[laughs]
They have to know who you are, so that doesn'tmake it easy- easier.
Yeah.

(44:45):
I t- totally agree. I mean, the Facebook algorithmis- is always changing and, you know, and I've seen too,
like, you know, we can go make an identical poston JobTred's page versus on
mine, and I'll get like, 100X the engagementversus what
the- the company page, you know, the companyprofile there. And so I- I- I think you're totally right.
It's so important that people, you know, realizethat, like, it- it is.

(45:07):
It's people are hiring you. They like you. Theywanna work with you.
You know, your- your company is just kind of this-this- this- this wrapper, this vehicle of people, and
they're trusting you and the people under the hoodthat- that they wanna do business with and know at the end
of the day if something goes wrong-
Mm-hmm
... they're calling you and that you're gonna helpthem.
And so I do think it's very important that peopleput-
Mm-hmm
... you know, a big emphasis on building thatpersonal brand and showing the people behind

(45:31):
the business. You know, uh, uh, uh, I love thethought of, again, having them, you know,
and- and- and capturing video testimonials wherethey're talking about the experience and what was it
like and, you know, why did they choose Johnny?
Why did they, you know, choose you for thisproject and how was it...
you know, how was the experience like?
That is the stuff that you gotta capture and shareand that helps to really keep building that brand.

(45:53):
Yeah, and that's... It's like, you know, like,
multiple reasons. Like, one, like, Facebook justabsolutely crushes business algorithm, you get that.
But, like, the reason you get to reach, you do isbecause of who you are. You know, there...
You know, it's a big part of- of
what is a tr- Like, JobTred is unbelievablesoftware. My coach works...

(46:14):
Uses BuilderTrend, he's like, "No, use JobTred."If it didn't take so much learning
curve for the- the nominal difference in price, Iwould- I would probably switch.
I'm- I'm still working on it. But, uh, like, i-it's...
So software is software but the people are sales,and I think that's what makes a big difference.
Um, you know, and I think that's a big part of whyyou have the reach you do.

(46:35):
Yeah.
I'm curious, so when... You know, obviously,you're- you're- you're on a goal for this year, you know, but
as- as you continue to grow and scale thebusiness, like, what do you think are gonna be the biggest
challenges that- that you're gonna face?
Man, the biggest bottleneck I have right now is Ican't estimate anything.
Um, I... That's not true. I can estimate somethings now, but I can't estimate anything.

(46:57):
Dude, I walked into that first kitchen, had aclipboard and tape measure on my hip.
I took some pictures and took some measurements.
I was like, "Shit, now what?"
So, [laughs] uh, you know, so we startedestimating. I had a buddy come out.
I think my biggest bottlenecks right now are gonnabe...

(47:18):
For the custom home, I don't have an address Ibuilt. Like, it'd be really... I could show my dad's houses.
His name was John Buck as well. I could be like,"Well, look." He's like, "You built that when you were 13?"
I'm like, "Yeah, I'm a savant." Um, so I don'thave any,
uh, any addresses for a custom home, so I'm gonnago with spec.
But right now in the remodeling space, my biggest-my biggest, uh,

(47:40):
bottleneck is being able to look at a job and geta price in a- a
timely manner. Um, you know,
and I- I... But here's the thing. I'm very honestabout. I'm like, "Hey, man, listen.
I ha- It's gonna be a while for me to get back toyou.
If this is a rush, I can't do it."
And they're like, "No, man, it's cool." Or thenthey'll get this crazy price, and all of a sudden the price

(48:01):
changes, and then they'll call me back up like,"Hey,
we could probably do it for their second number.Let me give you a process." A- and I'm- I'm...
I will do a free estimate. I don't do a freequote.
And what I mean by that is yeah, so I d- I lookedat a deck.
Um, I was like, "You're looking at probably
$35,000 to $42,000 depending on these threevariables." And he goes, "Okay,

(48:24):
cool. Let's have our thing." I was like, "If youwant a full on actual quote, meaning I will do it for this
price
without change orders..."... um, I'll say, "It'sgonna cost you $1,500."
And I- I- I... That's helped me a lot,
because it gets buy-in from them.
Um, it allows me to bring in experts. Um, and- andsometimes we have engineers, or-

(48:46):
or- or draftsmen have to draw things, so that's abig part of depending where we're going.
But
yeah, for right now, my biggest bottleneck isbeing able to estimate.
So
as far as hiring goes, my first one's gonna beadmin.
Um, I already had Nino, one of the... She worksfor me at the gym.
I already go through your, uh, admin boot cour-uh, crash course.

