Episode Transcript
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(00:00):
Hi, I'm Parag
Amin. Welcome
to my podcast
from crisis
to justice.
As a lawyer
and
entrepreneur,
I'm
passionate
about helping
small
business
owners
successfully
navigate
situations
that
can kill a
business. As
a kid, I
watched my
dad's dreams
of being an
entrepreneur
destroyed
by an
unethical
businessman.
And I don't
want that to
happen to you
(00:20):
or your
family.
That's why I
started my
law firm. I
want to
protect and
defend
business
owners
and their
legacies from
crisis.
Welcome to
from crisis
to justice.
Welcome back
everyone to
the from
crisis to
justice
podcast. I'm
your host,
Parag Amin.
I'm joined by
(00:41):
a very
special guest
here today,
David A
Perez. He's
been quoted
or seen on
numerous
publications
such as CBS,
entrepreneur
and business
insider for
his
expertise on
tax. David is
a top tax
strategist
known for
helping high
income
earners
reduce or
eliminate
their tax
liability by
(01:01):
implementing
advanced tax
strategies so
they can use
their tax
savings
to invest in
assets like
real estate.
He's
passionate
about helping
his
clients join
the elite 3%
of taxpayers
who make over
$200,000 and
pay $0 in
federal
taxes.
Welcome,
David.
Thank you so
much for
being on
today.
What's up, my
(01:22):
man? That was
a great
intro. I
appreciate
you having
me. How you
doing?
I'm doing
great. I'm
doing great.
So what
brought you
and got you
into the
area that
you're in
now, David?
The tax you
mean? How did
I get there?
You know, I
didn't grow
up like most
people would
think
thinking I
was gonna be
a tax guy or
I love
numbers or an
accountant or
any of
(01:42):
those things.
In fact, it
was kind of
like the
opposite. I
didn't like
math. I
didn't
really like a
lot of things
about
finance. But
in 2006, I
got my real
estate
license.
And I was
pursuing a
career in
becoming a
very
successful
realtor. But
I mean,
everybody
gets into it
to be a very
successful
realtor. And
I was in my
20s trying to
(02:03):
figure
out life
and you know,
about a year
and a half
in, I started
to find a
groove and
then the
market
starts to
tank. And I,
you know, as
not a very
well
established
realtor, and
I was still
a lot very
immature, I,
I didn't have an
established
client base,
I didn't have
a very
good network.
So I didn't
really
succeed in
that in that
(02:23):
endeavor. And
so when I was
trying
to find
something
else to do
with my life,
a buddy of
mine
introduced me
into the tax
preparation
industry and
introduced it
to me as
like, hey, an
opportunity
to have a
job and maybe
partner with
him. But I
wasn't
relatively
excited about
it until I
kind of
put a lot of
thought
together. And
I thought
this could be
a good
business. And
it wasn't
again,
(02:43):
because I
like taxes or
finance, it
was more so
because at
the time I
was
experiencing
the recession
and taxes
seem to be
recession
proof. So I,
I said, you
know, this is
there's
something
here. And so
I entered
into the
industry in
my first
year, I
realized that
I had a
passion for
it. And it
was again, it
wasn't I
wasn't a
passion for
(03:03):
numbers,
it was a
passion for
people. And I
loved
learning
about
people's
unique
situations,
how they
made money,
how they
invested
money, how
they blew
their money,
and you know,
how they
pay taxes.
And it was
very
interesting
to learn just
the
structures
that
were going
on around me
that I never
was exposed
to. Because I
(03:23):
grew up
relatively
poor, my
parents
didn't have a
lot of money.
So I didn't,
you know, I
didn't see
any of their
tax returns,
we didn't
talk about
finance. So
this was all
new to me.
And so in
that
first year,
I made a
decision that
this was
gonna be my
career. And
that was in
2008. And as
I pursued
that career,
I became one
of the
biggest or
largest tax
preparers in
the state of
Texas,
we were
preparing
about 7000
(03:44):
tax returns
on an annual
basis of 7000
customers.
And, and
I really grew
that
business, I
loved it.
And, you
know, in
2015, I was
filing my own
personal
tax return.
And as I was
entering
everything
into the damn
software, I
call it
the damn
software
because you
know,
software
never works.
And I sit
putting it in
the bottom.
And I see on
page two of
the 1040,
where it says
how much you
(04:04):
owe or how
much
you're going
to get into
refund, as I
was entering
in my
documents and
stuff, and my
profit and
loss
statements
and all those
things, you
know, my, the
number kept
on
growing. And
it finally
stopped at
142,000
bucks. And so
I'm sitting
there looking
at my
software,
like what the
f right, a
guy who is in
the tax
industry,
looking at
(04:24):
his own tax
return,
and realizing
that I didn't
know jack
shit about
taxes, like I
just realized
that in
that moment.
So I said,
Oh, what's
the best
thing I could
do? So I
mean, next
best thing
is to find
somebody who
could help
me. So I went
over to a
mentor of
mine,
who was a
very successful
CPA. And I
went to him
and I said,
Hey, man, I
need some
help. And I
shared with
him all of my
documents and
(04:45):
my tax
return. And,
and he came
to the same
conclusion.
And, you
know, as I'm
there sitting
down, I'm
like, dude,
you're
successful.
You know
what you're
doing. Tell
me how I can
get rid of
this bill.
And he looks
at me and
he says,
you know,
David,
there's no
way to do
that. And I
said, you
know, why
not? And
he goes,
you failed to
plan. And I
said, okay, I
can agree
there, but
there's got
to be a way.
I said, all
these very
successful
billionaires,
(05:05):
the Donald
Trump's of
the world,
they seem
to find ways.
Why can't I
find a way? I
mean, and he
says to me,
David, that's
just not
how it is.
And you
should be so
lucky because
you know, you
made money
and when
you make
money, you're
supposed to
pay your tax.
And as I'm
sitting there
contemplating
this idea,
like I'm
supposed to
write, I
challenge
him. I'm
like, there's
got to be a
way. There's
something to
do here. Like
(05:25):
I know people
avoid taxes,
you're smart,
help me. And
he just
looks at me
and he says,
David, if you
don't pay
your taxes,
you shouldn't
have
the right
to vote. And,
you know,
this was a
guy I looked
up to. So,
you know, I
finally just,
you know,
I backed down
and I said,
okay, I will
agree here to
disagree, but
I will
agree. And I
walked out of
that office
with my tail
between my
(05:46):
legs. And I
vowed that
day to
never let
that ever
happen to me
again. And I
said, I'm
not, I'm not
going to
allow
this to be
my future.
