April 2, 2025 • 27 mins
Mistakes happen—so how do you fix them without giving away the farm? Learn the art of handling difficult client conversations!
In the fast-paced world of event planning, mistakes are inevitable—but how you handle them can make or break client relationships. In this episode, we break down how to navigate tough conversations, resolve issues proactively, and ensure successful event outcomes.
Topics include:
✔️ How to quantify the value of a mistake in event planning
✔️ Best practices for addressing client complaints
✔️ Why communication before, during, and after an event is key
✔️ The best ways to offer solutions without losing money
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#EventCrisisManagement #DifficultConversations #EventPlanning #EventTroubleshooting #ClientManagement #ConflictResolution #AVIss
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Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Welcome to event therapy podcast. Today, we're gonna be talking about navigating difficult conversation. How do you handle leak on work loss and client complaints? Yeah. I know.
(00:01):
Well, so this was a topic that came up in a natural conversation, David, that you and I had. And I remember afterwards, you looking at me like, yeah. And we need to talk about this on the podcast. Like, this would help so many people because we all deal with it in various ways. So I'll kinda kick it over to you to kinda share, like, how the conversation started and, you know, some of the questions that you posed.
Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, essentially, just thinking about quantifying the value of a mistake. That's kinda where this all started. Right?
Because oftentimes, obviously, being an AV company, if you make a mistake, unfortunately, sometimes those mistakes can be, sometimes they can be small, but sometimes they can appear to be big. And then it's like, how do you really quantify the value when you have a a client that's unhappy about what happened? And and, you know, what's the dollar amount of that? Let's say, for example, a staff member, you know, messes up or or is rude to a client or something along those lines. Like, how do you really put a value on that?
Do you refund the whole amount of money of the event? Is it really like, is that does that really make sense? So just really, I think, you know, the idea of that conversation was, like, how do we really do this in a way that's fair to everybody? Because it's easy to say, well, you wanna be fair to the client, but in some ways, you gotta be fair to the business too. And so there's that happy medium of where it makes sense and then where it becomes too much.
Because some mistakes when they happen, like, that moment in time is already gone. So there's no amount of money or there's no amount of anything that's really going to bring it back, but there is a way to fix it. So it's like, how do you fix it where you're not as a business, you're not giving away the whole farm? And as a client, how do you look at it where you say, okay. Yeah.
I see where, you know, a full refund doesn't make sense unless it totally destroyed the event. But we're not talking about necessarily a question like that. You know what I mean? So I think that's the premise of the conversation. And I think just looking at it from a planner standpoint, from a hotelier standpoint, also having like, Liz, you you have the the situation where you have an in house company.
So there's this, layer of, like, client and then the the hotel and so on and so forth. So I just think it's an interesting way to look at, how we would all handle that. So that that was really the premise, like, quantifying the value of a mistake. Yeah. Absolutely.
And this can happen in in every avenue of events, like, not just AV. And I think when you had kinda brought that question, you were asking me, like, as a planner, what would kind of satisfy and, you know Right. Make it, you know, not make it perfect, but make it okay, you know, to overcome, you know, any mishap that happened, especially from the AV front. And I kinda shared from my perspective and how I have kinda seen these things is, you know, the more you can get in front of it, the better. When you just, like, keep charging along, it can kind of oh, it's bad for her and sue.
And it's like you feel wronged, and you don't feel like you've gotten any kind of solution. And I always like the approach of just being proactive about it. So in your example, if it was, you know, an employee or, heck, even if it was just a piece of equipment that malfunctioned, you know, what is the value of that amount Instead of saying, oh, I'm just going to comp the whole thing or get a 50% refund. I mean, then at that point, you'd potentially be losing money. I mean, you are a business, so it's like, I think everybody understands that when something goes wrong, you just wanna feel, one, heard, and two, that it's acknowledged and something is being done.
So my suggestion was maybe it's if it was an employee for that day and it was a couple hours, maybe deduct what the cost of that employee was and say, hey. You know what? I'm I'm so sorry this happened. I'm gonna go ahead and take the labor off for that employee for for today, and you won't be charged for that. Or this equipment piece malfunction, we're gonna get it fixed and replaced real quick, but I'm gonna go ahead and not charge you the for that.
And you you won't have to pay for that. Her ticket so you're eliminating your your cost, but you're also making them feel hurt. And then that way, they are like, okay. I feel like they're doing something. They've done something.
They can let it go and move on with the program. Well, and I think I think that's a great way to to help understand that there's a difference between ruining a ruining a moment and ruining an event. Right? Because sometimes, a moment might have happened, a hiccup, or or something like that. But if the whole event everything else at the event was great, it's like, okay.
Well, that that's I think that's where you really get into that rub. And, again, like, as we were we were diving a little more into that conversation, I was thinking of when you suggest something like, oh, okay. So that's a great idea. Like, for example, if you had an employee that just I I don't know. They were having a bad day.
Mhmm. Maybe they stayed up too late the night before or whatever. I, as the owner of the company, would want to maybe maybe I go and say, send that person home, and then I just fill that shift. Right. And like you said, like, I don't charge I don't charge the client for that that particular shift, but I fill in as the owner and say, hey.
I wanna be proactive. I wanna make sure your event for the rest of the event comes off well and so on and so forth. So I think those are all our things here too. Like, we wanna make it right. So I think saying, you know, we wanna make it right.
You know, I acknowledge this happened. You know? And and making it right depending on the situation could also be more than just giving back money. You know? I think it's it's about when were you notified of it.
Like, was is this something that you're aware of, or is it something that maybe happened where it's happened and you're not even aware? Things important. You know, if there has to share that live, you know, there was an issue with the meal, if there was an issue with the service. Like, saying that at the event and not waiting until after the event is so helpful because there's a lot we can do to recover from that. That's not also necessarily just getting money back.
