June 13, 2025 • 40 mins
On this episode of Human Design-Powered Business, special guest Denise Duffield-Thomas reveals her strategies for building a lucrative business as a Manifestor.
Money mindset mentor, bestselling author, and creator of the legendary Money Bootcamp, Denise shares the raw truth about how she's maintained focus and followed through on her vision for over 13 years - despite the Manifestor tendency toward creative urges and new shiny objects.
In this candid conversation, Denise opens up about:
• How she treats herself "like an alcoholic" to avoid destroying her successful business when creative urges strike
• The strategic way she batches content (12 podcasts in one day!) to honor her Manifestor energy
• Why she refuses one-on-one coaching and how setting fierce boundaries created scalable success
• Her journey from working 5 jobs (including an adult chat line) to building a multi-million dollar empire
• How growing up with a single mother shaped her determination to never be financially dependent
• The spiritual visits from her grandmother that keep her motivated during challenging times
• Why Manifestors struggle with traditional coaching methods and what works instead
This episode is essential listening for any Manifestor entrepreneur who's tired of forcing themselves into other people's business blueprints. Denise proves that success comes not from fighting your design, but from embracing your unique energy and creating containers that honor how you're truly wired to work.
Want to know more about Denise and her work?
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Visit her Website and find out more about her courses and books..
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Keywords
Human Design, Business, Money Mindset, Manifestor, Creativity, Success, Entrepreneurship, Personal Development, Denise Duffield Thomas, Victoria Gibson
Summary
In this conversation, Victoria Gibson and Denise Duffield Thomas explore the intersection of Human Design and entrepreneurship, focusing on the unique challenges and strengths of manifestors in business. They discuss the importance of money mindset, creative urges, and the drive for success, sharing personal stories and insights that inspire listeners to embrace their individuality and pursue their passions.
Takeaways
Denise is a money mindset coach and mentor.
The importance of being loved and supported in business.
Manifestors have a unique creative urge that drives them.
Staying on track as a manifestor requires discipline and devotion.
Batching content creation can help manifestors manage their energy.
It's okay to be repetitive in messaging for new audiences.
Manifestors can create without depleting their energy.
The influence of ancestry and personal history on our paths.
Chapters
00:00 Introduction to Money Mindset and Human Design
02:10 The Manifestor's Journey in Business
08:53 Creating Boundaries and Energy Management
11:36 Publishing Journey and Manifestation Stories
13:35 Understanding Personal Constraints and Business Flow
16:01 The Importance of Structure and Guardrails in Business
19:07 Embracing Mistakes and Learning from Experience
25:29 The Drive for Independence and Economic Empowerment
30:45 Legacy and the Influence of Ancestry on Success
36:26 Introduction to Human Design
36:53 Understanding Your Human Design Type
40:16 Introduction to Human Design
40:45 Understanding Your Human Design Type
Mark as Played
Transcript
Episode Transcript
Available transcripts are automatically generated. Complete accuracy is not guaranteed.
(00:00):
Welcome to Human Design powered business.
(00:02):
I'm Victoria Gibson and every week I am sharing how you can harness your human design tounlock more flow, leverage and opportunity within your business
So let's dive in.
So welcome Denise Duffield Thomas to the podcast.
I'm so excited to have you here as a money mindset mentor and author and also dare I say agood friend.
(00:28):
I wanted to get you on the podcast and really explore our human design type.
But before we do that,
How are you going, my darling?
Please introduce yourself and tell everyone.
Yeah.
A little more about you who don't already know.
So I, yes, I'm a money mindset coach and mentor.
So I create books and courses around helping entrepreneurs deal with their money gremlinsand all that stuff.
(00:50):
and you and I met through just the entrepreneurial space, right?
When we were first starting out, you had a spare ticket for a conference.
I had a spare ticket for a conference.
we're like, let's meet up.
and yeah, we just fell in love straight away.
yeah, you're just so, you're just one of those people that is so easy to connect with andyou're such a champion.
And I just want to say this right off the start to when we're at our mastermind last week,we're.
(01:15):
know, what was there, 10 of us or so.
And we're all having our hot seats and Kerry one of our friends, she was saying, isn't itlovely to be loved by Victoria?
yeah, she said it's so lovely to be loved by her.
And during my hot seat, you were looking at everyone, anyone who gave me advice, you werelooking at them like, how dare you give advice to my precious, perfect baby?
(01:39):
You're like, no, no, no.
And I just, it was so beautiful that she mentioned that cause she's just like, you're sofiercely loyal and loving to your clients and your friends.
yes.
is lovely to be loved by you.
you for saying that.
And I love being loved by you.
And I think there's something about as well.
(01:59):
And I know, you know, I've chatted with you about this, but my journey in jumping into.
new things and I'm very much as both of us being a manifestor in human design, which isreally kind of like a bit of a human dynamo, right?
Like we are here to act, achieve, do the things and kind of ignite others and expressourselves and it comes very easily, but it also comes with a lot of creative pulls in
(02:25):
different directions,
it's sometimes referred to as a creative urge where it'll come in and we'll be cyclingthrough and we'll want to follow it.
And it'll be such a deep pull to follow the creative downloads and urges that come throughus.
And you definitely, and within your design, you've got a lot of creativity within there asa big driver for you.
(02:45):
And I know you have a lot of creative urges because we've talked about them, but one ofthe things I admire about you so much is your commitment and devotion to following
through.
with especially this iteration of your business.
And I know that you've had other iterations of business.
So tell me about staying on track as a manifestor, particularly in business, because it'ssomething I haven't been able to achieve.
(03:12):
And it's something I've seen you really do amazingly well, particularly the word devotioncomes to mind in many ways over the years.
can you just...
of give us a bit of insight because it's not going to be your natural desire to do it,right?
But when you say I'm a good follow-through person, I'm actually not, except I can do itand then I have to forget about it.
(03:33):
And so a really good example of that is like my Money Bootcamp, right?
Which I've been doing since 2012.
Is that right?
Yeah.
So how many years is that now?
was like,
13 years, So a lot of people go, how can you have that discipline to keep doing that?
But I actually don't have to have the discipline.
I just have to not break it.
(03:54):
And so I think in those early years, maybe the first three years, I redesigned it everyyear and I launched it a lot.
But then after that, I only re-recorded it every two years and I pretty much do the samerecording.
You know, I do the same transcripts.
just tweak them a little bit.
So I actually treat myself like an alcoholic in a way.
(04:16):
So if I do have a creative urge, sometimes if it's something that I can do, I'll do it.
But a lot of times the creative urge for people comes in destroying something first.
So I'm like, I can destroy it tomorrow, but just not today, which is very much analcoholic thing.
And I don't mean to sound, trite it in that.
or offensive, but I think sometimes with that manifestor personality, it can be aworkaholic energy.
(04:42):
Totally.
And an addiction to new and all that kind of stuff.
And so I still have it.
just don't, I just say to myself, you can do it tomorrow.
And then the urge passes.
And I don't do it.
Which of course it does.
Like it is that like, Oh, shiny object.
I'll go over here.
Or sometimes for me, it just feels like such a compulsion.
Like I can't go back and.
(05:03):
then I'm like, I can't have that anymore.
And I know that that is being such a costly drain in many ways, but not to my creativespirit, right?
Not to my essence and my learning, but in terms of a business strategic focus, it can besuch a detriment.
So that's why I wanted to ask you about that.
(05:25):
And I have been able to see that even in your chart too, in certain channels and
There is a lot of, there is, particularly with one, you know, I'm not going to all thedetail cause we're going to rabbit hole, but there's actually like quite, quite a big, a
strong discipline element in there.
And when I was looking at it, was like, it's so interesting to me because I remember whenwe went on a retreat, do you remember when we went to Dalesford?
(05:47):
for Julie Parker and Sora Schilling's retreat, which was amazing.
I loved it.
And I love it when we go on retreat, because we always generally share a bedroom or evensometimes a bed when there's hasn't been.
And we have full slumber parties and I love it.
But I remember when Julie Parker was, we were doing the archetypes of women, where you gofrom like the maiden to the crone.
(06:10):
I'm definitely.
I've been to my, what is it?
Queen and then Crone.
I'm hoping that I can stay in the Queen for a bit longer, but I'm also excited about theCrone being that wise woman, just not some of the other elements, but that's fine.
And you, we were talking about the different archetypes even in business or that like ourstyle and you had the nun and I was like, the nun Denise, you're so like stitched up.
(06:33):
And it was about devotion and discipline.
And I was so like,
That stayed with me for such a long time in me having the beautiful gift of witnessingyour journey in this current iteration of business for those 13 years, right?
And we met 14 years ago.
So it's actually, I knew you pre-kids, I knew you pre, you know, the author, the followingthat you have now, all of that.
(06:57):
So I've been able to see that evolution from you going from
what the maiden to the mother really like in that archetype, but that none archetype justreally stayed with me because it was one that I went, even though that doesn't naturally
come to me, how could I cultivate it within me, Not going against my design, but in orderto serve me.
And I think that I found that inspiring because normally I would have gone, that's justnot me and I'm not gonna do that.
(07:23):
It's kind of like I used to say, I can't cook.
So I'm not going to cook.
I just don't cook.
But in learning it and trying it, then I'm like, I really like cooking.
So, you you can borrow and try those on.
I can't remember the one I had.
I had one that was like almost like the sexy woman.
You had the nun and I had the sexy woman.