And so over
the course of
the next five
years, up
until about
2020, I just
studied
the tax code
to find
solutions for
me because as
a, as a tax
professional,
you know,
there's
tax preparers
and there's
CPAs and
(06:06):
there's
accountants,
there's all
these
different
titles.
But just to
be clear, the
majority of
them are just
their data
entry people
were
historians.
And so I was
doing a lot
of historian
work. I was
preparing
returns, but
I was
preparing
for people
who didn't
have a tax
problem. They
just got it
either a
freaking
refund,
which always
pissed me off
because I'm
like, they're
getting money
back and I
paid all
that effing
money. And,
uh, or they
(06:27):
didn't have
a, you know,
they didn't
have a
big tax
bill, so I
couldn't help
them. So I
was just
helping
myself. And
so five years
into this
journey, I,
I, I figure
out a formula
that I can
use for
myself,
investing in
different
asset classes
that give me
tax waiver
benefits,
structuring
my entities
the right
way. And,
uh, you know,
I was doing
it for me to
win. And in
2020, when
the world
kind of
shifted
(06:47):
and everything
had to go
virtual, my
business had
to shift
because the
majority of
my clients
came into my
office and
shook my
hand. Well,
we couldn't
do that
anymore. And
the way I
was getting
new business
was, you
know, going
out and
shaking
hands. I was
more of a
network
guy in my
community. I
was known in
the
community, by
the way, as
the tax guy.
When I
realized
I had to
pivot, I
pivoted to
online. I
started a
market to
different
people. One
of my
marketing
pieces was
(07:07):
I'll help you
with your PPP
and EIDLs and
SBA, this and
SBA, that,
which was
a big deal at
that time.
And I started
to meet
people from
all over the
country
because
most of my
clients were
down here in
Texas. And
now I was
like meeting
people in different
places in
Florida and
Alabama and
California.
And anyways,
so one guy
reaches
out to me
in March, one
of my first
clients and
says, Hey, I
need some
help. So I
(07:27):
get on a zoom
call with him
and he shares
with me his
information
so I could
help him with
the
application.
And I'm
looking at
his tax
return and I
realized this
guy owed a
hundred
grand.
And I said,
did you owe
this
consecutively?
So I looked
at the last
three years,
he'd be
paying a
hundred
grand. And I
said, you
know what,
bro, if you
don't mind,
can I just
look at
these returns
really
quickly? And
as I started
to scope
through these
returns, I
realized
that this guy
(07:47):
was just
severely
overpaying.
He's paying
50,000 more
than he
needed to
pay. And I
didn't even
know it at
the time.
Like this was
just
something I
just knew
second
hand, I had
figured this
out, but I
didn't even
know it. And
so as I'm
reviewing it,
I'm like,
Hey, can I
help you? And
he says,
yeah, help
me. And then
I like,
okay, let's
do this.
Let's do
this. And
then I said,
let's, let's
figure this
out. And at
(08:08):
the end, he's
just like,
dude, you
should just
like do this.
And I'm like,
you're right. Like
he's asked
me, do you do
this every
day? I was
like,
actually, I
don't get to
do this
every day.
So but what
if I could do
this every
day? And it
was like more
of like an
epiphany. The
guy I was
looking for
in 2015, was
the guy I was
that day. And
I just had
built these
unique skill
sets, not
only to save
taxes, but I
(08:29):
had built,
you know,
seven figure
multi seven
figure tax
practice, I
had managed
hundreds of
employees, I,
I've
leveraged and
borrowed
money from
institutions,
we had
multiple real
estate. At
that time, we
probably had
a probably a
two or three
million
dollar real
estate
portfolio
today. It's
it's over
eight
figures. Like
we I learned
a lot of
these things,
because I
went through
them. And now
(08:49):
today, that's
all I do is I
help high
income
earners or
high
achievers
like you who
are like, you
know, screw
this, I'm not
supporting
Ukraine,
I'm not
supporting
the the shit
they're
telling me
about like,
and it's not
because I'm
trying to
get
political,
it's like,
you see where
the dollars
go. The only
people who
are
supporting
those things
are the
people who
don't pay
taxes.
Because if
they did,
they would
say,
screw that
I'm not
giving my
money to
anybody.
(09:09):
Like, I
worked hard,
at least let
me pick where
it can go,
right? Like,
let me decide
which, which
institution
should
receive this
funds,
because if
I'm going
to give it
away, okay,
cool. I'm not
against
giving tax
dollars to
the
government, I
just
want to have
more control.
And if I can
give, if I
can make it
so it's not
so much, then
that's my
right. And I
believe it's
our right not
to pay tax.
(09:30):
Listen, I
love that. I
love that.
And I agree
with you as
it relates to
supporting
these wars, I
think the
people
supporting
them are the
ones
profiting off
of supporting
it. So right.
So let me ask
you this, you
said you grew
up relatively
poor. Now,
obviously,
you're very
successful,
you work with
very
successful
entrepreneurs.
What was that
journey like?
Like, what
was what was
(09:50):
childhood
like for you
growing up
being poor?
And what was
that
lifestyle
like? And
then what is
that journey
been like?
Great, great
question. So
I was born
1983 puts me
40 years old,
you know, in
the 80s. You
know, there
was an
internet
technology
and all
these things.
And so I was
born to two,
two young
parents, my
mom was 17
(10:11):
years old
when she
had me.
And at birth,
the doctors
told my
mother that I
was going to
be a special
kid. And he
really meant
that. And the
reason he
meant that is
because I am
Mexican, both
of my parents
are Mexican,
they're
brown, and
I'm white. So
when I was
born, they
diagnosed me
with a
condition
called
albinism,
(10:31):
which means I
lack
pigmentation
in my skin
sensitive to
light, that's
just how I
was born.
And so the
doctor tells
my mom at 17,
she says,
Hey, says,
Hey, she's
going to be a
special kid,
a special
needs kid.