You know? Like, maybe we give you an you know, a free hour on the bar the next night, or we upgrade your next meal, or, like you know, there's just other things that you can do that I think, you know, that in evaluating the situation is making it right in the customer's eyes too, then that could be a good win win. So I think being upfront about things, you could not everything that goes, you know, wrong necessarily is something that, you know, you as the business owner are even aware. Sure. That's a very that's a valid point because you're right.
Sometimes we don't hear about it until after the fact. And then it's almost like in in a client's eyes, the only solution is a re is a refund. Right. It's really hard a partner to do anything other than that too. Like, gosh, I wish I would have known us.
Look at an employee that was, like, a couple mafia and like, there's just a lot of things. I mean, I I it's like the things are not what is actually happening. Hope little things, timing. Yeah. You know what's frustrating, you know, if he's changed on the agenda and the timing.
Yeah. Whatever it may be. There's just so many other ways to make it right and just giving him back money. So I think that's also part of, you know, deciding what the right recovery method is. Is is it necessary to have to be made of that?
(00:22):
Or could we, you know, overcome that by adding value, or just making a staffing cage or whatever it may be? So I think those are some things to consider too because it is for everything's gonna be situational as far as what the value is there. But I think being for active is huge. You know? Like, I don't think you as a customer, if we're all aware that this was a pretty big deal, you know, should have to say after the fact, get your bill.
Nobody's addressed it. I I mean, I think that's where it starts to get. It does. And, you know, I've had situations where that's happened. You know?
Something fun wrong at a venue and whether it's, you know, on a food front or an AV front. And I voiced that concerns in the moment to the correct people, and nothing was done. And then it's kind of like, at the end of it, here's your bill, full amount. And I'm like, like Yeah. Let's just wait and see what they say.
Yeah. Let's just wait and see if we can get by. But now I never wanna go back to those places because I feel like nothing was that. And it wasn't that I was necessarily expecting, oh, I needed it all all pumped or a a refund. I mean, maybe something on the back end of the deal would have been nice.
Or like you said, upgrading some hey. Can we add, you know, a complimentary reception for your desk or something? I think that works as well. It's just when something goes wrong, you don't hear anything, and it's like, well, you guys aren't gonna that's not gonna be quiet about the whole thing. Right?
You're gonna get the bill. You're gonna be disappointed that the hotel didn't address anything. You're gonna pay for it. But and maybe your vendors seem to be like, okay. No.
No. No. No. No. No.
No. No. No. No. No.
No. No. No. No. No.
No. No. No. No. No.
No. No. No. No. No.
No. No. No. No. No.
No. No. No. No. No.
No. No venues. And and I will say, I did go back and say, you know, and and several of them, like, hey. There were some disaster things that happened, to the point where I was like, I was kind of appalled that I was even parts for some of these things that didn't happen and didn't work. Yeah.
Well, you know what's interesting to me? I think in the day and age that we live in, we pretty much we all have cell phones. We all have a very we're we're very connected. Right. Is what we oh, let me rephrase that.
We have the ability to be very connected because we're not always very connected. Right? And so I I think it's something where all of us as professionals have to be willing to have the conversation. You know what I mean? Because it, I I I I feel like it's weird to use it's not fair, but I can't think of a different way to word it.
But just for conversational purposes, like, it's not fair for where the problem happened to be able to be made up for if it's not addressed, as you said, like, in a timely fashion. If if the person or the company that it happened to waits too long. And and I have another scenario for the flip side of this I wanna bring up in a second too. But, like, if if, let's say it's a a planner or just maybe it's a client direct, maybe a planner is not involved, it's a client direct. If they don't, if they're not then if we don't give them that sense of comfortability, like, hey.
A conversation can be simple. We don't anticipate anything going wrong. But in the unlikely chance you know, I feel like I'm on an airplane. Right? But in an unlikely chance that something does go wrong, I want you to feel comfortable knowing you can reach out to me.
Send me a text. Let me know. Let me know as soon as you can so that we can hopefully fix we would we would prefer to fix it as quickly as it happened. Right? We wanna fix it just as fast as the problem happened.
And so if you're waiting till after the fact and, again, I'm not saying any anybody specifically, but if a client waits till after the fact or if or if the problem doesn't come up until after the fact, then it really does eliminate the ability to fix it. It's a more challenging. It really does. It really does. This happens a lot, though.
I really do. Right? He's afterwards, and it's because you're like, gosh. I just really know. That was fun.
(00:43):
No. Because I could have come up with three other solutions Then the client starts to unload all this. Right. So that's the big question. Right?
That's the big question in all of this. It's like, why doesn't it come up? You know? Start to foster. So it's like it can start with one thing, but then when that's not resolved, it's like, well, now this is an issue.
And this is when maybe it wouldn't, but, like, you've let it, like, accumulate. And then as the planner, you're, like, fuming at the end of So so to this point, in our entertainment company, one of the things that we used to always and and we still kinda do this when we train new people. We would ask quest we would ask this question, which is a little bit of a trick question, but we would say, what is the most important aspect of an event to your client? And they would throw all these different answers out, but that it was like I said, it was kind of a trick question. The answer was whatever you do wrong.
That becomes the most important thing to that. We we didn't care about anything other than blank. And then blank was right? Blank was whatever you did wrong. And then the the next layer of that is what y'all are talking about now.
You know, the client is even more amplified and more unhappy because of this, you know, what you could have fixed in the beginning. It's just amazing. So what can we do to overcome that? And do you think that is on the the vendor, the hotel, the, you know, the partner to say, like, I who who are the right people to let, you know, notify your banquet captain, check-in with your banquet manager? Does the event manager check-in every day?
How's it looking going? It's very, hey. I mean, what communication channel is most appropriate to make your customer feel comfortable knowing, okay. This is the person that I should go to or that I have this line of communication. Yeah.