I was like, not that I'm saying you got sexy, but you know what I'm, you know, like what Imean.
(07:46):
Well, when we've, I remember we've been at conferences and it's like, I'll go to theconference at 9am.
And then you go out at night and then you just crawl in at 3am and just like, hi, butthat's so beautiful.
Cause then we can download, can be like, this is what happened in the 9am session.
You can be like, I met this, I met the speaker at the bar last night at 1am and here's anopportunity for you.
(08:07):
And I think that is, that is a really beautiful, like just a position I think, but I'vecompletely forgot about the none thing.
I actually think that is, it's almost, think it's that solitude thing.
of, don't feel like I need a lot of interaction with people.
So I don't need that necessarily from my business.
And so I think having somewhere to put people to be like, go into my money bootcamp.
(08:29):
I've created this space for you has been like great for me from a business point of view.
But also it's like, but I'm like, maybe it's that hermit thing too, right?
That's in my, it's like, I'm just doing my own thing over here.
But if you want something from me, you have to get it from
have to go there.
And I often say that about bootcamp.
I'm like, it's this or nothing, because I don't have anything else to give you at themoment, literally, energetically, anything, because I've got, you know, I've got kids to
(08:57):
deal with or whatever.
And it's been really useful also to separate myself energetically from the business,because I can go, my energy is in there, my, my course that I've created, but it doesn't
need me to like,
I don't know, be the guide all the time personally for people.
That's been super helpful for me.
Yeah.
And I think even, like it's such a big part of being a manifestor is this lone wolf kindof element, right?
(09:23):
We have this independent drive and a drive to do things alone and to move with that.
It doesn't mean we don't want to be with people, but there is that.
very strong element of independence.
And when we're able to do things so quickly and ignite things and wonder why like otherscan't go as fast and make it happen, there is a tendency to go alone.
(09:47):
And, what I love about all of those elements really speak to being a manifestor in termsthat you just mentioned in terms of I've got something that
I don't have to give my energy to, we don't have generative energy.
So we only have a finite amount and it is used to get others started and to inspire theirtransformation, which is perfect for you as well.
(10:10):
But we don't necessarily have the energy to be showing up and giving that, you know, allthat commitment every single day in our physical presence.
so this has been
Like I hope people really take that away because that's one of the biggest lessons I'velearned from you and watching it is like, wow, you could create a container and you could
just have some of those elements that don't require full depletion, but you're buildingand building rather than going to a new urge.
(10:38):
Like I remember even very early on, probably it was 2013, you wrote your book, the firstbook, Lucky Bitch.
And if that...
people haven't got Denise's books, people always tell me how much they love your books andI love them too.
So there's three, there's Lucky Bitch, there's Get Rich Lucky Bitch, and there'sChillpreneur.
There's not another one that I'm forgetting.
Well, Chillpreneur got renamed Chill & Prosper actually.
(10:59):
I think this is a really cool manifesting story too because when I self-published my booksand I didn't really care that much about traditional publishing, but it was kind of a
little bit of an urge.
But I got an email from a Hay House lady who is just on my newsletter list, right?
And this is just always such a good lesson.
You never know who's watching.
And I was like sending my newsletter out every week.
(11:20):
So she contacted me and said, look, I really love your stuff.
I'd love to pitch you to my bosses at Hay House.
And we went through the whole process and she was like, look, there are no at this time.
And so this is where my business was called Lucky Bitch as well.
And I was just like, they're just not, it's just not, hey, how see, you know, it's, and Iwent, that's fine.
I said, my God, just even going through this process has been so great, but now I'm goingto go away and build something that you can't say no to next time.
(11:46):
So then we changed my whole company name.
So that's when I went to Denise DT.
Also my ads and stuff were starting to get disapproved because Facebook didn't like theword bitch.
Like it was just starting to become a bit of a problem, but I went away and built all ofmy social media numbers.
And then I went back to them and said, Hey, look, I've got an idea for a new book calledChilpreneur.
And you can have the other books essentially for free.
(12:08):
And like as a package deal.
And they went, yeah, great.
And so we went through the process and I hated the cover.
I hated it.
You remember the first cover of it?
And I was like, I just, hate it.
it was because I was a new author with them, was trying to push back that feeling like, Ican't really do it.
So I just said, you know what, universe?
Like I'm just leaving it up to you.
(12:28):
I'm like, I'm just going to let it go.
Right.
And then, two years later, they were like, Denise, we'd love to do a new version of thebook because it's, you know, pandemic.
Like we want to be able to mention that we want more case studies.
And I said, right.
Like, I, really need to change the cover.
And they went great, but let's change the name as well.
Cause they never, they never really liked children.
(12:49):
And so I was like totally fine, but it was just such a thing of like going.
I know it's going to happen.
Like just, know, that manifest a trust sometimes you have, you just go, okay, fine.
I've got other things to worry about.
Like we don't fixate on, on stuff.
I was just like, fine, whatever.
And so then I love the cover.
and chill and prosper.
had already called my podcast that name.
(13:09):
I was like, a marketer, I'm like, brilliant.
And that couldn't have been a bigger gift to alignment, your podcast anyway.
And I remember even waiting in the wings before you did a podcast going.
we should hurry up and do a podcast because when she does, it is going to be huge becausepeople, think you had that beautiful energy, which is difficult for a manifestor to have
as well because we have what they sometimes call a closed and repelling aura and noteveryone is open to our, um, transformation and our ignition and our informing, right?
(13:40):
So it's interesting.
I I've loved watching the way people
and I think it's because you have always had those clear boundaries.
It's like, you can go over here and you're not gonna get all of me.
Even when I wanna kind of like cross your boundaries, like not that I would do it, but youknow me, I'd like get up in people's stuff and I'd say things to you or like, remember one
(14:00):
day I asked you a question, you're like, well, you could just go and Google that.
And I'd be like, yeah, I actually could.
That's so rude.
No, no, no, it was late.
Like it was late at night and I came in, I was probably like had a few drinks.
I was like.
about this, but you know mainstream of consciousness is talking blah blah blah.
3am.
Yeah, at 3am.
I do remember that actually.
Yes, and you were gonna just google it Victoria, it's 3am.
(14:21):
Just google it lady.
I love that.
Go ahead, go ahead.
Oh no, what I was gonna say is the way that I do the podcast I think is probably amanifest thing, right?
So I
batch it very intensely.
So I'll hire a studio because otherwise I will not do it at home.
There'll be a million things that will distract me.
(14:42):
So I hire a studio for someone.
I just need to sit there and talk and I'll, usually do 12 in a day.
So I only have to do that four times a year.
that is again, but then it means I have to make sure that my podcasts, like they're notsuper topical.
They, they have to be.
know, stuff I can pull out at any time.
Obviously, I can look ahead and go, I can do a Christmas episode, I can do whatever, but Itry and make them kind of evergreen.
(15:08):
And also, I think the lesson that I've learned too is, it's okay to be repetitive withstuff, because people need to hear it again and again.
And I'm not always trying to reach the people who have been following me forever and, youknow, done all my things.
It's like, it's always trying to get the new person.
So I think I don't know if that's a manifest thing of just going,
(15:28):
Here's the thing, here's the constraint, and then I don't want to think about it untilnext quarter.
Absolutely.
And I know my human design teacher said to me as well, he goes, the perfect kind ofbusiness for you is to come in and out.
So you're not designed to be there the whole time.
And you will start to get like, you know, our not self theme is that anger, right?
(15:52):
And I used to think, I don't...
I really get angry.
And then I thought about my parenting.
yeah.
Angry.
My children would make me when they were small and Millie, I've got two kids, you knowthem very well.
And Millie in fact has your birthday and your same human design life theme, even thoughshe's a projector.
So very different.
But, you know, she said to me last night, I remember when you were just screaming at meone day saying, you.
(16:14):
I can't even remember now, I can't remember the word.
was something like, it wasn't even frustrating.
It was the next level of like, you know, just make me so like mad.
I don't think I said angry or mad.
It was something like, I just cannot believe how frustrating you are.
And she goes, never forget, just look at your face.
Like you were just so, so like distraught.
And I was like, because I just couldn't get through to you.
(16:35):
And it was so like, I was so annoyed.
So then I realized anger comes in.
But yeah, that having to show up
not on our terms, I think can be very difficult.
So that batching that you just mentioned, whichever one always admires when you say it'ssuch a manifestor thing too, like you'll go, I just like did, you know, 50 podcasts in two
weeks or whatever you say.
(16:55):
And people are like, my God, like, you do because it's, it's beautiful.
that's where.
Yeah.
I want the container.
I want to be on, I get my hair and makeup done.
I'm like, so even today, right?
I was like, I had two gaps.
Normally I would do five in a row and.
Mark, my husband, had put in the orthodontics appointment.
It shouldn't just be an FYI, but he's blocked it out in my calendar.
(17:18):
So then I said to ask my group, hey, I've got two slots tomorrow, because I don't want tojust sit here and be like, I'm going to do with my life for two hours waiting for my next
podcast.
So it's like, I just want to be very contained with stuff like that.
So I have freedom then during my week, because I find it so difficult, like when Mark cameinto the business, he's a projector.
but he needed to have all these touch points with me to be like, and he still does itwhere he's like, so we're doing our SMA launch, like, are we going to have the clothes on
(17:46):
the thing?
What?
And I'm like, like this conversation once, I never want to have it again.
Why are we having this conversation?
It's so boring to go over old ground, but if I can do it where it's just like, okay, I'mthere, I'll do my thing.