And so that
was the
label. And so
my mother
raised me for
about a
year and
realized that
I, you know,
raising a
special needs
kid
apparently
(10:51):
was very
hard. And so
my
grandparents
took me under
their care
and they
raised me, I
was in
special ed
classes at
the age of
three,
I was treated
as a special
eds or
special needs
kid all my
life, you
know, I had a
relatively
good
life, you
know, we
weren't dirt
poor. But you
know, we
didn't have a
lot of money,
never
ate out,
never took a
vacation,
didn't get
toys, didn't
get perks,
none of that
(11:11):
stuff. Like
I, I can
literally
tell you that
we never took
a vacation
ever because
we couldn't
afford it. We
never ever
ate out
because we
couldn't
afford it.
Like never.
And so my
grandparents
raised me, I
grew up
in a great
school system
that, you
know,
supported me.
I never
really saw
myself as a
special
needs kid,
but I mean, I
(11:31):
was okay,
that's what
they treated
me like. And
so I got
bullied
because of my
looks,
because I was
the widest
kid in
school. And
but I got
coddled by
the teachers
and my
family,
which was
cool, right?
So it was
like this pro
and con
relationship
all my life.
And so I
grew up
until about
the age of
16. I come
home from
school, you
know, it was
just regular
school day,
come home
from school.
And there's
(11:51):
two gentlemen
sitting in
the in the
living room
with my
parents.
And these are my
grandparents,
but they're
my parents.
And so they
asked me to
sit down,
they asked me
to sit down,
I sit down
and they
asked me a
group of
questions.
And
they're just
like asking
me about my
medical
history. And
they're
asking me
about my
conditions.
And so I,
I answer all
these
questions.
And then at
the end of the
questioning,
I said,
What's this
all about?
(12:12):
And the guy
looks over at
me and he
says, This is
for life
insurance.
And I, you
know, I said,
Okay,
whatever.
And, you
know, I
didn't want I
was kind of
shy and
timid. I
mean, I was
trained like
that all my
life. I mean,
I was, I was
kind of
bullied and
picked on. So
I just I was
a shy kid.
So I go to my
bedroom. And
later that
night, I run
into my mom
and in the
kitchen. And
I say, Mom,
what's what's
(12:32):
this all
about? And
she tells me,
David, you
know, we
wanted to get
a life
insurance
policy on
you. Because
in the event
of something
happening to
us, because
they're my
grandparents,
are a little
older. We
want somebody
to have, you
know,
something to
fall back on.
She didn't
say it
in those
words. But
basically,
what she was
trying to
tell me is,
somebody's
gonna take
care of you.
And we want
to give them
this as a
gift. And,
(12:53):
you know, at
that point in
my life, I had
never felt
like I was a
burden or
dependent, or
that somebody
had to take
care of me, I
had never
felt this way
in my life.
And in that
moment, I
did. And it
was a wake up
call for me.
And it was
kind of
like a
an eye
opening
experience
that made me
believe that
I was not put
on this earth
to be a
dependent.
(13:15):
And so on
that moment
in time, I
made a
decision to
be an
independent
person that I
was not going
to have a
label put on
me and that I
wasn't going
to stay and
be this, you
know, kid
that
depending
on his
parents or
the school
system or
some sort of
disability,
anything, I
just, I
didn't
want that.
And so it was
like, it was
like, I was
born again.
And at 16
years old, I
made these
(13:35):
changes in my
life mentally
to become an
independent
person, which
kind of led
me in some
negative
paths. I
mean, you
know, like
you hang out
the wrong
people who do
the wrong
things, but
it was me
trying to
find myself,
you know, my
career really
didn't begin
till about,
you know,
maybe, you
know, I
went to
college for a
year and I
failed
everything.
And then I
went to
another
college and I
you know,
I went I
(13:55):
pursued my
degree, but
along the
way, I was
just trying
my best to
figure
things out.
That's when I
got my
license to be
a real estate
agent, you
know,
becoming a
real estate
agent was
one of the
most exciting
things for
me, because
it was really
independence,
because I
believe
independence
is really
business
ownership,
it's
entrepreneurialism
at some
level. And so
I became
an
independent
contractor,
which was
exciting. And
then to have
that
shattered in
a year
(14:15):
and a half
kind of
sucked. But
but one thing
I picked up,
and this
will, this is
kind of like
the second
epiphany in
my life is
when I was
doing all the
networking
for real
estate, you
know, I was
always
shy and a
tibid guy,
like I'm
always the
guy I was the
guy that
would just
kind of walk
into a room
and go sit by
himself. You
know, I tried
to network,
but I was
more
networking
with people I
knew not
people I
didn't know
that was just
that guy. And
(14:36):
so one event
of going to
this network
event for
real estate
agents, and I
walked in and
I had done a
bunch of
these events
in the past,
but I just
went to this
one. And I
walked in and
as soon as I
walked in, like
everybody
was like,
Hey, David,
hey, David,
hey, David.
And I was
just like,
everybody
knows me
here. This is
weird,
but I
couldn't
remember
them. That's
the weird
part. Like I
couldn't
remember
(14:56):
them,
but they
remembered
me. And so
like later on
the afternoon
or later in
that party,
I'm having a
few drinks
with people.
And people
just kept on
always coming
by David, how
you doing,
David, David,
David. And I
learned that
night I go
home and I'm
like, man, I
didn't know
half of those
fucking
people. Like
how did they
know me? And,
you know, it
dawned on me
in that
moment that
the reason
they knew me
is because I
looked
different.
(15:16):
And you can't
forget me is
kind of what
I thought.
I was like,
they couldn't
forget me.
And, you
know, the one
thing that I
was always
shy and
timid about
is my looks, my
appearance.
Like I really
was because I
looked
different
compared
to all the
people that I
grew up
around. In
that moment,
I realized
the thing
that was
really the
most
different
about me was
the one thing
that I had a
competitive
advantage on,
because
in the
marketplace,
the thing is
(15:37):
to look
different.
The thing is
to be
different,
because you
got to pay
to do that,
right? You
got to be
louder. You
got to be
crazier. You
got to be,
you got to
stand out
somehow
because your
competition
is going to
look the
same. If you
look the
same, right?