I don't think you wanna set the tone of like, if anything, it was Right. That's the hard part. Right? Like, you don't you don't wanna, like, plant in the seed in the head of the client that something might go wrong, but it it it's and then it's it's an interesting, like, really pondering over what the answer is because you want those open line of communications, and maybe that's you. And I literally wrote down put my number on the AU because I think if the event manager reaches out to the client and says, here is my cell phone number.
Yeah. Should anything come up, just leave it generic like that. You know? Please reach out to me and let me know so that we can be of assistance. Yeah.
And I think as the they also then need to ask the client for their cell phone number or whoever is going to be the point of contact. I think the vendor should do the same thing. Yes. And I think it's almost one of those things that maybe at the start of a program, the event manager or the vendor text the client. Hey.
Hope everything goes well today. Like, just checking in. Yeah. Let me know if you need anything. And then maybe it's just so, like then they feel like if something goes wrong, you've already been communicating with them that they can say, oh, this just happened.
Oh, let me get right on that for you. Right. A good banquet team, a good AD team. Let me I can ace them so that I have and I know our team's awesome about this and and makes everybody's lives happier because they know that they know exactly who they can be. So if they need something, and it could be proactive.
It's something we're going on. You know, something got delayed or a product didn't come in, or I don't know what could happen. Different things, you know, that be you know, what coming with that. You're gonna wait until, like, see that did you notice that the those particular chips were not on your break? Like, I think our team's really been about being proactive.
So I think proactively notifying. We don't even need to go get some bucks free if they if we need it. So so you could shout out to Sonny Dubasa. I'll make sure you have everything. Well, And, I mean, I think it I think it's important for for everybody involved to realize that, of course, we're all striving for a perfect event.
Of course, we're all striving for, everything to flow smoothly, but we have to we have to make it not so taboo that something could go wrong. I mean, it's just the truth. I mean, anytime you have humans involved, anytime you have technology involved, it's events. Something can go wrong. And and sometimes we feel like we go too far on the end of this expectation of perfection.
Right? Like, yes, we want it, and, yes, nobody I mean, it's it's the most embarrassing thing in the world if you're whatever you are responsible for, whether it's a hotel, whether it's the, you know, whether it's the AV, whether it's even, you know, the the person responsible for the event themselves. Like, nobody wants it to go wrong. That's the last thing you want to have happen. So I think it's just really being being more proactive of, like you said, of the communication, being more understanding of each other and realizing that, hey.
We're in this we're in this together. We're not here to take advantage of you. Lord forbid, not come what if something goes wrong. We wanna get it fixed right away, but we need to know about it right away. We can't fix it right away if we don't know about it right away.
So maybe even that's part of the conversation. I'm just saying, don't be afraid to let us know. Don't don't keep all your notes and then tell us at the end. Like, right away, let's handle. Let's get it out of the way because especially if it's a multiday event, let's say this this situation happened on day one.
You don't want day two and three and whatever ridden by it. Right? You wanna be able to say, hey. It happened. They recovered.
I have confidence. We're gonna have a great next couple of days. Yeah. It's events, and, you know, we we know that things are are changing. Things can go wrong.
So how do we be proactive about it to, you know, quickly overcome and move forward and make it successful? Because you know why? I'm gonna make up a number here, but I would be willing to say eight times out of 10, your guests don't even know something happened. And that's the So point. It's it's, you know, how to yeah.
Things may happen, and, yes, you may know and the planner may know, but, like, most of the time, the guests don't know. So if you can overcome that quickly, it's still a successful event. And I think trying not to harp on, you know, the in the reality at the end of the day, the little things. Now going back to the text message, I kinda started to think about it. I'm really liking this.
(01:04):
Yeah. As I think about it more because if you think of, like, some of your more higher end hotels that you go to now, now they text you. Your concierge text you your ring ready, if you need anything. They check-in with you every day. There's times I text about I normally wouldn't.
You know? I did go about because I don't wanna pick up and fall the front desk or I don't wanna go down to the front desk. But, oh, I got this person I can text and the NASA. I know it's a robot. No.
I know it is. But, you know, if I check back, I'm hoping somebody is going to show a look at it. And it it just kinda made it more inviting to, oh, hey. I really hand fax this back with, I text it back asking if I can have an earlier check-in, you know, of course. So, I think those things, it again, being co opted, it kinda opens that door to make them feel comfortable to reach out.
It makes you feel like you're in it together. I think I think that's what it boils down to. So it makes it feel like you're in it together. You know, going back to your point about, the the audience not necessarily knowing what, you know, things that happen or whatever, this could have really backfired on me a lot, but I'm gonna tell you a quick story. I I I had no, I had a client that we did a multi day event with.
And we have these, like, ear comms that we communicate with each other, and we let the client wear one of the ear comms as well. So that way, she could connect to me very quickly. She was in the room. She was kinda helping out and everything. But I'll just be honest.
Like, there were some things that happened behind the scenes that were problems that we were able to fix behind the scenes, and the audience never knew it happened. She would not even know it happened. But after the fact, she came up and said to me, I was so amazed at how quickly you guys were able to react, fix, change, adapt, do whatever you needed to do. Right? She's she's like, it it was a whole different world to me being able to see that happen and realize the pressure that you all are under to really make this happen for us.
And and I thought it was such a cool experience. Show that Mazda back out on the hotel. Yeah. Well, that was something I That was one of my favorite things, at a WEC we went where you could sign up as a planner to sit back and listen on the headsets to the AV of the full production. And I mean, oh, like, I'm, like, sitting there getting nervous for him.
Like, oh my gosh. There's a lot going on here. So I can imagine in my Just really watch that guy. What's that guy gonna do? Okay.
No. He's gotta go over there. Oh, run back. No. He's moving over.
Alright. Like, we're we're doing all that stuff in behind the scenes, and we're like, hey. If this guy does this and that person does that, then this is what we need to do instead. It's like, it's crazy, but it's it's cool. You say that, like, the back alley of the hotel, like, I totally bat hallway end of day.