(49:06):
Um, you know, five stars from her. She said,"Really simple."
[laughs]
Um, the bootcamp is obviously great. Uh, I'llprobably...
I'll- I'll definitely send them down whenever itgets to that point.
Um, but I'm gonna hire admin first, because that'sthe- the lowest ticket
item that I do that takes up too much time.
Yeah.
Um,
the next thing will probably be a sales estimator.Like, that's probably the next person I hire.

(49:31):
Um,
I- I can still ma- project manage. I can projectmanage four or five projects right now.
I'm not having any major issues with that.
So that's gonna be the process to scale, I think,realistically, is admin and then sales
and estimator.
Yep. No, I mean, and- and, you know, again, it's-it's- it's hard when you're starting out and- and- and you
don't have, you know, really anything to- to startwith.

(49:53):
And so having, you know, experience estimatingjobs, I think that'll be really, really helpful for you.
And as you guys get more jobs, you know, you'regonna be able to start looking at that data, and then
that will help inform the next job and the nextjob and the next job.
It just, you know, takes a little bit of time to-to- to get to that point.
Um, so I certainly think, you know, again, if- ifyou're cool and- and- and good with the project management

(50:14):
side, then definitely go and find somebody who'sgot experience and- and would be a great sales
estimator, you know, put them in place, you know,and then now you're dividing and conquering.
And so just whatever they get, they throw over thewall to you, you run with it, they're onto the next thing.
You know, having that admin obviously is gonna bereally helpful too, but, you know, it's- it's- it's
exciting, man, to- to- to watch you building, youknow, this- this business from scratch.

(50:35):
Because, again, it's- it's- it's not easy, right?
It's- it's something that, like, you know, I thinky- you chose a very challenging, you know, endeavor here
because, you know, without that constructionexperience, it's so important that the people you surround
yourself with are gonna make up for that.
But, you know, at the end of the day, it's- it'sbetter that you get people around you who are better,
smarter, you know, know the trades, know theinsides and- and- and the outs, and that means that you as the

(50:57):
business owner, you can keep that higher level,"I'm gonna focus on the business, the
marketing, the budgeting, the kind of growing the-the- the- the team, the culture, all of that," you know?
It- it's- it's- it's a good balance. So it doessound like
thinking about your team and how you build thatout will be a great way to overcome these- these- these
challenges that you're gonna have.
Yeah, I wanted to buy a business, so that was theplan.

(51:18):
Um, something in home service or buy, partner,whatever, and,
you know, I move fast, I make quick decisions. Itake the data, I look at it, I analyze it.
I- I turn... I'll turn 90 degrees. All of asudden, I get new data, I'll be 180 degrees.
And a lot of people don't do that well.
Um-
Yeah
... so I wanted to buy a business and it justdidn't work out. You know what? I'm gonna just do it myself.

(51:40):
And, uh, it obviously worked out well.
But yeah, you know, just using
the systems I built and experience in the gymworld, I mean, business is all the same.
It- it's- it's not really
any different. Your deliverables obviously are,your timelines obviously are, but, you know, business
is business. Um-
Yeah.

(52:00):
I mean, I'm- I'm curious kind of just as- as- aswe wrap up here, is there- is there any kind of
final advice that, you know, some- some of themaybe the best things that you've learned from- from your
mentors, coaches, you know, or- or even just someof your own businesses?
Like, any advice that- that you would give toothers who, you know, are in a similar spot, thinking about
starting a business or- or going all in on theirbusiness?