And then I don't have to think about that.
That's the only way I can do the business.
And I think that's why it's been so.
good with having the same business because I'm like, I don't need to, like that's done.
(18:10):
You know, like I don't have to have that question mark in my mind.
What's my next course?
When am I going to launch it?
That's why I also made my course evergreen.
So then we can still do launches, which Mark pretty much takes care of now.
Um, and, but we can serve those people who are instant gratification people.
And it's just like, cool.
I've got somewhere to send you.
(18:31):
when he came in the business, he was like, oh, you could do a mastermind.
We could do all these things.
And I was like, I don't want to, I just don't want to.
And I don't think I can, if I don't want to, it doesn't matter how much money, somethinglike that would make.
like, I just, I can't, I do it.
Yeah.
And I think for you as well, Laine, I've always been, you know, in admiration of it, butalso like envious of having you, you put in place those
(18:56):
Kind of like the, I think, Carrie was talking last week about having guard rails onthings.
And I thought that was such a good term to use in having guard rails in your businesswhere, even when I started my mastermind, right.
In 2013 and you'd come on the retreats and coach.
mean, how lucky were those women till I have asked first start, but also like have thatopportunity.
It was amazing.
And then we could catch up.
(19:16):
It was great.
they were the best of times, but.
in terms of that, like it's, it's kind of like you said to me, well, you can have thatperson.
They can join your mastermind when you had been coaching and you just put a line in thesand said, I'm not doing coaching with clients anymore.
One-on-one, like it's just not going to happen.
And you could have had, can you imagine how many people would have kept wanting that?
(19:38):
And for you not to have put that guardrail in, you would have been blocked in startingthis scale.
not that you were like, I'm going to scale and take over the world, but you just put thoseguardrails in and really believed in that direction.
And once again, that discipline and devotion of staying there, despite wanting to bepulled off course, whether it be by Mark or, you know, a million other ideas.
(20:01):
And even the good thing was, I remember also you saying,
when you'd have some other creative urges like doing the branded like merch and products.
And I mean, you did have decks and I mean, you'd always, what about the jumpsuit with thebees on it?
mean, my goodness.
And it was definitely bits where I mean, I still get distracted a little bit, but I justdon't break that core thing.
(20:21):
on the one-to-one thing, it'd be really interesting to if this is in my chart too, becauseI did like one-to-one, but I maxed out like,
I remember the most I ever had in a week was like 15 clients.
I actually think I maxed out at about five because any more than that, I was like, I can'tremember the details between clients.
Like I can't remember.
(20:42):
I just, couldn't hold all of that.
And so, and also I feel like I'm not that good at it.
So occasionally someone will go, you know, can you please do one to one?
And I was like, look, I would take your money, but I'm just, I'm not good at it.
Like it's not, I'd prefer to speak rather than listen.
And like, can't, I'm not good at it.
So it would be a waste of your money.
(21:03):
And so that's why, you know, bootcamp's great, but even when I do my money archetypes, Ionly do it once a year.
It's, you know, a set time and I can give myself to it for that time.
But apart from that, it's not my skillset, you know?
Yeah.
And it's so interesting you say that about the speaking, because as manifestos, that'swhere, that's where all the manifestation takes place.
(21:25):
takes place in our throat, right?
So the expression of ourselves, that's how we create.
So when we're talking as a manifestor, it's about creation and that drive to we've got amotor directly to the throat.
So that is what has to come through.
And I know when I studied life coaching and they're like, you have to hold the space.
can't put your judgment, you can't put your opinion.
(21:46):
And I'd be sitting there going, my brain is broken.
I don't know what you mean about that.
I think that's very true.
are more suited to having that group to express ourselves to because we're, yeah, wearen't going to hold that squabbles.
We can't hold it back, right?
And I have seen you in action with that where you're just like, well, here's the strategy.
Like, you're not going to be like, well, what do you think?
(22:08):
Because they're like, I've got the information that I can just give you.
I can just tell you, you don't have to figure it out.
And it's hard.
And it is hard.
And it's so funny because in learning those principles, was like,
Oh yeah, maybe that's what I need to do more.
And I still try and do that now to this day where I say, well, what, do you think?
Or what, what, or ask those coaching questions, right?
(22:30):
And in my head, I'm just like, I've got the answer.
Just take it and go, you'll make a million dollars and like, go and have fun.
Right.
But I have to go, no.
Okay.
And as soon as I do, then I see, cause it's not my natural style.
It's not my design.
People get like actually really kind of, well, can't you just tell me like they get
very frustrated with me.
So then I'm like, I'll just tell them now.
(22:51):
don't care.
Yeah, absolutely.
It's interesting.
And so your profile type being a three-fiver is quite a common profile type, but thebiggest hallmark of it is a lot of trial and error, giving things a go, but just recovery
straight back.
Like, I ran over here, fell off a cliff.
I'm back again.
Can you talk to
(23:12):
parts of your life that might be in business particularly, I guess, would be interestingjust to think about some of those recovery mechanisms or an experience you can think of
when I say that, that comes to mind that would be a hallmark of being a three-five.
Well, I think when I have made mistakes, I do feel like, my God, this is going to be sogreat for the podcast.
(23:32):
Like this is going to be such a great chapter for a book.
And
So I see the juice in things very, very quickly.
And I think when I was one to one coaching too, I had to slow that down a bit becausepeople would be like, here's a bad thing.
I'd be like, this is amazing.
Like this would be so great to share, but they were still in it.
So it was hard sometimes to then be like, oh no, that is really bad.
(23:55):
Sorry.
But it's really good.
And so even as a friend, if someone's getting divorced, I'm like already can see like fiveyears down the track.
I'm like, this is amazing.
But
people need to wallow in it a little bit and get that sympathy.
So I think I've just always had that for myself and others.
Also, I don't know if this is just ADHD, but I totally forget about things.
So I was speaking in London and so I was doing a keynote and there was like a really drunkguy who stood up and like he heckled and he had to be removed, whatever.
(24:25):
Like he was super drunk, right?
And this was in England.
So a lot of people were just like mortified by it.
I get to the end of my keynote, I just like recovered and went whatever.
And I get to the end of the keynote, I meeting people after and they were like, are youokay?
And I was like, about what?
I I've just forgotten about it.
Like it just didn't penetrate at all.
(24:46):
I also think from an early age, because I was a performer, so I started dancing at eightand the dance school I went to, we were not the best, but we
danced bloody everywhere.
So my dance teacher, Simone, love her, Simone's school of performing arts.
She literally would be like, we would dance at McCappie Day, we would dance at old folkshomes, we're always dancing at the local shopping center, like anywhere we danced, right?
(25:14):
And so I feel like, especially in the early years when we were still kind of gettingbetter, we had so many disasters.
And so like our music would be the wrong music.
Our music would be sped up.
We'd be dancing on the back of a flatbed truck and it would start to bounce.
We would be on a really slippery floor and half of us would fall over.
We would be like just so many embarrassing humiliating things happened in those early daysthat we would just kind of like whatever.
(25:42):
And I see that now, cause I do perform again now and I see people are so nervous and I'mlike, what's the worst that can happen?
Like, I feel like
It's happened already.
Also, the other thing I think that helps with that is that, you know, know, my mom, my momis like so undiagnosed ADHD.
We just had such a kind of chaotic sometimes childhood, but also just like she does justtry lots of things and nothing was ever a big deal.
(26:09):
And I think that now I'm only appreciating that now.
think I didn't appreciate it for a long time where I'm like, she'll just walk away fromstuff like, and
not be bothered.
And she's just like, well, okay, what's the next next new thing?
And of course, that was very painful sometimes as a kid.
now I'm like, that's such a great skill just to go, well, that happened.
(26:30):
then, like, great, I can talk to other people about it.
yes, like, then it doesn't make it as embarrassing, I think, too.
Yeah, I think actually that brings up something I wanted to talk to you about because Iwas thinking about, mentioned this last week to you how Denise and I would host retreats
together, but we would also bring in our third manifestor friend.
I mean, I really thought about it.
(26:50):
There's not many manifestor entrepreneur friends I have and Denise and Jodie are two ofthem, right?
And they were my closest entrepreneur friends.
And it's so funny that you manifested because we just had that recognition, even though wedidn't know it, but we
all got different elements in it.
But one of the things I was thinking about with Jodie and the distinction, because I loveactually now with the knowledge of human design, looking at the difference between us all
(27:12):
as manifestors.
But one of the things that I was thinking of that was different was that Jodie grew up ina family of brothers and her dad was very much part of the family.
Mom, dad, very nuclear family.
And no families are perfect.
And I'm sure she's not going to say hers was, but you know, it was a really strong familyunit.
And there were certain things that I think Jodie expects because her dad would always belike, okay, Jodie, you know, she's the girl and here's the things that happen.
(27:39):
And not that Jodie expects certain things, but I think you and I growing up with singlemothers as manifestors where we were free, we're left kind of free to do a lot of our own
thing.
And I think that's such a gift if you do have a manifestor child, which I know a lot ofpeople do now because of sort of the way the world's changing and a lot of manifestors are
being born, which
Yay.
(27:59):
But yeah, which is kind of cool.
So if you speak to more people, so many more women are like, Mike, my baby's a manifestor.
And you're like, yes, I know, because that's kind of the way the world is moving to me.
know.
Right.
Exactly.
So, um, but what was that?
What I was going to say to that was that there there's something as well about that beingdriven to
succeed.