Yeah. It's what it takes to close together. I mean, and that's what you've hired all of us for. So, I mean, that is our job, but, I mean, there's a lot that could go wrong. And I love this podcast for that reason, and I think David, he always steer us back to, like, not having any rose colored glasses on.
Of course, we all wanna agree with that. But this is there's so much that could go wrong in an offense, and there likely could be a comp and wrong is not the huge. You know, wrong could be very small, and wrong could be on everyone's end, not just the the service provider, but also on the the planer's end. You know? And that can create a lot of problems for the hotel and vendors.
So I think just the awareness of, like, it's not always going to be completely perfect, you know, and how we partner together to make sure that we overcome these little little things that can happen and move cast them, find a resolution, find a stitch hall, whom you're always talking about on here, and being a good partner. And but you're right. Things are gonna happen, and I love that you say that. Like, we all want it to go well. There's nothing that anyone wants less than anyone to be unhappy.
And, yeah, just as stressful on whoever it's happening to Vex as it is you know, nobody wants that. Well, I I I just one quick point I'm thinking about too is that most of the problems that happen, I think this is I think this is where it becomes such a challenge in the events industry. Almost every and probably on the hotelier side as well, but definitely I know on our side, just about every single problem that happens, you don't have any anticipation time for the problem. Right? So you don't see, like, somebody walking and about to trip over something.
Are you like like, you just you have no no re it's like you almost have no reaction time because it happens in a split second. There's no there's no build out to the problem. Right? And that's the same thing of, like, somebody accidentally dropping a tray or or anything at all. You know what I mean?
Like, it's just it's really interesting that it would be great. Like, I I think about it all the time when it comes to microphones. It'd be great when I knew that somebody was getting ready to walk into a place where it might be a dead zone in the room, and and I could prevent them from doing that. You know? It'd be great if I knew any it would be great if I knew some lady was ten minutes before we're gonna start, we're gonna go back and unplug all of our power to plug her phone in.
Right? Like, I I would be great if I knew yes. It would be great if I knew these things were gonna happen. You know? But the just so stressful.
You know? Because it's really you don't have warning, and that's how you recover. I love what you were saying, like, just going back to if you haven't been to a back hallway, a hotel, it is not a huge area. And there are a lot of people going back and forth on it and a lot of different vendors. And it's like there's there's a going on.
Like, everything has to be coordinated. It's timing. And I've sat in those meetings, like, those DEO meetings where you've got a staff of DEOs, and you're going through it with the client, and they're like, you know what? Change this. Change that.
Then we do this, and it's the day before the event. Right. It's morning up. Changing menus, and you spent all the sun calculating and the time and the plan of how things are gonna go in that back hallway and the timing of when stabbing's gonna come out and this vendor's gonna come out. And just one little thing can completely just derail it all.
And then the whole big operation, the bigger deal that is. You know? So And then y'all are scrambling to get together last minute to figure out we need a new game plan. Well, I think the game changer is really shadowing that. If if I could offer any advice to anybody, it's like shadow the other people that you work with.
(01:25):
Find a time. If you if if you have time in your calendar and you have a good relationship with a hotel or with a AB partner or with a planner partner, and you're like, hey. Look. You know, I'm not really doing anything. Do you have an event coming up that I could come shadow you?
It's it's a whole different world. I mean, just that small explanation I gave of the the lady from the client that was on the headset with us. Like, it totally changed her view of what we do and I think gave her a perspective. She'd never I could try to explain that perspective all day long, but to actually experience it. And and I I try to do it as much as I can.
I I honestly have not done it as much lately as I probably should, but it's something I used to do a lot. And I really just talking about it reminds myself even to get back to doing it. Well and I think even, you know, as a painter, I'd really go, but I've done that before, but, like, do it again. Yeah. Like, keep it fresh in your mind.
Really think about the other vendors and the hoteliers perspective because I know sometimes I'll be like, I forget that when I change that, I'm literally causing them to have a fire drill. Yeah. And when I think about those things and when I have those things fresh in my mind, it also makes it more helpful for me to explain to you know, at the time if it's my boss or it's my client, like, hey. I really know like, how important is this change? Yep.
Because I know this is something that you would like to have, but just for contacts, this is what it's possibly potentially gonna do to the hotel or the vendor. And are you is it that important that you're willing to take that risk? Yeah. And a lot of times, then they say, no. You know what?
No. Let's just keep it the way it is. But it gives you more ammo to be like, that I I think I say that a lot, like ammo. Like, to make sure you, you know, have the knowledge and and educate yourself so that you have that ammo to have this. Yeah.
So he's gonna say another you know, he can't go, you know, shout out at other people. I think when you're in the then your own event, you know, be more aware of what's going on and and really listening and learning and but most surround yourself with people. Like, the reason why I know a lot about some of the AD shuttles is because I you shared them and, you know, again, surrounding myself in a professional organization with people that do these roles. So anyways, you know, I I know that I'm better at my job because of my relationships with friends that are winners. Because I hear you talk about different things that you experience at hotels, and I think you could say the same about, you know, understanding the hotel side of things a little bit more.
So surrounding yourself with your professional network that is not just your own profession, that is is also the people that Yeah. No. That's a great point. Like like, working at, you know, or being, you know, being a part of MPI allows us to have these healthy conversations. And it's something that, you know, if if you're listening and you're part of an organization, if if it's not happening, like, be the person to spearhead those conversations and just always remembering that it's supposed to be done in a healthy way.
It's supposed to be done in a way where everybody in the conversations wins. It's not it's not a it's a very selfless conversation, not a selfish conversation because it gives you the ability to understand. And to your point earlier about even if you've done it before, also remembering that each venue and each service provider is going to do things a little bit differently. You've learned something new on the way. Yeah.