(52:21):
Like, you know, what- what advice, you know, wouldyou share with them?
I think there's two pieces of advice that havebeen
from the very beginning and will continue beingthe case is
there's two mistakes people make in business, orthree actually. One, they don't start. All right?
So that's
non-starter, you lose. But the- the mistakes thatpeople make the most are

(52:43):
these two are the one. People quit too soon.
I mean, they're right on the verge or things gettough and they quit.
"Oh, I can't do this," or, "This is stupid,"whatever.
That's things I have in my head, uh, quitefrequently.
Um,
so they quit too soon. And the other one is, andthis is what causes that, is they make the same mistake
twice. And what I mean by that is you dosomething,

(53:04):
you know that's not the answer, you do it again,you don't learn from your mistakes because that...
then you can't grow. You're gonna keep hitting thesame wall, hit- keep hitting the same wall.
Um,
you can't make the same mistake twice.
And yes, you're gonna make it twice, but if you dothe same thing over and over and over and you expect a
different result, that's the definition ofinsanity.
So realistically, don't quit

(53:25):
and don't do the same thing wrong twice. A- andyou do that, there's no way you can lose.
Yeah. You know, I, uh, uh, I think that's greatadvice.
And- and- and you said it earlier on too, like,you know, one, you're- you're- you're betting on yourself,
you know? And I think that's so important thatpeople have confidence in themselves and know
that it's not gonna be easy, but as long as you'rewilling to do the work, you

(53:49):
know, that is why you know that nine out of 10times you will win, is that you are willing to
do the work no matter what it takes to get the jobdone.
That is something that you can count on, and youare the only one that can tell yourself to quit
and to walk away and to stop and to cut corners.
And so I- I think, you know, it's- it's- it shows,Johnny, that your mindset and that your

(54:11):
belief that you can do whatever it takes to besuccessful.
I mean, at the end of the day, like, we can'tcontrol so many different aspects of- of our life in
this crazy world that we live in. But what you cancontrol is right up here.
And it's- and it's- and it's believing inyourself, it's building a great team, a great, you know,
culture around you. It's building that customerexperience to the point where people,

(54:35):
you know, want to work with you, they want torefer others to you.
Your subs, suppliers, they want to be part ofthis.
Like, continuing to attract other people, youknow, by giving and by caring and
showing that you're- you're- you're- you'repassionate about what you're doing is gonna help you to
continue achieving the success that- that- thatyou've had in your other businesses.
You know, I'm excited to just watch your- your-your path.

(54:57):
I- I appreciate that- that you're chronicling iton- on social and that, you know, you're gonna keep kind of
sharing the- the challenges. And- and look, you'rereal. You're- you're raw, you're transparent.
Like, you don't sugarcoat it and- and kind of onlypost the good stuff.
You give the bad stuff too, and I think that's sovaluable, you know, because again, it's- it's- it's
something that builds trust. And I just...
I- I appreciate you coming on and- and sharingyour story, Johnny.

(55:18):
I look forward to-
to seeing you hit that million dollar goal thisyear and, you know, three, four, five years, however many,
you know, whenever- whenever you start rolling upother- other- other businesses into it, that'll-
that'll be super exciting too. You know, butagain, I- I- I appreciate, you know, your- your- your
willingness to- to- to just open up here, man,and- and share, 'cause I know it's not easy, I know you're
grinding, you know, but it's, uh, it's aninspiration to others to see you, you know, working that hard

(55:41):
and- and doing, you know, what needs to be doneand holding yourself accountable.
That's- that's- that's all that you could ask.
I appreciate it.
Yeah, man. Well, again, we- we- we appreciate youand, uh, yeah, look- look forward to seeing, uh, the
continued success.
All right, man. Thank you.
See you.
Thanks for joining us for this episode of BuilderStories.
We hope you enjoyed the conversation and gainedvaluable insights that can help you in your

(56:05):
journey along the way.
Don't forget to subscribe to the show and leave usa review.
And as always, if you or someone you know has astory to share, please contact
us at builderstories.com. We'd love to hear fromyou.
I'm Eric Fortenberry, and remember, every builderhas a unique story.
Keep building yours.