(28:19):
Yes, we've got the manifest element, but I think growing up with a single mother,obviously economically, that is not an abundant place to be for most people, right?
So talk to that for me, you know, in terms of that being a driver, it can also be ahindrance, I understand, but you know, in seeing that kind of like sheer, I've got to get
(28:39):
this because I've got to provide for myself.
like tell me about that.
Yeah, I think that started really early because I saw my mom
either struggle with money or be in situations like with relationships where, you know,she didn't have economic power.
So when I was 11, she married someone who was much older, you know, wealthy, controlling,and they were together for about six years, but I think we moved in and out of his big
(29:06):
house about five, six times, probably even more.
Like we'd come home and she'd be like, okay, we're moving somewhere else.
And I think...
I realized too, I was like, I never want to be in that situation where a man can kick meout or choose how I spend my life.
also I was very aware about like, I really loved dancing and I just wanted to dance allthe time.
(29:31):
I was very aware that that was both an expense, but it was also a way that my stepdadcould control me.
You know, cause he'd be like, well, I'm not going to pay for your dance here.
I'm not going to pay for this.
So when I was 12, I asked my dance teacher if I could be her, like do assistant teachingfor her, like helping with the, know, baby's ballet and stuff like that.
(29:51):
So that paid for some of my lessons.
And then as soon as I could, I got a job.
And even like at university and in my twenties, I always had like five jobs, you know?
And like one of them was an adult chat line, which I've talked about before.
And the reason why I picked that,
is because it was open 24 seven.
And so if I needed money, I could just be like, Oh, can I come in for a shift?
(30:13):
Could I come in for a double and do like 12 hour shift, like 6 PM to 6 AM, which was yourchat line stories.
is the best.
And I was like, I never, when people go, Oh, university was so fun.
go, I was always working.
And then even in my twenties in London, I did the same thing.
I was always working and I always had.
all these side hustles.
(30:35):
I even, I did, I participated in a medical experiment in the UK to pay for my tuition.
And I remember a friend at the time, she was like, you'd do anything for money, wouldn'tyou?
And I remember thinking, bitch, I have to.
No one else, no one is going to take care of me.
There's no way for me to get that money to, you know, do my university tuition, if not forthis.
(30:58):
half of it was like 10 grand.
I remember half of it came from the medical experiment and half of it came in a bank errorin my favor.
So I was like, that's, think when things started to shift for me and to being lucky, likethat's when the lucky bitch thing happened because then things were coming to me, not
necessarily through just hard work and hustle.
Um, but actually like the universe was kind of nudging me in a different direction.
(31:23):
So I set an intention.
write a book and I won the Daw Prize at Sandy Forster's event, which was a self-publishingcourse.
I wanted to be a life coach and a friend texted me, she goes, you know, you won a lifecoaching thing on a webinar I was on yesterday.
And I was like, I don't even remember like signing up for the webinar.
And she was like, yeah, and you won the Daw Prize, which was a life coaching qualificationthing.
(31:46):
And then, you know, all these things were happening and it really shifted then of going
Like you're a really hard worker and you'll do whatever it takes to hang on.
Maybe you don't have to try as hard.
can direct your intention.
And it was just a really different shift for me.
I love that.
That, that almost gives me goosebumps.
Just the thought of it.
(32:07):
It wasn't also just landing on you.
You were igniting it in terms of, right.
I have to create these elements.
Like, and you always talk to that entrepreneurial drive, but
there, there was also a deeper pull within you emotionally about that to feel that safety.
I believe as well of that.
(32:27):
Yes.
I can be creative.
Yes, I can have that, but it's like, and also very manifest a thing of nobody's going tocontrol me.
And I feel like that very much drove me to being a mother of a single mother too, whereshe'd be like, you know, well, your father's not giving us any money.
So, and I never wanted to rely on a man for
by choices or my freedoms like that.
(32:48):
And I still don't.
And I might be why I'm divorced.
Cause when I married someone who wanted to control how money was spent, even though bothof us were making it, that was just a hard no for me.
Like, and he wasn't even like financially good.
It wasn't anything bad, but it was just like even that little bit of control.
was like, no way.
I get to decide these things.
And that's sovereign to me.
(33:09):
So I love that you shared that.
And I know we're at times, so we've got to wrap up.
But in talking to that one thing about like, you have always had that message from thebeginning about that luck, which, know, there was definitely luck there, but it was kind
of strategic luck in many ways, right?
And that force of who you are.
(33:30):
But in talking to that, you know, determination or seeing that opportunity,
Like, is there just something you'd like to share with other women?
know they always ask you, women in business who see your success and they want to emulateit.
And this is part of my drive to say to people, you can do it on your terms and do itdifferently.
Maybe just leave us with that one thing you think you have done differently that hasworked really well and really given you that leverage maybe that maybe you haven't even
(33:58):
talked about before or there's something that-
I think of, I always think of my grandmother, right?
So my grandmother died when I was 25 and I was really close to her, but I think even morethan my mom, she really would drum into me, you know, like don't ever be dependent.
She'd always say to me from a young age, she'd be like, I hope your grandfather dies thisyear.
And I was like, when she started telling me that they were like in their 50s, they weren'told, but she just didn't have any other avenue.
(34:24):
And
But one of the last times I spent with her before she died, cause she was, you know, shehad breast cancer and all that kind of stuff.
did a road trip up to Queensland and I was like really starting my personal developmentjourney and I was listening to like Zig Ziglar or like, amway tapes or something.
And we just kind of drove in silence and it was like a couple of hours in and she waslike, you could do this.
(34:47):
And I just sort of went, really?
And I thought, you know,
she never got to see any like literally nothing.
Cause she died when I was 25.
So I was still in my like, yeah, trying things out phase, but I think she did see that inme.
And so she has visited me at very like important parts of my life.
So I've smelled like I've smelled her perfume, like when I was giving birth to Willow andI was, and also other times I've been in hospital and I remember I was saying, I can smell
(35:16):
my nan and like, you know, the midwives are kind of like, okay, whatever.
was like,
my God, she's here.
And it was, it was really, really special because I'm like, she was so smart.
She was so creative.
know she was a dressmaker.
She did all these cool things.
She was very funny as well, but she just lived in a time where she couldn't do anything.
Yes.
(35:36):
With that creativity, you know, she could have had a...
an amazing Etsy store or a YouTube channel or whatever, right?
And so every time I think, oh, look at me, I'm so smart.
go, no, it's literally just the, the era that I'm in.
And so I think about my grandma and I always do think like, imagine saying to yourgrandma, like, oh, I would start my podcast, but what if someone's mean to me on the
(35:59):
internet?
They couldn't do what we can do.
And like,
I even think she started NutriMedics.
was selling NutriMedics for a while.
Like in Pacific Palms in Foster where there was probably like a hundred people around her,right?
And I just think, oh my God, we have, we're able to have all these beautiful friendshipswith people all around the world who are like-minded.
(36:23):
We get all these beautiful support.
We can create a bloody podcast.
We can make things with our imagination.
I just, I feel so privileged.
with that.
And I think that's what keeps me going because I go, nobody can stop us from doing this,but nobody can make us either.
we do have to be internally driven to go, why not me?
I'm allowed to write a book.
(36:44):
I'm allowed to create a podcast.
No one is sitting there waiting for it and begging for it.
So you just have to be a bit delusional and just go, okay, I'm going to do it because mygrandmother would have, God, she would have done it.
absolutely.
Can I leave that and we'll wrap up with this one thing that
In your human design, you're in your unconscious is your ancestry, right?
(37:04):
And there's certain planetary activations that are your maternal grandmother.
So I'm going to look into what that is for you and share it because that will be, you'recarrying her.
She's within you.
Really quick story on this.
So I went to a yoga retreat and sometimes in yoga spaces, I feel like I'm the likebusiness bitch.
And everyone's talking about like,
(37:26):
what's your spirit animal and all this kind of stuff.
And I went, I don't know, I'm a bitch.
And so I had this session with someone and she goes, yours is a dragon.
She's like, you're fire.
And she's like, that is an animal.
And it's really important for those lightning strikes in the ground that is like rings,what nitro, something like something into the soil.
(37:46):
And she's like, it's really important to be that fire energy.
Cause I was like, everyone's like is a unicorn and stuff like that.
So mine doesn't exist.
So then I was like, okay, I'm gonna embrace that dragon energy.
I came home and my auntie who long ago divorced my uncle met with me for coffee.
She goes, I've got a present for you.
I went and visited your uncle, my ex-husband.
And while he was in the toilet, I like rummaged in his cupboard of all your grandmother'sthings that he has.
(38:11):
And it's a dragon.
Get out.
Yes, go and get it.
It's right here.
Show me, show me.
know what you're like.
I was always like, my grandmother was so like soft and kind and, like, she lovedtraveling.
And so she got this in the eighties from, think she was in China or Japan.
She loved traveling and it was just, she just thought I just grabbed the first thing and Iwanted you to have something because I don't have anything from her.
(38:36):
And it was just the perfect thing of going, I am allowed to be the dragon.
It's, that is, that is who I am.
so dragon lady, just.
Isn't that so cool?
Your daddies.
I love that.
And I love the way that the way you put things together decor wise as well.
Always like, just love it because you could just put that and anyone else, it's just goingto look ugly.
(38:57):
Even like your Fortuna statues, which I know you always have.
You've given me one, but that one I can see it up there as well.