I think this has been a a great conversation, and I think, you know, it's something that can continue to happen and evolve, and I hope it continues in the industry in general. Just, you know, shadow, get in front, of things. How about open communication? Look at your network. These are all, I think, great tools to make all of us, not deaf painters, but also suppliers and health book polliers that are a net professional.
We're a professional. Well, thank you for joining us today on Event Therapy Podcast, and we hope you follow us on social at Event Therapy Podcast, and we'll catch you at the next event.
Welcome to event therapy podcast. Today, we're gonna be talking about navigating difficult conversation. How do you handle leak on work loss and client complaints? Yeah. I know.
(00:01):
Well, so this was a topic that came up in a natural conversation, David, that you and I had. And I remember afterwards, you looking at me like, yeah. And we need to talk about this on the podcast. Like, this would help so many people because we all deal with it in various ways. So I'll kinda kick it over to you to kinda share, like, how the conversation started and, you know, some of the questions that you posed.
Yeah. Yeah. So, you know, essentially, just thinking about quantifying the value of a mistake. That's kinda where this all started. Right?
Because oftentimes, obviously, being an AV company, if you make a mistake, unfortunately, sometimes those mistakes can be, sometimes they can be small, but sometimes they can appear to be big. And then it's like, how do you really quantify the value when you have a a client that's unhappy about what happened? And and, you know, what's the dollar amount of that? Let's say, for example, a staff member, you know, messes up or or is rude to a client or something along those lines. Like, how do you really put a value on that?
Do you refund the whole amount of money of the event? Is it really like, is that does that really make sense? So just really, I think, you know, the idea of that conversation was, like, how do we really do this in a way that's fair to everybody? Because it's easy to say, well, you wanna be fair to the client, but in some ways, you gotta be fair to the business too. And so there's that happy medium of where it makes sense and then where it becomes too much.
Because some mistakes when they happen, like, that moment in time is already gone. So there's no amount of money or there's no amount of anything that's really going to bring it back, but there is a way to fix it. So it's like, how do you fix it where you're not as a business, you're not giving away the whole farm? And as a client, how do you look at it where you say, okay. Yeah.
I see where, you know, a full refund doesn't make sense unless it totally destroyed the event. But we're not talking about necessarily a question like that. You know what I mean? So I think that's the premise of the conversation. And I think just looking at it from a planner standpoint, from a hotelier standpoint, also having like, Liz, you you have the the situation where you have an in house company.
So there's this, layer of, like, client and then the the hotel and so on and so forth. So I just think it's an interesting way to look at, how we would all handle that. So that that was really the premise, like, quantifying the value of a mistake. Yeah. Absolutely.
And this can happen in in every avenue of events, like, not just AV. And I think when you had kinda brought that question, you were asking me, like, as a planner, what would kind of satisfy and, you know Right. Make it, you know, not make it perfect, but make it okay, you know, to overcome, you know, any mishap that happened, especially from the AV front. And I kinda shared from my perspective and how I have kinda seen these things is, you know, the more you can get in front of it, the better. When you just, like, keep charging along, it can kind of oh, it's bad for her and sue.
And it's like you feel wronged, and you don't feel like you've gotten any kind of solution. And I always like the approach of just being proactive about it. So in your example, if it was, you know, an employee or, heck, even if it was just a piece of equipment that malfunctioned, you know, what is the value of that amount Instead of saying, oh, I'm just going to comp the whole thing or get a 50% refund. I mean, then at that point, you'd potentially be losing money. I mean, you are a business, so it's like, I think everybody understands that when something goes wrong, you just wanna feel, one, heard, and two, that it's acknowledged and something is being done.
So my suggestion was maybe it's if it was an employee for that day and it was a couple hours, maybe deduct what the cost of that employee was and say, hey. You know what? I'm I'm so sorry this happened. I'm gonna go ahead and take the labor off for that employee for for today, and you won't be charged for that. Or this equipment piece malfunction, we're gonna get it fixed and replaced real quick, but I'm gonna go ahead and not charge you the for that.
And you you won't have to pay for that. Her ticket so you're eliminating your your cost, but you're also making them feel hurt. And then that way, they are like, okay. I feel like they're doing something. They've done something.
They can let it go and move on with the program. Well, and I think I think that's a great way to to help understand that there's a difference between ruining a ruining a moment and ruining an event. Right? Because sometimes, a moment might have happened, a hiccup, or or something like that. But if the whole event everything else at the event was great, it's like, okay.
Well, that that's I think that's where you really get into that rub. And, again, like, as we were we were diving a little more into that conversation, I was thinking of when you suggest something like, oh, okay. So that's a great idea. Like, for example, if you had an employee that just I I don't know. They were having a bad day.
Mhmm. Maybe they stayed up too late the night before or whatever. I, as the owner of the company, would want to maybe maybe I go and say, send that person home, and then I just fill that shift. Right. And like you said, like, I don't charge I don't charge the client for that that particular shift, but I fill in as the owner and say, hey.
I wanna be proactive. I wanna make sure your event for the rest of the event comes off well and so on and so forth. So I think those are all our things here too. Like, we wanna make it right. So I think saying, you know, we wanna make it right.
You know, I acknowledge this happened. You know? And and making it right depending on the situation could also be more than just giving back money. You know? I think it's it's about when were you notified of it.
Like, was is this something that you're aware of, or is it something that maybe happened where it's happened and you're not even aware? Things important. You know, if there has to share that live, you know, there was an issue with the meal, if there was an issue with the service. Like, saying that at the event and not waiting until after the event is so helpful because there's a lot we can do to recover from that. That's not also necessarily just getting money back.
You know? Like, maybe we give you an you know, a free hour on the bar the next night, or we upgrade your next meal, or, like you know, there's just other things that you can do that I think, you know, that in evaluating the situation is making it right in the customer's eyes too, then that could be a good win win. So I think being upfront about things, you could not everything that goes, you know, wrong necessarily is something that, you know, you as the business owner are even aware. Sure. That's a very that's a valid point because you're right.