You can't
compete
against
somebody that
you just
can't look
like, right?
So I use this
as my
competitive
advantage.
Like I just
became, I
embraced it.
I said, you
know what,
the
appearance
that I didn't
like, this is
(15:57):
who I am. And
you know,
fuck it,
you're going
to remember
me forever.
You're just
going to
remember my
ass. And so
it was
another
epiphany for
me. And, you
know, my
journey is
kind of taken
off from
there. I've
read a few
books about
like, just
this concept
of going and
building
something
that's
independent
of yourself
called
building your
own economy.
I've
opened to
several
companies
from real
(16:17):
estate to
tax. We got a
mortgage
company.
We've done
several
things, but
I'm really
passionate
about sharing
where I've
been. That's
important
because I
have
had a lot
of epiphanies
along the
way. But what
I'm more
passionate
about is
helping
people get to
another
level. And
that starts
with the
foundation of
finance,
because as
much as we
want to
(16:37):
talk about
everything
else other
than health,
it's the most
primary
thing. Yeah,
I love that.
I love that
story.
I love
everything
about that, the
resilience, the
difficulty
I'm sure you
faced
of being
underestimated
and making
the decision
to use what
other
perceived as
a weakness
and turn it
into your
superpower.
(16:57):
That's
incredible.
So let me ask
you this. I
mean,
obviously,
you were
faced with
adversity
at a very
young age,
because of
just the way
you look and
other people
look
differently
than you.
And so you're
bullied. And
you go
through that.
Now, I'm sure
that the
challenges
didn't stop
there.
Meaning you
decide to
start your
own business,
(17:19):
you're
involved in
advising
clients
on taxes,
you've also
got your own
real estate
company and
business. And
I'm sure
you've taken
some knocks
along the
way, maybe
some legal
knocks too.
Could you
tell us a
little bit
about
that and
how you found
your way
through that?
I got into
business for
myself as a
real estate
agent. But
my second
business,
which I
rarely talk
(17:39):
about was a
bar. And I
got into the
bar business
because
what I
learned as a
realtor, and
in that
process of
spreading my
wings and
becoming
independent
is
you have to
have a
network and
you got to
know the
right people.
I figured
that out at
an early age.
Now, I didn't
always know
the best
people, but I
(17:59):
knew that if
I was going
to go to a
place,
I wanted to
meet the
owner, I
wanted to
meet the
manager, I
wanted to
connect with
the right
people. I've
always known
that's a big
deal. My dad,
which is my
grandfather
who's
passed away,
but in his
early career,
he was more
of a banker.
And it wasn't
like a
banker-banker,
more like
these small
finance
companies. So
it wasn't
like a big
role, but he
(18:20):
ran a little
finance
company.
Didn't make a
lot of money,
but if I ever
saw him, he
knew so many
people. And he'd
always shake
their hand.
He goes, "Oh,
that guy's
the manager
here." And
this guy, he
would tell me
these things
as a young
kid. So when
I grew up, I
felt like
that is
something you
should do.
And so
anytime
I'd meet
people, I'd
introduce
myself. And
if I knew
they were the
owner, I'd
always
make it a
point to try
to connect.
(18:41):
And so I
connected
with the
owner of a
local bar. We
became
really good
friends right
when I was a
real estate
agent. I'd go
there and I
liked to
drink. I was
in my 20s,
so that was
cool. And so
I'd hang out
with him. And
then one
night
after...
Actually,
I'll tell
you this
story just so
everybody can
get this. I
would always
go every
night. I was
a local
there.
And at the
(19:01):
end of the
night, which
was like two
in the
morning or
12, whatever
time we'd
close,
I would
actually help
this guy
clean up and
stuff. He was
a manager,
owner,
janitor,
everything.
That's who I
was. I would
just help. So
I'd throw out
the trash
every night
with him and
I'd sweep
up and I'd do
cool stuff.
And so one
night we're
sitting there
after hours
just having a
beer. And
he's like,
"Hey man, I
need to get
out of this
business."
And I said,
(19:21):
"Okay, well,
why? I love
this place.
It seems like
you're making
money. Do I
need to spend
more money?
Do we need to
promote?"
And he's
like, "No,
man, I'm just
having some
challenges
with my wife
and some
other things.
And I need to
sell." And I
said, "Do you
have a
buyer?" I
didn't know a
lot. He's
like, "No."
And he's
like, "How
about you buy
it?" And I
was like,
"I'm here on
the dollar
beer
nights, bro.
(19:41):
You know I
don't make
fucking money
is basically
what I was
telling him."
And he's
just like,
"Nah, man,
you're a good
guy and you
helped me and
I know you
wouldn't let
this place
down."
He's like,
"I'd be
willing to
finance this
for you." And
I said,
"Yeah, but I
still
don't have
money." He
goes, "Look,
this is what
I'll do." And
it took like
two or three
days. And he
came to me,
he says,
"Look, I'll
leave you the
money in the
(20:02):
till. That
night,
whatever, I'm
going to give you
the night.
I'm going to
transition
this business
to you. I'm
going to let
you make as
much money as
you can.
Promote the
shit out of
it, make a
bunch of
money,
because
that's going
to be your
starting
fund." That's
how he
started me.
He let me
sell and he
gave me the
product and
he goes, he
gave me a
kind of a
payment plan
to give him
money back
and that's
what we did.
Now, the
reason I'm
sharing
this story is
not because I
(20:22):
want to talk
about the
bar, but it
was a crazy,
amazing,
exciting,
overwhelming,
stressful,
inebriated
experience.
About a year
into that
experience,
I'm sitting,
I'm in the
bar during
the day on
like a
weekday, I'm
cleaning and
(20:43):
a lady comes
in and
she says,
"Are you
David
Pettis?" And
I said, "Yes,
ma'am." And
she goes,
"Here you
go." And she
served me
with papers.
Here we go.
First legal
experience of
my life.
Serves me
with papers
that I
was being
sued because
one night a
guy at the
bar decides
to get his
ass kicked.
(21:06):
And it wasn't
even in
the bar.
He gets his
ass kicked by
the road,
which is
literally 100
yards away
and he gets
his ass
kicked. And
apparently,
he was in the
bar, he
leaves the
bar talking
shit to
everybody. Some
guys follow
him, take him
into the
parking lot
and whoop his
ass. "Well, I
got served
with a
lawsuit
for a guy who
gets his ass
kicked."