And I always love it because I'm always like, yeah, my mom bought me a blue typewriterwhen I was nine.
So it's not quite like that.
And there's like a little B here.
crystals and stuff.
you and beautiful.
And I love that.
And then yeah, my dragon sits on there I love that story.
(39:18):
And I'm gonna, and I actually really want to do Vicky, your mum's design too.
The more I think about it, the more I'm like,
I just so want to do Vicky.
I love your mother.
But anyway, we could go on forever, but we've got to wrap it up and just leave everyone,hopefully with those thoughts, particularly, hopefully this has given some comfort to
manifestors out there.
I know that human design has given me so much comfort and permission to be the way we arewired to be.
(39:41):
So it's interesting to hear those different experiences.
And I have learned new things just.
Doing this, can we do it again, please?
I would just have a chat.
We don't even have a toolbox, but we should just record all our chats.
sort of makes them even better, right?
So let's do it.
So thank you, my darling.
I cannot wait to see you again soon.
yeah, let's just share and go and take our grandmother's and our mother's energy for alltheir light and shade it's in us.
(40:10):
And this is our privilege to take that and ignite it out there as well.
So thank you.
Thank you.
Thanks for joining me on today's episode.
If you'd like to get your free human design type guide, then head on over tovictoriagibson.com and enter your birth details and you're going to get a custom report
(40:34):
that dives in and tells you more about your human design type and your authority, which isreally the basis for making great decisions in your business.
It's absolutely free.
Head to victoragibson.com and grab your copy.
Welcome to Human Design powered business.
(00:02):
I'm Victoria Gibson and every week I am sharing how you can harness your human design tounlock more flow, leverage and opportunity within your business
So let's dive in.
So welcome Denise Duffield Thomas to the podcast.
I'm so excited to have you here as a money mindset mentor and author and also dare I say agood friend.
(00:28):
I wanted to get you on the podcast and really explore our human design type.
But before we do that,
How are you going, my darling?
Please introduce yourself and tell everyone.
Yeah.
A little more about you who don't already know.
So I, yes, I'm a money mindset coach and mentor.
So I create books and courses around helping entrepreneurs deal with their money gremlinsand all that stuff.
(00:50):
and you and I met through just the entrepreneurial space, right?
When we were first starting out, you had a spare ticket for a conference.
I had a spare ticket for a conference.
we're like, let's meet up.
and yeah, we just fell in love straight away.
yeah, you're just so, you're just one of those people that is so easy to connect with andyou're such a champion.
And I just want to say this right off the start to when we're at our mastermind last week,we're.
(01:15):
know, what was there, 10 of us or so.
And we're all having our hot seats and Kerry one of our friends, she was saying, isn't itlovely to be loved by Victoria?
yeah, she said it's so lovely to be loved by her.
And during my hot seat, you were looking at everyone, anyone who gave me advice, you werelooking at them like, how dare you give advice to my precious, perfect baby?
(01:39):
You're like, no, no, no.
And I just, it was so beautiful that she mentioned that cause she's just like, you're sofiercely loyal and loving to your clients and your friends.
yes.
is lovely to be loved by you.
you for saying that.
And I love being loved by you.
And I think there's something about as well.
(01:59):
And I know, you know, I've chatted with you about this, but my journey in jumping into.
new things and I'm very much as both of us being a manifestor in human design, which isreally kind of like a bit of a human dynamo, right?
Like we are here to act, achieve, do the things and kind of ignite others and expressourselves and it comes very easily, but it also comes with a lot of creative pulls in
(02:25):
different directions,
it's sometimes referred to as a creative urge where it'll come in and we'll be cyclingthrough and we'll want to follow it.
And it'll be such a deep pull to follow the creative downloads and urges that come throughus.
And you definitely, and within your design, you've got a lot of creativity within there asa big driver for you.
(02:45):
And I know you have a lot of creative urges because we've talked about them, but one ofthe things I admire about you so much is your commitment and devotion to following
through.
with especially this iteration of your business.
And I know that you've had other iterations of business.
So tell me about staying on track as a manifestor, particularly in business, because it'ssomething I haven't been able to achieve.
(03:12):
And it's something I've seen you really do amazingly well, particularly the word devotioncomes to mind in many ways over the years.
can you just...
of give us a bit of insight because it's not going to be your natural desire to do it,right?
But when you say I'm a good follow-through person, I'm actually not, except I can do itand then I have to forget about it.
(03:33):
And so a really good example of that is like my Money Bootcamp, right?
Which I've been doing since 2012.
Is that right?
Yeah.
So how many years is that now?
was like,
13 years, So a lot of people go, how can you have that discipline to keep doing that?
But I actually don't have to have the discipline.
I just have to not break it.
(03:54):
And so I think in those early years, maybe the first three years, I redesigned it everyyear and I launched it a lot.
But then after that, I only re-recorded it every two years and I pretty much do the samerecording.
You know, I do the same transcripts.
just tweak them a little bit.
So I actually treat myself like an alcoholic in a way.
(04:16):
So if I do have a creative urge, sometimes if it's something that I can do, I'll do it.
But a lot of times the creative urge for people comes in destroying something first.
So I'm like, I can destroy it tomorrow, but just not today, which is very much analcoholic thing.
And I don't mean to sound, trite it in that.
or offensive, but I think sometimes with that manifestor personality, it can be aworkaholic energy.
(04:42):
Totally.
And an addiction to new and all that kind of stuff.
And so I still have it.
just don't, I just say to myself, you can do it tomorrow.
And then the urge passes.
And I don't do it.
Which of course it does.
Like it is that like, Oh, shiny object.
I'll go over here.
Or sometimes for me, it just feels like such a compulsion.
Like I can't go back and.
(05:03):
then I'm like, I can't have that anymore.
And I know that that is being such a costly drain in many ways, but not to my creativespirit, right?
Not to my essence and my learning, but in terms of a business strategic focus, it can besuch a detriment.
So that's why I wanted to ask you about that.
(05:25):
And I have been able to see that even in your chart too, in certain channels and
There is a lot of, there is, particularly with one, you know, I'm not going to all thedetail cause we're going to rabbit hole, but there's actually like quite, quite a big, a
strong discipline element in there.
And when I was looking at it, was like, it's so interesting to me because I remember whenwe went on a retreat, do you remember when we went to Dalesford?
(05:47):
for Julie Parker and Sora Schilling's retreat, which was amazing.
I loved it.
And I love it when we go on retreat, because we always generally share a bedroom or evensometimes a bed when there's hasn't been.
And we have full slumber parties and I love it.
But I remember when Julie Parker was, we were doing the archetypes of women, where you gofrom like the maiden to the crone.
(06:10):
I'm definitely.
I've been to my, what is it?
Queen and then Crone.
I'm hoping that I can stay in the Queen for a bit longer, but I'm also excited about theCrone being that wise woman, just not some of the other elements, but that's fine.
And you, we were talking about the different archetypes even in business or that like ourstyle and you had the nun and I was like, the nun Denise, you're so like stitched up.
(06:33):
And it was about devotion and discipline.
And I was so like,
That stayed with me for such a long time in me having the beautiful gift of witnessingyour journey in this current iteration of business for those 13 years, right?
And we met 14 years ago.
So it's actually, I knew you pre-kids, I knew you pre, you know, the author, the followingthat you have now, all of that.
(06:57):
So I've been able to see that evolution from you going from
what the maiden to the mother really like in that archetype, but that none archetype justreally stayed with me because it was one that I went, even though that doesn't naturally
come to me, how could I cultivate it within me, Not going against my design, but in orderto serve me.
And I think that I found that inspiring because normally I would have gone, that's justnot me and I'm not gonna do that.
(07:23):
It's kind of like I used to say, I can't cook.
So I'm not going to cook.
I just don't cook.
But in learning it and trying it, then I'm like, I really like cooking.
So, you you can borrow and try those on.
I can't remember the one I had.
I had one that was like almost like the sexy woman.
You had the nun and I had the sexy woman.
I was like, not that I'm saying you got sexy, but you know what I'm, you know, like what Imean.
(07:46):
Well, when we've, I remember we've been at conferences and it's like, I'll go to theconference at 9am.
And then you go out at night and then you just crawl in at 3am and just like, hi, butthat's so beautiful.
Cause then we can download, can be like, this is what happened in the 9am session.
You can be like, I met this, I met the speaker at the bar last night at 1am and here's anopportunity for you.
(08:07):
And I think that is, that is a really beautiful, like just a position I think, but I'vecompletely forgot about the none thing.
I actually think that is, it's almost, think it's that solitude thing.
of, don't feel like I need a lot of interaction with people.
So I don't need that necessarily from my business.
And so I think having somewhere to put people to be like, go into my money bootcamp.
(08:29):
I've created this space for you has been like great for me from a business point of view.
But also it's like, but I'm like, maybe it's that hermit thing too, right?
That's in my, it's like, I'm just doing my own thing over here.
But if you want something from me, you have to get it from
have to go there.
And I often say that about bootcamp.
I'm like, it's this or nothing, because I don't have anything else to give you at themoment, literally, energetically, anything, because I've got, you know, I've got kids to
(08:57):
deal with or whatever.
And it's been really useful also to separate myself energetically from the business,because I can go, my energy is in there, my, my course that I've created, but it doesn't
need me to like,
I don't know, be the guide all the time personally for people.
That's been super helpful for me.
Yeah.
And I think even, like it's such a big part of being a manifestor is this lone wolf kindof element, right?