Sometimes we don't hear about it until after the fact. And then it's almost like in in a client's eyes, the only solution is a re is a refund. Right. It's really hard a partner to do anything other than that too. Like, gosh, I wish I would have known us.
Look at an employee that was, like, a couple mafia and like, there's just a lot of things. I mean, I I it's like the things are not what is actually happening. Hope little things, timing. Yeah. You know what's frustrating, you know, if he's changed on the agenda and the timing.
Yeah. Whatever it may be. There's just so many other ways to make it right and just giving him back money. So I think that's also part of, you know, deciding what the right recovery method is. Is is it necessary to have to be made of that?
(00:22):
Or could we, you know, overcome that by adding value, or just making a staffing cage or whatever it may be? So I think those are some things to consider too because it is for everything's gonna be situational as far as what the value is there. But I think being for active is huge. You know? Like, I don't think you as a customer, if we're all aware that this was a pretty big deal, you know, should have to say after the fact, get your bill.
Nobody's addressed it. I I mean, I think that's where it starts to get. It does. And, you know, I've had situations where that's happened. You know?
Something fun wrong at a venue and whether it's, you know, on a food front or an AV front. And I voiced that concerns in the moment to the correct people, and nothing was done. And then it's kind of like, at the end of it, here's your bill, full amount. And I'm like, like Yeah. Let's just wait and see what they say.
Yeah. Let's just wait and see if we can get by. But now I never wanna go back to those places because I feel like nothing was that. And it wasn't that I was necessarily expecting, oh, I needed it all all pumped or a a refund. I mean, maybe something on the back end of the deal would have been nice.
Or like you said, upgrading some hey. Can we add, you know, a complimentary reception for your desk or something? I think that works as well. It's just when something goes wrong, you don't hear anything, and it's like, well, you guys aren't gonna that's not gonna be quiet about the whole thing. Right?
You're gonna get the bill. You're gonna be disappointed that the hotel didn't address anything. You're gonna pay for it. But and maybe your vendors seem to be like, okay. No.
No. No. No. No. No.
No. No. No. No. No.
No. No. No. No. No.
No. No. No. No. No.
No. No. No. No. No.
No. No. No. No. No.
No. No. No. No. No.
No. No venues. And and I will say, I did go back and say, you know, and and several of them, like, hey. There were some disaster things that happened, to the point where I was like, I was kind of appalled that I was even parts for some of these things that didn't happen and didn't work. Yeah.
Well, you know what's interesting to me? I think in the day and age that we live in, we pretty much we all have cell phones. We all have a very we're we're very connected. Right. Is what we oh, let me rephrase that.
We have the ability to be very connected because we're not always very connected. Right? And so I I think it's something where all of us as professionals have to be willing to have the conversation. You know what I mean? Because it, I I I I feel like it's weird to use it's not fair, but I can't think of a different way to word it.
But just for conversational purposes, like, it's not fair for where the problem happened to be able to be made up for if it's not addressed, as you said, like, in a timely fashion. If if the person or the company that it happened to waits too long. And and I have another scenario for the flip side of this I wanna bring up in a second too. But, like, if if, let's say it's a a planner or just maybe it's a client direct, maybe a planner is not involved, it's a client direct. If they don't, if they're not then if we don't give them that sense of comfortability, like, hey.
A conversation can be simple. We don't anticipate anything going wrong. But in the unlikely chance you know, I feel like I'm on an airplane. Right? But in an unlikely chance that something does go wrong, I want you to feel comfortable knowing you can reach out to me.
Send me a text. Let me know. Let me know as soon as you can so that we can hopefully fix we would we would prefer to fix it as quickly as it happened. Right? We wanna fix it just as fast as the problem happened.
And so if you're waiting till after the fact and, again, I'm not saying any anybody specifically, but if a client waits till after the fact or if or if the problem doesn't come up until after the fact, then it really does eliminate the ability to fix it. It's a more challenging. It really does. It really does. This happens a lot, though.
I really do. Right? He's afterwards, and it's because you're like, gosh. I just really know. That was fun.
(00:43):
No. Because I could have come up with three other solutions Then the client starts to unload all this. Right. So that's the big question. Right?
That's the big question in all of this. It's like, why doesn't it come up? You know? Start to foster. So it's like it can start with one thing, but then when that's not resolved, it's like, well, now this is an issue.
And this is when maybe it wouldn't, but, like, you've let it, like, accumulate. And then as the planner, you're, like, fuming at the end of So so to this point, in our entertainment company, one of the things that we used to always and and we still kinda do this when we train new people. We would ask quest we would ask this question, which is a little bit of a trick question, but we would say, what is the most important aspect of an event to your client? And they would throw all these different answers out, but that it was like I said, it was kind of a trick question. The answer was whatever you do wrong.
That becomes the most important thing to that. We we didn't care about anything other than blank. And then blank was right? Blank was whatever you did wrong. And then the the next layer of that is what y'all are talking about now.
You know, the client is even more amplified and more unhappy because of this, you know, what you could have fixed in the beginning. It's just amazing. So what can we do to overcome that? And do you think that is on the the vendor, the hotel, the, you know, the partner to say, like, I who who are the right people to let, you know, notify your banquet captain, check-in with your banquet manager? Does the event manager check-in every day?
How's it looking going? It's very, hey. I mean, what communication channel is most appropriate to make your customer feel comfortable knowing, okay. This is the person that I should go to or that I have this line of communication. Yeah.
I don't think you wanna set the tone of like, if anything, it was Right. That's the hard part. Right? Like, you don't you don't wanna, like, plant in the seed in the head of the client that something might go wrong, but it it it's and then it's it's an interesting, like, really pondering over what the answer is because you want those open line of communications, and maybe that's you. And I literally wrote down put my number on the AU because I think if the event manager reaches out to the client and says, here is my cell phone number.