Anyway, so
(21:26):
I've never
ended this
before, so I
don't
respond. I'm
like, "Fuck
these guys."
And I had
never done
this, so I
was immature.
So another
letter
comes and
then gets
served again
and it's
finally like,
"Oh shit,
this is
serious."
Now,
fortunate
for me,
I had
insurance. So
I filed a
claim with my
insurance. I
had
liability,
liquor
liabilities,
which you
required in
the state of
Texas. Liquor
viability
takes in
(21:46):
place. And
then I go
through
these formal
proceedings
of
depositions
and
discoveries
and all that.
It was
crazy. Now,
what I
learned along
the way, I
learned very
young that
anybody can
file a
fucking
lawsuit.
That was
stupid.
Number two,
lawyers will
charge any
amount of
money to make
money.
Sorry, bro.
I learned
(22:07):
that the
legal system
is designed
to settle and
not to be
right. It's
just designed
to settle.
It's never
designed to
actually win
because it's
never
favorable if
anybody
can win
because the
only person
that wins in
a lawsuit,
everybody
knows this,
is the
attorneys.
That's
the only
people that
really win
because the
fees go to
the attorneys
no matter
(22:27):
what and no
matter
who
somebody's
going to win,
somebody's
going to
lose. And
even if they
win, the
attorney gets
paid. And
even if they
lose, the
attorney gets
paid. So good
luck. I
learned a lot
about
lawsuits
in this
experience.
It took about
three years
to settle
that suit, by
the way, of
back
and forth
depositions,
back and
forth
interviews. I
actually met
the guy face
to face. I
was like,
bro, I've
never seen
you. I don't
know you. You
(22:47):
weren't even
on my
property. His
claim was
that we
didn't have
addicts quit
security at
the door,
which was
about a
hundred yards
away. It was
so dumb. We
ended up
settling with
the guy. Well, I
didn't pay
anything. I
just paid my
insurance
policy, but I
think he got
80 grand of
which I have
no clue how
much he
actually
kept. Because
the lawyer
probably got
a good
percentage of
that, but I
had to go to
(23:07):
three years
of court
hearings for
no
reason. And
of course,
I've been in
a lot of
things, the
state of
Texas for the
city I was
in. I got
cited and
fined for
signs a few
times that I
had to go to
court. I had
a warrant for
my arrest. I
was on
the media and
the news
because these
guys were
trying to
shut down
my... I've
(23:27):
been in
all kinds
of crazy
stuff, bro,
because I'm
very loud and
aggressive in
business. And
well, that's
what it
is. Now,
fortunate for
me, by the
way,
everybody
who's
watching this
fortunate for
me,
I've never
been in a
negative
situation
with the IRS.
I've never
been in an
auto with the
IRS that
didn't
get settled
and was
favorable for
us. I've
never been in
a situation
(23:48):
where we've
had
criminal or
any
proceedings
brought upon
me because
everything
has just been
civil from a
litigation
standpoint.
I've never
really been
in really big
lawsuits
other than
that. Yeah,
yeah, I hear
you. Okay.
Well, I
didn't want
to interrupt
the flow
there. But I
got to
disagree with
some of the
stuff you
said, as you
probably
expected me
to. Yeah,
yeah. I mean,
listen, my
clients win,
but I will
(24:08):
say this.
You know, I
understand
that. I will
say that I
understand
that that
perspective
of lawyers,
a lot of
people tend
to have that
negative view
and
stereotype of
lawyers,
because,
you know,
at the end of
the day, I
think great
lawyers
looking out
for their
clients and
what's in the
client's best
interest. And
so for
example, the
way we
litigate
cases at my
firm is we
look at the
ROI, the
return on
(24:28):
investment
that a
client's
going to get
in terms of
what they
paid in
legal fees
versus what
they're
actually
going to
recover. So
we're looking
at cases
where it's
like 2x, 4x,
10x, 20x,
what their
attorneys
fees were.
So, you know,
not literally
every case
works out
that way.
But what's
that? If they
win. Yeah,
that's right.
That's right.
Yeah. Well,
or, you know, I mean,
(24:48):
to your
point, most
cases do
settle. At
some point,
they do
settle. And
at what point
you're
not, I don't
actually
believe that
all lawyers
this way. I
would just
say that it's
probably
skewed.
If I had to
guess, it's
probably 80
20, 20% of
the lawyers
are out there
like you who
care and
present a
really nice
proposal and
say, Hey,
(25:09):
this is the
return on
investment.
This is
what we're
trying to do.
Like, it's
probably go
through a
whole really
good process.
I think 80%
of them
are not this
way. That's
just my
belief
system. Am I
am I am I?
What would
you say?
Well, listen,
I don't know
about the
stats on
this. But I
will say
this, I think
here's the
common thread
between
both of us is
you started
your business
as a solution
(25:30):
for yourself.
Yes. Like,
like you were
the solution
you were
looking for.
So you wanted
to provide
that service.
So just a
brief
background
about me. The
reason I went
into law in
the first
place is when
I was a kid,
my parents
had
immigrated
to the United
States from
India. And my
dad wanted to
be an
entrepreneur,
he wanted
to be an
investor. And
he had
invested his
life savings
in the store
(25:50):
in Florida.
So he moved
my
family from
New York,
where I was
born down to
Florida. And
he and my mom
are working
60 7080 hours
a week,
trying to
make this
store
successful,
trying to get
a piece of
the American
dream. Two
years after
he bought the
store, the
taxing
authority
comes
knocking. And
they're like,
Listen, you
owe over
$200,000 in
unpaid sales
tax. He's
(26:10):
like, that
doesn't make
sense. We
paid
ourselves.
Here's
what he
didn't know.
The guy
before him
hadn't paid
his sales
taxes. And my
dad had
bought the
entity the
company that
owned the
store. So
he'd also
bought the
liabilities.
And so the
taxing
authority
doesn't care
about any of
that. Their
position is
look, I asked
her shut it
down. So my
dad had to
make the
tough
decision of
shutting it
(26:30):
down. So I
decided at a
relatively
young age,
I didn't want
that to
happen to me
or my family
again. And I
didn't want
that to
happen
to other
people. So so
I started the
firm with
that idea
that that
solution that
I was looking
for that I
hope my dad
had back when
he got taken
advantage of.