(09:23):
We have this independent drive and a drive to do things alone and to move with that.
It doesn't mean we don't want to be with people, but there is that.
very strong element of independence.
And when we're able to do things so quickly and ignite things and wonder why like otherscan't go as fast and make it happen, there is a tendency to go alone.
(09:47):
And, what I love about all of those elements really speak to being a manifestor in termsthat you just mentioned in terms of I've got something that
I don't have to give my energy to, we don't have generative energy.
So we only have a finite amount and it is used to get others started and to inspire theirtransformation, which is perfect for you as well.
(10:10):
But we don't necessarily have the energy to be showing up and giving that, you know, allthat commitment every single day in our physical presence.
so this has been
Like I hope people really take that away because that's one of the biggest lessons I'velearned from you and watching it is like, wow, you could create a container and you could
just have some of those elements that don't require full depletion, but you're buildingand building rather than going to a new urge.
(10:38):
Like I remember even very early on, probably it was 2013, you wrote your book, the firstbook, Lucky Bitch.
And if that...
people haven't got Denise's books, people always tell me how much they love your books andI love them too.
So there's three, there's Lucky Bitch, there's Get Rich Lucky Bitch, and there'sChillpreneur.
There's not another one that I'm forgetting.
Well, Chillpreneur got renamed Chill & Prosper actually.
(10:59):
I think this is a really cool manifesting story too because when I self-published my booksand I didn't really care that much about traditional publishing, but it was kind of a
little bit of an urge.
But I got an email from a Hay House lady who is just on my newsletter list, right?
And this is just always such a good lesson.
You never know who's watching.
And I was like sending my newsletter out every week.
(11:20):
So she contacted me and said, look, I really love your stuff.
I'd love to pitch you to my bosses at Hay House.
And we went through the whole process and she was like, look, there are no at this time.
And so this is where my business was called Lucky Bitch as well.
And I was just like, they're just not, it's just not, hey, how see, you know, it's, and Iwent, that's fine.
I said, my God, just even going through this process has been so great, but now I'm goingto go away and build something that you can't say no to next time.
(11:46):
So then we changed my whole company name.
So that's when I went to Denise DT.
Also my ads and stuff were starting to get disapproved because Facebook didn't like theword bitch.
Like it was just starting to become a bit of a problem, but I went away and built all ofmy social media numbers.
And then I went back to them and said, Hey, look, I've got an idea for a new book calledChilpreneur.
And you can have the other books essentially for free.
(12:08):
And like as a package deal.
And they went, yeah, great.
And so we went through the process and I hated the cover.
I hated it.
You remember the first cover of it?
And I was like, I just, hate it.
it was because I was a new author with them, was trying to push back that feeling like, Ican't really do it.
So I just said, you know what, universe?
Like I'm just leaving it up to you.
(12:28):
I'm like, I'm just going to let it go.
Right.
And then, two years later, they were like, Denise, we'd love to do a new version of thebook because it's, you know, pandemic.
Like we want to be able to mention that we want more case studies.
And I said, right.
Like, I, really need to change the cover.
And they went great, but let's change the name as well.
Cause they never, they never really liked children.
(12:49):
And so I was like totally fine, but it was just such a thing of like going.
I know it's going to happen.
Like just, know, that manifest a trust sometimes you have, you just go, okay, fine.
I've got other things to worry about.
Like we don't fixate on, on stuff.
I was just like, fine, whatever.
And so then I love the cover.
and chill and prosper.
had already called my podcast that name.
(13:09):
I was like, a marketer, I'm like, brilliant.
And that couldn't have been a bigger gift to alignment, your podcast anyway.
And I remember even waiting in the wings before you did a podcast going.
we should hurry up and do a podcast because when she does, it is going to be huge becausepeople, think you had that beautiful energy, which is difficult for a manifestor to have
as well because we have what they sometimes call a closed and repelling aura and noteveryone is open to our, um, transformation and our ignition and our informing, right?
(13:40):
So it's interesting.
I I've loved watching the way people
and I think it's because you have always had those clear boundaries.
It's like, you can go over here and you're not gonna get all of me.
Even when I wanna kind of like cross your boundaries, like not that I would do it, but youknow me, I'd like get up in people's stuff and I'd say things to you or like, remember one
(14:00):
day I asked you a question, you're like, well, you could just go and Google that.
And I'd be like, yeah, I actually could.
That's so rude.
No, no, no, it was late.
Like it was late at night and I came in, I was probably like had a few drinks.
I was like.
about this, but you know mainstream of consciousness is talking blah blah blah.
3am.
Yeah, at 3am.
I do remember that actually.
Yes, and you were gonna just google it Victoria, it's 3am.
(14:21):
Just google it lady.
I love that.
Go ahead, go ahead.
Oh no, what I was gonna say is the way that I do the podcast I think is probably amanifest thing, right?
So I
batch it very intensely.
So I'll hire a studio because otherwise I will not do it at home.
There'll be a million things that will distract me.
(14:42):
So I hire a studio for someone.
I just need to sit there and talk and I'll, usually do 12 in a day.
So I only have to do that four times a year.
that is again, but then it means I have to make sure that my podcasts, like they're notsuper topical.
They, they have to be.
know, stuff I can pull out at any time.
Obviously, I can look ahead and go, I can do a Christmas episode, I can do whatever, but Itry and make them kind of evergreen.
(15:08):
And also, I think the lesson that I've learned too is, it's okay to be repetitive withstuff, because people need to hear it again and again.
And I'm not always trying to reach the people who have been following me forever and, youknow, done all my things.
It's like, it's always trying to get the new person.
So I think I don't know if that's a manifest thing of just going,
(15:28):
Here's the thing, here's the constraint, and then I don't want to think about it untilnext quarter.
Absolutely.
And I know my human design teacher said to me as well, he goes, the perfect kind ofbusiness for you is to come in and out.
So you're not designed to be there the whole time.
And you will start to get like, you know, our not self theme is that anger, right?
(15:52):
And I used to think, I don't...
I really get angry.
And then I thought about my parenting.
yeah.
Angry.
My children would make me when they were small and Millie, I've got two kids, you knowthem very well.
And Millie in fact has your birthday and your same human design life theme, even thoughshe's a projector.
So very different.
But, you know, she said to me last night, I remember when you were just screaming at meone day saying, you.
(16:14):
I can't even remember now, I can't remember the word.
was something like, it wasn't even frustrating.
It was the next level of like, you know, just make me so like mad.
I don't think I said angry or mad.
It was something like, I just cannot believe how frustrating you are.
And she goes, never forget, just look at your face.
Like you were just so, so like distraught.
And I was like, because I just couldn't get through to you.
(16:35):
And it was so like, I was so annoyed.
So then I realized anger comes in.
But yeah, that having to show up
not on our terms, I think can be very difficult.
So that batching that you just mentioned, whichever one always admires when you say it'ssuch a manifestor thing too, like you'll go, I just like did, you know, 50 podcasts in two
weeks or whatever you say.
(16:55):
And people are like, my God, like, you do because it's, it's beautiful.
that's where.
Yeah.
I want the container.
I want to be on, I get my hair and makeup done.
I'm like, so even today, right?
I was like, I had two gaps.
Normally I would do five in a row and.
Mark, my husband, had put in the orthodontics appointment.
It shouldn't just be an FYI, but he's blocked it out in my calendar.
(17:18):
So then I said to ask my group, hey, I've got two slots tomorrow, because I don't want tojust sit here and be like, I'm going to do with my life for two hours waiting for my next
podcast.
So it's like, I just want to be very contained with stuff like that.
So I have freedom then during my week, because I find it so difficult, like when Mark cameinto the business, he's a projector.
but he needed to have all these touch points with me to be like, and he still does itwhere he's like, so we're doing our SMA launch, like, are we going to have the clothes on
(17:46):
the thing?
What?
And I'm like, like this conversation once, I never want to have it again.
Why are we having this conversation?
It's so boring to go over old ground, but if I can do it where it's just like, okay, I'mthere, I'll do my thing.
And then I don't have to think about that.
That's the only way I can do the business.
And I think that's why it's been so.
good with having the same business because I'm like, I don't need to, like that's done.
(18:10):
You know, like I don't have to have that question mark in my mind.
What's my next course?
When am I going to launch it?
That's why I also made my course evergreen.
So then we can still do launches, which Mark pretty much takes care of now.
Um, and, but we can serve those people who are instant gratification people.
And it's just like, cool.
I've got somewhere to send you.
(18:31):
when he came in the business, he was like, oh, you could do a mastermind.
We could do all these things.
And I was like, I don't want to, I just don't want to.
And I don't think I can, if I don't want to, it doesn't matter how much money, somethinglike that would make.
like, I just, I can't, I do it.
Yeah.
And I think for you as well, Laine, I've always been, you know, in admiration of it, butalso like envious of having you, you put in place those
(18:56):
Kind of like the, I think, Carrie was talking last week about having guard rails onthings.
And I thought that was such a good term to use in having guard rails in your businesswhere, even when I started my mastermind, right.
In 2013 and you'd come on the retreats and coach.
mean, how lucky were those women till I have asked first start, but also like have thatopportunity.
It was amazing.
And then we could catch up.
(19:16):
It was great.
they were the best of times, but.
in terms of that, like it's, it's kind of like you said to me, well, you can have thatperson.
They can join your mastermind when you had been coaching and you just put a line in thesand said, I'm not doing coaching with clients anymore.