Yeah. Should anything come up, just leave it generic like that. You know? Please reach out to me and let me know so that we can be of assistance. Yeah.
And I think as the they also then need to ask the client for their cell phone number or whoever is going to be the point of contact. I think the vendor should do the same thing. Yes. And I think it's almost one of those things that maybe at the start of a program, the event manager or the vendor text the client. Hey.
Hope everything goes well today. Like, just checking in. Yeah. Let me know if you need anything. And then maybe it's just so, like then they feel like if something goes wrong, you've already been communicating with them that they can say, oh, this just happened.
Oh, let me get right on that for you. Right. A good banquet team, a good AD team. Let me I can ace them so that I have and I know our team's awesome about this and and makes everybody's lives happier because they know that they know exactly who they can be. So if they need something, and it could be proactive.
It's something we're going on. You know, something got delayed or a product didn't come in, or I don't know what could happen. Different things, you know, that be you know, what coming with that. You're gonna wait until, like, see that did you notice that the those particular chips were not on your break? Like, I think our team's really been about being proactive.
So I think proactively notifying. We don't even need to go get some bucks free if they if we need it. So so you could shout out to Sonny Dubasa. I'll make sure you have everything. Well, And, I mean, I think it I think it's important for for everybody involved to realize that, of course, we're all striving for a perfect event.
Of course, we're all striving for, everything to flow smoothly, but we have to we have to make it not so taboo that something could go wrong. I mean, it's just the truth. I mean, anytime you have humans involved, anytime you have technology involved, it's events. Something can go wrong. And and sometimes we feel like we go too far on the end of this expectation of perfection.
Right? Like, yes, we want it, and, yes, nobody I mean, it's it's the most embarrassing thing in the world if you're whatever you are responsible for, whether it's a hotel, whether it's the, you know, whether it's the AV, whether it's even, you know, the the person responsible for the event themselves. Like, nobody wants it to go wrong. That's the last thing you want to have happen. So I think it's just really being being more proactive of, like you said, of the communication, being more understanding of each other and realizing that, hey.
We're in this we're in this together. We're not here to take advantage of you. Lord forbid, not come what if something goes wrong. We wanna get it fixed right away, but we need to know about it right away. We can't fix it right away if we don't know about it right away.
So maybe even that's part of the conversation. I'm just saying, don't be afraid to let us know. Don't don't keep all your notes and then tell us at the end. Like, right away, let's handle. Let's get it out of the way because especially if it's a multiday event, let's say this this situation happened on day one.
You don't want day two and three and whatever ridden by it. Right? You wanna be able to say, hey. It happened. They recovered.
I have confidence. We're gonna have a great next couple of days. Yeah. It's events, and, you know, we we know that things are are changing. Things can go wrong.
So how do we be proactive about it to, you know, quickly overcome and move forward and make it successful? Because you know why? I'm gonna make up a number here, but I would be willing to say eight times out of 10, your guests don't even know something happened. And that's the So point. It's it's, you know, how to yeah.
Things may happen, and, yes, you may know and the planner may know, but, like, most of the time, the guests don't know. So if you can overcome that quickly, it's still a successful event. And I think trying not to harp on, you know, the in the reality at the end of the day, the little things. Now going back to the text message, I kinda started to think about it. I'm really liking this.
(01:04):
Yeah. As I think about it more because if you think of, like, some of your more higher end hotels that you go to now, now they text you. Your concierge text you your ring ready, if you need anything. They check-in with you every day. There's times I text about I normally wouldn't.
You know? I did go about because I don't wanna pick up and fall the front desk or I don't wanna go down to the front desk. But, oh, I got this person I can text and the NASA. I know it's a robot. No.
I know it is. But, you know, if I check back, I'm hoping somebody is going to show a look at it. And it it just kinda made it more inviting to, oh, hey. I really hand fax this back with, I text it back asking if I can have an earlier check-in, you know, of course. So, I think those things, it again, being co opted, it kinda opens that door to make them feel comfortable to reach out.
It makes you feel like you're in it together. I think I think that's what it boils down to. So it makes it feel like you're in it together. You know, going back to your point about, the the audience not necessarily knowing what, you know, things that happen or whatever, this could have really backfired on me a lot, but I'm gonna tell you a quick story. I I I had no, I had a client that we did a multi day event with.
And we have these, like, ear comms that we communicate with each other, and we let the client wear one of the ear comms as well. So that way, she could connect to me very quickly. She was in the room. She was kinda helping out and everything. But I'll just be honest.
Like, there were some things that happened behind the scenes that were problems that we were able to fix behind the scenes, and the audience never knew it happened. She would not even know it happened. But after the fact, she came up and said to me, I was so amazed at how quickly you guys were able to react, fix, change, adapt, do whatever you needed to do. Right? She's she's like, it it was a whole different world to me being able to see that happen and realize the pressure that you all are under to really make this happen for us.
And and I thought it was such a cool experience. Show that Mazda back out on the hotel. Yeah. Well, that was something I That was one of my favorite things, at a WEC we went where you could sign up as a planner to sit back and listen on the headsets to the AV of the full production. And I mean, oh, like, I'm, like, sitting there getting nervous for him.
Like, oh my gosh. There's a lot going on here. So I can imagine in my Just really watch that guy. What's that guy gonna do? Okay.
No. He's gotta go over there. Oh, run back. No. He's moving over.
Alright. Like, we're we're doing all that stuff in behind the scenes, and we're like, hey. If this guy does this and that person does that, then this is what we need to do instead. It's like, it's crazy, but it's it's cool. You say that, like, the back alley of the hotel, like, I totally bat hallway end of day.
Yeah. It's what it takes to close together. I mean, and that's what you've hired all of us for. So, I mean, that is our job, but, I mean, there's a lot that could go wrong. And I love this podcast for that reason, and I think David, he always steer us back to, like, not having any rose colored glasses on.