So I don't
want that to
happen
to other
businesses.
Is that so
what's your
primary
litigation?
(26:51):
You're in
litigation?
Is that what
it is? Yeah,
that's right.
Business
disputes,
partnership
disputes
litigation,
although
we do
deal with pre
litigation
disputes,
meaning
before the
lawsuit is
filed, it
does come in,
but it's a
rare breed. Usually
people come
to us once
the lawsuits
already been
filed. Hey,
man,
proactive
or real
active?
Everybody's
reactive,
right? That's
yeah. But by
(27:12):
the way, what
you're
saying is,
is a very
good
testament to
the degree of
which we
always pursue
the things
that we want
to solve
problems for.
And, you
know, I
thoroughly
agree with
you that that
taking from
and the
reason I
use the
status
because I've
encountered a
lot of
attorneys
over the
course of my
career.
I mean,
I have an
attorney
right now,
which I just
feel like
just builds
me all the
time. Do I
feel like
there's value
(27:32):
behind it?
100% like but
I you know, I
just hate
seeing bills
all the time.
I just hate
it, right?
It's, I think
do I think
attorneys do
get a bad rap
just because
there are
a lot of bad
ones. That's
what I mean.
And I don't
mean that to
disrespect
you or your
profession. I
just feel
like there's
probably a
lot more
people out
there that
are just
about money
than they are
about winning
or success
for their
(27:52):
clients. And
it sounds
like you're
doing a
great job.
Yeah, I
appreciate
that. I
appreciate
that. I mean,
because I
think you and
I both
measure our
success with
like the
success of
our
respective
clients, you
know, at a
certain
point,
there's
only so much
money you can
use. And you
know, it
really has to
be about
something
more than
than the
financials of
it, it really
ends up being
like the
success of
clients. And
if you're
doing a great
job for them,
(28:13):
at least that
that's been
really my
metric. That
that's
exactly
right.
You know, in
the in the in
the legal
world, what
I've
encountered
in
partnerships
and
relationships
and things is
that along
the way,
proactive is
better than
reactive. And
a very few
people are
proactive in
this sense.
Most
partnerships,
you know, are
started
without
really good
operating
agreements,
maybe not
even an
operating
(28:33):
agreement
that these
days, right.
I think a lot
of people
were pursuing
their self
service tools
like in our
tax industry.
And in 2015
was a big
shift,
because there
was this big
push for like
online filing
with with
different
providers.
I'm pretty
confident in
legal firms
to that was
the the
what's the
big legal
firm online
or
(28:53):
legal zone.
Yeah, when
legal zoom
started, I'm
sure every
attorney in
the country
was like,
screw this,
this is
stupid. And
only because
self service
gets you what
you paid for,
right. And a
lot of people
don't see the
value in
those things.
Like I
believe
attorneys
need to be
there for
those
type of legal
documents. I
believe
attorneys
have a great
role for
business
owners across
this country.
(29:14):
And the
things that
we do from a
tax
perspective,
all are maybe
don't require
an attorney,
a full
blown out
like
attorney, but
they do
require legal
structures
that need to
be reviewed
or audited or
presented
through an
attorney. You
know, all of
our clients
are
recommended
to have an
attorney on
council.
I believe
there's a
board of
advisors that
everybody
needs you
need. You
definitely
need
a pastor, you
(29:34):
definitely
need a
partner, you
definitely
need an
attorney, you
need a
financial
advisor, you
definitely
need a doctor
on there,
right. And
you need a
tax
strategist,
you need
those people
in your
corner, if
you don't
have those
people,
that's that's
kind of like
your board
of advisors.
And if you
got those
people, which
a great
attorney is
part of that,
you've got a
great,
great team
(29:55):
that could
get you
through
anything.
Yeah, that's
great advice.
So what
are your
thoughts on
this, David?
How do you
get or how do
you or your
clients get
all of those
advisors is
on the same
page? Do you
recommend
that the
listeners
hire each one
of these
experts?
And then is
there is
there like a
group
meeting? How
do you make
sure that
your clients
are on
the same page
or their
advisors are
on the same
page as you
(30:15):
are? Well,
you know, I
don't
necessarily
believe you
need to have
some formal
board
meeting,
although that
can happen. I
think you've
got to
pay all of
them. Number
one, that's
for sure. You
never as much
as I'd like
to say that
like for an
example, my
doctor for an
example, I
believe
that's a
foundational
piece, by the
way,
nobody will
include that
in a board of
advisors, I
need a
doctor,
(30:36):
right? Like
my doctor,
they get a
they get
it. He makes
he makes over
five figures
for me every
year. Okay.
And that's
that's not
insurance,
that's paid.
And because I
don't I mean,
I don't I
don't I don't
really
necessarily
want to I don't
need
insurance. I
mean, we do
have some
insurance.
You know what
I mean? Like,
I don't want
to pay him
through an
insurance. I
want him to
know that I'm
committed to
him. So
whenever I
make
the phone
call at two
in the
morning, two
(30:56):
in the
afternoon or
seven in the
morning, he's
going to
answer that
call. But
what I'm
trying to say
is like, that
guy doesn't
necessarily
need to
engage with
my banker
doesn't need
to
necessarily
engage with
my attorney.
So when I
find people I
want to
engage
with them on
a personal
level. And I
want to say
you're my
advisor in
this specific
area. And it
time from
time to time,
I might
communicate
that you need
to engage
with this
other
person, like
my attorney
definitely
(31:17):
probably
needs to talk
to my banker
is make sure
that my tax
team knows
what's going
on. Those
three people
probably have
more synergy
than
anything. But
I don't
think they
need to meet.
I really
think it just
depends. Like
whenever I
have a
challenge in
my life,
I just ask
myself who on
my team do I
need to talk
to? That's
all I do.
Have you
found your
team? Is it
is it
referrals
from other
people? Is it
how do you
how do you
vet who
you're going
(31:37):
to let on to
your team?