One-on-one, like it's just not going to happen.
And you could have had, can you imagine how many people would have kept wanting that?
(19:38):
And for you not to have put that guardrail in, you would have been blocked in startingthis scale.
not that you were like, I'm going to scale and take over the world, but you just put thoseguardrails in and really believed in that direction.
And once again, that discipline and devotion of staying there, despite wanting to bepulled off course, whether it be by Mark or, you know, a million other ideas.
(20:01):
And even the good thing was, I remember also you saying,
when you'd have some other creative urges like doing the branded like merch and products.
And I mean, you did have decks and I mean, you'd always, what about the jumpsuit with thebees on it?
mean, my goodness.
And it was definitely bits where I mean, I still get distracted a little bit, but I justdon't break that core thing.
(20:21):
on the one-to-one thing, it'd be really interesting to if this is in my chart too, becauseI did like one-to-one, but I maxed out like,
I remember the most I ever had in a week was like 15 clients.
I actually think I maxed out at about five because any more than that, I was like, I can'tremember the details between clients.
Like I can't remember.
(20:42):
I just, couldn't hold all of that.
And so, and also I feel like I'm not that good at it.
So occasionally someone will go, you know, can you please do one to one?
And I was like, look, I would take your money, but I'm just, I'm not good at it.
Like it's not, I'd prefer to speak rather than listen.
And like, can't, I'm not good at it.
So it would be a waste of your money.
(21:03):
And so that's why, you know, bootcamp's great, but even when I do my money archetypes, Ionly do it once a year.
It's, you know, a set time and I can give myself to it for that time.
But apart from that, it's not my skillset, you know?
Yeah.
And it's so interesting you say that about the speaking, because as manifestos, that'swhere, that's where all the manifestation takes place.
(21:25):
takes place in our throat, right?
So the expression of ourselves, that's how we create.
So when we're talking as a manifestor, it's about creation and that drive to we've got amotor directly to the throat.
So that is what has to come through.
And I know when I studied life coaching and they're like, you have to hold the space.
can't put your judgment, you can't put your opinion.
(21:46):
And I'd be sitting there going, my brain is broken.
I don't know what you mean about that.
I think that's very true.
are more suited to having that group to express ourselves to because we're, yeah, wearen't going to hold that squabbles.
We can't hold it back, right?
And I have seen you in action with that where you're just like, well, here's the strategy.
Like, you're not going to be like, well, what do you think?
(22:08):
Because they're like, I've got the information that I can just give you.
I can just tell you, you don't have to figure it out.
And it's hard.
And it is hard.
And it's so funny because in learning those principles, was like,
Oh yeah, maybe that's what I need to do more.
And I still try and do that now to this day where I say, well, what, do you think?
Or what, what, or ask those coaching questions, right?
(22:30):
And in my head, I'm just like, I've got the answer.
Just take it and go, you'll make a million dollars and like, go and have fun.
Right.
But I have to go, no.
Okay.
And as soon as I do, then I see, cause it's not my natural style.
It's not my design.
People get like actually really kind of, well, can't you just tell me like they get
very frustrated with me.
So then I'm like, I'll just tell them now.
(22:51):
don't care.
Yeah, absolutely.
It's interesting.
And so your profile type being a three-fiver is quite a common profile type, but thebiggest hallmark of it is a lot of trial and error, giving things a go, but just recovery
straight back.
Like, I ran over here, fell off a cliff.
I'm back again.
Can you talk to
(23:12):
parts of your life that might be in business particularly, I guess, would be interestingjust to think about some of those recovery mechanisms or an experience you can think of
when I say that, that comes to mind that would be a hallmark of being a three-five.
Well, I think when I have made mistakes, I do feel like, my God, this is going to be sogreat for the podcast.
(23:32):
Like this is going to be such a great chapter for a book.
And
So I see the juice in things very, very quickly.
And I think when I was one to one coaching too, I had to slow that down a bit becausepeople would be like, here's a bad thing.
I'd be like, this is amazing.
Like this would be so great to share, but they were still in it.
So it was hard sometimes to then be like, oh no, that is really bad.
(23:55):
Sorry.
But it's really good.
And so even as a friend, if someone's getting divorced, I'm like already can see like fiveyears down the track.
I'm like, this is amazing.
But
people need to wallow in it a little bit and get that sympathy.
So I think I've just always had that for myself and others.
Also, I don't know if this is just ADHD, but I totally forget about things.
So I was speaking in London and so I was doing a keynote and there was like a really drunkguy who stood up and like he heckled and he had to be removed, whatever.
(24:25):
Like he was super drunk, right?
And this was in England.
So a lot of people were just like mortified by it.
I get to the end of my keynote, I just like recovered and went whatever.
And I get to the end of the keynote, I meeting people after and they were like, are youokay?
And I was like, about what?
I I've just forgotten about it.
Like it just didn't penetrate at all.
(24:46):
I also think from an early age, because I was a performer, so I started dancing at eightand the dance school I went to, we were not the best, but we
danced bloody everywhere.
So my dance teacher, Simone, love her, Simone's school of performing arts.
She literally would be like, we would dance at McCappie Day, we would dance at old folkshomes, we're always dancing at the local shopping center, like anywhere we danced, right?
(25:14):
And so I feel like, especially in the early years when we were still kind of gettingbetter, we had so many disasters.
And so like our music would be the wrong music.
Our music would be sped up.
We'd be dancing on the back of a flatbed truck and it would start to bounce.
We would be on a really slippery floor and half of us would fall over.
We would be like just so many embarrassing humiliating things happened in those early daysthat we would just kind of like whatever.
(25:42):
And I see that now, cause I do perform again now and I see people are so nervous and I'mlike, what's the worst that can happen?
Like, I feel like
It's happened already.
Also, the other thing I think that helps with that is that, you know, know, my mom, my momis like so undiagnosed ADHD.
We just had such a kind of chaotic sometimes childhood, but also just like she does justtry lots of things and nothing was ever a big deal.
(26:09):
And I think that now I'm only appreciating that now.
think I didn't appreciate it for a long time where I'm like, she'll just walk away fromstuff like, and
not be bothered.
And she's just like, well, okay, what's the next next new thing?
And of course, that was very painful sometimes as a kid.
now I'm like, that's such a great skill just to go, well, that happened.
(26:30):
then, like, great, I can talk to other people about it.
yes, like, then it doesn't make it as embarrassing, I think, too.
Yeah, I think actually that brings up something I wanted to talk to you about because Iwas thinking about, mentioned this last week to you how Denise and I would host retreats
together, but we would also bring in our third manifestor friend.
I mean, I really thought about it.
(26:50):
There's not many manifestor entrepreneur friends I have and Denise and Jodie are two ofthem, right?
And they were my closest entrepreneur friends.
And it's so funny that you manifested because we just had that recognition, even though wedidn't know it, but we
all got different elements in it.
But one of the things I was thinking about with Jodie and the distinction, because I loveactually now with the knowledge of human design, looking at the difference between us all
(27:12):
as manifestors.
But one of the things that I was thinking of that was different was that Jodie grew up ina family of brothers and her dad was very much part of the family.
Mom, dad, very nuclear family.
And no families are perfect.
And I'm sure she's not going to say hers was, but you know, it was a really strong familyunit.
And there were certain things that I think Jodie expects because her dad would always belike, okay, Jodie, you know, she's the girl and here's the things that happen.
(27:39):
And not that Jodie expects certain things, but I think you and I growing up with singlemothers as manifestors where we were free, we're left kind of free to do a lot of our own
thing.
And I think that's such a gift if you do have a manifestor child, which I know a lot ofpeople do now because of sort of the way the world's changing and a lot of manifestors are
being born, which
Yay.
(27:59):
But yeah, which is kind of cool.
So if you speak to more people, so many more women are like, Mike, my baby's a manifestor.
And you're like, yes, I know, because that's kind of the way the world is moving to me.
know.
Right.
Exactly.
So, um, but what was that?
What I was going to say to that was that there there's something as well about that beingdriven to
succeed.
(28:19):
Yes, we've got the manifest element, but I think growing up with a single mother,obviously economically, that is not an abundant place to be for most people, right?
So talk to that for me, you know, in terms of that being a driver, it can also be ahindrance, I understand, but you know, in seeing that kind of like sheer, I've got to get
(28:39):
this because I've got to provide for myself.
like tell me about that.
Yeah, I think that started really early because I saw my mom
either struggle with money or be in situations like with relationships where, you know,she didn't have economic power.
So when I was 11, she married someone who was much older, you know, wealthy, controlling,and they were together for about six years, but I think we moved in and out of his big
(29:06):
house about five, six times, probably even more.
Like we'd come home and she'd be like, okay, we're moving somewhere else.
And I think...
I realized too, I was like, I never want to be in that situation where a man can kick meout or choose how I spend my life.
also I was very aware about like, I really loved dancing and I just wanted to dance allthe time.
(29:31):
I was very aware that that was both an expense, but it was also a way that my stepdadcould control me.
You know, cause he'd be like, well, I'm not going to pay for your dance here.
I'm not going to pay for this.
So when I was 12, I asked my dance teacher if I could be her, like do assistant teachingfor her, like helping with the, know, baby's ballet and stuff like that.
(29:51):
So that paid for some of my lessons.
And then as soon as I could, I got a job.
And even like at university and in my twenties, I always had like five jobs, you know?
And like one of them was an adult chat line, which I've talked about before.