Of course, we all wanna agree with that. But this is there's so much that could go wrong in an offense, and there likely could be a comp and wrong is not the huge. You know, wrong could be very small, and wrong could be on everyone's end, not just the the service provider, but also on the the planer's end. You know? And that can create a lot of problems for the hotel and vendors.
So I think just the awareness of, like, it's not always going to be completely perfect, you know, and how we partner together to make sure that we overcome these little little things that can happen and move cast them, find a resolution, find a stitch hall, whom you're always talking about on here, and being a good partner. And but you're right. Things are gonna happen, and I love that you say that. Like, we all want it to go well. There's nothing that anyone wants less than anyone to be unhappy.
And, yeah, just as stressful on whoever it's happening to Vex as it is you know, nobody wants that. Well, I I I just one quick point I'm thinking about too is that most of the problems that happen, I think this is I think this is where it becomes such a challenge in the events industry. Almost every and probably on the hotelier side as well, but definitely I know on our side, just about every single problem that happens, you don't have any anticipation time for the problem. Right? So you don't see, like, somebody walking and about to trip over something.
Are you like like, you just you have no no re it's like you almost have no reaction time because it happens in a split second. There's no there's no build out to the problem. Right? And that's the same thing of, like, somebody accidentally dropping a tray or or anything at all. You know what I mean?
Like, it's just it's really interesting that it would be great. Like, I I think about it all the time when it comes to microphones. It'd be great when I knew that somebody was getting ready to walk into a place where it might be a dead zone in the room, and and I could prevent them from doing that. You know? It'd be great if I knew any it would be great if I knew some lady was ten minutes before we're gonna start, we're gonna go back and unplug all of our power to plug her phone in.
Right? Like, I I would be great if I knew yes. It would be great if I knew these things were gonna happen. You know? But the just so stressful.
You know? Because it's really you don't have warning, and that's how you recover. I love what you were saying, like, just going back to if you haven't been to a back hallway, a hotel, it is not a huge area. And there are a lot of people going back and forth on it and a lot of different vendors. And it's like there's there's a going on.
Like, everything has to be coordinated. It's timing. And I've sat in those meetings, like, those DEO meetings where you've got a staff of DEOs, and you're going through it with the client, and they're like, you know what? Change this. Change that.
Then we do this, and it's the day before the event. Right. It's morning up. Changing menus, and you spent all the sun calculating and the time and the plan of how things are gonna go in that back hallway and the timing of when stabbing's gonna come out and this vendor's gonna come out. And just one little thing can completely just derail it all.
And then the whole big operation, the bigger deal that is. You know? So And then y'all are scrambling to get together last minute to figure out we need a new game plan. Well, I think the game changer is really shadowing that. If if I could offer any advice to anybody, it's like shadow the other people that you work with.
(01:25):
Find a time. If you if if you have time in your calendar and you have a good relationship with a hotel or with a AB partner or with a planner partner, and you're like, hey. Look. You know, I'm not really doing anything. Do you have an event coming up that I could come shadow you?
It's it's a whole different world. I mean, just that small explanation I gave of the the lady from the client that was on the headset with us. Like, it totally changed her view of what we do and I think gave her a perspective. She'd never I could try to explain that perspective all day long, but to actually experience it. And and I I try to do it as much as I can.
I I honestly have not done it as much lately as I probably should, but it's something I used to do a lot. And I really just talking about it reminds myself even to get back to doing it. Well and I think even, you know, as a painter, I'd really go, but I've done that before, but, like, do it again. Yeah. Like, keep it fresh in your mind.
Really think about the other vendors and the hoteliers perspective because I know sometimes I'll be like, I forget that when I change that, I'm literally causing them to have a fire drill. Yeah. And when I think about those things and when I have those things fresh in my mind, it also makes it more helpful for me to explain to you know, at the time if it's my boss or it's my client, like, hey. I really know like, how important is this change? Yep.
Because I know this is something that you would like to have, but just for contacts, this is what it's possibly potentially gonna do to the hotel or the vendor. And are you is it that important that you're willing to take that risk? Yeah. And a lot of times, then they say, no. You know what?
No. Let's just keep it the way it is. But it gives you more ammo to be like, that I I think I say that a lot, like ammo. Like, to make sure you, you know, have the knowledge and and educate yourself so that you have that ammo to have this. Yeah.
So he's gonna say another you know, he can't go, you know, shout out at other people. I think when you're in the then your own event, you know, be more aware of what's going on and and really listening and learning and but most surround yourself with people. Like, the reason why I know a lot about some of the AD shuttles is because I you shared them and, you know, again, surrounding myself in a professional organization with people that do these roles. So anyways, you know, I I know that I'm better at my job because of my relationships with friends that are winners. Because I hear you talk about different things that you experience at hotels, and I think you could say the same about, you know, understanding the hotel side of things a little bit more.
So surrounding yourself with your professional network that is not just your own profession, that is is also the people that Yeah. No. That's a great point. Like like, working at, you know, or being, you know, being a part of MPI allows us to have these healthy conversations. And it's something that, you know, if if you're listening and you're part of an organization, if if it's not happening, like, be the person to spearhead those conversations and just always remembering that it's supposed to be done in a healthy way.
It's supposed to be done in a way where everybody in the conversations wins. It's not it's not a it's a very selfless conversation, not a selfish conversation because it gives you the ability to understand. And to your point earlier about even if you've done it before, also remembering that each venue and each service provider is going to do things a little bit differently. You've learned something new on the way. Yeah.
I think this has been a a great conversation, and I think, you know, it's something that can continue to happen and evolve, and I hope it continues in the industry in general. Just, you know, shadow, get in front, of things. How about open communication? Look at your network. These are all, I think, great tools to make all of us, not deaf painters, but also suppliers and health book polliers that are a net professional.
We're a professional. Well, thank you for joining us today on Event Therapy Podcast, and we hope you follow us on social at Event Therapy Podcast, and we'll catch you at the next event.
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