Because I
think that's
a critical
question to
figure out. I
mean, I
maybe I'm a
little more
fortunate
than most in
the sense
that I've
I've just
stumbled
along the
way. I didn't
have a
strategic
approach to
it today. If
I had to go
back, I would
just be
looking for
people who
align with my
core values,
right?
personal
development,
growth,
(31:57):
details
matter,
winning it
all, you
know, winning
is is an
important. So
I look around
me and I find
the people
that I want
to have what
they're doing
or want to be
aligned with
what where
they're
going. I
don't
like like
for an
example, I
was working
with one of
my team
members this
morning. And
he was
talking to me
about his his
physician and
how he
listens to
his physician
(32:17):
at all costs.
And you know,
and, and this
this team
member is not
in great
health. And I
said, you
know, what
why is why?
Why do
you you
listen to
your doctor?
And he says,
Well, because
my doctor,
that's that's
their job,
they're
supposed
to take care
of me. And I
said, No, you
look at your
doctor and
you say, is
this person
healthy?
Is this
person an
example of,
you know,
what I want
to embody?
And he's
like, so I
look at them
(32:38):
and ask them,
I said, you
don't have to
ask them,
just look at
them. And if
they don't
have that
appeal, and
you can't say
that you want
to be be like
them, then
that's not
the right
person.
The same
thing from a
banker's
perspective,
if I was
talking to a
banker, I
would be
looking at,
okay, I have
big
aspirations,
right? Like,
I want to I
want to own,
you know,
$100 million
worth of
real estate
in the next
24 months.
Okay, so how
(32:58):
do I get
there? I'm
going to need
a good
banker who
has the
lending
capacity to
do that. So I
have to know
that their
bank that
they have
that
they work
with can
produce or
connect me
with that
kind of
lending
capacity. And
if they
can't, then
that's
not the right
guy, I have
to know that
my attorney
is well
versed in in
ways of
business,
right? Like
they have to
have a
(33:18):
business
acumen. If
they don't
have a
business
acumen, like
you, you for
an example,
you'd be a
great
illustration
of somebody
to work with.
Like if I
were starting
my
business right
now, I'd be
talking to
you, I'd be
like, let's
talk
proactively.
Let's make
sure like I'm
thinking
about having
partners.
What are your
thoughts on
that
partnership?
How should I
be
thinking about
this? What
are the
structures?
I'm going to
go if I want
to go to like
right now,
we're I'm
opening
a new bit,
well, I've
opened the
business,
(33:38):
we're, we're
converting it
to a C Corp.
And we're
putting
some things
together. And
I started
consulting
with people
with profit
profit, not
profit
sharing
agreements
with stock
option
agreements.
And we're
bringing
people in
that have
these, these
these skill
sets. And if
I find one of
the attorneys
that are just
so good, I'm
like, hey,
I need you on
my team,
because I got
to be
proactive. If
I'm looking
at my faith,
(33:58):
and I
obviously
you go
to the church
that you like
it, my
partner is my
wife, right?
Like I can't
I chose that
partner. So
we're, we're
trying to
find people
that have
core values
that are in
alignment
with me
that have
positions
that can
benefit me.
And then I
think based
on where I
want to go,
they have the
characteristics,
attributes
and resources
to get me.
Yeah, I love
that. And I
agree with
that. That's
something I
tell my
(34:19):
clients too
is, you know,
at the end of
the day, I
think comes
down to core
values
alignment,
making sure
you feel
comfortable
with the
person, and
they share
similar
values as
you do. And
then two
comes down to
results, what
kind of
results is
the person
you're
looking at
gotten? Have
they gotten
results for
the type of
situation
you're in?
And if so,
what
they can't
give you the
stats? I
don't know
how you can
trust them,
because
they're just
(34:39):
figuring it
out along
the way.
That's
correct.
Usually,
usually the
way the
journey
works, in
most
professions
is,
it's go to
school, get a
job or open a
business. And
then, you
know, with no
proven track
record
or results,
most people
are teaching
things
they've never
done before.
Yeah, that's right.
So so today,
it's more
about where's
(34:59):
the person
been? Because
that's the
results that
you're
talking
about?
Where's the
person been?
What have
they gone
through? What
have they had
to, you know,
what have
they shown as
a
demonstrated
capacity to
produce an
outcome? The
demonstrated
capacities,
which are
100% Yeah,
outcomes in
the real
world, as
opposed to
the safe
sandbox of
school,
or somebody
who's been a
lifelong
professor and
hasn't done
any of the
stuff they're
(35:19):
preaching
about. You
know, it's so
funny is that
yesterday or
no, Monday, I
reached out
to a local
the local
university
here at
University of
Texas. And I
said, Hey,
I'm looking
for some guys
I need some I
need some
some good,
good
accountants,
because I you
know, we've
been growing,
I need to
hire some
junior
accountants
guy writes me
back and
says, you
know, there's
a career
services
department
I'm
going to
connect you
with. And I'm
(35:40):
like, Okay,
so I write
back, I just
want to know
who you
would pick.
You know,
like, like,
tell me who
the winners
are, bro.
This just
made me think
of this,
because like,
I need
somebody
who's shown a
demonstrated
capacity to
produce a
result.
And you know
that but
you're not
telling me
that's so
stupid, like,
you go to the
career
department
and talk to
them like I
was so mad. I
wanted to
write back
(36:00):
like
fuck off.
That's so
annoying,
because
that's what
we're looking
for is as
entrepreneurs,
business
owners,
or people we
want to grow,
we're looking
for people
who have
shown a
result,
either
they're
going to show
the result to
work with us
as partners
or as team
members or as
associates,
like we just
got to find
those people.
And it's
harder and
harder these
days, because
people
don't know.
Yeah, I love
(36:20):
that. I love
that. I mean,
so who's the
person you
reached
out to,
by the way,
at the
university
who told you
to go to the
career
services? Was
it a
professor?
It was it was
the Dean of
Accountancy
or whatever.
You know,
here's a
here's a
random
thought. If
you look on
the website,
if you find
the
accounting
professors,
if you reach
out to them
and say, Hey,
who do you
think is one
of the most
proficient
students in
your class
would be
successful
(36:40):
accounting in
the real
world, that
person's
got the
reality of
the day to
day of the
students,
right? The
Dean isn't
really as
involved
with the
students.