And the reason why I picked that,
is because it was open 24 seven.
And so if I needed money, I could just be like, Oh, can I come in for a shift?
(30:13):
Could I come in for a double and do like 12 hour shift, like 6 PM to 6 AM, which was yourchat line stories.
is the best.
And I was like, I never, when people go, Oh, university was so fun.
go, I was always working.
And then even in my twenties in London, I did the same thing.
I was always working and I always had.
all these side hustles.
(30:35):
I even, I did, I participated in a medical experiment in the UK to pay for my tuition.
And I remember a friend at the time, she was like, you'd do anything for money, wouldn'tyou?
And I remember thinking, bitch, I have to.
No one else, no one is going to take care of me.
There's no way for me to get that money to, you know, do my university tuition, if not forthis.
(30:58):
half of it was like 10 grand.
I remember half of it came from the medical experiment and half of it came in a bank errorin my favor.
So I was like, that's, think when things started to shift for me and to being lucky, likethat's when the lucky bitch thing happened because then things were coming to me, not
necessarily through just hard work and hustle.
Um, but actually like the universe was kind of nudging me in a different direction.
(31:23):
So I set an intention.
write a book and I won the Daw Prize at Sandy Forster's event, which was a self-publishingcourse.
I wanted to be a life coach and a friend texted me, she goes, you know, you won a lifecoaching thing on a webinar I was on yesterday.
And I was like, I don't even remember like signing up for the webinar.
And she was like, yeah, and you won the Daw Prize, which was a life coaching qualificationthing.
(31:46):
And then, you know, all these things were happening and it really shifted then of going
Like you're a really hard worker and you'll do whatever it takes to hang on.
Maybe you don't have to try as hard.
can direct your intention.
And it was just a really different shift for me.
I love that.
That, that almost gives me goosebumps.
Just the thought of it.
(32:07):
It wasn't also just landing on you.
You were igniting it in terms of, right.
I have to create these elements.
Like, and you always talk to that entrepreneurial drive, but
there, there was also a deeper pull within you emotionally about that to feel that safety.
I believe as well of that.
(32:27):
Yes.
I can be creative.
Yes, I can have that, but it's like, and also very manifest a thing of nobody's going tocontrol me.
And I feel like that very much drove me to being a mother of a single mother too, whereshe'd be like, you know, well, your father's not giving us any money.
So, and I never wanted to rely on a man for
by choices or my freedoms like that.
(32:48):
And I still don't.
And I might be why I'm divorced.
Cause when I married someone who wanted to control how money was spent, even though bothof us were making it, that was just a hard no for me.
Like, and he wasn't even like financially good.
It wasn't anything bad, but it was just like even that little bit of control.
was like, no way.
I get to decide these things.
And that's sovereign to me.
(33:09):
So I love that you shared that.
And I know we're at times, so we've got to wrap up.
But in talking to that one thing about like, you have always had that message from thebeginning about that luck, which, know, there was definitely luck there, but it was kind
of strategic luck in many ways, right?
And that force of who you are.
(33:30):
But in talking to that, you know, determination or seeing that opportunity,
Like, is there just something you'd like to share with other women?
know they always ask you, women in business who see your success and they want to emulateit.
And this is part of my drive to say to people, you can do it on your terms and do itdifferently.
Maybe just leave us with that one thing you think you have done differently that hasworked really well and really given you that leverage maybe that maybe you haven't even
(33:58):
talked about before or there's something that-
I think of, I always think of my grandmother, right?
So my grandmother died when I was 25 and I was really close to her, but I think even morethan my mom, she really would drum into me, you know, like don't ever be dependent.
She'd always say to me from a young age, she'd be like, I hope your grandfather dies thisyear.
And I was like, when she started telling me that they were like in their 50s, they weren'told, but she just didn't have any other avenue.
(34:24):
And
But one of the last times I spent with her before she died, cause she was, you know, shehad breast cancer and all that kind of stuff.
did a road trip up to Queensland and I was like really starting my personal developmentjourney and I was listening to like Zig Ziglar or like, amway tapes or something.
And we just kind of drove in silence and it was like a couple of hours in and she waslike, you could do this.
(34:47):
And I just sort of went, really?
And I thought, you know,
she never got to see any like literally nothing.
Cause she died when I was 25.
So I was still in my like, yeah, trying things out phase, but I think she did see that inme.
And so she has visited me at very like important parts of my life.
So I've smelled like I've smelled her perfume, like when I was giving birth to Willow andI was, and also other times I've been in hospital and I remember I was saying, I can smell
(35:16):
my nan and like, you know, the midwives are kind of like, okay, whatever.
was like,
my God, she's here.
And it was, it was really, really special because I'm like, she was so smart.
She was so creative.
know she was a dressmaker.
She did all these cool things.
She was very funny as well, but she just lived in a time where she couldn't do anything.
Yes.
(35:36):
With that creativity, you know, she could have had a...
an amazing Etsy store or a YouTube channel or whatever, right?
And so every time I think, oh, look at me, I'm so smart.
go, no, it's literally just the, the era that I'm in.
And so I think about my grandma and I always do think like, imagine saying to yourgrandma, like, oh, I would start my podcast, but what if someone's mean to me on the
(35:59):
internet?
They couldn't do what we can do.
And like,
I even think she started NutriMedics.
was selling NutriMedics for a while.
Like in Pacific Palms in Foster where there was probably like a hundred people around her,right?
And I just think, oh my God, we have, we're able to have all these beautiful friendshipswith people all around the world who are like-minded.
(36:23):
We get all these beautiful support.
We can create a bloody podcast.
We can make things with our imagination.
I just, I feel so privileged.
with that.
And I think that's what keeps me going because I go, nobody can stop us from doing this,but nobody can make us either.
we do have to be internally driven to go, why not me?
I'm allowed to write a book.
(36:44):
I'm allowed to create a podcast.
No one is sitting there waiting for it and begging for it.
So you just have to be a bit delusional and just go, okay, I'm going to do it because mygrandmother would have, God, she would have done it.
absolutely.
Can I leave that and we'll wrap up with this one thing that
In your human design, you're in your unconscious is your ancestry, right?
(37:04):
And there's certain planetary activations that are your maternal grandmother.
So I'm going to look into what that is for you and share it because that will be, you'recarrying her.
She's within you.
Really quick story on this.
So I went to a yoga retreat and sometimes in yoga spaces, I feel like I'm the likebusiness bitch.
And everyone's talking about like,
(37:26):
what's your spirit animal and all this kind of stuff.
And I went, I don't know, I'm a bitch.
And so I had this session with someone and she goes, yours is a dragon.
She's like, you're fire.
And she's like, that is an animal.
And it's really important for those lightning strikes in the ground that is like rings,what nitro, something like something into the soil.
(37:46):
And she's like, it's really important to be that fire energy.
Cause I was like, everyone's like is a unicorn and stuff like that.
So mine doesn't exist.
So then I was like, okay, I'm gonna embrace that dragon energy.
I came home and my auntie who long ago divorced my uncle met with me for coffee.
She goes, I've got a present for you.
I went and visited your uncle, my ex-husband.
And while he was in the toilet, I like rummaged in his cupboard of all your grandmother'sthings that he has.
(38:11):
And it's a dragon.
Get out.
Yes, go and get it.
It's right here.
Show me, show me.
know what you're like.
I was always like, my grandmother was so like soft and kind and, like, she lovedtraveling.
And so she got this in the eighties from, think she was in China or Japan.
She loved traveling and it was just, she just thought I just grabbed the first thing and Iwanted you to have something because I don't have anything from her.
(38:36):
And it was just the perfect thing of going, I am allowed to be the dragon.
It's, that is, that is who I am.
so dragon lady, just.
Isn't that so cool?
Your daddies.
I love that.
And I love the way that the way you put things together decor wise as well.
Always like, just love it because you could just put that and anyone else, it's just goingto look ugly.
(38:57):
Even like your Fortuna statues, which I know you always have.
You've given me one, but that one I can see it up there as well.
And I always love it because I'm always like, yeah, my mom bought me a blue typewriterwhen I was nine.
So it's not quite like that.
And there's like a little B here.
crystals and stuff.
you and beautiful.
And I love that.
And then yeah, my dragon sits on there I love that story.
(39:18):
And I'm gonna, and I actually really want to do Vicky, your mum's design too.
The more I think about it, the more I'm like,
I just so want to do Vicky.
I love your mother.
But anyway, we could go on forever, but we've got to wrap it up and just leave everyone,hopefully with those thoughts, particularly, hopefully this has given some comfort to
manifestors out there.
I know that human design has given me so much comfort and permission to be the way we arewired to be.
(39:41):
So it's interesting to hear those different experiences.
And I have learned new things just.
Doing this, can we do it again, please?
I would just have a chat.
We don't even have a toolbox, but we should just record all our chats.
sort of makes them even better, right?
So let's do it.
So thank you, my darling.
I cannot wait to see you again soon.
yeah, let's just share and go and take our grandmother's and our mother's energy for alltheir light and shade it's in us.
(40:10):
And this is our privilege to take that and ignite it out there as well.
So thank you.
Thank you.
Thanks for joining me on today's episode.
If you'd like to get your free human design type guide, then head on over tovictoriagibson.com and enter your birth details and you're going to get a custom report
(40:34):
that dives in and tells you more about your human design type and your authority, which isreally the basis for making great decisions in your business.
It's absolutely free.
Head to victoragibson.com and grab your copy.
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