Maybe it
wasn't Dean,
this person
was listed as
one of the
professors
too. So I
don't want to
show that
email. I
wrote 13
emails, it
was 13 of
professors,
only one
responded.
Wow. Only
responded.
And I said
that I said,
I'm a local
(37:00):
employer, I'm
looking for
talented
people,
I'm growing
my company
really fast.
We have a
great
opportunity.
I was just
hoping maybe
you could
introduce me
to a few of
them that you
feel like may
have a
potential to
do something
big and
crickets. I'm
like, dude,
these guys
suck. Yeah,
there's a
there's a lot
left to
desire. I
remember
Career
Services when
I was a law
student
looking for a
summer job,
(37:21):
they weren't
great at
it. And
when I was an
employer
looking for
attorneys and
looking for
law students,
I email them
and say,
Hey, you
know, who are
your best and
brightest
send them
over. And
they put me
through
this whole
process. And
they never
even got back
to me. I'm
like, how's
this how's
this make
sense for
anybody?
It's the
check the box
mentality,
bro. Like
that, that is
what's
happening in
most
organizations
and most
(37:41):
bureaucratic
organizations
where they
have to
create a
system to
follow. And
no matter
what you
can't
deviate,
because if
you deviate,
then your
metrics are
messed up, or
your funding
will get cut.
It's so dumb.
It's crazy.
Results are
results in
the real
world. It's
revenue. And
they don't
have an
impact of
revenue. So
there's no
reason, right
when there is
no
consequence,
(38:01):
behavior
rarely
changes.
Yeah, 100%
agree a game
without
points
pointless.
That's Hey,
that's really
good. Right?
That's a good
statement. I
heard that. I
like that. I
came up
with that.
So let me ask
you this. Let
me ask you
this. I'm
going to
quote you.
Okay,
listen, yeah,
I appreciate
that. Well,
let me ask
you this.
What is the
best piece of
advice you
have ever
gotten? And
(38:22):
who gave it
to me? It's
funny,
because it's
going to go
back to my
2015. After
after I
got that big
tax bill, I
was going
through some
restructuring,
because that
tax bill put
me in a
big negative.
And I had
some debt
service that
needed to pay
off that
year. So it was
like a big,
it was like,
you know, it
was it was
all things
coming to a
head. And the
(38:42):
guy that I
went to that
told me I
needed to pay
my fucking
taxes or
don't vote,
he was a
mentor of
mine for
real. And so
after I left
the office
that day, and
a few weeks
later, I
called him up
and I was
like,
Hey, bro,
I just want
to talk to
you about
some things
because I got
this debt
service
coming up,
got to pay
this tax
bill, you
know, I still
got a
business that
I got to run,
like, I
don't even
know how I'm
going to make
it. And he
says, let's
look over
your
financials.
(39:03):
And so I
mean, even
though I was
in the tax
world, that
doesn't mean
I was like a,
you know,
bookkeeper or
an account,
I did have
our stuff,
but it wasn't
really as
organized as
it needed to
be. And it
wasn't up
to date as it
needed to be.
And so I
remember
showing him
everything.
And he goes,
Look, man,
this is his
words to me,
he goes, the
reason you're
experiencing
all this
stuff is
because
you're
not keeping
up with the
things that
you're doing.
And then he
(39:24):
just said
this in this
statement,
I don't think
he'll ever
remember
this, but he,
he was a very
stern guy
with me. And
he said,
David, always
know your
fucking
numbers. I
mean, just
straight up
just told me,
and
he's like,
that's it. He
goes, there's
no other way
to fucking
tell you how
to change
your life.
Know your
fucking
numbers. This
guy's right.
This guy's
right. He was
right. And
that was
the best
piece of
advice I ever
(39:44):
had. It's not
because I
didn't know
it. It wasn't
because I
didn't think
that was
important.
It's because
I needed
somebody to
remind me
that that is
the most
important
thing in a
business. The
financial
health is
more
important
than culture,
because you
you can you
can have a
great
culture, but
have no
fucking
money. So you
know, the
jelly beans
and the
bread bulls
and the Kit
Kats and all
(40:04):
the damn junk
food you can
put in the
break room do
not make a
business
successful.
It's what get
deposited
it's in the
bank account
and what's
left at the
end of
the month.
And so it was
just great
advice. And
I've always
I've always
lived
through it.
Yeah, I agree
with that.
Yeah, I mean,
the stats are
critical in
terms of
various areas
that gets
that which
gets measured
is what leads
to success.
(40:25):
That's right.
You can't
Yeah, you
can't measure
things like
culture as
much as I
have a great
culture and
organization
can't measure
it, you
can feel it,
you can't
measure it.
So you got to
measure
things. Yeah.
Yeah, I love
that.
So let me
ask you this,
David, where
where can our
listeners
find you to
keep track of
you? You're
on Instagram.
Can you tell
us about the
handle? Where
on LinkedIn?
Are you?
What's your
(40:45):
website? So
you can
find if,
well, a few
sites. But if
you want to
find out if
we're a good
fit to work
together, if
I could
help you
mitigate or
eliminate
your tax
liability,
you can go to
taxplanexperts.com
and
schedule a
free
discovery
call.
Taxplanexperts.com
schedule a
free
discovery
call. I give
a lot I
would say
tons but I do
(41:05):
put out a lot
of content
pretty
regularly and
you can find
me on any any
social
channel at I
am am David a
don't forget
the A because
there's a lot
of David
Perez's
so David
a Perez I am
David a Perez
on any social
channel. You
can find me I
do put out
regular
content
about tax
strategies,
tax savings
and real
estate
investing
(41:25):
because as as
a tax
strategies
what I
like to do.
And yeah,
anybody who
would need
some help
from us go to
our website
or
message me DM me
on any any
social
channel I'll
respond back
to you will
connect and
hopefully we
can find a
way to
work
together.
Love it.
That's great.
Yeah, guys,
chat with
David to see
if you can
save on some
taxes for
sure. You'll
probably be
able to find
a better way
to spend your
(41:45):
money than
the
government
will. So
David
invested in
some real
estate. Yeah,
that's right.
That's right.
All right, David.
Listen, thank
you so much
for joining
us again
today and
looking
forward to
speaking
again. I
appreciate
you, my man.
Likewise.